November 10, 2024 • 55 mins
A slightly short episode this time, recorded on the fly because Matthew was away on our usual schedule.
00.00.40: Introductions
00.04.05: Our interview with Andreas about the My Father's Sword kickstarter
00.55.56: Next time and Goodbye
Effekt is brought to you by Effekt Publishing. Music is by Stars in a Black Sea, used with kind permission of Free League Publishing.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hello, and welcome to episode 244 of the InVet
podcast. The the real urge tosay 100 and
Speaker 2 (00:14):
100.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
But this episode is called an evening with Andreas.
I'm Matthew.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
And I'm Dave. And, yeah, the
Speaker 3 (00:24):
reason it's called an evening with Andreas is because
we
Speaker 2 (00:27):
are going to spend an evening with Andreas.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Not a whole evening. We're gonna we're gonna do this.
A nice, tight hour.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Yes. I think And yes. So, yeah, Andreas of, Nordic
Sculpts, they have just put outtheir, dragon bone supplement,
the Windheim as it's known. Butalso, he is currently kick
starting a game called myfather's sword, or is it your
father's sword?
Speaker 1 (00:55):
It's my father's sword, I think.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
My father's sword. Yes.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Which is a, I'm not sure how you describe it. It's a
it's a short, fantasy game whichis I think I haven't read it in
any detail yet, but it's notquite got the the the madness of
McBoyle about it, but it has athere there is a feeling of it's
(01:23):
a it's a shorter game. It's,it's produced in a in a lovely
looking, I mean, pamphlet forone of a better word, which is,
about 20 pages long. And it hasthat, oh, no. I'm sorry.
Let's be 40 pages long. Let'snot do this. No.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Oh, massively more than 20
Speaker 3 (01:41):
pages. Half did. That's so good.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Yeah. But again, I think it's intended probably to
carry a little bit of punch inthe way that that Merc Boyer
does. Yeah. And and bring you adifferent experience at the
table. So we are expecting,Andreas to join us in the not
too distant future.
And, yeah, that's what today'sshow is about. The we are
slightly this week put off ouraxle because Matthew has chosen
(02:05):
to go on holiday.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Yeah. It's my wedding anniversary, Dave.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Matthew has chosen to do something for his wedding
anniversary. I mean, come on.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
My 25th wedding anniversary.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
25th. Well, congratulations, mate. Well
done.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Thank you. Thank you. So, yeah, it deserves taking my
wife to Iceland, which is wherewe're going. And, we are going
to see not the northern lightsbecause, you know, they came
down here to Surrey only a fewmonths ago, and also because
it's gonna be raining constantlyfor the entire week as far as we
(02:41):
can work out. So the northernlights could be worldy playing
great, great, stuff above aboveour heads, and we won't even see
it.
But that's what I'm doing. Ijust wanna say, we've got no new
patrons this week. I know you'veall backed our Kickstarter, but
but come on. Join us. Join thehappy community, the prettiest
(03:04):
place on earth.
But thank you to all our currentpatrons. We're gonna miss out on
the world of gaming because I'moff to Iceland, and it's only a
week since you did the last one.And let us welcome Andreas,
who's gonna be a bit surprisedby the fact we're already
recording.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Yes. Sadly, we we didn't warn Andreas that this is
happening. Hello, Andreas.Welcome. Welcome to the podcast.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Thank you ever so much. Thank you. Thank you.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Sorry to to to ambush you somewhat, but, because
Matthew's away for some holidayfor his anniversary, you know, I
mean, only a 25th anniversary,you know, We suddenly thought,
let's just record the wholepodcast here. So we kicked off
whilst we're waiting for you toarrive. So, yeah, apologies for,
yeah, for ambushing you withthat. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
We are now we're not live, but we are now live. So
please don't swear. No. It'sokay. You can swear because
we're we have that littlewarning on our podcast that
people might.
Welcome, Andreas, as as Davidsaid.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Thank you so much, guys. I am amazing. Thank you.
I'm amazing.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
We've got so much to talk to you about today, haven't
we?
Speaker 3 (04:14):
Yeah. Don't worry. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
I mean, particularly, I want to talk to you about, the
horn of dawn and, your campaign.Particularly, we wanna probably
question you a little bit aboutthis in terms of actually
delivering on a Kickstarter thatyou've done because we're at the
beginning of that journey, andyou have successfully delivered
(04:39):
your 1st Kickstarter. And, of
Speaker 3 (04:40):
course a while though.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Perfectly timed what you didn't do while that was
while while while your backersare waiting for for this to
appear. What you didn't do islaunch another Kickstarter.
You've only done that otherKickstarter once this has
started arriving in people's,doormat. So I give you credit
(05:02):
for that, Andreas. And that'sthe other thing.
My father's sword is the otherthing that we want to talk to
you about. But first of all,let's let's, obviously, Andreas,
you know, he's a he's a friendof the show. He's been on
before. We don't need to ask youabout your life in gaming. But,
what have you been doingrecently?
How's Sweden Rolls gettingalong?
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Sweden roles is, is, yeah, coming along nicely. Just,
plodding on. We're actuallydoing Coriolis at the moment.
Oh. We are Is
Speaker 2 (05:34):
it original or the great dark?
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Well, original. 3rd horizon. Cool. Cool. I'm too
much in love with the 3rdhorizon to let that go.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
Yeah. All. Like, it's real. Me too.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Me too. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
And, also, our story takes place in the 3rd horizon,
so it's, yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
And we're not quite quite finished with that story
just yet. So, yeah, so we'vebeen doing the past few months,
season 3 of Coriolis, basically.A game we all love. Right?
Speaker 1 (06:01):
We all love that game.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
We all love that game. Oh, yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:04):
Yes. And, of course, you've been getting Wind Time
and the Horn of Dawn out. Right.I I got I gotta launch straight
in there. What was the biggestproblem you had between ending
the Kickstarter and thisarriving on my doormat apart
(06:26):
from me not completing the backof kit and giving you my
address?
Speaker 3 (06:31):
No. By then, we were quite finished. I I would
definitely say, writing 2 booksin 2 languages, for sure. I
deeply underestimated the amountof work that would go into the
translation and, yeah, just thepsychological effect of feeling
like you're finished when youwrite when you finish the first
(06:53):
book in the first language,which was, yeah, like, almost a
year ago, like, end of December2023. Right.
And then it's taking anotherhalf a year to to translate that
and write the second one andtranslate the second one. So,
yeah, that that's definitely thethe main thing. Underestimating
(07:14):
how lot how much time that wouldtake.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Did those translations did you do those in
house? Oh, yeah. I did. I did.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
I did those. I because I wrote I wrote the
books in English and then Itranslated into Swedish. Okay.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
Right. So the whole thing was translating it into
Swedish rather than writing itin English.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Because I I I I feel in
in a way that English I feelmore free writing in English
because that language has 4times as many words as as the
Swedish language does.
Yeah. But there's much more,finesse to it. You can you can
choose synonyms that workbetter, which gives me as a
(07:58):
writer more freedom. I I I tend.But, also, I'm more, of course,
more familiar with Swedish,which means that when I need to
find a translation, it's easiergoing from English to Swedish
than than the other way around.
So Okay. Cool.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
I gotta say, I think Dave and I prefer writing in
English as well, don't we?
Speaker 3 (08:17):
I can't imagine why. Somewhat. Yeah. I I could write
a
Speaker 2 (08:21):
little bit in Swedish, but it'll mostly be be
rude words because that's whatmy wife has taught me,
Speaker 3 (08:26):
yeah, on the whole. So I feel like you guys being,
rather proficient with sweetSwedish by now.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
No. Not at all. Well, me. Not at all.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Well, you know. Yeah. Well, I've I've been I've been,
you know, I've been, my wife andI have been together now nearly
20 years and she's Swedish and Ihave learned very little
Swedish. It's terrible.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Shame. Shame. Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
And then the thing is the thing is though, the thing
is though, she she like, youknow, she ought to get her
English going. And whenever wesee our Swedish friends, they're
like, oh, no. No. We wanna talkEnglish. We wanna talk English.
Speaker 3 (08:58):
They wanna practice their English. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
So it's not my fault. That's what I'm saying. It's
nothing to do with
Speaker 3 (09:05):
We have the same thing here in Sweden. Like
everyone I know who's fromAmerica or from from from any
English speaking country,basically, very few of them
learn Swedish well becauseeveryone wants to practice their
English with them. And people inSweden talk Swedish talk English
very well. So there's, like, noneed to learn Swedish if you
(09:25):
live here.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
It is a bit lazy, though. I mean, I I mean, quite
a lot of my in laws I know it.Some of my in laws don't speak
English terribly well, my mymother-in-law in particular. And
I do have a Swedish tutor in thehouse. Even if I just spent half
an hour a day Yeah.
Over the last 20 years, I
Speaker 3 (09:43):
would be Yeah. I mean, though, the those who have
actually learned Swedish are theones who actually like, no. I
really want to, and I I'm gonnadedicate time to it. And then
they learn, of course, becauseif they live here, they learn
quite fast. But it's only theones who really, really dedicate
themselves to do to do it.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
Okay. I'm moving on to the next item now rather than
getting to discuss the Swedish,of which I feel
Speaker 2 (10:09):
like a 3rd
Speaker 3 (10:09):
wheel because I
Speaker 1 (10:11):
don't I don't have a Swedish wife. I don't
particularly wanna learnSwedish. I'm moving on. So apart
from the language problems andwriting the whole book twice in
2 or 2 books twice in 2different languages, when you
got we we don't have thatproblem, obviously, because, we
just write in the one language.But when you get to production,
(10:33):
where what are the pitfalls thatwe're about to fall into?
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Shipping. Shipping. Shipping. Shipping. Right.
It cost, a a shitload of moneyto ship. And especially,
unfortunately, due to Brexit,you guys are royally fucked.
Because, like like, Alphaspiel,the the big, one of the 2 big
game stores in Stockholm, theyare the ones who've been doing
(10:59):
the fulfillment the the theshipping, I would say. The
shipping to Sweden and EUcountries for us. And they, and
we're talking now about themdoing shipping for my father's
sword.
And they're like, yeah. We canship to Taiwan and New Zealand,
but not UK.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Oh, that's rubbish, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (11:20):
Because it's such a such a bother. It's such, so
much admin stuff to do. So I'myeah. I'm I'm yeah. Check check
shipping thoroughly thoroughly.
Have a good deal with someoneand make sure it's yeah. Because
it's, it takes it takes time.Like, I did I it it either costs
(11:43):
a shitload of money or takes anenormous amount of time.
Speaker 2 (11:48):
Right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Yeah. So we will I mean, we we think we've got
quite a good deal with adistributor that's got
distribution channels overseasas well as being in the UK. But
the the the price of that's goneup actually, isn't it, since we
Speaker 3 (12:01):
It has. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Talked In the last 6 months. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
So I think we'll I think our plan is to do the
pledge manager as close todelivery as we can to make sure
that the the price people pay inthe pledge manager is the price
the shipping actually costs.That's a useful thing to
Speaker 3 (12:17):
That's good. That's that's very, very smart of you
guys. You you really do that forsure.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
Working with the guys at, at Standard in Lithuania on
the printing, how did that go?
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Oh, amazing. They are so amazing to work with. I
cannot recommend them, highlyenough.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
It is you have produced a couple of super
books. They are really, reallyhigh quality. And the work is
high quality. I mean, not justthe printing, but the books
themselves are are superb. Youshould really be congratulated
for putting out something thatwas so good.
It's really Thank
Speaker 3 (12:49):
you so much. Thank you. Yeah. We're very happy.
When, of course, we could havemade more money if we would have
gone with another paper, anothercover, and all that.
Yeah. We we really wanted peopleto get the wind in books in
their hands to feel like, oh,oh, well, this is something
else. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
We've gotten exactly that response, which is, of
course, delightful. Yeah. Butstandard, they're amazing, and
they're very, thorough. That's,like, one reason that the last
month of delay is solely due tothe diligence of standard of
(13:29):
getting back to us. You have tochange this.
You have to change that. Thiswon't work. This will not be
clear enough. Okay. So I'm onbasically a back and forth for
Christian, with standard, justmaking sure everything is
printable, like a a good qualityprinting wise.
