January 23, 2025 • 9 mins
Tonight on The Huddle, AUT chancellor Rob Campbell and Infrastructure NZ CEO Nick Leggett joined in on a discussion about the following issues of the day - and more!
The Prime Minister has outlined his plans to grow the economy in his State of the Nation address today - do we agree with these changes? Can more foreign investment, more mining and a restructure of the Crown Research Institutes turn things around?
Labour leader Chris Hipkins has also been quick to suggest Labour can come back and take over in the next election - do we agree with this?
President Donald Trump has threatened Vladimir Putin to make a deal and end the Ukraine war or 'risk the consequences'. Do we think this tactic will work? What might this mean for Ukraine?
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Huddle with New Zealand Southerby's International Realty, local and
global exposure like no other.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
And on the huddle today we've got Rob Campbell, aut
Chancellor and former Health New Zealand chair and Nick Leggett
Infrastructure New Zealand Chief Executive. Gentlemen, good afternoon to you.
All right, So the Prime Minister laid out has planned
to grow the economy in the State of the Nation
speech today and he mentioned forming a new government agency,
which was slightly ridiculed by the taxpayers unions because you know,
(00:31):
this is a government agency and they don't like more
public servants. But what do you make of the idea,
Rob Campbell? Is this a good thing?
Speaker 3 (00:40):
I don't often agree with the taxpayers Union, but they're right.
I mean, it's frankly laughable. There are huge amounts of
capital around the world and sovereign funds and in private hands,
and it constantly that capital constantly scours the world looking
for opportunities to invest. The idea that they had to
decisions are going to be in any way influenced by
(01:02):
some tim pot little new agency formed in New Zealand
to draw attention to this country and what we think
are opportunities is frankly laughable.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
What do you think, Nick, And remind you I did
talk to Tom McLay before he said he's going to
go around the world and shoulder tap already influential New
Zealanders to be part of this agency to go out
and do this and this is what happens in Ireland
and Singapore.
Speaker 4 (01:30):
Yeah, well, look, I agree with the Prime Minister's diagnosis.
We're very good at saying no to things in this country.
In terms of the solution, I am concerned that a
new agency has been seen as the way the truth
and the life. Look, it's questionable, right. I'm also worried,
(01:51):
you know, what are our settings, our fundamental settings for
a foreign investment? Like here are there projects? They're businesses
that are ready to take capital and to grow. It's
fine having the welcome at out, but the door's got
to be open when the person comes down the mat.
And it's really I think a chant for the government
(02:14):
to project a long term vision for where the country
needs to go and to remember there's significant pools of
capital onshore that we should be utilizing as well as
foreign investment.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
Andrew, this stuff is really a joke and it's been
going on. The previous government, Frankie wasn't much better at it.
You might recall them bringing in a two billion dollar
fund to invest in sustainable energy projects not long ago.
One investment from that crowd. It didn't go too good.
They've scarp it off. This whole idea that it's sort
of a cargo cult mentality that success of New Zealand
(02:50):
governments have had that there is this money around the
world that can be brought in to solve our problems.
And frankly, it's an excuse. It's never right and it's
not going to be right this time.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
A bit of a point there, Rob, because I think
Christoph Luxan has often said the governments can't pick winners.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
Yeah, thinking pick losers. They're quite good at that.
Speaker 4 (03:09):
They're very good at that.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Okay, gentlemen, we're back in a few months time. It
is a huddle with Robin Nick.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
The huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty Elevator Marketing
of your Home.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
With Rob Campbell and Nick Leggett. And it is now
twelve to six and we've talked about national in their
state of the nation. Of course that Labour's been meeting
as well, and Chris Hipkins has been talking and he
said we over promised and we underdelivered, and we're promising
now that our phone is back on the hook and
we're ready to go. So have you seen any evidence.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Nick, Yeah, I have.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
I mean the first bit of evidence that people are
listening is the Courier poll that came out last week
that showed that Labor were ahead of National for the
first time since the election. Now it's but one poll,
of course, but I think it shows that the uncertain
economic environment means that people will be interested in what
(04:05):
Labour's got to say. I've been watching and listening very
closely to Barbara Edmonds, certainly in the finance and infrastructure areas.
You know, she hasn't been barking at every passing car.
She supported a lot of Chris Bishop's very sensible system changes,
and she's thinking very carefully about tax about the way
(04:27):
the New Zealand economy needs to operate the way that
I know Labour doing whide of thinking about how climate
and the economy can better work together. What I think
the nation is going to be looking for is economic
certainty from either the current government or an opposition government.
But I think Labor I've got to show they've done
(04:48):
some big thinking that their answer to everything is not
restructuring government departments and bureaucratic change. That's not transformation. Transformation
is actually impacting people's lives, so the better, and I
think that's what New Zealanders are interested in.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
But that poll, was it actually proof that they're getting better?
Or was it just that of course, National's in charge
of a failing economy because we've got in Australia Peter.
But Peter Duttin is now the preferred prime minister over
Albanesi and that's pretty much purely and simply because Albanesi
is in charge of a stuttering economy.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
Well, the old adage is that governments lose elections, oppositions
don't would them.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
That's true, So that doesn't necessarily mean that Labor's any better.
