April 25, 2024 • 38 mins
In the first hour, leading up to the NFL Draft beginning at 5pm, Dave Softy Mahler and Dick Fain are joined by Mike Holmgren and Hugh Millen to break down the draft ahead, what the Seahawks will do at 16, plus Michael Penix with former UW Coach and current Alabama Offensive Coordinator Nick Sheridan.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:01):
Go, Mike Comgrin, Dick Fane, and Hugh Breedlove Millan and like clockwork,
guys, Hugh and Dick like clockwork, Hugh Millan, Dick Fane.
I want you to know that everyyear Mike Combrin comes over here, he
always threatens to make this the lastyear. Every year, next year,
I'm out, I'm done, I'mgonna retire, I'm finished. And every
year you keep showing up because youlove this too, admit it. You
(00:24):
love hanging out with us talking draft. That's why I'm here. I am
here because of you three. Yeah, you have the draft right right,
because don't ask me any questions otherthan other than the fact, other than
the fact that what we did innineteen twenty three, Yeah, all right,
and you just sit there, allright, and when the draft starts
at five o'clock, we'll just saygoodbye and we're done. Well, it's
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an exciting time. So I appreciateyou asking me, but you're right.
Next year, No, have yougotten I told him? Have you gotten
more aggressive with John Schneider in thehallway as the years go on? Or
have you gotten less aggressive as faras who he should take? Well,
it's kind of the same because Ibumped into him as I was coming into
the building and it was really goodto see him and wish him well,
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and I said, Okay, here'swho you should take. And he looks
at me and I go, I'mjust kidd John. You you don't have
to go what I say. Soit was, but we reminisced a little
bit about previous drafts. A coupleof times I yelled at him over things,
and I feel bad about it tothis day. Sure, yeah,
but I saw you shove him upagainst a wall in the hall about an
hour ago. It's like, what'sgoing on here? Has he ever listened
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to you as far as advice ondraft day? Have you ever given John
a player and he's taken that player? No? Since he's been here.
Yeah, no, okay, Istay away from that. I think I
know my place. Yeah. Well, there's a first time for everything.
Man. You never know. Oneday he might actually pay attention. But
the Seahawks have seven picks in thisyear's draft for now, first pick is
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obviously number sixteen in the first round. And you know, here, it's
funny that everybody is sitting here waiting. I think guys Dick and Mike,
you'd probably agree. They're waiting forthe Hawks to trade down today in the
first round, and you guys correctme if I'm wrong. But last year
they had the number five pick thatthey got from Denver and we woke up
on draft Day and they used it. Right. Twenty twenty two, they
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had the number nine pick you wakeup on draft Day, Dick, and
they used it on Charles Cross.They did not have a first round draft
pick in twenty twenty one or twentytwenty two because they gave him to the
Jets for Adams, but they didhave their original pick at number twenty seven
and they used that on Jordan Brooksin twenty twenty. I think the last
time the Seahawks actually had a firstround draft pick on draft Day and traded
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down was back in twenty nineteen whenthey had that pick swap with Green Bay.
So either a Schneider's grown up alittle bit and he wants to use
those picks, or he's due.He's due, and the reason he's due
is because I can just see JohnSchneider sitting there between sixteen and eighty one,
just sweating like it's too big agap for him. He's never had
a gap like that, I amgoing back. The biggest gap he has
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had is twenty seven to seventy nine. I can't believe he didn't trade down.
Instead, he took Rashad Penny withthe twenty seventh pick, so I
would be really surprised if he didn't. If you now he may trade a
pick next year for a pick thisyear in the second round. I'm not
saying he's guaranteed to trade down outof sixteen, but that's probably the most
likely. I guess. The questionis how confident are we? What are
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the odds? Guys here will startwith you that the Seahawks actually make that
selection here at number two. Well, you know, there's a lot of
talk about whether they'll move down andfrom sixteen you say, okay, they
don't like their value. For example, Seattle, as we know, doesn't
have the second round pick. They'retotal This is according to the Harvard Sports
and Analysis Collective. The Seahawks havethe twenty sixth highest draft value. The
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Cardinals have number one, highlighted byThey have the fourth overall pick, they
have the twenty seventh pick, andthey also have the thirty fifth pick.
Their total value is fourteen hundred andtwelve. That's the Cardinals. Just remember
that number. You don't need toknow what it means. Just remember one
thousand. Don't know what it means, but just it just means the best
fourteen twelve. The worst is theCleveland Browns at four four oh two.
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So that's the world that all ofthe NFL is from. Fory tell us
for reference, though, can youtell us what like a mid first round
pick would be in points? Uh, not on that, not not on
that, but but Seattle. Soif if we're in a range between fourteen
twelve and four oh two, Seattleis twenty sixth in the NFL at six
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sixty seven. And so the theory, if they move down, they're not
going to change their value. Rightin theory, like they could trade the
one for you know, six fourthround picks, the value the fourth round
picks is still going to be equalto the one. So they're not gonna
materially change the value. But Mike, they will if they trade down pick
get more picks. And as ageneral rule, is it not true,
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like if you say, we havea horrible team, we went one in
fifteen last year, our roster stinks, let's move down because there's a lot
of guys in the third, fourth, and fifth round. They're better than
the dudes we got. Let's goget all those guys because they're gonna make
the team. If you have agreat team, you're fifteen to one.
You say, man, there's nota lot of openings. We're like one
player away. Let's focus on thatone player. Right, that's a general
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rule. And where is that true? A? And where Seattle in line
with that? Yeah, that's ageneral rule. And I think as John
grew up in Green Bay when Iwas there under Ron Wolf, I remember
going in and seeing our board thefirst time, and Bill Walsh did it
differently in San Francisco. He waskind of the guru. He did differently.
When I got into green Bay thefirst round draft picks on the day,
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there were sixteen names up there andI said to Ron, I said,
there's thirty two teams or you know, we don't have enough people up
there, and he goes, wegot plenty one of those guys will be
there. Yeah, And it wasright. So what he also did,
we said, okay, and everyteam does this, picks one through fifteen
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or whatever those are, take them. They can't miss. Then from sixteen
to forty or some number. Thoseare all We're okay with anything there.
So let's get people, not necessarilyby position, but a need. Let's
get our need there instead of whatwe think is the best player. You
just say sixteen to forty, Mike, No, I understand they're just kind
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of as a general. But thereis a distinction between thirty two and thirty
three, right because thirty two you'restill in the first round, you have
the fifth year option. Thirty threeyou're in the second round, you only
have the four year. How muchof that is part of the discussion when
you're working that part of the draft, you know what? With me,
it never was part of it.Honestly, the rookie contract and things like
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that. I was not focused onthat at all. I really wasn't.
I wanted to. I'm going togo the player and let the let the
guys with the thick classes and stuffthat do that them, let them worry
about the rest of the stuff beingcounting. Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna
get the player. You know,you're wearing fairly thick glasses right now,
really thick? Are you there?I hear your voice. But the point
that Dick made about Schneider just losinghis mind, and you may have said
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this, Dick, I was distractedfor half a second, so I apologize
if I'm being repetitive. The gapbetween the first pick the Hawks have now
and their second pick is sixty fivepicks. Okay, they had to wait
eighty one picks in twenty twenty onebetween Dwayne Eskridge and Trey Brown. But
that's the year they gave up oneof their first round draft picks for Jamal
Adams. He has three picks.You'll wonder how antsy the guy's gonna get
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tonight. No one thing I wasgoing to say when I talked to John
today, I said, I wasteasing. I'm said, I'm going to
tell you the guy I want youto pick. And everyone left. Okay.
Then then Dave Pierson was there andgoes, what do you think he's
gonna do? And I said,and I'm gonna save that for the radio.
No tell us, town, whatdo you think he's gonna do?
I said, you're gonna trade back? Yeah? I told him that.
He kind of gave me this funnylook and I said, okay, I've
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played poker before. You are tradingback? Did you give him a name?
Actually, though, did you giveJohn a name? No? Bid?
God, how concerned would you beif you're in that draft room and
you have sixteen to eighty one tosit? I mean, how much much
would that go into your thought processof Man, we kind of have to
trade down a lot more than wenormally would if we had the sixteenth pick
in the second round, unless thesixteenth pick is unanimously we got to have
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this guy. This guy makes isto use point, this one player makes
us a lot better right away,right then you take him. If there's
any hesitation at all. I thinkif there's any hesitation at all, you
trade back, because sitting there that'shard, and they could trade out of
there still get a number one pickand add a pick. They can do
that. Someone wants to move up, Mike. I'm glad you brought that
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up because I was gonna say,Hugh that our buddy Daniel Jeremiah from the
NFL network is mocking Terry On Arnoldthe corner from Alabama to the Seahawks at
sixteen not necessarily a position of need. But if you've got a guy that
you believe is going to be astar, Cooper de gene by the way
from Iowa may not be a positionof need. But if you think he's
going to become a star and aHall of Fame type player, does it
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really matter if you need him ornot. Well, if this guy's that
great and he's going to be aHall of Famer, no you need any
Hall of famer, right, Imean, Mike, you didn't need Steve
Hutchinson the year you took him.But the player was just too good,
right, I'd be stunned if Terryand Arnold, you know. I mean,
that's a guy they usually play man. At Alabama, they played a
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lot more zone this year. Theleague is going to more zone, and
he's a good zone player. ButI don't don't I don't sense that he's
like a top ten type of atalent there. I think i'd be more
interested. Obviously there's a local connection, but Mike Troy Fatano played left tackle
for Washington left guard, and he'splayed some left guard there Seattle. There's
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a lot of people who think aroundthe league is just under six' five.
