November 5, 2024 • 7 mins
Labour is lamenting the Treaty Principles Bill even seeing the light of day.
David Seymour's controversial bill will be introduced in Parliament tomorrow.
Labour Leader Chris Hipkins says if implemented it would throw away years of legal precedent.
He told John MacDonald that National allowing the bill to get this far is irresponsible.
Hipkins says Labour wouldn't introduce anything it wasn't interested in taking further.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Canterbury Morning's Podcast with John McDonald
from News Talk ZB.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
It's time for a regular catch up with the opposition
and labor leader Chris Hopkins.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Go Chris, and how are you going?
Speaker 2 (00:19):
John? YEA, Well, do you want to go on for
that chocolate bar price. It's a real thing. Jess just
got it from a relative. It was in America recently
and it is a Donald Trump chocolate bar. And all
you need to do is make a prediction of the
outcome of today's election.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
I'm not I'm just not that bold, honestly. I just
think it's going to be so close that I wouldn't
want to pick it either way. The way maybe Donald Trump.
I'll tell you what, I can make a prediction. Donald
Trump's going to announce that he wam regardless of we
three wins or not. And I'm absolutely suited that that's
what's going to happen. But as to who actually wins
when all the votes account that, we could be waiting
(00:57):
a while to find that out.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
I think, see, my gut instinct says it's going to
be Trump. Your gun instinct must tell you something.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
My gat instinct tells me it's going to be it's
going to be very very close, and that Harris hasn't
had the momentum behind her in the last few weeks
that she really needed to be able to get a
sort of a convincing win. So you know, it is
certainly quite possible that Trump will win, but I just
don't know. It's so close, and those critical states where
(01:27):
it's going to be really close, it is very very close.
So who knows.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Why hasn't she had that momentum.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
I don't know. It was a tough campaign for her.
I mean, one hundred days isn't been very long to
run a presidential election campaign in the states where you're
talking billions of dollars and you know, you've got to
build the machinery. They're quite phenomenal things American presidential campaigns.
But I do think the Democrats have still got some
(01:56):
challenges ahead of them to figure out how it is
that they become disconnected from a large part of what
was traditionally the Democrats call voting base. So if you
look at the states that are that are really kind
of hotly contested, and even some of the ones now
that are now Republican states where they would have previously
been in contention for the Democrats. They've got to really
sort of think about how that's happened. You know, there's
(02:18):
a lot of blue collar workers in the States who
would have previously been you know, reliable Democrat voters who
are now voting Republican.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Sounds to me like you've put yourself in contention for
that Jobler Bar and you're predicting a Trump win.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
No, I certainly have. I certainly look, I just wouldn't
pick it either way at the moment. You know, I
guess on my more optimistic moments, I think that Harris
might still pull it off. But on my pessimistic moments,
I think that, you know, maybe it's a Trump presidency.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
All right, just probably going any further. Just I said
before ten that Exit Pole results would be out around
about ten. My mistake. It'll be eleven. If you were
listening before ten, It'll be around eleven when those Exit
Pole results will start coming through, right Chris David Seymour
has announced that he's pretty principal Bill will be coming
onto the agenda on Thursday. What's your reaction to that,
(03:12):
because I know I know you're anti it, but how
do you feel now that it's going to taken the
next step.
Speaker 3 (03:18):
Well, I mean, I think it's a big step backwards.
They're waiting. A tribuneal Will released their report on this
last night basically highlighting all of the problems with it.
I mean that abandons, you know, all of the kind
of current law around the treaty that's built up over
a long period of time, and it sort of sets
the clock back a long, a long long way. I mean,
(03:39):
I think it's it's sort of it's the biggest leap
backwards in one hundred years or more when we're talking
about treaty and how we use it and how we
interpret it. And it's really unnecessary because the government have
already said the going to vote it down, but yet
they're introducing it as government policy. So I just think
it's a debate that it's very backwards when you.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Go into if you are in a position in future
to go into coalition talks, does this mean that you'll
be kicking any pipe dream ideas of potential coalition partners
out the door right from the start.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
The ones that would be is to visit this is this.
You know, there are examples where we've been willing to
explore things in the past. But I can't think of
anything where we have signed up to and see here
we're willing to explore that, knowing full well that we
then wouldn't support it further down the track. So I
mean I think about things like you know, Peter Dunne
had a proposal around superannuations that we were a bit
skeptical of, but with the idea we'll explore it and
(04:36):
if the numbers at UT will consider it. That's a
bit different to saying we think this is a terrible idea,
but we're going to support it because that's the cost
of getting into government.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
So Labour will never do that.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
I'm certainly not an ion topic like this.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
No, all right, let's look at the with you being
a former education minister and the head of the Secondary
School's Principals Association today is saying that kids always find
a way to cheat, and he's not in favor of
doing what some parts of Australia have done and putting
a ban on using official intelligence in schools. Where do
you stand on this?
