December 16, 2025 • 9 mins
Tonight on The Huddle, Child Fund CEO Josie Pagani and Tim Wilson from the Maxim Institute joined in on a discussion about the following issues of the day - and more!
The disgraced lawyer at the centre of the Russell McVeagh #MeToo scandal has been granted a new practising certificate by the Law Society, which says he’s fit to return as a barrister. Do we believe in second chances?
The Government has pushed out the return to surplus for another year - and Ruth Richardson has responded by calling off the debate between her and Nicola Willis. What do we make of this?
Auckland Council has moved to scrap a proposed trial for fortnightly rubbish collection in some Auckland suburbs. Do we think this is the right move?
Will the new MCERT mega-Ministry actually improve anything?
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, a name
you can trust locally and globally.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Joining me Tonight, Child fun Ceo, Josie Bigani, Josie good Evening. Hello,
lovely to see you. Tim Wilson has here too, from
the Maximum Institute, Tim good evening to you, good evening. Now, Well,
what do we think sort of a second chance here,
Joseph fair enough?
Speaker 3 (00:20):
I mean, he didn't go to jail. He isn't being
suspended from making a living for the rest of his life.
That would be a pretty big price to pay. He's
entitled to in a living right. I mean, it worries
me when Steph just said then that he was apparently
looking at the woman's profiles of people who spoke up
(00:40):
against him. So you have to take it face value
that he has rehabilitated, that he's seen the impact his
behavior had, and you do have to give people a
second chance, right Otherwise, how do you distinguish between people
who get their life together and sort their shit out
and basically become decent human beings exactly and people who don't.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
And also, it's kind of ironic for a lawyer to
be you know, because they're always arguing for sick people.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
That's pretty low when you're saying the legal profession is
this great standard bearer of behavior. But of course Steth
Diber exception.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
Actually, I have a brother in law who's a lawyer,
and I often quote to him the words of the
Babe of Bethlehem, which called them lawyers, woe to you
unmarked grades. Now I'm sure there are, and I know
in fact for a fact there are many very good
lawyers of great moral probity. But yeah, and look, I agree,
but I think I think lawyers as well. When we
(01:38):
think about the least trusted, it's us car salesman, lawyers,
and then journalists. So I speak as an ext journalist.
I think I can say that I'm a big fan
of second chances too. There are scrutiny and oversights in this,
so he has to He's been watched over, he lost it.
Speaker 5 (01:56):
You know, he's stood down for three years.
Speaker 4 (01:57):
And we're all talking about this guy. So I guess
there will there will certainly be people who won't go
to him because he is whom he is.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
The huddle with New Zealand Southeby's international realty, the only
truly global.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
Brand, thirteen minutes away from Sexier on news talks. That'd
be Joseph Becgarney and Tim Wilson on the huddle tonight, guys.
I've got some breaking news for you, very important breaking news.
This is from a media release, The Big, the Big
debate between Nicola Here it is Nichol Willis and Ruth
Richardson is off. She's Ruth.
Speaker 5 (02:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Ruth pulled out, I will not be a party to
a circus. This is Ruth Woods from the taxpaers and
I'll not be a party to a circus or a
sideshow designed to distract from fiscal failure.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
What does she think politics is?
Speaker 5 (02:47):
Honestly, Josie, this was that sounds like you've just had
your Christmas present.
Speaker 4 (02:59):
Take it away.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Not for the first time. I was really looking forward
to this because I reckon. You know, do you remember
when Elon Musk sort of challenged Mark Zuckerberg to a
cage fight, and Mark Zuckerberg sort of bare chested, said
send location, you know, and Ruth Richardson was like, you know,
I don't do pistols at dawn with a picture of
a fully clothed in her garden. So honestly, come on,
(03:25):
I want politics to get away from this idea that
it's something to do with diplomacy and kindness and you know,
sharing the ordeus and back into an argie bargie contest
of ideas, and god knows we need one.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
You want you want to bring back the days of
and what's his name in.
Speaker 3 (03:43):
Some fisticuffs in the corridors, but not the real stuff.
Speaker 4 (03:47):
So you want politicians to be more like lawyers.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Because they're careful and US bureaucratic jargon. I want politicians
to be authentically Why do you think Trump was so popular?
