256. April 2025 (Vinnie Stigma / Agnostic Front)

Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_05 (00:00):
185milesouth.com

SPEAKER_04 (00:05):
Smash that Patreon

SPEAKER_05 (00:27):
button.
185 miles south.
a hardcore punk rock podcast.

SPEAKER_03 (00:41):
Introducing first, fighting out of the hard corner,
fueled by cheesesteaks and theRocky soundtrack, don't come to
him asking for salvation.
From Philadelphia, Pennsylvania,it's Heaven, the King of the
Windmill, Hair.
And his opponent, fighting outof the core corner, from parts

(01:03):
unknown, weight unknown, reasonhe didn't pick minor threat in
the straight edge Super 7,unknown.
It is the reigning, defending,undisputed, 185 miles south
trivia champion of the world,Daniel, these questions are too
easy, Sant!

SPEAKER_05 (01:29):
All right.
And the first question goes toKevin Hare.
Fire.
Fire.
Point to Kevin.

SPEAKER_02 (01:48):
The Earth isn't that old.
Jesus told me so.

SPEAKER_05 (01:53):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
When he was riding a dinosaur6,000 years ago.
Okay, Dan, this is pertinentbecause we just recorded an
episode, so you should know thisanswer.
The Saints hail from whatAustralian city?

SPEAKER_02 (02:06):
Oh my God.
I mean, everything in me issaying Melbourne, but...
Now I'm second guessing myself.
I'm going to say Melbourne.

SPEAKER_05 (02:20):
We go to Kevin for the potential steal.
Kevin, the Saints hail from whatAustralian city?

SPEAKER_01 (02:27):
Let's say Sydney.

SPEAKER_05 (02:29):
No points this round.
The Saints hail from Brisbane.

SPEAKER_02 (02:33):
Brisbane, of

SPEAKER_01 (02:34):
course.
That would have been the thirdguess.

SPEAKER_05 (02:38):
Yep.
Shout out, Australia.
We love married at first sight.
Okay, let's go back to Kevin forhis second question.
Kevin, which came first?
Sandra Day O'Connor is appointedthe first female to serve on the
U.S.
Supreme Court or Dischargereleases their first single,
Realities of War.

SPEAKER_01 (02:55):
Let's say Sandra Day O'Connor becomes elected to the
Supreme Court.

SPEAKER_05 (03:03):
Appointed.

SPEAKER_01 (03:05):
Appointed.
That's what I meant.

SPEAKER_05 (03:07):
We go to Dan for the potential steal.
Dan, which came first?
Sandra Day O'Connor is appointedfirst female to serve on the US
Supreme Court or Dischargereleases their first single,
Realities of War.

SPEAKER_02 (03:21):
Well, it's interesting because part of the
vetting process of Sandra DayO'Connor was seeing if she knew
all the words to Discharge'sRealities of War 7-inch.
And she did.
So she got appointed.
So Discharge, Realities of Warcame first.

SPEAKER_05 (03:40):
I thought that she had to name the first three
7-inches in order, but I couldhave been wrong.
All right.
Multiple choice, Dan.
What was the catalog number onthe 1981 compilation strength
through oi was it a boy one wasit b boot one was it c skin one

(04:00):
or was it d stargazy pie one

SPEAKER_02 (04:04):
well you know what's funny about this there's in a
different label there is thingscataloged by oi but this one is
skin

SPEAKER_05 (04:16):
point to dan yep you know what the other one is it's
no future is oi Yep.
Okay, we go to Kevin for hisround number three.
Kevin, true or false?
In 1992, Unforgiven wins theOscar for Best Picture.
Also, Bastard releases their LP,Wind of Pain.

SPEAKER_01 (04:36):
Oh, I want to say the Bastard LP is earlier than
that, but now I'm secondguessing.
I want to say it's 1990.
You know what?
I'm going to say that's true.
I think it's 1992.
Final answer.
Point to

SPEAKER_05 (04:49):
Kev.

SPEAKER_02 (04:50):
Yeah, I knew Unforgiven.
I didn't know Bastard.
Shameful.

SPEAKER_05 (04:57):
All right.
Well, Dan, now it is your timeto shine.
We are doing a before and after.
So example, band who did BrightSide and band on Safe Inside
from St.
Louis, Missouri would be KillingTime and Pressure.
Got it?

SPEAKER_02 (05:12):
Yep.

SPEAKER_05 (05:13):
All right.
The B-side of the Sex PistolsAnarchy in the UK 7-inch and a
shitty cover band on FatRecords.

SPEAKER_02 (05:24):
Well, I know that I'm trying to work out what
your...
Fucking hell.
It's...
Oh, I got it.
I got it.
I got it.
I got it.
I want to be me first in thegimme gimme's.

SPEAKER_05 (05:37):
He's the champ for a reason, people.
God damn.
What the fuck?
Much respect.
Dan, you won already.
How about that?
Okay, let's go back here to Kevfor his...
That's

SPEAKER_02 (05:54):
a good song, by the way.
I want to be me.

SPEAKER_05 (05:57):
It is.
We go to Kev for his numberfour.
Kev, before joining Madball,Hoya played in this band with
future 25 to Life member Beto.
Demise.
Point to Kev.
We go to Dan for his numberfour.
Dan, the pre J church band thatput out the album perversion is

(06:19):
their destiny on vinylcommunications in 1987.
And also what I become when Iwitness badge.
Well, actually someone.

SPEAKER_02 (06:32):
A band called Cringer.
A

SPEAKER_05 (06:39):
point to the champ.

SPEAKER_02 (06:40):
You could have also said what Battlecap's alter ego
is before He-Man has the power.

SPEAKER_05 (06:48):
That's true.
That is true.
You could have gotten that.
Okay, we go to Kev for his roundnumber five.
Kev, this is multiple choice.
What is the first song on theGizem LP Detestation?
Is it A, Endless blockades forthe pussy footer.
Is it B, endless blockades ofthe pussy footer?

(07:09):
Is it C, endless blockades of apussy footer?
Or is it D, endless blockadesfrom a pussy footer?
I

SPEAKER_01 (07:18):
believe that it is B, endless blockades of the
pussy footer.
We go to

SPEAKER_05 (07:29):
Dan for the potential steal.
Dan, what is the first gizm songon the LP Detestation?
Is it A, Endless Blockades forthe Pussyfooter?
Is it B, Endless Blockades ofthe Pussyfooter?
Is it C, Endless Blockades of aPussyfooter?
Or is it D, Endless Blockadesfrom a Pussyfooter?

SPEAKER_02 (07:52):
Okay.
Well, it definitely has the inthe title, like the pussy
footer.
So I'm going a endless blockadefor the pussy footer.

SPEAKER_05 (08:02):
A point to Dan.

UNKNOWN (08:05):
Fuck.

SPEAKER_05 (08:06):
And we go back.
See, it's hard to be.

SPEAKER_01 (08:09):
I was feeling good.
I felt good about that one.

SPEAKER_05 (08:12):
Dude, I have the answer key right here.
And if you asked me, I wouldn'tknow.
Dan, this squirrely Chicago areaband put out a seven
Billingsgate.
Shout out Squirrel.
That is right.

(08:32):
All right, all right.
Kev, round number six.
Lip cream.
A point to Kev.
Dan, any chance you would havestolen that one?

SPEAKER_02 (08:48):
I would have guessed either that or...
Yeah, I think that or Gestunk.
Those were the two guesses thatI would have gone with.

SPEAKER_05 (08:58):
Yep, good guesses.
Okay, Dan, your final question.
In 1990, Nemesis Recordsreleased the Iceman Cometh
compilation that was recordedMay 17th, 1989 at what Hollywood
club?

SPEAKER_02 (09:13):
Okay, I'm pretty sure I'm going to guess one in
particular, but I don't want tobe wrong because I own this
record.
So

SPEAKER_05 (09:26):
Dan's going to keep chatting it up while he runs

SPEAKER_02 (09:28):
over to his seven-inch box?
Well, I can't take the mic withme, unfortunately.
But I'm going to guess thewhiskey.

SPEAKER_05 (09:38):
A point to the champ.
All right.

SPEAKER_01 (09:41):
You sounded pretty distant.
When you answer that one.

SPEAKER_02 (09:44):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (09:46):
Only

SPEAKER_02 (09:46):
because of the bleed.

SPEAKER_05 (09:48):
I know.
We're going to need you to weartap dancing shoes next time on
the pod,

SPEAKER_02 (09:53):
Dan.
Okay, no problem.
I have some bejeweled ones readyfor the OMDB reunion.

SPEAKER_05 (10:00):
All right.
It's time.

SPEAKER_08 (10:06):
What?
What?

UNKNOWN (10:12):
What?

SPEAKER_08 (10:13):
All

SPEAKER_05 (10:17):
right, Dan, you get to call it.
Do you want heads or tails?

SPEAKER_02 (10:22):
Tails for Peter Swales.

SPEAKER_05 (10:26):
It is tails.
Do you want sample A or sampleB?

SPEAKER_02 (10:31):
I will go second, please.
Sample B.

SPEAKER_05 (10:34):
So, yeah, we're looking at Dan has seven points
and Kevin has four points.
So, Kev, Dan's going second.
How many would you like towager?

SPEAKER_01 (10:43):
We're risking it all.

SPEAKER_05 (10:45):
Kev is risking all four.
And Dan, how many would you liketo wager?

SPEAKER_02 (10:50):
All seven.

SPEAKER_05 (10:52):
Oh, my God.
I don't have a fucking timebreaker.
Okay.
All right.
Here we go.
Kev, this one's for you.
Here we go.
One more time.

UNKNOWN (11:07):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (11:13):
One more.
As many times as you need,buddy.
Here we

SPEAKER_01 (11:21):
go.
Let's see.
I'm not going to unhear what I'mhearing, even though I don't
think that it's right.
So let's go 10 seconds tomidnight.

SPEAKER_05 (11:31):
Oh, not terrible.
It does kind of sound like that.
Jesus.
He says, no sense of commitment.
Everyone come up front and singalong.

SPEAKER_02 (11:47):
No sense of commitment.
He does say that.

SPEAKER_05 (11:48):
I thought it was just their response to a

SPEAKER_01 (11:50):
cold as life.

SPEAKER_05 (11:51):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
For sure.
Dan, here we go.
This one is yours.
No sense of commitment.

SPEAKER_02 (12:01):
Can I have it five times in a row, please?

SPEAKER_05 (12:04):
Here we go.

SPEAKER_02 (12:30):
Ugh.
I think he says somethinglike...
Something like...
Can I hear it one more time?
Of course.
I think he says like...
You understand what I said, youfucking...
Meh.
I don't know what that lastword...

(12:52):
You fucking...
I don't know.
Like, what's a 25 to life styleword?
You fucking mook or something.

SPEAKER_05 (13:00):
I don't know.
Dude, this was the one you couldhave got, Dan.

SPEAKER_01 (13:04):
I

SPEAKER_05 (13:04):
think I might have it.
Can I try?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, you can.
You don't have what it takes,you fucking fake.
Yes, one word off, and we wouldhave given it to you, I think.
You ain't...
You haven't got what it takes,sir, because you're a fucking
fake.
He says, you ain't got what ittakes, you fucking fake.
Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (13:23):
Wow.
If I had been one word off, Iwould have been bound to the
nether region.

SPEAKER_05 (13:32):
If you would have gotten one, it was pretty close.
I mean, ain't, don't got,whatever.

SPEAKER_01 (13:36):
Now that I listen to it, I hear the ain't, but I
think I just...
It was like, I think don't, Ijust kind of put it in there.

SPEAKER_05 (13:44):
All right, guys.
The tiebreaker is going to besongs off negative approach,
total recall that are not live.
Dan, we go to you first.
Tied down.
That's one.
Kev, to you.
Dead stop.
Dan, back to you.

SPEAKER_02 (14:01):
Ready to fight.

SPEAKER_05 (14:03):
Kev, back to you.
Pressure.
Dan, back to you.

SPEAKER_02 (14:08):
Negative approach.

SPEAKER_05 (14:10):
Kev, back to you.

SPEAKER_02 (14:11):
Nothing.

SPEAKER_05 (14:12):
Dan, back to you.

SPEAKER_02 (14:13):
Why didn't I say that?
It's my favorite.
Dead Stop.
Already been said.
Oh,

SPEAKER_07 (14:19):
no! Oh, yes, let's go.
An epic defeat.
New blood.

SPEAKER_05 (14:25):
This is Nick Bockwinkle knocking Vern Gagne
off the throne.
Oh,

SPEAKER_01 (14:33):
fuck.
What a comeback for me.
I think I did pretty good inthe...
Yeah,

SPEAKER_05 (14:39):
yeah, yeah.
You lured Dan into betting itall when he didn't have to.
This is a good win.
But Dan, don't despair becausenext trivia, you will be
undefeated again.
It's still so aggressive, sofast, so beefy

SPEAKER_02 (14:57):
and brilliant.

SPEAKER_05 (15:00):
What's up, everyone?
We are back and talkinghardcore.
Helping out.
You know him.
You love him.
It is the best dressed man onthe pod.
It is Daniel Sant.
What's up, dude?

SPEAKER_02 (15:09):
God save the queen.
She ain't no human being.

SPEAKER_05 (15:12):
Also helping out live from the Liberty Bell.
It is the king of the windmill.
It is Kevin Hare.
What's up, dude?
What up?
What up, what up?
All right.
Overweighted body played lastweekend.
Dan, I went to the Shea.
Kev flew out.
He did the windmill move.
It was sick.
I'm lucky I'm six feet tall.
I could see everything from theback, dude.
And it looked pretty ill.
How do you feel?

