January 29, 2025 • 31 mins
There isn’t a script to follow that turns growing up in a chaotic family into living a life of peace and serenity. In fact, it seems like a miracle when someone does turn that life around. Melissa Huray is a former radio and television broadcaster, an addiction counselor, and an author whose memoir "Blackout to Blessing” chronicles her path towards sobriety and salvation. Melissa is currently the Executive Director of the Lindell Recovery Network and the host of "The Hope Report,” a daily internet television show. She has also written a new book, a daily devotional called "Radical Freedom.” Access to her books and story are at https://melissahuray.com/, and daily internet TV show can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/c/TheHopeReport
The views and opinions of the guests on this podcast are theirs and theirs alone and do not necessarily represent those of the host, Westwords Consulting or the Kenosha County Substance Abuse Coalition.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Mike (00:12):
Welcome, everybody.
This is Avoiding the AddictionAffliction, brought to you by Westwords
Consulting and the Kenosha CountySubstance Use Disorder Coalition.
I'm Mike McGowan.
One of the phrases I've used foreveris that growing up in a family
where alcoholism is ever presentis that everything is predictable.
(00:32):
Predictably chaotic.
There isn't a script that turns thatchaos into peace and serenity, and
to me, it always seems like a miraclewhen somebody turns that life around.
My guest today is one of those people.
Melissa Huray is a former radio andtelevision broadcaster, an addiction
counselor, and author of a justfabulous memoir, Blackout to Blessing.
(00:55):
Let me hold it up.
There we go.
For those of you watching on YouTube.
That chronicles her pathtowards sobriety and salvation.
Melissa is currently the executivedirector of the Lindell Recovery Network
and the host of The Hope Report, a dailyinternet television show the links to
which are attached to the podcast's blurb.
(01:15):
She's also written a brand new book, adaily devotional called Radical Freedom.
Welcome, Melissa, andthanks for being here.
Melissa (01:23):
Mike, it's great to be with you.
I just, I always feel like theseare divine appointments and I'm
so glad you reached out to me andwe were able to make this happen.
Mike (01:30):
Yeah, it's great.
Now, you know how this goes being amore expert at this than I, right?
However, I want to gobackwards for a minute.
I want to start your, about your storyand your book, Blackout to Blessing.
I know it's been a long time, you've beenin recovery for a long time, but I want
you to talk a little bit about blackouts,because for most people, they're really
(01:54):
scary, and one and done is, I think, theexperience for most people, but not you.
Melissa (02:00):
No.
You know, Mike, I think blackoutswere the defining feature of my
drinking and what made it so horrific.
And I didn't know what it was at first, Iwas 15 years old the first time I drank,
I went out with some kids who partied andwe got a case of Pabst Blue Ribbon beer.
And you read the story, youknow, went in a Ford pickup truck
(02:21):
and we drank that case of beer.
And I remember forgetting.
I mean, I recall that there werechunks of the night I didn't remember
that first time I drank, but afterthat, my drinking just grew more
compulsive and more reckless.
And it was like, I had no off switch.
I would start drinking and I would justpound whatever was available, beer, wine
(02:42):
coolers, whiskey, whatever anybody had.
And I would drink so fastthat I would blackout.
And sometimes people confuseblacking out and passing out.
And that's a common thing.
I think people think....
You know, when you pass out, you drink alot and then you fall asleep on the couch
or you know, you're kind of unconscious.
But when you're blacked out, you'reactually awake, you're conscious,
(03:04):
you're walking, talking, doing thingsthat you are forming no memory of.
Because you drink so fast thatyour blood alcohol rises rapidly
and it inhibits memory storage.
So basically, you know, you'renever going to get that memory back.
It's gone forever because yourbrain never converted it from short
term memory to long term memory.
(03:24):
So it's like you're walkingaround where every moment is new.
You're able to keep informationfor like one minute.
So if you were to sit down next to meat a bar, start talking to me, introduce
yourself, say your name is Mike, and Italk to you and we get in a conversation,
you leave, go to the bathroom, comeback five minutes later, I'm not going
to remember anything that you said.
It's all going to be new.
(03:45):
So you think of how reckless a personis in this state of mind, where you're
acting on impulse from moment to moment.
So typically what would happenis that I'd start drinking,
and I never planned to do this.
I never planned a blackout.
Actually, I found it really scary, evenas a teenager, coming to, say, waking
up in my bed and scrambling to rememberwhat was the last thing I was doing.
(04:08):
And it would be like, oh, I rememberbeing at that gravel pit party, and
I remember talking to Jimmy in, youknow, at the tailgate of the truck.
That's the last thing I remember, andit's like the curtain just closes.
And then my next memory is comingto in my bed and that was just a
recurring thing and it was somethingI had a lot of shame about.
Because I knew on some level thisdidn't happen to normal people.
(04:29):
My friends remembered stuff.
They would say oh you were you knowwhat you were doing last night you were
and I would be horrified I would haveso much shame even as a young person,
but I was compelled to repeat thisjust over and over as you read in my
book from 15 to 30 this is what I did.
Because I would always think I'dfind a way to not blackout, or
I'd be able to control it in a waythat I would avoid the blackouts.
Mike (04:53):
I like the part in your book where you know, your parents become aware of it.
And of course, those of you who don'tgrow up in the Midwest, you began life,
not at 15, drinking, but you got sips.
Right?
You were allowed to drink aroundyour parents at a much earlier age.
That's the Wisconsin/Minnesota way, right?
Melissa (05:12):
Right.
Mike (05:13):
But your dad said to your mom, I'll take care of this.
(chuckle) And your dad,who's the alcoholic, decided
to have the talk with you.
Melissa (05:21):
I know.
It was kind of comical.
I remember that really well.
And when you look back, it's a littlebit humorous when you read about it,
but it was really a horrifying event.
I was in 9th or 10th grade, I thinkit was the summer after 9th grade,
decided to start drinking after school.
You know, what a great idea, gohome and raid the liquor cabinets.
Remember it very well.
And when you're an addict andyou're impulsive and you're a
(05:43):
teenager, you're just, you're doingwhat seems good in the moment.
Like, hey, here's a bottle of Amarettothat hasn't been touched for a few years.
Let's have a few drinks.
So my boyfriend, my first boyfriend,the guy I got into all of this with,
he was just an innocent bystander.
He would go along with whateverI thought was a good idea.
So we started drinking and very quicklyI blacked out, came to in my bed.
(06:06):
I had thrown up on myself.
You read it in the story.
All the gory details are inthere in Blackout to Blessing.
But I remember the ceiling cominginto view, and that particle board
ceiling, and the naked bulb glaringdown, and my mom screaming at me and
trying to make sense of, why are youlike comatose in your bed at 6 in the
afternoon and I can't wake you up?
(06:27):
And then she realizes I'm drunkand I've thrown up on myself.
She loses it.
And then my dad starts down the stairs.
He says, Sue, it's all right.
Let me handle it.
You know, you go upstairs, get in yourrobe and just go watch your TV shows.
She had a lazy boy chair.
She sat in and she smoked Winston'sand she watched TV shows at night.
Okay.
This is what we did in the eighties.
(06:47):
We ate TV dinners and we watched TV shows.
But my dad had a little talk with me.
Very conflict avoidant.
That was the theme in my family was wedon't talk about what's really happening.
We know dad's a raging alcoholic anddad is barely hanging on to a job.
We got junk cars in the driveway anddisconnect notices coming in our mailbox.
But dad says, you know, Meliss,he's like, just stay off the stuff.
