August 1, 2024 • 5 mins
A Ministry of Health review three years after euthanasia became legal might re-ignite debate.
The Ministry is asking people to share their thoughts on the Act.
It says 344 people had an assisted death in the year to March 31.
General Practice NZ chair, Bryan Betty, says the Act is working as designed.
But he says some groups and people still strongly oppose it, despite its rigorous safeguards.
"The reason for doing a review like that is to uncover those types of issues and to see how this has been operating - and if there are any things there that we should be thinking about going forward."
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Right. The public are being invited to weigh in on
the End of Life Choice Act once again. The Ministry
is required to review the operation within three years of
it coming into force. So this is the time for
the review. Let's get the review happening. Do we need
to make changes? Do we not? Now? The Government will
not make changes to the Act following the review. However,
(00:22):
individual political parties can then progress changes through members' bills.
So so far since this came into place, three hundred
and forty four people have chosen assisted dying. This is
in the year to March. So to discuss this, I'm
joined by Dr Brian Betty. Here's the Chair of General Practice,
New Zealand. Good afternoon, Brian.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Good lead Jean Andrew.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
By your measure, has assisted dying being a success so far?
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Well? Certainly in the conversations I've had around this and
sat listen to the sector, it seems to have worked
in the way it was designed to do. So I
haven't heard that there's been a big problems in terms
of what it's done, but the way it was designed,
the way it was put into place, seems to be
working as intended. And I suppose that would be my comment.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
However, some people have expressed a design to make it
better that it currently is. For instance, a lot of
rest homes won't let their clients advanced conversations about getting
into the process, and that's called organizational conscientious objection. That
sort of thing should be debated, don't you think, I.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Think around the edges of this, You're actually right, that's
where the tension will arise. So how the acts being implemented,
the safeguards around it, the restrictions that are in place,
and how that works. I'm always the intention an ability
to participate in news of Asia was always voluntary. That
was always the intention. I believe that's the way it
(01:51):
should be. And yeah, there are absolutely certain certain facilities
for a number of reasons don't want to engage in that.
But again I suppose the reason for doing a review
like that is to uncover those type of issues and
to see how this has been operating and if there
are any things there that we should be thinking about
going forward.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
And surely at the heart of this whole issue is
personal responsibility. It's the ultimate personal responsibility, So it should
be down to the individual themselves rather than the organization
that might be you know, accommodating them at any one time.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
I think there's a lot of there's a number of
arguments around that, both for that approach and against that approach. Again,
you know a number of practitioners, health practitioners and organizations
have taken a particular stance against euthanasia as such, and
is their right to do that. So I think this
(02:47):
is an ongoing debate, It will be an ongoing issue
as we go forward, and one that we need to
engage in. But my comment around that, as well as
often the argument around that, is that lod of care
services per se in this country are not fully funded
or adequately funded, and there should be equal weight given
(03:07):
to two proper funded health care service and advice. And
that's part of what pluts around this as well.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Absolutely, just look at some of the issues that were
raised when we first discussed all this. Now that it
has been in place for three years, have there been
any issues with coesition?
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Look that Again, the reason they're doing a review like
that is to pick up on any of those type
of issues. But certainly, I certainly haven't come across any
concerns raised in the sector around that. So again I
go back to my original comment that the actors that
was put into place and the safeguards were put around those,
but for reasonably rigorous in terms of what was done,
(03:49):
seems to be working.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
And has it had any effect on our suicide rates?
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Look, I couldn't comment on those rates, Andrew, so I
wouldn't know. Now.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
At the end of the day, the government will not
make changes to the act no matter what the review says. However,
then political parties can progress changes through members' bills, So
if there were going to be any changes to the legislation,
it might take years if at all.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
That's the process that's in place. If that was to happen,
then it becomes a conscious folk generally in the Parliament
because of the nature of of this of euthanasia and
what actually happens the end of life, So it's a
be amotive area obviously, But yeah, that is the process
is in place, and that's what's been put in place
at this point.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
So I guess you could say though, the good thing
is that the process is working quite well right now
and there isn't an urgent need to make a change,
because even if we wanted to make a change, we
couldn't do it urgently.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
Look, I think that's probably a fair summation of the
situation that it does seem to have worked in the
way it was intended. There doesn't seem to be a
huge urgency to review or change anything, so we probably
are in a reasonable space at this point.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
Brian Betted to Brian Betty, Cheer of General Practice and
New Zealand, I thank you for your time.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
For more from Hither Duplessy, Allen Drive, listen live to
news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
Right. The public are being invited to weigh in on
the End of Life Choice Act once again. The Ministry
is required to review the operation within three years of
it coming into force. So this is the time for
the review. Let's get the review happening. Do we need
to make changes? Do we not? Now? The Government will
not make changes to the Act following the review. However,
(00:22):
individual political parties can then progress changes through members' bills.
