Kevin Clements: Otago University Emeritus Peace and Conflict Studies professor on NZ's place in the Global Peace Index

New Zealand has risen two spots to third place in this year's Global Peace Index. 

Countries are ranked based on measures including societal safety and security, and the degree of militarisation. 

We currently sit behind Iceland and Ireland, and ahead of Austria and Switzerland. 

Otago University Emeritus Peace and Conflict Studies professor Kevin Clements says recent defence purchases could count against us next year. 

He says New Zealand's never not been in the top five. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now New Zealand has jumped up the Global Peace Index,
up two spots. We're now ranked third in the world.
Goes Iceland Ireland. US. Kevin Clements is an emeritus professor
of Peace and Conflict Studies at the University of Otago
and also the chair of the Expert Advisory Panel for
the Global Peace Index and with US. Now, hey, Kevin, hi,
how are you very well? Thank you? What have we
done to go up two spots?

Speaker 2 (00:21):
Well, well, it's based on three different things. It's sort
of a measure of societal safety and security and ongoing
to Mesican national conflict and degree of militarization. And when
the data was coming in, I mean New Zealand was
not joining all the other countries immediately agreeing to kind
of a five percent defense expenditure. But we've always been

(00:42):
in the top five ever since the index was developed
in nineteen years ago. So we've moved around a little bit,
but it's always been Iceland Island, you see in Austria,
in Switzerland.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
So does it count against us that we've bought all
these helicopters and.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
Worries, Well, say, next year, main next year we may drop.

Speaker 1 (01:02):
Well, that's counterintuitive isn't it, Kevin, Because you're not going
to have peace if you can't defend your borders.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
Well no, but but you also can't have peace if
there's no social cohesion. High levels of polarization, a bad governance,
lack of free media and so forth. Piece are the
things which really can generate high levels of peacefulness and
in terms of what we understand as positive peace.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
So is there anything to the fact that all three
in the top three, being Iceland, Ireland and ourselves have
we're islands. Does that count for something?

Speaker 2 (01:34):
Well, yes, because we've got a new huge motes between us.
I mean that you know, our nearest neighbors is Australia,
and that provides you know, one one very major line
of defense. And it's true that they're all they're all islands. Austria, however,
is in Switzerland landlocked. So no, it's got more to
do with levels of militarization, high levels of state welfare,

(02:01):
education and so forth, good health systems, although these are
kind of currently under stress here. But you know, the
things which make up for social cohesion. I mean, you
can see also what happens when when you move in
a direction of heavy militarization like the US. I mean
that's now I've dropped one hundred and twenty eight out

(02:24):
of one hundred sixty three countries.

Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yeah, I see, Kevin, Thanks so much, appreciate your time.
That's Kevin Clements, Emeritus Professor of Peace and Conflict Studies
at the University of Otaga.

Speaker 2 (02:34):
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