Now, mate, there's some powerquestions from time to time. He
got walked back, but nobody hasbetter feet than this guy. I mean,
he has feet like a tight end, right, and he may have
that position. You know, hemay be able to play five positions on
the line. I to my knowledge, he's never played center, but I
think, you know, perhaps hecould if they if they need a point
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being see all needs a lot ofhelp on the offensive line. A guard
may be arguably, as we standtoday, the worst position on their entire
depth chart. What do you thinkabout Troy Fatanu the position versatility and just
whether or not that would be aguy that you say, hey, at
sixteen, let's not move back,let's take Fatana. Well, the other
thing I told John was that,and then they asked me, Dave,
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to your point, well, whowould you take? Who's he going to
take? I said, you needan offensive lineman. I told him that,
and they all left. So we'llsee. But I'm with you,
Hugh. If he's there and that'sa need, they could take him,
they should take him. I meanthat that's a need. Their offensive line
is an area for the offense.They've got good receivers, they've got good
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running backs, they got a tightend that you know that that's pretty good.
If they shore up the offensive line, that offense can do pretty much
what it has to do. Andso yeah, he's in the Only thing
I'd say is I am a Iwas never a big believer in a guy
played tackle in college, he canplay guard in the pros. That never.
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I never saw that work as wellfor us in any place I was
at the They you know, aguy's a center. Oh he can play
guard, he can play, butno, he's a center, you know.
And so to your point, youknow him a lot better than I
do. And if they need himto move him to guard, and you
believe that, I believe you sothat I would take him, well,
I don't. I'm not saying onehundred percent that he could be a great
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guard. There's some question about power. Things happen quicker at guard, right,
and you're you're blocking defensive tackles,so you gotta be stouter, right,
Uh. And but I think thatany movement type stuff, you know,
powers counters. Uh, you know, pull it out on oh blocks
and G blocks that's out on theperimeter. Dick, his ability to fit
on guys in space is elite becausehe has elite feet. Coach, how
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about the value of a guard versusa tackle, because let's face it,
tackles are more valuable, they're higherpicks, they're paid more five years from
now. So is there any areyou devaluing? I don't get me wrong,
I love Droy Feltana. I wouldbe happy if if the Seahawks took
him. But are you devaluing yourpick a little bit if you're using a
mid first round pick on a guythat you're just gonna move to guard?
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I don't think you devaluate it aslong as you believe he can be a
star at that position. If youplug him in, he can do this.
You know, we know he cando this. He played tackle in
college. But he can do this, and we're we you know, take
him. That's what I would say, you know the value of You're right,
though, tackles get paid more money. Tackles. The left tackle I
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always thought was the was the guythat had to be in your offensive line.
Walter Jones. We're pretty lucky tohave him, yep, you know
so. But the same could besaid the Seahawks. Do you know?
The same could be said? Ithought with corners and safeties. Yet they
paid their safeties a lot of money, and and that was never the way
it used to be. Either youknow, it used to be the corners
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get it, the safeties get paida little bit less and things like that,
so you're never quite sure exactly whatthey're gonna do. But if he's
there, they have a decision tomake Mike. As you're talking about offensive
line guys, I think it wouldbe this for all of us. I
think this would be interesting if youtake the hit rate of all positions in
the draft, you say, okay, what, what the hell is a
hit rate as defined by whether ornot the team that drafted them signed him
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to a second contract. Right,Okay, so these were all first rounders.
That's a fair enough fair barometer.Right now, we have to have
a period of time that's recent enoughthat they could have exercised that option.
So we're going from twenty ten totwenty nineteen. That's ten drafts the most
recent tenuere gap that we could assessthis because we needed a few years for
them to make the decision. Centeris number one in the ninety two percent
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of centers draft in the first round. Imagine it's not a lot, but
in terms of frequency, centers ninetytwo percent hit, then offensive tackle at
fifty nine percent. Big gap,Big gap then guard at fifty percent.
So the first three positions I justbroad off obviously are all offensive lineman.
Then linebacker forty eight percent, quarterbackat forty six percent. Less than half
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of the quarterbacks are getting a secondcontract. Are these first round picks?
These are first rounders? Yep?And actually you know what I beg your
pardon. It's exercising the option forthe fifth year. So it's even a
lower brom ed dresser's forty four percent, defensive tackles forty percent, cornerback thirty
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eight percent, running back thirty eightpercent, safety thirty four percent, tight
end thirty three percent, and lastis wide receivers at twenty seven percent.
Wow, so by forty six figurethat quarterback. But theft year, that's
what you're saying, forty six percentforty six percent, six percent. Yeah,
okay, So so the offensive lieMike just said here a moment ago
the value of offensive lineman, andand there's at least some data if if
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that seems meaningful to you, thatsuggests that the offensive line is the solid
pick. Sure, well it's tome. It's the number one need by
far with the football team. Iwould say number one's offensive line. Number
two's defensive line. But there's agap between the offensive line and the defensive
line. I can get bodies torotate through my defensive line, but I
need five guys on that offensive linethat will turn into you know, Pro
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Bowl caliber guys, or at leasta couple of Pro Bowl caliber guys.
And I got issues with my righttackle with his injury history. I have
issues with my center. I don'tknow what Big o'dos all about. Laken
Tomlinson's probably a one year answer atleft guard Anthony Bradford right now, as
you're starting right guard. So tome, I mean you call the interior
offensive line a situation. It wasa crisis, and that was before they
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signed lacln Tomlinson. I don't knowwhat's above a crisis, but it's still
not where you want it. Veryconcerned, right, it's still not where
you want to be. So,Mike, the offensive line, I mean,
look, I don't want to takeaway credit for Matt Hasselback or Alexander
or Marcus Truefont or Grant Wistrom oranybody, but I think the number one
reason why you went to that SuperBowl because of those guys up front.
No, absolutely, you know thatthey didn't miss a snap all year.
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I mean, and and you knowwhen you had good leadership with Tobec leading
the charge, you had all youhad prope. You had a Hall of
Fame left guard, left tackle,that's right. You had Chris Gray who
played in the league for I don'tknow for a long time, real steady,
and then you had the young upand coming right tackle, you know.
And so yeah, luckilyer so greatnine. You agree with that that
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that was the number one reason whyyou guys got that far? Is that
that that that group up front bestpart of your team? Was that group?
Well, it's you know, wewere good on offense, uh,
running and passing that year. Ye. Now, why why does that happened?
Because you know it's sometimes you'll say, well, this team can't they
can pass block, but they can'trun block. You know, the tight
end can do this, and wedid both. Why is that because the
offensive line? Well, let's geta break. We're gonna kind of just
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give you a preview of what theSeahawks are looking at this weekend. Uh,
it feels like it's a good yearto be a quarterback in the draft
because a lot of teams need quarterbacks. We'll talk about the local guy,
Michael Pennix, get some thoughts onthe guys at the top and Caleb Williams
and Jaden Daniels. Nick Sheridan,by the way, who was with Michael
Pennix when he was at Indiana atWashington. He's now with Kaitlin to board
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Alabama. He's gonna hop on thegear with us at three forty five and
give us a thought on where hethinks the best fit for Michael will be
in the first round tonight. That'sall coming up live from the Virginia Mason
Athletics Center. Draft coverage brought toyou in part by our friends at Hunt
Services. Get a plumber, electrician, heating or cooling expert at your doorstep
for only forty nine dollars, Jumpon the horn and call Hunts. More
(17:34):
from the NFL Draft. Mike Hongrin, Dick Fane, Hu Millen with us
right here on ninety three three KJRFM. Welcome to the NFL drafts Now back
to SUCKI and Dish on your homefor the twenty twenty four NFL Draft and
cml's best NFL Draft cover. CnleSeahawks EPI Show, The Sports Radio ninety
three point three KJR FM. Igray it off my draft four fish Year's
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believe papers he's my number one rateof prospect and I think Adunzay, I
believe is number five. Actually,oh Gunsey, I think is going to
have a really, really good careerprovided in You know, my comparison on
him is Larry Fitzgerald, but Ialso think he's got some DeAndre Hopkins and
him. That is the voice ofLance zerline guys from the NFL Network who
(18:19):
joins us every week courtesy of MossBay Hall unless he's too busy with NFL
Network stuff that will be on nextweek. Talking about Roma Dunza has him
as his number five pick, numberfive prospects. Sorry, in the draft.
Rome is the only Husky player thatis at the green room in Detroit.
