July 2, 2025 • 48 mins
Dr. Michael Sonick joins Chad Johnson, Maggie Augustyn, and Regan Robertson to share how emotional presence and trust—not treatment plans—drive real case acceptance.
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Episode Transcript
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Dr. Chad Johnson (00:00):
Welcome to Everyday Practices Dental Podcast.
This is your host, Dr. Chad Johnson,along with my other co-host.
Uh, Reagan, Robertson and my otherother host, uh, Dr. Maggie Augustine.
So today we have a special guest.
Dr. Michael Sonic is a board certifiedperiodontist and implant surgeon based
(00:20):
out of Fairfield, Connecticut, who trainedme in dental implants 20 years ago.
He has over 35 years experience.
He's not only renowned forhis patient-centered in.
Interdisciplinary approach to treatment,but also for the way that he shares
that philosophy with the world.
I found him recently on YouTube andwas watching some of his, uh, stuff on
(00:41):
Facebook, and it inspired me to havehim on the podcast through his YouTube
channel and growing social media presence.
Dr. Sonic offers a rare look inside whatit means to build a practice on empathy,
aesthetics, and education, whetherit's guiding a full arch transformation
or sharing insights on treating the.
Person, not just the teeth.
(01:02):
His message is clear.
Dentistry is about connection.
So let's welcome to the show with Dr.
Michael Sonic.
Mike, how you doing?
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:10):
Good.
It is good.
Thank you, Chad.
Good to see you again.
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:13):
Yes,
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:13):
look the same as you did 20 years ago,
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:16):
just with a few more grays and you look amazing.
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:18):
Well, thank you.
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:19):
Yeah,
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:20):
I feel good.
I'm doing what I love to do.
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:22):
So what keeps you young?
I mean like what's keeping you healthy?
I.
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:26):
Um, physically, mentally, spiritually, it's, it's, it
is the whole package, you know, andit is the way I treat my patients.
It's really connecting with human beingsand just sort of being there for them.
So I do a lot of things tostay healthy, you know, diet.
Well, there are four things.
There are four pillars, uh, is diet,exercise, sleep, and mindfulness.
And of course then you could addon a few other things to that.
(01:47):
One is having a passionfor doing what you love.
And I'm lucky as you are.
We all are to do what we love to doand connecting with other people.
It's all about human connectivity.
So my message about practicing dentistryby human connection, that that's
really important no matter who youlisten to about longevity or health.
You know, you look at the blue zones andthe people who live in those parts of
(02:07):
the world, which I'm not sure if that'strue or not, but it seems to be true.
You know, when you're living ina community, and I actually live
in my community, I practiced200 yards from my high school.
So I get to see the peopleI went to high school with.
So I'm instilled in my,my, my, my, my natural hat.
Habitat and I've gotten too far, and it'ssort, it's sort of really, really nice.
So I think all those thingsare really, really important.
(02:28):
We're, and
Dr. Chad Johnson (02:30):
share with our audience and, and our co-host here.
Tell us about your office.
Was it, wasn't it something like400 years old, the building and you
had it redone and stuff like that?
Tell me about it.
Dr. Michael Sonick (02:38):
Yeah, but I, I was in a small, small office and I actually,
when you came and trained with us mm-hmm.
It was relatively new.
Well, the office was, but the buildingis the building's 150 years old.
Uh, it was a doctor's office atone point, and when I bought it, I
bought it from an older periodontist.
He was in his early eighties.
It was all chopped up and uh,I got it in an old building in
(02:58):
historical Dexter of Fairfield.
Uh, if you, from the outside, it lookslike a beautiful home and you walk
inside, it's a very modern facility.
As you know, we have a teachingcenter on the second floor.
Got seven operatories.
It's, you know, we got a laboratorythere, we now have added a photo
studio and a videographer up there.
So we have a whole, wholebunch of things going.
We use it, I
Dr. Chad Johnson (03:17):
remember it being super clean.
You guys were, you know, obsessive as,as I try and be about, uh, cleanliness
and, and you know, sterility and.
Keeping things.
Not that though, that's gonna exciteanyone, but I just, you know, being
obsessive compulsive kind of type, Iwas, uh, super impressed with how you
kept offices clean in spite of the fact.
I've gone to a few officeswhere that's not the case.
(03:40):
You know, they have, they havegreat education, but it's like,
oh man, they're kind of lackingand actually keeping stuff clean.
So, yeah.
Dr. Michael Sonick: Yeah, we're fastidious. (03:47):
undefined
It's, it's a big part of mymessage, uh, because people see.
Now I talk about, you know, the three,the triad of, of running a good practice.
You have to do good dentistry, right?
Mm-hmm.
But people don't really seeme 'cause I'm a good dentist.
I am a good dentist, butpeople really don't know.
I mean, they can't tell.
I mean, if I'm going bone back andif there's bone loss down to the
(04:08):
third thread, if the tooth is stillthere or whatever, um, also you
have to have great service, but youalso have to have nice day core.
So day decor is a big partof how we run our practice.
I happen to love nice day core.
Everywhere I go, I, I look for it.
I'll walk out of a restaurant ifit doesn't feel good, you know,
without even knowing anythingabout the food, I just leave.
And actually, I was in Chicagoonce with my son and, uh, we were
(04:30):
there, this was about 15 years ago,and we didn't know where to eat.
And we walked in, we're looking fora place, we walked in one restaurant,
I opened the door, I got into thevestibule, and I turned around.
He goes, what are you doing?
But someone was like.
19 at the time.
I go, you don't get that feel.
He goes, no, I go the placesI can't, I can't eat here.
He goes, how do you know that?
I go, I just know.
And people do know that, you know, and Ihave some stories in my book about that,
(04:51):
how people leave certain places becauseof, you know, what the someone looks like.
'cause people look at everything.
Now you're looking, you're, Imean, you're a prestigious guy.
Your hair's neat and clean.
You always were like that.
I mean that, that's the wayhe took care of yourself.
Not all dentists are, but um, canyou be great if you're a slob?
I don't know.
You know, you walk into a doctor's office,they get speckles of blood on their shoes.
(05:14):
Are you gonna, are you gonnalet them operate on you?
So, yeah, there's people.
It's, it is amazing.
You know, I have a number of storieslike that in the book, and I have
many stories from my life like thatwhere people just will walk out
because of what you, you look like.
So in our, in our office, I have,uh, on Mondays, I, I tell everybody
that their nails gotta look goodat the beginning of the week.
You know, I actually, I cutmy nails every Monday morning.
(05:35):
I've been doing that for 40 years.
The first thing I do when I get in theoffice on Monday after our, our staff
meeting, we, I cut my nails and go on.
Sometimes I forget, I go,oh God, they look terrible.
But nobody noticed except for me.
Dr. Chad Johnson (05:46):
So can I ask you a question from one guy to another?
Let's talk nails for a second.
This will be the first podcast showever about guy talking about nails.
Do you ever take a fileand bevel the sharp corner?
I.
Dr. Michael Sonick (05:58):
No, I, I don't, I, I,
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (06:00):
yeah.
Dad, talk about what kind of file you use.
Dr. Chad Johnson (06:02):
So, so I started using my wife's, uh, you know,
file that wears o out over time.
And I was like, you know what?
I, so I went to the hardware storeand I got like a, um, a metal.
Uh, file.
And so I use a meta file 'causeI was like, I'm, this one's
gonna last the rest of my life.
And somehow I've told Maggie this, soshe's going to help share my details.
(06:25):
But I love Beveling the corner sothat way they're not sharp, you know,
like when, when you're touching it.
So like.
Dr. Michael Sonick (06:31):
Can't be sharp.
I will cut them.
I was on.
Did you end up playing?
I was on the airplane the other day anda woman next to me started filing her
nails, which I, I didn't care for at thisNo thing is should do in public, you know.
No.
Right on the airplane.
No.
Right.
Dr. Chad Johnson (06:46):
I'll allow it outside if it's casual.
You know, like let's sayyou're in someone's backyard
and there for some reason feeluncomfortable, but not on a plane.
Come on.
Alright, so now before I let anyonejump into it, because I know Reagan
is chomping at the bit, but Iam just, uh, super excited about
having you on and talking with ya.
Is, uh, tell me how did you endup deciding to write this book
(07:08):
and how's it been received?
Like, tell me about the book.
I.
Dr. Michael Sonick (07:12):
Yeah, I mean, I've been, the, the book,
the book sort of wrote itself.
I've been, I've been practicing likethe book since I started in practice.
Mm-hmm.
And when I, when I work, I startedmy, I started practicing, well,
I've had probably 20 jobs before Iopened my own pri private practice.
And I opened up a, a white box.
It was 600 square feet.
I had no patience.
I was a sixth period,honest in a town of 65,000.
(07:35):
So it was already, there was not a needfor another periodontist at that time.
And so when I opened up my office,I really wanted to make it perfect
and so I create, I crafted thatway and I worked in the mall to try
to make enough money so I can openup my new practice because, um, I.
(07:55):
Because I didn't wanna, I,I didn't wanna practice in
another office in my own state.
So I worked in two different states.
My office is in Connecticut, but I workedin a mall in New York, New York, in the
Galleria and White Plains and in Holyoke.
In Ingleside, up in Massachusetts.
I drove 700 miles a week, you know,worked for six days a week just to
generate enough cash flow so I canopen up my practice at that time.
(08:15):
Wow.
When I opened it up, I wanted tomake it really boutiquey and very
nice, and we didn't take insurance.
I never took insurance andmy, my growth was slow.
My first year in practice,I produced 35,000 and my
overhead was about a hundred.
So I had $400,000 in debt this 1985.
So it wasn't, everyone thinks likeI'm an overnight success, but it
took me a long time to get there.
(08:36):
I worked really hard and um, so all theprinciples that I built the practice
with, I sort of put into the book.
And when I was in the mallworking in the mall, I used to.
Bring in my own stuff.
I, I bring in cassette players.
This was before streaming music, and I'dgive, I'd have a Walkman and I'd have my
patients that I would give them a choiceof 20 different cd uh, cassette tapes.
(08:57):
I'd have Willie Nelson,I'd have the Beatles.
I'd have some jazz, youknow, I, I, classical music,
Brahms, whatever they like.
I would give them music.
I'd run in, I'd run in.
Eyeglasses that were dark, sothey would be dark in and out.
I brought in like a little, littleblankets for them, and because
the mall was sort of disgusting,I carried my own artwork in and
hung it while I was working there.
And the all mall was so badthat my, my, my friend who was
(09:20):
working there, Jeff Shapiro, wasa very busy practice in New York.
Jeff Shapiro and I, we wentin on a weekend and we got
all the dental assistant.
We paid them when our boss was outtatown and we painted the whole office.
So we wanted to make it look nice.
And that's how I sort of started.
So during COVID, I've been talkingabout this book, book and I've been
lecturing for 40 years about, youknow, clinical dentistry, but I've
(09:41):
always wove a little bit of the.
Clinical practice part in, 'causeI think that's equally, if not more
important, is how we connect with humans.
And so when COVID came around,I go, uhoh, I got nothing to do.
I better, I better even saywhen the book coming out.
And a good friend of mine, Bob Levine, awell-known period from Philadelphia, kept
on saying, I'm talking about your book.
He goes, when's it coming out?
And I hadn't written yet.
So during COVID, I, I wrote it.
(10:02):
That took me about a year to write it.
I got on, I got online every day.
I talked it through.
I had people record me and Ispent a long time doing it.
And then when COVID wasover, I renovated my office.
We cleaned it all up, we wrote,rewrote all our protocols,
and I had the book come out.
And then when we hit the ground running,when they opened up the door, and we
did a lot of cool things during COVIDto make it really customer centric.
(10:25):
Matter of fact, I mean, our office was.
Oh, you think our office was clean then?
We were over the top of COVID.
So a lot of people came to ourpractice, say we're the only place
that they would go post COVID becausethey didn't trust anybody else.
And you know, for COVID, as youremember, I'd be walking in the woods,
you know, in the middle of nowhere andI'd see someone I knew and they'd jump
behind a tree to get away from me.
(10:45):
It was, oh yeah.
You know?
And so I learned a lot during,during that period of time.
And then it finally came out and so thenI had a, now that the book is out, it's
pretty well received, we've sold, um.
I have over 3000 copies out, whichis not bad, uh, for a boutique book.
Right.
You know, we have the, we have their videoseries out on YouTube, and I give one
(11:06):
keynote a week, um, one one day a week.
I'm lecturing on this topicsomewhere, you know, like, this
is my second podcast this week.
I gave a, a two day program last week.
So it, it, it is.
Getting traction, and I'm tryingto, my moonshot is to change
the way healthcare is delivered.
