February 27, 2025 • 42 mins
Jonah Babins sits down with Jonathan Levit to discuss his multifaceted career in the entertainment industry.
The post Magic and Mystery with Jonathan Levit appeared first on Discourse in Magic.
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Episode Transcript
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Jonah (00:00):
Hello my friends, and welcome to a brand new episode of Discourse in Magic.
(00:04):
My name is Jonah Bins, and in thisepisode we sit down with Jonathan Levitt.
Jonathan has an incredible careerin the entertainment industry from
acting to tv, hosting to magic, butyou might not know him from his show.
You might know him fromhis incredible stranger.
App and entire Stranger System, plussome new projects that he has that
(00:28):
you are going to really, really love.
So this was an incredible episode allabout all the things he's been up to,
including his Vegas show, creating Magic,being on tv, hosting, producing, as well
as his magic apps just for magicians.
You're gonna love thisepisode as much as I did here.
It is a wonderful episodewith the one and only.
(00:49):
Jonathan Levitt.
Hello my friends and welcome to a brandnew episode of Discourse in Magic.
My name is Jonah Bains and weare here with Jonathan Levitt.
Jonathan, how are you?
Hello.
Hello, I'm Grace.
Thanks for having me on on the show.
(01:09):
I am excited to have you.
To be honest.
I asked you to be on the show beforeI realized that I was gonna see you
at Maggi Fest and I got a chance tosee your show and and chat a bit so we
have some extra things to talk about.
Why don't we start at the very beginning.
How did you get started in magic?
How did Magic find you?
Oh wow.
My
Jonathan (01:27):
father was a magician.
He as a, I would say a semi-pro.
Yep.
You know, did magic as a young man andthroughout New York and Canada and, and
I, when I was eight years old, I foundsome of his magic props in the bottom
drawer of a dresser in our basement in St.
Louis, Missouri.
That's where I grew up.
Moved there when I was eightyears old, and rest is history.
I was very lucky to be in St. Louis,where there I was surrounded by amazing
(01:50):
magicians and my peers at that time, and.
I was there at the time of ChrisKenner and, and Chris Korn and Andrew
Golden Hirsch and, you know, we'reall contemporaries and, and that
was really a great time to be there.
And Harry Monty was a, a, a greatmentor for me and I met many, many
magicians out of St. Louis and itwas a wonderful time to be growing
up there and I learned a lot.
(02:11):
And that's it.
Jonah (02:12):
Yeah.
What a, I mean, amazing, amazingstart with amazing people to be
surrounded by, so that's fantastic.
Talk to me about like.
Did you know you're gonnabe serious about this?
Did you go to school for something else?
Like, when did this become real for you?
Jonathan (02:26):
It's a, you know what, this, this is interesting.
So I, I've been, you know,I started when I was eight.
So what, what is that?
45 years ago.
Started doing it, startedstreet performing when I was 12.
Been doing it my whole life.
Went to the college, started producingshows, always doing magic in some way.
Then I moved into, out of, outof college, went to Colorado,
Denver for about four years.
(02:47):
To a major software company.
During that time, I was stilldoing magic, but it was a
little bit on the back burner.
But I still found myself in thepapers, still found myself doing busker
festivals and performing and, and, youknow, here or there, but it was still
sort of on the back burner and then.
And, but I made some greatfriends there as well.
Great friends, Sean Pop and BradMontgomery and Brian Dino and, you
(03:10):
know, a longer list than that, but madegreat friends in, in Steve Spangler and
great friends in, in, in Colorado, butwasn't really doing a lot of magic, you
know, just sort of on the periphery.
And then I mo I made the decision to moveto Los Angeles to pursue my acting career.
And when I did that.
(03:30):
I got thrown into magic a bitmore, a lot more than ever before.
And, and I, you know, I have a, I'msure you know I have a history in magic
back then from, because I moved to LosAngeles and so magic became a much more
important part of my life, but it wasn't.
(03:51):
Probably wasn't, and and magicfound its way into all aspects of
my life, whether it's in front ofthe camera, behind the camera, live,
entertainment, all of it, consulting.
But I would say it was probably, I don'tknow, 10 ish, maybe a little more years
ago that I finally was able to bringmyself to say, when people say, what
(04:12):
do you do for me to say I'm a magician?
Jonah (2) (04:15):
Mm-hmm.
Jonathan (04:15):
Because I was always doing, and I still do so many different
things, wear many, many hats.
And I talk about those things,but still would have a hard time
saying the words, I'm a magician.
Jonah (04:28):
So a, around what age or period in your life did you become a magician?
You know, happy to, happy tosay that that's what you do.
Jonathan (04:36):
Well, I guess about 10 or 15 years ago is when I thought really
started to, to say that, you know?
Wow.
And so, yeah, it's a,that's a big deal for me.
Jonah (04:43):
Of course it is.
You know, and, and it's, it'sa scary thing to tell people.
Someone asks what you do.
Like, you know, a lot of the times,the reason why magicians do lots of
other things is because, you know, Iwas afraid to do this kind of thing
full time and, and to potentially saygoodbye to some of the other things.
I want to go throughsome of those bits, so.
Acting.
I was digging through your websiteand I found that you acted in it.
(05:05):
One of my favorite shows of alltime that lasted one season.
Flash Forward.
Love that.
Flash forward, love that show.
Yeah.
Talk to me about acting.
How, how'd you get into it andwas it something that you liked?
Like, I mean, I, I know that the realdifference in terms of, I. Getting work
in acting and magic is like night andday one is lining up with a bunch of
people that look just like you, hopingthat you get a job, and then magic
(05:27):
is kind of the exact opposite side.
Oftentimes you're not in competition with25 other people that are just like you.
People want you.
So talk to me about like how was acting
Jonathan (05:38):
for you?
Well, I mean, I, acting was good.
I mean, I, I moved out to Los Angelesto pursue an acting career and I feel
very fortunate in the career that Ihad and have, and, and that also moved
into, um, hosting, television hosting.
So I did have done quite a bitof television, ho television
hosting in my career as well.
(05:59):
So they're all, you know, being infront of the camera, sort of all related
in, in a, in different way, in, insimilar and in different ways, but.
As far as getting gigs, yeah.
It's a very different beast.
And, and you have to be verycommitted to it, you know?
I mean, it's, what can I tell you?
I mean, it's a, it's a, um, yeah,it, it is, it, you know, I don't
(06:21):
get to just say, oh, you know what,I think I wanna be on that show.
I think I'll go audition for that show.
I. You don't get to do that.
Even though people, your, your familyand friends that don't really know
the business will say, you know what?
You would be great on this show, X show.
You should do that one.
They're like, oh, thanks.
Yeah, sure, I'll, I'll go do that one.
But, you know, it is abouthaving representation.
It's about having relationshipsand building relationships.
(06:42):
You know, I've been, I was veryfortunate in my career to build some
wonderful relationships and, and those.
Relationships.
Most, mostly my, my acting jobs,not all of them, but many of them
came from relationships more thangoing in and sitting in a room and
auditioning, even though I either hadto go through audition process still,
(07:04):
but, but to get through to that, tobe able to get in the door to do that.
It's not always easy, so I don't knowwhat to tell you other than it's a,
it is a grind and, you know, I tendto not be a great client for, for
agents because I'm doing so much andtraveling and, and, and wearing many
other hats, which is not, does notnecessarily make you a great client.
(07:26):
For an agent, an agent isgenerally waiting for you to,
well, wanting you to just be thereand be available at all times.
And, and then we alsohave the business itself.
The business itself up in, in LA isa little upside down at the moment
and has gone through its, its issuesrecently with strikes and what have you.
So it's, it's a very difficultbusiness to be a part of right now.
(07:48):
For all, for everybodythat's in the business.
So, but it is fun.
I mean, I certainly enjoyed the work,you know, the work is the fun part.
Of course the work is the fun part,you know, going on set and, and doing
something as uh, is the, is the fun part.
Um, flash forward, I was fortunateto be the coroner on that show,
and that was great, great fun.
So I got to, you know,be around dead bodies.
Jonah (08:09):
Talk to me about the hosting on, on some tv, like you certainly
learn a lot about some skills thatreally translate into performing magic,
both for a camera and also just ingeneral managing different people.
What are some of the thingsthat you learned and took from
the hosting opportunities?
Jonathan (08:28):
Well, ho hosting is a, is is a skill.
There's no doubt.
It is.
There's a, there, it's a,there's a skill to that.
It's not easy for many peopleto do, but you get to learn
how to, well, it's interesting.
So as a host, very oftenI would, I would, um.
You know, I would interview peoplefor the, the shows I was on, you know,
(08:51):
it was Discovery channel, scienceChannel, biography Channel, et cetera.
I did do one magic based show calledCelebra Cadabra, which was on VH one.
Hmm.
Yeah.
But, but it was you.
I'm interviewing people, interviewinginteresting people, and for me, I'm
a conduit as a host, I'm a conduitfor the audience, kind of the
every man conduit for the audience.
(09:12):
And so you get to learn, youknow, there's 10, there's the
technical side of it, learning.
To deliver lines, learning to make your,you know, hit your mark, learning to
walk and talk, learning to interview.
These are, you know, it's all technicalstuff, but what was interesting, I always,
I would always do, Ima not often, butnot always, but often do a magic trick.
I. For the people I'm interviewingbefore going on, on camera, because
(09:36):
my job is to put them at ease.
The more they're at ease, themore they're gonna open up to me.
So I was always able to do that andthat, I think that was a, that was
something that I had that was beneficial.
You know, I would sit out, sitwith somebody before an interview.
Do a mag trick for them, and it would openthem up and give them, you know, make them
more comfortable in front of me, you know,in, in front of the camera talking to me.
(09:58):
So, but it was fun.
I mean, I got to learn quite a bitand, you know, you take that, you
take all of these skills to the stagewith you as a magician, you know, we,
people ask me what, what they shoulddo as a magician, as they're learning.
And I always say, take an improvclass, take an acting class.
