June 11, 2025 • 46 mins
Tired of asking for reviews and getting crickets? In this episode, Sara Hansen reveals why most practices struggle to earn referrals and how to change that—starting from the inside out.
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Episode Transcript
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Sara Hansen (00:00):
The Productive Dentist Academy Podcast Network.
Regan Robertson (00:06):
Welcome to the Everyday Practices Dental Podcast.
I'm Reagan Robertson and myco-host Dr. Chad Johnson.
Dr. Maggie Augustine and Iare on a mission to share the
stories of everyday dentists whogenerate extraordinary results.
Using practical proven methods you cantake into your own dental practice if
you are ready to reclaim your time so youcan focus on great patient care without
sacrificing yourself along the way.
(00:28):
Buckle up and listen in
Sara Hansen (00:31):
when it comes to reviews.
The purpose of reviews are weare looking as consumers for
authentic, truthful experiences.
Anytime we order anything onAmazon or other websites, the first
thing we do is we read the reviewsbecause we believe and trust.
(00:53):
The feedback that's coming from thosepeople who've experienced that, you
know, if the outfit runs too small,if it broke after two days, right?
We believe those and thatultimately changes our buying, um,
purposes and what we do, right?
We may move on if there's not greatfeedback from the people who have
authentically used the product.
(01:13):
So the purpose of reviews isreally about authenticity and
them leaving the experiences.
Dr. Maggie Augustine: Marketing is like occlusion. (01:19):
undefined
This is what I, what I tellWade Kiffer all the time.
It's like black magic, right?
And I should have my crystals out tohelp me guide through the process.
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:31):
Truth
Regan Robertson (01:32):
there is, I've learned over my 26 years, 26 years in, in
marketing that, uh, that I actually.
I personally don't enjoy marketing.
I actually don't like marketing,which is a really weird thing to say,
uh, especially from someone who hasbeen in marketing this entire time.
(01:52):
And I think it's my own evolution.
I, what I love is the storyand the essence of a brand.
And a brand is more than, uh.
Than one element of it.
So I think marketing overall,it, it tends to get painted
on lots of different elements.
And, and the reality is, is thatmarketing is, is a beautiful distribution
(02:15):
channel and that's where it canbecome the biggest blessing ever.
And it can also become the most.
Overwhelming and confusing area.
And so Maggie, when you'resaying that it feels like, you
know, it's just black magic.
It's, it is, there's abit of mystery to it.
And, and you know why?
It's not like fast and hard.
It's unique to the brand and theaudience that you're trying to attract.
(02:36):
And so just like anything,it takes a lot of practice.
It takes some skill, ittakes a lot of listening.
And, uh, I am really excitedtoday We have the full.
Crew here to have SarahHanson in the hot seat.
Listeners get ready because Sarahabsolutely, not only does she love
(02:57):
marketing, like it pours out of herskin naturally, and she has this way of
making uncomfortable stuff really fun.
And so.
If marketing to you feels like,ugh, like I have to, or I just
don't know if I'm doing it right.
She's there to guide you along the way.
And her and I have worked togetherfor several years now, and she
has just, she's inspired me.
(03:17):
Um, she's shown me how easy she makes itto, to wanna market, and most importantly,
she understands the essence and thedifference between a brand and marketing.
And she bridges the two togetherreally well so that you can make
sure that when you tell your brandstory, it's gonna go to the right.
Place.
So Chad and Maggie, welcome to our show.
So pleased that both ofyou are following us.
(03:38):
Any, any notes that you have to say beforewe bring Sarah into the conversation?
Dr. Chad Johnson (03:43):
Well, I was gonna ask Maggie, uh, uh, I was gonna
ask, uh, Sarah, is, is, is themarketing exuding from your pores?
Is that what gives you your glow?
Sara Hansen (03:53):
The marketing glow?
Yes.
I, I wonder like pregnancy glow.
That's marketing.
Regan Robertson (03:58):
Yes.
Oh, oh.
Dr. Chad Johnson (04:03):
Ing new ideas.
Yes,
Dr. Maggie Augustine (04:07):
and and one of the things about Sarah, and I've
known her for quite a few yearsnow, is that she just stands in this
confidence of what marketing is.
And she exudes that, not just whenyou're working with her, but if
you've ever seen her on stage.
And that confidence is notjust her walking around
(04:27):
saying, I know this stuff, but.
She has a lot behind her to support theconfidence that she, that she stands in.
And I really look forward to thisconversation in kind of teasing that
out of her and, and, uh, and showingour listeners some of these pearls
(04:48):
that I have no doubt she will present,uh, to you guys that you can take
away just from this short podcastand incorporate into your practice.
This black magic
Dr. Chad Johnson (04:59):
when, yeah, when, when Sarah tells her puppy story.
I'm serious.
I can about cry on demand.
I mean, so the farmer's dog.
Regan Robertson (05:11):
Oh, the farmer's dog.
Yes, yes, yes.
Dr. Chad Johnson (05:15):
Says the guy from Iowa.
Well, listen, I'm, I'm not a crier,but like, uh, but that, like, it's
not just the first time I heard it,but I, the second time I was like.
S Bite your lip.
Look away.
Think.
Regan Robertson (05:29):
I think you did get teary.
Did.
Yes.
Somebody at the conference.
She played it at the conferenceand somebody, I think it
was you that got teary.
Dr. Chad Johnson (05:35):
It was me.
It was you.
It was me.
I was missing my girls.
And then I'm watching this videoand I'm just like, oh shoot.
I'm just like, that was,that's exemplary of finding the
emotion that goes with the, the.
Concept of what you're trying to portray.
So,
Regan Robertson (05:51):
okay.
Show notes.
We'll put the farmer's dog ad in.
So you all know what the heckwe're talking about here today?
Yes.
Or
Dr. Chad Johnson (05:59):
caveat, uh, trigger warning.
If you need to not cry within, you know,10 minutes of, of a listening to the
podcast or whatever, don't click on thatad until you're ready to emotionally,
you know, disengage and let it go.
Regan Robertson (06:16):
If you haven't listened to the previous episode, I
highly recommend you go and do that.
Chad and I break down, uh, exactlywhat, what marketing looks like when
it's done, uh, correctly, and then whenit's, you know, when it breaks down
where to look for the breakdowns init and how to do a great audit on it.
And I think it's a nice, um,prerequisite to having Sarah on today.
(06:37):
Either way, though, you could just listento this standalone and it'd be great.
Sarah, welcome to Everyday Practices.
Marketing from the inside out.
If you could just kind of bringlisteners along in this journey.
Tell us a little bit aboutyourself first and why, why
marketing is so, um, something thatyou're really passionate about.
Sara Hansen (06:56):
Hi everyone.
Three of my favorite.
Um, yeah, so I've been in thedental industry for over 25
years now, so I am an oldie.
Um, but I started in the dentalpractice, had almost every position
other than the dentist and, and hygienistand, you know, it's interesting.
(07:17):
Going through and sitting in thedifferent seats of the practice.
You definitely see patientjourneys at different spots.
And so I think having that knowledgeand experience of being in the dental
practice for 18 years before I decidedto move on and do more things with.
The education and the knowledge thatI had, and I think it's given me
the background that I really neededto, one, understand what's truly
(07:40):
happening in the dental practice.
Um, but two, be able to, you know, whenwe train teams and talk about what does
something look like or sound like, orhow does it feel to ask for a review?
Or how does it feel?
To complete a reallygreat patient journey.
I understand what that feels likebecause I've experienced, you know,
I've been the one to answer thetricky phone calls from a patient.
(08:02):
I've been the one at eventstrying to promote our practice.
And so, um, that's where I thinkthe love of marketing came for me.
Unbeknownst to me, I didn'trealize it was there until I really
started doing more and more of it.
Um, and now I truly love it, so I getto be the one that tells the stories
of the practice, and I love it.
Like
Regan Robertson (08:21):
who, who has a better job than that?
Well, this is a really uniquedifferentiator here because
not very many marketers haveheld each role in the practice.
I love stories of people whohave been in an organization and
they've been from the ground.
Up.
So it gives them a very unique positionto say, okay, I know exactly what happens
at each of these intersections, and Iknow what matters to that role, and I know
(08:44):
what matters to the patient at that role.
Um.
Something that we've talkedabout for years now, uh, is,
it was, it was interesting.
It, it started a few years ago.
Gosh, maybe even 10 at this point.
But I remember, you know, doingmarketing for dentists and the
dentist coming back and just saying,it doesn't, it just doesn't work.
You need more.
You need more.
You need more.
And me and the people pleasing role,I immediately thought it must be
(09:08):
something I'm doing, like as a marketer,it must be something I'm doing.
I'm not, I'm not messaging it right orI'm not putting it in the right location,
or I'm not hitting it at the right time.
Like I just.
Kept racking my brain and I didn'treally think a lot at the time about
what happens when the phone call goes orwhat happens when they walk in the door.
Um, I. When I understood that thereis a whole internal side that needs
(09:32):
to be called marketing, it just burstopen my doors and I realized, okay,
there's an actual relationship herebetween the outside marketing world
and the inside marketing world, and,and both of those need to be handled
with care and treated equally.
That does include a lot of it.
It is a lot of work.
You have to have a team that'saligned, that understands you have
to communicate really well, and thetwo have to be married together.
(09:57):
Can you walk us through like yourexperience of discovering that
yourself and what you have found?
Sara Hansen (10:04):
Yeah.
I think oftentimes people feel likemarketing is everything external,
which, yes, that is a great way tomarket your practice, but it's also
incredibly expensive to market external.
And what we know is that.
Most dentists want tocreate loyal patients.
They want to have more patients justlike the ones they really, really
(10:26):
love and they don't wanna spend a lot.
Right?
Yeah, it's expensive.
So it's interesting because as westarted peeling back marketing and
looking at things differently, um,PDA, we really came up with this great
concept of marketing from the inside out.
It truly makes sense.
And what's great is not only does itmake sense, but we're able to prove
(10:46):
the results from how it's making sense.
So when we look at external marketing,the purpose of external marketing
is really to get the phone to ring.
It's announcing to the communityand to the area who you are, how
you show up for patients, andthen it gets your phone to ring.
If your phone's ringing and thatfirst contact with the practice
is not a great experience.
(11:08):
Now all those marketing dollarsthat you just invested to get
that phone to ring is now gone.
So really, marketing is the complete.
Patient journey fromthe time they see you.
There's something that captures themwithin your marketing message to the first
phone call, the first time they come in.
Do you listen to what their needs are?
(11:28):
Are we offering solutions?
