Issue 604: Happy Fantastic Four Week & Kevin Feige's MCU Update

On today's issue of Comicast the guys discuss the positive reception The Fantastic Four: First Steps is garnering so far, Matt Shakman's reasoning for cutting John Malkovich from the film, and the use of practical effects. The guys also deep dive into all of the information that Kevin Feige shared during a sitdown with journalists last Friday including realizing Marvel Studios released too much after Endgame, cutting down the amount of TV shows to 1 per year, pivoting to Doom, the X-Men casting, Spider-Man: Brand New Day being a street level story, Miles Morales' future in the MCU, the status of Blade, diversity in their stories, Secret Wars being a reset not a reboot, and more. Plus, the guys are frustrated with some movie goers... *MC takes keyboard* STOP SHINING YOUR DUMB PHONE LIGHT IN MY EYES!!!
 
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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
You can do this.

Speaker 2 (00:04):
You want.

Speaker 1 (00:14):
You.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
Oh, hello there Internet, Welcome to issue six hundred and
four of Comic Cast. I am Michael Carroll alongside Jong
Lee John.

Speaker 3 (00:45):
How are you.

Speaker 1 (00:46):
I'm good, my man, how are you?

Speaker 3 (00:48):
I'm good. I'm good. I'm doing well.

Speaker 2 (00:50):
I'm excited because hey, it's Fantastic four week. Finally we're
on the precipice of the next film for Marvel Studios.

Speaker 3 (00:59):
And I'm excited.

Speaker 1 (01:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:02):
Yeah, the what do you call the embargo is up? Yeah,
and the reactions have been very, very good. I'm very
excited for this movie. And I think, like you know,
I think going into the year, we circled this month,
as you know, the big blockbuster hitters, and I think

(01:23):
we were all like looking forward to both Superman and
Fantastic Four, And I'm glad that both of these movies
are living up to the hype and what we've been
saying constantly that it's not really superhero fatigue, that these
are actually good movies.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
So I'm excited.

Speaker 2 (01:41):
Yeah, same me too, So looking forward to this week
and looking forward to finally watching Fantastic four, And we'll
get into Fantastic for a little bit more as well
as Kevin Faigy, there was a ton of stuff coming
out yesterday. We're recording this on Monday, July twenty. First,
a bunch of articles came out on Sunday in regards
to to a basically I guess a sit down that

(02:03):
he had with journalists. So we'll talk about that here shortly.
But first, as always, you can follow us on social media.
I'm at producer Mike nine seven.

Speaker 1 (02:11):
Five and I've met one punch.

Speaker 2 (02:14):
And as always, you can find this podcast wherever you
get your podcasts, to shirts, Comiccast, cicast, give us like, ratings, share,
or subscribe.

Speaker 3 (02:22):
We would greatly appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (02:23):
You can also listen to a version of this podcast
on ESPN ninety seven to five and ninety two to
five Wednesday nights at eight pm. So, as I mentioned before,
Fantastic four is this week, and you mentioned it first.
Reactions are coming in very positive about the film so far,
from Brandon Davis to Jamie, from Black Girl Nerds to
a bunch of different Chris Killian, a bunch of different

(02:47):
journalists that have had a chance to see the film
have really enjoyed it so far. So that has me excited.
But we also learned from some of these talks and
early interviews in the process that with fantas Ask four,
there's one key thing that I want to highlight and
then we'll get into Kevin Feig's stuff. Matt Schackman revealed
that John Malkovich, who was set to play finally confirmed

(03:10):
Red Ghost, is not in the final cut of Fantastic
four when we watch it later this week. He said, quote,
there were a lot of things that ultimately ended up
hitting the cutting room floor when we were building a
sixties retro future world, introducing all of these villains, introducing
these four main characters as a group, as well as
individually introducing the idea of a child. There was a

(03:32):
lot of stuff to balance in this movie, and some
things had to go ultimately in terms of shaping the
film for its final version. He went on to say
it was heartbreaking not to include him in the final
version of the movie because he's one of my favorite
humans and one of my biggest inspirations as a person
who walks the line between theater and film and television.

(03:53):
There's no one who is more inspiring than the founder
of Steppenwolf Theater Company. What he's done on stage as
an actor and what he's done as a director in
theater as well as in film, and as just a
film actor of incredible ability. I was honored he came
to play. So sadly, no Red Ghosts, No, no John
Malkovich in this film. But the other characters that we

(04:14):
know of, Paul, Walter Hauser, Natasha Leone, those actors and
actresses are still set for the movie. It's just John
Malkovich so far that's been cut.

Speaker 4 (04:24):
Yeah, that would probably mean that he was. The role
was very small and minimal, and it's the movies just
under two hours, kind of around where Marvel kind of
likes their movies now, So yeah, I don't think he
probably didn't play a pivotal role in the movie.

Speaker 3 (04:42):
Yeah, I was.

Speaker 2 (04:44):
I forget if it's the Variety article because this was
from Variety what I just read.

Speaker 3 (04:47):
I should have noted that, but.

Speaker 2 (04:49):
Yeah, here it is in the in the In the article,
it says Malcovich's seems came scenes came early in the
Fantastic Four, part of a lengthy sinquitz detailing the titular
families early years as superheroes, including when they battled the
Red Ghost and his team of super apes. So yeah,
we would have seen red ghosts in the super apes
in the movie, but it was too much to stuff

(05:12):
in there.

Speaker 4 (05:12):
Yeah, if it didn't make sense, and you're not you know,
you're abiding by your two hour policy. Now I'm it
makes no sense to keep them in And if it's
gonna extend it to like two fifteen or whatever, it's
whatever the runtime is gonna be.

Speaker 2 (05:27):
Yeah, I believe the runtime is at hour fifty five.
So with credits, you're probably looking at if you take
away the credits, you're probably looking at an hour forty
maybe hour forty five or so something like that. So
it's a it's a tight, fast paced movie, it seems like,
just based off looking at the runtime.

Speaker 4 (05:47):
Yeah, I didn't realize trailers are so long. And then
you have the commercials at the beginning of the movie too,
and then you have your you know, silent in the
theater and all that's starting depending on the movie theater
you go to, you have the whole we get snacks
at the lobby and all that kind of thing you have.
They have, you know, a bunch of promos they get
to run and all that stuff adds up.

Speaker 2 (06:10):
Can I this is a tangent, But can I complain
about some people at theaters?

Speaker 3 (06:15):
Real quick?

Speaker 1 (06:16):
Can I?

Speaker 3 (06:17):
Can I do that?

Speaker 2 (06:18):
Because last week I went to the theater a lot,
and I every movie that I saw, there was somebody
in the audience that was doing something that was unneeded
because one one person you know, like you like you
said you you, You go to the theater and it's
thirty minutes of this and and you know, it's this

(06:40):
whole experience. It's a pricey We've talked about all this,
So when I get to the theater, I don't need
extra stuff from people in the audience. One guy on
what was it Monday, decided to start throwing jokes out
at the film, like kind of commentating as he went.
As we were watching the movie, h it was the
movie Eddington and Pedro Pascal's character's name is Ted Garcia,

(07:03):
and he said something, Oh, I thought it was Ted Cruz.
And he said it loud, and he's like in the
front row. It was very loud. It's like, what are
we doing here?

Speaker 3 (07:09):
Bro.

Speaker 2 (07:10):
Then on Tuesday there was a woman that was like
Caddy corner from me that had her phone out the
entire time and was kind of paying attention to the movie,
but it was like paying attention to the movie as
if she was at home, where if there was a
joke thrown she would laugh at it and like look
up and then go back to her phone. It's like,

(07:31):
why are you here? Why? Just why? And then I
saw I know what she did last summer? Someone brought
a baby to I know what she did last summer.
Luckily they didn't stay because I mean, it's a baby.
I get like, a baby is not gonna like recognize
some of the stuff. But it's a horror slasher movie.
Come on, what are we doing? And then the people

(07:53):
to the right of me were like horror movie analysts
because they kept providing commentary throughout where they're like, oh,
they're dead first, yeah, yeah, see that. Yeah, that means
they're gonna die. And it's like, oh my gosh, I
don't need this commentary right now. Just so many people
have the free will to commentate and whatever else.

Speaker 3 (08:15):
Stop it, just stop it.

Speaker 1 (08:19):
Yeah, I sorry, I had that Why you're going to
the theater?

Speaker 4 (08:23):
Well when you do stuff like that, yeah, And I
don't know, I don't think it's anything new. I've you know,
seen this kind of stuff growing up and you know,
you're you're there to enjoy the movie, and you know,
as times have gone on, movies have become more expensive.

