May 28, 2025 • 33 mins
In this Memorial Day episode of Beyond Sunday, Julie, Zach, and Dina talk about what sacrifice really means—from those who gave their lives for our freedom to how we live out our faith through generosity and trust. It’s a reminder that real freedom often comes when we let go and live for something bigger than ourselves.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Welcome to Beyond Sunday, the podcast where we
dive a little bit deeper intothe King of Kings message series
and talk about what we'retaking beyond Sunday.
My name is Dena Newsome and Iam ecstatic to have some
wonderful guests this week ofMemorial Day.
Go ahead and introduce yourselffriends.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Hi, I'm Julie Easley.
I'm the executive director hereat King of Kings.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
And I'm Zach Zinder and the multi-site director, and
Dina, you're so loving.
The last three times I've beenon, you've used words like great
, amazing and now this time,wonderful guests.
And I agree for my counterpart.
But normally I'm looking aroundlike, who do you have that I
don't know about, but I thinkyou're actually talking about me
(00:50):
, which just feels so loving andspecial.
So thank you.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
I have a plethora of adjectives that I like to use.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Well, now, you know I'm listening and I'll be
looking for new ones, you knowsome days you're wonderful just
because you said, yes, you'dcome.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
There you go.
Wonderful, just because yousaid, yes, you'd come, there you
go.
No matter what you say.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
The available people.
Right, it's true.
No thanks for joining us.
This week was Memorial Day, andso we had a special message
from Pastor Greg talking aboutgreater love, a family legacy of
sacrifice, and he kind ofleaned into a comparison of
Memorial Day.
So my opening question to youguys is what's a great Memorial
Day memory for you or somethingthat stands out to you about
(01:36):
Memorial Day Like?
I'm going to go first.
In my neighborhood there is afamily that puts out little
flags by our mailboxes everyMemorial Day weekend.
They used to do it at the 4thof July and then they switched
when they had a veteran in thefamily that passed away, and
(01:56):
they come and put little flagsby the mailboxes in the
neighborhood, and that, to me,is the smallest little thing,
but I just love the way it looksin the neighborhood.
Yeah, that's, very sweet I lookforward to that for Memorial Day
weekend.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
That's awesome.
So on my dad's side of thefamily we just had a super
extended family who I grew up inIllinois, and so we would
travel out to this kind of small, small farm community out in
Illinois St Ann, illinois andall of the extended cousins
would get together and thehighlight for us is we would get
(02:32):
tractor rides and it was like ahuge deal.
We would look forward to that,all you know, like all year.
So a cousin of mine just posteda picture of all of us sitting
in the cart together and it wasjust a fun time.
Speaker 3 (02:49):
Yeah, yeah, you know, just remembering.
I think a great way to rememberthose that have fought your for
your freedom is to actuallyjust go out and enjoy and have a
really fun, free, filled day.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
If that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
I think that's the best way to honor them, in
addition to all the things thatwe would normally do, which, of
course, is praying for those.
It's it's you know saying greatthings to those that you do
know who've lost loved ones, uh,and have sacrificed for that,
and so I just remember yeah, thethe fun free times that a lot
of times ends with lots ofprotein and meat on a grill, and
(03:25):
that's what we did yesterday.
We grilled up a whole lot ofburgers, brats and dogs, and you
know what I found over theyears.
I'm curious if this is true foryour families and our circle of
friends.
Far less people are eating bunsthan they're used to yes.
Totally Okay, tell me, tell mewhat you think Well, maybe I tip
(03:48):
my hats there to what I'm thequestion I'm about to ask, but
we at our house had, let's see,14 hamburgers, 14 bratwursts and
eight hot dogs eaten.
How many buns were consumedwith those pieces of meat, which
totals 14, 20, 36?
(04:10):
What would you guess?
Speaker 2 (04:11):
I would guess, one package of hamburger buns and
one of hot dog buns and that'sit Like eight and eight Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Well, like you know, logically, I would say 36,.
But since you professed theanswer, Well, like you know,
logically, I would say 36, butsince you professed the answer,
I'm thinking it's not?
Yeah, well, you're right, let'ssay half 18.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Okay, 14 total.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
It's insane.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
I weigh over by buns.
So I guess what I'm saying outthere is if you're the cooker or
providing and buns, uh, maybecut the bun intake in half or
less of what the actual amountof meats are.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Like a third.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Yeah, maybe a third Cause.
Yeah, crazy.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
I know.
Thankfully they're not thatexpensive, so I don't feel
terrible if they go to waste,but still it's not good.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
I just feel like, after last week's talk, zach, we
just need to start.
I'm telling you, the EatingChallenge is your next book.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
I know the Red Letter Eating let's go we're going to
have a cookbook and all sorts ofstuff.
Water will turn into wine.
It's going to be awesome Onfood A lot.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
We like food, apparently, or like to talk
about it.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Or both.
Yeah, it's good.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Okay, so Greg's message was really talking about
sacrifice.
What really stuck out to youguys?
What are you taking, beyondSunday, from that?
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah, I think he talked about three types of
sacrifice right, physical,spiritual and financial.
I believe were the three, and Ithink the overall message,
though what I'm taking beyondSunday, is freedom.
We can't experience freedomwithout sacrifice, and we have
people that have done that forus for the freedom we have in
(05:51):
our nation, and we have a Godwho's done that for us for
freedom spiritually.
And even in the church we havemany who have sacrificed
financially for us to be able tohave a church family like we do
.
And I really believe what I'mtaking beyond Sunday is that, if
(06:12):
you really want to talk aboutlegacy and I'm really big into
legacy I don't think you canhave a really long, lasting
legacy without sacrifice.
And so what's my withoutsacrifice?
And so what's my sacrifice?
Because that'll probably be mylegacy.
(06:32):
I can do a whole lot of thingsin life, but I think probably
the sacrifice would beremembered, potentially.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Yeah, I completely agree.
I think anybody who's doneanything truly noble in this
world and I'm talking from thesmallest thing, like parents
sacrificing for their children,all the way up to people who've
changed the world right thecourse of human events sacrifice
(06:59):
has been a part of it.
A part of it, and when I, youknow, when you talk about legacy
, when I think about what Iwould hope my family and my
children would say was that Iwas a person of sacrifice, you
know, and not in a doormat sortof way, but in a just a way, a
way that really, that I reallygave myself for the good of
(07:23):
others, it just feels like sucha noble aspiration.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
What really stuck out to me was my birthday is near
Memorial Day every year, soMemorial Day is a big holiday to
me because it's just rightabout that and I like spending
time with family and I know whatMemorial Day is all about.
But I had never reallyintertwined that with the story
of Jesus' sacrifice, like theyhad always kind of been separate
(07:51):
parallel lines, and I feel likeGreg really leaned into this is
the ultimate sacrifice, like wewant to talk about, you know,
this holiday that's celebratingpeople who sacrificed for our
freedoms, but who gave thebigger sacrifice for our
heavenly freedom.
And it was just kind of like alittle light bulb moment for me
(08:13):
where I was just like, oh mygosh, those things are so
aligned.
