Liam Hehir: Political Commentator on the Te Pati Māori suspension debate

Parliament's Speaker will hold all the power in today's vote on three Te Pati Māori MPs. 

The Privileges Committee's proposing 21-day suspensions for the party's leaders, and a seven-day suspension for MP Hana-Rawhiti Maipi-Clarke for their behaviour at last year's Treaty Principles Bill vote.  

The public gallery will be closed for safety and security reasons. 

Political Commentator Liam Hehir told Ryan Bridge the punishment is unprecedented but so is the offence. 

He says the suspension needs to be looked at in the context that these were never before seen actions. 

Hehir says it's an unusual situation, as the debate technically has no time limit.  

He says Speaker Gerry Brownlee has the unique ability to regulate how long people speak, tell them if they're repeating themselves and close off debate. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Votes on the three week suspension for Debbie and Rawdi
today in seven days for my Pete Clark, the public
gallery will sit empty. The debate could drag on with
filibustering every MP able to speak.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
Liam.

Speaker 1 (00:10):
Here is a columnist and political commentator with me this
morning them, Good morning, good morning. You're right, this is unprecedented.
You know, normally you just get named, you apologize. It
would be the worst suspension since Muldoon in the eighties.
Is it too far?

Speaker 2 (00:26):
Well, look, that's for Parliament to decide, and it's a
really important thing. But can I just point out something
that's going to annoy me a little bit, is, yes,
the punishment would be unprecedented, but the offense is pretty
unprecedented too, right, And so sort of the idea that
there's some sort of sort of arbitrary or outrageous thing
about a never before I heard of punishment needs to

(00:50):
be in the context of the fact that it's never
before heard of offense, so in breach of parliamentary privilege.
So it's pretty yes, it's here, but the circumstances were severe.

Speaker 1 (01:02):
I agree with you, But so for me that the
the aggravating factor was the pistol gesture by Debbie, But
then why why was her sentence not longer? And what
about Julianne Jenta, Well it certainly, well.

Speaker 2 (01:17):
That certainly was an aggregating, aggravating factor, but really the
truly aggravating factor is the complete lack of remorse and
contrition and and that's the difference between julian and Jena.
And also, and let's not forget that Penny Hellaby is
also up for a vote today because he was also
complained of to the Privileges Committee and in both cases

(01:37):
apologize unreservedly accepted the authority of the House to regulate
its own affairs and conduct its own discipline of the members.
And you know, we're treated with some leniency as a result,
whereas here we have a continuing, continuing contempt for the
ability of Parliament to even regulate the conduct of its

(01:57):
own members. And that is more than anything as aggravating factor.

Speaker 1 (02:01):
So what has to happen today, because this could drag
on and on and on. Does National need to cut
a deal with the labor Because from where I'm sitting,
New Zeam first Act to Party, Malori, the Greens, they
all have a political interest in dragging this out but
the bigger parties are the ones probably who will actually
lose if this starts to look messy and too long.

Speaker 2 (02:22):
You're right about that. So the small parties always have
an incentive for it to be as much of a
stunt as possible because that plays their base. But really
the key person is Jerry Brownley. So this is an
unusual kind of situation when you're debating matters of privilege.
When the house is you're not subject to the normal

(02:44):
time limits because it's sort of it's a special sort
of circumstance. And so in the theory, you know, speeches
can go on for as long as they want. They're
not subject to a time limit, and so you have
what might look in some ways like an American filibuster,
where are speaker can get up and talk forever to
protest what's happening and come up to the whole business

(03:06):
of the house. But Jerry Browne is the speaker of
the House. It has the unique ability to regulate how
long people speak, to say that they're repeating themselves, that
they're talking about irrelevant things, and also to close off debate.
So actually, Jerry Brownlee, he holds all the power in the.

Speaker 1 (03:23):
Situation, interesting Takelem really appreciate that. Thanks for coming on
lim Here, columnist and political commentator with us this morning.
That will take place this afternoon.

Speaker 2 (03:32):
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