(08:43):
And then you're like, why are you ruining your experience
and other people's experience by throwing jokes out there talking
on your phone, like I don't know's it's a waste
of money when you do it, stuff like that, and
and just people, you just don't have common courtesy for
your fellow theater goer.

Speaker 1 (09:01):
So I never understood that.

Speaker 3 (09:04):
I never understand it either. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (09:06):
I just when we were talking about the theaters, they
maybe think about, oh yeah, I wanted to complain about
this really quickly.

Speaker 4 (09:12):
No, but last week or when Superman came out, when
I went to go watch Superman, there was a family
walking in while I was walking in, and I moved
pretty quick. I walk pretty fast, so I you know,
I scurry past them real quick. And then I get
in line, get my popcorn and get my drink. And
then as I'm going to the theater, the family is, like,

(09:33):
I think, in a different line, but they're like talking
to the talking to the cashier, and oh my god,
the dad is so loud, and he's like trying to
get his son to hit on the cashier, and the
cashiers like me laughing, and he'said, oh my my son's single,
he's an athlete, and blah blah blah. I think it
was a family of like man six or seven.

Speaker 1 (09:56):
It's a big family. And so.

Speaker 4 (09:59):
I was just sitting there thinking, please pray to God
that they don't they're not in my theater because like
our movie was about to start, and I mean, I'm
pretty sure ninety percent of the people, ninety five percent
of the people there are there to see Superman, but
there were lolliguigings. I was like, Okay, my our movies
like right about to start. Maybe they're not in the theater.
And I get seated and I think it's like in

(10:21):
the middle of the first preview, and as the movie starts,
they don't walk in. I'm like, oh, thank god, they're
I think there was a showing like forty minutes later,
and I think that's probably the one they went into.
I just yeah, it's it's I just hate those those
like you you have a family of like six or seven,
you're spending, you're at concessions, you have your you know,

(10:42):
it's tintled down but regardless, like that's what seventy if
you're watching Superman, that was like I think twelve dollars
a ticket or something like that. So you're you're, you know,
you're damn, we're damn, damn. You're spending you know, one
hundred bucks right there on just on tickets alone, close
to one hundred dollars. And then you're at concessions, you're
about to buy, however many popcorns and drinks, and you're

(11:03):
about to spend upwards of one hundred and fifty dollars.
And I hope to god that you went into whatever
theater you went to and didn't see a word. But
it didn't seem like the conversations they were having and
the loud, the dad being just obnoxious, it just felt
like that you weren't going to pipe down when the

(11:24):
when the lights went out. So I I just hate
people that don't have any social awareness of just being
quiet during a movie where almost everybody in the theater
is there to just watch the movie and not hear
you crack jokes or your commentary.

Speaker 1 (11:42):
I just I hate that. Man.

Speaker 4 (11:44):
That's that's the that's that has to be the number
one thing about the why people don't go to movies.
Is that and and and or I maybe pricing is
number one, but like that kind of stuff is like
it's it's so irritating, Like why are you here? Wait
until it releases on demand?

Speaker 2 (12:00):
Yeah, if you want to go away, Yeah, if you
want to provide a commentary track to this, do it
on your own time. Not a podcast, Yeah, start a
podcast something else. Also the awareness to, like I get
for folks that you know, the movie says nine o'clock
or eight o'clock whatever it is, but it actually doesn't

(12:20):
start till like eight twenty eight thirty, so people are
gonna come in maybe a little bit closer to the
actual start time of the movie. I get that one
hundred percent. But like, if it's dark, just be aware
of how and where your your flashlight on your phone
is flashing. Because there was people just what I forget

(12:41):
whichever movie it was last week, where they were just
shining their light everywhere and it just lit up the
theater and there was like zero awareness to let me
just hold it down or turn down the brightness a
little bit, just so it's not blasting people in the
eyes while they're trying to watch this movie.

Speaker 3 (12:57):
I want to shake people.

Speaker 1 (12:58):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (12:59):
I just don't understand that.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (13:03):
Like if you're coming in, please, I mean, if you're
coming in like during the during the trailers, that's fine,
that's one thing. But coming in like like like we
talked about, trailers, are fifteen twenty thirty minutes, Like that
period is that long? If you're coming into the theater
when your start time is at nine and you're walking,

(13:23):
you go lollygag around nine point forty, go do a
different showing.

Speaker 2 (13:27):
Bro, I can't. I can't with people. I'm sorry. I
just I had to get that off my chest. I'm
frustrating anyway, No.

Speaker 1 (13:34):
You're good. I share the same sentiment with you.

Speaker 2 (13:36):
Cause I think both you and I are proponents of
movie theater experience. We both enjoy the movie theater experience
and all that stuff. But people, some people make it
frustrating and a little boiling point here, I look like
the little dude from inside out, Like just you know, anyway,
some people suck, some people do suck. You know what

(13:58):
doesn't suck? Fantastic for and Viike. He said as much
in his long interview with I mean, I don't know
if it was an interview. It was a sit down
with a small group of journalists last Friday where he
sat down and he talked about everything that's coming out.
Since we're on the subject of Fantastic Four, I'll start

(14:18):
off with that, because he had a bit to say
about the Fantastic Four and it coming out this week.
He said, quote in regards to the Fantastic Four, we
didn't want to have the Eternal's issue of where were they?
Where have they been? How come they didn't help with Thanos.
We wanted them to be apart from our reality so
that we didn't have to say, oh, look, they were

(14:41):
hiding over here. And he was asked why Fantastic Four
because it's Marvel's first family. They let's see, it's in
the history of our characters. They deserve to be a listers.
They were a listers in the comics every crossover movie
we've made, in the Infinity Saga, Civil War leading to
Infinity War, in Endgame, which is really the Infinity Saga

(15:01):
from the comics, the Fantastic Four were huge players in
those comics, and obviously we couldn't do that. Then then
he went on to talk about previous Fantastic Four films.
There have been maybe good Fantastic Four movies or not
so good Fantastic Four movies, but nothing that felt like
we had really seen what they are capable of. He
also teased that the four lead actors from the unreleased

(15:24):
nineteen ninety four Fantastic Four film all have cameos in
the new movie. And then, in regards to the aesthetic,
he said, quote, we were always we always were planning
even before that became a talking point to introduce them
in their own world in which they are the only heroes.
It is a no homework required movie. It literally is

(15:46):
not connected to anything we've made before. End quote. What
do you think of Kevin Faigey's comments on that? I mean,
for one, I do appreciate and fully expected it was
going to be something where is like no homework required
since they are in a different universe.

Speaker 1 (16:03):
I mean makes sense.

Speaker 4 (16:05):
I mean I think going in like you're like you said, like, yeah,
another universe, another earth, the aesthetics are in which which
I think is aside from you know, confusing audiences and whatnot,
I think it was a good choice to go this route,
to have a different aesthetic look to it and when
when they first tease the picture, I was like, oh, like,

(16:28):
I love it. It's a retro, it's it's a different
type of vibe to it. It had that Jetsons feel
to it. And I was like, oh man, this is
gonna be great, this is gonna be great. It's on track.
And then like the as you know, as we as
time passed and you had all this different news about
how Marvel's trying to get back to, you know, being
what they were, and there overhaul, overhauling, how they're shooting,

(16:53):
writing and all that kind of stuff, and you know,
a year or two passes and we get more and
more stuff. The first trailer, all this stuff, and it's
it's tracking to be a very very good movie. And Yeah,
in terms of what he says about the Fantastic for
I don't really disagree with disagree with the stuff that
he's he's been saying, and maybe this is kind of

(17:19):
maybe the way that they're going to approach these movies
going forward is and I know the connective universe thing
has worked for them in the past, and there's there
are different issues on why it hasn't worked in the
last couple of years. And we've talked to on nauseum
about that, maybe they go back and start doing more

(17:40):
of these movies where it's not so deeply connected, and
then as you get closer and closer to your you know,
your endgame level, you know, movie the culmination, then you
start integrating multiple characters and do it that way. And
maybe that's that's the approach that they're going to to do.

(18:01):
But yeah, I can't wait for this movie, and yeah,
I'm excited.

Speaker 2 (18:06):
Do you think too, kind of going off of that,
do you think it could be a thing where it
does feel like Fantastic Four, It feels like its own story.
It's gonna happen, it's gonna be this, and there's no
homework required for this one. But then the post credit, obviously,
I fully expect the post credit to set up Doomsday.
I wonder if they get back to that where their

(18:28):
post credits are for the larger narrative overall, but the
film itself is focused on the Fantastic Four or Shang
Chi or whoever.

Speaker 4 (18:39):
I think so, And I mean, that's not a bad
way to approach it is to do it that way.
So I'm not going to be surprised if that's kind
of their strategy going.

