July 2, 2025 • 6 mins
Labour leader Chris Hipkins raised a few eyebrows after he offered his theory about why ram-raids don't get as much media coverage anymore.
In an earlier interview on ZB's Wellington Mornings, Chris Hipkins claimed NZME's 'Tory owners' decided not to put ram-raids on the front page anymore - in order to put the National Party in a better light.
NZ Herald political editor Thomas Coughlan says data shows ram-raids have dropped significantly over the last year.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thomas Coglan, the Herald's political editors, with me right now. Hello, Thomas,
good afternoon. So I want to talk to you about
what happened this morning. On Nick Mills's show This is
Wellington Mornings, Chris Hopkins was talking about ram raids. Things
took quite a turn.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
If quickly ask you there, we don't ever hear of
ram raids anymore. Is that because of the system that
you put in place? Or is it since the coalition's
come in now it's because your Tory owners that Ends
and me have just decided not to put it on
the front page anymore. It's still happening. It's just Ends
and Me have decided that it's not in the government's
best interests. And they do the National parties singing for them,
so they are. They're not covering it as much anymore.
(00:32):
Oh gosh, that's a bit tough to jog. Do you
think that that.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Is he saying that with a straight face.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Well, fortunately with radio you can't really tell. But I'm
honestly it's look, obviously, I'm deeply conflicted here being someone
who works for the company that puts together that front page.
But I did pull together some stats on those ram raids.
So in twenty twenty two we were having about fifty
(01:00):
nine RAM raids a month. So twenty thirty two, the
last year of full year of the Labor government, seven
hundred and fourteen ram raids that year. Now we've had
forty five ram raids total this year, about nine ram
raids a month for each month that we have data.
So so the reason I don't put together the front page,
(01:20):
and so I don't know what what how it's put together,
but I would imagine the reason why there aren't so
many ram raids on the front page is that there
are just far fewer ram raids. And you know, the
government's not perfect, but one area you would.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Say that to defend your owners.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
Yes, we're also I mean we're a publicly traded company,
so that so many people own stocks and enzer the
me and I'm sure some of them are Tories and
some of them are not Tories. It's it is part
of being a listed company.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
So is this chippy just kind of you know, just
just riffing or is this part of strategy?
Speaker 3 (01:55):
Well, it's I mean, it's interesting. It's interesting that he
leaned into this thing because that IPSOS issues monitor that
came out a few months ago. Labor is ahead of
the government on most issues that are affecting voters, cost
of living, even inflation, housing areas where labor traditionally does
not lead national. One area where labor is behind national
(02:17):
still is on law and order. So it is maybe
he's looking for an excuse to explain why labor's behind
national and law and order. The government is obviously making
a big virtue of law and order this week, but
look of what you know. You can't Crime statistics are
a mercurial thing, but it is difficult to fudge these numbers.
The RAM raids to be fear to the government, they've
(02:39):
had a massive success in bringing those down, and to
be fear to labor. Ram raids dropped by it was
seven hundred and fourteen in twenty two and they dropped
to four hundred and ninety five and twenty three, so
that they did start coming down under labor too.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
But what about what about blaming the media, because this,
I think is a fascinating thing. Right, this has been
going on. Parties across the spectrum have been doing it.
Just Cinda pulled out of the interviews with Mike. You've
had new Zealand first deliberately deliberately trying to bait our
n Z into arguments you've had, act refusing to go
on morning report you've had now the Labor Party have
(03:13):
a crack at end Z meet like it feels to
me like it suits. You're certainly seeing enough of it
for me to think that it could potentially be a
strategy to have a crack at at whichever media organization
you feel as your enemy.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
I certainly agree to me. It always feels like like
blaming the ref. And now, obviously you know reefs do
get things wrong, the media gets things wrong, but everyone
knows that it's usually not the ref that causes the
game to go one way or the other. A good
team will prevail in more games than not because of
(03:48):
their performance rather than the ref. And I think it's
the same in politics. You know that the media will
get things right sometimes, they'll get things wrong sometimes, but
if you've got the solutions, then you'll be able.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Having said that, provoked Thomas, I mean you and I
both work in this industry, in the sector, right we
understand that we are gatekeepers and that there is a
fair amount of blame to be laid at the feet
of people who are choosing the news angles, choosing the subjects,
deciding deciding how to write the thing, choosing what words
to use.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Right, absolutely, and like I'm not you know that with
with this, I think it's fair to point out that
I just think that the data doesn't really batter what
Chris that's saying. But you know, I back all politicians
publicly grumbling about about things, specific things that they don't like.
