August 19, 2024 • 22 mins
Are superfans happier than the rest of us? Behind the pageantry of Shen Yun, untreated injuries and emotional abuse. ‘Do They Have a Case’ with Wayne Resnick.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You're listening to Bill Handle on demand from KFI AM
six forty.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
And this is a KFI Bill Handle here on a
Monday morning, August nineteenth. Democratic National Convention starts two day
Gary and Shannon recovering it.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
They'll be there, a lot going on.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Kamala Harris is going to accept the nomination, which he
already has. And I'll be Thursday tonight Joe Biden, and
then the joys of Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton and
Barack Obama and probably Michelle Obama and then the whole panoply.
And you can tell the hierarchy of whatever political party
(00:43):
is by the later someone talks. Those who speak at
one am not too much influence.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Now we are lonely. Let me tell you about a
guy named Joe Blake.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
He kicked off his first dating app chat with Missy
gosby asking what's your face?
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Were at Star Wars Movies episode five?
Speaker 2 (01:02):
She instantly said the Empire strikes back then they were
spending birthdays watching thirteen hour Star Wars marathons, okay, and
cooking with Star Wars themed cookbooks. And between the two
of them they have twelve, count them twelve lightsabers. So
(01:22):
they got married the music, of course, was some Star
Wars and they went through you know how in the
military people, you know, the military guys have their swords
that the couples walk under put their swords up well
lightsabers in this time and it happened.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
So, you know what. Here is the question psychologists asked.
I mean, we are lonely.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
I mean data from Signet shows fifty eight percent of
Americans are lonely.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
Religion is fading, work doesn't love us back.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
And maybe these crazy obsessives have the answer. They seem
to be a lot happier, a lot six and ten
Americans said hobbies or recreational activities are very important to them.
That's way up in the last fifteen years. Meanwhile, the
(02:14):
share of people who said the same about religion dropped
seven percent.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
What's going on?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Well, obviously, and this was out of the Wall Street Journal.
It's a question that was given to psychologists. And here
is the answer, or an answer. Picture of crowd swinging
in unison to a song. Everyone there feels the same
emotion simultaneously. This is Paul Booth says this, a professor
at De Paul University, and the euphoria catches and builds.
(02:46):
That's called collective effervescence. It's almost telepathic. Loneliness is like thirst,
according to professor of psychology and neuroscience at Brigham Young,
where social being being biologically wired to crave part of
being a group. And if that's gone, our mental and
physical health can suffer, leading to depression, even diabetes, even
(03:10):
early death. And so what is this about? Why do
people not do this well? It requires vulnerability, is what
the medical experts are saying. Fandom asks us to latch
to ourselves something outside of us, something that we don't
have control of that becomes part of identities. And how
much easier it is to stay stay cool and not
(03:33):
really pay attention. It has to do with, if you
can imagine this, mental health. So people that go to,
for example, particularly rock concerts, or one guy in the
story is a grateful dead of ficionado who still listens
to the grateful Dead, and he's in his fifties or sixties.
His kids went nuts because that's all he would listen
(03:53):
to in the car. So my position has always been
that frankly, people who don't or who do have this
fanaticism that they have with other people. Swifties for example,
I've always thought that they just don't have much of
(04:14):
a life, and it turns out there is among the
experts real disagreement about that, that they have more of
a life. I also want to point out that these
studies are fake news because there is no chance that
if you're a swifty you have much of a life.
(04:35):
No value judgment, mind you. I want to point that out.
You're happier if you're a swifty or a grateful dead fan,
or you have a hobby bowllying, for example, if you're
fanatic about your bowling team, if you're fanatic about the
Dodgers or the Clippers or the Chargers, and you join
(04:59):
other fans. I went to one game with the Chargers.
I'll never do that.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Again because the fanaticism I just can't take. I can't.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
The only thing that's fun is going to a Dodgers
San Francisco game or a San Francisco you know football
team San Francisco VERSUS LA. Then at least you see
people killing each other in the parking lot. You see,
that's entertainment. Does that make sense? It's absolutely true. Okay,
(05:31):
it's been going on for what three weeks? Four weeks now?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
I have no idea. Have you ever seen Shehn Yun?
