February 2, 2026 • 10 mins
Tonight on The Huddle, Trish Sherson from Sherson Willis PR and Child Fund CEO Josie Pagani joined in on a discussion about the following issues of the day - and more!
Fire and Emergency NZ has launched an investigation into the firefighter who got caught making a crude gesture at the PM on video. Do we think this is really necessary?
Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor is in the news again after the latest release from the Epstein files. New photos reveal the former royal crouched on all fours and touching an unidentified woman. What do we think of this?
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, a name
you can trust locally and globally.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
On the huddle with me this evening, we have Tris
Sharson from Sherson Willis pr and Josie PEGANI, CEO of
Child Fund.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Hi, are you too?
Speaker 4 (00:13):
Hello?
Speaker 1 (00:13):
A you that right?
Speaker 3 (00:14):
What do you reckon? Trish? Should the firefighter be investigated?
Speaker 5 (00:19):
Absolutely not. I think it's ridiculous to think that.
Speaker 4 (00:22):
A meme, what's essentially turned into a gesture that's turned
into a meme, should now be turned into a disciplinary process.
Speaker 5 (00:31):
I think it's a reminder to.
Speaker 4 (00:34):
You know, the leaders in our organizations that they're going
to have to be a bit more grown up when
it comes to reacting to stuff like this that rears
its head on social media. Then they get a call
from the media to say what are you going to do?
Speaker 5 (00:49):
And their first reaction is an investigation.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
I actually thought the PM this morning, the way he
laughed it off, I thought it was smart, smart politics.
He didn't go into pearl clutching about it, which would
be ridiculous. But I think what it what it reminds
us of Number one in New Zealand. We love humor
(01:13):
like this. That that video went around New Zealand in
lightning speed over the weekend and we all had a
bit of a chuckle. But underlying that, I think is
what I would call the contempt gap. You know, politicians
used to be held.
Speaker 5 (01:30):
In sort of awe whereas these days for a.
Speaker 4 (01:34):
Lot of people, you know, they just they don't have
the same feeling anymore. People are feeling unheard. There is
just respect around. But the good news for New Zealand
is if this is the level of our you know,
showing what we actually feel about politicians, we're in a
pretty good space compared.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
To other countries too, Right, Jose, what do you think?
Speaker 6 (01:57):
Yeah, I mean the firefighter woman who did this gesture,
she wasn't doing it to the cameras, she wasn't doing
it in public. She was clearly turning around doing it
to a mate of hers and going, you know what
a banker. And so you know the fact that it
went public isn't her fault. And I think you made
that point too.
Speaker 5 (02:18):
She hasn't.
Speaker 6 (02:19):
She hasn't sort of put this up on TikTok herself,
and I think you're right. Trish Luxem's response was actually
really good. He just said, you know, stay calm, laughed off,
although he did use one of his you know, menu
of cliches and metaphors. I think he said something like,
you know, well there's a lot of moving parts, which
I have no idea what he means by that. And
(02:39):
I think that also talks to another bigger problem here though,
which you alluded to Trish, that it shows also I
think that luxelm is just not really connecting with people
despite the hand on the shoulder, and that's a problem
for National, isn't it. I mean that, you know, there's
a feeling that he just talks like chat GPT. He
(03:00):
doesn't really talk like a human. He talks like a spreadsheet,
and you know, this is just another example of him
not really connecting. And I think this is just this
problem for National is just going to keep accelerating because
unfortunately connecting with the voters as part of the job.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
Do you know what I thought the toughest part of
watching that video was when so so Luxeon's He's gone
from just patting someone on the arm to to sort
of a rub like you'd give you great auntie, which
is you know, you needs to pull back on the
keep hands yourself. But then he walks away and he's
like the uncool kid in the playground, thinking he's really
(03:36):
made strides with the cool gang. And so he's walking
away and he thinks, should I'll turn back and give
them one more wave? That went so well, And so
he's in the background waving again and she's in the front,
still in the gesture.
Speaker 5 (03:49):
It was quite a hard watch.
Speaker 6 (03:52):
It's awful, and it's kind of like you feel that
his political advisors will be telling him again and again,
you know, be yourself, be yourself. But the problem is
what is being yourself is that you know, basically are
outperformed by your lecteruns every time you give a speech.
So I don't know. You know, it's hard to know
what to do with him, isn't it. He's not doing
(04:12):
anything wrong as such, he's saying the right things. He
responded well this morning. It's just not connecting. We just
don't love him, and you've got to love someone who's
the leader of your country, or at least admire them.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Yeah, we just have to enjoy this video. I think again.
