January 15, 2025 • 52 mins
Pebblebee is the ultimate platform for businesses and consumers to find anything, anytime from any device. Our innovative products seamlessly integrate with either Apple’s Find My or Google’s Find My Device networks to help you locate your keys, wallet, or other valuable items.
For businesses, our embedded solutions make it easy to add cutting-edge tracking technology to your products, empowering you to deliver added value and convenience to your customers.
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Episode Transcript
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Intro / Outro (00:02):
Welcome to Building the Future, hosted by
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(00:22):
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Kevin Horek (00:35):
com. Welcome back to the show. Today we have and
Daniel, the CEO and CTO ofPebblebee. Guys, welcome to the
show.
Daniel (00:43):
Thanks, Kevin. Great to hear. Welcome. Thank you.
Kevin Horek (00:45):
Yeah. I'm I'm excited to have both of you on
the show. I think what you guysare doing at Pebblebee is
actually really innovative andcool, But maybe before we get
into that, let's get to knoweach one of you a little bit
better. Maybe, Doug, sinceyou're the CEO, maybe we'll let
you go first. Maybe give us alittle background on yourself,
and then, Daniel, I'll do thesame for you.
Doug (01:08):
Yeah. Sure. Thanks. Yeah. So I grew up in the in the
Midwest, in the great state ofMinnesota, not far from Canada.
So, yeah, kind of a traditionalupbringing up there. Attended
the University of Minnesota,business degree with marketing
and finance, economics. And thenhad, you know, kind of my early
press
Kevin Horek (01:28):
Sorry to cut you off. I'm just curious what got
you passionate about that andwhy did you wanna take that in
university?
Doug (01:36):
I had done various, sort of internships through high
school, early in college, andreally just found business was
my passion. It allowed me I'm apretty competitive guy and grew
up in lots of athletics andsports and just found that that
I was able to tap thecompetitive side a little more
(01:57):
on the business side. And then,frankly, I'm not as brilliant as
Daniel on the product side, andI learned that early on. He's,
he's a better engineer than Iwould be. So, I'd rather I'd
rather do a do the businessside.
So got in early on at theUniversity of Minnesota, did
lots of internships from, in thein the business realm, and then
(02:17):
had an opportunity with an earlystage company in Minneapolis or
Saint Paul called USSB. Theywere a pioneer in the satellite
business in this small the small18 inch satellite satellites. So
got in early on there and, wasable to sort of tap into more of
(02:38):
the marketing and sales side of,of the background. And then, did
that for a few years and, andDIRECTV, which we were a partner
with DIRECTV. But DIRECTVultimately acquired our side of
the business, and then I wasexposed to TiVo.
So then it's sort of been a acareer in new products,
(02:59):
innovative new products in innew segments, whether it was,
you know, satellite or, youknow, home secured DIY home
security. We were really thefirst one at Dropcam, which was
acquired by Google. And a lot oftime with you with Euro on the
mesh Wi Fi side. So Wi Fi hadbeen around, traditional routers
had been around. They had gottenfaster, but nobody was doing
(03:20):
mesh Wi Fi until till Euro gotinto it.
So I've had a an interestingopportunity for 25 years to
bring new and innovativeproducts to market in new
segments, and, and that's, yeah,that's sort of turned into into
a passion over the top over theyears.
Kevin Horek (03:37):
Very cool. Daniel, do you wanna give us a bit of
background on yourself?
Daniel (03:42):
Absolutely. So, yeah, Daniel Dara. I was born and
raised in Beirut, Lebanon. Sovery different, culture. You
know, best food, you you canfind anywhere in the world.
I'm a little biased, but, youknow, honestly, you gotta trust
me on that one. So, yeah, I Ithink, you know, my upgrade
upbringing in Beirut was was,challenging to say the least.
(04:05):
Obviously, we we, you know, we Iremember back in the day. I
mean, this is kinda what got meinto engineering. My grandfather
was was very innovative and andand he was an engineer in
background himself.
And I remember when we, would bein bomb shelters, and we would
have no electricity. Wow. And wehad to, you know, run TV to to
(04:28):
to watch our, news. And so himand I would would go collect
milk jugs and would wouldformulate some sort of acidic,
formula, which is usually lemonand vinegar and have our cathode
and anode from copper and zincand create develop batteries.
They were terrible.
They weren't efficient. But, youknow, that was our first
experience, you know, creatingbatteries and charging them when
(04:51):
we had power and running our TV.You know? Wow. And, and then
learned from that and then wentfrom there to essentially
salvage batteries from from,cars that were just on the
street and then rebuilding themand built the system where now
we had heat and TV and, we hadthe all sorts of things, the
(05:15):
basics that we needed when wedidn't have electricity.
So that kinda really trick Imean, I was 9 years old, you
know, and that triggered my, my,interest in innovation and
adding value. And I rememberalso, also, you know, I I flew
into the US. This was when itwas really bad, and and we had
to, leave. And we came into theUS for about 6 months, and I was
(05:36):
12 years old. And I went backand I this is when I discovered
Costco, and I I discoveredcandy, you know, American candy.
And I and I bought a wholebunch, and I every dollar I had,
I I spent it all and bought awhole bunch of candy, went back
to Lebanon, full suitcase, youknow, went back to school, and I
(05:56):
sold it for 3, 4 times theprice. Uh-huh. And that's when I
got hooked. Not only because Imade money, but I could see the
smiles on these kids. You know?
And they were so excited andhappy. Within 2, 3 days, they
were all sold out, and they werelike, can we have some more? Can
we have some more? And I waslike, I was just talked, you
know, and and and the in boththe innovation side of things
and then also the business sideof things, which is why I ended
(06:18):
up, going to University ofWashington. I got my computer
engineering degree there as wellas my master's in electrical
engineering, and then, ended upworking for Boeing, Phantom
Works, which is, specificallyfocused on military
communication systems.
My thesis, back at school wasbased on predicting satellite
communication traffic, for thepurposes of improving quality of
(06:41):
service. And so it was in themilitary segment. It was also
military assets, which isessentially tracking assets, and
I ended up doing the same thingfor Boeing for 11 years.
Specifically for military,whether it's air, subsea, sea,
land, not just for the US, butalso internationally, helping
(07:01):
them track, military assets. Andthen that led me to start and
found, with Nick Pearson Franks,which was my business partner,
founded the company in 2,013, onthe basis and the vision of,
essentially helping people findand and track their things and
their belongings and havingpeace of mind.
Kevin Horek (07:22):
Interesting. Okay. So it's one thing to have,
obviously, an idea to do this.What made you decide to actually
go for it and actually buildPebbleby, and how has it evolved
over the last, you know, decade,basically?
Daniel (07:39):
It has evolved quite a bit to say the least. But really
what what struck me and and gotme into starting this is really
there are 2 things. 1 is mypassion for innovation and
creativity and then also aproblem solver. The problem was
there, you know, and and we wecan find our stuff. This was
back in 2012.
(07:59):
And, so I wanted to solve thatproblem. My background in
technology, wanting to learnengineering because I wanted to
create I wanted these tools sothat I can create. And then also
the the the passion of creatingsomething that adds value in
this world, just really addingvalue, good for humanity. That's
really something that I've I'vealways been passionate about.
(08:21):
And that's where we started offwith with the business.
We we created it in our basementand in our garages, I mean,
literally, for several years.And then when we really spun off
the company and ended up I mean,we started in 2013, but I quit
Boeing in 2015 because I wasjust, you know, overwhelmed. So,
Nick and I started the company,and and ever since then, we've
(08:43):
always had this vision of havinga cross platform system where no
matter what system you're using,iOS, Android, Amazon, whatever
it is, Windows, it would workfor you as a user whether it's a
consumer or business. The visionis always to create a unified
cross platform system that issustainable and environmentally
(09:05):
friendly, which is why in 2016,we started with rechargeability.
And we're the only company inthe space today that we have
rechargeable products that workfor, you know, as long as 18
months on a single charge.
And you don't have to go to thestore and buy a battery, replace
it, and waste time, and havethis peace of mind just be on
pause. You know, you could justplug it in 30 minutes, 20
(09:27):
minutes, fully charged. You gota whole year left, you know, on
on on your device.
Kevin Horek (09:32):
Okay. So in the early days, you were basically
building prototypes in yourgarage. Is that correct? Did I
understand that correctly?
Daniel (09:41):
Yeah. Yeah. Actually, it was my basement, and it was
Nick's garage. But I was I wasfocused on hardware, firmware
Kevin Horek (09:47):
Okay.
Daniel (09:48):
Which is essentially the software that runs on the
hardware. And, back then, it wasit wasn't like it is today. You
didn't have chat to PT. Youknow? Right.
You have to you have to you haveto you read books, you know, a
lot of books, and you have tohave advisers and and people to
talk to. And and, really, youhave to just order equipment and
and test it yourself, anddevelopment kits weren't as good
(10:10):
as they are today. EvenBluetooth was terrible back
then. It wasn't as good astoday. So it was a lot more
challenging and, you know, itwould take us 6 months to to
have a viable product and MVPthat we can send out to friends
and family.
I remember in in, Christmas of2012 is when we gave out these
gifts. And, I mean, it lookedterrible, but it worked, you
(10:30):
know, and you can attach it toyour keys, and you had to
download the special app that webuilt. This was Nick. Nick was
focused on app and software.And, and it worked and it worked
so good that in 2013, everyone'slike, you guys gotta do this.
You gotta I mean, this is amoneymaker, you know, and you're
not just that. You're gonna addvalue to people and you're gonna
give peace of mind and savepeople time. And so so we did
(10:53):
it, you know, in 2013, and welaunched in late 2013. And 2014,
we have good revenue, you know,we're profitable, and that led
us to, go out to Angel's friendsand family. Actually, one of our
really close family friend isour still our largest, investor
as a single, entity person.
(11:13):
And and he invested in us andbelieved in us and and, you
know, we're we're, we're hereand thriving and growing today.
Kevin Horek (11:20):
That's awesome. So how did you and Doug meet? And
and then let's talk about howwhat the product does today.
Well, the few products you have.
Daniel (11:34):
Daniel? Okay. Yeah. So, actually, this is kind of a
interesting topic becausethere's one person, his name is
Jack. And I was at a coffeeshop, and really just tinkering
with my products testing.
In fact, this is what I doalmost on a daily basis. We we
get products, and I'm testingjust previously wanting to make
sure we achieve best userexperience. And I was at a
(11:57):
coffee shop, happens to be at acoffee shop and testing, and I
had about maybe 50 of them onthe table, and I'm doing this
and that. This person shows upto me and comes up, and his his
name is Jack. He's he's youngkid, you know, he's 23, I think,
at the time, 24 maybe.
And he, he then said, hey, youknow, I I I work with this
company and they love to seeinnovation and they're a future
(12:21):
looking forward looking companyand they they like to invest in
people like you and yourcompany. And so are you
interested and you're lookingfor investment? I said,
absolutely. You know, this isthe time when we need to grow.
And this was back in 2017 ish,2018 maybe.
And that's when I connectedwith, Soracom, which ended up
(12:41):
investing in Pebblebee. And thenJack introduced me to someone
Here's what I said. That oh,here's Siri listening to me
again. Jack introduced me tosomeone that, I said, hey, Jack.
I need I need the the best salesand leadership person you know
today.