(07:09):
Hangovers are no fun.
And I know that was kind of thethe culmination of our talk.
Mike (07:15):
And there you go, right?
Melissa (07:17):
Yeah.
And I learned just don't get caught.
Okay.
You need to like fly under the radar.
And if, as long as you're notblowing anything up and you're not
flunking out of school, then youcan basically do whatever you want.
And that's what I learned in my family.
That we don't ask, don't tell.
We don't talk about what's reallygoing on with people, and that's
how it is in an addicted family.
Mike (07:36):
Well, yeah, and your mom was the classic don't rock the boat at all, right?
Melissa (07:41):
Yeah.
Yeah, unfortunately, I learned a lotof that, and that was what I had to
unlearn even after becoming sober.
That was so much of astronghold in my life.
The people pleasing and what I learnedand really she was just trying to exist.
I look back with so much compassionon her now with what she dealt with,
with my father for so many years.
And she was 17 when she married him.
(08:03):
I mean, she got pregnant with my brother.
She stayed with him to his death.
She was strong in a lot of ways,but the family modeled a lot of
really dysfunctional behavior.
Mike (08:13):
You know, you touched on it.
Ford trucks, gravel pits, low standardssounds like a bad country song.
But you kept drinking because ithad the effect you were looking for.
Melissa (08:25):
Yeah.
Yeah, well, you know very early on I waslooking for a way to escape this shame I
had that has become very clear to me andjust that the Lord and the Holy Spirit
has revealed to me that I was in thishouse of shame and secrets and I knew on
some level that things were not right.
And I was looking forways to escape my reality.
And really I think addiction isjust a symptom of trying to escape
(08:47):
emotional pain or numb ourselves or tonot be in the reality that we're in.
You know, it's just like, there'sa deep root and the addiction
is like leaves on the tree.
It might be shopping.
It might be gambling.
It might be porn.
It might be people pleasing.
For me, it started withbinge eating and television.
I mean, that was how I soothedmyself after school when I was alone
(09:09):
and I was scared because it wasgetting dark at 4:30 in December.
My parents weren't home.
I don't know if they're coming home.
My big brother was off playing sports, butI soothed myself with TV and binge eating,
but the enemy had begun priming me.
Like you said, when I was three yearsold, I have a Polaroid picture of
clutching this plastic cup of glass beer.
And my dad, they thought it was socute, you know, and Melissa likes beer.
(09:32):
And I've got like the frost on myupper lip or the foam from the beer.
But so it was very normalized in my home.
And early on, the enemy wouldhighlight alcohol to me and he began
priming me and showing me that'sgoing to do something for you.
That's going to help you.
You see what happens to these adults.
And for some reason, I didn't reallythink I'd ever turn out like my dad,
and people often ask me about that.
But I knew it would do somethingfor me, and I had anxiety and panic
(09:56):
because of the instability in the home.
So when I got to be 15, that's whenalcohol just moved into the forefront,
and I started to look for ways toseek that relief I knew that alcohol
would give me, and it did at first.
And a lot of people who become addicted,you know, it works for a while.
It really helped that anxiety, likeslamming a couple of beers and I
was super human on top of the world.
(10:17):
But then it turns on you and itstarts to create the problems
you think it's treating.
So where I thought it was helping withanxiety, it was making me more anxious.
It was making me isolated.
It was making me...
increasing the shame.
And in the beginning ithelped to numb that shame.
And.
But then I started creating more shame.
You know, there was the shame in myhousehold, and then there was the shame I
(10:38):
was creating with my own alcohol binges.
Mike (10:43):
Well, and you know when you're that's the danger right
of beginning to use at a youngage is you don't project forward.
So when your dad shows up drunk at asoftball game, you know, you never think
oh, that's gonna be me in ten years.
Melissa (10:59):
No, no, I think about that I have so much compassion and empathy
for that little girl for that child whowanted her dad to see her play softball.
And I know my story I mean thereare people with much worse trauma
than I had and terrible, terriblethings that happened to them.
And over 21 years of sobriety,I've been able to put it more into
(11:22):
perspective that Yeah, things happenedthat were tough and difficult,
but there were good things also.
And my parents did provide for mein the way that they were able to.
So I've been able to reframe alot of that that's been helpful.
But that softball gameis a painful memory.
And thinking back of, I was alwaysso embarrassed of my dad, because
the way he would be in public.
(11:42):
And not only was he an alcoholic,but he just was peculiar.
Even when stone cold sober, hehad this dry wit, and he would say
inappropriate things to people.
He wasn't a cool dad.
And I started looking around at thedads of my friends or the sitcom
dads, like on Growing Pains and FamilyTies and these shows in the eighties.
And I thought, I want a dad like that.
(12:04):
So TV and books and writing and journalingand all of that gave me an escape from
that family and let me create thisother reality, but when I got into
drinking, all of that stopped and Istopped, you know, really pursuing the
creative aspects that were helping me.
But that softball game is a painfulmemory and my dad continued to
(12:24):
do things like that throughouthis drinking as it escalated.
Mine was kind of going in tandemwith his, but the focus was on him.
The focus was on his medical problemsbecause he started to have liver
failure and esophageal varices andseizures and all of these really
serious problems related to alcohol.
Mike (12:45):
And of course when you're using the way you were using, that is not
conducive to really healthy relationshipsand so from 15 to 30 there's a trail
of fairly unhealthy relationships.
I want to use a quote that youuse in the book, if that's okay.
You said, I had not taught Rickhow to treat me or to demand
the respect that I deserved.
Melissa (13:08):
Rick, Rick, Rick.
Wonder what he's doing now.
He was a weatherman.
He was actually, I think I changedthe name of the city in the book, but
we'll just say he was in Wisconsin.
But yeah, it began at 15 and it really wasthis abandonment wound and this brokenness
that I had, you know, if you don't learnyour identity in Christ, And I had met
(13:28):
Jesus as a young child when I was nine.
My parents brought us tothe Presbyterian Church.
My uncle was a Presbyterian minister.
He also had a serious drinking problem,would move around from small country
church to small country church.
My dad's brother.
They were real close, but, you know,I had that knowing that drinking
(13:49):
was going to be my ruin, and I feltlike I was getting highlights from
the Holy Spirit about that, but Icontinued to pursue the bad boys.
I really had no interestin anybody stable, anybody
healthy, anybody seeking God.
Even when I completed confirmationclass, I wrote in the book about that.
And I actually am friendswith this person on Facebook.
(14:09):
He's come to the Lord and he'sa great guy, but I remember
completing confirmation class.
I got my certificate.
Yeah!
I memorized the apostle's creed.
And then I went out in the hall, goton the phone and called my friends.
And this guy picked me up in his.
It was a trans am or Camero.
Picks me up, and then we pickup some people and go to a
gravel pit and get drunk.
(14:30):
I mean, so, my churchexposure was not discipleship.
It didn't teach me how to havea relationship with the Lord.
It just taught me behaviors.
So I went from one relationship to thenext, trying to find attachment, really.
I was trying to attach myself tosomebody who would never leave me.
And we know the only one who'sgoing to do that for you is Jesus.
(14:53):
But I kept going to broken men.
with alcoholism or justwho didn't want to commit.
And I would try to take on my mom'scaretaking and convince them to love me.
And it really, it was just a sad cyclethat went with my alcoholism, was this
desire to get a man to submit to me.
And that if only I could do that in mymind I had this vision of the Family
(15:16):
Ties family or the Growing Pains family.
I'm going to create this perfect family.