Speaker 1 (13:51):
Brilliant. Brilliant. That's good, to be aware of.
Mhmm. Let's factor out.
Let's see now. Let's make surewe've got that month still.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Mhmm. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
And when you talk to Christian, you're talking about
your layout artist.
Speaker 3 (14:04):
Yeah. Christian, the one who does the maps and
layouts. Yeah. Graphic design.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
Cool. Cool. They do look lovely. They do look
lovely.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
It is.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Yeah. Okay. So having set yourself the challenge of
writing 2 books in a differentlanguage and or 2 different
languages, you've gone simplerwith your next Kickstarter,
which is really why we've gotyou on the show. Now, you sent
us an early, early preview ofthis.
Speaker 3 (14:35):
Mhmm.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
And, there aren't many words in it is the first
thing I noticed. Lots ofgorgeous illustrations. Are
there gonna be more words by thetime the final version comes
out, or is it as simple as itseems?
Speaker 3 (14:50):
It might even be fewer.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Wow. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
Because this game is supposed to be a pick up and
play game that a game master canbuy in a game store on their way
to a game session and then readthe game on the bus to the game
session and then run it. Andthen their players can can make
their characters in half anhour, and then you just go.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Cool. Interesting. So and and what sort of characters
are you making?
Speaker 3 (15:21):
Characters?
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Yeah. You said make our characters in half an hour.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
Oh, what kind of character you make in the game?
Oh, sorry. Yeah. You make thatinto heroes that are also
slightly comical, because wewant people to really lean in
heavily on on the humorous andcomedy part of of role playing
games. It's supposed to be anostalgia game where you, live
out all the all the silly thingsyou did when you started playing
(15:49):
role playing games in theeighties or nineties.
Like, for me, for instance, wehad a guy who wanted to break
down a door, and he startedhacking at it with a sword
because the sword was the itemthat deal dealt the most most
damage. I was like, you can'tget shot.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
On that?
Speaker 3 (16:04):
Well, you can't shop through a door with a sword.
You'll be much better throwingyour full weight behind it. And
he's like, no. It does some moredamage. Or the guy who want to
try and kill Elrond because justimagine the the amount of XP
that you would get in Merp.
We're playing the Swedishversion of Merp then. So they
had an XP system. Like, thefirst time you do something,
(16:24):
it's it's, 4 times even higher.So it's like, well, no one's
ever killed an Elven lordbefore. So if you do that,
Netherland gives a lot of shouldgive a lot of XP.
So, yeah, all these kind ofridiculous things that you used
to do, and and we also have somesome quotes from famous
adventure movies from from wayback when. And, yeah, we try to
(16:47):
we try to give a lot of,humorous notes, and homarches
back to to old adventure movies.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
I quite like the, the the first page of the rules,
which says, I make it a rulenever to lie with someone unless
they can beat me in a fairfight.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Mhmm. Yep.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
Is that a quote from a movie? I don't I don't know if
Speaker 3 (17:09):
that Yeah. All the quotes are from movies.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
Yep. Excellent. Just remember, there's a thin line
between being a hero and being amemory. Sorry. I I I gotta stop
quoting.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
Yeah. My favorite is a combination. I I I managed to
combine 2. You killed myfather's brothers nephews
cousins former roommate. Prepareto
Speaker 2 (17:34):
die. Excellent. So what what one of them is the
princess bride. What's the otherone from?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Spaceballs. Spaceballs. Right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Long time since I've seen that. Never felt any need
to rewatch it either. That
Speaker 3 (17:50):
was nice. So so the characters are are epic heroes
that are amazing at some stuffand really crap at other stuff.
So yeah. And it's really easy.The rules are supposed to be
yeah.
You learn them in in 15, 20minutes. And most of the book is
actually dedicated to charactercreation. The rules are
(18:11):
basically one spread, maybe 2spreads.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Yes. It's brilliant. And the spreads themselves are
gorgeous. Lots of I guess youmight call them fantasy cliches
in a Mhmm. Painted in a humorousstyle, but what makes them not a
cliche is most of them arereally close-up.
You're zoomed in on a lot ofthese things. So, they don't
(18:35):
quite have their heroic posesyou might see in a Frank
Frazetta thing, but you're rightup against the thigh of a of a
Frank Frazetta hero or whatever.So it looks gorgeous. Some
lovely bit of graphic design aswell. How is the campaign going?
Speaker 3 (18:53):
The campaign is going okay. I mean, we were funded,
but we haven't really, it hasn'treally taken off as as well as
we'd hoped. We figured we'd do aa Kickstarter with a very, very
cheap product where the productwould cost let's see now you're
in Britain. So, like, a PDFwould be not even £3, and and
(19:17):
the book would be not even £8.And then I've this is, yeah,
this is really embarrassing, butI'm gonna out myself now on your
pocket.
Go ahead. Go ahead. I didn'treally think it through because
because shipping to UK and
Speaker 2 (19:35):
US Oh, no.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
Is is, twice the cost for the book itself. So the
whole reason we went for such alow price is I said to
Christian, it has to be a nobrainer to back this. If you are
even slightly, curious aboutthis game, it has to be so cheap
that it's a no brainer to backit. And it is.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
As long as you don't live in the In the
Speaker 3 (20:02):
UK or the US, which is like where we wanna be with
our like, the markets we wannareach. So it's, yeah. So, yeah,
a huge mistake on on my my partthere. But it's, yeah. I mean,
we're gonna get we're we'regonna get funded.
We're gonna be able to have anokay print run, and we're gonna,
(20:23):
keep on talking to distributorstrying to get the game out.
Because I think that once it'sin the store, it's gonna be in
stores for maybe 11 or 10 quid.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
Mhmm.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
Something like that, is is our goal at least. Might
be a pound or 2 more, but, like,definitely not above £15 in
stores. So we want this to be,like, easy accessible. Someone,
sees it, flips through it, findsit enjoyable. And, like, if
you've gone Christmas shoppingfor, you know, a 100, 110, 115,
(20:59):
pounds, why not just grab thisfor Yeah.
An extra 12 while you're atwhile
Speaker 2 (21:05):
you're at it?
Speaker 3 (21:05):
When when you're still in the game store and and
you you spent so much money, whynot, like, grab this one as
well? Or if you're in there justbrowsing, haven't thought of
getting something, and this isso cheap that, oh, well, I could
I could I could try this out.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
A nice easy impulse buy.
Speaker 3 (21:25):
Yeah. Yeah. That's, yeah, that's our goal. I don't
know. Some people have warned usand said the low price could be
a deterrent because, it doesn't,it doesn't really sing out,
quality and, and the qualityproducts.
So I don't it might be yetanother miscalculation on my
part. I don't know.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Well, I mean, it's all a lesson, isn't it? It's not
a miscalculation. You you youhad a theory. You're testing the
theory, and you'll get a result.And, you know, next time you
might do things differently.
Sorry, Darren. I interruptedyou.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
That's alright. I was just
Speaker 2 (22:01):
gonna say it's a difficult one, is it? Because
with anything you're publishing,if you go too cheap Mhmm. Yeah,
you can, you know, you you canyou automatically think that,
it's a real bargain. People willlove it. But then sometimes,
like you say, people will see itand think, oh, that is a bit too
cheap.
So I'm not even gonna give you 5quid of my money because it's
not gonna be worth a fiver.Whereas if it's a bit more
(22:23):
expensive Mhmm. Kind ofironically, you might have a
better chance of of making thesale.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
And that
Speaker 1 (22:29):
is just when we we always say that about, drive
through RPG products, don't we?You know? Yeah. When we do those
reviews, we say, this is, youknow, a great a great book. It
looks really interesting, butyou're you're giving it away too
cheaply.
And I think I think that reallydoes on drive through RPG, even
though it's only a PDF, peoplekinda go, oh, if it's that
(22:51):
cheap, it can't be any good.And, that's a bit of a pain.
This, though, tell me more abouthow this is gonna look then. It
I mean, because visually, it'svery arresting. But what it's
it's not gonna be a fancyhardback like this, horn of
dawn.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
No. It's gonna be a softback. I don't ex Christian
knows more about exactly whatkind of softback it it's gonna
be, but I don't think we'regoing with a stapled one. It's
gonna be
Speaker 1 (23:21):
It's gonna be square bound.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
Case bound.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Yeah. In in some way bound, I think. And, we had a we
had a, stretch goal planned forfor some higher sons with a
flashier cover where the, thelogo might, like, flash the
silver a bit or something likethat.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
But I
Speaker 3 (23:38):
don't think we're gonna reach that, and and, we
will not be able to to to dothat with this, at least on with
this print run. I mean, if ifthis print run really sells out
and people really like it, wemight make an updated version.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Is this kind of an idea for a for an ongoing sort
of series of of of games in asimilar vein or, is this kind of
just what your your your yournostalgic love letter to
Speaker 3 (24:07):
to those stupid days back when you're a kid role
playing? Well, I mean, the ideafor this game actually started
with me, being a bit tired ofvery crunchy games. So I wanted
to experiment with with actually2 things, but the first thing
then would be, like, what liketrying to boil down the essence
(24:28):
of number of skills. Like, howhow few can you go? How how many
you need to have, like, a bareminimum to to cover everything,
to cover everything you need.
And and and I can like, when Istarted making it, I was like,
okay. So 8. You need 8 skills.Eight skills will cover
everything. Of course, you won'thave the super dynamics of the
(24:51):
difference between intimidatingand, persuading.
But, in in this in this ruleset, we we have 8 skills. We
think we cover they covereverything. And we also write
that, for instance, if you weregonna intimidate someone, you
could use social interactions,but you might also use spiritual
power. You know? It's not it'snot set in stone, which
(25:16):
situations you would use eachskill.
That that would depend on andalso on on your character. So
like like, we also encourage thegame master to just go with,
like, what's reasonable? What'sreasonable? Would it be
reasonable for a for a 3 and ahalf meter giant to intimidate
with his, combat skill, if he'sgonna intimidate someone just
(25:39):
cracking his knuckles. Yeah.
Well, it might intimidate mostpeople if he does that. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Dave, I've just I've got to admit a terrible thing. I
thought, well, we've gotta giveAndreas our support. So I I went
and backed it, but, I didn'tback it on my account. I backed
it on
Speaker 2 (25:59):
The company account. So this is why I need to have
access to the accounts, Matthew.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Both is okay.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
I
Speaker 3 (26:13):
mean, it's all here. It's not even That's the
Speaker 2 (26:16):
thin end of thin end of the wedge. That before we
know it, I'm so how are youpaying for Iceland, Matt?
Speaker 1 (26:21):
Oh, yeah. That's that's that's coming out of the
Kickstarter. It's research. No.No.
No. It's not
Speaker 3 (26:29):
Well, actually, the the other thing I wanted to to
to experience experiment with, Idon't know if you noticed it,
but, apart from the title, whichis I changed the title so many
times. But apart from the title,I ended up with going with my
father's sword because there'snothing more cliche than my
father's sword. I was rewatchingGame of Thrones, with my son the
(26:50):
other day, and it took, like, 2episodes. And someone was like,
my father's sword. And I'm like,perfect.
Why do we have that title?Because there's nothing more
cliche. And we have a whole rulefor cliches and stuff like that.
We can talk about that later.But I
Speaker 1 (27:04):
was gonna ask you about the cliche rule. I was
gonna ask you to start about thespelling of the cliche rule as
well.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
Uh-huh. Did I misspell it?
Speaker 1 (27:13):
Yeah. You've gotten it spelled with 2 e's on the
end, whereas cliche effectively.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Uh-huh. Oh, that must be a typo because I do think I
would use just an e with a alittle
Speaker 1 (27:28):
Yeah. Yeah. I think it's slightly it's only it's
only on the page title. Nobodywill notice it.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Yeah. You should have just said that that was a design
decision, and it was alwaysalways intended that way.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
If it's on the page title, I will completely blame
Christian because he writesthose himself. He does not copy
paste them. The same with, Ithink for a while, weakness was
spelled like, you know, a weekof time, 7 days.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
With 2 week 2 e's. K. An e's. Yeah. So I I think
Christian has a thing from with2 e's of it.