Um, and that, and that's a big moonshot,but I wanna get this book into medical and
dental schools and every healthcare, uh,every healthcare facility in the country.
(11:30):
And because we were talked a littleearlier in the age of AI and human.
Misinformation or disinformation.
And what we don't knowwhat's true, what's not true.
We always do know what is truein terms of a human connection.
That's something we feel.
Mm-hmm.
And people really, really need that.
They're starved for it.
And so our office, you know, we'rein the northeast where people, you
(11:52):
know, sometimes aren't, you don'tthink it's their friendliest, I don't
think Connecticut is the friendlieststate, but if you come into our office.
You know, it is like people arelaughing, they're having a good time.
It's, it really, they're greetedas friends by first name.
And we do a lot of things to makethat to, to make that happen.
And I had a friend of mine who'sa neurolinguistic programming
coach, and that's, that's sort ofthe, the way that we all interact.
(12:12):
By the way we look at each other, we,the way we, we, we speak the tone of our
voice, how we, how we move our hands.
There's that human interconnection.
We even get on Zoom a little bit.
I can see as I'm looking at some of youhere, we're starting to get that feeling.
He came to my office one day and spentthe day with me, and he says to me, he
says, this is before I wrote the book.
He goes, you know, you'rereally good at what you do, but
(12:33):
you're unconsciously competent.
Meaning that I'm good at it, butI don't know why I'm doing it.
I was a natural at doing it, butI couldn't teach anybody else.
So when I wrote the book, I said,I. I had a lookout and I had to
break down everything I did, justlike I do when I teach implants.
Like everything is a system.
So I have a system forbeing a good hospitality.
You know, someone who runs a reallygood, you know, hospitable practice and
(12:56):
is a, there, there's a technique for it.
And, and the great restaurants andthe great places like the Four Seasons
Hotel, when you go in there almost,they're all pretty much dissimilar.
They have, they, they have acertain way of reading you.
That's nice.
Most of the time, you know, it depends.
That they have in there.
Sometimes it's a little bitrobotic, the way people look at
you, you know, and talk to you.
But you gotta be sort of natural.
(13:16):
And that all really comes downto how you hire and who you
hire, which is a huge part.
So the most important part of my patientexperience, of course, is my cake.
It's, it's, it's, it's, mm-hmm.
Yeah.
You know, so.
Go ahead.
Regan Robertson (13:32):
What is fascinating, uh, about all of this is it, it, I would
call you a venture to call you a unicorn.
Um, in dentistry in particular,there are doctors that I have met
similar to you, but what you'redescribing from my lens is the brand
experience, the actual experience from.
Before they ever met you to, youknow, ever even know you exist to,
(13:53):
uh, to after they walk out the door.
And then what follows up for that.
And I'm genuinely curious because ofcourse there is natural, intuitive
nature to be an active listenerand to care about the person before
they're even sitting in your chair.
What is, uh, something that you couldshare, like a story from a time in your
life where you had an experience that justblew your mind, because there had to have
(14:16):
been some seed that was planted at somepoint that said, wow, this, I want to be
able to replicate this feeling, like thisvibe for my patients and for my practice.
Dr. Michael Sonick (14:31):
I, I don't have an experience that shaped my journey.
You know, they started, but I was,I, my father had a furniture store.
I delivered furniture.
I had customer experiences there.
I just always had it.
I was a lifeguard, so I used to takecare of people when they get injured.
Uh, I was a waiter, okay.
For many years I was a bartender,so I was a cocktail piano player.
(14:51):
I mean, I did all those type of thingswith, with service my whole career.
But I've had plenty of experiencesthat have been amazing.
And once you're open to thoseexperiences out there and you're
giving back from a place ofabundance, they just magically appear.
You know?
And, um, I mean, I hadone, I, I could share one.
(15:12):
This is this, this didn't shape me.
I was already shaped at this point.
But I always like to stay in nice hotelsand I'll stay at a Ritz or Four Seasons.
Oftentimes I don't have to pay for 'embecause they're being paid for for me.
But I was once staying at the um.
Um, what I thought was the FourSeasons Hotel in Atlanta, and
I know Atlanta really well.
I went to Emory and I go thereevery year and I went out for lunch.
(15:33):
I came back to the hotel and I went up tothe floor and I, I was on the eighth floor
and I used my room key as not working.
And um, I. You know, I'm a, you know,I'm a, I'm a little upset because
I'm in a Four Seasons hotel room.
Key's not working.
So I have a little bit of an attitude,but I'm trying not to show it.
So I walked to the front desk, I go,you know, uh, my room key's not working.
And the guy picks up theroom key and he looks at it.
(15:54):
He goes, um, that's 'cause thisis for the Four Seasons Hotel
and you're staying at the Ritz.
So, um, I said, oh.
So they looked alike.
And uh, so he go, I go, where's that?
He goes, it's like downthe road, two miles.
They, I'll walk.
He goes, no, well letus take you down there.
He goes, we have a hotel car and let ustake you down to the, the Four Seasons.
(16:14):
So I was staying at theRitz in downtown Atlanta.
I. And they gimme their car to take me tothe four seasons where I'm not staying.
Now, I didn't take it becauseI felt funny doing that.
Um, and I just took an Uber,so I, I could've stayed
either one of those hotels.
So for the last nine years, everytime I go to Atlanta, which is
about three or four times a year, Ialways stayed in the Four Seasons.
Downtown Ritz Carlton downtownbecause of that experience.
(16:37):
Hmm.
I like both hotels, but, butthat one, and it's, it's amazing.
Now who does that?
I mean, who does that?
I'm giving you a gift and, and even thoughit's not in my best interest and you
know, I have an expression, I go, do youknow why they call it the right thing?
'cause it's the right thing.
So when people come to me foradvice, I go, just do what's right.
I don't care what they're saying.
You know, I see it a lot in, in youngcouples that get married, they go,
(17:00):
well, I'd like you, but you know, myspouse says I can't and I shouldn't.
I go, but isn't theright thing to do this?
You always have to make a standfor doing it the right thing.
And if you're in the servicebusiness, you always wanna do the
right thing for the people you serve.
And I think it's a privilege,true privilege to do what we do.
I mean, especially people allow, peoplepay us thousands of dollars to, for them,
for us to open their mouths and cut them.
(17:21):
Okay.
And then they say, thank you.
It's a, it's a, it's a really, the wholedynamic of the dental experience, the
whole customer's journey is bizarre.
And if you can make it seem whenthey write to you, thank you so
much for giving me that experience.
Thank you so much.
I've never had a dental,dental experience.
I just treated dentist thisweek and he, he called me up,
he goes, and he's 75 years old.
(17:43):
He goes in all my years, and thisis the guy I used to work with.
He goes, in all my years Ihave never had such a painless.
Dental or medical experience.
Wow.
And the first time I met him andho and I, he didn't like me at all.
30 years ago, he couldn't stand me'cause he thought I was an arrogant
jerk, you know, because, you know,my reputation had preceded me.
But as you're my patient, I'm alwaysgonna be very kind for you there.
(18:03):
But I've had so many of thoseexperiences like that they're
al, they're always pretty cool.
I really what you give out there isyou usually get back, you know, and a
lot of, if you lead by, you know, ifyou lead by what can you do for me?
You're never gonna be successful.
So I have a question, you know, for youall, can you be successful If you are not
(18:24):
in an abundance mindset, can you be in thescarcity mindset and still be successful?
You know, put yourself first, so, mm-hmm.
I dunno,
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (18:33):
plenty of people are.
Dr. Michael Sonick (18:35):
Yeah.
Most people are something in a
Dr. Maggie Augustyn: scarcity mindset, Mick. (18:38):
undefined
Dr. Michael Sonick (18:39):
Yeah.
Most people in a scarcity mindset.
Yeah.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (18:41):
Yeah.
I think most people come from ascarcity mindset and they punch.
It's funny, I just left to Marco Poloabout this, uh, for our little group,
but it comes from a place of egoism.
Dr. Michael Sonick (18:54):
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn: And we feel so unworthy. (18:54):
undefined
That we will fight to the death tryingto prove that we are worth something.
And so we put on this armorpretending that we are everything,
that we are so tremendously arrogantand we will fight to the death.
Trying.
Why are you laughing, Chad?
Dr. Michael Sonick (19:16):
Because you're right.
Keep going.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (19:18):
Try
Dr. Michael Sonick (19:19):
we, we agree with you.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (19:20):
Trying to fight to the death that we are everything,
that we are better than you, right?
We are, we will take everythingfrom the people around us.
Uh, it's, it's a, it's,it's a power struggle.
It's a dominance thing, it'san ego thing and all of it.
Comes from the idea of scarcity,where if you just leaned back and
(19:44):
surrendered and looked at the beautyof the world, and because I am with
you, I talk about human connection.
I don't know if you've ever read the bookCompassion Ons, but, um, if, if you think
about human connection and compassion, um.
Think about what we can give toone another instead of what we are
(20:05):
there to take from one another.
All of a sudden, a whole new world opensup to you and you no longer have to prove
to someone looking at you, you're worth.
We all see what we are to oneanother, but there, but I would
say the majority of people, um.
Live from a scarcity mindset and theyfight to the death trying to prove
(20:29):
who they are and take from one anotherinstead of giving, if that makes sense.
Dr. Chad Johnson (20:36):
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Michael Sonick (20:38):
Yeah.
Yeah.
It, it, it does.
So here, here's, here's the opportunity.
If you're an abundance mindset, you're ata distinct advantage because most people
aren't there and there's an expressionthat there's no competition in a niche.
So if your niche is to practiceintegrity and to be an extremely giving
practitioner and to always be therefor your patient and not nickel and
(20:59):
dime 'em say, oh, you know, I alwayslook for experience that we, I always
look to give what I call patience.
We've named a lot of thingsthat we do in our practice.
One of 'em is the wow experience.
So I always look to givepeople a wow experience.
Every time someone is in my practice, Iwant them to leave with a wow experience.
Uh, today someone says, you know,uh, like on vacationing, as I
mentioned, you on Block Island,someone says, oh, I've been there.
(21:21):
You know, I like it there.
I said, oh, I have a list of, I have,I have a list of all the restaurants
and places to hike on Block Island.
And before I finish the sentence,my dental, uh, nurse is printed out
a list of three pages to hand them.
As they're walking out, you know, andthat was like you, did you expect to
get that at the periodontist office?
You know, or I always look for somethingto, to give, uh, people, I have a list
(21:42):
of all the top restaurants in areas.
I have 30 books in myoffice, multiple copies.
So someone says, I'mtrying to lose some weight.
Oh, have you read this book?
This is about diet.
You know, my neck hurts,you know, what about this?
And so I'll always, Ihave a book on back pain.
I have a book on.
I have a book.
I know almost everything.
Yeah.
So I'll always give it, I'll alwaysgive them a book and when I run out
of 'em, I order more, more of them.
(22:03):
So I always try to really improve, youknow, the quality of my patients' lives.
That's, that's my, our mission statement.
I wanna improve the qualityof my patients' lives.
Regan Robertson (22:12):
I have a question for you, because you mentioned that one of
the challenges of, of writing this bookwas really thinking carefully about
how you're able to deliver that wow.
Experience and putting it into.
To frameworks and tools that otherscan, can apply for themselves.
And it's kind of likedoing the right thing.
Uh, you know, when we look atlike crafting core values or key
(22:33):
characteristics and we say, dothe right thing, that can mean
different things to different people.
So leading them anddefining it is important.
Could you tell us about your process?
Of getting what was in your head outinto this book and like an example
that's in the book of a framework thatyou developed that you were able to walk
through that process of, okay, I have toreally break it down engineering style
(22:54):
and map out what it is that I can, youknow, that I do so I can teach others.
Dr. Michael Sonick (22:59):
I think a simple one is the initial examination.
So 90% of all dentists do theirexamination in a hygiene room, so
this is a big problem for dentists.
Patient call up and theysay, I want my teeth cleaned.
They go, well, we needto do an exam first.
Not only one is a cleaning.
I. So that's the big blockage, and theythink this can cleaning costs X dollars.
You even see people promotingthe practices, you know, 1 99
(23:22):
exam and cleaning an x-rays.
And so they get the patients in andit's, it's sort of like a loss leader,
but do they actually get to do all that?
So to enter our practice,it's an one hour examination.
And during that examinationprocess, we do, we do.
Four things.
So if you're a new patient in mypractice, I will tell them, I said,
oh, you're here today for your exam.
What we're gonna do is an examinationand then we're going to do a diagnosis.
(23:45):
And I said, the diagnosis that wehave for you is gonna be the same no
matter if I do it or anybody else.
Or Chad does it or Reagan does it, or Dr.
Maggie does it.
It's all gonna be the same diagnosis.
You either have periodontalthese or you don't.
Is it black and white?