Speaker 2 (18:50):
Forward, and then going back to what you said when
what we were talking about with Fantastic four in terms
of the look of it and then the Jetsons feel
of it, Matt Schackman talked about it, because I was like,
I remember him saying something he said in regards to
Fantastic four first steps quote, We're trying to go on
location as much as much as we can. We're building

(19:10):
real sets, We're depending less and less on blue screen,
green screen and making things. We have a real Herbie,
we have an incredibly beautiful lab set here. We've got
a real Fantastic car. We've been building models and miniatures,
and I think that has really translated so far with
the clips and just everything that we've seen from the
movie that it feels tangible right like it just feels

(19:34):
it doesn't feel like they're just standing on a sound
stage somewhere. It feels like they're actually in these places.

Speaker 1 (19:41):
I'm glad that they're going that route.

Speaker 4 (19:44):
I do think that I don't think, and I don't know,
And obviously I'm I'm gonna sit here and say how
much you know I know and how much I don't
know because we have no connect I have no connecttion.

Speaker 3 (20:00):
You mean you don't have sources.

Speaker 1 (20:03):
Sorry, I have a bad science infection as always. No, but.

Speaker 4 (20:09):
You take a look at the last movies post twenty one,
a lot of CG right, obviously because post pandemic not
a lot of rules and regularly there were a lot
of rules and regulations against close quarters and whatnot. And
I think some of that had to do them leaning.

Speaker 1 (20:30):
Into the.

Speaker 4 (20:32):
Green screen blue screen CG aspect of everything. I think
some of it does have to do lend itself to that.
And I also think that a lot of it has
to do with.

Speaker 1 (20:45):
You know, the characters you're dealing with.

Speaker 4 (20:47):
You know, I don't think you can practically do ted
drings floating in the air and a mystical dragon. That's
just you can't do it with practical effects. I mean,
I guess you could build a giant thing and just and.

Speaker 1 (21:02):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (21:03):
But from the aspect of having everybody together and being
on location, it makes a lot of sense. Like that
the whole the CG debacle with Spider Man Night that
that stuff, like you, it's stuff you can't avoid. Right
where you have flash in the middle of the street,
where all the shadows look very weird, and it's just

(21:24):
you can't you know, those like post pandemic rules and
stuff like that. Now on post you could probably maybe
edited it out. I don't know if you need that scene,
but it's I do like the fact that Marvel can
go back and look themselves in the mirror and evaluate
what has gone wrong, what needs to be improved, and

(21:49):
if anything, if we don't ever get you know, if
we don't ever get Eternals ever again, one thing that
I hope we can take away is how beautiful that
movie was. And I bet I bet you they look
at that and like, hey, like not a lot of
people may have seen this, but man, Chloe Jao did
something amazing and did a lot of on location.

Speaker 1 (22:11):
Shooting and it was great.

Speaker 4 (22:13):
And and I'm glad that they are looking at more
on location and practical effects and all that stuff. So too,
so like, I don't think the pendulum need to swing
the entire the other direction and you're only using practical effects.
But I'm glad that there it's swung from the other

(22:33):
extreme to maybe kind of in the middle. And I'm
glad that they're doing this.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
Like more tangible suits and armors and things like that,
like we saw with early Iron Man versus later Iron Man,
where it's always CG. You know, just you just need
to strike that right balance, right, Like, obviously you do
need some CGI, especially when you deal with mystical dragons
and different creatures and different things big big giant alien

(22:58):
monsters and all that, but you also need the practicality
of it all to make it feel a little bit
more tangible, feel a little bit more real. And there's
a reason why practical effects for the most part, not everything,
but a lot of them still hold up. Having watched
Jurassic Park not too long ago, those tangible practical effects

(23:19):
still hold up to this day in different old school movies, like,
the practical effects.

Speaker 3 (23:24):
Of it all really hold up very well.

Speaker 2 (23:25):
So I'm glad, Like you said, it's it's the pendulum
has swung back to this, but it is it still
needs to be that right balance.

Speaker 4 (23:32):
Yeah, it's just yeah, you just can't have like imagine
if they started seeging like capsuit just like why like
oh and I with Ironing Man stuff, I don't know
how much of it is like oh, it's like you know,
Downey didn't want to wear that thing for twelve hours
I don't know, it does look heavy, and I don't

(23:56):
know if that's the case, but like, like, and I'm
glad that they've they've went away from the whole Iron
Spider suit because it's just I don't want to see
Spider Man. I don't want to see behind the scenes
photos of Tom Holland wearing the same thing, you know,
same dot suits as you know, Mark Ruffalo and.

Speaker 1 (24:19):
Robert Downey Jr.

Speaker 4 (24:20):
Like Spider Man is supposed to be like in a
suit like he's supposed to. It's just that stuff didn't
make sense to me. I mean, I guess the Iron
Spider suit makes sense, but moving away from it, especially,
you know, he's set some stuff about Spider Man, but
you know, moving away from that kind of stuff, it's
it's very it's good for the brand, and I think,

(24:41):
you know, you get a more even small changes like
this will get more of a down to earth kind
of feeling to him. When you're shooting, especially, and when
you're shooting on location with everybody you can and you're
not talking to like a screen and they're you're going
to super impose somebody else there, it helps a lot.

Speaker 2 (25:01):
Yeah, And since you mentioned Spider Man, let's jump to that,
because he covers the gambit in terms of Spider Man
Blade pivoting from Doctor Doom or from Kang to Doctor Doom,
and he covers a lot of ground in this. So
but since you mentioned Spider Man, let's jump off there.
He said, in regards to Spider Man quote, I think
there's a promise at the end of No Way Home

(25:22):
that as that for as sad as it is that
Peter is forgotten by everyone in his life, we are
seeing for the first time in the Tom Holland Spider
Man stories, him being a proper Spider Man, him being
by himself dedicated to saving the city and dealing with,
for lack of better term, street level crime as opposed
as opposed to world ending events. So when you do that,

(25:45):
you say, okay, who are the other street level characters
that we've never seen him interact with? And of course
I love that Punisher started in a Spider Man comic
that great cover. I don't want to say too much,
but Destined Daniel Cretin, I will say. I will say
too much. Destin is doing an amazing job right now
on that movie, which starts shooting very soon. He's and

(26:06):
he's got eight or nine comic covers up on his
wall in his art department that he is bringing to
life in.

Speaker 3 (26:12):
This movie, which is super cool.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
And then just to tie into the Spider Man aspect
in regards to Miles Morales, he said, quote when asked
where Marvel was in development of a live action version
of the character, he said that is nowhere, and added
that Morale Miles Morales's fate was in Sony's hands. Quote
Sony has their brilliant, genius, incredible Spider Verse animated franchise going,

(26:35):
and until that finishes, we've been told to stay away
in quote, so we get the street level story, but
we're not gonna get Miles Morales anytime soon.

Speaker 4 (26:45):
Which I'm not too disappointed with. Yeah, the I think
treating Miles like you treat or or I want to say,
like you should treat Spider the Peter Parker Spider Man
and how you treat you know, Batman, like it's it's fair.
And I think Miles is so like a gotten to
that popularity that you should treat them like one of

(27:06):
your s tier heroes.

Speaker 1 (27:07):
And I don't.

Speaker 4 (27:08):
I have no qualms or beefs about them holding back
and and I'm glad he said, Sony's animated Sony itself
questionable decisions. But and my god, I hope you they
hand over the Miles movie to to somebody you know, competent, uh,

(27:30):
competent in doing the doing the movie. So like I
hope to god they hand it off to those guys
over at that did the Spider Verse movies. That that
part of it makes, it makes a lot of makes
a lot of sense. But in terms of the live

(27:51):
action Spider Man, I'm sitting here, like mister Burns saying
to myself, excellent, because I think that's I think a
lot of people want a more grounded Spider Man and
your neighbor, your friendly neighborhood Spider Man. I think a
lot of people were craving that. I think, you know,
him being involved in the MC was really really cool

(28:12):
and really nice. But I think at some point some
of those criticisms were valid. I think that you know,
he's relying on other people, not himself, and this isn't
like really the Spider Man that a lot of people
grew up with.

Speaker 1 (28:25):
Some of it, some of.

Speaker 4 (28:26):
It was a little extreme, some of it was was valid,
and I think some of it is you know, some
of it is rooted in in some truth, and so
I'm glad that he can see Kevin Fighter can see
like the the frustrations with the character amongst fans and
how they've treated Spider Man. So I I it's not

(28:49):
very surprising the direction that they're going. My only I'm
and I'm holding out hope. My only hope is that
they're they're taking Charlie Cox in and out of the
shoots with a full on body suit covering him from
head to toe, and that none of this news of
him being in the movie.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
Is out.

