September 1, 2024 • 24 mins
Navigating life with young adults who have intellectual disabilities can be a complex dance of fostering independence and cherishing interdependence. This heartfelt narrative unfolds as we reconnect with June and Jim Zoll alongside Melody and Bob Ruppel, who unveil the empowering decisions that shaped their children's growth into well-rounded individuals. Their stories breathe life into the everyday moments that, while often overlooked, form the bedrock of capability and joy. By integrating their children into family life and holding them to equal academic standards, our guests demonstrate that the pursuit of normalcy isn't merely about blending in—it's about standing out and thriving.
As the conversation sweeps us into the vibrant tapestry of school years and life beyond, the parents reflect on the milestones they celebrated and the support they yearned for. Hear how the children's participation in regular life events like sports, proms, and graduations has woven a richer narrative of inclusion and accomplishment. The journey doesn't pause after high school; the exuberance continues through community college adventures in dance and sign language, culminating in the blossoming of a beautiful relationship. This episode not only salutes these remarkable young adults but also previews the next chapter: James and Kristen's personal and professional strides, set to the resonant lyrics of Melissa Riggio performed by Rachel Fuller. Join us as we honor these narratives that reshape the landscape of what's possible, one heartfelt story at a time.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Greta Harrison (00:00):
Hello, my name is Greta Harrison.
Welcome to Born FabulousPodcast, season 3, episode 20.
The theme of this season isyoung adults with intellectual
disabilities living full livesof independence and
interdependence.
This episode features June andJim Zoul and Melody and Bob
Rupple.
It is the fourth of eightepisodes with the Zouls and the
(00:23):
Rupples, which is part of anin-depth series about marriage
featuring parents,self-advocates with support
staff and an employer.
Both the Zouls and the Rupplesare retired and have been
married over 40 years.
They are the parents of JamesZoul and Kristen Rupple, who've
been married over five years.
James and Kristen have Downsyndrome.
(00:43):
Now please enjoy this clip.
Of Love is a Potion.
The lyrics are by MelissaRiggio, who was the focus of
season one episodes one throughfour.
The music and voice are byRachel Fuller.
Rachel Fuller (01:11):
Love is everything.
Love is all around.
Love is a potion, love ispassion, love is devotion.
(01:36):
Love is fusion.
Greta Harrison (01:40):
But before we move on because I love the story
of how they met, but I skippedsomething and if I don't do it
now while I remember, I mightforget Can you give me some
examples or an example ofsomething that you implemented
early in your now adult's lifethat helped them be more
(02:01):
independent, interdependent.
Later Can you think ofsomething, and it can be
something small too, somethingmean it doesn't have to be small
.
I'm just saying it can besomething small, it can be small
or big.
Melody Rupple (02:13):
I think in my case because I had other
children younger and they wereall so close in age and I also
had a teenager, so withcompletely different needs there
was just one day where I justdecided I can't keep all this up
.
I mean, I think when you have akid with with special needs and
(02:36):
they tell you they need physicaltherapy and occupational
therapy and speech therapy, youget in this mindset of if I
don't do every one of thesethings, I'm going to wreck my
kid's life.
They won't be everything theycan be because I didn't do all
that stuff.
But when she was about four,five, and I'm taking all these
(02:59):
other kids with me to all thesetherapies, I'm looking at the
other kids and going well, theygot to have time to take a dance
lesson, they got to have timeto do these other things.
So I think, just because mylife, the way my life was set up
, I just made up my mind thatKristen would benefit the very
most by just being part of thefamily and I couldn't give her
(03:22):
every single solitary moment andin the long run, that's one of
the things that helped her bereally independent, you know,
and which she is veryindependent and determined was.
She just, you know, wanted todo the things that her sisters
(03:43):
do, and skipping one of thosetherapies didn't make a big
difference in that, you know it.
It just gave me a sense where Ilet some of that guilt go, you
know, and uh, so I think it justkind of for us hit, you know,
happened organically that shehad to learn.
Greta Harrison (04:04):
Yeah, there's a famous advocate named Kathy Snow
who talks about that.
Her son was Benjamin Snow.
Does that?
Is that name familiar to eitherof you?
no but um she talks abouttherapy world and she and
because her son has he hassignificant disabilities and he
(04:25):
had numerous therapies At acertain point in his life he
kind of let her know he didn'treally want to be in therapy
world and it was a wake up callto her that I'm not saying
therapy isn't important.
So please, please, don'tmisunderstand that.
But it was a wake up call thatsome things can be done at home
(04:46):
and some things can be doneother ways.
For instance, the dance classesKristen took.
That's physical therapy, yes,therapy.
And being fully included, Iargue, is speech therapy.
