June 25, 2025 • 28 mins
The road to success is not lined with empty liquor bottles. Ian Fee shares his story of addiction and redemption. Ian is a successful author and entrepreneur and the creator of Make It Great (MIG). Proudly sober since 2017, he has dedicated himself to personal growth, family, and living a life of purpose and clarity. Ian is the author of a new book, “Wild Ride to Sobriety: A Transformation From Drunken Oblivion to Profound Clarity.” He can be reached at https://makeitgreat.me
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:12):
Welcome everybody.
This is Avoiding the Addiction Affliction,brought to you by Westwords Consulting.
I'm Mike McGowan.
Recovery doesn't show up on a scheduleand the route it takes is unpredictable.
My guest today, Ian Fee, started sippingbeer at the age of, are you ready?
One.
He bartended at 13, then built abusiness from the ground up in 2003
(00:36):
and endured two failed marriages, andultimately sold his company in 2016.
While as he says, he was fat and drunk inVegas, Ian then reached a breaking point.
We're gonna talk about that today, andbegan his journey to reclaim his life.
He's a successful author with a new book.
Wild Ride to Sobriety.
(00:56):
It's great.
He's an entrepreneur, creator of MakeIt Great, proudly sober since 2017.
He has dedicated himself topersonal growth, family, and living
a life of purpose and clarity.
He's gonna talk about that journey fromaddiction to empowerment with us today.
Welcome Ian thanks so much for joining us.
Oh man.
I appreciate you so much for having me andfor all that you do through your service.
(01:20):
Oh, that's nice of you to say.
I wanna start with your story.
I always start with the story and yourterrific book, Wild Ride to Sobriety.
I really enjoyed it.
I really love the cover art too.
How'd you come up with thator who came up with that?
That is actually a real picture.
I was about eight, nine yearsold in Bellingham, Washington.
This is you?
Yeah.
(laughs) I didn't even realize that.
That's even better.
(01:40):
Yep.
Yep.
That is me in my livingroom in Bellingham.
That is a real Marlboro.
That is a real banquet of beer.
Oh geez.
(laughs) Six shooters.
They had to filter downthe picture a little bit.
And the best part that's not inthere is that I pissed my pants.
Oh, there you go.
There you go.
I'm glad we left that off the cover.
I'll send you the actual pictureand you'll get a amazing chuckle
(02:01):
and be like, oh my God, you shouldhave had the whole cover in there.
Oh my gosh, that is just, well, alright.
Like a lot of us, and we've talkedabout this a lot on here, you
grew up around alcohol, but youhave a quote early in your book.
That I think is interesting.
You and I were talking off theair a little bit about having
opposite reactions to alcohol.
You say, I grew up yearning to join theinebriated inner circle of cool adults.
(02:27):
Yep.
Oh, that's real.
There's a lot there.
There is a lot there.
You know, when you grow up with alcoholyou know, my parents were, I don't know,
you could call 'em social alcoholics.
Did they drink too much?
Maybe sometimes, but it wasjust a consistent thing.
Like everything evolved around alcohol.
We were gonna go to barbecues andlike bring your own beer in a,
(02:48):
you know, a bottle of Black Velvetwho's bringing the 7Up and you
know, hey, maybe it's wine night.
I just grew up with that.
When we had parties like in mybook at the age of 13, I started
bartending my own parents' partiesso I could make some money.
'cause I realized.
You know, the more I gave thesepeople the drink, they're like,
oh, what a cute little kid.
He dressed up and, you know, he had alittle tie on and be like, I remember
(03:09):
people's drinks today when I was 13,what my parents' best friends would
drink, Black Velvet Seven, you know vodkawith a splash of Sprite with two lime.
Like I remember it all.
So before their drinks would get empty, Iwould go pour another one and I'd be like,
oh my God, your son's so cute and amazing.
Here's a couple dollars,here's a couple dollars.
I was like, this is fabulous.
(03:29):
But I grew up around it.
And you were always drinking then.
Then what?
You started drinking yourself at what age?
I really didn't start drinking.
It wasn't like at 13, I'm sippingtheirs and be like, poor a little
for them, poor a little for me.
That wasn't me.
I really didn't dabble a whole lotin alcohol in high school, but as
soon as I got into college and Imoved to San Diego, man, it was
(03:51):
big mouth Mickey's and I actuallyeven I, this story's outta my book.
I probably should have put it, I hadthis old Toyota pickup truck, S 2002
wheel drive, long box, cranker windows.
Thank God it had AC but you know,when you pull the windshield wiper
fluid, it sprays the windows.
Well, my buddy and I punched a hole.
Clean that thing out, clean it outwith vinegar, hoard it with vodka,
(04:12):
punched a hole through the dashboard.
We would go to 7-Eleven.
Get those big mouth Mickey's.
A Sprite or you know, whatever.
And we would go drive and pull thewindshield fluid wiper and fill our big
mouth with vodka and thought it was great.
Cruising around SanDiego and Mission Beach.
Like, that wasn't a red flag.
(04:33):
I don't know what would be.
I've heard a lot.
I've never heard of people fillingand then drinking out of a straw
from their windshield wiper fluid.
But you know, when you grow uparound it, it's not surprising.
Then when you're post high schoolwhen you had some adversity that
you then turn to drinking to cope.
That's what you saw.
So why wouldn't thatbe a coping mechanism?
(04:55):
For sure.
And I'm 52 today and I'm goingthrough therapy on this NAD therapy.
And I'm like, everything relates toin your life, back to your childhood.
Yep.
And you gotta go figure outwhat that trigger is, what
that emotion is, what that is.
And I didn't realize how muchchildhood trauma and I didn't think
I was that traumatized as a kid.
But everything goes backto your childhood from my.
(05:15):
Obviously the cover of thebook, like that's a problem.
Age of one drinking beer, 13.
Like, where did all thesesuppressed feelings come from?
And I'm learning them now at 52.
(laughs)
Hey better late than never, right?
It doesn't, you know.
For sure.
You know, my dad when he wanted to loseweight, he switched from beer to whiskey.
(05:36):
You have a similar story in yourbook when you were in your forties.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's like, you know, the old sayingof like hey, you're drinking two, you
know, vodka sodas go down like water.
And I could, I could drink vodkasodas every, every 11 minutes,
which is a lot, sometimes eightminutes, depending on my location.
And then it'd be like, Hey, you know what?
I've really slowed down.
I'm just drinking Coors Light
(05:56):
Mm-hmm.
And that was like my justificationin my own little brain of like,
oh, I really slowed down in parts.
I don't do Fireball shots anymore.
I just do, I just do Coors Light andit's crazy that things you can justify
in your own mind to justify your actions.
Yeah.
You, you look really fit now.
What do you do to keep yourself fit?
I work out almost every day.
A lot of walking, weights.
(06:18):
I really kind of over the last, you know,seven and a half years of not drinking,
kind of just stacked all these babybaby wins and, and my morning routines.
Yeah.
I get up in the morning,I do some breath work.
I don't look at my phone for half hour.
I get outside.
I take some deep breaths, do two,three minutes of breath work.