SPEAKER_02 (15:31):
No, we got you up front singing along.
Like, don't tell the listenersthat you're jaded.
You're going to be up front.
You were up front singing along.
It was great.
Unity was happening everywhere.

SPEAKER_05 (15:43):
That's right.

SPEAKER_04 (15:56):
I am the ghost of the over my dead body reunion
hat straps.

SPEAKER_05 (16:07):
Okay, everyone, I want to dive right into newer
stuff.
Let's get into it.
Got a bunch of things to justtouch real quick here.
Can't remember if we mentionedit last time or not, but the
band The Hell put out a newself-titled 7-inch on Sorry
State.
It's really good.
Their 12-inch, I believe twoyears ago, was really good, and
we didn't talk it on the pod,and we didn't get around to

(16:28):
talking the 7-inch yet, so...
We'll be right back.

(16:50):
Putika Pomi.
File under Kev Hair Music so Idon't listen to it.
They're a young band out ofFinland.
They put out a 7-inch calledTahuto Televasus.
Just go to the Sorry Statewebsite and you can check it
out.
It was their record of the weeklike three weeks ago.
So sorry about thepronunciation, but it rules.

(17:10):
Kev, you ordered it.
You like it, right?

SPEAKER_01 (17:12):
Yeah, it's really fucking awesome.
I guess it came out at the endof last year, but the 7-inch
only came out this year and theymade it– sorry, they made a zine
because they liked it so much.
But it just kind of right downthe middle, a Scandinavian
hardcore like Mach 47,Antisomics, stuff like that.
And it's fucking– it's reallygood.
It does not– I guess they're allteenagers and it does not sound

(17:35):
like– I guess it does sound likea band like Teenagers because
it's like Mob 47, but also it'sreal honed and just like really
perfected.
So it's awesome.
Yeah,

SPEAKER_02 (17:44):
it's like– Can we just get Staffan to go
absolutely nuts over Kev'spronunciation of Antisium, eh?

SPEAKER_05 (17:53):
Yeah, yeah.
Our Fight, they put out two newsongs.
That is Joseph from Tsunami'sRoots Hardcore Band, so shout
out.
Naysayer put out a new EP calledRage Dreams.
We just wanted to do anotherquick shout out for the Combust
LP, Belly of the Beast.
It came out on Triple B.
Writing LPs is super hard, somuch respect.
A band called Spam Collar putout a new LP called Bad Connect

(18:15):
It's a pretty interestinglisten.
If you like straightforwardhardcore, but you want it to go
a little outside the lines, youshould check that out.
Haywire and No Guard did a split12-inch.
It is out digitally.
The vinyl is up for pre-order,and it'll come out at some
point.
It is a split release betweenlike a million different labels,
so check that out.
Necron 9 out of Milwaukee putout an LP called People Die on

(18:39):
Unlawful Assembly.
I saw them a couple weeks ago.
They were great.
A band called Worst Intentionsout of New Jersey put out an LP
called put out their demo tape.
All three songs rule.
If they got a decent recording,they could be a serious
contender.
This band is good.
All three songs are really,really good.
The band No Way Out out of LosAngeles and San Diego.

(19:01):
We should just say out ofSouthern California.
They put out a new single calledRolling Stone.
It is a killer track.
A band called Fight Back put outtheir demo 2025 on Rebirth
Records.
Check that out.
Leatherman out of Australia putout a new LP called Turn You On.
If you like power pop, checkthat out.
We talked to their 7-inch band.

(19:21):
Probably about a year, year anda half ago here on the pod.
A band called Lot In Life putout their demo called I'm Going
To Do Whatever I Want For TheRest Of My Life.
That's dudes from In Time andPseudo Youth.
A band called Axan put out theirself-titled 7-inch.
I enjoyed that a lot.
A band called Petty Theft putout their demo 25.
And then also...

(19:42):
These are coming out after werecord, so I don't have all the
details.
But Fool's Game will have putout their LP on Triple B by the
time this podcast airs, as wellas a band called Wits End put
out a new demo on RebirthRecords.
So check that all out.
But we're going to dive into afew things that we enjoyed a lot
and wanted to go a little deeperinto.

(20:20):
First up, the band Dynamite putout their second 7-inch called
Settle the Score.
It came out on Scheme Records inthe United States, and it came
out on Northern Unrest in theUK.
Dan, it's British, so let's goto you first.
What do you think?

SPEAKER_02 (20:36):
Well, I was expecting Rule Britannia to get
played before this segment.

SPEAKER_05 (20:40):
Well, it did play before.
I just edited it in.

SPEAKER_02 (20:44):
Ah, okay.
Well, I was already standing upand saluting.
I love this.
I love this style of hardcore.
This is right up my alley.
And this band does it really,really well.
It is that kind of locking outinfluenced, but also influenced

(21:06):
by straight up like Outburst andstuff like that.
And it's fantastic.
There's groove.
The riffs are sick.
The song Hardcore Pride isfantastic.
I think is fantastic.
It has like three phases to thesong, and I love each phase.

(21:26):
It's over two minutes long, soZach may have not made it
through to the end, but I hopehe did because the last third of
the song is really great.
And then that riff that opensSee Through You, the second
track, is that opening moshriff, is so good i love it so

(21:51):
much um the dynamite jam alsosuper groovy like it's just
where they really come intotheir own is when they do the
drop out like one guitar goingand then the rest of the band
comes in the drums are recordedso well on this um the way that

(22:11):
they build and layer these likekind of groovy mosh parts are
just so good and there's reallylike great little tricks and
things that like on HardcorePride where it kind of breaks
and then the singer's like comeon but it's not like all up
front it's like fading away alittle bit echoey and it just

(22:34):
sounds so good the songLoudmouth right in the middle is
a little blaster song whichbreaks up those kind of like bit
more drawn out like groovymoshes so I don't know I really
dug it I'm super psyched Kevpicked up the 7 inch the united
blood version for me in richmondand uh i can't wait till i get

(22:59):
it in my hands

SPEAKER_05 (23:00):
yeah i i ordered this record so i just any of
this roots hardcore stuff likeyou know i'm on board just take
my money and i do like this onemore than the the first one
mostly because like the firstone there was like a guest vocal
on every song and that just likeit pulls me out of it so this
was like easier for me to settleinto.
And they do play this stylereally well.

(23:21):
And like Dan said, there aresome nice tricks tucked in here,
like on Hardcore Pride, tuckingin the scissor beat at that end
section to cut up the mosh was areally good idea.
And then that last song, TheCan't Be Denied, with the fast
part with the speed picking isreally good.
The only thing I'd really liketo see from this band that would
make them even better would belike just trying to lean into

(23:42):
some big choruses because likethey write like a really good
roots, hardcore song, which ishard to do.
You know, it's, it's very easyto play this style and be shitty
and boring.
And that's not dynamite.
Dynamite has like the, the basisfor like really great songs.
And I think what would catapultthem for being a really good
band of this style to a greatband of the style would just be,

(24:04):
you know, taking some risks andtrying to have some big
choruses.
I think that, A lot of bands shyaway from that because they're
worried about being corny orputting themselves out there and
having people not sing along tothem or whatever.
Just thinking that they're maybedoing something a little too
cookie cutter.
But that is going to besomething that makes the song
stand out and be memorable.

(24:25):
So that's all I got.
But I did enjoy this a lot and Iordered it, like I said.
Kev, what do you think?

SPEAKER_01 (24:31):
Yeah, so I agree with you.
I like this one more than theirlast record.
Not that...
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(25:00):
another band call a song that Iwas like, Oh, that's interesting
to, you know, it's kind of bigshoes to fill.
And I think that they did, theydo a good job of that.
Um, at United blood, that songgot a really good reaction and
the record had been out for onlya few days at that point.
So I felt that was cool.
I think that the second song,uh, it starts with a cool little
super touched kind of mid tempogroovy riff, but it's not

(25:23):
exactly the same way that a bandlike, um, combust would do, uh,
a riff like that, like a NewYork hardcore riff.
So I thought I liked kind of thecontrast there.
And then I also like the thirdsong loud mouth.
I hear a lot of a band like stepforward in that too.
So I think that it's kind ofcool to combine both the New
York stuff and then the Bostonhardcore stuff, which was kind

(25:44):
of like a interpretation of someof that New York stuff too.
So I also think that thesinger's got a real distinct
voice too, which makes themstand out a lot among the other
bands.
And yes, that was a code wordfrom, for just sit.
you can tell that he's British.
And I think that's cool.
And yeah, I've seen them twicenow.
They came over a few months agoand played around Philadelphia.

(26:04):
And then at United Blood,they're really good.
And they cover shrapnel, which Ithink is really cool that they
cover a local band that they putrespect on.
And then both times they coveredNot For Me by Floor Punch as
well.
But at UB, they went right intoShotzi, which is the song that
follows it right on the LP.
And I've never seen, I don'tthink I've ever seen a band do
that.
But when they did it, it soundedabsolutely perfect.

(26:27):
So it was awesome.

SPEAKER_02 (26:30):
Cool band.
To touch on what you were sayingabout the big choruses, I think
that is a really good pointbecause think of a band like No
Warning.
They went for that on Ill Bloodand the success.
It's made some of the all-timersongs of that kind of style.

(26:50):
So I think pushing them towardsthat is a really good thing.
a really good critical point.

SPEAKER_05 (26:57):
All right, let's go on and talk a band called
Tramadol out of West Yorkshire.
They put out their self-titledEP.
It's on the Donor RecordsBandcamp.
That's the label that put outthat excellent Hellscape 7-inch
from last year.
But there are no notes on aphysical copy of this coming
out, so it might just be adigital EP.
But I thought it was prettyripping.

(27:18):
What do you think about this,Kev?

SPEAKER_01 (27:20):
Yeah, I thought that this was cool.
It reminded me a lot of a bandlike Rackage, I don't know if
they're from the same area ornot.
Dan can let me know about that.
But the production was a littlebit muddy, but not in a way
that's distracting.
There are a lot of cool leadsand stuff on it as well.
The singer sounded a lot...
The first thing I could rememberwas this band called Pure

(27:40):
Disgust, who was from DC like adecade or so ago.
And the singer reminded me a lotof him.
So this was one that I kind of,I liked.
I'm going to have to kind ofspend more time with it to see
if it kind of stands out to me.
Because right now it's just kindof like, this is cool and I like
it, but I haven't gone back toit that much, even though I have
listened to it a few times forthis.
But yeah, I mean, we've, Talkedalready.

(28:02):
There's been a few other recordslike this that we've liked a lot
this year.
It's kind of in the same realmas the Nisimono record that we
liked a lot last month.
So this is another cool, justfast blazing release.

SPEAKER_05 (28:15):
I think that I've been just looking for something
to scratch that Public Acid itchsince their LP came out last
year.
And this is similar in a certainway where I'd say the Public
Acid leans a little morerelentless with the speed.
This one...
they work the tempos a bit more,but like sound wise, they're not

(28:35):
too far off.
You know, it's a rock punk band.
It's a pretty good recording.
Sounds savage, but you can kindof hear everything.
Everything cuts through a littlebit.
The vocals are a little buried,but I think that's just like
something that we have to acceptof this genre.
Like, you know, super aggressivebands that are for some reason,
very shy when it comes to mixingthe vocals.
Like it is what it is.

(28:57):
But yeah, for like a, a DB band,I think that this is like, it's
very creative in certain ways.
And like the plane is verytight.
Like if you look at like thedrum break on crucifixion, like
they're like, they're tucking inthings that are like beyond, you
know, simple hardcore songwriting.
And there's a little bit of liketriumphantness and like some of

(29:19):
the little guitar licks thatlike, they might be pulling in a
little bit of like Japaneseburning spirits influence, which
I think is a nice mashup forlike rock punk.
Cause like, What I don't want isany sort of octave.
I can't handle any sort ofmelodic D-beat these days.
But doing a little bit of thatguitar work is a nice way to

(29:41):
snazzy up your song.
So I really enjoyed this.
All four songs I thought bangedall the way through.
And I do hope that there's afinal release at some point.
Dan, do you like this sincethey're British?

SPEAKER_02 (29:51):
I like this because it rules.
They're from, what's it say,West Yorkshire?
So maybe like...
Haliflax or Leeds or something,probably where they're from.
I don't know.
But Tramadol is kind of likeOxycontin over here.
It's like, that's what Tramadolis.

(30:12):
Just FYI to people out there.
I like it a lot.
Now, you both touched on exactlykind of what it sounds like.
I had a little bit of a problemwith it as the EP progresses.
I feel like they up the...
noise level of like the gatednoise that goes into the songs

(30:33):
so like calculated slaughter andlucid dream are way noisier than
the the first two and i don'tknow if it's just a recording of
like the crash symbols are justbeing smashed so much more and
it's just completely like noisegated out on on that or not but

(30:53):
either way it is a really noisydirty dirty db band that does it
so well and it is like beforeyou know it the record's over
and and all four songs are akiller but i do think when i was
because i was listening to it onheadphones like for the last few
days and i feel like as the epprogresses i don't know you tell

(31:17):
me if i'm if i'm tripping orwhatever but by the end i feel
like it is so much noisier thanit was at the beginning

SPEAKER_05 (31:25):
You're just getting old,

SPEAKER_02 (31:26):
dog.
Well, there's no lie there.

