In this episode of Citizens Climate Radio, we dive into the Inflation Reduction Act (IRA)—the biggest climate legislation in U.S. history—and the urgent effort underway to protect its clean energy tax credits.
CCL’s Content Marketing Manager Elissa Tennant joins CCL’s Research Manager Dana Nuccitelli to break it all down. You’ll learn what the IRA funds, how clean energy tax credits work for individuals and businesses, and why these programs are now under threat. Dana also explains the budget reconciliation process, the challenges in Congress, and the surprising level of bipartisan public support for clean energy investment.
You'll leave this episode knowing exactly why the IRA matters—and what simple actions you can take to defend it.
Featured Guests:
- Elissa Tennant is CCL’s Content Marketing Manager, leading strategy and creation for web, social media, and volunteer resources.
- Dana Nuccitelli is CCL’s Research Manager, an environmental scientist, and an award-winning climate journalist with a background in physics and over a decade of science communication experience.
Looking for a full transcript and more, visit www.cclusa.org/radio
Resources Mentioned:
- 📄 Take action to defend clean energy tax credits: cclusa.org/IRAdefense
- 📅 Register for the 2025 Citizens' Climate Lobby Summer Conference: cclusa.org/conference
- 🌟 Get involved with other climate actions: cclusa.org/action
- 🦖 Schoolhouse Rock: Tyrannosaurus Debt (explainer video): Watch on YouTube
- 🧠 Join CCL’s Nerd Corner (for policy deep dives): CCL Community - Nerd Corner
Highlights:
- Why the Inflation Reduction Act focuses so heavily on clean energy.
- What “tax credits” mean for individuals, businesses, and the broader economy.
- How budget reconciliation works—and why it's mostly a partisan process today.
- Why Republicans and Democrats alike have reasons to support clean energy tax credits.
- How CCL volunteers are defending climate investments—and how you can help.
We Want to Hear from You
Email: radio @ citizensclimate.org
Text/Voicemail: 619-512-9646
Social Media: Follow us on X, Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook, and TikTok.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
>> Peterson Toscano (00:02):
Welcome to Citizens Climate Radio, your climate
change podcast. I'm, um,
Peterson Toscano.
Each month we take you behind the scenes
of climate policy. We break down what's
happening in Washington and beyond,
(00:22):
and we share real steps you can
take to make a difference.
Today we're going to do something
new. CCL's Elissa
Tennant teams up with our policy
wizard, Dana Nuccitelli. They'll
unpack what's going on with the ira.
No, not the Irish Republican army, no. You'll
(00:45):
find out what the IRA is, but you probably know already, if you're listening to this
podcast, why the IRA matters
and how you can help. Elissa and Dana, welcome
to today's show.
>> Elissa Tennant (00:55):
Hello. Hello. Good to be here.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (00:57):
Hi, Peterson.
>> Peterson Toscano (00:58):
What is your title, dana?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (01:00):
I am CCL's research manager,
aka policy wizard.
>> Peterson Toscano (01:05):
Since, uh, you're going to be on the show a lot the next few
months, I thought it'd be great for you to tell
the listeners a bit about yourselves and what you do for
ccl. But before that, I have an
icebreaker for you.
If you could title your very own climate
bill, what would it be and
why?
>> Elissa Tennant (01:25):
I will go first, Dana. That's cool. I'm already going.
So if I could title a climate bill, I would call
it the Future Generations Security
Act. I was browsing
LinkedIn on Earth Day, as one does,
and I saw this quote. The Earth is not
something we inherit from our ancestors, it's something we borrow
from our children. That hit. And I think
(01:47):
that the Future Generation Security act would have broad
appeal and kind of speak to that need to protect the
Earth for our children. Not that I have any.
>> Peterson Toscano (01:55):
Great. I love that.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (01:58):
Wow, you've put a lot of thought into that answer.
Well done. We've got the Inflation
Reduction act, and I always felt there should be called the Climate Changed
Reduction Act. So I'm going to go with that simple answer.
>> Peterson Toscano (02:09):
Oh, good. I like that.
And could you tell the listener just a little bit about
yourselves? You know, whatever you want to share about your own lives
and what you do at CCL.
>> Elissa Tennant (02:20):
Yeah. So I am the content marketing manager at
CCL. I work on CCL's marketing team,
um, at every video or
social media post or. I make content. So I make
cool stuff. Um, so I like to call myself a metaphorical
air traffic controller. Kind of deciding what gets made
based on our messaging, what kind of bills are running through Congress
(02:40):
and what we want to say to the people.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (02:42):
And, uh, I'm an environmental scientist and a climate
journalist. As the research manager, I
keep up with the latest climate science research and
policy and do a lot of education
of our volunteers. And I make
social media videos when Elissa forces me to, which is all the
time.
>> Peterson Toscano (03:00):
All the time.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (03:01):
All the time.
>> Peterson Toscano (03:02):
Well, great. I'm excited that you're going to be here.
I'm going to take a backseat on this one and just sort of let
you go for it. And I'll listen and learn
as I really need to do. So thank you, Elissa and Dana, for
taking over the show today. Listener, I leave
you in capable hands.
>> Elissa Tennant (03:19):
Thank you, Peterson, for having us. So, before we dive
into the show, I just want to mention that Dana and I will be
live and in person at CCL's summer
conference this July in Washington, D.C. which
is a great opportunity to lobby
your members of Congress on the Hill, but also have a full
jam packed day of action preparing you to meet with your
(03:40):
members of Congress. So if you want to join us there,
please visit cclusa.org
conference but now let's talk about the
Inflation Reduction act, which is the aforementioned
IRA and the clean energy tax credits that come with
it.
I'm Melissa Tennant. Welcome to Citizens Climate
Radio. Today I am joined by Dana Nuccitelli,
(04:01):
CCL's research manager. Recently got a
promotion. Shout out. We are digging into the
Inflation Reduction act, what it is, how it
works, and why the clean energy tax credits in
this historic act are suddenly under
threat. So if you're hearing phrases like tax
credits and budget reconciliation and feeling your eyes
glaze over, please do not worry. We are in this together. We've
(04:23):
got you. And Dana and I are going to walk you through it.
So let's start with the big picture, Dana. What is the Inflation
Reduction Act? When did it pass and why is it
such a big deal for climate?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (04:34):
Yeah, the Inflation Reduction act was by far the
biggest climate bill that the United States has ever passed.
We, uh, passed it in August of 2022.
And it's a big deal for the climate because it has
lots of investments in clean energy that
will result in a big reduction in climate
pollution over the next decade or so, assuming it.
>> Elissa Tennant (04:54):
Stays in place as a throwback kind of
to your climate bill
of fantasy. So you said you would have
called it the Climate Reduction
Act. Climate Changed Reduction Act. Why wasn't it
called that? Why didn't they take that brilliant idea and run with it? Why is it
the Inflation Reduction Act?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (05:13):
It was a nice bit of marketing because everybody
was very, very worried about inflation at the time and still
is. And so they call it the Inflation Reduction
act to make sure that it would be very popular.
Um, and to be fair, like in the long term, it
should reduce the risks of inflation because
fossil fuels tend to be a big contributor to
inflation very often because their prices are very volatile. The price
(05:35):
of oil can go up, up and down quite a bit.
And so if we can reduce our, uh, reliance on
fossil fuels like oil over the long term, that will
reduce future risks of inflation. So it's kind of a
long term inflation reduction risk
Act. Um, but just calling it the Inflation Reduction act was
just a nice bit of marketing.