It's gonna be nothing like my family.
I think I even wrote about FamilyFeud in the book how I think about
the family I bring on is not going tobe my family, it's going to be this
other family that I made up in my head.
So I had this dream worldof having a marriage, having
children, but my addiction wouldnever allow that to happen.
(15:38):
So again and again, I'd getinto the wrong relationships.
I got married when I was 21.
That was outside God's will.
Again, same story.
Our foundation was built ondrinking and infatuation.
I got pregnant.
We got married.
We were divorced three years later.
And so I was 24 with atoddler and divorced.
Mike (15:58):
Well, and before you found salvation (chuckle) no offense,
Melissa, but I think you're the onlyperson I've ever met who called the
Psychic Friends Network for advice.
Melissa (16:10):
I know, and it was so sad that I even got them to discharge that bill,
because I think I called back and Iargued I was in mental distress, and
they you know, they weren't forthcomingwith how much it actually cost.
Yeah, I was on the line so long thatthe "psychic" (air quotes) hung up
on me because it probably exceeded30 minutes or whatever was the
(16:31):
length of the call supposed to be.
Mike (16:32):
(laugh)
Melissa (16:33):
Yeah, that was a real low point.
Mike (16:34):
You talk about Jesus sending you consistent lifelines throughout your life.
In the opening chapter, notto, you know, steal thunder,
read the book, it's just great.
In the opening chapter of Blackout toBlessing, you're sitting in the diviest
of dive bars in the smallest of Wisconsinsmall river towns, and in the bar,
a dive bar, a guy starts talking toyou about his dad and 12 step groups.
(17:01):
Have you looked back and said, Oh myGod (chuckle), Jesus was sitting next
to me, and I didn't even recognize Him?
Melissa (17:09):
Well, I really believe he absolutely works through
people and even the most brokenpeople who aren't seeking him.
He will use whatever we'reinterested in to get our attention
and it was a foreshadowing.
I mean, I put that in the beginningof the book because I wanted to
illustrate the level of the blackouts.
I mean, I was 25 at that point andI would do, as you read, extremely
(17:31):
dangerous things, go out to barsby myself, meet up with random
people, not know what happened.
I could kind of piece together.
I think this happened or may or may nothave happened, but I think I wrote in
there and I have a phenomenal memory too,which is something that can be a blessing
and a curse, but I remember details,I remember such specifics and that can
(17:51):
really be tormenting when you're creatinga lot of bad experiences for yourself.
But I remember saying that I couldhave started a colony on Venus and I
wouldn't have known because I rememberedhim buying me a shot of tequila.
Maybe it was the sun was setting.
And then the next thing I was comingto on the floor of my apartment,
wondering what had happened.
(18:11):
But I put that in there too, because it'sthe first entrance of my husband, Mike.
Who we've been married for 20 yearsnow, but Mike was an acquaintance
of my roommate and God put himin my path one time when I was
25, but Mike was a stable guy.
Mike was a handy guy.
He was not the type of guy Iwould go for deep in my addiction,
but it was a foreshadowing.
(18:32):
So I included that, but there was noway God was going to bring me that,
that stable man in that family I wanted,unless I would give up the alcohol.
And I believe he gives usa measure of free will.
He allows us to come tothe end of ourselves.
And he was saying to me,Melissa are you done yet?
And again and again, I kept goinginto these dangerous situations.
(18:53):
And then at 26, I had the 2 drunkdriving crashes you read about.
And that did stop mydrinking for 18 months.
But sometimes I'm amazed that hespared my life through all that.
And I just want to, you know, I tellthe story because it, it couldn't
be anything other than God thatwould have brought me out of that,
that highway to hell I was on.
Mike (19:12):
Yeah.
Well fast forward then August22nd, 2003, the last blackout.
You know, talk, no cravings after that.
So talk about that transformation.
It's pretty significant 180.
Melissa (19:27):
Yeah.
It's the story that I love to tell.
But when you look back, the lead up to itwas four years of going back and forth.
It was four years of wrestling with, Iknow I need to stop, but I don't want to.
You know, one foot in the world andone foot in, ah, yeah, maybe I'll do a
little of this Bible thing, church thing,because after the drunk driving arrest,
I was scared straight for 18 months.
(19:48):
And I went to AA, I did all thethings dutifully as a good Minnesota
girl would, you know, cause I couldreally turn it on when necessary and
really turn it on for people likeconfirmation class or at the times when
I needed to show them how dutiful I am.
I actually quit the bartending job.
I got a job at a TV station.
As a production assistant,eventually worked my way up to
(20:11):
reporter and weekend anchor.
Amazing how your life turns aroundwhen you stop the chaos of addiction.
I had started this new life, everythingwas going well, I was taking my
daughter to church, but then theenemy started to tell me, you're
not really like those people you seein AA, those like messed up people.
I mean, you're smarter than that.
You can outwit this.
You've never really tried to control it.
(20:31):
So I went back into it for two moreyears, and that's when my father died.
And I want to just stop therejust for a moment before we get to
the August 22nd, 2003, because myfather died on December 12th, 2002.
He was 54.
He was only two years older than I am now.
And people have been throwing himlifelines through his whole life
saying, Dan, you're going to die if youdon't quit, your liver is giving out.
(20:53):
You have the lowest hemoglobinlevel we've ever seen.
And we can't believe you made it.
You're not going to get another chance.
He would go into the hospital, get bloodtransfusions, sometimes go to treatment,
come back out and start drinking again.
The longest I had ever seenhim sober was one week.
After he died on December 12th.
I looked at him and in hishospital bed, and I said to myself.
(21:15):
You can't ever drink again.
There's no way you're drinking again.
But it was kind of like a vow I madeto myself, you know, by my own will.
And then a week later I was drunkand I started to get really scared.
I started to think, you can't stop this.
You thought you could when youwanted it bad enough or when things
got serious enough, you'd stop.
But I had six more relapsesafter that, but something
supernatural changed when he died.
(21:37):
I think I received some measure ofdeliverance in his death that where
the Lord stepped up his pursuit to me.
And this brought us, you know, I had sixdisastrous relapses all punctuated at the
end of the book that could have killed me.
The one at the week of San Diego whereI didn't, people tried for 20 minutes
to wake me up out of drunken stupor.
(21:58):
And then they said, well, is she dead?
And I drank until August 22nd,I had had 49 days of sobriety
and I was white knuckling it.
That's what never worked for mebecause myself will, would run out.
So I decided to go tothe Minnesota State Fair.
I'll tell the story quickly.
Friend of mine, old guy acquaintance,some affable guy who had just come along.
(22:20):
Came with me.
We drove down to the fair fromDuluth, where I used to live.
And on the way down, I just started tothink, maybe I could drink one more time.
Just one more time.
I can do it here at the fair.
Nobody will know.
I'm with him.
He's just a innocent, you know,he's not going to tell me I can't.
So, I started drinking at the fairand I was, as I said in the book,
pounding beers like they were water,cups of water at a marathon checkpoint.
(22:44):
I mean, that's what it waslike, just slamming beers like
you know, I had no off switch.
I came to 12 hours.
I was in a 12 hour blackout.
I came to an estranged motel room.
I remember this morning.
You know, it was muddy and vague, but itwas also vivid where I was just clamoring
to make sense of what had happened.
I was in this cheap motel,this marigold bedspread.
(23:07):
Like it was just a horrific scene.
I didn't know how I had gotten there.
And this guy was leaningover me going, we have to go.
I think your car was towed.
And I've never been so sick, fullof shame, just miserable and broken.
