October 6, 2025 • 11 mins
Tonight on The Huddle, Trish Sherson from Sherson Willis PR and Josie Pagani from Child Fund joined in on a discussion about the following issues of the day - and more!
Is it a good idea for the Government to show young people some tough love when it comes to the benefit? Do we think this is the way forward? And is the income threshold too low?
Winston Peters is firing back after groups of protesters kept showing up outside his house. Can new legislation fix this?
Former Reserve Bank Governor Adrian Orr is set to receive a $416,000 payout. What do we make of this?
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The huddle with New Zealand Southerby's International Realty find your
one of a Kind.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Frie Sherson of Sheerson Willis PR's on the huddle with
us and Josi Bigani, the CEO of Child Fund. Hi
you too, Hello, Hello Tris. Do you like this policy?
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Yes? I do like this policy. I think we've got
to do something differently, and I do not like the
thought of increasing numbers of younger people being left on
the scrap heap. I think it is going to be
(00:36):
tough for families, and let's be honest, this will hit
hardest families who are probably already really under pressure, So
that's really tough. And we also have to be honest
about the fact that these families probably there is a
cohort of them who are into multi generational dependency on
a benefit. So breaking that cycle isn't easy because neither
(00:59):
the parents the kids have role modeling on you know,
what it's like to go to work and what's needed.
And I also think that schools really have to play
a part because a big problem is you've got kids
coming out of schools they have just not been able
to succeed in that system, and they already come out
feeling like losers frankly, which isn't and that's through no
(01:23):
fault of their own. But it's not a great way
to start. But we can't keep going down this route.
And what we need to make sure is there is
a really clear bridge for these kids from school into
training into educational opportunities, and that there is the money
(01:44):
there to do it, because I know, you know, I've
got a daughter who's university age. A lot of kids
when they're trying to pay their own way through university,
even with allowances and things like that, it is bloody tough,
so you know, and they don't get as much support
as if they were on the doll.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Quite fairly, that's true, And I was thinking about this actually, Josie,
I think there are no perfect solutions here, right, So
what it could potentially do is drive up crime as
kids just go Jesus is too tough. I can't get
a job, it's too hard to study. I'm just going
to go join a gang or whatever. Would the solution
to this not be here's your stick, you can't get
the doll, but also an incentive will make it easier
(02:26):
for you to study.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Yeah, and the more eighteen year olds, nineteen year olds
getting a skill studying. If they need to study, that's great.
I'm just not sure if this isn't a policy in
search of a problem. The biggest problem in New Zealand
is not we've got that we've got too many eighteen
year old drop kicks living with their parents. I mean, yes,
there has always been a benefit dependency issue, which is
(02:50):
a slightly different issue, and there are some families and
you know, been on the doll for generations. But I
don't think it just feels to me like this is
something where they've gone, right, let's announce something after cabinet
and it's yet another announcement where you're going, oh, do
do we have a massive.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Prover you disagree with you. Look, you know, I've got
no time for this government and their announcements of announcements,
but I actually disagree with you on this and that
I think it's part of a suite of things that
Louise Upston is doing. The only thing that's maybe slightly
cynical here is that they've re announced it by bringing
it forward slightly. But she's actually doing that good work.
Speaker 4 (03:24):
Yeah, but also you have to look at the way
that the economy is structured in a way that both
national and labor governments have run the economy in this sense.
So let's say every one of those eighteen nineteen year
olds went and got a PhD, you would still have
about four to five percent unemployment because if it drops
below that, the way that our government's subsequent governments run
(03:47):
the economy is that they'll put interest rates up. The
Reserve Bank will put interest rates up because they think
that's a sign that the economy is overheating. So you're
probably always going to have about four to five percent unemployment.
So all you're doing is going We're going to punish
eighteen to nineteen year olds who are living at home,
and more to the point, punish the parents who already
having to buy them a house, will help them buy
(04:07):
a house and do everything. You know, and you're on
an income of sixty five k a year. That is
bugger all. So it just seems to me a problem,
a policy in search of a problem that we don't
That isn't the biggest problem. It's not going to grow
the New Zealand economy had there, and that's the biggest
problem I've got, right.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
Yeah, I mean, I'm not sure that's what it's about.