And this was back in 2018, andthat's when he introduced me to
(13:03):
someone that then introduced meto Doug. And then, we met and we
talked. Since then, we talked ona daily basis, for for a short
period of time. And then we wekinda lost, touch, and then we
kinda reconnected in 2021, Ibelieve. Right, Doug?
Doug (13:22):
Yep.
Daniel (13:22):
And that's that's when I got together with Doug, and I
said, Doug, I need help. Nickpassed away, my my cofounder in
2020. So I I really needed help.You know, I I took on a lot, for
for a short period of time forabout a year and a half, and
then I needed help. And that'swhen I reached out to Doug, and
Doug said, hey.
(13:42):
I not only can I help you, I canI can I can help you raise some
money too? Doug, you wanna takeit from there?
Doug (13:48):
Yeah. So we reconnected. I was with a, a really interesting
company based out of Tokyothat's, a a go to market partner
for US brands, but also adistributor, manufacturer,
publisher. So I'd spent a coupleof years through COVID, with
SourceNext, investing investingin brands and helping them with
(14:09):
the growth path for for theAsian market, specifically
Japan. And then, after Danieland I got reconnected, we
recalibrated a bit of what I wasdoing.
And over, you know, after we dida bunch of due diligence while
at Sourcenext did a bunch of duediligence in Pebblebee, Daniel
was in need of capital and sortof leadership help, and that was
(14:33):
the the model that we had had atSourcenext prior. So we put it
all together. We realized thatPebblebee was an amazing gem
that had, incredible product.Daniel's an incredible Daniel
and team are incredible productbuilders, innovators, and, and
lots of patents behind it. So itfelt like a really ripe
(14:55):
opportunity to to inject capitalinto the company, join Daniel,
and then ultimately bring thisnew initiative, a new product to
market maybe in a differentlevel than it had in the past.
So that was about about about 2years ago. And, yeah. So Daniel
and I, I guess, I officiallyjoined January of last year, and
(15:17):
we sat down and realized this isan amazing category that is,
that is on a massive growthcycle due to other brands that
have gotten into it andawareness is better. But it
isn't just about attaching tokeys and wallets. It's about
attaching to valuables.
And, and, usually, that reallycan be way beyond keys and
(15:39):
wallets and way beyond justconsumer into the b to b world.
So we'll we'll share more aboutthat. But, yeah, it's been
really great to to to getreconnected with Daniel, to join
the team, and then to partnerwith him on this new initiative
to bring Pebblebee to themasses. And we've got the right
the right strategy and the rightproduct to do that.
Kevin Horek (15:57):
Okay. So you you mentioned, obviously, and I
think anybody's kinda thinkingthat. It's like, there are other
companies and competitors outthere, probably Apple being the
big one. They also just signed adeal with Google right now. How
does that actually play intoyour strategy?
And then let's dive into howyou're different and and the
products that you're actuallybuilding these days.
Doug (16:20):
Yeah. Maybe I'll take that, Daniel. You can add on. I
I think, I I so Apple got intothis business roughly 2 years
ago. And, other brands that werein this space or all brands in
this space sort of had a choiceto make.
Apple has a platform. You canbecome a licensee and
essentially partner with them,or you can go other directions.
(16:43):
Daniel and and folks at the timemade the decision to partner
with Apple. Others have gone thelegal route. There was a there
was a great choice not to dothat.
So, essentially, we have, Appleas a licensee across licensing
partner. So we work within theirApple find my app. And back to
(17:04):
Daniel's original plan was, howdo you make this work for
everybody? So today, and we'llget into it over time here, but
we've got the the only productthat works on on a on the native
app for Apple and soon to be thenative app for Android with
Google. That was an announcementthat we made just a couple of
weeks ago.
So, we're in a really uniqueposition to solve for the
(17:26):
consumer with the best productthat works differently than
others, but it also bringssimplicity in that there's no
other app you need to download.It just works with what you have
in an environment you're alreadyusing.
Kevin Horek (17:40):
Sure. Well and let's be honest. I think a lot
of people have both ecosystemsin the house. Right? Not
everybody has the latest andgreatest iPhone or one might
have that and one might have anAndroid phone or your kids might
have your old phones or yourAndroid phone.
Like, right? Like, I think a lotof people have both devices
kicking around these days. Isthat fair to say?
Doug (18:02):
Yeah. I think that is fair to say. And and, yeah. So as
we've sort of built out thestrategy in some of these
licensing deals with the majortech companies, The other thing
that the that it's that's payingoff for us is when when Daniel
and I sat down after we gottogether here, it was realizing
that if we try and sell thisproduct like every other brand,
(18:26):
we're probably not gonna be assuccessful because there's other
brands that have 10 years inthis business, and there's other
brands like Apple that have amassive brand, massive
distribution, and and loyalty.So it was really about how do we
take, 1, products that have thatthat have that are grounded in
amazing patents, but take thisamaze the team that we have and
(18:46):
extend our products to otherthings.
So this then opens up the worldof b to b partnerships or
enterprise. And now becausewe're the only company that has
cross platform compatibility outof 1 individual SKU, and we can
clarify all this, but we canwork on either. This device
works on on either, notsimultaneously, but either, then
(19:08):
we can take that to partners.Like, you'll see skis behind
Daniel. You know, we did a dealwith Peak Skis.
We're now our discussion withPeak Skis was, if you're
interested in a trackingsolution first of its kind,
never been done in in skis or insnow sports. We're the only one
that when you sell it, it workswith either the Android customer
or the Apple customer. Theydon't have to version sets of
(19:30):
skis. Well, you know, they wouldnot do that. So Interesting.
It's really taken the thestrategy of the company in a
different way, where now it'sopened up partnerships, b to b,
and enterprise that maybehistorically had not been part
of the strategy.
Kevin Horek (19:44):
Okay. So let I wanna dive, obviously, deeper
into the business side, butmaybe let's start off with the
consumer devices, and then let'swork towards the business stuff
and and how they all kind ofeither tie together. And then do
they keep going all the waythrough business, or is there,
like, they're completelyseparate? Walk us through that.
Doug (20:06):
K. Daniel, you wanna talk product?
Daniel (20:08):
Yeah. Yeah. I'd I'd I kinda wanna tap back into what
we were just talking about iscross platform compatibility and
how we wanna make sure that thisis the best user experience for
users. And so we we don't wantto focus on this is the only way
it works, and you have to usethe Apple ecosystem. And this is
the the recent I I I've also, Idon't know if you know if there
(20:31):
was a recent proposal betweenApple and Google for unwanted
tracking, and there's a a newspec that was proposed.
And this was something thatprobably worked on as well, with
with Apple and Google. Yes.That's cool. Yeah. So so we
we've, definitely been workingon this, and we're participating
in this new spec.
And what that means is that, youknow, I can't say much now, but
(20:54):
but, eventually, you can see aunified system. And that is kind
of our vision. Our vision fromthe beginning has been to to to
be the global reader, leader ina cross platform integrated
location services, type of,company, which means that it's
not just, you know, Apple andGoogle. There are other big
(21:15):
companies in this space that wewill be integrated into. And not
only will this be a consumerplay, it's definitely an
enterprise play as well.
It's just that it it's gotta bein steps. And right now, we're
focused on the consumer, youknow, eventually. And, actually,
it is already playing a role inthe enterprise when it comes to,
for example, other brands and usbeing a value add to those
(21:39):
brands, like, for example, peakski, which is right behind me.
In fact, the the solution isinside the ski right now. I'm
not gonna show you, but it'sinside the ski.
And, essentially, like Doug waswas saying, yeah, you don't know
if if you're you you don't wannahave an Android ski or an iOS
ski. Right?
Kevin Horek (21:56):
Yeah. Yeah.
Daniel (21:56):
Yeah. And this works. It's a single SKU that works
with either, find my or find mydevice, which finally, we can
talk about it now, or, Pebblebeeor something else that will be
coming in the future. So mypoint is is that, it needs to be
the best user experience. That'show it comes, that's how a
(22:19):
winner becomes a winner becauseit it it cannot be from us
driving, you know, how the userneeds to use it.
It needs to be how the user isalready using their tools and
services, and then we blend in.
Kevin Horek (22:31):
Okay. So walk us through the current versions of
the hardware today, and then Iwanna go into the ski and all
the other kind of business,partnerships and how people
could leverage your technology.
Daniel (22:45):
Yeah. I'll I'll go into that. So we have 3 products that
we just recently released. Wehave the card, which is super
thin. It's, almost 2 creditcards thin.
Same shape as a credit card. Itis rechargeable, and it lasts
for up to 18 months on a singlecharge.
Kevin Horek (23:00):
Okay. Sorry to interrupt you, but Yeah. How do
you charge a credit? Like, is itwireless charging? How does how
does that work?
Daniel (23:07):
No. So it it's got pins on the back and it has a magnet
and there's a cable that comeswith it and they just slap on.
And I wish I had it right herein front of me so I can show
you, but it snaps on and it'sUSB. So you plug it in, charge
it. It full charge, probablymight take with trickle charging
about an hour and a half, but,you would get about 80% within
(23:29):
30 minutes.
Doug (23:30):
Kevin, can you see this little charger?
Daniel (23:32):
Yeah. I can see that. That's cool.
Doug (23:33):
It just just snaps on.
Kevin Horek (23:35):
That's very cool. Okay. And
Daniel (23:36):
then and then yeah. And then the last for 18 months on a
single charge, and it's loud.It's got a very good range, much
better than, you know, anycompetitor today. We say up to
500 feet, but, you know,honestly, I've been able to test
it 1500 feet line of sightstraight. Wow.
So but Wow. That's impressive,actually. I have to have my wife
sitting right next to it. I'm ona phone. Hey.
(23:59):
Can you hear it? So it's justfor testing purposes, obviously.
It's not practical. But yeah. Sothat's that's how this device
works in your wallet.
You can put it in your purse orany anything really that that,
needs a thin in fact, I have iton my laptop that I'm using
right now. And it's very usefulbecause sometimes I'll leave the
(24:19):
house and I forget my laptop. Iget a notification you left your
laptop behind. You know? Sothat's that's what we use the
card for, or most consumers useit for.
And we also have the clip. Theclip is also USB c rechargeable,
and it has very bright LEDs. Andthe LEDs are serve multiple
(24:41):
purposes. One of them is chargeindication. So the the the fully
charged is green, medium is,like, yellow.
You need to charge it. It's,like, red, you know. And this
also lasts up to 12 months on asingle charge. It has its
integrated clip functionality,so you don't have to buy an
additional accessory to clip itto your keys, etcetera. Again,
(25:04):
it's rechargeable, very thin,very lightweight, small, and,
lasts, you know, up to 12months.
And then the 3rd product that wejust recently introduced as well
is the tag. I mean, if youcompare it to the card, it's
quite small. Right? It's alittle bit thicker, but it's
quite small. It also charges thesame way as the card.
This one's up to 8 months. Andthis one's great, for example,
(25:28):
if you wanna put it, or, use anadhesive to use it on a a remote
control, for example, or if youwanna put it in a bag, you know,
or anything in that in thatsense. And then we also have an
attachment. So if you wannaattach this to a a a strap, you
know Okay. I lose my dog collarall the time because my kids
(25:48):
wanna remove it, and they'relike, they don't wanna pet the
dog with a with a dog collar.
And so I always lose the dogcollar or the dog leash. So I I
put this on the dog collar, andno problem. Find find it all the
time. So, yeah.
Kevin Horek (26:03):
Okay. Very cool. So I wanna dive deeper into the
tech, say, in the skis. Like,how how does that work? How is
it embedded?
