Episode Transcript
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Misty Janks (00:03):
These steps don't
just improve interactions.
They laid the groundwork forcultural transformation.
Adam Salgat (00:10):
Welcome to Beyond
the Class From Knowledge to
Action, the audio cast thathelps Chapman Foundation alumni
continue the journey of applyingthe skills they've built and
turning them into practical,intentional actions for everyday
life.
And turning them into practical, intentional actions for
everyday life.
Every action tells a story, andhow often do we see a behavior
(00:32):
and jump to conclusions.
But what if, instead ofinstantly reacting and creating
judgments, we paused and askedourselves why is this happening?
What's at the root of thisaction?
Today's episode is titled FromReacting to Understanding the
Impact of Behavioral Awareness.
Making time to take a deeperlook at behavior can shift the
(00:55):
way that you see the worldaround you.
To help break this down, I'mthrilled to have Misty Jenks
with us.
Misty is the CEO of the ChapmanFoundation for Caring
Communities.
She is also a thought leaderand organizational psychologist
who's passionate aboutunleashing the power and
potential of individuals andorganizations.
Misty, welcome to the show.
Misty Janks (01:17):
Thank you, Adam.
I'm super excited to be hereand explore this topic together.
Adam Salgat (01:21):
All right, Misty.
Your blog, titled Am I BehavingLike this, starts with a bold
claim that every action,reaction and decision stems from
an underlying need.
To me, that's a fascinatingperspective.
Can you break down where thisbelief comes from, and is there
any science that backs this up?
Misty Janks (01:42):
Across disciplines.
Psychology consistently affirmsthat human behavior is not
random or purely oppositional.
It is purposeful andneed-driven.
A couple of examples here arefrom nonviolent communication,
and this is built on theprinciple that all behavior is
an attempt to meet a universalhuman need.
It refrains judgment andactions not as good or bad, but
(02:07):
as expressions of need that mayor may not be met skillfully.
The second one that I wouldmention comes from behavioral
psychology, and that's thefunctional behavioral analysis,
where, from a behavioralist lens, every behavior serves as a
function.
It is to help us gain somethingthat we need.
So every behavior is anexpression of need is strongly
(02:28):
supported across psychologicaldisciplines.
Recognizing behavior throughthe lens of unmet needs fosters
empathy, connection and moreeffective support strategies in
the workplace, schools and ourcommunities.
Adam Salgat (02:42):
So the idea that we
should see behavior not as good
or bad but as a window into anunmet need is interesting and
pretty intriguing to me.
Can you help us understand thatidea with some examples?
Misty Janks (02:57):
Certainly.
Here's a couple of examplesthat can help us really have
this concept come to life for us.
So first, when someone seemsunmotivated at work, it might
not mean that they're lazy.
They might be searching formeaningful work or craving
attention.
But all two times we jumped tojudging that behavior.
First Another example maybe ateam member who frequently
(03:21):
interrupts, maybe expressing aneed to be heard or valued.
Maybe they feel like they'renot being seen in that meeting
or have that opportunity toreally have what they're trying
to say be heard.
A third example is when acolleague sees this change, they
might be trying to fulfilltheir need for security or trust
or a little bit of control.
Adam Salgat (03:43):
I'd like to jump in
right and say, as a higher S
tendency, I need for stabilitycauses me to not resist change
but bring change about slowly,and that's an identifying factor
for myself, that in the lastprobably two to three years I've
really started to realize andbecome okay with, and so that
(04:04):
way I know now it might take metime and I know that I'm going
to get there, but even thatrealization also helps me move a
little faster sometimes to say,okay, you're moving a little
slow and you know why.
How can you move this long?
Because people might be waitingon me to move a little faster.
Misty Janks (04:20):
What I love about
that story, adam, is you are
taking awareness to action, soyou are using some of those
skills that we learn in theclasses that we teach, like DISC
and understanding.
Okay, if I'm this tendency, Ihave these needs and my
overextensions look like this,and so when I start to see that
behavior surface for myself, Ican pause and be like where's
(04:41):
this coming from?
What do I actually need and howdo I make the best decision for
myself in this moment with thatinformation?
Adam Salgat (04:50):
Yeah, that's what
I'm trying to do.
I'm being very blunt and honest.
It's not always the easiest,but that's why we're here
learning some of these skills,right?
Misty Janks (04:59):
Absolutely.
When we look beyond the surfaceof behavior and approach it
with curiosity, we startuncovering the needs that drive
it.
Adam Salgat (05:07):
I do love that
mindset shift into curiosity and
trying not to label behavior asimmediately good or bad.
Right, and one of the mostthought provoking segments I
thought in your blog is aboutmaking that mindset shift.
What more can you add to that?
Misty Janks (05:26):
shift.
What more can you add to that?
Mindset shifts can be difficultand asking you to see the
behavior and not judge can beeasier said than done,
especially when that behaviorangers or annoys us.
But I encourage our listenersto pause and ask themselves two
key questions when faced withchallenging behavior.
These questions are simple butvery effective when applied
intentionally.
(05:47):
The first question what mightthis person need right now?
And the second how can Isupport that need in a
constructive way?