Just cut across all that stuff so bad move that
gives Nichola willis the win. She's now won it.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Well, yeah, and Tim, it's interesting because when we got
the hay food today and in all of Nichola's comments,
she is she's played it really well. She's saying, you've
got me in the middle, Ruth on the right, and
then crazy labor over there on the left.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
That's right. And if you're being bagged by the taxpayer's
union and labor, I guess well that's what centrism looks
like in twenty five and now and now Ruth Richardson
has handed her own head on a plate to Nikola Willis,
so it's and also ruined Josie's Christmas. That's the thing
I'm worried about, Josie. She's going to be sobbing into
(04:45):
her sobbing into her Lindau on Christmas Day because she
didn't get what she wanted.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
I will be wafting around in a caftan with a
gin and tonic and I will not care.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Shan't care, shan'n't care at all. Now you'll be throwing
things in the rubbish of all Christmas. In fact, you
know Christmas. I think about Boxing Day when look at
you your rubbish bin, how full that thing gets after
you've over all your presence, and then imagine having to
wait two weeks before someone comes and collects it. Thankfully,
this is Auckland is Thankfully. I know they do this
(05:14):
in some parts of the country. In Auckland they have
just said nay to the trial, Josie, do you think
And it's one of those issues where people spoke out
and said nap, we don't want it, and the counselors
have actually listened to them. But the whole idea is
still not off the table. It could happen for everyone
permanently one day.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
It's these crazy ideas that you can get people out
of cars by simply taking their car away I not
having parking places, and that you can get rid of
rubbish just by not giving them a big enough bin,
and like, I just won't like that, guys. And you
remember in the nineties, late nineties, I guess it was
in offices where they started taking the bins away and
putting in these little things on your desk where you
(05:53):
could put your apple core. And your lasted about a
nanosecond because everyone just you know, went, I'm not doing it.
I'm not. Don'd be silly. I've got rubbish, live with it.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
It's annoying, Tim. You know, at this studio we've got
a problem with the bins because they've they've got a
couple of bins and then on this floor and the
one bin we the main one we have is in
the studio and fills up so quickly, and then Mike
Hoskin gets angry in the morning.
Speaker 4 (06:16):
Oh yeah, yeah, I mean matth he fills it up
kerry Wood and fills it up. You Ryan, I'm sure
would be extremely obstemious when it comes to rubbish, you'd
eat your own apple cause you'd make sure that you
know it wasn't it wasn't rubbish. But look, I'm I'm
with the majority of Aucklanders who say, can you collect
my rubbish every week? Because well, our bin always gets
(06:38):
filled up? And why is that?
Speaker 5 (06:40):
We've got four boys.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
And we are literally providing taxpayers of the future, so
the council should be paying us to collect our rubbish.
You're welcome, exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
It's annoying. What do you make of this mega ministry?
We had MB and now we got M. I can't
even remember what it is, M sex something it's M
serves they're calling it, which is Cities, an Environment and
Transport MBM.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
So the first thing is stop coming up with these
stupid names. And if you can't just call it, like
I don't know, the mega Industry of Business Development, which
is what MB should have been, should always have been
Ministry of Development or whatever economic development, this whatever meth ends,
whatever it's called, should be Ministry of Environment or planning
(07:25):
or something like that. So that tells me, though it's
not just a silly, bloody acronym. It tells me that
they have the thinking is all up here about shuffling
the deck chairs. Clump a whole lot of government departments
together and you'll deal with the lack of collaboration and coordination. Actually,
you've got to deal with a substance. And I just
think this whole focus on structure rather than thinking, why
(07:46):
is the public sector not delivering everything we need urgently?
You've got to change the culture. You've got to put
more risk in the design and the ideas and less
in the implementation. You know, you need those sorts of
ideas rather than just what we do in New Zealand
where we go, Let's just clump them all together and
they'll spend two years developing hr policies, branding you know,
(08:08):
I don't know straighteners in the toilet's haad rise. It
will all just be two years of doing nothing, building nothing,
doing nothing.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
I'm not a fan, tim Well.
Speaker 4 (08:19):
I've got the name for it. Don't call it a
mega ministry. Call it a mega ministry, Make ALTI or
Great Again ministry. Actually, actually I'm kind of down with
this because these are it's a pretty coherent group of
ministries that are being put together. They are sort of
it's an attempt to enhance the RMA changes that are happening.
(08:40):
And also it reports to one minister, So you compare
that to say MB which reports to actually we looked
it up nineteen ministers and one parliamentary undersecretary. No one
owns that. One person will own this.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
I'm optimistic, yeah, good, well, good for you, Tim, I'm not.