I said, and then we're gonna giveyou some treatment options and
then we'll talk about treatment.
What most doctors do, and you know, andit's not just dentists, it's doctors, is
they look at their specialty and what theylike to do is go, oh, that's an O on X.
(24:09):
Okay, that's an, that's a IGN case.
So that, that's like whatever it is.
So that's, that's a LANAP case.
So when they go into what their, their,their procedures are, so most doctors
talk about patients as procedures.
I talked about dentistsas being pothole fillers.
We look at something to do if weget an insurance code to go down.
I wanna turn that on its head and Iwanna look at everybody as a human being.
(24:30):
And the way I do that is four parts.
We do an exam, we do a diagnosis,treatment plans, and treatment.
So I sort of made that up and that issomething else that's, that's with that
so that, that also people don't reallytalk about now what I just said to you.
Exam, diagnosis, treatment plans,and treatment we're, we taught
that in school as periodontistsas that's drilled into us.
Most periodontists don't think that way.
(24:50):
If they're like, let's do some implants,they just want to go to that, you know,
I don't care about the procedures.
So I, in my book, what I've done isI say, get away from the procedures
and get into the diagnosis.
Okay?
And once you get a diag, you haveto do a complete exam to do that.
You can't do that in three minutesin a hygiene room, so you need
to spend some time doing that.
It requires x-rays, models, and a bunchof other things that you all know about.
(25:12):
So I broke it down like that.
When I sit with that patient,then I'm gonna tell them, I
said, there's a system to this.
'cause patient's gonna say,I just want this fixed.
They go, hold on, lemmeget you your diagnosis.
Let me get you your treatment optionso that you can make the decision.
So then I give it to 'em.
I said, but before we make adecision, there's an order in
which we do your treatment.
And the first thing wedo is we have to get you.
(25:33):
We take care of pain.
And then I said, are you in any pain?
They go, no.
I go, then we don't have to do that.
So that's off the table.
We don't have to take care of your pain.
The only time I would treat someone ontheir initial visit is if they're in pain.
I wanna leave you relieve their pain.
The second thing I do is treat infection.
Caries, periodontal disease,endodonic problems, tumors, whatever.
Those things.
That's the second thing.
And the infection has to be treatedbefore I do the third thing, which
(25:55):
is functional rehabilitation.
That's implants, ortho, crown, and bridge.
That's all the stuff thatwe think about is dentistry.
And then I work with aesthetics,but the aesthetics is done ju which?
Functional rehabilitation.
I just want the front tooth fixed.
It can't if you have an infection'cause it's out of order.
And the last thing is maintenance.
So I give them these, thesetwo things, the protocols.
And the sequence of treatment.
(26:16):
The sequence of treatment is exam,diagnosis, treatment plans, and treatment.
Now, the treatment plansI break down into, I'm not
going to tell you what to do.
I'm gonna tell you what you cando, and then you make a decision.
And the first thing I always tella patient is, you can do nothing.
And once you tell a patient theycan do nothing, they immediately
take ownership because theysay, I don't wanna do nothing.
Yeah, but most peopledon't get that choice.
(26:38):
Most people, the doctor comes inand tells them, so I've also broken
down the three types of doctors.
There are, there's the paternal doctorthat tells a patient what to do and
that doesn't work too much anymore.
Then is the retail doctorlike these your options?
This is 4 99, this is 5 99.
You, this bone grafts 200, this one's 500.
You know this one's, and and theygo, well, I'll do the cheaper.
They don't know how to make a decision.
(26:59):
And then there's the doctorthat's collaborative.
And so I want every doctorto be a collaborative doctor,
but that requires education.
So I broke down that whole processof the exam, and I will, in the first
90 seconds of meeting a patient,if I can see his resistance, I say,
here's what we're gonna do today.
Today I'm gonna do an exam and diagnosis.
I said, I will do treatmentonly if you're in pain.
(27:19):
But I said, but I'll give you treatmentoptions and then you can own the decision
making process and I'll bring you toa level where we, you can understand
what we need we're doing so you canmake the best decisions for yourself.
And by doing that, Iget a 90% case except.
But I'm not giving them the treat.
I'm not telling them what to do.
I'm giving 'em options.
Mm-hmm.
I never give more than three options,and first option is to do nothing.
(27:40):
And second option wasto take out the tooth.
The the third option is to keep the tooth.
And then we could say, well, if wekeep the tooth, we could do endo,
we could do post and core this.
If we take out the tooth, wecould do a bridge, we could do
an implant, we do a flipper.
Or you could use hell of spacein your mouth, and if you have
a space in your mouth, this willhappen and this won't happen.
Or you could just leave it out.
So I give 'em a very logical sequence,which most doctors don't do because
they don't spend the time doing it.
(28:01):
'cause they don't have that conversation.
Mm-hmm.
So that conversation is very powerful andI break that down in my chapter on how
exactly to go ahead, ahead and do that.
Something else that I've also broken down.
Because people come in so fearful atthat when they walk into our office.
It is the most fearful thing that I alwayssay, that I'm like a divorce attorney.
I get to see people at their worstbefore I ask 'em to spend a lot of money.
(28:22):
And because, and they're vulnerable.
They're really scared.
Now I have five divorceattorneys as patients.
I use that line with them and they,they, they, they, they can relate to it.
Yeah.
Or attorneys are their bestpatients because they're so nice.
'cause they're really good atmaking people feel comfortable.
Yeah.
They just have great personalities.
You know, they're not litigators.
They're, some have to deal with, you know,family dynamic and when they're vulnerable
(28:43):
like that, what do I want to do?
We talked about fear before.
You know, you were talking about that too.
Dr. Maggie is basically, you weretalking about being a scarcity mindset.
The scarcity mindset is fearful.
Okay, you, when you lose your fear,you're not in scarcity mindset
because you know that you have thepower to do whatever you need to do.
You can take away everything from methat I could get it back again, because I
feel that I have the ability to do that.
I think you all feel the same way.
(29:04):
So when those patients come in tosee me, they're fearful as hell.
And I said to them, I said, you know,I, I congratulate them from walking in
the door, and then I immediately say attheir initial visit, I'm glad you're here.
You are in the right place.
That's a declarative sentence thatallows patients to say, okay, I
made the right decision being here.
Good.
I'm in the right place.
They have no idea.
Okay.
It's like I'm, you know, it's when you saysomething, you know, I'm a good athlete.
(29:26):
Oh, okay.
So you must be a good athlete.
You know, I'm good at this.
Okay.
Yeah.
Come on.
On our team.
So when I tell 'em in theright place, they feel good.
And then I tell 'em three things.
I never tell them about problems.
I only tell 'em about the solution.
If I mention the problem, Iimmediately link it with the solution.
So I do that, I do that linkage,and I always tell them before I
even tell 'em about the problem, Isay, there's three things that I'm
gonna, I'm gonna didn't do for you.
(29:47):
I'm gonna improve your function.
I'm gonna improve your health.
And if necessary, we'll improve thecosmetics because nobody doesn't want
to be healthy and nobody doesn't wannalook good and have good function.
All that is told within about90 seconds in some manner.
And I linked that all with a storyabout myself and I started to talk
the importance of storytelling becauseI relate to them as a human being.
I don't talk about ations in classtwo occlusions and carries, and
(30:11):
they don't know, you know, I don'tsay any of that kind of stuff.
You know, my, I, I did.
Did back in the day.
They don't care.
They just, they just wanna knowthat they're gonna get better.
It's just like when I meet my financialadvisor, I don't know what he's doing.
You know, I met yesterday, I met withmy, my, my, uh, my lawyer to, to set
up my estate planning and something.
I go, whatever.
(30:32):
Okay, that's fine.
Let's do that.
You know, I go, he, doyou have any questions?
I go, yeah, you'll answerand I'll walk outta here and
I won't remember damn thing.
Is this the right thing?
He goes, yeah, it's the right thing.
Okay, because I trust, you know, 'causeit basically comes down to trust.
It comes down to trust.
That was a long-winded answer to a no,
Dr. Chad Johnson (30:48):
Mike, let me say this.
I had, I met with my life insurance guy.
He really wanted to meet with me.
I didn't.
And so we sat down.
He was, he was late because he wasat the Mexican restaurant next to
the Buffalo Wild Wings for a while.
He finally then comes and meets with meand he says, uh, he says, well before you
leave, 'cause I said, I gotta get back.
Well before you leave, I have this book.
And he.
(31:09):
Bings brings out this binder and hesays, I want you to look through this.
Turn to section one.
He's got 'em, you know, labeledand look at section one.
Now you could, you do auniversal this and that.
And he starts talking about, you know,there's a gap between, you know, this.
And I'm like sitting there going,he's talking about stuff that he finds
interesting within his industry 'causehe's using, but I was just like.
I, I don't care.
(31:29):
And I don't, I don't knowwhat he's talking about, and
I, I actually don't care.
Like, and it reminds me alot of what you just said.
It's just like we have to, remi rememberthat when patients are sitting in the
chair, if we say, well, your classtwo furation is just like, they're
thinking, okay, so is that bad?
Or I, I don't know if I care.
Reagan, you've been lighting up your face.
Please tell me what you're thinking.
Regan Robertson (31:49):
Well, what Dr. Sonic you were just describing is,
I believe it's called attribute.
Priming, I think, I think that'sthe neurolinguistic phase for it.
And it is, it is.
Once I learned that particular,uh, it's not a trick.
It's just, it's just really agreat way to frame a conversation.
Uh, you can do it in, inall, I mean, it's great with.
(32:09):
Parenting.
It's great with clients.
It's great with patients.
It's phenomenal becauseit helps set the stage.
So when you say, you know, you werein the right place, it plants that
in the patient's mind and it helpsgive them that boost of confidence.
So I was, it's called
Dr. Chad Johnson (32:23):
Attribute What?
Regan Robertson (32:24):
Attribute?
Priming.
Dr. Chad Johnson (32:26):
Priming, priming.
Regan Robertson (32:27):
And I love it.
So you've set the stage and then I, Iguess I'm reflecting, I don't know that
I have a question for you, Dr. Sonic.
I'm just thrilled because to see youflip it over into the link, uh, so that
you can be relatable with them, you'retransferring that, that kind of hero's
journey onto the patient themselves andshowing them, you know, I care about you.
(32:47):
And you talked a lot about all of yourcustomer service experience, you know,
in, in the past that I think probably.
Helped maybe with this on, on how tocreate a, a really phenomenal experience.
Is this something that youdo with your team as well?
I'm just really curious.
Dr. Michael Sonick (33:07):
Of course it is.
You know, we have a, one of myteam members, uh, everybody in our
office, you know, dental assistant,administrative person, that's they
all, they all have another job.
So we have some in ouroffice administration.
She's, she's chief of customer service,chief of hospitality, so she is there.
That hospitality is not justfor patients, it's for the team.
(33:29):
So if you come to our office, Imean, every dime I'm in the office.
They, they have lunch, I buy them lunch,we do two or three celebrations a week.
We had, there's always, Ididn't know there was an IT day.
Okay.
There is an it day.
So we have cakes, we put thingsand we post all this kind of stuff.
We, we make, we makepeople feel really special.
We give 'em a one year thing andwe give 'em a five year thing.
And so yeah, I celebrate 'em.
(33:49):
I have to rehire my team every day.
'cause they're volunteers.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (33:53):
That's profound.
I have to rehire my team every day.
Dr. Michael Sonick (33:58):
Yeah,
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (33:59):
that's like recommitting in a marriage every day.
Dr. Michael Sonick (34:02):
Yeah.
Commitment's very big.
That's a, that's a wholeother co conversation.
I do that with my patients.
I make them commit tome at the first visit.
I go, I refuse to treat you unlessyou commit to keeping your teeth
clean for the rest of your lifeby getting your teeth clean every
three to six months, whatever it is.
I go, will you gimme that commitment?
And they go, I'm not sure Igo, then I'm not treating you.
So I make that commitment right there.
That's something I starteddoing about 10 years ago.
(34:25):
So we have, we have.
Hygiene practice.
I mean, we have three full-timehygienists, five days a week.
I mean, and, and most peoplesay, I hate their hygienist.
I love my hygienist.
They're a backbone of our practice.
And I tell 'em every day, I make sureI talk to my team members every day I
walk in, you know, I have a very quietguy that does all our instruments.
I walk in there, I go, I'mon vacation next week, Jason.
(34:46):
I go, I guess we won'thave a talk in a week.
Now he doesn't talk to anybody.
He's quiet.
He sits in the lab.
He loves it.
I mean, he just likes doing that.
And I just, I just make sure Iconnect with everybody and someone
goes through a different, I had oneof my patient, my, my team members
was going through a difficult time.
She was crying.
She goes, she's telling me what's wrong.
I go, okay.
