All Episodes

June 5, 2025 5 mins

Imagine a school having $800,000 in the bank. 

Imagine all the things a school could buy with that amount of money.  

This is a state school I’m talking about, not a Flash Harry private school that can put the call-out to the old boys and the old girls when it needs cash to do something.  

So a state school with $800,000 in the bank, and this state school has to spend that money fixing up a cock-up forced on it by the Ministry of Education.  

The cock-up I’m referring to is that disastrous experiment called the “modern learning environment” – where our kids have been the guinea pigs, forced into huge barns instead of your old-school single-cell classrooms.  

And the school I’m talking about, having to spend $800,000 of its own money to get out of this ideological nightmare, is Shirley Boys’ High School in Christchurch.  

Good on it for flipping the bird at the modern learning environment, but I think it’s crazy that the school has to dip into its own reserves to pay to sort it out.    

I know whether it’s the school that pays or the Ministry of Education that pays, it’s all pretty much taxpayer money. But the difference is Shirley Boys' is spending money it’s actually got in the bank, which could be spent on all sorts of other things. That’s why I think the ministry should be paying for this work.  

I’ve been anti this modern learning environment nonsense right from the outset. Which was pretty much straight after the earthquakes when schools in Canterbury needed rebuilds.   

And what happened is the powers-that-be jumped on the bandwagon and started telling schools that this is how it was going to be. That, if they wanted classrooms, they were going to be barn-like structures with up to 200 kids in them. 

To be fair, it wasn’t just the Government and the Ministry of Education forcing this one. There were some teachers and principals who thought it was a brilliant idea too.  

I’ve mentioned before how I was on the board of our local school for about six years, and they got sucked into the modern learning environment frenzy.  

In fact, they didn’t wait for new buildings. They had the caretaker knocking out walls left, right and centre every weekend, it seemed. And I thought it was nuts at the time and I still think the concept is nuts. 

As does Shirley Boys'. As does Rangiora High School, which did the same thing. It cost them even more – they spent $1.5 million turning their open-plan classrooms into single classrooms.  

But here’s what the principal at Shirley Boys', Tim Grocott, is saying about why they’re doing it. 

"The level of distraction was just too high. There was too much movement going on. They can hear what is happening in the class next door. Particularly if something was being played on TV or anything like that. So that level of distraction was a negative factor."  

He says the school did a formal inquiry into how the kids and the staff were finding the open-plan set-up and found that there was widespread unhappiness and so the school had no option but to do something.  

So it started the work during the last school holidays and will finish it during the next holidays.  

Tim Grocott says the changes that have been made so far have gone down very well.  

He says feedback has been “overwhelmingly positive and instantaneous”. I bet it has. 

He says: “The staff on the first day were absolutely thrilled. One of our teachers was hugging the walls in her classroom because she was so thrilled to have walls. The boys are just much happier too."  

Tim says he thinks that open plan classrooms are a flawed concept that just did not work for his school.  

Are they ever.   

And the Ministry of Education needs to admit that and needs to fr

Mark as Played
Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Canterbury Mornings podcast with John McDonald
from News Talks AB.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
I want you to imagine. I want you to imagine something.
Imagine a school having eight hundred thousand dollars in the bank.
Now imagine all the things that a school could buy
with that amount of money. And this is a this
is a state school. I'm talking about a lot of flash,
hairy private school that can put the call out to
the old boys and the old girls and then the

(00:34):
networks when they need to do something or when it
needs cash to do something. So a state school eight
hundred thousand dollars in the bank, and this state school
has to spend that money fixing up a cockup forced
on it by the Ministry of Education. What's the cockup,
I'll tell you. The cockup I'm referring to is that

(00:56):
disastrous experiment called the modern learning environment where our kids
have been the guinea pigs, haven't they forced into huge
barns instead of your old school single cell classrooms because
it was way of the future, the way of the future,
and the school I'm talking about, which is having to
spend eight hundred thousand dollars of its own money to

(01:18):
get out of this ideological nightmare. Is Shirley Boys High
School in Christchurch. Now, good on it. Good on Shurley
Boys for flipping the bird at the modern learning environment.
But I think it's crazy that the school has to
dip into its own reserves to sort the mess out.