So you know, there's, there'sdifferent ways and that's what
(05:09):
Kathy Snow talks about thattherapy is important and we need
guidance and we need to learn.
But we don't need to be caughtin this world of going 24, seven
, regardless of how manychildren you have.
But I can totally understandthat when you have four kids
because you're split and, yeah,I understand that.
(05:33):
That's a great example.
What about you, june?
June Zoul (05:37):
Yeah, I have to kind of piggyback on that first and
just say it's so nice the waythat you articulate all of that
melody.
It makes me just.
You know, I'm learning fromthis podcast about things and
(05:59):
that was just one part of whatI've learned.
So thank you for that, just onepart of what I've learned.
So thank you for that.
And I would I'd have to saythat for James, something that
happened and continues to happenearly on for his that has
helped his independence.
Interdependence is just hisorganizational.
(06:21):
That early on with hisschoolwork or his bedroom or his
cooking for himself or just anyof those life skills that he
had to learn early on,definitely helped him to be the
man that he is today.
Him taking pride in hisappearance when he goes to
(06:43):
school, having his homework done, being accountable for his
spelling tests has helped withhis reading, just all of it.
Greta Harrison (06:54):
You know you mentioned his.
You've mentioned his spelling acouple of times.
So I just want to jump in herebecause my daughter was also a
good speller and I remember afew teachers you know they're
always trying differenteducational things every year
and trying these systems and onetime this particular teacher
just automatically gave she haddifferent groups of words for
(07:18):
different kids and sheautomatically just gave my
daughter the lowest group andonly five words and she was like
in fourth grade and I'm likeI've always said give her the
same number of words aseverybody else.
She's a good speller, give herwhat everybody else has.
And I wouldn't say it was abattle, but it was an exercise
(07:39):
in making that teacher realizejust because somebody has Down
syndrome doesn't mean they can'tbe a good speller or a good
reader or a good whatever.
And give them the chance.
Just give them the opportunitybecause what's made them who
they are is that they had achance and I like that because
you're right, it helps in theirtexting, it helps in life when
(08:01):
they're able to spell.
I had one teacher in middleschool say it doesn't matter if
they can spell because they'respellcheck, and I said, excuse
me, that's not correct, you know, it's just it does matter.
So I'm sorry, didn't mean to gooff on a tangent.
I see so much I agree with withwhat both of you are saying.
Bob Rupple (08:21):
Could I?
Could I add one other thing onto what Melody and June both
said, too Along those same lines, but a little different slant.
We had said that we learnedearly on not to just take
Kristen's limitations or whatother people think are Kristen's
limitations and let Kristendetermine her own limitations
(08:44):
and when she needs help.
So one of our early onphilosophies mine was just to
treat her like all my otherdaughters.
Melody has a large extendedfamily, so Kristen has tons of
cousins too, so she had all thatsocialization and example
setting, et cetera, of how sheshould act, but not just about
(09:05):
social skills, but any situationthat Kristen is in
no-transcript, and so my initialway of approaching it is not to
help her at all and just sayKristen, this is what you need
to do, Let me know if you needsome help.
And of course if she needs somehelp then you give it to her.
But it's amazing what she cando when you just throw her in
(09:28):
and say sick or swim.
And even yesterday her pursehad been stolen and I won't get
into that whole story, but Itook her to the DMV to get her
new California ID card and Icould have easily taken her in
there and just say follow mearound, Kristen, and I'll get
this card for you.
But if anyone's been to the DMV, you might know what that
(09:49):
experience is like.
But I took her in there and Ihad her do it all.
I had her go up and talk to thepeople at the windows.
I was right behind her, youknow.
If she needed anything, Iexplained to her I'd already
been given a letter and a numberand you have to look for it up
on the screen and then find outwhat window you're going to and
(10:09):
listen to where they tell you todo and all that kind of stuff.
And I just explained that toher and I said okay, you're on
your own.
And then I started challengingher.
You know well, see right nowthe numbers on this for this
window.
Where is that window?
You know just that kind ofthing and simple things, like
she didn't want to be in therewith her glasses on because she
(10:30):
didn't look as nice with herglasses on in her mind, and so
of course, she couldn't read anyof the numbers that are up over
the windows.
So, you know, she eventuallyput on her glasses and was able
to coordinate with everythingperfectly.
So I just stood back from herand let her go and I think that
early on, having that as theirphilosophy not hovering over
(10:51):
them at all, that but just beobservant to when they do really
do need some help, but justassuming they can do it, explain
to them what they need to doand then turning the loops and
that has really worked forkristen.
Greta Harrison (11:04):
yeah, she takes pride in being able to figure
things out and it sounds likeyou've also given her a very
important skill of being able toask for help when she needs it,
because a lot of people that'shard for them.