Speaker 3 (28:01):
Yeah. I think so. I think so. No. But the other
thing I want to experiment waswas with was, gender pronouns.
There's not a single, genderassigned pronoun in the entire
game. Not a single one. BecauseI was like I mean, back in the
day, there was there was likethere was he, he, him, him
(28:23):
everywhere. And then nowadays,most companies go with, like, if
we take Free League forinstance, they go with, well,
the game master is always willalways be in the name as a she,
and the players will be him. Andthen we've balanced it out.
And I I was like, do you need tohave them? What would happen if
you would try and write, a gamecompletely without gender
(28:46):
assigned, pronouns? And it it itit it it there have been a few
situations where I've struggled.It might show in the text. It
might not.
I don't I'm not sure. I'm notgonna be the judge of that, but
I do think I've managed actuallyquite well to to write a whole
game without a single, gendersong pronoun apart from the
(29:08):
title. It's kinda ruins
Speaker 2 (29:11):
the whole thing. But Exactly. I was beginning to
think, there's in the firstpage, there might be a gender
like
Speaker 1 (29:21):
No. No. The father is a noun, not a pronoun. Remember?
Speaker 3 (29:25):
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
It's still a it is a it is a sign of the gender,
though, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Well, and there is also the classic as I pointed
out to my daughter who is doinga gender studies dissertation. I
pointed out that whenever shesays, in this case, my father
what that should be is my fatherapostrophe sword, then that is
actually in English a derivationof my father, his sword. So
(29:52):
every time you write apossessive in English, you're
actually reaffirming thepatriarchy.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
Just a
Speaker 1 (29:58):
little aside there.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
Yeah. No. But I'm curious if you if you go through
it again, if you if you'll spot,if you you're probably gonna see
it then now that I've said it.But it's interesting because no
one has reacted to it. I thinkthe 20 or 30 people have read
the the early beta that you'vegotten, by now, and, and no one
(30:23):
has has reacted to it yet, whichis fun because I wanted to
slightly, like, slightly gounder the radar.
It's not something that we'rewe're using in the, in the
marketing or anything like that.It's just, I I meant when you
Speaker 2 (30:38):
decided to do it. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Yeah. See, the problem is, Andreas, you've said
that thing, and now I am goingthrough the text going, oh,
yeah. So I see.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Yeah. Yeah. We might be able to miss it now you've
mentioned it. We're gonna get,oh god. I wish there was some
pronouns in this.
Speaker 3 (30:55):
Yeah. Yeah. This sentence doesn't really make
sense. Oh, it's because it'strying to avoid pronouns. For
sure.
There are a few like that.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
Yeah. So, Dave, you carry on with the interview
while I try and tear myself awayfrom the text. Salvador, I
wanted to ask you. So what givesthe cliche point?
Speaker 3 (31:15):
That's up to the to the game master and the and the
pray prayer. So this game has, arules mechanic called cliche
points. Whenever you dosomething that's super cliche,
sitting in a dark corner withyour hood drawn up in the inn,
for instance, or, yeah. Going ona quest to find your father's
sword or being the, magicalprodigy child, like a youngster
(31:39):
who's super talented in magic,although you've never had any
teachings in it. Whatever iscliche Well,
Speaker 1 (31:46):
of course, my background is I have no family.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
Yeah. Exactly. I have no family. My family was
slaughtered by orcs or whatever.Yeah.
Or or my family was killed by anunknown stranger.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Oh. I'm
Speaker 3 (31:58):
a mutt.
Speaker 1 (31:59):
Fingers on his hand. Yeah. Okay. So what do I do with
the cliche point when I've gotit?
Speaker 3 (32:05):
So once you get a cliche point, you can spend that
to to perform a heroic deed,which is in all adventure
movies, heroes sometimes dothings that are ridiculous.
Things that if you try to dothem and would wanna make a dice
roll for it, you'd get a minusmodification of 1 gazillion.
Mhmm. And instead, you but withthe cliche points, you can spend
(32:28):
them to make a perform a heroicdeed, and then you just do it.
You just yeah.
It just happens. Yeah. Yousucceed. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. Cool.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Brilliant. And are you are you going to stand up to
print this, or are you going,more locally?
Speaker 3 (32:45):
We were going back and forth on that, but we have
decided to go with stand up onceagain. Yeah. They're giving us a
good a very good deal, which noone in Sweden can can match. And
and also they've because theyknow we want this out at least
for the Christmas, shopping inSweden. So so they've actually,
Speaker 1 (33:07):
saved So they're turning it around. This is gonna
be this is the biggest newsever. Right. Okay. I've already
got the PDF.
I can see it's almost done,except you gotta correct those
typos we'll
Speaker 2 (33:19):
spot it for you. Mhmm. And put put some pronouns
in.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
I'll sprinkle a few pronouns in
Speaker 2 (33:23):
the same.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
Yeah. I got there's an illustration or 2 that's not
in the beta, but I think all theall the may all the
illustrations are actuallyfinished. So they just have to
be turned into yeah. Given toChristian to for some graphic
magic.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
So tell your backers, your potential backers, because
they're all gonna back when theyrealize they can back a game in
November and get it beforeChristmas.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
Mhmm.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
What's the processes gonna be here? What what what
happens when the campaignfinishes the, the Kickstarter
campaign finishes?
Speaker 3 (33:55):
Yeah. As soon as a Kickstarter campaign finishes
and we did we we decided to goon a a 21 day Kickstarter
campaign as well because thatextra week very seldom does very
much. It's just a a slot of, youknow, a a back or 2 a day. You
know?
Speaker 1 (34:11):
We've been there. We've been there.
Speaker 3 (34:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
One one backup up, 2 leave. It's a it's
Speaker 2 (34:17):
a terrible Yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:18):
Yeah. So we decided to go with a bit short. So as
soon as we basically, as soon aswe finish the Kickstarter, the
final PDF will go out, tobackers. That's our that's our
hope because we the time slotthat Standard Standard has has
given us is basically just likea week after the Kickstarter
campaign finishes. So we'll sendit to print, and then a few
(34:40):
weeks later, we'll get it.
And one reason, it also took afew weeks to to post the to ship
the the Wyndham stuff wasbecause, of add ons. And we
decided to not go with add onson this one at all just to speed
up the process. This is gonnabe, it's gonna be cheap, and
it's gonna be fast. So it'sstill gonna be good because I've
(35:03):
been writing on this game forfor years. So, like, when I gave
Christian the text, it's textthat I've been polishing and,
you know, working on for foryears.
I I playtested this game, in aSwedish livestream podcast on
YouTube 6 years ago. And and 95%of the text or at least the
(35:26):
rules and all that, I I did somepolishing, a lot a lot of
polishing this last few weeks.But but, like, 95% of the text
was there 6 years ago. Mhmm. Soand and our illustrator, an
Italian called, Alessia Marino.
Super talented. I've known herthrough Facebook for a while,
(35:47):
and, yeah, really wanted her toto go along with us for this one
because I knew that Robert isworking on upcoming projects for
for Nordisk called for Windhame,Horn of Dawn part 2. So so we
decided to to go with someoneelse, for this one to give to
not give Robert, like, stress,problems. So she's she's been
(36:13):
amazing to work with, and she'sbeen super fast, and we really,
love working with her. We'regonna work with her on upcoming
products as well for sure.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Yeah. Love loving loving some of the artwork. Some
of the artwork is really, reallygood.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
Yeah. Absolutely. It's great. Okay. Then now here
here's another question.
It comes back to print.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
Mhmm.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
And it's a question it's a selfish question because,
Dave and I are now wonderingabout this, and, you know, maybe
feedback to to your other booksas well. So you're gonna end up
with a certain number of peoplethat have bought the book. You
could print arguably, you know,the the the the cheapest
(36:58):
situation above that. How manyextra copies are you printing
for retail distribution?
Speaker 3 (37:04):
We haven't decided on that yet, actually, because of
the because of the kickstart notactually performing as well as
as we had hoped. So we mighthave to go down. We were gonna
go with the 2,008 each language,but, we will probably not we we
(37:25):
we're not gonna we're not gonnaafford that. Then we'd have to,
like, take money from the windowand campaign and put it into
this. And, like, we could put ina little bit, but not not too
much.
So we're we're probably gonnareduce that. And we might not
like, for Windhay, we did 700 ofeach book in each language.
Speaker 2 (37:45):
Mhmm. And and
Speaker 3 (37:47):
for this one, we might actually do a larger print
run-in Swedish because we haveall the channels, that we need.
We're like we have directcontact with all the Swedish
game stores. Mhmm. So we knowapproximately how many they will
they will buy, and and also wego to conventions here. So we
know a certain amount of copiesare gonna be sold at
(38:07):
conventions.
And when you go down and you
Speaker 1 (38:10):
just try crime convention material, isn't it? I
mean
Speaker 3 (38:12):
It really is.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
Pick it off your table at a convention. Find an
empty table, and go and play it.Yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. For sure. So we and the thing is
that when you go down in printrun, the total cost doesn't go
down.
Speaker 1 (38:27):
No. It doesn't
Speaker 3 (38:28):
go down.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
No. It doesn't go down. No.
Speaker 3 (38:30):
So it's like it's also a matter of not not just
distribution, but also, like,what do you call it?
Speaker 2 (38:38):
Warehouse. Storage.
Speaker 3 (38:39):
Yeah. Storage. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.
So Alpha Spill is helping uswith the storage. And, but these
books are huge, and and myfather's store is gonna be much
smaller. So Tiny. Yeah. 1 box isgonna contain a lot more copies.
So, yeah, we haven't reallydecided on on an exact print
one, actually.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Cool. But you did just let's step my the answer to
my next question. So you aredoing this in English and
Swedish?
Speaker 3 (39:04):
Yes. Indeed. Yeah. Yeah. Cool.
Yeah. We, our next product afterthis, which I I'd love to come
back and talk to you about, butI can't really just yet because
it's a little bit too early.Exactly. But but that one is
gonna be English only. But apartfrom that, I think most of our
stuff will be dual langlinguistic, do do both in
(39:26):
English and Swedish, for the forthe foreseeable future.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
So is that that new that new project that that isn't
the next, book for Windheimthen? Is it it's something new
and different that you're you'rekicking
Speaker 3 (39:40):
off? Yeah. We we might do that. We might do 2
other products before we do, thenext Windheim book, and it's not
because we're not writing on itbecause I'm I'm writing on
number 2 as we not as we speak.But, I I finished the first
chapter.
But it's because we wanna givepeople time to to play part 1
(40:01):
before we ask them to to backpart 2 because, yes, we've
gotten, like, great, reactionsfrom from all the backers and
all the people who bought it andall the people looked at it. But
that's all Roberts andChristian's work that they've
praised, isn't it? It's gonnatake them a while to to see if
they if they think I have to dothis now. You know? So I I we
(40:23):
don't wanna sell, in Sweden, wecall it call it we wanna we
don't you don't wanna sell thepig in the bag.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
No.
Speaker 3 (40:31):
Because you wanna see what the pig look like looks
looks like when you buy it. Sowe want we want people to be
able to have played part 1 forfor a while, and then and then
we're gonna release part 2.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
And I like the way that it's your contribution to
the book that gets described asthe pig that, Andre. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:49):
It surely is. It surely is.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
Yeah. The writers the writers plague to be referred to
as the pig in the bag. I likethat phrase, though. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (40:58):
Yeah. Cool. So so should we expect to see you over
at a convention in the UKanytime soon? We really, really
hope so. I think,
Speaker 3 (41:07):
when it comes to coming as a Sweden Roll's
podcaster, it's all about usneeding an invitation, because
we, like, we can't lose money ongoing on conventions. Like, if
we someone pays us to come, wecan come and do a kick ass live
show. We've done them in Swedenand in, many places all over
Sweden. But but it's up to thethe organizers if they if they
(41:33):
wanna bring us there or not. Imean, we're we are in the hall
of fame after all that over at NWorld, the the list over there.
So Yeah. Along with some prettypretty awesome names. But but
when it comes to Nordic scolds,I think we need a few more
books. I don't think it's worthit, coming to a convention with,
(41:53):
you know, 2 books. We need weneed we need 5, 6 at least, to
to show off for for for it to beworth it to to come as a
publisher.