Speaker 4 (29:13):
And I hope they do the same thing Vincent Dinafrio.
I'm not holding my breath, but I hope that they're
in this movie, and I hope that they're an integral
part of this movie. And if you can get me
those two and you're doing a full green screen do it?

Speaker 3 (29:28):
You just want to see them interact or something.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
Yeah, you've done no way home.

Speaker 4 (29:32):
Almost ninety five percent of the movie was green screen, Like,
Its just yeah, I really want the Daredevil Born Again
storyline to carry over to Spider Man. It's a piece
between the two seasons of Daredevil. Would be fantastic but

(29:53):
I don't think we're gonna get that, and I'm interested
to see how they're gonna, you know, work Frank Castle
into into Spider Man. I'm really interested is at the
time that is this going to be before Daredevil or
in between where and when Daredevil's not doing where he's
not you know, fighting crime, where Punisher's just in the basement,

(30:15):
Like I want to see where the timeline is. But
I'm excited to have a Spider Man that is grounded,
and Tom Holland has a lot of creative control with
the character. And I do trust Tom Holland, and I
think he wouldn't and he said it himself, he wouldn't
sign on to do another Spider Man. Let's take Thatt
the correct script and I hope in a pray to

(30:39):
God that the script is.

Speaker 1 (30:40):
Good and then caveat.

Speaker 4 (30:43):
I enjoyed all three versions of his Spider Man. I
really have, and I go, you know, three, one, two
is probably the order, but I know a lot of
fans have not. And I want the general audience, like
the general audience of Superman have enjoyed this film, and
I want the general like I want a lot of
people to enjoy Spider Man like they've enjoyed Superman.

Speaker 2 (31:05):
Well, like a back to basics approach right with him,
you know, And that was the concern that we've talked
about over the course of you know, since Spider Man
No Way Home first released and after the fact, it
felt like at the end of the movie, as Kevin
Figy noted, it promised a it was treated almost like
a soft reboot for the character where he could start

(31:27):
from ground level and start like the Spider Man that
we kind of know from the comics and everything, and
not be in this big world ending multiverse or or
space or anything like that. Like it's gonna be your
friendly neighborhood Spider Man to the fullest extent, and he's
running around New York and helping people and doing street

(31:47):
level type stuff. That was the promise, But then you
had all these rumors start floating out, like, Oh, it's
gonna be on Battle World. Oh, Sony wants another multiverse movie.
Maybe we get Toby and Andrew again in this movie.
And it's nice to hear, No, we're not doing that.
It's going to be a street level story that focuses
on Peter doing the Spider Man thing in New York.

(32:12):
I just can't wait for that. That's what I've been wanting.
And I enjoyed the previous three. I think that all
three of them were good in their own ways. But
I do like that, Oh, this brings a new like
a breath of fresh air for the character that we
haven't seen in the MCU.

Speaker 4 (32:30):
Yeah and yeah, I do like the fact that he's
basically starting from scratch and not having anybody and not
knowing who not and nobody knowing who he is.

Speaker 1 (32:44):
I do understand understand that.

Speaker 4 (32:47):
I do really enjoy that aspect of it, and him
actually having to balance you know, uh, living on his
own and bringing in trying to make money and you know, and.

Speaker 1 (32:58):
All that kind of stuff.

Speaker 4 (33:00):
And I would imagine this maybe after he gets his
ged and then attending school in the middle of college,
maybe first year. I'm not sure how they're going to
tackle it. But you know, the duality of the character
I think makes him and Batman so, you know, so

(33:21):
not I'm not relatable, but like so similar in that
aspect of it, even though they're kind of polar opposites
in terms of how they grew up. But I you know,
I think people really find that, you know, having to
juggle the two lives very interesting and for different reasons
for each character. But I think that's that's something that

(33:41):
I think people really enjoyed with these characters, and I'm
glad that they're going back to having to deal with
that kind of stuff.

Speaker 2 (33:48):
Well, there's not too many secret identities right in the
MCU currently, where I think Marvel Comics there is a
lot more with secret identities, and that hasn't been really
a big thing in this version of the MCU and
this version of Marvel. But getting back to that, getting
back to him trying to balance everything, just getting back

(34:09):
to just trying to live, trying to balance school, trying
to balance this that, you know, I like those aspects
of it, and I just I'm excited to see what
the what the story is and who the characters he'll
be dealing with.

Speaker 3 (34:22):
Again.

Speaker 2 (34:23):
This puts back Initially, Sadie Sink was Geene Gray and
this and that, you know, we talked about it, but
now it feels like Sadie Sink is probably more like
a I don't know, I'm just speculating Gwyn Stacy or
Felicia Hardy or somebody that's actually within his Spider Man's
Rogues Gallery if you will, which I.

Speaker 4 (34:44):
Like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I think any everybody is kind
of up for that.

Speaker 1 (34:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (34:49):
I can't wait for him to actually battle his own
enemies because Rogues Gallery probably the deepest in the in Marvel,
just like Batman. It's it's very deep and uh and
I'm hoping in this next trilogy is leading up to

(35:10):
him battling the members of this Senator Sinistor six. So yeah,
I I am very excited. The energy behind the movie
is gonna be much much different, and I think people
are gonna be really surprised and not surprised because I
think I think Spider Man and Batman are the two

(35:31):
that will whatever product that you put out there, they're
gonna go.

Speaker 1 (35:35):
People are gonna go watch it.

Speaker 4 (35:36):
You're gonna get billion dollar movies from these franchises, and
I think, yeah, I think Spider Man is is a
brand that you can't It's gonna be very hard to tarnish.
And I think with this the way that they're handling it,
I think people are going to go back. They're going
to continue to go watch Spider Man.

Speaker 2 (35:51):
Movies, especially if you if you take in that approach
of you don't necessarily need any homework. Maybe you do
need to know a little bit about Peter park journey,
but maybe it is treated in such a way to
where if you hadn't seen the other Spider Man movies,
you'll inherently understand it. It's Spider Man doing what he does.
It's kind of like what Andrew did, kind of like

(36:12):
what Toby did in terms of live action films, Like
you understand this the core essence of where they're going
with this story, and that may be and more palatable
for general audiences that do worry about homework or do
worry do I have to have seen the last five
movies or whatever to understand where Peter's at in this moment.

(36:34):
I don't the way that that he's talked about it,
and the way he's talked about these projects and throughout
his his discussions with all these journalists, it feels like
maybe that's the route that they're going.

Speaker 4 (36:44):
Yeah, yeah, and I hope, I hope we get to
get that. And I and I'm still you know, holding
out hope that we get you know, Kingpinn and uh
and Daredevil, so especially since Punisher's involved in this thing,
so uh yeah, I'm hoping to see something you know,
they could keep that thing a secret throughout all the

(37:06):
trailers if you want, it's fine, But I think if
it has any similar like similarities to the comics of
that storyline where Daredevil and the Spider Man are teaming up, like,
I'm I am going to be ecstatic.

Speaker 2 (37:22):
Right, And I want to jump off here to the
TV aspect because Kevin Fykey brought this up a lot
during during the discussion with the journalists. This is a
little long, but bear with me, people, because I think
it's important in regards to their TV output. And this
is from the Variety article. Basically, I was like mixing

(37:43):
and mashing all the reports from Deadline, Hollywood Reporter, Variety
as they did all their big rundowns of what Kevin
Figy said. But this is from Variety. In regards to TV,
while mar Marvel's feature output is slowing down to at
most three films a year the MCU first reached in
twenty seventeen, its TV output is cooling off even further,

(38:05):
with often just a single live action show per year,
and the shows they do make will have far less
overlap with the feature films to disabuse audiences from the
expectations that they have to watch everything to follow what's
happening on any MCU project. By way of example, Figie
cited the Marvel TV shows of the twenty tens like

(38:26):
Daredevil and Jessica Jones on Netflix and Agents of Shield
and Agent Carter on ABC, which were produced by a
separate now defunct division of Marvel Entertainment. Kevin Feigi said, quote,
I think allowing a TV show to be a TV
show is what we're returning to, he said. Asked if
the events at the end of Thunderbolts, when most of
the population of Manhattan was enveloped in an inky black

(38:50):
shroud of depressive nothingness, would affect season two of Daredevil,
Figee had a simple answer no, He said, quote, where
we have great actors playing great characters, I think it
would be fun to see them multiple places in regards
to like Punisher popping up in Spider Man, but the
output will be much less. That reduction also meant that

(39:10):
two of Marvel's TV show TV projects were held for
over a year after they had been completed, Ironheart with
Dominic Thorn, which concluded an early July, and wonder Man
with ya Ya Abdul Mateen, the second which premieres in December.
It's something Kevin Figi is not keen to repeat. He said,
quote I don't like when things sit on shelves. It
stinks the delay, especially effective Wonderman, which follows an aspiring

(39:34):
actor Abdul ya Ya Abdul Mateen with hidden superpowers as
he strives to land a role on a TV series
playing a superhero. Figi, who was wearing a Wonderman baseball cap,
pointed out that Marvel made the show before HBO Max's
twenty twenty four comic book Movies Send Up the Franchise
or Apple TV TV Plus's Hollywood Satire the Studio. But

(39:56):
now it looks like they're following a trend instead of
leading it. So we're only gonna get one live action show,
seemingly for the foreseeable future. What do you think of that,
downgrading that output to maybe being one show a year.