I think it's about looking at changing the incentives for
young people and basically saying that it's there is not
a pathway where you can just not get what education
and then just go on the doll and I think
that is that is fair. The areas that I worry about,
(04:46):
and this is growing up in a small town where
I did in Tomina Nui, where options are really limited
for kids and even really simple things that you need
to go to work, ie getting a driver's life since
and there have been changes around this, but even the
cost of that and the time now takes, like to
get your kids a driver's license these days you need
(05:08):
at least one parent who is into it. You've got
a registered and warranted car. This is you right, Well
I wasn't, but my husband was amazing at teaching the kids.
But that is our hours and months, and then you
have to pay for the defense of driving and all
of that stuff. And I think we have to really
understand at a very granular level what the barriers are
(05:30):
to these kids getting a job, and not least of
which what home environment that have they got that helps
them get out, get up, get out of bed in
the morning, get a kai in the tummy and go
out and do what you need.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Basically talking about social investment here. Aren't you getting in
there really early? We'll take a break, guys, and we'll
come back and talk about the protesters. An adrianaw is money.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
The huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, the global
leader and luxury real estate.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
Right, you're back of the huddle. You got Tresure and Josephcganey. Now, Joseph,
what do you think of those protests as turning up
at Winston Peter's house.
Speaker 4 (06:05):
Yeah, it's pretty ugly, isn't it. I mean, you can protest,
there's nothing against you protesting, but when you're protesting at
someone's home, it's bordering on illegal already. I mean, if
you were to cross the border into the driveway or
you know, hover around their front door or something like that,
you're getting into harassment and trespassing. But I also think
it's a sign of where our politics have gone. There's
(06:27):
a kind of movement away from a contest of ideas
where you can debate things and you can disagree, even
even loudly and rudely, but it's become about personality, So
it's like you're a bad person, you're a good person.
And that's really unhealthy because then you have this complete
inability to even debate something because they're going, no, we're
going to target you personally. And I do think it's
(06:50):
that kind of you know, we saw Justin duns made
a career post politics out of this. It's the sort
of how do you make people feel is the reason
for politics rather and what do you do? And I
think I think it's just another sign of that. And
the other thing I would say is it shows also
there's a kind of lack of curiosity amongst the protesters
(07:11):
over Gaza and Palestine to engage with anything that's contrary
to their own views of what's happening and what to do.
And there's a whole you know, peace process that's that's
been put forward. Whatever you think of it, it's our
best chance of stopping the violence. And there was a
journalist from The Times in London who went to the
demonstration yesterday in Trafalgar Square and he tried to engage
(07:33):
with people about you know, what do you think about
this proposal with Tony Blair and Trump? Okay, you don't
like Trump, but maybe it will work. You know, there
are eight Muslim countries in the region who are supporting it.
What do you think wouldn't even engage in it. Protesters
didn't want to know about it. They kicked them out,
They basically shoved them away. So I think it just
shows you a dangerous kind of protesting where you're not
(07:56):
engaging with anything that you disagree with, and you're making
it really, really personal, and it's pretty ugly.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Yeah, I think they need to stop Trish. I think
they run. They are not drawing attention to Gaza. They
are only making people cross at what they're doing, and
they're risking good will, aren't they.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Well, it's performative, isn't it that total? That's really what
this is about. It's like everything, it's driven for clicks
and views on social media. I know people who live
in the street and this has been going on for
months and months. It really has I think it's completely
wrong and I think what these groups I agree with
(08:32):
what Josie has just said, but I think what these
groups also underestimate is that one day there will be
a lunatic in one of those groups that they bring
along and they will do something really stupid and that
is a line in New Zealand that we absolutely don't
want to cross. And whatever you think about New Zealand politicians,
(08:52):
they deserve and their families deserve to feel safe like
everybody else. So I think this absolutely has to stop.
And if you think that protesting outside the House of
the Foreign Minister in New Zealand is in any way
going to change what's happening in Gaza or what will
happening or what will happen, you are absolutely barking up
(09:15):
the wrong Traluded.
