Bootstrapping in France (Baptiste Jamin from Crisp)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Justin (00:00):
Bonjour, Baptiste. Merci beaucoup. Thank you very much.
Come on, Saba. Traviere.

Baptiste (00:05):
Thank you. Thanks a lot.
Nice.

Justin (00:24):
Yeah. Your French is very good. It's it's still,
like, 10 or, like, 100 timesbetter than, all the, all the
American people watching Emilyin Paris on Netflix, and saying,
J'adan, Latourifel. J'adan LeLouvre. Oh, yeah.

(00:45):
It's how we say it. How we sayYeah. Le Louvre, vouslevez
couchez avec moi. 100 timesbetter. I see.
You can

Baptiste (00:54):
speak for Stevie. I'm glad. I'm glad I got a little
chance. Hey. Welcome to BuildYour Sass.
This is the behind the scenesstory of building web apps in

(01:18):
2022 bootstrapping startups,Building your own thing. I'm
Justin Jackson, one of thecofounders of transistor.fm.
Today on the show, I haveBaptiste Jamet, Who is the
cofounder of Krisp, Krisp dot Im, if you wanna check it out.
They do live chat, customersupport, ticket software, help

(01:39):
desk software. They compete withmassive companies, Zendesk,
HelpScout, Intercom.
And they're seriously one of themost impressive Product
companies I've come across, itthe product itself is super high
quality, but the cost tocustomers, the price is really
affordable. We switched to themfrom Kayako, and we just can't

(02:00):
believe how good it is. So Ithink you're gonna get a ton out
of this conversation. It's oneof a lot of people, you know,
might not know Baptiste or mightnot know have heard of Krisp,
but they are seriouslyimpressive In terms of how
profitable they are, how manycustomers they serve, and what
they've been able to achieve.They're located in Nantes,

(02:22):
France.
Yeah. Let's get into thisconversation. It's great. So
Krisp is basic we use it ascustomer support messaging. You
have a live chat widget and thenit also, has an email component
so you can email support attransistor And it goes into the

(02:43):
live chat interface, and we canrespond to those emails in the
same interface.
And then it has a ton more. Buthow did it get started? You did
you and your cofounder know eachother before? What was the kind
of beginning of Crisp?

Justin (02:59):
Yeah. -Basically, before doing Crisp, we did, like,
several side projects. I mean, Iwouldn't say startups, but
really side projects. He and I,we started coding, like, when we
were teenagers. I started codingwhen I was 12, -Uh, doing some

(03:20):
video games, and he startedcoding when he was 16, and he
did, like, a messaging -It waslike an open source Facebook,
basically.
And So we did that when we wereteenagers. Then we did some
projects that worked. Some otherfailed. And, And, basically, we

(03:44):
met each other in the incomputer science school. We were
apprentices, so we worked in bigFrench companies, I used to work
at Orange, which is the biggestFrench ISP and he used to work
at Ericsson, telecom company.
And basically, we were we gotbored of our jobs. I mean, we

(04:05):
were we worked in big companies,and we felt, okay, basic
customer support and messagingis the core of any company since
like 1000 of years.

Baptiste (04:17):
I mean,

Justin (04:17):
since, like, when you think about customer support,
and when you When you go to thesame restaurant every time, it's
because you have a nice filling.Yeah. With, And then, the
restaurant, the people workthere. And it's the same for any
kind of businesses. And we felt,okay, Something is happening in

(04:43):
the the startup ecosystem.
More and more companies aregonna be created in the next
years. So -So, we need to have atool allowing for those
companies to get in touch withtheir customers something which
is Super cheap, reliable, andhaving, like, a nice feeling. We

(05:04):
wanted to create, like, the Theapple of the, the customer
support.

Baptiste (05:09):
Yes, the apple of customer support.

Justin (05:11):
So, we tried doing that by using something really
minimalistic. So the first Chrisversion was messaging, like a
simple chat widget. Yes. Just asimple chat widget. No file no
file upload, no emojis, just thecore was text messaging With an

(05:33):
interface to to to reply to allthe customer queries

Baptiste (05:37):
Yes.

Justin (05:38):
And, a chat widget, and something crazy minimalistic.

Baptiste (05:42):
Must have been quite so were you quite young when you
were figuring all this out? Wereyou still in university or you
were still in you're justworking your first jobs out of
university?

Justin (05:51):
So we were like 21 or 22, something like that. Yeah.

Baptiste (05:55):
So you were quite young. And this is in 2015.

Justin (05:59):
Yeah. 2015. Yeah. And and so, we did that. So we did
Crisp, just because we reallyfelt that we had to do this.
And we didn't, like, have anyvision, like, 10 years vision. I
mean, I I didn't know what SaaSwas about. I mean, the SaaS, in

(06:22):
software as a device. Aninvestor told me, okay, so Crisp
is a Saas software.

Baptiste (06:29):
Right? Yeah.

Justin (06:30):
Saas what? I didn't know that. I didn't know About all
the competition, etcetera. Imean, we wanted to do Crisp, and
we did Crisp. And I think,because of all our previous
experiences, I mean, we diddifferent messaging software
before.
So, by doing Crisp, we knew whatwe had to do. Then the kind of

(06:51):
features I mean, we knew how todo a great chat software. So, it
saved us a lot of time.

Baptiste (06:57):
Because you'd built, You'd you'd built some chat
software before?

Justin (07:01):
Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.

Baptiste (07:02):
I'm I'm I'm really curious about, as a couple young
guys in France, How aware wereyou of the startup ecosystem of
like, you said you hadn't heardof SaaS before, But had you
heard of, like, had you heard ofIntercom? Had you heard of any
of that? Were you readingTechCrunch?

Justin (07:22):
I wasn't reading TechCrunch, basically. So,
obviously, I knew somecompetitors, but not Intercom.
When we started Crisp, I didn'tknow about Intercom at all. I
mean, We didn't, do somebenchmark or whatever. We did
crisp, I mean.
We did crisp without thinkingabout All the rest. We did

(07:45):
something opinionated. And aboutthe French ecosystem, I think,
it really So I did, like, in2012.

Baptiste (07:57):
Okay.

Justin (07:59):
We started to have a strong ecosystem, some podcasts
in France. So we had, like, astart up, called TheFamily, Who
basically translated, all thearticles from Paul Brown, and
translated everything in French,and did some pod French podcast.

Baptiste (08:20):
Okay.