How do I charge it? How doesthat work?
Daniel (26:15):
Yeah. And and so, obviously, for skis, we spent
considerable time, understandingfrom again, it all starts from
user experience. How is it thebest user experience, and how
can we create this product to bethe best user experience? And
and and ski is it's water resistit has to be water resistant.
Right?
You're always in water, I mean,snow. Yep. It's cold. Right?
(26:37):
There is no way to it's verythin.
It has to be very thin. And sowe started off with creating a
product that is wirelesslyrechargeable. It also lasts for
an entire season. So it's chicharging, which is a standard
charger. It's in your cars, youknow, your phone has chi
charging, you know, it worksthat way.
(26:59):
And then it also has NFC tap, sofor pairing, and then also for
reading information. So it'svery cool. You tap and you can
pair. And it has a specialbattery, chemical, construction
that allows it so that it canwithstand very, very low
temperatures, like, when you'reskiing in, you know, negative 20
(27:20):
degrees or higher temperatureswhen it's being stored, you
know, and left outside on therack, for example, in really
warm weathers, like springskiing. I don't know.
So, so that's that's important.And it also, needs to be over
molded with some sort of resinbecause this ski is getting a
lot of vibrations. Right? Thesecomponents need to last for a
(27:41):
long time, you know, in a ski.So that's how we kind of
reengineered this whole product.
I mean, we have the layout. Wehave the technology. We have
software. Everything that's agood platform. But when it comes
to form factor, you have tokinda rethink about what is the
best user experience and you goback from there, and you build
the product.
And so it's built in and hasvery bright LEDs, 5 LEDs, that
(28:03):
also indicate battery charge,but they're also there to to,
light up to show you where theski is. And then there's also a
range finder that would be used,for example, as a peak ski app
that could also show you whereand how far you are from your
skis. If one of those skis, getsbolt unbolted from your, from
your, from your boots, and thenit goes somewhere in the snow,
(28:27):
you know, in deep snow, and youyou gotta find it. That's it.
That's one of the major problemsyou get when when you're skiing,
back in the backcountry.
Doug (28:36):
Sure.
Kevin Horek (28:36):
So that's
Daniel (28:36):
how it works.
Kevin Horek (28:37):
Very cool. So how oh, you all also probably had to
make it super light too becauseobviously people don't want a
ton of extra weight. So how didyou worry about that and making
sure that arguably, people don'twanna know they they want all
the technology in their skis,but they don't want it to feel
like they have any technology intheir skis. Right? Yeah.
Daniel (28:59):
That's a very good point. A lot of people don't
even wanna know it's there, thetechnology, and some some are
very purest and they don't care,you know. Hey. If I buy a $2,000
ski and and the bindings andit's stolen, whatever, you know.
I don't want technology, but alot of a lot the majority do,
especially nowadays.
The majority do. And when itcomes to weight, you know, on
(29:23):
the ski, it's not that critical.And when we're talking about a
few ounces, it's not, you know,grams. I mean, a few grams, it's
not that that much. It'sprobably about an ounce or less,
half an ounce maybe.
It's not that big of a deal.What what is a problem though is
when it comes to, for example,golfs, golf clubs. And that's
something that we've built. Wehave a partnership with Henry
(29:44):
Griffiths. There it is.
Only 3 grams. Wow. Three gramsthat goes inside the golf butt,
the the shaft of the golf buttand under the grip. So you have
to regrip. Obviously, this isbuilt in, and the point isn't
for theft or anything like that.
Really, I mean, that is an anti,I mean, it's it is a theft
(30:04):
deterrent, but the point is,really, the functional and the
value add here is about leftbehind alerts. Because when
you're golfing I mean, Douggolfs more than me, probably not
enough, but a lot more than me.And, when I golf, I'm always
leaving my, 9 iron or my wedge,behind and moving to the next,
(30:25):
hole and then not realizinguntil after the end of the next
hole that, oh my gosh. My wedgeis all the way back there.
Kevin Horek (30:32):
Right.
Daniel (30:32):
And it happens because you carry 2 of them, and then
you're putting, and you leave itbecause you can't hold 2 at the
same time. And So You know?
Kevin Horek (30:39):
I've done that many times. Yeah.
Daniel (30:41):
So I see. Yeah. So so, you know, you're you're wasting
time. You know, it's just sothat's that's the the added
value there. And and to yourpoint in terms of weight, we had
to redesign this whole entire,form factor for golf clubs
because it need to be verylightweight.
It need to be rechargeable. Howdo you recharge something that's
inside of a club? Well, ithappens to be that we're
(31:05):
serendipitously is that there'sthis little hole in the in the,
not the sleeve, but the thegrip, you know, on the tip of
it. And the hole's purpose isthat when you slide it through,
air can escape from that hole.Right.
That's the only purpose, atleast Right. As far as I know.
And so now you have an entrypoint. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. There you go. But now youhave an entry point where you
(31:26):
can charge. So it's just a 2.5millimeter charge port, and you
charge it, and it lasts for, youknow, a season. So yeah.
Kevin Horek (31:34):
Very cool. Okay. So do you have any other examples
of how you've integratedhardware into things that aren't
technically, like, smart orknown to be smart devices?
Doug (31:44):
Well, I I think, the two examples there were really part
of a broader strategy ofembedding our tech into other
things. So those are valuableitems from skis to golf clubs.
And now we're we're creatingmore value for those. So there's
lots of other things. Like, eveneven our golf club solution, you
(32:05):
might imagine that goes prettywell in a bike bike handles.
Daniel (32:08):
Sure. Totally.
Doug (32:09):
Bike is, you know, just in the US alone, 2,000,000 bikes
are stolen a year. So whetherit's luggage, bikes, there's
there's plays in the automotiveworld. Ultimately, it's taking
our fantastic tech and extendingit to other valuable items. And
we're early on this in thisventure, but the ones that we've
talked about and shown so farare the 1st to roll out, but
(32:31):
there will be many more to come.
Kevin Horek (32:33):
Oh, very cool. So are you, guys actively looking
for companies to partner with,whether it's that you guys maybe
haven't even thought of yet ofhow you could use it?
Doug (32:47):
We we are. It's an important part of our strategy.
So we we love the consumerworld, and we love selling to
retailers, and we lovedelighting consumers that wanna
save their keys, wallets, andeverything else. But we also see
a larger mission here where wecan inject value into these
other products. You know, like,what Daniel and the peak
development team have done hasnever been done in in snow
sports ever.
(33:08):
Building an embedded trackingsolution into a ski, That's a
non that's not not easy to do,but we've done it. So, yeah,
we're we're actively seeking newpartners in various categories
to bring our technology where wecan provide value in bringing
our technology to their valuableitems. We're open for business,
and our our phones are, ourphones are ready.
Daniel (33:30):
In fact in fact, Doug says, this quite often, and that
is the biggest opportunity, hasnot happened yet. And it's it's
about to happen. And it's justwe don't know about it yet.
Right? And so there are so manyopportunities out there, that we
can, build and integrate ourtech into where where, you know,
in 10 years from now or maybemaybe less, 5 years now or from
(33:50):
now, we're gonna be in everyhousehold.
You know? It's gonna be built into so many of your, daily use,
type of products.
Kevin Horek (33:59):
Well and and you can correct me if I'm wrong
here. Just based on the price ofyour consumer devices, they're
very inexpensive. So, you know,like, next time I get a bike, I
might not even know that I'musing your technology, but the
bike I bought is integrated withyour technology and, you know,
you're just in my handlebars.Right? And, you know, the
(34:20):
whatever.
Right? Now that's really cool,actually. So I wanna dive a
little bit into the actualbusiness side and and some of
your kind of dashboards and andbusiness tools. Do you wanna
talk about some of those?
Doug (34:36):
Sure. Sure.
Kevin Horek (34:38):
So so how does that work? And give us maybe some
examples of how businesses areleveraging your tech, you know,
to kind of manage a fleet or ortrack a bunch of these things.
Doug (34:50):
Yeah. Yeah. One of the things that in in my previous
businesses and also whatDaniel's done is, especially on
the consumer side so let's takean example, Eero Eero Wi Fi. We
were selling great Wi Fi toconsumers, and then all of a
sudden cable operators camecalling. Well, you need
(35:10):
different tools to sell to cableoperators.
So what did we need over there?We need an admin panel where a
cable company could see lots ofdifferent devices, not just one
home. So and then there's otherother examples in my past of
doing that. So as we gottogether and thought, well,
jeez, let's take an example,like, in the world of golf. So
(35:31):
we've got a solution for golfclubs.
We've got another solution forgolf maybe golf bag
manufacturers. So this productcould easily be built into a
golf bag. And we've also hadanother product that's an LTE
product that this can be can beused on golf carts. So as an
example, there's there's somegolf carts that have GPS built
(35:54):
in. Yep.
Those companies that provideGPS, it's $50 a month per cart,
and they provide dashboard, andthey and there's tools that come
with that. Well, for a far moreeconomical solution, we have
this that can be attached to thegolf cart, so we built a
dashboard. So now that golfcourse owner can see every golf
(36:15):
cart where they are all throughthe course, and then the, the
the guy working the maintenanceshack at the end of the night, I
know because I was one of theseat 16 years old, knows where the
last two carts are when they'renot in. So they know exactly
where they
Kevin Horek (36:28):
are. Interesting.
Doug (36:30):
So that's an example of a tool that we built, a dashboard
that we built, so it gives fullvisibility to all of the
PebbleBee devices that thatcustomer, in this case a golf
course, is using with ourtechnology. There's rental
companies that are using it.There's lots of different
companies, but the reality is webuilt a dashboard that gives
them all the tools they need tohave access to their to their
(36:51):
product using our technology.
Kevin Horek (36:54):
Very cool. Okay. So, like, what other features
and functionality is in thisdashboard, and what can I how do
I interact with it? Obviously, Ican okay. I can see all the golf
carts on the course, but whatother data or what else can I
get from using this dashboard?
Doug (37:13):
Daniel, you wanna talk about that?
Daniel (37:15):
There there's quite a bit of features, that and
benefits that translate into Imean, feature that translate
into benefits. For example,geofence. For example, if a golf
I'm just going with the golfclub or, golf cart scenario. The
golf cart leaves a particulargolf course or an area that it's
now designated as no goes on,you get a notification. You get
(37:39):
an email.
You get a a list. At the end ofthe day, here are some of the
golf, carts that have gone thisarea or that area, and that
happens. Sometimes people takehim home, you know, if if there
are homes on that health, youknow, course, and, and they do
because, you know, they've hadlittle too many to drink or
(37:59):
something or maybe they're, youknow, busy or late some
somewhere and and then they endup there for a week or so, and
no one knows where they are. Andso that's that's, another
feature. And and then, ofcourse, administrative, features
and ways to be able to sharewith other people and and,
within an organization, forexample.
(38:19):
That is more on the enterpriseside of things. And then there's
also, and another for example,let me just, not that, we're we
are in this space or not, butlet's say car dealerships. You
know, that is a very big space,you know, when it comes to keys,
tracking keys, knowing wherethey are at all times, knowing
(38:40):
if they've left the car lot. Youknow, you can't do that with the
find my, app or you can't dothat with the find my device
app. This is more of a consumerspace.