Michael Pennix is in Tampa with hisfamily, Roger Rosengarten is in Colorado
(18:40):
with his family, and Troy Fatanais in Vegas with his family. So
Roma Dunzay is in Detroit. Wouldbe great to hear his name called early
tonight. And by the way,I was telling you in this her little
rumor, which means I saw iton Twitter. By the way that if
you if you see Roger Goodell nothugging players tonight on the stage, it's
because he has a bad back andmay want to fist pump. Guys are
(19:00):
giving a handshakes. So just keepthat in mind when you're watching the draft
of offensive line right six four threetwenty lifts him up, crack, crack,
crack gets free chiropractice. Yeah,all of a sudden, the guy
reaches his hand out and I waslike, no, oh, no,
right, yeah. Better make surethat those guys know Roger that your your
back is messed up. Nick Sheridan, who was the offensive coordinator at Alabama
(19:21):
and was with Michael Pennix at Indianaand at Washington, He's gonna join us
next segment and talk about Mike andhis journey and maybe a fit for him
tonight. In the draft, theSeahawks have seven picks as of right now,
uh sixteen in the first round,seventeen in round three. That's eighty
one overall, the second picking roundfour hundred and second overall, eighteenth picking
round four hundred and eighteen overall,the third pick in the sixth round at
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one seventy nine, the sixteenth pickin the sixth round at one ninety two
and the fifteenth pick and the seventhround at two thirty five. Their second
round draft pick, as you guysknow, you went to the Giants and
the Leonard Williams deal and the thirdround draft pick and a fifth round draft
pick went to Washington for Sam Howe. So the question is, if there's
a quarterback the Seahawks like who theyhave as a first round draft pick on
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their board sitting at sixteen, dothey allow the arrival of Sam Howe or
Geno Smith's presence on the roster toallow them to not take a quarterback today
if there's somebody there they really enjoy. Absolutely not. Yeah. I mean,
if you think the guy at sixteencan be your starter, yep,
and for a long time, youtake him. Now he's not playing right
away, we know that, buthe's watching and then learning, and if
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you believe he can be the quarterbackfor ten years, twelve years down the
road, you take them. Youdon't pass it up the need versus your
board. You talked about having maybesixteen guys that you're saying, man,
you know every year that numbers aboutthe same. I'm assuming something like that.
Something like that so how do yourank Let's say you've got these sixteen
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guys. How many of those sixteenguys are positions that you don't need at
all? Do you have any ofthose guys on there of positions that you
just set out? Yeah? Youknow what, I think. I think
most people do the board the sameway that you. You value the player,
is he a first round pick?And then you put them on the
board. These guys are first roundpicks by position. It's not when you
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set up your board. It's notwho are we going to take? That's
not how you start. You putthe players up there. Then you're working
through need, you're working through fitsand all those kind of things afterwards.
So, uh, yeah, youput the guys up there, and then
if it happens, but understand,understand this too. Surprises happen in the
draft. All of a sudden you'rethinking, Okay, I'm I'm gonna take
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this guy into here. He comeshere, he comes boom, someone hops
up, and maybe get trade getsin front of you, you know,
and then all of a sudden youlose out here. Let me ask you
the same question that I asked MikeDick about the quarterback situation. Because Gino
Smith is on a short term deal. Sam Howe, as I believe,
what two years left on his originalrookie contract, led the league in picks
a year ago. I like alot of what Sam Howe potentially has to
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offer. But do you say noto a quarterback because you're set at that
position? Oh, I certainly not. I look at Kansas City. They
had Alex Smith. Alex Smith wascoming off a Pro Bowl year. They
were twenty seventh, but they sawsomething special on Pat Mahomes they moved up
to ten. I think there's alwaysa conundrum. I would think, Mike,
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with the teams. The teams areat the top of the draft,
they lost the most last year,right, and they probably got poor to
average at best quarterback play. Right. And in fact that the three teams
at the top of the draft rightnow are projected doll take quarterbacks. Right,
there's always an argument say, well, listen, our team isn't very
good if we bring in this quarterback. We need offensive lineman, we need
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a defense, We're you know,we're bringing this guy into a just a
no win situation. That could alwaysbe stated for these these quarterbacks at the
top of the draft. So howmuch of that do you buy in.
Are you of a philosophy like,Okay, if we're at the top of
the draft, let's get the quarterbackbecause we may never be back up here
and then find a way to buildaround him. Or do you say this
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is just gonna be a waste becausewe're gonna bring this guy in, we
can't protect from him. We gotno receivers. You know, he's he's
set up for failure. So let'slet's address the rest of our team at
some other date in the future.We'll put off trying to get the real
franchise quarterback, the long term quarterback. Well, where do you ride on
that? Well, you can't everproject what's gonna happen next year or the
year after that. So if you'rein a position to pick a quarterback,
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then take him. Take him now. Say your team is not ready to
have a rookie quarterback as the starterto help him enough, Say you are
teams like that, but you're stuck. He's got to he's gonna play.
Then it's up to the play callor the coach or whatever to protect him
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a little bit and bring him along, let him learn, get him ready,
and don't put him you know,I think back to Hugh New England
and Jim Plunkett. That's the oneI think about it. You know,
he went into a bad team,got beat up, and then he had
to rest for a while, comeback, and he changed his whole career
around. You know, so yougot to be careful with that. Yeah,
but but no, you don't passhim up. You take him well,
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Gino, I'm gonna use my wordscarefully. There's no debating when you
look at the team performance and thethe performance from the quarterback, there's no
debating you got average play from thequarterback. I'm not saying Gino's average.
If you want to be a defenderof Genie would say, well, he
didn't have this, he didn't havethat, and and if he had had
this and he'd have had that,then he would have been better. But
I don't. I don't think there'sany debate that that that you got average
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quarterback play last year. Where doyou then stand? Are you more of
a like are you kind of gotyour head on the swivel of like,
hey, who's fallen to us?Uh? And with Gino you or do
you feel like there's that's not aniche you need to scratch in this draft.
No, it's it's no. Ithink if the quarterback is there,
If you think the quarterback for thefuture, is there a Michael Pennix or
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somebody, he's there. Okay,forget Gena Gino's going to be my quarterback
next year. He's going to bethe starting quarterback. Okay, but Michael
Pennix is going to be the quarterbackhere for whoever? Right, you know
it's gonna be the saw long timeyou saw penis enough. Yeah, I'm
gonna put your feet to the fire. At sixteen, Pennicks available, you're
the Seahawks. Do you take him? Or do you take somebody else?
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Or move down? What I takehim? You take Michael Pennocks. Why
at sixteen? Why? Absolutely?Why? Because of what he does,
what he showed me. Now,I don't study the film like you guys,
but I watched enough of the collegegames and him playing and him doing
stuff throwing balls that I go wow. I say that a lot when I
watch him play and his leadership,and from what I understand the things I
(25:40):
read about him, he's a goodteammate. There's a lot of pluses here.
The only the minuses are his injuryhistory. I think, can you
eat Can you eat that? Ifyou're the Seahawks? If yes, I
can, Yes you can? Well, yeah, coach, you know John
very well. If Michael Pennix isthere, will John take him at sixteen?
Dick? Let me think, comeon, man, tell us I
(26:04):
thought, I thought, after allthis what I said. See. Of
course, fortunately he's not listening tome. We all know that. Yeah,
right, okay, so but heI think I think John, I
don't have any inside knowledge, butI think he's gonna trade back. Yeah.
I think for John to have thegap between sixteen and eighty one out
(26:26):
a David eighty one yep, sixtyfive it's too big a gap sixty five
picks where he's doing nothing. It'stoo big A yeah. I agree.
Well, let's do this. We'vegot to break. Nick Sheridan is the
offensive coordinator at Alabama, and he'sbeen with Michael Pennick since his Indiana days.
He knows him as well as anybody. He knows his pros, he
knows his cons, he knows thefit he would need in the NFL to
have success. Nick Sheridan's going tojoin us and talk Michael Pennix from Tuscaloosa.
(26:51):
As we continue from the Virginia MasonAthletics Center, first round starts at
five. Right here on ninety threethree KJRFM, Come to the NFL Draft.
Out back to Sucky and on yourhome for the twenty twenty four NFL
Draft and Seattle's best NFL Draft coverseatle Seahawks aphow the Sports Radio ninety three
point three kJ R FM. Iactually didn't talking to the Seahawks. You
(27:15):
know, I don't know if Idon't know why that is. Maybe they
know me, hope so, butman, I'm super excited for him,
him and coach Huff. You knowthe things that they were able to do
with us at University of Washington,you know special. Well that's the voice
of Michael Pennix admitting he never talkedto the Seahawks. And maybe that's a
side maybe the Hawks try to keepthis thing secret out before the draft starts
(27:36):
tonight. Well, we're back atthe Virginia Mason Athletics Center. Mike Holmgan
rejoins us at four clock this afternoon. And Hugh, a guy I know
that you've known for a long time. Yes, I'm actually shocked that this
guy picked up the vote. He'skind of a big deal now. He's
the offensive coordinator in Alabama. Formertight ends coach At Washington was with Michael
Pennis way back in Indiana. Ourold pal Nick Sheridan's with us right now
(28:00):
the radio show. Nick. Howare you man? I'm doing great?
How are you guys doing good?It's great to hear your voice. Man,
you was here. Dick Fad ishere as well, and I got
to just start off by asking you, man, we are probably a couple
hours away, maybe three hours awayfrom Mike Penno's getting his name called in
the first run of the NFL Draft. For a guy like you that's been
with Mike for every step of hiscollege journey, what is the end of
(28:22):
this road tonight mean for you andmean for him? You think, well,
I think I think everybody that's beena part of mike you know story
here is just thrilled for him andhis family. I think it's a celebration,
you know. I think that's whatthe draft is for people. They
get to see these kids when they'refifteen, sixteen year old, to get
an opportunity to live out a dream, you know. I think that's it's
(28:45):
to be celebrated. You know,that's for all the players, you know.