I. Um, you know, I, I, she's the happiest,most, most joyful person in our office,
(35:09):
but she's having trouble with her childrenand she comes the next day, how you doing?
She goes, I'm still miserable.
I said, you know, something, used to bethe most joyful person in the office.
I said, now you're the most miserable.
And she looks at me.
She starts laughing, and then allof a sudden it broke their tension.
You know, another one of my assistantsI had had, had been to four funerals
in the last months, and I go four.
(35:30):
I go, supposed to come inthrees, you're up to four.
I go, what do you have?
Some sort of, we make lightof it and I connect with 'em.
I don't ignore that they'regoing through something and so
we can really talk about that.
Very, very open.
With my team.
We have a team meeting every day, youknow, and, uh, my door is open and, and
they have any problem in the office.
I tell 'em to come to me.
I don't want 'em fighting.
(35:51):
And I go, if you're fighting whenI'm in the office, you come to me.
I even have a form for, it'scalled the experience transformer.
What happened?
Why did it occur?
What's your part in it?
Number three part in it.
Yeah.
Four is what are you gonna do?
So that will never happen again.
So they don't wanna come to me becausethey're gonna have to become Okay.
The solution gonna become proactive.
(36:11):
So they are not sitting in,and you'll like this one.
Reagan.
They're not sitting in thevictim's chair, so, okay.
You can use that too.
Yeah.
Regan Robertson (36:20):
Can you imagine a future if dentistry was looked
at as a hospitality business?
I think that that iswhere the future is going.
I think that especially with all ofthe troubles with insurance right
now, the state of the world, just ai,all of the pieces together, I, I, I.
(36:41):
Full disclosure listeners, I havenot read this book yet, and you know,
it is literally in my hands and Icannot wait to devour this book.
Uh, it feels to me Dr. Sonic, like thishelps paint a new paradigm and what the
future of dentistry can be if we lookat it as a hospitality business where we
are earning, uh, the right to dentistry.
(37:02):
And, um, you've got no, the
Dr. Michael Sonick (37:05):
book is endorsed.
The book is endorsed Undercover,and this is not gonna impress any
of you, most likely, isn't it?
It's endorsed by Danny Meyer.
Okay.
It's also been endorsed by, youknow, John Coy and Dennis Tarno
and a lot of famous dentists,but nobody knows famous dentists.
And you don't know Danny Meyer?
Anyone know Danny Meyer?
No.
Okay.
Um, Danny Meyer is the most successfulrestaurateur world I. He started a
(37:30):
restaurant called Union Square Cafe.
Same year I opened my practice and thenhe opened up Gramercy Tavern in Manhattan.
My favorite restaurant, 11 MadisonPort Park, which was the number one
restaurant in world for two years.
Regan Robertson (37:42):
Oh, you're kidding.
I know who you're talking about.
Dr. Michael Sonick (37:45):
Yeah.
And he's famous.
Now here's how you'll know him.
Shake Shack.
So he, he's, oh yeah.
And, um, you know, he's now abillionaire because of Shake Shack,
not because of his restaurants, andhe was successful in his restaurants.
Um, you know, maybe dentists successful,but now he's like real successful.
Um, and he's the guythat everybody goes to.
He wrote a book called Setting the Table.
(38:05):
Yes.
One of his mentees is Will Guera,who took over 11 Madison Park.
He wrote Unreasonable.
So those FE folks are people that.
I've endorsed the book andthat's where I come from.
Bobby Stuckey, who justgot the James Beard Award.
You know him do I Stuckey Holder.
I'm a
Regan Robertson (38:22):
huge Wil Guera fan, so that's why I'm on the edge of dicey Right.
Connection was made.
Yeah.
I figured it out and went Oh, Iknow who you're talking about.
Yeah.
Dr. Michael Sonick (38:29):
Yeah.
I just sent the book toWil Guera, uh, last week.
And, um, the, uh, Bobby Stuckey, whois the saer at, was the SAE at, um.
French Laundry, which is one of thetop restaurants out in California.
He has a restaurant in Nebraskathat was just as the number one
restaurant in the United States.
Got the James Beard Award andI know him very well 'cause
(38:50):
my daughter went to Boulder.
I used to eat there and he also gave mean endorsement and he talks about, I.
You know, we're just servinga really good plate of food.
He goes, what, you know, Dr. Sonic does,and what doctors do is, is they're doing
something that has to be, that may thatplace an implant in a 22-year-old that's
gonna have to last another 60 years.
He goes, that's something that is,takes have to be taken very seriously.
(39:11):
If you can do that with hospihospitality, that's phenomenon.
And I, I, I mentioned earliermy, my, uh, this podcast that.
The term hospitality thatcame from Bobby Stuckey.
That's what his, that's his term.
'cause he looks himselfand he loves serving food.
I mean, here's a guy thatdoesn't have to anymore.
He's got his own jet, but he's on thefloor serving food, putting down glasses,
pouring wine, making our sugars coffee.
(39:33):
And he does a, he has a wholeunique process for giving
you a great experience there.
It's amazing what he does.
Dr. Chad Johnson (39:39):
So Mike, this gives people an intro to you.
Are you, I'm, I'm just curious, areyou still doing any lecturing at
NYU or do you like guest lectureonce or a semester, occasionally.
Like what's that look like for you?
Right now
Dr. Michael Sonick (39:52):
I lecture at least once a week somewhere.
I give probably about40, 50 lectures a year.
Dr. Chad Johnson (39:56):
Yes.
Dr. Michael Sonick (39:57):
Um, I lecture at NYU.
Um, if you go to my website, whichis my name, michael sonic.com,
Dr. Chad Johnson (40:02):
with a K on the N of Sonic, just to make sure people know.
Dr. Michael Sonick (40:06):
You'll see all, all the programs that I do.
I, I lecture for MBE Institute,the Implant Institute.
Uh, I do private courses.
I just did a two day course in softtissue with Shanker ear, well known
prosthodontist in Jersey this weekend.
Um, I lecture at various meetings.
The Academy of Boston Integration,the American Academy Implant
Dentistry, American c Periodontology.
(40:26):
And I do a lot of, um, you know, webinars.
I work for Glidewell, allthe, all the companies.
You will pull me inand, and do some things.
And, um, for this lecture here, youknow, I come in and, you know, I
I, I do, I do a lot of study clubs,you know, so I probably lecture
once a week somewhere, you know, Igo all, I go all over the country.
(40:47):
Yeah.
And the world actually.
I'll be in Brazil this year,Taiwan, later this year.
You know, I've done, I usedto do a lot more before COVID,
you know, not so, not so much.
And I'll probably createa series of programs.
Uh, I have a series of programs onlinetoo, that you can just, you can buy
the videos that for 4 99, and you canget, uh, f you know, 10 lectures with
a whole workbook on how to, on howto introduce this into your practice.
(41:11):
So if you wanna introducethis into your practice.
Um, buy the book.
Read the book.
At the end of every chapter, thereare three pages of questions to
ask yourself about the concepts.
A little reflection yourself, an analysis,like, what kind of order do I have?
Do I give a wow experience?
Do I do showtime?
Am I talking about myself?
Am I into myself?
You know, what about insurance?
You know, all the, all How do you hire?
I have a whole thing on hiring fire.
I have a pheno.
(41:31):
I haven't, I have had zero turnoverwith 25 employees in over a year,
which is, which I'm very proud of.
That's like a great statistic,um, because that's hard.
Because you have to rehire every day.
Yeah.
And um, I also have, um, as I mentioned,YouTube, every, every Wednesday I put out
a new YouTube video there on at my, on theYouTube channel, which is Michael Sonic,
(41:52):
and that, that links to an Instagram.
You can find me there.
So I do, I'm
Dr. Chad Johnson (41:55):
really liking those.
Thanks for doing those.
Dr. Michael Sonick (41:57):
Thanks.
And then I also do the courses andI can come in and do do in-house
training and things like that.
So I have a whole bunch of things I do.
Very cool.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (42:05):
Why do you care so much about people?
Where does that come from in you?
Dr. Michael Sonick (42:09):
I don't know.
I don't know.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn: That's not a fair answer. (42:11):
undefined
Come on.
Dr. Michael Sonick (42:13):
What do I know?
It?
Because, because it's the onlyway that you become spiritual
and get out of yourself.
Because if you're just thinking aboutyourself, it's a miserable life.
Okay?
So if, if I'm, if I'm in a bad mood,I'll give you the four part things that
I do if something bothers me, okay?
And by the way, something bothersme five or six times a day, okay?
Every day.
(42:34):
There's always something and something,something can be very small, right?
It's like, oh, that personjust doesn't get it.
I've spent so muchtime, they don't get it.
Or, I missed that bus or whatever.
Or I'm five pounds too heavy.
I shouldn't have eaten that donut,but what, whatever it is, my
daughter doesn't appreciate me.
Something every day is gonna bother me.
And so what do I do?
(42:54):
I just acknowledge it immediatelyand um, then I sort get into a place
where like, okay, let's remove this,you know, some sort of spiritual
spot, talk to somebody about it.
I go, they're gonna turn to me.
Usually My wife is great for this.
I'm very happily married.
My wife will just turn to me,you know, my wife Chad, my wife
will just turn to me and says.
You're being a baby.
I go, yeah, you're right.
And then I immediately, and this is thetrue gift, I find somebody else to help.
(43:17):
So by helping others, I getcompletely outta myself.
So the true gift, 'cause every day Iwalk into my office and I have, I've
been doing this ritual for 40 years.
I walk into my office and Isay to myself, it's Showtime.
Let me be the gift today.
It's a little ritual that I perform.
I open a door and I make believe I'mwalking onto a Broadway stage at Disney.
(43:37):
And it's the show?
Yes.
And it's the show.
Uh, I the back door's unlocked.
And that's, and when I open up thatdoor, there's, my team is sitting at for
a morning meeting and we start with themorning meeting and I think about that.
And at the end of that morning meeting,we always say, Showtime, let's go.
And whole team.
We, we do a dad joke.
We read a stupid joke.
And then we have a spiritual, wehave, we have like 15 books, spiritual
(43:58):
books, dad jokes, stupid things.
We read a stupid joke, which isreally dumb, like, I'll tell you one.
Uh, what is, um,Beethoven's favorite fruit?
Nah, nah, nah.
So it, okay, so that sounds,you know, they're really dumb.
So that was our joke this week.
And then we go, we go,we, we go out there.
So by getting out of myself, it'svery selfish by helping others.
(44:21):
It's the selfish thing, mostselfish thing I could do because
I feel better and it always works.
And when I have, I have a friendthat's going through a divorce
right now, and he hates his ex-wife.
He hates his ex-wife.
I go, it's killing you.
I go, she did this, shedid this, she did this.
I go, okay, so.
Well let it go, man.
Pray for her.
Help her.
(44:42):
It's gonna, it is gonna come back.
He won't get that for a few years.
He will eventually, butI know he'll get there.
But once he gets to that spot,and she's done some very painful
things for her and she's wrong.
But he suffered 'cause she's wrong.
Yeah.
You don't have to, things aregonna, people are gonna do
things that are suffering.
You look at the news, it's, youknow, it's, it is just all negative
and, and it is negative becausewe are attracted to negativity.
(45:03):
Yeah.
And the reason we're attractedto negativity is because it's,
it's a survival instinct.
You know, we have to look for danger.
Sure.
You know, and so all daylong, boom, boom, boom.
So positivity wins.
That's, that's why.
So I guess I do have areason why I do it, Maggie.
Yeah.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (45:17):
You
Dr. Michael Sonick (45:17):
do.
Dr. Chad Johnson (45:18):
Well, Dr. Michael Sonic out of Connecticut.
I love you and I really appreciate you.
I was honored that you said yesto come on today, and it's been
way too long, but, you know,distance just requires it, I guess.
Uh, but I think about you often.
I want you to know that, and I'm sayingit publicly so everyone knows that.
Uh, I'm just trying to throw yousome love that I regularly think
(45:41):
of you and I'm just, uh, uh, sothrilled to have you on today.
We're glad to have you on and, and talkingabout not only your book, but how you've,
uh, helped mentor a whole generation,particularly, um, uh, upping your area and
with periodontology, with Implantology andaround the world as much as you travel.
So thank you so much for coming on today.
Dr. Michael Sonick (46:03):
It's been a pleasure and true honor.
Yeah.
I remember you as a young boy, rightout of, I think it was one of your
first courses outta dental school.
It
Dr. Chad Johnson (46:10):
was.
It was ridiculous.
Yeah.
So, yeah, that was fun.
Yeah.
Well, everyone, thanks for beinggreat listeners on Everyday Practices
Dental podcast today with Reagan, Dr.
Maggie, Dr. Michael, and myself.