And it seems stupid to me thatI had never paired them up like
in my whole life before, of how,oh duh.
You know, that was really kindof a light bulb moment for me,
and it's one of those thingsthat I thought how did I miss
this?
Speaker 2 (08:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
It's so simple.
It's right there in front ofyou.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Right, yeah, and that sacrifice narrative is woven
through so much of the OldTestament and it culminates in
Christ.
But it's just a huge part ofthe story of the Bible.
I mean, you can see it all theway, from the very beginning,
all the way through.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
And I think too, when you talk about that, dina, it
feels like it doesn't just feellike it.
Americans love their freedom toa fault sometimes, right, I
think.
Sometimes we celebrate thatfreedom, but then it's almost
like most Americans would choosemost probably people would just
(09:10):
choose freedom withoutconstraints, freedom without
limits, and that's actually notthat healthy of a freedom, that
healthy of a freedom.
And what we need, more so thanAmerican freedom or national
freedom, is spiritual freedom,and that's what Jesus did for us
.
It may not feel like that onyour day-to-day, that that's
what your biggest need is, butit is your biggest need.
(09:32):
That spiritual reconciliation,that spiritual freedom and the
freedom we have in this world isfabulous and wonderful and we
ought to celebrate those thathave fought for that and given
it to us.
But the freedom we have in thisworld is fabulous and wonderful
and we ought to celebrate thosethat have fought for that and
given it to us.
But the freedom that Christgives us is freedom that we get
to have eternally, and we losesight of that so much in our
time-stamped years in this world, where we'll be here for, lord
willing, decades, but then we'renot here anymore, and now we've
(09:56):
got freedom that lasts forever,and so it's.
I'm glad you finally heard it.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
Yeah, which is good.
It means several years, butthat's okay.
Yeah, it's good.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
And may others hear it.
Come on, you need the freedomof Jesus, and there ain't
nothing like it and as free aswe can be in this world.
Praise God for it, for thepeople that have fought for it.
Praise God for Jesus, that thebiggest answers to life's
biggest questions have alreadybeen taken care of.
Through what Jesus?
Through his sacrifice, yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
So, speaking of sacrifice, can you guys think of
a time when you have had tosacrifice something for someone
else and how you dealt with that?
Speaker 2 (10:39):
I mean, I'm sure you two would agree parenthood is a
crash course in sacrificing.
I remember the first couple ofyears when Dale and I were
married.
I was like man, this isn't thathard, we're getting along great
.
And then Michael came along andI'm like you're selfish.
He's like no, you're selfishand just learning, like, oh, I'm
(11:00):
going to have to pour all of myenergies into keeping this
little person alive.
Like he's contributing nothingto the equation at all.
Speaker 3 (11:08):
It's actually a net negative.
Yeah, it's 100.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
He's just sucking energy right Like a little black
hole.
So I mean, yeah, and thatdoesn't end when they start
crawling or walking.
It doesn't even end when theyturn 18 and move out of your
house.
Now certainly there's a lotless demand on your time and on
your energy and thankfully allof my sons are now independent
(11:32):
adults.
But there's still a degree ofsacrifice there, even if it's
just praying sacrificially forthem or, you know, helping out
where you can.
Parenthood is a beautiful lifelesson in what sacrifice is
about.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
Yeah, I'd echo that.
And you know, yes, I'vesacrificed.
Yes, there've been times.
I don't want to tell you aboutthem because then I lose my
heavenly reward.
Some more kidding there.
But I also like don't want tojust make it seem like I'm
amazing at this I think Istruggle with sacrificing at
(12:11):
times.
I think, if you line up thephysical, financial, spiritual,
I think I'm stronger in parts ofthat than others.
I think I'm stronger at partsof that than others.
I think I'm stronger atfinancially sacrificing than
most people.
But on the day-to-day, like theserving, which is a sacrifice
as well, I'm probably weaker,and so that was a big, I guess,
(12:33):
goal of mine especially as Iwrote Serving Challenge years
ago, which is always like tryingto study how Jesus did this and
become more like him.
And for him, the word that Ikept coming back to that he was
just so good at was he wasalways available, Like he could
have the weight of the world onhis shoulders.
(12:53):
And he literally did, and he'dstill sacrifice his time to be
present with the one right infront of him.
And that's where I reallystruggle, and so I'm trying to
learn to be better at that, bothin my home with my wife, with
my kids, with my coworkers, andjust out and about in my normal
(13:16):
busy life.
How can I?
I ought to be able to.
If Jesus did this, I ought tosure be able to do this.
I shouldn't take myself thatimportant.
You know that and so I.
It's a struggle and I thinkthere's there's parts of it that
I get done, that I do right.
But I'm also on a journey, likeeverybody, of like how can I be
better at that?
How can I be more available?
How can I treat people not likeinterruptions in my schedule
(13:39):
but like real people?
Speaker 2 (13:43):
Well, and just to kind of encourage you, I think
about like there are a lot ofdifferent ways that you can
sacrifice for people, and I justthink about the amount of kind
of energy and brainpower andtime that you spend blessing
people that you'll never meet,and so I think it's easy to
downplay the stuff that we'renaturally good at and look at
where we struggle.
(14:03):
But just as an encouragement toyou, boy, I just see you
sacrificing a lot for the goodof others and giving of time.
I thought that Tim Keller quotereally stuck out at me.
Like money is a renewableresource, time is not, and so
the time that we're spending,whether it's working on a
(14:24):
project that'll bless otherpeople or sitting down to really
listen to someone, giving oftime is huge, and thankfully
that can look a lot of differentways and God's gifted us in
different ways.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Yeah, the sacrifice that I can think of as part of
parenting for me, when I had onechild and we had a second on
the way and I knew that for ourfamily I really wanted to be a
stay-at-home mom.
That was the choice that wasright for our family, but that
(14:57):
meant sacrifice.
That was going to a one-incomehousehold and what sacrifices
that took, and I love working.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Like.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
I love my jobs, I love being a part of a team,
whatever they've been, and sothat was a sacrifice to stay at
home and do that of what I feltwas right for our kids.
You know, at that time, in oursetting and I can remember,
there are nine years between mymiddle child and my youngest
child, and so when my middledaughter started kindergarten, I
went and got a job and I wasecstatic to be back at work.
(15:27):
And then my youngest child wasa surprise.
He was not planned, and when Ifound out that I was pregnant
with him, I wept and wept andwept because I knew I was going
to have to quit my job, becauseI knew, once again, that was the
right choice for our family.
I had stayed home with hissisters and I wanted to stay
home with him, but I was goingto miss my job so much in that
(15:51):
time that that's not me beingtotally selfless there are
benefits, too, to me stayinghome but I just remember
thinking I was so sad about that.
I was so excited for him andthat God had given us another
child, but I was so sad aboutwhat that meant for the next
five years of knowing that I wasgoing to be at home, and
(16:14):
there's just different isolationand struggles that come with
that too, and so that was.