But what you've done is you'veshown her she can do it and she
knows how to ask for help whenshe needs it, right.
Bob Rupple (11:25):
Yeah, we have the opposite problem.
She doesn't ask for help, butsometimes she should, because
she thinks she can figureeverything out.
She sometimes doesn't know whatshe doesn't know, and that's
the issue.
We have to look for more thanyou know.
June Zoul (11:40):
And James is just the opposite.
He asks for help continually,but that's because I'm one of
those that would go into DMV andwalk up to every counter and do
all the talking.
Bob Rupple (11:55):
So it's interesting how, how you had to pay for it
with her debit card.
She had to sign off.
Fingerprinting get the picture.
All this stuff you have to do.
June Zoul (12:06):
I think that's great and that's where you guys
inspire me.
Us is to to just kind of allow.
You know, I'm trying, afterafter all these years, I'm still
trying to allow him to do more.
It's uh, it's interesting, butgo ahead, greta I, I just think
I I love that.
Greta Harrison (12:27):
Thank you for that input, bob.
I I really appreciate that.
Jim Zoul (12:31):
Well, this is interesting you, you're gretta,
you hit on a real good pointearlier on this latest part, and
that is giving them theopportunity.
All they want sometimes is thatopportunity, and I've never.
You know, to this day I'm stillimpressed, along the way, by
(12:55):
what the results of anopportunity can be.
Greta Harrison (13:00):
You know, with James and Kristen, both so and
you know, that the differencebetween James and Kristen and
who they are now, and thedifference between James and
Kristen and who they might havebeen if they didn't have all the
opportunities they had alongthe way is night and day.
Jim Zoul (13:20):
Yes.
Greta Harrison (13:21):
You know they are who they are because of
their opportunities.
Yeah, and even though yourstories are different, there's
many more similarities thandifferences.
Jim Zoul (13:30):
Yeah.
Greta Harrison (13:31):
You know.
So I think that's absolutelygreat.
So I think that's absolutelygreat.
You know, bob, when you weretalking about being in the room
and coming in in your suit andtaking the names, it reminded me
of when Steve Riggio, theformer CEO of Barnes Noble he
talked about because his wifewas a teacher, so she was an
(13:52):
educator, and he noticed, atthis one particular IEP meeting
he he asked who everybody wasand then he asked how they knew
his daughter and nobody in theroom knew his daughter.
And he said, when nobody in theroom knew his daughter, he left
that meeting and told his wifewe're moving and they moved,
(14:14):
they literally moved.
Bob Rupple (14:15):
That's a great, a great story.
Greta Harrison (14:16):
Yeah, he tells that yeah.
Bob Rupple (14:19):
Yeah, that's something I never asked that I
should have.
Greta Harrison (14:22):
He said yeah, how do you know my daughter?
And he said nobody knew hisdaughter and it's like they were
all there to determine what thefate of his daughter was going
to be.
Jim Zoul (14:32):
And they didn't know her, Isn't that something?
Greta Harrison (14:35):
Yeah, yeah.
So and they didn't know her,isn't that something?
Bob Rupple (14:39):
Yeah, yeah, go ahead .
No, you go ahead, go ahead.
Well, I would just say twothings real quick.
One is that we, even as parentstoday and we certainly have to
help the aides that are providedto Kristen and James to
understand that you'll assumethey can't do as much as they
can do, you know, and thensometimes you'll assume they can
(15:00):
do one thing.
So therefore they can certainlydo these other things and
assume they can do more thanwhat they can really do.
And it's really a learningexperience and the goal is to go
through that experience andlearn what they can and can't
really do and then challengethem on on things they can't do
and let them go on things thatyou know that they obviously can
(15:23):
do.
The other thing I was justgoing to mention is how
fortunate the four of us are tohave each other's parents,
because if we didn't have therelationship we have, it
wouldn't work at all.
Greta Harrison (15:34):
Oh, and I'm trust me, I'm going to get into
that for sure.
That's a big part of thisconversation, because anybody
who's a parent, who has a child,who's old enough to have a
relationship, knows that it'sgot to be.
(15:54):
It's not just the two of them,it's the families too.
They have got to mesh.
So, yeah, yeah, that'sdefinitely true.
If you could change one thingabout their school years, what
would it be?
And then piggyback on that andtell me what your greatest joy
was of their school years.
And if there's nothing that youwould change, you can, you can
say that.
June Zoul (16:16):
I mean, that's totally up to you I don't, I
don't know that I I couldn'tthink of a situation that um an
instant that I would changeanything.
I would just always want to getmore support and to support the
teachers more and to make theinclusion a successful thing for
(16:40):
James and the teachers andeveryone involved.
So the change I would make isjust continue to ask for more
support.