>> Elissa Tennant (05:53):
I think I am biased, but I'm a really big fan of nice
marketing. So I will allow Inflation Reduction act to,
I know, to stand fine. So one of
the ira. So Inflation Reduction act parentheses
IRA to keep it short and sweet.
So One of the IRA's most powerful tools is this
concept of clean energy tax credits. So
can you break down kind of why we are here to talk
(06:16):
today? What actually are these clean energy tax
credits?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (06:20):
Yeah, the bill had a whole bunch of different
clean energy tax credits. And so
a couple categories. There are investment and
production tax credits for clean electricity
and manufacturing. So you can think about an example
of a solar panel. So if you are investing in
a facility to manufacture solar panels,
(06:40):
there's a tax credit for that. And then if you have a facility
that's manufacturing solar panels, you get a tax
credit for the solar panels that you're manufacturing. And then
those solar panels can go into building a
solar generation facility, a solar farm. And so if you're
investing in building a solar farm, you can get a tax credit for
that. Or if you are producing
(07:00):
solar energy from an existing, uh, solar farm,
then you can get tax credit for that. So, um, that's one big
category. There's also tax credits for things like
carbon capture and storage and hydrogen and
nuclear power, uh, and things like that. And then
there are also a category of tax credits for
consumers. So some examples of that are
electric vehicles. There's a tax credit for new and used
(07:23):
in commercial electric vehicles. And also for
leasing an electric vehicle. There's, uh, tax credits
for making your home more energy efficient or
electrifying it with technologies like heat pumps, which are an
awesome technology, um, for putting solar
panels on your roof and a battery system on your
roof. Um, if you're a homeowner or you can do it as a business
owner too. Um, so those are kind of the main. There's a bunch
(07:46):
more tax credits for. Those are kind of some of the main ones.
>> Elissa Tennant (07:49):
Wait, let's talk more about the tax credits
for the run of the mill people. So I'm not
at heat pump levels of income
yet, but I am at maybe like home energy
audit levels. Like, does it still cover
that?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (08:05):
Yes, there is a tax credit for home energy
audit. And so, like, if you get a, an expert to come
in and look at your house and figure out what the most
efficient things you can do to improve your home energy
efficiency is, there is a 30% tax credit
for that. So, like, if you spend $450 on that, you can get
$150 tax credit and then they'll tell you like,
you should improve your windows or your insulation or
(08:28):
your doors. And you can get tax credits when you make those improvements as well.
>> Elissa Tennant (08:31):
Fantastic. But we are kind of focusing on the business side
of tax credits today. Right. I just want to know about the individual side
for like, my personal own gain and use.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (08:39):
They're both important.
>> Elissa Tennant (08:41):
All right, so these clean energy tax credits for
individuals and businesses and everybody who can benefit from
the Inflation Reduction act, they are under
threat. So, so let's talk about that. Let's kind
of take a, uh, little turn here and go down
the not as fun part. Not as fun as
talking about home energy audits.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (09:01):
Yeah, it's a little more wonky. So
back in 2017, uh, the last time Republicans
had full control of Congress, they passed a bunch of tax cuts.
And those tax cuts are starting to expire. They last for a
little bit under a decade, and so they're nearing expiration
now. And so now that they're back in charge, they want to extend
those tax cuts. And doing so is
(09:22):
going to cost a lot of money, something north of
$4.5 trillion over the next decade, depending on
exactly what they decide to do.
And, um, a lot of people are also worried about the
size of our national debt, which is getting close to like
$37 trillion now. And so if
you add another $4.5 trillion to it, that's like
(09:42):
more than a 10% increase in our already very, uh, large national
debt. And so they would prefer not to just
do the spending without paying for it. And so they're looking for pay
fors, as we call them. And so, you know,
the Inflation Reduction act is one place to
get some money to pay for those tax cut
extensions, uh, because we invested
(10:02):
something like a trillion dollars over the coming
decade in the Inflation Reduction act, largely in
those tax credits. And so that's kind of why
they're on the chopping block with a big target on their back is
to Use as one of the pay fors
to extend those expiring tax cuts.
>> Elissa Tennant (10:19):
You ever watch this cool house rock where the national debt is an
animated Tyrannosaurus rex that
wanders through the nation's capital and eats things.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (10:28):
I don't think I saw that. I saw the one
like here's how a bill becomes a law. But I don't think I saw the
T route. The T Rex.
>> Elissa Tennant (10:35):
This is a deep cut, okay? Only the real ones know about the
Tyrannosaurus debt.
>> Peterson Toscano (10:39):
The dead was born in 1790 when our new government took
over 75 million the colony spent in the Revolutionary
War. We gotta feed the monster so it
doesn't get upset. It's got an
awesome appetite.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (10:52):
Tyrannosaurus debt.
>> Elissa Tennant (10:55):
But whenever we talk about the national debt, that's all I think about. Is this
like Schoolhouse Rock, uh, animated T Rex.
That being said, so we need to
pay to extend the tax credits. I'm. I'm
repeating it back to you. This is an active listening technique.
Make sure I understand. We need to pay for the extension of tax
credits.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (11:13):
Tax cuts.
>> Elissa Tennant (11:13):
Do that. Tax cuts. We need to pay for the extension of tax
cuts. And in order to do that we need to
find ways to cut our spending
as a federal government. So there are a lot of other
things on the chopping block, but we at uh, Citizens
Climate Lobby are focused on the IRA and the clean energy
tax credits.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (11:33):
That's right. You got it.
>> Elissa Tennant (11:34):
We are a climate org. Okay. M. That makes sense to
me. We can move on.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (11:38):
So.
>> Elissa Tennant (11:38):
So let's talk about budget reconciliation. This is something that has come up
quite a bit kind of in recent years. I don't think it was a really big
topic a decade or so ago. So it sounds like something from
a government finance class. Um, and I fear it a little bit. So
what does it mean in practice? And why is it
such a big deal for climate budget reconciliation? How
does it fit into all this?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (11:58):
Yeah, so the issue here is that, uh, the Senate
has the 60 vote filibuster that makes it hard
to forget the Senate to do very much. Um, because, you know,
40% of the Senate can just kind of block
progress, uh, on a particular piece of legislation if they so
desire. And Congress has decided
that getting a budget done each year is a really important
(12:18):
thing to do. And so they carved out an exemption from
the Senate filibuster for budgetary
negotiations. And that's what budget reconciliation is. The,
uh, Senate can do it once or twice per year
and basically they have to. Anything that goes into
a Budget reconciliation package has to be
specifically focused on the budget. And so they can't, for
example, change some regulations that don't have any
(12:40):
budgetary cost and stick that into budget reconciliation, because
that's not allowed. So anything like
tax cut extensions, tax credit
additions or repeals, those can all
get put into a budget reconciliation package that Then
only needs 50 votes to pass in the Senate, along with a
majority in the House.
>> Elissa Tennant (12:59):
I have many questions, and the first one is
a question I've wanted to ask for so long, but I'm too
scared because it's been too long. Why is it called a
filibuster? That sounds more like a candy bar.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (13:10):
I have no idea why it's called a filibuster.
>> Elissa Tennant (13:14):
At least you also don't know filibuster.
Anybody listening? If you know why it's called a filibuster, please write in.
Because our research manager, uh, doesn't know we
stumped him on this.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (13:23):
I failed. I failed. Sorry.
>> Elissa Tennant (13:25):
Moving on. So the budget reconciliation process
does not require the filibuster candy bar as part of it.
So we. How did they decide
what is budgetary and what isn't budgetary?