And in Psalm 34:18, it says that Godis close to the brokenhearted and
saves those who are crushed in spirit.
And I've never been socrushed as I was that morning.
(23:30):
I was just at the end of myselfand I did a couple of things.
I made a decision.
I think every addictneeds to make a decision.
And even in my withdrawal and mypanic, I was having a panic attack.
I said to myself, I'mnever drinking again.
And then I...
I've repented.
I didn't really know what that meantat the time, but I agreed with God.
(23:51):
I finally came into agreement withwhat He'd been showing me for so long.
That you're not going to live.
You're not going to have anything.
You're not going to surviveif you keep drinking.
It needs to be no alcohol.
There's no middle ground for you.
I'd been trying to take alcoholand blend it with a functional life
and it was never going to work.
(24:12):
So I repented and I asked God.
I just said a very simple prayer.
I said, please don'tever let me drink again.
And I wanted it with everything I had.
I haven't, this is the part I want tosay, I've never, I haven't had a craving.
I haven't had a day where I thought.
Hey, maybe I'm normal now.
I can have a couple of drinks.
It was like, it was liftedoff me in that moment.
(24:33):
That part was miraculous, nomore craving, no more mental
preoccupation, or obsession.
I still had a lot to learn about.
My other character defects,that's pretty much what this is.
Mike (24:44):
(laugh)
Melissa (24:44):
But what the mental and physical part was gone.
It was like, I had no desire to drinkand I haven't for over 21 years.
Mike (24:53):
Well, that's a moment, a walking, talking third
step of Alcoholics Anonymous.
Turn your will and life over to God.
Maybe that's what you say in thebook, that your favorite Bible
verse is John 16:33, right?
Melissa (25:09):
I don't know.
You know, it's hard to pick a favorite.
But John 16:33, when he says, Takeheart, I have overcome the world.
Mike (25:16):
Yeah.
Melissa (25:16):
I do believe surrender is such a huge thing.
Like I said about the free will.
You know, God has revealed more tome about this because that moment
I didn't know what all I was doing.
I just knew I was broken and miserableand that I could never take a drink again.
And I knew nothing I had tried to do hadworked because I could stop but I couldn't
stay stopped I would always pick it upagain So I think you know programs can
(25:38):
help us and all that stuff can be helpful.
But unless we're doing it with a postureof submission, you know we're seeking
the lord first and we're letting himlead us into the things we need, then
we're running on our own self will.
We're trying to do it in our own power.
And that's what I had always done,just looking outside myself for the
thing that's going to fix me, insteadof letting him run that and trusting
(25:59):
him that he would and he has he'sfaithfully led me into every single
thing I have needed since that day.
Mike (26:05):
Well, we could spend another four podcasts talking about your wonderful
husband, but talk about your work withthe recovery network and your YouTube
show The Hope Project which by theway is also the name of your daughter.
Melissa (26:20):
Her name is Haley, but I called her Hope in the book.
When I started writing...
Mike (26:23):
Oh, funny, funny, funny.
Melissa (26:25):
Yeah.
When I started writingit, she was a minor.
You know, she's 30 now.
Sure, sure.
I was trying to protect her identity.
And then at one point I asked her, hey, doyou want me to put your real name in here?
And she's like, no, you canjust leave it like that.
And I thought it was kind ofneat how I called her Hope.
Mike (26:39):
It is neat.
Yeah.
Melissa (26:40):
Because she, you know, God, she was a surprise.
I mean, we didn't planher, but God really...
She kept me alive.
I mean, she gave me a reason to live.
She did much more than that.
But in those years of my bartendingdays, you know, I had to be functional
for her and I really tried tokeep that life separate from her.
I wouldn't say I always succeededwith that, but she was so much a
(27:02):
source of inspiration and hope tome, and she's such an old soul.
But I did get married one year after that.
Some AA people might have discouragedthat, but Mike came back into my life
three weeks after I quit drinking.
He and I ended up at this event.
We didn't know we'd been workingacross the street from each other.
I was at the TV station andhe worked across the street.
(27:22):
We had never crossed paths.
And I went over there to do a story,just a quick little sound bite.
I didn't even want to go to the story.
And, but it was the story of mylife because Mike was there and
then we reconnected and he said,Hey, you want to go out for lunch?
And we kind of took it slow fora few months, but we ended up
getting married a year after we met.
And it was great.
We had a really awesome, idylliccourtship, whirlwind courtship.
(27:47):
We had two more daughters in 2008and 2010, but I wouldn't say our road
has been perfectly seamless becauseMike came from an addicted family.
He wasn't an addict himself, which waswhat was most important to me then.
But we know what happensin addicted families.
And even though you're not theaddict he picked up a lot of those
traits of perfectionism, workaholism.
So all of these things, the Lord hasused to refine us in our marriage.
(28:11):
Because early on, I made him anidol and I put him before God
and I had to be stripped of that.
So we went through a dark time.
It was 13 years ago, but we came through,we've been married for 20 years this
past September and he's a huge blessing.
He is absolutely the manthat God chose for me.
I tried to circumvent it and gosome other roads first, but he's an
(28:33):
amazing father, amazing man, and we'vegrown a lot together in the Lord.
We had to make Christ thefoundation of our marriage though,
which we didn't do at first.
And I don't know how peoplestay married without that.
Mike (28:45):
It is amazing how two people who come from really dysfunctional families
think that they can magically becomethe Keatons from Family Ties, right?
Melissa (28:55):
Oh, I know.
You're so right.
And I thought everything was just going tobe phenomenal because I had quit drinking.
I had the obsession lifted.
I went into counseling, you know, Iworked at the TV station for, I think,
two more years and then it closed.
And people were moving all overthe country doing market jumps.
But I went back to school andbecame an addiction counselor.
I did that for 12 years and workedin intensive outpatient treatment.
(29:19):
I saw about 55 people aweek at the height of it.
And toward the end, I was gettingsome burnout, some compassion fatigue,
and that's when I met Mike Lindell,and he wanted to launch this website
to help people with addiction.
So he brought me on in 2018, and wehave the LindellRecoveryNetwork.org.
It's a directory of Churches,Christian treatment centers,
free resources for addicts.
(29:40):
It's just all free.
Mike is a former crack addict.
So we had a lot in common and wedon't believe in the disease model.
We believe Jesus is thehealer and the answer.
So everything on that sitepoints people to Jesus.
And then four years ago,we started the Hope Report.
And when I met Mike, he wouldwalk around saying, one of these
days, I'm going to have a show.
It's only going to be good news.
(30:00):
I'm going to call it the Hope Report.
Well, I didn't know I'dhave any part of that.
But the Lord brought thebroadcasting thing back around again.
Only back then when I was in TV news, Iwas kind of doing it from a broken place.
Although, you know, Ilove the storytelling.
I loved a lot of the aspects ofthe job, but I wanted to be seen.
I wanted to be validated.
But now I get to do abroadcasting job for the Lord.
(30:23):
I mean, everything I do is Bible orit's helping addicts by teaching them
the truth and Jesus can set them free.
And so it's an inspirationalshow every day at 1 p.
m.
Central, and it's on YouTube,Facebook, Frank Speech, and on
Mike Lindell's other outlets.
Mike (30:41):
Well, and of course, I said it to begin with, but there's a link to that
attached to the blurb of the podcast.
You know, I'll let you go, butyou know, this has been terrific.
The story is so inspiring that youcan walk those streets in those
small little towns that are littered.