You know, and ultimately, arethey accepting treatment and
then referring their friendsand family to come to see you?
That is the complete marketing journey.
Um.
So when it comes to internal, like wehave a lot of doctors that just say
like, I can't afford to do marketing.
And guess what?
A lot of doctors can't.
But what we tell them is that great,you don't need a lot of money to market.
(11:51):
We have internal marketing and wefocus on the three Rs, which is
referrals, reviews, and reengagement.
And those do not cost a lot ofmoney at all, but yet it can produce
some of the biggest results thatwe've seen in marketing recently.
Dr. Chad Johnson (12:06):
Sarah, can I tell you something?
I have?
Yes.
Oh, good.
So, um, occasionally I'll work at abuddy's office up in Minot, North Dakota,
Lindell Kemet for those of the Cricworld and, and whatnot that know him.
And, uh.
I find it particularly fun when I gointo his office to ask for referrals
(12:31):
and because I like the pressure's off,like it's not my office and I'm not
busy thinking about ownership stuff.
And so I go in and one of my goals islike I. Every time I want to ask, at
least like half of the patients, I go,Hey, you know this office, it looks
like they've taken great care of you.
The last, uh, you know, Xyears and, and stuff like that.
(12:53):
You know what reallymeans a lot to Lindell?
I. Is when people arelooking for the office.
This might not have been you, but a lot ofpeople go to reviews and they look at the,
would you mind doing me a favor and doinglindela a favor that he'll never ask for,
but would you write him a review today?
And it's amazing because like whenI'm there for a couple days, I know
(13:15):
like, and I, I don't even do this inmy office well enough, you know, I,
I don't give the shameless plug, butI'm trying to model it for his team.
It's been so much fun.
It like, almost like this adventure thatI'm trying to see, like, can I be so
bold as to ask this grumpy patient that,you know, has been coming to them for
nine years, but they must be afraid of.
(13:35):
And I go and I just butter 'emup and I'm just like, I would
love if you wrote us a review.
And it's amazing.
The next day they'll be, youknow, because, uh, they, at, at
their morning huddle, they'llsay, did we get any reviews?
And they'll be like, yeah,we got two yesterday.
And I'm like, yes.
You know, so.
And I'm not, it's not a personal thing.
It's not like, Hey, willyou write me a review?
(13:57):
Which would be fine.
I, but I'm asking, you know, for,for the team's sake, I'm like, man,
they've done a great job at takingcare of you for the last 18 months.
You know, like, look how far you've come.
I know that it, it's probably hardfor them to ask, but would you
please consider, you know, todaywriting them a re review as a way
of saying thanks and it's mm-hmm.
(14:19):
It's just, uh, so challenge to theteam, you know, to model that and then
to do it, because it's amazing how manypeople I can get to actually do that.
Regan Robertson (14:28):
Why do you, why do you think that it was easier
for you to do it there than itwould be in your own practice?
Dr. Chad Johnson (14:34):
There's, there's no, there's no shame in, like, if someone
says, well, that's a stupid idea.
I hate that.
I'm not, I'm not, there'sno fear of rejection.
Like if the pa Oh,
Regan Robertson (14:44):
okay, it lowers that there.
See
Dr. Chad Johnson (14:46):
if the patient doesn't do it, the who, what do I care?
I mean, like, I tried, right?
But in my office it's like, ugh,I don't want to, you know, be.
You know, ask, but here I'm just the guestthere and so it's just like, why not?
Like, you know,
Regan Robertson (15:01):
I'm setting, I was setting that up because, um, I mean,
I didn't know how you were gonnaanswer, but I was assuming that
you were going to answer that waybecause we all fall into this trap.
Isn't it easier to point the finger andsay, I need more external marketing.
That's that job, because Idon't really want to like step
into my uncomfortable zone.
Yes.
And, and ask for a referral.
One of the things that I've heardthat's really exci, like an exciting
(15:23):
way to kind of make it less cringey.
Um, I think it was the, my medicalpractice maybe that did it.
Uh, it was Did you hear?
Did you, oh my gosh, did youhear We're taking patients again?
And that was really, I was like, what?
And it just spurred my referral oflike, oh my gosh, they're open now.
They probably were takingpatients the whole time.
Dr. Chad Johnson (15:40):
That's interesting though.
That is a great.
I
Sara Hansen (15:45):
I have a stat for you.
I have a stat for you.
So 94.
So, so in 2024, um, 94% of dentalpractices were accepting new
patients, and yet 28% of those weresaying that they're not busy enough.
And so the reality is, isthat your patients don't know.
(16:08):
So I wanna use Maggie as an examplebecause we've worked together in the past.
So anyone who knows Maggie knowswhy she practices dentistry
is incredibly powerful.
And Maggie, I think you and I hadsome tears over, like how you show up
for patients and you're incredible.
And so what I share with teams and Chad,it goes back to like feeling cringey.
(16:31):
If we show up for patients becauseof X, Y, and Z. So Maggie, will
you re re remind everybody?
Kind of why you show up for patients
Dr. Maggie Augustine (16:39):
every day?
So, so my whole thing is to makesure that the patient is seen
because they have gone their entirelife without being seen and heard.
Right?
And so the it, um, I, I just want them tounderstand that there's someone out there
that is willing to listen to them, which.
(17:00):
Is uncommon.
And, and I have come across a lotof doctors and, well dentists that
said, why would I waste my timelistening to a patient where I could
be making money holding at handpiece?
And I find that disturbingand gross and, and disgusting.
'cause I don't practice that way.
Sara Hansen (17:18):
Yeah, yeah.
So in, you know, so coming from whereDr. Maggie's coming from, which is I
want patients to feel seen and heard.
How we train teams then tobe asking for referrals.
It's taking that very mission.
Asking for referrals is not about sales.
Asking for referrals is about, if hermission to her practice is to let patients
(17:39):
know, Hey, I. Do you wanna be heardand seen and experience something new?
Then don't they have an obligation tojust let other people know about that?
You know, like truly, if I wasa patient and I had had some bad
dental experiences and then knewone of my friends said, Hey, I.
Go to this practice, they listen.
They truly care about what matters to you.
(18:01):
Like that would be lifechanging for people.
So asking for referrals isreally not about the sales thing.
It shouldn't feel salesy or any of, andif it does, then we don't have the right
frame of mind to be asking for referrals.
If we go into asking for referralsof, we want to grow our practice with
more patients that we want to serve.
(18:21):
And don't we have an obligation ashealthcare providers that transform
lives every single day to let morepatients know how we show up for them.
That really is the basisof a referral program.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (18:33):
But so, so here, so here's the challenge because you,
uh, well, Reagan has been in our officeand has done incredible training with
my team, and then we've been in coachingwith you, and then we've been in coaching
with, with Christie, with PDA andhave continued the coaching here is.
And my team knows that they, theysee the way that we interact with
(18:55):
patients and they, and they carry thatkind of mentality with our patients.
We are tremendously compassionate,even, even on the insurance issues.
My, my team is compassionate,however, and, and this is,
this is where the breakdown is.
I cannot get my team to askfor reviews and referrals, and
(19:19):
it's like hitting a brick wall.
And it doesn't matter what I explainto them, what you explain to them,
what Reagan explains to them.
There is something within them.
And I wonder if it's kind of likewhat Chad is going, what, what
Chad just described, where likehe goes into this other practice
and he's like, Hey, leave us a re.
(19:39):
A review or a referral becauseit feels different and safe over
there, but within their own practicethey just, they just won't do it.
They just feel like now, and oneof the ways that I explain this and
describe this is some of the peoplethat work in my practice, they, you
(20:01):
have to consider their background.
Mm-hmm.
Some of them are single moms thathave come out of abusive relationships
and they have never been given thepermission to speak or to ask Right.
Or to, to even want.
And so you put someonelike that in a position of.
(20:24):
Having a conversation with a patient wherethey request something or they, um, or
they lift up or they compliment somethingand just from their own core values or the
way that they view themselves or us, um,or the practice, they can't get past it.
(20:47):
Now I agree on everything that you'resaying because part of the way that
I think people are setting theirmoney on fire is by doing external
marketing and not reinforcingthat with internal marketing.
Right?
So you're setting money on fire bycontinuing to do external marketing and
not focusing on the internal marketing.
But the problem for my practicehas been, I mean the like.
(21:10):
I almost have to hold their jobs overtheir heads and say, this is a condition
of your employment to ask for reviews.
And even then, I, I just can'tget people to do it no matter how
I try to present the informationthat, that they need to do that.
And so we, we just hit a wall.
Mm-hmm.
Um, and I, and I wonder ifthere's other practices.
(21:33):
Struggle with this.
I, I know.
So, so, yeah.
The other thing is that my people arelike, almost all of us are introverts.
Like if you have, like, I wonderhow much that is also it, right?
Like there's extroverts and theymight have any issue with that.
Yeah.
No.
Sara Hansen (21:49):
Maggie, you are not alone.
I, we, I hear about this dailyfrom doctors and practices
of how do we do this?
We know we need to.
But how do we, so you're not alone.
Many, many practices feel this way.
The great news about these type ofprograms is it's not a one size fits all.
These are very custom to everysingle practice because the flow,
(22:11):
the dynamic of the practice,the team, how they structure.
Is completely different.
So what I recommend iswhat's going to work.
So first you have to lookat the obstacles, what's not
working, so in your practice.
And they're, you know, they're notcomfortable having the conversations
for certain reasons and that's okay.
But how do we then.
(22:32):
Overcome that obstacle is that maybeif you are more comfortable having
those conversations, you do it.
Is there a team member that ismore extroverted that's happy
to have those conversations?
How do we switch up theflow within the practice?
Do we have collateral aroundthe practice that says.
Hey, ask us about ourthank you program, right?
So now they don't have to ask, but we'redrawing attention and the patient's
(22:55):
like, Hey, what's your thank you program?
You know?
Um, so again, there are so manydifferent options to be able to
accomplish what we're trying toaccomplish within the practice.
Parameters, there are obstaclesand what actually works for them.
So that's why customized.
Programs.
And I can tell you everyoffice is not the same.
Every office we works with, workwith, they all have different
(23:17):
systems and techniques, but they'restill achieving the same goal.
Regan Robertson (23:21):
I have a question, Sarah.
Uh, yeah.
Uh, and Maggie too.
Maggie, do you have any automatedmessages that go out that
say thank you for your visit?
We'd love to hear from you.
So do you do that forfeedback and ref and reviews?
Does that work?
Dr. Maggie Augustine (23:37):
No.
