October 21, 2025 • 40 mins
Listen to the DynaMic Podcast Network at http://dynamicpodcasts.com
Join our community at https://patreon.com/dynamicduel
• 0:00:00 - Introduction
• 0:03:45 - No-Prize Time
• 0:06:43 - Question of the Week
• 0:07:22 - Neron vs Hela intro
• 0:10:36 - Neron history and abilities
• 0:19:42 - Hela history and abilities
• 0:29:10 - Fight speculation
• 0:36:45 - Duel results
• 0:39:31 - Sign off
Website: https://dynamicduel.com
Instagram: https://instagram.com/dynamicduelpodcast
Merch: https://dynamic-duel-shop.fourthwall.com/
Executive producers: John Starosky, Zachary Hepburn, Dustyn Balcom, Miggy Matanguihan, Nathaniel Wagner, Levi Yeaton, Austin Wesolowski, AJ Dunkerley, Nic Abanto, Scott Camacho, Gil Camacho, Adam Speas, Dean Maleski, Devin Davis, Joseph Kersting, Josh Liner, Mike Williams, Oscar Galvez, and Paul Graves
"Take a Chance" "Clash Defiant" "Blip Stream" "Nowhere Land" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com), Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
#Neron #Hela #MarvelVsDC
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/dynamic-duel-dc-vs-marvel--5414543/support.
Join our community at https://patreon.com/dynamicduel
• 0:00:00 - Introduction
• 0:03:45 - No-Prize Time
• 0:06:43 - Question of the Week
• 0:07:22 - Neron vs Hela intro
• 0:10:36 - Neron history and abilities
• 0:19:42 - Hela history and abilities
• 0:29:10 - Fight speculation
• 0:36:45 - Duel results
• 0:39:31 - Sign off
Website: https://dynamicduel.com
Instagram: https://instagram.com/dynamicduelpodcast
Merch: https://dynamic-duel-shop.fourthwall.com/
Executive producers: John Starosky, Zachary Hepburn, Dustyn Balcom, Miggy Matanguihan, Nathaniel Wagner, Levi Yeaton, Austin Wesolowski, AJ Dunkerley, Nic Abanto, Scott Camacho, Gil Camacho, Adam Speas, Dean Maleski, Devin Davis, Joseph Kersting, Josh Liner, Mike Williams, Oscar Galvez, and Paul Graves
"Take a Chance" "Clash Defiant" "Blip Stream" "Nowhere Land" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com), Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
#Neron #Hela #MarvelVsDC
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/dynamic-duel-dc-vs-marvel--5414543/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
This is a DynaMic Network Podcast. Hi and welcometo the Dynamic Duel Podcast, a weekly show where we
(00:27):
review superhero films and debate thesuperiority between Marvel and DC by comparing
their characters in stat-based battlesimulations. I'm Marvelous Joe and I'm his twin
brother Johnny DC. And in this episode we're goingto find out who would win in a fight between the two
lords of the underworld, Neron from DC and Helafrom Marvel. Now listeners are probably familiar
(00:50):
with both of these characters. Hela was the mainantagonist in Dora Gnarok and Neron was a freaking
horrifying character in the Arrowverse. Oh Ididn't even know that he was in that show. Yeah
don't Google it, he looks freaking gross. I'mgoogling it right now, Neron Arrowverse. What the
(01:12):
fuck is that? Exactly. I regret googling that, youshould have warned me. I literally did. He doesn't
look anything like the comic book character. No.It's one of those weird Arrowverse adaptations.
Okay. Yeah basically it's a demon from hell versusthe Norse god of death. My money's on the Norse god
of death. Everybody knows that hell with two L's issuperior to hell with one. Before we get into that
(01:39):
matchup guys we're going to break down the latestcomic book movie news to come out from this past
week, uh which there was none. Likely becausewe're just coming off of New York Comic when the
studios gave their latest updates on all theexisting projects. So we'll have to wait a few more
weeks for more news. As always though we list oursegment times in our episode description so feel
free to check out the show notes if you want to skipahead to a particular topic. Our artificially
(02:03):
intelligent dual simulator AJ9K has a quickmessage for our listeners so listen up. Why hello
there. Do you want even more from this podcast?Then become a part of the dynamic dual community on
Patreon where you can choose from three tiers. Thedynamic 2.0 tier gives you access to our discord
chat server. The fantastic 4.0 tier gives you twobonus episodes each month and the X-Force tier
(02:25):
makes you an executive producer of this show.Lastly the Diner Mike podcast network tier lets
you create your own podcast using this Monte Carlosimulator. Johnny and Joe will help you develop
your show, provide graphic support andconsultation, and get you simulation results.
Pitch the twins your ideas via email atdynamicdualpodcast.com. Check it out at
(02:46):
patreon.com .pippip.chirio. Thanks AJ9K andthanks to everyone who supports the podcast. Guys
be sure to tune into the other shows in the DinerMike podcast network this week including the
console combat podcast where hosts John and Deansimulate battles between popular video game
characters. In yesterday's episode theyreviewed the film Silent Hill. Over on the Max
(03:09):
Destruction podcast hosts Scotty and Gilly paintyour favorite action heroes from film and
television against each other. On Wednesdaythey're going to find out who would win between
Wesley Snipes blade and Vlad from Dracula Untold.And on the Central World podcast hosts Zachary
Hepburn speculates on fights between fanfavorite anime and manga characters. In his
latest episode Zach revealed who would winbetween Whitebeard and Kanpachi both from one
(03:34):
piece. Visit dynamicpodcast.com or click thelink in our show notes to listen to all of the shows
in the Diner Mike podcast network. But with thatout of the way quick to the no prize. A no prize is an
award that Marvel used to give out to fans. Ourversion the dynamic dual no prize is a digital
award that we post on Instagram for the person thatwe feel gave the best answer to the question of the
(03:59):
week. Last week we asked you guys regarding theWonder Man and Bat Fam trailers both of which were
released during New York Comic Con. What the fuckdid I just watch wrong answers only. And we got no
answers for the first time in the history of thispodcast. I think no one called in with their
answer. I blame Jonathan entirely for that. Ithought it was a good question. I did think it would
(04:22):
be hard for people because it kind of requires somecreative thinking. Basically the prompt was to
rename the shows based off of your impressions ofeach series trailer. And since no one called in
with an answer this week's no prize is beingawarded to us. We're giving ourselves the prize.
I've always wanted to win a no prize. I've neverbeen eligible. I got to say it feels pretty damn
(04:45):
good. My answers for last week's question of theweek would have been for Wonder Man I would have
retitled it the Studio Season 2. And for Bat Fam Iwould have retitled it Gotham Knights Season 2
because it stars a cast of characters that no onegives a shit about. Given that we all thought it was
going to be a show about the Bat Family as we know ityou know with Nightwing and Red Hood and Batgirl
(05:08):
and things like that. And instead we're getting aBat Fam show with like the ghost of Ross Hallgool,
Man Bat and a bunch of characters whose names Ican't remember. Yeah just like that CW show that
lasted one season Gotham Knights featuringcharacters that no one knew and no one cared about.
That was a good pick. I also liked the Studio Season2 because that was just a fun show and I definitely
(05:30):
understand like that same behind-the-scenesapproach to Hollywood vibe that you're going for.
What would your answers have been? Well for WonderMan I would have I think that show is essentially
Bat Bluey because it looks like it's forpreschoolers and also I think if it was called Bat
(05:55):
Bluey people would actually watch it. That seemspretty harsh considering do you liked the Merry
Little Batman film? Well I did like it. I alsoacknowledged that that was for a younger
demographic so I mean that's not really an insult.I do want to make it clear to listeners that for as
much as we are questioning the initial trailersfor both of these series and maybe even that's not
(06:16):
to say that they're not going to be good. We may endup enjoying them once we watch them. In fact I'm
pretty sure that's going to be the case especiallyfor Wonder Man. Bat Fam I'm not so sure. I was going
to say the reverse. I'll probably enjoy Bat Famwith my children but Blunderman and Blah Blah Land
I don't even know if I'm going to tune in for that.Well that's your loss but congrats to us for
winning this week's No Prize. If you the listenerwant a shot at winning your own No Prize go to our
(06:40):
website and click that record button next time andthat brings us to our question of the week. Where
the fuck were you guys last week? Wrong answersonly. Yeah what were you guys doing last week? Not
calling in that's all I know. We want to hear aboutit. Give us your best excuse. Again wrong answers
(07:01):
only. Record your answer at dynamicdool.com byclicking on the red microphone button in the
bottom right hand corner of the screen which willprompt you to leave us a voicemail. Your message
could be up to 30 seconds long and don't forget toleave your name in case we include you on the
podcast. We'll pick our favorite answer and awardthat person a dynamic dual no prize that we'll post
to Instagram. Be sure to answer before October25th. But let's go ahead and get into the main event
(07:31):
of this episode where we find out who would win in afight between the Lord of Hell, Neron and the Queen
of Hell, Hela. Alright Neron versus Hela. Now thisepisode is actually an executive producer
(07:58):
special request from Brandon Estregard. Hewanted to find out who'd win in a fight between
these two characters and it was a great request forthe Halloween season considering that Neron is a
demon or devil from hell. I don't actually know toomuch about the character. He's a demon. A demon?