I know the experts they have toyou know, diagnose the draft and
decide on the grades of the draftand all that. But I know for
college coaches and high school coaches andfamilies, it's a celebration. And I
know that's that's how we feel aboutMike. Well, we know Mike's history
here in Seattle, right because wesaw it. But but you've been with
(29:06):
him back to Indiana. Nick,tell us something maybe we don't know that
you think is important in Mike's journey, That that maybe we need to know
that you saw in Indiana, andthat that and the ability to come over
to Washington and do what he didso effectively. I think anybody that knows
Mike, and I know, youknow, for Washington fans this comes as
(29:27):
no surprise, but people that sawhim play at Indiana, I just think
that the moment's never too big forMike. You know, I think when
you really go back and see someof the games that he's played and competed
in, you know, and forpeople that know him, he's the same
guy all the time. You know, I've told plenty of teams in this
process that you know, when it'sthird and eight to win the division,
(29:48):
he's going to be ready to go. And and that won't, you know,
be too big of a spotlight forhim. And I think everybody that
saw him play the last few yearscertainly saw that. You know, in
the biggest games, in the biggestmoments, against the toughest competition, he
always came through. And the samewould be said in Indiana, you know,
and he was able to be healthy. You think about the Penn State
(30:11):
game, you think about him goinginto Columbus against Ohio State, you think
about beating Michigan. I think thisguy's a winner and you know, an
ultimate competitor. I think when youthink about competitors, people think about personality,
but I always think about guys thatwhen the moment's the biggest, they're
their best. And that's what Iwould say about Mike and I think everybody
that's seen him play here the lastfew two years would agree with that.
(30:33):
Coach, thanks for joining us.It's dick and something that Softie and I
have. It's just been driven us, driving us crazy over the last six
months or so, and that isthe constant focus by pundits on Michael Pennox's
injuries something that we never saw herein Seattle, but you did see at
Indiana. Talk about why you thinkthat emphasis has been so much on that
(30:55):
and what concerns should it be forsomebody that saw him both healthy here and
injured in Indiana. Well, Ithink anytime you go through this process and
people are talking about drafting franchise,you know, quarterbacks, I think,
you know, they look for everything. You know, they're trying to find
the reasons to not draft you.And I think that's the case for all
(31:15):
the players that are going to getpicked here in the first round. You
know, they're trying to find anythingthat they can to be critical to make
sure that they make the right choice, in the right decision. But you
know, I think you know,the best, you know, best predictor
of future performance is past performance andspecifically recent performance, you know. And
so for somebody like Michael that's hadyou know, zero issues for the last
(31:36):
two years, that has shown theability to be durable, to take hits,
to be available for his team,you know, that's all that he
can do, that's all that hecan control. And you know, I
think, you know, the lasttwo years kind of speak for itself,
and I think the early part ofhis career was what it was. You
know, I think that they wereunfortunate, you know, injuries, You
know that that that can happen toanybody, and for him to overcome,
(32:00):
for him to persevere, for himto grow and mature, you know,
in all areas. You know,I think his best football still ahead of
him. I think he's had someunbelievable moments so far, and I think
the last two years hopefully we'll giveyou know, these organizations peace of mind
and know, you know the typeof player and how how available he's going
to be for them. Well,former UDUB coach now the offensive coordinator at
(32:22):
Alabama, Nick Sheridan's with us onthe radio show talking about Michael Pennix and
Nick, I was looking at justthe first half of the draft, and
you could argue that twelve of thefirst sixteen teams, including the Seahawks,
by the way, could justify takinga quarterback in this draft. I mean,
I see a run there starting atnumber ten with the Jets, Minnesota,
Denver, the Raiders, the Saints. Do you see a good fit
(32:43):
for him? Do you see ascheme and an offense and a team in
the first round where you really feellike, hey, with with his skill
set and with that team's got,this would be a really nice spot for
him. Well, let me letme just preface this OFFTI, and this
lets you know I have no insightknowledge. Okay, So I don't want
anybody to think that I've talked tosome guys behind the scenes. You know.
(33:07):
Word is that you know the coordinatorin Seattle, what he might be
doing, that there might be somesome good fit there schematically for him.
But I honestly think that all thoseplaces would be a great spot for Mike.
You know, I think his skillset is so versatile. I think
you know, his ability to passthe football I think is rare and unique.
(33:28):
And his ability to process and makequick decisions. You know, I
do think places like Minnesota that havesome skill players on the outside, I
think that'd be a great fit forhim. I think, you know what
Oakland's trying to do, or excuseme, the Raiders are trying to do.
I think the same. So Ithink all the teams that you said,
I think there's a fit there forhim. And so I think that's
for any coach you know, fortheir players you want them to find the
(33:51):
right fit. You know, Ithink we all know how competitive the National
Football League is, and you know, you see guys all the time that
maybe go into a situation that's hard, hard for them to get their feet
underneath them in the league. AndI think for Michael, you want to
just see a stable place, youknow, a coach that can can coach
and train and develop the quarterbacks andsome good players around him. And so
(34:15):
I think a lot of those placesyou mentioned, you know, you talk
about Minnesota and some of the perimeterplayers, even New Orleans right they have
some young wide receivers that can reallygo. I think those would be great
spots for him because he's a greatpastor of the football and he's someone that
distributes it, you know, tohis guys at a high level. Nick
Sheridan with us the office coordinator atAlabama, he has been at Washington and
he knows Michael Pennix intricately. I'mgoing to preface nick my comments my next
(34:39):
question by saying, look, I'ma big advocate for Michael Pennox. I'm
on the radio, I'm on thethirty third team, made a presentation to
them. I'm advocating for him.So I love Michael Pennix at Washington and
at the next level. I wantyou to imagine you just made a veiled
reference to Ryan Grubb. You andI are on the same NFL team.
Okay, in this this hypothetical,I'm in the personnel and I come to
(35:00):
you and I say, Nick,look this guy he was. He was
so brilliant outside the numbers first incollege football, and the gap between first
and second is greater than the gapbetween second and twenty eight in terms of
the yards. He's twenty more yardson his deep throws down the field,
more than Drake Bay and all theother guys. So I know we can
throw it deep, and I knowwe can throw it outside the numbers.
(35:22):
But when I watch the tape,I see signs where he's a little bit
lacking in his anticipation over the middle. We got a deep angle cross by
Jalen Polk against Michigan State, We'vegot a spin concept against Oregon, and
there's others. I'm just like alittle bit concerned about the anticipatory throws over
(35:42):
the middle. So now you,in this hypothetical, you talk me out
of why I shouldn't be concerned aboutthat. Well, I think you know,
to be critical of the players forintermediate passes. I think you know.
What I would tell you is,if you want to draft someone that
throws a curl better than a postroute, I said, that's totally up
to use you. I love thatif that's your choice. You know,
(36:06):
I think we all know that you'renot going to win a game by throwing
a basic cross, you know.I think you know, I think what
his skill set has shown, andI also don't think that that's an area
of weakness. And I I hearyou'll maybe what the stats are numbers,
I mean, the analytics are theanalytics. All I could tell you is
that you know, he's an extremelyexplosive passer. I think when you look
at what, you know, whatare the metrics that really lend itself to
(36:28):
winning. That's someone that makes gooddecisions with the football and someone that can
create explosive plays. And I thinkyou know, if you're trying to check
those boxes with Michael Penny, let'sdraft there. I love it. I
love it. I mean you're saying, if he's got to be bad at
something, it may as well bethat for trying out loud. But hey,
next shared and great stuff. Ilove you putting you in his place.
By the way, man, anytimeyou want to come back on and
(36:50):
do that, you're always welcoming.By the way, I hope you got
air conditioning down there, pal Herd. It gets hot in the spring and
summer in Tuscal looseive, buddy,hope you're ready for that, man.
Yeah, well ready, we gotthat taken care about. Listen, go
get him and we'll talk down theroad, all right, coach, Okay,
take care of thanks. I loveit Nick Sheridan with us. Is
that a satisfactory answer? Yeah,I love it. You know he's gonna
be an advocate. But but butthat's great. I'd have to get Mike's
(37:14):
response. I mean because because,I mean, you have to work the
middle of the field. But butbut that ability to go grab those chunk
yards. The only the only I'veonly seen three statistics ever that anybody has
tried to make a claim is thenumber one correlation to winning. Uh.
There's obviously net turnovers. Everybody talksabout the turnover difference, Okay, and
(37:35):
then I've also heard net yards perattempt, and I've heard net explosive plays.
Nobody's ever else made an argument Mikethat that the number one stat uh
is is is anything other than that. So here, when we're talking about
Pennix's big playability, we're talking abouta deal that many say is the number
one thing net explosive plays and thisguy's ability to go get explosive. Well,
(37:59):
let's come back and ask Mike aboutall that next on ninety three three
kJ RFM live from the Virginia MasonAthletics Center. First round of the Draft
is just over an hour away righthere on ninety three three KJR
Go, Mike Comgrin, Dick Fane, and Hugh Breedlove Millan and like clockwork,
guys, Hugh and Dick like clockwork, Hugh Millan, Dick Fane.