Like, how is it decided what is allowed in budget
reconciliation and what it isn't? Like
if you tried to do something that was stepping over the line.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (13:46):
Yeah. I mean, generally speaking, it just has to have some
kind of component that generates revenue for the government or
that costs the government some money. That's kind of the focus of
it. And then they can ask the Senate
parliamentarian whether it is budgetary in
nature. And the Senate parliamentarian will make a ruling and say, yes, you
can include it in the budget reconciliation, or no, you
can't. And the parliamentarian's kind of like the
(14:08):
COP of Congress, and they, they. And the Senate actually
listens to the parliamentarian, uh, and does what the
parliamentarian says.
>> Elissa Tennant (14:15):
Who's the parliamentarian? I feel like we should all know who this person
is.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (14:19):
I forget what her name is, but she's been the parliamentarian for
quite a while. She's like the Senate rules
expert.
>> Elissa Tennant (14:25):
Good for her.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (14:26):
Yeah.
>> Elissa Tennant (14:27):
Fantastic.
All right, so this simple process that lets
Congress pass a budget with just a simple majority
budget reconciliation. Where are we in this process
right now? Like, what is the timeline? And again,
how do those IRA clean energy tax credits fit into
all of this? You need to lay the land.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (14:45):
Yeah. So, uh, each, uh,
each relevant committee in the Senate and the House
is kind of given a broad outline of. Here's how much
money you can spend and. Or how much money you have to
cut, and then they work on the details
of how they're going to meet that broad outline. And
so that's kind of what they're doing. One at a time, they're coming up with
(15:05):
their committee's specifics on how they're going to
meet that broad budget, uh, that they're
given. And then once those are all released
into the wild, then, uh, all the members
of the House and the members of the Senate look at those and decide if
they can vote on it or say, I can't vote for something
that's got this provision, so you need to change it. And then they have
negotiations, and ultimately they come up with
(15:27):
the one big package that supposedly can get a
majority of votes in the House and in the Senate.
And then the House and the Senate will each kind
of release their package and they have to agree
to a reconciled version, uh, um, between the two, so
that one package can get a majority in the House
and a majority in the Senate, because the House and the Senate might have
(15:48):
different priorities and disagree.
>> Elissa Tennant (15:49):
It's a reconciled package. Budget
reconciliation. Okay.
Uh, I was about to ask where the reconciliation term came
from, too, so you were way ahead of me there. So they come out
with two versions of it. We at ccl, um. I know you're giving me the lay
of the land, but we at CCL always refer to budget reconciliation
as largely a partisan process. I feel
like now's a good time to dive into why it is largely a
(16:11):
partisan process and why we call it that.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (16:14):
It wasn't always a partisan process.
In the past, when there was more
bipartisan, uh, negotiations that
tend to be more successful when there was less partisanship in Congress,
then, like the budget reconciliation process was just to make sure
that they could get something passed with a majority of votes, but it
didn't necessarily have to be all Republicans or all
Democrats. So just 50 votes in the Senate.
(16:36):
Uh, but then over time, Congress became more
partisan, more divided, and so it became a
partisan process such that whichever party was in
the majority in the Senate, they could get what they needed to get
done in the Senate. Um, so that's why it's become a
partisan process. But it wasn't always one, and it doesn't have to be
one. Um, it just. It is right now,
(16:57):
and there is.
>> Elissa Tennant (16:57):
A large, vast future ahead of us. But for this exact
moment, that's why it's a. Ah, it's largely a Republican
process as they hold a majority in the House and the Senate.
Okay, back to the lay of the land. So where are we in the
budget reconciliation process?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (17:11):
Yeah. So each committee's in the process of
releasing their plans for how they're going to
meet their broad uh, budgetary,
uh, rules. And then in terms of
the Inflation Reduction act tax credits, in the House it's the
Ways and Means committee is in charge of those and the Senate, it's the
Senate Finance Committee is in charge of the inflation, uh,
(17:32):
reduction act tax credits and other important finance,
uh, tax credits and provisions. So
we are going to see what they have planned and
then we'll try to hope, hope they preserve some
stuff from the Inflation Reduction act and we will try to convince them
to, to preserve that important
stuff.
>> Elissa Tennant (17:49):
Side note, I think Ways and Means is an excellent
committee name. I think it's just vague enough where I have no
idea what they actually do. But they seem very prestigious and important.
I think in terms of marketing they really nailed that.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (18:01):
They have the ways, they have the.
>> Elissa Tennant (18:02):
Means, they do whatever the things and stuff.
Committee Mysterious and
important.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (18:09):
Yes, that's what they should call it. Mysterious and important Committee.
>> Elissa Tennant (18:11):
The work is mysterious and important.
Shout out sepherance so
what's your favorite IRA tax credit? If
you had to pick one, you ha, you have to pick one. Actually it's not an
if.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (18:22):
That's a good question. Uh, I think I
have to say that the clean electricity tax credits,
because they're so important and they're going to do so many
things like help us deploy
a lot more clean electricity, a lot more power in
general as our power demand is increasing,
reduce home electricity bills, they
(18:42):
create a lot of construction jobs and they're the most
important provision for reducing climate pollution.
According to modeling, they're going to be responsible for about half of the
inflation reduction x climate pollution reductions.
So for all those reasons, uh, because they're so
important, clean electricity I have to say would be my favorite.
Although if I were being more biased and
(19:03):
selfish, I would say the uh, home
weatherization tax credits are my favorite because I recently
upgraded my 70 year old windows on
my house just last year and I was able this year to take the tax
credit for that and reduce my tax the amount of taxes that I owed.
So I really appreciate that tax credit for selfish
reasons too.
>> Elissa Tennant (19:21):
That's how I feel about um, the induction stove
tax credit. When I got my induction stove last year, just
because our old electric stove, this house is 105 years
old. Uh, so when our stove finally
gave out, um, I um, got the induction stove and I invited people over
to watch me boil water, I was like, do you want to come over and have, like, a spaghetti
party? It's so fast, you'll love
(19:41):
it. So I agree. Uh, uh, that was a big one. I thought you
were going to say, I don't even know why I know about these. But the
USDA reef credits, the agriculture. Because you're a big
silvopasture fan.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (19:52):
Uh, uh, well, the reef program's not a tax credit. It's more of, like, a
grant program. And so that's a good program.
And I do love silvopasture planting trees on
pasture land. But not technically a tax
credit.
>> Elissa Tennant (20:05):
Yes, well, that's right. We'll save that one for our
silvopasture episode in.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (20:08):
Ah, I like that. It's a good idea.
>> Elissa Tennant (20:11):
We've established these tax credits are important. The Inflation
Reduction act is important. We really need to leave it intact
throughout the budget reconciliation process.
So let's talk about why this really matters. Like, what would we lose
if these tax credits go away? What's at stake?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (20:24):
There is a lot at stake. We would lose a
big chunk of climate pollution cuts. We
would lose. I, uh, hate that a lot. Uh, we would lose
a whole bunch of domestic manufacturing
facilities and jobs, local, uh,
revenue that goes to communities where those
facilities are located.
Um, we would. Our electricity bills would go up
(20:47):
because we would get less of this cheap, clean electricity.
Um, so there's all kinds of bad stuff that would happen
that I don't think anybody wants to see those bad things happen.
And so we're going to try very hard to convince our
members of Congress to keep these important tax credits
in place.