As a visitor, I'd love to, butmy time schedule is ridiculous,
unfortunately. It it's, it wouldhave to be so many so many stars
(42:14):
would have to align for me to beable to come to Dragon Meat or
UK Games Expo, for instance. Foryeah. During the foreseeable
future, like, I I'd love to go.I'd love to go to SN.
I'd love to go to GenCon over atthe US, or some kind of, what do
you call what what do they callthem? Packs, unplugged. Plaques.
Speaker 1 (42:36):
Oh, packs. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:37):
Plaques, unplugged. And yeah.
Speaker 3 (42:39):
Yeah. And and Gary Cohn and and all of those, I'd
love to go to those. But, yeah,time and money. Time and money,
my friend.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
Yeah. Yeah. Same here.
Speaker 1 (42:51):
Yes. Yes. Mhmm. And and one book to sell. I think I
think I don't know.
I mean, even in even in Swedishconventions, you're gonna need
to partner up with other,publishers, aren't you, who've
also got 1 or 2 books to sell.And they say, let's let's get a
store together, and we'llmanage, you know, half the day
(43:13):
and you manage the other
Speaker 3 (43:13):
half of the day. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly.
Exactly. I think so. I think so.I think that's gonna be the
solution for 2025, at least,perhaps even 2026. But, yeah,
we'll see.
But I I did go to somethingcalled. Oh, yeah.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
Couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 3 (43:29):
Yeah. Yeah. Couple of weeks ago. Yeah. It was a big
thing in the eighties where the,the pub the big publisher at the
time who had, you know, DrakaOptumoner and and all of these
mutant and and cult and allthose games.
They, they had. And then, lastyear, Free League, revived it
with the, yeah, with theOctumona Dragonbane theme. Yeah.
(43:53):
Yeah. Yeah.
So I was there as a, yeah, 3rdparty product writer, and then
we got a table and, yeah, soldvery well, actually. Excellent.
Yeah. So it it it works, but, Imean, of course, then it was
people who there were people whowere there who were really,
(44:14):
really heavily into Dragon Bay.
Speaker 2 (44:16):
So
Speaker 3 (44:16):
Yeah. It was kind of an easy sell in that way, but
yeah.
Speaker 1 (44:20):
And they hadn't already backed the book. They'd
they'd these were these werepeople who were new customers.
Speaker 3 (44:24):
New customers. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, some of them
had been looking at the booksfor a while, but missed a
Kickstarter.
And and some were people who'venever seen it and just fell in
love with, you know, the feel ofthe paper and the cover. And
there was actually oneyoungster. He was maybe, I don't
know, 13, maybe 14. He stood inthe background while I was
(44:48):
describing the campaign toanother person. And when as soon
as I finished talking and theother person, you know, went
away, he came up and he said,can you just wait a second?
I need to go get my dad becauseI need I need these books. Nice.
Nice. He he just went andbrought his dad, and he said,
(45:10):
dad, we have to buy these. Thissounds like the the coolest
adventure for RPG ever.
And, you know, they ended upbuying, like, maps and books and
dice and everything.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
Oh, nice. Brilliant.
Speaker 3 (45:22):
But I I I can How did you
Speaker 1 (45:24):
describe this campaign to to this other
customer who didn't buy it toimpress this kid so much? What
what did you say?
Speaker 3 (45:33):
I was ranting for a while, but I I could give you
another answer, which I gave to,a guy interviewing me on
Discord, actually this morning,where he asked me to describe,
traces of darkness part 1 ofHorn of Dawn in less than 10
words.
Speaker 1 (45:49):
Oh, right. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (45:50):
Go ahead. What I went with was, an epic adventure
with, what was it, withpolitical intrigue. What was the
word I was using? Gosh. I forgotit.
You're at 6. So much. I know.Yeah. Jeez.
(46:18):
My brain is not workingproperly.
Speaker 2 (46:20):
I know. That's a lot
Speaker 1 (46:21):
more than 10 words now.
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Yeah. I know it is. I know. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (46:25):
I'm gonna have to get back to you with that one. But
if I get more than 10 words,it's it's, it's an exciting epic
adventure where you where youhave have to, wade through
morally moral gray zones andpick a side when it's not super
obvious and super easy to be on.And it's, yeah, as I said, like,
(46:49):
so let's social interactionsand, intrigues and murder
mysteries and a dungeon crawl.It has it has everything.
Speaker 1 (46:57):
And This is what we like. We like that sort of
social interaction
Speaker 3 (47:00):
stuff as well. Yeah. Yeah. So we we try to write it
so that it's not just pile up abunch of monsters to fight.
We've Yeah.
Included a lot of places wherewe write. If your group is a
group that enjoys combat and ormonster fighting, throw in
monster x here. That would
Speaker 1 (47:22):
be suitable.
Speaker 3 (47:23):
And, like yeah. But but it's very it's very focused
on story. It's very focused onit's it's it it doesn't really
start off that way, but it willdevelop into a save the world
story Mhmm. In a of ethnicproportions. But it's, in the
beginning, it's it's all about,yeah, navigating, yeah, moral
(47:47):
gray zones and, solvingmysteries, social interactions.
It's a rather the world that yousee from start is a rather
feudal, medieval fantasy world.Yeah. But it will turn more and
more into high fantasy as thestory goes along.
Speaker 2 (48:08):
Mhmm. Cool. So has wind has wind has wind had done
as well as you'd hoped?
Speaker 3 (48:13):
Oh, Wingham has definitely over, exceeded our
expectations for sure. We webroke a Swedish record for new
RPG writers. Cool. Neither FreeLeague or Hangast or Thunderbird
or Skvoggan or any of those,guys, reach neither the numbers
(48:34):
or the amounts of backers thatwe did for their very first
thing that they did. Now the thefirst Kickstarter for Helmgast
was Cultivated Lost.
That, of course, did better thanwe did, but those guys have been
producing RPGs since thenineties when they did that.
Yeah. So it doesn't really countas, you know, new RPG fighters.
Speaker 2 (48:57):
Yeah. No. That's fair.
Speaker 3 (48:58):
But it's been doing very well, and and since people
are so happy with it, the wordhas spread, and I think Alpha
Spirit is on their 3rd ordernow. Cool. Like, reorder of, you
know, restocking.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (49:12):
So That
Speaker 1 (49:13):
is good. That's good.
Speaker 3 (49:15):
It's excellent.
Speaker 1 (49:17):
I know that you've got another interview to go to
because you are on this mediatrail, aren't you, Andreas?
Speaker 3 (49:23):
Yeah. Yeah. And we we I really appreciate you you
taking the time to to talk to meabout this because it's No.
Speaker 2 (49:31):
Thank you for coming on.
Speaker 3 (49:32):
It's always want to talk with you guys, and I I
really need to to get out thereand tell people about my
father's sword. I think it mightbe one of the reasons I I know
one of the reasons, it hasunderperformed is because we we
started too late with buildinghype for it, like, beforehand.
Yeah. Yeah. And that was becausewe have been waiting to deliver
(49:55):
on the Windhay, Kickstarterbefore we do the next one, which
has meant that we had yeah.
But we could still have tried tobuild some hype for it. But, I
mean, that's also difficult whenyou haven't even we haven't
even, like, delivered your firstone to start building hype to a
new one. That's, and we reallywanted this, like, backers to
(50:17):
get it before Christmas andmaybe even out in stores before
Christmas. Mhmm. So we reallytried to get this on the fast
track, and it's, yeah, I thinkwe we underestimated the
difficulty in reaching peopleand telling them because telling
people about a third partyproduct is very easy.
You go to the to the Facebookgroup or the Discord, channels,
(50:41):
for that game, for the the theoriginal game. And then you say,
I I have a cool third partyproduct. And people, like, if
you do a good job with tellingthem what what it is, they're
gonna be excited and they'rethey're gonna wanna buy it. With
with a new RPG, like a totallystandalone RPG, it's much harder
to find channels where you cantalk about it.
Speaker 2 (51:01):
Yeah. Yeah. When when we were were trying to promote
tales of the old west, I found anumber of wild west paint you
know, groups on Facebook that Ijust with my fingers crossed
saying don't hate me for doingthis. I just did a bit of
spamming. And I think, you know,I think that that did quite
well.
And I think nobody said stopspamming. So that was, that was
(51:22):
cool. But yeah, it's a realtough one, isn't it? And that's,
yeah.
Speaker 3 (51:25):
It's difficult. It's difficult. Yeah. So we'll we'll
see with the future product overif we might like, you know,
shift things around a bit withthat with that in mind. My new
totally new RPGs might have towait a bit longer than we had
initially planned.
Speaker 2 (51:44):
I guess also with your very ambitious target to
get my father's sword out byChristmas, I think you'll have
done an epic job if, you know,once it's if you get out in that
time frame. Mhmm. Because it's,you know, it's as as we're
finding, as first timepublishers, there is an awful
lot of gulf built into the justthe process of doing stuff that
(52:05):
you don't Yeah. You don'tanticipate and it really takes a
lot longer than you think itought to.
Speaker 3 (52:11):
Even getting your bank account here in Sweden took
us a lot longer than we expectedbecause the banks are so afraid
of, like, money laundering andstuff like that. Yeah. Mhmm. So
so it took us like, we actuallygot refused by several banks
Speaker 2 (52:26):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (52:27):
Who are like some were like, no. We don't even
accept new clients at all. Andsome so there was all kinds of
obstacles that we could neverhave anticipated. Yeah. Because
that once we've solved them,like, we don't have to get a a
new bank again, and we don'thave to find, yeah.
So a lot of things that made usdelayed with the first one. Once
(52:50):
you've done it, then it's there.And It should be easier.
Speaker 2 (52:54):
Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (52:55):
It's gonna get easier.
Speaker 2 (52:58):
No. Brilliant. Well, as of recording, there's 11 days
to go. You've you've got 190backers and over £2,000. Well,
that works out to in Krona, I'mnot sure.
But, yeah, it's it's doing, youknow, like you say, it's, it's
too good. It's going. It's doingit seems to be doing quite well
even if it's not quite on theexpectations that you were
(53:18):
hoping for. So if, if anyone'slistening to this and you're
interested, go and find myfather's sword on Kickstarter
and, back it and get that gamein your hands before Christmas
if, if Andreas can make it allwork.
Speaker 1 (53:31):
Yeah. And there will only be about 4 days to go when
you hear this if you are one ofour things. So get don't waste
time.
Speaker 3 (53:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (53:40):
Our patrons will hear it a bit early on, but, but,
yeah, don't waste time. Ifyou're listening to this on
Monday, get over there toKickstarter. We will, of course,
put a link in the show notes,and, thank you very much,
Andreas. We're gonna finish theshow now, actually, Dave and I,
by telling them what we're gonnabe doing in,
Speaker 3 (54:01):
Couple of weeks.
Speaker 1 (54:02):
Well, 3 weeks from now. 2 weeks when other people
are hearing this. And that'sgonna be quite short because we
have no idea. But we'd love youto to hang on to the end so that
when we sign off, you can say,and may the icons bless your
adventures. You happy to dothat?
Speaker 3 (54:21):
Mainly icons bless your adventures. Yes.
Speaker 1 (54:23):
I will do that. Cool. Cool. Cool. Right.
Speaker 2 (54:25):
So next time then, Matthew. What are you doing next
time?
Speaker 1 (54:29):
Well, I think what we need to do next time, actually,
is you remember that terribleinterview I did with, it was a
great interview, actually, with2 of the mice.
Speaker 3 (54:39):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (54:40):
Their Kickstarter will be, I think, about to kick
off, in 2 or 3 weeks' time. SoI'm gonna try and fix an
interview with them, which willbe, I think, the majority of our
content in the next episode.
Speaker 2 (54:52):
Cool.
Speaker 1 (54:54):
That was easy. So there we go. So it's goodbye
from me.
Speaker 2 (54:59):
And it's goodbye from him.
Speaker 3 (55:01):
And may the icons bless your adventures.
Speaker 2 (55:05):
Perfect.