We'll take a break, come back to you guys. Shortly.
Speaker 1 (04:30):
The huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, the only
truly global brand.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
All right, you're back with the huddle, Joseph Gani Trisherson.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Okay, Josie Madeline has sent me a text, and it's
the first plausible explanation I have for what the hell
Andrew was doing on his hands and knees. She reckons
he might have been doing a first aid course and
the woman was a dummy.
Speaker 6 (04:52):
Well, anyone who's done a first day course, it's only
half a tulso, So I don't think that explanation stacks up.
That was the whole body. It's just it's really weird.
The weird bit about it is his look to camera,
like I believe he was doing some kind of abdominal message.
If you didn't have that weird look to the camera
where he looks like, you know, cat that got the
(05:14):
milk and he's about to do something awful. It's just,
oh my god, what a what an incredible stain on
you know, King Charles and this new reign. It just
feels so sordid. It's the whole thing feels salacious, sordid.
But the other thing that struck me about it is,
you know, all this stuff coming out this weekend and
(05:35):
we're all reading it kind of you know, intake of
breath going every time we read. Another example of all
of these media people I'm not going to name them,
but media you know, leaders of the world, business leaders,
political leaders, either in their underpants or worried about their
STDs or you know, flying to the Liita Island on
Lolita Express and you look at it and you go,
(05:57):
oh my god. The conspiracy theorist they actually we have
a little bit right, But there's this sort of weird
elite class that thinks that it doesn't have to obey
any rules, any laws, any moral codes, and it's kind
of running the world. And you sort of go, god,
they've got a point.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
Yeah, well, they often do have a little bit of
a point somewhere. Do you make it? I reckon, I reckon?
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Kiirstarma's intervention is probably the most problematic for the royals.
Speaker 4 (06:24):
Yeah, I mean, I think when this whole saga is
looked back on in you know, in his in the
annals of history, I think there's two things that will
come out. One is Epstein will be probably considered the
ultimate con man that he could come literally from nothing,
(06:45):
fake his way from being a teacher in a classroom
to then conning all of these uh you know, these
guys into doing what he wanted when he wanted and
obviously he was documenting stuff, so he had it in
the top drawer to keep them doing what he wanted.
(07:06):
And I think secondly, it will be one of the
biggest lessons ever in fronting up on something and dealing
with it first before it completely destroys you. This will
be the lesson for the Royal family in history. I mean,
Andrew has been. It's just been a disgrace the whole
way through how he's wanted to handle it. But the
(07:29):
terrible thing is that the Royal family has gone along
with that, and now with this next release, he is
always now the lightning rod or the sort of example
of just how disgraceful this whole thing was.
Speaker 6 (07:43):
But you know, well, I think you and I and
Heather would not be taken in by this con man, right,
So I don't believe they were particularly taken I do
think that there's just some sort of addiction to celebrity.
They all wanted to be in this network because he
was hanging out with the leaders and shakers and the
celebrities and the you know, if he wanted to be
(08:04):
with the people ruling the world, that's where you had
to be. And I just don't believe he was guy
was arrested, you know, for for association with minor or
whatever it was, when his first prison term, and still
these people were texting him and loving him and sending him,
you know, kisses and saying let's meet up. So there's
something kind of sick at the heart of it where
(08:24):
you think I don't think they were conned. I think
they're just they're just you know, there's some sort of
bad moral code that exists in this network of people.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
But the nets money was that not all it was.
I mean, Fergie kept coming back for the money. The
New Zealand academic was in it for the money. All
of these people wanted to be with him because he
was loaded.
Speaker 6 (08:44):
Well he Bill Gates and don't need the money, and
they're hanging out with him and you know, worried about.
Speaker 5 (08:51):
But that's something with Epstein.
Speaker 4 (08:53):
He didn't have money. He conned his way into having
some wealth behind him, and he was just absolutely he
was a master con artist. He knew psychologically what drove
these guys where they you know, he knew that where
he could.