Justin (08:21):
About all the, the YC, etcetera. So thanks to that, we
had all the Basically, all theknowledge from the Silicon
Valley, but in a French way. Andit helped a lot, all the French
people, building startups.

Baptiste (08:40):
Okay.

Justin (08:40):
Because we we came from we came from nowhere. Yeah. And
now we have a Trabillard, thankyou. Thanks a lot. Nice.
Pretty strong ecosystem inFrance, with, like, many, many,
many different startups beingcreated. And now, I think France
It's the biggest start upecosystem in Europe. Oh, really?
In fact, Brexit helped us a lot.Because, In in a sense that

(09:05):
because UK is no longer a partof, you, we Because we were,
like, the 2nd, the 2nd, Solidecosystem.
We are now the first one. Wow.Thanks to to Brexit. But, yeah,
still, it it's still a a apretty big ecosystem.

Baptiste (09:23):
And okay. So and so the family was like a, An
accelerator, like, a techaccelerator similar to Y
Combinator?

Justin (09:31):
Yeah. Yeah. It was like the French YC. Yeah.

Baptiste (09:33):
And did you participate in that? Did you end
Taking funding, or did you selffund Crisp?

Justin (09:39):
So we self funded Crisp. So Crisp is still, like, fully
bootstrapped And self, foundidea.

Baptiste (09:46):
And how did you do that as a couple of 20 guys in
their twenties, fresh out ofuniversity?

Justin (09:52):
So, in fact, it was not crazy complicated, because
what's cool building a startupwhen you're a student is, you
know, you don't have any wife,you don't have any Kids, you
don't have any house.

Baptiste (10:02):
Yes.

Justin (10:03):
So your life is pretty cheap.

Baptiste (10:04):
Mhmm.

Justin (10:05):
So being Ramen profitable, I mean, you don't
need so much money to, To to be,like, in life I mean, to to
succeed a company when youstarted you're a student is not
crazy complicated. So using,like, $100, you can stay alive,
and it's what we did. It's whatwe did.

Baptiste (10:26):
And What What infrastructure did you use when
you started? Were you on AmazonWeb Services? Were you

Justin (10:33):
No, no, no. So AWS is like too expensive, and, the
value for the money is prettybad. Yeah. So we did some
benchmarks, And we figured outthat digital auction servers
were, like, the best value forthe money. I mean, The servers
were, back in 2015, were, like,10 times more efficient.

(10:59):
So, for, like, $5 per month, youcan, like, host the entire Crisp
and Fashion Drink.

Baptiste (11:05):
Wow.

Justin (11:06):
-It's not possible anymore, but we tried to
optimize everything because wewere students. We really wanted
to have a freemium model. Wewanted to have a free plan
because we thought it could itcould give us A lot of
attraction, users. So we usedthe free plan, like, as a

(11:30):
marketing, and, So we we had tooptimize everything, and then
the servers, etcetera.Everything was super optimized.
So, basically, it was easy toget started because hosting
Chris costed us, like, €50 permonth, something like that.
Yeah. And we knew how to tocreate Crisp. I mean,

(11:53):
technically, how to createCrisp. We tried to do The
marketing ourselves, customersupport.
So, during, like, 1 year and ahalf, We didn't have any
employees, etcetera. Prettylean, and, we started to be
profitable just being Vallejoand I, doing

Baptiste (12:17):
Just the 2 of you. I mean, what's interesting is you
have this insight. Even havingnot heard of Intercom, you had
this insight that customermessaging was gonna be big, that
every business Needs some formof messaging. And you said,
maybe you noticed this atrestaurants, like restaurants
with good customer service.Restaurants that

Justin (12:38):
Yeah. Yeah.

Baptiste (12:39):
You know? But was that, like were you were you
thinking of when you wereobserving these things, were you
thinking of a restaurant thatanswers the phone, or you're
just Thinking of a restaurantthat onboards clients into the
restaurant itself, what wereyour observations that made you
feel like This was worthpursuing.

Justin (12:57):
-So when we started Crisp, we felt, Okay, maybe we
could sell Crisp to restaurants,actually. Having something,
handling email, phone calls,chat, etcetera. And messaging
chat was just the first Step ofthis plan. And when we started

(13:18):
with just chat, we the marketwas so huge That we had to do so
many things, so many features.Yes.
So many stuff was going on. So,going to chat took us a lot of
time, But because the market isso big, and then, in fact, In

(13:40):
terms of messaging, and in termsof customers, you had 2 kinds of
customers. The customers Whophone companies first, and the
customers who want asynchronousmessaging. So, nowadays, most of
the people who are under, like,35, maybe under 40, were born

(14:04):
with Internet And iPhones,etcetera. So, for them, they
prefer to chat with companies.
It's quite a thing for them.They want to chat with
companies. They don't want to dophone calls, etcetera.

Baptiste (14:19):
That's right. Like, if they'll avoid they'll do
anything but Getting on thephone. Like, don't make me call.

Justin (14:25):
Yeah. They're scared of taking phone calls.

Baptiste (14:29):
But boomers love it.

Justin (14:32):
Yeah. Exactly. And the open is and the opposite, the
boomers loved, phone calls.

Baptiste (14:38):
And so you have this This insight how did you know
the market was big? Like, youyou put Krisp out and you just
started seeing traction rightaway. What were the indicators
That the market was big, thatthere was a lot of potential
customers there. And when yousay the market is big, were you
still thinking of restaurants,or were you thinking of Just any
company on the Internet.

Justin (14:59):
So, basically, when we started Crisp, we thought to we
don't know anything about themarket. So, to get started,
we're gonna try withsolopreneurs, freelancers. We're
gonna try using this marketfirst. And then, we're gonna
collect all their feedback, andwe're gonna upmarket. So small

(15:21):
startups, SMBs, and then biggerSMBs, -And it's, what do we do?
Every try, we upmarket. And now,we are selling to enterprise
customers. So, when we startedCrisp, we had Maybe 10 initial
users. Okay. And we focused onthose 10 initial users.
Those users gave us a lot ofdifferent feedback. Yeah. So,

(15:44):
rather than focusing ontraction, acquisition, we just
focused on retention. Got it. Tomake those 10 customers happy,
and what we figured out that isthat Those 10 users talked about
Chris Q, other companies, and westarted to have 15 users, then

(16:05):
20, then 50, 100, and then oneof those initial users featured
us some product tints.

Baptiste (16:13):
Okay. Yeah.

Justin (16:15):
And back so, in 2015, Product Hunt was a closed
community. And the guy didn'tTell us about that. On Sunday,
we were on Crisp answering someusers and boom! So all the
analytics, etcetera, everythingwent crazy, like really crazy.