Jonah (2) (10:13):
Mm-hmm.
You know,
Jonathan (10:14):
these are skills that are incredibly beneficial to.
To someone on stage as a magician and I,and in my lectures, my magic lectures,
I often talk about acting and talkabout how to handle yourself on stage
and how to be in the moment, and howto deal with gifts that are given to
you on stage rather than ignoring them.
And that all comes from the actingbackground and the improv background.
So that's a very valuable thing to do.
(10:35):
So, you know, and having theexperience in front of a camera.
Only helps you, you know?
And then if you're going to do a TVshow, which I've done quite a bit of
magic on tv when you, or you're in orconsulting, you've done that as well in
front of a camera, then, then that pastexperience simply helps that process.
You know, when I've worked with actorsconsulting for actors in TV and film,
(10:58):
I'm able to talk to 'em as a magician.
I'm able able to talk to 'em as anactor and, and help them in that regard
so that they can come to the role.
As an actor and yet to still domagic, and how do magicians behave?
How do they think?
How do they act?
How do they move?
How do their hands move?
You know, all of that isimportant knowledge to be
giving to an actor as well.
(11:19):
That's going to be playing, going tobe playing the part of an A magician.
Jonah (11:23):
Let, let's talk about that.
I know you've consulted ormagic for a bunch of films.
I think Burt Wonderstone was one of them.
What did that look like?
And in general, if there's other ones.
Other ones that I don't know about.
What is consulting magic ona film like that look like?
Jonathan (11:41):
Well, for Bert Wonderstone, I was on the film for about four months and
there there's the pre-production part.
Jim Steinmeyer took part to createthe magic for the script as it was,
and then I came on to be on set.
And so what that meant.
Was working with the actors in this case.
(12:02):
Mostly working with Jim Carreyand actually not so much, but
working with Steve Carell, SteveCemi, and Olivia Wilde primarily.
I've also Steve Krall's handsin the film for the most part.
Mm-hmm.
I didn't know that that's See him, whenyou see him doing magic, usually it's me.
And then so coming in, working withthe actors before we start shooting.
(12:23):
And getting them comfortable with themagic that's been built for the movie.
And then being on set while it's happeningand working with the director and watching
the, the camera and watching, you know,trying to watch for flashing and watch
for proper angles, but then also watchfor execution of the magic and working
with the actors on set doing that as well.
(12:45):
So it's, and then at times, comingup with magic on the spot because.
Something has come up, you know,and you have to make adjustments.
So it's, you're sort ofalways on, on your toes.
Aside
Jonah (12:57):
from, aside from the hands, is there anything specific in that film, the
Witch is like a moment or something thatwas really memorable to you that you,
you know, look fondly on when you seethe movie or when people talk about it?
Jonathan (13:10):
Boy, it was a, that was a great experience.
It was, overall, it was areally great experience.
Working.
You know, Steve, well, all of them.
Steve K Crow, and Steve Chemi,the nicest people on the planet.
They were, they were veryinteresting to work with.
Olivia was great.
I mean, it was, it was, canI tell you specific example?
You know what I, I can'ttell you specifics right now.
(13:31):
That's a long time ago.
But what was interesting is when I wasdoing Steve k Crow's hands, we would
sometimes do it as digital inserts,sometimes do it as physical inserts.
Sometimes you'd see this.
There's actually one great scene.
Wow.
And Alan Arkin too.
Oh my gosh.
Alan Arkin.
But there's one great scene where yousee, actually, I will tell you a good
(13:55):
story, but there's one great, there'sone scene where you see Steve's hands
in the sh You know Steve in the shot I.And my ha I'm off out of frame, sticking
my hands up into the frame as his hands.
It's very funny, if you go back andwatch the movie, it's the, it's,
it's where he and Aan Arkin aredoing are in the old folks home and
working with the billiard balls.
Um, here's a story that I love andhas nothing to do with my doing
(14:19):
magic, but Alan Arkin is on stage.
And he's playing the, the youngerversion of himself on stage, doing
a kind of an infomercial on tv.
And we're in a theater and I'm in,I'm, you know, I'm in the audience
behind the director and we'rewatching, watching this play out.
And Alan Arkin does this thing where he,he's shaking his hand on stage and then.
(14:44):
Bam and egg appears in his hand andthat's going to be happening in post.
They put the egg in, in post, theyput the in his hand and we're shaking.
He's shaking his hand, shaking hishand, and then bam, that egg appears.
And I said to him, to Alan Harkin,I said, you know, a magician
would never act like that, wouldnever move their hands like that.
(15:06):
And he said to me, yes,but my way is funnier.
And then you watch the film.
And you realize.
His way is funnier.
So much better.
Lesson learned.
Thank you.
I do not, do not give notes to Alan Orkin.
It was, it was great.
Jonah (15:23):
That is awesome.
So, you know, right now, roughly in thetimeline, like you always did some magic.
You went and did some acting in LA I,I assume, in and around then is when
the consulting started to happen.
What sort of.
Magic were you doing, when you were doinggigs, were you doing corporate stuff?
(15:45):
Were you doing colleges?
Were you doing, what was the bulkof the magic that you were doing?
Oh,
Jonathan (15:52):
just pri private parties in, in around town, some travel, some
corporate working, the Magic Castle.
You know, kind of, kind of all of it.
Really kind of all that.
Yeah, I mean, I, I just sort of acrossthe board, just a journeyman magician,
you know, I. Yeah, like anybody else,
Jonah (16:09):
little bit of everything right now.
You have a show that happensat the Venetian in Las Vegas.
I wanna hear a bit about the show,but also I'm curious about, I.
How it came to be, you know,a lot of magicians dream of
having that sort of thing.
How did you know, like you werejoking earlier about people telling
(16:31):
the actor, oh, you should be in this,you know how many magicians have
heard, oh, you should go to Vegas.
Oh, you should be in Vegas.
Right.
How did, first of all,how did that come to be?
And then tell me a bitmore about the show itself.
Sure.
Well,
Jonathan (16:42):
Benjamin Schrader, my partner on this, had a, he had a show in,
in Encino, California Magic Bar showthat he created and he was bringing
magicians into work in that venue.
And it was very intimate.
16 people at a time, you know,very intimate setting and.
(17:04):
Then when, when Covid hit that sort ofshut down and two other producing partners
that are now on our team came on to, tosay, we wanna do something with that show.
And then Ben and I startedworking together on this as well.
So now the, you know, our core teamis together producing the show and.
Then we, you know, we, we were able to,we did a two week run in New York City
(17:30):
where we built a theater out and, and didthe show there, and did in a couple other
places, sort of as proof of concepts.
And then, and then theopportunity for Vegas arose.
And we, we were able to, to jump on that.
So we're at the Venetia now.
And it's going great.
I, as a co-creator of the show withBenjamin Schrader, we mounted the
(17:51):
show for a couple of months and thennow we have other people in the show.
I. And we're here back here in labut the show's running and going.
Well, I'll actually go out there inApril for a weekend, I think April
10th through the 13th to fill in for aweek for a weekend, which will be fun.
But yeah, the show's going great.
Marketing's kicking off and, or notkicking off, but continuing on and, uh,
(18:12):
response has been very positive to it.
And it's, it's a good fun.
And it's, the show itself is.
Intimate show of two people behind abar, the magician and a host bartender.
It's their interaction and it's atheatrical presentation of magic.
It's not just any magician gettingbehind a bar and doing 70 minutes
of their, of their material.
(18:32):
It's really a structured showwith the two people behind the
bar and their banter and theirrelationship, and that's very intimate.
We put about eight.
Or 10 people at the bar itself, and theneverybody else is raked behind them.
How many people total capout the seating at about 45?
And it's a great intimate experience.
It's really, really fun.
Jonah (18:54):
And so, you know, the fact that it's a theatrical show means that
you don't just fill in any magician.
Do you have a roster?
How does, how does it work?
Do you have two people that go in and out?
Is it one person for nowuntil they get replaced?
How?
How does that work?
Jonathan (19:09):
We have, we have, we, right now it's, we have our set cast, right?
Our two people that are there,but uh, with other people that
we're keeping an eye on, but.
As we're, if we need to fill in or,you know, do anything down the road.
But right now we're, we're veryhappy with our current cast.
John Ricardo is playing the partof the magician and playing the
(19:33):
part because he is a magician.
Mm-hmm.
And, and a, and a great one.
And then Zachary Petite is doing our hostbartender role, and he's amazing as well.
So the two of them haveincredible chemistry.
It's a great show if anybody'sinterested in seeing the show again,
it is at the Venetian, it's called.
Legger de Domain, L-E-G-E-R-D-E-M-A-I-N,and you can find it out at, if you look
(19:55):
up 1923 live, I believe it's 1923 lv.com.
It's, that's the venue thatwe're in at the Venetian and.
You
Jonah (20:04):
know, from what I understand, like Vegas is a tough place to
produce a show 'cause there's somuch competition and so many big
names to go see when you're there.
Sure.
What have you learned about trying toproduce a show where it's going well?
People are coming to it ina city like that, it is not
Jonathan (20:23):
easy there, that's for sure.
There's a, I forget the number,but the number of available seats.
Throughout Vegas on anynight is beyond imagination.
Yeah.
So you are competing with all of that, youknow, you're competing with all of that.
I think we're lucky to be inan intimate setting like this.
I think some of the shift is happeningwhere people are more interested or, or
(20:44):
interested in these smaller, more intimateshows versus the, the larger scale shows.
And it's a little bit easierto manage, but it is, it, you
know, there's a lot to it.
There's a, you know, the marketing,the, you know, we just recently.
Ended up on taxi cabs, you know,now we're on the, the tops of taxi
cabs and those kind of things.
So it's, there's a lot to it.
We're very fortunate to havesome great marketing teams and
(21:04):
great partners out in, in Vegas.
Our other producing partnerswe have, we're with Spy
Entertainment out there as well.
So.
Cool.
They're, they're terrific.