Regan Robertson (46:25):
Thanks everyone.
Dr. Chad Johnson (46:26):
That's it, man.
Welcome to Everyday Practices Dental Podcast.
This is your host, Dr. Chad Johnson,along with my other co-host.
Uh, Reagan, Robertson and my otherother host, uh, Dr. Maggie Augustine.
So today we have a special guest.
Dr. Michael Sonic is a board certifiedperiodontist and implant surgeon based
(00:20):
out of Fairfield, Connecticut, who trainedme in dental implants 20 years ago.
He has over 35 years experience.
He's not only renowned forhis patient-centered in.
Interdisciplinary approach to treatment,but also for the way that he shares
that philosophy with the world.
I found him recently on YouTube andwas watching some of his, uh, stuff on
(00:41):
Facebook, and it inspired me to havehim on the podcast through his YouTube
channel and growing social media presence.
Dr. Sonic offers a rare look inside whatit means to build a practice on empathy,
aesthetics, and education, whetherit's guiding a full arch transformation
or sharing insights on treating the.
Person, not just the teeth.
(01:02):
His message is clear.
Dentistry is about connection.
So let's welcome to the show with Dr.
Michael Sonic.
Mike, how you doing?
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:10):
Good.
It is good.
Thank you, Chad.
Good to see you again.
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:13):
Yes,
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:13):
look the same as you did 20 years ago,
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:16):
just with a few more grays and you look amazing.
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:18):
Well, thank you.
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:19):
Yeah,
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:20):
I feel good.
I'm doing what I love to do.
Dr. Chad Johnson (01:22):
So what keeps you young?
I mean like what's keeping you healthy?
I.
Dr. Michael Sonick (01:26):
Um, physically, mentally, spiritually, it's, it's, it
is the whole package, you know, andit is the way I treat my patients.
It's really connecting with human beingsand just sort of being there for them.
So I do a lot of things tostay healthy, you know, diet.
Well, there are four things.
There are four pillars, uh, is diet,exercise, sleep, and mindfulness.
And of course then you could addon a few other things to that.
(01:47):
One is having a passionfor doing what you love.
And I'm lucky as you are.
We all are to do what we love to doand connecting with other people.
It's all about human connectivity.
So my message about practicing dentistryby human connection, that that's
really important no matter who youlisten to about longevity or health.
You know, you look at the blue zones andthe people who live in those parts of
(02:07):
the world, which I'm not sure if that'strue or not, but it seems to be true.
You know, when you're living ina community, and I actually live
in my community, I practiced200 yards from my high school.
So I get to see the peopleI went to high school with.
So I'm instilled in my,my, my, my, my natural hat.
Habitat and I've gotten too far, and it'ssort, it's sort of really, really nice.
So I think all those thingsare really, really important.
(02:28):
We're, and
Dr. Chad Johnson (02:30):
share with our audience and, and our co-host here.
Tell us about your office.
Was it, wasn't it something like400 years old, the building and you
had it redone and stuff like that?
Tell me about it.
Dr. Michael Sonick (02:38):
Yeah, but I, I was in a small, small office and I actually,
when you came and trained with us mm-hmm.
It was relatively new.
Well, the office was, but the buildingis the building's 150 years old.
Uh, it was a doctor's office atone point, and when I bought it, I
bought it from an older periodontist.
He was in his early eighties.
It was all chopped up and uh,I got it in an old building in
(02:58):
historical Dexter of Fairfield.
Uh, if you, from the outside, it lookslike a beautiful home and you walk
inside, it's a very modern facility.
As you know, we have a teachingcenter on the second floor.
Got seven operatories.
It's, you know, we got a laboratorythere, we now have added a photo
studio and a videographer up there.
So we have a whole, wholebunch of things going.
We use it, I
Dr. Chad Johnson (03:17):
remember it being super clean.
You guys were, you know, obsessive as,as I try and be about, uh, cleanliness
and, and you know, sterility and.
Keeping things.
Not that though, that's gonna exciteanyone, but I just, you know, being
obsessive compulsive kind of type, Iwas, uh, super impressed with how you
kept offices clean in spite of the fact.
I've gone to a few officeswhere that's not the case.
(03:40):
You know, they have, they havegreat education, but it's like,
oh man, they're kind of lackingand actually keeping stuff clean.
So, yeah.
Dr. Michael Sonick: Yeah, we're fastidious. (03:47):
undefined
It's, it's a big part of mymessage, uh, because people see.
Now I talk about, you know, the three,the triad of, of running a good practice.
You have to do good dentistry, right?
Mm-hmm.
But people don't really seeme 'cause I'm a good dentist.
I am a good dentist, butpeople really don't know.
I mean, they can't tell.
I mean, if I'm going bone back andif there's bone loss down to the
(04:08):
third thread, if the tooth is stillthere or whatever, um, also you
have to have great service, but youalso have to have nice day core.
So day decor is a big partof how we run our practice.
I happen to love nice day core.
Everywhere I go, I, I look for it.
I'll walk out of a restaurant ifit doesn't feel good, you know,
without even knowing anythingabout the food, I just leave.
And actually, I was in Chicagoonce with my son and, uh, we were
(04:30):
there, this was about 15 years ago,and we didn't know where to eat.
And we walked in, we're looking fora place, we walked in one restaurant,
I opened the door, I got into thevestibule, and I turned around.
He goes, what are you doing?
But someone was like.
19 at the time.
I go, you don't get that feel.
He goes, no, I go the placesI can't, I can't eat here.
He goes, how do you know that?
I go, I just know.
And people do know that, you know, and Ihave some stories in my book about that,
(04:51):
how people leave certain places becauseof, you know, what the someone looks like.
'cause people look at everything.
Now you're looking, you're, Imean, you're a prestigious guy.
Your hair's neat and clean.
You always were like that.
I mean that, that's the wayhe took care of yourself.
Not all dentists are, but um, canyou be great if you're a slob?
I don't know.
You know, you walk into a doctor's office,they get speckles of blood on their shoes.
(05:14):
Are you gonna, are you gonnalet them operate on you?
So, yeah, there's people.
It's, it is amazing.
You know, I have a number of storieslike that in the book, and I have
many stories from my life like thatwhere people just will walk out
because of what you, you look like.
So in our, in our office, I have,uh, on Mondays, I, I tell everybody
that their nails gotta look goodat the beginning of the week.
You know, I actually, I cutmy nails every Monday morning.
(05:35):
I've been doing that for 40 years.
The first thing I do when I get in theoffice on Monday after our, our staff
meeting, we, I cut my nails and go on.
Sometimes I forget, I go,oh God, they look terrible.
But nobody noticed except for me.
Dr. Chad Johnson (05:46):
So can I ask you a question from one guy to another?
Let's talk nails for a second.
This will be the first podcast showever about guy talking about nails.
Do you ever take a fileand bevel the sharp corner?
I.
Dr. Michael Sonick (05:58):
No, I, I don't, I, I,
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (06:00):
yeah.
Dad, talk about what kind of file you use.
Dr. Chad Johnson (06:02):
So, so I started using my wife's, uh, you know,
file that wears o out over time.
And I was like, you know what?
I, so I went to the hardware storeand I got like a, um, a metal.
Uh, file.
And so I use a meta file 'causeI was like, I'm, this one's
gonna last the rest of my life.
And somehow I've told Maggie this, soshe's going to help share my details.
(06:25):
But I love Beveling the corner sothat way they're not sharp, you know,
like when, when you're touching it.
So like.
Dr. Michael Sonick (06:31):
Can't be sharp.
I will cut them.
I was on.
Did you end up playing?
I was on the airplane the other day anda woman next to me started filing her
nails, which I, I didn't care for at thisNo thing is should do in public, you know.
No.
Right on the airplane.
No.
Right.
Dr. Chad Johnson (06:46):
I'll allow it outside if it's casual.
You know, like let's sayyou're in someone's backyard
and there for some reason feeluncomfortable, but not on a plane.
Come on.
Alright, so now before I let anyonejump into it, because I know Reagan
is chomping at the bit, but Iam just, uh, super excited about
having you on and talking with ya.
Is, uh, tell me how did you endup deciding to write this book
(07:08):
and how's it been received?
Like, tell me about the book.
I.
Dr. Michael Sonick (07:12):
Yeah, I mean, I've been, the, the book,
the book sort of wrote itself.
I've been, I've been practicing likethe book since I started in practice.
Mm-hmm.
And when I, when I work, I startedmy, I started practicing, well,
I've had probably 20 jobs before Iopened my own pri private practice.
And I opened up a, a white box.
It was 600 square feet.
I had no patience.
I was a sixth period,honest in a town of 65,000.
(07:35):
So it was already, there was not a needfor another periodontist at that time.
And so when I opened up my office,I really wanted to make it perfect
and so I create, I crafted thatway and I worked in the mall to try
to make enough money so I can openup my new practice because, um, I.
(07:55):
Because I didn't wanna, I,I didn't wanna practice in
another office in my own state.
So I worked in two different states.
My office is in Connecticut, but I workedin a mall in New York, New York, in the
Galleria and White Plains and in Holyoke.
In Ingleside, up in Massachusetts.
I drove 700 miles a week, you know,worked for six days a week just to
generate enough cash flow so I canopen up my practice at that time.
(08:15):
Wow.
When I opened it up, I wanted tomake it really boutiquey and very
nice, and we didn't take insurance.
I never took insurance andmy, my growth was slow.
My first year in practice,I produced 35,000 and my
overhead was about a hundred.
So I had $400,000 in debt this 1985.
So it wasn't, everyone thinks likeI'm an overnight success, but it
took me a long time to get there.
(08:36):
I worked really hard and um, so all theprinciples that I built the practice
with, I sort of put into the book.
And when I was in the mallworking in the mall, I used to.
Bring in my own stuff.
I, I bring in cassette players.
This was before streaming music, and I'dgive, I'd have a Walkman and I'd have my
patients that I would give them a choiceof 20 different cd uh, cassette tapes.
(08:57):
I'd have Willie Nelson,I'd have the Beatles.
I'd have some jazz, youknow, I, I, classical music,
Brahms, whatever they like.
I would give them music.
I'd run in, I'd run in.
Eyeglasses that were dark, sothey would be dark in and out.
I brought in like a little, littleblankets for them, and because
the mall was sort of disgusting,I carried my own artwork in and
hung it while I was working there.
And the all mall was so badthat my, my, my friend who was
(09:20):
working there, Jeff Shapiro, wasa very busy practice in New York.
Jeff Shapiro and I, we wentin on a weekend and we got
all the dental assistant.
We paid them when our boss was outtatown and we painted the whole office.
So we wanted to make it look nice.
And that's how I sort of started.
So during COVID, I've been talkingabout this book, book and I've been
lecturing for 40 years about, youknow, clinical dentistry, but I've
(09:41):
always wove a little bit of the.
Clinical practice part in, 'causeI think that's equally, if not more
important, is how we connect with humans.
And so when COVID came around,I go, uhoh, I got nothing to do.
I better, I better even saywhen the book coming out.
And a good friend of mine, Bob Levine, awell-known period from Philadelphia, kept
on saying, I'm talking about your book.
He goes, when's it coming out?
And I hadn't written yet.
So during COVID, I, I wrote it.
(10:02):
That took me about a year to write it.
I got on, I got online every day.
I talked it through.
I had people record me and Ispent a long time doing it.
And then when COVID wasover, I renovated my office.
We cleaned it all up, we wrote,rewrote all our protocols,
and I had the book come out.
And then when we hit the ground running,when they opened up the door, and we
did a lot of cool things during COVIDto make it really customer centric.
(10:25):
Matter of fact, I mean, our office was.
Oh, you think our office was clean then?
We were over the top of COVID.
So a lot of people came to ourpractice, say we're the only place
that they would go post COVID becausethey didn't trust anybody else.
And you know, for COVID, as youremember, I'd be walking in the woods,
you know, in the middle of nowhere andI'd see someone I knew and they'd jump
behind a tree to get away from me.
(10:45):
It was, oh yeah.
You know?
And so I learned a lot during,during that period of time.
And then it finally came out and so thenI had a, now that the book is out, it's
pretty well received, we've sold, um.
I have over 3000 copies out, whichis not bad, uh, for a boutique book.
Right.
You know, we have the, we have their videoseries out on YouTube, and I give one
(11:06):
keynote a week, um, one one day a week.
I'm lecturing on this topicsomewhere, you know, like, this
is my second podcast this week.
I gave a, a two day program last week.
So it, it, it is.
Getting traction, and I'm tryingto, my moonshot is to change
the way healthcare is delivered.
Um, and that, and that's a big moonshot,but I wanna get this book into medical and
dental schools and every healthcare, uh,every healthcare facility in the country.
(11:30):
And because we were talked a littleearlier in the age of AI and human.