SPEAKER_05 (31:30):
All right, let's go on to the next one.
Total Con out of Essex.
They put out an EP called WhoNeeds the Peace Corpse?
It came out as a split releasebetween Static Shock and
Unlawful Assembly.
Nine songs in 12 minutes.
Dude, this is a blazer.
Kev, is this an EP or a mini LP?

(31:53):
I think it might be a flexi.
yeah yeah yeah uh what do youthink about this one

SPEAKER_01 (31:57):
yeah this record is awesome so if i see something
from either static shock orunlawful assembly like i know
that i might there's a chancei'm not gonna like everything
but everything they put out isworth checking out so i'd never
heard this band before the seveninch came out and i i just
checked it out and this rips umIt's similar.

(32:17):
The thing that it kind ofreminded me the most is that
Speed Plans LP last year or Iguess two years ago where it's
like it's really fast.
The production is– it's veryrough, but it doesn't take away
from everything.
It kind of adds to it.
The rough– Production kind ofcomplements everything and you
can kind of hear everythingstill.

(32:38):
And it kind of just makes itfeel a little bit more intense
and crazy.
And that's what I really likeabout this.
It just kind of blazes theentire time.
And that's why I was reallydrawn to it.
So it's one of those recordswhere...
Other than really the enemy, theenemy is my friend chant in the
middle.
Not much of it necessarilystands out to me as I'm

(32:59):
listening to it.
It's just mostly you just kindof put it on for however long it
is, eight minutes or whatever itis, and you just kind of just
blast it and kind of just ragethrough.
And then it's over and you'relike, yeah, I want to put this
on again.
So it's just another.
I think that this year so farhas been kind of proven.
We've talked about there's a lotof hardcore demos coming out,

(33:20):
but also I think we're startingto get to the point where
there's going to be a decentamount of good seven inches that
are coming out and good, youknow, faster, just not quite
LPs, but things that are likeright underneath of just, you
know, it's kind of the samething that's been building for a
few years of all the, we talkedabout the regular hardcore, like
I said, and now just kind of thefast blazing punk bands have

(33:41):
been bubbling for a while too.
So yeah, really good record.
I just got mine in the mailtoday.
So I spun it once, but I'm goingto definitely Yeah, I

SPEAKER_05 (33:50):
bought it at that Necron 9 show like they had it
because the dude from that band,he does Unlawful Assembly, I
believe.
Yeah, I like it a lot, dude.
They call out on the littlewrite-up for it that White Cross
is the comp that they think theysound like, and that is a pretty
good call-out.
It's just that fast-blazing,first-wave USHC stuff that's

(34:15):
like, know right under like thetop level stuff right it's not
minor threat negative approachuh or you know the abused and
stuff it's like it's along thelines of like the rejecters or
rosemary's babies or hatedprinciples like that stuff and
and kev called out speed plansit's like right in line with
that like if you like speedplans especially the lp like

(34:37):
it's just it's pummeling likethat but The same way that
Tramadol tucks tricks in to makethem stand out from your average
D-beat band, this band doeslittle things that are really
good and make all these songs sothey're not so samey.
Working between the closedhi-hat and the open hi-hat and

(34:58):
the cymbals on Never Understandis a good trick to cut up a
song.
My favorite song is RepugnantSlime.
It rules when he starts singingreally fast at the end.
Generally, A record like this,it does feel too samey to me,
but this one didn't.
I think they do it prettyspectacularly.
The one thing I'd say is this issome Jason Newstead shit on the

(35:20):
bass.
It's hard to hear.
And I think that if they justgave it a little bit more bottom
end and had it be a little moreballsy, it would sound just a
little more powerful.
But I think that this band isobviously very intentional for
the sound they're going for.
But I do think a little morebass wouldn't hurt.
But overall, I love this thing.
Like I said, I bought it.
I enjoyed it a lot.
What do you think, Dan?

SPEAKER_02 (35:40):
Yeah, I think it is really good.
I think, like you said, thatearly USHC is nailed on.
It's done so well.
But what they do really well intheir own right is there's these
little rocking guitar parts thatjust leap from the songs a
little bit just to give it itsown personality.

(36:01):
Yeah.
I love that the enemy of myenemy is my friend.
Like almost, almost like a, eventhough it's the rest of the
music doesn't sound like it'salmost like a crass part or
something, you know, right inthe middle of it, this chant,
like it, I don't know.
It's really great.
And then who would have everthought I would enjoy a cover of

(36:24):
the doors.
And I really did writers on thestorm ends this.
And it is a, the door song andit is done like crazy that you
might not even know it is a doorsong like it's just absolutely
The way they do it is fuckingkiller.
It's like super, super good.

(36:45):
I really liked this.
And it is just the right amountof lo-fi.
Like the recording ismarshmallowing on the stick
where it could go slightly justto the, oh God, I wish there was
a bit more production here, butit's actually quite perf at most
parts.
And I think it's a really greatthing.
Also, what an amazing name for aband, Total Con.

(37:09):
I love it.

SPEAKER_05 (37:10):
All right.

(37:30):
We are continuing Dan's journeythrough the Poison Idea catalog.
This time around, we are goingto get into their LP Poison.
Blank, Blackout, Vacant.
It came out in 1992 on aplethora of labels, but TKO did
a repress recently, which isvery nice.
Dan, what do you think aboutthis one?

SPEAKER_02 (37:51):
Well, I only like one song, and it's Amy's theme.
JK.
No, this thing is so great.
I love this song.
era that they're in to thisbecause it's almost like this
blazing brutal hardcore bandthat can go really dark is now

(38:15):
circling back and channeling 77punk but through their filter
and that's how these songs arekind of so like rocking but in a
very punk manner and thatThere's a couple of songs on
here that are just so fuckinggood.

(38:36):
I mean, actually, you couldcount on two hands how many
songs are on here that are so,so good.
But a few of my favorites thatreally stood out to me, the way
it starts with that song, SayGoodbye, the way the guitar has
that melodic lead to it, andjust the song is so good.

(38:59):
Jerry A's voice is...
so good on this record Star ofBaghdad follows that up and I
love that song so much too andthen the next two are excellent
too Smack Attack especially nowafter Smack Attack you get to a
song that I think is fucking notgood it is which is funny

(39:27):
because who am I going to saythat they sound like on this
song is Buster Poindexter, youknow, like David Johansson's,
like, it just sounds like almostvaudevillian version of it and
it's called forever and always.
And, you know, it, I just reallydidn't like that song,

SPEAKER_05 (39:49):
but it's a, it's a bad ZZ top song.

SPEAKER_02 (39:51):
Yeah.
It's, it's really like, it'sjust, Yeah, like you say, it is
a straight up MTV in 1984, inbetween two good videos, that
kind of song.
But then Punish Me is good, butthen Crippled Angel.
Holy fucking shit, what a greatsong.

(40:14):
That song and then the middlepart with the keyboard, it
just...
enhances that song and the waythat transitions from part A to
part B of the song with thatmiddle bridge is just so fucking
good.
What Happened to Sunday, Iabsolutely loved.
And then, you know, Your Next isso...

(40:37):
fucking pissed and so hard andsuch a great song and then you
know i'll i'll skip to the end iwon't go on for every single
song but i love their take ondoing a new york doll song and
doing it like with full homagelike we're channeling the dolls

(40:57):
on this and doing vietnamesebaby so good which is funny
because you know i don't likewhen they're doing the schmaltzy
version on Forever and Always.
But when they're doing it on theactual cover, it sounds amazing.

SPEAKER_05 (41:12):
What do you think, Kev?

SPEAKER_01 (41:13):
So I've always been a little conflicted about this
record.
I think that this is where I'mtrying to pick my words here.
It's like the all-time, all-timePoison Idea run is kind of over
after Feel the Darkness, wherealmost every record is great.
This is still very good, but tome, it's not quite that level.

(41:34):
It's kind of taking the midtempo parts of Feel the Darkness
and doing a full record off ofit.
And it's still really good, butit's not quite as charming, I
think, because maybe it's notquite as theatrical.
But still, it is really good.
I don't mean to slander it oranything because I do think it's
a great record.
It's just kind of like a B-plusand a catalog that's got a lot

(41:57):
of A's.
So...
But still, I think the mostinteresting thing, Dan, that I,
that when you were discussing itis that I do think that punish
me is like a top five poisonidea song top 10 at minimum.
I think that it's easily thebest song on this record and
it's one of the best songsthey've ever done.
It's got a really catchy guitarpart to start that kind of just

(42:20):
keeps building.
They kind of nail the tempo herewhere it's not completely
blazing, but it's also not slow.
It's not as slow as some of theother songs.
And, um, It's got a great soloin the middle.
It kind of makes you want to tapyour feet, but also just like
really go crazy.
And I think that it just reallyhits on all things Poison Idea

(42:41):
is good at, especially like late80s, early 90s Poison Idea.
So yeah, overall, it's a greatrecord.
It's not as good as the otherrecords to me, but it's still
Poison Idea and it's still themkind of in their final form,
which is still...
One of the greatest bands of alltime.

SPEAKER_05 (42:59):
Yeah, I'm conflicted on this as well.
My Poison Idea journey ends withFeel the Darkness, although I've
had this on cassette foreverbecause it's like one of those
tapes that Tang put out.
And so I think I got it for liketwo bucks at some point and
probably listened to it once.
But I did listen to thisprobably, I don't know, three or
four times before this.
It's interesting because usuallyI like a record that's like all

(43:22):
fast and then has two mid-tempobangers.
And so this is like– Theopposite of that, it's like all
mid-tempo with two fast songs,you know?
And the fast songs aren'tspectacular.
Smack Attack is not that great.
It kind of gets hung up on thatSmack Attack hook on the verses,
when really I just want to hearJerry A rage.

(43:43):
And then on the other fast song,What Happened to Sunday...
he doesn't even really sing thatfast.
So it's like, I don't know whatI listen to these songs.
It's like, it's really good mentype of songs.
I think say goodbye is a greatsong.
I think punish me is a greatsong that has maybe pig
champions, best guitar solo.
Um, I think crippled angel is a,a really good song, but I want

(44:05):
them to come after like fastsongs, you know, it's kind of
like, they sound so good, youknow, like they still sound like
they are in that prime of, uh, afield of darkness, but like,
they're just not delivering thesong.
that I want.
It's kind of like you go to seea band and they don't play the
songs you want to hear.
You know what I mean?
It's like they still sound good.
It's still them.

(44:26):
They're not washed up oranything.
This sounds good.
They're still raging away.
It's still very punk.
I want it to break loose and gofast.
That's what I like Poison Ideafor.
I don't know.
I think objectively it's a verygood album, especially if you
like mid-tempo punk.
But like, but yeah, but it's a,it's a disappointing poison idea

(44:49):
record because like they don'tever just like let it rip.
And, and I don't, I don't knowif it's like a, a part of the
times where like, you know, it's92.
So like all the Seattle stuffand like the alt rock is like
going and maybe like fast musicis just totally out of vogue.

(45:09):
Maybe it's natural and that's acoincidence.
Like, I don't know, but I don'tthink I'll go back to this
record very often.
But yeah, I mean, I think it isstill a notable record.

SPEAKER_02 (45:18):
Well, this is an introduction, you know,
introducing me to everything aswe go along.
And this is, you know, I'veparticularly stayed away from
this.
And for me to experience arecord with really rocking
mid-tempo bangers, like as themajority of it, you know, I
loved it.

SPEAKER_05 (45:54):
All right, Dan went to get a beverage, and me and
Kev are going to do the secondside of the opening round of the
Japanese Hardcore Tournament.
Dude, overall thoughts on thisside of the bracket?

SPEAKER_01 (46:10):
I like this side, but I think the winner will
probably come from the otherside.
This one, I don't want to saythat it was hard to get through
or anything, but there was kindof less that really stood out to
me as like, top-level great,even though there's definitely
some classic stuff on this side.

SPEAKER_05 (46:26):
Yeah, I think that the other side had more
surprises for me when it came tobands taking big-time risks and
it paying off sometimesbig-time.
This side, I think that Some ofthe best stuff is the more
straightforward.
So we'll get into it.
Let's kick it off.
The first matchup here is Gasout of Hiroshima with their

(46:51):
7-inch No More Hiroshima, theirflexi 7-inch that is.
It came out in 1982.
This was their first EP.
They put out two more plus asplit 12-inch after this, and
they broke up in 1986.
Yeah, this is five songs in sixminutes, and I just think that
the recording sounds great.
They got a killer fuzzy guitartone, but with the bass and

(47:14):
drums punching through.
Singer has a good voice.
The songs are simple, butexecuted well.
I mean, this is 1982.
This is very early, primitive,hardcore, and it sounds that
way, and I love that shit.
It's mostly simple in the waythat the riffs are three or four
chord progressions.

(47:34):
The third song is a mid-tempobanger, and the fourth and fifth
songs are total ragers.
Also, that fourth song has asuper sick fast left-hand riff,
so very cool.
The final song is fast andcrazy.
The singer sounds like he'slosing his mind, and then it
just ends out of nowhere, whichis pretty wild.
This is straightforward in thepocket, but it is still very...

(47:55):
Crazy in parts.
And this Flexi goes for over athousand bucks.
So I hope you enjoy listening toMP3s.
Yeah.
And then Alto, the other one,they do six songs in 11 minutes.
And this one starts strong.
Like that intro, you know,especially on the other side of
the bracket.
So many of the bands had likevery...