Speaker 4 (40:12):
I'm not mad at it, but I think he I
don't think it's the number of things that you're releasing,
movies and movies and shows. I don't think it's the number.
I do think the number affects the quality, because I
don't think Kevin, and I don't think I know Kevin

(40:34):
Figy isn't able to oversee all projects, and which is
why we get some of the stuff that we get
we got.

Speaker 1 (40:42):
I think the number affects that.

Speaker 4 (40:45):
But if you can produce great quality television shows, and
you can produce like two a year and three a year,
then sure fine release three. But like I said, having

(41:05):
three shows a year and then having three movies a
year spreads Kevin Fike very very thin, and so that
affects that in it. But I think I don't think
putting a number on it should be your goal. I
think the goal is and I think the response should
have been more if the quality, if the if the

(41:29):
quality control is good enough, we can release X amount,
we don't have to that. There doesn't need to be
a number on it. I mean that's the way they
should approach it. I think that's the way James Guns
approaching it is if we have something that's great that
we only have one good thing to release this year,
we're only going to release one. If we have four

(41:51):
good things to release this year, we're going to release
that should be the goal is to make sure it
passes quality control.

Speaker 1 (42:00):
I understand where he's.

Speaker 4 (42:01):
Coming from and giving the number one, because they haven't
been really you know, hitting it.

Speaker 1 (42:07):
Out of the ballpark with these shows.

Speaker 4 (42:09):
But yeah, I think and maybe that's how he thinks,
and maybe he's just saying this just for like the
general audience, but I think it should be quality over
a number.

Speaker 2 (42:19):
Yeah, and if they did put out two shows or
three shows, it's not terrible, but it would make more
sense in terms of adjusting the method and how they
do it and taking a more daredevil born again approach
where you have obviously you're following along with the main
story of Matt Murdoch, but you have these subplots interweave.

(42:43):
Do you have like larger like larger narratives at play
with different characters and everything. Some of these series have
felt more mini series esque and sometimes they feel stretched out.
Sometimes they they try to have this bigger impact secret
invasion that don't really amount to anything when you look
at the bigger grand scale of everything, and just changing

(43:05):
that approach to be more like I'm watching this is
a very bad example, but like the Pit, where you
have your main character, but you have all these different
side characters and side stories that are interwoven with the
main story. Just taking that more just how you would
do a TV show would help a lot and actually

(43:26):
get ten episodes and actually build on these characters. I
think is a step that they need to start taking,
and they seemingly are with Daredevil and seemingly how they're
going to handle their series moving forward.

Speaker 4 (43:40):
Yeah, dealing with it this way is a much better
way to kind of address it. So yeah, I'm glad
that they're able to. And I think this happened maybe
a year or a year and a half ago where
they were able to step back and reevaluate this whole thing.
Maybe it is when Bob Eiger Job jumped back in,

(44:03):
and maybe that's when they had some time to bring
Kevin Feige in and say, hey, like, let's reevaluate how
we're doing this like it's, uh, it's it's not working,
Like we're like, it's the quality isn't there. And God,
I cannot imagine the biggest David Saslov of of taking

(44:26):
over from as the CEO to Bob Chappick tinky over.
I think that's very similar. Bob Chappick was all about
just and and maybe it's like Steve Jobs and then
Tim Cook, it's it just turned into it from innovation
and quality to just pumping out products and and I

(44:50):
maybe at the time Disney that's what Disney wanted. They
wanted more people at the at the at the theme parks,
they wanted more people watching. They just wanted people to
zoom and consumeing and zoom. And maybe it works for
a little bit during the pandemic because people couldn't go
anywhere and everything went kind of went to streaming.

Speaker 1 (45:08):
But it's just not working anymore.

Speaker 4 (45:09):
And I'm glad that as a society we've reverted back to, Hey,
give me something, you know, give me quality over quantity.
I don't like a Secret invasion that was terrible, and
give me more of Daredevil. And so I am glad
that they're reverting back and actually taking a look in

(45:31):
the mirror and say, hey, like we need to fix this.

Speaker 2 (45:34):
Yeah, this kind of leads me to the we released
too much was one of the big highlights of this
whole discussion, Kevin said, quote, we produced fifty hours of
stories between twenty twenty seven and twenty nineteen, but in
all the six years since Avengers Endgame concluded the Infinity Saga,
we've had well over one hundred hours of stories. In
half that time that's too much, and Variety points out

(45:58):
if you include animation, Marvel's Multiverse saga spans one hundred
and twenty seven hours of content versus the fifty hours
from twenty seven to twenty nineteen. Fike said in regards
to after Endgame, the company entered a period of quote
experimentation and quote evolution of the kinds of movies it

(46:19):
was making, leading to projects like Eternals and shann Chi.
In the Legend of the Same Rings, he said, quote,
I've always thought if you take success and don't experiment
with it and don't risk with it, then it's not
worth it. What we also ended up focusing on because
of Disney Plus was expansion, and that expansion that I
think led people to say it used to be fun,
but now do I have to know everything about all

(46:41):
of these? He said, quote it was a big company
push and it doesn't take too much to push us
to go. People have been asking for Miss Marvel for years,
and now we can do it.

Speaker 3 (46:51):
Do it. Oscar Isaac wants to be Moonnight. Do it.

Speaker 2 (46:55):
So there was a mandate that we were put in
the middle of, but we also thought it'd be fun
to bring these to life. So that kind of speaks
to what you were saying in terms of Bob Chappick,
who seemingly mandated, like we got to produce as much.
And they're also launching Disney Plus around this time, and
what do you want? You want a wealth of content
to make people want to subscribe, Push people, push Marvel

(47:18):
Studios and others to create all these different shows that
they can flood their net, their streaming service with.

Speaker 1 (47:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (47:28):
Yeah, they just kind of expanded when I don't want
to say they do when they didn't need to. And
I do agree that once you finish a movie or
like a saga like Endgame, you are kind of like
sitting there like what do we do next? And I
hope that this doesn't turn them off to experimenting, because man,

(47:54):
you experimented. And I want to say your hit rate
was over. I want to say your hit rates is
seventy percent of greater. I'm not gonna sit here and count,
but you've hit a lot more than you've missed. But
when you missed, you missed.

Speaker 1 (48:07):
Bad, like it was bad like.

Speaker 4 (48:10):
And then and then you get too scared to advertise
your market your stuff. And then when you have a
TV show that comes along that is actually generally well
received by most audiences. In Ironheart, there is absolutely no
marketing behind it. It makes no sense to me. And
I don't know if it's because you're scared or you

(48:33):
just don't want like like scared, like you don't want
to pour an x you know, a lot more money
into a project like this for it to and just
kind of sweep it under under the rock and say
onto the next because you don't want to, you know,
spend more money on it, or I don't know what
it is. And it definitely ain't because it's woke, because

(48:53):
he spoke on that too, and I'll let you read
the quote on it, but like it's just like it
makes no sense on some of the decisions that you made,
and I don't and I I don't know if it's
all on him. I think some of it is all
on him. Some of it's on him, And I could
even sit here and say most of it's on him,

(49:15):
And I think it's a product of also a product
of like when you have like quote quote unquote geniuses
like this, they're not very good at picking people that
are working beneath him, beneath them, and that have the
same like kind of mindset and like kind of like
operate the same way, kind of think that they kind

(49:37):
of had this genius behind them as well. It's very
rare that you like even in like, like great players
typically don't make great coaches because they kind of expect
the same things from everybody as what you expect from yourself,
and that's just not how everybody is built. You know,

(49:57):
you have your Jeff Tigues, but you also have your
honest onto the compos Like Jeff Tigue likes to kind
of have fun and joke around and all that kind
of thing, and Giannie is more serious like you just like, like,
I don't know, like having a coach like Jason Kidd
that is actually pretty decent to good, you don't find
that you like, I don't think like Michael Jordan would

(50:19):
have made a terrible coach, Like you don't like you
just like the same thing goes here, Like I don't
think he had somebody that was working under him that
could that he could give some of these TV projects
to That may have been better, Like the quality control
would have been better if if somebody they was actually

(50:41):
competent could be right under him to handle the TV stuff,
and so what ended up happening is like he's like
producing some of these TV shows, and some of them
just kind of get pushed to the wayside. And then
you get a monstrosity like Secret Wars, where it just
they just took a movie and just chopped it up
and really says TV show. Yeah, I'm sorry, Secret Invasion

(51:01):
and something.