And for James, one of thebiggest highlights was the
basketball CIF championship inSan Diego at the end of his
senior year.
It just kind of spoke to somany successes that James had
(17:05):
through his school schoolingyears and his confidence and his
friendships and all of that.
So that was probably everyone'sgreatest joy for that.
Greta Harrison (17:21):
There's no words to describe what it's like to
be part of a team.
Yeah, that's great.
Okay, melody and Bob.
Melody Rupple (17:28):
Well, as far as changing, I don't think we
change anything.
I guess you'd like the systemto change and make it easier so
that we don't have to work sohard to make all these things
happen for our kids.
But obviously it's 23 and notall that much has changed, and I
(17:52):
guess the highlights are thatshe just got to have a regular
life experience.
You know, it was the big jokewith my other daughters and
their friends that Kristen wasalways the one that had the date
for prom and she had moreboyfriends than any of them and
uh and she went to the prom in alimo with you know, a group of
(18:17):
friends, so I think that'sprobably our greatest joy.
She has fabulous memories of allthat.
Greta Harrison (18:25):
That's wonderful .
I love that.
Tell me about graduation.
What was their high schoolgraduation like?
Was there anything special?
Were there any special stories?
Melody Rupple (18:38):
Not really school graduation, like, was there
anything special?
Were there any special stories?
Uh, not, not really.
I mean, she had her cap andgown and got to walk with
everybody else and uh, you knowagain, it was just that normalcy
.
Bob Rupple (18:50):
The fact that there aren't a bunch of stories about
how their graduation was forsomeone with a handicap or a
ability.
A different ability is thesuccess story and the special
story in itself.
June Zoul (19:05):
Yeah, ours was the same and I totally agree with
you guys.
Jim Zoul (19:11):
Yeah, pretty normal it was a big, exciting moment
really for family and friends,you know.
Greta Harrison (19:18):
Yeah.
Jim Zoul (19:19):
A lot of support there , yeah.
Greta Harrison (19:23):
Okay.
Bob Rupple (19:25):
I'm sorry, Greg.
Greta Harrison (19:26):
No, you go ahead , Bob.
Bob Rupple (19:27):
Well, I'm just off of what Jim said.
The one thing I guess that is alittle different is that with
Kristen I'm sure with James thewhole family really took part
and that's not necessarilyuncommon for the whole family to
come out and support a graduate, any graduate of high school.
(19:47):
But again with Kristen,everyone was so, you know, were
part of the support story forher whole life yeah so they came
out and it was an extra special, as was her wedding, which
we'll get into later yeah so youwould say it was magnified.
Right, you're just saying it wasextra special in that it was
(20:10):
happening as a normal thing yeah, as a non-specialty event you
know what I'm saying but thatshe could experience that just
like anybody else.
Greta Harrison (20:21):
That's wonderful , that's great.
So after high school they bothwent and did some classes at the
local community college.
Jim Zoul (20:32):
Yes, they did.
Greta Harrison (20:34):
Okay, and did they have any classes together?
June Zoul (20:38):
At the local community college.
Greta Harrison (20:40):
Yes, they did.
They did have some classestogether, okay, they did.
June Zoul (20:44):
That was kind of the time period that they became
boyfriend and girlfriend.
I think that the college werethey there about four or five
years, I think.
Off and on they or James was.
It was probably about fouryears, four years.
Jim Zoul (21:02):
I think they.
June Zoul (21:04):
James started with work in the workout room and
swimming and weights andcomputer classes.
When, for after, they becameboyfriend and girlfriend and
they took more classes together,they took salsa dance together,
(21:27):
I think.
Did Kristen take some readingclasses in the lab?
Yeah, she took some readingclasses.
Melody Rupple (21:34):
There was actually a disability department
at that junior college andKristen had some extra support.
She took a couple regularclasses.
She took sign language a coupleregular classes.
(21:55):
Um, she took sign language.
She took um the first becauseshe was uh, she worked, uh, in a
kindergarten classroom and, uh,so she would have loved to have
got the, you know, thepreschool uh certification.
But she made it through thefirst class okay.
But the second one was reallytoo hard and she took a couple
(22:18):
years, a couple semesters ofsign language.
She actually knows quite a bitof sign language and then she
took a lot of like dance andswim and-.
Bob Rupple (22:29):
Not a lot of mathematics or science.
June Zoul (22:31):
No yeah.
Bob Rupple (22:35):
That's not Kristen's strong suit.
Hard math is hard.
Greta Harrison (22:38):
Thank you for listening to episode 20 of born
fabulous podcast, third season.
I hope you enjoyed it and wantto hear more short video clips
from most episodes are availableon our youtube channel and on
born fabulouspodcastulouspodcastcom.
You can also hear all releasedepisodes of Born Fabulous
Podcast on YouTube.