Okay so he's not like a mafisto? Um. Or I guessmafisto is a demon. Technically he's a hell lord.
(08:20):
Neron's a hell lord. Okay Hela is also a hell lord.She's considered one despite the fact that her
domain of the underworld only pertains toescardians and even then it only pertains to
escardians who have not died in battle becauseescardians who do die in battle go to Valhalla. So
it's not a place of torment. It's just nounderworld. No it's not like a realm of fire and
(08:45):
torture and suffering. It's just whereescardians go when they die. Okay that's lame. Not
nearly as metal as Neron. I am interested inlearning how powerful Neron is and how that
compares to Hela so let's go ahead and get into thebackstories. First to explain the methodology
behind our duels let's go to our sentient dualsimulator Alfred Jarvis 9000. AJ9K tell our
(09:07):
listeners how you go about determining a winner inour dual matchups. Yes of course sir. The way I
determine a winner between the contestants is byrunning 1000 Monte Carlo simulations using the
character's statistics. A Monte Carlosimulation is a probabilistic model used to
determine outcomes through random sampling. Inthis case I randomize the statistics along a
(09:27):
normal distribution as a way to simulate the manyvariables that can occur during battle. The stat
parameters are based on the official marvel powergrid from which the DC characters statistics are
extrapolated. Additional stat categories areincluded such as range, damage potential,
versatility and perception in order to create amore detailed and accurate simulation. The
(09:48):
results of the 1000 simulations provide apercentage of wins for each character. The
contestant with the higher percentage isdeclared the victor as they have a higher
probability to win any given battle. In anequitable pairing neither character should win
100% of the matches. The comic book stories haveshown that there's even a way for Batman to defeat
Superman so the confidence rate of my method fallsin line with the precedents that have been
(10:11):
established in the source material. Mymathematical simulations are without
subjectivity or bias. Feats are not the soleconsideration nor are fan votes tabulated for
determination of the winner. Thanks AJ9K. Beforewe run the simulations though we like to break down
each character's histories and abilities beforeimprovising a scenario on how we imagine one of the
(10:33):
1000 simulations would play out B for beat. Andit's my turn to go first with the DC characters
backstory so let me tell you all about Nier on. Inthe infernal depths of hell Nier on was once a
lesser demon whose cunning and ambition set himapart from his kin. Through deception and mastery
of infernal law he rose within the demonichierarchy, binding both fiends and mortals to his
(10:57):
will through perfectly worded bargains. Overcountless centuries he became renowned for
crafting covenants that damned their signerswhile strengthening his own dominion. To extend
his reach to the mortal realm he crafted blackcandles that when lit would summon him to the
bearer or draw the bearer to his court. Throughthese devices Nier on bartered for souls in
(11:20):
exchange for granting mortals their heartsdesires each packed designed to twist to his
advantage. His mastery of such dealings earnedhim titles among the damned. The wish weaver, the
lord of lies and the king of hate. From his throne inhell he turned his gaze toward earth preparing a
grand design to expand his infernal power beyondthe boundaries of his realm. Nier on initiated a
(11:44):
plan to unleash the underworld by appearing tofive of the flashes rogues. Captain cold, mirror
master, heatwave, weather wizard and captainboomerang convincing them to carry out
synchronized acts of destruction across theunited states. The five explosions arranged in
points of a pentagram killed the rogues in greenfire and opened a passage from hell to earth. You
(12:07):
can learn more about the rogues in their teen dualepisode against the brotherhood of mutants.
Emerging through the flames Nier on offeredcountless villains and even some heroes black
candles promising power or fulfillment inexchange for their souls. Dozens accepted
villains were transformed abilities magnifiedand desires granted. Nier on's true ambition
(12:29):
however was the corruption of a single pure soulwhose fall would magnify his dominion. Many
believed he sought superman but Nier on's trueprize was shazam. When the hero offered his soul to
save earth and his fellow heroes his selflessnessrendered the contract uncollectable. Bound by
the infernal law that required him to honor hisdeals exactly as written Nier on was forced to
(12:53):
release his claims. The trickster exploited theloophole and unraveling Nier on's network in
bargains and banishing him back to hell emptyhanded. Two years later Nier on resurfaced and
resurrected the same five rogues sending them toterrorize Keystone city. His true target was the
flash Wally West whom he drew into hell. RefusingWally soul Nier on instead demanded something
(13:17):
pure. His love for Linda Park. When Linda offeredher own soul to spare him Nier on intended to use
their combined essence to ascend heaven's gatesby channeling the speed force. But the purity of
their love corroded him and affecting his beingwith pity and compassion. Desperate to be rid of
the contamination he struck a new bargain. Herestored their love and lives in exchange for
(13:41):
bringing the rogues fully back from death. Nier onhonored the deal found vengeance against the
flash for the humiliation. You can learn moreabout Wally West in our flash versus speedball
episode. Soon after Nier on observed chaos in thecelestial order as the angel Asmodel rebelled
against heaven. Seeing opportunity he alliedwith Asmodel's army to seize heaven itself but at
(14:04):
the moment of the assault he withdrew supportwithout explanation and returned to hell. Not
long after Trickster again crossed his pathbinding Nier on in a new bargain that compelled him
to forget the rogues entirely. Nier on agreed andthe Trickster walked away as the one mortal who had
bested him twice. You can learn more aboutTrickster in his duel against Toad. When Etchigan
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manipulated Asmodel's punishment by fusing himwith the unhosted specter force hell erupted into
turmoil. The merging froze hell's fires andunleashed the damned upon the earth. Nier on used
Superman's body as a vessel to reach the mortalplane attempting to claim the specter force for
himself. The spirit chose hell Jordan instead andhell's princes punished Nier on for abusing
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hell's power for personal gain. They stripped himof his royal title and cursed him to speak in rhyme
demoting him to a lower demonic caste. Determinedto reclaim his crown Nier on trialed through time
to seize the souls of Barry Allen, Jason Todd andSuperman at the moments of their deaths. He
captured the first two but Superman's puritydefied him. When Nier on erased dead man's memory
(15:14):
to prevent interference the specter restored itexposing the scheme. Nier on failed but
maneuvered through infernal politics to regainhis powers and status. From hell's throne he
turned again toward earth. Nier on empoweredFelix Faust to masquerade as Dr. Fate luring Ralph
Dibney into a ritual that promised theresurrection of his wife Sue. When Nier on
(15:37):
appeared to claim Ralph's soul Ralph activated abinding circle that trapped them both inside the
tower of fate. Nier on killed him only to find thebinding unbreakable by any but its creator.
Eventually Nier on escaped and resumed hisbargains transforming Eddie Bloomberg into a
demonic metihuman known as Kid Devil. Nier on'spact was conditional if Eddie lost faith in blue
(16:01):
devil his soul would be forfeit at age 18. Yearslater Eddie discovered blue devils and winning
role in his aunt's death and lost faith fulfillingNier on's expectation. War soon erupted in the
underworld when Blaze and Satanus the twin rulersof purgatory invaded hell promising hope and
redemption to the damned. Nier on rallied hisarmies summoning Lilith's monstrous offspring
(16:24):
to his side as victory neared Satanus unleashed amodified demon plague activated by the word
Shazam. The spell transformed demons intosoulless humans perjuring centuries of devoured
entities from Nier on's body. Script of power hewas beheaded and Blaze usurped her brother to
claim hell's throne. Though dethroned Nier on'sinfluence persisted through artifacts he had
(16:48):
forged on earth including Ocean Master's Tridentand a get out of hell free card that circulated
among mortals desperate to cheat damnation. Inpost flashpoint continuity Nier on claimed
hell's throne after Lucifer abdicated and set hissights on earth once more. He overthrew Papa
Midnight's operations and repurposedMidnight's New York City club as a conduit for his
(17:10):
growing influence intent on seizing control ofNew York as the first step in conquering the world.