Misinformation or disinformation.
And what we don't knowwhat's true, what's not true.
We always do know what is truein terms of a human connection.
That's something we feel.
Mm-hmm.
And people really, really need that.
They're starved for it.
And so our office, you know, we'rein the northeast where people, you
(11:52):
know, sometimes aren't, you don'tthink it's their friendliest, I don't
think Connecticut is the friendlieststate, but if you come into our office.
You know, it is like people arelaughing, they're having a good time.
It's, it really, they're greetedas friends by first name.
And we do a lot of things to makethat to, to make that happen.
And I had a friend of mine who'sa neurolinguistic programming
coach, and that's, that's sort ofthe, the way that we all interact.
(12:12):
By the way we look at each other, we,the way we, we, we speak the tone of our
voice, how we, how we move our hands.
There's that human interconnection.
We even get on Zoom a little bit.
I can see as I'm looking at some of youhere, we're starting to get that feeling.
He came to my office one day and spentthe day with me, and he says to me, he
says, this is before I wrote the book.
He goes, you know, you'rereally good at what you do, but
(12:33):
you're unconsciously competent.
Meaning that I'm good at it, butI don't know why I'm doing it.
I was a natural at doing it, butI couldn't teach anybody else.
So when I wrote the book, I said,I. I had a lookout and I had to
break down everything I did, justlike I do when I teach implants.
Like everything is a system.
So I have a system forbeing a good hospitality.
You know, someone who runs a reallygood, you know, hospitable practice and
(12:56):
is a, there, there's a technique for it.
And, and the great restaurants andthe great places like the Four Seasons
Hotel, when you go in there almost,they're all pretty much dissimilar.
They have, they, they have acertain way of reading you.
That's nice.
Most of the time, you know, it depends.
That they have in there.
Sometimes it's a little bitrobotic, the way people look at
you, you know, and talk to you.
But you gotta be sort of natural.
(13:16):
And that all really comes downto how you hire and who you
hire, which is a huge part.
So the most important part of my patientexperience, of course, is my cake.
It's, it's, it's, it's, mm-hmm.
Yeah.
You know, so.
Go ahead.
Regan Robertson (13:32):
What is fascinating, uh, about all of this is it, it, I would
call you a venture to call you a unicorn.
Um, in dentistry in particular,there are doctors that I have met
similar to you, but what you'redescribing from my lens is the brand
experience, the actual experience from.
Before they ever met you to, youknow, ever even know you exist to,
(13:53):
uh, to after they walk out the door.
And then what follows up for that.
And I'm genuinely curious because ofcourse there is natural, intuitive
nature to be an active listenerand to care about the person before
they're even sitting in your chair.
What is, uh, something that you couldshare, like a story from a time in your
life where you had an experience that justblew your mind, because there had to have
(14:16):
been some seed that was planted at somepoint that said, wow, this, I want to be
able to replicate this feeling, like thisvibe for my patients and for my practice.
Dr. Michael Sonick (14:31):
I, I don't have an experience that shaped my journey.
You know, they started, but I was,I, my father had a furniture store.
I delivered furniture.
I had customer experiences there.
I just always had it.
I was a lifeguard, so I used to takecare of people when they get injured.
Uh, I was a waiter, okay.
For many years I was a bartender,so I was a cocktail piano player.
(14:51):
I mean, I did all those type of thingswith, with service my whole career.
But I've had plenty of experiencesthat have been amazing.
And once you're open to thoseexperiences out there and you're
giving back from a place ofabundance, they just magically appear.
You know?
And, um, I mean, I hadone, I, I could share one.
(15:12):
This is this, this didn't shape me.
I was already shaped at this point.
But I always like to stay in nice hotelsand I'll stay at a Ritz or Four Seasons.
Oftentimes I don't have to pay for 'embecause they're being paid for for me.
But I was once staying at the um.
Um, what I thought was the FourSeasons Hotel in Atlanta, and
I know Atlanta really well.
I went to Emory and I go thereevery year and I went out for lunch.
(15:33):
I came back to the hotel and I went up tothe floor and I, I was on the eighth floor
and I used my room key as not working.
And um, I. You know, I'm a, you know,I'm a, I'm a little upset because
I'm in a Four Seasons hotel room.
Key's not working.
So I have a little bit of an attitude,but I'm trying not to show it.
So I walked to the front desk, I go,you know, uh, my room key's not working.
And the guy picks up theroom key and he looks at it.
(15:54):
He goes, um, that's 'cause thisis for the Four Seasons Hotel
and you're staying at the Ritz.
So, um, I said, oh.
So they looked alike.
And uh, so he go, I go, where's that?
He goes, it's like downthe road, two miles.
They, I'll walk.
He goes, no, well letus take you down there.
He goes, we have a hotel car and let ustake you down to the, the Four Seasons.
(16:14):
So I was staying at theRitz in downtown Atlanta.
I. And they gimme their car to take me tothe four seasons where I'm not staying.
Now, I didn't take it becauseI felt funny doing that.
Um, and I just took an Uber,so I, I could've stayed
either one of those hotels.
So for the last nine years, everytime I go to Atlanta, which is
about three or four times a year, Ialways stayed in the Four Seasons.
Downtown Ritz Carlton downtownbecause of that experience.
(16:37):
Hmm.
I like both hotels, but, butthat one, and it's, it's amazing.
Now who does that?
I mean, who does that?
I'm giving you a gift and, and even thoughit's not in my best interest and you
know, I have an expression, I go, do youknow why they call it the right thing?
'cause it's the right thing.
So when people come to me foradvice, I go, just do what's right.
I don't care what they're saying.
You know, I see it a lot in, in youngcouples that get married, they go,
(17:00):
well, I'd like you, but you know, myspouse says I can't and I shouldn't.
I go, but isn't theright thing to do this?
You always have to make a standfor doing it the right thing.
And if you're in the servicebusiness, you always wanna do the
right thing for the people you serve.
And I think it's a privilege,true privilege to do what we do.
I mean, especially people allow, peoplepay us thousands of dollars to, for them,
for us to open their mouths and cut them.
(17:21):
Okay.
And then they say, thank you.
It's a, it's a, it's a really, the wholedynamic of the dental experience, the
whole customer's journey is bizarre.
And if you can make it seem whenthey write to you, thank you so
much for giving me that experience.
Thank you so much.
I've never had a dental,dental experience.
I just treated dentist thisweek and he, he called me up,
he goes, and he's 75 years old.
(17:43):
He goes in all my years, and thisis the guy I used to work with.
He goes, in all my years Ihave never had such a painless.
Dental or medical experience.
Wow.
And the first time I met him andho and I, he didn't like me at all.
30 years ago, he couldn't stand me'cause he thought I was an arrogant
jerk, you know, because, you know,my reputation had preceded me.
But as you're my patient, I'm alwaysgonna be very kind for you there.
(18:03):
But I've had so many of thoseexperiences like that they're
al, they're always pretty cool.
I really what you give out there isyou usually get back, you know, and a
lot of, if you lead by, you know, ifyou lead by what can you do for me?
You're never gonna be successful.
So I have a question, you know, for youall, can you be successful If you are not
(18:24):
in an abundance mindset, can you be in thescarcity mindset and still be successful?
You know, put yourself first, so, mm-hmm.
I dunno,
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (18:33):
plenty of people are.
Dr. Michael Sonick (18:35):
Yeah.
Most people are something in a
Dr. Maggie Augustyn: scarcity mindset, Mick. (18:38):
undefined
Dr. Michael Sonick (18:39):
Yeah.
Most people in a scarcity mindset.
Yeah.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (18:41):
Yeah.
I think most people come from ascarcity mindset and they punch.
It's funny, I just left to Marco Poloabout this, uh, for our little group,
but it comes from a place of egoism.
Dr. Michael Sonick (18:54):
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn: And we feel so unworthy. (18:54):
undefined
That we will fight to the death tryingto prove that we are worth something.
And so we put on this armorpretending that we are everything,
that we are so tremendously arrogantand we will fight to the death.
Trying.
Why are you laughing, Chad?
Dr. Michael Sonick (19:16):
Because you're right.
Keep going.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (19:18):
Try
Dr. Michael Sonick (19:19):
we, we agree with you.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (19:20):
Trying to fight to the death that we are everything,
that we are better than you, right?
We are, we will take everythingfrom the people around us.
Uh, it's, it's a, it's,it's a power struggle.
It's a dominance thing, it'san ego thing and all of it.
Comes from the idea of scarcity,where if you just leaned back and
(19:44):
surrendered and looked at the beautyof the world, and because I am with
you, I talk about human connection.
I don't know if you've ever read the bookCompassion Ons, but, um, if, if you think
about human connection and compassion, um.
Think about what we can give toone another instead of what we are
(20:05):
there to take from one another.
All of a sudden, a whole new world opensup to you and you no longer have to prove
to someone looking at you, you're worth.
We all see what we are to oneanother, but there, but I would
say the majority of people, um.
Live from a scarcity mindset and theyfight to the death trying to prove
(20:29):
who they are and take from one anotherinstead of giving, if that makes sense.
Dr. Chad Johnson (20:36):
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Michael Sonick (20:38):
Yeah.
Yeah.
It, it, it does.
So here, here's, here's the opportunity.
If you're an abundance mindset, you're ata distinct advantage because most people
aren't there and there's an expressionthat there's no competition in a niche.
So if your niche is to practiceintegrity and to be an extremely giving
practitioner and to always be therefor your patient and not nickel and
(20:59):
dime 'em say, oh, you know, I alwayslook for experience that we, I always
look to give what I call patience.
We've named a lot of thingsthat we do in our practice.
One of 'em is the wow experience.
So I always look to givepeople a wow experience.
Every time someone is in my practice, Iwant them to leave with a wow experience.
Uh, today someone says, you know,uh, like on vacationing, as I
mentioned, you on Block Island,someone says, oh, I've been there.
(21:21):
You know, I like it there.
I said, oh, I have a list of, I have,I have a list of all the restaurants
and places to hike on Block Island.
And before I finish the sentence,my dental, uh, nurse is printed out
a list of three pages to hand them.
As they're walking out, you know, andthat was like you, did you expect to
get that at the periodontist office?
You know, or I always look for somethingto, to give, uh, people, I have a list
(21:42):
of all the top restaurants in areas.
I have 30 books in myoffice, multiple copies.
So someone says, I'mtrying to lose some weight.
Oh, have you read this book?
This is about diet.
You know, my neck hurts,you know, what about this?
And so I'll always, Ihave a book on back pain.
I have a book on.
I have a book.
I know almost everything.
Yeah.
So I'll always give it, I'll alwaysgive them a book and when I run out
of 'em, I order more, more of them.
(22:03):
So I always try to really improve, youknow, the quality of my patients' lives.
That's, that's my, our mission statement.
I wanna improve the qualityof my patients' lives.
Regan Robertson (22:12):
I have a question for you, because you mentioned that one of
the challenges of, of writing this bookwas really thinking carefully about
how you're able to deliver that wow.
Experience and putting it into.
To frameworks and tools that otherscan, can apply for themselves.
And it's kind of likedoing the right thing.
Uh, you know, when we look atlike crafting core values or key
(22:33):
characteristics and we say, dothe right thing, that can mean
different things to different people.
So leading them anddefining it is important.
Could you tell us about your process?
Of getting what was in your head outinto this book and like an example
that's in the book of a framework thatyou developed that you were able to walk
through that process of, okay, I have toreally break it down engineering style
(22:54):
and map out what it is that I can, youknow, that I do so I can teach others.
Dr. Michael Sonick (22:59):
I think a simple one is the initial examination.
So 90% of all dentists do theirexamination in a hygiene room, so
this is a big problem for dentists.
Patient call up and theysay, I want my teeth cleaned.
They go, well, we needto do an exam first.
Not only one is a cleaning.
I. So that's the big blockage, and theythink this can cleaning costs X dollars.
You even see people promotingthe practices, you know, 1 99
(23:22):
exam and cleaning an x-rays.
And so they get the patients in andit's, it's sort of like a loss leader,
but do they actually get to do all that?
So to enter our practice,it's an one hour examination.
And during that examinationprocess, we do, we do.
Four things.
So if you're a new patient in mypractice, I will tell them, I said,
oh, you're here today for your exam.
What we're gonna do is an examinationand then we're going to do a diagnosis.
(23:45):
And I said, the diagnosis that wehave for you is gonna be the same no
matter if I do it or anybody else.
Or Chad does it or Reagan does it, or Dr.
Maggie does it.
It's all gonna be the same diagnosis.
You either have periodontalthese or you don't.
Is it black and white?
I said, and then we're gonna giveyou some treatment options and
then we'll talk about treatment.