(48:17):
like vibey intros like they tooka lot of time to like set the
vibe with their intro and thisone kind of does that too like
it starts very strong the tomsand the guitar like surging in
and out and then like it goesinto a ripping first track but
this is a band that like theykind of get cited a lot I've
seen this name forever and I'vealways read like positive

(48:40):
reviews of it it is verystraightforward like generic
hardcore And I don't say thatdisparagingly.
I like generic hardcore, butit's just very straightforward.
No risks you come to expect inJapanese hardcore.
And the singer does the cup inthe mic bit, which is a thing

(49:01):
that a lot of people do overtime.
So it's very ripping, but it'salso generic and juvenile.
It's kind of like...
you know, if DRI and AdrenalineOD are your favorite bands, or
if you were obsessed with likethe circa 2000, 625 records,
like this is probably yourfavorite shit.
But part of me thinks that like,if this wasn't a Japanese band,

(49:21):
like they'd kind of just be likea random band on a mystic comp.
I really didn't like this thatmuch if I'm being totally
honest.
And yeah, That frog song isfucking terrible.
You know, just a dude garglingfor two minutes, you know, over
a like down home jamboree track.
So this one's easy for me, Kev.
I'm going gas.
What do you think?

SPEAKER_01 (49:38):
So I like both of these on the gas record.
The vocals are kind of snotty,which I thought was cool.
The guitars, it was really kindof like UK 82 style kind of.
repetitive type of driving riff,which I also liked.
You called out the fourth song.
I like that song too.
It's a little bit more melodicand had some guitar leads and

(49:59):
stuff.
But Alto, I think I like this alot more than you.
You called out kind of whatthings that it reminds you of,
but the thing that it reminds memost of is Clevo Hardcore.
I think you can hear this a lotin a band like Inmates and that
type of lane, H100s, all thattype of stuff.
I mean, it's pretty obvious thatthose guys were listening to a

(50:22):
lot of Japanese hardcore whenthey were writing songs.
And I think you can hear Altoquite a bit in that.
I like the vocals.
I think they sound really crazy.
They sound kind of doubled.
Maybe that's a couple of themicrophones that you were
talking about, but they soundjust really crazy and all over
the place, which I liked.

(50:43):
I think the guitars, they'rejust kind of a wall of noise
buzzsaw guitars, but you cankind of still hear them.
I mean, there's going to be somelater on where it just sounds
like static, but this is justkind of real fast and raging.
I do think that the Frog song isterrible, and It's weird that
it's in the middle of therecord.
I don't think it should havebeen on the record anyway.

(51:04):
But if you're going to put iton, just put it on last.
Putting it where somebody wouldhypothetically be forced to
listen to it, I don't think is agreat decision.
But then they come back afterthat with a song called I Like
Cola.
And I mean, come on.
The chorus is just I Like Cola.
That's punk and hardcore rightthere.
Come on.

SPEAKER_08 (51:24):
Come on is right.
Come on is right.

SPEAKER_01 (51:27):
But yeah, so I'm going Alto, many question,
poison answer.

SPEAKER_05 (51:32):
Yeah.
And I didn't set this up right.
So this is the Alto 7-inch, manyquestion, poison answer.
This is their first EP.
They put out four EPs between 84and 88.
And the singer of this band isthe younger brother of Cherry,
who sang for Zhao.
For this, it was a choicebetween...
This 7-inch and the Half-WitLife 7-inch.

(51:53):
And so, I don't know.
Maybe I would have liked theHalf-Wit Life one more.
But, dude, when it comes to badtranslations or whatever, many
question, poison answer is oneof my favorites.
So, we are split on this.
So, we have to go to ourtiebreaker.
I got to give Dan from WretchedRight and Down to the Wire a
call and see what he says.

(52:15):
Yo.
What up?
Gas, no more Hiroshima?
Auto, many questions, poisonanswer.

SPEAKER_06 (52:23):
Auto, many

SPEAKER_05 (52:24):
questions, poison answer.
All right, Kev, you win again.
Auto is moving on to the nextround.
Sorry, Gas, you were muchbetter.
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (52:36):
Is it a good thing that I'm with the consensus?
I don't know if that's good orbad.

SPEAKER_05 (52:42):
Maybe.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know.
It's like, should there be aconsensus with Japanese
hardcore?
There's so much risk taking andrule breaking.
I don't know if there really isa consensus.
Okay, let's go on to the nextmatchup.
The Sexual out of Kochi City.
Their flexi, The Last Days from1985.
This is their second flexi.
The first came out in 1984.

(53:03):
They are going up against...
Betosha, their flexi calledHiromi's Party Part One from
1984.
And guys, I did a disclaimer onthe last one, but I just want to
say it again.
If we get anything wrong or ifwe mispronounce anything, this
whole thing is done out of love.
So we apologize in advance.
Please send corrections to185milesouth at gmail.com and I

(53:27):
will post the corrections on thesub stack if we have any.
Okay.
The Sexual is a very classicband.
I'm going to get into it, but Iwant to say I had never heard of
Bitosha before, the band out ofSendai, and they were such a
pleasant surprise to me.
I feel like I got a lot of thoseon the first side of the
bracket, and this was mypleasant surprise of this side.

(53:48):
Three songs in six minutes.
This thing just sounds great.
It's full-on rocker shit.
And that first song going backand forth between the mid-tempo
and the tom-banging sections,and then having it break fast on
the solo, which is a totallyexceptional solo, is just so
cool.

(54:09):
And then that sleazer riffcoming out of the solo, so sick,
dude.
The second song being aninstrumental, perfect up-tempo,
mid-tempo song with full-onshredding.
And then just fades out ofnowhere.
It's like, what the fuck isgoing on here?
It's so cool.
Again, it's just real rockershit, which I don't know if

(54:29):
we've gotten yet in this firstwave.
Maybe the Masturbation recordthat we didn't end up doing
because we found stuff that wasmore hardcore, but that record
kind of rocks.
But then the third song here,very Motorhead-y and cool.
I love this 7-inch dude.
So this has a female singer andit's members of...
Disarray and Rebel.

(54:51):
And this band only did this oneflexi.
And after this band, somemembers joined other members of
GZ, who you might remember fromthe great punk hits comp to form
a band called Bradbury, which isa band that I'm sure sounds
cooler in Japanese.
So there's that.
This was a pleasant surprise.
I really liked it, but it wasgoing up against the sexual

(55:12):
issues.
And this is one of the bestseven issues, I think, in the
tournament.
Six songs in 15 minutes.
So is it a flexi?
Is it a mini LP?
I don't know.
But it rips for sure.
Very good intro, like the ringouts over the slow tom work.
And then yelling anarchy anddestruction into it going fast.

(55:34):
It's like...
The classic hardcore formula,dude.
The singer is so good.
Sounds a lot like the dude fromCrucifix to me.
And the first four songs are allragers that have great, catchy
choruses.
This has the big choruses, whichis something that I love.
And then the kind of draggersong on here, it's the fifth

(55:55):
song.
I wish it was the last song, butit's cool.
It's kind of weird, slow,mid-tempo, a little anarcho, but
it's very hypnotic in a way.
So I do enjoy it.
And then that last song mighthave my favorite riff on the
whole record.
It's very Motorhead-y.
But this is very strange, dude.
I don't know if the microphonethat was micing the snare or

(56:16):
something got bumped in thestudio.
But for whatever reason, thesnare doesn't cut through very
loud on the last track.
So you don't really get thatthundering fast beat, which
would make this song the bestsong on here.
It kind of sounds almost likeavant-garde because you just
hear the hi-hat and not thesnare.
I don't know.
This record, Rules, is one of myfavorites of the whole
tournament, and so I would goThe Sexual in this matchup.

(56:40):

SPEAKER_01 (56:41):
Yeah, I thought Petosha was pretty cool.
It was a little more mid-tempo,but to be honest, not that much
of it really stood out to me.
I mean, that was one that Ihadn't really heard before or
heard of.
The Sexual, though, I don'tthink I've listened to this one
before either.
So...
This one is awesome.
It was really fast, reallyraging, really unhinged solos.

(57:02):
The vocals, like you said, arejust really crazy and echoey.
And sometimes I hate echoeyvocals, but sometimes they kind
of add to the vibe.
And I think they do here.
On the third song where it kindof starts with like an oi intro
and then goes right into likeraging.
It was a funny misdirection thatyou don't really...
Think about with this type ofJapanese hardcore or anything.

(57:23):
And Scatter the Hatred is just ahard name for a song.
So I think you can really hear aband like Warhead or something
kind of coming from bands likethis like a decade later or
whenever it was.
So like it's not necessarily acompletely straight line, but at
the same time, this is kind ofmore of– what in the direction

(57:45):
that people kind of considerJapanese hardcore later on, like
the giant net of it, this iskind of what people think of and
it doesn't really get too muchbetter than this.
So yeah, I'm going to go withthe sexual.

SPEAKER_05 (57:59):
I think part of that is that this is 1985 too, right?
So like we're looking at somerecords that are starting at 81.
This is four years later.
So like they have a lot ofmaterial to go off of and like,
Also, iron sharpens iron, right?
If you're putting out yourrecord in 85 and not 82, it
better be better.
You know what I'm saying?
Otherwise, I'd just ratherlisten to the records from 82.

(58:20):
Okay, we are unanimous on thatone.
So that means the sexual moveson to the next round.
Okay, the next matchup is IkaShinju out of Okazaki Aichi.
Their dead section flexi, itcame out in 1985.
It is going up against Last Bombout of Tokyo.

(58:40):
Their 7-inch firing, that cameout in 1985.
Quick setup before I shoot itover to Kevin.
The Ika Shinju...
Guys, I'm butchering that.
My bad.
That translates to familysuicide, so that's a hard-ass
name.
And then Last Bomb, that has anex-ghoul bassist in the band.

(59:01):
Kev, what do you think aboutthis matchup, and who are you
taking?

SPEAKER_01 (59:03):
So first, Last Bomb.
I was kind of, I was prettysurprised by this one because it
sounds a lot different than anyof the other stuff that we've
listened to for this.
This is more straightforward.
It kind of sounds, reminds me alot of like the SoCal bands from
the era, like, you know, AgentOrange, Adolescence and stuff.
It had that way, it had thatlike dark vibe.

(59:24):
moody or guitar sound that thosebands are kind of known for and
I thought that was veryinteresting to hear that
influence or if it's notinfluenced by that a band just
kind of gravitating to that,especially again, it's a bit
different than what we've beenlistening to here.
So that stood out to me, but Ithought that Ika Shinju was a

(59:45):
band that I, another one that Ihadn't heard of before this.
And this one I was prettyimpressed with and I was pretty
surprised by.
It's kind of got that UK 82influence too.
I think that it is reallyinteresting to hear what,
influences you can hear in a lotof these bands.
And I think you can tell thatthey were getting the UK records

(01:00:07):
way more than they were gettingthe US records, which makes
sense because obviously theywere on bigger labels and were
distributed.
I mean, all the bands in the USwere getting those same records.
So that makes sense.
But I just think that it's kindof interesting here.
So other than that, I don't havetoo much to point out for it,
other than it's just kind ofraging and pretty cool.
But this is one that I'm likethis one quite a bit

SPEAKER_05 (01:00:32):
i like this matchup i think that both bands are very
different last bomb is a longerrecord five songs 15 minutes um
so kev would you say that's amini lp

SPEAKER_01 (01:00:43):
yeah i'd say maybe it would fit better on like an

SPEAKER_05 (01:00:45):
eight inch there you go but this has a really good
recording what is interestingabout it is the singer has like
a very normal yelling voicewhich is almost tuneful and like
that is kind of a rarity in thistournament like All these bands
have had very aggressive vocals.
So for a dude to go kind ofnormal voice, semi-tuneful, it's

(01:01:09):
pretty strange.
And there is a little bit ofcrossover creeping in on this
record.
But I do like, Kev, that youcalled out that you think that
there's some SoCal in this.
Because there is.
And I think that a lot of thatis the melody in here.
That solo on the first song,Decadence, is so good.
But...
This kind of drags in themiddle, like that third and

(01:01:30):
fourth song drag a lot and arevery long.
And so I don't know, it's likethe first and last songs rule,
but like you got that, thatmiddle section was just kind of
drags a bit.
And like, I don't know, thistournament is like, it's hooking
me on all this crazy shit.
And then like when there'ssomething that's not crazy at
all, like it's hard to win.

(01:01:51):
And the Ika Shinjuu, I enjoyed.
It has a pretty lo-fi recording,but you hear everything.
The songs are very simplestructure-wise, but the playing
is excellent.
The drumming is super killer,especially on the third track.
And then the guitarist's lefthand shines on the first track.

(01:02:12):
Very aggressive riffing.
The last song is killer, and ithas a good chorus.
And that little guitar lickunderneath the dead you is so
sick.
Yeah, this one...
It was an interesting matchup,but it wasn't close for me.
I'm going the Ika Shinju aswell.
So that moves on to the nextround.
Okay.
Let's go on.

(01:02:33):
This matchup is going to be LipCream out of Tokyo.
Their 7-inch Knight Rider MoreThan Fight came out in 1984.
They are going up against Rebelout of Sendai City.
They're self-titled Flexi from1983.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:52):
So Lip Cream obviously is one of the seminal
Japanese bands of all time.
I think they get better afterthis, obviously with Nine Chalks
Terror, which I think isprobably their seminal record,
which is real fast and crazysounding.
So this one is a bit more rougharound the edges.
I mean, it's really early forthem, obviously.