When he trapped both Midnight and JohnConstantine in hell Constantine escaped and
dismantled Nier on's plan by exploiting aloophole in Nier on's own hex forcing the demon
back to his realm. You can learn more aboutConstantine in our John Constantine vs brother
(17:32):
voodoo episode. Later Nier on captured the solarpowered hero Apollo and imprisoned him within his
palace baiting his partner Midnighter into hellfor a direct confrontation. Midnighter fought
through demonic hordes and engines of torment tofree Apollo ultimately defeating Nier on in
personal combat and costing Nier on his captiveprize. When the great darkness rose to consume the
(17:55):
multiverse Nier on was among the infernal lordsenslaved to its will forming parts of the dark army
that clashed with the Justice League. After theheroes severed the darkness's link to reality and
later purged its new host Nier on and the otherswere freed from its control. In time Nier on was
dethroned by Raven who restored order to helldisplaced again Nier on resumed his dealings in
(18:20):
the shadows crafting new packs leaving infernalcontracts and searching for the next soul whose
fall might restore his supremacy and that's Nieron's backstory powers wise Nier on is one of the
most powerful demon lords of hell possessing vaststrength and durability he can manipulate
reality through sorcery unleash hellfire andeldritch force and assume either a regal humanoid
(18:43):
guise or his true form a green tentacled mass he canfly teleport and conjure artifacts of immense
power including weapons his defining ability iscontract magic he grants power transformation or
resurrection to mortals in exchange for theirsouls within his own realm this power grows
(19:04):
exponentially and he will reform there if slainmaking him immortal so is he shumagorath in his
true form not with like the giant eyeball oranything like that it's more just like a chunky
green mass gross you know hella has a true form aswell if her headdress is ever removed she was
(19:26):
actually born like half dead and half alive so likehalf of her is beautiful but the other half is
basically like a zombie that's her true forminteresting she's severely weakened when in that
state so her headdress is her weakness i will takenote yeah nieran's not gonna know that but let me
tell you more about hella in her backstory hellawas mystically born in joenheim the land of the
(19:48):
giants as the daughter of the giantess engerbotaand the trickster god Loki whom you can learn more
about in his duel with aries some myths claim hellawas the offspring of an earlier incarnation of
odin but all accounts agree that she was born halfdead her body split between life and decay as she
came of age odin appointed her the goddess of deathgranting her dominion over two of the nine realms
(20:12):
hell the land of the dead and niflheim the land ofeternal mist and shadow cloaked in garments that
concealed her half-rotted massage she appearedas a darkly beautiful woman when veiled but
beneath the cloak was the withered form of deathitself the garment held Hela held her power and
vitality, without it, she became weak and frail.Though Hela's role was to guide souls of
(20:34):
Asgardians and their followers to the afterlife,her ambition soon exceeded her station. She
sought to extend her dominion to Valhalla, therealm of honored warriors slain in battle, and
longed to claim the souls of Odin and his son Thor.During one of their earliest encounters, she
appeared before Thor when he offered his own lifeto spare Lady Sif, and impressed by his nobility,
(20:55):
Hela allowed them both to live. Yet herfascination with Thor persisted, often walking
the line between adversary and reluctantadmirer. You can learn more about Thor in his duel
against Wonder Woman. In time, Hela's hunger forpower grew. She stole a fragment of Odin's soul
during his slumber upon the Sea of Eternal Night,using it to create a cosmic entity called
(21:16):
Infinity. The being nearly unmade existencebefore Hela was defeated by Thor's sacrifice and
Odin's intervention. Though Odin slew her to endher threat, he was persuaded by Thor to resurrect
her, restoring the balance between life anddeath. Hela continued to test the gods resolve,
once slaying Thor only to restore him when Sifoffered her own life in his place. When the
(21:39):
monstrous mangog killed Odin, Hela clashed withPluto, the Olympian god of death, over the right to
claim Odin's soul. To deny Pluto the victory, sherevived Odin herself. Later, alongside Loki, she
attempted to trigger Ragnarok, the apocalypticrebirth of Asgard, by slaying Thor's friend Baldr
(22:00):
and unleashing an army of monsters upon the realm.Odin thwarted her scheme, but her obsession with
the prophesied end of the gods endured. Hela'sauthority was challenged by O'Larris, the
unmerciful and Asgardian military commander whosought to usurp her throne in Hell. The conflict
drew the attention of the superhero team, thedefenders, who aided her in repelling O'Larris
(22:20):
and restoring order to Valhalla. She laterconspired with Loki and the war god Tyr against
Odin and joined the Hell Lords, Mephisto, Pluto,and Satanish in merging their netherworlds to
consolidate power. Their union awakened thegod-eater Demogorge, who devoured Hela and the
others before being destroyed by Thor, restoringher once again. Throughout these eras, Hela's
(22:44):
realm served as both prison and battlefield fordivine souls. She commissioned the construction
of Naglfar, a massive ship built from thefingernails of the dead intended to carry her army
across the Nine Realms during Ragnarok. Yetbefore it could sail, it was destroyed by Scourge,
the executioner who defied her tyranny to savemortal souls. Hela's repeated attempts to claim
(23:06):
Thor's life culminated when she cursed him so thathis wounds would never heal and his body could
never die. After a brutal battle with the Midgardserpent left him mangled, Thor entered Hell
within the armor of the destroyer and forced Helato lift the curse, restoring his body and trapping
the destroyer in her realm as a warning. Even so,she continued to meddle with mortal and divine
(23:28):
affairs, at times battling Mephisto for the rightto claim Thor's soul. You can learn more about
Mephisto in his duel against Sandman. When Odinentered the Odin's sleep, Hela seized the
opportunity to expand her influence, corruptingthe Valkyria and turning them into fire demons.
Among them was Mirage of the new mutants whorebelled against her queen. With help from the
(23:50):
dwarven King Ytri and the young mutants, Hela'sUruforge sword called the Night Sword was
destroyed, and Odin was spared. You can learn moreabout Mirage and Valkyria in their respective
duels against Aeroet and Powergirl. WhenRagnarok brought about the fall of the Nine
Realms, including Hel in Niflheim, Loki awakenedher in Immortal Guies in Las Vegas. There, she
(24:14):
resumed feeding on human souls and aided Loki inhis schemes. During this period, she attended
councils with Mephisto, Dormammu, and other HellLords, often shifting alliances based on
convenience and survival. Her presence drew theattention of mutant allies when Mirage sought her
aid in battle, gaining from Hela a sword and steedthat allowed her to defeat Ares. Around the same
(24:36):
time, Hela accepted the soul of Primhari, the WolfPrince of Asgard, who bargained his own life to
save his mortal lover and unborn child. AfterAsgard was destroyed during an invasion led by
Norman Osborn, whom you can learn more about in ourJoker vs Green Goblin duel, many Asgardian souls
were left without a resting place. With no realm toclaim them, the cursed Valkyries, known as the
(24:59):
Dessir, began feasting on their spirits. Lokiapproached Hela with an offer to restore her
dominion. By bargaining with Mephisto, hegranted her a portion of Hell to rule for 1,001
years, forming a new Hell, single L, and savingcountless Asgardian souls from oblivion. In
exchange, Hela erased Loki's name from the booksof Hell, freeing him from his predestined death.
(25:23):
Soon after, the Dessir turned on Hela and attackedher new domain. In the ensuing battle, her hand was
severed and she was forced to absorb the dead intoher body to shield them. With the aid of Thor and
Tyr, Hela repelled the Dessir, though theconflict left her weakened. She later made a pact
with Loki and Mephisto during the rise of Odin'sbrother, Kul Borson, aka the Serpent, ensuring
(25:45):
her realm's protection and pledging her servantsto Loki's cause. When peace returned, she
regained the true Hell and reclaimed her place asits ruler. After Loki restored Hela's severed
hand with the power of the Holy Grail, Hela facedAngela, the lost daughter of Odin and Freya, in
combat. Angela had descended into Hell to free herlover, Sera, and overcame the Death Goddess. She
(26:08):
seized Hela's crown and took her place as Queen ofHell, before abdicating the throne to Balder.
Stripped of power and seeking vengeance, Helaallied herself with Thanos, the Mad Titan,
offering him the one thing he desired most, deathitself, in exchange for his aid in reclaiming her
realm. You can learn more about Thanos and his duelagainst Darkseid. Together with the Black Order,
(26:31):
Hela stole into the collector's vault to retrievea version of Thor's hammer, Mjolnir, from a dead
universe, only to fail. Returning empty-handed,Hela slew Proxima midnight before Thanos as proof
of her worth and sealed their alliance with a kiss.You can learn more about the Black Order in their
duel against Darkseid's elite. However, Hela'spact with Thanos eventually brought ruin. When
(26:54):
she sought to resurrect him after his death, Helasucceeded in restoring Thanos' body, but his
consciousness was fractured, his mind leftbroken by the failed resurrection. During the
battle against the Guardians of the Galaxy thatfollowed on nowhere, Hela commandeered a weapon
capable of creating a black hole. Upon firing it,she was caught in the black hole's collapse,
(27:14):
vanishing alongside Thanos into oblivion. Youcan learn more about the Guardians of the Galaxy in
their duel against Doom Patrol. Hela survived thevoid and clawed her way back into existence,
reclaiming her throne in Hell. She later joinedforces with Camilla, Queen of the Norns, to defend
the realm from Cinder, Queen of Cinders, during awar among the realms. For strategic reasons, she
(27:36):
and Balder agreed to a ceremonial marriage,though Carnilla ultimately bound herself to Hela
in Balder's place, joining the two as reluctantco-rulers. Together they ruled Hell in an uneasy
alliance. You can learn more about Malekith in hisduel against Eclipso. When the Cult of Null on
Earth attempted to resurrect the Symbiote God,she seized his weakened form and siphoned his
(27:58):
power, seeking to command the living darknessitself and seize control of the Symbiotes. You can
learn more about Null in his duel against WhiteLantern. And that's her backstory thus far.
Powers-wise, Hela has as Guardian Physiology andDark Magic as the Goddess of Death. She has
God-level strength, able to lift over 100 tons.She can teleport, run over 100 miles per hour, has
(28:21):
vast durability, and is immortal. She can fly,astral project, cast illusions, manipulate
magical energies into blasts or weaponconstructs that can kill even an Asgardian God.