Speaker 1 (51:02):
You get stuff like.

Speaker 4 (51:03):
Loki where you actually, you know, get to produce it
and then find actually writers and directors that are really
good that you can kind of trust. You just don't
like just the quality is just not there. And yeah,
I just that's that's just it just happens. And I
I and like I said, I'm really glad that the
read they're able to look at self reflect and looking

(51:26):
at themselves in the mirror and be able to make
a change and pivot. But I just hope that this
this quote unquote failure failure doesn't lead them to be
too scared to try anything new, like you bring up
Eternals in shang Chi. Shang Chi is a is a
big success. I enjoyed Eternals. I thought it was a

(51:49):
good experiment and a good risk. Now with general audiences,
it didn't work, But I just hoped, I mean, and
then now saying that you're not going to have a sequel,
and I don't know what you're going to do with
these characters, and you have a freaking celestial there in
the ocean, and you have to address the eternal somehow.
I don't know how you move forward. But I hope

(52:12):
and I pray to God that this doesn't stop you
from taking risks and chances.

Speaker 2 (52:18):
And having a diverse cast, which he mentioned when pressed
on the question, because I think it came up in
regards to that dialing things back and the concern about
what you said about like not experimenting as much, he said.

Speaker 1 (52:35):
Quote.

Speaker 2 (52:35):
When pressed on the question, fig appeared unconcerned. He said, quote,
Marvel represents the world outside your window. I've always said
it before Dei and Woke became a thing, and after
Dei and Woke became a thing. Are we after question mark?
I don't think so. He singled out Miss Marvel and
the Marvel's star Iman Vaalani as one of the greatest

(52:55):
hit bits of casting we've ever done. I can't wait
to see her somewhere end quote. So I am like you,
I hope that with this dialing things back. It doesn't
mean that we're dialing on the diverse wealth of characters
that we have, like a Man Vollani as Miss Marvel

(53:16):
that worked tremendously, Whereas a secret invasion with some of
those castings and some of that aspects the story just
didn't work as well. But that experimentation has led to
an awesome shang Chi and awesome Miss Marvel. I would
throw in Tiana Paris as as Monica Rambo, like as
awesome characters that they've been able to find as they've

(53:39):
been experimenting and trying new things and bringing this diverse
group of actors and characters along.

Speaker 4 (53:46):
Yeah, and I don't think he's gonna, you know, shy
away from casting diverse talent. When you know, when he
looks at a character and casting like that, I don't
think that's him. He's never gonna shy away from that.
And I'm glad that he did speak, actually speak on
on that, and I hope and that's a positive thing
going forward because the X Men is going to be

(54:08):
the next ensemble up, and that is going to be
the casting for that is going to be.

Speaker 1 (54:16):
I think.

Speaker 4 (54:19):
You don't have to be careful, but I think because
of what the story means and.

Speaker 1 (54:25):
What the the.

Speaker 4 (54:28):
Theme around the X Men means to people, I think
it's very important that you nail the cast for that.
And I don't think, you know, obviously you're not gonna
shy shy away from uh, diverse cast, because that's what
the X Men are. It's diversity, and it's a it's
it's literally a fight to to be a to be

(54:51):
somebody that is uh, you know, looked down upon by
society and trying to find their footing in society. And
so it's gonna be I think each one of those
characters in the plot point and all that kind of
stuff is very important, and I think they just he
confirmed the I don't know if it was in the interview,

(55:12):
but he did confirm that the Jake Schreyer is going
to be the actual director for that, and which he
tackled Thunderbolts very very well, and that had to do
with mental health. Now I kind of kind of still
still wish that Jordan Peele was on to direct it,
but you know, it's it's it's it's you know, it's whatever.

(55:33):
But I'm glad that they he at least with the
Thunderbolts and the messaging behind the Thunderbolts. They got that
messaging correct, and I'm and I'm hoping that they can
translate translate some of that into the X Men franchise.
But you have to you have to you have to
crank that up, that emotional aspect of the Thunderbolts. You

(55:55):
need to crank that up to from like a seven
to like a like a twelve. You need crank that up.
And it needs to be emotional just as much as
it is action packed, and like that needs to be
turned up. And and I hope that he has annother
gear for for that. And but yeah, like that, diversity

(56:17):
is a thing that shouldn't die in the MCU, and
I don't think it will.

Speaker 2 (56:22):
Yeah, I don't think it'll pivot back to what I
promoter or however you say his name was wanting and
hoping with Marvel Movies. I I think it's it's going
to still be diverse and and have diverse characters, you know.
I just I think that's the way it goes, especially
as you referenced when you talk about X Men and

(56:42):
what they represent and the type of stories that they
they have in comics and all sorts of media, like
there's there's a wealth of stories that have diverse, few
view points, diverse characters, and we we can't lose that
when we get to the X Men, and and in
reference to to the X Men, it sounds like it'll

(57:02):
be a young, younger group of x Men, just based
off his comment about it, and like you mentioned, Jake Schreier,
he did acknowledge and confirm that he is directing X Men,
but in regards to X Men comics and with their
focus on Xavier School for the for gifted youngsters, naturally
centered on stories about adolescent characters. He said, quote they
have been a place to tell stories about young people

(57:25):
who feel different and who feel other and who feel
like they don't belong. That's the universal story of Mutants
and that is where we're going. So it sounds like
it will be a younger cast that will grow with
over the course of the films.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
I e.

Speaker 2 (57:42):
A younger maybe not like super young, but kind of
in that vein of X Men first class.

Speaker 3 (57:47):
But not quite like that. And especially in terms of
time period.

Speaker 4 (57:52):
Is it wrong for me that I'm more excited for
that than Secret Wars?

Speaker 3 (57:57):
No, I don't think so.

Speaker 4 (57:58):
And then I know he talked about, you know, bringing
you know, Ryan Reynolds and Hugh Jackman back, and I'm.

Speaker 1 (58:05):
Kind of over.

Speaker 4 (58:08):
Reliving some of these past characters and and I know
Secret Secret Wars is going to be like kind of
the point where you're gonna do kind of a reboot,
but like, I like, we need to move one. Like
having twenty plus years of Hugh Jackman as Wolverine is
not good for anybody. Like it was great to see
him back and actually in his costume and Deadpool versus Wolverine,

(58:32):
but like I kind of wish that that was kind
of like the end and then we can move on.
But it just is obviously not because they're talking to
them about doing and I don't know if they're I
don't know if he said another movie, but they're at
least talking to them about bringing them back. I'm more
excited about doing a fresh, clean X Men than I
am having you know, Hugh Jackman, who I think is

(58:56):
close to seventy playing Wolverine. I think he's closest something
I don't remember, but but yeah, I I am very
excited to see the next Oh he's fifty six.

Speaker 1 (59:09):
I'm sorry, he's close to sixty. He's close to sixty.
I put a decade on him. But I'm glad.

Speaker 4 (59:14):
I'm hoping that I'm more excited to see the next
iteration of X Men than I am to see Ryan
Reynolds and Hugh Jackman team up for another movie.

Speaker 2 (59:25):
Honestly, I don't. I don't disagree with you. I am
excited to close the multiverse saga because it has been
such a tiring.

Speaker 3 (59:35):
Tiring thing.

Speaker 2 (59:36):
Yeah, I just I don't know, like the stakes when
you I don't know, that's that's a whole other podcast.
But yeah, it's been tiring to for sure. So in
reference to that and in reference to Secret Wars, he
did speak about it being like the new beginning if
you will, uh he said, quote in future Well, this

(59:57):
is from Variety's article In future Films, however, X Men
characters who appeared in previous movies will be played by
new actors, along with mutants making their big screen debut.
The decision echoes changes in the composition of the Marvel
comics following the twenty fifteen Secret War storyline, which involved
multiple timelines collapsing and reconverging, mixing up the characters of

(01:00:18):
the main Marvel timeline in the process, Kevin said, quote,
we're utilizing that story not just to round out the
stories we've been telling post endgame, just as importantly. And
you can look at the at the at the Secret
Wars comic for where they for where that takes you.
It very very much sets up for the future. Endgame

(01:00:40):
literally was about ending. Secret War is about beginnings. But
Faggy Figi was also careful not to characterize the changes
as a reboot. Instead, the executive said Secret Wars will
serve as a reset for the MCU. He said, quote,
reboot is a scary word. Reboot, reboot can mean a
lot of things, to a lot of peace, reset, singular timeline.