But when it comes to enterprise,you can. And you could do that
with a dashboard when it whenyou're we're talking about
thousands of devices. And youcan also create groups. You
know, these groups of devicesare for this dealership, and
(39:04):
these groups are for this otherdealership. One one owner may
own, maybe 10 dealerships.
Right? Right. Some of them own100. Right? So Yeah.
You wanna be able to have thesetools that are completely
different, features that userstypically don't need, but
enterprise need. And someenterprise needs are not,
(39:24):
necessary for consumers and viceversa. So my point is is there
are a lot of features that comeinto play here when it comes to
enterprise, and differentbusinesses are, different from
what they need. Some in somebusinesses need enterprise, and
then they want hand off tocustomer. Maybe imagine the key
scenario.
(39:45):
You're selling a car. It's atthe lot. We don't know where the
keys are. You know, you don'twanna be caught with your pants
down when you're like, I soldthe car, but, I can't find the
keys for your car brand new carthat you just bought. Right?
And that happens. Believe it ornot, it happened happened to me
once. I had to come the nextday. And I'm like, are you
serious? I just paid for thesign for this.
(40:06):
They're like, we're sorry. Youknow, you can wait 2 more hours.
I'm like, no. I'm gone. So, so,essentially, you you find the
keys on the lot, but then youwanna hand it off to the
customer.
So the keys end up with thecustomer and the tracker is with
the customer. How does it gofrom being tracked on the lot to
now being more of a privatesetting, which is tracked by the
(40:27):
customer? And so there are allthese scenarios that we're
playing a role in.
Kevin Horek (40:33):
Interesting. Okay. So and you can correct me if I'm
wrong here. It sounds like a lotof the features and even
hardware that you're buildingactually is coming from your
customer and you're solvingyou're partnering with them,
basically, to solve a problemthat benefits both parties. Is
(40:54):
that correct?
Doug (40:55):
Mhmm. Yep. Yep.
Kevin Horek (40:57):
Which is actually a really smart way of building a
business, especially in thehardware space. Because as you
guys both know, and I'm maybeeven some listeners know it,
like, iterating and prototypingand hoping that there's a
customer can take months, if notyears, where if you're saying
you have a, you know, a skicompany come to you or partner
(41:18):
with and say, we need to putthis in a ski, that's a lot
easier than you saying, we builtthis for a ski. Now we gotta go
find the
Daniel (41:25):
Right.
Kevin Horek (41:25):
You know, companies. Right?
Daniel (41:27):
Right. Yep. That is that is for sure. And and hardware is
hard. Everyone knows that.
Hardware is very hard. Buthardware, nowadays, I think I
think in the future, nowadays isis gonna be much more high
higher value proposition,especially when you think of AI
and what AI has done tosoftware. Yep. You know, it's
(41:47):
it's definitely normalized, thethe entire world when it comes
to software and tools, etcetera.But when it comes to hardware,
that's still very hard.
And so it's it's it's definitelymade hardware companies, I
believe, in the next, you know,6 to 12 months and beyond, more
valuable because that is a traitthat very few people know how to
(42:08):
manage and run. And so, so yeah.And when when you talk about
creating a product like thisthat is universal, that can work
for, you know, certain,universal products like keys or
or bags, etcetera, as opposed tobuilding a product that is
purpose built for skis or golfclubs. That, I think, is where
(42:30):
the future is going to be, andwe're already ahead, you know,
on that path.
Kevin Horek (42:34):
No. It makes a lot of sense. So I'm curious,
though, is obviously, you'vebeen doing this a long time,
longer than some of yourcompetitors. But how did you
basically partner with thesebrands, including Google and
Apple, that are arguably yourcompetitors and part of your
(42:56):
business space? Because, let'sbe honest, anybody that's
building hardware and orsoftware would love to partner
with some of these brands.
So what advice do you give topeople, and how did you guys do
it? Because, like, that's thegolden ticket, right, that
everybody's hoping for whenthey're building this stuff.
Doug (43:16):
They don't
Daniel (43:17):
It's it's not easy. It's not easy.
Kevin Horek (43:19):
Sure. I can imagine.
Daniel (43:21):
It's, there's definitely, you know, I don't,
disregard the the the fact thatthere is some luck, but it's
small compared to perseverance,determination, focus. I mean,
you you you will never guess howmany emails I had to send to
Sure. One of the partners to getthere. And, it wasn't just that.
(43:45):
The emails may is is just thevehicle, but you have to have a
very good quality vehicle.
Right? And you have to make surethat you can back what you're
talking about with proof. Andthat is, the fact that we
already have, you know, bestrated products. But,
furthermore, going in andstarting that conversation and
meeting with those big giantsand then helping them improve
(44:08):
their processes. Right?
Not just on a business or or orlevel, but on a technical level.
That has been our value add thatwe've been advising these big
companies in terms of how toimprove and deliver best user
experience. And so I think fromfrom, again, it's not easy. It's
it's very, very, very, veryhard, but it really starts with
(44:32):
good quality, user best userexperience in mind and then
perseverance, determination, andfocus.
Kevin Horek (44:39):
Interesting. You mentioned patent technology
earlier in the conversation. Howmuch does that play into that
conversation as well with thesepeople or these companies, I
should say?
Doug (44:51):
Yeah. I think I would echo what Daniel said with
perseverance. I think, you know,one of the things with how you
get some of these brands toengage is you just try. You
know? And Daniel was super superyou know, his perseverance was
persistence.
But then, ultimately, you'vegotta back it up, And, and we
back it up with with quality ofproduct. You can see that in the
reviews. And we we own thefundamental patents on a lot of
(45:15):
this. You know, as an example,this this key technology,
Daniel. We own the patent forfor the tracking device in the
ski.
So, as we engage variouscategories, various partners,
various, you know, whateverwe're engaged with, they then
can do their own due diligenceon the product and, you know,
how we can we can bring IP aspart of the solution. And
(45:37):
fortunately, we've got a good,you know, a good, good portfolio
there.
Kevin Horek (45:42):
No. I I think that's that's really good
advice. I'm curious, and we'rekinda come to the end of the
show, but is there any otherthoughts or advice that you
would give people to look thatare getting into the hardware,
firmware, software space?Because it's challenging.
Doug (45:59):
I'll
Daniel (45:59):
let Yeah. Product perspective,
Doug (46:02):
but, it's not cheap.
Daniel (46:04):
Yeah.
Doug (46:05):
It's not cheap. So, so be be sure if you're in the
hardware space, it's not cheapin a number of ways. 1 is it
takes capital to build theproduct. 2, it takes it takes
dollars to bring the product tomarket, and ultimately to drive
website traffic, to drive sales,to do to do distribution deals,
all of that. So be sure thatyou're well capitalized, to to
(46:30):
build on the the strategy ofwhatever product you're gonna
build.
But from a product perspective,Daniel can address that.
Daniel (46:36):
Yeah. And I'd I'd like to add great points, Doug. But
I'd like to add the I think frommy perspective, the most
expensive component of this istime. It takes a long time to
establish these relationshipswith these factories, the
relationships with the componentvendors, relationship with these
partners and customers that thattakes a long time. And when you
(46:58):
mess up on something or qualityor anything like that, it takes
even longer to recuperate thatlost time and and, trust in that
customer.
So so I think what we've I thinkthe biggest value, largest value
that we've attained here is isthat we have that experience
under our belt, and we've madethe mistakes, and we've learned
(47:19):
from them and not made themagain. Yeah. And we continue to
improve. And our focus again isbest user experience, but it
also when it comes to within thecompany, it's people. It's a
100% people, and it's it'sabout, partnering with employees
that are devoted that we aredevoted for what's best for them
(47:42):
and their future and theircareer as opposed to what's best
for the company because thatinherently becomes what's best
for the customer.
Right? And so Interesting. We wewe we have I mean, if you talk
to any of our employees, theythey just love Pebblebee. They
love what we do. They love thethe culture that we've built.
And I think it it really, comesdown to when you wanna tackle
(48:06):
this sort of, market space ofwhether whether it's hardware or
anything, you gotta start withpeople. You gotta have good,
employees, good people, goodpartners on the team that can
that have a that have a a sortof very similar vision, you
know, to to what you're tryingto accomplish. But when it comes
(48:26):
to as Doug was saying, in termsof having, good funding, that is
very important to know becauseyou need to scale that business,
and it's a challenging verychallenging landscape,
especially nowadays. Extremelychallenging, landscape. So,
really, it's just finding yourniche, you know, and and and
(48:48):
having the right people, havingthe right mindset, being very
persistent and determinedbecause you will get so many
no's.
You'll you'll Yeah. You know,get so many doors that are
locked. Eventually, though, ifyou're determined on what you're
trying to accomplish and youhave that vision and you
continue to be, persistent, youwill get there. You just have to
(49:12):
believe in yourself, really.
Kevin Horek (49:14):
Oh, I think that's really good advice. And correct
me if I'm wrong, you saidearlier in the show that you
started this while working fulltime, and you didn't just, like,
quit right away. You worked atthis for a couple years,
validated the idea, then quityour job. Correct?
Daniel (49:31):
Yeah. Yeah. I did that, when I just had, 2 kids at the
time, and they were very young.And and, my wife, if it wasn't
for her, I would not be heretoday. So so she she helped a
lot.
So I don't know. You know, thatis very important to also keep
in mind this family, health isis super important. But I was
(49:54):
younger, and I I definitely hadmore energy and drive that I
could, provide towards this,this business. And nowadays,
it's just I'm I'm definitely alittle bit more consumed with
family and which which should bethe case. Right?
Yeah. But but, if I had to startthis over again, it would be
definitely a lot harder, youknow, having family, you know,
(50:17):
and and, and just being honestwith everyone. You you really
have to have a balance and youhave to make sure that, you
know, really, health is mostimportant because if you're not
healthy enough to do this, thenyou you shouldn't even start.
Right? So, take care ofyourself, take care of your
family, and then definitely havehave that passion and
(50:39):
perseverance that, can drive youto the next day, you know, and
and and on and so forth.
Kevin Horek (50:45):
No. I I think that's really good advice. And
just to reiterate, I think it'sit's good to see somebody like
yourself that didn't quit theirjob. Because you hear that so
much that you have to be like,all in day 1 or you're gonna
fail. And it's like, no.
That's not always the case. And,like, sure. If you can do that,
sure. If you can't do that, youcan still be successful and, you
(51:07):
know, not quit your job rightout of the gate. Right?
I think Yeah. That's what Ireally wanted to get on top of
that too. Yep. But I but I think
Daniel (51:14):
I agree.
Kevin Horek (51:16):
Sadly Yep. We're out of time. So how about we
close with mentioning where wecan get more information about
you guys, Pebblebee, and anyother links you wanna mention?
Doug (51:25):
Yeah. Pebblebee.com. We're available on amazon.com as well,
and then, you know, all of oursocial platforms we're, we're on
as well. So yeah. And, and anyinteresting brands could look us
up on LinkedIn.
But we would love to engage withany brand that's interested in
injecting our our valuabletechnology into their valuable
products.
Daniel (51:44):
And and look definitely look us up, Doug, Peter, and
Daniel Daura, d a o u r a, onLinkedIn, and connect with us.
We'd we'd be, happy to, takethis further on.
Kevin Horek (51:55):
Perfect, guys. Well, I really appreciate you
both taking the time out of yourday to be on the show, and I
look forward to keeping in touchwith you. And have a good rest
of your day.
Doug (52:02):
Great. Thanks, Kevin. Awesome.