(01:03:14):
Rebel, I found to be moreunhinged than Lip Cream.
I thought they were prettysimilar, but...
Rebel sounded a bit crazier.
So I was really going back andforth on this one about which I
was going to pick because theykind of are giving me the same.
But if something is crazier, I'mprobably going to go for that.

(01:03:36):
But then the last time Ilistened to it, the last song on
the Rebel record, which isreally long and kind of, you
know, when bands there wouldkind of just do the really
droning intro, outro song orsomething, that kind of just
took me out of it last time.
So I think that I'm going to gowith Lip Cream again, even
though, like I said, this onewas pretty much a toss up for me

(01:03:58):
and I came really close tochoosing the Rebel record.

SPEAKER_05 (01:04:02):
Yeah, I think that the Rebel record really suffers
from like the second and fourthsong dragging, which is
unfortunate because that firstsong and the third song are so
good.
This is a band, they have acouple of members that also did
that Bitosha band, just as aside note.

(01:04:22):
But dude, this is going to soundcrazy, but listen to that first
song again.
It sounds like 1980 Bad Brains.
Obviously, there's no HR, butthe song, it has that Bad Brains
swing.
Where it's like, I'm listeningto a hardcore punk song, but I'm

(01:04:42):
also kind of shaking my hips.
What is going on here?
It's very good.
Obviously, if the singer doesn'tsound like HR at all, he's a
pretty crazy singer as well.
But obviously, no one's touchingHR.
But those first and third songsare so good in that early, bad
brains way.

(01:05:02):
And I think you should check itout, thinking about that and See
if you agree with me or not.
This is 1983.
So, I mean, the Bad Brains arethe best band in the world.
So, I'm sure people are chasingthem.
On to the lip cream.
There was a little bit ofcontroversy.
A couple people got at me andsaid I should have taken the
first 7-inch over this.

(01:05:23):
I do like this one more, andthat's why it's in the
tournament.
Although, A, this is allsubjective, right?
What we like matters.
That's subjective.
This might be my favorite lipcream thing there is.
Kind of in the way that PoisonID, I think there's peaks and
valleys, but that whole firstrun is very strong.

(01:05:43):
The lip cream stuff sort ofbounces back and forth too.
The first one I like, the secondone I love, and then that first
LP I like, but then the secondone I really like.
So that's interesting in a way.
But this 7-inch dude...
It's so good.
The band needs no introduction.
They're a legendary Japanesehardcore band.
This is their second 7-inch.
They do two classic 7-inches in1984.

(01:06:05):
Then they do LPs in 86 and 87.
And they do some LPs after thatas well.
But that's the classic run.
Five songs in 10 minutes here.
And this recording justsounds...
So good, dude.
Like the drums are thunderingand they punch through like this
wall of noise they set upbetween like the guitars and the
bass.

(01:06:25):
And it's weird in the way thatlike the guitars sound super
panned out or like roomy almost.
And then you have this bass tonethat's like charging right down
the middle.
And the mix of the two of themis just absolutely perfect,
dude.
I do think the 7-inch suffers alittle bit from the first song
being like really whatever.
Like when the punks go marchingin, like, come on, dude.

(01:06:48):
What the fuck?
And Abrasive Wheels had theirrecord called that too, like
right around this time.
Maybe a year or two earlier.
So two bands with a bad ideathere.
But once you get past that firstsong, oh my god.
Knight Rider more than Fight.
Like...
When it hits that shit, that isa fist pump ass chorus.

(01:07:08):
Like that chorus is so good,dude.
And then Yellow Beauty comingafter that super sick left hand
riffing, great fills from thedrummer and a totally raging
solo.
And then into the VX2 song.
All-timer, mid-tempo banger,dude.
And then to cap the record witha good choice, it's a good
sleazy rocker, slightly tuneful.

(01:07:29):
But, dude, that three-song run,Knight Rider, More Than Fight,
Yellow Beauty, and the VX-2 orwhatever, oh, my God.
It's just back-to-back-to-back,like classics.
Some of the best hardcore thereis, in my opinion.
This one's a no-brainer for me.
I'm going lip cream.
So they move on, and...
Let's go to the next matchup,State Children.

(01:07:51):
It was hard to find info on thisband.
I believe they may be out ofShimoseki, but I could be wrong.
This is their bomb shelter formoney-making flexi that came out
in 1985.
Again, very hard to find info onthis band.
Discogs didn't even have a listof the band member names, so

(01:08:12):
hard to track down that way.
They are going up against Kuroout of So this State Children

SPEAKER_01 (01:08:29):
record is probably the craziest sounding one that
we've listened to for thisentire tournament.
It's crazy.
The bass is up so loud that itjust punches through everything.
It's crazy.
And then the guitar is sostaticky that I had to listen to
figure out if it was the hi-hatsor the guitar.
I couldn't figure it out.

(01:08:52):
Literally, I'm like, wow, thehi-hat is really going crazy.
And then I turned it up.
I'm like, that's not the hi-hat.
That's the guitar.
So I kind of back it because ofjust how– like this doesn't
sound like anything else reallylike the way the bass just
punches through that's reallythe only way to describe it it's

(01:09:12):
kind of it's marching on justbreaking through and then the
guitars are so low but sostaticky it's just really crazy
where Kuro is kind of morestraightforward punk hardcore
stuff from this era like Ihonestly don't really have too
many notes about it other thanit's just pretty good it's when

(01:09:34):
you So I kind of was goingthinking back and forth, like,
should I pick state childrenjust because it sounds insane?
but I don't think that I can,I'm going to go Corot, but the
state children thing just isreally like, unlike anything

(01:09:55):
else that I've ever heard.

SPEAKER_05 (01:09:57):
Yeah.
It had to go on here.
Like I'm, I'm not like a noiseaficionado.
So like, I don't know if likeyou're a true noise head.
If you listen to this and you'relike, Oh my God, this is the
Holy grail.
Or if you listen to this andyou're like, Oh, this is some
bullshit, you know, zero clue.
But to me, like, God damn, thisis some harsh ass noise.

(01:10:18):
Like, you know, in doing thislike tournament, like you listen
to all the bands and like youcome away thinking like, okay,
like Confuse and Good On arelike noisy.
But like this is like literally10 levels up from that.
And it's wild too because theirpunk music is very like simple.

(01:10:38):
It's like you're listening tothe Urinals or like a very
simple Killed by Death band.
But there's a static televisionsample mixed in over the top of
it.
And there's a crazy dude yellingtoo.
It doesn't sound like normalmusic at all.
So I would have to say it's notfor me.
People that have listened tothis podcast for 200 plus

(01:10:59):
episodes know my taste.
But I would say this is a truepiece of really harsh, weirdo
music.
And so if you're into that...
God damn, this might be yourHoly grail.
It went up against the Kuroseven inch and or eight inch
that is.
So this is their second EP.
I enjoy it more than the firstone.

(01:11:20):
And I might like their 1986 onefire the most, but we're doing
81 to 85 here.
I think this thing is great.
Seven songs in 11 minutes, itkicks in and like, it doesn't
sound necessarily likedischarge, but it has like that
droniness and thatrepetitiveness in it that like,
prime discharge has, you know?

(01:11:41):
And another thing that I likeabout this is like the recording
is like so bottom heavy, whichlike works good for the style.
It like adds that meat to thesound, which you want when you
have like that repetitiveriffing.
And then it's funny.
Cause like, you know, I say thatabout, Oh, it doesn't
necessarily sound likedischarge, but then the second
song kicks and it's like, okay,now we just sound like
discharge, which is cool.

(01:12:03):
I mean, like it does sound likea slowed down discharge in a
way.
And it's absolutely great.
And then song three, it justlike breaks loose and goes into
great straight up, fast,hardcore.
It's an insane vocalist.
It's like everything you want inlike, Japanese hardcore when you
want it kind of over the plate,but you still want them to get a
little crazy.
That song Selfish Cow might bemy favorite.

(01:12:24):
It's a full-on ripper.
This one's a no-brainer for me.
I'm going the Kuro as well.
So they move on to the nextround.
Okay, now the next matchup here,we have a heavy favorite to go
at least to the finals.
The Execute out of Tokyo, their7-inch Hardcore Temptation from
1983.
This is a legendary band, ofcourse.

(01:12:47):
They put out four EPs in the1983 to 1985 range, so it was
very hard to choose which one totake here.
They are going up against LSD,also out of Tokyo.
They're Destroy Flexi from 1984.
This is their first 7-inch.
They put out another one in 1986with a new lineup.

(01:13:08):
Kev, what do you think aboutthis matchup and who are you
taking?

SPEAKER_01 (01:13:11):
Yeah, this is a pretty heavy-hitting first-round
matchup because both of theseare kind of big time cited bands
and records.
So it's, it's interesting to seeit in the first round.
The execute obviously is classicand I really like it here.
You know, the, the flexi two is,is kind of a classic one, which
I have seen in the wild.

(01:13:31):
It was in Japan and it was$2,000, but I did see it.
I did see it.
I, somebody I knew or I ran intoand they there and they in the
store coincidentally across theworld.
And they were just like, yo,there's an execute flexi over
there.
So I went over and looked at himlike, my God, there it is.
Um, but the, uh, the LSD record,I really like a lot.

(01:13:55):
I think that it sounds, they,they really hit the balance of
where things are soundingchaotic and, um, You don't
really know what's going tohappen, but you still hear
everything and everything soundsclear, even though it sounds
really distorted.
And that's a tricky bounce,right?
We just talked about otherthings on here that don't quite

(01:14:17):
have that.
So the execute kind of hits allof the notes of what you want
for this.
I mean, it's a classic record.
It's really kind of hard for meto...
boil it down more than that.
They're a classic band and it'sJapanese hardcore to the T, but
so is LSD.
And honestly, that's what I'mgoing to pick.

(01:14:38):
I'm going to pick the LSD recordon here.
It's one that I've liked beforewe did this.
It's one that I've beengravitated to and it's what I'm
going to go with now.

SPEAKER_05 (01:14:47):
That's wild in my opinion, but I respect it.
I think on this side of thebracket, you have a lot more of
the good, straightforward, fasthardcore.
But It's hard to go againstsomeone like The Execute when
they're like, this record is sogood.
I mean, the first one is classicas well.
But this is the one that I likethe most.

(01:15:07):
The record sounds amazing.
That first song, Final Attack,that riff on it is so good.
And the chorus is great.
And it has that amazing solo.
It might be the best solo on theside of the bracket.
And then it flows justseamlessly into the mid-tempo
banger, Blackwater.
And that's like...
probably neck and neck with lipcreams, the VX2 for the best MTB

(01:15:29):
in the whole tournament.
So I don't know.
The songwriting here is justlike, it's on such a high level
and it's so early, dude.
It's 1983, you know, like anexample that would be like them
hitting like that bass breakafter the first chorus on a will
border.
Like the songwriting is just sohigh level here and the

(01:15:51):
recording sounds great.
It's just like every littlepiece of this is so good.
And yeah, I mean like, fuck, ifit gets out of the first round,
it is a contender to win thewhole thing.
So we'll see the LSD.
I enjoy a lot as well.
Five songs in five minutesstarts with a drum and guitar
doing like kind of a gallop andthen it kicks in.

(01:16:12):
And when it kicks in, it's, It'spretty psychotic because it's
like a bouncy ass tempo withlike manic reverb type vocals.
And then like it goes into likea 17 second ripper.
Like they're just going for it.
And Kill You is probably myfavorite song on here.
The last song is like an 18second instrumental, which is

(01:16:33):
insane.
Like to think of that, you know,like we're used to in USHC,
like, you know, bands doing anintro or something, but like we
would never think about doinglike a 17 second instrumental
fast song.
So it's super sick if you'reinto like.
That really fast early 80shardcore, like the Neos or like
Hated Youth.
I think you'd like this a lotand it would be up your alley,

(01:16:55):
but I can't go against theExecute.
I am going the Execute HardcoreTemptation, which means we are
going to a tiebreaker.
Let's give Dan a call.

SPEAKER_06 (01:17:06):
Yo.

SPEAKER_05 (01:17:07):
The Execute Hardcore Temptation or LSD Destroy.
The

SPEAKER_06 (01:17:12):
Execute Hardcore Temptation.

SPEAKER_05 (01:17:15):
Kev, you're not winning this one.
He went with the execute, so theexecute move on.
I

SPEAKER_01 (01:17:22):
was due.
I figured it would happen onthis one.

SPEAKER_07 (01:17:24):
That's true.
You can't win them all.

SPEAKER_05 (01:17:27):
All right.
The next matchup is SystematicDeath out of Yokohama.
Their Systema Flexi 7-inch from1984 going up against Nurse out
of Tokyo.
That is Nurse 2, their 7-inchout of 1984.
Systematic Death, this is theirfirst EP, but this band had a

(01:17:49):
very long career, and they arestill around today, I believe.
And then a quick note on Nurse,they are an all-girl band.
This is their second EP.
I enjoy them both, but I likethis one more.
Yeah, this is a crazy matchup,dude, because Systematic Death
right over the plate.

SPEAKER_01 (01:18:07):
So Nurse, I, it sounded, I mean, this is going
to be very on the nose, butlike, it sounded like a Riot
Grrrl band from a few yearslater, like, you know, Bramobile
or Bikini Kill or something likethat.
Like, I have no idea if thatthis band is a reference point
for those, but like, it soundssimilar.
And of course, you know, an allgirl band.