Speaker 5 (08:59):
Fear that are here.
Speaker 4 (09:00):
Jose is already in the KF ten cut clutching and guatonical.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Each has.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Somebody Here is text in Ministry of Urban and Regional Development,
Environment and Roads in the acronym as murder. Appreciate that. Guys,
Tim Wilson and Josey beganni on the Huddle tonight.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to
news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
The Huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, a name
you can trust locally and globally.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Joining me Tonight, Child fun Ceo, Josie Bigani, Josie good Evening. Hello,
lovely to see you. Tim Wilson has here too, from
the Maximum Institute, Tim good evening to you, good evening. Now, Well,
what do we think sort of a second chance here,
Joseph fair enough?
Speaker 3 (00:20):
I mean, he didn't go to jail. He isn't being
suspended from making a living for the rest of his life.
That would be a pretty big price to pay. He's
entitled to in a living right. I mean, it worries
me when Steph just said then that he was apparently
looking at the woman's profiles of people who spoke up
(00:40):
against him. So you have to take it face value
that he has rehabilitated, that he's seen the impact his
behavior had, and you do have to give people a
second chance, right Otherwise, how do you distinguish between people
who get their life together and sort their shit out
and basically become decent human beings exactly and people who don't.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
And also, it's kind of ironic for a lawyer to
be you know, because they're always arguing for sick people.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
That's pretty low when you're saying the legal profession is
this great standard bearer of behavior. But of course Steth
Diber exception.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
Actually, I have a brother in law who's a lawyer,
and I often quote to him the words of the
Babe of Bethlehem, which called them lawyers, woe to you
unmarked grades. Now I'm sure there are, and I know
in fact for a fact there are many very good
lawyers of great moral probity. But yeah, and look, I agree,
but I think I think lawyers as well. When we
(01:38):
think about the least trusted, it's us car salesman, lawyers,
and then journalists. So I speak as an ext journalist.
I think I can say that I'm a big fan
of second chances too. There are scrutiny and oversights in this,
so he has to He's been watched over, he lost it.
Speaker 5 (01:56):
You know, he's stood down for three years.
Speaker 4 (01:57):
And we're all talking about this guy. So I guess
there will there will certainly be people who won't go
to him because he is whom he is.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
The huddle with New Zealand Southeby's international realty, the only
truly global.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
Brand, thirteen minutes away from Sexier on news talks. That'd
be Joseph Becgarney and Tim Wilson on the huddle tonight, guys.
I've got some breaking news for you, very important breaking news.
This is from a media release, The Big, the Big
debate between Nicola Here it is Nichol Willis and Ruth
Richardson is off. She's Ruth.
Speaker 5 (02:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Ruth pulled out, I will not be a party to
a circus. This is Ruth Woods from the taxpaers and
I'll not be a party to a circus or a
sideshow designed to distract from fiscal failure.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
What does she think politics is?
Speaker 5 (02:47):
Honestly, Josie, this was that sounds like you've just had
your Christmas present.
Speaker 4 (02:59):
Take it away.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Not for the first time. I was really looking forward
to this because I reckon. You know, do you remember
when Elon Musk sort of challenged Mark Zuckerberg to a
cage fight, and Mark Zuckerberg sort of bare chested, said
send location, you know, and Ruth Richardson was like, you know,
I don't do pistols at dawn with a picture of
a fully clothed in her garden. So honestly, come on,
(03:25):
I want politics to get away from this idea that
it's something to do with diplomacy and kindness and you know,
sharing the ordeus and back into an argie bargie contest
of ideas, and god knows we need one.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
You want you want to bring back the days of
and what's his name in.
Speaker 3 (03:43):
Some fisticuffs in the corridors, but not the real stuff.
Speaker 4 (03:47):
So you want politicians to be more like lawyers.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Because they're careful and US bureaucratic jargon. I want politicians
to be authentically Why do you think Trump was so popular?