I really kind of learned to getmy body going in the morning.
Before I even look at my phone.
(06:38):
So I got a pretty good half hourroutine before, you know, just get
my mind right and my body right.
And you know, walking is a big thing.
Fitness, health, wellness, and fitnessis kind of like my new, my new addiction.
So yeah, I've lost 80 pounds.
Wow.
[inaudible] and I feel like amillion bucks and clarity and just a
whole new purpose in life for sure.
It's like nothing goodcame outta drinking for me.
(06:59):
That picture you have in your book nextto the one in high school where you had
let yourself go a little bit is stunning.
I wouldn't have even recognized you.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's, that was probably my peak andI think that was actually in Vegas.
When I sold my company, it gotfunded in the bank account.
I was like, I dunno, 264 pounds anddrunk and fat and just a Large Marge.
(07:22):
Well, let's talk aboutyour business for a minute.
'cause I've worked with a lot of peopleover the years who have their own business
and are really successful and you gointo it, you were successful, you said,
in part because of your ability to show'em a good time, quote unquote, right?
Yeah, yeah.
Whining and dining them.
My superpower and I believed it.
(07:43):
And lived it.
That booze was my superpower.
I've always been a good networker.
Obviously, probably started when Iwas 13 with my friend's parents and
pretty social and I was always a peoplepleaser and knew how to read a room
and understood what motivated people.
And I kind of brought that energyand I did that in my business.
But I thought it was, Hey,let's go have martini lunches.
(08:04):
I'll get 'em outside their business.
And then martini lunches turned intosteak dinners with bottles of wine.
And then be like, whyshould the party end?
Why don't we just come back to myhouse and go into the hot tub, maybe
do some fireball shots, maybe openanother bottle of wine and rinse
and repeat four or five days a week.
So I was growing this network inmy business and great relationships
with my business partners, and Ithought booze was my superpower.
(08:27):
Like, well, hey, I can't be home tonightbecause I gotta go entertain clients.
I gotta go take them to a baseballgame and we're gonna have beers.
Maybe we'll go to a strip club.
Hey, I might even come home with a 12pack and we're gonna sit in the hot tub.
So I might be home by midnight,but it might get a little loud.
Yeah.
And repeat.
And that just wasn't one day a week.
Those were multiple times a week.
And that's how I kind of blew out,you know, two failed marriages,
(08:48):
which I'm absolutely not proud of.
Booze was in my mind a superpower.
I was an all American [inaudible].
Well then how do you,that's self perpetuating.
If that's the way you're makingyour living, then how do you show
somebody a good time again withquotes if you're not gonna drink?
(09:09):
Well, it's was just a mindset.
I am probably better at it.
I can still be around.
I can still be in a bar.
I don't have that, you know,like, Hey, don't drink around me.
I can still buy people drinks.
I don't care, if you wannadrink, drink, I don't care.
I'm not here to preach you not to drink.
So I have no judgment there.
And I can be in bars, I can be out, youknow, we do a lot of conferences in Vegas.
(09:31):
I could be out till midnight, one o'clock.
I can get people drinks and I havejust as much fun, if not more fun.
Yeah.
One because I remember it and I'mnot the big drunken idiot that, if a
party's going hot, I can make it hotter.
And the biggest thing is I don'thave the regrets in the morning.
I'd be like, in the mornings you'd belooking at your phone and be like, oh no.
(09:51):
Yeah.
Did I say that?
Or text that?
Oh shit.
Why'd I call that personat one?
Oh my gosh, did I leave him a voicemail?
I have no regrets.
And it's so refreshing to be up inthe morning clearheaded and having
none of that anxiety, if you will.
It's just a differentmindset of, you know.
It's not just about sobriety, right?
(10:12):
It's about overcoming adversity andreally just changing your mindset
of like, who do you wanna be?
It's like in rehab.
I was going into rehab for mywife, my kids, my business, my
friends, my business partners,everybody else but me, everybody.
On that third day of rehab, thegood Lord touched me on the shoulder
and like, Hey, look in the mirror.
(10:33):
Unless you're right, absolutely nothingwill ever, ever be right in your lives.
So you need to get your shit togetherand worry about you and get your mindset
right, or you can try to be all this foreverybody else and that really hit me.
And I want you to talk aboutthat, because when you checked
yourself into, what, where was it?
Schick in Seattle.
Was it Seattle?
Yeah.
It's called Schick Shadel in Seattle.
(10:55):
Yeah.
You went through something thatI've talked to people since
I read your book about it.
We have a little network soyou, I'm gonna let you go.
What did they do for, so I wannasay to you, but it's for you, right?
It was, it's called Schick Shadel,and it's called aversion therapy.
And it's 10 days and I really didn'twanna go to a Betty Ford for 30
(11:15):
because I still running my company.
I still have kids baseball and you know,thinking I was being a good husband.
So I wanted to go short.
So I found this place happened to be in mybackyard in Seattle called Schick Shadel.
And it's 10 days of aversion therapy.
And what aversion therapy is the peoplethat have kids know what ipecac is.
So you go into this place, youcan leave if you opted to, but
you stay 10 days in this facility.
(11:37):
And there's some counseling that goesalong with it, but there, you know,
the aversion pieces, you kind of gointo like a doctor's office and where
they have all their utensils and stuff.
Well, it's a full bar and you sit downand in front of you is this ginormous
mirror, a silver bucket, your chair,and then your nurse, which we call them
bartenders, and they give you some ipecac.
(11:59):
Which induces nausea and vomiting.
You know, if your kidsswallow something...
poison.
Yep.
They induce vomiting.
And so they give you 16 ounces of that andthen 16 ounce glass of warm salt water.
Oh.
And you swallow the salt water?
Swallow the salt water.
And for me it was about seven, nineminutes that you did not feel good.
(12:21):
You felt like your worst hangoverin the world, your mouths watering,
and then they pour you a shot.
Mine started with vodka andthey try to get 18 shots in you.
So they, you take this shot, youswish it around in your mouth and
spit it out in the silver bowl.
And probably about the second shot,let's say the second one's whiskey, black
(12:42):
velvet, swish it around in your mouth.
By this time you're throwing up.
They try to get 18.
So typically my, I could get one switchedaround and be like, oh yeah, no problem.
Two would come, it's all over.
And then they give you fireball,red wine, Coors Light, Scotch,
Baileys and try to get 18.
And you're at some of them, you'reputting 'em on your lips and you
(13:04):
can't even, it can't even touchyour lips and you're throwing up
profusely and that was the tough part.
So you do that for.
It felt like a long time, butmaybe a half hour, 25 minutes,
they take you back to your room.
No electronics, no phones, no tv, andthey wheel in this, you sit at the end
of your bed and then there's a pinkbucket, and I remember specifically
(13:27):
there was a clock right above me.
For about an hour and a half.
You're just gettingthis outta your system.
You are violentlypuking, not feeling good.
Every 10 minutes a nurse wouldcome in and check your oxygen
and make sure you're still alive.
And then at the hour and a half, mark,oh my God, I'm turning the corner.
They come in 16 ounces of ipecac.
