John MacDonald: Should NZ build a nuclear reactor to attract tech giants?

How would you feel about New Zealand building small nuclear reactors to generate more power?

That’s what the Maxim Institute think-tank is calling for. Saying that, if we did, more of the world’s biggest technology companies could be attracted here to establish big data centres and that would add billions of dollars to the economy.

Thomas Scrimgeour from the Maxim Institute says the rest of the world is going nuclear on the power generation front and we need to catch up.

He also thinks New Zealanders could be convinced that small nuclear power generators are a good thing. Saying that, in the 1970s, it was assumed that New Zealand would one-day use nuclear energy to generate power. But that changed in the 1980s because of nuclear testing in the Pacific.

I’m not as confident as him.

I’m open to finding out more about nuclear power generation. But I think if you did something like a referendum on it, most people would be against it.

I may be wrong. But that’s my hunch. Because our nuclear-free policy has muddied the waters bug time.

Our policy doesn’t even let ships that are nuclear-powered into our waters. Let alone ships carrying nuclear weapons. And, because of that, a lot of people think if nuclear weapons are bad then anything and everything nuclear is bad.

But my mind is more open than that.

I’m not saying it would be easy to convince me that we should be using nuclear energy to generate power. I’d have just as many reservations as the next person.

But why can’t we at least agree to look into it?

You know what would happen, though. Even the exercise of investigating further would be hijacked by those who just cover-up their ears and don’t want to know.

Or, more to the point, it would be hi-jakced by those who want to cover up not just their own ears - but everyone else’s ears, as well.

But I’m up for us looking into it.

The reason the Maxim Institute is pushing this thinking today is that it wants us to take advantage of all the big technology companies wanting to set-up big data centres. Especially for artificial intelligence.

They’re saying there’s big money in that for New Zealand, potentially. Microsoft has committed $1 billion to local data centres. While Ammazon Web Services’ Auckland development is expected to contribute around $10.8 billion to the economy over the next 15 years.

We need the power to run them and attract more data centres here. But they need truckloads of power and, as things are at the moment, we aren’t in a position to offer truckloads of power.

Which is why the Maxim Institute is saying we need to go nuclear.

My mind is open to it. But what about yours?

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Canterbury Mornings podcast with John McDonald
from News Talk ZB.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
How would you feel about New Zealand building small nuclear
reactors to generate more power? How would you feel about that?
That's what the Maximum Maxim Institute think tank is calling
for today, saying that if we did more, of the
world's biggest technology companies could be attracted here to establish
big data centers and that would add billions of dollars

(00:36):
to the economy. Now. Thomas Scrunger from the Maxim Institute,
he said to Mike earlier that the rest of the
world is going nuclear on the power generation front, and
we need to catch up.

Speaker 3 (00:47):
Small nuclear reactors are an excellent source of energy that
we should be exploring. The International Energy Agencies report earlier
this year was titled a New Era for Nuclear Energy.
The world is heavily, heavily investing in nuclear power. Over
thirty trees have signed a pledge to triple nuclear power

(01:10):
production by twenty fifty. The world is returning to nuclear
power because it is clean, because it is reliable, is
always there for you. The nuclear power is something we
should be.

Speaker 2 (01:20):
Looking at now. How about this? He reckons New Zealanders
could be convinced that small nuclear power generators are a
good thing. I want to find out whether you agree
with that or not. But first, here's why Thomas Scruminger
thinks we would be.

Speaker 1 (01:35):
Up for it.

Speaker 3 (01:35):
New Zealand's opposition to nuclear power is quite recent, in
the nineteen seventies, so not that long ago. In the
nineteen seventies, we had a Royal Commission on Nuclear Power
and a release support report in nineteen seventy eight that
was expecting a significant nuclear power program in New Zealand
by the early twenty first century. It's only since the

(01:57):
nineteen eighties we became a country that reacted against nuclear
power because of its associations with weapons testing in the Pacific.
Nuclear energy is not the same thing as a nuclear bomb,
and New Zealand hasn't always been opposed to nuclear energy.
Once upon a time we were expecting to get nuclear power,
and we can talk people back into that.

Speaker 2 (02:17):
We can talk people back into that. Now. I'm not
as confident as him, but here's where I stand on this.
I am open to finding out more about nuclear power generation.
But I think if you did something like a referendum
on it, I think most people would be against it.
I may be wrong, but that's my hunch because New

(02:38):
Zealand's nuclear free policy has muddied the waters big time,
hasn't it big time? I mean our nuclear free policy.
It doesn't even let ships that are nuclear powered into waters,
little loone ships carrying nuclear weapons themselves. And because of that,
a lot of people think if nuclear weapons are bad,
if nuclear powered ships are bad, then they think anything

(03:00):
and everything nuclear is bad. But my mind is more
open than that.

Speaker 3 (03:04):
Now.

Speaker 2 (03:05):
I'm not saying here and now that it be easy
to convince me that we should be using nuclear energy
to generate power here in New Zealand. I'd have just
as many reservations as the next person, probably, But why
can't we at least agree to look into it. I
suppose you know what would happen, don't you? Even the
exercise of invest investigating it further would be hijacked by

(03:26):
those who just cover up their ears, don't want to know,
blah blah blah, I don't want to hear it, or
more to the point, it would be hijacked by those
who want to cover up not just their own ears,
but your ears as well. But I'm up for us
looking into it.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
Now.

Speaker 2 (03:41):
The reason the Maximum Institute is pushing this thinking today
is that it wants us to take advantage of all
the big technology companies that want to set up big
data centers, especially for artificial intelligence, and they're saying that
there's big money in that for New Zealand potentially. Microsoft
has committed a billion to local data centers. Amazon Web

(04:01):
Services the Gould of Development in Auckland expected to contribute
around ten point eight billiant a GDP over the next
fifteen years. But we need to need the power to
run them, and we need the power to attract more
data centers here. But they need truckload truckloads of power
to operate truckloads and as things are at the moment,

(04:21):
we're not in a position to offer truckloads of power,
are we, Which is why the Maxim Institute is saying
we need to go nuclear. My mind is open to it.

Speaker 1 (04:32):
For more from Caterbory Mornings with John McDonald, listen live
to news Talks It'd be christ Church from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.