>> Elissa Tennant (21:04):
Yeah. Can we get, like, a, A vibe check on aisle
America? How are people feeling about
the tax credits in general? Do we have, like, a
general public opinion on the Inflation Reduction
act, clean energy tax credits?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (21:17):
Yes, There is just recently a survey released by
the University of Maryland that asked specifically about
a bunch of these tax credits, and they found
that all of them that they asked about were very popular
across the political spectrum. So actually, the least
popular one that they asked about was the tax credit for
new electric vehicles, which is a $7,500 tax credit
(21:37):
if you qualify and you're purchasing a new electric car.
Even that one. Even among Republican voters
who they surveyed, it was a, uh,
71% support and
29% wanted to repeal it. So even, like, the
least popular tax credit among Republican
voters specifically was still, like, 2.5 to 1
support to oppose. And so they are all very, very popular because
(21:59):
they do so much good stuff. And who doesn't like to get a
tax credit?
>> Elissa Tennant (22:03):
I can't imagine people wouldn't want to get a tax
credit for their clean energy purchases.
That makes sense to me. Yeah, so these are important. We want
to keep them intact. What can listeners do right
now to help protect these tax credits?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (22:18):
Well, we at CCL have been doing stuff to help protect them
since like last December. We have
had our, our volunteers, whose members of Congress
are on the House Ways and Means Committee and the Senate
Finance and Finance Committee, contact those
representatives and tell them about the importance of the tax
credits. We've, uh, had lots of actions where our
members have contacted their members of Congress, especially Republican members
(22:40):
of Congress, asking them to support and preserve
the Inflation Reduction act tax credits. We, uh, had
a conservative conference where our conservative volunteers
went to Washington D.C. and had a nice conference
and training and then lobbied almost 50 Republican members
of Congress about the Inflation Reduction act tax rates and a
few other things. So we've been doing a lot. And of course
(23:01):
we have our summer conference, as you mentioned, between
July 20th and 22nd, where we will
again, most likely, assuming that this question
hasn't been settled yet, which it probably won't have been, we will be
lobbying on the Inflation Reduction act there
too. We've also got a database that I put together
of all the different, uh, facilities
and projects that the Inflation Reduction act has
(23:23):
helped incentivize all across the country. And like the number
of jobs it's created in the local revenue
that, um, we're using that information to inform our lobbying.
And so we're doing a whole lot. And so one thing
people can do is to join their local citizens Climate
Lobby chapter, uh, to help us with these
lobbying efforts or just to contact
(23:44):
their member of Congress directly and do this kind of
lobbying and tell their stories and
convince our members of Congress to keep these important tax
credits in place.
>> Elissa Tennant (23:54):
Dana, you just named so many things. So I'm going to take,
I'm going to give it one thing.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (24:00):
Okay, one thing's good.
>> Elissa Tennant (24:01):
That was, that was so many things. I.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (24:03):
What's the one thing stressed?
>> Elissa Tennant (24:04):
So the one thing I would say is if you are
represented by a Republican member of Congress, you can
write their office right now asking them to protect the, uh,
Inflation Reduction Acts clean energy tax credits. And
we have a tool that makes it super easy@, ah,
cclusa.org
IRA defense. So it's
cclusa.org IRA defense.
(24:26):
And then a lot, uh, of people will say, well, I'm not represented by a Republican, but I
still want to Help. And you totally can. You can share that link
on your social media accounts and send it directly to your friends
and family who are represented by Republican members of Congress.
And spread the word, because budget reconciliation is a really long
process. Like you said, this question probably will not be answered by the time
our conference rolls around in July. So we need to keep the
(24:46):
conversation going because the more we keep it going, the more
important these tax credits are to the general public.
So bring it up at parties, talk about it on your next
open mic night, take out a billboard, or just share this
episode with anybody you think might be interested
in learning more about the Inflation Reduction Act's
tax credits. And once again, please
join US this, uh, July 20th through
(25:09):
22nd in Washington, D.C. @
Citizens Climate Lobby Summer Conference. You can learn more
and sign
up@cclusa.org
conference. It's the perfect opportunity to get up to speed
on climate policy, build community, and meet directly
with lawmakers to defend these tax credits credits and
more. And you don't have to be a policy expert because I
(25:30):
clearly am not. I am just someone who
cares. So, again, learn more and
register@cclusa.org
conference.
And I have one last question for you, Dana. What gives
you hope that we can keep these programs alive? Why are we
still going at this?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (25:46):
The good news is that a lot of Republican members of Congress have already
expressed that they want to preserve at least some
of these important tax credits. There's been a number of
letters from groups of Republicans to their
leadership saying, hey, let's be careful about what we're
getting rid of here because there's a lot
of great benefits, especially in
(26:06):
Republican districts in terms of like battery
manufacturing and as you mentioned, auto EV
manufacturing facilities and big solar and wind farms. And
those things generate a lot of local jobs and local
revenue and they're helping local communities.
And it doesn't look good if you
vote to repeal a, uh, policy
that is generating a lot of local jobs
(26:29):
and manufacturing and tax revenue in your
district. And so it's in their benefits to
preserve a lot of these tax credits. And so I'm hopeful
that we will be successful in preserving
at least some of the more important provisions from the Inflation
Reduction Act.
>> Elissa Tennant (26:45):
Hear, hear. Peterson, myself,
and hopefully the listener, agree with you. So thank you,
Data. Uh, the next episode I think might be
the Foreign Pollution Fee act, which was just introduced
in Congress a short time ago. And we're going to be doing a training
on that for our volunteers coming up. So I think we have a lot
to talk about on that topic. Unless we decide to skip it and just go straight
(27:05):
to Silva Pastor, who.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (27:07):
Knows both good topics.
>> Elissa Tennant (27:09):
And thank you for listening. We'll give it back to Peterson to close things
out.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (27:12):
Thanks, Alessa.
>> Elissa Tennant (27:14):
Thanks, Dana.
>> Peterson Toscano (27:15):
Elissa. Uh, Dana, I need to thank you
for that amazing overview. I understand
this so much more clearly than I did before. I
mean, I thought I knew about the Inflation Reduction act, but
I. I really lost the thread at some point.
But you brought it all back for me. Thank you.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (27:32):
Thank you.
>> Peterson Toscano (27:33):
Yeah. Um. Uh, yeah, I just. I learned so much.
So thank you very much.
>> Elissa Tennant (27:37):
Thank Data. But I am happy to help facilitate a conversation about
the Inflation Reduction act at any party.
>> Peterson Toscano (27:42):
I have, uh, one request. Whenever you
talk about having created a database, can I
call it a Danabase?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (27:53):
The Danabase. It's a good name. I like it.
>> Peterson Toscano (27:56):
Well, yeah, come back and talk more, because we need to know
about this policy. And I have to say, it's one of the
areas I'm weakest in. And as people who
do climate work, it's easy to lean into
the places where we have strength because it's comfortable.
But we all have to learn new tricks and
adapt all the time to climate change and to climate
(28:16):
policy. So thank you so much, and I'm
looking forward to much more.
>> Elissa Tennant (28:21):
Thank you, Peterson.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (28:22):
We're all going to learn and grow together.
>> Peterson Toscano (28:24):
Yay.
And thank you for listening to Citizens Climate
Radio. If you're ready to take action
to protect climate clean energy tax
credits, visit
cclusa.orgiradefense
(28:45):
that's cclusa.org
IRA defense. And don't forget,
you can join us in person. And when I say join us, I mean
like Elissa, Dana and I are going to
be at Citizens Climate
Lobby's summer conference, happening
from July 20th to the 22nd
(29:05):
in Washington, DC. Learn more
and sign up at
cclusa.org
conference. In fact, I think you should just type in
cclusa.org whatever
you like and see if it comes up as an actual page
on the website.
