Joyously Free!: A Methodist “All Inclusive” Pastor!

In this episode of Joyously Free!, host Jonie Lindenmeier talks with Pastor Dana Gill of Crescent City United Methodist Church about fostering truly inclusive and affirming faith spaces for the LGBTQ+ community. Pastor Gill shares her personal journey from rejection in a fundamentalist church to finding belonging in a progressive congregation, which inspired her own ministry. She discusses her church’s commitment as a reconciling congregation, offering safe spaces, support groups, and open communion to all, regardless of identity. Pastor Gill highlights the vital role of allies and advocates within faith communities and addresses misconceptions about LGBTQ+ inclusion by encouraging open, compassionate dialogue rooted in grace and understanding.

Host: Joanie Lindenmeyer; Producer: Joanie Lindenmeyer

Music is from freepd.com, in the public domain.

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The opinions expressed here are those of the individual participants. Curry Coast Community Radio takes no position on issues discussed in this program.

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Episode Transcript

(00:10):
Hi, and welcome KCIW
listeners at 100.7kciw.org,
beautiful Brookings, Oregon.
And syndicated listeners, welcome to you at k
z z h ninety six point seven FM
access humble Eureka, California.
This is joyously free radio with me, Joni
Lindenmeyer, the best selling author of none better,

(00:32):
an amazing love story. I'm so glad that
you are tuning in today. I'm a thirty
four year resident of Harbor, Oregon, a retired
Del Norte High School teacher after thirty five
years in Crescent City, and an author who
has published three books in two years, also
creating an audiobook in my own voice of
my memoir, None Better. I absolutely
love life, love being around people, and love

(00:55):
being the producer and host of this fabulous
inspiring show. So let's begin with our morning
salutation.
I will say, it's a brand new day.
And your response is, it's never been lived
before. So here we go. It's a brand
new day.
Woo hoo. Yep. It's never been lived before.

(01:16):
So this radio, radio show, as Will and
Viv named it, is a show that talks
about LGBTQ
stories and tips along with religion, church, faith,
spirituality,
and joy. Simply said, the purpose of the
show is to share, radiate, and spread abundant
joy and freedom. Hence, the title joyously free.
It's also the title of my second book

(01:36):
I coauthored with Elizabeth Ann Atkins of 2sisterswriting.com.
So in this radio broadcast, just as in
every day in my life, there's no hate
speech,
no hate behaviors, and no bullying. We will
blast it with the three c's of courage,
confidence, and collaboration.
Together, let's seek understanding.
Well, as with every show that we do,

(01:57):
I always start with a prayer. So let's
open our hearts as we ask our creator
to shine light on our community
and our world.
I excitedly believe in hope, in the power
of the divine, and that Jesus, God's spirit,
whatever name you put on a higher being,
is always with me and always with you.
So be not afraid or troubled,

(02:17):
saddened or depressed.
Joy and peace are an internal expression of
love and harmony that is already within us,
and we only have to reach deep within
and let it out because love is abundant
and everlasting.
So let's center ourselves.
Take a deep breath in with the good
and out with doubt.

(02:39):
Again,
breathe in through your nose with hope
and out from your mouth with any fears.
Last one.
Take a really big deep breath in with
joy
and out with worry or despair.
In the name of mother earth,
God a creator,
Jesus our redeemer, and the blowing winds of

(03:01):
the holy spirit, We say, good morning. Hi,
Jesus. Hi, God. Hi, Spirit. Thanks for being
with us on this beautiful day.
Well, today, I chose a reading from Jeremiah.
And I'm gonna read it first and then
I'll give you just a quick little reflection,
and maybe my guest will jump in and
give a quick reflection too.
Jeremiah thirty one ten and a little bit

(03:23):
of Isaiah thirty five four.
Hear the word of the lord, oh nations.
Declare it to the distant lands.
Behold, our savior will come.
You need no longer fear.
Oh, I love that.
Hear the word of the Lord, oh nations.
I think about the entire world, all of

(03:45):
the nations.
I think about the distant lands that we
don't even know about. Maybe they're not even
found yet.
And what about, yes, behold,
our savior will come, and it's days away
from Christmas, days away,
and you need not longer fear.
Oh, you know what? I think we're more

(04:06):
spiritual beings than we are human beings.
Oh, Dana, would you like to add anything
in there really quickly?
Oh, gosh. No. No. I need I I
need to have text in front of my
eyes to be able to reflect on it.
Alright. Well, everybody, you know that this is
our morning prayer. We're lifting up our friends
and our family. We ask our creator guidance