I can remember being so upsetabout having to sacrifice that,
but in the long run, I believemost sacrifices pay off rewards
tenfold more than that, you know, and so that was something that
really worked out well for ourfamily.
(16:34):
That's great, yeah.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
The other piece about sacrifice too, is like by me
sacrificing, it might also forceor cause my wife to have to
sacrifice.
So right I'm, that's great.
Yeah, we wanted to do those.
(16:55):
Right for us and that standsright for everybody, is we?
We wanted to.
We didn't both want to workfull time when our kids were
young, and so I had the career.
So she sacrificed, or at leastthe career path.
That was obvious, and so shesacrificed her time.
But then all the hours quotethat I sacrificed for work,
which was a sacrifice, goingabove and beyond doing what I
(17:18):
needed, also meant that she hada sacrifice, that I wasn't there
as much as I ought to, and sosometimes it's challenging,
because sometimes my sacrificecauses her to have to sacrifice.
And is that the sacrifice thatis important?
That is right, it's not alwayseasy but, that's where family
comes in and where friends comein too to, like you know, help,
help, hopefully give someunderstanding to what's
(17:40):
happening and whether it's rightor not.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
So Greg posed the question of uh, how can we live
out the idea of being a livingsacrifice, and he referenced
Romans 12, one in this.
And Romans 12, one saystherefore I urge you, brothers
and sisters, in view of God'smercy, to offer your bodies as a
living sacrifice, holy andpleasing to God.
(18:06):
This is your true and properworship.
How does that verse speak toyou, or how do you feel like we
can live out the idea of being aliving sacrifice?
Speaker 2 (18:26):
a living sacrifice.
I think about just things assimple as when you wake up in
the morning and turning your dayover to the Lord and saying I'm
not exactly sure what's goingto be happening entirely today,
but would you please present mewith opportunities to share your
love and just kind of set upyour brain in a way to be on the
lookout for ways that you cangive of yourself to other people
(18:49):
.
I think it's really easy just tohop out of bed and you're like
all right, I'm getting in theshower and we're going to do
this thing, but justsurrendering your day to God
before it starts, because really, if you talk about offering
yourself as a living sacrifice,that's an everyday thing, and so
I just want to try to keep thatin front of mind and talking to
(19:12):
the Holy Spirit throughout theday, and especially when I'm in
meetings and maybe meetings thatare difficult.
Lord, what is it that you wantme to say in this moment?
Not what does Julie want to say, necessarily, but what is it
that you would have me to say?
And giving way to whatever theSpirit is, kind of I feel like
he's prompting me towards.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Yeah, I'd echo what Julie said and I think, in
addition to that too, I wouldjust, you know, talk about each
person understanding, if theydon't already, what their
purpose, what their mission inlife is all about.
I think so often we havecompany mission statements or
vision.
You know big statements, vision, look ahead, five-year plans
(19:54):
Awesome, that's great.
But do you have thatindividually?
I think coming up with that andthen just every day, alongside
of what Julie said, thespiritual side of it is starting
your day with God and being inrelationship with him, is like
awesome.
These are the things I'm goingto do today.
I'm going to be intentionalwith what God's given to me.
I'm going to do my best withthe hours.
Here's what I want toaccomplish today, hopefully for
(20:18):
your glory, god, and juststicking to it, I think, is
really important.
I think, without vision andwithout intention direction, a
lot of times we just kind of Idon't know revert back to the
norm, and the norm is justchecking our phone, going
through social media binge,watching Netflix, watching
sports, eating out, closing ourgarage, going to bed.
(20:40):
Does that make sense?
Yeah, I mean obviously thespiritual things of that
connection.
But then just like, why am Ihere, and what can I do today
that hopefully will helpaccomplish that mission?
Some days may be far moredirect to it, other days may not
be, but it may be stuff youhave to get done so that you can
be that person the next day.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
I love lists, I love checking things off lists, and
so when you look at your day andyou've got to accomplish, you
know, one, two, three, four,five, six, however many things.
There was a period in my lifewhere I was really good about
putting intentional time in theword or in worship or in
something on my list, but itwould always get knocked to the
bottom when the day would kindof go off kilter and it wasn't a
(21:22):
priority.
And then it got to the pointwhere I knew I wanted change and
so that I just created aboundary for myself that I
couldn't do anything else untilthat time was done, like that
was the most important thing,and I kept shoving it aside.
That's not sacrificing anything, it's like, oh, it'll get done
if I have time, you know.
(21:43):
But it was making sure thatthat was the first thing on my
list and that was the firstthing that I got to check off.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
That's good.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
Yeah, yeah, you like to check off lists too, don't
you?
Speaker 3 (21:53):
Yeah, we all do and about whenever we're done with
this podcast.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
You know what I'm going to do.
I'm going to put a check by thepodcast recording for today.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
What situation have you faced where you needed to
speak up or take a stand forwhat is right?
So I'm going through one rightnow, kind of in our denomination
, without getting into too manydetails, it feels.
I had a friend of mine that Ifeel like was unfairly treated
not long ago and in many wayshas tried to be a leader with
forming pastors and leaders inour synod, and the things that
(22:33):
he's doing are not beingrecognized in a positive light
for sure, and more so being seenin a negative light.
And he's got a podcast that hada very large reach and I felt
like hosted some really greatconversations to talk about.
Are there new avenues for howwe can form pastors with our
(22:55):
great theology?
And sadly, all that stuff's beenkind of been looked down upon
from leaders and he's kind offorced to apologize and and and
told to be silent on theseissues and I I don't know put a
video out in his defense, lesstrying to be less against the
(23:18):
authority, but more just.
I'm standing up for a friendbecause I don't think what
happened to him is right.
I know his heart, I know who heis.
I think we ought to look to himas a leader and ask what worked
, what didn't work and how canwe learn from what you've done
and um.
So that's one that is kind oftop of mind right now and I'm
still kind of in the middle ofit and working through it and
hopefully having conversationsfrom multiple different sides so
(23:41):
I have better understanding ofthe whole thing.
But it's a challenge right nowand I think what I'm really
frustrated with is just silence,is it feels like is never the
right answer and that's kind ofwhat it feels like they've done
to him and like if we want tomove the ball forward and we
need to, like things aren'tgoing well when you look at
(24:02):
faith metrics and trends acrossthe board, but especially in our
denomination, like why wouldn'twe try to do something new and
don't we want the voices thatare trying something?
And it's like if they're notwelcome, then I don't know what.
I don't know what to do, sowelcome then I don't know what
to do.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Well, and it's hard.
I feel like a lot of things inour society right now is if
you're standing up for something, it must mean you're against
something else, and so it'simmediately a head-to-head, and
that doesn't always have to bethe case.
You can stand up for what isright without being against any
other thought or idea about thattoo, yeah, without being
against any other thought oridea about that too.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
I don't know if this is standing up for something of
what's right, but just beinghonest and open about my faith.
So I joined a neighborhoodboard and so after the board
meeting was over, one of thewomen on the board was like, oh,
let's just.
We were at a restaurant and theguys left and she was like,
let's just have dinner and I'dlike to get to know you.