>> Elissa Tennant (29:23):
Hey.
>> Peterson Toscano (29:26):
Do you have a start story or a question you'd
like to share? Call or text our listener
line, which is, uh,
619-512-9646.
That's
619-512-9646.
You'll find show notes and, um, links to
(29:47):
our hosts. All of us are hosts today, it
feels like@, uh,
cclusa.org
radio. See how it works
and be sure to follow us on Instagram X,
Facebook, LinkedIn, and yes,
TikTok. Just search for Citizens
Climate Radio. This episode was
(30:08):
written by Elissa Tennant, Dana Nuccitelli, Leslie Beatty,
Elise Silvestri and me Peterson Citoscano
Production by Elise Silvestri and me. M Music comes
from Epidemic Sound.
Citizens Climate Radio is a project of Citizens Climate
Education. I will see you next time, but in the
meantime stay strong, determined and
creative in your work on climate change.
>> Elissa Tennant (30:45):
SA.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (30:49):
M.
Welcome to Citizens Climate Radio, your climate
change podcast. I'm, um,
Peterson Toscano.
Each month we take you behind the scenes
of climate policy. We break down what's
happening in Washington and beyond,
(00:22):
and we share real steps you can
take to make a difference.
Today we're going to do something
new. CCL's Elissa
Tennant teams up with our policy
wizard, Dana Nuccitelli. They'll
unpack what's going on with the ira.
No, not the Irish Republican army, no. You'll
(00:45):
find out what the IRA is, but you probably know already, if you're listening to this
podcast, why the IRA matters
and how you can help. Elissa and Dana, welcome
to today's show.
>> Elissa Tennant (00:55):
Hello. Hello. Good to be here.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (00:57):
Hi, Peterson.
>> Peterson Toscano (00:58):
What is your title, dana?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (01:00):
I am CCL's research manager,
aka policy wizard.
>> Peterson Toscano (01:05):
Since, uh, you're going to be on the show a lot the next few
months, I thought it'd be great for you to tell
the listeners a bit about yourselves and what you do for
ccl. But before that, I have an
icebreaker for you.
If you could title your very own climate
bill, what would it be and
why?
>> Elissa Tennant (01:25):
I will go first, Dana. That's cool. I'm already going.
So if I could title a climate bill, I would call
it the Future Generations Security
Act. I was browsing
LinkedIn on Earth Day, as one does,
and I saw this quote. The Earth is not
something we inherit from our ancestors, it's something we borrow
from our children. That hit. And I think
(01:47):
that the Future Generation Security act would have broad
appeal and kind of speak to that need to protect the
Earth for our children. Not that I have any.
>> Peterson Toscano (01:55):
Great. I love that.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (01:58):
Wow, you've put a lot of thought into that answer.
Well done. We've got the Inflation
Reduction act, and I always felt there should be called the Climate Changed
Reduction Act. So I'm going to go with that simple answer.
>> Peterson Toscano (02:09):
Oh, good. I like that.
And could you tell the listener just a little bit about
yourselves? You know, whatever you want to share about your own lives
and what you do at CCL.
>> Elissa Tennant (02:20):
Yeah. So I am the content marketing manager at
CCL. I work on CCL's marketing team,
um, at every video or
social media post or. I make content. So I make
cool stuff. Um, so I like to call myself a metaphorical
air traffic controller. Kind of deciding what gets made
based on our messaging, what kind of bills are running through Congress
(02:40):
and what we want to say to the people.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (02:42):
And, uh, I'm an environmental scientist and a climate
journalist. As the research manager, I
keep up with the latest climate science research and
policy and do a lot of education
of our volunteers. And I make
social media videos when Elissa forces me to, which is all the
time.
>> Peterson Toscano (03:00):
All the time.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (03:01):
All the time.
>> Peterson Toscano (03:02):
Well, great. I'm excited that you're going to be here.
I'm going to take a backseat on this one and just sort of let
you go for it. And I'll listen and learn
as I really need to do. So thank you, Elissa and Dana, for
taking over the show today. Listener, I leave
you in capable hands.
>> Elissa Tennant (03:19):
Thank you, Peterson, for having us. So, before we dive
into the show, I just want to mention that Dana and I will be
live and in person at CCL's summer
conference this July in Washington, D.C. which
is a great opportunity to lobby
your members of Congress on the Hill, but also have a full
jam packed day of action preparing you to meet with your
(03:40):
members of Congress. So if you want to join us there,
please visit cclusa.org
conference but now let's talk about the
Inflation Reduction act, which is the aforementioned
IRA and the clean energy tax credits that come with
it.
I'm Melissa Tennant. Welcome to Citizens Climate
Radio. Today I am joined by Dana Nuccitelli,
(04:01):
CCL's research manager. Recently got a
promotion. Shout out. We are digging into the
Inflation Reduction act, what it is, how it
works, and why the clean energy tax credits in
this historic act are suddenly under
threat. So if you're hearing phrases like tax
credits and budget reconciliation and feeling your eyes
glaze over, please do not worry. We are in this together. We've
(04:23):
got you. And Dana and I are going to walk you through it.
So let's start with the big picture, Dana. What is the Inflation
Reduction Act? When did it pass and why is it
such a big deal for climate?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (04:34):
Yeah, the Inflation Reduction act was by far the
biggest climate bill that the United States has ever passed.
We, uh, passed it in August of 2022.
And it's a big deal for the climate because it has
lots of investments in clean energy that
will result in a big reduction in climate
pollution over the next decade or so, assuming it.
>> Elissa Tennant (04:54):
Stays in place as a throwback kind of
to your climate bill
of fantasy. So you said you would have
called it the Climate Reduction
Act. Climate Changed Reduction Act. Why wasn't it
called that? Why didn't they take that brilliant idea and run with it? Why is it
the Inflation Reduction Act?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (05:13):
It was a nice bit of marketing because everybody
was very, very worried about inflation at the time and still
is. And so they call it the Inflation Reduction
act to make sure that it would be very popular.
Um, and to be fair, like in the long term, it
should reduce the risks of inflation because
fossil fuels tend to be a big contributor to
inflation very often because their prices are very volatile. The price
(05:35):
of oil can go up, up and down quite a bit.
And so if we can reduce our, uh, reliance on
fossil fuels like oil over the long term, that will
reduce future risks of inflation. So it's kind of a
long term inflation reduction risk
Act. Um, but just calling it the Inflation Reduction act was
just a nice bit of marketing.
>> Elissa Tennant (05:53):
I think I am biased, but I'm a really big fan of nice
marketing. So I will allow Inflation Reduction act to,
I know, to stand fine. So one of
the ira. So Inflation Reduction act parentheses
IRA to keep it short and sweet.
So One of the IRA's most powerful tools is this
concept of clean energy tax credits. So
can you break down kind of why we are here to talk
(06:16):
today? What actually are these clean energy tax
credits?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (06:20):
Yeah, the bill had a whole bunch of different
clean energy tax credits. And so
a couple categories. There are investment and
production tax credits for clean electricity
and manufacturing. So you can think about an example
of a solar panel. So if you are investing in
a facility to manufacture solar panels,
(06:40):
there's a tax credit for that. And then if you have a facility
that's manufacturing solar panels, you get a tax
credit for the solar panels that you're manufacturing. And then
those solar panels can go into building a
solar generation facility, a solar farm. And so if you're
investing in building a solar farm, you can get a tax credit for
that. Or if you are producing
(07:00):
solar energy from an existing, uh, solar farm,
then you can get tax credit for that. So, um, that's one big
category. There's also tax credits for things like
carbon capture and storage and hydrogen and
nuclear power, uh, and things like that. And then
there are also a category of tax credits for
consumers. So some examples of that are
electric vehicles. There's a tax credit for new and used
(07:23):
in commercial electric vehicles. And also for
leasing an electric vehicle. There's, uh, tax credits
for making your home more energy efficient or
electrifying it with technologies like heat pumps, which are an
awesome technology, um, for putting solar
panels on your roof and a battery system on your
roof. Um, if you're a homeowner or you can do it as a business
owner too. Um, so those are kind of the main. There's a bunch
(07:46):
more tax credits for. Those are kind of some of the main ones.