Her power over life and death can kill others with asimple touch. She is formidable in hand-to-hand
and weapons combat, particularly with her NightSword, which is forged of the same Uru metal that
(28:44):
Thor's Hammer Mjolnir is made of. And that's Hela.Is there anything special about the Night Sword
besides it being forged from Uru? I mean, she cankill people with it. That's lame. So it's just a
plain-ass sword? It's a fucking durable-asssword, and she has all these other magical
abilities in conjunction with this badass sword.I mean, kinda. She's basically Nier on. Don't say
(29:07):
that. That's rude. What a rip-off. In a world wherefantasies collide and heroes clash, one podcast
network rises above the rest. Prepare yourselffor the ultimate showdowns in comic books, video
games, movies, and anime. The Dynamite PodcastNetwork presents Console Combat, where video
(29:33):
game legends brawl every Monday. Dynamic Duel,where comic book titans smash every Tuesday. Max
Destruction, where TV and action heroes battleevery Wednesday. And Cendro World, where anime
champions clash every Thursday. Join us as wespeculate on the matches and armed with the power
of mathematical simulations discover who willemerge victorious. Visit dynamicpodcast.com
(29:59):
where we settle the debate and settle the score.Now that we've got their histories and abilities
out of the way, let's speculate on how one of the1000 simulated matches will go. The winner is
determined by simulations, not the speculation,but it's fun to imagine how this fight could play
out. AJ9K, what are the rules of our speculation?Well I should say there are no rules, other than the
(30:23):
characters have no prior knowledge of the othergoing into the fight. All they are aware of
starting out is that the other character is athreat that needs to be eliminated. For the
speculation, the contestants will beginapproximately 50 meters apart in a non-descript
environment that will have no bearing on the matchitself, as no environmental statistics are
considered in my simulations. The contestantsmust earn victory on their own merit. Alright then
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let's get into it. Neron and Hela meet on thebattlefield. Who goes first? I think before even
fighting that Neron is probably going to offerHela what she's always wanted, a way to obtain
Thor's soul. And to help her with that, he's goingto present her with a black candle that transforms
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into a glowing green hammer called, let's say, B.Olner. And that's like 10 times more powerful than
Mjolnir and it shoots green lightning becausethat's cooler. A hammer that's 10 times more
powerful than Mjolnir? Yeah. Well, what happensif she takes it? What does she give up? That's for
Neron to know and for Hela to not find out until it'stoo late. So he's just going to present this as a
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present to her? Yeah. I don't deny that she wouldprobably be tempted by the offer just for that much
power. She'd probably take him up on it actually.So she grabs the green hammer, Bjolnir, whatever.
She grabs Bjolnir and just wallops the shit out ofNeron with it once she gets it. What an idiot. Okay.
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She tries to, but Neron, he's going to gointangible. So he's just laughing as the hammer
swings through him just time after time. And eachtime she swings, that actually is going to drain
Hela's soul, weakening her while Neron gains herstrength. And that was the twist on his offer. The
hammer drains her rather than empowering her. Andwith her weakened, that's when he is going to
(32:19):
straight up uppercut her and she's going to goflying towards the horizon, dropping Bjolnir.
Okay. Well, first of all, Hela knew that some shadyshit was going to go down. Okay. Obviously she's
dealing with the demon, wildswood, your enemygrant you power. So this was all just a test. Like
she split her soul, a fraction of it off beforetaking the hammer. So Neron may have drained like
(32:43):
1% of her soul's power, but she has power to spare.So instead of getting knocked to the horizon, when
Neron hits her, her body just explodes into a hugeflock of crows. That just fly back together again
and they're going to reform back into Hela with 99%of her soul intact. Wait, wait, she can split her
soul? Yeah. She's done it quite a few times in thecomics. Oh, it's like a Horcrux thing. Uh, no, not
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really. Okay. Well, Neron's probably pissed thathis bargain backfired. We'll say that with the
contract avoided, Bjolnir is just going to meltlike candle wax. That's fine. Hela didn't need the
hammer. She has her own night sword. So she's goingto manifest it in her hand and she just flies
forward lunging at Neron and just running thesword right through his torso. Oh dang. Okay. So
(33:33):
Neron is impaled by the night sword, but thesegreen flames are going to be flicking out of the
sword's entry and exit points because Neron'shate is so hot that it's going to cause the night
sword to burn Hela's hand. That's going to forceher to let go of it. And that's when Neron's going to
pull out the sword from his torso and he's going toimbue her weapon with sentience, transforming it
(33:58):
into this Uru armored hell knight that startsattacking Hela with its sword arms. Okay. A
sentient sword hell knight. Hela's going to blockthe hell knight's attacks with a magic eldritch
shield, but then she summons her own warrior, thisgiant spider from her realm of hell. Think like
(34:18):
Shalob from Return of the King. That spideractually serves as a warden in her realm and the
spider's going to web up this hell knight so that itcan't even use its swords. Okay. Well, I mean, if
Hela's going to start conjuring beings from herrealm, Neron, he's going to summon the four
horsemen of the apocalypse and they're going tocircle this giant spider on their horses and just
(34:41):
stab it to death before charging Hela and doing thesame. No, except Hela has her own steed and she
rises up on it. It's this 15 foot tall wolf, Fenriswolf, who's just going to pounce on these tiny ass
horsemen and rip them apart just like how a wolfwould do to a herd of baby deer. Oh, you think Fenris
is big? Yeah. Neron's going to mount a fuckinggiant 50 foot dragon that's going to blast Fenris
(35:05):
and Hela with a blast of green hellfire justdisintegrating them. Fenris will be fine. Hela
leaps off of him so the wolf gets the brunt of theblast. He has a healing factor, but Hela summons a
group of giant rock trolls from hell and their skinare like immune to fire, right? And they just beat
the dragon to death and Neron with their rock clubsand axes. Okay. Well, like Hela, Neron's going to
(35:31):
leap off the dragon before he's also attacked andhe's going to cause these iron chains like burning
with green flame to shoot up from the ground andwrap around the rock trolls and Hela, pulling them
down into hell where they'll be trapped andtormented for eternity. That's ending this
match. So Hela's in hell, Neron's hell. So what shedoes then is she's going to summon the souls from
(35:58):
her hell into Neron's hell. And because theAsgardians are all badasses with more strength
and fighting skill than Neron's weak ass souls,Hela and her undead army kill all the souls in
Neron's hell and so he gets weakened and thenkilled. I mean, I've got to have strength in
(36:20):
numbers, you'd think. Doesn't matter, even ifthat's the case, as guardians are badass Vikings.
I mean, all the real badasses went to Valhallathough. So Hela's squad is the JV team. It'll be
enough. It'll be enough. A great disagree. We'llleave it there. Either the souls in Neron's hell
overpower the souls in Hela's hell or vice versa.Let's go ahead and input the stats on these two
(36:46):
characters, run the simulations and come backwith a winner. AJ9K, hit it. Inputting data,
running calculations, processing results,simulations complete. All right, I thought last
week was a good matchup. This matchup betweenNeron and Hela, I think, is even better. These guys
are so close. Like, they're the same when it comesto speed and invasiveness, damage level, range
(37:10):
and versatility, but they had enough differencesto make things interesting. Yeah, we said that
Neron is slightly more perceptive because he cansee a person's desires and that's what he exploits
in his bargains with them. Yeah, we also said thatmakes him smarter because he's a little bit more
crafty and cunning in that regard. But we said thatHela was not only a better fighter, but she was also
(37:33):
better physically in terms of durability andstrength because while Neron does have demon
physiology, the dude lost to Midnighter and whenhe goes up against foes like Superman, his
strength is often bolstered through magic. Yeah,so between the differences in their brains and
brawn, they were able to cancel each other out for atruly even match. So taking all of these stats into
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consideration, Joseph, who do you think is comingout on top? Hela. You would. Well, Instagram
wouldn't. I'm guessing largely because you gotthe poll up Hela late because Neron is beating Hela
65% to 35% in that poll, meaning more people thinkthat Neron's going to win. It's okay to be wrong
(38:18):
though. That's surprising. I did not see thatcoming. I was pretty confident Hela was going to
get the popularity vote. Yeah, me too. Well, let'sfind out who's correct. AG9K, the results please.
Here you are, sir. The winner of the matchupbetween Neron and Hela is Hela. Oh yeah, baby. Me by
(38:41):
51.4% or 514 of the 1000 matches compared toNeron's 48.6%. Wow, that's almost a coin toss.
That is a coin toss. Considering the way theydiffered in stats, I'm surprised it came out to be
this close. Well, like I said, they kind of evenedeach other out when it came to brains and brawn.
(39:01):
Usually a win rate lower than 52.5% of the matches Iconsider a coin toss where if you ran another 1000
simulations, you might get a different resultbecause it's just that close. But let's not do
that. I mean, we could. But let's not. Fine.Congrats to Hela. Congrats to the Marvel fans.