16 ounces of warm salt water again,and you go for another hour and a
(13:50):
half of just violently throwing up.
And the, when they emptied out the shotsthey, they put it in a little towel so
they would put that towel next to inyour room and be like, Hey, you gotta
smell when you throw up, smell the towel.
And is just, and it was horrible.
So after about three hours,you're absolutely gassed, and
(14:13):
then you're kind of free to gowhatever class was going on there.
There was always a group session going onand I would go, maybe go grab a cracker.
Like I, we've all been there.
You haven't, super hungover.
He'd be like, I could, I just needa piece of bread or something.
So I'd go naw on alittle bit of a cracker.
Feel like shit the rest of the day.
Listening to people in theirdrinking stories and be like
I'm, I'm never doing this again.
(14:34):
And then, so that's day one.
Next day they sedate you.
So you go into same room, they give youan IV and they get into your subconscious.
So you're sedated enough to notknow they're in your subconscious.
And there's obviously you got yournurse you got the IV doctor, and
(14:55):
then you're assigned a therapist andthey ask you 26 different questions.
Random, like, who's a bad influence?
Where'd you drink?
Where do you think drinking started?
And you're answering all thesequestions and then you're
sedated maybe 8 to 12 minutes.
When you come out it, youare on top of the world.
(15:15):
It's such an energy dump.
They put you in your room for half hourjust to be like, Hey, settle down, and
then you go spend three hours with yourcounselor and review these 26 questions
that you're like, I answered what?
I didn't even think of that person.
And it was absolutely insane.
So you do that your second day andthen your third day you look on
your schedule and be like, Ooh.
(15:35):
They call 'em Duffy days.
You'd be like, Ooh, my Duffy's at one 30.
Which I didn't like the 1:30 ones.
'cause you're just waiting, anticipating.
And before you go on your Duffydays, you have to drink a gallon
of, I chose blue Powerade.
To this day, my kids know there isno blue Powerade, no blue Gatorade.
There ain't nothing.
My mouth will water if I seeblue Gatorade to this day.
And there are no silver bowlsin my house to be found.
(15:58):
(Laughs)
My aversion was so high coming out ofthere and their success rate was like 78%.
It was phenomenal.
I've kind of sad that they'reclosed 'cause their success rate
was incredible and I had a couplebuddies in front of me go through it
as well and their aversion is stillextremely high nine 10 years later.
Was there some research behind18 as opposed to 17 or 22?
(16:22):
18 man.
It might've been thefounder's favorite number.
I don't know why 18.
I have no idea.
Because at four or fiveyou're like, okay, I'm good.
I am at stop because...
So how many days did you repeat that then?
So you do five puke days.
So you do a Duffy day, your throw up day.
You do your sedation day, Duffy day.
Sedation day.
(16:42):
So five days of it, but everyother day, then you're off.
And the reason I wanted youto talk about this is, people
have heard me say this before.
Something works for somebody, oreverything works for somebody.
Yeah.
You know, who knows?
Like you said, if they had 78%,so when you got out after 10
days, you were like, that is it.
(17:04):
Yeah.
I had zero, zero interest.
One, I don't even know if I could,without throwing up if somebody gave me
a beer and be like, Nope, not happening.
Do you count your soberday as the day you got out?
(laughs) Or because youwere sipping the whole time.
So.
Yeah, they have you swish itaround in your mouth and then you,
you just, you can't get it down.
Well, I think, you know, like yousaid, you went in there thinking,
(17:25):
I'm gonna, I'm gonna save everything.
And I think it's kind ofpoignant that the day you got
out wasn't your best day either.
Yeah, I got served papers.
But the damage was so far gone for me.
There was really no saving it,even though in my mind I was like,
Hey, I'm gonna give this a whirl.
I'm gonna give it my shot.
And like, look at me.
I'm a new man.
You know, coming out of that 10days, I actually lost 13 pounds.
(17:46):
One because you're notkeeping anything down.
And that was a pivotal point for me oflike, man, I could go back to drinking.
Like, you know.
I did all this for nothing.
Yeah.
You know, shame, a lot of guilt.
And then I had my circle in my kids thatwere just troops for me, man, they, they
pulled me out of, you know, a tailspin oflike, Hey, remind yourself, you gotta get
(18:07):
yourself right and then we'll be fine.
So I had a really good circle thattoday is my ride or die, for sure.
Yeah.
We're gonna talk about them in a minute.
You know, it's funny, you mentionedkids earlier, they don't care,
do they when they're younger?
If you're at work, if you're hungover,if you're in a bar, if you're not
there, it's just, where's dad?
(18:29):
Right?
And there is, the word present hasa whole new meaning for me today.
Because I was the RV dad.
I had an RV and we'd go to the kidssoftball games, baseball games, and I
was, you know, my RV was really a barbecause I was the life of the party.
I was making sure everybody had redsolo cups in the stands, whether
(18:51):
it be, if it was a morning game,we're having Bailey's and coffee.
If it's an afternoon game, we're doingCoors Light, and I made sure everybody
in the stands are good while behind me.
My kids are playing.
So I was there, but I wasn't present.
Mm-hmm.
And there's a big, bigdifference between the two.
Yeah.
Talk about Make It Great,
Make It Great actually started in thesmoker's lounge, sitting outside of rehab.
(19:15):
I wasn't a smoker, but I was prettysocial and pretty good with people
and I always had kind of this vibe andenergy for people of being a leader
and a mentor and pretty positivein the situation that we're in.
And make it great was justkind of a somebody says like,
you make everybody feel great.
You make everybody feel great.
And like, so our whole environment'sgreat when you're around.
And I was like, man, we should starta company and call it, Make It Great.
(19:38):
And, you know, let's gomake an impact in the world.
And like, you know, had a couple people.
And on this, this big table oneof the gals actually created the
logo with a Sharpie on the table.
It's still there.
When I went and did a speaking gig.
I dunno, however long, nineyears ago or six years ago.
And it kind of started that way andthen it kind of morphed into like my
(19:58):
kids were just coming outta college, mydaughter like, Hey, why don't we just,
you know, start a speaking gig to go makean impact on high school and colleges.
And then it kinda sat dormant for a while.
Which I'm gonna start ramping it back upnow with, with the book and just really
how can you go make somebody feel great?
What can you do to have a great day?
You know, I think I had it before,you know make America, right?
(20:20):
Mm-hmm.
It's the same, same, same thing.
Look at it however you want.
How can you be better every day?
How can you make somebody feel good today?
How can you make somebodyfeel great today?
So yeah, that's kinda, it all startedsitting around the smokers lounge.
Well, and it's a family affair.
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
You know, it started with my, my kiddos.
My kids are on the website and.
So proud of them and they, theyhave no idea how much impact they've
(20:44):
made on me on this sober journey.
And I actually had 'em write in the book.
Yeah.
Some of their experiences.
Yeah.
Do you mind talking about that?
That's interesting to me.
'Cause that's a risk you took, right?
You, 'cause you know, well, the riskyou took is what are they gonna say?
Right?
Because as you said, you weren't there.