And so we're very, very lucky to bepartnered with and with the folks that are
there, that are entrenched in, in Vegas,that know Vegas and know how to do this.
So we're, we have a good team.
And how often does the show run?
(21:25):
It's Thursday through Sundaywith Possibility event
and, and Wednesday as well.
Cool.
And and one show a night.
One show a night, except for when thereare two shows a night on the weekends.
Cool.
Got it.
Jonah (21:37):
Yeah.
Jonathan (21:37):
That's really exciting.
Congratulations.
How long have you been there?
I. Thanks.
Uh, we opened up lastsummer and it's going great.
Cool.
And we continue to keep going strong.
And, you know, the show is strong.
The magic's strong.
It's, it's very funny and engagingand the response has been incredibly
Jonah (21:53):
positive.
And is the magician doing themagic that you designed or are
they doing parts of their act?
Jonathan (21:59):
Both.
Both.
So the magic that they, that they'rebringing to the table, that is
not something that I've designed.
It has been vetted and directed.
By us to fit the, the mold of the showand the style and the tone of the show.
Yeah.
But, but we do, you know, give themsome, some flexibility to be able to
bring in their own style to that sowe're not handcuffing them, but, but
(22:22):
it, but it, but it is curated for sure.
Cool.
Jonah (22:25):
Well maybe the people around Vegas know you for that show, but The Magicians
know you for some other project and I'dlove to hear a little more about them
starting with sort of, I think the mostpopular, which is The Stranger, you know?
It is a, it's an amazing trick andalso sort of a community of people
(22:47):
that are, are helping each other.
Can you give some background on like.
First of all, what is itfor anyone who doesn't know?
And then like, how did this come to be?
Because Sure.
It's a really unique, you know, it'ssuch a mixture of a magic trick, but
also a, you know, software, but also,you know, a people helping each other.
(23:08):
So how, how did this trickthe stranger come to be?
What is it and, and how does it all work?
Sure, and our audience are, are
Jonathan (23:15):
magicians
Jonah (23:15):
only.
This is just magicians.
If a lay person's listening tothis, they're outta their mind.
Jonathan (23:19):
Okay, well the stranger phone call is it it for me?
It's one of the greatest tricksI've ever done in my career.
You know, I get, I basically,I generally finish.
Every show with it.
That's my finale.
I get 12 to 14 minutesof it out of it on stage.
And the reactions are incredible.
And what it is, is it's basically the,the wizard phone call on steroids.
(23:43):
Right.
But, but built in sucha way as a phone app.
I. To give you, to be thinking about, I,I think about you as a performer, right?
So as a person that's having, usingthis as a performer, 'cause I'm a
performer, so all the little nuancesthat you need to make it believable.
So it's very powerful, this thing.
And, you know, you can reveal aplain card, you know, if you wanna
(24:05):
do that, but there's other ways toreveal other information as well.
But it started, you know, I,my background's in software
and software development and soit's, and software should be.
Used to make somethingmore efficient mm-hmm.
To make your process more efficient and inmagic to enhance the impact of an effect.
(24:25):
And I started, you know, wewere doing this to give a quick
history lesson on this, please.
But we started this, there were, it goes,it goes back, Romanos was, was doing a,
a, a way of, of using your phone to makea phone call, seemingly to somebody.
It's a stranger that you didn't know, but.
(24:48):
But was really calling your friend, right?
Yeah.
But then you had to communicate theinformation of the card or force
a card if you were doing a plaincard reveal, that kind of thing.
But it was, it was fun.
And a group of us were, and PeterTurner had a, you know, I think, I
think Peter came around, it was doing itbefore Romanos actually showed Romano.
So I, I'm pretty sure that'sthe right history of this.
But, and I talk, I talkextensively about this history.
(25:09):
In my vanishing masterclass thatcame out this last year as well.
And so it was, you know, it was funand a group of us were doing it.
Robert Ramirez had kind of brought it toa, a small group of people 'cause he had
learned it from, from someone who learnedit from Romanos and, you know, so we were
all kind of doing it and I thought, youknow what, this really should be an app.
(25:31):
It's much more.
We should be able tostreamline this process.
So I decided I was going to startto work on creating an app for it.
At which point when I was doing that,Mark Stein, who has a great app called
Diverter, which does a similar typeof thing where it sends a, allows you
to call somebody else, reached out tome and said, Hey, I think I, you know,
I'm doing this kind of thing already,which I had not heard of diverter at
(25:53):
the time, but we, we talked about it,agreed that it was independent thinking
and, and that both moved forward.
And so I started to really workon this, this app in that way.
So, and I did, and I just started tobecome more and more and, and what came
out of it, the, the technology is solidand really well built, and there's so
(26:14):
much in the app itself that that is, areconvincers that just make it believable.
But in addition to that, what cameout of it was a community, and this
is what I'm perhaps most proud of,is this worldwide community of.
Strangers that have become friendsthat are all helping each other.
So we have, you know, we haveWhatsApp groups in different parts
(26:35):
of the world where you go in andyou say, Hey, I need some help.
And people start responding.
I can help you.
I can help you.
It's tremendous.
So we actually have a community of peoplearound the world helping each other.
And I don't, the the is
Jonah (26:48):
saying like, Hey, I need someone to pretend to be a random person.
Yeah.
At 1130 tonight when I'm doing my show.
Jonathan (26:55):
E. Exactly, and, and what you'll find is many magicians say that
they have more fun being the stranger.
Than the magician.
So, and then we get together forstranger photo photos at, at conventions
and it's really become a communityand, and I'm very proud of that.
And, and it's a very vibrant
Jonah (27:13):
group of people.
Not to like get too deep into it,but just to like comprehend what it
is, which is that there is a way tocleverly encode the information to the
person who you are calling so that theyknow what it is to reveal and that.
Ostensibly, you don't have toforce the thing, you just, yeah.
It's have to pass theinformation off to them.
Jonathan (27:34):
Yeah, preselection, the app does all the work for you.
And so by the time you make thephone call, you're just having
a conversation and at that pointit becomes an acting exercise.
Wow.
And the believability factor is, is there.
And so it, it's really, it, it's themost fun you'll ever have doing magic.
It's like a drug, you know?
And, and there are magiciansthat have held off from doing it.
(27:57):
And then when they finally do it,once they, oh my God, I. I now
see what you're talking about,you know, and it's so much fun.
Basically for me, a lot oftimes I'm doing my show.
Just so I can get to this, youknow, I'll, I'll do all the other
stuff just so I can get to this.
And it's the most memorable thing anybodyhas, you know, the most magicians,
you know, if you ask a lay audienceafter a show, what did you just see?
(28:19):
For the most part, they'll say,they'll forget what they saw.
They won't be able to rememberwhat they actually saw on the show.
This trick I've had people a year latercome up to me and before they even
say hello, they go that phone trick.
You know, they, it's the thing theyremember and, and this, this is,
this is the trick that closes deals.
I've been, I've been with people that,you know, they like, I'm doing business
(28:41):
deals and I do this, and you're done.
You know, that's all you
Jonah (2) (28:44):
need.
Jonathan (28:44):
So it's the most, it's just the
Jonah (28:45):
most fun.
I. Awesome.
Yeah.
What an awesome thing you created.
You know, I've seen so manymagicians doing it and using it
and, and loving it and loving, youknow, being able to work together
and, and have fun with each other.
So,
Jonathan (28:57):
yeah, I, I've made, I've made great, I've made great friends from
this, you know, people, I mean, I, I amproud to say that I have friends all over
the world that have come out of this.
Project and, and I'm very proudof that and humbled by it as well.
And you have another project,
Jonah (29:12):
which was I, I guess once called the Stranger System, but is now evolved
into something greater called Nexus.
What is that?
That's this
Jonathan (29:24):
is, this blows the doors wide open.
This allows you to takedata in 'cause what?
And, and send it out, right?
It becomes your digital hub forother apps and devices, for other
ways to input for other information.
So it is your, yourhub to create routines.
(29:45):
It's your, it's your place to createroutines and, and run your show.
So, for instance, I can take.
And we take data in, ina variety of ways, right?
We take it in throughinput on your phone itself.
We take it in through other appsthat send information to Nexus.
We, we have one of the most advancedlistening technologies in magic today.
(30:06):
So it will listen throughyour phone or your watch.
It will listen for zip codes and,and lotto numbers and serial numbers
on bills and phrases and words,and, and do calculations for you.
And all of this could be done through.
Your voice, so in a very effortlessway without ever touching your phone.
You can take information inand then send it out somewhere.
(30:30):
You can send it through an AI enginewithin the app as well, you know, so
all of this is possible to create uniqueroutines that you may not have been able
to create before, and then use those.
Through what we call pathways in Nexusthat allow you to construct routines
and be able to select them easily, youcan select them through the built-in
(30:50):
remote control that comes with Nexus.
You can, you can, you can, you know, getthem, you can execute those pathways by.
Selecting them or auto advancing throughthem so you can automate your show.
So for instance, the show thatI just did at MGI Fest, you
mentioned we were just at MGI Fest.
Mm-hmm.
I used Nexus in my show on stageduring the hour, five different times.
(31:10):
Wow.
And that allowed me to create wholly newroutines that were seamless, effortless,
without seemingly using any technologyfrom the audience's perspective,
and then ending with a phone callthrough the Stranger phone call app.
I. But not doing a plain card reveal,but in this case using a lumen
impression pad to be able to senda drawing over to my stranger and
(31:36):
have a drawing duplication on stage.
Through a video FaceTime call wherethe drawing that the stranger just
drew on that call matched the drawingthat was made by the person on stage,
and the result is just stupendous.
So Nexus is your hub.
To create routines you've neverbeen able to create before and to be
(31:57):
completely creative and, and applywhat I like to consider or think of as
non-linear creativity, creating routinesthat are not A to B and and are more
complex and unique and interesting.
I.
Jonah (32:10):
I know that sort of the whole point of it is to be creative, but can
you give us a couple of examples of thingsthat one might do or that like outta the
box, you know, without ordering a bunchof impression pads or whatever Sure.
