October 7, 2025 • 11 mins
The Police Minister says officers don't have the laws they need to move protesters from MPs' homes.
The Government introduced the legislation to ban protests outside homes in August, and it's now before a select committee.
A 29-year-old man's turned himself in and been charged, accused of smashing a window at Foreign Minister Winston Peters' house earlier this week.
Minister Mark Mitchell told Mike Hosking every single Kiwi would agree the one place they should feel safe is in their own home.
Labour’s Ginny Andersen agreed, but says the law as proposed is really unclear in terms of detail.
She says people have the right to protest but if they’re breaking the law, then they should get prosecuted, just as the person who was charged with smashing the window was.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Turned out for politics Wednesday. Mark Mentell, Jinny Anderson, both Weathers.
Good morning to you both.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Good morning, Mike, morning, Jenny.
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Good morning.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Yes, where this morning is?
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Mark?
Speaker 3 (00:13):
I was gonna ask if it was the Lulu Lounge,
but I think that's not right.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
No, Lulu, Ly, he's not at the Lulu Lounge. Where
are you this morning?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Mark? I am being very well looked after by the
amazing staff here at Wellington Hospital.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
So you're in hospital?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Yes, it's no state secret. Yes, I might just here
for a few days having a big dose of some
Adie bolets. I've hit a chest in fiction, that's s.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
I hope you feel better soon. You.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
I gotta say, you sound a bit croaky. Mark, you
sound a bit sort of.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
I've instantly finally beack on my feet in a couple
of days.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Okay, So are you up for the session? I mean,
you know, Jenny.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Hoves starts going nice, nicer than promise.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
It'll be more even, It'll be more even.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Okay. Still got a sense of competition going on there.
As far as Job Seeker, Jinny, the announcements made on
Job Seeker for the eighteen to nineteen year olds without
making policy because no you want, I get all that
as an idea if fair enough, or you'd flip it back,
do you reckon?
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Well, well, I'm not going to just come out and
say we'll reverse access silly. But the problem is these
thirty six thousand fewer jobs. So where are the jobs.
So it's great that I want to incentivize them and
they're encouraging people to work, but if there's you know,
two hundred people a day leaving for Australia, you know,
I think the problem they're trying to fix is needs
(01:47):
to be employment for these young people to go to
and so they've cut apprenticeship boosts, that increased fees for
university and you can't employment at record rates. So that's
the reality of the problem. I can't see their answer
actually fixing the problem that still exists.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Part of the problem, Mark, is you've timed it. I
happen to think it's a good policy, but part of
the timing is She's right, it comes at a tricky
time in the economy and you're asking a lot of
young people, aren't you.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
Yeah, I just think that young people are getting stuck
on a benefit. I mean, it's awful. The socialist model
is having more people relied on the state, and that
is an awful model because you know, they lose any
sense of personal responsibility, any sense of aspiration, any sense
of trying to go out there and seize opportunities in
any young person that gets stuck on the job seeker
(02:37):
benefit under twenty five on average is going to spend
eighteen years or more on a benefit.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
So, I mean that is a shocker, you know, well
and good and I you know, we don't want that.
I think nobody wants that for our young people. We
want to provide a country where they have hope, they
have opportunity, and they want to stay here and have
those good things to look forward to. And we still
don't see that. We've got a.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Minister you huge numbers going on jobs.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
Let me finish, You've got a prime minister's telling them
to go to Dargaville and dig up a kumera. You
that's crazy. You know, they need some real.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
That's the problem, and that's the problem with your view
of the world is that when I know, when I
was a young guy shipping, I would take a job
wherever it was. And when I didn't, when I was
between jobs, when I was willing to go on the police.
I went as a runner and a restaurant because my
mum and dad taught me that I would go and
find a job and I would work.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
An interesting point, But your.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Attitude, gen is that's that's beneath anyone.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
You know, I got I got my first job when
I when I was as soon as I could. You're
just you're just pooping job And I saved. And I
wasn't pooping that. I was saying. These no shops available
in the regions, these areas are not saying they don't.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
You just used You just use the example the Prime
Minister use and you're poop putting it and say why
would a young person go targall to go with it?