(21:06):
So, yeah, I'm pretty naked in thisbook, and I wanted it to be so real
and so authentic, and if people judgeit, I really didn't give a shit.
Mm-hmm.
Because if it resonated withsomebody to be a better mom, a
better dad, better business owner,a better friend, that's what the
whole reason of this book was for.
So, yeah, I had my kids, they grewup with, the party animal dad, what
kind of dad, what, what kind of dadam I gonna get when he walks in the.
(21:28):
Drunk happy Dad.
Is he gonna be drunk, sad, angry Dad.
How many people are coming in behind him?
Are we having a party again on a Tuesday?
So I had my three kids write letters.
My oldest son who still drinkstoday, not nearly as much as when
I was drinking because I would pushthem to do shots and fireball and
like, Hey, have your friends over.
Come on.
And he has a story in thereof like, what's your biggest
(21:50):
memory of your dad drinking?
Like, oh man.
Sundays we could, you, you could havebreakfast, lunch, dinner in the hot tub.
We're doing Bloody Mary's, wehaving beers and people are
over and we're playing cornhole.
And and then my daughter who's a coupleyears younger would be like, well, I
didn't know what kind of dad I was gonnaget, and I would have to text you to turn
down the music so I could do my homework.
(22:10):
While I'm having this full blownparty downstairs, you know, dancing
and music loud, and the speakers arein the ceiling and so her room's just
thumping while she's trying to studygoing to Seattle U and then my youngest,
who was seven, really just doesn'tremember a whole lot of drinking.
But you know, where's dad?
(22:31):
At 7, 8, 9, they're like, where's dad?
Oh.
And mom would cover and be like,oh, he is got a work function.
Mm-hmm.
Or he's here or there where sheprobably really didn't even know
where I was at, but probablyknew I was drinking somewhere.
So a lot of this emotional talkabout, but those stories are in
there 'cause that is real life.
Have you thought about havinghim write a letter now?
(22:52):
No, but that's a great idea.
Nobody's ever asked me that.
That's a great idea of like.
Then and now, I guess.
Yeah.
Yeah, because it, there's a, you know, thepersonality's probably still there, right?
Oh
yeah.
So do you, do you go to how do you,you talked about going to a therapist.
Yeah.
Do you attend meetings?
Are you a 12 step person?
Do you do reading?
What, how do you do it?
I've never attended one.
(23:12):
My oldest brother is frequentsome.
You know, on a weekly basis.
I have one of my very closest friends,who used to attend meetings, and he was
like, Hey, after he got sober and he,he went to my rehab, that Schick Shadel
aversion therapy to go back into AA.
It was really negative for him.
It really hit him reallyhard in a negative way.
(23:34):
Like, man, these stories and thenegativity in the vibe, it just hurt him.
But I've never been to one.
So I have a life coachAngie, that's out of Florida.
Who I speak with every Wednesday,super early in the morning.
And it's just good for life,relationships, business,
keeps me accountable on mygoals, my drive, my ambitions.
And I go see an NED therapist,which focuses a lot really on your
(23:58):
domestication of your childhood.
Of like how, you know, I'm really intolike, how can you be better every day?
Mm-hmm.
And how can I learn these triggers oremotions or things that be like, why
did I get all weirded out on that.
And my guy takes me all the wayback to like, let's figure out
was it at age 10, 12, 21, 22?
Where was this trigger for you?
(24:19):
And once you can kind ofidentify 'em, it's like, oh my
God, that makes complete sense.
Why am I letting that bother me?
And sometimes it's just that, youknow, I have a story in there about
my girlfriend of running water.
I grew up very poor.
Running water, be like, Heyif it's yellow, let it mellow.
If the water's running, you'relike, turn the fucking water off.
(24:41):
What are we doing?
Mm-hmm.
And it was, I didn't know why this wassuch a big trigger for me and my gal.
Angie's like, well, let's walk backand figure out like, how'd you grow up?
Like poor.
What was it like?
Did you have to turn the water off?
Yeah.
Like you, you fill the sink up withand wash dishes until it got cold.
And then, you know, you put 'emin the dishwasher and be like,
(25:01):
I want you to do me a favor.
I want you to go home and ask Shelbyhow was she brought up doing dishes?
And it sounds so minor and petty.
And I'd be like, Hey babe.
What was it like when, when you grewup be like, oh my God, we had to
run hot water and the dishes had tobe spotless before they even went
into the, to the washing machine.
And right there, the light bulb went off.
Like, why am I letting water bother me?
(25:23):
She grew up this way.
I grew up that way.
It makes complete sense.
Like, let the water go.
It's okay.
But that bothered me for years.
And I just get quiet.
I get pouty.
I mean, I get all these goofy emotions,overrunning warm water, which is insane.
And to this day, let her run, let her run.
(25:44):
You know, that's fascinating'cause I think we all have those.
And sometimes Ian, you can figure 'em outand sometimes I had a, a friend of mine
say, I said, why does coughing bother me?
And he goes, well, because of yourprevious life experience in the
middle ages with tuberculosis.
And I went like this.
And he goes, that's a lot, right?
And I said, why do he goes.
(26:06):
Who knows.
You said you may figure it out,but you may never figure it out.
Right.
But in the meantime, youcan still have a good life.
Right?
Right.
So I'll let you go with this.
What are the upsides to living the lifethe way you are now and not drinking?
Everything is better.
My relationships arebetter, my health is better.
(26:28):
My priorities are better.
My relationships with myclosest circle is like no other.
I used to have this ginormouscircle and I could get a party
together in 10 minutes at my house.
And really, I just care about my...
Yeah.
My family and my closest circle.
I could give, you know, it pretty hardto come into my closest circle these
(26:50):
days because they're so intimate.
There's nothing off boundaries.
We can laugh together.
We can cry together.
Anything and everythingcan be talked about.
And before I was numbing it and Ididn't realize I was just numbing
all these emotions and feelings.
And then when you have to sit inyour own dirty diaper for a little
while and deal with your emotionsand feel it, it's a game changer.
Especially if you have the mindsetof like, Hey, I want to be better.
(27:12):
I want to improve daily.
I wanna be a, a better parent.
I, I wanna be a better leader.
I wanna be a better boyfriend,fiance, husband, whatever.
If you go into that mindset,it's a game changer for me.
And health and fitnessis like my dopamine hit.
Like I'm addicted to working out.
I'm, you know, walked this morning,we're gonna go to the gym after this.
Like that is my dopaminefix and my energy level.
(27:35):
I had pretty high energy levelwhen I was drinking, even
though it was my superpower.
I have that if not more, and if Iwasn't drinking back in the days
when I sold my company, my companyprobably would've been 10 x.
It was like I relate it to, and a goodbody always supposed to be like, I'm
driving down the HOV fast lane with theemergency brake on and to today I have no
(27:57):
emergency brake on and I am just going.
Awesome.
Ian, I told you earlier howmuch I enjoyed your book.
It was really a quick read.
It was fascinating.
It was fun, and it was alsovery moving at the same time.
We're gonna put links to all of Ian'sstuff on the tag of this podcast.
Thanks for your story.