So so far since this came into place, three hundred
and forty four people have chosen assisted dying. This is
in the year to March. So to discuss this, I'm
joined by Dr Brian Betty. Here's the Chair of General Practice,
New Zealand. Good afternoon, Brian.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Good lead Jean Andrew.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
By your measure, has assisted dying being a success so far?
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Well? Certainly in the conversations I've had around this and
sat listen to the sector, it seems to have worked
in the way it was designed to do. So I
haven't heard that there's been a big problems in terms
of what it's done, but the way it was designed,
the way it was put into place, seems to be
working as intended. And I suppose that would be my comment.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
However, some people have expressed a design to make it
better that it currently is. For instance, a lot of
rest homes won't let their clients advanced conversations about getting
into the process, and that's called organizational conscientious objection. That
sort of thing should be debated, don't you think, I.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Think around the edges of this, You're actually right, that's
where the tension will arise. So how the acts being implemented,
the safeguards around it, the restrictions that are in place,
and how that works. I'm always the intention an ability
to participate in news of Asia was always voluntary. That
was always the intention. I believe that's the way it
(01:51):
should be. And yeah, there are absolutely certain certain facilities
for a number of reasons don't want to engage in that.
But again I suppose the reason for doing a review
like that is to uncover those type of issues and
to see how this has been operating and if there
are any things there that we should be thinking about
going forward.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
And surely at the heart of this whole issue is
personal responsibility. It's the ultimate personal responsibility, So it should
be down to the individual themselves rather than the organization
that might be you know, accommodating them at any one time.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
I think there's a lot of there's a number of
arguments around that, both for that approach and against that approach. Again,
you know a number of practitioners, health practitioners and organizations
have taken a particular stance against euthanasia as such, and
is their right to do that. So I think this
(02:47):
is an ongoing debate, It will be an ongoing issue
as we go forward, and one that we need to
engage in. But my comment around that, as well as
often the argument around that, is that lod of care
services per se in this country are not fully funded
or adequately funded, and there should be equal weight given
(03:07):
to two proper funded health care service and advice. And
that's part of what pluts around this as well.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Absolutely, just look at some of the issues that were
raised when we first discussed all this. Now that it
has been in place for three years, have there been
any issues with coesition?
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Look that Again, the reason they're doing a review like
that is to pick up on any of those type
of issues. But certainly, I certainly haven't come across any
concerns raised in the sector around that. So again I
go back to my original comment that the actors that
was put into place and the safeguards were put around those,
but for reasonably rigorous in terms of what was done,
(03:49):
seems to be working.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
And has it had any effect on our suicide rates?
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Look, I couldn't comment on those rates, Andrew, so I
wouldn't know. Now.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
At the end of the day, the government will not
make changes to the act no matter what the review says. However,
then political parties can progress changes through members' bills, So
if there were going to be any changes to the legislation,
it might take years if at all.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
That's the process that's in place. If that was to happen,
then it becomes a conscious folk generally in the Parliament
because of the nature of of this of euthanasia and
what actually happens the end of life, So it's a
be amotive area obviously, But yeah, that is the process
is in place, and that's what's been put in place
at this point.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
So I guess you could say though, the good thing
is that the process is working quite well right now
and there isn't an urgent need to make a change,
because even if we wanted to make a change, we
couldn't do it urgently.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
Look, I think that's probably a fair summation of the
situation that it does seem to have worked in the
way it was intended. There doesn't seem to be a
huge urgency to review or change anything, so we probably
are in a reasonable space at this point.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
Brian Betted to Brian Betty, Cheer of General Practice and
New Zealand, I thank you for your time.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
For more from Hither Duplessy, Allen Drive, listen live to
news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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