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Because there's no jobs they mark that's the point.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Well, that's not true. There are What you're saying that's correct, Jenny,
is that the supply and demand curve is not working
at the not everyone's going to end up in a job.
But what I found interesting is, so what did the
Prime Minister post cabinet on Monday? There seems to be
a thing these days, because he was being asked about
that moving town to find a job is somehow unacceptable.
Do you find that unacceptable, not at all.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Like if people want to go somewhere, no, no, no, what.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
If they don't know know a different part of the question,
if you have to move because that's life, Is that acceptable?
Speaker 3 (04:33):
Many people have to do that. Yes, it's a reality.
You were just talking about food prices and how much
people spend on food. The reality for many Kiwi families
they can't afford to live where they are now, so
they're forced to go to other areas. If it means
they can earn money and pay the rent and look
after their family.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Well that's good.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
Here.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
It's the brutal reality of New Zealand right now.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
See, I would argue that that's not a bad thing.
I mean when I was sixteen, I left home to
go to Wellington. Why to go to wend That's where
the job was, so I mean I didn't think twice
about it was.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
What it was.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
It wasn't like, oh my god, I'm leaving home to
move to it and like it.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Is what it is. I think what some of those
areas have been saying, particularly in the regions, is they've
been the hardest hit by some of the job losses.
Why can't all with closures of all those mills. You've
had Nelson with about three closures. Now you've had big
manufacturing losses, and you Plumouth around the Tartanucky area and
all those regions are struggling right now. So just telling
(05:24):
people to move to the regions to find a job.
Do you understand what to the problem New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
I was just saying, I don't think Ginny understands why
the country is. The whole country is working hard to
drive ourselves out of the of the recession, the inflation
that we obviously as a government that we inherited high
interest rates. The reason why we got there is because
we had very poor energy policy settings that has created
(05:50):
very high energy prices. We're currently having to pay about
eleven billion dollars annually an interest on the massive borrowing
that were made by the government. That has an impact
on the economy. Ginny, we have that we have to
pay the price when you throw it.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
This will be the election you need to debate.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Genny.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Do you can you explain Hipkins, who I think failed yesterday,
this Peter's thing and the new law the government are
looking to put through about protesting outside people's houses. Why
did you vote against it.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
It was really unclear. And the detail about we you know,
at your house, my house, someone else's house. I mean
that the reality is if someone is protesting their right
to protest, if they break the law, then they get
prosecuted as the person did out front.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
Sorter person than in your view, be able to come
outside Winston Peter's house at four o'clock in the afternoon
and bang a drum and yell through a loud speaker
for as long as they want because that's legitimate protest
or not.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
Well, that would be breaching the peace and it would
be causing it to sturbance, and so place would likely
have good grounds to apprehend that person.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
But we don't know that well is there aren't clear
laws of it.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
That's why we're passing the bill, and that's why we
would have expected you to support it. And I think
that every single KIWI would would agree and say that
the one place that that they and their family should
feel safe is in their house. And you picture a
group of people standing outside your house shouting all sorts
of things with loud ailers and carrying on them and
(07:23):
by the way, you know, completely totally stepping over the line.
Going in this smesh in the window. You know they've
got it. They've got this beautiful black lab Winston and
Jan apparently there was glass through his eyes and it
was just a bloody shocker.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
Yeah. I think the problem with it is Ginny As
You're on the wrong side of this now, aren't you,
Because what happens is it's all very well theoretically going
around going oh, you should be able to protest. These
sort of people aren't normal, and when let off the leash,
that's where it ends up. And no one, No one
finds that acceptable do they.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Let me be very clear, what happened to Winston Peters
is absolutely unacceptable and no one should have that happen
at all. And so if someone is breaking the law
one hundred percent, they should be.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
But that's the point of having a law, so that
we because the law at the moment clearly doesn't work
as well as it should do, and you shouldn't be.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Able to arrested. He was arrested, Yeah, well he was because.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
He's hammed himself in.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
Yes, the police advice is that they don't have the
laws they need to be able to go in and
move people away when they're protesting. Someone's private house. So
that's why we're passing the law. So you know, I
would go back and have a serious chat with Hickins
and say we better change your position on this pretty quick.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Quickly, Ginny, how much do you spend on groceries per week?