It's inspiring, it's honest, andalso for your work, for those
(28:20):
of you listening and watching.
We hope you find love, courage,support wherever you are.
Thanks for listening.
Be safe and if you'restruggling, keep looking.
It's there.
It's right there.
You just gotta find it.
Welcome everybody.
This is Avoiding the Addiction Affliction,brought to you by Westwords Consulting.
I'm Mike McGowan.
Recovery doesn't show up on a scheduleand the route it takes is unpredictable.
My guest today, Ian Fee, started sippingbeer at the age of, are you ready?
One.
He bartended at 13, then built abusiness from the ground up in 2003
(00:36):
and endured two failed marriages, andultimately sold his company in 2016.
While as he says, he was fat and drunk inVegas, Ian then reached a breaking point.
We're gonna talk about that today, andbegan his journey to reclaim his life.
He's a successful author with a new book.
Wild Ride to Sobriety.
(00:56):
It's great.
He's an entrepreneur, creator of MakeIt Great, proudly sober since 2017.
He has dedicated himself topersonal growth, family, and living
a life of purpose and clarity.
He's gonna talk about that journey fromaddiction to empowerment with us today.
Welcome Ian thanks so much for joining us.
Oh man.
I appreciate you so much for having me andfor all that you do through your service.
(01:20):
Oh, that's nice of you to say.
I wanna start with your story.
I always start with the story and yourterrific book, Wild Ride to Sobriety.
I really enjoyed it.
I really love the cover art too.
How'd you come up with thator who came up with that?
That is actually a real picture.
I was about eight, nine yearsold in Bellingham, Washington.
This is you?
Yeah.
(laughs) I didn't even realize that.
That's even better.
(01:40):
Yep.
Yep.
That is me in my livingroom in Bellingham.
That is a real Marlboro.
That is a real banquet of beer.
Oh geez.
(laughs) Six shooters.
They had to filter downthe picture a little bit.
And the best part that's not inthere is that I pissed my pants.
Oh, there you go.
There you go.
I'm glad we left that off the cover.
I'll send you the actual pictureand you'll get a amazing chuckle
(02:01):
and be like, oh my God, you shouldhave had the whole cover in there.
Oh my gosh, that is just, well, alright.
Like a lot of us, and we've talkedabout this a lot on here, you
grew up around alcohol, but youhave a quote early in your book.
That I think is interesting.
You and I were talking off theair a little bit about having
opposite reactions to alcohol.
You say, I grew up yearning to join theinebriated inner circle of cool adults.
(02:27):
Yep.
Oh, that's real.
There's a lot there.
There is a lot there.
You know, when you grow up with alcoholyou know, my parents were, I don't know,
you could call 'em social alcoholics.
Did they drink too much?
Maybe sometimes, but it wasjust a consistent thing.
Like everything evolved around alcohol.
We were gonna go to barbecues andlike bring your own beer in a,
(02:48):
you know, a bottle of Black Velvetwho's bringing the 7Up and you
know, hey, maybe it's wine night.
I just grew up with that.
When we had parties like in mybook at the age of 13, I started
bartending my own parents' partiesso I could make some money.
'cause I realized.
You know, the more I gave thesepeople the drink, they're like,
oh, what a cute little kid.
He dressed up and, you know, he had alittle tie on and be like, I remember
(03:09):
people's drinks today when I was 13,what my parents' best friends would
drink, Black Velvet Seven, you know vodkawith a splash of Sprite with two lime.
Like I remember it all.
So before their drinks would get empty, Iwould go pour another one and I'd be like,
oh my God, your son's so cute and amazing.
Here's a couple dollars,here's a couple dollars.
I was like, this is fabulous.
(03:29):
But I grew up around it.
And you were always drinking then.
Then what?
You started drinking yourself at what age?
I really didn't start drinking.
It wasn't like at 13, I'm sippingtheirs and be like, poor a little
for them, poor a little for me.
That wasn't me.
I really didn't dabble a whole lotin alcohol in high school, but as
soon as I got into college and Imoved to San Diego, man, it was
(03:51):
big mouth Mickey's and I actuallyeven I, this story's outta my book.
I probably should have put it, I hadthis old Toyota pickup truck, S 2002
wheel drive, long box, cranker windows.
Thank God it had AC but you know,when you pull the windshield wiper
fluid, it sprays the windows.
Well, my buddy and I punched a hole.
Clean that thing out, clean it outwith vinegar, hoard it with vodka,
(04:12):
punched a hole through the dashboard.
We would go to 7-Eleven.
Get those big mouth Mickey's.
A Sprite or you know, whatever.
And we would go drive and pull thewindshield fluid wiper and fill our big
mouth with vodka and thought it was great.
Cruising around SanDiego and Mission Beach.
Like, that wasn't a red flag.
(04:33):
I don't know what would be.
I've heard a lot.
I've never heard of people fillingand then drinking out of a straw
from their windshield wiper fluid.
But you know, when you grow uparound it, it's not surprising.
Then when you're post high schoolwhen you had some adversity that
you then turn to drinking to cope.
That's what you saw.
So why wouldn't thatbe a coping mechanism?
(04:55):
For sure.
And I'm 52 today and I'm goingthrough therapy on this NAD therapy.
And I'm like, everything relates toin your life, back to your childhood.
Yep.
And you gotta go figure outwhat that trigger is, what
that emotion is, what that is.
And I didn't realize how muchchildhood trauma and I didn't think
I was that traumatized as a kid.
But everything goes backto your childhood from my.
(05:15):
Obviously the cover of thebook, like that's a problem.
Age of one drinking beer, 13.
Like, where did all thesesuppressed feelings come from?
And I'm learning them now at 52.
(laughs)
Hey better late than never, right?
It doesn't, you know.
For sure.
You know, my dad when he wanted to loseweight, he switched from beer to whiskey.
(05:36):
You have a similar story in yourbook when you were in your forties.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's like, you know, the old sayingof like hey, you're drinking two, you
know, vodka sodas go down like water.
And I could, I could drink vodkasodas every, every 11 minutes,
which is a lot, sometimes eightminutes, depending on my location.
And then it'd be like, Hey, you know what?
I've really slowed down.
I'm just drinking Coors Light
(05:56):
Mm-hmm.
And that was like my justificationin my own little brain of like,
oh, I really slowed down in parts.
I don't do Fireball shots anymore.
I just do, I just do Coors Light andit's crazy that things you can justify
in your own mind to justify your actions.
Yeah.
You, you look really fit now.
What do you do to keep yourself fit?
I work out almost every day.
A lot of walking, weights.
(06:18):
I really kind of over the last, you know,seven and a half years of not drinking,
kind of just stacked all these babybaby wins and, and my morning routines.
Yeah.
I get up in the morning,I do some breath work.
I don't look at my phone for half hour.
I get outside.
I take some deep breaths, do two,three minutes of breath work.
I really kind of learned to getmy body going in the morning.
Before I even look at my phone.
(06:38):
So I got a pretty good half hourroutine before, you know, just get
my mind right and my body right.
And you know, walking is a big thing.
Fitness, health, wellness, and fitnessis kind of like my new, my new addiction.