I think it's you know, the media does have a
(04:37):
powerful role to playing society, and politicians of every right
if they don't think that something's been handled appropriately to
call it out, you.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
Make a fair point. It's just Chippy has chosen a
bad example because actually he just his government just let
the rand rays happen, didn't they? Yes, okay, listen, talk
me through this business with New Zealand First and the flags.
Okay they want to. They've got as a private member's
bill where it would only allow the New Zealand flag
to be flown on government buildings.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
What what's going they would? I tried to get in
touch with the New Zealand First before coming on the show.
They didn't return my call. The the yessue they have
is that the spudin me that the legislation, it's Andy
Foster's Members Bill would ban symbols and flags of politically
motivated ideology and division from being displayed on government buildings
and the words of Winston Peters. One of the issues
(05:21):
that the party has had and passed has been the
display of the Pride flag, the transgender flag outside parliament.
You know the big line of flagpoles outside Parliament. They
display a number of flags. You know, it's sort of
whatever particular week or issue it is, you know, the
Pride month and then there's you know, other months. You
know what it's like, the Parliament tends to display those flags.
(05:43):
New Zealand First has raised issues with that in the past.
This would basically ban that would also bean bean non
national flags from local authority buildings and state schools, only
the official flag of New Zealand. So it seems like
a wee bit of an overreaction if you ask me.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
But however, they are a nationalistic party and this is
this is you.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Know, I think you'd want to you'd want to allow like,
you know, like local local government should be able to
display you know, the absolutely positively Wellington flag. No No,
It's sadly.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
I vote in favor of taking more decisions away from
local government, absolutely not giving them any more. Thomas, you
are such a soft touch. Thank you man, I really
appreciate it. Thomas Coglan, the Herald's Political Edit.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
For more from Heather Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to
news Talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
Thomas Coglan, the Herald's political editors, with me right now. Hello, Thomas,
good afternoon. So I want to talk to you about
what happened this morning. On Nick Mills's show This is
Wellington Mornings, Chris Hopkins was talking about ram raids. Things
took quite a turn.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
If quickly ask you there, we don't ever hear of
ram raids anymore. Is that because of the system that
you put in place? Or is it since the coalition's
come in now it's because your Tory owners that Ends
and me have just decided not to put it on
the front page anymore. It's still happening. It's just Ends
and Me have decided that it's not in the government's
best interests. And they do the National parties singing for them,
so they are. They're not covering it as much anymore.
(00:32):
Oh gosh, that's a bit tough to jog. Do you
think that that.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Is he saying that with a straight face.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Well, fortunately with radio you can't really tell. But I'm
honestly it's look, obviously, I'm deeply conflicted here being someone
who works for the company that puts together that front page.
But I did pull together some stats on those ram raids.
So in twenty twenty two we were having about fifty
(01:00):
nine RAM raids a month. So twenty thirty two, the
last year of full year of the Labor government, seven
hundred and fourteen ram raids that year. Now we've had
forty five ram raids total this year, about nine ram
raids a month for each month that we have data.
So so the reason I don't put together the front page,
(01:20):
and so I don't know what what how it's put together,
but I would imagine the reason why there aren't so
many ram raids on the front page is that there
are just far fewer ram raids. And you know, the
government's not perfect, but one area you would.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Say that to defend your owners.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
Yes, we're also I mean we're a publicly traded company,
so that so many people own stocks and enzer the
me and I'm sure some of them are Tories and
some of them are not Tories. It's it is part
of being a listed company.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
So is this chippy just kind of you know, just
just riffing or is this part of strategy?