(04:27):
and healing today, and you've already heard our
wonderful
speaker's voice this morning. Let me introduce you
to
pastor Dana Gill. Yes. She is the pastor
of the Crescent City United Methodist of Church,
and I am just so glad that you're
here, Dana. And our topic today,
it's awesome. It's all about all inclusive church,

(04:49):
an all inclusive pastor, which you are. Thank
you for being here.
Oh, thank you. Thanks for having me. Oh
my gosh. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. And this
is what it's all about is all inclusivity.
And so I'm hoping Dana, can you jump
in and just say, how are you doing
today?
I you know, I'm doing alright. It's, we're

(05:09):
in the middle or the middle of our
busy season.
So I'm kind of in sprint mode, but,
you know, I am paused and I'm present,
and I'm here. Good for you. Good for
you. So there might be listeners out there,
Dana, that don't have a clue of who
you are, where you are, what you do.
Can you fill us in on a little
bit about you personally?

(05:32):
Okay. Sure.
I don't know how much depth and breadth
you're looking for, but I so I'm a
ordained elder in the United Methodist Church,
here in Northern California and Northern Nevada. That's
how our conference is broken up. Okay.
And
I, you know, I have two different graduate

(05:54):
degrees,
for ordination.
One, I have a master of arts in
ministry and then a master of divinity.
And I, you know, I came here to
Del Norte County,
because my bishop told me to because that's
the way the Methodist church works. Fantastic. Fantastic.
Where did you get your master's from?
So my master of arts in ministry is

(06:16):
from Drew Theological School in New Jersey, and
it's a Methodist
university.
And then my master of divinity, I got
from Austin Presbyterian
Seminary,
in Austin, Texas. Wow. Way cool. Way cool.
And did you live in any of those
areas, or did education take you to those
sites?

(06:36):
Oh, yeah. Well, I I lived on-site at
both locations.
Online school was not really a thing as
far as, like, universities go. I think that
really took off with the pandemic. So it
was all in person.
And, so I lived in New Jersey, and
then I lived in Austin, and then I
moved here. Wow. Very cool. And you're so
young. I think you're only, like, 25.

(07:00):
Thank you so much. No. I am 41.
Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. I would
not think that at all. Your energy is
galactic for one thing. Oh my gosh.
Yes. Yes. Believe it or not believe it
or not, I have more energy,
ten years ago.
Really?
Mhmm.
Yeah. I feel like I hit a wall

(07:21):
about, when I hit 35.
Oh, wow. Well, any reason why?
Well, yeah. I was exposed well, this is
a rabbit hole. I was, exposed to mold,
over a long period of time. And so
I had to I I deal with chronic
mold exposure and autoimmune diseases now. Oh my
gosh. Oh my gosh. So medically, it just

(07:44):
hits your body is what you're talking about.
Yeah. And it and it triggered multiple autoimmune
diseases to start like, my body just started
attacking itself. And now because of that, I
have,
you know, Hashimoto's and fibromyalgia
and, you know, other things going on. Mhmm.
Mhmm. I also have Hashimoto's.
I guess we have another thing in common.

(08:07):
Oh, boy. Oh, boy. So, you know, going
back to your masters,
Dana, why did you get the masters?
Well, I mean, they're required for ordination.
Mhmm.
But I suppose the the deeper question there
is, why did I seek ordination? Right? There
you go. Let's go for it.

(08:28):
So when I I I was raised in
a household with a lot of love,
and I'm very, very grateful for that. And
I wanna preface this story with I have
a wonderful relationship with my parents now. Mhmm.
And I grew up in a very fundamentalist
Christian household, like, cult of the Christian patriarchy.
My dad was the only one who had

(08:51):
any say in how we acted and what
we did. Right?
And I came out
as queer to my parents
when I was
12,
and I was met with
shame and don't talk about that. That's not,
like, it's not even something that we are
going to entertain.

(09:12):
Right?
And then I came out to them again
when I was 15,
and I was met with the same reaction.
This time, that time, it was a little
bit more dismissive. And then when I brought
my first
girlfriend home, it wasn't my first girlfriend, but
it was my first girlfriend that I brought
home. Mhmm.