Speaker 2 (05:40):
You know the show of those Chinese people dancing and
singing and doing all these incredible acrobatic tricks and splits
and ballet, and it's incredible.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Now I have seen people said it's terrible.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
I've seen people have and people I think it's the
most wonderful thing they've ever seen. Just look at the
commercials that they buy. And I have never heard that
it is a propaganda tool for a group, well for
a cult actually that was created about twenty years ago,
(06:23):
and it involves mister Master Lee who started a religious
movement and it came out of China. It was anti
communist ten thousand protesters in Beijing who were members of
Falloun Yung.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
Is the name, full O n Gang. Excuse me, Followun
Gong is the name.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
They tried to get Tim Conway Junior, and they couldn't
get him to say following Gong. I don't know why
I said that that made absolutely no sense. Some of
them work, some of the don't. The point is this
guy who heads the cult, now he had to leave
China obviously, so he's an exile if you will, and
he has an upstate New York compound four hundred acres,
(07:12):
a full campus, followers by the millions all over the world.
He's got a giant pagoda, there's a giant Buddha who
has a face that strangely looks like his face.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
And these Shun Shenyun dancers.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Live there and they are told that he is effectively God.
Speaker 3 (07:39):
Like any other cult.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Leader, he says, if you follow what I teach, you
will be able to levitate yourself.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
I'd love to see that one. Has it happened yet?
Speaker 2 (07:52):
No? And if you complain now he has these kids,
mainly teenagers, dance, rehearse, move a do show after show
in a very short period of time.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
And it doesn't pay them because they're religious.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Because it's all about his view of while he calls
himself the creator of the universe, which kind of you know,
I don't know about that. That would fly his believers
think he is. You know, this is like any other cult.
It's just they know how to make money, and lots
and lots of it. It's not just those who are
(08:30):
part of the cult giving up their money. Jim Jim Jones,
for example, and you have David Koresh where people.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Gave the money these guys have.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Shen Young has eight troops going around the country dancing,
and people don't know it's a it's a cult, a
religious cult. Tickets can cost up to three hundred and
nine dollars. Just to give you an idea that Sheen
Yun Performing Arts. Now we're not talking about the organization
(09:06):
Galun Gong or Yallalun Gong. We're just talking about Shen
Yun Performing Arts, which is owned by the religious group.
It's a separate corporation and ticket sales on five continents,
going on constantly, eight troops holdings the more than two
hundred and sixty five million dollars.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I mean, I've always thought, always thought.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
The answer was to start your own religion and get
I would love to do that. I would love to Neil,
we have to start some kind of religion, just you
have to and just get people to.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
Buy it, like a sex cult. Yeah, and that would work,
that would work.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
And no, and the priestesses would be along Santa Monica Boulevard.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
Yeah, so that's not gonna work.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
I mean, the point is is that.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Religions are crazy, and.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
The basic religions, the great religions of the world that
have been around a long time. Judaism almost four thousand years,
Christianity over two thousand years, Mormonism the eighteen hundreds, the
Mooni's one.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Of the great religions of the world.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
That was in I think the nineteen seventies is when
that started some of these very old religions that have
been around for a while. So this one is what
twenty five years old, millions of followers.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
So next time you go, if.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
You go, I haven't been to one, and I've talked
to people and they said, yeah, it's great, or know
what's horrible. What I want to do is buy a ticket,
sit in my chair, and get me to levitate.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
If they can pull that off. Man, they have a
fan here that.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Will continue to tell you how how great this organization is.
All right, it is time for Do they have a
case with Wayne hey Bill.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
Yes, there's a part near the border in Arizona they
call the Seep Seep, and a lot of people smuggle
drugs through there. Then a lot of people decided they
would go there and rob those drug smugglers. So Border
patrol put together a tactical unit to catch the rip
crews that were going in there to rob the drug smugglers,
(11:31):
and one night they're out there on an operation, they
come across some fellas and there's a shootout.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
One of the border patrol agents ends up dead.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
Now they are able to identify a couple of these
guys even though they got away, because they left some
stuff behind and they got their DNA off of the stuff,
so they have an idea of who they're looking for.