Speaker 3 (55:07):
Did I get that right?
Speaker 2 (55:08):
Oh, yeah. That's dead on.
Speaker 3 (55:09):
Always worried about that bit.
Hello, and welcome to episode 244 of the InVet
podcast. The the real urge tosay 100 and
Speaker 2 (00:14):
100.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
But this episode is called an evening with Andreas.
I'm Matthew.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
And I'm Dave. And, yeah, the
Speaker 3 (00:24):
reason it's called an evening with Andreas is because
we
Speaker 2 (00:27):
are going to spend an evening with Andreas.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Not a whole evening. We're gonna we're gonna do this.
A nice, tight hour.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Yes. I think And yes. So, yeah, Andreas of, Nordic
Sculpts, they have just put outtheir, dragon bone supplement,
the Windheim as it's known. Butalso, he is currently kick
starting a game called myfather's sword, or is it your
father's sword?
Speaker 1 (00:55):
It's my father's sword, I think.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
My father's sword. Yes.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Which is a, I'm not sure how you describe it. It's a
it's a short, fantasy game whichis I think I haven't read it in
any detail yet, but it's notquite got the the the madness of
McBoyle about it, but it has athere there is a feeling of it's
(01:23):
a it's a shorter game. It's,it's produced in a in a lovely
looking, I mean, pamphlet forone of a better word, which is,
about 20 pages long. And it hasthat, oh, no. I'm sorry.
Let's be 40 pages long. Let'snot do this. No.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Oh, massively more than 20
Speaker 3 (01:41):
pages. Half did. That's so good.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Yeah. But again, I think it's intended probably to
carry a little bit of punch inthe way that that Merc Boyer
does. Yeah. And and bring you adifferent experience at the
table. So we are expecting,Andreas to join us in the not
too distant future.
And, yeah, that's what today'sshow is about. The we are
slightly this week put off ouraxle because Matthew has chosen
(02:05):
to go on holiday.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Yeah. It's my wedding anniversary, Dave.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Matthew has chosen to do something for his wedding
anniversary. I mean, come on.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
My 25th wedding anniversary.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
25th. Well, congratulations, mate. Well
done.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Thank you. Thank you. So, yeah, it deserves taking my
wife to Iceland, which is wherewe're going. And, we are going
to see not the northern lightsbecause, you know, they came
down here to Surrey only a fewmonths ago, and also because
it's gonna be raining constantlyfor the entire week as far as we
(02:41):
can work out. So the northernlights could be worldy playing
great, great, stuff above aboveour heads, and we won't even see
it.
But that's what I'm doing. Ijust wanna say, we've got no new
patrons this week. I know you'veall backed our Kickstarter, but
but come on. Join us. Join thehappy community, the prettiest
(03:04):
place on earth.
But thank you to all our currentpatrons. We're gonna miss out on
the world of gaming because I'moff to Iceland, and it's only a
week since you did the last one.And let us welcome Andreas,
who's gonna be a bit surprisedby the fact we're already
recording.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Yes. Sadly, we we didn't warn Andreas that this is
happening. Hello, Andreas.Welcome. Welcome to the podcast.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Thank you ever so much. Thank you. Thank you.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Sorry to to to ambush you somewhat, but, because
Matthew's away for some holidayfor his anniversary, you know, I
mean, only a 25th anniversary,you know, We suddenly thought,
let's just record the wholepodcast here. So we kicked off
whilst we're waiting for you toarrive. So, yeah, apologies for,
yeah, for ambushing you withthat. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
We are now we're not live, but we are now live. So
please don't swear. No. It'sokay. You can swear because
we're we have that littlewarning on our podcast that
people might.
Welcome, Andreas, as as Davidsaid.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Thank you so much, guys. I am amazing. Thank you.
I'm amazing.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
We've got so much to talk to you about today, haven't
we?
Speaker 3 (04:14):
Yeah. Don't worry. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
I mean, particularly, I want to talk to you about, the
horn of dawn and, your campaign.Particularly, we wanna probably
question you a little bit aboutthis in terms of actually
delivering on a Kickstarter thatyou've done because we're at the
beginning of that journey, andyou have successfully delivered
(04:39):
your 1st Kickstarter. And, of
Speaker 3 (04:40):
course a while though.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Perfectly timed what you didn't do while that was
while while while your backersare waiting for for this to
appear. What you didn't do islaunch another Kickstarter.
You've only done that otherKickstarter once this has
started arriving in people's,doormat. So I give you credit
(05:02):
for that, Andreas. And that'sthe other thing.
My father's sword is the otherthing that we want to talk to
you about. But first of all,let's let's, obviously, Andreas,
you know, he's a he's a friendof the show. He's been on
before. We don't need to ask youabout your life in gaming. But,
what have you been doingrecently?
How's Sweden Rolls gettingalong?
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Sweden roles is, is, yeah, coming along nicely. Just,
plodding on. We're actuallydoing Coriolis at the moment.
Oh. We are Is
Speaker 2 (05:34):
it original or the great dark?
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Well, original. 3rd horizon. Cool. Cool. I'm too
much in love with the 3rdhorizon to let that go.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
Yeah. All. Like, it's real. Me too.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Me too. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
And, also, our story takes place in the 3rd horizon,
so it's, yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
And we're not quite quite finished with that story
just yet. So, yeah, so we'vebeen doing the past few months,
season 3 of Coriolis, basically.A game we all love. Right?
Speaker 1 (06:01):
We all love that game.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
We all love that game. Oh, yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:04):
Yes. And, of course, you've been getting Wind Time
and the Horn of Dawn out. Right.I I got I gotta launch straight
in there. What was the biggestproblem you had between ending
the Kickstarter and thisarriving on my doormat apart
(06:26):
from me not completing the backof kit and giving you my
address?
Speaker 3 (06:31):
No. By then, we were quite finished. I I would
definitely say, writing 2 booksin 2 languages, for sure. I
deeply underestimated the amountof work that would go into the
translation and, yeah, just thepsychological effect of feeling
like you're finished when youwrite when you finish the first
(06:53):
book in the first language,which was, yeah, like, almost a
year ago, like, end of December2023. Right.
And then it's taking anotherhalf a year to to translate that
and write the second one andtranslate the second one. So,
yeah, that that's definitely thethe main thing. Underestimating
(07:14):
how lot how much time that wouldtake.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Did those translations did you do those in
house? Oh, yeah. I did. I did.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
I did those. I because I wrote I wrote the
books in English and then Itranslated into Swedish. Okay.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
Right. So the whole thing was translating it into
Swedish rather than writing itin English.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Because I I I I feel in
in a way that English I feelmore free writing in English
because that language has 4times as many words as as the
Swedish language does.
Yeah. But there's much more,finesse to it. You can you can
choose synonyms that workbetter, which gives me as a
(07:58):
writer more freedom. I I I tend.But, also, I'm more, of course,
more familiar with Swedish,which means that when I need to
find a translation, it's easiergoing from English to Swedish
than than the other way around.
So Okay. Cool.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
I gotta say, I think Dave and I prefer writing in
English as well, don't we?
Speaker 3 (08:17):
I can't imagine why. Somewhat. Yeah. I I could write
a
Speaker 2 (08:21):
little bit in Swedish, but it'll mostly be be
rude words because that's whatmy wife has taught me,
Speaker 3 (08:26):
yeah, on the whole. So I feel like you guys being,
rather proficient with sweetSwedish by now.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
No. Not at all. Well, me. Not at all.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Well, you know. Yeah. Well, I've I've been I've been,
you know, I've been, my wife andI have been together now nearly
20 years and she's Swedish and Ihave learned very little
Swedish. It's terrible.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Shame. Shame. Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
And then the thing is the thing is though, the thing
is though, she she like, youknow, she ought to get her
English going. And whenever wesee our Swedish friends, they're
like, oh, no. No. We wanna talkEnglish. We wanna talk English.
Speaker 3 (08:58):
They wanna practice their English. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
So it's not my fault. That's what I'm saying. It's
nothing to do with
Speaker 3 (09:05):
We have the same thing here in Sweden. Like
everyone I know who's fromAmerica or from from from any
English speaking country,basically, very few of them
learn Swedish well becauseeveryone wants to practice their
English with them. And people inSweden talk Swedish talk English
very well. So there's, like, noneed to learn Swedish if you
(09:25):
live here.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
It is a bit lazy, though. I mean, I I mean, quite
a lot of my in laws I know it.Some of my in laws don't speak
English terribly well, my mymother-in-law in particular. And
I do have a Swedish tutor in thehouse. Even if I just spent half
an hour a day Yeah.
Over the last 20 years, I
Speaker 3 (09:43):
would be Yeah. I mean, though, the those who have
actually learned Swedish are theones who actually like, no. I
really want to, and I I'm gonnadedicate time to it. And then
they learn, of course, becauseif they live here, they learn
quite fast. But it's only theones who really, really dedicate
themselves to do to do it.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
Okay. I'm moving on to the next item now rather than
getting to discuss the Swedish,of which I feel
Speaker 2 (10:09):
like a 3rd
Speaker 3 (10:09):
wheel because I
Speaker 1 (10:11):
don't I don't have a Swedish wife. I don't
particularly wanna learnSwedish. I'm moving on. So apart
from the language problems andwriting the whole book twice in
2 or 2 books twice in 2different languages, when you
got we we don't have thatproblem, obviously, because, we
just write in the one language.But when you get to production,
(10:33):
where what are the pitfalls thatwe're about to fall into?
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Shipping. Shipping. Shipping. Shipping. Right.
It cost, a a shitload of moneyto ship. And especially,
unfortunately, due to Brexit,you guys are royally fucked.
Because, like like, Alphaspiel,the the big, one of the 2 big
game stores in Stockholm, theyare the ones who've been doing
(10:59):
the fulfillment the the theshipping, I would say. The
shipping to Sweden and EUcountries for us. And they, and
we're talking now about themdoing shipping for my father's
sword.
And they're like, yeah. We canship to Taiwan and New Zealand,
but not UK.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Oh, that's rubbish, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (11:20):
Because it's such a such a bother. It's such, so
much admin stuff to do. So I'myeah. I'm I'm yeah. Check check
shipping thoroughly thoroughly.
Have a good deal with someoneand make sure it's yeah. Because
it's, it takes it takes time.Like, I did I it it either costs
(11:43):
a shitload of money or takes anenormous amount of time.
Speaker 2 (11:48):
Right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Yeah. So we will I mean, we we think we've got
quite a good deal with adistributor that's got
distribution channels overseasas well as being in the UK. But
the the the price of that's goneup actually, isn't it, since we
Speaker 3 (12:01):
It has. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Talked In the last 6 months. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
So I think we'll I think our plan is to do the
pledge manager as close todelivery as we can to make sure
that the the price people pay inthe pledge manager is the price
the shipping actually costs.That's a useful thing to
Speaker 3 (12:17):
That's good. That's that's very, very smart of you
guys. You you really do that forsure.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
Working with the guys at, at Standard in Lithuania on
the printing, how did that go?
Speaker 3 (12:29):
Oh, amazing. They are so amazing to work with. I
cannot recommend them, highlyenough.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
It is you have produced a couple of super
books. They are really, reallyhigh quality. And the work is
high quality. I mean, not justthe printing, but the books
themselves are are superb. Youshould really be congratulated
for putting out something thatwas so good.
It's really Thank
Speaker 3 (12:49):
you so much. Thank you. Yeah. We're very happy.
When, of course, we could havemade more money if we would have
gone with another paper, anothercover, and all that.
Yeah. We we really wanted peopleto get the wind in books in
their hands to feel like, oh,oh, well, this is something
else. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
We've gotten exactly that response, which is, of
course, delightful. Yeah. Butstandard, they're amazing, and
they're very, thorough. That's,like, one reason that the last
month of delay is solely due tothe diligence of standard of
(13:29):
getting back to us. You have tochange this.
You have to change that. Thiswon't work. This will not be
clear enough. Okay. So I'm onbasically a back and forth for
Christian, with standard, justmaking sure everything is
printable, like a a good qualityprinting wise.
Speaker 1 (13:51):
Brilliant. Brilliant. That's good, to be aware of.
