Shayne Currie: NZME editor-at-large on Google threatening to pull out of New Zealand over Fair Digital News Bargaining Bill

Tech giant Google is being accused of playing hardball with the Government and media companies over the Fair Digital News Bargaining Bill.

The bill would force Google to pay for the journalism and news content that help drive its business model.

NZME editor-at-large Shayne Currie says it's unlikely Google will pull away from New Zealand altogether - despite the company's threats.

"They will certainly be reviewing their stance - they've actually said publicly in their submission to Parliament for the Fair Digital News Bill that they will need to review operations in New Zealand if the bill goes ahead."

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Feather due to see it. There are reports that Google
is threatening to pull out of New Zealand altogether because
of the government's plan to make it pay media companies
for news content. Clearly not happy about this. Endzed Me
media columnist Shane Curry broke the news this morning and
he's with us now, Hey, Shane, They're not going to
pull out, are they?

Speaker 2 (00:16):
I don't think so. But you know, in any negotiations
like this, they will certainly be reviewing their stants. They've
actually said publicly in their submission to Parliament for the
Fair Digital News Bill that they will need to review
operations in New Zealand if the bill goes ahead. And
of course we know the bill is going to go ahead.
National has picked it up and so Google quite rightly,

(00:37):
quite expectedly, is now maneuvering its position.

Speaker 1 (00:40):
But review operations could mean anything, couldn't It could mean
taking away the news tabs or whatever they do, pulling
out all together. What's the most.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
Absolutely absolutely right now. They have a lot of deals
with media companies, are very proud of those, and that
includes you know, the likes of ented Me stuff, spin
Off Newsroom. They all have deals where they get a
little bit of money to display their news and what
they call the Google News showcase. The publishers argue, although
none of them are actually talking because they have lots

(01:09):
of non disclosure agreements, but industry sources are telling me that,
you know, they expect the publishers expect to receive a
lot more money as a result of the Fair Digital
News Bill, and so that's why you know, they've been
amping for that for so long. That's why the government
has listened, and that's why Google is angry.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
Okay, Now, Google has up to now been the good guys,
right because Facebook have been the bad guys, shutting down
operations and places like Canada. Google's been the good guys.
Are they putting that at risk with threats like this?

Speaker 2 (01:35):
I think Google have certainly, compared to Meta, compared to Facebook,
have certainly been a lot more forthright and supportive of
the New Zealand media industry. And that's just as a
casual observer, as a media columnist. You know, I talk
to exex all the time and Google have certainly been supportive.
But as I say, that's also there's been a lot
of pr around that. If you look at the deals

(01:58):
that they've done in Australia and even Canada. There's a
lot more money that's at state here that can be
I think they made a million. They made a billion
dollars last year in New Zealand. We're talking here at
the moment. They fund New Zealand media companies with their
different initiatives and sothing to the tune of just a
few several million dollars.

Speaker 1 (02:15):
Really only several not even tear.

Speaker 2 (02:17):
Again, it's all part of a non disclosure agreement. No
one is telling me the exacts are.

Speaker 1 (02:21):
Title, aren't they really about?

Speaker 2 (02:24):
What is interesting now is Google is going straight to Goldsmith,
straight to Luxen and writing to them directly about you
know that even though the bill is now passing through Parliament,
Google is still in their ears. The cabinet paper hasn't
been released. It was expected to be released last month.
The government's holding off on releasing it for some reason,
and so we've got Official Information Act requests in for
that kind of thing. But certainly the officials and Willington.

Speaker 1 (02:46):
Scrambling, tell me what you think. Okay, this hasn't worked,
I would argue in any anywhere else where it's been tried.
Australia and Canada is going to work now.

Speaker 2 (02:52):
It is working. It is working. Whereas I know, there's
a lot of controversy about a lot of comment, but
there's certainly a lot more money now being given to
the media companies where dividually Australia Canada. You can't say
the poll of money in Canada.

Speaker 1 (03:03):
I mean you've got tiny little media outlets falling over
because the I've got the Facebook train, They've got.

Speaker 2 (03:07):
A hunt that there's now a pool. Even though Google
is exempt from that law. Yeah, they have still agreed
to one hundred million dollars a year to publishers in Canada.
I know they're exempt, but that is one hundred million
dollars more than they were getting previous.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
Okay, So you would argue that in both of these
jurisdictions this law is well.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
Google and Australia's doing their own individual deals.

Speaker 1 (03:26):
Yes.

Speaker 2 (03:26):
Yeah, as a result of that legislation, Google has had
to come to the negotiation.

Speaker 1 (03:29):
Table and it will work here, yes, Okay.

Speaker 2 (03:32):
And my view, guys, well, why not have a view.

Speaker 1 (03:34):
You've been around long enough to have a view. Shane,
thank you. I appreciate your take on it. That's Shane Curry,
who's en Zigmy's media columnists. You can catches media inside
it all the time. I don't know if it comes
out her regularly. It just comes out all the time,
and it's brilliant.

Speaker 2 (03:46):
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