(09:33):
My, I don't I didn't need to come
out to my parents anymore, but that was
still a struggle and an adjustment. Right? They
took it really personal. Mhmm.
And so I really I left the church,
because I had been har I had so
much harm had been caused,
by

(09:53):
the the ways in which told me that
I was not a complete person, that I
was not whole, that I was shameful, like,
all of the things that you hear from
churches about being queer. Mhmm.
And my perceived rejection of my parents
made me
seek out really
harmful

(10:14):
institutions
to try and liberate myself. And I made
a lot of really bad choices.
But then eventually,
I ended up coming
back to the church. I was living in
San Francisco,
at the time,
and found
a very progressive church in The Ocean Merced,

(10:37):
some it's the OMI District. I can't remember
what the I stands for. Mhmm.
Temple United Methodist Church. And
I don't know, you know, I don't know
what made me want to go back to
church. I I have a few ideas that
we don't need to get into, but I
I did go back to church.
And I don't know why I picked a
United Methodist church, but I did. And I'm

(10:57):
glad that I did in hindsight. Mhmm. And
I just kept coming back. They were lovely
and wonderful, and they didn't understand me and
some of the choices that I had made.
But they
continued to embrace me, and I grew with
them. And I realized, like,
you know, this is the kind of community
that church should be. Mhmm.

(11:17):
It was inclusive.
It was diverse.
It was accepting regard even if they didn't
agree with your lifestyle choices or whatever. Right?
Mhmm. It was a shame free, judgment free
church, and that was my first time ever
experiencing it. And so I decided,
I decided that I wanted to get ordained

(11:38):
and create communities like that to reach people
who had been so harmed,
moving forward.
Wow. What a calling. I call that a
calling.
Yeah. Yeah. And it sounds like you never
expected any of this.
Oh, no. If you had told me even
twenty years ago

(11:59):
that, you know, when on my 20 birthday
that I was gonna be an ordained
clergy person, I would have laughed in your
face.
Oh, wow.
Wow. Wow. And what did what did your
family say with this?
They you know? Well, my sister my my

(12:20):
sister is,
she goes between agnostic and atheist. Right?
But she didn't understand it and she was,
like, wow, is this another one of your
really bad decisions?
But as
it started to unfold, she was, like, no,
this is actually a really beautiful decision and
I support it.
My parents were just absolutely thrilled because

(12:41):
I had had I, like, I was living
unhoused in San Francisco. Mhmm.
And so when I got back into church
and got my life back on track,
they were just absolutely thrilled and it got
them back into church, actually. They now go
to church again. Wow. And they go to
a United Methodist church. They have
reconciled their souls and are no longer This

(13:04):
is huge, Dana.
You have so many factors here going on.
You have your parents' decisions in calling. You
have yours. You have your sisters. This is
absolutely huge that that all of this is
like a ripple effect.
Mhmm. Yeah. It's great.
Wow. And and now I got to I
got to be in Del Norte County and
create a safe space that's inclusive and welcoming,

(13:27):
you know, and really live into my calling.
Awesome. Awesome. Oh my god. And then talk
to me about your church community in Crescent
City. Where is it? What street is it
on? How did it how does somebody get
ahold of your church?
Oh, boy.
So we're in the middle of Crescent City.
Our parking lot is right across from the
police station.

(13:48):
So it's 664
H Street. It's the big cement gothic looking
church, I've been told.
Mhmm.
And
our best the best way to communicate with
us is either
if you look at our Facebook page or
our Google,
like, info page, the phone number on there
is actually my Google voice number. So people

(14:08):
are often surprised when they call that number
and they're like, oh, I wasn't expecting to
get the pastor.
But you can contact us through Facebook,
through,
phone or text or through email.
But we have our services on Sunday at
eleven. We're what's called a reconciling congregation. Oh,
what does that mean?

(14:29):
Yeah. So in the United Methodist Church, if
you are a reconciling congregation,
you're not just a welcoming and inclusive church.
You are actively committed to repairing
the community
is actually
committed to repairing the harm that is caused
to the queer community.
So we have
a safe space at our church every Friday

(14:51):
night where it's just a safe space for
the queer community to come together and be
who they are.
We're kind of in the middle of a
restructuring because we had some leadership changes.
We have a trans support group,
every other Saturday.
You know, I
yeah. We just have this ability to reach

(15:14):
out
to so many people who have been harmed
by being told that they were
not whole. Mhmm.
Or imperfect.
Yes. And and and I've been honored to
be there as a lesbian woman as well
as an author, as well as a friend
for these safe space gatherings.
The potlucks, the the camaraderie

(15:37):
is just phenomenal, and the healing that just
happens because you just get to be yourself.
And, I mean, we have a great music
program. You had our music director on on
your radio show a few weeks ago. And
Yes. David Sedgwick.
Yes. So it's it's a good church. It's
a joyful church.
There's a lot of celebration

(15:58):
that happens,
and a lot of community like, because I
believe that, community meals are some of the
best ways to get to know, to grow,
and to heal. Right? Yes. So we we
break bread together regularly, twice a month at
least, bare minimum.
And and you know what I also love
about your church, and please talk about it,

(16:19):
are the allies and the advocates. So if
a person is not anywhere on the LGBTQ
spectrum, your allies and advocates are so
right there with everybody.
Yeah. Oh, yeah. Well, that's part of what
it means to be a reconciling church is
it that doesn't mean that everyone in our
church,
identifies as, somewhere on the queer spectrum.