Turns out one of them is arrested in Mexico, and
Mexico knows that the FEDS are looking for this guy,
so they arrange an interrogation of this guy.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
Buy the American Feds the.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
FBI in a jail in Mexico, and they go in
and they say, tell us everything you know, and he says, well, yes,
I was there.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Why were you there to drop off food?
Speaker 3 (12:20):
What?
Speaker 4 (12:21):
Yeah, we would just go and drop off food. Now
here's the thing. They are charged with murder and some
other stuff and hobbes act robbery. This is a federal
robbery statue to robbery that interferes with commerce. The Feds
must be able to prove that they were there to
(12:42):
rob in order to convict them of the murder. If
they can't prove they were there to commit robbery. They
cannot get them on anything. So this guy says, if
I'm dropping off food, they try everything every tactic in
the book. But then his lawyer, the guy lawyer, a
Mexican lawyer, says to him, listen, you can't get in
(13:06):
trouble for going to rob drug dealers because it's not
a crime to rob people who are committing a crime.
So you can't hurt yourself here. Why don't you just
really tell them the truth? And he goes, oh, well, okay,
and then he tells them everything. Yes, we went to
rob drug dealers, and I've robbed drug dealers before and
(13:28):
all of that stuff. Well, he gets to court in
America and a better lawyer says, you need to suppress
that whole confession because this advice by his attorney in
Mexico that you can tell them everything because there's no
way you can get in trouble for robbing drug dealers
is wrong and false and stupid, and there's no possible
(13:51):
way to justify it. Ineffective assistance of counsel.
Speaker 3 (13:56):
What do you say, Ah, well, I think he loses,
because does.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Ineffectiveness assistance of counsel go to someone who is not
counsel in the United States, not a member of the bar. Therefore,
I don't think he is a lawyer recognized by the US.
I don't think if any jurisdiction that says yes, if
you're represented by someone outside of the country that we
(14:27):
view as representation.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
This is my guess, okay, And I don't know which
way it would go.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
And his argument that you cannot commit a crime against
someone who's committing a.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
Crime, of course you can.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
Are you kidding Someone shoplifts and is running out the
door committing a crime and a security guard shoots him
in the back. Well, I didn't commit a crime because
he was committing a crime. So I am going to
argue and we'll see if I'm right on this one,
because this one is not very clear cut the way
I see it. The argument in effect thats this in
(15:01):
effectiveness of counsel is not the same as a domestic lawyer,
and it just not recognize that kind of counsel.
Speaker 3 (15:12):
What did the court say.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
Now, this is a reasonable line of thinking that you're on,
and this is one of the lines of reasoning.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
That was used.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
However, in this case, the Ninth Circuit found that because
he was being interrogated by the Americans about an American investigation.
That it doesn't matter where the lawyer's from, the lawyer
counts as a lawyer. So knowing that, do you want
to say anything about the the level of blunder of
(15:41):
telling his client what he told them that you can
you can tell them everything because you can't get in
trouble for robbing drug dealers.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
Yeah, it's pretty high. It's pretty high.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
The blunder is like one, several levels of idiocy, not
just level one. It goes up level two, three, probably
beyond six levels of stupid and bad legal practice. But
you're right, I didn't take into account that it was
American interrogation. But you know what, if he argues, does
(16:15):
someone have to be given miranda warnings outside of the country,
I guess so. I guess so he was given his miranda.
Everything was done by American law.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
Huh.
Speaker 4 (16:26):
So that was part of the problem is that he
didn't have anything procedurally.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
But it didn't matter.
Speaker 4 (16:31):
The guy wins because his lawyer was an absolute and.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
That is and that is an effectiveness of counsel, which
means that his confession is thrown out and they start
from scratch again. And did they have enough evidence outside
of his confession.
Speaker 4 (16:47):
The fact of the matter is reading everything about the
case without somebody saying, oh, yes, we were there to
rob people, they aren't.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Gonna be able to convict them of anything.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
Wow, okay, uh yeah, well I got that one right,
I got that one wrong, one for one and no, you.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Got it, you got it.