(31:02):
You know, Melissa, you and I both knowin this part of the world, there's a
lot of stories just like ours, right?
So the Hope Report goesthrough your whole life.
There's a lot of hopethrough your whole life.
For those of you listening, wewant to thank Melissa for her
inspiration, faith, and hope.
(31:23):
And if you are listening, I hope youfind love and support wherever you are.
Always thank you for listening.
We want you to be safe and keep looking.
It's right in front ofyou, or sitting beside you.
Welcome, everybody.
This is Avoiding the AddictionAffliction, brought to you by Westwords
Consulting and the Kenosha CountySubstance Use Disorder Coalition.
I'm Mike McGowan.
One of the phrases I've used foreveris that growing up in a family
where alcoholism is ever presentis that everything is predictable.
(00:32):
Predictably chaotic.
There isn't a script that turns thatchaos into peace and serenity, and
to me, it always seems like a miraclewhen somebody turns that life around.
My guest today is one of those people.
Melissa Huray is a former radio andtelevision broadcaster, an addiction
counselor, and author of a justfabulous memoir, Blackout to Blessing.
(00:55):
Let me hold it up.
There we go.
For those of you watching on YouTube.
That chronicles her pathtowards sobriety and salvation.
Melissa is currently the executivedirector of the Lindell Recovery Network
and the host of The Hope Report, a dailyinternet television show the links to
which are attached to the podcast's blurb.
(01:15):
She's also written a brand new book, adaily devotional called Radical Freedom.
Welcome, Melissa, andthanks for being here.
Melissa (01:23):
Mike, it's great to be with you.
I just, I always feel like theseare divine appointments and I'm
so glad you reached out to me andwe were able to make this happen.
Mike (01:30):
Yeah, it's great.
Now, you know how this goes being amore expert at this than I, right?
However, I want to gobackwards for a minute.
I want to start your, about your storyand your book, Blackout to Blessing.
I know it's been a long time, you've beenin recovery for a long time, but I want
you to talk a little bit about blackouts,because for most people, they're really
(01:54):
scary, and one and done is, I think, theexperience for most people, but not you.
Melissa (02:00):
No.
You know, Mike, I think blackoutswere the defining feature of my
drinking and what made it so horrific.
And I didn't know what it was at first, Iwas 15 years old the first time I drank,
I went out with some kids who partied andwe got a case of Pabst Blue Ribbon beer.
And you read the story, youknow, went in a Ford pickup truck
(02:21):
and we drank that case of beer.
And I remember forgetting.
I mean, I recall that there werechunks of the night I didn't remember
that first time I drank, but afterthat, my drinking just grew more
compulsive and more reckless.
And it was like, I had no off switch.
I would start drinking and I would justpound whatever was available, beer, wine
(02:42):
coolers, whiskey, whatever anybody had.
And I would drink so fastthat I would blackout.
And sometimes people confuseblacking out and passing out.
And that's a common thing.
I think people think....
You know, when you pass out, you drink alot and then you fall asleep on the couch
or you know, you're kind of unconscious.
But when you're blacked out, you'reactually awake, you're conscious,
(03:04):
you're walking, talking, doing thingsthat you are forming no memory of.
Because you drink so fast thatyour blood alcohol rises rapidly
and it inhibits memory storage.
So basically, you know, you'renever going to get that memory back.
It's gone forever because yourbrain never converted it from short
term memory to long term memory.
(03:24):
So it's like you're walkingaround where every moment is new.
You're able to keep informationfor like one minute.
So if you were to sit down next to meat a bar, start talking to me, introduce
yourself, say your name is Mike, and Italk to you and we get in a conversation,
you leave, go to the bathroom, comeback five minutes later, I'm not going
to remember anything that you said.
It's all going to be new.
(03:45):
So you think of how reckless a personis in this state of mind, where you're
acting on impulse from moment to moment.
So typically what would happenis that I'd start drinking,
and I never planned to do this.
I never planned a blackout.
Actually, I found it really scary, evenas a teenager, coming to, say, waking
up in my bed and scrambling to rememberwhat was the last thing I was doing.
(04:08):
And it would be like, oh, I rememberbeing at that gravel pit party, and
I remember talking to Jimmy in, youknow, at the tailgate of the truck.
That's the last thing I remember, andit's like the curtain just closes.
And then my next memory is comingto in my bed and that was just a
recurring thing and it was somethingI had a lot of shame about.
Because I knew on some level thisdidn't happen to normal people.
(04:29):
My friends remembered stuff.
They would say oh you were you knowwhat you were doing last night you were
and I would be horrified I would haveso much shame even as a young person,
but I was compelled to repeat thisjust over and over as you read in my
book from 15 to 30 this is what I did.
Because I would always think I'dfind a way to not blackout, or
I'd be able to control it in a waythat I would avoid the blackouts.
Mike (04:53):
I like the part in your book where you know, your parents become aware of it.
And of course, those of you who don'tgrow up in the Midwest, you began life,
not at 15, drinking, but you got sips.
Right?
You were allowed to drink aroundyour parents at a much earlier age.
That's the Wisconsin/Minnesota way, right?
Melissa (05:12):
Right.
Mike (05:13):
But your dad said to your mom, I'll take care of this.
(chuckle) And your dad,who's the alcoholic, decided
to have the talk with you.
Melissa (05:21):
I know.
It was kind of comical.
I remember that really well.
And when you look back, it's a littlebit humorous when you read about it,
but it was really a horrifying event.
I was in 9th or 10th grade, I thinkit was the summer after 9th grade,
decided to start drinking after school.
You know, what a great idea, gohome and raid the liquor cabinets.
Remember it very well.
And when you're an addict andyou're impulsive and you're a
(05:43):
teenager, you're just, you're doingwhat seems good in the moment.
Like, hey, here's a bottle of Amarettothat hasn't been touched for a few years.
Let's have a few drinks.
So my boyfriend, my first boyfriend,the guy I got into all of this with,
he was just an innocent bystander.
He would go along with whateverI thought was a good idea.
So we started drinking and very quicklyI blacked out, came to in my bed.
(06:06):
I had thrown up on myself.
You read it in the story.
All the gory details are inthere in Blackout to Blessing.
But I remember the ceiling cominginto view, and that particle board
ceiling, and the naked bulb glaringdown, and my mom screaming at me and
trying to make sense of, why are youlike comatose in your bed at 6 in the
afternoon and I can't wake you up?
(06:27):
And then she realizes I'm drunkand I've thrown up on myself.
She loses it.
And then my dad starts down the stairs.
He says, Sue, it's all right.
Let me handle it.
You know, you go upstairs, get in yourrobe and just go watch your TV shows.
She had a lazy boy chair.
She sat in and she smoked Winston'sand she watched TV shows at night.
Okay.
This is what we did in the eighties.
(06:47):
We ate TV dinners and we watched TV shows.
But my dad had a little talk with me.
Very conflict avoidant.
That was the theme in my family was wedon't talk about what's really happening.
We know dad's a raging alcoholic anddad is barely hanging on to a job.
We got junk cars in the driveway anddisconnect notices coming in our mailbox.
But dad says, you know, Meliss,he's like, just stay off the stuff.
(07:09):
Hangovers are no fun.
And I know that was kind of thethe culmination of our talk.
Mike (07:15):
And there you go, right?
Melissa (07:17):
Yeah.
And I learned just don't get caught.
Okay.
You need to like fly under the radar.
And if, as long as you're notblowing anything up and you're not
flunking out of school, then youcan basically do whatever you want.
And that's what I learned in my family.
That we don't ask, don't tell.