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Roughly two teenage kids? Yes, it would be more than that,
it would be about four eighty.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
I would say, yeah, see that's where I don't know
where they got their numbers from, because I mean the.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
People who don't earn as much as may So.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
You think you spend more because you've got it as
your argument.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
Definitely, I would say, so like we spent, we have
two people who are and we're able to when we
run out, we can go and buy more. And so
many families in New Zealand and I hear this locally
that when their food runs out for the week, they
can't And so that's why they're not spending more money
on takeaways or other things. As you said, it's because
(09:14):
people don't have the money to feed their family.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
What would you spend make.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
It's a really good question, to be honest, because I've
got to put my hand up and so that I
don't actually do the grocery as much these days. But
we've got two growing boys in the house, strapping leads,
and you know, and obviously costs a bit to feed them.
But yet I couldn't give you anything.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
If the number is right. My point being, if the
number is right, then it's a wake up call, isn't it?
Because what I do know about shopping is that two
hundred and forty dollars is done by it much is
the problem, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (09:45):
Well, it doesn't buy you good quality food. It replies
you processed food and white bread and ter minute noodles.
And that's some of the problems we've got. And that
was the whole reason behind the Healthy Launchers program, that
if you keep kids going to school who hadn't been
feed proper food to nourish them and at least they
had the opportunity for learning and taking it away.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
The one thing, the one thing that the one the next.
Speaker 3 (10:08):
Generation of young people not learning or engaging in education.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
I mean, one thing, one thing, And this is what
we're telling people to suck eggs. But when I was
a young police officer and had a young family, I mean,
we used to just see what the seasonal vegetables were,
what the specials were, and and try to shop like that.
I still do to just to keep the building.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
I grow my own mark.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
There you go.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Good on your mate, Good on your mate. Do you
have a little do you have a little roadside stall where.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
I was thinking about it because I had I've had
a very good citrus season with mandarins, lemons and grapefruit,
more more of those that I can do with, and
I was thinking that I'll need to. If I was
a nice guy, I would have brought them in here,
and of course she had them run the start, but
I'm not.
Speaker 3 (10:51):
Lemons can go really well exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:55):
But anyway, I'm not a nice person, so I didn't
bring it any Nice to see you guys, Jenny Anderson,
markill get better soon.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
Make for more from the Mic Asking Breakfast. Listen live
to news Talks at B from six am weekdays, or
follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
Turned out for politics Wednesday. Mark Mentell, Jinny Anderson, both Weathers.
Good morning to you both.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Good morning, Mike, morning, Jenny.
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Good morning.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Yes, where this morning is?
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Mark?
Speaker 3 (00:13):
I was gonna ask if it was the Lulu Lounge,
but I think that's not right.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
No, Lulu, Ly, he's not at the Lulu Lounge. Where
are you this morning?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Mark? I am being very well looked after by the
amazing staff here at Wellington Hospital.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
So you're in hospital?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Yes, it's no state secret. Yes, I might just here
for a few days having a big dose of some
Adie bolets. I've hit a chest in fiction, that's s.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
I hope you feel better soon. You.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
I gotta say, you sound a bit croaky. Mark, you
sound a bit sort of.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
I've instantly finally beack on my feet in a couple
of days.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Okay, So are you up for the session? I mean,
you know, Jenny.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Hoves starts going nice, nicer than promise.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
It'll be more even, It'll be more even.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Okay. Still got a sense of competition going on there.
As far as Job Seeker, Jinny, the announcements made on
Job Seeker for the eighteen to nineteen year olds without
making policy because no you want, I get all that
as an idea if fair enough, or you'd flip it back,
do you reckon?
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Well, well, I'm not going to just come out and
say we'll reverse access silly. But the problem is these
thirty six thousand fewer jobs. So where are the jobs.