Speaker 4 (17:07):
I say you got it right because the substance of
it is how bad was his advice? And is there
any way around how bad his advice was? And you
got that right. The other thing is more of a
weird technical procedural thing.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
All right, all right, let's get to this guy.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
He diving and he's got his phone in the in
the holder thing nice and legal, and the GPS freezes,
so he pulls over to fix it, and about ten
seconds after he pulls over, there's a cop at his window.
Bomb bomb bomb what's going on? Turns out he's, apparently,
according to the cop, in a high crime area. So
(17:43):
he says, oh, my GPS froze. I went to fix it,
and the guy says license please, and he goes yes,
and also, I will give you now my concealed carry permit.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Here it is, and let you know there is a.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
Gun down here in the driver's side pocket. The cop
yanks him out of the car, yells at him, throws
him in the back of the squad car. Other cops
show up. The guy sits in the back of a
squad car for thirty minutes and then he's let go.
(18:21):
So he sues for false arrest and also search, false
search incedure because as he's sitting in the car for
thirty seconds, he sees this cop.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Search his whole car, including the trunk.
Speaker 4 (18:35):
And he says, there was never any probable cause or
even reasonable suspicion that I was committing any crime. And
the cop says his defense is, well, I had to
verify that this permit that you gave me is valid.
That doesn't take thirty minutes, that doesn't require putting me
(18:56):
in the back of the squad car, all these things.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
So the cop says qualified immunity.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
I didn't violate his rights, and even if I did,
I didn't know that.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
I wasn't supposed to do what I did.
Speaker 4 (19:06):
And a lower court judge says, no, no qualified immunity
for you. Cop appeals Second c Circuit Court of Appeal says,
what do you think.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
Well, because I'm going to be adamant about what I'm
about to say, I'm guessing the Circuit Court of Appeals
went the other way. And let's start with the fact
that I think the driver wins because there's no probable
cause the way you describe it, the fact that he
had a gun and told him about the gun and
(19:35):
showed the permit.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
The cop clearly overreacted.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
As you said, it's very easy to determine whether the
gun was legal or not. They could have kept him
in the driver's seat. Now you could argue for fear
he was going to take out the gun and it
was a safety issue, but I don't think that's going
to fly at all. I think that it was a
false arrest. The cop way overreacted on that one. And
(20:00):
the search and seizure issue, the cops shouldn't have done that,
but there was no evidence that they found for wrongdoing.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
So no harm, no foul, because the violation of search
and seizure, for the most part.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
Is simply not allowed, not allowing the evidence, suppressing the
evidence that was found. I don't know if there's a
common law or statutory provision that says if cops sees
or if they do an illegal search and seizure and
find nothing, if there is punishment for that.
Speaker 3 (20:30):
I don't know, but I think I think he wins.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
He does win. He means he wins big time.
Speaker 4 (20:37):
And the Circuit court said, you can't have this because
here's why. I mean, the idea that he wanted to
check the validity of the permit is fine, but you
don't do all these things to this guy to check
the validity. And the problem is, if he can do this,
it means everybody with a gun permit, cops can always presume,
(20:58):
with zero reason to so, that it's not lawful. And
then I thought, well, if they can do that with
somebody's concealed carry permit, why couldn't you do that with
somebody's driver's license. Here's my license. I presume this is
a false license. I don't have any reason to presume it,
but I do.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Okay, So excellent fifty two this morning, No, two for two,
two for two.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
You're gonna give it to me, all right?
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I win?
Speaker 2 (21:24):
All right, We'll see you next Monday, Wayne, as always.