(25:01):
And she was sharing about allof her accomplishments and all
of her children's brilliantaccomplishments.
And I just started talking toher about my faith and who Jesus
(25:22):
meant to me and how he's beenimportant in my life.
And it was a really interestingexchange just to watch her kind
of defenses go down or she wasable to share with me some
things that were challenging inher own life.
So I think, just being honestabout who we are, that like I'm
not a person who has it alltogether, but I have a faith
that really sustains me.
And it was a little risky I'dnever really talked to her
(25:44):
before, but I thought you knowwhat I'm, just going to be me
and share who I am.
And it was great and we've metsince and I don't regret that
exchange at all.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
That's good.
So another type of sacrificethat Greg talked about was that
financial sacrifice, and so oneof the questions I have for you
is how does giving cheerfully,like described in 2 Corinthians
9-7, which he referenced,contribute to God's kingdom?
So that verse 2 Corinthians 9-7, is each of you should give
(26:21):
what you have decided in yourheart to give, not reluctantly
or under compulsion, for Godloves a cheerful giver.
So how does giving cheerfullycontribute to God's kingdom?
Speaker 3 (26:34):
Yeah, I've got a whole lot to say about this.
Coming out in October of 2025is Giving Challenge, a 40-day
generosity study.
Hey, I think it's so gosh, sovaluable For me, I think.
Sometimes what I found is thatin the Bible and in reality,
(26:55):
that giving, no matter myattitude or heart, just makes me
cheerful and makes me happy andthat's not new science, even
though science does say thatthat's Jesus.
It's more blessed to give thanto receive, and when you give to
God's kingdom, good thingshappen and smiles are all around
.
It's a win for everybody.
(27:16):
I've never been disappointed orfrustrated about being generous
.
I've always loved seeing thosedollars go to work and it really
does boost happiness and givescheer to those that give.
Gallup did a study and 120 outof 136 countries participated,
(27:37):
and the findings were that ifyou want to grow in your
happiness, you can do one of twothings double your income every
year or donate to a charity.
Okay, let's do the second, andI'm like one of those sounds a
whole lot easier, right, and soI've been asking the question
lately can money buy youhappiness?
(27:58):
And I'm like it kind of dependson what you do with it.
It feels like if you give itaway, you're going to be more
cheerful and you're going to behappy.
Now I do think that ourattitude is important.
It's great to give cheerfullywith a good attitude.
My point is, though, is maybe,if you're not there yet, just
try it a few times, and thenmaybe your attitude will come
alongside of it, because whereyour treasure goes, there your
heart goes.
(28:18):
So sometimes we hold back andwe wait for God to stir our
hearts, and I think, biblically,what God is asking is no, give
me your treasure, and then yourheart will be in it, and so the
order, I think, is reallyimportant, and when you give,
it's just going to provide cheerand happiness everywhere,
including inside of you.
So that's a little bit ofwhat's coming in October.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
It's going to be good .
Speaker 1 (28:41):
Yeah, if you're here at King of Kings, we are going
through that whole thingtogether.
Yeah, it'll be good, we'll getto talk about it here on the
podcast and in our messages.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:49):
It's great.
I really have, over in the lastcouple of years, been
structuring my thinking about myrelationship with Jesus in just
the picture of like apilgrimage, like he and I are
doing things together in theworld, and when I pray about
things, we're working together,and when I give, we're working
(29:11):
together and I just feel likethat's such a privileged
position that he's given to us.
So right, I'm not, I'm not, Idon't like that.
God is my co-pilot business.
Right, he's clearly the us.
So right, I'm not, I'm not, Idon't like that.
God is my co-pilot business.
Right, he's clearly the pilot.
But he does say, hey, you wantto sit next to me and we're
going to do some really awesomethings together.
And so I view giving as I amcheerful about it because, wow,
(29:35):
I get to be on this bigadventure with Him in all
aspects of my life, in praying,in the way I live my life, in
giving.
It just makes the Christianlife so much more interesting
when you view it as like anadventure you're taking with
Jesus.
So I mean it's such a rich life, it's such a joy-filled life.
(29:56):
Is it it perfect life?
No, and are there hard things?
For sure, but overall, man,it's just something I like.
I think about that bookPilgrim's Progress.
He's going through thesedifferent challenges but it's
leading somewhere and it'sexciting and that can be our
life, and giving can be a partof that.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
And you talk about legacy, too, which is all about
sacrifice and financial Like youcan't take anything with you.
No, but what you can do is youcan send your money ahead, you
can give your money, you can begenerous, and that can still
create ripple effects years,decades, generations later with
our finances, and that's one ofthe unique things about giving
(30:35):
is that it can do just that.
It's something that God gives tous to give away now and not to
hold on to, and when you do that, you can create quite a legacy
and quite an impact that willmake a major difference.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
Yeah, so I love visual imagery and so when I was
kind of figuring out thisquestion, the thing that I kept
thinking about with cheerfulgiving was when my son was
probably five or six years oldand in the winter the Salvation
Army bell ringers would be outwith the little buckets and
you'd see if you had some changeor maybe a dollar that my son
(31:12):
can put in the bucket, becausethen they'd let him ring the
bell and he would just light upand that's the image that I
think I want a bell that I canring Every time I give like I'm
going to go drop some stuff offat Goodwill.
Let me ring a bell that I justdid this, you know.
Or I'm passing the bucket inchurch hey, let me ring a bell,
and a bell for you and a bellfor you.
(31:33):
Like I just so in my mindthat's the image that I get and
there's such a little whetherit's a dopamine kick in my brain
or it's just the happy memorythat's associated with it.
That's what I think of.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
And.
Speaker 1 (31:46):
I'm like I want all my giving to be like that,
whether it's small or large,then I want to ring that bell,
not because I want the attentionpointed to me but, because I
want it to be joyful.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
Yes, I want that.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
cheer with it I love that All right.
As we wrap up here, are thereany final takeaways you have
from this message that you wantto share?
Speaker 2 (32:10):
I think I would just like to say a big thank you to
all of the people who haveserved our country.
You know, as I have three sonswho would be in the age of
someone who would serve theUnited States, you realize what
a sacrifice so many people havemade for our freedom and it is
true that Christ has set us freeand there have been a lot of
(32:33):
people who have secured that forus here in America.
And let's just use our freedomwell, not to satisfy or be
self-indulgent, satisfyourselves, but to really give to
others.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Yeah, that's so well said.
I'd echo the same Thank you tothose that have paid the
ultimate price, those who losttheir lives and the families
that, like we said earlier, weresacrifice of you usually
require sacrifice of others too,yeah.
Means the world to me, so thankyou.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
Well, and I think that that's just very honoring
and that's like a great segue.
Not planned into our nextsermon series is the Honor Code.
Planned into our next sermonseries is the Honor Code.
So next week, when we're back,we're going to be looking at the
first message in that serieswhere we're talking about
honoring and Memorial Day as atime to honor that sacrifice, to
honor our freedoms, to honorthe things that God gives us,
(33:29):
whether that's our giving ourspiritual sacrifice, whatever.
