TAKE THIS PERSONALLY: Jessica Buchanan on Her Kidnapping, Captivity, & the Life That Followed

Jessica Buchanan was a schoolteacher from Ohio who followed a calling to serve overseas. That calling led her to East Africa, meaningful humanitarian work, and eventually into one of the most terrifying experiences imaginable. Jessica shares the full story of how she was kidnapped in Somalia, held hostage in the desert for 93 days, and ultimately rescued by SEAL Team Six. She opens up about the moments leading up to her capture, the role intuition tried to play, what captivity was really like, and how she survived mentally when survival felt impossible.

We also talk about the aftermath from PTSD, rebuilding identity, motherhood, faith, and what it means to “survive survival.”

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:13):
Personally with The Duelsman starting a new series to officially
kick off the new year. I know or a few
weeks late, but I did have some news to share
with you guys before we got really into twenty twenty six.
Many people see the new year as an opportunity to
start fresh, try new things, do things they've always wanted,
chase dreams. So I have some guests lined up to

(00:35):
really hone in on so many of those things. This week,
We're starting with Jessica Buchanan, and her story is one
that you'll want to hear and then you'll want to
read her books. She was kidnapped in Somalia by pirates,
held captive, and rescued by Seale Team six, and she's
recounting the whole experience as well as how she is
now surviving survival. I'm joined this week with Jessica Buchanan,

(01:02):
and I'm really excited to share your story because it
is a.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
One with so many twists and turns. Jessica, thanks for
joining me much, thanks for having me. I'm excited to
be here.

Speaker 1 (01:11):
Let's get started at the very beginning. I would love
for you to paint the picture of who you were
until we get to that kind of moment where your
life took a drastic turn.

Speaker 2 (01:20):
Sure, well, I think the easiest place to start is
in college. I was getting a teaching degree, and like
after my first year, I went on a teaching trip
to Honduras and got bit by the oh I can
travel and work at the same time. Bug. And then
as I went through like my education courses, really got

(01:42):
involved in we're young and so idealistic and naive and
thinking that I could go out and save the world,
and so got very interested in some of the things
that were happening in East Africa, and did a service
trip and almost died on that one, but that's another story.
And then I just felt really compelled and connected to

(02:07):
continuing work any sufforgum and especially like in the Northern
Uganda South Sudan area. And so I had to finish
up my degree and had an opportunity to do my
student teaching at an international school in there Robi, Kenya,
which was not what I had in mind. Was like
fancy private school and it was beautiful and wonderful, but

(02:28):
I wanted to be like getting my hands dirty and
that kind of thing. But they offered me a job
and it was my best way in to stay on
the continent, so I took it. It was great. I
started teaching fourth grade, loved it. About two months into
my teaching contract, I'm out with a bunch of my
teacher friends one night. I always say it was a
trashy night club, because it really was. It was just

(02:49):
like blowing off steam and having a good time.

Speaker 1 (02:51):
Yeah, you're a bunch of teachers who were doing stuff
and you wanted to tidd.

Speaker 3 (02:54):
We're young.

Speaker 2 (02:55):
We're in this amazing exotic place, and so we're dancing
and I see this cute guy across the room and
he looks up at me. He's on his phone, and
I wave him over and he ignores me. Actually he
laughs at me and looks down again, and I thought, no,
you didn't, I don't think so he looks up again

(03:15):
and I wave him over again a little bit more
like forcefully. Then he comes over and introduces himself. I
think his name is Oric, and he tells me he's
from Sweden, and I'd never met anybody from Sweden, so
Oric seems like a likely name that sounds sweedish to me.
He was a terrible dancer, so I was like, how
about me? You just go talk. And so we went
and got a drink and we talked for four hours

(03:37):
street And turns out his name is Eric, and I
didn't know that until he wrote like that. Or actually
now every once in a while I call him Oric
when I'm mad. That was like twenty years ago, so
we've been talking ever since. And so people always ask me,
how does a school teacher who grew up in the
middle of a cornfield, Ohio end up working in a

(03:58):
place like Somalia, And I'm like, well, it started with
a guy. And so Eric at the time was working
for an organization. He was the equivalent of a human
rights lawyer essentially, and his job was shifting and he
was going to be based up in her Geza, Somaliland,
which is the northern part of Somalia where a lot
of the NGOs were based in. The UN had a
presence there, And so we got married about a year

(04:21):
and a half after we met, and I quit my
job and moved up there with him.

Speaker 1 (04:25):
Wow. Okay, then Africa is where the story will take
the turn. But I love that you guys met first
of all, the fact that you felt compelled one to
share education around the world, that's.

Speaker 3 (04:37):
A really passionate and cool experience. So before we get.

Speaker 1 (04:42):
To everything else, what was that experience like, because I
imagine that's not only fun and amazing, but also really
eye opening.

Speaker 2 (04:51):
Oh for sure, in so many different ways. Now, if
I talk about formal teaching, like again, it was a
very different kind of environment. It was kids, diplomat kids.
I think we had sixty four countries represented in the school.
So I just was exposed to so much diversity, so
many different types of ways of doing things, religions, jobs.

(05:13):
It was just it was very cool. But on the
weekends I would go into Kibor Islam, which is one
of I think it might be one of the largest
slums in the world. It houses about over a million
people at least at that time it did, and this
is like real poverty. So I would go in and
tutor on the weekends. There were some orphanages there, and
that is by opening in a completely different way. I

(05:37):
just love to help people understand things, So it doesn't
really matter what the content is. I've realized throughout the
course of my career that content is easy to learn,
but trying to communicate it to someone so that they
can be empowered and educate themselves is a real skill
set and it's when I happen to possess and I've

(05:58):
just it was just really you such a cool way
to travel and to serve and to make a living.

Speaker 1 (06:06):
And then on the other side, getting to meet your
husband this way and out in the wild.

Speaker 2 (06:11):
I know, it's crazy. Well, it's so interesting because I
was thinking about this the other day my dad. I
had a couple boyfriends in college and stuff, and I'd
had a very serious relationship before all of that, and
I just couldn't find anybody that I like, really clicked with.
And my dad said to me, just go out and
do what you love. Go to Africa, and the best

(06:32):
place for you to meet someone is when you're out
doing what you love. And wise words, yeah, very wise words.

Speaker 1 (06:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:39):
I really carry that with me and it was really true.

Speaker 1 (06:42):
But you were also doing what you love in a club,
having fun, Dancy, We can love many things exactly. And
you meet your husband who you said, you guys are
now obviously married together and you have kids, yes, yep,
And is that crazy too? Where you think about that
portion of your life and the things that we're going
to talk about, just that it also brought you him

(07:02):
and your kids.

Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yeah. Yeah, he is my person, holy and completely and
that was very solidified in the moments of what we're
going to talk about next, like dropping all these cryptic statements.

Speaker 3 (07:17):
Yeah, that's not meant to you, but I just there's
so much backstory to you.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
That's not all you are.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
So I wanted to make sure I appreciate that we
paint the whole story first, so we can get a
little bit deeper to the other things. Go ahead and
share with us the piece that where everything really took
the turn.