We're on a streak now, guys. It's been a while. Astreak of two. That's not a streak. It's a streak,
(39:25):
baby. We're just going to keep it rolling. Keep itrolling all the way into January. That does it for
this dual episode. H.A .9K, help close this up.Thanks for listening to Dynamic Dual. Visit the
show's website at dynamicdual.com and follow uson Instagram at Dynamic Dual podcast. You can
support the show on Patreon at patreon.com slashdynamicdual and joining a tier that works for you
(39:49):
or by rating and reviewing Dynamic Dual on Applepodcasts, Spotify, Podchaser or on our website.
Don't forget to listen to the other shows in theDynamite podcast network, including Max
Destruction, Senjo World and Console Combat. Inour next episode, which is dropping days before
Halloween, we are going to bring you a specialspooky episode where we pit the House of Mystery
(40:14):
against the Crypt of Shadows. Yeah, this is aspecial dual request. It's going to be a team duel
between seven supernatural and mystic users fromDC and Marvel. But we're going to tie in some like
tales of the crypt goodness in there. It'll be a lotof fun. But that does it for this episode. We want to
give a big thanks to our executive producers, JohnStarosky, Zachary Hepburn, Dustin Belcom,
(40:35):
Mickey Methegien, Nathaniel Wagner, Levi Yatyn,Austin Wieselowski, AJ Dunkerley, Nick Ibonto,
Scott Camacho, Gil Camacho, Adam Spees, DeanMaleski, Devin Davis, Joseph Kirsting, Mike
Williams and Paul Graves for helping make thispodcast possible. We'll talk to you guys next
week. Up, up and away. True believers.
This is a DynaMic Network Podcast. Hi and welcometo the Dynamic Duel Podcast, a weekly show where we
(00:27):
review superhero films and debate thesuperiority between Marvel and DC by comparing
their characters in stat-based battlesimulations. I'm Marvelous Joe and I'm his twin
brother Johnny DC. And in this episode we're goingto find out who would win in a fight between the two
lords of the underworld, Neron from DC and Helafrom Marvel. Now listeners are probably familiar
(00:50):
with both of these characters. Hela was the mainantagonist in Dora Gnarok and Neron was a freaking
horrifying character in the Arrowverse. Oh Ididn't even know that he was in that show. Yeah
don't Google it, he looks freaking gross. I'mgoogling it right now, Neron Arrowverse. What the
(01:12):
fuck is that? Exactly. I regret googling that, youshould have warned me. I literally did. He doesn't
look anything like the comic book character. No.It's one of those weird Arrowverse adaptations.
Okay. Yeah basically it's a demon from hell versusthe Norse god of death. My money's on the Norse god
of death. Everybody knows that hell with two L's issuperior to hell with one. Before we get into that
(01:39):
matchup guys we're going to break down the latestcomic book movie news to come out from this past
week, uh which there was none. Likely becausewe're just coming off of New York Comic when the
studios gave their latest updates on all theexisting projects. So we'll have to wait a few more
weeks for more news. As always though we list oursegment times in our episode description so feel
free to check out the show notes if you want to skipahead to a particular topic. Our artificially
(02:03):
intelligent dual simulator AJ9K has a quickmessage for our listeners so listen up. Why hello
there. Do you want even more from this podcast?Then become a part of the dynamic dual community on
Patreon where you can choose from three tiers. Thedynamic 2.0 tier gives you access to our discord
chat server. The fantastic 4.0 tier gives you twobonus episodes each month and the X-Force tier
(02:25):
makes you an executive producer of this show.Lastly the Diner Mike podcast network tier lets
you create your own podcast using this Monte Carlosimulator. Johnny and Joe will help you develop
your show, provide graphic support andconsultation, and get you simulation results.
Pitch the twins your ideas via email atdynamicdualpodcast.com. Check it out at
(02:46):
patreon.com .pippip.chirio. Thanks AJ9K andthanks to everyone who supports the podcast. Guys
be sure to tune into the other shows in the DinerMike podcast network this week including the
console combat podcast where hosts John and Deansimulate battles between popular video game
characters. In yesterday's episode theyreviewed the film Silent Hill. Over on the Max
(03:09):
Destruction podcast hosts Scotty and Gilly paintyour favorite action heroes from film and
television against each other. On Wednesdaythey're going to find out who would win between
Wesley Snipes blade and Vlad from Dracula Untold.And on the Central World podcast hosts Zachary
Hepburn speculates on fights between fanfavorite anime and manga characters. In his
latest episode Zach revealed who would winbetween Whitebeard and Kanpachi both from one
(03:34):
piece. Visit dynamicpodcast.com or click thelink in our show notes to listen to all of the shows
in the Diner Mike podcast network. But with thatout of the way quick to the no prize. A no prize is an
award that Marvel used to give out to fans. Ourversion the dynamic dual no prize is a digital
award that we post on Instagram for the person thatwe feel gave the best answer to the question of the
(03:59):
week. Last week we asked you guys regarding theWonder Man and Bat Fam trailers both of which were
released during New York Comic Con. What the fuckdid I just watch wrong answers only. And we got no
answers for the first time in the history of thispodcast. I think no one called in with their
answer. I blame Jonathan entirely for that. Ithought it was a good question. I did think it would
(04:22):
be hard for people because it kind of requires somecreative thinking. Basically the prompt was to
rename the shows based off of your impressions ofeach series trailer. And since no one called in
with an answer this week's no prize is beingawarded to us. We're giving ourselves the prize.
I've always wanted to win a no prize. I've neverbeen eligible. I got to say it feels pretty damn
(04:45):
good. My answers for last week's question of theweek would have been for Wonder Man I would have
retitled it the Studio Season 2. And for Bat Fam Iwould have retitled it Gotham Knights Season 2
because it stars a cast of characters that no onegives a shit about. Given that we all thought it was
going to be a show about the Bat Family as we know ityou know with Nightwing and Red Hood and Batgirl
(05:08):
and things like that. And instead we're getting aBat Fam show with like the ghost of Ross Hallgool,
Man Bat and a bunch of characters whose names Ican't remember. Yeah just like that CW show that
lasted one season Gotham Knights featuringcharacters that no one knew and no one cared about.
That was a good pick. I also liked the Studio Season2 because that was just a fun show and I definitely
(05:30):
understand like that same behind-the-scenesapproach to Hollywood vibe that you're going for.
What would your answers have been? Well for WonderMan I would have I think that show is essentially
Bat Bluey because it looks like it's forpreschoolers and also I think if it was called Bat
(05:55):
Bluey people would actually watch it. That seemspretty harsh considering do you liked the Merry
Little Batman film? Well I did like it. I alsoacknowledged that that was for a younger
demographic so I mean that's not really an insult.I do want to make it clear to listeners that for as
much as we are questioning the initial trailersfor both of these series and maybe even that's not
(06:16):
to say that they're not going to be good. We may endup enjoying them once we watch them. In fact I'm
pretty sure that's going to be the case especiallyfor Wonder Man. Bat Fam I'm not so sure. I was going
to say the reverse. I'll probably enjoy Bat Famwith my children but Blunderman and Blah Blah Land
I don't even know if I'm going to tune in for that.Well that's your loss but congrats to us for
winning this week's No Prize. If you the listenerwant a shot at winning your own No Prize go to our
(06:40):
website and click that record button next time andthat brings us to our question of the week. Where
the fuck were you guys last week? Wrong answersonly. Yeah what were you guys doing last week? Not
calling in that's all I know. We want to hear aboutit. Give us your best excuse. Again wrong answers
(07:01):
only. Record your answer at dynamicdool.com byclicking on the red microphone button in the
bottom right hand corner of the screen which willprompt you to leave us a voicemail. Your message
could be up to 30 seconds long and don't forget toleave your name in case we include you on the
podcast. We'll pick our favorite answer and awardthat person a dynamic dual no prize that we'll post
to Instagram. Be sure to answer before October25th. But let's go ahead and get into the main event
(07:31):
of this episode where we find out who would win in afight between the Lord of Hell, Neron and the Queen
of Hell, Hela. Alright Neron versus Hela. Now thisepisode is actually an executive producer
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special request from Brandon Estregard. Hewanted to find out who'd win in a fight between
these two characters and it was a great request forthe Halloween season considering that Neron is a
demon or devil from hell. I don't actually know toomuch about the character. He's a demon. A demon?
Okay so he's not like a mafisto? Um. Or I guessmafisto is a demon. Technically he's a hell lord.