Speaker 4 (09:16):
Can I just say one thing that the other day
when I was walking to the studio to come and
do a huddle, I walked past TV and Z and
there's a huge banner out there. There was a Palestine
protest out there and the huge banner said New Zealand
media stop committing genocide. And I was thinking, what do
you think the New Zealand media are doing? Like the
Newsila media are reporting on stuff, they're not actually dropping
(09:37):
bombs on Gaza. So I think people, you know, are
kind of going, hold on, guys, what are you actually
asking the New Zealand government to do here that it
isn't already doing? And you know, if there's a chance
of peace, which I think the biggest chance you've gotten
it may fail dismally. Is the peace deal that's on
the table because it has the support of Muslim countries
in the region and Palestinians, the Palestinian authority as well.
(09:59):
It's the best chance of leading to a Palestinian state,
So you know, why not engage with that?
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (10:06):
Right, okay, Now trah Adriana's got four hundred and sixteen
smackers coming at him.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
What do you think, Well, it's a lot of money,
isn't it. There's a couple of points here, so you've
talked about why have a restraint so you know who
else was going to take him? That it would cause
competitive damage to the Reserve Bank. That's one thing. There
is a legitimate restraint of trade around a cooling off period,
(10:33):
which we often talk about with ministers leaving and going lobbying.
So you might be privy to sensitive information, so you'd
have a restraint of trade to cover that. I can't
I can't see how that is applicable here, and for
someone in Adrian's role, you wouldn't go off talking about
you know, sensitive matters. The other interesting thing is you
(10:55):
can have a restraint, but you're not required to have
a dollar figure around us have to get paid. You don't.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
It's really, let's be honest, it's shut up money, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
Well? I think the question should be asked when when
was this restraint of trade? Has it always been in
the contract and in this quantum or was it something
agreed around the time of the exit?
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Very good point, I shall ask Nickola willis that okay?
Very quickly, Josie, what do you think?
Speaker 4 (11:21):
Well, I'm not sure what the government's doing here. If
you're eighteen and nineteen and you're unemployed, you're going to
have your money taken away from you now. And if
you're the Reserve Bank governor and you're unemployed, you get
four hundred k. Yeah, get your priorities right.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
You're right, Gils, thanks very much, really appreciate it. Tru
Seerson and JOSEPHCGUANNEI iur huddle.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
This evening for more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive. Listen
live to news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
The huddle with New Zealand Southerby's International Realty find your
one of a Kind.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Frie Sherson of Sheerson Willis PR's on the huddle with
us and Josi Bigani, the CEO of Child Fund. Hi
you too, Hello, Hello Tris. Do you like this policy?
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Yes? I do like this policy. I think we've got
to do something differently, and I do not like the
thought of increasing numbers of younger people being left on
the scrap heap. I think it is going to be
(00:36):
tough for families, and let's be honest, this will hit
hardest families who are probably already really under pressure, So
that's really tough. And we also have to be honest
about the fact that these families probably there is a
cohort of them who are into multi generational dependency on
a benefit. So breaking that cycle isn't easy because neither
(00:59):
the parents the kids have role modeling on you know,
what it's like to go to work and what's needed.
And I also think that schools really have to play
a part because a big problem is you've got kids
coming out of schools they have just not been able
to succeed in that system, and they already come out
feeling like losers frankly, which isn't and that's through no
(01:23):
fault of their own. But it's not a great way
to start. But we can't keep going down this route.
And what we need to make sure is there is
a really clear bridge for these kids from school into
training into educational opportunities, and that there is the money
(01:44):
there to do it, because I know, you know, I've
got a daughter who's university age. A lot of kids
when they're trying to pay their own way through university,
even with allowances and things like that, it is bloody tough,
so you know, and they don't get as much support
as if they were on the doll.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Quite fairly, that's true, And I was thinking about this actually, Josie,
I think there are no perfect solutions here, right, So
what it could potentially do is drive up crime as
kids just go Jesus is too tough. I can't get
a job, it's too hard to study. I'm just going
to go join a gang or whatever. Would the solution
to this not be here's your stick, you can't get
the doll, but also an incentive will make it easier
(02:26):
for you to study.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Yeah, and the more eighteen year olds, nineteen year olds
getting a skill studying. If they need to study, that's great.