>> Elissa Tennant (07:49):
Wait, let's talk more about the tax credits
for the run of the mill people. So I'm not
at heat pump levels of income
yet, but I am at maybe like home energy
audit levels. Like, does it still cover
that?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (08:05):
Yes, there is a tax credit for home energy
audit. And so, like, if you get a, an expert to come
in and look at your house and figure out what the most
efficient things you can do to improve your home energy
efficiency is, there is a 30% tax credit
for that. So, like, if you spend $450 on that, you can get
$150 tax credit and then they'll tell you like,
you should improve your windows or your insulation or
(08:28):
your doors. And you can get tax credits when you make those improvements as well.
>> Elissa Tennant (08:31):
Fantastic. But we are kind of focusing on the business side
of tax credits today. Right. I just want to know about the individual side
for like, my personal own gain and use.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (08:39):
They're both important.
>> Elissa Tennant (08:41):
All right, so these clean energy tax credits for
individuals and businesses and everybody who can benefit from
the Inflation Reduction act, they are under
threat. So, so let's talk about that. Let's kind
of take a, uh, little turn here and go down
the not as fun part. Not as fun as
talking about home energy audits.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (09:01):
Yeah, it's a little more wonky. So
back in 2017, uh, the last time Republicans
had full control of Congress, they passed a bunch of tax cuts.
And those tax cuts are starting to expire. They last for a
little bit under a decade, and so they're nearing expiration
now. And so now that they're back in charge, they want to extend
those tax cuts. And doing so is
(09:22):
going to cost a lot of money, something north of
$4.5 trillion over the next decade, depending on
exactly what they decide to do.
And, um, a lot of people are also worried about the
size of our national debt, which is getting close to like
$37 trillion now. And so if
you add another $4.5 trillion to it, that's like
(09:42):
more than a 10% increase in our already very, uh, large national
debt. And so they would prefer not to just
do the spending without paying for it. And so they're looking for pay
fors, as we call them. And so, you know,
the Inflation Reduction act is one place to
get some money to pay for those tax cut
extensions, uh, because we invested
(10:02):
something like a trillion dollars over the coming
decade in the Inflation Reduction act, largely in
those tax credits. And so that's kind of why
they're on the chopping block with a big target on their back is
to Use as one of the pay fors
to extend those expiring tax cuts.
>> Elissa Tennant (10:19):
You ever watch this cool house rock where the national debt is an
animated Tyrannosaurus rex that
wanders through the nation's capital and eats things.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (10:28):
I don't think I saw that. I saw the one
like here's how a bill becomes a law. But I don't think I saw the
T route. The T Rex.
>> Elissa Tennant (10:35):
This is a deep cut, okay? Only the real ones know about the
Tyrannosaurus debt.
>> Peterson Toscano (10:39):
The dead was born in 1790 when our new government took
over 75 million the colony spent in the Revolutionary
War. We gotta feed the monster so it
doesn't get upset. It's got an
awesome appetite.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (10:52):
Tyrannosaurus debt.
>> Elissa Tennant (10:55):
But whenever we talk about the national debt, that's all I think about. Is this
like Schoolhouse Rock, uh, animated T Rex.
That being said, so we need to
pay to extend the tax credits. I'm. I'm
repeating it back to you. This is an active listening technique.
Make sure I understand. We need to pay for the extension of tax
credits.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (11:13):
Tax cuts.
>> Elissa Tennant (11:13):
Do that. Tax cuts. We need to pay for the extension of tax
cuts. And in order to do that we need to
find ways to cut our spending
as a federal government. So there are a lot of other
things on the chopping block, but we at uh, Citizens
Climate Lobby are focused on the IRA and the clean energy
tax credits.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (11:33):
That's right. You got it.
>> Elissa Tennant (11:34):
We are a climate org. Okay. M. That makes sense to
me. We can move on.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (11:38):
So.
>> Elissa Tennant (11:38):
So let's talk about budget reconciliation. This is something that has come up
quite a bit kind of in recent years. I don't think it was a really big
topic a decade or so ago. So it sounds like something from
a government finance class. Um, and I fear it a little bit. So
what does it mean in practice? And why is it
such a big deal for climate budget reconciliation? How
does it fit into all this?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (11:58):
Yeah, so the issue here is that, uh, the Senate
has the 60 vote filibuster that makes it hard
to forget the Senate to do very much. Um, because, you know,
40% of the Senate can just kind of block
progress, uh, on a particular piece of legislation if they so
desire. And Congress has decided
that getting a budget done each year is a really important
(12:18):
thing to do. And so they carved out an exemption from
the Senate filibuster for budgetary
negotiations. And that's what budget reconciliation is. The,
uh, Senate can do it once or twice per year
and basically they have to. Anything that goes into
a Budget reconciliation package has to be
specifically focused on the budget. And so they can't, for
example, change some regulations that don't have any
(12:40):
budgetary cost and stick that into budget reconciliation, because
that's not allowed. So anything like
tax cut extensions, tax credit
additions or repeals, those can all
get put into a budget reconciliation package that Then
only needs 50 votes to pass in the Senate, along with a
majority in the House.
>> Elissa Tennant (12:59):
I have many questions, and the first one is
a question I've wanted to ask for so long, but I'm too
scared because it's been too long. Why is it called a
filibuster? That sounds more like a candy bar.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (13:10):
I have no idea why it's called a filibuster.
>> Elissa Tennant (13:14):
At least you also don't know filibuster.
Anybody listening? If you know why it's called a filibuster, please write in.
Because our research manager, uh, doesn't know we
stumped him on this.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (13:23):
I failed. I failed. Sorry.
>> Elissa Tennant (13:25):
Moving on. So the budget reconciliation process
does not require the filibuster candy bar as part of it.
So we. How did they decide
what is budgetary and what isn't budgetary?
Like, how is it decided what is allowed in budget
reconciliation and what it isn't? Like
if you tried to do something that was stepping over the line.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (13:46):
Yeah. I mean, generally speaking, it just has to have some
kind of component that generates revenue for the government or
that costs the government some money. That's kind of the focus of
it. And then they can ask the Senate
parliamentarian whether it is budgetary in
nature. And the Senate parliamentarian will make a ruling and say, yes, you
can include it in the budget reconciliation, or no, you
can't. And the parliamentarian's kind of like the
(14:08):
COP of Congress, and they, they. And the Senate actually
listens to the parliamentarian, uh, and does what the
parliamentarian says.
>> Elissa Tennant (14:15):
Who's the parliamentarian? I feel like we should all know who this person
is.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (14:19):
I forget what her name is, but she's been the parliamentarian for
quite a while. She's like the Senate rules
expert.
>> Elissa Tennant (14:25):
Good for her.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (14:26):
Yeah.
>> Elissa Tennant (14:27):
Fantastic.