So, yeah, we'll be back nextweek to look at that first week
of the Honor Code and until then, let's keep living our faith
beyond Sunday.
Welcome to Beyond Sunday, the podcast where we
dive a little bit deeper intothe King of Kings message series
and talk about what we'retaking beyond Sunday.
My name is Dena Newsome and Iam ecstatic to have some
wonderful guests this week ofMemorial Day.
Go ahead and introduce yourselffriends.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Hi, I'm Julie Easley.
I'm the executive director hereat King of Kings.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
And I'm Zach Zinder and the multi-site director, and
Dina, you're so loving.
The last three times I've beenon, you've used words like great
, amazing and now this time,wonderful guests.
And I agree for my counterpart.
But normally I'm looking aroundlike, who do you have that I
don't know about, but I thinkyou're actually talking about me
(00:50):
, which just feels so loving andspecial.
So thank you.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
I have a plethora of adjectives that I like to use.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Well, now, you know I'm listening and I'll be
looking for new ones, you knowsome days you're wonderful just
because you said, yes, you'dcome.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
There you go.
Wonderful, just because yousaid, yes, you'd come, there you
go.
No matter what you say.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
The available people.
Right, it's true.
No thanks for joining us.
This week was Memorial Day, andso we had a special message
from Pastor Greg talking aboutgreater love, a family legacy of
sacrifice, and he kind ofleaned into a comparison of
Memorial Day.
So my opening question to youguys is what's a great Memorial
Day memory for you or somethingthat stands out to you about
(01:36):
Memorial Day Like?
I'm going to go first.
In my neighborhood there is afamily that puts out little
flags by our mailboxes everyMemorial Day weekend.
They used to do it at the 4thof July and then they switched
when they had a veteran in thefamily that passed away, and
(01:56):
they come and put little flagsby the mailboxes in the
neighborhood, and that, to me,is the smallest little thing,
but I just love the way it looksin the neighborhood.
Yeah, that's, very sweet I lookforward to that for Memorial Day
weekend.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
That's awesome.
So on my dad's side of thefamily we just had a super
extended family who I grew up inIllinois, and so we would
travel out to this kind of small, small farm community out in
Illinois St Ann, illinois andall of the extended cousins
would get together and thehighlight for us is we would get
(02:32):
tractor rides and it was like ahuge deal.
We would look forward to that,all you know, like all year.
So a cousin of mine just posteda picture of all of us sitting
in the cart together and it wasjust a fun time.
Speaker 3 (02:49):
Yeah, yeah, you know, just remembering.
I think a great way to rememberthose that have fought your for
your freedom is to actuallyjust go out and enjoy and have a
really fun, free, filled day.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
If that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
I think that's the best way to honor them, in
addition to all the things thatwe would normally do, which, of
course, is praying for those.
It's it's you know saying greatthings to those that you do
know who've lost loved ones, uh,and have sacrificed for that,
and so I just remember yeah, thethe fun free times that a lot
of times ends with lots ofprotein and meat on a grill, and
(03:25):
that's what we did yesterday.
We grilled up a whole lot ofburgers, brats and dogs, and you
know what I found over theyears.
I'm curious if this is true foryour families and our circle of
friends.
Far less people are eating bunsthan they're used to yes.
Totally Okay, tell me, tell mewhat you think Well, maybe I tip
(03:48):
my hats there to what I'm thequestion I'm about to ask, but
we at our house had, let's see,14 hamburgers, 14 bratwursts and
eight hot dogs eaten.
How many buns were consumedwith those pieces of meat, which
totals 14, 20, 36?
(04:10):
What would you guess?
Speaker 2 (04:11):
I would guess, one package of hamburger buns and
one of hot dog buns and that'sit Like eight and eight Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Well, like you know, logically, I would say 36,.
But since you professed theanswer, Well, like you know,
logically, I would say 36, butsince you professed the answer,
I'm thinking it's not?
Yeah, well, you're right, let'ssay half 18.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Okay, 14 total.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
It's insane.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
I weigh over by buns.
So I guess what I'm saying outthere is if you're the cooker or
providing and buns, uh, maybecut the bun intake in half or
less of what the actual amountof meats are.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Like a third.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Yeah, maybe a third Cause.
Yeah, crazy.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
I know.
Thankfully they're not thatexpensive, so I don't feel
terrible if they go to waste,but still it's not good.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
I just feel like, after last week's talk, zach, we
just need to start.
I'm telling you, the EatingChallenge is your next book.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
I know the Red Letter Eating let's go we're going to
have a cookbook and all sorts ofstuff.
Water will turn into wine.
It's going to be awesome Onfood A lot.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
We like food, apparently, or like to talk
about it.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Or both.
Yeah, it's good.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Okay, so Greg's message was really talking about
sacrifice.
What really stuck out to youguys?
What are you taking, beyondSunday, from that?
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah, I think he talked about three types of
sacrifice right, physical,spiritual and financial.
I believe were the three, and Ithink the overall message,
though what I'm taking beyondSunday, is freedom.
We can't experience freedomwithout sacrifice, and we have
people that have done that forus for the freedom we have in
(05:51):
our nation, and we have a Godwho's done that for us for
freedom spiritually.
And even in the church we havemany who have sacrificed
financially for us to be able tohave a church family like we do
.
And I really believe what I'mtaking beyond Sunday is that, if
(06:12):
you really want to talk aboutlegacy and I'm really big into
legacy I don't think you canhave a really long, lasting
legacy without sacrifice.
And so what's my withoutsacrifice?
And so what's my sacrifice?
Because that'll probably be mylegacy.
(06:32):
I can do a whole lot of thingsin life, but I think probably
the sacrifice would beremembered, potentially.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Yeah, I completely agree.
I think anybody who's doneanything truly noble in this
world and I'm talking from thesmallest thing, like parents
sacrificing for their children,all the way up to people who've
changed the world right thecourse of human events sacrifice
(06:59):
has been a part of it.
A part of it, and when I, youknow, when you talk about legacy
, when I think about what Iwould hope my family and my
children would say was that Iwas a person of sacrifice, you
know, and not in a doormat sortof way, but in a just a way, a
way that really, that I reallygave myself for the good of
(07:23):
others, it just feels like sucha noble aspiration.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
What really stuck out to me was my birthday is near
Memorial Day every year, soMemorial Day is a big holiday to
me because it's just rightabout that and I like spending
time with family and I know whatMemorial Day is all about.
But I had never reallyintertwined that with the story
of Jesus' sacrifice, like theyhad always kind of been separate
(07:51):
parallel lines, and I feel likeGreg really leaned into this is
the ultimate sacrifice, like wewant to talk about, you know,
this holiday that's celebratingpeople who sacrificed for our
freedoms, but who gave thebigger sacrifice for our
heavenly freedom.
And it was just kind of like alittle light bulb moment for me
(08:13):
where I was just like, oh mygosh, those things are so
aligned.
And it seems stupid to me thatI had never paired them up like
in my whole life before, of how,oh duh.