We don't talk about what's reallygoing on with people, and that's
how it is in an addicted family.
Mike (07:36):
Well, yeah, and your mom was the classic don't rock the boat at all, right?
Melissa (07:41):
Yeah.
Yeah, unfortunately, I learned a lotof that, and that was what I had to
unlearn even after becoming sober.
That was so much of astronghold in my life.
The people pleasing and what I learnedand really she was just trying to exist.
I look back with so much compassionon her now with what she dealt with,
with my father for so many years.
And she was 17 when she married him.
(08:03):
I mean, she got pregnant with my brother.
She stayed with him to his death.
She was strong in a lot of ways,but the family modeled a lot of
really dysfunctional behavior.
Mike (08:13):
You know, you touched on it.
Ford trucks, gravel pits, low standardssounds like a bad country song.
But you kept drinking because ithad the effect you were looking for.
Melissa (08:25):
Yeah.
Yeah, well, you know very early on I waslooking for a way to escape this shame I
had that has become very clear to me andjust that the Lord and the Holy Spirit
has revealed to me that I was in thishouse of shame and secrets and I knew on
some level that things were not right.
And I was looking forways to escape my reality.
And really I think addiction isjust a symptom of trying to escape
(08:47):
emotional pain or numb ourselves or tonot be in the reality that we're in.
You know, it's just like, there'sa deep root and the addiction
is like leaves on the tree.
It might be shopping.
It might be gambling.
It might be porn.
It might be people pleasing.
For me, it started withbinge eating and television.
I mean, that was how I soothedmyself after school when I was alone
(09:09):
and I was scared because it wasgetting dark at 4:30 in December.
My parents weren't home.
I don't know if they're coming home.
My big brother was off playing sports, butI soothed myself with TV and binge eating,
but the enemy had begun priming me.
Like you said, when I was three yearsold, I have a Polaroid picture of
clutching this plastic cup of glass beer.
And my dad, they thought it was socute, you know, and Melissa likes beer.
(09:32):
And I've got like the frost on myupper lip or the foam from the beer.
But so it was very normalized in my home.
And early on, the enemy wouldhighlight alcohol to me and he began
priming me and showing me that'sgoing to do something for you.
That's going to help you.
You see what happens to these adults.
And for some reason, I didn't reallythink I'd ever turn out like my dad,
and people often ask me about that.
But I knew it would do somethingfor me, and I had anxiety and panic
(09:56):
because of the instability in the home.
So when I got to be 15, that's whenalcohol just moved into the forefront,
and I started to look for ways toseek that relief I knew that alcohol
would give me, and it did at first.
And a lot of people who become addicted,you know, it works for a while.
It really helped that anxiety, likeslamming a couple of beers and I
was super human on top of the world.
(10:17):
But then it turns on you and itstarts to create the problems
you think it's treating.
So where I thought it was helping withanxiety, it was making me more anxious.
It was making me isolated.
It was making me...
increasing the shame.
And in the beginning ithelped to numb that shame.
And.
But then I started creating more shame.
You know, there was the shame in myhousehold, and then there was the shame I
(10:38):
was creating with my own alcohol binges.
Mike (10:43):
Well, and you know when you're that's the danger right
of beginning to use at a youngage is you don't project forward.
So when your dad shows up drunk at asoftball game, you know, you never think
oh, that's gonna be me in ten years.
Melissa (10:59):
No, no, I think about that I have so much compassion and empathy
for that little girl for that child whowanted her dad to see her play softball.
And I know my story I mean thereare people with much worse trauma
than I had and terrible, terriblethings that happened to them.
And over 21 years of sobriety,I've been able to put it more into
(11:22):
perspective that Yeah, things happenedthat were tough and difficult,
but there were good things also.
And my parents did provide for mein the way that they were able to.
So I've been able to reframe alot of that that's been helpful.
But that softball gameis a painful memory.
And thinking back of, I was alwaysso embarrassed of my dad, because
the way he would be in public.
(11:42):
And not only was he an alcoholic,but he just was peculiar.
Even when stone cold sober, hehad this dry wit, and he would say
inappropriate things to people.
He wasn't a cool dad.
And I started looking around at thedads of my friends or the sitcom
dads, like on Growing Pains and FamilyTies and these shows in the eighties.
And I thought, I want a dad like that.
(12:04):
So TV and books and writing and journalingand all of that gave me an escape from
that family and let me create thisother reality, but when I got into
drinking, all of that stopped and Istopped, you know, really pursuing the
creative aspects that were helping me.
But that softball game is a painfulmemory and my dad continued to
(12:24):
do things like that throughouthis drinking as it escalated.
Mine was kind of going in tandemwith his, but the focus was on him.
The focus was on his medical problemsbecause he started to have liver
failure and esophageal varices andseizures and all of these really
serious problems related to alcohol.
Mike (12:45):
And of course when you're using the way you were using, that is not
conducive to really healthy relationshipsand so from 15 to 30 there's a trail
of fairly unhealthy relationships.
I want to use a quote that youuse in the book, if that's okay.
You said, I had not taught Rickhow to treat me or to demand
the respect that I deserved.
Melissa (13:08):
Rick, Rick, Rick.
Wonder what he's doing now.
He was a weatherman.
He was actually, I think I changedthe name of the city in the book, but
we'll just say he was in Wisconsin.
But yeah, it began at 15 and it really wasthis abandonment wound and this brokenness
that I had, you know, if you don't learnyour identity in Christ, And I had met
(13:28):
Jesus as a young child when I was nine.
My parents brought us tothe Presbyterian Church.
My uncle was a Presbyterian minister.
He also had a serious drinking problem,would move around from small country
church to small country church.
My dad's brother.
They were real close, but, you know,I had that knowing that drinking
(13:49):
was going to be my ruin, and I feltlike I was getting highlights from
the Holy Spirit about that, but Icontinued to pursue the bad boys.
I really had no interestin anybody stable, anybody
healthy, anybody seeking God.
Even when I completed confirmationclass, I wrote in the book about that.
And I actually am friendswith this person on Facebook.
(14:09):
He's come to the Lord and he'sa great guy, but I remember
completing confirmation class.
I got my certificate.
Yeah!
I memorized the apostle's creed.
And then I went out in the hall, goton the phone and called my friends.
And this guy picked me up in his.
It was a trans am or Camero.
Picks me up, and then we pickup some people and go to a
gravel pit and get drunk.
(14:30):
I mean, so, my churchexposure was not discipleship.
It didn't teach me how to havea relationship with the Lord.
It just taught me behaviors.
So I went from one relationship to thenext, trying to find attachment, really.
I was trying to attach myself tosomebody who would never leave me.
And we know the only one who'sgoing to do that for you is Jesus.
(14:53):
But I kept going to broken men.
with alcoholism or justwho didn't want to commit.
And I would try to take on my mom'scaretaking and convince them to love me.
And it really, it was just a sad cyclethat went with my alcoholism, was this
desire to get a man to submit to me.
And that if only I could do that in mymind I had this vision of the Family
(15:16):
Ties family or the Growing Pains family.
I'm going to create this perfect family.
It's gonna be nothing like my family.
I think I even wrote about FamilyFeud in the book how I think about
the family I bring on is not going tobe my family, it's going to be this
other family that I made up in my head.
So I had this dream worldof having a marriage, having
children, but my addiction wouldnever allow that to happen.
(15:38):
So again and again, I'd getinto the wrong relationships.
I got married when I was 21.
That was outside God's will.
Again, same story.
