John MacDonald: On why the government should be hitting the brakes on controversial bootcamps

The minute the defence force said it didn’t want a bar of the new youth boot camps, the Government should have put the brakes on then and there.

It didn’t, though, because it had talked a tough game before the election and like hell it was going to back away from that promise now.

But it should have.

So, let’s give the Government another chance and let’s see if it’s prepared to stop being so gung-ho now that we know that two of the kids who did a runner from the programme were involved in what appears to be some sort of car-jacking attempt at the weekend.

I don’t hold out much hope. But, at the very least, the Government should be pressing pause.

It should be pressing pause until it’s worked out whether this is a full-on residential programme or whether it’s still happy to have the kids go in-house for a bit and then send them back to the lives they came from in the first place. Because why would you do that?

It should be pressing pause to see if it can get the military involved on a much greater scale. The scale that it talked about before getting into government - without actually talking to the military.

It should be pressing pause until it gets Oranga Tamariki properly on-board. Because, let’s face it, boot camps are the last thing OT wants to be involved with.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Canterbury Morning's Podcast with John McDonald
from News Talk ZB.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
Now you know the minute the Defense Force told the
government that it didn't want a bar of its youth
boot camps there and then the government should have put
the brakes on. It didn't though, because well, we know
why to talk that tough game, hadn't it before the
election and like like how it was going to back
away now from that promise. But it should have, but

(00:38):
it didn't. So let's give the government in another chance. Eh,
Let's give them another chance today and see if it's
prepared to stop being so gung ho. Now that we
know that two of the kids who did a runner
from the program were involved in what appears to be
some sort of carjacking attempt at the weekend, Machetes knives

(00:59):
full ball the whole nine yards. Personally, I don't hold
out much hope of any change in the direction from
the government, but at the very least the government should
be pressing paws on the boot camps. It should be
pressing paws until it's worked out whether this is going
to be a full on residential program or whether it's

(01:22):
still happy to have the kids go in house for
a bit and then send them back to the lives
they came back from in the first place. I mean
questioned on that one, why would you do that? It
should be pressing pause to see if it can get
the military involved on a much greater scale. And here
I'm talking about the scale that it talked about before
getting into government will without actually talking to the military.

(01:46):
It should be pressing pause until it gets Udono Tarmidiki
properly on board, because, let's face it, boot camps are
the last thing OT wants to be involved with. And
I know that because I have some familiarity with Ordono
Tarmidiki and I know that sending kids to boot camps,
I mean you can say that, I can say this confidently.
Boot camps go completely against OT's DNA. The government should

(02:13):
also be pressing pause so it can get advice from
actual experts in this field instead of pressing on blindly
with something that it knew it was going to get
votes for. But at this point, anyway, it looks like
something that's doomed to fail. Not that phil O'Reilly feels
that way. You and I'm from his time with Business

(02:33):
New Zealand. He was also a member of the Welfare
Advisory Group that was in place during the last version
of the book Camps under John Key's government. Here the
spoke to him this morning.

Speaker 3 (02:42):
Now, these are troubled kids, and they've had tough upbringings,
and so who knew that sometimes they might have gone
and do bad things. And I know that's a terrible
thing that's happen, but you can't blame the whole system
just on that, on that issue. And I think we
need to see it through now because I can tell
you from personal experience of seeing one of these things
in action, they work. These kids walk out better sober,

(03:03):
you know, together, more team building and so on. I
just need to support to realigrate back into a better
life ahead.

Speaker 2 (03:10):
And he hopes, he hopes the government doesn't lose its
nerve and sticks with this bootcamp plan.

Speaker 3 (03:16):
I think maybe to see it through because otherwise all
little happiness they'll be seen to us falling over at
the first gate. As I say, these kids are gablished
in in fact they've gone through tough times, and in
fact the government's targeting much more of these kind of
harder to solve offenders and harder to solve young people
with this particular program rather than some of the kids
I saw it would just off the rails really, so

(03:37):
you can imagine that there's going to be a few
more of these bumps. And I caught teathing troubles and
for who listeners out there, as one who's actually seen
at work, it does work, and I really hope the
government will see it through and and stay the course.

Speaker 2 (03:49):
Now that's Phil and Riley's view different from mine. Now,
if you're thinking how and on a minute and on
these two kids weren't actually under lock and key because
they've finished what's called the facility based part of the
program and they were in family or community placement SNEE.
You might be thinking that's what happens, So why do
you want to write off the boot camps because of that? Well,

(04:12):
if you're thinking that, then doesn't the fact that they
did this when they were away from the boot camp?
Doesn't it show you that this idea doesn't work. Since
these two did a runner, and since that tragedy with
the third young person who was involved in the program
dying in a car crash, since then, the government it's
been at great pains. Hasn't it to point out that

(04:34):
other kids involved have got back into education or found work,
which is great. It's brilliant. Don't get me wrong that
it's not enough to convince me that the government should
just keep on keeping on without at the very least
talking to a few experts trying to get the military
more involved and deciding whether this community placement part of

(04:55):
the program is actually a good idea.

Speaker 1 (04:58):
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