Baptiste (16:37):
Like traffic, like people coming in, people Asking
questions.

Justin (16:41):
Yeah. Yeah. We had 2 busy days. So I had, like, to
work during nights. And mycolleague during days.
And we did like shifts likethat.

Baptiste (16:53):
Oh, wow.

Justin (16:54):
So, yeah. We could like handle all the traction. And
then, we tried to collect allthe feedback and to make all the
users happy about that. And, anyin the next so Product Hunt was
something big for us because itreally helped, to get traction.

Baptiste (17:15):
Yeah. And that that was fairly because that was also
in 2015. So you launched by theway, how did you find those
first ten people? Where did theycome from?

Justin (17:26):
So, I had a friend, who contacted like a few companies.
Called emailing, basically,telling them, You don't have any
customer service. I mean, yourcontact form is broken. You
should use Crisp. Wow!
And the next the next day, wehave 10 users.

Baptiste (17:44):
Wow. That's a good friend.

Justin (17:46):
Yeah. Very good friend. Yeah. Yeah. Because initially,
Crisp, I mean, No one could signup on Crisp.
I mean, with Valerian, we weretypical engineers. Now, it's not
perfect yet. Yes. It's passwordprotected. So the the home page
was password protected.
And, so this friend told me, butcan I Sign up on Crisp? No, you

(18:10):
can't. It's password protected.Oh, man. Give me give me the
password.
And I told that I okay. Couldcould we maybe stop, password
protecting Crisp? And, yeah.Okay. Let's remove that shit.
So, yeah. Nowadays, Many people,had a look to the movie about

(18:35):
Facebook. I don't remember thename.

Baptiste (18:38):
The Social Network.

Justin (18:39):
The social network. And, most of the people think that
launching a company is likeemailing thousands of people,
and then boom. Yeah. Yourcompany is, is created, and you
get, you have traction. Yeah.
But in fact, starting a companyis like Launching your company

(19:00):
every day, during like a fewweeks. Yes. There is no d day.
Yeah. Yeah.
It's a slow, opening.

Baptiste (19:09):
Slow opening. And and you felt like did it feel like
you mean, like, every single dayyou came in and you were like,
Okay. Well, like, today, we'regoing to take off the password
protection, and that's going tobe like another launch. Is that
what you mean?

Justin (19:23):
Yeah. Yeah. It's not even a launch. I mean, it's just
one more step.

Baptiste (19:27):
Yes.

Justin (19:27):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So so we moved the password, and the
next day, boom, 10 users.

Baptiste (19:32):
It's it's really interesting that you got started
with the cold emailing, if youthink about it. Was that a hard
step for you to get somebody tohelp you with that? Did you have
any kind of sales or marketinginclinations?

Justin (19:45):
No, no. I mean, we were like 2 typical engineers,
Developers not knowing anythingabout marketing, SEO, etcetera.
Not wanting to talk 2 people atall. Yeah. So, yeah, when we
started to have to have users,we had to split the roles, and
my colleague, Valeron, Moredoing code, doing more code, and

(20:09):
me doing more marketing andgrowth.
So I I try to Learn everythingabout marketing. Draw faking.

Baptiste (20:18):
So and even today, if I look at your about page,
there's you and Is it Valerian?How do you say it? Valerian?

Justin (20:26):
Yeah. Yeah. In French, you you pronounce the arbot in
English. I think you would sayValerian.

Baptiste (20:31):
Yeah. So You too. So he's more technical and and then
you have Antoine who's alsodoing marketing and sales, And
then you have some more softwareengineers. So and then a content
manager. So did that sales andmarketing grow over time?

Justin (20:48):
So, we went from 0 to 100 ks amoral, just Being the 2
two roles.

Baptiste (20:58):
Wow. How long did that take?

Justin (21:01):
3 years?

Baptiste (21:02):
0 to a 100 k in 3 years with just the 2 of you.
And how did let's just stopthere for a second. How did that
feel? So You launch. You got 10customers.
Then someone features you onProduct Hunt. How many customers
do you think you got out ofProduct Hunt?

Justin (21:18):
5,000, something like that.

Baptiste (21:19):
5,000?

Justin (21:21):
Wow. Yeah, yeah, but not all the users were paying for
Krisp, But Okay.

Baptiste (21:26):
So you had some free

Justin (21:27):
users then? 5 yeah. Yeah. 5,000 user is it's still a
lot. And When when we talk aboutProduct Hunt, we we talk about
people who have a big impact inthe start up industry.
And talk those users are reallydifferent to, regular SMBs. I

(21:49):
mean, they're gonna spread Theword about your product. So
initially, yeah, maybe 5,000users, but thanks to all The
those users, we had a lot more.

Baptiste (22:03):
Yeah. You must have started getting a lot of
word-of-mouth.

Justin (22:06):

Baptiste (22:07):
And, I mean, it's nice that At this time, 2015, you
know, the SaaS ecosystem is muchmore mature. Customer support
ecosystem is much more, mature.There's Zendesk. There's, You
know, all these big players inthat space. And so now people

(22:30):
are looking for alternatives,and You folks come in.
What's always been interestingabout Krisp is the price. You
start free, And then you yougive an incredible amount of
value for the price that youcharge. How What was your

(22:52):
instinct there? Like, why makeit so affordable? Why you know,
because, you know, intercom Is1,000 and 1,000 of dollars per
month for, you know, they dodifferent things, but, you know,
that's what people are Oftencomparing, you must get a lot of
people switching from intercomto Krisp, I'm imagining.

Justin (23:13):
We felt we need to reduce The decision making for
users wanting to use a productlike Crisp. Initially, we had 4
different plans, And you had adifferent usage level between
all the the plans. So we had thefree plan. We had Crispro, Crisp
Business, And, enterprise,maybe. We had, like, 2 different

(23:39):
plans.
And we try to reduce decisionmaking by just having a free
plan, a cheap plan, and, like, Amore expensive plan, but with
all the features included

Baptiste (23:52):
Yes.