Now In episode 21, you willhear the Zolls and the Rupels
(23:01):
discuss James and Kristen's jobsand their dating journey.
Please follow and like us onFacebook, instagram, twitter and
Threads.
If you enjoyed this episode.
I'd be honored if you wouldleave a review wherever you
heard this podcast Now.
Please enjoy this clip.
Of Love is a Potion.
The lyrics are by MelissaRiggio, who was the focus of
(23:21):
season one, episodes one throughfour.
The music and voice are byRachel Fuller.
Rachel Fuller (23:29):
Love is passion.
Love never fails.
Melody Rupple (23:54):
Lost in motion.
Hello, my name is Greta Harrison.
Welcome to Born FabulousPodcast, season 3, episode 20.
The theme of this season isyoung adults with intellectual
disabilities living full livesof independence and
interdependence.
This episode features June andJim Zoul and Melody and Bob
Rupple.
It is the fourth of eightepisodes with the Zouls and the
(00:23):
Rupples, which is part of anin-depth series about marriage
featuring parents,self-advocates with support
staff and an employer.
Both the Zouls and the Rupplesare retired and have been
married over 40 years.
They are the parents of JamesZoul and Kristen Rupple, who've
been married over five years.
James and Kristen have Downsyndrome.
(00:43):
Now please enjoy this clip.
Of Love is a Potion.
The lyrics are by MelissaRiggio, who was the focus of
season one episodes one throughfour.
The music and voice are byRachel Fuller.
Rachel Fuller (01:11):
Love is everything.
Love is all around.
Love is a potion, love ispassion, love is devotion.
(01:36):
Love is fusion.
Greta Harrison (01:40):
But before we move on because I love the story
of how they met, but I skippedsomething and if I don't do it
now while I remember, I mightforget Can you give me some
examples or an example ofsomething that you implemented
early in your now adult's lifethat helped them be more
(02:01):
independent, interdependent.
Later Can you think ofsomething, and it can be
something small too, somethingmean it doesn't have to be small
.
I'm just saying it can besomething small, it can be small
or big.
Melody Rupple (02:13):
I think in my case because I had other
children younger and they wereall so close in age and I also
had a teenager, so withcompletely different needs there
was just one day where I justdecided I can't keep all this up
.
I mean, I think when you have akid with with special needs and
(02:36):
they tell you they need physicaltherapy and occupational
therapy and speech therapy, youget in this mindset of if I
don't do every one of thesethings, I'm going to wreck my
kid's life.
They won't be everything theycan be because I didn't do all
that stuff.
But when she was about four,five, and I'm taking all these
(02:59):
other kids with me to all thesetherapies, I'm looking at the
other kids and going well, theygot to have time to take a dance
lesson, they got to have timeto do these other things.
So I think, just because mylife, the way my life was set up
, I just made up my mind thatKristen would benefit the very
most by just being part of thefamily and I couldn't give her
(03:22):
every single solitary moment andin the long run, that's one of
the things that helped her bereally independent, you know,
and which she is veryindependent and determined was.
She just, you know, wanted todo the things that her sisters
(03:43):
do, and skipping one of thosetherapies didn't make a big
difference in that, you know it.
It just gave me a sense where Ilet some of that guilt go, you
know, and uh, so I think it justkind of for us hit, you know,
happened organically that shehad to learn.
Greta Harrison (04:04):
Yeah, there's a famous advocate named Kathy Snow
who talks about that.
Her son was Benjamin Snow.
Does that?
Is that name familiar to eitherof you?
no but um she talks abouttherapy world and she and
because her son has he hassignificant disabilities and he
(04:25):
had numerous therapies At acertain point in his life he
kind of let her know he didn'treally want to be in therapy
world and it was a wake up callto her that I'm not saying
therapy isn't important.
So please, please, don'tmisunderstand that.
But it was a wake up call thatsome things can be done at home
(04:46):
and some things can be doneother ways.
For instance, the dance classesKristen took.
That's physical therapy, yes,therapy.
And being fully included, Iargue, is speech therapy.
So you know, there's, there'sdifferent ways and that's what
(05:09):
Kathy Snow talks about thattherapy is important and we need
guidance and we need to learn.
But we don't need to be caughtin this world of going 24, seven
, regardless of how manychildren you have.
But I can totally understandthat when you have four kids
because you're split and, yeah,I understand that.
(05:33):
That's a great example.
What about you, june?
June Zoul (05:37):
Yeah, I have to kind of piggyback on that first and
just say it's so nice the waythat you articulate all of that
melody.
It makes me just.
You know, I'm learning fromthis podcast about things and
(05:59):
that was just one part of whatI've learned.
So thank you for that, just onepart of what I've learned.
So thank you for that.