That they could do.
Sure.
Jonathan (32:25):
You know, that's a good question.
You know, the people haveasked, well, what can I do if
I don't have the glyph printer?
If I don't have hydro Instagram,if I don't have a Lumin impression
pad, if I don't have a mind busterimpression pad, if I don't have, if
I, if I don't have some of these otherapps and devices, what can I do if I
don't have products from Ben k Smith?
The, and the, the answer is thatthere's, there's things you could
(32:45):
do built in for inputting, and theninstead of outputting what, and again,
if you have a stranger phone call,you can always go to a phone call.
But if you.
Don't have that.
What can you do just with Nexus?
And the answer is you become the output.
So information that comes in.
Can then be transferred to your knowledge.
So let's say pi revelations, youknow, is a, is a good example of that.
(33:09):
Yep.
From, from David Penn, I can take a numberin, whether it's through listening mode
or through inputting on my phone, andinstead of sending it anywhere for the PI
revelation, I can send it to my own peak.
On my own phone, which is agiant peak screen, and now
I can have that information.
I can go through the AI engine.
So that what, I did this on stageactually at Magi Fest, right?
(33:30):
Where I, I asked somebody just talk to theaudience and say, give me a, a birthday.
I. They tell me birthday now we have abirthday mode in our listening module
that listens specifically to theconversation and extracts the birthday.
And so we take that birthday, Itook it through my AI engine to find
a celebrity that was born on thatbirthday, and in this case, I send
it off to Instagram via Hydra, whichis an amazing app from Shamir, Salim,
(33:54):
and, and, and put it in my bio.
That said, and this is a nonlinear.
Approach to this.
You say a birthday and you go to mybio on Instagram and instantly it
says, I thought you would say MichaelJordan, and when somebody looks up
Michael Jordan's birthday, there it is.
And I've done nothing on stage.
I simply have.
And that wasn't someoneoff stage inputting it.
(34:15):
That was it.
Listening and knowing that was listening.
That's right.
You saw the show.
Yeah.
So what was happening was at that moment.
The person on, uh, in the audience saidtheir, the birthday, my watch, heard the
birthday, and then immediately sent itoff to Hydra through the AI engine in
Nexus and converted that to a celebrity.
Sent that to Hydra andput it on Instagram.
(34:37):
I had them search their phoneon, in the audience on Instagram.
It said it, and that was it,and I didn't have to do a thing.
Wow.
It just happened automatically.
But if I didn't want to go toInstagram, I could go to my peak on my
screen and know immediately who that.
Celebrity was, right?
So you become the output, youbecome this, you, you become.
(34:57):
You have all of this informationat your fingertips and you're
able to recount that information.
You know, you give me a zip codeand I'll tell you what city it's in,
and that information goes throughthe AI engine and we're done.
I also use it for book tests.
You notice there, I did twobook tests in that show.
One with a book that's published by.
But my wife and I have a publishingcompany, and I did it again using
(35:19):
Particle system from Joshua Jsince he lectured on it that day.
And I was able to have someone inthe audience open up those books,
go to any page, tell me the pagenumber they're on, and I was able
to reveal the word on that page.
And that's all built into Nexus.
Anybody can create those, thosecribs as we call them, through auto
(35:40):
crib for any book off their shelf.
Easily.
So you can create a book test forany book to, you don't have to
find like an ebook version of it.
You just submitted the book itself.
No, no.
I just created a crib.
It took me, it takes me about fiveto 10 minutes to create a crib
for any book off my bookshelf.
And at that point it's in in Nexusand I can use it at any time.
And all I have to do is say thepage number and I know the word.
(36:03):
Wow.
Well this
Jonah (36:05):
is a beast of a project.
This is very exciting.
Yeah.
This is coming out at Blackpool.
Jonathan (36:10):
Yes.
Cool.
It gets, it gets releasedat Blackpool officially.
It'll release to Blackpool and it is.
It, it, it will change theway that you create routines
and it comes with the remote.
What's the remote for?
The remote will allow you to inputinformation in without touching your
phone or relying on another app or device.
It also will allow you to, toselect and execute pathways.
(36:33):
So let's say I've got my top.
10 pathways that I like to, routinesthat I like to perform, you know, in
zip code to city, to Instagram, or topeak or book test for this one book.
And I wanna know the word, any of theseroutines and I can simply on my remote,
select the routine number and go.
(36:54):
And then based on what that pathwayneeds for input, whether it's number
or playing card or words or what haveyou, the remote will change to that.
Input profile automatically.
So it's just your way of controllingyour show and executing pathways.
You know, I was at a, I, this was great.
I was, I was at the car dealershipyesterday and I wanted to, I was talking
(37:17):
with the, the advisor there to take inmy car and I needed, I needed a loaner.
And they said, well, we'll have to seeif any are available, what have you.
So we sat down and he said, hewas talking about the weather.
He and I said, yeah,I just came from Ohio.
It's freezing there.
And he said, what are you doing in Ohio?
And I told him, I'm a magician.
I was out performing at a magicconvention and, and then he said,
well, can you do anything for me?
(37:37):
Well, I really didn't haveanything on me, but I went to my
everyday carry my EDC, which was,Hey, gimme a tell me a birthday.
Check your Instagram and therewas the celebrity, we were done.
That was it.
That's all that it took place.
I said, well, just gimme yourbirthday and open up your phone.
Go to Instagram.
And wow.
That was like, no, you'renot using your hands at all.
It's just no, it's like nothing.
(37:59):
It's a nothing.
I just, you're done.
You could either input that birthdayon the remote or in this case you
could use the the wrist to, to listenon the watch or listen on the phone.
Any of those are possible, but none ofthem have the appearance of using any
technology or doing anything, and hesimply goes to his Instagram and it's.
Done and there's kind of nothing better.
It was the fastest way to get Yeah.
(38:19):
I
Jonah (38:19):
mean, it's like a magic trick without any of the slights or Yeah.
Uh, you know, it just happens.
Jonathan (38:24):
It just happens.
And that's the thing with Nexus,the miracles just happen over and
over again, and it's just so easy.
I. Love it.
Streamlined.
Well,
Jonah (38:32):
congrats on the project.
Very excited for its for its release.
As we are nearing the end ofthe podcast, there's a bunch of
questions that we ask each person.
The first is the endless chain.
So in order to keep the podcast goingon for eternity, each guest is asked
to recommend another guest that wouldbe perfect for this kind of thing.
Oh.
With the exceptions being A, I cannothave had interviewed him already, which
(38:56):
is really difficult, and B, that youhave to be able to put us in contact.
You can't just name thecraziest name you can think of.
So who is a person who youthink would be a really good fit
for this kind of conversation?
Jonathan (39:06):
Wow.
Okay.
Christopher
Jonah (39:07):
Hart.
That's great.
Gimme a great interview for you.
Good.
That's really fantastic.
Thank you for that.
The next one is about modern magic,like what's one thing you like
about the world of magic rightnow and one thing you don't like?
Ah.
Jonathan (39:21):
One thing I like is the accessibility of magic to a
wider range, a wider audience.
One thing I don't like is theaccessibility of magic to a wider
audience where I'm more on the fence,I'm, I'm more on the side of loving
it, but also recognizing that thathas opened up avenues for exposure.
(39:43):
It's also opened up the need formagicians to go back to their roots.
Right now there's less reading in magic.
There's less, less understandingof performance and how to present
magic and that kind of thinking.
But the trade off is that more peopleare able to access magic and more
(40:08):
people are able to access magic andbe exposed to a wider range of magic.
And we're also able to get to amore diverse grouping of magicians.
We're able to see more women in magic,more girls in magic, which is fantastic.
And Leo Orleans is actually puttingon a conference called Mystify.
Mm-hmm.
She's someone else you should interviewis Leo Orleans, if you haven't already.
(40:30):
Who's doing a wonderful job with agreat team to present a new convention
that's focused on women and magic.
It's Fanta, it's great.
So these are, these are all the positives.
It's, it's really wonderful.
Jonah (40:43):
Love it and how, how interesting that the best part of magic right now
is also the, the most challenging too.
Yeah, and I can certainlyresonate with that.
The last question is sort of aboutwhat we just talked about overall.
You know, people are gonna belistening to this episode and there
was a lot of information and adviceand things for people to learn.
What do you think is the most importanttakeaway from this conversation?
(41:04):
Like what do you hope thatpeople take home with them?
Jonathan (41:07):
Be creative.
Try new things, nonlinear creativity.
Try to create routines that are,are interesting for an audience and,
and surprising for our audience.
I hope they take that away from it.
Try and dare to try new things.
Don't, don't be afraid.
Take leaps and chances and,and perform as much as you can.
Jonah (41:29):
I love it.
Those are fantastic tips.
Jonathan.
Where can people find you and where canpeople find things like the Stranger
and Nexus and any of your projects?
Jonathan (41:37):
You know what?
You can find out aboutme@jonathanlevitt.com,
J-O-N-A-T-H-A-N-L-E-V-I t.com.
You can also find my my store sitefor some more information on this
kind of stuff@twistingtheaces.com.
Twisting vas.com.
But other than that, find me online.
I'm on Facebook and, and Instagram, uh,the typical handles, but I'm, I'm around.
(42:02):
I'm around.
Awesome.
Jonah (42:04):
Well, Jonathan, thank you so much for doing this.
Thanks for the great time at MagiFest and, and for being here and,
and giving us a, a great interview.
So appreciate the time.
Thank you so much, and of course,big thank you to everybody at
home to listen and tuning in.
Appreciate it and we'llsee you all next Thursday.
Thanks.
(42:30):
Well, there you have it.
I hope you liked the episode, and I hopeof course, that you learn something.
Make sure to follow Jonathan on socialsand if you liked the episode, if
something in here resonated with you,then tell a friend about the podcast.
Podcasts are kind of clunky,they're hard to grow.
They don't, you know, come up onYouTube or anything like that.