Kevin Horek (52:03):
Thank you, Kevin. Thanks, guys.
Daniel (52:04):
Thank you for the opportunity. Take care. Thanks.
Bye.
Intro / Outro (52:07):
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Kevin Horek (00:35):
com. Welcome back to the show. Today we have and
Daniel, the CEO and CTO ofPebblebee. Guys, welcome to the
show.
Daniel (00:43):
Thanks, Kevin. Great to hear. Welcome. Thank you.
Kevin Horek (00:45):
Yeah. I'm I'm excited to have both of you on
the show. I think what you guysare doing at Pebblebee is
actually really innovative andcool, But maybe before we get
into that, let's get to knoweach one of you a little bit
better. Maybe, Doug, sinceyou're the CEO, maybe we'll let
you go first. Maybe give us alittle background on yourself,
and then, Daniel, I'll do thesame for you.
Doug (01:08):
Yeah. Sure. Thanks. Yeah. So I grew up in the in the
Midwest, in the great state ofMinnesota, not far from Canada.
So, yeah, kind of a traditionalupbringing up there. Attended
the University of Minnesota,business degree with marketing
and finance, economics. And thenhad, you know, kind of my early
press
Kevin Horek (01:28):
Sorry to cut you off. I'm just curious what got
you passionate about that andwhy did you wanna take that in
university?
Doug (01:36):
I had done various, sort of internships through high
school, early in college, andreally just found business was
my passion. It allowed me I'm apretty competitive guy and grew
up in lots of athletics andsports and just found that that
I was able to tap thecompetitive side a little more
(01:57):
on the business side. And then,frankly, I'm not as brilliant as
Daniel on the product side, andI learned that early on. He's,
he's a better engineer than Iwould be. So, I'd rather I'd
rather do a do the businessside.
So got in early on at theUniversity of Minnesota, did
lots of internships from, in thein the business realm, and then
(02:17):
had an opportunity with an earlystage company in Minneapolis or
Saint Paul called USSB. Theywere a pioneer in the satellite
business in this small the small18 inch satellite satellites. So
got in early on there and, wasable to sort of tap into more of
(02:38):
the marketing and sales side of,of the background. And then, did
that for a few years and, andDIRECTV, which we were a partner
with DIRECTV. But DIRECTVultimately acquired our side of
the business, and then I wasexposed to TiVo.
So then it's sort of been a acareer in new products,
(02:59):
innovative new products in innew segments, whether it was,
you know, satellite or, youknow, home secured DIY home
security. We were really thefirst one at Dropcam, which was
acquired by Google. And a lot oftime with you with Euro on the
mesh Wi Fi side. So Wi Fi hadbeen around, traditional routers
had been around. They had gottenfaster, but nobody was doing
(03:20):
mesh Wi Fi until till Euro gotinto it.
So I've had a an interestingopportunity for 25 years to
bring new and innovativeproducts to market in new
segments, and, and that's, yeah,that's sort of turned into into
a passion over the top over theyears.
Kevin Horek (03:37):
Very cool. Daniel, do you wanna give us a bit of
background on yourself?
Daniel (03:42):
Absolutely. So, yeah, Daniel Dara. I was born and
raised in Beirut, Lebanon. Sovery different, culture. You
know, best food, you you canfind anywhere in the world.
I'm a little biased, but, youknow, honestly, you gotta trust
me on that one. So, yeah, I Ithink, you know, my upgrade
upbringing in Beirut was was,challenging to say the least.
(04:05):
Obviously, we we, you know, we Iremember back in the day. I
mean, this is kinda what got meinto engineering. My grandfather
was was very innovative and andand he was an engineer in
background himself.
And I remember when we, would bein bomb shelters, and we would
have no electricity. Wow. And wehad to, you know, run TV to to
(04:28):
to watch our, news. And so himand I would would go collect
milk jugs and would wouldformulate some sort of acidic,
formula, which is usually lemonand vinegar and have our cathode
and anode from copper and zincand create develop batteries.
They were terrible.
They weren't efficient. But, youknow, that was our first
experience, you know, creatingbatteries and charging them when
(04:51):
we had power and running our TV.You know? Wow. And, and then
learned from that and then wentfrom there to essentially
salvage batteries from from,cars that were just on the
street and then rebuilding themand built the system where now
we had heat and TV and, we hadthe all sorts of things, the
(05:15):
basics that we needed when wedidn't have electricity.
So that kinda really trick Imean, I was 9 years old, you
know, and that triggered my, my,interest in innovation and
adding value. And I rememberalso, also, you know, I I flew
into the US. This was when itwas really bad, and and we had
to, leave. And we came into theUS for about 6 months, and I was
(05:36):
12 years old. And I went backand I this is when I discovered
Costco, and I I discoveredcandy, you know, American candy.
And I and I bought a wholebunch, and I every dollar I had,
I I spent it all and bought awhole bunch of candy, went back
to Lebanon, full suitcase, youknow, went back to school, and I
(05:56):
sold it for 3, 4 times theprice. Uh-huh. And that's when I
got hooked. Not only because Imade money, but I could see the
smiles on these kids. You know?
And they were so excited andhappy. Within 2, 3 days, they
were all sold out, and they werelike, can we have some more? Can
we have some more? And I waslike, I was just talked, you
know, and and and the in boththe innovation side of things
and then also the business sideof things, which is why I ended
(06:18):
up, going to University ofWashington. I got my computer
engineering degree there as wellas my master's in electrical
engineering, and then, ended upworking for Boeing, Phantom
Works, which is, specificallyfocused on military
communication systems.
My thesis, back at school wasbased on predicting satellite
communication traffic, for thepurposes of improving quality of
(06:41):
service. And so it was in themilitary segment. It was also
military assets, which isessentially tracking assets, and
I ended up doing the same thingfor Boeing for 11 years.
Specifically for military,whether it's air, subsea, sea,
land, not just for the US, butalso internationally, helping
(07:01):
them track, military assets. Andthen that led me to start and
found, with Nick Pearson Franks,which was my business partner,
founded the company in 2,013, onthe basis and the vision of,
essentially helping people findand and track their things and
their belongings and havingpeace of mind.
Kevin Horek (07:22):
Interesting. Okay. So it's one thing to have,
obviously, an idea to do this.What made you decide to actually
go for it and actually buildPebbleby, and how has it evolved
over the last, you know, decade,basically?
Daniel (07:39):
It has evolved quite a bit to say the least. But really
what what struck me and and gotme into starting this is really
there are 2 things. 1 is mypassion for innovation and
creativity and then also aproblem solver. The problem was
there, you know, and and we wecan find our stuff. This was
back in 2012.
(07:59):
And, so I wanted to solve thatproblem. My background in
technology, wanting to learnengineering because I wanted to
create I wanted these tools sothat I can create. And then also
the the the passion of creatingsomething that adds value in
this world, just really addingvalue, good for humanity. That's
really something that I've I'vealways been passionate about.
(08:21):
And that's where we started offwith with the business.
We we created it in our basementand in our garages, I mean,
literally, for several years.And then when we really spun off
the company and ended up I mean,we started in 2013, but I quit
Boeing in 2015 because I wasjust, you know, overwhelmed. So,
Nick and I started the company,and and ever since then, we've
(08:43):
always had this vision of havinga cross platform system where no
matter what system you're using,iOS, Android, Amazon, whatever
it is, Windows, it would workfor you as a user whether it's a
consumer or business. The visionis always to create a unified
cross platform system that issustainable and environmentally
(09:05):
friendly, which is why in 2016,we started with rechargeability.
And we're the only company inthe space today that we have
rechargeable products that workfor, you know, as long as 18
months on a single charge.
And you don't have to go to thestore and buy a battery, replace
it, and waste time, and havethis peace of mind just be on
pause. You know, you could justplug it in 30 minutes, 20
(09:27):
minutes, fully charged. You gota whole year left, you know, on
on on your device.
Kevin Horek (09:32):
Okay. So in the early days, you were basically
building prototypes in yourgarage. Is that correct? Did I
understand that correctly?
Daniel (09:41):
Yeah. Yeah. Actually, it was my basement, and it was
Nick's garage. But I was I wasfocused on hardware, firmware
Kevin Horek (09:47):
Okay.
Daniel (09:48):
Which is essentially the software that runs on the
hardware. And, back then, it wasit wasn't like it is today. You
didn't have chat to PT. Youknow? Right.
You have to you have to you haveto you read books, you know, a
lot of books, and you have tohave advisers and and people to
talk to. And and, really, youhave to just order equipment and
and test it yourself, anddevelopment kits weren't as good
(10:10):
as they are today. EvenBluetooth was terrible back
then. It wasn't as good astoday. So it was a lot more
challenging and, you know, itwould take us 6 months to to
have a viable product and MVPthat we can send out to friends
and family.
I remember in in, Christmas of2012 is when we gave out these
gifts. And, I mean, it lookedterrible, but it worked, you
(10:30):
know, and you can attach it toyour keys, and you had to
download the special app that webuilt. This was Nick. Nick was
focused on app and software.And, and it worked and it worked
so good that in 2013, everyone'slike, you guys gotta do this.
You gotta I mean, this is amoneymaker, you know, and you're
not just that. You're gonna addvalue to people and you're gonna
give peace of mind and savepeople time. And so so we did
(10:53):
it, you know, in 2013, and welaunched in late 2013. And 2014,
we have good revenue, you know,we're profitable, and that led
us to, go out to Angel's friendsand family. Actually, one of our
really close family friend isour still our largest, investor
as a single, entity person.
(11:13):
And and he invested in us andbelieved in us and and, you
know, we're we're, we're hereand thriving and growing today.
Kevin Horek (11:20):
That's awesome. So how did you and Doug meet? And
and then let's talk about howwhat the product does today.
Well, the few products you have.
Daniel (11:34):
Daniel? Okay. Yeah. So, actually, this is kind of a
interesting topic becausethere's one person, his name is
Jack. And I was at a coffeeshop, and really just tinkering
with my products testing.
In fact, this is what I doalmost on a daily basis. We we
get products, and I'm testingjust previously wanting to make
sure we achieve best userexperience. And I was at a
(11:57):
coffee shop, happens to be at acoffee shop and testing, and I
had about maybe 50 of them onthe table, and I'm doing this
and that. This person shows upto me and comes up, and his his
name is Jack. He's he's youngkid, you know, he's 23, I think,
at the time, 24 maybe.
And he, he then said, hey, youknow, I I I work with this
company and they love to seeinnovation and they're a future
(12:21):
looking forward looking companyand they they like to invest in
people like you and yourcompany. And so are you
interested and you're lookingfor investment? I said,
absolutely. You know, this isthe time when we need to grow.
And this was back in 2017 ish,2018 maybe.
And that's when I connectedwith, Soracom, which ended up
(12:41):
investing in Pebblebee. And thenJack introduced me to someone
Here's what I said. That oh,here's Siri listening to me
again. Jack introduced me tosomeone that, I said, hey, Jack.
I need I need the the best salesand leadership person you know
today.
And this was back in 2018, andthat's when he introduced me to
(13:03):
someone that then introduced meto Doug. And then, we met and we
talked. Since then, we talked ona daily basis, for for a short
period of time. And then we wekinda lost, touch, and then we
kinda reconnected in 2021, Ibelieve. Right, Doug?
Doug (13:22):
Yep.