Justin (23:53):
Included, which was the Crisp Unlimited. Yes. And when
we released the Crisp Unlimitedplan, We had, like, 4 times more
users on this plan. Got it. Allthe users We're choosing this
plan rather than the Crisproone.
So, and we had a few friendsdoing unlimited plans, And in

(24:16):
fact it worked a lot. Yeah. Andin France, we did that because
in France we have I think theunlimited usage, is quite
popular in France. For instance,it started with Phones, and,
basically it was like crazy inFrance, when he did that, and

(24:40):
internet went popular, Thanks tothat. And we wanted we really
wanted to do the just somethingsimilar, but for Sass.
And we thought, okay, if we wantto make Krisp popular, it needs
to be a a no brainer dealer. SoIf you don't have any money and
just you start a company, justchoose for free, because,

(25:01):
anyway, you don't have the moneyto pay For any SaaS. So better
give the product for free, and,anyway, maybe you're gonna be
successful one day. And, it'show it works. And then we try to
have a plan for any kind ofcompany.

Baptiste (25:20):
For John and I, This is exactly how it worked
because, you know, we startedjust the 2 of us just like you
2, and we're bootstrapping this.We're self funding it. John,
especially, doesn't likespending money. So anytime he
can save money, he likes it. Andwe started with Kayako, and We
started with Kayako because itwas free.

(25:41):
So it was like, are are we gonnause intercom and spend, whatever
it was, 100 of dollars month, itwould have been more than our
hosting bill. Or are we gonnastart on something that's free?
We started on something that wasfree. The problem with Kayako Is
that the price was low, but theproduct quality was quite low.
It was just always had bugs.

(26:01):
We were always having downtime.We were always having trouble.
And then we're looking foralternatives. And every you
know, like, we would havedowntime, and then every 3
months, we'd be like, You know,should we look at something
else? We look at Intercom, andthen we look at Help Scout and,
you know, all these other tools.
And it never felt like right.Like, a lot of the tools didn't

(26:23):
have good live chat, which iswhat we wanted. And Then we
found Crisp. It got recommendedto us. And I just remember,
like, looking at it and going,there's no way that we're gonna
All of this for this price, butwe signed up for the free plan
and tried it.
And we're just like, thissoftware is solid. Like, this is

(26:43):
really good software, And it'sso much more affordable than the
alternatives. And you're right.It was just a no brainer. And I
think what's interesting is inthe startup ecosystem, there's a
lot of a lot of, ideas aboutmaximizing your price.
So, like, intercom is maximizingtheir price.

Justin (27:05):
Yeah.

Baptiste (27:06):
But for SMBs, that's the wrong At answer, if you're
looking if you're trying toserve SMBs, it's the wrong
answer because we We can'tafford intercom prices, and it's
way more likely we're gonnarecommend you to other people.
So I've recommended Krisp Somany times just because it's

(27:27):
like, this is an amazingsoftware, and you won't believe
the value you get for the price.Like, it's just a no brainer.
You've gotta get on it. And soit it I'm interested to know,
like, have do you feel like thattrade off has paid off of you
just get Way more word-of-mouth,way more uptake because of the

(27:48):
price?
Yeah.

Justin (27:48):
I think raising your price, like, Two times per year
can work for VC fundedcompanies.

Baptiste (27:56):
Mhmm.

Justin (27:57):
For a reason is they have So much growth that they
just don't care about paying 2times more for for what they
paid before. And it's even nottheir money. I mean, it's the
VC's money. So just just spend.Spend on the people, Spend on
the software.
Spend on ads. The spend,basically. So I think in comes

(28:21):
customers They're mostly VCfounded companies, and just,
they just just don't have thetime to switch. Yeah. So, okay.
They pay. They pay. But SMBs isquite different. And at Crisp,
we really Craft, a software forSMBs. Now, we start to have

(28:44):
enterprise users.
Yeah. But you're really crisp.What made us is SMBs. I mean,
regular SMBs, not technicalstartups. Really, we are talking
about German, industry, I mean,regular SMEs.

Baptiste (29:02):
Like like, main street businesses? Your So not
necessarily tech companies.

Justin (29:06):
Like Yeah.

Baptiste (29:06):
You're talking about, like, retail stores,
Restaurants?

Justin (29:10):
Regular. E commerce. Okay. Yeah. Many, many
different, many differentcompanies, you wouldn't Even
think about so, for instance,during COVID 19 pandemic, we
started to have, like, funny,usage of Crisp.
For instance, churches usingKrisp. Yeah. Because churches

(29:31):
were closed and people couldn'tconfess anymore, physically.

Baptiste (29:36):
They would just jump on they would jump on Crisp with
the priest.

Justin (29:40):
Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Wow. Exactly.
Yeah.

Baptiste (29:42):
Just start confessing their sins. And and the thing
is, the priest could, use yourmagic tool to look at what they
were looking at on their browserand see how sinful they really
were.

Justin (29:53):
Yeah. Yeah. And we also have a video. We also have a
video, chat system with Crisp.So they can do a live
conversation as well.
Okay. So it's a big confession.It it it it won't work with
chat. Let let's go.

Baptiste (30:13):
Let's do

Justin (30:13):
a call. Let's have a a video, Phil. That is hilarious.

Baptiste (30:16):
So do you find is it difficult having such a wide
variety of users? Becausethere's definitely, companies in
the the knowledge base space andthe customer support space And
the live chat space that goesspecifically for technology
companies. So you have all sortsof customers using in all sorts

(30:38):
of different ways. Has that beena challenge, or does it not
really matter? Does it notreally matter what they're using
it for?

Justin (30:45):
So sometimes, for these users, They're the 1st SaaS
software they're paying for.Yeah. I mean, they never paid
for any software before. So,they don't know stuff like what
the seats are. For instance, inthe live chat industry, they
used to pay per seat.

(31:07):
So, they they don't they're notfamiliar with that. And, so,
which it's why we've tried tomake Crisp As crisp as possible,
as simple as possible. It's tosatisfy this kind of customers.
And, now we have, a fewintegrations, a few
integrations, as well, made forthis kind of industries. Okay.

(31:31):
For instance, we have a fewintegrations for, like, niche
softwares. For instance, CRMsFor specific industries, and now
Krisp tends to be the iPhone ofthe customer service. I mean,
It's a tool where you can plugapps that can multiply the

(31:54):
experience of customer service.So you can, like, connect your
Stripe account on Krisp, andwhen someone has a chat with
you, you can immediately Findall the invoices.

Baptiste (32:07):
Yes.

Justin (32:09):
And we are now connected with different invoicing system
here, including Niche Systems,and it's how we try to tech
industries.

Baptiste (32:21):
Yeah. How because you have a pretty small team still.
How how are you able to ship somuch At this quality level,
like, you you have probably youyou might have a 100 times less
employees than some of yourcustomers. So how are you able
to build this quality softwareand keep releasing this? Like,

(32:43):
whenever I get your newsletters,I'm always like, How are they
shipping so much?
Like, how are they doing allthis with such a small team?