So if you think someone needs toknow about the Discourse in Magic
(42:52):
podcast, then please spread the word.
Thanks so much for being here,and I'll see you next Thursday.
Ciao.
Hello my friends, and welcome to a brand new episode of Discourse in Magic.
(00:04):
My name is Jonah Bins, and in thisepisode we sit down with Jonathan Levitt.
Jonathan has an incredible careerin the entertainment industry from
acting to tv, hosting to magic, butyou might not know him from his show.
You might know him fromhis incredible stranger.
App and entire Stranger System, plussome new projects that he has that
(00:28):
you are going to really, really love.
So this was an incredible episode allabout all the things he's been up to,
including his Vegas show, creating Magic,being on tv, hosting, producing, as well
as his magic apps just for magicians.
You're gonna love thisepisode as much as I did here.
It is a wonderful episodewith the one and only.
(00:49):
Jonathan Levitt.
Hello my friends and welcome to a brandnew episode of Discourse in Magic.
My name is Jonah Bains and weare here with Jonathan Levitt.
Jonathan, how are you?
Hello.
Hello, I'm Grace.
Thanks for having me on on the show.
(01:09):
I am excited to have you.
To be honest.
I asked you to be on the show beforeI realized that I was gonna see you
at Maggi Fest and I got a chance tosee your show and and chat a bit so we
have some extra things to talk about.
Why don't we start at the very beginning.
How did you get started in magic?
How did Magic find you?
Oh wow.
My
Jonathan (01:27):
father was a magician.
He as a, I would say a semi-pro.
Yep.
You know, did magic as a young man andthroughout New York and Canada and, and
I, when I was eight years old, I foundsome of his magic props in the bottom
drawer of a dresser in our basement in St.
Louis, Missouri.
That's where I grew up.
Moved there when I was eightyears old, and rest is history.
I was very lucky to be in St. Louis,where there I was surrounded by amazing
(01:50):
magicians and my peers at that time, and.
I was there at the time of ChrisKenner and, and Chris Korn and Andrew
Golden Hirsch and, you know, we'reall contemporaries and, and that
was really a great time to be there.
And Harry Monty was a, a, a greatmentor for me and I met many, many
magicians out of St. Louis and itwas a wonderful time to be growing
up there and I learned a lot.
(02:11):
And that's it.
Jonah (02:12):
Yeah.
What a, I mean, amazing, amazingstart with amazing people to be
surrounded by, so that's fantastic.
Talk to me about like.
Did you know you're gonnabe serious about this?
Did you go to school for something else?
Like, when did this become real for you?
Jonathan (02:26):
It's a, you know what, this, this is interesting.
So I, I've been, you know,I started when I was eight.
So what, what is that?
45 years ago.
Started doing it, startedstreet performing when I was 12.
Been doing it my whole life.
Went to the college, started producingshows, always doing magic in some way.
Then I moved into, out of, outof college, went to Colorado,
Denver for about four years.
(02:47):
To a major software company.
During that time, I was stilldoing magic, but it was a
little bit on the back burner.
But I still found myself in thepapers, still found myself doing busker
festivals and performing and, and, youknow, here or there, but it was still
sort of on the back burner and then.
And, but I made some greatfriends there as well.
Great friends, Sean Pop and BradMontgomery and Brian Dino and, you
(03:10):
know, a longer list than that, but madegreat friends in, in Steve Spangler and
great friends in, in, in Colorado, butwasn't really doing a lot of magic, you
know, just sort of on the periphery.
And then I mo I made the decision to moveto Los Angeles to pursue my acting career.
And when I did that.
(03:30):
I got thrown into magic a bitmore, a lot more than ever before.
And, and I, you know, I have a, I'msure you know I have a history in magic
back then from, because I moved to LosAngeles and so magic became a much more
important part of my life, but it wasn't.
(03:51):
Probably wasn't, and and magicfound its way into all aspects of
my life, whether it's in front ofthe camera, behind the camera, live,
entertainment, all of it, consulting.
But I would say it was probably, I don'tknow, 10 ish, maybe a little more years
ago that I finally was able to bringmyself to say, when people say, what
(04:12):
do you do for me to say I'm a magician?
Jonah (2) (04:15):
Mm-hmm.
Jonathan (04:15):
Because I was always doing, and I still do so many different
things, wear many, many hats.
And I talk about those things,but still would have a hard time
saying the words, I'm a magician.
Jonah (04:28):
So a, around what age or period in your life did you become a magician?
You know, happy to, happy tosay that that's what you do.
Jonathan (04:36):
Well, I guess about 10 or 15 years ago is when I thought really
started to, to say that, you know?
Wow.
And so, yeah, it's a,that's a big deal for me.
Jonah (04:43):
Of course it is.
You know, and, and it's, it'sa scary thing to tell people.
Someone asks what you do.
Like, you know, a lot of the times,the reason why magicians do lots of
other things is because, you know, Iwas afraid to do this kind of thing
full time and, and to potentially saygoodbye to some of the other things.
I want to go throughsome of those bits, so.
Acting.
I was digging through your websiteand I found that you acted in it.
(05:05):
One of my favorite shows of alltime that lasted one season.
Flash Forward.
Love that.
Flash forward, love that show.
Yeah.
Talk to me about acting.
How, how'd you get into it andwas it something that you liked?
Like, I mean, I, I know that the realdifference in terms of, I. Getting work
in acting and magic is like night andday one is lining up with a bunch of
people that look just like you, hopingthat you get a job, and then magic
(05:27):
is kind of the exact opposite side.
Oftentimes you're not in competition with25 other people that are just like you.
People want you.
So talk to me about like how was acting
Jonathan (05:38):
for you?
Well, I mean, I, acting was good.
I mean, I, I moved out to Los Angelesto pursue an acting career and I feel
very fortunate in the career that Ihad and have, and, and that also moved
into, um, hosting, television hosting.
So I did have done quite a bitof television, ho television
hosting in my career as well.
(05:59):
So they're all, you know, being infront of the camera, sort of all related
in, in a, in different way, in, insimilar and in different ways, but.
As far as getting gigs, yeah.
It's a very different beast.
And, and you have to be verycommitted to it, you know?
I mean, it's, what can I tell you?
I mean, it's a, it's a, um, yeah,it, it is, it, you know, I don't
(06:21):
get to just say, oh, you know what,I think I wanna be on that show.
I think I'll go audition for that show.
I. You don't get to do that.
Even though people, your, your familyand friends that don't really know
the business will say, you know what?
You would be great on this show, X show.
You should do that one.
They're like, oh, thanks.
Yeah, sure, I'll, I'll go do that one.
But, you know, it is abouthaving representation.
It's about having relationshipsand building relationships.
(06:42):
You know, I've been, I was veryfortunate in my career to build some
wonderful relationships and, and those.
Relationships.
Most, mostly my, my acting jobs,not all of them, but many of them
came from relationships more thangoing in and sitting in a room and
auditioning, even though I either hadto go through audition process still,
(07:04):
but, but to get through to that, tobe able to get in the door to do that.
It's not always easy, so I don't knowwhat to tell you other than it's a,
it is a grind and, you know, I tendto not be a great client for, for
agents because I'm doing so much andtraveling and, and, and wearing many
other hats, which is not, does notnecessarily make you a great client.
(07:26):
For an agent, an agent isgenerally waiting for you to,
well, wanting you to just be thereand be available at all times.
And, and then we alsohave the business itself.
The business itself up in, in LA isa little upside down at the moment
and has gone through its, its issuesrecently with strikes and what have you.
So it's, it's a very difficultbusiness to be a part of right now.
(07:48):
For all, for everybodythat's in the business.
So, but it is fun.
I mean, I certainly enjoyed the work,you know, the work is the fun part.
Of course the work is the fun part,you know, going on set and, and doing
something as uh, is the, is the fun part.
Um, flash forward, I was fortunateto be the coroner on that show,
and that was great, great fun.
So I got to, you know,be around dead bodies.
Jonah (08:09):
Talk to me about the hosting on, on some tv, like you certainly
learn a lot about some skills thatreally translate into performing magic,
both for a camera and also just ingeneral managing different people.
What are some of the thingsthat you learned and took from
the hosting opportunities?
Jonathan (08:28):
Well, ho hosting is a, is is a skill.
There's no doubt.
It is.
There's a, there, it's a,there's a skill to that.
It's not easy for many peopleto do, but you get to learn
how to, well, it's interesting.
So as a host, very oftenI would, I would, um.
You know, I would interview peoplefor the, the shows I was on, you know,
(08:51):
it was Discovery channel, scienceChannel, biography Channel, et cetera.
I did do one magic based show calledCelebra Cadabra, which was on VH one.
Hmm.
Yeah.
But, but it was you.
I'm interviewing people, interviewinginteresting people, and for me, I'm
a conduit as a host, I'm a conduitfor the audience, kind of the
every man conduit for the audience.
(09:12):
And so you get to learn, youknow, there's 10, there's the
technical side of it, learning.
To deliver lines, learning to make your,you know, hit your mark, learning to
walk and talk, learning to interview.
These are, you know, it's all technicalstuff, but what was interesting, I always,
I would always do, Ima not often, butnot always, but often do a magic trick.
I. For the people I'm interviewingbefore going on, on camera, because
(09:36):
my job is to put them at ease.
The more they're at ease, themore they're gonna open up to me.
So I was always able to do that andthat, I think that was a, that was
something that I had that was beneficial.
You know, I would sit out, sitwith somebody before an interview.
Do a mag trick for them, and it would openthem up and give them, you know, make them
more comfortable in front of me, you know,in, in front of the camera talking to me.
(09:58):
So, but it was fun.
I mean, I got to learn quite a bitand, you know, you take that, you
take all of these skills to the stagewith you as a magician, you know, we,
people ask me what, what they shoulddo as a magician, as they're learning.
And I always say, take an improvclass, take an acting class.
Jonah (2) (10:13):
Mm-hmm.
You know,
Jonathan (10:14):
these are skills that are incredibly beneficial to.