I'm just not sure if this isn't a policy in
search of a problem. The biggest problem in New Zealand
is not we've got that we've got too many eighteen
year old drop kicks living with their parents. I mean, yes,
there has always been a benefit dependency issue, which is
(02:50):
a slightly different issue, and there are some families and
you know, been on the doll for generations. But I
don't think it just feels to me like this is
something where they've gone, right, let's announce something after cabinet
and it's yet another announcement where you're going, oh, do
do we have a massive.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Prover you disagree with you. Look, you know, I've got
no time for this government and their announcements of announcements,
but I actually disagree with you on this and that
I think it's part of a suite of things that
Louise Upston is doing. The only thing that's maybe slightly
cynical here is that they've re announced it by bringing
it forward slightly. But she's actually doing that good work.
Speaker 4 (03:24):
Yeah, but also you have to look at the way
that the economy is structured in a way that both
national and labor governments have run the economy in this sense.
So let's say every one of those eighteen nineteen year
olds went and got a PhD, you would still have
about four to five percent unemployment because if it drops
below that, the way that our government's subsequent governments run
(03:47):
the economy is that they'll put interest rates up. The
Reserve Bank will put interest rates up because they think
that's a sign that the economy is overheating. So you're
probably always going to have about four to five percent unemployment.
So all you're doing is going We're going to punish
eighteen to nineteen year olds who are living at home,
and more to the point, punish the parents who already
having to buy them a house, will help them buy
(04:07):
a house and do everything. You know, and you're on
an income of sixty five k a year. That is
bugger all. So it just seems to me a problem,
a policy in search of a problem that we don't
That isn't the biggest problem. It's not going to grow
the New Zealand economy had there, and that's the biggest
problem I've got, right.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
Yeah, I mean, I'm not sure that's what it's about.
I think it's about looking at changing the incentives for
young people and basically saying that it's there is not
a pathway where you can just not get what education
and then just go on the doll and I think
that is that is fair. The areas that I worry about,
(04:46):
and this is growing up in a small town where
I did in Tomina Nui, where options are really limited
for kids and even really simple things that you need
to go to work, ie getting a driver's life since
and there have been changes around this, but even the
cost of that and the time now takes, like to
get your kids a driver's license these days you need
(05:08):
at least one parent who is into it. You've got
a registered and warranted car. This is you right, Well
I wasn't, but my husband was amazing at teaching the kids.
But that is our hours and months, and then you
have to pay for the defense of driving and all
of that stuff. And I think we have to really
understand at a very granular level what the barriers are
(05:30):
to these kids getting a job, and not least of
which what home environment that have they got that helps
them get out, get up, get out of bed in
the morning, get a kai in the tummy and go
out and do what you need.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Basically talking about social investment here. Aren't you getting in
there really early? We'll take a break, guys, and we'll
come back and talk about the protesters. An adrianaw is money.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
The huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, the global
leader and luxury real estate.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
Right, you're back of the huddle. You got Tresure and Josephcganey. Now, Joseph,
what do you think of those protests as turning up
at Winston Peter's house.
Speaker 4 (06:05):
Yeah, it's pretty ugly, isn't it. I mean, you can protest,
there's nothing against you protesting, but when you're protesting at
someone's home, it's bordering on illegal already. I mean, if
you were to cross the border into the driveway or
you know, hover around their front door or something like that,
you're getting into harassment and trespassing. But I also think
it's a sign of where our politics have gone. There's
(06:27):
a kind of movement away from a contest of ideas
where you can debate things and you can disagree, even
even loudly and rudely, but it's become about personality, So
it's like you're a bad person, you're a good person.
And that's really unhealthy because then you have this complete
inability to even debate something because they're going, no, we're
going to target you personally. And I do think it's
(06:50):
that kind of you know, we saw Justin duns made
a career post politics out of this. It's the sort
of how do you make people feel is the reason
for politics rather and what do you do? And I
think I think it's just another sign of that. And
the other thing I would say is it shows also
there's a kind of lack of curiosity amongst the protesters
(07:11):
over Gaza and Palestine to engage with anything that's contrary
to their own views of what's happening and what to do.