(16:40):
Right? Mhmm. It it means it means that
we have a lot of allies in our
church
that
know deep in their bones that,
they need to use
their straightness,
to help amplify the the needs,

(17:00):
of the queer community. Absolutely.
Absolutely. It's absolutely beautiful. I I I love
our church community. Like,
everyone's so wonderful there.
Right. Right. So as an ordained minister,
a queer ordained minister,
Dana, pastor Dana,
do you provide
same sex marriages? What are some of the
things that you provide

(17:21):
as this pastor, as this ordained minister?
Well, so,
as an ordained person, that allows me
to, perform the sacraments, which is communion and
baptism.
And then I can marry and bury folks.
Right? Those are the four main things Mhmm.
That
Beautiful. Elevate me. I'm I'm using air quotes,

(17:42):
but they elevate me above what other laypeople
can do.
Mhmm.
And yes, I do I I've performed same
sex marriages,
and there is no
like, someone can complain about it if they
want, but, you know, nothing will happen. Like,
I won't be have my title removed from
me,

(18:03):
which was not always the case in the
United Methodist Church. Mhmm. Mhmm.
But I also
one of my favorite parts about being a
queer ordained minister
is being able to offer the queer community
communion.
Because for a lot of people, especially from
the Catholic tradition,

(18:25):
they
are still, to this day, denied communion. Mhmm.
But if they come into my church, we
serve what's called an open table. So if
communion is something that's important to you,
I don't ask questions. I
gay, straight,
cis, trans,
purple, pink, I it doesn't matter. You're gonna

(18:45):
get communion if you want it. Mhmm.
And that's what I'm gonna do. To be
out.
They don't have to share that they're out
or not. Correct?
Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope.
I I don't ask questions like that because
we I move at the pace of grace
of someone else.
Everyone comes out in their own time. I'm
not about to out someone else because that's

(19:05):
one of the worst things in the world
is being outed when you're not ready.
Exactly. Exactly.
Yep. For sure. For sure. I so get
the communion thing. That is just vitally important.
I know for sacramentally,
when Carol and I and you never met
Carol, but we waited thirty nine years for
the Catholic church to marry us. It never
happened. So we became Episcopalian.
And, we're married by an Episcopal priest up

(19:26):
here, father Bernie from Saint Timothy's.
But that was a big, big thing, and
and I think that the marrying and the
bearing
is all inclusive
for those people on the LGBTQ spectrum. That
really nails it. The marrying and the bearing.
Awesome.
Yeah. Yep. Yep. And to me, those are
joyously free moments.

(19:47):
Yeah. We had actually our first
ever,
gay wedding at the church because our our
United Methodist rules
only recently shifted. And in all honesty, I
would have married them anyways
Mhmm. Even if it
even if it was a chargeable offense. Mhmm.
But we had our first gay wedding. And,

(20:08):
ma'am, it was standing room only in that
place. Oh my gosh. It was such a
wonderful celebration.
Oh
oh, how exciting. How exciting.
That's wonderful. And within the church, not on
the riverbanks, not on the ocean, but in
the actual church building.
Yep.
Yep. Oh my gosh. Big a big moment

(20:28):
for the queer community who are
dying
for faith Yes. Again.
Yes. Are are are you and your church
the only all inclusive church in Del Norte
County?
Well, the Saint Paul's Episcopal Church, is also
very welcoming.
I don't know what
their the denomination's

(20:48):
formal stance is. You might be able to
speak to it better.
But they they, like, they hold the Trans
Day of Remembrance,
but we we also partner on a pretty
regular basis.
Yeah. Cool. And and then how about other
churches that are non inclusive?
Are they,
antagonistic

(21:09):
towards you? Is there any,
ugliness going on there?
You know,
not not overtly. I can't say what happens
behind closed doors or, you know, what kind
of conversation.
They
I have been
personally threatened,
when I was hanging a rainbow flag during