So yeah, I've lost 80 pounds.
Wow.
[inaudible] and I feel like amillion bucks and clarity and just a
whole new purpose in life for sure.
It's like nothing goodcame outta drinking for me.
(06:59):
That picture you have in your book nextto the one in high school where you had
let yourself go a little bit is stunning.
I wouldn't have even recognized you.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's, that was probably my peak andI think that was actually in Vegas.
When I sold my company, it gotfunded in the bank account.
I was like, I dunno, 264 pounds anddrunk and fat and just a Large Marge.
(07:22):
Well, let's talk aboutyour business for a minute.
'cause I've worked with a lot of peopleover the years who have their own business
and are really successful and you gointo it, you were successful, you said,
in part because of your ability to show'em a good time, quote unquote, right?
Yeah, yeah.
Whining and dining them.
My superpower and I believed it.
(07:43):
And lived it.
That booze was my superpower.
I've always been a good networker.
Obviously, probably started when Iwas 13 with my friend's parents and
pretty social and I was always a peoplepleaser and knew how to read a room
and understood what motivated people.
And I kind of brought that energyand I did that in my business.
But I thought it was, Hey,let's go have martini lunches.
(08:04):
I'll get 'em outside their business.
And then martini lunches turned intosteak dinners with bottles of wine.
And then be like, whyshould the party end?
Why don't we just come back to myhouse and go into the hot tub, maybe
do some fireball shots, maybe openanother bottle of wine and rinse
and repeat four or five days a week.
So I was growing this network inmy business and great relationships
with my business partners, and Ithought booze was my superpower.
(08:27):
Like, well, hey, I can't be home tonightbecause I gotta go entertain clients.
I gotta go take them to a baseballgame and we're gonna have beers.
Maybe we'll go to a strip club.
Hey, I might even come home with a 12pack and we're gonna sit in the hot tub.
So I might be home by midnight,but it might get a little loud.
Yeah.
And repeat.
And that just wasn't one day a week.
Those were multiple times a week.
And that's how I kind of blew out,you know, two failed marriages,
(08:48):
which I'm absolutely not proud of.
Booze was in my mind a superpower.
I was an all American [inaudible].
Well then how do you,that's self perpetuating.
If that's the way you're makingyour living, then how do you show
somebody a good time again withquotes if you're not gonna drink?
(09:09):
Well, it's was just a mindset.
I am probably better at it.
I can still be around.
I can still be in a bar.
I don't have that, you know,like, Hey, don't drink around me.
I can still buy people drinks.
I don't care, if you wannadrink, drink, I don't care.
I'm not here to preach you not to drink.
So I have no judgment there.
And I can be in bars, I can be out, youknow, we do a lot of conferences in Vegas.
(09:31):
I could be out till midnight, one o'clock.
I can get people drinks and I havejust as much fun, if not more fun.
Yeah.
One because I remember it and I'mnot the big drunken idiot that, if a
party's going hot, I can make it hotter.
And the biggest thing is I don'thave the regrets in the morning.
I'd be like, in the mornings you'd belooking at your phone and be like, oh no.
(09:51):
Yeah.
Did I say that?
Or text that?
Oh shit.
Why'd I call that personat one?
Oh my gosh, did I leave him a voicemail?
I have no regrets.
And it's so refreshing to be up inthe morning clearheaded and having
none of that anxiety, if you will.
It's just a differentmindset of, you know.
It's not just about sobriety, right?
(10:12):
It's about overcoming adversity andreally just changing your mindset
of like, who do you wanna be?
It's like in rehab.
I was going into rehab for mywife, my kids, my business, my
friends, my business partners,everybody else but me, everybody.
On that third day of rehab, thegood Lord touched me on the shoulder
and like, Hey, look in the mirror.
(10:33):
Unless you're right, absolutely nothingwill ever, ever be right in your lives.
So you need to get your shit togetherand worry about you and get your mindset
right, or you can try to be all this foreverybody else and that really hit me.
And I want you to talk aboutthat, because when you checked
yourself into, what, where was it?
Schick in Seattle.
Was it Seattle?
Yeah.
It's called Schick Shadel in Seattle.
(10:55):
Yeah.
You went through something thatI've talked to people since
I read your book about it.
We have a little network soyou, I'm gonna let you go.
What did they do for, so I wannasay to you, but it's for you, right?
It was, it's called Schick Shadel,and it's called aversion therapy.
And it's 10 days and I really didn'twanna go to a Betty Ford for 30
(11:15):
because I still running my company.
I still have kids baseball and you know,thinking I was being a good husband.
So I wanted to go short.
So I found this place happened to be in mybackyard in Seattle called Schick Shadel.
And it's 10 days of aversion therapy.
And what aversion therapy is the peoplethat have kids know what ipecac is.
So you go into this place, youcan leave if you opted to, but
you stay 10 days in this facility.
(11:37):
And there's some counseling that goesalong with it, but there, you know,
the aversion pieces, you kind of gointo like a doctor's office and where
they have all their utensils and stuff.
Well, it's a full bar and you sit downand in front of you is this ginormous
mirror, a silver bucket, your chair,and then your nurse, which we call them
bartenders, and they give you some ipecac.
(11:59):
Which induces nausea and vomiting.
You know, if your kidsswallow something...
poison.
Yep.
They induce vomiting.
And so they give you 16 ounces of that andthen 16 ounce glass of warm salt water.
Oh.
And you swallow the salt water?
Swallow the salt water.
And for me it was about seven, nineminutes that you did not feel good.
(12:21):
You felt like your worst hangoverin the world, your mouths watering,
and then they pour you a shot.
Mine started with vodka andthey try to get 18 shots in you.
So they, you take this shot, youswish it around in your mouth and
spit it out in the silver bowl.
And probably about the second shot,let's say the second one's whiskey, black
(12:42):
velvet, swish it around in your mouth.
By this time you're throwing up.
They try to get 18.
So typically my, I could get one switchedaround and be like, oh yeah, no problem.
Two would come, it's all over.
And then they give you fireball,red wine, Coors Light, Scotch,
Baileys and try to get 18.
And you're at some of them, you'reputting 'em on your lips and you
(13:04):
can't even, it can't even touchyour lips and you're throwing up
profusely and that was the tough part.
So you do that for.
It felt like a long time, butmaybe a half hour, 25 minutes,
they take you back to your room.
No electronics, no phones, no tv, andthey wheel in this, you sit at the end
of your bed and then there's a pinkbucket, and I remember specifically
(13:27):
there was a clock right above me.
For about an hour and a half.
You're just gettingthis outta your system.
You are violentlypuking, not feeling good.
Every 10 minutes a nurse wouldcome in and check your oxygen
and make sure you're still alive.
And then at the hour and a half, mark,oh my God, I'm turning the corner.
They come in 16 ounces of ipecac.
16 ounces of warm salt water again,and you go for another hour and a
(13:50):
half of just violently throwing up.
And the, when they emptied out the shotsthey, they put it in a little towel so
they would put that towel next to inyour room and be like, Hey, you gotta
smell when you throw up, smell the towel.