(01:01:02):
We're thinking along those lines. Later, he added, X Men
is where all that will happen next. So after Secret
Wars we will get our new X Men team that
we will follow along for however long. But that is
where we're heading. And a closing of of a lot
of things, a closing of of I would imagine Hugh Jackman,

(01:01:22):
a closing of of Patrick Stewart as popping up as
Professor X Anymore, a lot of those older actors were
finally like shutting the door with Secret Wars, Secret Well
Doomsday and Secret Wars, like that's it, and we've done it.
We've we've had this culmination. Now we're gonna move on
and tell new stories with new characters and new actors

(01:01:44):
and go from there.

Speaker 4 (01:01:45):
Yeah, I would hope you on for Patrick Stewart. He's
eighty five. But no, no, I don't disagree with a
lot of a lot of the stuff that he said.
I think to to his credit and to the way
he I think he's looking to do it properly.

Speaker 1 (01:02:07):
I don't think which.

Speaker 4 (01:02:08):
I think he's learned his mistakes, especially from this multiverse saga,
which some of the stuff I don't disagree. I don't
agree with him in terms of like the John with
the major stuff, but and I think maybe he's learned
from that mistake and then they just because they completely
pivoted and just didn't put a closure to that storyline

(01:02:32):
and they're just moving on to Doom. So yeah, I
think he's learned, and I think he's wanting a proper
sendoff for these characters, and I don't I don't disagree
with him. I think some I do think that Hugh
Jackman needs a proper send off and uh. Without with

(01:02:52):
that proper send off will come the next version of Logan.

Speaker 1 (01:02:57):
And yeah, I think he's correct in that aspect of it.

Speaker 3 (01:03:01):
I'm excited to see a new version of Wolverine.

Speaker 2 (01:03:03):
Like obviously, Hugh Jackman as Wolverine is a quintessential casting
and one of those legacy type castings that we may
never see quite like it again. But I do want
to move on to a new Wolverine and just have
a new wealth of stories we can tell with Wolverine
and the X Men and all that, and I imagine

(01:03:24):
they will be treated, as he referenced earlier, with the
Fantastic Four being a listers, I imagine we treat the
X Men as a listers when this new reboot reset
stage of the MCU once we enter it. Speaking of
doctor Doom in the pivot, you mentioned that, so I'll
jump to that really quick, he said quote. We had

(01:03:45):
started even before what had happened to the actor happened.
We had started to realize that Kang wasn't big enough,
wasn't Thanos, and that there was only one character that
could be that because he was in the comics for
decades and decades. Because of the Fox acquisition, we finally
had it and it was Doctor Doom. We so we
had started talking about Doctor Doom even before we officially

(01:04:08):
pivoted from Kang And in fact, I had started talking
with Robert Downey Jr. About this audacious idea before ant
Man three even came out. It was a long plan
that we had to take one of our greatest characters
and utilize one of our greatest actors. Now, you said
you disagreed with what Figi was saying, you would you

(01:04:28):
disagree with him on.

Speaker 1 (01:04:29):
I mean, I don't think the character needs to be big.
I mean, yeah, it helps to be theanos.

Speaker 4 (01:04:36):
But like Jonathan Majors, if you don't if I don't know,
if he's he remembers the time that he actually got
cast in and he debuted as as as King is
Jonathan Major Majors if not for Michael B. Jordan would
be the most hottest actor in Hollywood without without this,

(01:04:57):
you know, obviously, you know with the sexual assault scandal
and the abuse scandal that you know that is derailed
his career. But at the time, especially when Creed came out,
like you had two of the hottest actors in Hollywood
in one movie. You can't sit there and tell me

(01:05:19):
that that was a mistake and that like Kang.

Speaker 1 (01:05:24):
Okay, sure he's not.

Speaker 4 (01:05:25):
Bigger than Thanos, but King is pretty big in the comics,
and you have ties to the Fantastic Four, you have
ties to Doctor Doom. You have a lot of ties
with King the Conqueror.

Speaker 1 (01:05:36):
Like there was a with Kang.

Speaker 4 (01:05:38):
You could have pivoted so well into any direction you
wanted to go with and even introduce Doctor Doom towards
the end in Secret Wars. You could have still had King,
I mean still yes, still had King, and tell this
story with Doctor Doom. It makes no it's because of
what happened with him, and also the fact that whatever
you're doing with A Man three, which it was my

(01:06:01):
most anticipated movie a few years ago, would completely crap
the bad. It completely crapped the bad. And it's just
it's just because of what happened with that and what
would happen with Jonathan Majors and his girlfriend. That's exactly
why you've pivoted away from King. Don't tell me otherwise,

(01:06:22):
because Jonathan Majors is a fantastic actor, like one of
the best that we may have. Like this is like
you know, like you look back on careers and this
would maybe be the biggest fumble in the entirety of Hollywood,
one of the biggest fumbles. Jonathan Majors, whatever he was,

(01:06:42):
whatever he touched was great.

Speaker 2 (01:06:45):
He was on a heater in that and he was,
I mean, one of my favorite actors at the time.

Speaker 1 (01:06:50):
Yeah, nobody.

Speaker 4 (01:06:51):
I don't think anybody had a meteoric rise like Jonathan.
Like again, I think it was Michael B. Jordan and
Jonathan Majors two actors that had meteoritic me Yorck rises
in careers. And I just he just completely crapped the
bad He fumbled the bag hard, and I just ken't
I'm gonna I'm gonna call it. This is the one

(01:07:12):
of the few things that I completely vietnamely disagree with
and Kevin Figy. It's because of the sexual assault scandal
and also because of how badly A Man Three was perceived, produced, directed,
written in all that stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:07:28):
Yeah, I mean, I think they just fumbled the bag
with the character King, and I don't think they treated
him in a way that made him feel like Thanos,
because there's no reason why you couldn't have made him
on the level of the Thanos because He is such
a big character in the comics. There is a wealth
of stories with him, and I just think they misused

(01:07:49):
the character because you had a phenomenal actor again, Jonathan Major's.
When we got that casting, we were all excited for it.
I still remember when he pops up as he who
remains in Loki. I was like, Oh, this is Oh,
this is gonna be good, this is this is it.
And then they they fumbled it. They fumbled it. And
then on top of that, Jonathan Major's has the scandal,
does the the the the has the domestic violence scandal

(01:08:12):
and and is found guilty and all that, and you
have to move on from him at that point. So yeah,
I didn't love what he had to say about that.
I think that's kind of, I don't know, revisionist history.
If you will, maybe it's true, but I don't know.
It feels like revisionist history a little bit.

Speaker 4 (01:08:29):
And let me take that back. It wasn't sexual assault,
and I said that a couple of times. It was
just assault.

Speaker 1 (01:08:34):
It was battery. It was domestic violence. I'm sorry.

Speaker 4 (01:08:37):
But and the and the other thing is you one
singular act in ant Man three changes the entire uh
entire perception of King, an entire perception of this of
this saga is to kill off Scott Scott Uh to
kill yeah, no, not Hank, to kill off ant Man.
That's the one singular thing you can do. And him

(01:09:00):
escaping instead of you know him, and him escaping instead
of uh Scott. So it's just that one singular thing
could have changed the entire outlook of the series of
the saga, and King actually winning that would have changed
the entire thing. And then then you recast King if

(01:09:21):
you want to, and you move on, you finish the
saga like that's what you should have done. But him
being defeated and then him you know, I hundred percent
thought that Scott was gonna Scott Lang was going to
be trapped, uh trapped down there and not King. I
thought like it was going to be reversed. And then
then they just didn't do that, And I think that

(01:09:44):
mistake costs King his role in uh in the in
the saga.

Speaker 3 (01:09:51):
Well.

Speaker 2 (01:09:51):
And then once you have that impression of the character
with audiences, how is that going to be the big
bad Like that's not yes, you made him not feel
like a thing character. He should have won and there
should have been like Hank Pim should have not made
it out of that movie. Scott Lang should have been trapped,
like there should have been some game changing moments in

(01:10:14):
that movie, especially if it's being treated as the Phase
five opener. I did air quotes on that because it
doesn't feel like a Phase five opener. It doesn't feel
like anything. It just felt like a movie that happens,
and by the end of it, Scott Lang is still
Scott Lang. Like everything. Just it just felt like a
little side adventure that when you have your big bat

(01:10:37):
in it. It shouldn't have felt like a side adventure.
It should have felt like a critical point in the MCU.
And for him to not escape and just kind of
seemingly die, just that weakened the character so much, and
I think they they're still feeling the reverberations of that
for sure. We have a few other things before we

(01:10:58):
before we wrap up. I do want to get to uh,
let's see, where do you want to go next? Do
you want to go Blade?