(01:18:27):
might easily sound like that,but I just kind of, it reminded
me quite a lot, not just inbeing an all-girl band, but
like, and how the vocals arekind of delivered and the way
the vocal melodies go.
And they're kind of, they'rekind of melodic, but also kind
of yelled, not just sang.
And I think that you can hearthat a lot in the bands that

(01:18:48):
come after them.
So I don't know if this is aninfluential record or not, but
it feels like it could be.
On the other hand, SystematicDeath is just really, blazing
the whole time.
They're a band that has been onmy radar for a long time,
obviously, because they're seenas a legendary band, but also
they're a band that has comeover to the US quite a bit over

(01:19:10):
the past 20 years.
But I think becausespecifically, especially when I
was younger, because theyweren't a Burning Spirits band,
I think that I was kind of notas quick to check them out as I
probably should have.
And I had never really dove inquite as much as I should have
through the last decade or so.

(01:19:30):
But they're just blazing.
And it's probably the fastestthing that we've listened to on
here, at least the mostconsistently fast.
And it just rages and isblazing.
So that's what I...
I really like how theproduction, it just kind of, you
know, the drums are justpummeling and everything just
kind of really goes.

(01:19:51):
And so I'm going to gosystematic death here.

SPEAKER_05 (01:19:54):
Yeah, I think this band rips.
Eight songs, 10 minutes.
It's six studio tracks and twolive ones.
But this recording is reallygood.
You can hear everything.
It's just good, raging, fast,hardcore punk.
Like, executed very well.
And then there's some supersimple catchy choruses, which is
what I want to hear.
That's like what makes songsstand out.

(01:20:15):
And you don't just have like amorass of like fast core
bullshit.
So like systematic death andsync you, those are both great
choruses moving on to nurse.
This is a longer record forsongs in 11 minutes.
It has a good recording and ithas a great bass tone.
So that's that.
But, uh, Kev called out thatit's definitely, you can tell,

(01:20:37):
it's like a girl singer on thisone.
Because it's a very femininevoice compared to that Betosha.
That had a female singer too,and you would have never known.
It could have been fucking GlennBenton.
But this is like, I enjoy hervoice.
And that first song, it startsvery droney, but then it kicks

(01:20:59):
into like an MTB at the end.
That's a very cool little thing.
And then I don't know if they dothemselves a disservice, but
they save the last, the lastsong is the best.
Like it's the most straighthardcore.
And then that guitar tone on thesolo is just absolutely crazy.
So this is a very cool seveninch.

(01:21:20):
I enjoy this a lot and I enjoytheir other record too.
So yeah, it is a toss.
So I'm going to go, I'm going togo nurse on this.
I just think it's a moreinteresting record, although I
enjoy the systematic death alot.
So let's go to a tiebreaker.
We're going to call Dan.
Yo.
Systematic Death Systema orNurse Nurse 2?

(01:21:42):
Systematic Death Systema.
All right, Kev, you're back inthe win column.
Dan is taking Systematic Death,so that is what will move on.
And now we are in the finalmatchup of the night.
is Tranquilizer from Hokkaido.
Their self-titled Flexi from1985 going up against Ghoul out

(01:22:04):
of Tokyo.
Their 7-inch carryout fuckingcame out in 1984.
The Tranquilizer versusSystematic Death would have been
a pretty good matchup becausethose are just two raging fast
bands that do it really well.
A little note here onTranquilizer.
The singer of this band ismarried to a pro wrestler named

(01:22:27):
Jaguar Yokota, which is prettysick.
And then Jaguar Yokota, sheactually has a couple records
out too.

SPEAKER_01 (01:22:34):
And she's like one of the legendary pro wrestlers
too, not just like a random one.
She's an all-time pro wrestler.

SPEAKER_05 (01:22:42):
Yeah, and I think that the dude– so the singer of
this band that's married to heris like a famous doctor now too.
So like they're like a celebritycouple, which is wild because
like– This Tranquilizer recordis wild.
Six songs in five minutes.
It's super fast, thrashy, noisy.
I love the song Never Go to War.
Starts with that clean channelguitar strumming and then just

(01:23:04):
goes buck on you.
This is like, again, I got toreference the Neos.
This is like Neos, but on meth.
It's a sick-ass notable record,I think.
But the Ghoul 7-inch is, again,I think one of the best records
ever.
in the tournament five songs 12minutes very cool recording

(01:23:24):
super fuzzy guitar but like thatbass cuts through nicely the
drums do sound a little bittinny but like overall it sounds
really good and the gangs on thefirst song sound great really
like the production of all thesejapanese records has been
fabulous in the way that likethey all sound different but
they all sound good you knowlike i don't know the engineers

(01:23:46):
over there must have really justbeen killing it because you have
so many bands and like nothingends up sounding very
homogenous, which is justabsolutely fabulous.
Yeah.
This is like relentless in themost aggressive, like UK 82 way.
I think like if you think aboutmaybe like one way system mixed
with chaos UK, but with crazierJapanese vocals, that's what you

(01:24:09):
get here.
It's just, it's great playinggreat recording.
And yeah, I'm going cool.
What do you think Kev?

SPEAKER_01 (01:24:17):
This Tranquilizer record is wild.
It's so short.
Every song is so short where youcan't even really process what's
going on when you're listeningto it, which I think is cool.
The guitarist is just all overthe neck of the guitar, but I
think he's hitting half of thenotes, which I think is a cool

(01:24:38):
thing here.
That's a feature, not a bug.
It's just really crazy and I'veused unhinged quite a bit, but
this is right one filing rightin there.
I think that this is anotherlike fun thing to find from this
project because again, it'sjust, this is not something I

(01:24:59):
think that people would considerclassic.
I mean, I don't know, but likejust listening to it, it's not
something that's consideredclassic, but it's different than
everything else that we'velistened to on this.
And I think that that's whatmakes it really interesting.
But you're right about theghoul.
This is just a classic Japanesehardcore record.
The production is great, likeyou said.

(01:25:20):
The vocals kind of fall off thestick a little bit, but in a
great way.
And yeah, this is just exactlythe type of stuff that you
listen to regularly.
kind of Japanese punk andhardcore for.
Like I said, I don't haveanything.
It's funny with the classicstuff.
It's kind of harder to say stuffabout it sometimes because it's

(01:25:41):
just kind of classic and great,whereas something like
Tranquilizer, which isn't asmuch, it's kind of easier to
talk about.
So I'm going to go for Ghoul onthis one pretty easily, although
the Tranquilizer record isreally a fun and interesting
listen.

SPEAKER_05 (01:25:57):
Yeah, I agree.
I mean, I had never heard ofthat before.
And so that was like a nicesurprise, like in a different
way.
Like I liked the Betosha recordso much just because they took a
lot of risks and like went weirdin a way that I hadn't heard
like other stuff on here, butlike not weird in a way I don't
like weird in a way that I dolike, you know, but like this
tranquilizer was like a nicesurprise.

(01:26:19):
And yeah, I I'm with you, dude.
Like some of the classic stuffis harder to explain.
I think just because like,there's such a, an intangible
thing here in the highest levelof these legendary Japanese
bands.
It's like the secret sauce,right?
They have the it factor, andit's hard to explain that.

(01:26:42):
But you feel it when you listento the records.
They are just ones that standout more than others.
So that does it for the firstround.
In a month or two, we will go onto the quarterfinals when this
stuff is going to really startgetting hard.
So we will see.

(01:27:22):
Both Anthony's and Carl fromKilling Time, Doug Holland,
Eddie and AJ from Leeway,Rabies, Glenn Danzig, Jerry
Olney, Doyle, Kevin Seconds,Craig Zatari, Joe from Infest,
Mike Judge, Ray and Porcel, Siv,and of course, my guest today,
the godfather of Vinny Stigma.
Vinny, are Italians the MVPs ofAmerican hardcore?

SPEAKER_00 (01:27:46):
Yeah, well, I go to church every day anyway.
You know, today's Holy Thursday.
Tomorrow's Good Friday.
No meat.
Tomorrow.

SPEAKER_08 (01:27:53):
That

SPEAKER_00 (01:27:54):
was like every Friday used to be no meat
because I'm Catholic, you know,and then they got away with that
law like or whatever.
Now it's only on Good Friday,which is I could do that, you
know.

SPEAKER_05 (01:28:07):
For real, though, that's like a good list of
Italian dudes in classicAmerican hardcore bands.
Like, what do you attribute tothat?

SPEAKER_00 (01:28:15):
You're left out by Gallo, Lou DiBella.
There's a lot of, well, in thisarea, a lot of Italian people
lived, you know?
My neighborhood, there was onlyItalian people, and then little
Italy, and then there wasChinese people.
I grew up with Chinese andItalian kids and some Puerto

(01:28:38):
Rican kids.
There was no Polish kids orIrish kids.
or black or whatever.
A couple of Jewish kids from,you know, a little, but nah, it
was only basically that.
New York was a little moresegregated then.
There was Spanish Harlem,Harlem, Hell's Kitchen, you

(01:29:00):
know, and to be honest with you,it breeds culture, you know, in
a way, you know, you go toChina, you eat Chinese food, you
do, you know, you go to LittleItaly, you get Italian food, you
know, it's kind of cool, youknow.

SPEAKER_08 (01:29:13):
Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:29:13):
Especially if it's safe.
You could go with your wife andkid, have a nice dinner, you
know?
Have a glass of wine, walkthrough the streets, go to
cafes, you know?

SPEAKER_05 (01:29:24):
Yeah.
Vinny, in your book, you talkedabout how there was a divide
between the bands that playedMax's Kansas City and CBGB.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat?

SPEAKER_00 (01:29:33):
Well, you know, like I said, a lot of guys don't want
to make the jump.
You know, you know, I mean,times change, you know.
I'm putting out a new album.
I got a new album.
As a matter of fact, I got acountry album coming out on the
12th.
It's soon called The OutlawVinny Stigma.

(01:29:53):
You know, and you'd besurprised.
You're not going to hear like aJohnny Cash cover.
OK, you know, you're going tohear like.
Like kind of Civil War songs andstuff like that.
All right.
So I got that on the radar, andI just recorded a new album for

(01:30:15):
Gnostic Front, untitled at themoment.
Even some of the songs areuntitled, but it's complete, you
know?
Whatever.
Just got to get the artwork andget it mastered.
So I'll have two albums comingout this year.
But back to what you weresaying.
Sorry about that.
About, like, the old schoolguys.
They just didn't get it.
I don't know.

(01:30:35):
They didn't make the jump.
You know, clubs were closing,you know, especially when Max's
closed.
That was the death of the oldpunk, like, glam punk and...
You know, that kind of stuff.
And it just went to the street,a lot of it, you know, because

(01:30:58):
there was nowhere to go exceptfor CBGB's then became the spot.
I mean, CB's was always thespot, but it wasn't the glam
place like Max's, you know.
It was like the street kids now,you know, because it's on the
Lower East Side, you know.
So, I mean, it's only around aquarter from my house, so I was

(01:31:19):
always there, you know.
You know, it was like a thing.
I'd be there like now talking toyou, you know, I'd be in the
phone booth in the front, theold fashioned phone booth.
I love it.
They had that phone booth inthere forever.

SPEAKER_05 (01:31:35):
Can you talk about like the birth of hardcore in
New York City?
Like and and what do you thinkwas like the first New York
hardcore band or record?

SPEAKER_00 (01:31:42):
It could have been the mob.
Oh, no.
There was the Stimulators.
There was Kraut.
Then everyone was doing EP, youknow?
So Kraut had the first albumalbum, you know?

(01:32:06):
Stimulators, I don't know ifthey have an album.
You know, I'm not a key on thesethings anymore because I gave
all my records away over 40years ago.

SPEAKER_08 (01:32:15):
Because I was an easy touch.

UNKNOWN (01:32:17):
Hey, Vinnie, let me borrow the record.
Like, yeah, okay, yeah, sure.
Two months later, hey, you gotmy record?
He said, nah, I lent it out.
You lent my record out.

SPEAKER_00 (01:32:26):
Like, I lent it to you.
Not for you to lend, you know?
I just asked a friend about twoyears ago, I gave him a Beastie
Boys record.
I said, hey, how's that be?
He says, oh, I sold it.
You sold it?
Where's my card?
What do I get out of it?
I give it to you as a gesture,you know?
Yeah.
You know, you do it, you give itback.
You don't want it.

(01:32:47):
All right.
Oh, let's get me my cut.

SPEAKER_05 (01:32:50):
That's right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
The stimulators, that was just aseven inch.
So,

SPEAKER_00 (01:32:55):
yeah, you know what I mean?
You know, the crowd wasdifferent, but when we landed
with victim in pain with thegatefold, that was it.
We changed the whole sound.
That was New York hardcore.
We had our scene going on.
We had United Blood.
There was Cause for Alarm.
They had their EP.

(01:33:16):
The Mob had their EP.
Urban Waste had their EP.
And there was a couple of otherbands that maybe cut a record or
two, like Ultraviolence.
maybe even much less than thehypocrites.

(01:33:40):
But they were from the old Youknow?
And I never forget, because Ilove the songs.
They were...
Butch Loss was a gujin.
Speaking of Italian.
He was a gujin.
He didn't get it.
He had, like, long, jerry curlhair, like Rick James.
But he thought he was a punkrocker.
And he would make songs likeSmash Strats.