Speaker 3 (21:28):
All right, we're done, guys. Coming up.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Gary and Shannon are at the Democratic National Convention all
week long.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
We'll see you tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
We start with wake up Call and that's with Amy
five to six. The rest of us come aboard from
six to nine except for Cono and and who Are
Here Forever.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
That's it. Catch you tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
This is kf I Am six forty Live everywhere on
the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (21:54):
You've been listening to the Bill Handle Show.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Catch my Show Monday through Friday, six am to nine am,
and any time on demand on the iHeartRadio app
You're listening to Bill Handle on demand from KFI AM
six forty.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
And this is a KFI Bill Handle here on a
Monday morning, August nineteenth. Democratic National Convention starts two day
Gary and Shannon recovering it.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
They'll be there, a lot going on.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Kamala Harris is going to accept the nomination, which he
already has. And I'll be Thursday tonight Joe Biden, and
then the joys of Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton and
Barack Obama and probably Michelle Obama and then the whole panoply.
And you can tell the hierarchy of whatever political party
(00:43):
is by the later someone talks. Those who speak at
one am not too much influence.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Now we are lonely. Let me tell you about a
guy named Joe Blake.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
He kicked off his first dating app chat with Missy
gosby asking what's your face?
Speaker 3 (01:00):
Were at Star Wars Movies episode five?
Speaker 2 (01:02):
She instantly said the Empire strikes back then they were
spending birthdays watching thirteen hour Star Wars marathons, okay, and
cooking with Star Wars themed cookbooks. And between the two
of them they have twelve, count them twelve lightsabers. So
(01:22):
they got married the music, of course, was some Star
Wars and they went through you know how in the
military people, you know, the military guys have their swords
that the couples walk under put their swords up well
lightsabers in this time and it happened.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
So, you know what. Here is the question psychologists asked.
I mean, we are lonely.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
I mean data from Signet shows fifty eight percent of
Americans are lonely.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
Religion is fading, work doesn't love us back.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
And maybe these crazy obsessives have the answer. They seem
to be a lot happier, a lot six and ten
Americans said hobbies or recreational activities are very important to them.
That's way up in the last fifteen years. Meanwhile, the
(02:14):
share of people who said the same about religion dropped
seven percent.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
What's going on?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Well, obviously, and this was out of the Wall Street Journal.
It's a question that was given to psychologists. And here
is the answer, or an answer. Picture of crowd swinging
in unison to a song. Everyone there feels the same
emotion simultaneously. This is Paul Booth says this, a professor
at De Paul University, and the euphoria catches and builds.
(02:46):
That's called collective effervescence. It's almost telepathic. Loneliness is like thirst,
according to professor of psychology and neuroscience at Brigham Young,
where social being being biologically wired to crave part of
being a group. And if that's gone, our mental and
physical health can suffer, leading to depression, even diabetes, even
(03:10):
early death. And so what is this about? Why do
people not do this well? It requires vulnerability, is what
the medical experts are saying. Fandom asks us to latch
to ourselves something outside of us, something that we don't
have control of that becomes part of identities. And how
much easier it is to stay stay cool and not
(03:33):
really pay attention. It has to do with, if you
can imagine this, mental health. So people that go to,
for example, particularly rock concerts, or one guy in the
story is a grateful dead of ficionado who still listens
to the grateful Dead, and he's in his fifties or sixties.
His kids went nuts because that's all he would listen
(03:53):
to in the car. So my position has always been
that frankly, people who don't or who do have this
fanaticism that they have with other people. Swifties for example,
I've always thought that they just don't have much of
(04:14):
a life, and it turns out there is among the
experts real disagreement about that, that they have more of
a life. I also want to point out that these
studies are fake news because there is no chance that
if you're a swifty you have much of a life.
(04:35):
No value judgment, mind you. I want to point that out.
You're happier if you're a swifty or a grateful dead fan,
or you have a hobby bowllying, for example, if you're
fanatic about your bowling team, if you're fanatic about the
Dodgers or the Clippers or the Chargers, and you join
(04:59):
other fans. I went to one game with the Chargers.
I'll never do that.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Again because the fanaticism I just can't take. I can't.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
The only thing that's fun is going to a Dodgers
San Francisco game or a San Francisco you know football
team San Francisco VERSUS LA. Then at least you see
people killing each other in the parking lot. You see,
that's entertainment. Does that make sense? It's absolutely true. Okay,
(05:31):
it's been going on for what three weeks? Four weeks now?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
I have no idea. Have you ever seen Shehn Yun?