Daniel (13:22):
And that's that's when I got together with Doug, and I
said, Doug, I need help. Nickpassed away, my my cofounder in
2020. So I I really needed help.You know, I I took on a lot, for
for a short period of time forabout a year and a half, and
then I needed help. And that'swhen I reached out to Doug, and
Doug said, hey.
(13:42):
I not only can I help you, I canI can I can help you raise some
money too? Doug, you wanna takeit from there?
Doug (13:48):
Yeah. So we reconnected. I was with a, a really interesting
company based out of Tokyothat's, a a go to market partner
for US brands, but also adistributor, manufacturer,
publisher. So I'd spent a coupleof years through COVID, with
SourceNext, investing investingin brands and helping them with
(14:09):
the growth path for for theAsian market, specifically
Japan. And then, after Danieland I got reconnected, we
recalibrated a bit of what I wasdoing.
And over, you know, after we dida bunch of due diligence while
at Sourcenext did a bunch of duediligence in Pebblebee, Daniel
was in need of capital and sortof leadership help, and that was
(14:33):
the the model that we had had atSourcenext prior. So we put it
all together. We realized thatPebblebee was an amazing gem
that had, incredible product.Daniel's an incredible Daniel
and team are incredible productbuilders, innovators, and, and
lots of patents behind it. So itfelt like a really ripe
(14:55):
opportunity to to inject capitalinto the company, join Daniel,
and then ultimately bring thisnew initiative, a new product to
market maybe in a differentlevel than it had in the past.
So that was about about about 2years ago. And, yeah. So Daniel
and I, I guess, I officiallyjoined January of last year, and
(15:17):
we sat down and realized this isan amazing category that is,
that is on a massive growthcycle due to other brands that
have gotten into it andawareness is better. But it
isn't just about attaching tokeys and wallets. It's about
attaching to valuables.
And, and, usually, that reallycan be way beyond keys and
(15:39):
wallets and way beyond justconsumer into the b to b world.
So we'll we'll share more aboutthat. But, yeah, it's been
really great to to to getreconnected with Daniel, to join
the team, and then to partnerwith him on this new initiative
to bring Pebblebee to themasses. And we've got the right
the right strategy and the rightproduct to do that.
Kevin Horek (15:57):
Okay. So you you mentioned, obviously, and I
think anybody's kinda thinkingthat. It's like, there are other
companies and competitors outthere, probably Apple being the
big one. They also just signed adeal with Google right now. How
does that actually play intoyour strategy?
And then let's dive into howyou're different and and the
products that you're actuallybuilding these days.
Doug (16:20):
Yeah. Maybe I'll take that, Daniel. You can add on. I
I think, I I so Apple got intothis business roughly 2 years
ago. And, other brands that werein this space or all brands in
this space sort of had a choiceto make.
Apple has a platform. You canbecome a licensee and
essentially partner with them,or you can go other directions.
(16:43):
Daniel and and folks at the timemade the decision to partner
with Apple. Others have gone thelegal route. There was a there
was a great choice not to dothat.
So, essentially, we have, Appleas a licensee across licensing
partner. So we work within theirApple find my app. And back to
(17:04):
Daniel's original plan was, howdo you make this work for
everybody? So today, and we'llget into it over time here, but
we've got the the only productthat works on on a on the native
app for Apple and soon to be thenative app for Android with
Google. That was an announcementthat we made just a couple of
weeks ago.
So, we're in a really uniqueposition to solve for the
(17:26):
consumer with the best productthat works differently than
others, but it also bringssimplicity in that there's no
other app you need to download.It just works with what you have
in an environment you're alreadyusing.
Kevin Horek (17:40):
Sure. Well and let's be honest. I think a lot
of people have both ecosystemsin the house. Right? Not
everybody has the latest andgreatest iPhone or one might
have that and one might have anAndroid phone or your kids might
have your old phones or yourAndroid phone.
Like, right? Like, I think a lotof people have both devices
kicking around these days. Isthat fair to say?
Doug (18:02):
Yeah. I think that is fair to say. And and, yeah. So as
we've sort of built out thestrategy in some of these
licensing deals with the majortech companies, The other thing
that the that it's that's payingoff for us is when when Daniel
and I sat down after we gottogether here, it was realizing
that if we try and sell thisproduct like every other brand,
(18:26):
we're probably not gonna be assuccessful because there's other
brands that have 10 years inthis business, and there's other
brands like Apple that have amassive brand, massive
distribution, and and loyalty.So it was really about how do we
take, 1, products that have thatthat have that are grounded in
amazing patents, but take thisamaze the team that we have and
(18:46):
extend our products to otherthings.
So this then opens up the worldof b to b partnerships or
enterprise. And now becausewe're the only company that has
cross platform compatibility outof 1 individual SKU, and we can
clarify all this, but we canwork on either. This device
works on on either, notsimultaneously, but either, then
(19:08):
we can take that to partners.Like, you'll see skis behind
Daniel. You know, we did a dealwith Peak Skis.
We're now our discussion withPeak Skis was, if you're
interested in a trackingsolution first of its kind,
never been done in in skis or insnow sports. We're the only one
that when you sell it, it workswith either the Android customer
or the Apple customer. Theydon't have to version sets of
(19:30):
skis. Well, you know, they wouldnot do that. So Interesting.
It's really taken the thestrategy of the company in a
different way, where now it'sopened up partnerships, b to b,
and enterprise that maybehistorically had not been part
of the strategy.
Kevin Horek (19:44):
Okay. So let I wanna dive, obviously, deeper
into the business side, butmaybe let's start off with the
consumer devices, and then let'swork towards the business stuff
and and how they all kind ofeither tie together. And then do
they keep going all the waythrough business, or is there,
like, they're completelyseparate? Walk us through that.
Doug (20:06):
K. Daniel, you wanna talk product?
Daniel (20:08):
Yeah. Yeah. I'd I'd I kinda wanna tap back into what
we were just talking about iscross platform compatibility and
how we wanna make sure that thisis the best user experience for
users. And so we we don't wantto focus on this is the only way
it works, and you have to usethe Apple ecosystem. And this is
the the recent I I I've also, Idon't know if you know if there
(20:31):
was a recent proposal betweenApple and Google for unwanted
tracking, and there's a a newspec that was proposed.
And this was something thatprobably worked on as well, with
with Apple and Google. Yes.That's cool. Yeah. So so we
we've, definitely been workingon this, and we're participating
in this new spec.
And what that means is that, youknow, I can't say much now, but
(20:54):
but, eventually, you can see aunified system. And that is kind
of our vision. Our vision fromthe beginning has been to to to
be the global reader, leader ina cross platform integrated
location services, type of,company, which means that it's
not just, you know, Apple andGoogle. There are other big
(21:15):
companies in this space that wewill be integrated into. And not
only will this be a consumerplay, it's definitely an
enterprise play as well.
It's just that it it's gotta bein steps. And right now, we're
focused on the consumer, youknow, eventually. And, actually,
it is already playing a role inthe enterprise when it comes to,
for example, other brands and usbeing a value add to those
(21:39):
brands, like, for example, peakski, which is right behind me.
In fact, the the solution isinside the ski right now. I'm
not gonna show you, but it'sinside the ski.
And, essentially, like Doug waswas saying, yeah, you don't know
if if you're you you don't wannahave an Android ski or an iOS
ski. Right?
Kevin Horek (21:56):
Yeah. Yeah.
Daniel (21:56):
Yeah. And this works. It's a single SKU that works
with either, find my or find mydevice, which finally, we can
talk about it now, or, Pebblebeeor something else that will be
coming in the future. So mypoint is is that, it needs to be
the best user experience. That'show it comes, that's how a
(22:19):
winner becomes a winner becauseit it it cannot be from us
driving, you know, how the userneeds to use it.
It needs to be how the user isalready using their tools and
services, and then we blend in.
Kevin Horek (22:31):
Okay. So walk us through the current versions of
the hardware today, and then Iwanna go into the ski and all
the other kind of business,partnerships and how people
could leverage your technology.
Daniel (22:45):
Yeah. I'll I'll go into that. So we have 3 products that
we just recently released. Wehave the card, which is super
thin. It's, almost 2 creditcards thin.
Same shape as a credit card. Itis rechargeable, and it lasts
for up to 18 months on a singlecharge.
Kevin Horek (23:00):
Okay. Sorry to interrupt you, but Yeah. How do
you charge a credit? Like, is itwireless charging? How does how
does that work?
Daniel (23:07):
No. So it it's got pins on the back and it has a magnet
and there's a cable that comeswith it and they just slap on.
And I wish I had it right herein front of me so I can show
you, but it snaps on and it'sUSB. So you plug it in, charge
it. It full charge, probablymight take with trickle charging
about an hour and a half, but,you would get about 80% within
(23:29):
30 minutes.
Doug (23:30):
Kevin, can you see this little charger?
Daniel (23:32):
Yeah. I can see that. That's cool.
Doug (23:33):
It just just snaps on.
Kevin Horek (23:35):
That's very cool. Okay. And
Daniel (23:36):
then and then yeah. And then the last for 18 months on a
single charge, and it's loud.It's got a very good range, much
better than, you know, anycompetitor today. We say up to
500 feet, but, you know,honestly, I've been able to test
it 1500 feet line of sightstraight. Wow.
So but Wow. That's impressive,actually. I have to have my wife
sitting right next to it. I'm ona phone. Hey.
(23:59):
Can you hear it? So it's justfor testing purposes, obviously.
It's not practical. But yeah. Sothat's that's how this device
works in your wallet.
You can put it in your purse orany anything really that that,
needs a thin in fact, I have iton my laptop that I'm using
right now. And it's very usefulbecause sometimes I'll leave the
(24:19):
house and I forget my laptop. Iget a notification you left your
laptop behind. You know? Sothat's that's what we use the
card for, or most consumers useit for.
And we also have the clip. Theclip is also USB c rechargeable,
and it has very bright LEDs. Andthe LEDs are serve multiple
(24:41):
purposes. One of them is chargeindication. So the the the fully
charged is green, medium is,like, yellow.
You need to charge it. It's,like, red, you know. And this
also lasts up to 12 months on asingle charge. It has its
integrated clip functionality,so you don't have to buy an
additional accessory to clip itto your keys, etcetera. Again,
(25:04):
it's rechargeable, very thin,very lightweight, small, and,
lasts, you know, up to 12months.
And then the 3rd product that wejust recently introduced as well
is the tag. I mean, if youcompare it to the card, it's
quite small. Right? It's alittle bit thicker, but it's
quite small. It also charges thesame way as the card.
This one's up to 8 months. Andthis one's great, for example,
(25:28):
if you wanna put it, or, use anadhesive to use it on a a remote
control, for example, or if youwanna put it in a bag, you know,
or anything in that in thatsense. And then we also have an
attachment. So if you wannaattach this to a a a strap, you
know Okay. I lose my dog collarall the time because my kids
(25:48):
wanna remove it, and they'relike, they don't wanna pet the
dog with a with a dog collar.
And so I always lose the dogcollar or the dog leash. So I I
put this on the dog collar, andno problem. Find find it all the
time. So, yeah.
Kevin Horek (26:03):
Okay. Very cool. So I wanna dive deeper into the
tech, say, in the skis. Like,how how does that work? How is
it embedded?
How do I charge it? How doesthat work?
Daniel (26:15):
Yeah. And and so, obviously, for skis, we spent
considerable time, understandingfrom again, it all starts from
user experience. How is it thebest user experience, and how
can we create this product to bethe best user experience? And
and and ski is it's water resistit has to be water resistant.