No, I, I, and I know there'scompanies that say, you know,
we'll get you automated reviewsthat are sent out to patients.
Look, think about, um, think aboutgoing to a hotel and think about
getting an email afterwards from Hilton.
Yes.
How often, how, how likelyare you to, to click on that?
Regan Robertson (23:54):
Okay.
Okay.
I've got, I've got my 2 cents to add here.
Just to bounce off of Sarah's, um,response of, it's unique to the practice.
I've figured this out because I have,I've received lots of different.
Automated responses forfeedback and reviews.
Um, the medical practice that I go to,that I love, I don't think they personally
have told me that they, other than, otherthan the, Hey, we're taking new patients.
(24:17):
They haven't said like, we'dlove it if you leave us a review.
I don't think I've everheard that from a human.
But what they do is they have it set.
Up so that it texts mequickly, like, like mm-hmm.
Immediately following that.
If yours does and they stilldon't respond, then I, I guess
I'm not, I'm not helpful there.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (24:34):
Yeah.
So what we'll do is,but timing is important.
Yeah.
So what we'll do is like, whenthey're checking out, we will
say something like, you know, um.
Some, some of, uh, we ask certainpatients for, for their opinion about,
um, about their experience here, andI think as soon as checkout is done.
Regan Robertson (24:53):
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (24:53):
So it's very, very quickly it'll
Regan Robertson (24:55):
go on their phone.
Dr. Maggie Augustine: It'll go on their phone. (24:56):
undefined
Yeah.
That, that they'll getthe, and that's through di
Regan Robertson (25:01):
This is like today, this is diagnosis right here For sure.
Dr. Chad Johnson (25:05):
Well, I mean, an interesting.
Situation with my, with my two practices,one practice, I can get, um, uh,
reviews and the other practice is.
Worse than pulling teeth.
I won't say it's lip pong teeth.
Regan Robertson (25:21):
I pulling teeth.
Dr. Chad Johnson (25:23):
I do.
I just thought it wouldbe funny to say that
Regan Robertson (25:26):
I like watching Chad pull teeth.
Dr. Chad Johnson (25:28):
Yeah.
I But the, the two practices, like,you'll look at the one and you'll be like,
okay, well maybe it's a different team.
Nope, same team.
Well, maybe it's different times.
Nope.
Same time.
Well, maybe, you know, it's justlike there's, there's really.
It's just, I think we have adifferent demographic there and
they're just like, screw you.
I don't care.
I'm not writing a review.
(25:49):
And now if you said, but do you love us?
Yeah, sure.
You're great.
Well, but I mean like,do you wanna help us out?
Yeah, sure.
I'll tell anyone that you know,like that I run across, Hey,
can you write us a review?
Yeah.
I'm not gonna do that.
It's so weird.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (26:01):
Yeah.
And so our conversation with patientsand I'll, and, and it's a great
relationships that I've es established.
We've done this compassionatething, patient hasn't been
heard with other doctors.
They're come here, I will spendan hour and a half with them.
I'll give them my business cardwith a QR code on the back.
That takes you straight to the review.
Yes,
Dr. Chad Johnson (26:19):
you do.
Um,
Dr. Maggie Augustine (26:20):
and.
And, and I'm, you know, it'slike, I, I hope that you have felt
supported in this appointment.
Um, and I'll say something like, you know,there's a lot of competition in this area.
We would really appreciate if,if I, I know this is difficult
and I know we're all busy.
Uh, we would be very grateful if you justtook a moment and even if it's five stars,
(26:43):
if you left us a review and I'll hand 'emthe card and I'll show them the QR code
and they still will not leave a review.
Sara Hansen (26:52):
Okay, so, oh, yeah.
Regan Robertson (26:55):
Yeah.
So much to unpack.
Wait, can I wait?
Pause, pause, pause.
Maggie, I love that you're on.
You are always radically openand radically honest, and I just
wanna call that out right now.
I love it.
Yeah.
People aren't gonna learn if, ifeverybody just tries to pretend that
everything's perfect or that, youknow, you just do this one thing and
it's gonna be cookie cutter for you.
So kudos to you, Maggie.
(27:16):
You just gave Sarah and Ithink it's a hard one too.
So you just gave her Yeah.
Something honest to really digest.
Okay.
Go ahead Sarah.
Take it away.
But,
Sara Hansen (27:24):
but what I love is what Maggie is saying is
what I hear all the time.
So.
As listeners are listening,like, yeah, yeah, me too.
Right?
So I love this.
So first I wanna backus up just a little bit.
When it comes to reviews, the purpose ofreviews are, we are looking as consumers.
(27:47):
For authentic, truthful experiences.
Anytime we order anything on Amazon orother websites, the first thing we do is
we read the reviews because we believeand trust the feedback that's coming from
those people who've experienced that.
You know, if the outfit runs too small,if it broke after two days, right?
(28:07):
We believe those and thatultimately changes our buying.
Um.
Purposes and what we do, right?
We may move on if there's not greatfeedback from the people who have
authentically used the product.
So the purpose of reviews isreally about authenticity and
them leaving the experiences.
So when we talk about reviews,I remind teams is first, have we
(28:31):
earned the right to ask for a review?
Has that patient experience been somethingthat we can confidently say, we would
love to hear about your experience?
Um, we've all had the experience where,you know, either I know for me I bought
a car or I've had a service come to myhome and you know, they instantly say,
Hey, can you live me a five star review?
(28:53):
And because I do what I do every day,I kind of clap back and I'm like, well,
did you earn your five star review?
And I think they look at me dumbfounded.
But that's the truth is I'm notgonna leave a five star review
to just leave a five star review.
What did you do?
Right?
You know, like now, if I truly had anamazing experience, which I have, and
they haven't even asked me for the reviewbecause of what I do, I go in and leave
(29:15):
an amazing review because I truly felt thegreat experience they earned the right.
So when it comes back to askingfor reviews, we, one, we need to
know how our patients found us.
So what I recommend is during theconversation with the patient,
whether that's admin, team assistance,doctors, hygiene team, I always
say ask the question, Hey, did youever check out any of our reviews?
(29:39):
Did when you found us, did youhappen to look at our reviews?
You're setting the stage because now whatwe're doing is if they said, yeah, I did.
Something in those reviews now made themcall you and take action so that the
conversation becomes really easy of.
When you ask them, say, Hey, I knowyou found us through our reviews.
(30:00):
Would you mind sharing the goodness andyou know, talking about your experience so
others like you can now find us as well.
Right?
Because ultimately that'sthe point of a review.
It's not about let'sget 1,005 star reviews.
I mean, yes, that helps withSEO and online presence, but the
purpose of the review and why it'simportant to us is because we want
to hear the authentic stories.
(30:21):
Now, when a patient iskind of like, my guess.
Is that there's probably somethingwithin those patient journeys, you
know, that they're like, yeah, Ididn't like the way that I walked
in and no one acknowledged me.
Right.
It may be a little thing, but so I wouldguess there's something to be said,
but again, when we can frame it as.
I know that you checked out our reviews.
(30:42):
What we'd love to do iscontinue to carry this forward.
We know how important that was to you.
We'd love for you to share your experiencewith other patients that now frames it in
the authentic way that it really should.
And I have seen that that has likeexponentially increased reviews for
practices by reframing how we put them.
Dr. Chad Johnson (31:01):
Sarah, so what I heard is gonna be different than exactly
what you were saying, like what yousaid stand on, uh, stands on its own.
But the tangent in my mind wasI just go as a practice owner.
Sometimes I go the expectations of thecustomer patient is I. So high that
it's just like, do you understand that?
(31:22):
I used compound topical.
I used, I used buffered anesthetic.
I got you a crown in one day with thetranslucency that matches your adjacent
teeth and I polished this with you.
Give it to them, Chad.
Well, no, I'm not saying this.
But I'm thinking in my mind it'sjust like, and then it's like,
yeah, it kind of, it I feel swollen.
(31:44):
It's, yeah.
Four, four stars.
I feel sw we actually make, um, Dean andI, my, my in-house marketing guy, um, we
make fun of this one review that we got.
We ma we're making fun of ourselves.
It's this one attorney that, uh, thatcomes in and he just put four stars.
And I, I told Dean, I like no comment.
It was four stars.
(32:05):
And I, I told him, I was like, oh.
So that one Saturday night when Icame in, uh, postoperatively to use a
laser on, on where you wouldn't stopbleeding and stuff like that, um,
that, that was Fourstar uh, effort.
You know, like when, when I, when Idid all the thi and like there's other
stuff and I'm just like, there's,there are things that I've done.
(32:28):
That, like that we make fun of ourselves.
It's just like, like, we'll, we'llhave something, knock our socks off
and it might be at Jersey Mike's.
Okay, we're, we'll go to lunch at JerseyMike's and we'll, and they'll, they'll
have the sandwich, extra hot, extra meat,you know, the Pepsi taste extra good.
And, and I'll leave with Dean and I'll go.
Four stars, no comment.
And because it's just like theexpectations are, are beyond
(32:52):
what the, the was given.
Even though to me, I'm just like, yeah,we actually did earn our five stars.
But I think in your mindyou go, I still feel numb.
It's like, yes, 'cause I gave youextra numbing so you'd be comfortable.
Now here's my point, because it'sa, it sounds like a gripe session,
but then, but then I wonder.
Yeah.
Yes.
See, and I'm enjoying it.
(33:12):
Yes, because, uh, well, I think, Ithink listeners will identify, it's
just like, yes, we do everything.
And it's like, yeah,four stars, no comment.
Now here's my thought that wasintrospective to this point.
Have we set up to help them understandthe awesomeness of what they're getting?
So have we have the assistance orhas the dentist, whatever said.
(33:32):
Hey, do you know like most offices,they'll have you in a temporary for
two or three weeks, we're gettingthis crown put on same day, and
isn't that, isn't that awesome?
You don't have to come back a second time.
You don't have to set up and, butif it's just standard, then to
the patient, they just go, well,I guess it was just standard.
And, you know, if, if thetoothbrush wasn't good enough
(33:53):
then, you know, but it's like, no.
Do you know that, that Dr.Chad has chosen, this is the
toothbrush he uses at home.
He wants all his patients to have this.
That's different than, here'syour toothbrush in a bag, right?
Yeah.
It's the same toothbrush,but it's the sizzle.
Sara Hansen (34:09):
Yeah.
No, and, and we loved,we're all dental nerds.
We love dentistry.
We get it like we geek outover margins and this and that,
but our patients don't know.
So Chad, you are spot on.
You have to tell them.