Speaker 2 (07:32):
Yeah. So I was working in her Geza. We'd been there.
I'd been there for about two and a half years
at that point, so this is October twenty eleven. I
started out just tutoring and teaching English lessons. We had
a compound that we were sharing with other AID workers.
There weren't Ethiopian refugees living on the compound because we
had the working farm, and there was a little girl there.

(07:54):
She was there with her dad. Her name was Muslima
and there was no one for her to play with,
and so I didn't have a So I was like, hey, basically,
do you want to learn some English? And before I
knew it. I had an entire dining room full of
grown men, women like all these people, and we were
playing these English games. It was so much fun. That's
the thing about teaching is like you can always find

(08:15):
a job, like you can either create it or you
can find when. But then word got out that there
was a teacher in town, like an actual teacher, and
I started doing work for the Ministry of Education in
writing curriculum because they were developing their different departments of
the government. So that was a real interesting experience. And
then I did work for the UN, and then I

(08:37):
started doing work for DDG, the Danish d Mining Group,
which was the mine action unit of the Danish Refugee Council.
So they were a non governmental organization that was really
focused on arm violence reduction and community safety. They had
a couple of mandates. One of them was to actually
go into communities and do mine clearance because a lot
of the communities that they worked in were maybe like five, ten,

(09:00):
fifteen years post civil war and there were still leftover
UXO's or land mines that hadn't been cleared, and so
it would leave parts of their communities unpassable, or little
kids would be out there playing and see something shiny
and not know what it was and pick it up
and it could still explode. So our job was to

(09:22):
educate these communities on the dangers and also if we
were able to clear them. So again back to that, like,
I have no experience in mind clearance or any education
in that, but it's easy to learn content. And then
I was able to apply my teaching pedagogical skills to
because when I walked in to one of their trainings,

(09:44):
they're like writing English words on a flip chart and
you're sitting in this group of people who are nomadic,
largely non literate, definitely don't speak English, so nothing you're
doing is getting through to them. So we were able
to come up with all kinds of creative things to
part these messages to help make the community safer for
kids especially, And it was so awesome. I got to

(10:06):
travel all over East Africa, South Sudian and Northern Uganda.
I got to go into parts of Africa that you
only see on National Geographic. It was the love of
my life. As far as my job was concerned.

Speaker 3 (10:17):
We were doing important work.

Speaker 2 (10:19):
I felt like it was important. We weren't like delivering
food assistance or giving medical care. Like we weren't emergency relief,
but we were doing something that I really felt mattered,
and I felt good about my contribution. I didn't think
I was out there saving the world, but I did
feel like I was doing something meaningful.

Speaker 3 (10:37):
But in a way you.

Speaker 1 (10:38):
Were to me, and I'm not sure anybody else whatever,
but to me, you were providing education and giving people
a way to communicate.

Speaker 3 (10:46):
Is a lifeline in itself.

Speaker 2 (10:48):
Yeah, thank you. I think for those of us who've
spent a lot of time in the like that world,
we tend to downplay things.

Speaker 3 (10:55):
And I'm here to make sure you don't.

Speaker 2 (10:58):
It's a whole culture. But I appreciate that it did matter,
and at the end of the day, it almost cost
me my life, but I had been part of my
portfolio included traveling down to the southern part of Somalia,
so it's very nuanced. But Somalia at the time was
divided into three regions. Essentially, we lived in the northern

(11:20):
part Somaliland, which was self declared autonomous region, so they
had like their own government, but they have never been
recognized worldwide as like their own country, but they function
that way. So things were much safer and more there
was more infrastructure there down in the south, like in Mogadishu.
If you ever hear of anything on the news about Somalia,
something bad has happened, probably and it's probably happened abount Mogadishue.

(11:44):
We had a field office in a town called Galcayo,
which was north of Mogadishue. Definitely a little bit more
precarious in terms of security, but we followed United Nations
security protocols and we had regional security advisors that we
followed certain procedures and they gave us permission to go.

(12:06):
And my colleague, a Danish gentleman named Paul, who was
also a personal friend of mine, managed the operations down there,
and part of my job was to go down there
and support his team, his education team. But I had
canceled the trip. I was supposed to go down there
for three day training. I canceled it twice because there
were weird security things that were popping up. We weren't
the target necessarily, but and again not to get two

(12:29):
in the weeds. But the town was divided in half essentially,
and it was governed by two opposing clans, and so
if you got caught in the crossfire, which is what
I was worried about. Something bad could happen, and I
just didn't feel like the work that I needed to
do necessitated me going down there. So I canceled a

(12:50):
couple of times, and then the third time the trip
came up, I called him to cancel again, and he
was like getting sick of it. He was like, look,
if you're not going to get down here and do
your job, then Wolf, I'm somebody who can. And I'm like,
I get off the phone and I go talk to Eric.
He's been in the area for so long. He knows
everything there is to know as far from a foreigner perspective.

Speaker 3 (13:13):
And at this point, were you in Eric dating?

Speaker 2 (13:15):
We were married?

Speaker 3 (13:16):
You were married at this point.

Speaker 2 (13:17):
Okay, we've been married for about a year, so okayuch
Newlio ed still and it was you have to make
those decisions all the time, right, Like, you have to
assess the risk, and there's no there are inherent risks
to being in this part of the world. For sure,
you take those on. But is there like anything that's
super obvious. No, My regional security advisors gives me permission

(13:41):
to go. So I'm like what's the worst that can happen, Right,
I'm a school teacher from Ohio. Yeah, I'm just here
to help. A big deal. You're just being paranoid. So
I get on on you and plane I go down.
The training is three days. The first two days are
in the northern part of the city, and we were

(14:02):
actually staying on the compound where we were conducting the training,
So I wasn't worried about that because I didn't have
to leave. Right. What I was worried about is the
third day of the training, because we had to leave
that compound and drive in a convoy of armed vehicles
across town, essentially to another part of the city. And
I knew from like different trainings i'd taken. My organization

(14:25):
required us to take these heat trainings, their hostile environmental
awareness trainings, and I knew I was miss vulnerable if
I was in transit. I get up that morning, I
remember I didn't sleep like all night long. Paul and
I had stayed up way too late. We were drinking
white wine and watching I don't know, led Zeppelin concerts

(14:46):
or something and just hanging out and I didn't sleep,
but I'd had these nightmares all night long, and they
were really vivid, and in my dreams, our compound was
being stormed by pirates. And I woke up and I
was like, oh, it's just gross and stupid and where
did that come from? And I got up and went
to the bathroom, and I remember looking at myself in

(15:07):
the mirror and I sat out loud to my reflection,
do you want to do this? Your body was yelling,
was just like doing cartwheels.

Speaker 1 (15:22):
Like we're trying to tell you and every way we
can find a way.

Speaker 2 (15:26):
And all I kept doing was like pragmatizing my way
out of it. Right, everybody's waiting for me. The trip
has been planned. I spent all this money to come
down here. What's the team going to say if I
don't show up, I'm going to lose my job, all
the things. And I just put my head scarf on
and looked at myself one more time in the mirror

(15:48):
and walked out the door. But it was just like
into a different life.