Justin (32:51):
But it's because we're a small team that we can achieve
great things. I don't think, andit's not possible to do a baby
with 9 women in 1 month. It'sthe same for features. I mean,
it's not by bringing moredevelopers Solving the same

(33:11):
issue, you're going to reducethe amount of time required to
solve the problem because therethere is some decision making
some meetings required, unittests, you know, Scaling people
is hard. Yeah.
So, with TridentCrisp, you findT shaped, people. Yes. People

(33:33):
with an entrepreneurshipmindset, and it's it's a lot
easier. Mhmm. Because you don'tneed to, like, spend your time
doing calls, etcetera, meetings.

Baptiste (33:46):
Yes.

Justin (33:46):
Just we get the things done. Okay. There is a problem.
Let's solve the problem. I mean,You are in charge of solving the
problem alone, and it's oh, itworks.

Baptiste (33:57):
And it and it's worked so far. And when you say t
shaped, you mean Somebody who isdeep in one area, like, has deep
knowledge in Yeah. Programmingor Whatever. But it's also broad
in that they could alsounderstand customer support.
They might also understand somemarketing.
They might all under

Justin (34:16):
The design, etcetera. Yeah. Exactly.

Baptiste (34:19):
Interesting. And and so right now, your team is how
many engineers on your team?

Justin (34:25):
We're 4

Baptiste (34:27):
engineers. Four engineers.

Justin (34:29):
Including, Valerio and I.

Baptiste (34:32):
Okay. And then it looks like you have Another you
have Antoine and Leo on content,and then you've got Leah, whose
partnerships, is that likefiguring out enterprise deals?

Justin (34:47):
Not only, but we start to have agencies. So we have a
lot of Different agencies usingCrisp, freelancers, etcetera.

Baptiste (34:55):
Okay.

Justin (34:56):
So we try to figure out Who could recommend Crisp for
clients and, having specialdeals, for them?

Baptiste (35:06):
Got it. In terms of marketing, what has been have
there been some other thingsthat have really worked for you,
like, where you've pulled thelever and you're like, This is
this brought us in a whole new,group of business that we
wouldn't have had before. Isthere anything like that, or is
it just gradual? Like, is itmostly word-of-mouth? Where are

(35:29):
you really focusing yourmarketing energy these days?

Justin (35:33):
It changed a lot, over the time. It changed, a lot. So
when we we started Crisp,basically, we didn't have any
strategy about marketing,etcetera. Just like a few users
using Crisp, Word-of-mouth, andwe tried to iterate crisp on
them about all their needs. Thenwe we started to have traction,

(35:56):
more users using Krisp, usingthe free plan and recommending
Krisp.
So, we worked a lot on theproduct, and especially around
onboarding, to better understandwhat the people needed. Yes. And
what was in their mind when theywanted to use a tool like Crisp?

(36:16):
Mhmm. So, we did the bottom ofthe funnel.
I mean, all those people neededa chat software right now. It
was their job finding a chatsoftware To get the things done
today. And it's what we offerthem, by simplifying the user

(36:39):
experience When the users signup for Crisp, and we try to
optimize all the steps so youcan get the things done
immediately. And it worked alot, and we figured out, by
doing that, let's so 50% of theusers We're still using Krisp

(37:00):
the next day.

Baptiste (37:01):
Wow. I I mean, that insight is what's interesting is
that instead of starting with amarketing tactic, You said,
first of all, let's just figureout where people are at when
they land on our doorstep.

Justin (37:16):
Yeah. Crisp is still about product led growth. It's
still. But with some, magicsauce, spicy morning sauce
around it, That makes a greatmultiplier around. I think
marketing is a great multiplier.
So, if you have a good tractionlike that, Using your product I

(37:37):
mean, succeeding a company isall about product market fit and
having a great Product for anaudience. If you have that,
okay, you're gonna have sometraction.

Baptiste (37:49):
Yeah.

Justin (37:50):
Marketing is doing from that To that, something like
that.

Baptiste (37:54):
Yeah, it's an amplifier.

Justin (37:56):
An amplifier, exactly. And and so we we achieved doing
that until 100 ks. So, I used toarrive at plateau of knowledge.
Marketing is was not like mything. I did that because I had
to do that, but it's not mypassion.

(38:17):
So we tried to find people, andAntoine, who joined the team In
2018, to solve to to reach thenext milestone, And, we started
to work on SEO. Back in thedays, no SEO at all. I mean, no
SEO. So, we had to iterate on alot of stuff. We tried paid

(38:43):
advertising as well,Copywriting, and, yeah.
But still the bottom of thefunnel. Yeah. And now, -As we
grow to more enterprise deals,more, users willing to pay more,
We need to to to have a betterbranding around Crisp. So, users

(39:05):
not requiring To use a supportsystem right now, but maybe in 6
months, a year, can know aboutour brand. They can know that
Crisp is good for them, andmaybe one day, they're gonna use
a tool like us, and they'regonna think about Crisp.

Baptiste (39:24):
Of Of those levers, SEO, ads, has anything worked
better or worse? Like, forexample, we've, At Transistor,
we've never really been able tomake ads work for us. What's
been your experience with ads,SEO? What's Been working the
best.

Justin (39:40):
I think it's complicated. Mhmm. Very
complicated and expensive. SEOis like Magic. I mean, magic in
the terms of it can be, supergood in terms of growth, but
It's super dark in the meantime.
I mean, the way it works for me,it's still not 100%. I still

(40:06):
don't understand everything.Yes. And even people working
100% of the time on SEO, theydon't understand What's

Baptiste (40:17):
going on? Yeah. What's in the dark box? But,

Justin (40:19):
there there Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But, there is still things
to do. I I don't think you needto focus a lot on SEO at the
beginning, to to succeed,something.
But at some point, you know, SEOis like the multiplier, the
amplifier.