All right, so this simple process that lets
Congress pass a budget with just a simple majority
budget reconciliation. Where are we in this process
right now? Like, what is the timeline? And again,
how do those IRA clean energy tax credits fit into
all of this? You need to lay the land.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (14:45):
Yeah. So, uh, each, uh,
each relevant committee in the Senate and the House
is kind of given a broad outline of. Here's how much
money you can spend and. Or how much money you have to
cut, and then they work on the details
of how they're going to meet that broad outline. And
so that's kind of what they're doing. One at a time, they're coming up with
(15:05):
their committee's specifics on how they're going to
meet that broad budget, uh, that they're
given. And then once those are all released
into the wild, then, uh, all the members
of the House and the members of the Senate look at those and decide if
they can vote on it or say, I can't vote for something
that's got this provision, so you need to change it. And then they have
negotiations, and ultimately they come up with
(15:27):
the one big package that supposedly can get a
majority of votes in the House and in the Senate.
And then the House and the Senate will each kind
of release their package and they have to agree
to a reconciled version, uh, um, between the two, so
that one package can get a majority in the House
and a majority in the Senate, because the House and the Senate might have
(15:48):
different priorities and disagree.
>> Elissa Tennant (15:49):
It's a reconciled package. Budget
reconciliation. Okay.
Uh, I was about to ask where the reconciliation term came
from, too, so you were way ahead of me there. So they come out
with two versions of it. We at ccl, um. I know you're giving me the lay
of the land, but we at CCL always refer to budget reconciliation
as largely a partisan process. I feel
like now's a good time to dive into why it is largely a
(16:11):
partisan process and why we call it that.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (16:14):
It wasn't always a partisan process.
In the past, when there was more
bipartisan, uh, negotiations that
tend to be more successful when there was less partisanship in Congress,
then, like the budget reconciliation process was just to make sure
that they could get something passed with a majority of votes, but it
didn't necessarily have to be all Republicans or all
Democrats. So just 50 votes in the Senate.
(16:36):
Uh, but then over time, Congress became more
partisan, more divided, and so it became a
partisan process such that whichever party was in
the majority in the Senate, they could get what they needed to get
done in the Senate. Um, so that's why it's become a
partisan process. But it wasn't always one, and it doesn't have to be
one. Um, it just. It is right now,
(16:57):
and there is.
>> Elissa Tennant (16:57):
A large, vast future ahead of us. But for this exact
moment, that's why it's a. Ah, it's largely a Republican
process as they hold a majority in the House and the Senate.
Okay, back to the lay of the land. So where are we in the
budget reconciliation process?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (17:11):
Yeah. So each committee's in the process of
releasing their plans for how they're going to
meet their broad uh, budgetary,
uh, rules. And then in terms of
the Inflation Reduction act tax credits, in the House it's the
Ways and Means committee is in charge of those and the Senate, it's the
Senate Finance Committee is in charge of the inflation, uh,
(17:32):
reduction act tax credits and other important finance,
uh, tax credits and provisions. So
we are going to see what they have planned and
then we'll try to hope, hope they preserve some
stuff from the Inflation Reduction act and we will try to convince them
to, to preserve that important
stuff.
>> Elissa Tennant (17:49):
Side note, I think Ways and Means is an excellent
committee name. I think it's just vague enough where I have no
idea what they actually do. But they seem very prestigious and important.
I think in terms of marketing they really nailed that.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (18:01):
They have the ways, they have the.
>> Elissa Tennant (18:02):
Means, they do whatever the things and stuff.
Committee Mysterious and
important.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (18:09):
Yes, that's what they should call it. Mysterious and important Committee.
>> Elissa Tennant (18:11):
The work is mysterious and important.
Shout out sepherance so
what's your favorite IRA tax credit? If
you had to pick one, you ha, you have to pick one. Actually it's not an
if.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (18:22):
That's a good question. Uh, I think I
have to say that the clean electricity tax credits,
because they're so important and they're going to do so many
things like help us deploy
a lot more clean electricity, a lot more power in
general as our power demand is increasing,
reduce home electricity bills, they
(18:42):
create a lot of construction jobs and they're the most
important provision for reducing climate pollution.
According to modeling, they're going to be responsible for about half of the
inflation reduction x climate pollution reductions.
So for all those reasons, uh, because they're so
important, clean electricity I have to say would be my favorite.
Although if I were being more biased and
(19:03):
selfish, I would say the uh, home
weatherization tax credits are my favorite because I recently
upgraded my 70 year old windows on
my house just last year and I was able this year to take the tax
credit for that and reduce my tax the amount of taxes that I owed.
So I really appreciate that tax credit for selfish
reasons too.
>> Elissa Tennant (19:21):
That's how I feel about um, the induction stove
tax credit. When I got my induction stove last year, just
because our old electric stove, this house is 105 years
old. Uh, so when our stove finally
gave out, um, I um, got the induction stove and I invited people over
to watch me boil water, I was like, do you want to come over and have, like, a spaghetti
party? It's so fast, you'll love
(19:41):
it. So I agree. Uh, uh, that was a big one. I thought you
were going to say, I don't even know why I know about these. But the
USDA reef credits, the agriculture. Because you're a big
silvopasture fan.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (19:52):
Uh, uh, well, the reef program's not a tax credit. It's more of, like, a
grant program. And so that's a good program.
And I do love silvopasture planting trees on
pasture land. But not technically a tax
credit.
>> Elissa Tennant (20:05):
Yes, well, that's right. We'll save that one for our
silvopasture episode in.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (20:08):
Ah, I like that. It's a good idea.
>> Elissa Tennant (20:11):
We've established these tax credits are important. The Inflation
Reduction act is important. We really need to leave it intact
throughout the budget reconciliation process.
So let's talk about why this really matters. Like, what would we lose
if these tax credits go away? What's at stake?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (20:24):
There is a lot at stake. We would lose a
big chunk of climate pollution cuts. We
would lose. I, uh, hate that a lot. Uh, we would lose
a whole bunch of domestic manufacturing
facilities and jobs, local, uh,
revenue that goes to communities where those
facilities are located.
Um, we would. Our electricity bills would go up
(20:47):
because we would get less of this cheap, clean electricity.
Um, so there's all kinds of bad stuff that would happen
that I don't think anybody wants to see those bad things happen.
And so we're going to try very hard to convince our
members of Congress to keep these important tax credits
in place.
>> Elissa Tennant (21:04):
Yeah. Can we get, like, a, A vibe check on aisle
America? How are people feeling about
the tax credits in general? Do we have, like, a
general public opinion on the Inflation Reduction
act, clean energy tax credits?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (21:17):
Yes, There is just recently a survey released by
the University of Maryland that asked specifically about
a bunch of these tax credits, and they found
that all of them that they asked about were very popular
across the political spectrum. So actually, the least
popular one that they asked about was the tax credit for
new electric vehicles, which is a $7,500 tax credit
(21:37):
if you qualify and you're purchasing a new electric car.
Even that one. Even among Republican voters
who they surveyed, it was a, uh,
71% support and
29% wanted to repeal it. So even, like, the
least popular tax credit among Republican
voters specifically was still, like, 2.5 to 1
support to oppose. And so they are all very, very popular because
(21:59):
they do so much good stuff. And who doesn't like to get a
tax credit?
>> Elissa Tennant (22:03):
I can't imagine people wouldn't want to get a tax
credit for their clean energy purchases.