Speaker 2 (05:40):
You know the show of those Chinese people dancing and
singing and doing all these incredible acrobatic tricks and splits
and ballet, and it's incredible.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Now I have seen people said it's terrible.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
I've seen people have and people I think it's the
most wonderful thing they've ever seen. Just look at the
commercials that they buy. And I have never heard that
it is a propaganda tool for a group, well for
a cult actually that was created about twenty years ago,
(06:23):
and it involves mister Master Lee who started a religious
movement and it came out of China. It was anti
communist ten thousand protesters in Beijing who were members of
Falloun Yung.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
Is the name, full O n Gang. Excuse me, Followun
Gong is the name.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
They tried to get Tim Conway Junior, and they couldn't
get him to say following Gong. I don't know why
I said that that made absolutely no sense. Some of
them work, some of the don't. The point is this
guy who heads the cult, now he had to leave
China obviously, so he's an exile if you will, and
he has an upstate New York compound four hundred acres,
(07:12):
a full campus, followers by the millions all over the world.
He's got a giant pagoda, there's a giant Buddha who
has a face that strangely looks like his face.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
And these Shun Shenyun dancers.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Live there and they are told that he is effectively God.
Speaker 3 (07:39):
Like any other cult.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Leader, he says, if you follow what I teach, you
will be able to levitate yourself.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
I'd love to see that one. Has it happened yet?
Speaker 2 (07:52):
No? And if you complain now he has these kids,
mainly teenagers, dance, rehearse, move a do show after show
in a very short period of time.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
And it doesn't pay them because they're religious.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Because it's all about his view of while he calls
himself the creator of the universe, which kind of you know,
I don't know about that. That would fly his believers
think he is. You know, this is like any other cult.
It's just they know how to make money, and lots
and lots of it. It's not just those who are
(08:30):
part of the cult giving up their money. Jim Jim Jones,
for example, and you have David Koresh where people.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Gave the money these guys have.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Shen Young has eight troops going around the country dancing,
and people don't know it's a it's a cult, a
religious cult. Tickets can cost up to three hundred and
nine dollars. Just to give you an idea that Sheen
Yun Performing Arts. Now we're not talking about the organization
(09:06):
Galun Gong or Yallalun Gong. We're just talking about Shen
Yun Performing Arts, which is owned by the religious group.
It's a separate corporation and ticket sales on five continents,
going on constantly, eight troops holdings the more than two
hundred and sixty five million dollars.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I mean, I've always thought, always thought.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
The answer was to start your own religion and get
I would love to do that. I would love to Neil,
we have to start some kind of religion, just you
have to and just get people to.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
Buy it, like a sex cult. Yeah, and that would work,
that would work.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
And no, and the priestesses would be along Santa Monica Boulevard.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
Yeah, so that's not gonna work.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
I mean, the point is is that.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Religions are crazy, and.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
The basic religions, the great religions of the world that
have been around a long time. Judaism almost four thousand years,
Christianity over two thousand years, Mormonism the eighteen hundreds, the
Mooni's one.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Of the great religions of the world.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
That was in I think the nineteen seventies is when
that started some of these very old religions that have
been around for a while. So this one is what
twenty five years old, millions of followers.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
So next time you go, if.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
You go, I haven't been to one, and I've talked
to people and they said, yeah, it's great, or know
what's horrible. What I want to do is buy a ticket,
sit in my chair, and get me to levitate.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
If they can pull that off. Man, they have a
fan here that.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Will continue to tell you how how great this organization is.
All right, it is time for Do they have a
case with Wayne hey Bill.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
Yes, there's a part near the border in Arizona they
call the Seep Seep, and a lot of people smuggle
drugs through there. Then a lot of people decided they
would go there and rob those drug smugglers. So Border
patrol put together a tactical unit to catch the rip
crews that were going in there to rob the drug smugglers,
(11:31):
and one night they're out there on an operation, they
come across some fellas and there's a shootout.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
One of the border patrol agents ends up dead.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
Now they are able to identify a couple of these
guys even though they got away, because they left some
stuff behind and they got their DNA off of the stuff,
so they have an idea of who they're looking for.