What most doctors do, and you know, andit's not just dentists, it's doctors, is
they look at their specialty and what theylike to do is go, oh, that's an O on X.
(24:09):
Okay, that's an, that's a IGN case.
So that, that's like whatever it is.
So that's, that's a LANAP case.
So when they go into what their, their,their procedures are, so most doctors
talk about patients as procedures.
I talked about dentistsas being pothole fillers.
We look at something to do if weget an insurance code to go down.
I wanna turn that on its head and Iwanna look at everybody as a human being.
(24:30):
And the way I do that is four parts.
We do an exam, we do a diagnosis,treatment plans, and treatment.
So I sort of made that up and that issomething else that's, that's with that
so that, that also people don't reallytalk about now what I just said to you.
Exam, diagnosis, treatment plans,and treatment we're, we taught
that in school as periodontistsas that's drilled into us.
Most periodontists don't think that way.
(24:50):
If they're like, let's do some implants,they just want to go to that, you know,
I don't care about the procedures.
So I, in my book, what I've done isI say, get away from the procedures
and get into the diagnosis.
Okay?
And once you get a diag, you haveto do a complete exam to do that.
You can't do that in three minutesin a hygiene room, so you need
to spend some time doing that.
It requires x-rays, models, and a bunchof other things that you all know about.
(25:12):
So I broke it down like that.
When I sit with that patient,then I'm gonna tell them, I
said, there's a system to this.
'cause patient's gonna say,I just want this fixed.
They go, hold on, lemmeget you your diagnosis.
Let me get you your treatment optionso that you can make the decision.
So then I give it to 'em.
I said, but before we make adecision, there's an order in
which we do your treatment.
And the first thing wedo is we have to get you.
(25:33):
We take care of pain.
And then I said, are you in any pain?
They go, no.
I go, then we don't have to do that.
So that's off the table.
We don't have to take care of your pain.
The only time I would treat someone ontheir initial visit is if they're in pain.
I wanna leave you relieve their pain.
The second thing I do is treat infection.
Caries, periodontal disease,endodonic problems, tumors, whatever.
Those things.
That's the second thing.
And the infection has to be treatedbefore I do the third thing, which
(25:55):
is functional rehabilitation.
That's implants, ortho, crown, and bridge.
That's all the stuff thatwe think about is dentistry.
And then I work with aesthetics,but the aesthetics is done ju which?
Functional rehabilitation.
I just want the front tooth fixed.
It can't if you have an infection'cause it's out of order.
And the last thing is maintenance.
So I give them these, thesetwo things, the protocols.
And the sequence of treatment.
(26:16):
The sequence of treatment is exam,diagnosis, treatment plans, and treatment.
Now, the treatment plansI break down into, I'm not
going to tell you what to do.
I'm gonna tell you what you cando, and then you make a decision.
And the first thing I always tella patient is, you can do nothing.
And once you tell a patient theycan do nothing, they immediately
take ownership because theysay, I don't wanna do nothing.
Yeah, but most peopledon't get that choice.
(26:38):
Most people, the doctor comes inand tells them, so I've also broken
down the three types of doctors.
There are, there's the paternal doctorthat tells a patient what to do and
that doesn't work too much anymore.
Then is the retail doctorlike these your options?
This is 4 99, this is 5 99.
You, this bone grafts 200, this one's 500.
You know this one's, and and theygo, well, I'll do the cheaper.
They don't know how to make a decision.
(26:59):
And then there's the doctorthat's collaborative.
And so I want every doctorto be a collaborative doctor,
but that requires education.
So I broke down that whole processof the exam, and I will, in the first
90 seconds of meeting a patient,if I can see his resistance, I say,
here's what we're gonna do today.
Today I'm gonna do an exam and diagnosis.
I said, I will do treatmentonly if you're in pain.
(27:19):
But I said, but I'll give you treatmentoptions and then you can own the decision
making process and I'll bring you toa level where we, you can understand
what we need we're doing so you canmake the best decisions for yourself.
And by doing that, Iget a 90% case except.
But I'm not giving them the treat.
I'm not telling them what to do.
I'm giving 'em options.
Mm-hmm.
I never give more than three options,and first option is to do nothing.
(27:40):
And second option wasto take out the tooth.
The the third option is to keep the tooth.
And then we could say, well, if wekeep the tooth, we could do endo,
we could do post and core this.
If we take out the tooth, wecould do a bridge, we could do
an implant, we do a flipper.
Or you could use hell of spacein your mouth, and if you have
a space in your mouth, this willhappen and this won't happen.
Or you could just leave it out.
So I give 'em a very logical sequence,which most doctors don't do because
they don't spend the time doing it.
(28:01):
'cause they don't have that conversation.
Mm-hmm.
So that conversation is very powerful andI break that down in my chapter on how
exactly to go ahead, ahead and do that.
Something else that I've also broken down.
Because people come in so fearful atthat when they walk into our office.
It is the most fearful thing that I alwayssay, that I'm like a divorce attorney.
I get to see people at their worstbefore I ask 'em to spend a lot of money.
(28:22):
And because, and they're vulnerable.
They're really scared.
Now I have five divorceattorneys as patients.
I use that line with them and they,they, they, they, they can relate to it.
Yeah.
Or attorneys are their bestpatients because they're so nice.
'cause they're really good atmaking people feel comfortable.
Yeah.
They just have great personalities.
You know, they're not litigators.
They're, some have to deal with, you know,family dynamic and when they're vulnerable
(28:43):
like that, what do I want to do?
We talked about fear before.
You know, you were talking about that too.
Dr. Maggie is basically, you weretalking about being a scarcity mindset.
The scarcity mindset is fearful.
Okay, you, when you lose your fear,you're not in scarcity mindset
because you know that you have thepower to do whatever you need to do.
You can take away everything from methat I could get it back again, because I
feel that I have the ability to do that.
I think you all feel the same way.
(29:04):
So when those patients come in tosee me, they're fearful as hell.
And I said to them, I said, you know,I, I congratulate them from walking in
the door, and then I immediately say attheir initial visit, I'm glad you're here.
You are in the right place.
That's a declarative sentence thatallows patients to say, okay, I
made the right decision being here.
Good.
I'm in the right place.
They have no idea.
Okay.
It's like I'm, you know, it's when you saysomething, you know, I'm a good athlete.
(29:26):
Oh, okay.
So you must be a good athlete.
You know, I'm good at this.
Okay.
Yeah.
Come on.
On our team.
So when I tell 'em in theright place, they feel good.
And then I tell 'em three things.
I never tell them about problems.
I only tell 'em about the solution.
If I mention the problem, Iimmediately link it with the solution.
So I do that, I do that linkage,and I always tell them before I
even tell 'em about the problem, Isay, there's three things that I'm
gonna, I'm gonna didn't do for you.
(29:47):
I'm gonna improve your function.
I'm gonna improve your health.
And if necessary, we'll improve thecosmetics because nobody doesn't want
to be healthy and nobody doesn't wannalook good and have good function.
All that is told within about90 seconds in some manner.
And I linked that all with a storyabout myself and I started to talk
the importance of storytelling becauseI relate to them as a human being.
I don't talk about ations in classtwo occlusions and carries, and
(30:11):
they don't know, you know, I don'tsay any of that kind of stuff.
You know, my, I, I did.
Did back in the day.
They don't care.
They just, they just wanna knowthat they're gonna get better.
It's just like when I meet my financialadvisor, I don't know what he's doing.
You know, I met yesterday, I met withmy, my, my, uh, my lawyer to, to set
up my estate planning and something.
I go, whatever.
(30:32):
Okay, that's fine.
Let's do that.
You know, I go, he, doyou have any questions?
I go, yeah, you'll answerand I'll walk outta here and
I won't remember damn thing.
Is this the right thing?
He goes, yeah, it's the right thing.
Okay, because I trust, you know, 'causeit basically comes down to trust.
It comes down to trust.
That was a long-winded answer to a no,
Dr. Chad Johnson (30:48):
Mike, let me say this.
I had, I met with my life insurance guy.
He really wanted to meet with me.
I didn't.
And so we sat down.
He was, he was late because he wasat the Mexican restaurant next to
the Buffalo Wild Wings for a while.
He finally then comes and meets with meand he says, uh, he says, well before you
leave, 'cause I said, I gotta get back.
Well before you leave, I have this book.
And he.
(31:09):
Bings brings out this binder and hesays, I want you to look through this.
Turn to section one.
He's got 'em, you know, labeledand look at section one.
Now you could, you do auniversal this and that.
And he starts talking about, you know,there's a gap between, you know, this.
And I'm like sitting there going,he's talking about stuff that he finds
interesting within his industry 'causehe's using, but I was just like.
I, I don't care.
(31:29):
And I don't, I don't knowwhat he's talking about, and
I, I actually don't care.
Like, and it reminds me alot of what you just said.
It's just like we have to, remi rememberthat when patients are sitting in the
chair, if we say, well, your classtwo furation is just like, they're
thinking, okay, so is that bad?
Or I, I don't know if I care.
Reagan, you've been lighting up your face.
Please tell me what you're thinking.
Regan Robertson (31:49):
Well, what Dr. Sonic you were just describing is,
I believe it's called attribute.
Priming, I think, I think that'sthe neurolinguistic phase for it.
And it is, it is.
Once I learned that particular,uh, it's not a trick.
It's just, it's just really agreat way to frame a conversation.
Uh, you can do it in, inall, I mean, it's great with.
(32:09):
Parenting.
It's great with clients.
It's great with patients.
It's phenomenal becauseit helps set the stage.
So when you say, you know, you werein the right place, it plants that
in the patient's mind and it helpsgive them that boost of confidence.
So I was, it's called
Dr. Chad Johnson (32:23):
Attribute What?
Regan Robertson (32:24):
Attribute?
Priming.
Dr. Chad Johnson (32:26):
Priming, priming.
Regan Robertson (32:27):
And I love it.
So you've set the stage and then I, Iguess I'm reflecting, I don't know that
I have a question for you, Dr. Sonic.
I'm just thrilled because to see youflip it over into the link, uh, so that
you can be relatable with them, you'retransferring that, that kind of hero's
journey onto the patient themselves andshowing them, you know, I care about you.
(32:47):
And you talked a lot about all of yourcustomer service experience, you know,
in, in the past that I think probably.
Helped maybe with this on, on how tocreate a, a really phenomenal experience.
Is this something that youdo with your team as well?
I'm just really curious.
Dr. Michael Sonick (33:07):
Of course it is.
You know, we have a, one of myteam members, uh, everybody in our
office, you know, dental assistant,administrative person, that's they
all, they all have another job.
So we have some in ouroffice administration.
She's, she's chief of customer service,chief of hospitality, so she is there.
That hospitality is not justfor patients, it's for the team.
(33:29):
So if you come to our office, Imean, every dime I'm in the office.
They, they have lunch, I buy them lunch,we do two or three celebrations a week.
We had, there's always, Ididn't know there was an IT day.
Okay.
There is an it day.
So we have cakes, we put thingsand we post all this kind of stuff.
We, we make, we makepeople feel really special.
We give 'em a one year thing andwe give 'em a five year thing.
And so yeah, I celebrate 'em.
(33:49):
I have to rehire my team every day.
'cause they're volunteers.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (33:53):
That's profound.
I have to rehire my team every day.
Dr. Michael Sonick (33:58):
Yeah,
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (33:59):
that's like recommitting in a marriage every day.
Dr. Michael Sonick (34:02):
Yeah.
Commitment's very big.
That's a, that's a wholeother co conversation.
I do that with my patients.
I make them commit tome at the first visit.
I go, I refuse to treat you unlessyou commit to keeping your teeth
clean for the rest of your lifeby getting your teeth clean every
three to six months, whatever it is.
I go, will you gimme that commitment?
And they go, I'm not sure Igo, then I'm not treating you.
So I make that commitment right there.
That's something I starteddoing about 10 years ago.
(34:25):
So we have, we have.
Hygiene practice.
I mean, we have three full-timehygienists, five days a week.
I mean, and, and most peoplesay, I hate their hygienist.
I love my hygienist.
They're a backbone of our practice.
And I tell 'em every day, I make sureI talk to my team members every day I
walk in, you know, I have a very quietguy that does all our instruments.
I walk in there, I go, I'mon vacation next week, Jason.
(34:46):
I go, I guess we won'thave a talk in a week.
Now he doesn't talk to anybody.
He's quiet.
He sits in the lab.
He loves it.
I mean, he just likes doing that.
And I just, I just make sure Iconnect with everybody and someone
goes through a different, I had oneof my patient, my, my team members
was going through a difficult time.
She was crying.
She goes, she's telling me what's wrong.
I go, okay.
I. Um, you know, I, I, she's the happiest,most, most joyful person in our office,
(35:09):
but she's having trouble with her childrenand she comes the next day, how you doing?