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Neron's a hell lord. Okay Hela is also a hell lord.She's considered one despite the fact that her
domain of the underworld only pertains toescardians and even then it only pertains to
escardians who have not died in battle becauseescardians who do die in battle go to Valhalla. So
it's not a place of torment. It's just nounderworld. No it's not like a realm of fire and
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torture and suffering. It's just whereescardians go when they die. Okay that's lame. Not
nearly as metal as Neron. I am interested inlearning how powerful Neron is and how that
compares to Hela so let's go ahead and get into thebackstories. First to explain the methodology
behind our duels let's go to our sentient dualsimulator Alfred Jarvis 9000. AJ9K tell our
(09:07):
listeners how you go about determining a winner inour dual matchups. Yes of course sir. The way I
determine a winner between the contestants is byrunning 1000 Monte Carlo simulations using the
character's statistics. A Monte Carlosimulation is a probabilistic model used to
determine outcomes through random sampling. Inthis case I randomize the statistics along a
(09:27):
normal distribution as a way to simulate the manyvariables that can occur during battle. The stat
parameters are based on the official marvel powergrid from which the DC characters statistics are
extrapolated. Additional stat categories areincluded such as range, damage potential,
versatility and perception in order to create amore detailed and accurate simulation. The
(09:48):
results of the 1000 simulations provide apercentage of wins for each character. The
contestant with the higher percentage isdeclared the victor as they have a higher
probability to win any given battle. In anequitable pairing neither character should win
100% of the matches. The comic book stories haveshown that there's even a way for Batman to defeat
Superman so the confidence rate of my method fallsin line with the precedents that have been
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established in the source material. Mymathematical simulations are without
subjectivity or bias. Feats are not the soleconsideration nor are fan votes tabulated for
determination of the winner. Thanks AJ9K. Beforewe run the simulations though we like to break down
each character's histories and abilities beforeimprovising a scenario on how we imagine one of the
(10:33):
1000 simulations would play out B for beat. Andit's my turn to go first with the DC characters
backstory so let me tell you all about Nier on. Inthe infernal depths of hell Nier on was once a
lesser demon whose cunning and ambition set himapart from his kin. Through deception and mastery
of infernal law he rose within the demonichierarchy, binding both fiends and mortals to his
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will through perfectly worded bargains. Overcountless centuries he became renowned for
crafting covenants that damned their signerswhile strengthening his own dominion. To extend
his reach to the mortal realm he crafted blackcandles that when lit would summon him to the
bearer or draw the bearer to his court. Throughthese devices Nier on bartered for souls in
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exchange for granting mortals their heartsdesires each packed designed to twist to his
advantage. His mastery of such dealings earnedhim titles among the damned. The wish weaver, the
lord of lies and the king of hate. From his throne inhell he turned his gaze toward earth preparing a
grand design to expand his infernal power beyondthe boundaries of his realm. Nier on initiated a
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plan to unleash the underworld by appearing tofive of the flashes rogues. Captain cold, mirror
master, heatwave, weather wizard and captainboomerang convincing them to carry out
synchronized acts of destruction across theunited states. The five explosions arranged in
points of a pentagram killed the rogues in greenfire and opened a passage from hell to earth. You
(12:07):
can learn more about the rogues in their teen dualepisode against the brotherhood of mutants.
Emerging through the flames Nier on offeredcountless villains and even some heroes black
candles promising power or fulfillment inexchange for their souls. Dozens accepted
villains were transformed abilities magnifiedand desires granted. Nier on's true ambition
(12:29):
however was the corruption of a single pure soulwhose fall would magnify his dominion. Many
believed he sought superman but Nier on's trueprize was shazam. When the hero offered his soul to
save earth and his fellow heroes his selflessnessrendered the contract uncollectable. Bound by
the infernal law that required him to honor hisdeals exactly as written Nier on was forced to
(12:53):
release his claims. The trickster exploited theloophole and unraveling Nier on's network in
bargains and banishing him back to hell emptyhanded. Two years later Nier on resurfaced and
resurrected the same five rogues sending them toterrorize Keystone city. His true target was the
flash Wally West whom he drew into hell. RefusingWally soul Nier on instead demanded something
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pure. His love for Linda Park. When Linda offeredher own soul to spare him Nier on intended to use
their combined essence to ascend heaven's gatesby channeling the speed force. But the purity of
their love corroded him and affecting his beingwith pity and compassion. Desperate to be rid of
the contamination he struck a new bargain. Herestored their love and lives in exchange for
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bringing the rogues fully back from death. Nier onhonored the deal found vengeance against the
flash for the humiliation. You can learn moreabout Wally West in our flash versus speedball
episode. Soon after Nier on observed chaos in thecelestial order as the angel Asmodel rebelled
against heaven. Seeing opportunity he alliedwith Asmodel's army to seize heaven itself but at
(14:04):
the moment of the assault he withdrew supportwithout explanation and returned to hell. Not
long after Trickster again crossed his pathbinding Nier on in a new bargain that compelled him
to forget the rogues entirely. Nier on agreed andthe Trickster walked away as the one mortal who had
bested him twice. You can learn more aboutTrickster in his duel against Toad. When Etchigan
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manipulated Asmodel's punishment by fusing himwith the unhosted specter force hell erupted into
turmoil. The merging froze hell's fires andunleashed the damned upon the earth. Nier on used
Superman's body as a vessel to reach the mortalplane attempting to claim the specter force for
himself. The spirit chose hell Jordan instead andhell's princes punished Nier on for abusing
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hell's power for personal gain. They stripped himof his royal title and cursed him to speak in rhyme
demoting him to a lower demonic caste. Determinedto reclaim his crown Nier on trialed through time
to seize the souls of Barry Allen, Jason Todd andSuperman at the moments of their deaths. He
captured the first two but Superman's puritydefied him. When Nier on erased dead man's memory
(15:14):
to prevent interference the specter restored itexposing the scheme. Nier on failed but
maneuvered through infernal politics to regainhis powers and status. From hell's throne he
turned again toward earth. Nier on empoweredFelix Faust to masquerade as Dr. Fate luring Ralph
Dibney into a ritual that promised theresurrection of his wife Sue. When Nier on
(15:37):
appeared to claim Ralph's soul Ralph activated abinding circle that trapped them both inside the
tower of fate. Nier on killed him only to find thebinding unbreakable by any but its creator.
Eventually Nier on escaped and resumed hisbargains transforming Eddie Bloomberg into a
demonic metihuman known as Kid Devil. Nier on'spact was conditional if Eddie lost faith in blue
(16:01):
devil his soul would be forfeit at age 18. Yearslater Eddie discovered blue devils and winning
role in his aunt's death and lost faith fulfillingNier on's expectation. War soon erupted in the
underworld when Blaze and Satanus the twin rulersof purgatory invaded hell promising hope and
redemption to the damned. Nier on rallied hisarmies summoning Lilith's monstrous offspring
(16:24):
to his side as victory neared Satanus unleashed amodified demon plague activated by the word
Shazam. The spell transformed demons intosoulless humans perjuring centuries of devoured
entities from Nier on's body. Script of power hewas beheaded and Blaze usurped her brother to
claim hell's throne. Though dethroned Nier on'sinfluence persisted through artifacts he had
(16:48):
forged on earth including Ocean Master's Tridentand a get out of hell free card that circulated
among mortals desperate to cheat damnation. Inpost flashpoint continuity Nier on claimed
hell's throne after Lucifer abdicated and set hissights on earth once more. He overthrew Papa
Midnight's operations and repurposedMidnight's New York City club as a conduit for his
(17:10):
growing influence intent on seizing control ofNew York as the first step in conquering the world.