Baptiste (40:36):
Yeah. Yeah. I think that's such a key insight. And,
again, just to go back to thisinsight of You realized that
when people landed on Krisp,they needed to make a decision
today. It was their job To findcustomer support software today.
Hey, Janet. I need you to go andresearch the best ones and just
choose 1. It it was similar forTransistor too. It's like, you

(40:59):
know, the 3rd time Kayako wentdown, we were like, that's it.
Like, today's the day.
I'm gonna go and research all ofthe possibilities. I go in 3
different Slack groups. I say,hey. What is everybody using for
live chat? Chris gets mentionedin that list.
I go check it out. I sign up fora free trial, and Now I'm in,

(41:22):
and I've but I also wanna closethe loop fast. I don't wanna be
deciding what software we'regonna use forever. I just wanna
make a decision and move on. Andgetting in the customer's
mindset the way you did,understanding That if you can
improve that initial experienceand that onboarding, that's the

(41:43):
piece that so much softwareDoesn't get.
They don't understand where ourcustomers at. What brought them
to your site today? Like, whatbrought them there? What mindset
are they in? And once youunderstand that, you can
configure your your onboardingto best Just, like, get them in

(42:05):
the product and get them paying.
And that's a lot of the battlebecause you could have a huge
funnel with tons and tons ofpeople coming in, But if you're
not able to make those keymoments

Justin (42:16):
Yeah. And for instance, I think regular industries, For
instance, if you think about thefood industry, and chocolate
bars, have a break, have a KitKat, it's such Great, tagline,
because I think it was creating50 in the 50s, 57. And the idea

(42:42):
about that is what the users, Imean, the people buying our
product, are doing When they buyour product. And, in fact, if
you think about chocolate bars,people try to achieve a task.
They're hardworking in theircompany.
They try to solve a bug. Theytry to, lawyers -Doing,

(43:07):
paperwork, etcetera. -Yeah. -Andthey want to get the things
done. -Yeah.
-And they go to the machine,They, they use, $1 to get the
product, and boom. They eat theproduct in, like, 5 seconds, and
boom, they are they go back towork. It's not about the taste.
It's just about Throwing the getthe food. That's right.

(43:31):
And it's it worked so well. Imean, have a break, have a Kit
Kat. It's just A chocolate bar,but it's a great tagline because
the marketing guys, thinkingabout that, knew The customers
and what the customer is wherewhat the what were their the

(43:51):
goal? What they wanted to do?

Baptiste (43:53):
Context. This is, in The jobs to be done, they call
they say, what are people hiringthe product to do? And there's
so many layers to that. Like, ifif you're in a company, and
let's say it's a 20 personagency, and your boss says, We
need to get live chat softwarefor this customer. And then

(44:16):
says, Janet, you go research,you know, the live chat
software.
The job to be done is differentfor different people in that
organization. For Janet, shewants to look good to the boss
and to the client. So what doesthat mean? It means I've got to
make a decision. It's if it'smore affordable, that's always

(44:36):
good.
They're gonna be saving money.If it's a good software that
doesn't make me look bad, that'sa good thing.

Justin (44:44):
Right? Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. And It's the customer,
and they're scared about theythey just don't want to fuck up
the decision, because it's Howtheir colleagues gonna think
about their role?
I mean, at the end, it's justchoosing, like, A software

(45:04):
costing, like, a few bucks permonth, but it's like their their
their job is all about This, andthey could be fired or whatever.
They they they want to mess upabout this.

Baptiste (45:15):
And even in small companies, with a cofounder, you
see this dynamic. If it's my jobto choose a tool or make a
decision and I fuck up and itlooks bad to John, my cofounder,
It that does affect me. That's apart of my calculus. Right? It's
like, I wanna make gooddecisions even in a Even in a

(45:37):
small company, in a cofounderrelationship, you don't wanna
fuck up.
Like, there's that old saying,like, nobody got fired for
choosing IBM. Right? Like,there's always this idea of
what's the safest choice I canmake that will make me We had a
a

Justin (45:53):
a an easy trick, And I learned this trick by working
from a French company, a smallcompany, having, like, normal
clients. And In a decisionmaking process, you have the
people choosing the software,and the people gonna choose, if
I'm gonna choose this softwareor another one. And then, maybe,

(46:14):
the the billing department isgonna pay for the software. And,
what they did is just A PDF.And, they gave you a PDF, and
then, you could forward this PDFto your boss, to your
colleagues.
So, you could convince them thatthis is the right decision. And,
we made the same horse crisp,just A PDF. Resuming everything

(46:40):
in 20 slides. That's so smart.Very easy.
Super easy to process. Featuresand three key points about what
to think. And super, like, it'ssuper easy and at the end, it's
just what, who we are, The Crispcustomer survives. Crisp SLA. I

(47:04):
mean, Crisp is never down.
We have a good customer support.And what's the cost? And if you
have any questions, email us.Just very easy and it works So
great. Because they can, like,okay, boss.
This is the document. This iswhat we need. And the boss He's

(47:25):
not having the time. He needs toto to make a decision, like,
quickly. And using thisdocument, He can do the right
decision.
He's not he's not having to goto the website, maybe Having an
account, etc. Is having a PDF.It's like buying a house, you

(47:46):
know. When you buy a house, wantto buy a house, You have a PDF
with photos, etc. The the thethe cards,

Baptiste (47:55):
Yeah.

Justin (47:56):
The agency, etc. Yeah. Contact points. Yes. This is the
same.

Baptiste (48:01):
Yeah. That's such a key insight. Again, because it
it gets in the psychology Ofsomeone buying a product, how do
people buy products? And unlessyou're just selling to a
solopreneur And there'sdifferent dynamics with
solopreneurs. But as soon as youhave 2 people in the company, I
have to convince John to buythis product.

(48:21):
So what am I gonna do? I'm gonnabe selling him on it. I'm now
the salesperson. So equip me asThe person who wants to buy your
software to sell it to the otherpeople in the organization. And
that's such a key like, a greatway of doing it is the is the
PDF.
This this is also the sameinsight, we a lot of us in SAS

(48:44):
have had about reports. What whydo you want reports? Give me
reports so that I can look goodto my boss in a meeting. Hey,
Janet. How are we doing in termsof customer support?
Oh, well, we've had Yeah. 81more conversations this week.
Our response time is down, andwe've had more visitors.

(49:06):
Perfect. Thanks, Janet.
Like, you you're equippingpeople to have the answers So
that they look good in ameeting. So key. Yeah. And once
you understand why Not everyoneis hire like, for podcast
hosting, not everybody is hiringpodcast hosting for the same
reason. The marketing team hastheir goals.

(49:29):
The boss has their goals. Theyou know, everybody has their
goals. The individual employeewho's in charge of purchasing
Has their goals. Right? Andnobody wants to fuck up.
Everybody wants to look good.

Justin (49:43):

Baptiste (49:44):
Make a decision that makes them look good. Make it a
no brainer. And this is why

Justin (49:49):
Definitely. Yeah.