Our foundation was built ondrinking and infatuation.
I got pregnant.
We got married.
We were divorced three years later.
And so I was 24 with atoddler and divorced.
Mike (15:58):
Well, and before you found salvation (chuckle) no offense,
Melissa, but I think you're the onlyperson I've ever met who called the
Psychic Friends Network for advice.
Melissa (16:10):
I know, and it was so sad that I even got them to discharge that bill,
because I think I called back and Iargued I was in mental distress, and
they you know, they weren't forthcomingwith how much it actually cost.
Yeah, I was on the line so long thatthe "psychic" (air quotes) hung up
on me because it probably exceeded30 minutes or whatever was the
(16:31):
length of the call supposed to be.
Mike (16:32):
(laugh)
Melissa (16:33):
Yeah, that was a real low point.
Mike (16:34):
You talk about Jesus sending you consistent lifelines throughout your life.
In the opening chapter, notto, you know, steal thunder,
read the book, it's just great.
In the opening chapter of Blackout toBlessing, you're sitting in the diviest
of dive bars in the smallest of Wisconsinsmall river towns, and in the bar,
a dive bar, a guy starts talking toyou about his dad and 12 step groups.
(17:01):
Have you looked back and said, Oh myGod (chuckle), Jesus was sitting next
to me, and I didn't even recognize Him?
Melissa (17:09):
Well, I really believe he absolutely works through
people and even the most brokenpeople who aren't seeking him.
He will use whatever we'reinterested in to get our attention
and it was a foreshadowing.
I mean, I put that in the beginningof the book because I wanted to
illustrate the level of the blackouts.
I mean, I was 25 at that point andI would do, as you read, extremely
(17:31):
dangerous things, go out to barsby myself, meet up with random
people, not know what happened.
I could kind of piece together.
I think this happened or may or may nothave happened, but I think I wrote in
there and I have a phenomenal memory too,which is something that can be a blessing
and a curse, but I remember details,I remember such specifics and that can
(17:51):
really be tormenting when you're creatinga lot of bad experiences for yourself.
But I remember saying that I couldhave started a colony on Venus and I
wouldn't have known because I rememberedhim buying me a shot of tequila.
Maybe it was the sun was setting.
And then the next thing I was comingto on the floor of my apartment,
wondering what had happened.
(18:11):
But I put that in there too, because it'sthe first entrance of my husband, Mike.
Who we've been married for 20 yearsnow, but Mike was an acquaintance
of my roommate and God put himin my path one time when I was
25, but Mike was a stable guy.
Mike was a handy guy.
He was not the type of guy Iwould go for deep in my addiction,
but it was a foreshadowing.
(18:32):
So I included that, but there was noway God was going to bring me that,
that stable man in that family I wanted,unless I would give up the alcohol.
And I believe he gives usa measure of free will.
He allows us to come tothe end of ourselves.
And he was saying to me,Melissa are you done yet?
And again and again, I kept goinginto these dangerous situations.
(18:53):
And then at 26, I had the 2 drunkdriving crashes you read about.
And that did stop mydrinking for 18 months.
But sometimes I'm amazed that hespared my life through all that.
And I just want to, you know, I tellthe story because it, it couldn't
be anything other than God thatwould have brought me out of that,
that highway to hell I was on.
Mike (19:12):
Yeah.
Well fast forward then August22nd, 2003, the last blackout.
You know, talk, no cravings after that.
So talk about that transformation.
It's pretty significant 180.
Melissa (19:27):
Yeah.
It's the story that I love to tell.
But when you look back, the lead up to itwas four years of going back and forth.
It was four years of wrestling with, Iknow I need to stop, but I don't want to.
You know, one foot in the world andone foot in, ah, yeah, maybe I'll do a
little of this Bible thing, church thing,because after the drunk driving arrest,
I was scared straight for 18 months.
(19:48):
And I went to AA, I did all thethings dutifully as a good Minnesota
girl would, you know, cause I couldreally turn it on when necessary and
really turn it on for people likeconfirmation class or at the times when
I needed to show them how dutiful I am.
I actually quit the bartending job.
I got a job at a TV station.
As a production assistant,eventually worked my way up to
(20:11):
reporter and weekend anchor.
Amazing how your life turns aroundwhen you stop the chaos of addiction.
I had started this new life, everythingwas going well, I was taking my
daughter to church, but then theenemy started to tell me, you're
not really like those people you seein AA, those like messed up people.
I mean, you're smarter than that.
You can outwit this.
You've never really tried to control it.
(20:31):
So I went back into it for two moreyears, and that's when my father died.
And I want to just stop therejust for a moment before we get to
the August 22nd, 2003, because myfather died on December 12th, 2002.
He was 54.
He was only two years older than I am now.
And people have been throwing himlifelines through his whole life
saying, Dan, you're going to die if youdon't quit, your liver is giving out.
(20:53):
You have the lowest hemoglobinlevel we've ever seen.
And we can't believe you made it.
You're not going to get another chance.
He would go into the hospital, get bloodtransfusions, sometimes go to treatment,
come back out and start drinking again.
The longest I had ever seenhim sober was one week.
After he died on December 12th.
I looked at him and in hishospital bed, and I said to myself.
(21:15):
You can't ever drink again.
There's no way you're drinking again.
But it was kind of like a vow I madeto myself, you know, by my own will.
And then a week later I was drunkand I started to get really scared.
I started to think, you can't stop this.
You thought you could when youwanted it bad enough or when things
got serious enough, you'd stop.
But I had six more relapsesafter that, but something
supernatural changed when he died.
(21:37):
I think I received some measure ofdeliverance in his death that where
the Lord stepped up his pursuit to me.
And this brought us, you know, I had sixdisastrous relapses all punctuated at the
end of the book that could have killed me.
The one at the week of San Diego whereI didn't, people tried for 20 minutes
to wake me up out of drunken stupor.
(21:58):
And then they said, well, is she dead?
And I drank until August 22nd,I had had 49 days of sobriety
and I was white knuckling it.
That's what never worked for mebecause myself will, would run out.
So I decided to go tothe Minnesota State Fair.
I'll tell the story quickly.
Friend of mine, old guy acquaintance,some affable guy who had just come along.
(22:20):
Came with me.
We drove down to the fair fromDuluth, where I used to live.
And on the way down, I just started tothink, maybe I could drink one more time.
Just one more time.
I can do it here at the fair.
Nobody will know.
I'm with him.
He's just a innocent, you know,he's not going to tell me I can't.
So, I started drinking at the fairand I was, as I said in the book,
pounding beers like they were water,cups of water at a marathon checkpoint.
(22:44):
I mean, that's what it waslike, just slamming beers like
you know, I had no off switch.
I came to 12 hours.
I was in a 12 hour blackout.
I came to an estranged motel room.
I remember this morning.
You know, it was muddy and vague, but itwas also vivid where I was just clamoring
to make sense of what had happened.
I was in this cheap motel,this marigold bedspread.
(23:07):
Like it was just a horrific scene.
I didn't know how I had gotten there.
And this guy was leaningover me going, we have to go.
I think your car was towed.
And I've never been so sick, fullof shame, just miserable and broken.
And in Psalm 34:18, it says that Godis close to the brokenhearted and
saves those who are crushed in spirit.
And I've never been socrushed as I was that morning.
(23:30):
I was just at the end of myselfand I did a couple of things.
I made a decision.
I think every addictneeds to make a decision.
And even in my withdrawal and mypanic, I was having a panic attack.
I said to myself, I'mnever drinking again.
And then I...