Speaker 1 (15:53):
So clearly your body's sitting here trying to send a message,
figuring out something's going on whatever, And so you decided
to walk out that door that day. Does something happen
in transit like you anticipated or was it when you
got to the location.

Speaker 2 (16:09):
Yeah, So we get across the green line, just fine,
do the training. Everything's great at this point. Right, it's
three o'clock in the afternoon, and I'm like, I am
home free. All I have to do is get from
here to the guesthouse. I'm leaving first thing in the morning.
I'm was so paranoid. I'm like chuckling at myself. Jest,
You're just like whatever, you just need to calm down, right.

(16:31):
And so we're waiting for the convoy of vehicles to
come and pick us up. And it's so convoy in
that environment looks like land cruisers, like big land cruisers,
and you've got armed guards like occupying the front in
the back in case something happened, right, And we have
a driver and we're waiting for the convoy to come
in in our security advisor. It's a Somali guy. His

(16:53):
name's Abduruzak. He keeps saying, Okay, it's time to go.
It's not time to go. Wait, gave on the phone,
and I think this is weird, but at the same time, whatever,
let's just get home. And so we get in the car.
We pull through the gates and we're driving ten minutes.
Maybe I'm thinking about what I'm out for dinner. Can
I get my workout in? You're home free at this Yeah,

(17:15):
I forgot to send that one email to my boss.
Let me do that. I text my husband. He's in
another part of the country doing trainings, and so I'm like, okay,
And then all of a sudden, this other vehicle comes
roaring up on the right side and cuts us off
and stops us to halt. Then mud splashes up all
over the windows in the windshield of the vehicle, and

(17:35):
we can't see because it had been raining earlier. And
I look up and I just say to the whole car,
what a jerk who drives like that? And to be fair,
like people drive like crazy, like I'm not part of
the yeah, but and not part of the world too.
But it was just like so abrupt. And then all
of a sudden, I hear somebody banging on the car
hood with something hard. It turns out to be an

(17:57):
Ak forty seven, and it sounds like we're being surrounded
by men who are like shouting, and so Mollie and
I'm thinking, oh my god. And then Abdi Rezak, the
security advisor sitting next to me in the back seat.
He's on the right side. His door is pulled open,
and there's a very angry man dressed in a police
uniform holding an AK forty seven. He pulls him out,
like straight out of his seat belt and slams into

(18:20):
the ground, hits him in the head with his gun,
and then gets in the car and puts the gun
to my head and starts screaming at the driver to drive.
And I'm thinking, like, I have two thoughts that are
like racing through my head. They're very simple and very fundamental.
And the driver's just like taking off. He just starts
tearing through the town. He's like up on two wheels.
He slammed back down. He's up on two wheels. Palls

(18:41):
in the front seat, and he's just like begging him,
please stop, please stop, Please slow down. You're gonna kill us,
because it feels like he's gonna flip the car. And
I'm thinking, this is bad. This is bad. This is
so bad.

Speaker 1 (18:54):
You're probably going through a shock, and yeah, not realizing
why what's going on, Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (19:00):
And then I kept thinking, like I don't have anything
to reach for, right, I don't think I've ever seen
a movie or read a book or taken a training
that is giving me any frame of reference for this
whatever this is is so bad. And then I kept thinking, like,
even if they stopped and they kicked us out of
the car and we're just being carjacked and they're just

(19:21):
going to take our stuff and let us walk back
to town, Like something in my life, in my worldview
has shattered, like this belief or this idea truth that
I cling to that the world is a safe place,
which I realized is a very privileged place to come from,
but I did feel that way. It has been shattered,

(19:43):
and everything about my life is going to change from
this moment on and how I live it and how
I approach it. And of course that is like in
retrospect that I can articulate that what I was just
thinking in those moments was, oh my god, this is
so bad. We would drive for hours. We drive, we stop,

(20:04):
They put other people in the car. It's like they
were switching out teams or personnel. We stop, were forced
in other vehicles. At one point, I think Paul and
I are separated, which was really scary because.

Speaker 1 (20:15):
You two were the ones that were taken, Yes, and
the driver was also taken at one point.

Speaker 2 (20:20):
No, okay, so we got the only two foreigners, if
you will. There were other Somali staff like our team.
They were not harmed and whatever. This of course I
don't know that, like I have no idea. What's now
you do? Yes times exactly, but that in that moment,
at that time, I'm just At one point, there's a

(20:43):
guy sitting next to me and he's got like a
sheet wrapped around it. He's got like a turbine, and
he's got a machine gun and like an old machine gun.
It's like really big and long, and it doesn't fit
in the vehicle, so he's hanging outside the vehicle. And
then at one point we stop and I hear a
high pitched voice right behind me, and I think it's

(21:03):
a woman, Like oh that would like why would there
be a woman involved in a kidnapping?

Speaker 3 (21:08):
Like this?

Speaker 2 (21:09):
What is going on here? Turn around and come face
to face with a little kid that was one.

Speaker 3 (21:15):
Of the people helping in your rest.

Speaker 2 (21:18):
He is a little boy. He looks like he's nine.
He's wearing belts of ammunition. He's got a gun that's
bigger than him, and we like make eye contact, and
he does one of these numbers like yeah, and then
tells me to turn around, and I'm just like, what

(21:39):
hell have I stepped into?

Speaker 1 (21:41):
Yeah, you're especially coming from a teacher perspective. You're sitting there,
and that's a kid behind me.

Speaker 2 (21:46):
There's a little kid with an a K right behind
my head. What is this? And I think I don't
know at what point it was, but I Paul was
He turned around, I think to check on me, and
I'm like what And he says, we're being kidnapped? And

(22:07):
I'm like, I think I'm have a panic attack. I
think I can't breathe. It's all what in God's name
is this? And why me? What is happening? And so
we drive like into the middle of the night. Have
no idea how many hours, but it had to have
been like twelve hours.

Speaker 3 (22:25):
I'm assuming too. You don't know any of this language
that they're speaking.

Speaker 2 (22:29):
No, First of all, Smolly is a very difficult language
to learn, and it's not for lack of trying, but
it's difficult. No, I didn't know what was going on.
I kept hearing them talk about American. They're talking really loudly,
They're hyped up on this plant called cot chat. It
depends on who you talk to. It's like speed, it's
like an amphetamine. And they're like really hyped up and

(22:50):
amped up. And so we stop. We're out in the
middle of nowhere. There's it's so pitch black, there's no
ambient light. We are not near in We're just out
in the middle of the desert. And the guy with
the machine gun shoves me out of the car and
orders me to walk out into the desert. And I'm like, nope,

(23:15):
I'm not doing that. I have no idea what's waiting
for me out there, but I can guarantee you it's
not going to be good. And so we go back
and forth and he's like screaming at me to walk,
and I'm like no, and he's shaking his gun in
my face. No, I'm pressing myself up against the car
and Paul comes around the corner and he takes my
hand and he says, Jessica, and you have to walk.

(23:40):
And I'm just thinking, like I maybe I should have understood.
I just don't understand, Like, how is this my life?

Speaker 1 (23:50):
Yeah, you were going through probably so many different emotions
of anger and sadness, and shock and grief, like it's
all hitting you up at this moment, imagine exactly.