Mhmm. Let's factor out.
Let's see now. Let's make surewe've got that month still.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Mhmm. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
And when you talk to Christian, you're talking about
your layout artist.
Speaker 3 (14:04):
Yeah. Christian, the one who does the maps and
layouts. Yeah. Graphic design.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
Cool. Cool. They do look lovely. They do look
lovely.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
It is.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Yeah. Okay. So having set yourself the challenge of
writing 2 books in a differentlanguage and or 2 different
languages, you've gone simplerwith your next Kickstarter,
which is really why we've gotyou on the show. Now, you sent
us an early, early preview ofthis.
Speaker 3 (14:35):
Mhmm.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
And, there aren't many words in it is the first
thing I noticed. Lots ofgorgeous illustrations. Are
there gonna be more words by thetime the final version comes
out, or is it as simple as itseems?
Speaker 3 (14:50):
It might even be fewer.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Wow. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
Because this game is supposed to be a pick up and
play game that a game master canbuy in a game store on their way
to a game session and then readthe game on the bus to the game
session and then run it. Andthen their players can can make
their characters in half anhour, and then you just go.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Cool. Interesting. So and and what sort of characters
are you making?
Speaker 3 (15:21):
Characters?
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Yeah. You said make our characters in half an hour.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
Oh, what kind of character you make in the game?
Oh, sorry. Yeah. You make thatinto heroes that are also
slightly comical, because wewant people to really lean in
heavily on on the humorous andcomedy part of of role playing
games. It's supposed to be anostalgia game where you, live
out all the all the silly thingsyou did when you started playing
(15:49):
role playing games in theeighties or nineties.
Like, for me, for instance, wehad a guy who wanted to break
down a door, and he startedhacking at it with a sword
because the sword was the itemthat deal dealt the most most
damage. I was like, you can'tget shot.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
On that?
Speaker 3 (16:04):
Well, you can't shop through a door with a sword.
You'll be much better throwingyour full weight behind it. And
he's like, no. It does some moredamage. Or the guy who want to
try and kill Elrond because justimagine the the amount of XP
that you would get in Merp.
We're playing the Swedishversion of Merp then. So they
had an XP system. Like, thefirst time you do something,
(16:24):
it's it's, 4 times even higher.So it's like, well, no one's
ever killed an Elven lordbefore. So if you do that,
Netherland gives a lot of shouldgive a lot of XP.
So, yeah, all these kind ofridiculous things that you used
to do, and and we also have somesome quotes from famous
adventure movies from from wayback when. And, yeah, we try to
(16:47):
we try to give a lot of,humorous notes, and homarches
back to to old adventure movies.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
I quite like the, the the first page of the rules,
which says, I make it a rulenever to lie with someone unless
they can beat me in a fairfight.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Mhmm. Yep.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
Is that a quote from a movie? I don't I don't know if
Speaker 3 (17:09):
that Yeah. All the quotes are from movies.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
Yep. Excellent. Just remember, there's a thin line
between being a hero and being amemory. Sorry. I I I gotta stop
quoting.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
Yeah. My favorite is a combination. I I I managed to
combine 2. You killed myfather's brothers nephews
cousins former roommate. Prepareto
Speaker 2 (17:34):
die. Excellent. So what what one of them is the
princess bride. What's the otherone from?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Spaceballs. Spaceballs. Right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Long time since I've seen that. Never felt any need
to rewatch it either. That
Speaker 3 (17:50):
was nice. So so the characters are are epic heroes
that are amazing at some stuffand really crap at other stuff.
So yeah. And it's really easy.The rules are supposed to be
yeah.
You learn them in in 15, 20minutes. And most of the book is
actually dedicated to charactercreation. The rules are
(18:11):
basically one spread, maybe 2spreads.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Yes. It's brilliant. And the spreads themselves are
gorgeous. Lots of I guess youmight call them fantasy cliches
in a Mhmm. Painted in a humorousstyle, but what makes them not a
cliche is most of them arereally close-up.
You're zoomed in on a lot ofthese things. So, they don't
(18:35):
quite have their heroic posesyou might see in a Frank
Frazetta thing, but you're rightup against the thigh of a of a
Frank Frazetta hero or whatever.So it looks gorgeous. Some
lovely bit of graphic design aswell. How is the campaign going?
Speaker 3 (18:53):
The campaign is going okay. I mean, we were funded,
but we haven't really, it hasn'treally taken off as as well as
we'd hoped. We figured we'd do aa Kickstarter with a very, very
cheap product where the productwould cost let's see now you're
in Britain. So, like, a PDFwould be not even £3, and and
(19:17):
the book would be not even £8.And then I've this is, yeah,
this is really embarrassing, butI'm gonna out myself now on your
pocket.
Go ahead. Go ahead. I didn'treally think it through because
because shipping to UK and
Speaker 2 (19:35):
US Oh, no.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
Is is, twice the cost for the book itself. So the
whole reason we went for such alow price is I said to
Christian, it has to be a nobrainer to back this. If you are
even slightly, curious aboutthis game, it has to be so cheap
that it's a no brainer to backit. And it is.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
As long as you don't live in the In the
Speaker 3 (20:02):
UK or the US, which is like where we wanna be with
our like, the markets we wannareach. So it's, yeah. So, yeah,
a huge mistake on on my my partthere. But it's, yeah. I mean,
we're gonna get we're we'regonna get funded.
We're gonna be able to have anokay print run, and we're gonna,
(20:23):
keep on talking to distributorstrying to get the game out.
Because I think that once it'sin the store, it's gonna be in
stores for maybe 11 or 10 quid.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
Mhmm.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
Something like that, is is our goal at least. Might
be a pound or 2 more, but, like,definitely not above £15 in
stores. So we want this to be,like, easy accessible. Someone,
sees it, flips through it, findsit enjoyable. And, like, if
you've gone Christmas shoppingfor, you know, a 100, 110, 115,
(20:59):
pounds, why not just grab thisfor Yeah.
An extra 12 while you're atwhile
Speaker 2 (21:05):
you're at it?
Speaker 3 (21:05):
When when you're still in the game store and and
you you spent so much money, whynot, like, grab this one as
well? Or if you're in there justbrowsing, haven't thought of
getting something, and this isso cheap that, oh, well, I could
I could I could try this out.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
A nice easy impulse buy.
Speaker 3 (21:25):
Yeah. Yeah. That's, yeah, that's our goal. I don't
know. Some people have warned usand said the low price could be
a deterrent because, it doesn't,it doesn't really sing out,
quality and, and the qualityproducts.
So I don't it might be yetanother miscalculation on my
part. I don't know.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Well, I mean, it's all a lesson, isn't it? It's not
a miscalculation. You you youhad a theory. You're testing the
theory, and you'll get a result.And, you know, next time you
might do things differently.
Sorry, Darren. I interruptedyou.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
That's alright. I was just
Speaker 2 (22:01):
gonna say it's a difficult one, is it? Because
with anything you're publishing,if you go too cheap Mhmm. Yeah,
you can, you know, you you canyou automatically think that,
it's a real bargain. People willlove it. But then sometimes,
like you say, people will see itand think, oh, that is a bit too
cheap.
So I'm not even gonna give you 5quid of my money because it's
not gonna be worth a fiver.Whereas if it's a bit more
(22:23):
expensive Mhmm. Kind ofironically, you might have a
better chance of of making thesale.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
And that
Speaker 1 (22:29):
is just when we we always say that about, drive
through RPG products, don't we?You know? Yeah. When we do those
reviews, we say, this is, youknow, a great a great book. It
looks really interesting, butyou're you're giving it away too
cheaply.
And I think I think that reallydoes on drive through RPG, even
though it's only a PDF, peoplekinda go, oh, if it's that
(22:51):
cheap, it can't be any good.And, that's a bit of a pain.
This, though, tell me more abouthow this is gonna look then. It
I mean, because visually, it'svery arresting. But what it's
it's not gonna be a fancyhardback like this, horn of
dawn.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
No. It's gonna be a softback. I don't ex Christian
knows more about exactly whatkind of softback it it's gonna
be, but I don't think we'regoing with a stapled one. It's
gonna be
Speaker 1 (23:21):
It's gonna be square bound.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
Case bound.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Yeah. In in some way bound, I think. And, we had a we
had a, stretch goal planned forfor some higher sons with a
flashier cover where the, thelogo might, like, flash the
silver a bit or something likethat.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
But I
Speaker 3 (23:38):
don't think we're gonna reach that, and and, we
will not be able to to to dothat with this, at least on with
this print run. I mean, if ifthis print run really sells out
and people really like it, wemight make an updated version.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Is this kind of an idea for a for an ongoing sort
of series of of of games in asimilar vein or, is this kind of
just what your your your yournostalgic love letter to
Speaker 3 (24:07):
to those stupid days back when you're a kid role
playing? Well, I mean, the ideafor this game actually started
with me, being a bit tired ofvery crunchy games. So I wanted
to experiment with with actually2 things, but the first thing
then would be, like, what liketrying to boil down the essence
(24:28):
of number of skills. Like, howhow few can you go? How how many
you need to have, like, a bareminimum to to cover everything,
to cover everything you need.
And and and I can like, when Istarted making it, I was like,
okay. So 8. You need 8 skills.Eight skills will cover
everything. Of course, you won'thave the super dynamics of the
(24:51):
difference between intimidatingand, persuading.
But, in in this in this ruleset, we we have 8 skills. We
think we cover they covereverything. And we also write
that, for instance, if you weregonna intimidate someone, you
could use social interactions,but you might also use spiritual
power. You know? It's not it'snot set in stone, which
(25:16):
situations you would use eachskill.
That that would depend on andalso on on your character. So
like like, we also encourage thegame master to just go with,
like, what's reasonable? What'sreasonable? Would it be
reasonable for a for a 3 and ahalf meter giant to intimidate
with his, combat skill, if he'sgonna intimidate someone just
(25:39):
cracking his knuckles. Yeah.
Well, it might intimidate mostpeople if he does that. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Dave, I've just I've got to admit a terrible thing. I
thought, well, we've gotta giveAndreas our support. So I I went
and backed it, but, I didn'tback it on my account. I backed
it on
Speaker 2 (25:59):
The company account. So this is why I need to have
access to the accounts, Matthew.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Both is okay.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
I
Speaker 3 (26:13):
mean, it's all here. It's not even That's the
Speaker 2 (26:16):
thin end of thin end of the wedge. That before we
know it, I'm so how are youpaying for Iceland, Matt?
Speaker 1 (26:21):
Oh, yeah. That's that's that's coming out of the
Kickstarter. It's research. No.No.
No. It's not
Speaker 3 (26:29):
Well, actually, the the other thing I wanted to to
to experience experiment with, Idon't know if you noticed it,
but, apart from the title, whichis I changed the title so many
times. But apart from the title,I ended up with going with my
father's sword because there'snothing more cliche than my
father's sword. I was rewatchingGame of Thrones, with my son the
(26:50):
other day, and it took, like, 2episodes. And someone was like,
my father's sword. And I'm like,perfect.
Why do we have that title?Because there's nothing more
cliche. And we have a whole rulefor cliches and stuff like that.
We can talk about that later.But I
Speaker 1 (27:04):
was gonna ask you about the cliche rule. I was
gonna ask you to start about thespelling of the cliche rule as
well.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
Uh-huh. Did I misspell it?
Speaker 1 (27:13):
Yeah. You've gotten it spelled with 2 e's on the
end, whereas cliche effectively.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Uh-huh. Oh, that must be a typo because I do think I
would use just an e with a alittle
Speaker 1 (27:28):
Yeah. Yeah. I think it's slightly it's only it's
only on the page title. Nobodywill notice it.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Yeah. You should have just said that that was a design
decision, and it was alwaysalways intended that way.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
If it's on the page title, I will completely blame
Christian because he writesthose himself. He does not copy
paste them. The same with, Ithink for a while, weakness was
spelled like, you know, a weekof time, 7 days.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
With 2 week 2 e's. K. An e's. Yeah. So I I think
Christian has a thing from with2 e's of it.
Speaker 3 (28:01):
Yeah. I think so. I think so. No. But the other
thing I want to experiment waswas with was, gender pronouns.