I've repented.
I didn't really know what that meantat the time, but I agreed with God.
(23:51):
I finally came into agreement withwhat He'd been showing me for so long.
That you're not going to live.
You're not going to have anything.
You're not going to surviveif you keep drinking.
It needs to be no alcohol.
There's no middle ground for you.
I'd been trying to take alcoholand blend it with a functional life
and it was never going to work.
(24:12):
So I repented and I asked God.
I just said a very simple prayer.
I said, please don'tever let me drink again.
And I wanted it with everything I had.
I haven't, this is the part I want tosay, I've never, I haven't had a craving.
I haven't had a day where I thought.
Hey, maybe I'm normal now.
I can have a couple of drinks.
It was like, it was liftedoff me in that moment.
(24:33):
That part was miraculous, nomore craving, no more mental
preoccupation, or obsession.
I still had a lot to learn about.
My other character defects,that's pretty much what this is.
Mike (24:44):
(laugh)
Melissa (24:44):
But what the mental and physical part was gone.
It was like, I had no desire to drinkand I haven't for over 21 years.
Mike (24:53):
Well, that's a moment, a walking, talking third
step of Alcoholics Anonymous.
Turn your will and life over to God.
Maybe that's what you say in thebook, that your favorite Bible
verse is John 16:33, right?
Melissa (25:09):
I don't know.
You know, it's hard to pick a favorite.
But John 16:33, when he says, Takeheart, I have overcome the world.
Mike (25:16):
Yeah.
Melissa (25:16):
I do believe surrender is such a huge thing.
Like I said about the free will.
You know, God has revealed more tome about this because that moment
I didn't know what all I was doing.
I just knew I was broken and miserableand that I could never take a drink again.
And I knew nothing I had tried to do hadworked because I could stop but I couldn't
stay stopped I would always pick it upagain So I think you know programs can
(25:38):
help us and all that stuff can be helpful.
But unless we're doing it with a postureof submission, you know we're seeking
the lord first and we're letting himlead us into the things we need, then
we're running on our own self will.
We're trying to do it in our own power.
And that's what I had always done,just looking outside myself for the
thing that's going to fix me, insteadof letting him run that and trusting
(25:59):
him that he would and he has he'sfaithfully led me into every single
thing I have needed since that day.
Mike (26:05):
Well, we could spend another four podcasts talking about your wonderful
husband, but talk about your work withthe recovery network and your YouTube
show The Hope Project which by theway is also the name of your daughter.
Melissa (26:20):
Her name is Haley, but I called her Hope in the book.
When I started writing...
Mike (26:23):
Oh, funny, funny, funny.
Melissa (26:25):
Yeah.
When I started writingit, she was a minor.
You know, she's 30 now.
Sure, sure.
I was trying to protect her identity.
And then at one point I asked her, hey, doyou want me to put your real name in here?
And she's like, no, you canjust leave it like that.
And I thought it was kind ofneat how I called her Hope.
Mike (26:39):
It is neat.
Yeah.
Melissa (26:40):
Because she, you know, God, she was a surprise.
I mean, we didn't planher, but God really...
She kept me alive.
I mean, she gave me a reason to live.
She did much more than that.
But in those years of my bartendingdays, you know, I had to be functional
for her and I really tried tokeep that life separate from her.
I wouldn't say I always succeededwith that, but she was so much a
(27:02):
source of inspiration and hope tome, and she's such an old soul.
But I did get married one year after that.
Some AA people might have discouragedthat, but Mike came back into my life
three weeks after I quit drinking.
He and I ended up at this event.
We didn't know we'd been workingacross the street from each other.
I was at the TV station andhe worked across the street.
(27:22):
We had never crossed paths.
And I went over there to do a story,just a quick little sound bite.
I didn't even want to go to the story.
And, but it was the story of mylife because Mike was there and
then we reconnected and he said,Hey, you want to go out for lunch?
And we kind of took it slow fora few months, but we ended up
getting married a year after we met.
And it was great.
We had a really awesome, idylliccourtship, whirlwind courtship.
(27:47):
We had two more daughters in 2008and 2010, but I wouldn't say our road
has been perfectly seamless becauseMike came from an addicted family.
He wasn't an addict himself, which waswhat was most important to me then.
But we know what happensin addicted families.
And even though you're not theaddict he picked up a lot of those
traits of perfectionism, workaholism.
So all of these things, the Lord hasused to refine us in our marriage.
(28:11):
Because early on, I made him anidol and I put him before God
and I had to be stripped of that.
So we went through a dark time.
It was 13 years ago, but we came through,we've been married for 20 years this
past September and he's a huge blessing.
He is absolutely the manthat God chose for me.
I tried to circumvent it and gosome other roads first, but he's an
(28:33):
amazing father, amazing man, and we'vegrown a lot together in the Lord.
We had to make Christ thefoundation of our marriage though,
which we didn't do at first.
And I don't know how peoplestay married without that.
Mike (28:45):
It is amazing how two people who come from really dysfunctional families
think that they can magically becomethe Keatons from Family Ties, right?
Melissa (28:55):
Oh, I know.
You're so right.
And I thought everything was just going tobe phenomenal because I had quit drinking.
I had the obsession lifted.
I went into counseling, you know, Iworked at the TV station for, I think,
two more years and then it closed.
And people were moving all overthe country doing market jumps.
But I went back to school andbecame an addiction counselor.
I did that for 12 years and workedin intensive outpatient treatment.
(29:19):
I saw about 55 people aweek at the height of it.
And toward the end, I was gettingsome burnout, some compassion fatigue,
and that's when I met Mike Lindell,and he wanted to launch this website
to help people with addiction.
So he brought me on in 2018, and wehave the LindellRecoveryNetwork.org.
It's a directory of Churches,Christian treatment centers,
free resources for addicts.
(29:40):
It's just all free.
Mike is a former crack addict.
So we had a lot in common and wedon't believe in the disease model.
We believe Jesus is thehealer and the answer.
So everything on that sitepoints people to Jesus.
And then four years ago,we started the Hope Report.
And when I met Mike, he wouldwalk around saying, one of these
days, I'm going to have a show.
It's only going to be good news.
(30:00):
I'm going to call it the Hope Report.
Well, I didn't know I'dhave any part of that.
But the Lord brought thebroadcasting thing back around again.
Only back then when I was in TV news, Iwas kind of doing it from a broken place.
Although, you know, Ilove the storytelling.
I loved a lot of the aspects ofthe job, but I wanted to be seen.
I wanted to be validated.
But now I get to do abroadcasting job for the Lord.
(30:23):
I mean, everything I do is Bible orit's helping addicts by teaching them
the truth and Jesus can set them free.
And so it's an inspirationalshow every day at 1 p.
m.
Central, and it's on YouTube,Facebook, Frank Speech, and on
Mike Lindell's other outlets.
Mike (30:41):
Well, and of course, I said it to begin with, but there's a link to that
attached to the blurb of the podcast.
You know, I'll let you go, butyou know, this has been terrific.
The story is so inspiring that youcan walk those streets in those
small little towns that are littered.
(31:02):
You know, Melissa, you and I both knowin this part of the world, there's a
lot of stories just like ours, right?
So the Hope Report goesthrough your whole life.
There's a lot of hopethrough your whole life.
For those of you listening, wewant to thank Melissa for her
inspiration, faith, and hope.
(31:23):
And if you are listening, I hope youfind love and support wherever you are.
Always thank you for listening.
We want you to be safe and keep looking.
It's right in front ofyou, or sitting beside you.
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