You have to tell them really howawesome certain things are, or the
benefit of coming there, right?
(34:29):
They just don't know.
Dr. Chad Johnson (34:31):
It goes back to Bruce Baird saying, you know, do
you know this handpiece has a littlelight on it, you know, on the front?
You know, and it, and, and thatcould be awfully standard, but you
know, patients don't know that.
And so they, they're just like, hehas a little light on the front.
You know, I
Dr. Maggie Augustine (34:47):
referred to my, to my loops as microscopes because
they don't know what loops are
Dr. Chad Johnson (34:52):
correct.
Regan Robertson (34:53):
Bringing it back around, uh, to what you said, Sarah, which to
me sounds like a, a diagnosis of sorts.
Have you earned the right for a referraland because of authenticity and because
of the uniqueness of each practice,something that will, that will get
me hot and, and upset immediatelyis when somebody says, oh, dental,
you know, dental offices are all thesame, or dentists all want the same.
(35:15):
We know that that's not true.
And the same goes for.
Patients and, and your geographicregion and your demographics and
your psychographics, all of thosethings make a huge, huge difference.
And I mean, when I look at Chad'spractice versus say, a high end, super
cosmetic practice that serves thestars down in Miami Beach, those two,
Dr. Chad Johnson (35:36):
or New York, Dubai even,
Regan Robertson (35:38):
right?
Those.
Those patients, their expectationsof what is going to garner a a
review is gonna be a lot differentthan, than at Chad's practice.
So, so Sarah, I, I know that theproof is in the pudding here.
I'll, I'll, this is a great example.
Sarah will do this if in in offices.
So she was the one that likebrought to PDA and, and it
(36:00):
comes from this wholeheartedself-confidence that you can't fake
and you are authentic in yourself.
Um, I am in the chatboat a hundred percent.
I'm always like, you could leave us areview and you can tell, even if you tell
yourself I'm confident, leave us a review.
People can tell subconsciouslywhether or not you're being genuine,
authentic, and confident aboutasking for that particular review.
(36:22):
She does this, um, when she does inoffices, and I will know that she is
in office with a practice because Iwill get notifications in my email
that says, productive Dentist Academy.
Just got a review and I will open it upand it's five star, five star, five star.
But it's not just five star orjust four star with nothing.
It has, you know, Sarah and,and Star like killed it today.
Our whole, it's, it's very specific.
(36:44):
I have done the samethings now as my role.
I don't go in office, I go in.
Extremely rarely, like maybetwice, like not very much, but I
was like, I'll ask for the review.
I'll do what Sarah says,and I'll get like two.
And I'm like, well, was it good?
And then one-on-one, they're like, oh.
But you didn't, but you didn't say it.
And I think part of it was the waythat I, I rushed through it, right?
(37:06):
It was, could you, couldyou leave us a review?
That'd be great.
Goodbye.
So there's part of that,and so they can sense that.
And then the other part iswhat were they expecting?
What, what did I earn that, right?
Yes.
Ask for the review and meetthem where they were at.
And that's not something I, Idon't normally go and do that.
Whereas Sarah comes.
20 plus years have in practice.
I am willing to bet you she knows exactlywhere to meet each individual team
(37:29):
member when she goes in office and sheknows how to earn that, that review.
So is it Sarah, like, does, is itthese things combined like this
that equal getting over the hump?
Sara Hansen (37:40):
Yeah, I mean I think it really is a combination
of a lot of different things.
It, it is understanding, butI think it's also, you know,
you used me as an example, but.
I think my authenticity comes isbecause I truly love what I do.
I love how I show up.
I love, love, love my clients.
Maggie's been on phone callswith me when I get teary
(38:01):
talking about my clients, right?
I truly am invested in theirsuccess and I love how I show up.
So I think that you canbuild that authenticity.
Patients need to fill thatfrom every single team member.
And you know, I do understand the.
Repetition sometimes of our jobs, right?
(38:22):
But what I say from the stage in thefront of the room always is, do you all
understand the impact that you're makingon patients' lives every single day?
You are truly transforming lives.
I mean, you can scroll throughTikTok or Res and you can see
life-changing videos of people thatyou have truly changed their lives.
What we do at dentistry, and Iget passionate about this, is we
(38:45):
just don't like drill and fill.
That's not what we do.
We're in the business of healthcare.
We're in the business of trulychanging people's lives, and I
think oftentimes we forget that.
So, you know, if we can go back to whowe are, just as team members, you know,
showing up for our patients every day,and believe in that role and step in
that role that patients come to us.
(39:06):
Because they truly have a need and we'rethere to find a solution that also changes
how we show up for our patients and theexperience, the reviews, it all kind
Regan Robertson (39:16):
of flows together.
Let's do this.
I'm gonna, I'm gonna go, this hasbeen a, an exceptional episode and
the four of us can be here all day.
We're gonna invite you again, Sarah.
I'd love to talk aboutauthenticity and how it shows up.
I think you've done a really exceptionaljob today at Giving Doctors something to.
(39:36):
Really self-evaluate in their ownpractice and understand the complexity
of, um, you know, of growing yourpractice through internal marketing
and external, how they go together.
And, um, and being authenticis, is one of those keys to it.
Uh, Chad and then Maggie, finalthoughts, and we'll hand it
over to Sarah for the last word.
Dr. Chad Johnson (39:55):
My tangible take home is as a team, when you have.
An expectation that they fill out a fivestar review or something of the like, and
you're like, why don't they recognize thatwe go the extra mile in doing X and y.
Find out what those X and Y are.
(40:19):
Write them down and be like, wewant to be recognized for the
fact that we do this and that.
Then.
Make yourself recognizablethat you do those.
Because if it's, if it's silent andunknown that the team, you know, is
bringing out a, a warm blanket that theythrew in the dryer and stuff like that,
but no one, no one knows, like it's just.
(40:41):
It's very Disney-esque, you know, DisneyService to be able to provide that.
But then like no one is gonna sellthe sizzle, you know, in that.
Like that's what we do.
We do this for you because we care.
And then, then that's where weneed to come through as a team and
be like, identify where we are.
Let's call it resentfulthat no one recognizes this.
(41:04):
And then go, let's make ourselves.
Known that this is what we doand this is what sets us apart.
And, and, and that might take a littlebit of, um, finesse in figuring out how to
make sure that people can recognize thatyou're awesome because of those things.
Um, but that, that would help flipthe script instead of just being
(41:25):
a martyr that you're always being.
Uh, unseen and unheard for doingthose, uh, uncommon things.
Uh, but make yourself known.
Um, and it might not even be tootingyour own horn, but somehow figuring
out a way to say, you know, thatthis is, uh, what we do as a standard
for our patients, but it's notstandard, uh, you know, across the.
(41:47):
The city.
It's not standard thatevery office is doing that.
That's my take home message for thelisteners is to find those things that
kind of almost hurt your feelings.
Like, why doesn't anyone recognizethat we use buffered anesthetic?
Mm-hmm.
Well, do they know that you're usinga buffered anesthetic and that it
stings less when you inject it andyou can get going quicker, so the
patient is outta there quicker?
(42:08):
Let your patients know.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (42:10):
Mm-hmm.
That's a, that's a really.
That's a really great point.
Um, and, and I have started to use thatsince I, since I got the Glidewell io
mill, I have started to let patients knowthat that is really unique and we've spent
a lot of money on technology to bringit to our patients, and they have, I.
And they have become moregrateful as a result of that.
(42:32):
My takeaway is, you know, when Ihave jokingly said that, that, um,
that marketing is, is black magicmarketing is extremely complex.
Dr. Chad Johnson (42:43):
Yes.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (42:43):
Because, you know, we think of it as just
spending money on ads or clicks.
But the truth is that it trickles downto not just external marketing and.
And then internal marketing.
But it really pushes us to understandourselves, our personalities, the way that
we interact with one another, who we areas people, what is expected of us, uh, and
(43:08):
how we translate that onto our patientsbecause all of those things are affected.
And really what stands behind marketingand Reagan, you know that really
well and, and so does Sarah, is thisstory that we're trying to tell about
who we are and how we understand andserve our patients, and putting that.
(43:32):
Into a package and, um, allowingour patients to connect to
that is the basis of marketing.
But it makes everythingso extremely complex.
Um, and so, you know, many peopleuse metrics to try and figure out
whether or not it's all working.
Uh, I remember when I was workingwith, with a marketing company
(43:55):
before PDA and, and I would say,you know, they'd be like, well.
They came to the office, but theydidn't use the number that you gave.
And, and his answer was like,well, right, you don't know that.
But did they use the websitethat we, that we showed them?
Did they check out yourFacebook or Instagram?
These are the things that you don'tknow, but they're part of branding
(44:16):
and they're part of marketing.
So is marketing workingor isn't it working?
These there, there's so much gray area,which is why I call it, you know, kind of.
Black magic.
Yeah.
And so that's my, my takeaway.
It is, it is really, it's complex.
Really complex and and difficult to track.
I think
Regan Robertson (44:35):
there are final thoughts.
Take us home, girl.
Sara Hansen (44:39):
Yeah.
When it comes to reviews and referrals,listen, this really is about.
Turning your satisfied patients intothe practice's biggest advocates.
Um, you know, that's really all it is.
Let your patients tell otherpatients about how great you are.
You don't even have to do anything,but just treat them the way that
you know that they deserve to betreated and they'll do it for you.
(45:02):
So that's, that's my
Regan Robertson (45:04):
final thoughts for today's episode.
Thank you everybody for joining us today.
Uh, we had a great time.
Thank you, Sarah for joining us.
Thank you, Chad and Maggiefor being together again.
Uh, look forward to more episodescoming forward, and if you
wanna leave Everyday Practices areview, you can find us on iTunes.
You can find us on Spotify.
(45:26):
You can find us on socialmedia at productive Dentists
on Facebook and LinkedIn.
All the pieces go to where you are.
We'd love to hear your feedback.
Dr. Chad Johnson (45:35):
Especially if it's five stars.
Regan Robertson (45:38):
Cheese.
Cheese, four stars, nothing.
Chef,
Dr. Chad Johnson (45:42):
four stars, no comment.
Regan Robertson (45:44):
Take care everybody.
Thank you for listening to anotherepisode of Everyday Practices Podcast.
It would mean the world if you canhelp spread the word by sharing this
episode with a fellow dentist andleave us a review on iTunes or Spotify.
Do you have an extraordinary story you'dlike to share or feedback on how we can
make this podcast even more Awesome.
(46:06):
Drop us an email at podcast.
At productive dentist.com.