I want you to know that everyyear Mike Combrin comes over here, he
always threatens to make this the lastyear. Every year, next year,
I'm out, I'm done, I'mgonna retire, I'm finished. And every
year you keep showing up because youlove this too, admit it. You
(00:24):
love hanging out with us talking draft. That's why I'm here. I am
here because of you three. Yeah, you have the draft right right,
because don't ask me any questions otherthan other than the fact, other than
the fact that what we did innineteen twenty three, Yeah, all right,
and you just sit there, allright, and when the draft starts
at five o'clock, we'll just saygoodbye and we're done. Well, it's
(00:44):
an exciting time. So I appreciateyou asking me, but you're right.
Next year, No, have yougotten I told him? Have you gotten
more aggressive with John Schneider in thehallway as the years go on? Or
have you gotten less aggressive as faras who he should take? Well,
it's kind of the same because Ibumped into him as I was coming into
the building and it was really goodto see him and wish him well,
(01:06):
and I said, Okay, here'swho you should take. And he looks
at me and I go, I'mjust kidd John. You you don't have
to go what I say. Soit was, but we reminisced a little
bit about previous drafts. A coupleof times I yelled at him over things,
and I feel bad about it tothis day. Sure, yeah,
but I saw you shove him upagainst a wall in the hall about an
hour ago. It's like, what'sgoing on here? Has he ever listened
(01:27):
to you as far as advice ondraft day? Have you ever given John
a player and he's taken that player? No? Since he's been here.
Yeah, no, okay, Istay away from that. I think I
know my place. Yeah. Well, there's a first time for everything.
Man. You never know. Oneday he might actually pay attention. But
the Seahawks have seven picks in thisyear's draft for now, first pick is
(01:49):
obviously number sixteen in the first round. And you know, here, it's
funny that everybody is sitting here waiting. I think guys Dick and Mike,
you'd probably agree. They're waiting forthe Hawks to trade down today in the
first round, and you guys correctme if I'm wrong. But last year
they had the number five pick thatthey got from Denver and we woke up
on draft Day and they used it. Right. Twenty twenty two, they
(02:12):
had the number nine pick you wakeup on draft Day, Dick, and
they used it on Charles Cross.They did not have a first round draft
pick in twenty twenty one or twentytwenty two because they gave him to the
Jets for Adams, but they didhave their original pick at number twenty seven
and they used that on Jordan Brooksin twenty twenty. I think the last
time the Seahawks actually had a firstround draft pick on draft Day and traded
(02:35):
down was back in twenty nineteen whenthey had that pick swap with Green Bay.
So either a Schneider's grown up alittle bit and he wants to use
those picks, or he's due.He's due, and the reason he's due
is because I can just see JohnSchneider sitting there between sixteen and eighty one,
just sweating like it's too big agap for him. He's never had
a gap like that, I amgoing back. The biggest gap he has
(02:59):
had is twenty seven to seventy nine. I can't believe he didn't trade down.
Instead, he took Rashad Penny withthe twenty seventh pick, so I
would be really surprised if he didn't. If you now he may trade a
pick next year for a pick thisyear in the second round. I'm not
saying he's guaranteed to trade down outof sixteen, but that's probably the most
likely. I guess. The questionis how confident are we? What are
(03:21):
the odds? Guys here will startwith you that the Seahawks actually make that
selection here at number two. Well, you know, there's a lot of
talk about whether they'll move down andfrom sixteen you say, okay, they
don't like their value. For example, Seattle, as we know, doesn't
have the second round pick. They'retotal This is according to the Harvard Sports
and Analysis Collective. The Seahawks havethe twenty sixth highest draft value. The
(03:46):
Cardinals have number one, highlighted byThey have the fourth overall pick, they
have the twenty seventh pick, andthey also have the thirty fifth pick.
Their total value is fourteen hundred andtwelve. That's the Cardinals. Just remember
that number. You don't need toknow what it means. Just remember one
thousand. Don't know what it means, but just it just means the best
fourteen twelve. The worst is theCleveland Browns at four four oh two.
(04:09):
So that's the world that all ofthe NFL is from. Fory tell us
for reference, though, can youtell us what like a mid first round
pick would be in points? Uh, not on that, not not on
that, but but Seattle. Soif if we're in a range between fourteen
twelve and four oh two, Seattleis twenty sixth in the NFL at six
(04:30):
sixty seven. And so the theory, if they move down, they're not
going to change their value. Rightin theory, like they could trade the
one for you know, six fourthround picks, the value the fourth round
picks is still going to be equalto the one. So they're not gonna
materially change the value. But Mike, they will if they trade down pick
get more picks. And as ageneral rule, is it not true,
(04:51):
like if you say, we havea horrible team, we went one in
fifteen last year, our roster stinks, let's move down because there's a lot
of guys in the third, fourth, and fifth round. They're better than
the dudes we got. Let's goget all those guys because they're gonna make
the team. If you have agreat team, you're fifteen to one.
You say, man, there's nota lot of openings. We're like one
player away. Let's focus on thatone player. Right, that's a general
(05:14):
rule. And where is that true? A? And where Seattle in line
with that? Yeah, that's ageneral rule. And I think as John
grew up in Green Bay when Iwas there under Ron Wolf, I remember
going in and seeing our board thefirst time, and Bill Walsh did it
differently in San Francisco. He waskind of the guru. He did differently.
When I got into green Bay thefirst round draft picks on the day,
(05:36):
there were sixteen names up there andI said to Ron, I said,
there's thirty two teams or you know, we don't have enough people up
there, and he goes, wegot plenty one of those guys will be
there. Yeah, And it wasright. So what he also did,
we said, okay, and everyteam does this, picks one through fifteen
(05:56):
or whatever those are, take them. They can't miss. Then from sixteen
to forty or some number. Thoseare all We're okay with anything there.
So let's get people, not necessarilyby position, but a need. Let's
get our need there instead of whatwe think is the best player. You
just say sixteen to forty, Mike, No, I understand they're just kind
(06:19):
of as a general. But thereis a distinction between thirty two and thirty
three, right because thirty two you'restill in the first round, you have
the fifth year option. Thirty threeyou're in the second round, you only
have the four year. How muchof that is part of the discussion when
you're working that part of the draft, you know what? With me,
it never was part of it.Honestly, the rookie contract and things like
(06:42):
that. I was not focused onthat at all. I really wasn't.
I wanted to. I'm going togo the player and let the let the
guys with the thick classes and stuffthat do that them, let them worry
about the rest of the stuff beingcounting. Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna
get the player. You know,you're wearing fairly thick glasses right now,
really thick? Are you there?I hear your voice. But the point
that Dick made about Schneider just losinghis mind, and you may have said
(07:05):
this, Dick, I was distractedfor half a second, so I apologize
if I'm being repetitive. The gapbetween the first pick the Hawks have now
and their second pick is sixty fivepicks. Okay, they had to wait
eighty one picks in twenty twenty onebetween Dwayne Eskridge and Trey Brown. But
that's the year they gave up oneof their first round draft picks for Jamal
Adams. He has three picks.You'll wonder how antsy the guy's gonna get
(07:26):
tonight. No one thing I wasgoing to say when I talked to John
today, I said, I wasteasing. I'm said, I'm going to
tell you the guy I want youto pick. And everyone left. Okay.
Then then Dave Pierson was there andgoes, what do you think he's
gonna do? And I said,and I'm gonna save that for the radio.
No tell us, town, whatdo you think he's gonna do?
I said, you're gonna trade back? Yeah? I told him that.
He kind of gave me this funnylook and I said, okay, I've
(07:47):
played poker before. You are tradingback? Did you give him a name?
Actually, though, did you giveJohn a name? No? Bid?
God, how concerned would you beif you're in that draft room and
you have sixteen to eighty one tosit? I mean, how much much
would that go into your thought processof Man, we kind of have to
trade down a lot more than wenormally would if we had the sixteenth pick
in the second round, unless thesixteenth pick is unanimously we got to have
(08:13):
this guy. This guy makes isto use point, this one player makes
us a lot better right away,right then you take him. If there's
any hesitation at all. I thinkif there's any hesitation at all, you
trade back, because sitting there that'shard, and they could trade out of
there still get a number one pickand add a pick. They can do
that. Someone wants to move up, Mike. I'm glad you brought that
(08:37):
up because I was gonna say,Hugh that our buddy Daniel Jeremiah from the
NFL network is mocking Terry On Arnoldthe corner from Alabama to the Seahawks at
sixteen not necessarily a position of need. But if you've got a guy that
you believe is going to be astar, Cooper de gene by the way
from Iowa may not be a positionof need. But if you think he's
going to become a star and aHall of Fame type player, does it
(08:58):
really matter if you need him ornot. Well, if this guy's that
great and he's going to be aHall of Famer, no you need any
Hall of famer, right, Imean, Mike, you didn't need Steve
Hutchinson the year you took him.But the player was just too good,
right, I'd be stunned if Terryand Arnold, you know. I mean,
that's a guy they usually play man. At Alabama, they played a
(09:18):
lot more zone this year. Theleague is going to more zone, and
he's a good zone player. ButI don't don't I don't sense that he's
like a top ten type of atalent there. I think i'd be more
interested. Obviously there's a local connection, but Mike Troy Fatano played left tackle
for Washington left guard, and he'splayed some left guard there Seattle. There's
(09:43):
a lot of people who think aroundthe league is just under six' five.