So what do you think, Rob.
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Well, I think it's just another version what I'm hearing
from Chris Hopkins, just another version of I'm less of
a cock up than the other guys, which is not
the way that New Zealand's going to dig dig its
way out of its problems. So Labor has to focus
on not just what it thinks of the popular issues.
(05:51):
It's got to focus on the way that this economy
can in the modern world where there is a climate
crisis where the people like to accept it on not
where there is incredible geopolitical uncertainty, and where there is
a really damaging level of inequality of not just income
but wealth and power. It has to present a view
(06:13):
of how New Zealand can prosper in that world. And
that's not just from some kind of minor adjustments around
the edge. In amongst that, they've got to put forward
some proposals that make some short term benefit to people,
but it has to be within a long term context.
The worst thing about and they're repeating it, in my opinion,
(06:34):
the worst thing about what the current government is doing
is that it is pretending to people that they can
have genuine better certainty and security and living standards from
playing around with the edges, with these new things like
mining and all that sort of carry on. It's just
a repeat of what we've done before. It won't work
and they all frankly know it, and I think it's
(06:56):
very disappointing that Labor is seeking to repeat that.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Well, talking about to your politics. Donald Trump has come
out and threatened that to be and Putin to go
out there, make a deal boy, and end the Ukraine War.
So do you think this is a good tactic or
could the deal look terrible for the Ukraine?
Speaker 4 (07:11):
Nick, Well, that's I think the risk and the fear
of anybody who's listened to Donald Trump's rhetoric on Ukraine
over the last months. But to be fair to Donald Trump,
what he said previously and now what he's saying as
president to Russia appears to be somewhat different. It sounded
(07:36):
as though he was sort of going to meet in
the middle and that Ukraine had have to sort of
lose a bit to get a sort of a peace
set on one. But he is talking tougher to Putin now.
Whether that is, of course just bluster, because we know
Trump's never met a political tyrant that he hasn't fancied.
Whether or not that's the case, we will see. But
(07:57):
I have to say I've been more optimistic and what
I've from Trump on this in the last twenty four hours,
but I just I think it's too unpredictable and really
there is too much for Europe and the West and
the allies around the world to lose if Ukraine fools
(08:17):
in an unjust way, and we can't afford for that
to happen many of us.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
What do you reckon, Rob Well.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
I am in favor of anything that brings peace and
stops people bombing one another. Frankly, so I hope that
there is some substance to it, as I hope the
substance in many of the other conflicts around the world.
But I'm apprehensive that anything that Donald Trump does will
be allied to an increase in American power and influence
(08:47):
in the world. And I don't think that that is
something that we need to be encouraging. But if there's
a peace process, if it's a negotiated peace process, then
the world should participate in it, not just have it
sorted out amongst three irons.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
Good stuff, Rob Campbell and Nick Leckett, thank you for
your thoughts.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to
news Talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
The Huddle with New Zealand Southerby's International Realty, local and
global exposure like no other.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
And on the huddle today we've got Rob Campbell, aut
Chancellor and former Health New Zealand chair and Nick Leggett
Infrastructure New Zealand Chief Executive. Gentlemen, good afternoon to you.
All right, So the Prime Minister laid out has planned
to grow the economy in the State of the Nation
speech today and he mentioned forming a new government agency,
which was slightly ridiculed by the taxpayers unions because you know,
(00:31):
this is a government agency and they don't like more
public servants. But what do you make of the idea,
Rob Campbell? Is this a good thing?
Speaker 3 (00:40):
I don't often agree with the taxpayers Union, but they're right.
I mean, it's frankly laughable. There are huge amounts of
capital around the world and sovereign funds and in private hands,
and it constantly that capital constantly scours the world looking
for opportunities to invest. The idea that they had to
decisions are going to be in any way influenced by
(01:02):
some tim pot little new agency formed in New Zealand
to draw attention to this country and what we think
are opportunities is frankly laughable.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
What do you think, Nick, And remind you I did
talk to Tom McLay before he said he's going to
go around the world and shoulder tap already influential New
Zealanders to be part of this agency to go out
and do this and this is what happens in Ireland
and Singapore.
Speaker 4 (01:30):
Yeah, well, look, I agree with the Prime Minister's diagnosis.
We're very good at saying no to things in this country.
In terms of the solution, I am concerned that a
new agency has been seen as the way the truth
and the life. Look, it's questionable, right. I'm also worried,
(01:51):
you know, what are our settings, our fundamental settings for
a foreign investment? Like here are there projects? They're businesses
that are ready to take capital and to grow. It's
fine having the welcome at out, but the door's got
to be open when the person comes down the mat.
And it's really I think a chant for the government
(02:14):
to project a long term vision for where the country
needs to go and to remember there's significant pools of
capital onshore that we should be utilizing as well as
foreign investment.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
Andrew, this stuff is really a joke and it's been
going on. The previous government, Frankie wasn't much better at it.
You might recall them bringing in a two billion dollar
fund to invest in sustainable energy projects not long ago.
One investment from that crowd. It didn't go too good.