Turns out one of them is arrested in Mexico, and
Mexico knows that the FEDS are looking for this guy,
so they arrange an interrogation of this guy.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
Buy the American Feds the.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
FBI in a jail in Mexico, and they go in
and they say, tell us everything you know, and he says, well, yes,
I was there.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Why were you there to drop off food?
Speaker 3 (12:20):
What?
Speaker 4 (12:21):
Yeah, we would just go and drop off food. Now
here's the thing. They are charged with murder and some
other stuff and hobbes act robbery. This is a federal
robbery statue to robbery that interferes with commerce. The Feds
must be able to prove that they were there to
(12:42):
rob in order to convict them of the murder. If
they can't prove they were there to commit robbery. They
cannot get them on anything. So this guy says, if
I'm dropping off food, they try everything every tactic in
the book. But then his lawyer, the guy lawyer, a
Mexican lawyer, says to him, listen, you can't get in
(13:06):
trouble for going to rob drug dealers because it's not
a crime to rob people who are committing a crime.
So you can't hurt yourself here. Why don't you just
really tell them the truth? And he goes, oh, well, okay,
and then he tells them everything. Yes, we went to
rob drug dealers, and I've robbed drug dealers before and
(13:28):
all of that stuff. Well, he gets to court in
America and a better lawyer says, you need to suppress
that whole confession because this advice by his attorney in
Mexico that you can tell them everything because there's no
way you can get in trouble for robbing drug dealers
is wrong and false and stupid, and there's no possible
(13:51):
way to justify it. Ineffective assistance of counsel.
Speaker 3 (13:56):
What do you say, Ah, well, I think he loses,
because does.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Ineffectiveness assistance of counsel go to someone who is not
counsel in the United States, not a member of the bar. Therefore,
I don't think he is a lawyer recognized by the US.
I don't think if any jurisdiction that says yes, if
you're represented by someone outside of the country that we
(14:27):
view as representation.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
This is my guess, okay, And I don't know which
way it would go.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
And his argument that you cannot commit a crime against
someone who's committing a.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
Crime, of course you can.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
Are you kidding Someone shoplifts and is running out the
door committing a crime and a security guard shoots him
in the back. Well, I didn't commit a crime because
he was committing a crime. So I am going to
argue and we'll see if I'm right on this one,
because this one is not very clear cut the way
I see it. The argument in effect thats this in
(15:01):
effectiveness of counsel is not the same as a domestic lawyer,
and it just not recognize that kind of counsel.
Speaker 3 (15:12):
What did the court say.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
Now, this is a reasonable line of thinking that you're on,
and this is one of the lines of reasoning.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
That was used.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
However, in this case, the Ninth Circuit found that because
he was being interrogated by the Americans about an American investigation.
That it doesn't matter where the lawyer's from, the lawyer
counts as a lawyer. So knowing that, do you want
to say anything about the the level of blunder of
(15:41):
telling his client what he told them that you can
you can tell them everything because you can't get in
trouble for robbing drug dealers.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
Yeah, it's pretty high. It's pretty high.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
The blunder is like one, several levels of idiocy, not
just level one. It goes up level two, three, probably
beyond six levels of stupid and bad legal practice. But
you're right, I didn't take into account that it was
American interrogation. But you know what, if he argues, does
(16:15):
someone have to be given miranda warnings outside of the country,
I guess so. I guess so he was given his miranda.
Everything was done by American law.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
Huh.
Speaker 4 (16:26):
So that was part of the problem is that he
didn't have anything procedurally.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
But it didn't matter.
Speaker 4 (16:31):
The guy wins because his lawyer was an absolute and.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
That is and that is an effectiveness of counsel, which
means that his confession is thrown out and they start
from scratch again. And did they have enough evidence outside
of his confession.
Speaker 4 (16:47):
The fact of the matter is reading everything about the
case without somebody saying, oh, yes, we were there to
rob people, they aren't.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Gonna be able to convict them of anything.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
Wow, okay, uh yeah, well I got that one right,
I got that one wrong, one for one and no, you.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Got it, you got it.