So it's great that I want to incentivize them and
they're encouraging people to work, but if there's you know,
two hundred people a day leaving for Australia, you know,
I think the problem they're trying to fix is needs
(01:47):
to be employment for these young people to go to
and so they've cut apprenticeship boosts, that increased fees for
university and you can't employment at record rates. So that's
the reality of the problem. I can't see their answer
actually fixing the problem that still exists.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Part of the problem, Mark, is you've timed it. I
happen to think it's a good policy, but part of
the timing is She's right, it comes at a tricky
time in the economy and you're asking a lot of
young people, aren't you.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
Yeah, I just think that young people are getting stuck
on a benefit. I mean, it's awful. The socialist model
is having more people relied on the state, and that
is an awful model because you know, they lose any
sense of personal responsibility, any sense of aspiration, any sense
of trying to go out there and seize opportunities in
any young person that gets stuck on the job seeker
(02:37):
benefit under twenty five on average is going to spend
eighteen years or more on a benefit.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
So, I mean that is a shocker, you know, well
and good and I you know, we don't want that.
I think nobody wants that for our young people. We
want to provide a country where they have hope, they
have opportunity, and they want to stay here and have
those good things to look forward to. And we still
don't see that. We've got a.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Minister you huge numbers going on jobs.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
Let me finish, You've got a prime minister's telling them
to go to Dargaville and dig up a kumera. You
that's crazy. You know, they need some real.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
That's the problem, and that's the problem with your view
of the world is that when I know, when I
was a young guy shipping, I would take a job
wherever it was. And when I didn't, when I was
between jobs, when I was willing to go on the police.
I went as a runner and a restaurant because my
mum and dad taught me that I would go and
find a job and I would work.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
An interesting point, But your.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Attitude, gen is that's that's beneath anyone.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
You know, I got I got my first job when
I when I was as soon as I could. You're
just you're just pooping job And I saved. And I
wasn't pooping that. I was saying. These no shops available
in the regions, these areas are not saying they don't.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
You just used You just use the example the Prime
Minister use and you're poop putting it and say why
would a young person go targall to go with it?
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Because there's no jobs they mark that's the point.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Well, that's not true. There are What you're saying that's correct, Jenny,
is that the supply and demand curve is not working
at the not everyone's going to end up in a job.
But what I found interesting is, so what did the
Prime Minister post cabinet on Monday? There seems to be
a thing these days, because he was being asked about
that moving town to find a job is somehow unacceptable.
Do you find that unacceptable, not at all.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Like if people want to go somewhere, no, no, no, what.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
If they don't know know a different part of the question,
if you have to move because that's life, Is that acceptable?
Speaker 3 (04:33):
Many people have to do that. Yes, it's a reality.
You were just talking about food prices and how much
people spend on food. The reality for many Kiwi families
they can't afford to live where they are now, so
they're forced to go to other areas. If it means
they can earn money and pay the rent and look
after their family.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Well that's good.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
Here.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
It's the brutal reality of New Zealand right now.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
See, I would argue that that's not a bad thing.
I mean when I was sixteen, I left home to
go to Wellington. Why to go to wend That's where
the job was, so I mean I didn't think twice
about it was.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
What it was.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
It wasn't like, oh my god, I'm leaving home to
move to it and like it.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Is what it is. I think what some of those
areas have been saying, particularly in the regions, is they've
been the hardest hit by some of the job losses.
Why can't all with closures of all those mills. You've
had Nelson with about three closures. Now you've had big
manufacturing losses, and you Plumouth around the Tartanucky area and
all those regions are struggling right now. So just telling
(05:24):
people to move to the regions to find a job.
Do you understand what to the problem New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
I was just saying, I don't think Ginny understands why
the country is. The whole country is working hard to
drive ourselves out of the of the recession, the inflation
that we obviously as a government that we inherited high
interest rates. The reason why we got there is because
we had very poor energy policy settings that has created
(05:50):
very high energy prices. We're currently having to pay about
eleven billion dollars annually an interest on the massive borrowing
that were made by the government. That has an impact
on the economy. Ginny, we have that we have to
pay the price when you throw it.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
This will be the election you need to debate.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Genny.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Do you can you explain Hipkins, who I think failed yesterday,
this Peter's thing and the new law the government are
looking to put through about protesting outside people's houses. Why
did you vote against it.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
It was really unclear. And the detail about we you know,
at your house, my house, someone else's house. I mean
that the reality is if someone is protesting their right
to protest, if they break the law, then they get
prosecuted as the person did out front.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
Sorter person than in your view, be able to come
outside Winston Peter's house at four o'clock in the afternoon
and bang a drum and yell through a loud speaker
for as long as they want because that's legitimate protest
or not.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
Well, that would be breaching the peace and it would
be causing it to sturbance, and so place would likely
have good grounds to apprehend that person.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
But we don't know that well is there aren't clear
laws of it.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
That's why we're passing the bill, and that's why we
would have expected you to support it. And I think
that every single KIWI would would agree and say that
the one place that that they and their family should
feel safe is in their house. And you picture a
group of people standing outside your house shouting all sorts
of things with loud ailers and carrying on them and
(07:23):
by the way, you know, completely totally stepping over the line.