Right?
You're always in water, I mean,snow. Yep. It's cold. Right?
(26:37):
There is no way to it's verythin.
It has to be very thin. And sowe started off with creating a
product that is wirelesslyrechargeable. It also lasts for
an entire season. So it's chicharging, which is a standard
charger. It's in your cars, youknow, your phone has chi
charging, you know, it worksthat way.
(26:59):
And then it also has NFC tap, sofor pairing, and then also for
reading information. So it'svery cool. You tap and you can
pair. And it has a specialbattery, chemical, construction
that allows it so that it canwithstand very, very low
temperatures, like, when you'reskiing in, you know, negative 20
(27:20):
degrees or higher temperatureswhen it's being stored, you
know, and left outside on therack, for example, in really
warm weathers, like springskiing. I don't know.
So, so that's that's important.And it also, needs to be over
molded with some sort of resinbecause this ski is getting a
lot of vibrations. Right? Thesecomponents need to last for a
(27:41):
long time, you know, in a ski.So that's how we kind of
reengineered this whole product.
I mean, we have the layout. Wehave the technology. We have
software. Everything that's agood platform. But when it comes
to form factor, you have tokinda rethink about what is the
best user experience and you goback from there, and you build
the product.
And so it's built in and hasvery bright LEDs, 5 LEDs, that
(28:03):
also indicate battery charge,but they're also there to to,
light up to show you where theski is. And then there's also a
range finder that would be used,for example, as a peak ski app
that could also show you whereand how far you are from your
skis. If one of those skis, getsbolt unbolted from your, from
your, from your boots, and thenit goes somewhere in the snow,
(28:27):
you know, in deep snow, and youyou gotta find it. That's it.
That's one of the major problemsyou get when when you're skiing,
back in the backcountry.
Doug (28:36):
Sure.
Kevin Horek (28:36):
So that's
Daniel (28:36):
how it works.
Kevin Horek (28:37):
Very cool. So how oh, you all also probably had to
make it super light too becauseobviously people don't want a
ton of extra weight. So how didyou worry about that and making
sure that arguably, people don'twanna know they they want all
the technology in their skis,but they don't want it to feel
like they have any technology intheir skis. Right? Yeah.
Daniel (28:59):
That's a very good point. A lot of people don't
even wanna know it's there, thetechnology, and some some are
very purest and they don't care,you know. Hey. If I buy a $2,000
ski and and the bindings andit's stolen, whatever, you know.
I don't want technology, but alot of a lot the majority do,
especially nowadays.
The majority do. And when itcomes to weight, you know, on
(29:23):
the ski, it's not that critical.And when we're talking about a
few ounces, it's not, you know,grams. I mean, a few grams, it's
not that that much. It'sprobably about an ounce or less,
half an ounce maybe.
It's not that big of a deal.What what is a problem though is
when it comes to, for example,golfs, golf clubs. And that's
something that we've built. Wehave a partnership with Henry
(29:44):
Griffiths. There it is.
Only 3 grams. Wow. Three gramsthat goes inside the golf butt,
the the shaft of the golf buttand under the grip. So you have
to regrip. Obviously, this isbuilt in, and the point isn't
for theft or anything like that.
Really, I mean, that is an anti,I mean, it's it is a theft
(30:04):
deterrent, but the point is,really, the functional and the
value add here is about leftbehind alerts. Because when
you're golfing I mean, Douggolfs more than me, probably not
enough, but a lot more than me.And, when I golf, I'm always
leaving my, 9 iron or my wedge,behind and moving to the next,
(30:25):
hole and then not realizinguntil after the end of the next
hole that, oh my gosh. My wedgeis all the way back there.
Kevin Horek (30:32):
Right.
Daniel (30:32):
And it happens because you carry 2 of them, and then
you're putting, and you leave itbecause you can't hold 2 at the
same time. And So You know?
Kevin Horek (30:39):
I've done that many times. Yeah.
Daniel (30:41):
So I see. Yeah. So so, you know, you're you're wasting
time. You know, it's just sothat's that's the the added
value there. And and to yourpoint in terms of weight, we had
to redesign this whole entire,form factor for golf clubs
because it need to be verylightweight.
It need to be rechargeable. Howdo you recharge something that's
inside of a club? Well, ithappens to be that we're
(31:05):
serendipitously is that there'sthis little hole in the in the,
not the sleeve, but the thegrip, you know, on the tip of
it. And the hole's purpose isthat when you slide it through,
air can escape from that hole.Right.
That's the only purpose, atleast Right. As far as I know.
And so now you have an entrypoint. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. There you go. But now youhave an entry point where you
(31:26):
can charge. So it's just a 2.5millimeter charge port, and you
charge it, and it lasts for, youknow, a season. So yeah.
Kevin Horek (31:34):
Very cool. Okay. So do you have any other examples
of how you've integratedhardware into things that aren't
technically, like, smart orknown to be smart devices?
Doug (31:44):
Well, I I think, the two examples there were really part
of a broader strategy ofembedding our tech into other
things. So those are valuableitems from skis to golf clubs.
And now we're we're creatingmore value for those. So there's
lots of other things. Like, eveneven our golf club solution, you
(32:05):
might imagine that goes prettywell in a bike bike handles.
Daniel (32:08):
Sure. Totally.
Doug (32:09):
Bike is, you know, just in the US alone, 2,000,000 bikes
are stolen a year. So whetherit's luggage, bikes, there's
there's plays in the automotiveworld. Ultimately, it's taking
our fantastic tech and extendingit to other valuable items. And
we're early on this in thisventure, but the ones that we've
talked about and shown so farare the 1st to roll out, but
(32:31):
there will be many more to come.
Kevin Horek (32:33):
Oh, very cool. So are you, guys actively looking
for companies to partner with,whether it's that you guys maybe
haven't even thought of yet ofhow you could use it?
Doug (32:47):
We we are. It's an important part of our strategy.
So we we love the consumerworld, and we love selling to
retailers, and we lovedelighting consumers that wanna
save their keys, wallets, andeverything else. But we also see
a larger mission here where wecan inject value into these
other products. You know, like,what Daniel and the peak
development team have done hasnever been done in in snow
sports ever.
(33:08):
Building an embedded trackingsolution into a ski, That's a
non that's not not easy to do,but we've done it. So, yeah,
we're we're actively seeking newpartners in various categories
to bring our technology where wecan provide value in bringing
our technology to their valuableitems. We're open for business,
and our our phones are, ourphones are ready.
Daniel (33:30):
In fact in fact, Doug says, this quite often, and that
is the biggest opportunity, hasnot happened yet. And it's it's
about to happen. And it's justwe don't know about it yet.
Right? And so there are so manyopportunities out there, that we
can, build and integrate ourtech into where where, you know,
in 10 years from now or maybemaybe less, 5 years now or from
(33:50):
now, we're gonna be in everyhousehold.
You know? It's gonna be built into so many of your, daily use,
type of products.
Kevin Horek (33:59):
Well and and you can correct me if I'm wrong
here. Just based on the price ofyour consumer devices, they're
very inexpensive. So, you know,like, next time I get a bike, I
might not even know that I'musing your technology, but the
bike I bought is integrated withyour technology and, you know,
you're just in my handlebars.Right? And, you know, the
(34:20):
whatever.
Right? Now that's really cool,actually. So I wanna dive a
little bit into the actualbusiness side and and some of
your kind of dashboards and andbusiness tools. Do you wanna
talk about some of those?
Doug (34:36):
Sure. Sure.
Kevin Horek (34:38):
So so how does that work? And give us maybe some
examples of how businesses areleveraging your tech, you know,
to kind of manage a fleet or ortrack a bunch of these things.
Doug (34:50):
Yeah. Yeah. One of the things that in in my previous
businesses and also whatDaniel's done is, especially on
the consumer side so let's takean example, Eero Eero Wi Fi. We
were selling great Wi Fi toconsumers, and then all of a
sudden cable operators camecalling. Well, you need
(35:10):
different tools to sell to cableoperators.
So what did we need over there?We need an admin panel where a
cable company could see lots ofdifferent devices, not just one
home. So and then there's otherother examples in my past of
doing that. So as we gottogether and thought, well,
jeez, let's take an example,like, in the world of golf. So
(35:31):
we've got a solution for golfclubs.
We've got another solution forgolf maybe golf bag
manufacturers. So this productcould easily be built into a
golf bag. And we've also hadanother product that's an LTE
product that this can be can beused on golf carts. So as an
example, there's there's somegolf carts that have GPS built
(35:54):
in. Yep.
Those companies that provideGPS, it's $50 a month per cart,
and they provide dashboard, andthey and there's tools that come
with that. Well, for a far moreeconomical solution, we have
this that can be attached to thegolf cart, so we built a
dashboard. So now that golfcourse owner can see every golf
(36:15):
cart where they are all throughthe course, and then the, the
the guy working the maintenanceshack at the end of the night, I
know because I was one of theseat 16 years old, knows where the
last two carts are when they'renot in. So they know exactly
where they
Kevin Horek (36:28):
are. Interesting.
Doug (36:30):
So that's an example of a tool that we built, a dashboard
that we built, so it gives fullvisibility to all of the
PebbleBee devices that thatcustomer, in this case a golf
course, is using with ourtechnology. There's rental
companies that are using it.There's lots of different
companies, but the reality is webuilt a dashboard that gives
them all the tools they need tohave access to their to their
(36:51):
product using our technology.
Kevin Horek (36:54):
Very cool. Okay. So, like, what other features
and functionality is in thisdashboard, and what can I how do
I interact with it? Obviously, Ican okay. I can see all the golf
carts on the course, but whatother data or what else can I
get from using this dashboard?
Doug (37:13):
Daniel, you wanna talk about that?
Daniel (37:15):
There there's quite a bit of features, that and
benefits that translate into Imean, feature that translate
into benefits. For example,geofence. For example, if a golf
I'm just going with the golfclub or, golf cart scenario. The
golf cart leaves a particulargolf course or an area that it's
now designated as no goes on,you get a notification. You get
(37:39):
an email.
You get a a list. At the end ofthe day, here are some of the
golf, carts that have gone thisarea or that area, and that
happens. Sometimes people takehim home, you know, if if there
are homes on that health, youknow, course, and, and they do
because, you know, they've hadlittle too many to drink or
(37:59):
something or maybe they're, youknow, busy or late some
somewhere and and then they endup there for a week or so, and
no one knows where they are. Andso that's that's, another
feature. And and then, ofcourse, administrative, features
and ways to be able to sharewith other people and and,
within an organization, forexample.
(38:19):
That is more on the enterpriseside of things. And then there's
also, and another for example,let me just, not that, we're we
are in this space or not, butlet's say car dealerships. You
know, that is a very big space,you know, when it comes to keys,
tracking keys, knowing wherethey are at all times, knowing
(38:40):
if they've left the car lot. Youknow, you can't do that with the
find my, app or you can't dothat with the find my device
app. This is more of a consumerspace.
But when it comes to enterprise,you can. And you could do that
with a dashboard when it whenyou're we're talking about
thousands of devices. And youcan also create groups. You
know, these groups of devicesare for this dealership, and
(39:04):
these groups are for this otherdealership. One one owner may
own, maybe 10 dealerships.
Right? Right. Some of them own100. Right? So Yeah.