Speaker 5 (09:10):
Push their moral compasses.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Right off the edge, and that's the way that he
got them into this vortex of grub and filth. And ultimately,
I think what this tranche of release has shown is
that the most damaging part of this is not just
their association with them. It's now showing that they have
(09:34):
been lying and cheating all the way along, and that
their timing in contact to your earlier point, Josie, they
were donkey deep with this guy even after his first
his first jail time, they literally didn't care about that.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
It's a very good point, ladies. It's lovely to chat
to the pair of you. Thank you. Tritius and Joseph
Begunny are herdle this evening.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
For more from Heather duplessy Ellen Drive, listen live to
News Talks itt B from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
The Huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, a name
you can trust locally and globally.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
On the huddle with me this evening, we have Tris
Sharson from Sherson Willis pr and Josie PEGANI, CEO of
Child Fund.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Hi, are you too?
Speaker 4 (00:13):
Hello?
Speaker 1 (00:13):
A you that right?
Speaker 3 (00:14):
What do you reckon? Trish? Should the firefighter be investigated?
Speaker 5 (00:19):
Absolutely not. I think it's ridiculous to think that.
Speaker 4 (00:22):
A meme, what's essentially turned into a gesture that's turned
into a meme, should now be turned into a disciplinary process.
Speaker 5 (00:31):
I think it's a reminder to.
Speaker 4 (00:34):
You know, the leaders in our organizations that they're going
to have to be a bit more grown up when
it comes to reacting to stuff like this that rears
its head on social media. Then they get a call
from the media to say what are you going to do?
Speaker 5 (00:49):
And their first reaction is an investigation.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
I actually thought the PM this morning, the way he
laughed it off, I thought it was smart, smart politics.
He didn't go into pearl clutching about it, which would
be ridiculous. But I think what it what it reminds
us of Number one in New Zealand. We love humor
(01:13):
like this. That that video went around New Zealand in
lightning speed over the weekend and we all had a
bit of a chuckle. But underlying that, I think is
what I would call the contempt gap. You know, politicians
used to be held.
Speaker 5 (01:30):
In sort of awe whereas these days for a.
Speaker 4 (01:34):
Lot of people, you know, they just they don't have
the same feeling anymore. People are feeling unheard. There is
just respect around. But the good news for New Zealand
is if this is the level of our you know,
showing what we actually feel about politicians, we're in a
pretty good space compared.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
To other countries too, Right, Jose, what do you think?
Speaker 6 (01:57):
Yeah, I mean the firefighter woman who did this gesture,
she wasn't doing it to the cameras, she wasn't doing
it in public. She was clearly turning around doing it
to a mate of hers and going, you know what
a banker. And so you know the fact that it
went public isn't her fault. And I think you made
that point too.
Speaker 5 (02:18):
She hasn't.
Speaker 6 (02:19):
She hasn't sort of put this up on TikTok herself,
and I think you're right. Trish Luxem's response was actually
really good. He just said, you know, stay calm, laughed off,
although he did use one of his you know, menu
of cliches and metaphors. I think he said something like,
you know, well there's a lot of moving parts, which
I have no idea what he means by that. And
(02:39):
I think that also talks to another bigger problem here though,
which you alluded to Trish, that it shows also I
think that luxelm is just not really connecting with people
despite the hand on the shoulder, and that's a problem
for National, isn't it. I mean that, you know, there's
a feeling that he just talks like chat GPT. He
(03:00):
doesn't really talk like a human. He talks like a spreadsheet,
and you know, this is just another example of him
not really connecting. And I think this is just this
problem for National is just going to keep accelerating because
unfortunately connecting with the voters as part of the job.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
Do you know what I thought the toughest part of
watching that video was when so so Luxeon's He's gone
from just patting someone on the arm to to sort
of a rub like you'd give you great auntie, which
is you know, you needs to pull back on the
keep hands yourself. But then he walks away and he's
like the uncool kid in the playground, thinking he's really
(03:36):
made strides with the cool gang. And so he's walking
away and he thinks, should I'll turn back and give
them one more wave? That went so well, And so
he's in the background waving again and she's in the front,
still in the gesture.
Speaker 5 (03:49):
It was quite a hard watch.
Speaker 6 (03:52):
It's awful, and it's kind of like you feel that
his political advisors will be telling him again and again,
you know, be yourself, be yourself. But the problem is
what is being yourself is that you know, basically are
outperformed by your lecteruns every time you give a speech.
So I don't know. You know, it's hard to know
what to do with him, isn't it. He's not doing
(04:12):
anything wrong as such, he's saying the right things. He
responded well this morning. It's just not connecting. We just
don't love him, and you've got to love someone who's
the leader of your country, or at least admire them.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Yeah, we just have to enjoy this video. I think again.
We'll take a break, come back to you guys. Shortly.