(01:34:02):
Smash Strats.
I see Smash Strats.
I see Smash Strats.
Smash Strats.
It was so great.
But he had a great guitar playerin the band.
This guy, Lenny.
You know?
So...
really like to you know watchthe band you know because the
guitar player was awesome but uhthe content was stupid you know
he had another song makeupmakeup makeup oh i love it he

(01:34:27):
passed away years ago you knowhe really didn't make the jump
but he came along witheverybody.
There was Ira.
He was another one from the oldschool.
He was the cashier with CBGBswhen it was like$3, three bands.

(01:34:49):
And he'd be at the door.
That was the early, as far asrecords go, that's the way it
goes in some people.
Ira passed away too.

SPEAKER_05 (01:35:04):
Going back before Victim in Pain, though, what
does it feel like to write ariff as good as Friend or Foe?
Do you remember at all where you

SPEAKER_00 (01:35:13):
were?
Yes, I do.
I wanted to use the full...
Well, first of all, I was amusician before punk rock.
I played in bands.
I used to do biker rock, badcompanies, stuff like that.
Those kind of bands.
A couple of originals...

(01:35:34):
Steppenwolf song, you know, wewould like, you know, like hard
music, you know.
Now this is going back 73.
All right.
Then like when the 77, I wasjumping all over the place with
my band, The Eliminators.
You know, I'd fucking roll intofucking CBGB's or Max's Kansas

(01:35:56):
City with a fucking, because Ilived down here.
All the Italian kids come to seeme because I was Vinnie.
They all loved me.
And I'm from the neighborhood.
But I used to hang out inChinatown with one of my friends
that was in the band.
He hung out in Chinatown, too.
And all the Chinese gangs usedto come see my band.

(01:36:18):
And they all used to spike theirhair and wear sunglasses.
They all had the leather jacket.
They were like, who the hell isthis guy in this crowd?
You know, I brought a toughcrowd, you know?
And it was really cool.
You know, that's how I did thatjob.

SPEAKER_05 (01:36:34):
Yeah.
But as far as like writing ariff, like friend or foe, like
what's that

SPEAKER_00 (01:36:39):
like?
Oh, sorry.
Yeah.
Okay.
I want to use the full neck ofthe guitar.

SPEAKER_08 (01:36:43):
That's right.

SPEAKER_00 (01:36:45):
That's another thing.
I want to go high.
I want to go low on the neck.
I want to go high.
I want to go low.
You know, sometimes there's thatbox pattern, you know, and like
somewhat of a 12-bar blues.
And there's like somewhat of aprogressive pattern.
I want it to just go fly allover the place.
You know, there are a lot ofriffs in there that are like

(01:37:06):
fast and faster.
You know, so like today, Rogerhas his band, The Alligators,
and they're like the...
They're like the United Blood EPtype, you know, but 40 years
later and a lot much morematured, you know.

(01:37:26):
But that raw sound sometimesbecause you can't get those
amps.
You can't get those distortionboxes.
You know, you're not going toget the sound.
You know, I did that on the 16track.
Everything was 8 track.
You know, at the time, eighttrack was a big deal.
Then when we did a sick dance atThird's Den, it all started, you

(01:37:49):
know, going crazy.
But I did a 16 track on Victimin Pain.
And that was kind of, you know,because they did eight tracks
just on the drums alone.
You got the high cymbals.
Just think of all the drums thatgot to get mic'd up.
Then you got a singer, bass,guitar.
You want an open mic here orthere.

(01:38:10):
You go through 16 channels, noproblem.
That's why years ago with theeight track, everything, or the
four track, everything bled intoeach other.
So it had that warm feeling.
Me personally, you know, this ishow I like it.
Then, you know, all the tracks,then the analog, then the
digital, you know, it getssliced up a lot.

(01:38:33):
Now you got the pro tools, youknow, which I love.
Makes life easy.
When I used to have to record asong, you used to have to record
the whole song.
You get something wrong, it'sover.
You got to start from the get,you know.
It was pretty cool, you know, itwas challenging.

SPEAKER_05 (01:38:55):
Yeah, so on Victim in Pain, you recorded all the
music live.
Everyone was together.
Right.
Yeah.
Did Roger do the vocals at thesame time too, or did he do his
vocals after?

SPEAKER_00 (01:39:04):
You know, that's a good question.
I should know that.
But I don't know.
Trump's running in isolation.
That was big for us.
But we were all live in thestudio.
He might have done them live inthe studio.
Yeah, I think he might have.

SPEAKER_05 (01:39:21):
Yeah, I'll ask him because I know like Minor Threat
did it both ways on differentrecords.
I just saw you the other day.
Oh, right.
I told you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, for sure.
What are your memories of A7?
And like, How important was thatto the scene?

SPEAKER_00 (01:39:37):
Well, A7 was in my father's neighborhood.
You know, he used to hang out inthe park there.
My mother was from the westside.
You know, my father was from theeast side.
You know, and that was like myneighborhood.
You know, like that was mygrandmother's neighborhood.
And you don't commit crimes inyour grandmother's neighborhood,

(01:39:57):
Gavish.
That's from the godfather.
Because you bring disgrace.
Well, that's the lesson.
Anyway, I used to hang out atthe A7 Club.
It used to be a candy store whenI was a little kid, you know.
And then it became, it was abandage for a minute, you know.
And then this guy Dave justopened up this after hour

(01:40:20):
speakeasy joint, you know,totally illegal, like, you know.
And we all used to hang out inthere, you know.
And the bands would play and weall go in this little room, we
mush it up.
We go out, you know, there was alittle bar area, like a built
bar.
Like it's not like even a realjoint, you know?

(01:40:42):
Then in the back, there was likea couple of couches.
Everybody would just millaround, you know?
I go in there now, I kind of notrecognize it because, you know,
they broke through the wall andyou could go into another
section and I'd never go there.
I don't recognize it.

(01:41:03):
And I walked through it.
Well, thank God for Jesse Malin.
That's another thing.
Speaking of A7.
He saved A7.
He did a lot.
He does a lot for the punk scenewith the Bowery Electric.
Those are free shows.
Kids get to premiere their bandsonline.

(01:41:24):
The ground bag guy walks onbecause he does a lot for music,
underground music.

SPEAKER_05 (01:41:32):
Vinny, you brought up The Godfather right there.
Which mob movies do you thinkare legit?
Which do you think are bullshit?

SPEAKER_00 (01:41:39):
You know...
I mean, I grew up with the oldones, the roaring 20s, angels
with dirty faces, white heat,you know, Little Caesar, the
James Cagney, you know what Imean?
Because they had that kind of,you know, that machine gun, you
know?
Speaking of which, my apartment,which I'm talking to you right

(01:42:00):
out of, Vincent Cole lived here.
He was in Al Capone's outfit.
He was a German.
I think he was German or Polish.
And he was a gangster.
And he came to work right acrossthe street in Murder

(01:42:23):
Incorporated, right across thestreet here.
You walk out my door, it wasMurder Incorporated.
There they were.
And he lived in this apartment.
Now, I'm going back to 1925.
We know who lived in thisapartment.
Of course, my family lived here.
in all these apartments, youknow?
I'm the only one left, you know?
As a matter of fact, thebuilding is 100 years old.

(01:42:48):
It opened up in 1925, thisbuilding, and my family was the
first one to move in.
I'm

SPEAKER_05 (01:42:53):
here

SPEAKER_00 (01:42:54):
100 years,

SPEAKER_05 (01:42:55):
my family.
Of the other ones, like thenewer ones that people know, do
you think that any are good?

SPEAKER_00 (01:43:00):
Ah, Rockstale's good, you know?
I mean, you know, you know, youknow...
Yeah, you know, the Godfatherhas lessons in it.
You know, it all comes, that'sthe garlic and oil, the
Godfather, you know.
I still think they should haveused Rob Duvall in part three.

(01:43:22):
They still got beef, you know.
Yeah, because they filmed it inthe neighborhood.
Yeah, all the kids in theneighborhood got$25 and a
haircut.
It was a big deal.
My friend Googie, he passedaway.
he uh he was you see him quickin it like something but i never
noticed it you know everybody ididn't miss it there it goes but

(01:43:46):
they filmed a lot in theneighborhood elizabeth street
especially because elizabethstreet is uh sicilian or like
they would say shakadan or or uhLike, they had their own saints,
like St.
Vito, San Chiro, San Galocho.
And on my street, all thenobilidans lived like me.

(01:44:10):
They had different saints, likeSan Rocco, San Junaro is the big
one, you know?
And I live on the block with thechurch, you know?
So there was always...
As a matter of fact, that's thechurch I got burnt down, if you
ever watch the gangs in NewYork.

SPEAKER_05 (01:44:28):
You guys...
were serious like road warriors.
You toured a lot.
And you came to the West Coastthe first time in 1985.
What are your memories of comingout to California the first
time?

SPEAKER_00 (01:44:38):
84, but nobody's complaining.
What am I complaining?
I remember living on A.M.P.M.
A.M.P.M.
Hot Dogs and a Big Goat.
One dollar.
Listen to this for a dollar.
Three hot dogs and a Big Goat.
So I lived on three dollars aday.
Breakfast, lunch, and dinner.
I was hitting links.

(01:45:02):
That's what you got to do whenyou're on tour.

SPEAKER_05 (01:45:07):
Do you remember anything about playing with GBH
at the Olympic Auditorium?

SPEAKER_00 (01:45:11):
Yeah, whatever.
But I'll tell you another storythat Jacques just told me the
last time I was in England.
I saw him.
He says, hey, Vinnie, youremember when we lost your
guitar in Texas?
I forgot all about it.
I lost my guitar in Dallas,Texas.
The next day, like, I don'tknow, I was in Austin, let's
say, because they came over backthen with no guitars.

(01:45:35):
They had to play out of ourequipment.
So they used to play out of myguitar.
I wonder if Jack has any photosof him with my guitar.
That would be cool, because he'sone of my guitar heroes.
He's a guitar slinger.
Anyway, they would come overwith nothing, because they

(01:45:58):
didn't have a work visa.
It was different then.
And when we went on tour, webroke a string.
We changed the one string.
It was like, wow.
It was so rural.
And who tuned and who took careof guitars the way we do today?
You know, with the tuning, allthe wireless and all that.

(01:46:21):
But I tell you, even they got alot better, too.
Well, you know, 40-somethingyears, you know, and they're
great.
You know, I went on their firetour.
What is it?
Give Me Fire.
That was the name of the tour.
That was in 86.

(01:46:42):
And we went all the way down.
We made a lot of friends.
But I toured before that in 84.
That was in the OlympicAuditorium.
We played with them.
I don't know if it was them.
I think it was the Exploited.
Was it the Exploited and GBH?
I know Dr.
No was on it.
I know...

SPEAKER_05 (01:47:03):
Yeah, exploited UK subs, Dr.

SPEAKER_00 (01:47:05):
No.
UK subs, exploited UK subs.
I remember the poster now.
Not GBH, I believe.
So many years, believe me, I'vebeen there.
Sometimes I get a littleconfused.
Yeah, 86 is with GBH.
That's when you played.
Yeah, and then we playedbaseball with them and they

(01:47:28):
cheated.
We made a trophy, you know whatI mean?
We said, come on, we're going toplay.
They cheated.
It was great.
We still talk

SPEAKER_05 (01:47:36):
about it till today.
Yeah, but what was it likeplaying like a show that big in
that era, like playing Olympicto like thousands of people?

SPEAKER_00 (01:47:44):
Well, it was challenging for me in a way
because, you know, I'm a I'm anunderground punk rock hardcore
band.
And to step on a stage whereit's taller than people, I'm not
used to.
My stages are about two, threefeet, maybe.

(01:48:07):
Like CBGB's, let's say.
I don't know.
I should have measured theheight of the stage.
That's a good question.
I would say it's about threefeet.

SPEAKER_05 (01:48:18):
So, yeah, in 86, he played Fenders of GBH, and
Fenders Ballroom in Long Beachhad, like, a real reputation for
being a violent place.
What do you remember about that?

SPEAKER_00 (01:48:28):
Well, I remember a real...
I mentioned all the bands thatplayed there, and...
We had a great time.
You know, that's when I becameCharlie Harper's friend.
A very good friend of mine,Charlie Harper.
And I always tell him I'm goingto kill him because he's the
oldest punk rocker in the world.
And I want to be the oldest punkrocker in the world.

(01:48:48):
He's such a sweet guy.
But it was, you know, the copswere off the hook.
There were cars overturned,helicopters, fires.
You know, there were kids withtheir heads cracked open.
Like, you know, cops in NewYork...
I didn't feel that bad, youknow, like when, you know,
whatever.
I thought the L.A.

(01:49:10):
cops were like a little, likeoff the hook, you know?
Yeah.
But, yeah, it was a lot ofchaos, you know, and, you know,
part of the stage got damaged.
So our speaker fell.
It was people getting hurt allover the place.
Cops running, big kids running.
It was really...
It's one of my early L.A.

(01:49:32):
experiences.
So I was like, yo, welcome toCalifornia.

SPEAKER_05 (01:49:39):
Do you have any memories of playing San Diego?
You played the Jackie RobinsonYMCA in 86, and then you played
another spot in 88.

SPEAKER_00 (01:49:46):
Let's see.
86, that would be with GBH.

SPEAKER_05 (01:49:50):
Yeah, that was GBH.