You know, that was really kindof a light bulb moment for me,
and it's one of those thingsthat I thought how did I miss
this?
Speaker 2 (08:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
It's so simple.
It's right there in front ofyou.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Right, yeah, and that sacrifice narrative is woven
through so much of the OldTestament and it culminates in
Christ.
But it's just a huge part ofthe story of the Bible.
I mean, you can see it all theway, from the very beginning,
all the way through.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
And I think too, when you talk about that, dina, it
feels like it doesn't just feellike it.
Americans love their freedom toa fault sometimes, right, I
think.
Sometimes we celebrate thatfreedom, but then it's almost
like most Americans would choosemost probably people would just
(09:10):
choose freedom withoutconstraints, freedom without
limits, and that's actually notthat healthy of a freedom, that
healthy of a freedom.
And what we need, more so thanAmerican freedom or national
freedom, is spiritual freedom,and that's what Jesus did for us
.
It may not feel like that onyour day-to-day, that that's
what your biggest need is, butit is your biggest need.
(09:32):
That spiritual reconciliation,that spiritual freedom and the
freedom we have in this world isfabulous and wonderful and we
ought to celebrate those thathave fought for that and given
it to us.
But the freedom we have in thisworld is fabulous and wonderful
and we ought to celebrate thosethat have fought for that and
given it to us.
But the freedom that Christgives us is freedom that we get
to have eternally, and we losesight of that so much in our
time-stamped years in this world, where we'll be here for, lord
willing, decades, but then we'renot here anymore, and now we've
(09:56):
got freedom that lasts forever,and so it's.
I'm glad you finally heard it.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
Yeah, which is good.
It means several years, butthat's okay.
Yeah, it's good.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
And may others hear it.
Come on, you need the freedomof Jesus, and there ain't
nothing like it and as free aswe can be in this world.
Praise God for it, for thepeople that have fought for it.
Praise God for Jesus, that thebiggest answers to life's
biggest questions have alreadybeen taken care of.
Through what Jesus?
Through his sacrifice, yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
So, speaking of sacrifice, can you guys think of
a time when you have had tosacrifice something for someone
else and how you dealt with that?
Speaker 2 (10:39):
I mean, I'm sure you two would agree parenthood is a
crash course in sacrificing.
I remember the first couple ofyears when Dale and I were
married.
I was like man, this isn't thathard, we're getting along great
.
And then Michael came along andI'm like you're selfish.
He's like no, you're selfishand just learning, like, oh, I'm
(11:00):
going to have to pour all of myenergies into keeping this
little person alive.
Like he's contributing nothingto the equation at all.
Speaker 3 (11:08):
It's actually a net negative.
Yeah, it's 100.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
He's just sucking energy right Like a little black
hole.
So I mean, yeah, and thatdoesn't end when they start
crawling or walking.
It doesn't even end when theyturn 18 and move out of your
house.
Now certainly there's a lotless demand on your time and on
your energy and thankfully allof my sons are now independent
(11:32):
adults.
But there's still a degree ofsacrifice there, even if it's
just praying sacrificially forthem or, you know, helping out
where you can.
Parenthood is a beautiful lifelesson in what sacrifice is
about.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
Yeah, I'd echo that.
And you know, yes, I'vesacrificed.
Yes, there've been times.
I don't want to tell you aboutthem because then I lose my
heavenly reward.
Some more kidding there.
But I also like don't want tojust make it seem like I'm
amazing at this I think Istruggle with sacrificing at
(12:11):
times.
I think, if you line up thephysical, financial, spiritual,
I think I'm stronger in parts ofthat than others.
I think I'm stronger at partsof that than others.
I think I'm stronger atfinancially sacrificing than
most people.
But on the day-to-day, like theserving, which is a sacrifice
as well, I'm probably weaker,and so that was a big, I guess,
(12:33):
goal of mine especially as Iwrote Serving Challenge years
ago, which is always like tryingto study how Jesus did this and
become more like him.
And for him, the word that Ikept coming back to that he was
just so good at was he wasalways available, Like he could
have the weight of the world onhis shoulders.
(12:53):
And he literally did, and he'dstill sacrifice his time to be
present with the one right infront of him.
And that's where I reallystruggle, and so I'm trying to
learn to be better at that, bothin my home with my wife, with
my kids, with my coworkers, andjust out and about in my normal
(13:16):
busy life.
How can I?
I ought to be able to.
If Jesus did this, I ought tosure be able to do this.
I shouldn't take myself thatimportant.
You know that and so I.
It's a struggle and I thinkthere's there's parts of it that
I get done, that I do right.
But I'm also on a journey, likeeverybody, of like how can I be
better at that?
How can I be more available?
How can I treat people not likeinterruptions in my schedule
(13:39):
but like real people?
Speaker 2 (13:43):
Well, and just to kind of encourage you, I think
about like there are a lot ofdifferent ways that you can
sacrifice for people, and I justthink about the amount of kind
of energy and brainpower andtime that you spend blessing
people that you'll never meet,and so I think it's easy to
downplay the stuff that we'renaturally good at and look at
where we struggle.
(14:03):
But just as an encouragement toyou, boy, I just see you
sacrificing a lot for the goodof others and giving of time.
I thought that Tim Keller quotereally stuck out at me.
Like money is a renewableresource, time is not, and so
the time that we're spending,whether it's working on a
(14:24):
project that'll bless otherpeople or sitting down to really
listen to someone, giving oftime is huge, and thankfully
that can look a lot of differentways and God's gifted us in
different ways.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Yeah, the sacrifice that I can think of as part of
parenting for me, when I had onechild and we had a second on
the way and I knew that for ourfamily I really wanted to be a
stay-at-home mom.
That was the choice that wasright for our family, but that
(14:57):
meant sacrifice.
That was going to a one-incomehousehold and what sacrifices
that took, and I love working.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Like.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
I love my jobs, I love being a part of a team,
whatever they've been, and sothat was a sacrifice to stay at
home and do that of what I feltwas right for our kids.
You know, at that time, in oursetting and I can remember,
there are nine years between mymiddle child and my youngest
child, and so when my middledaughter started kindergarten, I
went and got a job and I wasecstatic to be back at work.
(15:27):
And then my youngest child wasa surprise.
He was not planned, and when Ifound out that I was pregnant
with him, I wept and wept andwept because I knew I was going
to have to quit my job, becauseI knew, once again, that was the
right choice for our family.
I had stayed home with hissisters and I wanted to stay
home with him, but I was goingto miss my job so much in that
(15:51):
time that that's not me beingtotally selfless there are
benefits, too, to me stayinghome but I just remember
thinking I was so sad about that.
I was so excited for him andthat God had given us another
child, but I was so sad aboutwhat that meant for the next
five years of knowing that I wasgoing to be at home, and
(16:14):
there's just different isolationand struggles that come with
that too, and so that was.
I can remember being so upsetabout having to sacrifice that,
but in the long run, I believemost sacrifices pay off rewards
tenfold more than that, you know, and so that was something that
really worked out well for ourfamily.