Now, mate, there's some powerquestions from time to time. He
got walked back, but nobody hasbetter feet than this guy. I mean,
he has feet like a tight end, right, and he may have
that position. You know, hemay be able to play five positions on
the line. I to my knowledge, he's never played center, but I
think, you know, perhaps hecould if they if they need a point
(10:05):
being see all needs a lot ofhelp on the offensive line. A guard
may be arguably, as we standtoday, the worst position on their entire
depth chart. What do you thinkabout Troy Fatanu the position versatility and just
whether or not that would be aguy that you say, hey, at
sixteen, let's not move back,let's take Fatana. Well, the other
thing I told John was that,and then they asked me, Dave,
(10:28):
to your point, well, whowould you take? Who's he going to
take? I said, you needan offensive lineman. I told him that,
and they all left. So we'llsee. But I'm with you,
Hugh. If he's there and that'sa need, they could take him,
they should take him. I meanthat that's a need. Their offensive line
is an area for the offense.They've got good receivers, they've got good
(10:50):
running backs, they got a tightend that you know that that's pretty good.
If they shore up the offensive line, that offense can do pretty much
what it has to do. Andso yeah, he's in the Only thing
I'd say is I am a Iwas never a big believer in a guy
played tackle in college, he canplay guard in the pros. That never.
(11:11):
I never saw that work as wellfor us in any place I was
at the They you know, aguy's a center. Oh he can play
guard, he can play, butno, he's a center, you know.
And so to your point, youknow him a lot better than I
do. And if they need himto move him to guard, and you
believe that, I believe you sothat I would take him, well,
I don't. I'm not saying onehundred percent that he could be a great
(11:35):
guard. There's some question about power. Things happen quicker at guard, right,
and you're you're blocking defensive tackles,so you gotta be stouter, right,
Uh. And but I think thatany movement type stuff, you know,
powers counters. Uh, you know, pull it out on oh blocks
and G blocks that's out on theperimeter. Dick, his ability to fit
on guys in space is elite becausehe has elite feet. Coach, how
(11:58):
about the value of a guard versusa tackle, because let's face it,
tackles are more valuable, they're higherpicks, they're paid more five years from
now. So is there any areyou devaluing? I don't get me wrong,
I love Droy Feltana. I wouldbe happy if if the Seahawks took
him. But are you devaluing yourpick a little bit if you're using a
mid first round pick on a guythat you're just gonna move to guard?
(12:20):
I don't think you devaluate it aslong as you believe he can be a
star at that position. If youplug him in, he can do this.
You know, we know he cando this. He played tackle in
college. But he can do this, and we're we you know, take
him. That's what I would say, you know the value of You're right,
though, tackles get paid more money. Tackles. The left tackle I
(12:41):
always thought was the was the guythat had to be in your offensive line.
Walter Jones. We're pretty lucky tohave him, yep, you know
so. But the same could besaid the Seahawks. Do you know?
The same could be said? Ithought with corners and safeties. Yet they
paid their safeties a lot of money, and and that was never the way
it used to be. Either youknow, it used to be the corners
(13:03):
get it, the safeties get paida little bit less and things like that,
so you're never quite sure exactly whatthey're gonna do. But if he's
there, they have a decision tomake Mike. As you're talking about offensive
line guys, I think it wouldbe this for all of us. I
think this would be interesting if youtake the hit rate of all positions in
the draft, you say, okay, what, what the hell is a
hit rate as defined by whether ornot the team that drafted them signed him
(13:28):
to a second contract. Right,Okay, so these were all first rounders.
That's a fair enough fair barometer.Right now, we have to have
a period of time that's recent enoughthat they could have exercised that option.
So we're going from twenty ten totwenty nineteen. That's ten drafts the most
recent tenuere gap that we could assessthis because we needed a few years for
them to make the decision. Centeris number one in the ninety two percent
(13:54):
of centers draft in the first round. Imagine it's not a lot, but
in terms of frequency, centers ninetytwo percent hit, then offensive tackle at
fifty nine percent. Big gap,Big gap then guard at fifty percent.
So the first three positions I justbroad off obviously are all offensive lineman.
Then linebacker forty eight percent, quarterbackat forty six percent. Less than half
(14:16):
of the quarterbacks are getting a secondcontract. Are these first round picks?
These are first rounders? Yep?And actually you know what I beg your
pardon. It's exercising the option forthe fifth year. So it's even a
lower brom ed dresser's forty four percent, defensive tackles forty percent, cornerback thirty
(14:37):
eight percent, running back thirty eightpercent, safety thirty four percent, tight
end thirty three percent, and lastis wide receivers at twenty seven percent.
Wow, so by forty six figurethat quarterback. But theft year, that's
what you're saying, forty six percentforty six percent, six percent. Yeah,
okay, So so the offensive lieMike just said here a moment ago
the value of offensive lineman, andand there's at least some data if if
(15:01):
that seems meaningful to you, thatsuggests that the offensive line is the solid
pick. Sure, well it's tome. It's the number one need by
far with the football team. Iwould say number one's offensive line. Number
two's defensive line. But there's agap between the offensive line and the defensive
line. I can get bodies torotate through my defensive line, but I
need five guys on that offensive linethat will turn into you know, Pro
(15:22):
Bowl caliber guys, or at leasta couple of Pro Bowl caliber guys.
And I got issues with my righttackle with his injury history. I have
issues with my center. I don'tknow what Big o'dos all about. Laken
Tomlinson's probably a one year answer atleft guard Anthony Bradford right now, as
you're starting right guard. So tome, I mean you call the interior
offensive line a situation. It wasa crisis, and that was before they
(15:43):
signed lacln Tomlinson. I don't knowwhat's above a crisis, but it's still
not where you want it. Veryconcerned, right, it's still not where
you want to be. So,Mike, the offensive line, I mean,
look, I don't want to takeaway credit for Matt Hasselback or Alexander
or Marcus Truefont or Grant Wistrom oranybody, but I think the number one
reason why you went to that SuperBowl because of those guys up front.
No, absolutely, you know thatthey didn't miss a snap all year.
(16:07):
I mean, and and you knowwhen you had good leadership with Tobec leading
the charge, you had all youhad prope. You had a Hall of
Fame left guard, left tackle,that's right. You had Chris Gray who
played in the league for I don'tknow for a long time, real steady,
and then you had the young upand coming right tackle, you know.
And so yeah, luckilyer so greatnine. You agree with that that
(16:29):
that was the number one reason whyyou guys got that far? Is that
that that that group up front bestpart of your team? Was that group?
Well, it's you know, wewere good on offense, uh,
running and passing that year. Ye. Now, why why does that happened?
Because you know it's sometimes you'll say, well, this team can't they
can pass block, but they can'trun block. You know, the tight
end can do this, and wedid both. Why is that because the
offensive line? Well, let's geta break. We're gonna kind of just
(16:52):
give you a preview of what theSeahawks are looking at this weekend. Uh,
it feels like it's a good yearto be a quarterback in the draft
because a lot of teams need quarterbacks. We'll talk about the local guy,
Michael Pennix, get some thoughts onthe guys at the top and Caleb Williams
and Jaden Daniels. Nick Sheridan,by the way, who was with Michael
Pennix when he was at Indiana atWashington. He's now with Kaitlin to board
(17:12):
Alabama. He's gonna hop on thegear with us at three forty five and
give us a thought on where hethinks the best fit for Michael will be
in the first round tonight. That'sall coming up live from the Virginia Mason
Athletics Center. Draft coverage brought toyou in part by our friends at Hunt
Services. Get a plumber, electrician, heating or cooling expert at your doorstep
for only forty nine dollars, Jumpon the horn and call Hunts. More
(17:34):
from the NFL Draft. Mike Hongrin, Dick Fane, Hu Millen with us
right here on ninety three three KJRFM. Welcome to the NFL drafts Now back
to SUCKI and Dish on your homefor the twenty twenty four NFL Draft and
cml's best NFL Draft cover. CnleSeahawks EPI Show, The Sports Radio ninety
three point three KJR FM. Igray it off my draft four fish Year's
(17:56):
believe papers he's my number one rateof prospect and I think Adunzay, I
believe is number five. Actually,oh Gunsey, I think is going to
have a really, really good careerprovided in You know, my comparison on
him is Larry Fitzgerald, but Ialso think he's got some DeAndre Hopkins and
him. That is the voice ofLance zerline guys from the NFL Network who
(18:19):
joins us every week courtesy of MossBay Hall unless he's too busy with NFL
Network stuff that will be on nextweek. Talking about Roma Dunza has him
as his number five pick, numberfive prospects. Sorry, in the draft.
Rome is the only Husky player thatis at the green room in Detroit.