When he trapped both Midnight and JohnConstantine in hell Constantine escaped and
dismantled Nier on's plan by exploiting aloophole in Nier on's own hex forcing the demon
back to his realm. You can learn more aboutConstantine in our John Constantine vs brother
(17:32):
voodoo episode. Later Nier on captured the solarpowered hero Apollo and imprisoned him within his
palace baiting his partner Midnighter into hellfor a direct confrontation. Midnighter fought
through demonic hordes and engines of torment tofree Apollo ultimately defeating Nier on in
personal combat and costing Nier on his captiveprize. When the great darkness rose to consume the
(17:55):
multiverse Nier on was among the infernal lordsenslaved to its will forming parts of the dark army
that clashed with the Justice League. After theheroes severed the darkness's link to reality and
later purged its new host Nier on and the otherswere freed from its control. In time Nier on was
dethroned by Raven who restored order to helldisplaced again Nier on resumed his dealings in
(18:20):
the shadows crafting new packs leaving infernalcontracts and searching for the next soul whose
fall might restore his supremacy and that's Nieron's backstory powers wise Nier on is one of the
most powerful demon lords of hell possessing vaststrength and durability he can manipulate
reality through sorcery unleash hellfire andeldritch force and assume either a regal humanoid
(18:43):
guise or his true form a green tentacled mass he canfly teleport and conjure artifacts of immense
power including weapons his defining ability iscontract magic he grants power transformation or
resurrection to mortals in exchange for theirsouls within his own realm this power grows
(19:04):
exponentially and he will reform there if slainmaking him immortal so is he shumagorath in his
true form not with like the giant eyeball oranything like that it's more just like a chunky
green mass gross you know hella has a true form aswell if her headdress is ever removed she was
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actually born like half dead and half alive so likehalf of her is beautiful but the other half is
basically like a zombie that's her true forminteresting she's severely weakened when in that
state so her headdress is her weakness i will takenote yeah nieran's not gonna know that but let me
tell you more about hella in her backstory hellawas mystically born in joenheim the land of the
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giants as the daughter of the giantess engerbotaand the trickster god Loki whom you can learn more
about in his duel with aries some myths claim hellawas the offspring of an earlier incarnation of
odin but all accounts agree that she was born halfdead her body split between life and decay as she
came of age odin appointed her the goddess of deathgranting her dominion over two of the nine realms
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hell the land of the dead and niflheim the land ofeternal mist and shadow cloaked in garments that
concealed her half-rotted massage she appearedas a darkly beautiful woman when veiled but
beneath the cloak was the withered form of deathitself the garment held Hela held her power and
vitality, without it, she became weak and frail.Though Hela's role was to guide souls of
(20:34):
Asgardians and their followers to the afterlife,her ambition soon exceeded her station. She
sought to extend her dominion to Valhalla, therealm of honored warriors slain in battle, and
longed to claim the souls of Odin and his son Thor.During one of their earliest encounters, she
appeared before Thor when he offered his own lifeto spare Lady Sif, and impressed by his nobility,
(20:55):
Hela allowed them both to live. Yet herfascination with Thor persisted, often walking
the line between adversary and reluctantadmirer. You can learn more about Thor in his duel
against Wonder Woman. In time, Hela's hunger forpower grew. She stole a fragment of Odin's soul
during his slumber upon the Sea of Eternal Night,using it to create a cosmic entity called
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Infinity. The being nearly unmade existencebefore Hela was defeated by Thor's sacrifice and
Odin's intervention. Though Odin slew her to endher threat, he was persuaded by Thor to resurrect
her, restoring the balance between life anddeath. Hela continued to test the gods resolve,
once slaying Thor only to restore him when Sifoffered her own life in his place. When the
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monstrous mangog killed Odin, Hela clashed withPluto, the Olympian god of death, over the right to
claim Odin's soul. To deny Pluto the victory, sherevived Odin herself. Later, alongside Loki, she
attempted to trigger Ragnarok, the apocalypticrebirth of Asgard, by slaying Thor's friend Baldr
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and unleashing an army of monsters upon the realm.Odin thwarted her scheme, but her obsession with
the prophesied end of the gods endured. Hela'sauthority was challenged by O'Larris, the
unmerciful and Asgardian military commander whosought to usurp her throne in Hell. The conflict
drew the attention of the superhero team, thedefenders, who aided her in repelling O'Larris
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and restoring order to Valhalla. She laterconspired with Loki and the war god Tyr against
Odin and joined the Hell Lords, Mephisto, Pluto,and Satanish in merging their netherworlds to
consolidate power. Their union awakened thegod-eater Demogorge, who devoured Hela and the
others before being destroyed by Thor, restoringher once again. Throughout these eras, Hela's
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realm served as both prison and battlefield fordivine souls. She commissioned the construction
of Naglfar, a massive ship built from thefingernails of the dead intended to carry her army
across the Nine Realms during Ragnarok. Yetbefore it could sail, it was destroyed by Scourge,
the executioner who defied her tyranny to savemortal souls. Hela's repeated attempts to claim
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Thor's life culminated when she cursed him so thathis wounds would never heal and his body could
never die. After a brutal battle with the Midgardserpent left him mangled, Thor entered Hell
within the armor of the destroyer and forced Helato lift the curse, restoring his body and trapping
the destroyer in her realm as a warning. Even so,she continued to meddle with mortal and divine
(23:28):
affairs, at times battling Mephisto for the rightto claim Thor's soul. You can learn more about
Mephisto in his duel against Sandman. When Odinentered the Odin's sleep, Hela seized the
opportunity to expand her influence, corruptingthe Valkyria and turning them into fire demons.
Among them was Mirage of the new mutants whorebelled against her queen. With help from the
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dwarven King Ytri and the young mutants, Hela'sUruforge sword called the Night Sword was
destroyed, and Odin was spared. You can learn moreabout Mirage and Valkyria in their respective
duels against Aeroet and Powergirl. WhenRagnarok brought about the fall of the Nine
Realms, including Hel in Niflheim, Loki awakenedher in Immortal Guies in Las Vegas. There, she
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resumed feeding on human souls and aided Loki inhis schemes. During this period, she attended
councils with Mephisto, Dormammu, and other HellLords, often shifting alliances based on
convenience and survival. Her presence drew theattention of mutant allies when Mirage sought her
aid in battle, gaining from Hela a sword and steedthat allowed her to defeat Ares. Around the same
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time, Hela accepted the soul of Primhari, the WolfPrince of Asgard, who bargained his own life to
save his mortal lover and unborn child. AfterAsgard was destroyed during an invasion led by
Norman Osborn, whom you can learn more about in ourJoker vs Green Goblin duel, many Asgardian souls
were left without a resting place. With no realm toclaim them, the cursed Valkyries, known as the
(24:59):
Dessir, began feasting on their spirits. Lokiapproached Hela with an offer to restore her
dominion. By bargaining with Mephisto, hegranted her a portion of Hell to rule for 1,001
years, forming a new Hell, single L, and savingcountless Asgardian souls from oblivion. In
exchange, Hela erased Loki's name from the booksof Hell, freeing him from his predestined death.
(25:23):
Soon after, the Dessir turned on Hela and attackedher new domain. In the ensuing battle, her hand was
severed and she was forced to absorb the dead intoher body to shield them. With the aid of Thor and
Tyr, Hela repelled the Dessir, though theconflict left her weakened. She later made a pact
with Loki and Mephisto during the rise of Odin'sbrother, Kul Borson, aka the Serpent, ensuring
(25:45):
her realm's protection and pledging her servantsto Loki's cause. When peace returned, she
regained the true Hell and reclaimed her place asits ruler. After Loki restored Hela's severed
hand with the power of the Holy Grail, Hela facedAngela, the lost daughter of Odin and Freya, in
combat. Angela had descended into Hell to free herlover, Sera, and overcame the Death Goddess. She
(26:08):
seized Hela's crown and took her place as Queen ofHell, before abdicating the throne to Balder.
Stripped of power and seeking vengeance, Helaallied herself with Thanos, the Mad Titan,
offering him the one thing he desired most, deathitself, in exchange for his aid in reclaiming her
realm. You can learn more about Thanos and his duelagainst Darkseid. Together with the Black Order,
(26:31):
Hela stole into the collector's vault to retrievea version of Thor's hammer, Mjolnir, from a dead
universe, only to fail. Returning empty-handed,Hela slew Proxima midnight before Thanos as proof
of her worth and sealed their alliance with a kiss.You can learn more about the Black Order in their
duel against Darkseid's elite. However, Hela'spact with Thanos eventually brought ruin. When
(26:54):
she sought to resurrect him after his death, Helasucceeded in restoring Thanos' body, but his
consciousness was fractured, his mind leftbroken by the failed resurrection. During the
battle against the Guardians of the Galaxy thatfollowed on nowhere, Hela commandeered a weapon
capable of creating a black hole. Upon firing it,she was caught in the black hole's collapse,
(27:14):
vanishing alongside Thanos into oblivion. Youcan learn more about the Guardians of the Galaxy in
their duel against Doom Patrol. Hela survived thevoid and clawed her way back into existence,
reclaiming her throne in Hell. She later joinedforces with Camilla, Queen of the Norns, to defend
the realm from Cinder, Queen of Cinders, during awar among the realms. For strategic reasons, she
(27:36):
and Balder agreed to a ceremonial marriage,though Carnilla ultimately bound herself to Hela
in Balder's place, joining the two as reluctantco-rulers. Together they ruled Hell in an uneasy
alliance. You can learn more about Malekith in hisduel against Eclipso. When the Cult of Null on
Earth attempted to resurrect the Symbiote God,she seized his weakened form and siphoned his
(27:58):
power, seeking to command the living darknessitself and seize control of the Symbiotes. You can
learn more about Null in his duel against WhiteLantern. And that's her backstory thus far.
Powers-wise, Hela has as Guardian Physiology andDark Magic as the Goddess of Death. She has
God-level strength, able to lift over 100 tons.She can teleport, run over 100 miles per hour, has
(28:21):
vast durability, and is immortal. She can fly,astral project, cast illusions, manipulate
magical energies into blasts or weaponconstructs that can kill even an Asgardian God.
Her power over life and death can kill others with asimple touch. She is formidable in hand-to-hand
and weapons combat, particularly with her NightSword, which is forged of the same Uru metal that
(28:44):
Thor's Hammer Mjolnir is made of. And that's Hela.Is there anything special about the Night Sword
besides it being forged from Uru? I mean, she cankill people with it. That's lame. So it's just a
plain-ass sword? It's a fucking durable-asssword, and she has all these other magical
abilities in conjunction with this badass sword.I mean, kinda. She's basically Nier on. Don't say
(29:07):
that. That's rude. What a rip-off. In a world wherefantasies collide and heroes clash, one podcast
network rises above the rest. Prepare yourselffor the ultimate showdowns in comic books, video
games, movies, and anime. The Dynamite PodcastNetwork presents Console Combat, where video
(29:33):
game legends brawl every Monday. Dynamic Duel,where comic book titans smash every Tuesday. Max
Destruction, where TV and action heroes battleevery Wednesday. And Cendro World, where anime
champions clash every Thursday. Join us as wespeculate on the matches and armed with the power
of mathematical simulations discover who willemerge victorious. Visit dynamicpodcast.com
(29:59):
where we settle the debate and settle the score.Now that we've got their histories and abilities
out of the way, let's speculate on how one of the1000 simulated matches will go. The winner is
determined by simulations, not the speculation,but it's fun to imagine how this fight could play
out. AJ9K, what are the rules of our speculation?Well I should say there are no rules, other than the
(30:23):
characters have no prior knowledge of the othergoing into the fight. All they are aware of
starting out is that the other character is athreat that needs to be eliminated. For the
speculation, the contestants will beginapproximately 50 meters apart in a non-descript
environment that will have no bearing on the matchitself, as no environmental statistics are
considered in my simulations. The contestantsmust earn victory on their own merit. Alright then
(30:47):
let's get into it. Neron and Hela meet on thebattlefield. Who goes first? I think before even
fighting that Neron is probably going to offerHela what she's always wanted, a way to obtain
Thor's soul. And to help her with that, he's goingto present her with a black candle that transforms
(31:07):
into a glowing green hammer called, let's say, B.Olner. And that's like 10 times more powerful than
Mjolnir and it shoots green lightning becausethat's cooler. A hammer that's 10 times more
powerful than Mjolnir? Yeah. Well, what happensif she takes it? What does she give up? That's for
Neron to know and for Hela to not find out until it'stoo late. So he's just going to present this as a
(31:32):
present to her? Yeah. I don't deny that she wouldprobably be tempted by the offer just for that much
power. She'd probably take him up on it actually.So she grabs the green hammer, Bjolnir, whatever.