You wanna be able to have thesetools that are completely
different, features that userstypically don't need, but
enterprise need. And someenterprise needs are not,
(39:24):
necessary for consumers and viceversa. So my point is is there
are a lot of features that comeinto play here when it comes to
enterprise, and differentbusinesses are, different from
what they need. Some in somebusinesses need enterprise, and
then they want hand off tocustomer. Maybe imagine the key
scenario.
(39:45):
You're selling a car. It's atthe lot. We don't know where the
keys are. You know, you don'twanna be caught with your pants
down when you're like, I soldthe car, but, I can't find the
keys for your car brand new carthat you just bought. Right?
And that happens. Believe it ornot, it happened happened to me
once. I had to come the nextday. And I'm like, are you
serious? I just paid for thesign for this.
(40:06):
They're like, we're sorry. Youknow, you can wait 2 more hours.
I'm like, no. I'm gone. So, so,essentially, you you find the
keys on the lot, but then youwanna hand it off to the
customer.
So the keys end up with thecustomer and the tracker is with
the customer. How does it gofrom being tracked on the lot to
now being more of a privatesetting, which is tracked by the
(40:27):
customer? And so there are allthese scenarios that we're
playing a role in.
Kevin Horek (40:33):
Interesting. Okay. So and you can correct me if I'm
wrong here. It sounds like a lotof the features and even
hardware that you're buildingactually is coming from your
customer and you're solvingyou're partnering with them,
basically, to solve a problemthat benefits both parties. Is
(40:54):
that correct?
Doug (40:55):
Mhmm. Yep. Yep.
Kevin Horek (40:57):
Which is actually a really smart way of building a
business, especially in thehardware space. Because as you
guys both know, and I'm maybeeven some listeners know it,
like, iterating and prototypingand hoping that there's a
customer can take months, if notyears, where if you're saying
you have a, you know, a skicompany come to you or partner
(41:18):
with and say, we need to putthis in a ski, that's a lot
easier than you saying, we builtthis for a ski. Now we gotta go
find the
Daniel (41:25):
Right.
Kevin Horek (41:25):
You know, companies. Right?
Daniel (41:27):
Right. Yep. That is that is for sure. And and hardware is
hard. Everyone knows that.
Hardware is very hard. Buthardware, nowadays, I think I
think in the future, nowadays isis gonna be much more high
higher value proposition,especially when you think of AI
and what AI has done tosoftware. Yep. You know, it's
(41:47):
it's definitely normalized, thethe entire world when it comes
to software and tools, etcetera.But when it comes to hardware,
that's still very hard.
And so it's it's it's definitelymade hardware companies, I
believe, in the next, you know,6 to 12 months and beyond, more
valuable because that is a traitthat very few people know how to
(42:08):
manage and run. And so, so yeah.And when when you talk about
creating a product like thisthat is universal, that can work
for, you know, certain,universal products like keys or
or bags, etcetera, as opposed tobuilding a product that is
purpose built for skis or golfclubs. That, I think, is where
(42:30):
the future is going to be, andwe're already ahead, you know,
on that path.
Kevin Horek (42:34):
No. It makes a lot of sense. So I'm curious,
though, is obviously, you'vebeen doing this a long time,
longer than some of yourcompetitors. But how did you
basically partner with thesebrands, including Google and
Apple, that are arguably yourcompetitors and part of your
(42:56):
business space? Because, let'sbe honest, anybody that's
building hardware and orsoftware would love to partner
with some of these brands.
So what advice do you give topeople, and how did you guys do
it? Because, like, that's thegolden ticket, right, that
everybody's hoping for whenthey're building this stuff.
Doug (43:16):
They don't
Daniel (43:17):
It's it's not easy. It's not easy.
Kevin Horek (43:19):
Sure. I can imagine.
Daniel (43:21):
It's, there's definitely, you know, I don't,
disregard the the the fact thatthere is some luck, but it's
small compared to perseverance,determination, focus. I mean,
you you you will never guess howmany emails I had to send to
Sure. One of the partners to getthere. And, it wasn't just that.
(43:45):
The emails may is is just thevehicle, but you have to have a
very good quality vehicle.
Right? And you have to make surethat you can back what you're
talking about with proof. Andthat is, the fact that we
already have, you know, bestrated products. But,
furthermore, going in andstarting that conversation and
meeting with those big giantsand then helping them improve
(44:08):
their processes. Right?
Not just on a business or or orlevel, but on a technical level.
That has been our value add thatwe've been advising these big
companies in terms of how toimprove and deliver best user
experience. And so I think fromfrom, again, it's not easy. It's
it's very, very, very, veryhard, but it really starts with
(44:32):
good quality, user best userexperience in mind and then
perseverance, determination, andfocus.
Kevin Horek (44:39):
Interesting. You mentioned patent technology
earlier in the conversation. Howmuch does that play into that
conversation as well with thesepeople or these companies, I
should say?
Doug (44:51):
Yeah. I think I would echo what Daniel said with
perseverance. I think, you know,one of the things with how you
get some of these brands toengage is you just try. You
know? And Daniel was super superyou know, his perseverance was
persistence.
But then, ultimately, you'vegotta back it up, And, and we
back it up with with quality ofproduct. You can see that in the
reviews. And we we own thefundamental patents on a lot of
(45:15):
this. You know, as an example,this this key technology,
Daniel. We own the patent forfor the tracking device in the
ski.
So, as we engage variouscategories, various partners,
various, you know, whateverwe're engaged with, they then
can do their own due diligenceon the product and, you know,
how we can we can bring IP aspart of the solution. And
(45:37):
fortunately, we've got a good,you know, a good, good portfolio
there.
Kevin Horek (45:42):
No. I I think that's that's really good
advice. I'm curious, and we'rekinda come to the end of the
show, but is there any otherthoughts or advice that you
would give people to look thatare getting into the hardware,
firmware, software space?Because it's challenging.
Doug (45:59):
I'll
Daniel (45:59):
let Yeah. Product perspective,
Doug (46:02):
but, it's not cheap.
Daniel (46:04):
Yeah.
Doug (46:05):
It's not cheap. So, so be be sure if you're in the
hardware space, it's not cheapin a number of ways. 1 is it
takes capital to build theproduct. 2, it takes it takes
dollars to bring the product tomarket, and ultimately to drive
website traffic, to drive sales,to do to do distribution deals,
all of that. So be sure thatyou're well capitalized, to to
(46:30):
build on the the strategy ofwhatever product you're gonna
build.
But from a product perspective,Daniel can address that.
Daniel (46:36):
Yeah. And I'd I'd like to add great points, Doug. But
I'd like to add the I think frommy perspective, the most
expensive component of this istime. It takes a long time to
establish these relationshipswith these factories, the
relationships with the componentvendors, relationship with these
partners and customers that thattakes a long time. And when you
(46:58):
mess up on something or qualityor anything like that, it takes
even longer to recuperate thatlost time and and, trust in that
customer.
So so I think what we've I thinkthe biggest value, largest value
that we've attained here is isthat we have that experience
under our belt, and we've madethe mistakes, and we've learned
(47:19):
from them and not made themagain. Yeah. And we continue to
improve. And our focus again isbest user experience, but it
also when it comes to within thecompany, it's people. It's a
100% people, and it's it'sabout, partnering with employees
that are devoted that we aredevoted for what's best for them
(47:42):
and their future and theircareer as opposed to what's best
for the company because thatinherently becomes what's best
for the customer.
Right? And so Interesting. We wewe we have I mean, if you talk
to any of our employees, theythey just love Pebblebee. They
love what we do. They love thethe culture that we've built.
And I think it it really, comesdown to when you wanna tackle
(48:06):
this sort of, market space ofwhether whether it's hardware or
anything, you gotta start withpeople. You gotta have good,
employees, good people, goodpartners on the team that can
that have a that have a a sortof very similar vision, you
know, to to what you're tryingto accomplish. But when it comes
(48:26):
to as Doug was saying, in termsof having, good funding, that is
very important to know becauseyou need to scale that business,
and it's a challenging verychallenging landscape,
especially nowadays. Extremelychallenging, landscape. So,
really, it's just finding yourniche, you know, and and and
(48:48):
having the right people, havingthe right mindset, being very
persistent and determinedbecause you will get so many
no's.
You'll you'll Yeah. You know,get so many doors that are
locked. Eventually, though, ifyou're determined on what you're
trying to accomplish and youhave that vision and you
continue to be, persistent, youwill get there. You just have to
(49:12):
believe in yourself, really.
Kevin Horek (49:14):
Oh, I think that's really good advice. And correct
me if I'm wrong, you saidearlier in the show that you
started this while working fulltime, and you didn't just, like,
quit right away. You worked atthis for a couple years,
validated the idea, then quityour job. Correct?
Daniel (49:31):
Yeah. Yeah. I did that, when I just had, 2 kids at the
time, and they were very young.And and, my wife, if it wasn't
for her, I would not be heretoday. So so she she helped a
lot.
So I don't know. You know, thatis very important to also keep
in mind this family, health isis super important. But I was
(49:54):
younger, and I I definitely hadmore energy and drive that I
could, provide towards this,this business. And nowadays,
it's just I'm I'm definitely alittle bit more consumed with
family and which which should bethe case. Right?
Yeah. But but, if I had to startthis over again, it would be
definitely a lot harder, youknow, having family, you know,
(50:17):
and and, and just being honestwith everyone. You you really
have to have a balance and youhave to make sure that, you
know, really, health is mostimportant because if you're not
healthy enough to do this, thenyou you shouldn't even start.
Right? So, take care ofyourself, take care of your
family, and then definitely havehave that passion and
(50:39):
perseverance that, can drive youto the next day, you know, and
and and on and so forth.
Kevin Horek (50:45):
No. I I think that's really good advice. And
just to reiterate, I think it'sit's good to see somebody like
yourself that didn't quit theirjob. Because you hear that so
much that you have to be like,all in day 1 or you're gonna
fail. And it's like, no.
That's not always the case. And,like, sure. If you can do that,
sure. If you can't do that, youcan still be successful and, you
(51:07):
know, not quit your job rightout of the gate. Right?
I think Yeah. That's what Ireally wanted to get on top of
that too. Yep. But I but I think
Daniel (51:14):
I agree.
Kevin Horek (51:16):
Sadly Yep. We're out of time. So how about we
close with mentioning where wecan get more information about
you guys, Pebblebee, and anyother links you wanna mention?
Doug (51:25):
Yeah. Pebblebee.com. We're available on amazon.com as well,
and then, you know, all of oursocial platforms we're, we're on
as well. So yeah. And, and anyinteresting brands could look us
up on LinkedIn.
But we would love to engage withany brand that's interested in
injecting our our valuabletechnology into their valuable
products.
Daniel (51:44):
And and look definitely look us up, Doug, Peter, and
Daniel Daura, d a o u r a, onLinkedIn, and connect with us.
We'd we'd be, happy to, takethis further on.
Kevin Horek (51:55):
Perfect, guys. Well, I really appreciate you
both taking the time out of yourday to be on the show, and I
look forward to keeping in touchwith you. And have a good rest
of your day.
Doug (52:02):
Great. Thanks, Kevin. Awesome.
Kevin Horek (52:03):
Thank you, Kevin. Thanks, guys.
Daniel (52:04):
Thank you for the opportunity. Take care. Thanks.
Bye.
Intro / Outro (52:07):
Thanks for listening. Please visit our
website at building the futureshow.com to join the free
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show. The music is done byElectric Mantra. You can check
him out at electricmantra.comand keep building the future.
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