They've scarp it off. This whole idea that it's sort
of a cargo cult mentality that success of New Zealand
(02:50):
governments have had that there is this money around the
world that can be brought in to solve our problems.
And frankly, it's an excuse. It's never right and it's
not going to be right this time.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
A bit of a point there, Rob, because I think
Christoph Luxan has often said the governments can't pick winners.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
Yeah, thinking pick losers. They're quite good at that.
Speaker 4 (03:09):
They're very good at that.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Okay, gentlemen, we're back in a few months time. It
is a huddle with Robin Nick.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
The huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty Elevator Marketing
of your Home.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
With Rob Campbell and Nick Leggett. And it is now
twelve to six and we've talked about national in their
state of the nation. Of course that Labour's been meeting
as well, and Chris Hipkins has been talking and he
said we over promised and we underdelivered, and we're promising
now that our phone is back on the hook and
we're ready to go. So have you seen any evidence.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Nick, Yeah, I have.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
I mean the first bit of evidence that people are
listening is the Courier poll that came out last week
that showed that Labor were ahead of National for the
first time since the election. Now it's but one poll,
of course, but I think it shows that the uncertain
economic environment means that people will be interested in what
(04:05):
Labour's got to say. I've been watching and listening very
closely to Barbara Edmonds, certainly in the finance and infrastructure areas.
You know, she hasn't been barking at every passing car.
She supported a lot of Chris Bishop's very sensible system changes,
and she's thinking very carefully about tax about the way
(04:27):
the New Zealand economy needs to operate the way that
I know Labour doing whide of thinking about how climate
and the economy can better work together. What I think
the nation is going to be looking for is economic
certainty from either the current government or an opposition government.
But I think Labor I've got to show they've done
(04:48):
some big thinking that their answer to everything is not
restructuring government departments and bureaucratic change. That's not transformation. Transformation
is actually impacting people's lives, so the better, and I
think that's what New Zealanders are interested in.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
But that poll, was it actually proof that they're getting better?
Or was it just that of course, National's in charge
of a failing economy because we've got in Australia Peter.
But Peter Duttin is now the preferred prime minister over
Albanesi and that's pretty much purely and simply because Albanesi
is in charge of a stuttering economy.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
Well, the old adage is that governments lose elections, oppositions
don't would them.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
That's true, So that doesn't necessarily mean that Labor's any better.
So what do you think, Rob.
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Well, I think it's just another version what I'm hearing
from Chris Hopkins, just another version of I'm less of
a cock up than the other guys, which is not
the way that New Zealand's going to dig dig its
way out of its problems. So Labor has to focus
on not just what it thinks of the popular issues.
(05:51):
It's got to focus on the way that this economy
can in the modern world where there is a climate
crisis where the people like to accept it on not
where there is incredible geopolitical uncertainty, and where there is
a really damaging level of inequality of not just income
but wealth and power. It has to present a view
(06:13):
of how New Zealand can prosper in that world. And
that's not just from some kind of minor adjustments around
the edge. In amongst that, they've got to put forward
some proposals that make some short term benefit to people,
but it has to be within a long term context.
The worst thing about and they're repeating it, in my opinion,
(06:34):
the worst thing about what the current government is doing
is that it is pretending to people that they can
have genuine better certainty and security and living standards from
playing around with the edges, with these new things like
mining and all that sort of carry on. It's just
a repeat of what we've done before. It won't work
and they all frankly know it, and I think it's
(06:56):
very disappointing that Labor is seeking to repeat that.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Well, talking about to your politics. Donald Trump has come
out and threatened that to be and Putin to go
out there, make a deal boy, and end the Ukraine War.
So do you think this is a good tactic or
could the deal look terrible for the Ukraine?
Speaker 4 (07:11):
Nick, Well, that's I think the risk and the fear
of anybody who's listened to Donald Trump's rhetoric on Ukraine
over the last months. But to be fair to Donald Trump,
what he said previously and now what he's saying as
president to Russia appears to be somewhat different. It sounded
(07:36):
as though he was sort of going to meet in
the middle and that Ukraine had have to sort of
lose a bit to get a sort of a peace
set on one. But he is talking tougher to Putin now.
Whether that is, of course just bluster, because we know
Trump's never met a political tyrant that he hasn't fancied.
Whether or not that's the case, we will see. But
(07:57):
I have to say I've been more optimistic and what
I've from Trump on this in the last twenty four hours,
but I just I think it's too unpredictable and really
there is too much for Europe and the West and
the allies around the world to lose if Ukraine fools
(08:17):
in an unjust way, and we can't afford for that
to happen many of us.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
What do you reckon, Rob Well.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
I am in favor of anything that brings peace and
stops people bombing one another. Frankly, so I hope that
there is some substance to it, as I hope the
substance in many of the other conflicts around the world.
But I'm apprehensive that anything that Donald Trump does will
be allied to an increase in American power and influence
(08:47):
in the world. And I don't think that that is
something that we need to be encouraging. But if there's
a peace process, if it's a negotiated peace process, then
the world should participate in it, not just have it
sorted out amongst three irons.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
Good stuff, Rob Campbell and Nick Leckett, thank you for
your thoughts.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to
news Talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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