And I would I'd have to saythat for James, something that
happened and continues to happenearly on for his that has
helped his independence.
Interdependence is just hisorganizational.
(06:21):
That early on with hisschoolwork or his bedroom or his
cooking for himself or just anyof those life skills that he
had to learn early on,definitely helped him to be the
man that he is today.
Him taking pride in hisappearance when he goes to
(06:43):
school, having his homework done, being accountable for his
spelling tests has helped withhis reading, just all of it.
Greta Harrison (06:54):
You know you mentioned his.
You've mentioned his spelling acouple of times.
So I just want to jump in herebecause my daughter was also a
good speller and I remember afew teachers you know they're
always trying differenteducational things every year
and trying these systems and onetime this particular teacher
just automatically gave she haddifferent groups of words for
(07:18):
different kids and sheautomatically just gave my
daughter the lowest group andonly five words and she was like
in fourth grade and I'm likeI've always said give her the
same number of words aseverybody else.
She's a good speller, give herwhat everybody else has.
And I wouldn't say it was abattle, but it was an exercise
(07:39):
in making that teacher realizejust because somebody has Down
syndrome doesn't mean they can'tbe a good speller or a good
reader or a good whatever.
And give them the chance.
Just give them the opportunitybecause what's made them who
they are is that they had achance and I like that because
you're right, it helps in theirtexting, it helps in life when
(08:01):
they're able to spell.
I had one teacher in middleschool say it doesn't matter if
they can spell because they'respellcheck, and I said, excuse
me, that's not correct, you know, it's just it does matter.
So I'm sorry, didn't mean to gooff on a tangent.
I see so much I agree with withwhat both of you are saying.
Bob Rupple (08:21):
Could I?
Could I add one other thing onto what Melody and June both
said, too Along those same lines, but a little different slant.
We had said that we learnedearly on not to just take
Kristen's limitations or whatother people think are Kristen's
limitations and let Kristendetermine her own limitations
(08:44):
and when she needs help.
So one of our early onphilosophies mine was just to
treat her like all my otherdaughters.
Melody has a large extendedfamily, so Kristen has tons of
cousins too, so she had all thatsocialization and example
setting, et cetera, of how sheshould act, but not just about
(09:05):
social skills, but any situationthat Kristen is in
no-transcript, and so my initialway of approaching it is not to
help her at all and just sayKristen, this is what you need
to do, Let me know if you needsome help.
And of course if she needs somehelp then you give it to her.
But it's amazing what she cando when you just throw her in
(09:28):
and say sick or swim.
And even yesterday her pursehad been stolen and I won't get
into that whole story, but Itook her to the DMV to get her
new California ID card and Icould have easily taken her in
there and just say follow mearound, Kristen, and I'll get
this card for you.
But if anyone's been to the DMV, you might know what that
(09:49):
experience is like.
But I took her in there and Ihad her do it all.
I had her go up and talk to thepeople at the windows.
I was right behind her, youknow.
If she needed anything, Iexplained to her I'd already
been given a letter and a numberand you have to look for it up
on the screen and then find outwhat window you're going to and
(10:09):
listen to where they tell you todo and all that kind of stuff.
And I just explained that toher and I said okay, you're on
your own.
And then I started challengingher.
You know well, see right nowthe numbers on this for this
window.
Where is that window?
You know just that kind ofthing and simple things, like
she didn't want to be in therewith her glasses on because she
(10:30):
didn't look as nice with herglasses on in her mind, and so
of course, she couldn't read anyof the numbers that are up over
the windows.
So, you know, she eventuallyput on her glasses and was able
to coordinate with everythingperfectly.
So I just stood back from herand let her go and I think that
early on, having that as theirphilosophy not hovering over
(10:51):
them at all, that but just beobservant to when they do really
do need some help, but justassuming they can do it, explain
to them what they need to doand then turning the loops and
that has really worked forkristen.
Greta Harrison (11:04):
yeah, she takes pride in being able to figure
things out and it sounds likeyou've also given her a very
important skill of being able toask for help when she needs it,
because a lot of people that'shard for them.
But what you've done is you'veshown her she can do it and she
knows how to ask for help whenshe needs it, right.
Bob Rupple (11:25):
Yeah, we have the opposite problem.
She doesn't ask for help, butsometimes she should, because
she thinks she can figureeverything out.
She sometimes doesn't know whatshe doesn't know, and that's
the issue.
We have to look for more thanyou know.
June Zoul (11:40):
And James is just the opposite.
He asks for help continually,but that's because I'm one of
those that would go into DMV andwalk up to every counter and do
all the talking.
Bob Rupple (11:55):
So it's interesting how, how you had to pay for it
with her debit card.
She had to sign off.
Fingerprinting get the picture.