Speaker 2 (24:01):
Yeah, And all I can think is I can't think
very far forward because I don't want to like face
whatever reality is weeding for me in those eminent moments.
But I can feel that I'm heading. I'm like marching
toward my death. And so as I like continue walking,

(24:24):
Paul and I are like hand in hand and it's
so dark, and we're like tripping over thornbushes and rocks,
and I remember I gashed my leg on a rock
and it starts bleeding, and I'm thinking, like, Okay, this
is good. I can feel pain, this is this must
mean I'm still alive, because at that point it feels
so surreal that you're like, am I dreaming? Is this

(24:45):
really happening. I feel like I'm floating over my body.
I'm not grounded or tethered. I think also, that's probably
like a defense mechanism.

Speaker 1 (24:53):
Right fight For sure, you're going through it out of
body experience, and you're detaching from what's.

Speaker 2 (24:58):
Percent and I I'm thinking, Okay, I'm saying goodbye to Eric,
I'm saying goodbye to my dad, my brother, my sister.
My mom had passed away the year before, and so
I felt her presence there very strongly, and I was
just asking her to help me be strong, help me
be brave, help me be dignified. I was very aware
that I wanted to not have the last moments of

(25:20):
my life be hysterical, crying and begging for mercy or something.
I just I wanted to be dignified in those moments.
And so we just walk and more people come out
of the shadows, and we're being surrounded and there's like
chains of ammunition. I just remember thinking of it and
the weapons that there have to be twenty thirty who
knows how many men and who knows how many kids,

(25:43):
but at least this one. And then we basically just
get out into some like random place in the middle
of the desert, and they tell us to stop and
get down on our knees, and I think, this is it.
This is the end of my life. I'm thirty two,
thirty one, and this is it. Like I came here,

(26:06):
I really did try to help. I tried to make
a difference. Don't know why everybody's so angry at me.
I'm sorry if I did something wrong.

Speaker 3 (26:17):
You're blaming yourself with this.

Speaker 2 (26:18):
Oh, I'm just trying to make sense of how did
I end up here?

Speaker 1 (26:22):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (26:22):
And what did it have to do with you?

Speaker 1 (26:23):
Well, you had so many questions that weren't answered for sure.

Speaker 2 (26:26):
And then I think there's also this I'm a person
of faith, and so there's this God, why would you
let something like this happen to me? You know, like
floating around somewhere, you can't catch any of the thoughts
because they're just like flying all.

Speaker 1 (26:39):
Of them at the same time, while literally being in
a situation where you don't know if the next few
moments are the end.

Speaker 2 (26:45):
Right, And then you're like, is it gonna hurt? Are
they going to wait?

Speaker 1 (26:50):
Wow? Just everything that you could possibly think that could
happen is going through your head absolutely, and then like
things you're too afraid to think about happening.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
And so I'm on my knees. I'm waiting for a
bullet to pierce my brain. I'm waiting for my head
to be cut off from my body. And then I
just hear one of them go sleep. Oh my god, Wait,
I know that word. What does that word mean? Does
that word mean what I think it means? Sleep? One
of them says, and I'm just like, I don't understand.

(27:21):
And then they like shove me to the ground, and
I realize they want me to lay down in the
dirt and go to sleep, and amazingly I do. I
like us out. It's almost like shock, yeah, like unconscious, right,
And so for a couple I guess for a couple
of hours, I wake up and it's like becoming daylight,

(27:42):
and I wake up with the realization like, oh my god,
that wasn't that really that happened? And I am quite
literally in hell and that would begin ninety three days
as a hostage out in the desert.

Speaker 1 (27:57):
Oh my gosh, my my heart is just racing for you.
I can't even imagine that.

Speaker 3 (28:01):
It's well, yeah, and I'm sure we living.

Speaker 1 (28:04):
It is also difficult in itself to walk yourself back
through those moments.

Speaker 2 (28:09):
So thank you.

Speaker 1 (28:10):
I know that takes a lot, it does, and I
know sharing your story is just as important to you,
but it doesn't negate the fact that this.

Speaker 2 (28:18):
Is difficult to share.

Speaker 1 (28:20):
And I just I have so many follow up questions,
first being did you ever find out.

Speaker 2 (28:27):
Why they took you money? They wanted money? Any It
took about a week for us to get that answer.
The scary part was we didn't really understand the context
of who had us. So like in Somalia there is
they have their own version of isis essentially or like
the Taliban kind of and probably that's a bad comparison,

(28:48):
but they're an extremist group and that was what I
was most afraid of. Have we been taken? Is this
an ideological thing? Like I'm a Christian white woman from America?
Is are they a statement? If that's true, then Gonner
and so it took a really long time to figure

(29:08):
out who we could ask because mostly they just left you.
If they weren't terrorizing you and threatening you, then they
would just leave you alone and leave you off in
the corner under a tree. And finally we asked this guy,
his name was Abdy, who we figured must be the
leader of the group to some extent, and he spoke
some English and we asked, plaint blank, are you gonna

(29:31):
kill us? And he said no, no, no, we just
want money. We just want money. And the relief I
felt here didn't trust him when he said that, that's
the interesting thing about this whole thing is like you,
I'll use my eyewords. I found that I would hold
on to some of the most ludicrous, unrealistic information because

(29:55):
my brain needed to hold on to something and convince
myself that it was true so that I could like
hang on and survive until whatever that happened. Right, So
I felt so much relief finding out that, oh, no,
we're not taking you for ideological reasons. We just took
you for money. But then my heart sank again when
I found out the ransom demand was forty five million dollars.

Speaker 3 (30:17):
What from I'm assuming our government or.

Speaker 2 (30:20):
They don't care where it comes from. They just want money, Yeah,
from whoever is willing to get it. These were not terrorists,
they were not extremists. They are just a gang of
random people. It's not that random it is. It's kind
of like the mafia or something. They're crooks, they're criminals.
They don't care where when it comes from. So, but
America does not negotiate with terrorists is how they say it.

(30:43):
But what they mean is they don't pay ransom demands.
It's further complicated because you got an American and a
Danish guy who worked for a Danish company who were
sent there by their company. It's not like we were
freelance journalists out there gallivanting around Somalia. How our organization
had sent us to do a job and given us
permission to go there. And so I did know somewhere

(31:06):
in the back of my mind that our organization had
insurance like kidnapping ranks of insurance, which they don't talk
about very widely, because right.

Speaker 1 (31:15):
It's going to deter a lot of whole people from
working for you, and it's going to addrise a lot
more incidents.

Speaker 3 (31:20):
Well, yeah, they know that.

Speaker 2 (31:21):
There's that's how this works. So that provided me a
little bit of like mental relief, but also forty five
million dollars do you even know what that? Do you even?
And we kept saying, we're two aid workers, we're not
a containership off in the Indian Ocean that you've overtaken
a whole crew, and then all the stuff that's on
the ship were two people that no one really cares about,

(31:45):
like other than our families. And then we heard that
our organization countered at twenty thousand dollars and I'm like, look,
I'm no mathematician, but that's going to take a really
long time to meet in the middle.