Baptiste (49:50):
Is why you need, like, on another thing you guys do
great on your page is you justYou kinda systematically show
people, like, here's theproduct. It's built for customer
support, marketing, and salesaltogether, and then you have
300,000 brands are already usingCrisp. So the boss is gonna
wanna know why should I trustthese people. Well, 300,000

(50:14):
brands, including BostonUniversity, Call Hippo, John
Deere are all using thisproduct. Yeah.

Justin (50:23):
And and in fact, if you switch to a different language,
so if you switch to French, Ifyou switch to Portuguese

Baptiste (50:31):
I'm looking now. German.

Justin (50:32):
Oh, yeah. You're gonna change. You're gonna change. So
You you you know brand this kindof brands?

Baptiste (50:41):
Yeah. So you're doing it you're you're geolocating.
You're making it even moreSalient to potential customers
to say, hey. Well, if you're inFrance, let's, we'll show you, B
and B Hotels. You know, that's abrand that you might know and
recognize.
That's so smart. Like, are mostof your customers from Europe or

(51:03):
from North America. And what'sit like being a technology
company outside of NorthAmerica? Do you feel like that
has made anything harder, Or isthere a huge opportunity in the
EU that you've been able to takeadvantage?

Justin (51:17):
So, US, it's only 30% of our revenues, So, it means that
we take our revenues all aroundthe world and outside, the OS.
So I don't think there is anyissue for US customers buying a

(51:38):
product Map made, from theinvoice. In fact, it's why, if
you look at the footer on thehome page, it says, Made, Made
in France, something like that.Initially, I didn't want, to add
this tagline. I mean, We don'twant to sell us as a French

(51:59):
company.
But, if you look at the trends,show that American customers
have a good feeling aboutFrench, made product.

Baptiste (52:13):
That's right. Yes.

Justin (52:14):
So so, it's why we show that. I mean, I don't think it
would be the same if it willwould have been India, or I
don't know. But when if you lookat the trends, and it's even
better than showing USA. Made inthe USA.

Baptiste (52:34):
I mean, there's there's definitely, like,
certain brands that you see thatyou got Made in France has this
feeling of quality, of maybecraftsmanship, of higher
quality, luxury.

Justin (52:49):
Yeah. Yeah. It's the same for Germany. If you think
about German cars, when youclose the door, it makes a
special sound. It's perfect.
So a company, I mean, a countrycan have a perception about How
how they do product. It's whythere is this tagline, made in

(53:13):
France, in the future. But atthe end, you know, There are
great software developers allaround the world, so it's not
making any difference. And, So,yeah, it's not a problem for,

Baptiste (53:29):
Is your whole team located in Nantes?

Justin (53:31):
No. No. No. So Krisp used to be a remote company. I
mean, we didn't wait it ForCOVID-nineteen pandemic, to to
know what remote is.
We started Crisp by by being100% remote. And but we wanted,
like, to have our families, sobeing nomads was not easy

(53:53):
because when you travel allaround the world, You have not
you have you don't are you arenot doing any long term
relationships. So by going to,-Uh, the west of France, near
our families, friends, etcetera,it was easier. So, we made a
team in Nantes, But still, halfso 50% of the team is All around

(54:20):
the world. I mean, we havepeople working at Crisp in
different countries.
So all the Slack So we use Slackevery day, and all the people on
Slack just we speak Englishaltogether.

Baptiste (54:34):
Okay.

Justin (54:34):
And, but But half of the team is French.

Baptiste (54:38):
Oh, interesting. So but during the day, the language
that you use for, like, work isEnglish.

Justin (54:45):
Yeah. Not at the offices, obviously.

Baptiste (54:48):
And the other thing I think you've done well that I
think we're trying to thinkabout too, it's it's so easy
because so much Of the SaaSmarket, traditionally, has been
North America. It's easy for usto have blinders on. And so,
like, if I I would say our itgoes US first, then maybe UK,

(55:10):
Germany, Canada, France, AndAustralia. Those are our top
markets. But we know that, Youknow, in Spanish speaking
countries, podcasting is gettingbig.
And so one thing that's beeninteresting about Chris is you
have that auto translatefeature, And we have people all
the time that is it's almostlike you built the product just

(55:34):
assuming that you're gonna havea global audience. So you can
see right away, this personlikely speaks Spanish. Do you
wanna live translate this rightall at once? Do you think that's
helped you as a company get intomarkets that you wouldn't
normally have have reached into?Like, is there are you seeing
uplift in Spanish speakingcountries or in Asia?

Justin (55:56):
As we come from Europe, so people in the US and
especially, all the in America,think that Europe is Europe. I
mean, like the USA, but it's notworking like that. I mean,
Europe is 30 differentcountries, even more. And we all
speak different languages. Weall have different cultures,

(56:20):
different feelings, etcetera.
And as France comes we areFrench people. We come from
Europe. So we knew that, okay,If we want to be global, I mean,
France is going to be a marketfor us, because we are French.
So, we need to translateeverything in French. -We're
going to be global first, soEnglish first, but then we're

(56:43):
going to localize everything.
So We're gonna localizeeverything in French, everything
in Spanish, Portuguese, German,etcetera. And this strategy
worked great because, the Crisplive chat widget is translated
in more than 60 differentlanguages. And actually, our

(57:05):
users translated everything. Wedidn't do anything. Oh, really?
For that. Just Yeah. So all thechat widgets are translated by
the users, because they wantedto use Crisp In their own
language. So, yeah. Here is thetranslation file.
Translate it, and we're gonnamake Crisp compatible with

(57:29):
Finnish with, Danish withwhatever. And it's what we did.
And by doing that, in fact, wehad the huge Shrractions in
countries we never thought wewould have a chance. For
instance, Finland. Okay.
Chris was translated in Finnish,And thanks to that, we had a

(57:50):
YouTuber, doing a blog articlein Finland. And this guy was
super popular. And like in a fewmonths, we went from 0 to Market
leader in, Finland.

Baptiste (58:07):
Wow. That's incredible. It it may does make
me feel like I mean, this issomething we talk about at
Transistor, but going we in someways inspired by Chris, we
decided to localize Our podcastwebsites feature. And we have a
developer, Jason, who reallypushed this. He said, like, we
really gotta do this.

(58:27):
And so we localized it into, Ithink, 5 or 6 languages to
start. And it's interestingbecause you do just as soon as
people see, for For example,that you can have your website
in your language for yourcountry. It does just bring in a
bunch more attention, and sodemand customer demand that you
might not have been aware ofKind of shows up.