And don't forget to check out ourother podcasts from Productive
Dentist academy@productivedentist.comslash podcasts.
See you next week.
The Productive Dentist Academy Podcast Network.
Regan Robertson (00:06):
Welcome to the Everyday Practices Dental Podcast.
I'm Reagan Robertson and myco-host Dr. Chad Johnson.
Dr. Maggie Augustine and Iare on a mission to share the
stories of everyday dentists whogenerate extraordinary results.
Using practical proven methods you cantake into your own dental practice if
you are ready to reclaim your time so youcan focus on great patient care without
sacrificing yourself along the way.
(00:28):
Buckle up and listen in
Sara Hansen (00:31):
when it comes to reviews.
The purpose of reviews are weare looking as consumers for
authentic, truthful experiences.
Anytime we order anything onAmazon or other websites, the first
thing we do is we read the reviewsbecause we believe and trust.
(00:53):
The feedback that's coming from thosepeople who've experienced that, you
know, if the outfit runs too small,if it broke after two days, right?
We believe those and thatultimately changes our buying, um,
purposes and what we do, right?
We may move on if there's not greatfeedback from the people who have
authentically used the product.
(01:13):
So the purpose of reviews isreally about authenticity and
them leaving the experiences.
Dr. Maggie Augustine: Marketing is like occlusion. (01:19):
undefined
This is what I, what I tellWade Kiffer all the time.
It's like black magic, right?
And I should have my crystals out tohelp me guide through the process.
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:31):
Truth
Regan Robertson (01:32):
there is, I've learned over my 26 years, 26 years in, in
marketing that, uh, that I actually.
I personally don't enjoy marketing.
I actually don't like marketing,which is a really weird thing to say,
uh, especially from someone who hasbeen in marketing this entire time.
(01:52):
And I think it's my own evolution.
I, what I love is the storyand the essence of a brand.
And a brand is more than, uh.
Than one element of it.
So I think marketing overall,it, it tends to get painted
on lots of different elements.
And, and the reality is, is thatmarketing is, is a beautiful distribution
(02:15):
channel and that's where it canbecome the biggest blessing ever.
And it can also become the most.
Overwhelming and confusing area.
And so Maggie, when you'resaying that it feels like, you
know, it's just black magic.
It's, it is, there's abit of mystery to it.
And, and you know why?
It's not like fast and hard.
It's unique to the brand and theaudience that you're trying to attract.
(02:36):
And so just like anything,it takes a lot of practice.
It takes some skill, ittakes a lot of listening.
And, uh, I am really excitedtoday We have the full.
Crew here to have SarahHanson in the hot seat.
Listeners get ready because Sarahabsolutely, not only does she love
(02:57):
marketing, like it pours out of herskin naturally, and she has this way of
making uncomfortable stuff really fun.
And so.
If marketing to you feels like,ugh, like I have to, or I just
don't know if I'm doing it right.
She's there to guide you along the way.
And her and I have worked togetherfor several years now, and she
has just, she's inspired me.
(03:17):
Um, she's shown me how easy she makes itto, to wanna market, and most importantly,
she understands the essence and thedifference between a brand and marketing.
And she bridges the two togetherreally well so that you can make
sure that when you tell your brandstory, it's gonna go to the right.
Place.
So Chad and Maggie, welcome to our show.
So pleased that both ofyou are following us.
(03:38):
Any, any notes that you have to say beforewe bring Sarah into the conversation?
Dr. Chad Johnson (03:43):
Well, I was gonna ask Maggie, uh, uh, I was gonna
ask, uh, Sarah, is, is, is themarketing exuding from your pores?
Is that what gives you your glow?
Sara Hansen (03:53):
The marketing glow?
Yes.
I, I wonder like pregnancy glow.
That's marketing.
Regan Robertson (03:58):
Yes.
Oh, oh.
Dr. Chad Johnson (04:03):
Ing new ideas.
Yes,
Dr. Maggie Augustine (04:07):
and and one of the things about Sarah, and I've
known her for quite a few yearsnow, is that she just stands in this
confidence of what marketing is.
And she exudes that, not just whenyou're working with her, but if
you've ever seen her on stage.
And that confidence is notjust her walking around
(04:27):
saying, I know this stuff, but.
She has a lot behind her to support theconfidence that she, that she stands in.
And I really look forward to thisconversation in kind of teasing that
out of her and, and, uh, and showingour listeners some of these pearls
(04:48):
that I have no doubt she will present,uh, to you guys that you can take
away just from this short podcastand incorporate into your practice.
This black magic
Dr. Chad Johnson (04:59):
when, yeah, when, when Sarah tells her puppy story.
I'm serious.
I can about cry on demand.
I mean, so the farmer's dog.
Regan Robertson (05:11):
Oh, the farmer's dog.
Yes, yes, yes.
Dr. Chad Johnson (05:15):
Says the guy from Iowa.
Well, listen, I'm, I'm not a crier,but like, uh, but that, like, it's
not just the first time I heard it,but I, the second time I was like.
S Bite your lip.
Look away.
Think.
Regan Robertson (05:29):
I think you did get teary.
Did.
Yes.
Somebody at the conference.
She played it at the conferenceand somebody, I think it
was you that got teary.
Dr. Chad Johnson (05:35):
It was me.
It was you.
It was me.
I was missing my girls.
And then I'm watching this videoand I'm just like, oh shoot.
I'm just like, that was,that's exemplary of finding the
emotion that goes with the, the.
Concept of what you're trying to portray.
So,
Regan Robertson (05:51):
okay.
Show notes.
We'll put the farmer's dog ad in.
So you all know what the heckwe're talking about here today?
Yes.
Or
Dr. Chad Johnson (05:59):
caveat, uh, trigger warning.
If you need to not cry within, you know,10 minutes of, of a listening to the
podcast or whatever, don't click on thatad until you're ready to emotionally,
you know, disengage and let it go.
Regan Robertson (06:16):
If you haven't listened to the previous episode, I
highly recommend you go and do that.
Chad and I break down, uh, exactlywhat, what marketing looks like when
it's done, uh, correctly, and then whenit's, you know, when it breaks down
where to look for the breakdowns init and how to do a great audit on it.
And I think it's a nice, um,prerequisite to having Sarah on today.
(06:37):
Either way, though, you could just listento this standalone and it'd be great.
Sarah, welcome to Everyday Practices.
Marketing from the inside out.
If you could just kind of bringlisteners along in this journey.
Tell us a little bit aboutyourself first and why, why
marketing is so, um, something thatyou're really passionate about.
Sara Hansen (06:56):
Hi everyone.
Three of my favorite.
Um, yeah, so I've been in thedental industry for over 25
years now, so I am an oldie.
Um, but I started in the dentalpractice, had almost every position
other than the dentist and, and hygienistand, you know, it's interesting.
(07:17):
Going through and sitting in thedifferent seats of the practice.
You definitely see patientjourneys at different spots.
And so I think having that knowledgeand experience of being in the dental
practice for 18 years before I decidedto move on and do more things with.
The education and the knowledge thatI had, and I think it's given me
the background that I really neededto, one, understand what's truly
(07:40):
happening in the dental practice.
Um, but two, be able to, you know, whenwe train teams and talk about what does
something look like or sound like, orhow does it feel to ask for a review?
Or how does it feel?
To complete a reallygreat patient journey.
I understand what that feels likebecause I've experienced, you know,
I've been the one to answer thetricky phone calls from a patient.
(08:02):
I've been the one at eventstrying to promote our practice.
And so, um, that's where I thinkthe love of marketing came for me.
Unbeknownst to me, I didn'trealize it was there until I really
started doing more and more of it.
Um, and now I truly love it, so I getto be the one that tells the stories
of the practice, and I love it.
Like
Regan Robertson (08:21):
who, who has a better job than that?
Well, this is a really uniquedifferentiator here because
not very many marketers haveheld each role in the practice.
I love stories of people whohave been in an organization and
they've been from the ground.
Up.
So it gives them a very unique positionto say, okay, I know exactly what happens
at each of these intersections, and Iknow what matters to that role, and I know
(08:44):
what matters to the patient at that role.
Um.
Something that we've talkedabout for years now, uh, is,
it was, it was interesting.
It, it started a few years ago.
Gosh, maybe even 10 at this point.
But I remember, you know, doingmarketing for dentists and the
dentist coming back and just saying,it doesn't, it just doesn't work.
You need more.
You need more.
You need more.
And me and the people pleasing role,I immediately thought it must be
(09:08):
something I'm doing, like as a marketer,it must be something I'm doing.
I'm not, I'm not messaging it right orI'm not putting it in the right location,
or I'm not hitting it at the right time.
Like I just.
Kept racking my brain and I didn'treally think a lot at the time about
what happens when the phone call goes orwhat happens when they walk in the door.
Um, I. When I understood that thereis a whole internal side that needs
(09:32):
to be called marketing, it just burstopen my doors and I realized, okay,
there's an actual relationship herebetween the outside marketing world
and the inside marketing world, and,and both of those need to be handled
with care and treated equally.
That does include a lot of it.
It is a lot of work.
You have to have a team that'saligned, that understands you have
to communicate really well, and thetwo have to be married together.
(09:57):
Can you walk us through like yourexperience of discovering that
yourself and what you have found?
Sara Hansen (10:04):
Yeah.
I think oftentimes people feel likemarketing is everything external,
which, yes, that is a great way tomarket your practice, but it's also
incredibly expensive to market external.
And what we know is that.
Most dentists want tocreate loyal patients.
They want to have more patients justlike the ones they really, really
(10:26):
love and they don't wanna spend a lot.
Right?
Yeah, it's expensive.
So it's interesting because as westarted peeling back marketing and
looking at things differently, um,PDA, we really came up with this great
concept of marketing from the inside out.
It truly makes sense.
And what's great is not only does itmake sense, but we're able to prove
(10:46):
the results from how it's making sense.
So when we look at external marketing,the purpose of external marketing
is really to get the phone to ring.
It's announcing to the communityand to the area who you are, how
you show up for patients, andthen it gets your phone to ring.
If your phone's ringing and thatfirst contact with the practice
is not a great experience.
(11:08):
Now all those marketing dollarsthat you just invested to get
that phone to ring is now gone.
So really, marketing is the complete.
Patient journey fromthe time they see you.
There's something that captures themwithin your marketing message to the first
phone call, the first time they come in.
Do you listen to what their needs are?
(11:28):
Are we offering solutions?
You know, and ultimately, arethey accepting treatment and
then referring their friendsand family to come to see you?
That is the complete marketing journey.
Um.