SPEAKER_00 (01:49:52):
Yeah, I don't remember that exactly, but...
Yeah, I had my Marshall head.
I had my cabinet and my guitar.
My wires, everything.
Jock just had to play oneverything because, like I said,
they never came with a visa.

(01:50:13):
They just came in as tourists orsomething.
And yeah, you know, I rememberthere were a few, like sometimes
I would play three shows in aweek.
I'd be in California for twoweeks and I'd play like five,
six shows.
You know, because we have to layover a couple of days.
We have to wait for the weekend.

(01:50:33):
Like now you get booked likewith a it's a string of
bookings, you know.
Then it was like word of mouth,flyer, you know, or you got to
be in the know or something likethat.

SPEAKER_05 (01:50:48):
Yeah, I know that's kind of just putting you on the
spot.
Do you remember this onespecific show from 86?
That's a ridiculous question,but I got one last one like
that.
In 1990, you played Iguanas inTijuana.
Yes, okay.
Do you remember anything aboutgoing to Tijuana?
I like the Iguana Club.
It's closed now, I believe,right?
Yeah, it closed in like 92 or

SPEAKER_00 (01:51:09):
something.
Oh, yeah?
Oh, too bad, because I liked it.
It was set up nice.
The sound was good.
You know, it was right there.
You could come back to Americain like two hours, you know?
It was a good...
It was like, in a way, whenlike...
I don't mind anywhere I coulddrive to, whether it's Toronto,

(01:51:31):
Montreal, or Tijuana, you know.
As long as I could drive, I'llget there.

SPEAKER_05 (01:51:39):
Did you guys go out and party at all, or did you
just go to the show and that'sit?

SPEAKER_00 (01:51:43):
Well, back in the day...
It was a rolling party, like,kind of.
But it was more party,adventure, you know, survival,
you know?
Having fun, making friends, youknow?
I mean, I still have friendsstill today, you know?
So I come to a fucking stop signin the middle of the desert,

(01:52:08):
right?
And it says, so I'm lookingaround, and I'm in the fucking
middle of the desert.
There's no fucking cars.
So I look at the sign and I go.
I get stopped up the road.
They said they had aerialsurveillance.
That was on the way to the show.
So another time I'm in thedesert.

(01:52:30):
I come to the same stop sign inthe desert.
They said, beware, endangeredturtles like crossing the road.
So there was a turtle crossingthe road.
What did I do?
I forget.
My friend likes animals.
He had that turtle for 25, 30years in his backyard.

(01:52:52):
It looked like a stone movingaround.

SPEAKER_05 (01:52:57):
Oh, my God.
That's hilarious.
Vinny, One Voice is one of myfavorite AF records.
What's your opinion on thatrecord and that era of Agnostic
Front?
Okay.

UNKNOWN (01:53:08):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:53:10):
It goes back to the jump, from glam to punk-like
jump, from punk to hardcore,from hardcore to crossover, from
crossover to the new hardcore,which...
I had to learn all these stylesof playing through my life.

(01:53:34):
You know, like the new hardcore,like Mabel, slip, it slips, it's
slick, it's groove, you know.
Back in the old days, in 83, itwas just crunch, you know,
attack, kill, you know.
But it's more finesse now.

(01:53:54):
Well, everything got better.
The kids play good today.
You know, back in the old days,it was like, hey, what do you
do?
I don't do nothing.
Hey, you play the bass, youknow?
And I take the truth in a way Ithink there's an originality
come out of that, you know, thatyou get that flavor in a way,

(01:54:14):
kind of like, you know,segregation breeds culture, you
know?
Something like that.
Some kind of bullshit

SPEAKER_05 (01:54:24):
like that, whatever.
Can you talk about why you brokeup in 93?
You break up pretty soon afterthat record.
You go on a Europe tour and thenthat's it.

SPEAKER_00 (01:54:33):
Well, we had a lot of issues in Nasik Front.
And I say there are three.
Shot, stabbed, imprisoned.
Okay?
Now the new three things ispandemic, cancer, And I forget
what else.

(01:54:53):
But, you know, went through alifetime of, you know, when
Roger, I guess he'll tell youthe story or it's in his book or
whatever.
You know, when he got locked up,you know, I didn't want to do it
with anybody else, you know.
You know, like, you know, Iwould never get another singer.

(01:55:15):
Like, you know, I just wait formy guy to get out of jail, that
kind of.
So I did my fantasy band,Madball.
And, you know, we were likesomewhat of a Madball, you know?
So we did the Madball thing.
Well, like, kind of Roger was injail.
You know, then Freddie got usall together.

(01:55:38):
And we were playing a show.
And he says, hey, man, let's getthe, you know, like, kind of.
We were never really broken up.
But, you know, the guy gets outof jail, let him have a little
space, you know?
Yeah.
You know, sometimes don't justjump.
Let him enjoy what he's beenmissing.
You know, the relaxation, youknow, the whatever.
Then we'll fucking be roadwarriors.

(01:56:00):
Yeah, I want

SPEAKER_05 (01:56:01):
to talk about when you guys get back, because
that's a great era of the band.
But real quick, what was it likeplaying Dynamo with Madball in
1995?
First of all,

SPEAKER_00 (01:56:11):
we were totally unprofessional.
We were totally not ready.
We totally don't belong.
We totally took the cake.
That was it.
That's the bottom line.
We fucking broke the ice with ahardcore band to get on a stage
like that and shake the crowd uplike they did.

(01:56:31):
It was a great lineup because wewere on Roadrunner Records,
which was a big label.
There was Hyponegative,Biohazard, I think Life Agony
maybe.
I forget, you know, all thosekinds of guys, you know.
And then the other guys, youknow, the other style.

(01:56:55):
But we rolled a lot together,you know, festival to festival.
But I tell you right now, Dynamowas awesome.
They were abandoning their carsalong the highway.
They were just leaving theircars.
That's why they won't have onethat big anymore.

(01:57:15):
The Wacken Festival is very big,you know, but it's the whole
town kind of thing.
It's set up, I guess, a littledifferent.
The main stage, the Dynamo, andall those shirts they used to
make with the Samurai Warrior, Iguess, the symbol.

SPEAKER_05 (01:57:34):
Yeah.
The Dynamo show is just so wildbecause, like, Madball is so
raw, you know, like, It's notready for a giant stage like
that yet, but the people arestill just soaking it up.
Oh,

SPEAKER_00 (01:57:48):
yeah.
No way.
We were totally unprofessional.
The wire got caught in the pegsof the guitar.
We were on wire.
Now we're wireless.
It's a different thing.
Got a different amp.

(01:58:08):
You know?
It was, they just threw us upthere and we just went for it.
It was a Hail Mary, I gotta say.
On Easter Sunday, it's a HailMary.

SPEAKER_05 (01:58:22):
When the band gets back together in 96, 97, like
that Something's Gotta Give era,that was the first time I'd ever
saw you guys.
I saw you guys three timesaround that time.
And you were amazing.
What do you think about thatrecord and that era of AF?
Do you think it's underrated?
Because like, That's one of yourbest records, dude.

SPEAKER_00 (01:58:43):
Yes.
You know, it's a punk record.
It's more of a punk, hardcorepunk type thing.
Yeah, it was totally a trilogyof the music.
But I got my new album out.

(01:59:03):
It's going to be great.
I got some special guests on it,too.
All right, what are we

SPEAKER_05 (01:59:10):
looking at in the new record?

SPEAKER_00 (01:59:12):
A lot of, something you won't expect.
A lot of melody, maturity, youknow, something you don't
expect, agnostic front too.
That's another cool thing in away.
Because we kind of always like,you know, try to reinvent
ourselves and, you know, youknow, I made a record every

(01:59:38):
three years for over 40 years.
A studio album.
I mean, I throw my live album inthere anyway because there's a
day of CBGBs, you know?
And I know somewhere in there mydog was in the crowd.
Things I think of when I'm onstage.

(01:59:58):
Where's my dog?
Especially when I was in CBGBs,you know?
As a matter of fact, I waswalking with my son in his
house.
And I run across Joey Ramone'srobot.

(02:00:21):
Because he was a toy collector,Joey.
And he had the robot on theconsole of the soundboard.
It was there forever.
Like, you know?
And Joey passed.
And my kid was there one day.

(02:00:42):
You know, he's a little kid.
I don't know.
I was five, six.
I don't know.
Running around CBGBs with mydog.
You know?
And my kid was...
And I think Tommy Victor from...
You know Tommy Victor?
Yeah.
What's the name of the band?

(02:01:03):
Prong.
Prong, Prong, Prong.
Right.
Anyway, he gave my kid thething.
He said, Vinny, let your kidhave it, you know?
And I was just thinking aboutthat last line.
Sorry to get off subject.

SPEAKER_08 (02:01:18):
No, it's all good.

SPEAKER_00 (02:01:19):
I always get off subject with a lot of people
like you.
Because I think you're great atthe view, you know?

SPEAKER_05 (02:01:26):
Yeah, I appreciate that.
This is the last thing I got foryou, Vinny.
Sure.
AF has always been able to adaptto the times without seeming
like you're chasing a trend or asound.

SPEAKER_00 (02:01:36):
Yes, I hear you.
I understand.
How do you

SPEAKER_05 (02:01:39):
pull

SPEAKER_00 (02:01:39):
that off?
Why?
Because I stood true to themusic.
I didn't do like at the time inthe 90s, like hardcore bands did
a little hippity hop.
You know, I didn't go for that.
And you'd be surprised on myalbum who might make an
appearance on my new AF record.

(02:02:00):
And like, but it's not that we,it's, we didn't go along with
the trend.
You got to go along with thetimes, not with the trend, you
know, because things getoutdated.
I mean, hey, I, you know, youguys, when I make a record, I

(02:02:21):
think to myself, how's thisrecord going to sound eight, 10
years from now?
Is it still going to berelevant?
Like when you hear it?
So, yes, there's an element tomaking a record.
Don't go with a trend.
A lot of bands do that.
It gets like, that was trendy.

(02:02:43):
But basically, in the end, it'strendy, you know?
Especially with the hippity hopthing.
I think a lot of bands, youknow, had no business doing it,
like, you know?
In my opinion, anyway.
I mean, hip-hop should behip-hop, you know?
I like pure whatever.

(02:03:05):
I'm a big fan of undergroundstuff, you know?

SPEAKER_05 (02:03:08):
Vinny, you've been so generous with your time.

SPEAKER_00 (02:03:11):
And listen, because we ended the thing with the
hip-hop.
That's why I did this.
You see who's on my record next.

SPEAKER_05 (02:03:21):
To be continued,

SPEAKER_00 (02:03:23):
you're going to call

SPEAKER_05 (02:03:24):
me back.
And

SPEAKER_00 (02:03:25):
we're going to discuss this fucking very
moment.

SPEAKER_05 (02:03:28):
That's right.
That's right.
Yeah, we'll talk again when therecord comes out.
I'm excited.

SPEAKER_00 (02:03:33):
Yeah, sure, Zach.
Anytime.

SPEAKER_05 (02:03:35):
All right, Vinny.
Thanks so much for your time.

SPEAKER_00 (02:03:37):
You got it.

SPEAKER_02 (02:03:40):
All right, Dan, final thoughts on the pod.
I loved talking these new bandsand loved hearing you two chat
about the Japanese stuff.
Like, it's interesting because,you know, I've got...
It's a bit of a blind spot forme.
I've tried educating myself alittle bit more, so that's cool.

(02:04:00):
And, you know, one step furtherinto the Poison Idea world.

SPEAKER_05 (02:04:04):
Yeah, we're in full Uncharted territory for me now
because I've never listened toanything after blank Blackout
Vacant.
So I'm looking forward to it.
We got the LP.
We got to do it.
Kev,

SPEAKER_01 (02:04:14):
final thoughts?
Great interview.
Very insightful.
Enjoyed it quite a bit.
And then otherwise, you know,more...
Good stuff coming out all thetime, so appreciate that.
United Blood a few weekends agowas awesome.
The Hard Stripes sets allweekend were maybe the best sets
I've seen all year.
And yeah, Hardcore is stillgreat.

(02:04:36):
Dan, where can the people findyou?

SPEAKER_02 (02:04:37):
On Instagram, at Southport Instagrammer.

SPEAKER_01 (02:04:41):
Kev, where can the people find you?
Instagram, NotFairToFlare.
And Fall Salvation is onInstagram as well.
FallSalvationHC.
Hell yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (02:04:48):
Everyone get at me, 185MilesSouth at gmail.com.
Also, we got the website,185MilesSouth.com.
There is a playlist for everyepisode.
You can go to 185MilesSouth.com.
Click that playlist link at thetop of the page, or you can just
find us on Spotify.
We are also...
writing about punk and hardcoresometimes on Substack.

(02:05:11):
So check that out.
And we're on all the socials.
If you like this podcast,consider supporting it by
becoming a patron.
That would be awesome.
Patreon.com slash 185 milessouth.
And that is where we will seeyou next Monday behind the
dreaded paywall.

SPEAKER_08 (02:05:36):
We are Night Raiders, Night Raiders 4, Night
Raiders 7, Night Raiders, NightRaiders 4, Night Raiders 7,
Night Raiders 4, Night Raiders4, Night Raiders 4, Night
Raiders 4, Night Raiders 4,Night Raiders 4, Night Raiders
4, Night Raiders 4, NightRaiders 4, Night Raiders 4,

(02:05:56):
4, Night Raiders 4, NightRaiders 4

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