(16:34):
That's great, yeah.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
The other piece about sacrifice too, is like by me
sacrificing, it might also forceor cause my wife to have to
sacrifice.
So right I'm, that's great.
Yeah, we wanted to do those.
(16:55):
Right for us and that standsright for everybody, is we?
We wanted to.
We didn't both want to workfull time when our kids were
young, and so I had the career.
So she sacrificed, or at leastthe career path.
That was obvious, and so shesacrificed her time.
But then all the hours quotethat I sacrificed for work,
which was a sacrifice, goingabove and beyond doing what I
(17:18):
needed, also meant that she hada sacrifice, that I wasn't there
as much as I ought to, and sosometimes it's challenging,
because sometimes my sacrificecauses her to have to sacrifice.
And is that the sacrifice thatis important?
That is right, it's not alwayseasy but, that's where family
comes in and where friends comein too to, like you know, help,
help, hopefully give someunderstanding to what's
(17:40):
happening and whether it's rightor not.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
So Greg posed the question of uh, how can we live
out the idea of being a livingsacrifice, and he referenced
Romans 12, one in this.
And Romans 12, one saystherefore I urge you, brothers
and sisters, in view of God'smercy, to offer your bodies as a
living sacrifice, holy andpleasing to God.
(18:06):
This is your true and properworship.
How does that verse speak toyou, or how do you feel like we
can live out the idea of being aliving sacrifice?
Speaker 2 (18:26):
a living sacrifice.
I think about just things assimple as when you wake up in
the morning and turning your dayover to the Lord and saying I'm
not exactly sure what's goingto be happening entirely today,
but would you please present mewith opportunities to share your
love and just kind of set upyour brain in a way to be on the
lookout for ways that you cangive of yourself to other people
(18:49):
.
I think it's really easy just tohop out of bed and you're like
all right, I'm getting in theshower and we're going to do
this thing, but justsurrendering your day to God
before it starts, because really, if you talk about offering
yourself as a living sacrifice,that's an everyday thing, and so
I just want to try to keep thatin front of mind and talking to
(19:12):
the Holy Spirit throughout theday, and especially when I'm in
meetings and maybe meetings thatare difficult.
Lord, what is it that you wantme to say in this moment?
Not what does Julie want to say, necessarily, but what is it
that you would have me to say?
And giving way to whatever theSpirit is, kind of I feel like
he's prompting me towards.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Yeah, I'd echo what Julie said and I think, in
addition to that too, I wouldjust, you know, talk about each
person understanding, if theydon't already, what their
purpose, what their mission inlife is all about.
I think so often we havecompany mission statements or
vision.
You know big statements, vision, look ahead, five-year plans
(19:54):
Awesome, that's great.
But do you have thatindividually?
I think coming up with that andthen just every day, alongside
of what Julie said, thespiritual side of it is starting
your day with God and being inrelationship with him, is like
awesome.
These are the things I'm goingto do today.
I'm going to be intentionalwith what God's given to me.
I'm going to do my best withthe hours.
Here's what I want toaccomplish today, hopefully for
(20:18):
your glory, god, and juststicking to it, I think, is
really important.
I think, without vision andwithout intention direction, a
lot of times we just kind of Idon't know revert back to the
norm, and the norm is justchecking our phone, going
through social media binge,watching Netflix, watching
sports, eating out, closing ourgarage, going to bed.
(20:40):
Does that make sense?
Yeah, I mean obviously thespiritual things of that
connection.
But then just like, why am Ihere, and what can I do today
that hopefully will helpaccomplish that mission?
Some days may be far moredirect to it, other days may not
be, but it may be stuff youhave to get done so that you can
be that person the next day.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
I love lists, I love checking things off lists, and
so when you look at your day andyou've got to accomplish, you
know, one, two, three, four,five, six, however many things.
There was a period in my lifewhere I was really good about
putting intentional time in theword or in worship or in
something on my list, but itwould always get knocked to the
bottom when the day would kindof go off kilter and it wasn't a
(21:22):
priority.
And then it got to the pointwhere I knew I wanted change and
so that I just created aboundary for myself that I
couldn't do anything else untilthat time was done, like that
was the most important thing,and I kept shoving it aside.
That's not sacrificing anything, it's like, oh, it'll get done
if I have time, you know.
(21:43):
But it was making sure thatthat was the first thing on my
list and that was the firstthing that I got to check off.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
That's good.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
Yeah, yeah, you like to check off lists too, don't
you?
Speaker 3 (21:53):
Yeah, we all do and about whenever we're done with
this podcast.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
You know what I'm going to do.
I'm going to put a check by thepodcast recording for today.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
What situation have you faced where you needed to
speak up or take a stand forwhat is right?
So I'm going through one rightnow, kind of in our denomination
, without getting into too manydetails, it feels.
I had a friend of mine that Ifeel like was unfairly treated
not long ago and in many wayshas tried to be a leader with
forming pastors and leaders inour synod, and the things that
(22:33):
he's doing are not beingrecognized in a positive light
for sure, and more so being seenin a negative light.
And he's got a podcast that hada very large reach and I felt
like hosted some really greatconversations to talk about.
Are there new avenues for howwe can form pastors with our
(22:55):
great theology?
And sadly, all that stuff's beenkind of been looked down upon
from leaders and he's kind offorced to apologize and and and
told to be silent on theseissues and I I don't know put a
video out in his defense, lesstrying to be less against the
(23:18):
authority, but more just.
I'm standing up for a friendbecause I don't think what
happened to him is right.
I know his heart, I know who heis.
I think we ought to look to himas a leader and ask what worked
, what didn't work and how canwe learn from what you've done
and um.
So that's one that is kind oftop of mind right now and I'm
still kind of in the middle ofit and working through it and
hopefully having conversationsfrom multiple different sides so
(23:41):
I have better understanding ofthe whole thing.
But it's a challenge right nowand I think what I'm really
frustrated with is just silence,is it feels like is never the
right answer and that's kind ofwhat it feels like they've done
to him and like if we want tomove the ball forward and we
need to, like things aren'tgoing well when you look at
(24:02):
faith metrics and trends acrossthe board, but especially in our
denomination, like why wouldn'twe try to do something new and
don't we want the voices thatare trying something?
And it's like if they're notwelcome, then I don't know what.
I don't know what to do, sowelcome then I don't know what
to do.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Well, and it's hard.
I feel like a lot of things inour society right now is if
you're standing up for something, it must mean you're against
something else, and so it'simmediately a head-to-head, and
that doesn't always have to bethe case.
You can stand up for what isright without being against any
other thought or idea about thattoo, yeah, without being
against any other thought oridea about that too.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
I don't know if this is standing up for something of
what's right, but just beinghonest and open about my faith.
So I joined a neighborhoodboard and so after the board
meeting was over, one of thewomen on the board was like, oh,
let's just.
We were at a restaurant and theguys left and she was like,
let's just have dinner and I'dlike to get to know you.
(25:01):
And she was sharing about allof her accomplishments and all
of her children's brilliantaccomplishments.