So when it comes to internal, like wehave a lot of doctors that just say
like, I can't afford to do marketing.
And guess what?
A lot of doctors can't.
But what we tell them is that great,you don't need a lot of money to market.
(11:51):
We have internal marketing and wefocus on the three Rs, which is
referrals, reviews, and reengagement.
And those do not cost a lot ofmoney at all, but yet it can produce
some of the biggest results thatwe've seen in marketing recently.
Dr. Chad Johnson (12:06):
Sarah, can I tell you something?
I have?
Yes.
Oh, good.
So, um, occasionally I'll work at abuddy's office up in Minot, North Dakota,
Lindell Kemet for those of the Cricworld and, and whatnot that know him.
And, uh.
I find it particularly fun when I gointo his office to ask for referrals
(12:31):
and because I like the pressure's off,like it's not my office and I'm not
busy thinking about ownership stuff.
And so I go in and one of my goals islike I. Every time I want to ask, at
least like half of the patients, I go,Hey, you know this office, it looks
like they've taken great care of you.
The last, uh, you know, Xyears and, and stuff like that.
(12:53):
You know what reallymeans a lot to Lindell?
I. Is when people arelooking for the office.
This might not have been you, but a lot ofpeople go to reviews and they look at the,
would you mind doing me a favor and doinglindela a favor that he'll never ask for,
but would you write him a review today?
And it's amazing because like whenI'm there for a couple days, I know
(13:15):
like, and I, I don't even do this inmy office well enough, you know, I,
I don't give the shameless plug, butI'm trying to model it for his team.
It's been so much fun.
It like, almost like this adventure thatI'm trying to see, like, can I be so
bold as to ask this grumpy patient that,you know, has been coming to them for
nine years, but they must be afraid of.
(13:35):
And I go and I just butter 'emup and I'm just like, I would
love if you wrote us a review.
And it's amazing.
The next day they'll be, youknow, because, uh, they, at, at
their morning huddle, they'llsay, did we get any reviews?
And they'll be like, yeah,we got two yesterday.
And I'm like, yes.
You know, so.
And I'm not, it's not a personal thing.
It's not like, Hey, willyou write me a review?
(13:57):
Which would be fine.
I, but I'm asking, you know, for,for the team's sake, I'm like, man,
they've done a great job at takingcare of you for the last 18 months.
You know, like, look how far you've come.
I know that it, it's probably hardfor them to ask, but would you
please consider, you know, todaywriting them a re review as a way
of saying thanks and it's mm-hmm.
(14:19):
It's just, uh, so challenge to theteam, you know, to model that and then
to do it, because it's amazing how manypeople I can get to actually do that.
Regan Robertson (14:28):
Why do you, why do you think that it was easier
for you to do it there than itwould be in your own practice?
Dr. Chad Johnson (14:34):
There's, there's no, there's no shame in, like, if someone
says, well, that's a stupid idea.
I hate that.
I'm not, I'm not, there'sno fear of rejection.
Like if the pa Oh,
Regan Robertson (14:44):
okay, it lowers that there.
See
Dr. Chad Johnson (14:46):
if the patient doesn't do it, the who, what do I care?
I mean, like, I tried, right?
But in my office it's like, ugh,I don't want to, you know, be.
You know, ask, but here I'm just the guestthere and so it's just like, why not?
Like, you know,
Regan Robertson (15:01):
I'm setting, I was setting that up because, um, I mean,
I didn't know how you were gonnaanswer, but I was assuming that
you were going to answer that waybecause we all fall into this trap.
Isn't it easier to point the finger andsay, I need more external marketing.
That's that job, because Idon't really want to like step
into my uncomfortable zone.
Yes.
And, and ask for a referral.
One of the things that I've heardthat's really exci, like an exciting
(15:23):
way to kind of make it less cringey.
Um, I think it was the, my medicalpractice maybe that did it.
Uh, it was Did you hear?
Did you, oh my gosh, did youhear We're taking patients again?
And that was really, I was like, what?
And it just spurred my referral oflike, oh my gosh, they're open now.
They probably were takingpatients the whole time.
Dr. Chad Johnson (15:40):
That's interesting though.
That is a great.
I
Sara Hansen (15:45):
I have a stat for you.
I have a stat for you.
So 94.
So, so in 2024, um, 94% of dentalpractices were accepting new
patients, and yet 28% of those weresaying that they're not busy enough.
And so the reality is, isthat your patients don't know.
(16:08):
So I wanna use Maggie as an examplebecause we've worked together in the past.
So anyone who knows Maggie knowswhy she practices dentistry
is incredibly powerful.
And Maggie, I think you and I hadsome tears over, like how you show up
for patients and you're incredible.
And so what I share with teams and Chad,it goes back to like feeling cringey.
(16:31):
If we show up for patients becauseof X, Y, and Z. So Maggie, will
you re re remind everybody?
Kind of why you show up for patients
Dr. Maggie Augustine (16:39):
every day?
So, so my whole thing is to makesure that the patient is seen
because they have gone their entirelife without being seen and heard.
Right?
And so the it, um, I, I just want them tounderstand that there's someone out there
that is willing to listen to them, which.
(17:00):
Is uncommon.
And, and I have come across a lotof doctors and, well dentists that
said, why would I waste my timelistening to a patient where I could
be making money holding at handpiece?
And I find that disturbingand gross and, and disgusting.
'cause I don't practice that way.
Sara Hansen (17:18):
Yeah, yeah.
So in, you know, so coming from whereDr. Maggie's coming from, which is I
want patients to feel seen and heard.
How we train teams then tobe asking for referrals.
It's taking that very mission.
Asking for referrals is not about sales.
Asking for referrals is about, if hermission to her practice is to let patients
(17:39):
know, Hey, I. Do you wanna be heardand seen and experience something new?
Then don't they have an obligation tojust let other people know about that?
You know, like truly, if I wasa patient and I had had some bad
dental experiences and then knewone of my friends said, Hey, I.
Go to this practice, they listen.
They truly care about what matters to you.
(18:01):
Like that would be lifechanging for people.
So asking for referrals isreally not about the sales thing.
It shouldn't feel salesy or any of, andif it does, then we don't have the right
frame of mind to be asking for referrals.
If we go into asking for referralsof, we want to grow our practice with
more patients that we want to serve.
(18:21):
And don't we have an obligation ashealthcare providers that transform
lives every single day to let morepatients know how we show up for them.
That really is the basisof a referral program.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (18:33):
But so, so here, so here's the challenge because you,
uh, well, Reagan has been in our officeand has done incredible training with
my team, and then we've been in coachingwith you, and then we've been in coaching
with, with Christie, with PDA andhave continued the coaching here is.
And my team knows that they, theysee the way that we interact with
(18:55):
patients and they, and they carry thatkind of mentality with our patients.
We are tremendously compassionate,even, even on the insurance issues.
My, my team is compassionate,however, and, and this is,
this is where the breakdown is.
I cannot get my team to askfor reviews and referrals, and
(19:19):
it's like hitting a brick wall.
And it doesn't matter what I explainto them, what you explain to them,
what Reagan explains to them.
There is something within them.
And I wonder if it's kind of likewhat Chad is going, what, what
Chad just described, where likehe goes into this other practice
and he's like, Hey, leave us a re.
(19:39):
A review or a referral becauseit feels different and safe over
there, but within their own practicethey just, they just won't do it.
They just feel like now, and oneof the ways that I explain this and
describe this is some of the peoplethat work in my practice, they, you
(20:01):
have to consider their background.
Mm-hmm.
Some of them are single moms thathave come out of abusive relationships
and they have never been given thepermission to speak or to ask Right.
Or to, to even want.
And so you put someonelike that in a position of.
(20:24):
Having a conversation with a patient wherethey request something or they, um, or
they lift up or they compliment somethingand just from their own core values or the
way that they view themselves or us, um,or the practice, they can't get past it.
(20:47):
Now I agree on everything that you'resaying because part of the way that
I think people are setting theirmoney on fire is by doing external
marketing and not reinforcingthat with internal marketing.
Right?
So you're setting money on fire bycontinuing to do external marketing and
not focusing on the internal marketing.
But the problem for my practicehas been, I mean the like.
(21:10):
I almost have to hold their jobs overtheir heads and say, this is a condition
of your employment to ask for reviews.
And even then, I, I just can'tget people to do it no matter how
I try to present the informationthat, that they need to do that.
And so we, we just hit a wall.
Mm-hmm.
Um, and I, and I wonder ifthere's other practices.
(21:33):
Struggle with this.
I, I know.
So, so, yeah.
The other thing is that my people arelike, almost all of us are introverts.
Like if you have, like, I wonderhow much that is also it, right?
Like there's extroverts and theymight have any issue with that.
Yeah.
No.
Sara Hansen (21:49):
Maggie, you are not alone.
I, we, I hear about this dailyfrom doctors and practices
of how do we do this?
We know we need to.
But how do we, so you're not alone.
Many, many practices feel this way.
The great news about these type ofprograms is it's not a one size fits all.
These are very custom to everysingle practice because the flow,
(22:11):
the dynamic of the practice,the team, how they structure.
Is completely different.
So what I recommend iswhat's going to work.
So first you have to lookat the obstacles, what's not
working, so in your practice.
And they're, you know, they're notcomfortable having the conversations
for certain reasons and that's okay.
But how do we then.
(22:32):
Overcome that obstacle is that maybeif you are more comfortable having
those conversations, you do it.
Is there a team member that ismore extroverted that's happy
to have those conversations?
How do we switch up theflow within the practice?
Do we have collateral aroundthe practice that says.
Hey, ask us about ourthank you program, right?
So now they don't have to ask, but we'redrawing attention and the patient's
(22:55):
like, Hey, what's your thank you program?
You know?
Um, so again, there are so manydifferent options to be able to
accomplish what we're trying toaccomplish within the practice.
Parameters, there are obstaclesand what actually works for them.
So that's why customized.
Programs.
And I can tell you everyoffice is not the same.
Every office we works with, workwith, they all have different
(23:17):
systems and techniques, but they'restill achieving the same goal.
Regan Robertson (23:21):
I have a question, Sarah.
Uh, yeah.
Uh, and Maggie too.
Maggie, do you have any automatedmessages that go out that
say thank you for your visit?
We'd love to hear from you.
So do you do that forfeedback and ref and reviews?
Does that work?
Dr. Maggie Augustine (23:37):
No.
No, I, I, and I know there'scompanies that say, you know,
we'll get you automated reviewsthat are sent out to patients.