She grabs Bjolnir and just wallops the shit out ofNeron with it once she gets it. What an idiot. Okay.
(31:53):
She tries to, but Neron, he's going to gointangible. So he's just laughing as the hammer
swings through him just time after time. And eachtime she swings, that actually is going to drain
Hela's soul, weakening her while Neron gains herstrength. And that was the twist on his offer. The
hammer drains her rather than empowering her. Andwith her weakened, that's when he is going to
(32:19):
straight up uppercut her and she's going to goflying towards the horizon, dropping Bjolnir.
Okay. Well, first of all, Hela knew that some shadyshit was going to go down. Okay. Obviously she's
dealing with the demon, wildswood, your enemygrant you power. So this was all just a test. Like
she split her soul, a fraction of it off beforetaking the hammer. So Neron may have drained like
(32:43):
1% of her soul's power, but she has power to spare.So instead of getting knocked to the horizon, when
Neron hits her, her body just explodes into a hugeflock of crows. That just fly back together again
and they're going to reform back into Hela with 99%of her soul intact. Wait, wait, she can split her
soul? Yeah. She's done it quite a few times in thecomics. Oh, it's like a Horcrux thing. Uh, no, not
(33:10):
really. Okay. Well, Neron's probably pissed thathis bargain backfired. We'll say that with the
contract avoided, Bjolnir is just going to meltlike candle wax. That's fine. Hela didn't need the
hammer. She has her own night sword. So she's goingto manifest it in her hand and she just flies
forward lunging at Neron and just running thesword right through his torso. Oh dang. Okay. So
(33:33):
Neron is impaled by the night sword, but thesegreen flames are going to be flicking out of the
sword's entry and exit points because Neron'shate is so hot that it's going to cause the night
sword to burn Hela's hand. That's going to forceher to let go of it. And that's when Neron's going to
pull out the sword from his torso and he's going toimbue her weapon with sentience, transforming it
(33:58):
into this Uru armored hell knight that startsattacking Hela with its sword arms. Okay. A
sentient sword hell knight. Hela's going to blockthe hell knight's attacks with a magic eldritch
shield, but then she summons her own warrior, thisgiant spider from her realm of hell. Think like
(34:18):
Shalob from Return of the King. That spideractually serves as a warden in her realm and the
spider's going to web up this hell knight so that itcan't even use its swords. Okay. Well, I mean, if
Hela's going to start conjuring beings from herrealm, Neron, he's going to summon the four
horsemen of the apocalypse and they're going tocircle this giant spider on their horses and just
(34:41):
stab it to death before charging Hela and doing thesame. No, except Hela has her own steed and she
rises up on it. It's this 15 foot tall wolf, Fenriswolf, who's just going to pounce on these tiny ass
horsemen and rip them apart just like how a wolfwould do to a herd of baby deer. Oh, you think Fenris
is big? Yeah. Neron's going to mount a fuckinggiant 50 foot dragon that's going to blast Fenris
(35:05):
and Hela with a blast of green hellfire justdisintegrating them. Fenris will be fine. Hela
leaps off of him so the wolf gets the brunt of theblast. He has a healing factor, but Hela summons a
group of giant rock trolls from hell and their skinare like immune to fire, right? And they just beat
the dragon to death and Neron with their rock clubsand axes. Okay. Well, like Hela, Neron's going to
(35:31):
leap off the dragon before he's also attacked andhe's going to cause these iron chains like burning
with green flame to shoot up from the ground andwrap around the rock trolls and Hela, pulling them
down into hell where they'll be trapped andtormented for eternity. That's ending this
match. So Hela's in hell, Neron's hell. So what shedoes then is she's going to summon the souls from
(35:58):
her hell into Neron's hell. And because theAsgardians are all badasses with more strength
and fighting skill than Neron's weak ass souls,Hela and her undead army kill all the souls in
Neron's hell and so he gets weakened and thenkilled. I mean, I've got to have strength in
(36:20):
numbers, you'd think. Doesn't matter, even ifthat's the case, as guardians are badass Vikings.
I mean, all the real badasses went to Valhallathough. So Hela's squad is the JV team. It'll be
enough. It'll be enough. A great disagree. We'llleave it there. Either the souls in Neron's hell
overpower the souls in Hela's hell or vice versa.Let's go ahead and input the stats on these two
(36:46):
characters, run the simulations and come backwith a winner. AJ9K, hit it. Inputting data,
running calculations, processing results,simulations complete. All right, I thought last
week was a good matchup. This matchup betweenNeron and Hela, I think, is even better. These guys
are so close. Like, they're the same when it comesto speed and invasiveness, damage level, range
(37:10):
and versatility, but they had enough differencesto make things interesting. Yeah, we said that
Neron is slightly more perceptive because he cansee a person's desires and that's what he exploits
in his bargains with them. Yeah, we also said thatmakes him smarter because he's a little bit more
crafty and cunning in that regard. But we said thatHela was not only a better fighter, but she was also
(37:33):
better physically in terms of durability andstrength because while Neron does have demon
physiology, the dude lost to Midnighter and whenhe goes up against foes like Superman, his
strength is often bolstered through magic. Yeah,so between the differences in their brains and
brawn, they were able to cancel each other out for atruly even match. So taking all of these stats into
(37:57):
consideration, Joseph, who do you think is comingout on top? Hela. You would. Well, Instagram
wouldn't. I'm guessing largely because you gotthe poll up Hela late because Neron is beating Hela
65% to 35% in that poll, meaning more people thinkthat Neron's going to win. It's okay to be wrong
(38:18):
though. That's surprising. I did not see thatcoming. I was pretty confident Hela was going to
get the popularity vote. Yeah, me too. Well, let'sfind out who's correct. AG9K, the results please.
Here you are, sir. The winner of the matchupbetween Neron and Hela is Hela. Oh yeah, baby. Me by
(38:41):
51.4% or 514 of the 1000 matches compared toNeron's 48.6%. Wow, that's almost a coin toss.
That is a coin toss. Considering the way theydiffered in stats, I'm surprised it came out to be
this close. Well, like I said, they kind of evenedeach other out when it came to brains and brawn.
(39:01):
Usually a win rate lower than 52.5% of the matches Iconsider a coin toss where if you ran another 1000
simulations, you might get a different resultbecause it's just that close. But let's not do
that. I mean, we could. But let's not. Fine.Congrats to Hela. Congrats to the Marvel fans.
We're on a streak now, guys. It's been a while. Astreak of two. That's not a streak. It's a streak,
(39:25):
baby. We're just going to keep it rolling. Keep itrolling all the way into January. That does it for
this dual episode. H.A .9K, help close this up.Thanks for listening to Dynamic Dual. Visit the
show's website at dynamicdual.com and follow uson Instagram at Dynamic Dual podcast. You can
support the show on Patreon at patreon.com slashdynamicdual and joining a tier that works for you
(39:49):
or by rating and reviewing Dynamic Dual on Applepodcasts, Spotify, Podchaser or on our website.
Don't forget to listen to the other shows in theDynamite podcast network, including Max
Destruction, Senjo World and Console Combat. Inour next episode, which is dropping days before
Halloween, we are going to bring you a specialspooky episode where we pit the House of Mystery
(40:14):
against the Crypt of Shadows. Yeah, this is aspecial dual request. It's going to be a team duel
between seven supernatural and mystic users fromDC and Marvel. But we're going to tie in some like
tales of the crypt goodness in there. It'll be a lotof fun. But that does it for this episode. We want to
give a big thanks to our executive producers, JohnStarosky, Zachary Hepburn, Dustin Belcom,
(40:35):
Mickey Methegien, Nathaniel Wagner, Levi Yatyn,Austin Wieselowski, AJ Dunkerley, Nick Ibonto,
Scott Camacho, Gil Camacho, Adam Spees, DeanMaleski, Devin Davis, Joseph Kirsting, Mike
Williams and Paul Graves for helping make thispodcast possible. We'll talk to you guys next
week. Up, up and away. True believers.
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