To someone on stage as a magician and I,and in my lectures, my magic lectures,
I often talk about acting and talkabout how to handle yourself on stage
and how to be in the moment, and howto deal with gifts that are given to
you on stage rather than ignoring them.
And that all comes from the actingbackground and the improv background.
So that's a very valuable thing to do.
(10:35):
So, you know, and having theexperience in front of a camera.
Only helps you, you know?
And then if you're going to do a TVshow, which I've done quite a bit of
magic on tv when you, or you're in orconsulting, you've done that as well in
front of a camera, then, then that pastexperience simply helps that process.
You know, when I've worked with actorsconsulting for actors in TV and film,
(10:58):
I'm able to talk to 'em as a magician.
I'm able able to talk to 'em as anactor and, and help them in that regard
so that they can come to the role.
As an actor and yet to still domagic, and how do magicians behave?
How do they think?
How do they act?
How do they move?
How do their hands move?
You know, all of that isimportant knowledge to be
giving to an actor as well.
(11:19):
That's going to be playing, going tobe playing the part of an A magician.
Jonah (11:23):
Let, let's talk about that.
I know you've consulted ormagic for a bunch of films.
I think Burt Wonderstone was one of them.
What did that look like?
And in general, if there's other ones.
Other ones that I don't know about.
What is consulting magic ona film like that look like?
Jonathan (11:41):
Well, for Bert Wonderstone, I was on the film for about four months and
there there's the pre-production part.
Jim Steinmeyer took part to createthe magic for the script as it was,
and then I came on to be on set.
And so what that meant.
Was working with the actors in this case.
(12:02):
Mostly working with Jim Carreyand actually not so much, but
working with Steve Carell, SteveCemi, and Olivia Wilde primarily.
I've also Steve Krall's handsin the film for the most part.
Mm-hmm.
I didn't know that that's See him, whenyou see him doing magic, usually it's me.
And then so coming in, working withthe actors before we start shooting.
(12:23):
And getting them comfortable with themagic that's been built for the movie.
And then being on set while it's happeningand working with the director and watching
the, the camera and watching, you know,trying to watch for flashing and watch
for proper angles, but then also watchfor execution of the magic and working
with the actors on set doing that as well.
(12:45):
So it's, and then at times, comingup with magic on the spot because.
Something has come up, you know,and you have to make adjustments.
So it's, you're sort ofalways on, on your toes.
Aside
Jonah (12:57):
from, aside from the hands, is there anything specific in that film, the
Witch is like a moment or something thatwas really memorable to you that you,
you know, look fondly on when you seethe movie or when people talk about it?
Jonathan (13:10):
Boy, it was a, that was a great experience.
It was, overall, it was areally great experience.
Working.
You know, Steve, well, all of them.
Steve K Crow, and Steve Chemi,the nicest people on the planet.
They were, they were veryinteresting to work with.
Olivia was great.
I mean, it was, it was, canI tell you specific example?
You know what I, I can'ttell you specifics right now.
(13:31):
That's a long time ago.
But what was interesting is when I wasdoing Steve k Crow's hands, we would
sometimes do it as digital inserts,sometimes do it as physical inserts.
Sometimes you'd see this.
There's actually one great scene.
Wow.
And Alan Arkin too.
Oh my gosh.
Alan Arkin.
But there's one great scene where yousee, actually, I will tell you a good
(13:55):
story, but there's one great, there'sone scene where you see Steve's hands
in the sh You know Steve in the shot I.And my ha I'm off out of frame, sticking
my hands up into the frame as his hands.
It's very funny, if you go back andwatch the movie, it's the, it's,
it's where he and Aan Arkin aredoing are in the old folks home and
working with the billiard balls.
Um, here's a story that I love andhas nothing to do with my doing
(14:19):
magic, but Alan Arkin is on stage.
And he's playing the, the youngerversion of himself on stage, doing
a kind of an infomercial on tv.
And we're in a theater and I'm in,I'm, you know, I'm in the audience
behind the director and we'rewatching, watching this play out.
And Alan Arkin does this thing where he,he's shaking his hand on stage and then.
(14:44):
Bam and egg appears in his hand andthat's going to be happening in post.
They put the egg in, in post, theyput the in his hand and we're shaking.
He's shaking his hand, shaking hishand, and then bam, that egg appears.
And I said to him, to Alan Harkin,I said, you know, a magician
would never act like that, wouldnever move their hands like that.
(15:06):
And he said to me, yes,but my way is funnier.
And then you watch the film.
And you realize.
His way is funnier.
So much better.
Lesson learned.
Thank you.
I do not, do not give notes to Alan Orkin.
It was, it was great.
Jonah (15:23):
That is awesome.
So, you know, right now, roughly in thetimeline, like you always did some magic.
You went and did some acting in LA I,I assume, in and around then is when
the consulting started to happen.
What sort of.
Magic were you doing, when you were doinggigs, were you doing corporate stuff?
(15:45):
Were you doing colleges?
Were you doing, what was the bulkof the magic that you were doing?
Oh,
Jonathan (15:52):
just pri private parties in, in around town, some travel, some
corporate working, the Magic Castle.
You know, kind of, kind of all of it.
Really kind of all that.
Yeah, I mean, I, I just sort of acrossthe board, just a journeyman magician,
you know, I. Yeah, like anybody else,
Jonah (16:09):
little bit of everything right now.
You have a show that happensat the Venetian in Las Vegas.
I wanna hear a bit about the show,but also I'm curious about, I.
How it came to be, you know,a lot of magicians dream of
having that sort of thing.
How did you know, like you werejoking earlier about people telling
(16:31):
the actor, oh, you should be in this,you know how many magicians have
heard, oh, you should go to Vegas.
Oh, you should be in Vegas.
Right.
How did, first of all,how did that come to be?
And then tell me a bitmore about the show itself.
Sure.
Well,
Jonathan (16:42):
Benjamin Schrader, my partner on this, had a, he had a show in,
in Encino, California Magic Bar showthat he created and he was bringing
magicians into work in that venue.
And it was very intimate.
16 people at a time, you know,very intimate setting and.
(17:04):
Then when, when Covid hit that sort ofshut down and two other producing partners
that are now on our team came on to, tosay, we wanna do something with that show.
And then Ben and I startedworking together on this as well.
So now the, you know, our core teamis together producing the show and.
Then we, you know, we, we were able to,we did a two week run in New York City
(17:30):
where we built a theater out and, and didthe show there, and did in a couple other
places, sort of as proof of concepts.
And then, and then theopportunity for Vegas arose.
And we, we were able to, to jump on that.
So we're at the Venetia now.
And it's going great.
I, as a co-creator of the show withBenjamin Schrader, we mounted the
(17:51):
show for a couple of months and thennow we have other people in the show.
I. And we're here back here in labut the show's running and going.
Well, I'll actually go out there inApril for a weekend, I think April
10th through the 13th to fill in for aweek for a weekend, which will be fun.
But yeah, the show's going great.
Marketing's kicking off and, or notkicking off, but continuing on and, uh,
(18:12):
response has been very positive to it.
And it's, it's a good fun.
And it's, the show itself is.
Intimate show of two people behind abar, the magician and a host bartender.
It's their interaction and it's atheatrical presentation of magic.
It's not just any magician gettingbehind a bar and doing 70 minutes
of their, of their material.
(18:32):
It's really a structured showwith the two people behind the
bar and their banter and theirrelationship, and that's very intimate.
We put about eight.
Or 10 people at the bar itself, and theneverybody else is raked behind them.
How many people total capout the seating at about 45?
And it's a great intimate experience.
It's really, really fun.
Jonah (18:54):
And so, you know, the fact that it's a theatrical show means that
you don't just fill in any magician.
Do you have a roster?
How does, how does it work?
Do you have two people that go in and out?
Is it one person for nowuntil they get replaced?
How?
How does that work?
Jonathan (19:09):
We have, we have, we, right now it's, we have our set cast, right?
Our two people that are there,but uh, with other people that
we're keeping an eye on, but.
As we're, if we need to fill in or,you know, do anything down the road.
But right now we're, we're veryhappy with our current cast.
John Ricardo is playing the partof the magician and playing the
(19:33):
part because he is a magician.
Mm-hmm.
And, and a, and a great one.
And then Zachary Petite is doing our hostbartender role, and he's amazing as well.
So the two of them haveincredible chemistry.
It's a great show if anybody'sinterested in seeing the show again,
it is at the Venetian, it's called.
Legger de Domain, L-E-G-E-R-D-E-M-A-I-N,and you can find it out at, if you look
(19:55):
up 1923 live, I believe it's 1923 lv.com.
It's, that's the venue thatwe're in at the Venetian and.
You
Jonah (20:04):
know, from what I understand, like Vegas is a tough place to
produce a show 'cause there's somuch competition and so many big
names to go see when you're there.
Sure.
What have you learned about trying toproduce a show where it's going well?
People are coming to it ina city like that, it is not
Jonathan (20:23):
easy there, that's for sure.
There's a, I forget the number,but the number of available seats.
Throughout Vegas on anynight is beyond imagination.
Yeah.
So you are competing with all of that, youknow, you're competing with all of that.
I think we're lucky to be inan intimate setting like this.
I think some of the shift is happeningwhere people are more interested or, or
(20:44):
interested in these smaller, more intimateshows versus the, the larger scale shows.
And it's a little bit easierto manage, but it is, it, you
know, there's a lot to it.
There's a, you know, the marketing,the, you know, we just recently.
Ended up on taxi cabs, you know,now we're on the, the tops of taxi
cabs and those kind of things.
So it's, there's a lot to it.
We're very fortunate to havesome great marketing teams and
(21:04):
great partners out in, in Vegas.
Our other producing partnerswe have, we're with Spy
Entertainment out there as well.
So.
Cool.
They're, they're terrific.
And so we're very, very lucky to bepartnered with and with the folks that are
there, that are entrenched in, in Vegas,that know Vegas and know how to do this.
So we're, we have a good team.
And how often does the show run?