Speaker 1 (04:30):
The huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, the only
truly global brand.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
All right, you're back with the huddle, Joseph Gani Trisherson.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Okay, Josie Madeline has sent me a text, and it's
the first plausible explanation I have for what the hell
Andrew was doing on his hands and knees. She reckons
he might have been doing a first aid course and
the woman was a dummy.
Speaker 6 (04:52):
Well, anyone who's done a first day course, it's only
half a tulso, So I don't think that explanation stacks up.
That was the whole body. It's just it's really weird.
The weird bit about it is his look to camera,
like I believe he was doing some kind of abdominal message.
If you didn't have that weird look to the camera
where he looks like, you know, cat that got the
(05:14):
milk and he's about to do something awful. It's just,
oh my god, what a what an incredible stain on
you know, King Charles and this new reign. It just
feels so sordid. It's the whole thing feels salacious, sordid.
But the other thing that struck me about it is,
you know, all this stuff coming out this weekend and
(05:35):
we're all reading it kind of you know, intake of
breath going every time we read. Another example of all
of these media people I'm not going to name them,
but media you know, leaders of the world, business leaders,
political leaders, either in their underpants or worried about their
STDs or you know, flying to the Liita Island on
Lolita Express and you look at it and you go,
(05:57):
oh my god. The conspiracy theorist they actually we have
a little bit right, But there's this sort of weird
elite class that thinks that it doesn't have to obey
any rules, any laws, any moral codes, and it's kind
of running the world. And you sort of go, god,
they've got a point.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
Yeah, well, they often do have a little bit of
a point somewhere. Do you make it? I reckon, I reckon?
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Kiirstarma's intervention is probably the most problematic for the royals.
Speaker 4 (06:24):
Yeah, I mean, I think when this whole saga is
looked back on in you know, in his in the
annals of history, I think there's two things that will
come out. One is Epstein will be probably considered the
ultimate con man that he could come literally from nothing,
(06:45):
fake his way from being a teacher in a classroom
to then conning all of these uh you know, these
guys into doing what he wanted when he wanted and
obviously he was documenting stuff, so he had it in
the top drawer to keep them doing what he wanted.
(07:06):
And I think secondly, it will be one of the
biggest lessons ever in fronting up on something and dealing
with it first before it completely destroys you. This will
be the lesson for the Royal family in history. I mean,
Andrew has been. It's just been a disgrace the whole
way through how he's wanted to handle it. But the
(07:29):
terrible thing is that the Royal family has gone along
with that, and now with this next release, he is
always now the lightning rod or the sort of example
of just how disgraceful this whole thing was.
Speaker 6 (07:43):
But you know, well, I think you and I and
Heather would not be taken in by this con man, right,
So I don't believe they were particularly taken I do
think that there's just some sort of addiction to celebrity.
They all wanted to be in this network because he
was hanging out with the leaders and shakers and the
celebrities and the you know, if he wanted to be
(08:04):
with the people ruling the world, that's where you had
to be. And I just don't believe he was guy
was arrested, you know, for for association with minor or
whatever it was, when his first prison term, and still
these people were texting him and loving him and sending him,
you know, kisses and saying let's meet up. So there's
something kind of sick at the heart of it where
(08:24):
you think I don't think they were conned. I think
they're just they're just you know, there's some sort of
bad moral code that exists in this network of people.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
But the nets money was that not all it was.
I mean, Fergie kept coming back for the money. The
New Zealand academic was in it for the money. All
of these people wanted to be with him because he
was loaded.
Speaker 6 (08:44):
Well he Bill Gates and don't need the money, and
they're hanging out with him and you know, worried about.
Speaker 5 (08:51):
But that's something with Epstein.
Speaker 4 (08:53):
He didn't have money. He conned his way into having
some wealth behind him, and he was just absolutely he
was a master con artist. He knew psychologically what drove
these guys where they you know, he knew that where
he could.
Speaker 5 (09:10):
Push their moral compasses.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Right off the edge, and that's the way that he
got them into this vortex of grub and filth. And ultimately,
I think what this tranche of release has shown is
that the most damaging part of this is not just
their association with them. It's now showing that they have
(09:34):
been lying and cheating all the way along, and that
their timing in contact to your earlier point, Josie, they
were donkey deep with this guy even after his first
his first jail time, they literally didn't care about that.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
It's a very good point, ladies. It's lovely to chat
to the pair of you. Thank you. Tritius and Joseph
Begunny are herdle this evening.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
For more from Heather duplessy Ellen Drive, listen live to
News Talks itt B from four pm weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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