Justin (58:49):
It's complicated to think for native English people.
I mean, People, who have alwaysbeen used to speak English in
their life because they thinkthey think like that. But, you
know, right now, I'm doing thispodcast in English. It needs
even if I'm good, I think I'mgood at speaking English, but

(59:12):
It's not my main language. I hadto learn this language at
school, and right now, my brainCPU need to Tom's late in live,
everything.
And it's, I mean, even the bestNot English native speakers need
to think when they they readsomething, etcetera. So, if

(59:36):
everything is translated in yourmother Mar the tongue. It has an
immediate impact on yourthought. It's Something that you
are not thinking about, and evenlike English people are not
thinking about that, but it'sIt's a big impact to convince

(59:57):
people.

Baptiste (59:57):
Yeah. Because you feel like you're home when when you
see your language.

Justin (01:00:08):
Yeah, you have some kind of a Quebec accent.

Baptiste (01:00:11):
Yeah. I'm fine.

Justin (01:00:12):
Now Yeah, but for instance, people in Quebec.
Because crisp, is translated inFrench, they love it. Yeah. It
makes a big impact.

Yeah. The that we noticed that right away because
we get we would get a lot ofCustomer request from Ottawa and
from Quebec. And in Ottawa,that's our capital. Everything
has to be bilingual. And, inQuebec, everything has to be
bilingual, definitely, but, youknow, leads with French.

(01:00:42):
And, yeah, as soon as we Havethose French language
translations. One of the firstcustomers to use it was the
Canadian government because theyneed to have Podcasts in both
languages.

Justin (01:00:53):
Yeah.

So, yeah, I think it's a great insight.

Justin (01:00:56):
And it's a great way, as well, to differentiate with
competitors. At Crisp, we careabout that. We have features,
and, for instance, Crisp istranslated in Arabic. No one
cares about Hebrew, Arabic, etc.Because it's RTL.
Everything is in the oppositeway. Yes. Reverse.

Yes.

Justin (01:01:16):
And we do care about that. And, and, and, yeah. When
they see Crisp, wow, they'rethey're the only kind of company
Taking care of us. So they theylove us just because

of that.

Justin (01:01:30):
And and

some of those markets could be bigger. Has it been a
surprise for you? Like, is isAre some of those markets again,
like, when I talk to SaaScompanies in North America, it's
always the same 5 or 6. UnitedStates, Canada, Germany, France,
Australia, UK, germ Yeah. Thoseare the ones.
So is there a country whereyou've seen a lot of growth,

(01:01:52):
customers wise That surprisedyou?

Justin (01:01:55):
So, there, there is definitely something huge
happening right now in Countriesyou never think about. So, for
instance, in South America,there is something huge
happening right now in Brazil.In Asia as well, there is a big
startup ecosystem happening. Ifyou look at Indonesia, Vietnam.

(01:02:22):
Something is going on here, andyou see real startups.
Interesting. Launching.

But are you see are you seeing an influx of
customers from those locations?

Justin (01:02:32):
Yeah. Yeah. And and and also, So, definitely, something
is going to happen is, nownowadays, older people can use
smartphones, computers. Theknowledge tends to be cheap and
affordable. You can learnanything on Internet.

(01:02:53):
And you can for instance, thereare more and more startups
coming in Africa as well. Forinstance, there are some
companies, countries Like Kenya,with big startups' ecosystems.
So, the world where the USA,where the First, software

(01:03:13):
consumers and producers hasended, and we're Now, in a new
world where, like, internet isglobal, software, usage in
making is global, and it'stotally Changing right now.

Big opportunity. Well, thanks so much, Baptist, for
this. This was really great. Ilove So many of your customer
insights are are so interesting.I think we'll have to we should
do this again because I know I'mgonna have more questions as
soon as we hang up.
But is there anything you wantto, let our listeners know? Are

(01:03:51):
you hiring? Do you wanna, Anyanything in particular you wanna
let folks know before we leave?

Justin (01:03:57):
Yeah. So we we we hire Any kind of T shaped people, so
if you're looking, like, for acompany offering so, At Krisp,
we don't hire people for roles.We hire people because we think
those people are great people,and we try to build roles Around
people. So, if you're adeveloper liking a bit of

(01:04:21):
marketing, Crisp is for you. Ifyou're a developer liking design
plus, support, design plussupport, plus whatever.
Crisp is made for you. If youare you want to talk to people
but also code, Crisp is made foryou, for instance. We have
Dennis in Portugal, who startedat Crisp doing customer support

(01:04:43):
After doing, audio engineeringschool, and now he's shifting to
customer to, Development,because he's so good at it.
Yeah. So, Chris is T shapedpeople, and if you are this kind
of person, You can, reach usanytime, on chris.chat.

Awesome. Well, thanks again for doing this. Thanks for
staying up late to to do thephone call. Thank you for
engaging in English for an hourand 14 minutes and using all
those CPU cycles. I hope Ididn't make you.

Justin (01:05:17):
My my CPU is overeating. Yeah.

If I had to do this whole thing in French, it would
be it would be a you have tothink so Hard to think, how do I
say this in French? It's it'sjust I I I appreciate you doing
the the podcast, And, yeah,we'll do it again.

Justin (01:05:37):
Thank you very much. Have a good day.

Let's give a shout out to our supporters on Patreon.
We've got Jason Charms, MitchellDavis, Marshall Follett, Alex
Payne, Bill Kondo, Anton Zorin,Harris Kenny, Oleg Kulig, Ethan
Gunderson, Ward Sandler, RussellBrown, Noah Praill, Colin Gray,
Austin Loveless, MichaelSittver, Paul Jarvis, and Jack
Ellis, Dan Buddha, Darby Frey,Adam Duvander, Adam Duvander,

(01:06:05):
Dave Junta. You know, JohnBuddha found a bottle of Junta
wine the other day. Junta wine.We're gonna have a team retreat.
We gotta we gotta have someJunta wine while we're there.
And Kyle Fox From getrewardful.com. If you like this
episode, share it with a friend.Reach out to Baptiste on
Twitter. Let him know that youliked it, And I will talk to you

(01:06:27):
next time.
Bye.

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Cold Case Files: Miami

Dateline NBC

Stuff You Should Know

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Bootstrapping in France (Baptiste Jamin from Crisp)

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}Cold Case Files: Miami

Dateline NBC

Stuff You Should Know

All Episodes

Bootstrapping in France (Baptiste Jamin from Crisp)

Cold Case Files: Miami