Look, think about, um, think aboutgoing to a hotel and think about
getting an email afterwards from Hilton.
Yes.
How often, how, how likelyare you to, to click on that?
Regan Robertson (23:54):
Okay.
Okay.
I've got, I've got my 2 cents to add here.
Just to bounce off of Sarah's, um,response of, it's unique to the practice.
I've figured this out because I have,I've received lots of different.
Automated responses forfeedback and reviews.
Um, the medical practice that I go to,that I love, I don't think they personally
have told me that they, other than, otherthan the, Hey, we're taking new patients.
(24:17):
They haven't said like, we'dlove it if you leave us a review.
I don't think I've everheard that from a human.
But what they do is they have it set.
Up so that it texts mequickly, like, like mm-hmm.
Immediately following that.
If yours does and they stilldon't respond, then I, I guess
I'm not, I'm not helpful there.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (24:34):
Yeah.
So what we'll do is,but timing is important.
Yeah.
So what we'll do is like, whenthey're checking out, we will
say something like, you know, um.
Some, some of, uh, we ask certainpatients for, for their opinion about,
um, about their experience here, andI think as soon as checkout is done.
Regan Robertson (24:53):
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (24:53):
So it's very, very quickly it'll
Regan Robertson (24:55):
go on their phone.
Dr. Maggie Augustine: It'll go on their phone. (24:56):
undefined
Yeah.
That, that they'll getthe, and that's through di
Regan Robertson (25:01):
This is like today, this is diagnosis right here For sure.
Dr. Chad Johnson (25:05):
Well, I mean, an interesting.
Situation with my, with my two practices,one practice, I can get, um, uh,
reviews and the other practice is.
Worse than pulling teeth.
I won't say it's lip pong teeth.
Regan Robertson (25:21):
I pulling teeth.
Dr. Chad Johnson (25:23):
I do.
I just thought it wouldbe funny to say that
Regan Robertson (25:26):
I like watching Chad pull teeth.
Dr. Chad Johnson (25:28):
Yeah.
I But the, the two practices, like,you'll look at the one and you'll be like,
okay, well maybe it's a different team.
Nope, same team.
Well, maybe it's different times.
Nope.
Same time.
Well, maybe, you know, it's justlike there's, there's really.
It's just, I think we have adifferent demographic there and
they're just like, screw you.
I don't care.
I'm not writing a review.
(25:49):
And now if you said, but do you love us?
Yeah, sure.
You're great.
Well, but I mean like,do you wanna help us out?
Yeah, sure.
I'll tell anyone that you know,like that I run across, Hey,
can you write us a review?
Yeah.
I'm not gonna do that.
It's so weird.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (26:01):
Yeah.
And so our conversation with patientsand I'll, and, and it's a great
relationships that I've es established.
We've done this compassionatething, patient hasn't been
heard with other doctors.
They're come here, I will spendan hour and a half with them.
I'll give them my business cardwith a QR code on the back.
That takes you straight to the review.
Yes,
Dr. Chad Johnson (26:19):
you do.
Um,
Dr. Maggie Augustine (26:20):
and.
And, and I'm, you know, it'slike, I, I hope that you have felt
supported in this appointment.
Um, and I'll say something like, you know,there's a lot of competition in this area.
We would really appreciate if,if I, I know this is difficult
and I know we're all busy.
Uh, we would be very grateful if you justtook a moment and even if it's five stars,
(26:43):
if you left us a review and I'll hand 'emthe card and I'll show them the QR code
and they still will not leave a review.
Sara Hansen (26:52):
Okay, so, oh, yeah.
Regan Robertson (26:55):
Yeah.
So much to unpack.
Wait, can I wait?
Pause, pause, pause.
Maggie, I love that you're on.
You are always radically openand radically honest, and I just
wanna call that out right now.
I love it.
Yeah.
People aren't gonna learn if, ifeverybody just tries to pretend that
everything's perfect or that, youknow, you just do this one thing and
it's gonna be cookie cutter for you.
So kudos to you, Maggie.
(27:16):
You just gave Sarah and Ithink it's a hard one too.
So you just gave her Yeah.
Something honest to really digest.
Okay.
Go ahead Sarah.
Take it away.
But,
Sara Hansen (27:24):
but what I love is what Maggie is saying is
what I hear all the time.
So.
As listeners are listening,like, yeah, yeah, me too.
Right?
So I love this.
So first I wanna backus up just a little bit.
When it comes to reviews, the purpose ofreviews are, we are looking as consumers.
(27:47):
For authentic, truthful experiences.
Anytime we order anything on Amazon orother websites, the first thing we do is
we read the reviews because we believeand trust the feedback that's coming from
those people who've experienced that.
You know, if the outfit runs too small,if it broke after two days, right?
(28:07):
We believe those and thatultimately changes our buying.
Um.
Purposes and what we do, right?
We may move on if there's not greatfeedback from the people who have
authentically used the product.
So the purpose of reviews isreally about authenticity and
them leaving the experiences.
So when we talk about reviews,I remind teams is first, have we
(28:31):
earned the right to ask for a review?
Has that patient experience been somethingthat we can confidently say, we would
love to hear about your experience?
Um, we've all had the experience where,you know, either I know for me I bought
a car or I've had a service come to myhome and you know, they instantly say,
Hey, can you live me a five star review?
(28:53):
And because I do what I do every day,I kind of clap back and I'm like, well,
did you earn your five star review?
And I think they look at me dumbfounded.
But that's the truth is I'm notgonna leave a five star review
to just leave a five star review.
What did you do?
Right?
You know, like now, if I truly had anamazing experience, which I have, and
they haven't even asked me for the reviewbecause of what I do, I go in and leave
(29:15):
an amazing review because I truly felt thegreat experience they earned the right.
So when it comes back to askingfor reviews, we, one, we need to
know how our patients found us.
So what I recommend is during theconversation with the patient,
whether that's admin, team assistance,doctors, hygiene team, I always
say ask the question, Hey, did youever check out any of our reviews?
(29:39):
Did when you found us, did youhappen to look at our reviews?
You're setting the stage because now whatwe're doing is if they said, yeah, I did.
Something in those reviews now made themcall you and take action so that the
conversation becomes really easy of.
When you ask them, say, Hey, I knowyou found us through our reviews.
(30:00):
Would you mind sharing the goodness andyou know, talking about your experience so
others like you can now find us as well.
Right?
Because ultimately that'sthe point of a review.
It's not about let'sget 1,005 star reviews.
I mean, yes, that helps withSEO and online presence, but the
purpose of the review and why it'simportant to us is because we want
to hear the authentic stories.
(30:21):
Now, when a patient iskind of like, my guess.
Is that there's probably somethingwithin those patient journeys, you
know, that they're like, yeah, Ididn't like the way that I walked
in and no one acknowledged me.
Right.
It may be a little thing, but so I wouldguess there's something to be said,
but again, when we can frame it as.
I know that you checked out our reviews.
(30:42):
What we'd love to do iscontinue to carry this forward.
We know how important that was to you.
We'd love for you to share your experiencewith other patients that now frames it in
the authentic way that it really should.
And I have seen that that has likeexponentially increased reviews for
practices by reframing how we put them.
Dr. Chad Johnson (31:01):
Sarah, so what I heard is gonna be different than exactly
what you were saying, like what yousaid stand on, uh, stands on its own.
But the tangent in my mind wasI just go as a practice owner.
Sometimes I go the expectations of thecustomer patient is I. So high that
it's just like, do you understand that?
(31:22):
I used compound topical.
I used, I used buffered anesthetic.
I got you a crown in one day with thetranslucency that matches your adjacent
teeth and I polished this with you.
Give it to them, Chad.
Well, no, I'm not saying this.
But I'm thinking in my mind it'sjust like, and then it's like,
yeah, it kind of, it I feel swollen.
(31:44):
It's, yeah.
Four, four stars.
I feel sw we actually make, um, Dean andI, my, my in-house marketing guy, um, we
make fun of this one review that we got.
We ma we're making fun of ourselves.
It's this one attorney that, uh, thatcomes in and he just put four stars.
And I, I told Dean, I like no comment.
It was four stars.
(32:05):
And I, I told him, I was like, oh.
So that one Saturday night when Icame in, uh, postoperatively to use a
laser on, on where you wouldn't stopbleeding and stuff like that, um,
that, that was Fourstar uh, effort.
You know, like when, when I, when Idid all the thi and like there's other
stuff and I'm just like, there's,there are things that I've done.
(32:28):
That, like that we make fun of ourselves.
It's just like, like, we'll, we'llhave something, knock our socks off
and it might be at Jersey Mike's.
Okay, we're, we'll go to lunch at JerseyMike's and we'll, and they'll, they'll
have the sandwich, extra hot, extra meat,you know, the Pepsi taste extra good.
And, and I'll leave with Dean and I'll go.
Four stars, no comment.
And because it's just like theexpectations are, are beyond
(32:52):
what the, the was given.
Even though to me, I'm just like, yeah,we actually did earn our five stars.
But I think in your mindyou go, I still feel numb.
It's like, yes, 'cause I gave youextra numbing so you'd be comfortable.
Now here's my point, because it'sa, it sounds like a gripe session,
but then, but then I wonder.
Yeah.
Yes.
See, and I'm enjoying it.
(33:12):
Yes, because, uh, well, I think, Ithink listeners will identify, it's
just like, yes, we do everything.
And it's like, yeah,four stars, no comment.
Now here's my thought that wasintrospective to this point.
Have we set up to help them understandthe awesomeness of what they're getting?
So have we have the assistance orhas the dentist, whatever said.
(33:32):
Hey, do you know like most offices,they'll have you in a temporary for
two or three weeks, we're gettingthis crown put on same day, and
isn't that, isn't that awesome?
You don't have to come back a second time.
You don't have to set up and, butif it's just standard, then to
the patient, they just go, well,I guess it was just standard.
And, you know, if, if thetoothbrush wasn't good enough
(33:53):
then, you know, but it's like, no.
Do you know that, that Dr.Chad has chosen, this is the
toothbrush he uses at home.
He wants all his patients to have this.
That's different than, here'syour toothbrush in a bag, right?
Yeah.
It's the same toothbrush,but it's the sizzle.
Sara Hansen (34:09):
Yeah.
No, and, and we loved,we're all dental nerds.
We love dentistry.
We get it like we geek outover margins and this and that,
but our patients don't know.
So Chad, you are spot on.
You have to tell them.
You have to tell them really howawesome certain things are, or the
benefit of coming there, right?
(34:29):
They just don't know.