Speaker 3 (05:11):
I mean AI, You've got to be careful about where
you use AI. AI can be a very useful tool
in teaching and learning, So there are some some sort
of gamified apps at the moment that use an AI
system to actually help kids with their learning, and I
wouldn't want to say that kids can't use those tools.
When it comes to issues around assessments, that's where it
gets difficult because if you're talking about say, handing in
(05:33):
an essay, Yeah, you want to know that the kids
have actually done that work themselves and they haven't just
gone and got chat GPT to right there essay for them.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
But isn't using chat GPT part of the work. Don't
we have to get our heads around at the last
year this is the new reality, I think.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
So I was chatting to a university lecturer about this
the other day and he was saying, actually, the universe,
some of the university lecturers are saying, you can't use
chat GPT, but you have to attribute it. So you
have to acknowledge that you've used chat GPT, and you
have to verify that what chet GPT has been producing
actually legitimate. Because he was saying, you know, there's evidence
(06:12):
of people handing in essays where actually go to the
look up the references that chet GPT is reliable and
it turns out that they don't exist, and so on.
So I think you know, chet, GPT is a tool,
and it is only a tool. It's a bit like
a word processor. You know, years ago people say, well,
we're bemoaning the fact that if kids are allowed to
hand an essays using a word process that they will
(06:33):
lose the ability to write. And you know, technology moves
on and we do need to be open to that,
but we've also got to have ways of verifying that
kids are still still learning the stuff we need them
to learn.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
How have you used it as at all?
Speaker 3 (06:50):
I've largely used it as this is a research tool,
so it's quite interesting sometimes if you're in a hurry,
like before doing a radio to before somebody being like,
oh what was the latest number on X or what
was that effect? But you've also got to make sure
that you're just getting that right and that you're verified
it right.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
I should type into GPT right now. Have you heard
anything from Chris Hopkins today?
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Well, I hope. So I've done a round of interviews
and TV interviews and so I'm so fast today, so
I would hope.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
So did Chris tell you what to say? That's all
I asked. I'll do that during the air break. Nice
to talk to you, Good to talk to you.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
John.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Find out for more from Category Mornings with John McDonald.
Listen live to news talks It'd be christ Church from
nine am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Canterbury Morning's Podcast with John McDonald
from News Talk ZB.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
It's time for a regular catch up with the opposition
and labor leader Chris Hopkins.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Go Chris, and how are you going?
Speaker 2 (00:19):
John? YEA, Well, do you want to go on for
that chocolate bar price. It's a real thing. Jess just
got it from a relative. It was in America recently
and it is a Donald Trump chocolate bar. And all
you need to do is make a prediction of the
outcome of today's election.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
I'm not I'm just not that bold, honestly. I just
think it's going to be so close that I wouldn't
want to pick it either way. The way maybe Donald Trump.
I'll tell you what, I can make a prediction. Donald
Trump's going to announce that he wam regardless of we
three wins or not. And I'm absolutely suited that that's
what's going to happen. But as to who actually wins
when all the votes account that, we could be waiting
(00:57):
a while to find that out.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
I think, see, my gut instinct says it's going to
be Trump. Your gun instinct must tell you something.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
My gat instinct tells me it's going to be it's
going to be very very close, and that Harris hasn't
had the momentum behind her in the last few weeks
that she really needed to be able to get a
sort of a convincing win. So you know, it is
certainly quite possible that Trump will win, but I just
don't know. It's so close, and those critical states where
(01:27):
it's going to be really close, it is very very close.
So who knows.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Why hasn't she had that momentum.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
I don't know. It was a tough campaign for her.
I mean, one hundred days isn't been very long to
run a presidential election campaign in the states where you're
talking billions of dollars and you know, you've got to
build the machinery. They're quite phenomenal things American presidential campaigns.