Going in this smesh in the window. You know they've
got it. They've got this beautiful black lab Winston and
Jan apparently there was glass through his eyes and it
was just a bloody shocker.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
Yeah. I think the problem with it is Ginny As
You're on the wrong side of this now, aren't you,
Because what happens is it's all very well theoretically going
around going oh, you should be able to protest. These
sort of people aren't normal, and when let off the leash,
that's where it ends up. And no one, No one
finds that acceptable do they.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Let me be very clear, what happened to Winston Peters
is absolutely unacceptable and no one should have that happen
at all. And so if someone is breaking the law
one hundred percent, they should be.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
But that's the point of having a law, so that
we because the law at the moment clearly doesn't work
as well as it should do, and you shouldn't be.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Able to arrested. He was arrested, Yeah, well he was because.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
He's hammed himself in.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
Yes, the police advice is that they don't have the
laws they need to be able to go in and
move people away when they're protesting. Someone's private house. So
that's why we're passing the law. So you know, I
would go back and have a serious chat with Hickins
and say we better change your position on this pretty quick.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Quickly, Ginny, how much do you spend on groceries per week?
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Roughly two teenage kids? Yes, it would be more than that,
it would be about four eighty.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
I would say, yeah, see that's where I don't know
where they got their numbers from, because I mean the.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
People who don't earn as much as may So.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
You think you spend more because you've got it as
your argument.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
Definitely, I would say, so like we spent, we have
two people who are and we're able to when we
run out, we can go and buy more. And so
many families in New Zealand and I hear this locally
that when their food runs out for the week, they
can't And so that's why they're not spending more money
on takeaways or other things. As you said, it's because
(09:14):
people don't have the money to feed their family.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
What would you spend make.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
It's a really good question, to be honest, because I've
got to put my hand up and so that I
don't actually do the grocery as much these days. But
we've got two growing boys in the house, strapping leads,
and you know, and obviously costs a bit to feed them.
But yet I couldn't give you anything.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
If the number is right. My point being, if the
number is right, then it's a wake up call, isn't it?
Because what I do know about shopping is that two
hundred and forty dollars is done by it much is
the problem, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (09:45):
Well, it doesn't buy you good quality food. It replies
you processed food and white bread and ter minute noodles.
And that's some of the problems we've got. And that
was the whole reason behind the Healthy Launchers program, that
if you keep kids going to school who hadn't been
feed proper food to nourish them and at least they
had the opportunity for learning and taking it away.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
The one thing, the one thing that the one the next.
Speaker 3 (10:08):
Generation of young people not learning or engaging in education.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
I mean, one thing, one thing, And this is what
we're telling people to suck eggs. But when I was
a young police officer and had a young family, I mean,
we used to just see what the seasonal vegetables were,
what the specials were, and and try to shop like that.
I still do to just to keep the building.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
I grow my own mark.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
There you go.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Good on your mate, Good on your mate. Do you
have a little do you have a little roadside stall where.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
I was thinking about it because I had I've had
a very good citrus season with mandarins, lemons and grapefruit,
more more of those that I can do with, and
I was thinking that I'll need to. If I was
a nice guy, I would have brought them in here,
and of course she had them run the start, but
I'm not.
Speaker 3 (10:51):
Lemons can go really well exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:55):
But anyway, I'm not a nice person, so I didn't
bring it any Nice to see you guys, Jenny Anderson,
markill get better soon.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
Make for more from the Mic Asking Breakfast. Listen live
to news Talks at B from six am weekdays, or
follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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