There's not a single, genderassigned pronoun in the entire
game. Not a single one. BecauseI was like I mean, back in the
day, there was there was likethere was he, he, him, him
(28:23):
everywhere. And then nowadays,most companies go with, like, if
we take Free League forinstance, they go with, well,
the game master is always willalways be in the name as a she,
and the players will be him. Andthen we've balanced it out.
And I I was like, do you need tohave them? What would happen if
you would try and write, a gamecompletely without gender
(28:46):
assigned, pronouns? And it it itit it it there have been a few
situations where I've struggled.It might show in the text. It
might not.
I don't I'm not sure. I'm notgonna be the judge of that, but
I do think I've managed actuallyquite well to to write a whole
game without a single, gendersong pronoun apart from the
(29:08):
title. It's kinda ruins
Speaker 2 (29:11):
the whole thing. But Exactly. I was beginning to
think, there's in the firstpage, there might be a gender
like
Speaker 1 (29:21):
No. No. The father is a noun, not a pronoun. Remember?
Speaker 3 (29:25):
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
It's still a it is a it is a sign of the gender,
though, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Well, and there is also the classic as I pointed
out to my daughter who is doinga gender studies dissertation. I
pointed out that whenever shesays, in this case, my father
what that should be is my fatherapostrophe sword, then that is
actually in English a derivationof my father, his sword. So
(29:52):
every time you write apossessive in English, you're
actually reaffirming thepatriarchy.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
Just a
Speaker 1 (29:58):
little aside there.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
Yeah. No. But I'm curious if you if you go through
it again, if you if you'll spot,if you you're probably gonna see
it then now that I've said it.But it's interesting because no
one has reacted to it. I thinkthe 20 or 30 people have read
the the early beta that you'vegotten, by now, and, and no one
(30:23):
has has reacted to it yet, whichis fun because I wanted to
slightly, like, slightly gounder the radar.
It's not something that we'rewe're using in the, in the
marketing or anything like that.It's just, I I meant when you
Speaker 2 (30:38):
decided to do it. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Yeah. See, the problem is, Andreas, you've said
that thing, and now I am goingthrough the text going, oh,
yeah. So I see.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Yeah. Yeah. We might be able to miss it now you've
mentioned it. We're gonna get,oh god. I wish there was some
pronouns in this.
Speaker 3 (30:55):
Yeah. Yeah. This sentence doesn't really make
sense. Oh, it's because it'strying to avoid pronouns. For
sure.
There are a few like that.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
Yeah. So, Dave, you carry on with the interview
while I try and tear myself awayfrom the text. Salvador, I
wanted to ask you. So what givesthe cliche point?
Speaker 3 (31:15):
That's up to the to the game master and the and the
pray prayer. So this game has, arules mechanic called cliche
points. Whenever you dosomething that's super cliche,
sitting in a dark corner withyour hood drawn up in the inn,
for instance, or, yeah. Going ona quest to find your father's
sword or being the, magicalprodigy child, like a youngster
(31:39):
who's super talented in magic,although you've never had any
teachings in it. Whatever iscliche Well,
Speaker 1 (31:46):
of course, my background is I have no family.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
Yeah. Exactly. I have no family. My family was
slaughtered by orcs or whatever.Yeah.
Or or my family was killed by anunknown stranger.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Oh. I'm
Speaker 3 (31:58):
a mutt.
Speaker 1 (31:59):
Fingers on his hand. Yeah. Okay. So what do I do with
the cliche point when I've gotit?
Speaker 3 (32:05):
So once you get a cliche point, you can spend that
to to perform a heroic deed,which is in all adventure
movies, heroes sometimes dothings that are ridiculous.
Things that if you try to dothem and would wanna make a dice
roll for it, you'd get a minusmodification of 1 gazillion.
Mhmm. And instead, you but withthe cliche points, you can spend
(32:28):
them to make a perform a heroicdeed, and then you just do it.
You just yeah.
It just happens. Yeah. Yousucceed. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. Cool.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Brilliant. And are you are you going to stand up to
print this, or are you going,more locally?
Speaker 3 (32:45):
We were going back and forth on that, but we have
decided to go with stand up onceagain. Yeah. They're giving us a
good a very good deal, which noone in Sweden can can match. And
and also they've because theyknow we want this out at least
for the Christmas, shopping inSweden. So so they've actually,
Speaker 1 (33:07):
saved So they're turning it around. This is gonna
be this is the biggest newsever. Right. Okay. I've already
got the PDF.
I can see it's almost done,except you gotta correct those
typos we'll
Speaker 2 (33:19):
spot it for you. Mhmm. And put put some pronouns
in.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
I'll sprinkle a few pronouns in
Speaker 2 (33:23):
the same.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
Yeah. I got there's an illustration or 2 that's not
in the beta, but I think all theall the may all the
illustrations are actuallyfinished. So they just have to
be turned into yeah. Given toChristian to for some graphic
magic.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
So tell your backers, your potential backers, because
they're all gonna back when theyrealize they can back a game in
November and get it beforeChristmas.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
Mhmm.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
What's the processes gonna be here? What what what
happens when the campaignfinishes the, the Kickstarter
campaign finishes?
Speaker 3 (33:55):
Yeah. As soon as a Kickstarter campaign finishes
and we did we we decided to goon a a 21 day Kickstarter
campaign as well because thatextra week very seldom does very
much. It's just a a slot of, youknow, a a back or 2 a day. You
know?
Speaker 1 (34:11):
We've been there. We've been there.
Speaker 3 (34:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
One one backup up, 2 leave. It's a it's
Speaker 2 (34:17):
a terrible Yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:18):
Yeah. So we decided to go with a bit short. So as
soon as we basically, as soon aswe finish the Kickstarter, the
final PDF will go out, tobackers. That's our that's our
hope because we the time slotthat Standard Standard has has
given us is basically just likea week after the Kickstarter
campaign finishes. So we'll sendit to print, and then a few
(34:40):
weeks later, we'll get it.
And one reason, it also took afew weeks to to post the to ship
the the Wyndham stuff wasbecause, of add ons. And we
decided to not go with add onson this one at all just to speed
up the process. This is gonnabe, it's gonna be cheap, and
it's gonna be fast. So it'sstill gonna be good because I've
(35:03):
been writing on this game forfor years. So, like, when I gave
Christian the text, it's textthat I've been polishing and,
you know, working on for foryears.
I I playtested this game, in aSwedish livestream podcast on
YouTube 6 years ago. And and 95%of the text or at least the
(35:26):
rules and all that, I I did somepolishing, a lot a lot of
polishing this last few weeks.But but, like, 95% of the text
was there 6 years ago. Mhmm. Soand and our illustrator, an
Italian called, Alessia Marino.
Super talented. I've known herthrough Facebook for a while,
(35:47):
and, yeah, really wanted her toto go along with us for this one
because I knew that Robert isworking on upcoming projects for
for Nordisk called for Windhame,Horn of Dawn part 2. So so we
decided to to go with someoneelse, for this one to give to
not give Robert, like, stress,problems. So she's she's been
(36:13):
amazing to work with, and she'sbeen super fast, and we really,
love working with her. We'regonna work with her on upcoming
products as well for sure.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Yeah. Love loving loving some of the artwork. Some
of the artwork is really, reallygood.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
Yeah. Absolutely. It's great. Okay. Then now here
here's another question.
It comes back to print.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
Mhmm.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
And it's a question it's a selfish question because,
Dave and I are now wonderingabout this, and, you know, maybe
feedback to to your other booksas well. So you're gonna end up
with a certain number of peoplethat have bought the book. You
could print arguably, you know,the the the the cheapest
(36:58):
situation above that. How manyextra copies are you printing
for retail distribution?
Speaker 3 (37:04):
We haven't decided on that yet, actually, because of
the because of the kickstart notactually performing as well as
as we had hoped. So we mighthave to go down. We were gonna
go with the 2,008 each language,but, we will probably not we we
(37:25):
we're not gonna we're not gonnaafford that. Then we'd have to,
like, take money from the windowand campaign and put it into
this. And, like, we could put ina little bit, but not not too
much.
So we're we're probably gonnareduce that. And we might not
like, for Windhay, we did 700 ofeach book in each language.
Speaker 2 (37:45):
Mhmm. And and
Speaker 3 (37:47):
for this one, we might actually do a larger print
run-in Swedish because we haveall the channels, that we need.
We're like we have directcontact with all the Swedish
game stores. Mhmm. So we knowapproximately how many they will
they will buy, and and also wego to conventions here. So we
know a certain amount of copiesare gonna be sold at
(38:07):
conventions.
And when you go down and you
Speaker 1 (38:10):
just try crime convention material, isn't it? I
mean
Speaker 3 (38:12):
It really is.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
Pick it off your table at a convention. Find an
empty table, and go and play it.Yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. For sure. So we and the thing is
that when you go down in printrun, the total cost doesn't go
down.
Speaker 1 (38:27):
No. It doesn't
Speaker 3 (38:28):
go down.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
No. It doesn't go down. No.
Speaker 3 (38:30):
So it's like it's also a matter of not not just
distribution, but also, like,what do you call it?
Speaker 2 (38:38):
Warehouse. Storage.
Speaker 3 (38:39):
Yeah. Storage. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.
So Alpha Spill is helping uswith the storage. And, but these
books are huge, and and myfather's store is gonna be much
smaller. So Tiny. Yeah. 1 box isgonna contain a lot more copies.
So, yeah, we haven't reallydecided on on an exact print
one, actually.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Cool. But you did just let's step my the answer to
my next question. So you aredoing this in English and
Swedish?
Speaker 3 (39:04):
Yes. Indeed. Yeah. Yeah. Cool.
Yeah. We, our next product afterthis, which I I'd love to come
back and talk to you about, butI can't really just yet because
it's a little bit too early.Exactly. But but that one is
gonna be English only. But apartfrom that, I think most of our
stuff will be dual langlinguistic, do do both in
(39:26):
English and Swedish, for the forthe foreseeable future.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
So is that that new that new project that that isn't
the next, book for Windheimthen? Is it it's something new
and different that you're you'rekicking
Speaker 3 (39:40):
off? Yeah. We we might do that. We might do 2
other products before we do, thenext Windheim book, and it's not
because we're not writing on itbecause I'm I'm writing on
number 2 as we not as we speak.But, I I finished the first
chapter.
But it's because we wanna givepeople time to to play part 1
(40:01):
before we ask them to to backpart 2 because, yes, we've
gotten, like, great, reactionsfrom from all the backers and
all the people who bought it andall the people looked at it. But
that's all Roberts andChristian's work that they've
praised, isn't it? It's gonnatake them a while to to see if
they if they think I have to dothis now. You know? So I I we
(40:23):
don't wanna sell, in Sweden, wecall it call it we wanna we
don't you don't wanna sell thepig in the bag.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
No.
Speaker 3 (40:31):
Because you wanna see what the pig look like looks
looks like when you buy it. Sowe want we want people to be
able to have played part 1 forfor a while, and then and then
we're gonna release part 2.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
And I like the way that it's your contribution to
the book that gets described asthe pig that, Andre. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:49):
It surely is. It surely is.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
Yeah. The writers the writers plague to be referred to
as the pig in the bag. I likethat phrase, though. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (40:58):
Yeah. Cool. So so should we expect to see you over
at a convention in the UKanytime soon? We really, really
hope so. I think,
Speaker 3 (41:07):
when it comes to coming as a Sweden Roll's
podcaster, it's all about usneeding an invitation, because
we, like, we can't lose money ongoing on conventions. Like, if
we someone pays us to come, wecan come and do a kick ass live
show. We've done them in Swedenand in, many places all over
Sweden. But but it's up to thethe organizers if they if they
(41:33):
wanna bring us there or not. Imean, we're we are in the hall
of fame after all that over at NWorld, the the list over there.
So Yeah. Along with some prettypretty awesome names. But but
when it comes to Nordic scolds,I think we need a few more
books. I don't think it's worthit, coming to a convention with,
(41:53):
you know, 2 books. We need weneed we need 5, 6 at least, to
to show off for for for it to beworth it to to come as a
publisher.