This is about leading andresponding with intention.
It's about addressing the coreissue, not just reacting to the
symptom, and it's important torecognize.
This doesn't mean excusing poorbehavior.
(06:10):
Instead, this is aboutunderstanding, responding with
empathy and clarity andaddressing the behavior.
Adam Salgat (06:16):
Before we talk
about that empathy you just
mentioned in there in questionnumber two, you specifically
stated it as responding to thatneed in a constructive way.
Can you expand on that?
Misty Janks (06:26):
Yes.
So the example that I would usehere is if you have a coworker
coming to you and they arevisibly upset about something
and you can see that, so theyhave a need to kind of vent that
emotion around an issue, youhelping in a constructive way is
not going to be adding to thatfire, right and be like oh and
start gossiping or venting orwhatever it is and piling on.
(06:48):
Instead it will be to listenreflectively, respond and help
them vent all of that emotion sothey can get back to that
balanced state to be able tomake better decisions.
Adam Salgat (07:01):
So helping in a
constructive way, I also think
it reminds me of not taking onother problems in a situation
like that.
Right, so it also can beconstructive for them and not
destructive for yourself.
Right that you're not taking onmore than you might need in the
situation.
Misty Janks (07:19):
Absolutely Always
letting the problem owner keep
that problem.
You're just there to be thatsounding board.
Adam Salgat (07:26):
Towards the end of
the statement there you
mentioned about responding withempathy and I love the reminder
as we talk about our empatheticlistening skills often and
that's our foundation in ourcommunity listens.
But I tell you, man, respondingwith empathy with three kids
under 10 sometimes is reallyhard.
And to stay curious in momentswhen they're rebelling against
(07:48):
just the simplest things, likegetting ready for school and
they don't want to get theirsocks on, and man, it's just
like just put your socks on.
I don't need to know why youdon't want to put your socks on,
we need to go.
But that curiosity is hard andit's much easier to, you know,
go to that space of judgment.
But I think it would be healthyif I took that time sometimes
(08:09):
to say are they acting this waybecause they're worried about a
test or are they worried aboutrecess?
Are they worried about otherthings that maybe they've
brought up, that I've not madethat connection, other things
that maybe they've brought upthat I've not made that
connection, even when that'sdifficult, why is that curiosity
important?
Why does curiosity matter inour relationships and workplaces
.
Misty Janks (08:29):
When we stay
curious, we can do several
things.
First, we can build trust byresponding to needs rather than
judging actions.
Second, we can create a cultureof learning by encouraging open
conversations about what'sgoing on.
Third, we can strengthenconnections by showing empathy
and understanding.
And finally, we can increaseengagement by aligning
(08:50):
activities with what genuinelymatters to people.
Shifting from judgment tocuriosity isn't just helpful.
It can make a lasting impact onhow we lead and connect isn't
just helpful.
Adam Salgat (09:01):
it can make a
lasting impact on how we lead
and connect man.
Those are great reminders tokeep in mind when I need to
connect with my girls in themorning.
Maybe you know, maybe they'rejust tired, so I'll keep that in
mind, but you mentioned thereabout how we lead, right.
So, speaking of leadership,your blog continues on and it
highlights how this shift inperspective can be especially
(09:22):
empowering for leaders.
Can you expand on whyunderstanding the needs behind
the behavior is so critical forleaders?
Misty Janks (09:30):
Of course.
First, leaders aren't justmanaging tasks, they're working
to understand people,recognizing behavior as
communication fosters trust andstrengthens team dynamics, and
this approach helps createcultures of learning where
people can grow and dialogue isvalued.
When leaders take this approach, they create environments where
(09:53):
individuals feel heard, valuedand empowered to contribute.
Adam Salgat (09:59):
Your first bullet
point.
There, leaders are not justmanaging tasks, they're working
to understand people.
Again, we say this, and it'seasier said than done.
Right, what are some othertools that help leaders
understand people?
Misty Janks (10:14):
First, I would say
that the initial step in knowing
others better is to first knowourselves well.
There are many ways that we cando this and there's lots of
tools to help us understand andknow ourselves and others better
.
Tools like values exploration,understanding what is shaping
you and your experiences andyour mindsets that ultimately
(10:36):
are driving your behaviors.
There's StrengthsFinder, whichhelps us build on an
individual's natural talents.
There's also DISC that we'vealready mentioned, which
measures behavioral tendenciesand really helps us know what
are our needs, what are ourfears, what are our
overextensions that can show up.
There's also emotionalintelligence, which focuses in
(10:58):
on self-awareness,self-regulation, empathy and
relationship management.
There's a huge component in ourcommunity, serves curriculum
for that, and then skills likelistening and empathy can also
help.
Our organization does offer ahalf-day disc program if anyone
is interested in participating.
Adam Salgat (11:18):
So that half-day
disc program could be a couple
things right.
If you've already taken ourclasses and you're an alumni
listening, you know thathalf-day DISC could be a
refresher.
But I think it would also be apotential door opener for new
staff members who maybe haven'ttaken listens or anything else.
Have you seen that utilized fororganizations and what do you
normally see by the end of that?
Misty Janks (11:44):
Yes.