All this stuff you have to do.
June Zoul (12:06):
I think that's great and that's where you guys
inspire me.
Us is to to just kind of allow.
You know, I'm trying, afterafter all these years, I'm still
trying to allow him to do more.
It's uh, it's interesting, butgo ahead, greta I, I just think
I I love that.
Greta Harrison (12:27):
Thank you for that input, bob.
I I really appreciate that.
Jim Zoul (12:31):
Well, this is interesting you, you're gretta,
you hit on a real good pointearlier on this latest part, and
that is giving them theopportunity.
All they want sometimes is thatopportunity, and I've never.
You know, to this day I'm stillimpressed, along the way, by
(12:55):
what the results of anopportunity can be.
Greta Harrison (13:00):
You know, with James and Kristen, both so and
you know, that the differencebetween James and Kristen and
who they are now, and thedifference between James and
Kristen and who they might havebeen if they didn't have all the
opportunities they had alongthe way is night and day.
Jim Zoul (13:20):
Yes.
Greta Harrison (13:21):
You know they are who they are because of
their opportunities.
Yeah, and even though yourstories are different, there's
many more similarities thandifferences.
Jim Zoul (13:30):
Yeah.
Greta Harrison (13:31):
You know.
So I think that's absolutelygreat.
So I think that's absolutelygreat.
You know, bob, when you weretalking about being in the room
and coming in in your suit andtaking the names, it reminded me
of when Steve Riggio, theformer CEO of Barnes Noble he
talked about because his wifewas a teacher, so she was an
(13:52):
educator, and he noticed, atthis one particular IEP meeting
he he asked who everybody wasand then he asked how they knew
his daughter and nobody in theroom knew his daughter.
And he said, when nobody in theroom knew his daughter, he left
that meeting and told his wifewe're moving and they moved,
(14:14):
they literally moved.
Bob Rupple (14:15):
That's a great, a great story.
Greta Harrison (14:16):
Yeah, he tells that yeah.
Bob Rupple (14:19):
Yeah, that's something I never asked that I
should have.
Greta Harrison (14:22):
He said yeah, how do you know my daughter?
And he said nobody knew hisdaughter and it's like they were
all there to determine what thefate of his daughter was going
to be.
Jim Zoul (14:32):
And they didn't know her, Isn't that something?
Greta Harrison (14:35):
Yeah, yeah.
So and they didn't know her,isn't that something?
Bob Rupple (14:39):
Yeah, yeah, go ahead .
No, you go ahead, go ahead.
Well, I would just say twothings real quick.
One is that we, even as parentstoday and we certainly have to
help the aides that are providedto Kristen and James to
understand that you'll assumethey can't do as much as they
can do, you know, and thensometimes you'll assume they can
(15:00):
do one thing.
So therefore they can certainlydo these other things and
assume they can do more thanwhat they can really do.
And it's really a learningexperience and the goal is to go
through that experience andlearn what they can and can't
really do and then challengethem on on things they can't do
and let them go on things thatyou know that they obviously can
(15:23):
do.
The other thing I was justgoing to mention is how
fortunate the four of us are tohave each other's parents,
because if we didn't have therelationship we have, it
wouldn't work at all.
Greta Harrison (15:34):
Oh, and I'm trust me, I'm going to get into
that for sure.
That's a big part of thisconversation, because anybody
who's a parent, who has a child,who's old enough to have a
relationship, knows that it'sgot to be.
(15:54):
It's not just the two of them,it's the families too.
They have got to mesh.
So, yeah, yeah, that'sdefinitely true.
If you could change one thingabout their school years, what
would it be?
And then piggyback on that andtell me what your greatest joy
was of their school years.
And if there's nothing that youwould change, you can, you can
say that.
June Zoul (16:16):
I mean, that's totally up to you I don't, I
don't know that I I couldn'tthink of a situation that um an
instant that I would changeanything.
I would just always want to getmore support and to support the
teachers more and to make theinclusion a successful thing for
(16:40):
James and the teachers andeveryone involved.
So the change I would make isjust continue to ask for more
support.
And for James, one of thebiggest highlights was the
basketball CIF championship inSan Diego at the end of his
senior year.
It just kind of spoke to somany successes that James had
(17:05):
through his school schoolingyears and his confidence and his
friendships and all of that.
So that was probably everyone'sgreatest joy for that.
Greta Harrison (17:21):
There's no words to describe what it's like to
be part of a team.
Yeah, that's great.
Okay, melody and Bob.
Melody Rupple (17:28):
Well, as far as changing, I don't think we
change anything.
I guess you'd like the systemto change and make it easier so
that we don't have to work sohard to make all these things
happen for our kids.
But obviously it's 23 and notall that much has changed, and I
(17:52):
guess the highlights are thatshe just got to have a regular
life experience.