(21:31):
June in front of the church once. Someone
parks their big dually truck and started saying
that I was an abomination and that I
was sinful and blah blah blah blah. Mhmm.
You know? But
as far as the other churches go,
I I I can't really speak to it.
They but they they've never we've never really

(21:52):
had a big history of working together Mhmm.
Mhmm. Within our different denominations in Del Norte.
Do you think that might happen if you're
a reconciling
reconciliation?
No. Because most of the they're not like,
I don't wanna speak ill of another faith
tradition and denomination, but so many of the
other denominations around here
are not

(22:15):
don't have the same stance as we do.
Right? Like, they're we have some trans folks
in our congregation
that have been told they're not even allowed
to step foot on the property of other
churches. Yeah.
How hateful. How discriminatory.
Mhmm. Yep. Oh, man. And, you know, and
my heart goes out. And I know you've
experienced,
some things too that they were trying to
shame you and guilt you from when you

(22:36):
were young and have had crazy experiences well
within the community there. That is that is
the naysayers the naysayers. You know, if if
you could and somebody came up to you
and said, you know, I don't agree with
you at all, pastor Dana, what would you
say to them?
I would ask them why. Like, what what
about their faith says

(22:58):
that,
being queer is a sin? Mhmm. You know?
So for me, it's more about getting curious.
Like, why do you think that? And then
if they bring up scripture, well, why is
that relevant? How like, how is that content
right? Because it doesn't the Bible doesn't talk
at all about homosexuality.
You know? And then you can pull up

(23:19):
the one Leviticus
reference.
But if you look at the context of
it, that's not really what it's talking about.
Mhmm.
You know, there's a few other instances that
people try and pull from. And,
you know, I just get curious about why
that's important to them. Mhmm. Mhmm. And I
think that's a really important fact right there
is that, you know, the Bible doesn't say

(23:40):
anything against homosexuality.
It doesn't bring it up, and a lot
of people think that it does. Do you
think those are the man made rules that
have come into different denominations and that's why
it's there?
Well, you know, we've always had this
not always, but, you know, for
even since we were writing Leviticus as humans,

(24:03):
you know,
we've had these ideas around
what
sex is and isn't and what it should
and shouldn't be.
And so it's just humans wrestling with
what
I don't know. Because so I'm I'm thinking
about I'm not making any sense. But what

(24:23):
I'm currently thinking about is the ways in
which
sex, when it's talked about in Leviticus and
any of the other
bible texts,
it's more about
power over and dominance over
someone. It's the man has dominance over Yeah.
Another entity. The power But how does nothing
yeah.

(24:43):
Yeah. You know? And so if you're gonna
lay with a man the way you do
with a woman, that's taking away a man's
manhood.
Mhmm. Not so how so for them. Right?
I don't actually believe that's true. But that's
why that that was written. And so I
don't know. Yeah. It's all about power and
control, and I just so I always get
curious. Why why is that important to you?

(25:03):
Well, I think what's important today is that
the listeners tuning in right now, they know
they can get ahold of you. They can
talk to you openly and honestly
and be,
celebrated
and be included in your your church, your
care, your safe space.
And so that that is phenomenal to me,
Dana. Phenomenal. And I'm so glad that that
God has called you to be ordained, to

(25:25):
be a queer minister,
and to help our community
as a whole. So I'm I'm just so
thankful that you came on the radio today.
Are there any final comments you'd like to
share? You've got about thirty seconds or less.
Oh, man. You know, thanks for having me.
And to anyone who is struggling with harm
caused by their faith, like, just know that

(25:47):
you are
whole and holy and wholly loved.
Beautiful. You will take work to undo the
harm that has been caused, but it can
be done. Yay. I like it. It can
be done. And hang around with Dana because
her positivity will get you going right there.
Oh my gosh. Oh, listeners, this has been
fabulous. Dana, you've been fabulous. Phenomenal.

(26:07):
High tens. High tens to you. I thank
you so much, and I hope all the
listeners have been in included and been inspired
and hopeful and everything. Let me give some
thank yous here. You know, it's the KCIW
team of Mike Gorse on the sound, Tom
Bozak, Candice, and Rose, everybody here at KCIW
one hundred point seven FM makes this happen.
I wanna give a shout out to two

(26:28):
of my sponsors to make this joyously free
radio happen.
Steve Van Cleave up in Alaska and Sally
and Todd Roy right here in local Brookings.
You know, I I just highly recommend that
everybody get a hold of Dana. And in
the meantime,
smile big, wear bright colors, and have a
great day.
Thank you.