Speaker 1 (31:58):
That was the first sign of a negotiation happening, I guess.

Speaker 2 (32:02):
So yeah, okay, So were they also.

Speaker 3 (32:05):
Giving you food and water at all where.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
They were, but not a lot. We would get water,
we would run out of water. I remember there was
an incident, oh man, and we were so thirsty because
it's so hot.

Speaker 3 (32:18):
During the desert.

Speaker 2 (32:19):
Yeah, it's really cold at night, but it's dry, right
and dusty and really hot during the day. And one
of them threw a jery can at us if you
were too is this similar to gas can right, that
they actually used for gas, but they would use it
interchangeably for water too, And so you're you got like water,
you don't know the source. It's least with diesel, and

(32:42):
that's what they want you to drink, so that's your choice,
or just like feeling like you're gonna die from thirst.
So it wasn't like that all the time, but sometimes
and then mainly what we ate was small tins of tuna.
They had like little miniature cans of tuna. And people
are always very fascinated by the fact that I had

(33:03):
a pouch from my purse that they let me take
with me that night, and I have a thyroid condition
and so I had medicine in it, and I had
the wherewithal to ask them if I could take it
with me the night that they took us.

Speaker 3 (33:14):
Wow, and you needed that? I needed you not have that.
What would that have been like for you?

Speaker 2 (33:20):
I would have gone into a thyroid storm and died.
So I needed my thyroid meds.

Speaker 3 (33:25):
One that you knew to ask in that whole.

Speaker 2 (33:28):
Yeah, something in my head was just I don't know
what's going to happen, but I need this. Yeah, I
know you're probably gonna just execute me, but also in
case you don't, I need my thyroid medicine.

Speaker 1 (33:38):
Well, and probably, looking back at that moment too, in
them allowing you to have it could have given you
some content.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
I think it did. But I think I do remember
thinking like, okay, if they let me, why would they
let me take my bag if they were going to
kill me?

Speaker 3 (33:51):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (33:52):
So, but I had a fresh campon in there, right,
because it's a bag that you keep in your purse,
And after a couple of eating tuna out of a
can with your hands dirty, you're disgusting, like this is gross,
And so I started digging through my powder bag to
see is there anything in here? I could use for
a utensil. It turns out you can scoop tunic fish

(34:14):
out of a can with a tampon applicator and suck
it out. Then I would watch innovation that it's and
I like, have made a couple of reels about that,
and people are always like what, And I'm like, it
wasn't used. It wasn't like I found a use tampon
on the ground out in the desert.

Speaker 1 (34:30):
You found Think about your brain in that situation of
being like, what can I use? And you found something
and you just you were focused on surviving. Yeah, you
weren't focused on I don't care what I'm using. I'm
just trying to make this situation any way, shape or
form better.

Speaker 2 (34:44):
Yes, I've got a body, I've got a tampon. What
can I How can I use these things? What's that?
I'm not going to get that phrase? What desperation is
the mother of all invention? Is that it?

Speaker 1 (34:56):
Did?

Speaker 2 (34:56):
I get that right? But you learn in a situation
like this how resourceful you are.

Speaker 1 (35:01):
Did that end up becoming like now, when you carry
around a person everything, do you carry more things with you?

Speaker 3 (35:06):
Did that ever?

Speaker 1 (35:07):
Have much?

Speaker 2 (35:08):
Yeah? I packed my bag over there. I could probably
live out of that thing for two weeks really for sure.
But I also can see like how much you can
survive on how little you can survive on. Right, But
I do have a thing. I've got lots of PTSD,
lots of things that still this has been thirteen years
that still impact me. And yeah, carrying around a bunch
of crap in my bag is one of them.

Speaker 1 (35:29):
So well, if you're comfortable with it, I'd love to
hear more about that experience, because that's the other side
of this. This is now not only did you survive
and also we'll get to that you were rescued by
Seal Team six I'm correct, but I want to hear
the post of all of this, like your experience going
back into life after all this happened.

Speaker 3 (35:50):
The bag that changes things.

Speaker 1 (35:52):
But I also know you made a post about traveling
and how flying on airplanes is also difficult, Like walk
me through those posts this situation, Yeah, what that's like
for you now?

Speaker 2 (36:04):
So I call this phase and I think I'm like
moving out of it, but it's taken me a really
long time. By surviving survival, So there's surviving the tump
traumatic event and then there's the after, and so for
those of us who are fortunate enough to have survived
whatever that event is, then we have to figure out

(36:26):
how to if we want to rebuild our lives in
the aftermath of everything just falling apart. And so when
I came back, when I was brought back, I didn't
know who I was anymore. My identity had cracked because
it had been so connected to my work. I had
terrible PTSD, I had debilitating anxiety. I didn't feel safe

(36:49):
in the world anymore. I didn't know what I was
capable of doing anymore because my identity was very much
wrapped up in my work. I couldn't continue going out
in the field anymore because I just couldn't.

Speaker 3 (37:01):
And I don't think anybody would also expect you to
after Well.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
Well my organization did after a while, which is a
whole other story. But yes, right, so what am I
going to do? What am I qualified to do? All
of those questions, and then everything feels really over, really
hard and scary, and that surviving survival space is what
gets people. It's what keeps them ruminating over the past.

(37:26):
It paralyzes them and keeps them from moving forward because
they're also drowning in shame because of whatever has happened,
or perhaps they don't. They feel like they should be
able to move on and through it, where the truth is,
you don't move through any tragedy or trauma. You just
continue to move forward and so.

Speaker 3 (37:47):
Never quite leaves you.

Speaker 2 (37:48):
I would imagine, no never, And yes, I can talk
about it now, Yes I'll be extremely tired after this conversation.
I know how to take care of myself now, but
in those early days and I was. I am talking
to a friend about this who's also been through some
pretty hard stuff. And I've been extremely public about this also.

(38:08):
I guess I didn't have to, but I did feel
a sense of responsibility to say thank you and to
be vocal and to share because of the link to
the military and Seal Team six in that community, because
it's true if they hadn't come and gotten me, I
would have died out there, and so it was a
high profile media event. Again, I'm not going to act
like some victim here that, oh, I have to give

(38:31):
speeches and write books, and I've chosen to do that.
That's been part of my healing journey and that doesn't
work for everybody. But that takes a toll too. It's
another part of just navigating the after well.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
And I totally understand that responsibility and that care that
you want to give to your experience. There's a kindness
almost to it that you're treating yourself and saying, hey,
you went through this, and I'm going to recognize it
and we're going to do.

Speaker 3 (38:55):
Things that helpefully bring good from it. So yeah, and I.

Speaker 1 (38:58):
Would imagine that's mostly that goal for you and so,
but to not recognize that still being able to share
hard things doesn't mean it's easy. It's important, it's needed,
and it's necessary, but it doesn't again negate the hardness
that comes up. Two things can always be true, and
that's what this is. So I think it's amazing that

(39:21):
you're sharing and being willing to share, because I cannot
imagine going through an experience like this. You've created a
really beautiful life for yourself, and you have kids, and
I'm sure all of that came with so many levels
of that PTSD. Yes, but you've chosen to You made
the choice too, and I think that's really cool. And

(39:43):
I know that it is hard. It's a choice every.