Speaker 4 (17:07):
I say you got it right because the substance of
it is how bad was his advice? And is there
any way around how bad his advice was? And you
got that right. The other thing is more of a
weird technical procedural thing.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
All right, all right, let's get to this guy.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
He diving and he's got his phone in the in
the holder thing nice and legal, and the GPS freezes,
so he pulls over to fix it, and about ten
seconds after he pulls over, there's a cop at his window.
Bomb bomb bomb what's going on? Turns out he's, apparently,
according to the cop, in a high crime area. So
(17:43):
he says, oh, my GPS froze. I went to fix it,
and the guy says license please, and he goes yes,
and also, I will give you now my concealed carry permit.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Here it is, and let you know there is a.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
Gun down here in the driver's side pocket. The cop
yanks him out of the car, yells at him, throws
him in the back of the squad car. Other cops
show up. The guy sits in the back of a
squad car for thirty minutes and then he's let go.
(18:21):
So he sues for false arrest and also search, false
search incedure because as he's sitting in the car for
thirty seconds, he sees this cop.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Search his whole car, including the trunk.
Speaker 4 (18:35):
And he says, there was never any probable cause or
even reasonable suspicion that I was committing any crime. And
the cop says his defense is, well, I had to
verify that this permit that you gave me is valid.
That doesn't take thirty minutes, that doesn't require putting me
(18:56):
in the back of the squad car, all these things.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
So the cop says qualified immunity.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
I didn't violate his rights, and even if I did,
I didn't know that.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
I wasn't supposed to do what I did.
Speaker 4 (19:06):
And a lower court judge says, no, no qualified immunity
for you. Cop appeals Second c Circuit Court of Appeal says,
what do you think.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
Well, because I'm going to be adamant about what I'm
about to say, I'm guessing the Circuit Court of Appeals
went the other way. And let's start with the fact
that I think the driver wins because there's no probable
cause the way you describe it, the fact that he
had a gun and told him about the gun and
(19:35):
showed the permit.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
The cop clearly overreacted.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
As you said, it's very easy to determine whether the
gun was legal or not. They could have kept him
in the driver's seat. Now you could argue for fear
he was going to take out the gun and it
was a safety issue, but I don't think that's going
to fly at all. I think that it was a
false arrest. The cop way overreacted on that one. And
(20:00):
the search and seizure issue, the cops shouldn't have done that,
but there was no evidence that they found for wrongdoing.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
So no harm, no foul, because the violation of search
and seizure, for the most part.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
Is simply not allowed, not allowing the evidence, suppressing the
evidence that was found. I don't know if there's a
common law or statutory provision that says if cops sees
or if they do an illegal search and seizure and
find nothing, if there is punishment for that.
Speaker 3 (20:30):
I don't know, but I think I think he wins.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
He does win. He means he wins big time.
Speaker 4 (20:37):
And the Circuit court said, you can't have this because
here's why. I mean, the idea that he wanted to
check the validity of the permit is fine, but you
don't do all these things to this guy to check
the validity. And the problem is, if he can do this,
it means everybody with a gun permit, cops can always presume,
(20:58):
with zero reason to so, that it's not lawful. And
then I thought, well, if they can do that with
somebody's concealed carry permit, why couldn't you do that with
somebody's driver's license. Here's my license. I presume this is
a false license. I don't have any reason to presume it,
but I do.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Okay, So excellent fifty two this morning, No, two for two,
two for two.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
You're gonna give it to me, all right?
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I win?
Speaker 2 (21:24):
All right, We'll see you next Monday, Wayne, as always.
Speaker 3 (21:28):
All right, we're done, guys. Coming up.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Gary and Shannon are at the Democratic National Convention all
week long.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
We'll see you tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
We start with wake up Call and that's with Amy
five to six. The rest of us come aboard from
six to nine except for Cono and and who Are
Here Forever.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
That's it. Catch you tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
This is kf I Am six forty Live everywhere on
the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (21:54):
You've been listening to the Bill Handle Show.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Catch my Show Monday through Friday, six am to nine am,
and any time on demand on the iHeartRadio app
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