Fleur Fitzsimons: PSA National Secretary on the new legislation impacting workers taking part in partial strikes

Workers taking part in partial strikes could soon have their pay docked under new legislation coming out of Parliament.

Workplace Relations and Safety Minister Brooke van Velden recently confirmed the changes to the Employment Relations Act - and claimed they would be fairer for workers.

PSA National Secretary Fleur Fitzsimons says employers will now be allowed to dock 10 percent of pay for workers who participate in low-level strike action.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now workers taking part impartial strikes could soon have their
pay docked. Legislation passed in Parliament last night. Now, the
law was changed by the previous government in twenty eighteen
that stopped the docking of the pay. Now it's been
reversed in recent years. We've seen the teachers and the
train drivers in the end ZDF stuff all engage impartial strikes.
Flurfit Simons is the PSA's National secretary and with us now.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
Hey, flur good evening, Heather.

Speaker 1 (00:22):
Okay, so what is the docking of the pay ten percent?

Speaker 2 (00:26):
Yes, so there is the opportunity now for employers to
dock pay for up to ten percent for workers who
take partial strike action. So that's quite low level strike action,
usually at the beginning of a dispute, in an effort
to try and make the employer understand that are serious
and that they would like to settle the issue.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
Is it partial strikes or does that Is it just
partial strikes or is it also working to rule.

Speaker 2 (00:50):
Well, that's still to be decided and that there is
a lot of legal action that will result. Is part
of this new legislation that come in. We certainly think
that workers shouldn't have their paydoct when they're simply working
to roll or taking their breaks at the same time.
But whether the employers do that and whether the courts

(01:11):
uphold it will something will be something to be seen.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
Ah Okay, so it's clear that partial strikes are affected,
but it is possible that working to rule is not affected.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Well, that's the argument that we're making. I'm not sure
the government has the same position.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
But do you believe the government wants to dock the pay,
wants to allow employers to dock the pay of people
who are working to rule?

Speaker 2 (01:33):
Yeah, I think that is their intention. And actually all
of this is about undermining the power that workers have
to advance their interests and see better wages and conditions.
And we already have quite a major power and balance
in this country between workers and employers, and employers have
lots of tools available to them to impose conditions which

(01:54):
are not there. And that's why we have a problem
with low wages in New Zealand.

Speaker 1 (01:58):
The reason I keep asking about the work to rules
because that would be very unfair. I mean, my understanding
of working to rule you know more than me, But
it's basically just turning up and doing the job. As
per your contract, right, so you would only be doing
what you are supposed to do for your full pay,
isn't that right?

Speaker 2 (02:14):
Yeah, that's exactly right. And we know that so many
New Zealand workers put in extra time at longer hours
than they're paid for. And at the moment, if you
do decide collectively to work to rule, that is a
form of strike action, and you do have to run
a secret ballot for it, and it can be very
disruptive because employers rely on it. The government thinks that

(02:34):
this still gives them the right to deduct for that
will be contesting that in the courts, I imagine. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:39):
Okay, Now, is there any indication that there have been
more strikes as a result of employers being unable to
doc pay in the last few years?

Speaker 2 (02:48):
No, there heaven. And actually it's worth remembering that the
vast majority of collective agreements in New Zealand are settled
without being any industrial action, and workers in unions employers
and they negotiate every day and come to agreements, and
no worker takes a decision to take strike action lightly.
It's a very serious, considered decision and really, what we

(03:10):
think this will do is probably lead to more full
stoppages because the ability to take partial strike action at
that low level is significantly reduced.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
Now I see flur Thank you very much, appreciate your time.
It's Flurford Sigmon's PSA National Secretary. For more from Heather
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