But I do think the Democrats have still got some
(01:56):
challenges ahead of them to figure out how it is
that they become disconnected from a large part of what
was traditionally the Democrats call voting base. So if you
look at the states that are that are really kind
of hotly contested, and even some of the ones now
that are now Republican states where they would have previously
been in contention for the Democrats. They've got to really
sort of think about how that's happened. You know, there's
(02:18):
a lot of blue collar workers in the States who
would have previously been you know, reliable Democrat voters who
are now voting Republican.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Sounds to me like you've put yourself in contention for
that Jobler Bar and you're predicting a Trump win.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
No, I certainly have. I certainly look, I just wouldn't
pick it either way at the moment. You know, I
guess on my more optimistic moments, I think that Harris
might still pull it off. But on my pessimistic moments,
I think that, you know, maybe it's a Trump presidency.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
All right, just probably going any further. Just I said
before ten that Exit Pole results would be out around
about ten. My mistake. It'll be eleven. If you were
listening before ten, It'll be around eleven when those Exit
Pole results will start coming through, right Chris David Seymour
has announced that he's pretty principal Bill will be coming
onto the agenda on Thursday. What's your reaction to that,
(03:12):
because I know I know you're anti it, but how
do you feel now that it's going to taken the
next step.
Speaker 3 (03:18):
Well, I mean, I think it's a big step backwards.
They're waiting. A tribuneal Will released their report on this
last night basically highlighting all of the problems with it.
I mean that abandons, you know, all of the kind
of current law around the treaty that's built up over
a long period of time, and it sort of sets
the clock back a long, a long long way. I mean,
(03:39):
I think it's it's sort of it's the biggest leap
backwards in one hundred years or more when we're talking
about treaty and how we use it and how we
interpret it. And it's really unnecessary because the government have
already said the going to vote it down, but yet
they're introducing it as government policy. So I just think
it's a debate that it's very backwards when you.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Go into if you are in a position in future
to go into coalition talks, does this mean that you'll
be kicking any pipe dream ideas of potential coalition partners
out the door right from the start.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
The ones that would be is to visit this is this.
You know, there are examples where we've been willing to
explore things in the past. But I can't think of
anything where we have signed up to and see here
we're willing to explore that, knowing full well that we
then wouldn't support it further down the track. So I
mean I think about things like you know, Peter Dunne
had a proposal around superannuations that we were a bit
skeptical of, but with the idea we'll explore it and
(04:36):
if the numbers at UT will consider it. That's a
bit different to saying we think this is a terrible idea,
but we're going to support it because that's the cost
of getting into government.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
So Labour will never do that.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
I'm certainly not an ion topic like this.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
No, all right, let's look at the with you being
a former education minister and the head of the Secondary
School's Principals Association today is saying that kids always find
a way to cheat, and he's not in favor of
doing what some parts of Australia have done and putting
a ban on using official intelligence in schools. Where do
you stand on this?
Speaker 3 (05:11):
I mean AI, You've got to be careful about where
you use AI. AI can be a very useful tool
in teaching and learning, So there are some some sort
of gamified apps at the moment that use an AI
system to actually help kids with their learning, and I
wouldn't want to say that kids can't use those tools.
When it comes to issues around assessments, that's where it
gets difficult because if you're talking about say, handing in
(05:33):
an essay, Yeah, you want to know that the kids
have actually done that work themselves and they haven't just
gone and got chat GPT to right there essay for them.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
But isn't using chat GPT part of the work. Don't
we have to get our heads around at the last
year this is the new reality, I think.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
So I was chatting to a university lecturer about this
the other day and he was saying, actually, the universe,
some of the university lecturers are saying, you can't use
chat GPT, but you have to attribute it. So you
have to acknowledge that you've used chat GPT, and you
have to verify that what chet GPT has been producing
actually legitimate. Because he was saying, you know, there's evidence
(06:12):
of people handing in essays where actually go to the
look up the references that chet GPT is reliable and
it turns out that they don't exist, and so on.
So I think you know, chet, GPT is a tool,
and it is only a tool. It's a bit like
a word processor. You know, years ago people say, well,
we're bemoaning the fact that if kids are allowed to
hand an essays using a word process that they will
(06:33):
lose the ability to write. And you know, technology moves
on and we do need to be open to that,
but we've also got to have ways of verifying that
kids are still still learning the stuff we need them
to learn.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
How have you used it as at all?
Speaker 3 (06:50):
I've largely used it as this is a research tool,
so it's quite interesting sometimes if you're in a hurry,
like before doing a radio to before somebody being like,
oh what was the latest number on X or what
was that effect? But you've also got to make sure
that you're just getting that right and that you're verified
it right.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
I should type into GPT right now. Have you heard
anything from Chris Hopkins today?
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Well, I hope. So I've done a round of interviews
and TV interviews and so I'm so fast today, so
I would hope.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
So did Chris tell you what to say? That's all
I asked. I'll do that during the air break. Nice
to talk to you, Good to talk to you.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
John.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Find out for more from Category Mornings with John McDonald.
Listen live to news talks It'd be christ Church from
nine am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
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