Michael Pennix is in Tampa with hisfamily, Roger Rosengarten is in Colorado
(18:40):
with his family, and Troy Fatanais in Vegas with his family. So
Roma Dunzay is in Detroit. Wouldbe great to hear his name called early
tonight. And by the way,I was telling you in this her little
rumor, which means I saw iton Twitter. By the way that if
you if you see Roger Goodell nothugging players tonight on the stage, it's
because he has a bad back andmay want to fist pump. Guys are
(19:00):
giving a handshakes. So just keepthat in mind when you're watching the draft
of offensive line right six four threetwenty lifts him up, crack, crack,
crack gets free chiropractice. Yeah,all of a sudden, the guy
reaches his hand out and I waslike, no, oh, no,
right, yeah. Better make surethat those guys know Roger that your your
back is messed up. Nick Sheridan, who was the offensive coordinator at Alabama
(19:21):
and was with Michael Pennix at Indianaand at Washington, He's gonna join us
next segment and talk about Mike andhis journey and maybe a fit for him
tonight. In the draft, theSeahawks have seven picks as of right now,
uh sixteen in the first round,seventeen in round three. That's eighty
one overall, the second picking roundfour hundred and second overall, eighteenth picking
round four hundred and eighteen overall,the third pick in the sixth round at
(19:44):
one seventy nine, the sixteenth pickin the sixth round at one ninety two
and the fifteenth pick and the seventhround at two thirty five. Their second
round draft pick, as you guysknow, you went to the Giants and
the Leonard Williams deal and the thirdround draft pick and a fifth round draft
pick went to Washington for Sam Howe. So the question is, if there's
a quarterback the Seahawks like who theyhave as a first round draft pick on
(20:06):
their board sitting at sixteen, dothey allow the arrival of Sam Howe or
Geno Smith's presence on the roster toallow them to not take a quarterback today
if there's somebody there they really enjoy. Absolutely not. Yeah. I mean,
if you think the guy at sixteencan be your starter, yep,
and for a long time, youtake him. Now he's not playing right
away, we know that, buthe's watching and then learning, and if
(20:30):
you believe he can be the quarterbackfor ten years, twelve years down the
road, you take them. Youdon't pass it up the need versus your
board. You talked about having maybesixteen guys that you're saying, man,
you know every year that numbers aboutthe same. I'm assuming something like that.
Something like that so how do yourank Let's say you've got these sixteen
(20:51):
guys. How many of those sixteenguys are positions that you don't need at
all? Do you have any ofthose guys on there of positions that you
just set out? Yeah? Youknow what, I think. I think
most people do the board the sameway that you. You value the player,
is he a first round pick?And then you put them on the
board. These guys are first roundpicks by position. It's not when you
(21:15):
set up your board. It's notwho are we going to take? That's
not how you start. You putthe players up there. Then you're working
through need, you're working through fitsand all those kind of things afterwards.
So, uh, yeah, youput the guys up there, and then
if it happens, but understand,understand this too. Surprises happen in the
draft. All of a sudden you'rethinking, Okay, I'm I'm gonna take
(21:37):
this guy into here. He comeshere, he comes boom, someone hops
up, and maybe get trade getsin front of you, you know,
and then all of a sudden youlose out here. Let me ask you
the same question that I asked MikeDick about the quarterback situation. Because Gino
Smith is on a short term deal. Sam Howe, as I believe,
what two years left on his originalrookie contract, led the league in picks
a year ago. I like alot of what Sam Howe potentially has to
(21:57):
offer. But do you say noto a quarterback because you're set at that
position? Oh, I certainly not. I look at Kansas City. They
had Alex Smith. Alex Smith wascoming off a Pro Bowl year. They
were twenty seventh, but they sawsomething special on Pat Mahomes they moved up
to ten. I think there's alwaysa conundrum. I would think, Mike,
(22:18):
with the teams. The teams areat the top of the draft,
they lost the most last year,right, and they probably got poor to
average at best quarterback play. Right. And in fact that the three teams
at the top of the draft rightnow are projected doll take quarterbacks. Right,
there's always an argument say, well, listen, our team isn't very
good if we bring in this quarterback. We need offensive lineman, we need
(22:40):
a defense, We're you know,we're bringing this guy into a just a
no win situation. That could alwaysbe stated for these these quarterbacks at the
top of the draft. So howmuch of that do you buy in.
Are you of a philosophy like,Okay, if we're at the top of
the draft, let's get the quarterbackbecause we may never be back up here
and then find a way to buildaround him. Or do you say this
(23:03):
is just gonna be a waste becausewe're gonna bring this guy in, we
can't protect from him. We gotno receivers. You know, he's he's
set up for failure. So let'slet's address the rest of our team at
some other date in the future.We'll put off trying to get the real
franchise quarterback, the long term quarterback. Well, where do you ride on
that? Well, you can't everproject what's gonna happen next year or the
year after that. So if you'rein a position to pick a quarterback,
(23:27):
then take him. Take him now. Say your team is not ready to
have a rookie quarterback as the starterto help him enough, Say you are
teams like that, but you're stuck. He's got to he's gonna play.
Then it's up to the play callor the coach or whatever to protect him
(23:47):
a little bit and bring him along, let him learn, get him ready,
and don't put him you know,I think back to Hugh New England
and Jim Plunkett. That's the oneI think about it. You know,
he went into a bad team,got beat up, and then he had
to rest for a while, comeback, and he changed his whole career
around. You know, so yougot to be careful with that. Yeah,
but but no, you don't passhim up. You take him well,
(24:10):
Gino, I'm gonna use my wordscarefully. There's no debating when you
look at the team performance and thethe performance from the quarterback, there's no
debating you got average play from thequarterback. I'm not saying Gino's average.
If you want to be a defenderof Genie would say, well, he
didn't have this, he didn't havethat, and and if he had had
this and he'd have had that,then he would have been better. But
I don't. I don't think there'sany debate that that that you got average
(24:33):
quarterback play last year. Where doyou then stand? Are you more of
a like are you kind of gotyour head on the swivel of like,
hey, who's fallen to us?Uh? And with Gino you or do
you feel like there's that's not aniche you need to scratch in this draft.
No, it's it's no. Ithink if the quarterback is there,
If you think the quarterback for thefuture, is there a Michael Pennix or
(24:56):
somebody, he's there. Okay,forget Gena Gino's going to be my quarterback
next year. He's going to bethe starting quarterback. Okay, but Michael
Pennix is going to be the quarterbackhere for whoever? Right, you know
it's gonna be the saw long timeyou saw penis enough. Yeah, I'm
gonna put your feet to the fire. At sixteen, Pennicks available, you're
the Seahawks. Do you take him? Or do you take somebody else?
(25:18):
Or move down? What I takehim? You take Michael Pennocks. Why
at sixteen? Why? Absolutely?Why? Because of what he does,
what he showed me. Now,I don't study the film like you guys,
but I watched enough of the collegegames and him playing and him doing
stuff throwing balls that I go wow. I say that a lot when I
watch him play and his leadership,and from what I understand the things I
(25:40):
read about him, he's a goodteammate. There's a lot of pluses here.
The only the minuses are his injuryhistory. I think, can you
eat Can you eat that? Ifyou're the Seahawks? If yes, I
can, Yes you can? Well, yeah, coach, you know John
very well. If Michael Pennix isthere, will John take him at sixteen?
Dick? Let me think, comeon, man, tell us I
(26:04):
thought, I thought, after allthis what I said. See. Of
course, fortunately he's not listening tome. We all know that. Yeah,
right, okay, so but heI think I think John, I
don't have any inside knowledge, butI think he's gonna trade back. Yeah.
I think for John to have thegap between sixteen and eighty one out
(26:26):
a David eighty one yep, sixtyfive it's too big a gap sixty five
picks where he's doing nothing. It'stoo big A yeah. I agree.
Well, let's do this. We'vegot to break. Nick Sheridan is the
offensive coordinator at Alabama, and he'sbeen with Michael Pennick since his Indiana days.
He knows him as well as anybody. He knows his pros, he
knows his cons, he knows thefit he would need in the NFL to
have success. Nick Sheridan's going tojoin us and talk Michael Pennix from Tuscaloosa.
(26:51):
As we continue from the Virginia MasonAthletics Center, first round starts at
five. Right here on ninety threethree KJRFM, Come to the NFL Draft.
Out back to Sucky and on yourhome for the twenty twenty four NFL
Draft and Seattle's best NFL Draft coverseatle Seahawks aphow the Sports Radio ninety three
point three kJ R FM. Iactually didn't talking to the Seahawks. You
(27:15):
know, I don't know if Idon't know why that is. Maybe they
know me, hope so, butman, I'm super excited for him,
him and coach Huff. You knowthe things that they were able to do
with us at University of Washington,you know special. Well that's the voice
of Michael Pennix admitting he never talkedto the Seahawks. And maybe that's a
side maybe the Hawks try to keepthis thing secret out before the draft starts
(27:36):
tonight. Well, we're back atthe Virginia Mason Athletics Center. Mike Holmgan
rejoins us at four clock this afternoon. And Hugh, a guy I know
that you've known for a long time. Yes, I'm actually shocked that this
guy picked up the vote. He'skind of a big deal now. He's
the offensive coordinator in Alabama. Formertight ends coach At Washington was with Michael
Pennis way back in Indiana. Ourold pal Nick Sheridan's with us right now
(28:00):
the radio show. Nick. Howare you man? I'm doing great?