Dr. Chad Johnson (34:31):
It goes back to Bruce Baird saying, you know, do
you know this handpiece has a littlelight on it, you know, on the front?
You know, and it, and, and thatcould be awfully standard, but you
know, patients don't know that.
And so they, they're just like, hehas a little light on the front.
You know, I
Dr. Maggie Augustine (34:47):
referred to my, to my loops as microscopes because
they don't know what loops are
Dr. Chad Johnson (34:52):
correct.
Regan Robertson (34:53):
Bringing it back around, uh, to what you said, Sarah, which to
me sounds like a, a diagnosis of sorts.
Have you earned the right for a referraland because of authenticity and because
of the uniqueness of each practice,something that will, that will get
me hot and, and upset immediatelyis when somebody says, oh, dental,
you know, dental offices are all thesame, or dentists all want the same.
(35:15):
We know that that's not true.
And the same goes for.
Patients and, and your geographicregion and your demographics and
your psychographics, all of thosethings make a huge, huge difference.
And I mean, when I look at Chad'spractice versus say, a high end, super
cosmetic practice that serves thestars down in Miami Beach, those two,
Dr. Chad Johnson (35:36):
or New York, Dubai even,
Regan Robertson (35:38):
right?
Those.
Those patients, their expectationsof what is going to garner a a
review is gonna be a lot differentthan, than at Chad's practice.
So, so Sarah, I, I know that theproof is in the pudding here.
I'll, I'll, this is a great example.
Sarah will do this if in in offices.
So she was the one that likebrought to PDA and, and it
(36:00):
comes from this wholeheartedself-confidence that you can't fake
and you are authentic in yourself.
Um, I am in the chatboat a hundred percent.
I'm always like, you could leave us areview and you can tell, even if you tell
yourself I'm confident, leave us a review.
People can tell subconsciouslywhether or not you're being genuine,
authentic, and confident aboutasking for that particular review.
(36:22):
She does this, um, when she does inoffices, and I will know that she is
in office with a practice because Iwill get notifications in my email
that says, productive Dentist Academy.
Just got a review and I will open it upand it's five star, five star, five star.
But it's not just five star orjust four star with nothing.
It has, you know, Sarah and,and Star like killed it today.
Our whole, it's, it's very specific.
(36:44):
I have done the samethings now as my role.
I don't go in office, I go in.
Extremely rarely, like maybetwice, like not very much, but I
was like, I'll ask for the review.
I'll do what Sarah says,and I'll get like two.
And I'm like, well, was it good?
And then one-on-one, they're like, oh.
But you didn't, but you didn't say it.
And I think part of it was the waythat I, I rushed through it, right?
(37:06):
It was, could you, couldyou leave us a review?
That'd be great.
Goodbye.
So there's part of that,and so they can sense that.
And then the other part iswhat were they expecting?
What, what did I earn that, right?
Yes.
Ask for the review and meetthem where they were at.
And that's not something I, Idon't normally go and do that.
Whereas Sarah comes.
20 plus years have in practice.
I am willing to bet you she knows exactlywhere to meet each individual team
(37:29):
member when she goes in office and sheknows how to earn that, that review.
So is it Sarah, like, does, is itthese things combined like this
that equal getting over the hump?
Sara Hansen (37:40):
Yeah, I mean I think it really is a combination
of a lot of different things.
It, it is understanding, butI think it's also, you know,
you used me as an example, but.
I think my authenticity comes isbecause I truly love what I do.
I love how I show up.
I love, love, love my clients.
Maggie's been on phone callswith me when I get teary
(38:01):
talking about my clients, right?
I truly am invested in theirsuccess and I love how I show up.
So I think that you canbuild that authenticity.
Patients need to fill thatfrom every single team member.
And you know, I do understand the.
Repetition sometimes of our jobs, right?
(38:22):
But what I say from the stage in thefront of the room always is, do you all
understand the impact that you're makingon patients' lives every single day?
You are truly transforming lives.
I mean, you can scroll throughTikTok or Res and you can see
life-changing videos of people thatyou have truly changed their lives.
What we do at dentistry, and Iget passionate about this, is we
(38:45):
just don't like drill and fill.
That's not what we do.
We're in the business of healthcare.
We're in the business of trulychanging people's lives, and I
think oftentimes we forget that.
So, you know, if we can go back to whowe are, just as team members, you know,
showing up for our patients every day,and believe in that role and step in
that role that patients come to us.
(39:06):
Because they truly have a need and we'rethere to find a solution that also changes
how we show up for our patients and theexperience, the reviews, it all kind
Regan Robertson (39:16):
of flows together.
Let's do this.
I'm gonna, I'm gonna go, this hasbeen a, an exceptional episode and
the four of us can be here all day.
We're gonna invite you again, Sarah.
I'd love to talk aboutauthenticity and how it shows up.
I think you've done a really exceptionaljob today at Giving Doctors something to.
(39:36):
Really self-evaluate in their ownpractice and understand the complexity
of, um, you know, of growing yourpractice through internal marketing
and external, how they go together.
And, um, and being authenticis, is one of those keys to it.
Uh, Chad and then Maggie, finalthoughts, and we'll hand it
over to Sarah for the last word.
Dr. Chad Johnson (39:55):
My tangible take home is as a team, when you have.
An expectation that they fill out a fivestar review or something of the like, and
you're like, why don't they recognize thatwe go the extra mile in doing X and y.
Find out what those X and Y are.
(40:19):
Write them down and be like, wewant to be recognized for the
fact that we do this and that.
Then.
Make yourself recognizablethat you do those.
Because if it's, if it's silent andunknown that the team, you know, is
bringing out a, a warm blanket that theythrew in the dryer and stuff like that,
but no one, no one knows, like it's just.
(40:41):
It's very Disney-esque, you know, DisneyService to be able to provide that.
But then like no one is gonna sellthe sizzle, you know, in that.
Like that's what we do.
We do this for you because we care.
And then, then that's where weneed to come through as a team and
be like, identify where we are.
Let's call it resentfulthat no one recognizes this.
(41:04):
And then go, let's make ourselves.
Known that this is what we doand this is what sets us apart.
And, and, and that might take a littlebit of, um, finesse in figuring out how to
make sure that people can recognize thatyou're awesome because of those things.
Um, but that, that would help flipthe script instead of just being
(41:25):
a martyr that you're always being.
Uh, unseen and unheard for doingthose, uh, uncommon things.
Uh, but make yourself known.
Um, and it might not even be tootingyour own horn, but somehow figuring
out a way to say, you know, thatthis is, uh, what we do as a standard
for our patients, but it's notstandard, uh, you know, across the.
(41:47):
The city.
It's not standard thatevery office is doing that.
That's my take home message for thelisteners is to find those things that
kind of almost hurt your feelings.
Like, why doesn't anyone recognizethat we use buffered anesthetic?
Mm-hmm.
Well, do they know that you're usinga buffered anesthetic and that it
stings less when you inject it andyou can get going quicker, so the
patient is outta there quicker?
(42:08):
Let your patients know.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (42:10):
Mm-hmm.
That's a, that's a really.
That's a really great point.
Um, and, and I have started to use thatsince I, since I got the Glidewell io
mill, I have started to let patients knowthat that is really unique and we've spent
a lot of money on technology to bringit to our patients, and they have, I.
And they have become moregrateful as a result of that.
(42:32):
My takeaway is, you know, when Ihave jokingly said that, that, um,
that marketing is, is black magicmarketing is extremely complex.
Dr. Chad Johnson (42:43):
Yes.
Dr. Maggie Augustine (42:43):
Because, you know, we think of it as just
spending money on ads or clicks.
But the truth is that it trickles downto not just external marketing and.
And then internal marketing.
But it really pushes us to understandourselves, our personalities, the way that
we interact with one another, who we areas people, what is expected of us, uh, and
(43:08):
how we translate that onto our patientsbecause all of those things are affected.
And really what stands behind marketingand Reagan, you know that really
well and, and so does Sarah, is thisstory that we're trying to tell about
who we are and how we understand andserve our patients, and putting that.
(43:32):
Into a package and, um, allowingour patients to connect to
that is the basis of marketing.
But it makes everythingso extremely complex.
Um, and so, you know, many peopleuse metrics to try and figure out
whether or not it's all working.
Uh, I remember when I was workingwith, with a marketing company
(43:55):
before PDA and, and I would say,you know, they'd be like, well.
They came to the office, but theydidn't use the number that you gave.
And, and his answer was like,well, right, you don't know that.
But did they use the websitethat we, that we showed them?
Did they check out yourFacebook or Instagram?
These are the things that you don'tknow, but they're part of branding
(44:16):
and they're part of marketing.
So is marketing workingor isn't it working?
These there, there's so much gray area,which is why I call it, you know, kind of.
Black magic.
Yeah.
And so that's my, my takeaway.
It is, it is really, it's complex.
Really complex and and difficult to track.
I think
Regan Robertson (44:35):
there are final thoughts.
Take us home, girl.
Sara Hansen (44:39):
Yeah.
When it comes to reviews and referrals,listen, this really is about.
Turning your satisfied patients intothe practice's biggest advocates.
Um, you know, that's really all it is.
Let your patients tell otherpatients about how great you are.
You don't even have to do anything,but just treat them the way that
you know that they deserve to betreated and they'll do it for you.
(45:02):
So that's, that's my
Regan Robertson (45:04):
final thoughts for today's episode.
Thank you everybody for joining us today.
Uh, we had a great time.
Thank you, Sarah for joining us.
Thank you, Chad and Maggiefor being together again.
Uh, look forward to more episodescoming forward, and if you
wanna leave Everyday Practices areview, you can find us on iTunes.
You can find us on Spotify.
(45:26):
You can find us on socialmedia at productive Dentists
on Facebook and LinkedIn.
All the pieces go to where you are.
We'd love to hear your feedback.
Dr. Chad Johnson (45:35):
Especially if it's five stars.
Regan Robertson (45:38):
Cheese.
Cheese, four stars, nothing.
Chef,
Dr. Chad Johnson (45:42):
four stars, no comment.
Regan Robertson (45:44):
Take care everybody.
Thank you for listening to anotherepisode of Everyday Practices Podcast.
It would mean the world if you canhelp spread the word by sharing this
episode with a fellow dentist andleave us a review on iTunes or Spotify.
Do you have an extraordinary story you'dlike to share or feedback on how we can
make this podcast even more Awesome.
(46:06):
Drop us an email at podcast.
At productive dentist.com.
And don't forget to check out ourother podcasts from Productive
Dentist academy@productivedentist.comslash podcasts.
See you next week.
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