You know, it was the big jokewith my other daughters and
their friends that Kristen wasalways the one that had the date
for prom and she had moreboyfriends than any of them and
uh and she went to the prom in alimo with you know, a group of
(18:17):
friends, so I think that'sprobably our greatest joy.
She has fabulous memories of allthat.
Greta Harrison (18:25):
That's wonderful .
I love that.
Tell me about graduation.
What was their high schoolgraduation like?
Was there anything special?
Were there any special stories?
Melody Rupple (18:38):
Not really school graduation, like, was there
anything special?
Were there any special stories?
Uh, not, not really.
I mean, she had her cap andgown and got to walk with
everybody else and uh, you knowagain, it was just that normalcy
.
Bob Rupple (18:50):
The fact that there aren't a bunch of stories about
how their graduation was forsomeone with a handicap or a
ability.
A different ability is thesuccess story and the special
story in itself.
June Zoul (19:05):
Yeah, ours was the same and I totally agree with
you guys.
Jim Zoul (19:11):
Yeah, pretty normal it was a big, exciting moment
really for family and friends,you know.
Greta Harrison (19:18):
Yeah.
Jim Zoul (19:19):
A lot of support there , yeah.
Greta Harrison (19:23):
Okay.
Bob Rupple (19:25):
I'm sorry, Greg.
Greta Harrison (19:26):
No, you go ahead , Bob.
Bob Rupple (19:27):
Well, I'm just off of what Jim said.
The one thing I guess that is alittle different is that with
Kristen I'm sure with James thewhole family really took part
and that's not necessarilyuncommon for the whole family to
come out and support a graduate, any graduate of high school.
(19:47):
But again with Kristen,everyone was so, you know, were
part of the support story forher whole life yeah so they came
out and it was an extra special, as was her wedding, which
we'll get into later yeah so youwould say it was magnified.
Right, you're just saying it wasextra special in that it was
(20:10):
happening as a normal thing yeah, as a non-specialty event you
know what I'm saying but thatshe could experience that just
like anybody else.
Greta Harrison (20:21):
That's wonderful , that's great.
So after high school they bothwent and did some classes at the
local community college.
Jim Zoul (20:32):
Yes, they did.
Greta Harrison (20:34):
Okay, and did they have any classes together?
June Zoul (20:38):
At the local community college.
Greta Harrison (20:40):
Yes, they did.
They did have some classestogether, okay, they did.
June Zoul (20:44):
That was kind of the time period that they became
boyfriend and girlfriend.
I think that the college werethey there about four or five
years, I think.
Off and on they or James was.
It was probably about fouryears, four years.
Jim Zoul (21:02):
I think they.
June Zoul (21:04):
James started with work in the workout room and
swimming and weights andcomputer classes.
When, for after, they becameboyfriend and girlfriend and
they took more classes together,they took salsa dance together,
(21:27):
I think.
Did Kristen take some readingclasses in the lab?
Yeah, she took some readingclasses.
Melody Rupple (21:34):
There was actually a disability department
at that junior college andKristen had some extra support.
She took a couple regularclasses.
She took sign language a coupleregular classes.
(21:55):
Um, she took sign language.
She took um the first becauseshe was uh, she worked, uh, in a
kindergarten classroom and, uh,so she would have loved to have
got the, you know, thepreschool uh certification.
But she made it through thefirst class okay.
But the second one was reallytoo hard and she took a couple
(22:18):
years, a couple semesters ofsign language.
She actually knows quite a bitof sign language and then she
took a lot of like dance andswim and-.
Bob Rupple (22:29):
Not a lot of mathematics or science.
June Zoul (22:31):
No yeah.
Bob Rupple (22:35):
That's not Kristen's strong suit.
Hard math is hard.
Greta Harrison (22:38):
Thank you for listening to episode 20 of born
fabulous podcast, third season.
I hope you enjoyed it and wantto hear more short video clips
from most episodes are availableon our youtube channel and on
born fabulouspodcastulouspodcastcom.
You can also hear all releasedepisodes of Born Fabulous
Podcast on YouTube.
Now In episode 21, you willhear the Zolls and the Rupels
(23:01):
discuss James and Kristen's jobsand their dating journey.
Please follow and like us onFacebook, instagram, twitter and
Threads.
If you enjoyed this episode.
I'd be honored if you wouldleave a review wherever you
heard this podcast Now.
Please enjoy this clip.
Of Love is a Potion.
The lyrics are by MelissaRiggio, who was the focus of
(23:21):
season one, episodes one throughfour.
The music and voice are byRachel Fuller.
Rachel Fuller (23:29):
Love is passion.
Love never fails.
Melody Rupple (23:54):
Lost in motion.
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