Speaker 3 (01:55):
Well, it's I mean, it's interesting. It's interesting that he
leaned into this thing because that IPSOS issues monitor that
came out a few months ago. Labor is ahead of
the government on most issues that are affecting voters, cost
of living, even inflation, housing areas where labor traditionally does
not lead national. One area where labor is behind national
(02:17):
still is on law and order. So it is maybe
he's looking for an excuse to explain why labor's behind
national and law and order. The government is obviously making
a big virtue of law and order this week, but
look of what you know. You can't Crime statistics are
a mercurial thing, but it is difficult to fudge these numbers.
The RAM raids to be fear to the government, they've
(02:39):
had a massive success in bringing those down, and to
be fear to labor. Ram raids dropped by it was
seven hundred and fourteen in twenty two and they dropped
to four hundred and ninety five and twenty three, so
that they did start coming down under labor too.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
But what about what about blaming the media, because this,
I think is a fascinating thing. Right, this has been
going on. Parties across the spectrum have been doing it.
Just Cinda pulled out of the interviews with Mike. You've
had new Zealand first deliberately deliberately trying to bait our
n Z into arguments you've had, act refusing to go
on morning report you've had now the Labor Party have
(03:13):
a crack at end Z meet like it feels to
me like it suits. You're certainly seeing enough of it
for me to think that it could potentially be a
strategy to have a crack at at whichever media organization
you feel as your enemy.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
I certainly agree to me. It always feels like like
blaming the ref. And now, obviously you know reefs do
get things wrong, the media gets things wrong, but everyone
knows that it's usually not the ref that causes the
game to go one way or the other. A good
team will prevail in more games than not because of
(03:48):
their performance rather than the ref. And I think it's
the same in politics. You know that the media will
get things right sometimes, they'll get things wrong sometimes, but
if you've got the solutions, then you'll be able.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Having said that, provoked Thomas, I mean you and I
both work in this industry, in the sector, right we
understand that we are gatekeepers and that there is a
fair amount of blame to be laid at the feet
of people who are choosing the news angles, choosing the subjects,
deciding deciding how to write the thing, choosing what words
to use.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Right, absolutely, and like I'm not you know that with
with this, I think it's fair to point out that
I just think that the data doesn't really batter what
Chris that's saying. But you know, I back all politicians
publicly grumbling about about things, specific things that they don't like.
I think it's you know, the media does have a
(04:37):
powerful role to playing society, and politicians of every right
if they don't think that something's been handled appropriately to
call it out, you.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
Make a fair point. It's just Chippy has chosen a
bad example because actually he just his government just let
the rand rays happen, didn't they? Yes, okay, listen, talk
me through this business with New Zealand First and the flags.
Okay they want to. They've got as a private member's
bill where it would only allow the New Zealand flag
to be flown on government buildings.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
What what's going they would? I tried to get in
touch with the New Zealand First before coming on the show.
They didn't return my call. The the yessue they have
is that the spudin me that the legislation, it's Andy
Foster's Members Bill would ban symbols and flags of politically
motivated ideology and division from being displayed on government buildings
and the words of Winston Peters. One of the issues
(05:21):
that the party has had and passed has been the
display of the Pride flag, the transgender flag outside parliament.
You know the big line of flagpoles outside Parliament. They
display a number of flags. You know, it's sort of
whatever particular week or issue it is, you know, the
Pride month and then there's you know, other months. You
know what it's like, the Parliament tends to display those flags.
(05:43):
New Zealand First has raised issues with that in the past.
This would basically ban that would also bean bean non
national flags from local authority buildings and state schools, only
the official flag of New Zealand. So it seems like
a wee bit of an overreaction if you ask me.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
But however, they are a nationalistic party and this is
this is you.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Know, I think you'd want to you'd want to allow like,
you know, like local local government should be able to
display you know, the absolutely positively Wellington flag. No No,
It's sadly.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
I vote in favor of taking more decisions away from
local government, absolutely not giving them any more. Thomas, you
are such a soft touch. Thank you man, I really
appreciate it. Thomas Coglan, the Herald's Political Edit.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
For more from Heather Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to
news Talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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