How are you guys doing good?It's great to hear your voice. Man,
you was here. Dick Fad ishere as well, and I got
to just start off by asking you, man, we are probably a couple
hours away, maybe three hours awayfrom Mike Penno's getting his name called in
the first run of the NFL Draft. For a guy like you that's been
with Mike for every step of hiscollege journey, what is the end of
(28:22):
this road tonight mean for you andmean for him? You think, well,
I think I think everybody that's beena part of mike you know story
here is just thrilled for him andhis family. I think it's a celebration,
you know. I think that's whatthe draft is for people. They
get to see these kids when they'refifteen, sixteen year old, to get
an opportunity to live out a dream, you know. I think that's it's
(28:45):
to be celebrated. You know,that's for all the players, you know.
I know the experts they have toyou know, diagnose the draft and
decide on the grades of the draftand all that. But I know for
college coaches and high school coaches andfamilies, it's a celebration. And I
know that's that's how we feel aboutMike. Well, we know Mike's history
here in Seattle, right because wesaw it. But but you've been with
(29:06):
him back to Indiana. Nick,tell us something maybe we don't know that
you think is important in Mike's journey, That that maybe we need to know
that you saw in Indiana, andthat that and the ability to come over
to Washington and do what he didso effectively. I think anybody that knows
Mike, and I know, youknow, for Washington fans this comes as
(29:27):
no surprise, but people that sawhim play at Indiana, I just think
that the moment's never too big forMike. You know, I think when
you really go back and see someof the games that he's played and competed
in, you know, and forpeople that know him, he's the same
guy all the time. You know, I've told plenty of teams in this
process that you know, when it'sthird and eight to win the division,
(29:48):
he's going to be ready to go. And and that won't, you know,
be too big of a spotlight forhim. And I think everybody that
saw him play the last few yearscertainly saw that. You know, in
the biggest games, in the biggestmoments, against the toughest competition, he
always came through. And the samewould be said in Indiana, you know,
and he was able to be healthy. You think about the Penn State
(30:11):
game, you think about him goinginto Columbus against Ohio State, you think
about beating Michigan. I think thisguy's a winner and you know, an
ultimate competitor. I think when youthink about competitors, people think about personality,
but I always think about guys thatwhen the moment's the biggest, they're
their best. And that's what Iwould say about Mike and I think everybody
that's seen him play here the lastfew two years would agree with that.
(30:33):
Coach, thanks for joining us.It's dick and something that Softie and I
have. It's just been driven us, driving us crazy over the last six
months or so, and that isthe constant focus by pundits on Michael Pennox's
injuries something that we never saw herein Seattle, but you did see at
Indiana. Talk about why you thinkthat emphasis has been so much on that
(30:55):
and what concerns should it be forsomebody that saw him both healthy here and
injured in Indiana. Well, Ithink anytime you go through this process and
people are talking about drafting franchise,you know, quarterbacks, I think,
you know, they look for everything. You know, they're trying to find
the reasons to not draft you.And I think that's the case for all
(31:15):
the players that are going to getpicked here in the first round. You
know, they're trying to find anythingthat they can to be critical to make
sure that they make the right choice, in the right decision. But you
know, I think you know,the best, you know, best predictor
of future performance is past performance andspecifically recent performance, you know. And
so for somebody like Michael that's hadyou know, zero issues for the last
(31:36):
two years, that has shown theability to be durable, to take hits,
to be available for his team,you know, that's all that he
can do, that's all that hecan control. And you know, I
think, you know, the lasttwo years kind of speak for itself,
and I think the early part ofhis career was what it was. You
know, I think that they wereunfortunate, you know, injuries, You
know that that that can happen toanybody, and for him to overcome,
(32:00):
for him to persevere, for himto grow and mature, you know,
in all areas. You know,I think his best football still ahead of
him. I think he's had someunbelievable moments so far, and I think
the last two years hopefully we'll giveyou know, these organizations peace of mind
and know, you know the typeof player and how how available he's going
to be for them. Well,former UDUB coach now the offensive coordinator at
(32:22):
Alabama, Nick Sheridan's with us onthe radio show talking about Michael Pennix and
Nick, I was looking at justthe first half of the draft, and
you could argue that twelve of thefirst sixteen teams, including the Seahawks,
by the way, could justify takinga quarterback in this draft. I mean,
I see a run there starting atnumber ten with the Jets, Minnesota,
Denver, the Raiders, the Saints. Do you see a good fit
(32:43):
for him? Do you see ascheme and an offense and a team in
the first round where you really feellike, hey, with with his skill
set and with that team's got,this would be a really nice spot for
him. Well, let me letme just preface this OFFTI, and this
lets you know I have no insightknowledge. Okay, So I don't want
anybody to think that I've talked tosome guys behind the scenes. You know.
(33:07):
Word is that you know the coordinatorin Seattle, what he might be
doing, that there might be somesome good fit there schematically for him.
But I honestly think that all thoseplaces would be a great spot for Mike.
You know, I think his skillset is so versatile. I think
you know, his ability to passthe football I think is rare and unique.
(33:28):
And his ability to process and makequick decisions. You know, I
do think places like Minnesota that havesome skill players on the outside, I
think that'd be a great fit forhim. I think, you know what
Oakland's trying to do, or excuseme, the Raiders are trying to do.
I think the same. So Ithink all the teams that you said,
I think there's a fit there forhim. And so I think that's
for any coach you know, fortheir players you want them to find the
(33:51):
right fit. You know, Ithink we all know how competitive the National
Football League is, and you know, you see guys all the time that
maybe go into a situation that's hard, hard for them to get their feet
underneath them in the league. AndI think for Michael, you want to
just see a stable place, youknow, a coach that can can coach
and train and develop the quarterbacks andsome good players around him. And so
(34:15):
I think a lot of those placesyou mentioned, you know, you talk
about Minnesota and some of the perimeterplayers, even New Orleans right they have
some young wide receivers that can reallygo. I think those would be great
spots for him because he's a greatpastor of the football and he's someone that
distributes it, you know, tohis guys at a high level. Nick
Sheridan with us the office coordinator atAlabama, he has been at Washington and
he knows Michael Pennix intricately. I'mgoing to preface nick my comments my next
(34:39):
question by saying, look, I'ma big advocate for Michael Pennox. I'm
on the radio, I'm on thethirty third team, made a presentation to
them. I'm advocating for him.So I love Michael Pennix at Washington and
at the next level. I wantyou to imagine you just made a veiled
reference to Ryan Grubb. You andI are on the same NFL team.
Okay, in this this hypothetical,I'm in the personnel and I come to
(35:00):
you and I say, Nick,look this guy he was. He was
so brilliant outside the numbers first incollege football, and the gap between first
and second is greater than the gapbetween second and twenty eight in terms of
the yards. He's twenty more yardson his deep throws down the field,
more than Drake Bay and all theother guys. So I know we can
throw it deep, and I knowwe can throw it outside the numbers.
(35:22):
But when I watch the tape,I see signs where he's a little bit
lacking in his anticipation over the middle. We got a deep angle cross by
Jalen Polk against Michigan State, We'vegot a spin concept against Oregon, and
there's others. I'm just like alittle bit concerned about the anticipatory throws over
(35:42):
the middle. So now you,in this hypothetical, you talk me out
of why I shouldn't be concerned aboutthat. Well, I think you know,
to be critical of the players forintermediate passes. I think you know.
What I would tell you is,if you want to draft someone that
throws a curl better than a postroute, I said, that's totally up
to use you. I love thatif that's your choice. You know,
(36:06):
I think we all know that you'renot going to win a game by throwing
a basic cross, you know.I think you know, I think what
his skill set has shown, andI also don't think that that's an area
of weakness. And I I hearyou'll maybe what the stats are numbers,
I mean, the analytics are theanalytics. All I could tell you is
that you know, he's an extremelyexplosive passer. I think when you look
at what, you know, whatare the metrics that really lend itself to
(36:28):
winning. That's someone that makes gooddecisions with the football and someone that can
create explosive plays. And I thinkyou know, if you're trying to check
those boxes with Michael Penny, let'sdraft there. I love it. I
love it. I mean you're saying, if he's got to be bad at
something, it may as well bethat for trying out loud. But hey,
next shared and great stuff. Ilove you putting you in his place.
By the way, man, anytimeyou want to come back on and
(36:50):
do that, you're always welcoming.By the way, I hope you got
air conditioning down there, pal Herd. It gets hot in the spring and
summer in Tuscal looseive, buddy,hope you're ready for that, man.
Yeah, well ready, we gotthat taken care about. Listen, go
get him and we'll talk down theroad, all right, coach, Okay,
take care of thanks. I loveit Nick Sheridan with us. Is
that a satisfactory answer? Yeah,I love it. You know he's gonna
be an advocate. But but butthat's great. I'd have to get Mike's
(37:14):
response. I mean because because,I mean, you have to work the
middle of the field. But butbut that ability to go grab those chunk
yards. The only the only I'veonly seen three statistics ever that anybody has
tried to make a claim is thenumber one correlation to winning. Uh.
There's obviously net turnovers. Everybody talksabout the turnover difference, Okay, and
(37:35):
then I've also heard net yards perattempt, and I've heard net explosive plays.
Nobody's ever else made an argument Mikethat that the number one stat uh
is is is anything other than that. So here, when we're talking about
Pennix's big playability, we're talking abouta deal that many say is the number
one thing net explosive plays and thisguy's ability to go get explosive. Well,
(37:59):
let's come back and ask Mike aboutall that next on ninety three three
kJ RFM live from the Virginia MasonAthletics Center. First round of the Draft
is just over an hour away righthere on ninety three three KJR
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