So, just like you said, youhave the opportunity to take the
DISC component in our communitylistens or you could do a
standalone dedicated session andthen, after your team completes
that initial DISC training, wealso have what we call DISC in
teams, and so this takes a deepdive and we shift the lens from
just being about us to beingabout our full team.
And how do we see all of thesetendencies showing up?
(12:06):
Where are our strengths?
Where are our blind spots?
How can we collaborate together?
So you get a big disc diamondand everyone is charted up on
that diamond and with that youget to more understanding.
I now know how to style flex toyou.
I now know why maybe you onlyrespond to me in short bullet
points.
It's not that you're mad orupset, you're just direct.
Adam Salgat (12:31):
Yeah, I think
that's great.
I oftentimes, in lots ofconversations that I've had with
organizations and I talk tomultiple people within the
organization I hear them talkingabout how they utilize DISC.
Often I know it's a great tool.
So we've talked aboutrecognizing others' behaviors
and we've talked a bit aboutrecognizing our own.
How can we start reflecting onunderstanding the needs of our
(12:53):
own actions?
Misty Janks (12:54):
Great question,
adam.
This really starts withself-awareness.
It is important to first havethe awareness and curiosity
about your own behavior and thenpause.
This will give you the time toreflect and ask yourself why am
I acting this way or having thisresponse?
What is driving this behaviorfor me?
Is it tied to a value or abelief I hold?
(13:17):
And when you can pause andidentify your own needs, you can
increase your emotionalintelligence and act in a
mindful and productive way.
Adam Salgat (13:27):
So if we do that
and we identify our needs, is it
fair to, I don't know, at timeswhen we feel like it might be
appropriate to you know straightup, tell others what our needs
are.
Misty Janks (13:38):
Yes, please.
This will help you get yourneeds met more effectively and
efficiently.
Most of the time, people justare not aware what's really
driving that behavior.
So if you already know, that'sthe most efficient way to get
your needs met.
Adam Salgat (13:54):
I do think about
that coming up a little more
often in personal relationships,maybe in you know significant
other situations where you maybe expecting your significant
other to know what you want forX, holiday or whatever.
But I think at times it's veryloving to say, well, you know
what, I don't necessarily needsomething, I want time, or I
(14:14):
want such and such, or I'm justlooking for this type of
connection.
Misty Janks (14:18):
Yes, the example
that comes up for me happened
over our dinner table last night.
My husband was being kind andasked me hey, did you finish
what you needed to on yourdissertation, or did you finish
your dissertation?
And I was like stop asking methat question, I'm not going to
be done for a year.
And like I snapped back and Iwas like, oh, why did I do that?
I was feeling stressed.
(14:40):
I have my first chapter due bySunday and it's not done yet.
And so that realization in themoment I was like ooh, and I
thought to myself what ishappening?
I'm like I'm stressed becauseof the timeline.
And then I said it is going totake me a year to finish this.
Can you please start adjustingyour questions to be did you
(15:01):
finish what you needed to today?
Because then I don't feel asoverwhelmed.
Adam Salgat (15:05):
And if he takes
that in and I bet he does and
that kind of helps then the twoof you shift and create
expectations to communicate.
Misty Janks (15:15):
Yes, and I won't be
so snappy.
Adam Salgat (15:18):
Yeah, and in time,
as you start to execute things,
that's also going to help, andthat's something you know about
yourself too.
All right, misty, as we wrap upour conversation, we've covered
a lot, so I'm going to ask youto do your best to summarize and
provide our listeners with someclear steps that they can take.
(15:39):
What actionable takeaways wouldyou suggest to help them start
applying these ideas right away?
Misty Janks (15:47):
All right, here are
the three key steps that anyone
can implement.
First is to shift from judgmentto curiosity.
When someone's behaviorchallenges you, pause and ask
what need might they beexpressing to me right now?
Number two is to lead withempathy and emotional awareness.
Respond with intention ratherthan reacting.
(16:07):
Seek to understand beforetrying to fix the situation.
And then, finally, number three, reflect on your own needs.
Remember that your behavioralso tells a story.
Take time to ask yourself whatis driving this behavior.
For me, these steps don't justimprove interactions.
They laid the groundwork forcultural transformation, whether
(16:28):
that's in a workplace orpersonal relationship.
Adam Salgat (16:31):
Thank you, Misty,
for walking us through this
insightful and actionableframework.
Your perspective that everybehavior tells a story gives us
all a lot to think about.
Misty Janks (16:41):
Thank you so much
for having me on, Adam.
It's always great to speak withyou and our listeners.
Adam Salgat (16:46):
For our listeners.
If you want to learn more andexplore how to bring this
understanding into yourorganization, visit
chapmancommunitiesorg.
You'll find resources, toolsand opportunities to partner
with Misty and our team.
And don't forget to subscribeto Beyond the Class so you stay
up to date with morey and ourteam.
And don't forget to subscribeto Beyond the Class so you stay
up to date with morethought-provoking episodes, just
(17:07):
like this one.
Until next time, I'm AdamSalgett, inviting you to walk
your path with intention,because you are the message.
Take care, my friends.