Speaker 2 (39:45):
Day it is and it's an easier choice to make now,
there were some really dark moments. For a long time,
it was really hard. I got pregnant with my son
like a week after the rescue. Talk about a miracle,
but that really through me for a loop. I was like, Wow,
I really need a break here. Now I have to
show up for this other human being. And in retrospect,

(40:07):
of course, I know that was all the plan, Like
that was part of the plan, right, I had No
I don't feel like I had a choice to heal
because I needed to be. I had a responsibility to
my children to go to therapy, to do trauma treatment,
to do the journaling and the meditation and the prayer
and be on anxiety meds if I need, whatever it was,

(40:30):
so that I could be at the most healed version
of a mother that I could be for them. And
I don't know. I would like to think that I
would have taken those measures if I hadn't had kids,
but most likely I probably just would have ended up
drinking a bottle of white wine every night because I
didn't have to show up for anybody the next day.
And so I really see it as God's grace in

(40:51):
my life that I didn't get pregnant and so quickly.

Speaker 3 (40:54):
Wow, but you were healing.

Speaker 1 (40:56):
You hadn't even gosh, you probably hadn't even decompressed from everything, even.

Speaker 2 (41:00):
How my body like got pregnant or I lost forty
five pounds.

Speaker 3 (41:04):
Do you know if you were pregnant during that all
was happening? Or did it happen?

Speaker 2 (41:08):
So I've written about this.

Speaker 3 (41:10):
I don't sorry if that's too personal, it's.

Speaker 2 (41:11):
Not, no, no, because I've written about it and published
about it. I do believe so my husband Eric and
I were trying to get pregnant when all of this happened,
and I do believe I had a miscarriage. At the
beginning of the kidnapping of captivity. I had some I'd
never had one before and haven't had one since, So
I do believe that's what happened. And I really was
grateful because I can't imagine how complicated everything would have

(41:34):
been if I had been pregnant. So I don't really
think about that or focus on that very much. But
the fact that, like with extreme quick weight loss, I
was one hundred nineteen pounds when I came out and
I'm almost six feet tall, so that was significant significant,
And then to be able to get pregnant and hold
on to the pregnancy like I just I don't know.

(41:55):
It was just to me, it's miraculous.

Speaker 3 (41:58):
You're just I.

Speaker 1 (42:00):
Don't know how one person could handle so much of
what you were going through. And also you had mentioned
very briefly that you had lost.

Speaker 2 (42:06):
My mother a year before.

Speaker 1 (42:07):
I mean, I just like to make the choice to
be here and to do the things is so beautiful
and it's a testament to who you are and the
strength that you carry with you and the love that
you have surrounding you. I imagine your husband was a
critical part in your healing, and that is.

Speaker 2 (42:21):
Just the thing, right, Like, I recognize how privileged I am,
and I write about this a lot. I just had
a book come out, How to Survive, Survival and a
lot Like so many of us, none of us escape
the human experience, unescapes where either we've survived something, we're
surviving it right now, or we will Like that's just
the human experience. What we don't get to choose is

(42:42):
like some of us have more tools in our toolbox, right,
Like we have family who is supporting us, or we
have maybe resources available to us that other people don't have,
and in my situation, I just feel so lucky. Yes,
I have this amazing man. Just I knew he was
a bulldog while I was sitting out there in the desert.

(43:03):
I knew he was beating down every door. He was
doing whatever he could to get me out of there.
I knew my dad and my brother and sister were
praying and supporting and doing what they could. And I
also committed to my mental health recovery while I was
out there, and I did good on that promise to
myself and so, but not everybody has those support systems

(43:25):
or those resources available. And so I do think that
I'm just really lucky in that regard.

Speaker 1 (43:32):
And that's an important piece to this puzzle for sure,
at the end of it, to recognize the role your
life has in it. And I love that you speak
on just so many different angles and the nuance of
all of it, because it's necessary.

Speaker 2 (43:43):
To I think so none of it. It's like black
and white, Like it's not, oh well, this trauma is
worse than this trauma. You can't compare anything because we
are all working on different baselines. Yep. Like for whatever reason,
I just have a really strong mind. I was so
worried that I was going to have a psychotic break
while I was out there, because if that or there

(44:07):
was a time to have one, it would be then.

Speaker 3 (44:09):
Well and to nobody would fault you for that. That
would be completely fair, and you're right.

Speaker 2 (44:13):
To what one hundred percent. But I knew that was
my fear, and I needed to safeguard myself and figure
out a way to keep myself as mentally strong as
I possibly can. And it turns out the methods that
I used while I was in captivity are still things
that I apply to my life now. No even sharing them, No,
not at all. It sounds so cliche, but like gratitude,

(44:37):
it really it's the easiest hack, yeah, for surviving life.
I got to a point where I would not go
to sleep while I was out there on my mat
on the ground until I could say five things that
I was actually grateful for. And sometimes they were really pathetic,
but I'm glad my tonail didn't fall off today or such.
Just really really stretching it. It changes things, and it

(45:01):
gives you the strength to make it through to the
next minute, sometimes this minute by minute. And I have
so much empathy for people who are struggling through something.
I don't feel like they can get out of bed,
whether it's literally or metaphorically, And sometimes all you can
do is just move your big toe and that's enough.
And so for me, that's what it was like. I

(45:22):
also spent a lot of time in reflection, and I'm
a very reflective person anyway, and so that was easy
for me to do that. I got really organized about it,
and I again, I was grieving the last of my mom,
and so I used a lot of this time that
I had to think about some of the dysfunction of
our relationship and really find some closure in my grief

(45:47):
process while I was out there, and it helped me
gain some clarity around my mom and why maybe she
did some of the things she did and why I
responded the way I did. And I think there were
some really beautiful moment of forgiveness. And so all of
those things can be applied very easily when you don't
have a gun held to your head, and if they

(46:08):
can be that effective, then then they most assuredly can
be that effective.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
Now, well, can I just mention that it's remarkable that
you even thought to utilize those tools in a state
where you were in fighter flight, because most of the
time when you are in a fighter flight, it's really
hard to one advocate for yourself, to show up for yourself,
to do all the things that are needed to take
care of yourself. And you had enough wherewithal to just

(46:35):
force yourself to give you that hope to move forward.

Speaker 2 (46:38):
Well, it also provided me an escape, because what I've
learned is that our minds are so powerful. No one
only you have control of your mind. No one else
can gain entrance into your head. I will often say
that my body was being held hostage, but my mind
had never been for your because what I learned was

(47:00):
the power of my thoughts and what I focused on
what you appreciate, appreciates right. And if I had just
been laying there in the fetal position, thinking oh my god,
I'm going to die, I'm going to die, I'm going
to die, then I probably would have. But that was
helping no one. And so it really is. It's all.

(47:21):
It's a mindset thing. That is the hack, that is
the way you win it life and how you survive
it is it's all in your mind. That's such a
great fool that you've got to carry with you through yeah,
so many. I feel really grateful to have learned it. It
would have been nice to have learned it outside of captivity.

Speaker 3 (47:38):
But right any other way, Yeah, actually, like any other way.