Speaker 4 (01:11:06):
I I do have to wrap up with it a
little bit, but well, yeah we can. I can give
my thoughts on Blade, which I've always said, get get
your story correct, get your product correct. And then release it,
which Blade is taking a little bit longer than I
think anybody has expected. But yeah, I think I think

(01:11:28):
if marsh if you can keep on Marshall, I'll e
on it, which.

Speaker 1 (01:11:32):
Is a plus.

Speaker 4 (01:11:33):
You have a script that you like, then it's a plus.
The one thing that you cannot do is uh is
fumble and produce something terrible, and I think that is
gonna There's a lot of pressure on Marvel Studios to
get this to make this movie correctly. So they do

(01:11:55):
have a lot of pressure to get this movie correct
And I have no doubt that Marshall, Marshall Lawli is
gonna give a great performance.

Speaker 1 (01:12:07):
And I don't even know do they have a director?

Speaker 3 (01:12:12):
No, they still don't.

Speaker 4 (01:12:14):
Okay, So so that's gonna be an issue just a
little bit.

Speaker 1 (01:12:18):
And and the other problem here.

Speaker 4 (01:12:20):
Is is we kind of got a vampire movie with sinners. Yeah,
and you you've let I want to say, you let
Ryan Coogler, who you have doing Black Panthers, Black Panther movies,
and he wanted to do a vampire like it was

(01:12:43):
I I I I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:12:45):
I I bet you.

Speaker 4 (01:12:46):
Blade does restrict you from telling that story properly. Obviously,
I don't think you can make Blade like because because
of what you are, you're under Marvel and Disney. You
can't make Blade into Sinners. You you can't.

Speaker 1 (01:13:01):
But it's just.

Speaker 4 (01:13:01):
Funny that you had Ryan Coogler and you let not
let but he went off and did Sinners, and now
you have to release a vampire movie. Yeah, but yeah,
you have to get this right.

Speaker 2 (01:13:15):
So Kevin Faiggy, in regards to Blade, he said, quote,
there were well, he insinuated or stated that there were
four versions of Blade in the works, two of them
period ones, one of them set in the nineteen thirties.
Then he said, quote, we landed on modern day and
that's what we're focusing on. And then, in regards to

(01:13:38):
pausing Blade, after the exit of filmmakers Yon Demage and
Bossum Tariq fig said, we didn't want to simply just
put a leather outfit on him and have him start
killing vampires. It had to be unique. It fell into
the great. It fell into the time when we started
pulling back and saying only except insanely great, and it
wasn't insanely great at the time. He continued, We didn't

(01:14:02):
feel like, as we often do we can have a
good script and make it a great script through production.
We didn't feel confident that we could do that on Blade,
and we didn't want to do that to maherschela Ali
and didn't want to do that to us. We had
spent twelve years working on the Infinity saga saying there's
never going to that's never going to happen to us.

(01:14:24):
We always had more characters that people were asking about
than we could possibly make because we couldn't make because
we because we weren't going to make a movie a month.
That's crazy. Suddenly there's a mandate to make more, and
we go, well, we do have more, but maybe that's
what we fell into. And then, in regards to if

(01:14:44):
he regretted the hall h announcement of Blade, he said,
quote only in hindsight, I do, but I don't because
that's the way we'd announce everything before like that and
had not had not not.

Speaker 3 (01:14:57):
Delivered end quote.

Speaker 2 (01:14:58):
So there's settling on a modern day version and they're
trying to make sure everything's great and not just good.

Speaker 4 (01:15:06):
I mean, yeah, that's I mean, that's how you should
treat You should treat that every movie like you And
I know he took. I don't know if he took
offense to what James Gunn said, but he did fireback
saying like they don't they don't start filming a movie
before they have a script, which I don't think that's
what James Gunn necessarily meant. But no, I think James

(01:15:29):
Gun's more of the fact that you have to have
a full script ripped in on my table, we have
to review it, and then any revisions need to be made,
we do those revisions and then do it like I
don't but also like and I think, then this film
gets greenlit. I think I think that's what he meant,
And I think Kevin Faigy kind of maybe took.

Speaker 1 (01:15:49):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:15:49):
I think we all kind of took the initial comments differently.
But like like announcing a movie, green lighting a movie,
I think was is meant differently, I guess in both
DC and and Marvel. But but yeah, I I I
agree with I mean, it should be obvious that you
should have a good product before you, you know, release it,

(01:16:09):
but that's not been the case since post Endgame and
and and I've said this, and I'm going to reiterate
on it, Like I've said this a lot today, and
I'm glad they can look at look themselves in the mirror,
self criticized, and and try to fix this thing.

Speaker 3 (01:16:26):
Yeah, try to understand where they went wrong.

Speaker 1 (01:16:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:16:28):
And and I don't like fix this thing as in
like maybe make it more continuous and not like and
make make us care more. But like it's each if
you look at each individual project, like the majority of
them have been good like they have, They've been good
to great, And I just think that people are, you know,

(01:16:50):
expecting more from the studio and rightfully so you should
expect more from Marvel Studios than they what they've delivered.
But like in a that each product has not been
that bad.

Speaker 2 (01:17:03):
Yeah, No, I mean when going back to our comic
Pluza panel podcast panel, like looking back at those movies
that have been in the Multiverse Saga, most of those
movies I enjoyed doing my rewatch of I didn't like
Outside of a Man, Quantum Mania, and I'm not the
biggest proponent of thor Love and Thunder. Most of those
movies I still enjoyed for the most part, Like I

(01:17:25):
think it's it's fine. Most of the shows I've enjoyed
outside of Secret Invasion. I think that's the worst one,
but most of the stuff I've enjoyed. For the most part,
it's just dialing it back to make it on the
quality level that we've expected from from Marvel Studios. But
at the same time, I'm not expecting in game every time,

(01:17:47):
and I do wonder if some general audiences are expecting
in game level stuff and you're just not gonna get
that every time.

Speaker 4 (01:17:55):
Yeah, but I what I am expecting is these new
characters that you do get. I'm expecting some of them
to be Guardians of the Galaxy.

Speaker 1 (01:18:06):
Yes, like we just have.

Speaker 4 (01:18:07):
It like Thunderbolts maybe on that level and shang Chi,
but they're not. They're in they're in the same ballpark,
they're playing in the same league. Those two movies are
with Guardians, but they're not. You know, they're obviously not Guardians.
It's like, you know, Kevin Durant is Guardians of the
Galaxy and Alfred Shangoon is shang Chi. Like that's like

(01:18:28):
he's good, maybe an All Star, but he's not a
potential Hall of Famer. Like that is what we need
to that that's what you should be aspiring to is
like if you're going to experiment, and you're going to
introduce new characters, they have to be on some kind
of equal playing field with Guardians, the Guardians, Guardians of
the Galaxy, or even Hell Captain Marvel, like like Captain Marvel,

(01:18:53):
I don't like I think it is probably on the
more of an equal playing field like Chunk Chi and
and and Thunderbolts. But like you have to be like
at least close to that, and some of your new
projects have not been close to that. And like, and
I'm talking about TV shows too, Like they have to
be on the level of Loki. You have to give

(01:19:14):
me Loki or scarlet scarlet what's it called WandaVision or
don't give it to me at all, Like just yeah,
I don't need Echo, and I don't need I don't
need Secret Invasion, like I don't just don't need it,
and Moonnight to a certain extent, like like like if
they start strong, make sure they finish strong. Like it's

(01:19:35):
just that you knew you do need to go back
and look in the mirror in terms of that. But
most again, most projects have been in a vacuum, have
been decent to good.

Speaker 2 (01:19:45):
Yeah, no, definitely, and there's more here, but we got
to wrap up as we've recorded for a long time.
But yeah, maybe on the next issue we can get
into some of the stuff, but we'll also get into
Fantastic four because we'll have both seen it. I imagine
you're going to see it weekend or Thursday five.

Speaker 1 (01:20:01):
I'm gonna try Thursday night, okay, cool.

Speaker 3 (01:20:03):
I am going to see it probably Saturday.

Speaker 2 (01:20:07):
So we will have on issue six oh five a
full spoiler review a Fantastic four. Uh So, be on
the lookout for that next week because that's it for
today's issue of Comiccast. Thank you all for listening wherever
you are. We greatly appreciate it. As always, you can
follow us on social media. I'm at producer Mike nine
seven five and I'm at one Punch and rate, review, share,

(01:20:28):
or subscribe to this podcast on all your favorite podcast
platforms five stars.

Speaker 3 (01:20:32):
That'd be cool. We would really appreciate it, and we
will touch you guys next week.

Speaker 1 (01:20:35):
See it