And there's a whole you know, peace process that's that's
been put forward. Whatever you think of it, it's our
best chance of stopping the violence. And there was a
journalist from The Times in London who went to the
demonstration yesterday in Trafalgar Square and he tried to engage
(07:33):
with people about you know, what do you think about
this proposal with Tony Blair and Trump? Okay, you don't
like Trump, but maybe it will work. You know, there
are eight Muslim countries in the region who are supporting it.
What do you think wouldn't even engage in it. Protesters
didn't want to know about it. They kicked them out,
They basically shoved them away. So I think it just
shows you a dangerous kind of protesting where you're not
(07:56):
engaging with anything that you disagree with, and you're making
it really, really personal, and it's pretty ugly.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Yeah, I think they need to stop Trish. I think
they run. They are not drawing attention to Gaza. They
are only making people cross at what they're doing, and
they're risking good will, aren't they.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Well, it's performative, isn't it that total? That's really what
this is about. It's like everything, it's driven for clicks
and views on social media. I know people who live
in the street and this has been going on for
months and months. It really has I think it's completely
wrong and I think what these groups I agree with
(08:32):
what Josie has just said, but I think what these
groups also underestimate is that one day there will be
a lunatic in one of those groups that they bring
along and they will do something really stupid and that
is a line in New Zealand that we absolutely don't
want to cross. And whatever you think about New Zealand politicians,
(08:52):
they deserve and their families deserve to feel safe like
everybody else. So I think this absolutely has to stop.
And if you think that protesting outside the House of
the Foreign Minister in New Zealand is in any way
going to change what's happening in Gaza or what will
happening or what will happen, you are absolutely barking up
(09:15):
the wrong Traluded.
Speaker 4 (09:16):
Can I just say one thing that the other day
when I was walking to the studio to come and
do a huddle, I walked past TV and Z and
there's a huge banner out there. There was a Palestine
protest out there and the huge banner said New Zealand
media stop committing genocide. And I was thinking, what do
you think the New Zealand media are doing? Like the
Newsila media are reporting on stuff, they're not actually dropping
(09:37):
bombs on Gaza. So I think people, you know, are
kind of going, hold on, guys, what are you actually
asking the New Zealand government to do here that it
isn't already doing? And you know, if there's a chance
of peace, which I think the biggest chance you've gotten
it may fail dismally. Is the peace deal that's on
the table because it has the support of Muslim countries
in the region and Palestinians, the Palestinian authority as well.
(09:59):
It's the best chance of leading to a Palestinian state,
So you know, why not engage with that?
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (10:06):
Right, okay, Now trah Adriana's got four hundred and sixteen
smackers coming at him.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
What do you think, Well, it's a lot of money,
isn't it. There's a couple of points here, so you've
talked about why have a restraint so you know who
else was going to take him? That it would cause
competitive damage to the Reserve Bank. That's one thing. There
is a legitimate restraint of trade around a cooling off period,
(10:33):
which we often talk about with ministers leaving and going lobbying.
So you might be privy to sensitive information, so you'd
have a restraint of trade to cover that. I can't
I can't see how that is applicable here, and for
someone in Adrian's role, you wouldn't go off talking about
you know, sensitive matters. The other interesting thing is you
(10:55):
can have a restraint, but you're not required to have
a dollar figure around us have to get paid. You don't.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
It's really, let's be honest, it's shut up money, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
Well? I think the question should be asked when when
was this restraint of trade? Has it always been in
the contract and in this quantum or was it something
agreed around the time of the exit?
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Very good point, I shall ask Nickola willis that okay?
Very quickly, Josie, what do you think?
Speaker 4 (11:21):
Well, I'm not sure what the government's doing here. If
you're eighteen and nineteen and you're unemployed, you're going to
have your money taken away from you now. And if
you're the Reserve Bank governor and you're unemployed, you get
four hundred k. Yeah, get your priorities right.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
You're right, Gils, thanks very much, really appreciate it. Tru
Seerson and JOSEPHCGUANNEI iur huddle.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
This evening for more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive. Listen
live to news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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