Speaker 2 (47:40):
But you know what, I'm not going to learn the
lesson twice. Yeah, I got it this time. That we're good.

Speaker 3 (47:44):
Yeah, if you're like I, Yeah, that one will stay safely.

Speaker 2 (47:47):
In my head forever. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (47:49):
I do want to talk about that rescue part side
of this, because you were rescued by Sale Team six.

Speaker 3 (47:55):
So how did that even come to fruition? Did it
involve your husband?

Speaker 1 (48:00):
You did mention how he was beaten down doors and
trying to make some moves and do things.

Speaker 3 (48:05):
So what happened in the rescue?

Speaker 2 (48:07):
So unbeknownst to me that when something like this happens
to an American citizen abroad, the FBI gets involved immediately
because it's a crime against an American. And so the
FBI was working along with my organization. And because my
husband had been in Somalia working and knew the environment,
the landscape very well, not the physical landscape but the

(48:29):
cultural landscape. Rather, he was really brought in as an
expert right to run things past. And I had what
were would have been a series of six proof of
life calls, and those are when those are just like
what you see on TV. Right, they like, put you
on the phone for me. They would drive us deep,
deep out into the desert, put us on a satellite phone,
and we would talk to somebody from our organization and

(48:51):
answer security questions that would identify us. What your mother's made, name,
what's the tattoo on your back? Because they needed to
make sure that we were alive still so the negotiations
could keep moving forward. And my sixth proof of life
call was January sixteenth, twenty twelve, and it would be
my final one. Unbeknownst to me, and I said to

(49:16):
the communicator who was speaking on behalf of our family,
I listed my symptoms. I had contracted a UTI from
being out there in the desert, and I was like
on week two of an untreated urinary tract infection. I
knew it was moving into a kidney infection because I'd
had one actually like the year before, and I was
hospitalized in Nairobi for a week, so pretty serious things, right,

(49:39):
And I told her my symptoms and I said, I
knew exactly what's happening. If you guys, don't get me
out of here. I'm going to die. And I think
I said something like and it's going to be all
your fault.

Speaker 3 (49:52):
Well, yeah, and you're speaking from a place of panic.

Speaker 2 (49:54):
And yeah, you need to know how serious this is.
This is we are now at a life and death
situation here, right, And so I get off the phone,
go back. My health continues to decline to the point
where I'm like losing the ability to walk. I'm throwing
up all the time. It's getting bad because you have
to understand, I'm like outside the whole time. They don't

(50:15):
take us to a house, they don't take us to
a shelter. There's no bathroom, I'm not showering. I'm living outside.

Speaker 1 (50:22):
And you're probably in the same clothes you've been wearing
the whole time.

Speaker 2 (50:25):
Someone took my underwear, Okay, yeah, weird, Yeah weird. I
had washed them a couple of days into after I'd
had this massive whatever it was, like, miscarriage. I think
I washed my underwear and my pants and I laid
them like on a bush to dry, and somebody took them.
And so I kept asking for new underwear and they

(50:48):
didn't understand what I meant, and so I had no
underwear that Oh my.

Speaker 3 (50:53):
Gosh, and that's a I mean about sanitarium.

Speaker 2 (50:56):
Yeah, there's no barrier. I'm just going to the bathroom
out bushit. It's just sometimes I still can't believe I
liked all that. So we get to ten days later,
January twenty fourth, moving into the twenty fifth, twenty twelve,
and I'm just in a really bad way. I'm in
a lot of pain and like abdominal pain, cramping, high fevers.

(51:18):
Paul helps me pull my mat out into the field
where I'm in a sleep and there are nine guys
on the ground that night, and I was always sleeping
with machine guns pointed at my head, like surrounding my mat,
and then there would always be someone like sleeping next
to me, guarding me or whatever. And I remember that
night in particular, there were two stars that would come

(51:38):
out at the same time every night. I know this
sounds like I'm making it up, but I'm really not.
And they're big and bright and beautiful, and I would
I named one for my mom, And so I would
talk to my mom every night and tell her there
was usually not much going on, not much to report,
but I remember saying to her, like I need you
to go and tell God that he needs to do
something or else. I out here. I just I don't

(52:00):
want this to be the So I fall asleep. I
wake up a couple hours later because I'm sick, and
I like get up, and I'm saying toilet toilet, because
that's how I asked permission to leave the mat. And
they all nine of them are passed out. They're like
snoring like they're like passed out. And I'm like, oh,
this is weird because always at least one of them
was up at night keeping like keeping watch over the camp.

(52:23):
No one would wake up. So I picked up a
small flashlight, like a pen light, and I start flashing
it and I'm like toilet toilet, and I like crawl
my way over to the nearest bush. I do what
I need to do. I come back to my mat.
Everybody's still completely passed out. I wrap myself up in
my blanket and I can hear something like a noise

(52:44):
as if there's like maybe an animal or something walking
toward me. It's not like just sand, it's sand, and
then tufts of long grass and shrub and stuff, and
it sounds like something's sprinking the grasses and I don't
know what it is, so I cover myself back up,
and then the pirate who's sleeping on my left. I
can't see anything because it has gotten really dark now.

(53:05):
The clouds have overtaken the stars. There's no moon. But
I can tell he's terrified. I can feel it, and
he's standing up. I can tell he's holding his ak
and he's whisper screaming at all the other guys into
Malli like wake up, wake up, wake up, and they're
like rousing. All of a sudden, this just like shot
rings out and I don't know who where it came from,

(53:26):
and then the night just erupts into automatic gunfire and
it's just like and I'm like laying there on the
ground like, oh my god, oh my god, Like we're
being overtaken. I'm thinking we're being taken out by al Shabab,
because that was always the threat, or maybe another group,
and we're going to be re kidnapped because that can happen.

(53:47):
Just like laying there on the ground, and I put
blanket over and I'm trying to get as low as
I can to the ground, and I feel like if
I could just disappear. I'm just praying to disappear and
sink into the ground. And they're all these shots being fired.
I can cease barks, and these guys are dropping to
the ground. They're making the most horrific sounds. They're dying
all around me. And then I'm just like, oh my God,

(54:08):
Oh my God, over and over again, Oh God, Oh God.
And then somebody grabs my ankles and my shoulders and
tries to pull the blanket away from my face, and
I'm trying to protect myself. I have my hands in
front of me, and I'm just like just trying to
shield myself because I don't know what. I don't know
what they're gonna do to me. And then all of
a sudden, I hear the sound of a young American

(54:28):
man's voice and he knows my name, and he says, Jessica,
you're see and shock just overtakes me immediately, and I
just I start shaking and trembling and I can't stop shaking.

(54:49):
And all I can say over and over again is
you're American. We say it, You're American, like I don't
understand where she come from. You're American. And they pulled
the blanket away from me and help me sit up.
And the soldier the closest to me, gets down on
my level and he says, we've been watching you for
a really long time. We know how sick you. And

(55:10):
he's got medicine, he's got antibiotics, and he's got a
bottle of water and he gives that to me, and
I'm just like, I don't like. I just again like
I have my I can't process, I can't think straight.