That makes sense to me. Yeah, so these are important. We want
to keep them intact. What can listeners do right
now to help protect these tax credits?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (22:18):
Well, we at CCL have been doing stuff to help protect them
since like last December. We have
had our, our volunteers, whose members of Congress
are on the House Ways and Means Committee and the Senate
Finance and Finance Committee, contact those
representatives and tell them about the importance of the tax
credits. We've, uh, had lots of actions where our
members have contacted their members of Congress, especially Republican members
(22:40):
of Congress, asking them to support and preserve
the Inflation Reduction act tax credits. We, uh, had
a conservative conference where our conservative volunteers
went to Washington D.C. and had a nice conference
and training and then lobbied almost 50 Republican members
of Congress about the Inflation Reduction act tax rates and a
few other things. So we've been doing a lot. And of course
(23:01):
we have our summer conference, as you mentioned, between
July 20th and 22nd, where we will
again, most likely, assuming that this question
hasn't been settled yet, which it probably won't have been, we will be
lobbying on the Inflation Reduction act there
too. We've also got a database that I put together
of all the different, uh, facilities
and projects that the Inflation Reduction act has
(23:23):
helped incentivize all across the country. And like the number
of jobs it's created in the local revenue
that, um, we're using that information to inform our lobbying.
And so we're doing a whole lot. And so one thing
people can do is to join their local citizens Climate
Lobby chapter, uh, to help us with these
lobbying efforts or just to contact
(23:44):
their member of Congress directly and do this kind of
lobbying and tell their stories and
convince our members of Congress to keep these important tax
credits in place.
>> Elissa Tennant (23:54):
Dana, you just named so many things. So I'm going to take,
I'm going to give it one thing.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (24:00):
Okay, one thing's good.
>> Elissa Tennant (24:01):
That was, that was so many things. I.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (24:03):
What's the one thing stressed?
>> Elissa Tennant (24:04):
So the one thing I would say is if you are
represented by a Republican member of Congress, you can
write their office right now asking them to protect the, uh,
Inflation Reduction Acts clean energy tax credits. And
we have a tool that makes it super easy@, ah,
cclusa.org
IRA defense. So it's
cclusa.org IRA defense.
(24:26):
And then a lot, uh, of people will say, well, I'm not represented by a Republican, but I
still want to Help. And you totally can. You can share that link
on your social media accounts and send it directly to your friends
and family who are represented by Republican members of Congress.
And spread the word, because budget reconciliation is a really long
process. Like you said, this question probably will not be answered by the time
our conference rolls around in July. So we need to keep the
(24:46):
conversation going because the more we keep it going, the more
important these tax credits are to the general public.
So bring it up at parties, talk about it on your next
open mic night, take out a billboard, or just share this
episode with anybody you think might be interested
in learning more about the Inflation Reduction Act's
tax credits. And once again, please
join US this, uh, July 20th through
(25:09):
22nd in Washington, D.C. @
Citizens Climate Lobby Summer Conference. You can learn more
and sign
up@cclusa.org
conference. It's the perfect opportunity to get up to speed
on climate policy, build community, and meet directly
with lawmakers to defend these tax credits credits and
more. And you don't have to be a policy expert because I
(25:30):
clearly am not. I am just someone who
cares. So, again, learn more and
register@cclusa.org
conference.
And I have one last question for you, Dana. What gives
you hope that we can keep these programs alive? Why are we
still going at this?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (25:46):
The good news is that a lot of Republican members of Congress have already
expressed that they want to preserve at least some
of these important tax credits. There's been a number of
letters from groups of Republicans to their
leadership saying, hey, let's be careful about what we're
getting rid of here because there's a lot
of great benefits, especially in
(26:06):
Republican districts in terms of like battery
manufacturing and as you mentioned, auto EV
manufacturing facilities and big solar and wind farms. And
those things generate a lot of local jobs and local
revenue and they're helping local communities.
And it doesn't look good if you
vote to repeal a, uh, policy
that is generating a lot of local jobs
(26:29):
and manufacturing and tax revenue in your
district. And so it's in their benefits to
preserve a lot of these tax credits. And so I'm hopeful
that we will be successful in preserving
at least some of the more important provisions from the Inflation
Reduction Act.
>> Elissa Tennant (26:45):
Hear, hear. Peterson, myself,
and hopefully the listener, agree with you. So thank you,
Data. Uh, the next episode I think might be
the Foreign Pollution Fee act, which was just introduced
in Congress a short time ago. And we're going to be doing a training
on that for our volunteers coming up. So I think we have a lot
to talk about on that topic. Unless we decide to skip it and just go straight
(27:05):
to Silva Pastor, who.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (27:07):
Knows both good topics.
>> Elissa Tennant (27:09):
And thank you for listening. We'll give it back to Peterson to close things
out.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (27:12):
Thanks, Alessa.
>> Elissa Tennant (27:14):
Thanks, Dana.
>> Peterson Toscano (27:15):
Elissa. Uh, Dana, I need to thank you
for that amazing overview. I understand
this so much more clearly than I did before. I
mean, I thought I knew about the Inflation Reduction act, but
I. I really lost the thread at some point.
But you brought it all back for me. Thank you.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (27:32):
Thank you.
>> Peterson Toscano (27:33):
Yeah. Um. Uh, yeah, I just. I learned so much.
So thank you very much.
>> Elissa Tennant (27:37):
Thank Data. But I am happy to help facilitate a conversation about
the Inflation Reduction act at any party.
>> Peterson Toscano (27:42):
I have, uh, one request. Whenever you
talk about having created a database, can I
call it a Danabase?
>> Dana Nuccitelli (27:53):
The Danabase. It's a good name. I like it.
>> Peterson Toscano (27:56):
Well, yeah, come back and talk more, because we need to know
about this policy. And I have to say, it's one of the
areas I'm weakest in. And as people who
do climate work, it's easy to lean into
the places where we have strength because it's comfortable.
But we all have to learn new tricks and
adapt all the time to climate change and to climate
(28:16):
policy. So thank you so much, and I'm
looking forward to much more.
>> Elissa Tennant (28:21):
Thank you, Peterson.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (28:22):
We're all going to learn and grow together.
>> Peterson Toscano (28:24):
Yay.
And thank you for listening to Citizens Climate
Radio. If you're ready to take action
to protect climate clean energy tax
credits, visit
cclusa.orgiradefense
(28:45):
that's cclusa.org
IRA defense. And don't forget,
you can join us in person. And when I say join us, I mean
like Elissa, Dana and I are going to
be at Citizens Climate
Lobby's summer conference, happening
from July 20th to the 22nd
(29:05):
in Washington, DC. Learn more
and sign up at
cclusa.org
conference. In fact, I think you should just type in
cclusa.org whatever
you like and see if it comes up as an actual page
on the website.
>> Elissa Tennant (29:23):
Hey.
>> Peterson Toscano (29:26):
Do you have a start story or a question you'd
like to share? Call or text our listener
line, which is, uh,
619-512-9646.
That's
619-512-9646.
You'll find show notes and, um, links to
(29:47):
our hosts. All of us are hosts today, it
feels like@, uh,
cclusa.org
radio. See how it works
and be sure to follow us on Instagram X,
Facebook, LinkedIn, and yes,
TikTok. Just search for Citizens
Climate Radio. This episode was
(30:08):
written by Elissa Tennant, Dana Nuccitelli, Leslie Beatty,
Elise Silvestri and me Peterson Citoscano
Production by Elise Silvestri and me. M Music comes
from Epidemic Sound.
Citizens Climate Radio is a project of Citizens Climate
Education. I will see you next time, but in the
meantime stay strong, determined and
creative in your work on climate change.
>> Elissa Tennant (30:45):
SA.
>> Dana Nuccitelli (30:49):
M.
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