And is just, and it was horrible.
So after about three hours,you're absolutely gassed, and
(14:13):
then you're kind of free to gowhatever class was going on there.
There was always a group session going onand I would go, maybe go grab a cracker.
Like I, we've all been there.
You haven't, super hungover.
He'd be like, I could, I just needa piece of bread or something.
So I'd go naw on alittle bit of a cracker.
Feel like shit the rest of the day.
Listening to people in theirdrinking stories and be like
I'm, I'm never doing this again.
(14:34):
And then, so that's day one.
Next day they sedate you.
So you go into same room, they give youan IV and they get into your subconscious.
So you're sedated enough to notknow they're in your subconscious.
And there's obviously you got yournurse you got the IV doctor, and
(14:55):
then you're assigned a therapist andthey ask you 26 different questions.
Random, like, who's a bad influence?
Where'd you drink?
Where do you think drinking started?
And you're answering all thesequestions and then you're
sedated maybe 8 to 12 minutes.
When you come out it, youare on top of the world.
(15:15):
It's such an energy dump.
They put you in your room for half hourjust to be like, Hey, settle down, and
then you go spend three hours with yourcounselor and review these 26 questions
that you're like, I answered what?
I didn't even think of that person.
And it was absolutely insane.
So you do that your second day andthen your third day you look on
your schedule and be like, Ooh.
(15:35):
They call 'em Duffy days.
You'd be like, Ooh, my Duffy's at one 30.
Which I didn't like the 1:30 ones.
'cause you're just waiting, anticipating.
And before you go on your Duffydays, you have to drink a gallon
of, I chose blue Powerade.
To this day, my kids know there isno blue Powerade, no blue Gatorade.
There ain't nothing.
My mouth will water if I seeblue Gatorade to this day.
And there are no silver bowlsin my house to be found.
(15:58):
(Laughs)
My aversion was so high coming out ofthere and their success rate was like 78%.
It was phenomenal.
I've kind of sad that they'reclosed 'cause their success rate
was incredible and I had a couplebuddies in front of me go through it
as well and their aversion is stillextremely high nine 10 years later.
Was there some research behind18 as opposed to 17 or 22?
(16:22):
18 man.
It might've been thefounder's favorite number.
I don't know why 18.
I have no idea.
Because at four or fiveyou're like, okay, I'm good.
I am at stop because...
So how many days did you repeat that then?
So you do five puke days.
So you do a Duffy day, your throw up day.
You do your sedation day, Duffy day.
Sedation day.
(16:42):
So five days of it, but everyother day, then you're off.
And the reason I wanted youto talk about this is, people
have heard me say this before.
Something works for somebody, oreverything works for somebody.
Yeah.
You know, who knows?
Like you said, if they had 78%,so when you got out after 10
days, you were like, that is it.
(17:04):
Yeah.
I had zero, zero interest.
One, I don't even know if I could,without throwing up if somebody gave me
a beer and be like, Nope, not happening.
Do you count your soberday as the day you got out?
(laughs) Or because youwere sipping the whole time.
So.
Yeah, they have you swish itaround in your mouth and then you,
you just, you can't get it down.
Well, I think, you know, like yousaid, you went in there thinking,
(17:25):
I'm gonna, I'm gonna save everything.
And I think it's kind ofpoignant that the day you got
out wasn't your best day either.
Yeah, I got served papers.
But the damage was so far gone for me.
There was really no saving it,even though in my mind I was like,
Hey, I'm gonna give this a whirl.
I'm gonna give it my shot.
And like, look at me.
I'm a new man.
You know, coming out of that 10days, I actually lost 13 pounds.
(17:46):
One because you're notkeeping anything down.
And that was a pivotal point for me oflike, man, I could go back to drinking.
Like, you know.
I did all this for nothing.
Yeah.
You know, shame, a lot of guilt.
And then I had my circle in my kids thatwere just troops for me, man, they, they
pulled me out of, you know, a tailspin oflike, Hey, remind yourself, you gotta get
(18:07):
yourself right and then we'll be fine.
So I had a really good circle thattoday is my ride or die, for sure.
Yeah.
We're gonna talk about them in a minute.
You know, it's funny, you mentionedkids earlier, they don't care,
do they when they're younger?
If you're at work, if you're hungover,if you're in a bar, if you're not
there, it's just, where's dad?
(18:29):
Right?
And there is, the word present hasa whole new meaning for me today.
Because I was the RV dad.
I had an RV and we'd go to the kidssoftball games, baseball games, and I
was, you know, my RV was really a barbecause I was the life of the party.
I was making sure everybody had redsolo cups in the stands, whether
(18:51):
it be, if it was a morning game,we're having Bailey's and coffee.
If it's an afternoon game, we're doingCoors Light, and I made sure everybody
in the stands are good while behind me.
My kids are playing.
So I was there, but I wasn't present.
Mm-hmm.
And there's a big, bigdifference between the two.
Yeah.
Talk about Make It Great,
Make It Great actually started in thesmoker's lounge, sitting outside of rehab.
(19:15):
I wasn't a smoker, but I was prettysocial and pretty good with people
and I always had kind of this vibe andenergy for people of being a leader
and a mentor and pretty positivein the situation that we're in.
And make it great was justkind of a somebody says like,
you make everybody feel great.
You make everybody feel great.
And like, so our whole environment'sgreat when you're around.
And I was like, man, we should starta company and call it, Make It Great.
(19:38):
And, you know, let's gomake an impact in the world.
And like, you know, had a couple people.
And on this, this big table oneof the gals actually created the
logo with a Sharpie on the table.
It's still there.
When I went and did a speaking gig.
I dunno, however long, nineyears ago or six years ago.
And it kind of started that way andthen it kind of morphed into like my
(19:58):
kids were just coming outta college, mydaughter like, Hey, why don't we just,
you know, start a speaking gig to go makean impact on high school and colleges.
And then it kinda sat dormant for a while.
Which I'm gonna start ramping it back upnow with, with the book and just really
how can you go make somebody feel great?
What can you do to have a great day?
You know, I think I had it before,you know make America, right?
(20:20):
Mm-hmm.
It's the same, same, same thing.
Look at it however you want.
How can you be better every day?
How can you make somebody feel good today?
How can you make somebodyfeel great today?
So yeah, that's kinda, it all startedsitting around the smokers lounge.
Well, and it's a family affair.
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
You know, it started with my, my kiddos.
My kids are on the website and.
So proud of them and they, theyhave no idea how much impact they've
(20:44):
made on me on this sober journey.
And I actually had 'em write in the book.
Yeah.
Some of their experiences.
Yeah.
Do you mind talking about that?
That's interesting to me.
'Cause that's a risk you took, right?
You, 'cause you know, well, the riskyou took is what are they gonna say?
Right?
Because as you said, you weren't there.
(21:06):
So, yeah, I'm pretty naked in thisbook, and I wanted it to be so real
and so authentic, and if people judgeit, I really didn't give a shit.
Mm-hmm.
Because if it resonated withsomebody to be a better mom, a
better dad, better business owner,a better friend, that's what the
whole reason of this book was for.