(21:25):
It's Thursday through Sundaywith Possibility event
and, and Wednesday as well.
Cool.
And and one show a night.
One show a night, except for when thereare two shows a night on the weekends.
Cool.
Got it.
Jonah (21:37):
Yeah.
Jonathan (21:37):
That's really exciting.
Congratulations.
How long have you been there?
I. Thanks.
Uh, we opened up lastsummer and it's going great.
Cool.
And we continue to keep going strong.
And, you know, the show is strong.
The magic's strong.
It's, it's very funny and engagingand the response has been incredibly
Jonah (21:53):
positive.
And is the magician doing themagic that you designed or are
they doing parts of their act?
Jonathan (21:59):
Both.
Both.
So the magic that they, that they'rebringing to the table, that is
not something that I've designed.
It has been vetted and directed.
By us to fit the, the mold of the showand the style and the tone of the show.
Yeah.
But, but we do, you know, give themsome, some flexibility to be able to
bring in their own style to that sowe're not handcuffing them, but, but
(22:22):
it, but it, but it is curated for sure.
Cool.
Jonah (22:25):
Well maybe the people around Vegas know you for that show, but The Magicians
know you for some other project and I'dlove to hear a little more about them
starting with sort of, I think the mostpopular, which is The Stranger, you know?
It is a, it's an amazing trick andalso sort of a community of people
(22:47):
that are, are helping each other.
Can you give some background on like.
First of all, what is itfor anyone who doesn't know?
And then like, how did this come to be?
Because Sure.
It's a really unique, you know, it'ssuch a mixture of a magic trick, but
also a, you know, software, but also,you know, a people helping each other.
(23:08):
So how, how did this trickthe stranger come to be?
What is it and, and how does it all work?
Sure, and our audience are, are
Jonathan (23:15):
magicians
Jonah (23:15):
only.
This is just magicians.
If a lay person's listening tothis, they're outta their mind.
Jonathan (23:19):
Okay, well the stranger phone call is it it for me?
It's one of the greatest tricksI've ever done in my career.
You know, I get, I basically,I generally finish.
Every show with it.
That's my finale.
I get 12 to 14 minutesof it out of it on stage.
And the reactions are incredible.
And what it is, is it's basically the,the wizard phone call on steroids.
(23:43):
Right.
But, but built in sucha way as a phone app.
I. To give you, to be thinking about, I,I think about you as a performer, right?
So as a person that's having, usingthis as a performer, 'cause I'm a
performer, so all the little nuancesthat you need to make it believable.
So it's very powerful, this thing.
And, you know, you can reveal aplain card, you know, if you wanna
(24:05):
do that, but there's other ways toreveal other information as well.
But it started, you know, I,my background's in software
and software development and soit's, and software should be.
Used to make somethingmore efficient mm-hmm.
To make your process more efficient and inmagic to enhance the impact of an effect.
(24:25):
And I started, you know, wewere doing this to give a quick
history lesson on this, please.
But we started this, there were, it goes,it goes back, Romanos was, was doing a,
a, a way of, of using your phone to makea phone call, seemingly to somebody.
It's a stranger that you didn't know, but.
(24:48):
But was really calling your friend, right?
Yeah.
But then you had to communicate theinformation of the card or force
a card if you were doing a plaincard reveal, that kind of thing.
But it was, it was fun.
And a group of us were, and PeterTurner had a, you know, I think, I
think Peter came around, it was doing itbefore Romanos actually showed Romano.
So I, I'm pretty sure that'sthe right history of this.
But, and I talk, I talkextensively about this history.
(25:09):
In my vanishing masterclass thatcame out this last year as well.
And so it was, you know, it was funand a group of us were doing it.
Robert Ramirez had kind of brought it toa, a small group of people 'cause he had
learned it from, from someone who learnedit from Romanos and, you know, so we were
all kind of doing it and I thought, youknow what, this really should be an app.
(25:31):
It's much more.
We should be able tostreamline this process.
So I decided I was going to startto work on creating an app for it.
At which point when I was doing that,Mark Stein, who has a great app called
Diverter, which does a similar typeof thing where it sends a, allows you
to call somebody else, reached out tome and said, Hey, I think I, you know,
I'm doing this kind of thing already,which I had not heard of diverter at
(25:53):
the time, but we, we talked about it,agreed that it was independent thinking
and, and that both moved forward.
And so I started to really workon this, this app in that way.
So, and I did, and I just started tobecome more and more and, and what came
out of it, the, the technology is solidand really well built, and there's so
(26:14):
much in the app itself that that is, areconvincers that just make it believable.
But in addition to that, what cameout of it was a community, and this
is what I'm perhaps most proud of,is this worldwide community of.
Strangers that have become friendsthat are all helping each other.
So we have, you know, we haveWhatsApp groups in different parts
(26:35):
of the world where you go in andyou say, Hey, I need some help.
And people start responding.
I can help you.
I can help you.
It's tremendous.
So we actually have a community of peoplearound the world helping each other.
And I don't, the the is
Jonah (26:48):
saying like, Hey, I need someone to pretend to be a random person.
Yeah.
At 1130 tonight when I'm doing my show.
Jonathan (26:55):
E. Exactly, and, and what you'll find is many magicians say that
they have more fun being the stranger.
Than the magician.
So, and then we get together forstranger photo photos at, at conventions
and it's really become a communityand, and I'm very proud of that.
And, and it's a very vibrant
Jonah (27:13):
group of people.
Not to like get too deep into it,but just to like comprehend what it
is, which is that there is a way tocleverly encode the information to the
person who you are calling so that theyknow what it is to reveal and that.
Ostensibly, you don't have toforce the thing, you just, yeah.
It's have to pass theinformation off to them.
Jonathan (27:34):
Yeah, preselection, the app does all the work for you.
And so by the time you make thephone call, you're just having
a conversation and at that pointit becomes an acting exercise.
Wow.
And the believability factor is, is there.
And so it, it's really, it, it's themost fun you'll ever have doing magic.
It's like a drug, you know?
And, and there are magiciansthat have held off from doing it.
(27:57):
And then when they finally do it,once they, oh my God, I. I now
see what you're talking about,you know, and it's so much fun.
Basically for me, a lot oftimes I'm doing my show.
Just so I can get to this, youknow, I'll, I'll do all the other
stuff just so I can get to this.
And it's the most memorable thing anybodyhas, you know, the most magicians,
you know, if you ask a lay audienceafter a show, what did you just see?
(28:19):
For the most part, they'll say,they'll forget what they saw.
They won't be able to rememberwhat they actually saw on the show.
This trick I've had people a year latercome up to me and before they even
say hello, they go that phone trick.
You know, they, it's the thing theyremember and, and this, this is,
this is the trick that closes deals.
I've been, I've been with people that,you know, they like, I'm doing business
(28:41):
deals and I do this, and you're done.
You know, that's all you
Jonah (2) (28:44):
need.
Jonathan (28:44):
So it's the most, it's just the
Jonah (28:45):
most fun.
I. Awesome.
Yeah.
What an awesome thing you created.
You know, I've seen so manymagicians doing it and using it
and, and loving it and loving, youknow, being able to work together
and, and have fun with each other.
So,
Jonathan (28:57):
yeah, I, I've made, I've made great, I've made great friends from
this, you know, people, I mean, I, I amproud to say that I have friends all over
the world that have come out of this.
Project and, and I'm very proudof that and humbled by it as well.
And you have another project,
Jonah (29:12):
which was I, I guess once called the Stranger System, but is now evolved
into something greater called Nexus.
What is that?
That's this
Jonathan (29:24):
is, this blows the doors wide open.
This allows you to takedata in 'cause what?
And, and send it out, right?
It becomes your digital hub forother apps and devices, for other
ways to input for other information.
So it is your, yourhub to create routines.
(29:45):
It's your, it's your place to createroutines and, and run your show.
So, for instance, I can take.
And we take data in, ina variety of ways, right?
We take it in throughinput on your phone itself.
We take it in through other appsthat send information to Nexus.
We, we have one of the most advancedlistening technologies in magic today.
(30:06):
So it will listen throughyour phone or your watch.
It will listen for zip codes and,and lotto numbers and serial numbers
on bills and phrases and words,and, and do calculations for you.
And all of this could be done through.
Your voice, so in a very effortlessway without ever touching your phone.
You can take information inand then send it out somewhere.
(30:30):
You can send it through an AI enginewithin the app as well, you know, so
all of this is possible to create uniqueroutines that you may not have been able
to create before, and then use those.
Through what we call pathways in Nexusthat allow you to construct routines
and be able to select them easily, youcan select them through the built-in
(30:50):
remote control that comes with Nexus.
You can, you can, you can, you know, getthem, you can execute those pathways by.
Selecting them or auto advancing throughthem so you can automate your show.
So for instance, the show thatI just did at MGI Fest, you
mentioned we were just at MGI Fest.
Mm-hmm.
I used Nexus in my show on stageduring the hour, five different times.
(31:10):
Wow.
And that allowed me to create wholly newroutines that were seamless, effortless,
without seemingly using any technologyfrom the audience's perspective,
and then ending with a phone callthrough the Stranger phone call app.
I. But not doing a plain card reveal,but in this case using a lumen
impression pad to be able to senda drawing over to my stranger and
(31:36):
have a drawing duplication on stage.
Through a video FaceTime call wherethe drawing that the stranger just
drew on that call matched the drawingthat was made by the person on stage,
and the result is just stupendous.
So Nexus is your hub.
To create routines you've neverbeen able to create before and to be
(31:57):
completely creative and, and applywhat I like to consider or think of as
non-linear creativity, creating routinesthat are not A to B and and are more
complex and unique and interesting.
I.
Jonah (32:10):
I know that sort of the whole point of it is to be creative, but can
you give us a couple of examples of thingsthat one might do or that like outta the
box, you know, without ordering a bunchof impression pads or whatever Sure.
That they could do.
Sure.
Jonathan (32:25):
You know, that's a good question.