Speaker 3 (55:25):
It's the reverse side. Yeah, like when you got taken.
Now you're on the other side, and You're like, is
that real? Is this happening exactly?

Speaker 2 (55:32):
Is this another? Is this a dream? Maybe maybe I've died.
Maybe all these things are going through my mind right,
And then now I can start to make out. There
are all these soldiers around me. They've got these masks on,
and one of them says, we've been watching well, and
he says, do you know where your shoes are? And
I'm like, no, I have no idea where shoes are,

(55:55):
and so he's okay, well, we've got to get you
out of here. We've got to take you to a
place of safety. And I'm like okay, and so he's
here's what we're gonna do. I'm gonna pick you up,
and I'm gonna put you over my shoulder and I'm
gonna carry you to the edge of the camp. And
I'm like, okay, And so that's exactly what he does,
and I just will never forget. He's running across the desert.
My head is like bobbing up and down like against
his back, and I'm thinking, I am a school teacher

(56:17):
from Yo. How can this be my life?

Speaker 3 (56:19):
You're like, at this point is this real? Am I
in a movie? Did this just get completely made up?

Speaker 2 (56:25):
What is this? And so he puts me on the ground.
My first question is where's Paul. Did he make it out?
Is he okay? And he's there, He's sitting on the
edge of the camp and he leans over and he says, Jessica,
do you know these guys are And I'm like, I
have no idea what is going on? And he's like,
this is Seal Team six. These are the guys that
got us Godden wow. And I'm like, I'm what what?

(56:53):
And then it would just unfold from there. It's just
been the most life say, life giving and life changing
experience of my life in so many ways, but what tremendous,
tremendous community and individuals they are from. At one point,
they weren't sure the premises were safe, and so they

(57:14):
had Paul and I laid down and several of them
laid down on top of us to guard us, and
then the rest of them formed a human shield. And
of course I didn't understand this at the time, but
not only did they like jump out of a plane
from twenty five thousand feet up in the air, hike
in three miles and then take out all of these

(57:38):
guys for someone they don't know, and then we wait
for the heroes to come in and it's a medical helicopter,
so we start receiving medical treatment right away. And then
they put us on a plane in Gaukyo that's going
to take us to Djibouti, which is like, I don't
expect people to know where this is, but it's another

(57:59):
African country up right above the Horn of Africa, and
there's a big American military base there, and so we're
going to receive treatment there. And on the way there,
the lights are up. We're on this plane and all
these guys they're like celebrating their hooping and holler, and
they're like, are you hungry? Do you want to snick
our bar? We got chips and salsad. I can't make
words come out of my mouth. I just remember I'm
wearing this like smolly dress. It's completely ripped down the back.

(58:24):
I'm filthy. I have no wonderwear on. Like my hair,
I've been combing it with fork. I got a fork
like I am a shell of the woman that I
once was. And I feel so embarrassed by my appearance
and also so grateful. And I'm panicking because I'm thinking,

(58:44):
oh my goodness, I've lost all my social skills. Maybe
I'm a total freak be able to talk to people
again because I've spent so much time in the desert
and solitary confinement. I'm like freaking out. And one of
them comes over to me very quietly, and he gets
down on my level and he puts something in my
life app and I look down and I see that
it's an American full that they brought on. The bitch.

(59:08):
He just says, welcome.

Speaker 3 (59:09):
Okay, I'm gonna start crying. Yeah, I'm just imagining the.

Speaker 2 (59:15):
Experience every time I tell it, and I've probably told
it a thousand times, and I'm just like, I don't
know that I was like especially patriotic. I mean grateful
to be an American for sure, but in that moment,
I was just like, this is what to belong to

(59:36):
a country who will leave nothing, but they'd on leave
people behind in that regard, and I just tears just
ran down my face and then the words they came out,
then they could come out, and it was just thank you.

Speaker 3 (59:52):
All that gratitude and just say days of gratitude. We're
probably pouring back.

Speaker 2 (59:57):
I think there's nothing more you can say, but thank you.

Speaker 3 (01:00:02):
Your story is so special, Jessica.

Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
And I know it was never part of your plan
and it was never something that you'd like to repeat
ever again. No, but for you to be able to
be the one to be the vessel to continue to
share the story, to share all these bits and pieces
and moments, because there's so much more, and I wish
I could have you here to share it all, but
I think you'd actually need a week to really.

Speaker 3 (01:00:26):
Recover if we truly dove all the way in.

Speaker 2 (01:00:29):
But your story is so important and I'm so glad
that you took the time to be here, and I
do want you to shout your book out again and
your social media because people can continue to follow your story.
So if people are interested in learning more about the
actual event Impossible Odds, the kidnapping of Jessica Buchanan and
her dramatic rescue by Seal Team six, And then I

(01:00:49):
have a lot of anthologies and Desert's Mountaintops, and then
the latest book is How to Survive Survival. I died
for turning life's hardest moments into meaningful contribution for the world.
And I do hang out on Instagram way too much,
Jessica C. Buchanan, So I'd love it if people reach
out and connect with me. I love hearing people's stories,
helping them tell their stories and just connecting well.

Speaker 1 (01:01:12):
And the way we always in this podcast and there
is no one better to ask. But I like to
end it on something inspirational, motivational, or just something maybe
we didn't get too that's heavy on your heart that
you want to share and I just give the platform
over to you.

Speaker 2 (01:01:25):
So I have a good friend. His name is Martin,
and he has an incredible story of his own, and
so I feel like it's important that people understand that
I didn't say this, but he said it to me
during a conversation, and it's changed my life. He said,
things don't happen, they don't always happen for a reason,
but that doesn't mean we can't derive purpose from it.

(01:01:47):
And so I just feel like that so perfectly encapsulates
my situation, right like my story, I didn't spend a
whole lot of time in the aftermath thinking about asking
why did this happen to me? I asked why to
have to change everything? But I write about that and
how to survive survival. But I really do believe, I
really really do believe that the key to healing from

(01:02:11):
the hard stuff that happens to us in life is
to connect with some sort of purpose outside of ourself.
And so if anybody's listening to this and they're in
a place where they're like wondering now what, I really
hope that something in my story connects and you feel
inspired to think about the fact that perhaps things changed
because they had to, and that there is there really

(01:02:32):
can be a purpose for it all.

Speaker 1 (01:02:34):
Jessica, thank you so much from the bottom of my heart,
because again, I know that that could have been really
hard to just repeat all the stories, all the moments,
all the emotions, the really reliving that experience, and I
know that it will change some lives and will continue
to do so.

Speaker 2 (01:02:51):
So thank you, Thank you for the opportunity with my
honor and privilege.

Speaker 1 (01:02:56):
Jessica is such an incredible storyteller and beyond brave for
willing to share her story in order to help others
in so many ways. A reminder that you can watch
every single interview of the podcast on YouTube at web
Girl Morgan. You can follow the podcast instagram for extra
content at Take this Personally. As always, I'm so happy
that you're here. Thanks for showing up and supporting. Let
me know if there are any guests you hope make

(01:03:17):
it onto the podcast this year, because I will be
checking the dms for that and any other questions, comments,
concerns hit me up there too, So by for now,
my friends,