And I just started talking toher about my faith and who Jesus
(25:22):
meant to me and how he's beenimportant in my life.
And it was a really interestingexchange just to watch her kind
of defenses go down or she wasable to share with me some
things that were challenging inher own life.
So I think, just being honestabout who we are, that like I'm
not a person who has it alltogether, but I have a faith
that really sustains me.
And it was a little risky I'dnever really talked to her
(25:44):
before, but I thought you knowwhat I'm, just going to be me
and share who I am.
And it was great and we've metsince and I don't regret that
exchange at all.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
That's good.
So another type of sacrificethat Greg talked about was that
financial sacrifice, and so oneof the questions I have for you
is how does giving cheerfully,like described in 2 Corinthians
9-7, which he referenced,contribute to God's kingdom?
So that verse 2 Corinthians 9-7, is each of you should give
(26:21):
what you have decided in yourheart to give, not reluctantly
or under compulsion, for Godloves a cheerful giver.
So how does giving cheerfullycontribute to God's kingdom?
Speaker 3 (26:34):
Yeah, I've got a whole lot to say about this.
Coming out in October of 2025is Giving Challenge, a 40-day
generosity study.
Hey, I think it's so gosh, sovaluable For me, I think.
Sometimes what I found is thatin the Bible and in reality,
(26:55):
that giving, no matter myattitude or heart, just makes me
cheerful and makes me happy andthat's not new science, even
though science does say thatthat's Jesus.
It's more blessed to give thanto receive, and when you give to
God's kingdom, good thingshappen and smiles are all around
.
It's a win for everybody.
(27:16):
I've never been disappointed orfrustrated about being generous
.
I've always loved seeing thosedollars go to work and it really
does boost happiness and givescheer to those that give.
Gallup did a study and 120 outof 136 countries participated,
(27:37):
and the findings were that ifyou want to grow in your
happiness, you can do one of twothings double your income every
year or donate to a charity.
Okay, let's do the second, andI'm like one of those sounds a
whole lot easier, right, and soI've been asking the question
lately can money buy youhappiness?
(27:58):
And I'm like it kind of dependson what you do with it.
It feels like if you give itaway, you're going to be more
cheerful and you're going to behappy.
Now I do think that ourattitude is important.
It's great to give cheerfullywith a good attitude.
My point is, though, is maybe,if you're not there yet, just
try it a few times, and thenmaybe your attitude will come
alongside of it, because whereyour treasure goes, there your
heart goes.
(28:18):
So sometimes we hold back andwe wait for God to stir our
hearts, and I think, biblically,what God is asking is no, give
me your treasure, and then yourheart will be in it, and so the
order, I think, is reallyimportant, and when you give,
it's just going to provide cheerand happiness everywhere,
including inside of you.
So that's a little bit ofwhat's coming in October.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
It's going to be good .
Speaker 1 (28:41):
Yeah, if you're here at King of Kings, we are going
through that whole thingtogether.
Yeah, it'll be good, we'll getto talk about it here on the
podcast and in our messages.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:49):
It's great.
I really have, over in the lastcouple of years, been
structuring my thinking about myrelationship with Jesus in just
the picture of like apilgrimage, like he and I are
doing things together in theworld, and when I pray about
things, we're working together,and when I give, we're working
(29:11):
together and I just feel likethat's such a privileged
position that he's given to us.
So right, I'm not, I'm not, Idon't like that.
God is my co-pilot business.
Right, he's clearly the us.
So right, I'm not, I'm not, Idon't like that.
God is my co-pilot business.
Right, he's clearly the pilot.
But he does say, hey, you wantto sit next to me and we're
going to do some really awesomethings together.
And so I view giving as I amcheerful about it because, wow,
(29:35):
I get to be on this bigadventure with Him in all
aspects of my life, in praying,in the way I live my life, in
giving.
It just makes the Christianlife so much more interesting
when you view it as like anadventure you're taking with
Jesus.
So I mean it's such a rich life, it's such a joy-filled life.
(29:56):
Is it it perfect life?
No, and are there hard things?
For sure, but overall, man,it's just something I like.
I think about that bookPilgrim's Progress.
He's going through thesedifferent challenges but it's
leading somewhere and it'sexciting and that can be our
life, and giving can be a partof that.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
And you talk about legacy, too, which is all about
sacrifice and financial Like youcan't take anything with you.
No, but what you can do is youcan send your money ahead, you
can give your money, you can begenerous, and that can still
create ripple effects years,decades, generations later with
our finances, and that's one ofthe unique things about giving
(30:35):
is that it can do just that.
It's something that God gives tous to give away now and not to
hold on to, and when you do that, you can create quite a legacy
and quite an impact that willmake a major difference.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
Yeah, so I love visual imagery and so when I was
kind of figuring out thisquestion, the thing that I kept
thinking about with cheerfulgiving was when my son was
probably five or six years oldand in the winter the Salvation
Army bell ringers would be outwith the little buckets and
you'd see if you had some changeor maybe a dollar that my son
(31:12):
can put in the bucket, becausethen they'd let him ring the
bell and he would just light upand that's the image that I
think I want a bell that I canring Every time I give like I'm
going to go drop some stuff offat Goodwill.
Let me ring a bell that I justdid this, you know.
Or I'm passing the bucket inchurch hey, let me ring a bell,
and a bell for you and a bellfor you.
(31:33):
Like I just so in my mindthat's the image that I get and
there's such a little whetherit's a dopamine kick in my brain
or it's just the happy memorythat's associated with it.
That's what I think of.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
And.
Speaker 1 (31:46):
I'm like I want all my giving to be like that,
whether it's small or large,then I want to ring that bell,
not because I want the attentionpointed to me but, because I
want it to be joyful.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
Yes, I want that.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
cheer with it I love that All right.
As we wrap up here, are thereany final takeaways you have
from this message that you wantto share?
Speaker 2 (32:10):
I think I would just like to say a big thank you to
all of the people who haveserved our country.
You know, as I have three sonswho would be in the age of
someone who would serve theUnited States, you realize what
a sacrifice so many people havemade for our freedom and it is
true that Christ has set us freeand there have been a lot of
(32:33):
people who have secured that forus here in America.
And let's just use our freedomwell, not to satisfy or be
self-indulgent, satisfyourselves, but to really give to
others.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Yeah, that's so well said.
I'd echo the same Thank you tothose that have paid the
ultimate price, those who losttheir lives and the families
that, like we said earlier, weresacrifice of you usually
require sacrifice of others too,yeah.
Means the world to me, so thankyou.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
Well, and I think that that's just very honoring
and that's like a great segue.
Not planned into our nextsermon series is the Honor Code.
Planned into our next sermonseries is the Honor Code.
So next week, when we're back,we're going to be looking at the
first message in that serieswhere we're talking about
honoring and Memorial Day as atime to honor that sacrifice, to
honor our freedoms, to honorthe things that God gives us,
(33:29):
whether that's our giving ourspiritual sacrifice, whatever.
So, yeah, we'll be back nextweek to look at that first week
of the Honor Code and until then, let's keep living our faith
beyond Sunday.
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