Just cut across all that stuff so bad move that
gives Nichola willis the win. She's now won it.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Well, yeah, and Tim, it's interesting because when we got
the hay food today and in all of Nichola's comments,
she is she's played it really well. She's saying, you've
got me in the middle, Ruth on the right, and
then crazy labor over there on the left.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
That's right. And if you're being bagged by the taxpayer's
union and labor, I guess well that's what centrism looks
like in twenty five and now and now Ruth Richardson
has handed her own head on a plate to Nikola Willis,
so it's and also ruined Josie's Christmas. That's the thing
I'm worried about, Josie. She's going to be sobbing into
(04:45):
her sobbing into her Lindau on Christmas Day because she
didn't get what she wanted.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
I will be wafting around in a caftan with a
gin and tonic and I will not care.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Shan't care, shan'n't care at all. Now you'll be throwing
things in the rubbish of all Christmas. In fact, you
know Christmas. I think about Boxing Day when look at
you your rubbish bin, how full that thing gets after
you've over all your presence, and then imagine having to
wait two weeks before someone comes and collects it. Thankfully,
this is Auckland is Thankfully. I know they do this
(05:14):
in some parts of the country. In Auckland they have
just said nay to the trial, Josie, do you think
And it's one of those issues where people spoke out
and said nap, we don't want it, and the counselors
have actually listened to them. But the whole idea is
still not off the table. It could happen for everyone
permanently one day.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
It's these crazy ideas that you can get people out
of cars by simply taking their car away I not
having parking places, and that you can get rid of
rubbish just by not giving them a big enough bin,
and like, I just won't like that, guys. And you
remember in the nineties, late nineties, I guess it was
in offices where they started taking the bins away and
putting in these little things on your desk where you
(05:53):
could put your apple core. And your lasted about a
nanosecond because everyone just you know, went, I'm not doing it.
I'm not. Don'd be silly. I've got rubbish, live with it.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
It's annoying, Tim. You know, at this studio we've got
a problem with the bins because they've they've got a
couple of bins and then on this floor and the
one bin we the main one we have is in
the studio and fills up so quickly, and then Mike
Hoskin gets angry in the morning.
Speaker 4 (06:16):
Oh yeah, yeah, I mean matth he fills it up
kerry Wood and fills it up. You Ryan, I'm sure
would be extremely obstemious when it comes to rubbish, you'd
eat your own apple cause you'd make sure that you
know it wasn't it wasn't rubbish. But look, I'm I'm
with the majority of Aucklanders who say, can you collect
my rubbish every week? Because well, our bin always gets
(06:38):
filled up? And why is that?
Speaker 5 (06:40):
We've got four boys.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
And we are literally providing taxpayers of the future, so
the council should be paying us to collect our rubbish.
You're welcome, exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
It's annoying. What do you make of this mega ministry?
We had MB and now we got M. I can't
even remember what it is, M sex something it's M
serves they're calling it, which is Cities, an Environment and
Transport MBM.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
So the first thing is stop coming up with these
stupid names. And if you can't just call it, like
I don't know, the mega Industry of Business Development, which
is what MB should have been, should always have been
Ministry of Development or whatever economic development, this whatever meth ends,
whatever it's called, should be Ministry of Environment or planning
(07:25):
or something like that. So that tells me, though it's
not just a silly, bloody acronym. It tells me that
they have the thinking is all up here about shuffling
the deck chairs. Clump a whole lot of government departments
together and you'll deal with the lack of collaboration and coordination. Actually,
you've got to deal with a substance. And I just
think this whole focus on structure rather than thinking, why
(07:46):
is the public sector not delivering everything we need urgently?
You've got to change the culture. You've got to put
more risk in the design and the ideas and less
in the implementation. You know, you need those sorts of
ideas rather than just what we do in New Zealand
where we go, Let's just clump them all together and
they'll spend two years developing hr policies, branding you know,
(08:08):
I don't know straighteners in the toilet's haad rise. It
will all just be two years of doing nothing, building nothing,
doing nothing.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
I'm not a fan, tim Well.
Speaker 4 (08:19):
I've got the name for it. Don't call it a
mega ministry. Call it a mega ministry, Make ALTI or
Great Again ministry. Actually, actually I'm kind of down with
this because these are it's a pretty coherent group of
ministries that are being put together. They are sort of
it's an attempt to enhance the RMA changes that are happening.
(08:40):
And also it reports to one minister, So you compare
that to say MB which reports to actually we looked
it up nineteen ministers and one parliamentary undersecretary. No one
owns that. One person will own this.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
I'm optimistic, yeah, good, well, good for you, Tim, I'm not.
Speaker 5 (08:59):
Fear that are here.
Speaker 4 (09:00):
Jose is already in the KF ten cut clutching and guatonical.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Each has.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Somebody Here is text in Ministry of Urban and Regional Development,
Environment and Roads in the acronym as murder. Appreciate that. Guys,
Tim Wilson and Josey beganni on the Huddle tonight.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to
news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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