You know, the people haveasked, well, what can I do if
I don't have the glyph printer?
If I don't have hydro Instagram,if I don't have a Lumin impression
pad, if I don't have a mind busterimpression pad, if I don't have, if
I, if I don't have some of these otherapps and devices, what can I do if I
don't have products from Ben k Smith?
The, and the, the answer is thatthere's, there's things you could
(32:45):
do built in for inputting, and theninstead of outputting what, and again,
if you have a stranger phone call,you can always go to a phone call.
But if you.
Don't have that.
What can you do just with Nexus?
And the answer is you become the output.
So information that comes in.
Can then be transferred to your knowledge.
So let's say pi revelations, youknow, is a, is a good example of that.
(33:09):
Yep.
From, from David Penn, I can take a numberin, whether it's through listening mode
or through inputting on my phone, andinstead of sending it anywhere for the PI
revelation, I can send it to my own peak.
On my own phone, which is agiant peak screen, and now
I can have that information.
I can go through the AI engine.
So that what, I did this on stageactually at Magi Fest, right?
(33:30):
Where I, I asked somebody just talk to theaudience and say, give me a, a birthday.
I. They tell me birthday now we have abirthday mode in our listening module
that listens specifically to theconversation and extracts the birthday.
And so we take that birthday, Itook it through my AI engine to find
a celebrity that was born on thatbirthday, and in this case, I send
it off to Instagram via Hydra, whichis an amazing app from Shamir, Salim,
(33:54):
and, and, and put it in my bio.
That said, and this is a nonlinear.
Approach to this.
You say a birthday and you go to mybio on Instagram and instantly it
says, I thought you would say MichaelJordan, and when somebody looks up
Michael Jordan's birthday, there it is.
And I've done nothing on stage.
I simply have.
And that wasn't someoneoff stage inputting it.
(34:15):
That was it.
Listening and knowing that was listening.
That's right.
You saw the show.
Yeah.
So what was happening was at that moment.
The person on, uh, in the audience saidtheir, the birthday, my watch, heard the
birthday, and then immediately sent itoff to Hydra through the AI engine in
Nexus and converted that to a celebrity.
Sent that to Hydra andput it on Instagram.
(34:37):
I had them search their phoneon, in the audience on Instagram.
It said it, and that was it,and I didn't have to do a thing.
Wow.
It just happened automatically.
But if I didn't want to go toInstagram, I could go to my peak on my
screen and know immediately who that.
Celebrity was, right?
So you become the output, youbecome this, you, you become.
(34:57):
You have all of this informationat your fingertips and you're
able to recount that information.
You know, you give me a zip codeand I'll tell you what city it's in,
and that information goes throughthe AI engine and we're done.
I also use it for book tests.
You notice there, I did twobook tests in that show.
One with a book that's published by.
But my wife and I have a publishingcompany, and I did it again using
(35:19):
Particle system from Joshua Jsince he lectured on it that day.
And I was able to have someone inthe audience open up those books,
go to any page, tell me the pagenumber they're on, and I was able
to reveal the word on that page.
And that's all built into Nexus.
Anybody can create those, thosecribs as we call them, through auto
(35:40):
crib for any book off their shelf.
Easily.
So you can create a book test forany book to, you don't have to
find like an ebook version of it.
You just submitted the book itself.
No, no.
I just created a crib.
It took me, it takes me about fiveto 10 minutes to create a crib
for any book off my bookshelf.
And at that point it's in in Nexusand I can use it at any time.
And all I have to do is say thepage number and I know the word.
(36:03):
Wow.
Well this
Jonah (36:05):
is a beast of a project.
This is very exciting.
Yeah.
This is coming out at Blackpool.
Jonathan (36:10):
Yes.
Cool.
It gets, it gets releasedat Blackpool officially.
It'll release to Blackpool and it is.
It, it, it will change theway that you create routines
and it comes with the remote.
What's the remote for?
The remote will allow you to inputinformation in without touching your
phone or relying on another app or device.
It also will allow you to, toselect and execute pathways.
(36:33):
So let's say I've got my top.
10 pathways that I like to, routinesthat I like to perform, you know, in
zip code to city, to Instagram, or topeak or book test for this one book.
And I wanna know the word, any of theseroutines and I can simply on my remote,
select the routine number and go.
(36:54):
And then based on what that pathwayneeds for input, whether it's number
or playing card or words or what haveyou, the remote will change to that.
Input profile automatically.
So it's just your way of controllingyour show and executing pathways.
You know, I was at a, I, this was great.
I was, I was at the car dealershipyesterday and I wanted to, I was talking
(37:17):
with the, the advisor there to take inmy car and I needed, I needed a loaner.
And they said, well, we'll have to seeif any are available, what have you.
So we sat down and he said, hewas talking about the weather.
He and I said, yeah,I just came from Ohio.
It's freezing there.
And he said, what are you doing in Ohio?
And I told him, I'm a magician.
I was out performing at a magicconvention and, and then he said,
well, can you do anything for me?
(37:37):
Well, I really didn't haveanything on me, but I went to my
everyday carry my EDC, which was,Hey, gimme a tell me a birthday.
Check your Instagram and therewas the celebrity, we were done.
That was it.
That's all that it took place.
I said, well, just gimme yourbirthday and open up your phone.
Go to Instagram.
And wow.
That was like, no, you'renot using your hands at all.
It's just no, it's like nothing.
(37:59):
It's a nothing.
I just, you're done.
You could either input that birthdayon the remote or in this case you
could use the the wrist to, to listenon the watch or listen on the phone.
Any of those are possible, but none ofthem have the appearance of using any
technology or doing anything, and hesimply goes to his Instagram and it's.
Done and there's kind of nothing better.
It was the fastest way to get Yeah.
(38:19):
I
Jonah (38:19):
mean, it's like a magic trick without any of the slights or Yeah.
Uh, you know, it just happens.
Jonathan (38:24):
It just happens.
And that's the thing with Nexus,the miracles just happen over and
over again, and it's just so easy.
I. Love it.
Streamlined.
Well,
Jonah (38:32):
congrats on the project.
Very excited for its for its release.
As we are nearing the end ofthe podcast, there's a bunch of
questions that we ask each person.
The first is the endless chain.
So in order to keep the podcast goingon for eternity, each guest is asked
to recommend another guest that wouldbe perfect for this kind of thing.
Oh.
With the exceptions being A, I cannothave had interviewed him already, which
(38:56):
is really difficult, and B, that youhave to be able to put us in contact.
You can't just name thecraziest name you can think of.
So who is a person who youthink would be a really good fit
for this kind of conversation?
Jonathan (39:06):
Wow.
Okay.
Christopher
Jonah (39:07):
Hart.
That's great.
Gimme a great interview for you.
Good.
That's really fantastic.
Thank you for that.
The next one is about modern magic,like what's one thing you like
about the world of magic rightnow and one thing you don't like?
Ah.
Jonathan (39:21):
One thing I like is the accessibility of magic to a
wider range, a wider audience.
One thing I don't like is theaccessibility of magic to a wider
audience where I'm more on the fence,I'm, I'm more on the side of loving
it, but also recognizing that thathas opened up avenues for exposure.
(39:43):
It's also opened up the need formagicians to go back to their roots.
Right now there's less reading in magic.
There's less, less understandingof performance and how to present
magic and that kind of thinking.
But the trade off is that more peopleare able to access magic and more
(40:08):
people are able to access magic andbe exposed to a wider range of magic.
And we're also able to get to amore diverse grouping of magicians.
We're able to see more women in magic,more girls in magic, which is fantastic.
And Leo Orleans is actually puttingon a conference called Mystify.
Mm-hmm.
She's someone else you should interviewis Leo Orleans, if you haven't already.
(40:30):
Who's doing a wonderful job with agreat team to present a new convention
that's focused on women and magic.
It's Fanta, it's great.
So these are, these are all the positives.
It's, it's really wonderful.
Jonah (40:43):
Love it and how, how interesting that the best part of magic right now
is also the, the most challenging too.
Yeah, and I can certainlyresonate with that.
The last question is sort of aboutwhat we just talked about overall.
You know, people are gonna belistening to this episode and there
was a lot of information and adviceand things for people to learn.
What do you think is the most importanttakeaway from this conversation?
(41:04):
Like what do you hope thatpeople take home with them?
Jonathan (41:07):
Be creative.
Try new things, nonlinear creativity.
Try to create routines that are,are interesting for an audience and,
and surprising for our audience.
I hope they take that away from it.
Try and dare to try new things.
Don't, don't be afraid.
Take leaps and chances and,and perform as much as you can.
Jonah (41:29):
I love it.
Those are fantastic tips.
Jonathan.
Where can people find you and where canpeople find things like the Stranger
and Nexus and any of your projects?
Jonathan (41:37):
You know what?
You can find out aboutme@jonathanlevitt.com,
J-O-N-A-T-H-A-N-L-E-V-I t.com.
You can also find my my store sitefor some more information on this
kind of stuff@twistingtheaces.com.
Twisting vas.com.
But other than that, find me online.
I'm on Facebook and, and Instagram, uh,the typical handles, but I'm, I'm around.
(42:02):
I'm around.
Awesome.
Jonah (42:04):
Well, Jonathan, thank you so much for doing this.
Thanks for the great time at MagiFest and, and for being here and,
and giving us a, a great interview.
So appreciate the time.
Thank you so much, and of course,big thank you to everybody at
home to listen and tuning in.
Appreciate it and we'llsee you all next Thursday.
Thanks.
(42:30):
Well, there you have it.
I hope you liked the episode, and I hopeof course, that you learn something.
Make sure to follow Jonathan on socialsand if you liked the episode, if
something in here resonated with you,then tell a friend about the podcast.
Podcasts are kind of clunky,they're hard to grow.
They don't, you know, come up onYouTube or anything like that.
So if you think someone needs toknow about the Discourse in Magic
(42:52):
podcast, then please spread the word.
Thanks so much for being here,and I'll see you next Thursday.
Ciao.
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