She goes, I'm still miserable.
I said, you know, something, used to bethe most joyful person in the office.
I said, now you're the most miserable.
And she looks at me.
She starts laughing, and then allof a sudden it broke their tension.
You know, another one of my assistantsI had had, had been to four funerals
in the last months, and I go four.
(35:30):
I go, supposed to come inthrees, you're up to four.
I go, what do you have?
Some sort of, we make lightof it and I connect with 'em.
I don't ignore that they'regoing through something and so
we can really talk about that.
Very, very open.
With my team.
We have a team meeting every day, youknow, and, uh, my door is open and, and
they have any problem in the office.
I tell 'em to come to me.
I don't want 'em fighting.
(35:51):
And I go, if you're fighting whenI'm in the office, you come to me.
I even have a form for, it'scalled the experience transformer.
What happened?
Why did it occur?
What's your part in it?
Number three part in it.
Yeah.
Four is what are you gonna do?
So that will never happen again.
So they don't wanna come to me becausethey're gonna have to become Okay.
The solution gonna become proactive.
(36:11):
So they are not sitting in,and you'll like this one.
Reagan.
They're not sitting in thevictim's chair, so, okay.
You can use that too.
Yeah.
Regan Robertson (36:20):
Can you imagine a future if dentistry was looked
at as a hospitality business?
I think that that iswhere the future is going.
I think that especially with all ofthe troubles with insurance right
now, the state of the world, just ai,all of the pieces together, I, I, I.
(36:41):
Full disclosure listeners, I havenot read this book yet, and you know,
it is literally in my hands and Icannot wait to devour this book.
Uh, it feels to me Dr. Sonic, like thishelps paint a new paradigm and what the
future of dentistry can be if we lookat it as a hospitality business where we
are earning, uh, the right to dentistry.
(37:02):
And, um, you've got no, the
Dr. Michael Sonick (37:05):
book is endorsed.
The book is endorsed Undercover,and this is not gonna impress any
of you, most likely, isn't it?
It's endorsed by Danny Meyer.
Okay.
It's also been endorsed by, youknow, John Coy and Dennis Tarno
and a lot of famous dentists,but nobody knows famous dentists.
And you don't know Danny Meyer?
Anyone know Danny Meyer?
No.
Okay.
Um, Danny Meyer is the most successfulrestaurateur world I. He started a
(37:30):
restaurant called Union Square Cafe.
Same year I opened my practice and thenhe opened up Gramercy Tavern in Manhattan.
My favorite restaurant, 11 MadisonPort Park, which was the number one
restaurant in world for two years.
Regan Robertson (37:42):
Oh, you're kidding.
I know who you're talking about.
Dr. Michael Sonick (37:45):
Yeah.
And he's famous.
Now here's how you'll know him.
Shake Shack.
So he, he's, oh yeah.
And, um, you know, he's now abillionaire because of Shake Shack,
not because of his restaurants, andhe was successful in his restaurants.
Um, you know, maybe dentists successful,but now he's like real successful.
Um, and he's the guythat everybody goes to.
He wrote a book called Setting the Table.
(38:05):
Yes.
One of his mentees is Will Guera,who took over 11 Madison Park.
He wrote Unreasonable.
So those FE folks are people that.
I've endorsed the book andthat's where I come from.
Bobby Stuckey, who justgot the James Beard Award.
You know him do I Stuckey Holder.
I'm a
Regan Robertson (38:22):
huge Wil Guera fan, so that's why I'm on the edge of dicey Right.
Connection was made.
Yeah.
I figured it out and went Oh, Iknow who you're talking about.
Yeah.
Dr. Michael Sonick (38:29):
Yeah.
I just sent the book toWil Guera, uh, last week.
And, um, the, uh, Bobby Stuckey, whois the saer at, was the SAE at, um.
French Laundry, which is one of thetop restaurants out in California.
He has a restaurant in Nebraskathat was just as the number one
restaurant in the United States.
Got the James Beard Award andI know him very well 'cause
(38:50):
my daughter went to Boulder.
I used to eat there and he also gave mean endorsement and he talks about, I.
You know, we're just servinga really good plate of food.
He goes, what, you know, Dr. Sonic does,and what doctors do is, is they're doing
something that has to be, that may thatplace an implant in a 22-year-old that's
gonna have to last another 60 years.
He goes, that's something that is,takes have to be taken very seriously.
(39:11):
If you can do that with hospihospitality, that's phenomenon.
And I, I, I mentioned earliermy, my, uh, this podcast that.
The term hospitality thatcame from Bobby Stuckey.
That's what his, that's his term.
'cause he looks himselfand he loves serving food.
I mean, here's a guy thatdoesn't have to anymore.
He's got his own jet, but he's on thefloor serving food, putting down glasses,
pouring wine, making our sugars coffee.
(39:33):
And he does a, he has a wholeunique process for giving
you a great experience there.
It's amazing what he does.
Dr. Chad Johnson (39:39):
So Mike, this gives people an intro to you.
Are you, I'm, I'm just curious, areyou still doing any lecturing at
NYU or do you like guest lectureonce or a semester, occasionally.
Like what's that look like for you?
Right now
Dr. Michael Sonick (39:52):
I lecture at least once a week somewhere.
I give probably about40, 50 lectures a year.
Dr. Chad Johnson (39:56):
Yes.
Dr. Michael Sonick (39:57):
Um, I lecture at NYU.
Um, if you go to my website, whichis my name, michael sonic.com,
Dr. Chad Johnson (40:02):
with a K on the N of Sonic, just to make sure people know.
Dr. Michael Sonick (40:06):
You'll see all, all the programs that I do.
I, I lecture for MBE Institute,the Implant Institute.
Uh, I do private courses.
I just did a two day course in softtissue with Shanker ear, well known
prosthodontist in Jersey this weekend.
Um, I lecture at various meetings.
The Academy of Boston Integration,the American Academy Implant
Dentistry, American c Periodontology.
(40:26):
And I do a lot of, um, you know, webinars.
I work for Glidewell, allthe, all the companies.
You will pull me inand, and do some things.
And, um, for this lecture here, youknow, I come in and, you know, I
I, I do, I do a lot of study clubs,you know, so I probably lecture
once a week somewhere, you know, Igo all, I go all over the country.
(40:47):
Yeah.
And the world actually.
I'll be in Brazil this year,Taiwan, later this year.
You know, I've done, I usedto do a lot more before COVID,
you know, not so, not so much.
And I'll probably createa series of programs.
Uh, I have a series of programs onlinetoo, that you can just, you can buy
the videos that for 4 99, and you canget, uh, f you know, 10 lectures with
a whole workbook on how to, on howto introduce this into your practice.
(41:11):
So if you wanna introducethis into your practice.
Um, buy the book.
Read the book.
At the end of every chapter, thereare three pages of questions to
ask yourself about the concepts.
A little reflection yourself, an analysis,like, what kind of order do I have?
Do I give a wow experience?
Do I do showtime?
Am I talking about myself?
Am I into myself?
You know, what about insurance?
You know, all the, all How do you hire?
I have a whole thing on hiring fire.
I have a pheno.
(41:31):
I haven't, I have had zero turnoverwith 25 employees in over a year,
which is, which I'm very proud of.
That's like a great statistic,um, because that's hard.
Because you have to rehire every day.
Yeah.
And um, I also have, um, as I mentioned,YouTube, every, every Wednesday I put out
a new YouTube video there on at my, on theYouTube channel, which is Michael Sonic,
(41:52):
and that, that links to an Instagram.
You can find me there.
So I do, I'm
Dr. Chad Johnson (41:55):
really liking those.
Thanks for doing those.
Dr. Michael Sonick (41:57):
Thanks.
And then I also do the courses andI can come in and do do in-house
training and things like that.
So I have a whole bunch of things I do.
Very cool.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (42:05):
Why do you care so much about people?
Where does that come from in you?
Dr. Michael Sonick (42:09):
I don't know.
I don't know.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn: That's not a fair answer. (42:11):
undefined
Come on.
Dr. Michael Sonick (42:13):
What do I know?
It?
Because, because it's the onlyway that you become spiritual
and get out of yourself.
Because if you're just thinking aboutyourself, it's a miserable life.
Okay?
So if, if I'm, if I'm in a bad mood,I'll give you the four part things that
I do if something bothers me, okay?
And by the way, something bothersme five or six times a day, okay?
Every day.
(42:34):
There's always something and something,something can be very small, right?
It's like, oh, that personjust doesn't get it.
I've spent so muchtime, they don't get it.
Or, I missed that bus or whatever.
Or I'm five pounds too heavy.
I shouldn't have eaten that donut,but what, whatever it is, my
daughter doesn't appreciate me.
Something every day is gonna bother me.
And so what do I do?
(42:54):
I just acknowledge it immediatelyand um, then I sort get into a place
where like, okay, let's remove this,you know, some sort of spiritual
spot, talk to somebody about it.
I go, they're gonna turn to me.
Usually My wife is great for this.
I'm very happily married.
My wife will just turn to me,you know, my wife Chad, my wife
will just turn to me and says.
You're being a baby.
I go, yeah, you're right.
And then I immediately, and this is thetrue gift, I find somebody else to help.
(43:17):
So by helping others, I getcompletely outta myself.
So the true gift, 'cause every day Iwalk into my office and I have, I've
been doing this ritual for 40 years.
I walk into my office and Isay to myself, it's Showtime.
Let me be the gift today.
It's a little ritual that I perform.
I open a door and I make believe I'mwalking onto a Broadway stage at Disney.
(43:37):
And it's the show?
Yes.
And it's the show.
Uh, I the back door's unlocked.
And that's, and when I open up thatdoor, there's, my team is sitting at for
a morning meeting and we start with themorning meeting and I think about that.
And at the end of that morning meeting,we always say, Showtime, let's go.
And whole team.
We, we do a dad joke.
We read a stupid joke.
And then we have a spiritual, wehave, we have like 15 books, spiritual
(43:58):
books, dad jokes, stupid things.
We read a stupid joke, which isreally dumb, like, I'll tell you one.
Uh, what is, um,Beethoven's favorite fruit?
Nah, nah, nah.
So it, okay, so that sounds,you know, they're really dumb.
So that was our joke this week.
And then we go, we go,we, we go out there.
So by getting out of myself, it'svery selfish by helping others.
(44:21):
It's the selfish thing, mostselfish thing I could do because
I feel better and it always works.
And when I have, I have a friendthat's going through a divorce
right now, and he hates his ex-wife.
He hates his ex-wife.
I go, it's killing you.
I go, she did this, shedid this, she did this.
I go, okay, so.
Well let it go, man.
Pray for her.
Help her.
(44:42):
It's gonna, it is gonna come back.
He won't get that for a few years.
He will eventually, butI know he'll get there.
But once he gets to that spot,and she's done some very painful
things for her and she's wrong.
But he suffered 'cause she's wrong.
Yeah.
You don't have to, things aregonna, people are gonna do
things that are suffering.
You look at the news, it's, youknow, it's, it is just all negative
and, and it is negative becausewe are attracted to negativity.
(45:03):
Yeah.
And the reason we're attractedto negativity is because it's,
it's a survival instinct.
You know, we have to look for danger.
Sure.
You know, and so all daylong, boom, boom, boom.
So positivity wins.
That's, that's why.
So I guess I do have areason why I do it, Maggie.
Yeah.
Dr. Maggie Augustyn (45:17):
You
Dr. Michael Sonick (45:17):
do.
Dr. Chad Johnson (45:18):
Well, Dr. Michael Sonic out of Connecticut.
I love you and I really appreciate you.
I was honored that you said yesto come on today, and it's been
way too long, but, you know,distance just requires it, I guess.
Uh, but I think about you often.
I want you to know that, and I'm sayingit publicly so everyone knows that.
Uh, I'm just trying to throw yousome love that I regularly think
(45:41):
of you and I'm just, uh, uh, sothrilled to have you on today.
We're glad to have you on and, and talkingabout not only your book, but how you've,
uh, helped mentor a whole generation,particularly, um, uh, upping your area and
with periodontology, with Implantology andaround the world as much as you travel.
So thank you so much for coming on today.
Dr. Michael Sonick (46:03):
It's been a pleasure and true honor.
Yeah.
I remember you as a young boy, rightout of, I think it was one of your
first courses outta dental school.
It
Dr. Chad Johnson (46:10):
was.
It was ridiculous.
Yeah.
So, yeah, that was fun.
Yeah.
Well, everyone, thanks for beinggreat listeners on Everyday Practices
Dental podcast today with Reagan, Dr.
Maggie, Dr. Michael, and myself.
Regan Robertson (46:25):
Thanks everyone.
Dr. Chad Johnson (46:26):
That's it, man.
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