So, yeah, I had my kids, they grewup with, the party animal dad, what
kind of dad, what, what kind of dadam I gonna get when he walks in the.
(21:28):
Drunk happy Dad.
Is he gonna be drunk, sad, angry Dad.
How many people are coming in behind him?
Are we having a party again on a Tuesday?
So I had my three kids write letters.
My oldest son who still drinkstoday, not nearly as much as when
I was drinking because I would pushthem to do shots and fireball and
like, Hey, have your friends over.
Come on.
And he has a story in thereof like, what's your biggest
(21:50):
memory of your dad drinking?
Like, oh man.
Sundays we could, you, you could havebreakfast, lunch, dinner in the hot tub.
We're doing Bloody Mary's, wehaving beers and people are
over and we're playing cornhole.
And and then my daughter who's a coupleyears younger would be like, well, I
didn't know what kind of dad I was gonnaget, and I would have to text you to turn
down the music so I could do my homework.
(22:10):
While I'm having this full blownparty downstairs, you know, dancing
and music loud, and the speakers arein the ceiling and so her room's just
thumping while she's trying to studygoing to Seattle U and then my youngest,
who was seven, really just doesn'tremember a whole lot of drinking.
But you know, where's dad?
(22:31):
At 7, 8, 9, they're like, where's dad?
Oh.
And mom would cover and be like,oh, he is got a work function.
Mm-hmm.
Or he's here or there where sheprobably really didn't even know
where I was at, but probablyknew I was drinking somewhere.
So a lot of this emotional talkabout, but those stories are in
there 'cause that is real life.
Have you thought about havinghim write a letter now?
(22:52):
No, but that's a great idea.
Nobody's ever asked me that.
That's a great idea of like.
Then and now, I guess.
Yeah.
Yeah, because it, there's a, you know, thepersonality's probably still there, right?
Oh
yeah.
So do you, do you go to how do you,you talked about going to a therapist.
Yeah.
Do you attend meetings?
Are you a 12 step person?
Do you do reading?
What, how do you do it?
I've never attended one.
(23:12):
My oldest brother is frequentsome.
You know, on a weekly basis.
I have one of my very closest friends,who used to attend meetings, and he was
like, Hey, after he got sober and he,he went to my rehab, that Schick Shadel
aversion therapy to go back into AA.
It was really negative for him.
It really hit him reallyhard in a negative way.
(23:34):
Like, man, these stories and thenegativity in the vibe, it just hurt him.
But I've never been to one.
So I have a life coachAngie, that's out of Florida.
Who I speak with every Wednesday,super early in the morning.
And it's just good for life,relationships, business,
keeps me accountable on mygoals, my drive, my ambitions.
And I go see an NED therapist,which focuses a lot really on your
(23:58):
domestication of your childhood.
Of like how, you know, I'm really intolike, how can you be better every day?
Mm-hmm.
And how can I learn these triggers oremotions or things that be like, why
did I get all weirded out on that.
And my guy takes me all the wayback to like, let's figure out
was it at age 10, 12, 21, 22?
Where was this trigger for you?
(24:19):
And once you can kind ofidentify 'em, it's like, oh my
God, that makes complete sense.
Why am I letting that bother me?
And sometimes it's just that, youknow, I have a story in there about
my girlfriend of running water.
I grew up very poor.
Running water, be like, Heyif it's yellow, let it mellow.
If the water's running, you'relike, turn the fucking water off.
(24:41):
What are we doing?
Mm-hmm.
And it was, I didn't know why this wassuch a big trigger for me and my gal.
Angie's like, well, let's walk backand figure out like, how'd you grow up?
Like poor.
What was it like?
Did you have to turn the water off?
Yeah.
Like you, you fill the sink up withand wash dishes until it got cold.
And then, you know, you put 'emin the dishwasher and be like,
(25:01):
I want you to do me a favor.
I want you to go home and ask Shelbyhow was she brought up doing dishes?
And it sounds so minor and petty.
And I'd be like, Hey babe.
What was it like when, when you grewup be like, oh my God, we had to
run hot water and the dishes had tobe spotless before they even went
into the, to the washing machine.
And right there, the light bulb went off.
Like, why am I letting water bother me?
(25:23):
She grew up this way.
I grew up that way.
It makes complete sense.
Like, let the water go.
It's okay.
But that bothered me for years.
And I just get quiet.
I get pouty.
I mean, I get all these goofy emotions,overrunning warm water, which is insane.
And to this day, let her run, let her run.
(25:44):
You know, that's fascinating'cause I think we all have those.
And sometimes Ian, you can figure 'em outand sometimes I had a, a friend of mine
say, I said, why does coughing bother me?
And he goes, well, because of yourprevious life experience in the
middle ages with tuberculosis.
And I went like this.
And he goes, that's a lot, right?
And I said, why do he goes.
(26:06):
Who knows.
You said you may figure it out,but you may never figure it out.
Right.
But in the meantime, youcan still have a good life.
Right?
Right.
So I'll let you go with this.
What are the upsides to living the lifethe way you are now and not drinking?
Everything is better.
My relationships arebetter, my health is better.
(26:28):
My priorities are better.
My relationships with myclosest circle is like no other.
I used to have this ginormouscircle and I could get a party
together in 10 minutes at my house.
And really, I just care about my...
Yeah.
My family and my closest circle.
I could give, you know, it pretty hardto come into my closest circle these
(26:50):
days because they're so intimate.
There's nothing off boundaries.
We can laugh together.
We can cry together.
Anything and everythingcan be talked about.
And before I was numbing it and Ididn't realize I was just numbing
all these emotions and feelings.
And then when you have to sit inyour own dirty diaper for a little
while and deal with your emotionsand feel it, it's a game changer.
Especially if you have the mindsetof like, Hey, I want to be better.
(27:12):
I want to improve daily.
I wanna be a, a better parent.
I, I wanna be a better leader.
I wanna be a better boyfriend,fiance, husband, whatever.
If you go into that mindset,it's a game changer for me.
And health and fitnessis like my dopamine hit.
Like I'm addicted to working out.
I'm, you know, walked this morning,we're gonna go to the gym after this.
Like that is my dopaminefix and my energy level.
(27:35):
I had pretty high energy levelwhen I was drinking, even
though it was my superpower.
I have that if not more, and if Iwasn't drinking back in the days
when I sold my company, my companyprobably would've been 10 x.
It was like I relate it to, and a goodbody always supposed to be like, I'm
driving down the HOV fast lane with theemergency brake on and to today I have no
(27:57):
emergency brake on and I am just going.
Awesome.
Ian, I told you earlier howmuch I enjoyed your book.
It was really a quick read.
It was fascinating.
It was fun, and it was alsovery moving at the same time.
We're gonna put links to all of Ian'sstuff on the tag of this podcast.
Thanks for your story.
It's inspiring, it's honest, andalso for your work, for those
(28:20):
of you listening and watching.
We hope you find love, courage,support wherever you are.
Thanks for listening.
Be safe and if you'restruggling, keep looking.
It's there.
It's right there.
You just gotta find it.
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