As a visitor, I'd love to, butmy time schedule is ridiculous,
unfortunately. It it's, it wouldhave to be so many so many stars
(42:14):
would have to align for me to beable to come to Dragon Meat or
UK Games Expo, for instance. Foryeah. During the foreseeable
future, like, I I'd love to go.I'd love to go to SN.
I'd love to go to GenCon over atthe US, or some kind of, what do
you call what what do they callthem? Packs, unplugged. Plaques.
Speaker 1 (42:36):
Oh, packs. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:37):
Plaques, unplugged. And yeah.
Speaker 3 (42:39):
Yeah. And and Gary Cohn and and all of those, I'd
love to go to those. But, yeah,time and money. Time and money,
my friend.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
Yeah. Yeah. Same here.
Speaker 1 (42:51):
Yes. Yes. Mhmm. And and one book to sell. I think I
think I don't know.
I mean, even in even in Swedishconventions, you're gonna need
to partner up with other,publishers, aren't you, who've
also got 1 or 2 books to sell.And they say, let's let's get a
store together, and we'llmanage, you know, half the day
(43:13):
and you manage the other
Speaker 3 (43:13):
half of the day. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly.
Exactly. I think so. I think so.I think that's gonna be the
solution for 2025, at least,perhaps even 2026. But, yeah,
we'll see.
But I I did go to somethingcalled. Oh, yeah.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
Couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 3 (43:29):
Yeah. Yeah. Couple of weeks ago. Yeah. It was a big
thing in the eighties where the,the pub the big publisher at the
time who had, you know, DrakaOptumoner and and all of these
mutant and and cult and allthose games.
They, they had. And then, lastyear, Free League, revived it
with the, yeah, with theOctumona Dragonbane theme. Yeah.
(43:53):
Yeah. Yeah.
So I was there as a, yeah, 3rdparty product writer, and then
we got a table and, yeah, soldvery well, actually. Excellent.
Yeah. So it it it works, but, Imean, of course, then it was
people who there were people whowere there who were really,
(44:14):
really heavily into Dragon Bay.
Speaker 2 (44:16):
So
Speaker 3 (44:16):
Yeah. It was kind of an easy sell in that way, but
yeah.
Speaker 1 (44:20):
And they hadn't already backed the book. They'd
they'd these were these werepeople who were new customers.
Speaker 3 (44:24):
New customers. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, some of them
had been looking at the booksfor a while, but missed a
Kickstarter.
And and some were people who'venever seen it and just fell in
love with, you know, the feel ofthe paper and the cover. And
there was actually oneyoungster. He was maybe, I don't
know, 13, maybe 14. He stood inthe background while I was
(44:48):
describing the campaign toanother person. And when as soon
as I finished talking and theother person, you know, went
away, he came up and he said,can you just wait a second?
I need to go get my dad becauseI need I need these books. Nice.
Nice. He he just went andbrought his dad, and he said,
(45:10):
dad, we have to buy these. Thissounds like the the coolest
adventure for RPG ever.
And, you know, they ended upbuying, like, maps and books and
dice and everything.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
Oh, nice. Brilliant.
Speaker 3 (45:22):
But I I I can How did you
Speaker 1 (45:24):
describe this campaign to to this other
customer who didn't buy it toimpress this kid so much? What
what did you say?
Speaker 3 (45:33):
I was ranting for a while, but I I could give you
another answer, which I gave to,a guy interviewing me on
Discord, actually this morning,where he asked me to describe,
traces of darkness part 1 ofHorn of Dawn in less than 10
words.
Speaker 1 (45:49):
Oh, right. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (45:50):
Go ahead. What I went with was, an epic adventure
with, what was it, withpolitical intrigue. What was the
word I was using? Gosh. I forgotit.
You're at 6. So much. I know.Yeah. Jeez.
(46:18):
My brain is not workingproperly.
Speaker 2 (46:20):
I know. That's a lot
Speaker 1 (46:21):
more than 10 words now.
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Yeah. I know it is. I know. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (46:25):
I'm gonna have to get back to you with that one. But
if I get more than 10 words,it's it's, it's an exciting epic
adventure where you where youhave have to, wade through
morally moral gray zones andpick a side when it's not super
obvious and super easy to be on.And it's, yeah, as I said, like,
(46:49):
so let's social interactionsand, intrigues and murder
mysteries and a dungeon crawl.It has it has everything.
Speaker 1 (46:57):
And This is what we like. We like that sort of
social interaction
Speaker 3 (47:00):
stuff as well. Yeah. Yeah. So we we try to write it
so that it's not just pile up abunch of monsters to fight.
We've Yeah.
Included a lot of places wherewe write. If your group is a
group that enjoys combat and ormonster fighting, throw in
monster x here. That would
Speaker 1 (47:22):
be suitable.
Speaker 3 (47:23):
And, like yeah. But but it's very it's very focused
on story. It's very focused onit's it's it it doesn't really
start off that way, but it willdevelop into a save the world
story Mhmm. In a of ethnicproportions. But it's, in the
beginning, it's it's all about,yeah, navigating, yeah, moral
(47:47):
gray zones and, solvingmysteries, social interactions.
It's a rather the world that yousee from start is a rather
feudal, medieval fantasy world.Yeah. But it will turn more and
more into high fantasy as thestory goes along.
Speaker 2 (48:08):
Mhmm. Cool. So has wind has wind has wind had done
as well as you'd hoped?
Speaker 3 (48:13):
Oh, Wingham has definitely over, exceeded our
expectations for sure. We webroke a Swedish record for new
RPG writers. Cool. Neither FreeLeague or Hangast or Thunderbird
or Skvoggan or any of those,guys, reach neither the numbers
(48:34):
or the amounts of backers thatwe did for their very first
thing that they did. Now the thefirst Kickstarter for Helmgast
was Cultivated Lost.
That, of course, did better thanwe did, but those guys have been
producing RPGs since thenineties when they did that.
Yeah. So it doesn't really countas, you know, new RPG fighters.
Speaker 2 (48:57):
Yeah. No. That's fair.
Speaker 3 (48:58):
But it's been doing very well, and and since people
are so happy with it, the wordhas spread, and I think Alpha
Spirit is on their 3rd ordernow. Cool. Like, reorder of, you
know, restocking.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (49:12):
So That
Speaker 1 (49:13):
is good. That's good.
Speaker 3 (49:15):
It's excellent.
Speaker 1 (49:17):
I know that you've got another interview to go to
because you are on this mediatrail, aren't you, Andreas?
Speaker 3 (49:23):
Yeah. Yeah. And we we I really appreciate you you
taking the time to to talk to meabout this because it's No.
Speaker 2 (49:31):
Thank you for coming on.
Speaker 3 (49:32):
It's always want to talk with you guys, and I I
really need to to get out thereand tell people about my
father's sword. I think it mightbe one of the reasons I I know
one of the reasons, it hasunderperformed is because we we
started too late with buildinghype for it, like, beforehand.
Yeah. Yeah. And that was becausewe have been waiting to deliver
(49:55):
on the Windhay, Kickstarterbefore we do the next one, which
has meant that we had yeah.
But we could still have tried tobuild some hype for it. But, I
mean, that's also difficult whenyou haven't even we haven't
even, like, delivered your firstone to start building hype to a
new one. That's, and we reallywanted this, like, backers to
(50:17):
get it before Christmas andmaybe even out in stores before
Christmas. Mhmm. So we reallytried to get this on the fast
track, and it's, yeah, I thinkwe we underestimated the
difficulty in reaching peopleand telling them because telling
people about a third partyproduct is very easy.
You go to the to the Facebookgroup or the Discord, channels,
(50:41):
for that game, for the the theoriginal game. And then you say,
I I have a cool third partyproduct. And people, like, if
you do a good job with tellingthem what what it is, they're
gonna be excited and they'rethey're gonna wanna buy it. With
with a new RPG, like a totallystandalone RPG, it's much harder
to find channels where you cantalk about it.
Speaker 2 (51:01):
Yeah. Yeah. When when we were were trying to promote
tales of the old west, I found anumber of wild west paint you
know, groups on Facebook that Ijust with my fingers crossed
saying don't hate me for doingthis. I just did a bit of
spamming. And I think, you know,I think that that did quite
well.
And I think nobody said stopspamming. So that was, that was
(51:22):
cool. But yeah, it's a realtough one, isn't it? And that's,
yeah.
Speaker 3 (51:25):
It's difficult. It's difficult. Yeah. So we'll we'll
see with the future product overif we might like, you know,
shift things around a bit withthat with that in mind. My new
totally new RPGs might have towait a bit longer than we had
initially planned.
Speaker 2 (51:44):
I guess also with your very ambitious target to
get my father's sword out byChristmas, I think you'll have
done an epic job if, you know,once it's if you get out in that
time frame. Mhmm. Because it's,you know, it's as as we're
finding, as first timepublishers, there is an awful
lot of gulf built into the justthe process of doing stuff that
(52:05):
you don't Yeah. You don'tanticipate and it really takes a
lot longer than you think itought to.
Speaker 3 (52:11):
Even getting your bank account here in Sweden took
us a lot longer than we expectedbecause the banks are so afraid
of, like, money laundering andstuff like that. Yeah. Mhmm. So
so it took us like, we actuallygot refused by several banks
Speaker 2 (52:26):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (52:27):
Who are like some were like, no. We don't even
accept new clients at all. Andsome so there was all kinds of
obstacles that we could neverhave anticipated. Yeah. Because
that once we've solved them,like, we don't have to get a a
new bank again, and we don'thave to find, yeah.
So a lot of things that made usdelayed with the first one. Once
(52:50):
you've done it, then it's there.And It should be easier.
Speaker 2 (52:54):
Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (52:55):
It's gonna get easier.
Speaker 2 (52:58):
No. Brilliant. Well, as of recording, there's 11 days
to go. You've you've got 190backers and over £2,000. Well,
that works out to in Krona, I'mnot sure.
But, yeah, it's it's doing, youknow, like you say, it's, it's
too good. It's going. It's doingit seems to be doing quite well
even if it's not quite on theexpectations that you were
(53:18):
hoping for. So if, if anyone'slistening to this and you're
interested, go and find myfather's sword on Kickstarter
and, back it and get that gamein your hands before Christmas
if, if Andreas can make it allwork.
Speaker 1 (53:31):
Yeah. And there will only be about 4 days to go when
you hear this if you are one ofour things. So get don't waste
time.
Speaker 3 (53:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (53:40):
Our patrons will hear it a bit early on, but, but,
yeah, don't waste time. Ifyou're listening to this on
Monday, get over there toKickstarter. We will, of course,
put a link in the show notes,and, thank you very much,
Andreas. We're gonna finish theshow now, actually, Dave and I,
by telling them what we're gonnabe doing in,
Speaker 3 (54:01):
Couple of weeks.
Speaker 1 (54:02):
Well, 3 weeks from now. 2 weeks when other people
are hearing this. And that'sgonna be quite short because we
have no idea. But we'd love youto to hang on to the end so that
when we sign off, you can say,and may the icons bless your
adventures. You happy to dothat?
Speaker 3 (54:21):
Mainly icons bless your adventures. Yes.
Speaker 1 (54:23):
I will do that. Cool. Cool. Cool. Right.
Speaker 2 (54:25):
So next time then, Matthew. What are you doing next
time?
Speaker 1 (54:29):
Well, I think what we need to do next time, actually,
is you remember that terribleinterview I did with, it was a
great interview, actually, with2 of the mice.
Speaker 3 (54:39):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (54:40):
Their Kickstarter will be, I think, about to kick
off, in 2 or 3 weeks' time. SoI'm gonna try and fix an
interview with them, which willbe, I think, the majority of our
content in the next episode.
Speaker 2 (54:52):
Cool.
Speaker 1 (54:54):
That was easy. So there we go. So it's goodbye
from me.
Speaker 2 (54:59):
And it's goodbye from him.
Speaker 3 (55:01):
And may the icons bless your adventures.
Speaker 2 (55:05):
Perfect.
Speaker 3 (55:07):
Did I get that right?
Speaker 2 (55:08):
Oh, yeah. That's dead on.
Speaker 3 (55:09):
Always worried about that bit.
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