(01:39):
And I know whether it's the school that pays or
whether it's the Ministry of Education that pays, it all
pretty much comes down to being tax payer money. But
the difference is Shirley Boys is spending money it's actually
gotten the bank and which could be spent on all
sorts of other things. That's why I reckon the ministry
should be paying for this work. I'm in no doubt
about it. I've also been in no doubt and I've

(02:05):
also been in no doubt how nuts this modern learning
environment concept is. And I've been anti it pretty much
right from the outset, which was around about the time
of the earthquakes, when schools in Canterbury needed rebuilds, didn't they.
And what happened is the powers that be they all
jumped on the bandwagon. They started telling schools this is
how it's going to be, this is the way in

(02:26):
the future. But what they were really saying. What they
weren't saying is this is the cheapest way to do it.
And they told schools that if you want classrooms, you
want new classrooms, they're going to be barned like structures
with up to two hundred kids in them. Now'd be fair.
It wasn't just the government and the Ministry of Education
forcing this one. There was some teachers and principles who

(02:46):
had also drunk the call aid and who also thought
it was a brilliant idea. I've mentioned before how I
was on the board of our local school for about
six years. School the kids went to they got tony
what a few people there got sucked into the modern
learning environment frenzy. In fact, they didn't. They didn't wait
for new buildings. They had the caretaker or the principal anyway,

(03:08):
had the caretaker knocking up walls left, right and center
every weekend. And I thought it was nuts at the time,
and I still think the concept is nuts, and I've
been proven right, and Shirley Boys thinks it's nuts, as
well as does Rungy Order High School, which did the
same thing. It costs them even more. They spent one
and a half a million turning their open planing classrooms
into single classrooms. But here's what the principal Shirley Boys,

(03:32):
Tim Grocott, is saying today about why they're doing it.
He says, quote, the level of distraction was just too high.
There was too much movement going on. They can hear
what's happening in the class next door and think, oh,
that sounds interesting over there. I wonder what they're doing.
This is what Tim Grocott's saying. He says, particularly if
something was being playing on the TV or anything like that.
So that level of distraction was a negative factor. And

(03:55):
guess what he says. The school did a formal inquiry
into how the kids and staff were finding the open
plan set up. They did this last year, and he
says they found that there was wides bread unhappiness and
so the school realized it had no option but to
do something. So it started the work during the last
school holidays and we'll finish it during the next holidays.

(04:17):
And he says, the change is so far, how do
you think they've gone down? They've gone down brilliantly. He says.
Feedback has been quote overwhelmingly positive and instantaneous. I mean
a bet it has, he says, what about this? He says,
the staff on the first day were absolutely thrilled. One
of our teachers was hugging the walls in her classroom

(04:38):
because she was so thrilled to have walls. And he
says the boys are just much more and more much
happier as well. Tim says he thinks that open playing
classrooms are afflored to concept that just did not work
well for a school. Are they ever? You're being polite there, Tim,
And what needs to happen is the Ministry of Education

(04:59):
needs to admit that and needs to front up with
the money to pay back to Shirley Boys High School
for the eight hundred thousand bus spending fixing up this
flawed concept, or more correctly, it needs to front up
with the money to pay back Shirley Boys High School
for the eight hundred k AT spending to clean up
the mess caused by this failed experiment. As I said,

(05:21):
I think Tim Grocott's been generous saying it's a flawed concept.
It's worse than that, it is a failed experiment.

Speaker 1 (05:28):
For more from Caterbory Mornings with John McDonald, listen live
to news talks at be Christ Church from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
Advertise With Us

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know
Dateline NBC

Dateline NBC

Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com

24/7 News: The Latest

24/7 News: The Latest

The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.

Music, radio and podcasts, all free. Listen online or download the iHeart App.

Connect

© 2025 iHeartMedia, Inc.