June 22, 2025 • 39 mins
Happiness isn't just about feeling good – it's about living in alignment with your values and purpose while managing inevitable stress more effectively.
• Stress is the primary barrier to happiness, hijacking your brain and making good decisions difficult
• Toning your vagus nerve through humming, breath work, movement, connection and nature helps reset your nervous system
• Self-care doesn't just take time – it expands time by improving decision-making and clarity
• Colour-code tasks as red (urgent), yellow (needs attention), green (ongoing) or grey (time-wasters) to manage overwhelm
• Create space between receiving feedback and responding to avoid reactive decisions
• When confused or uncertain, ask for clarification rather than guessing
• Focus on enjoying the learning process rather than fixating solely on grades
Visit expandyourhappy.com to learn more about Dr. Heather Frederick's work and resources.
Heather's podcast is at https://happydocstudent.com/
Her 5.0-star rated book is at https://geni.us/happy-student*
*
Hosted by William Wadsworth, memory psychologist, independent researcher and study skills coach. I help ambitious students to study smarter, not harder, so they can ace their exams with less work and less stress.
BOOK 1:1 COACHING to supercharge your exam success: https://examstudyexpert.com/workwithme/
Get a copy of Outsmart Your Exams, my award-winning exam technique book, at https://geni.us/exams*
*
*As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases on suggested books.
Podcast edited by Kerri Edinburgh
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
William Wadsworth (00:02):
Hello and welcome to the Exam Study Expert
podcast.
Today we're continuing our dipinto the world of mindset for
scholars and talking about whatI'm sure you'll agree is a very
important subject, namely how tobe happy as a student.
I'm William Wadsworth,psychologist and your host for
the podcast.
There are two reasons that Iwant to talk to you about
(00:24):
happiness today.
One is that I simply think wedeserve to be happy, or more
happy than not.
Wherever possible it's nicer.
And, of course, if you'restruggling with mental health
and sort of feeling like, theidea of being happy is this sort
of feels like a little bit of atough ask.
You know, I hear you and youknow, maybe we've reframed this
(00:44):
conversation in terms of of it.
Maybe it's about finding moreof the good days, fewer of the
bad ones.
You know, wherever we can, youknow we might still have some
elements of unhappiness in our,in our world, um, but perhaps we
get a little bit better atbouncing back when we get a
setback.
And and, of course, then theother reason I think we want to
strive for happiness is is thatI think we we fundamentally we
(01:07):
do better work if we are morecontent with our world generally
and our progress in our studies.
Specifically, we show up moreeasily.
We do our best work.
We were able to, as alicemiller from the a few episodes
back, put it make make it easierto make meaningful contact with
our work, especially when thework's a little bit difficult.
And it make make it easier tomake meaningful contact with our
work, especially when thework's a little bit difficult
and it's a little bit of astretch.
(01:27):
It's easy to do that when we'rekind of emotionally in in a
good place.
So today's conversation issomething of a master class in
identifying key barriers to yourhappiness and finding ways to
overcome said barriers so thatthe effects of whatever has
caused you some challenge, sothat we make those effects a
little bit smaller and a littlebit shorter lived, so we bounce
(01:48):
back that much faster.
Some of our big themes aregoing to be finding ways to
mitigate stress, how tointegrate self-care even perhaps
, especially when it feelsimpossible to find time for
yourself, how to prioritise andnavigate an overwhelming to-do
list and how to bounce back frombad feedback or a disappointing
result that knocks yourconfidence.
(02:09):
And I've certainly been thereI'm sure you have too.
To help us unpack this topictoday, I am joined by the
wonderful Dr Heather.
Frederick Heather is a PhD inpsychology with over 20 years
experience in academia in a widerange of roles, from teaching
roles through to being a gradschool dean.
Heather is perhaps best knownkind of around the world as the
(02:32):
host of the very popular HappyDoc Student podcast.
I was honoured to be on hershow last year.
It was a great time and she'shad wonderful, many wonderful
episodes that you can dig intoover the years.
She's also the author of thebook of the same name, which has
a mightily impressive 5.0 starrating perfect 5.0 star rating
(02:54):
on Amazon from reviews aroundthe world, which is not
something you see every day.
It's important to stress.
Although her work is kind of thehappy doc student, so meaning
students pursuing a doctoralprogram or phd um, though that's
in the title of her podcast andher book uh, she really
stresses now that you don't haveto be pursuing a doctorate
program or even in highereducation at all, or, frankly,
(03:16):
even in education of any form atall, to benefit from heather's
ideas.
Much of her work, and certainlyuh, the the content we'll be
talking about today, is notspecific to any level of, you
know, any kind of specific partof your kind of academic journey
.
You know these themes and theideas she brings to the table
(03:37):
are pretty universal to alllevels in your academic journey
and indeed to all points alongyour journey of life as a human
being, no matter what goalsyou're pursuing at the time.
So I think we'll all find lotsof great things to take from
today's episode, no matter whatit was that inspired you to come
along and tune in to the ExamStudy Expert podcast.
It's wonderful how to have yourcompany today.
(03:58):
I hope you enjoy today'sconversation.
Let's meet Heather and dive in.
Dr Heather Frederick (04:03):
Thank you so much.
What an honor to be here.
My name is Dr Heather Frederick.
I've been working in highereducation for almost 30 years
now.
I'm an expert in doctoraleducation, but what I'm really
passionate about is helpingpeople find more joy in their
academic journey.
So, william, I can't wait tosee where our conversation goes
(04:25):
today.
William Wadsworth (04:25):
Me too, heather, it's wonderful to have
your company, so I wanted tojust, I guess, dig right into
that theme you introduced asecond ago.
So when we think about kind of,I guess, finding happiness, or
finding a calm and peaceful wayto pursue our academic pursuits,
from your vast experience ofthinking about this topic over
(04:46):
the years, what are some of thecommon things that you see
causing us problems when itcomes to finding happiness?
In our pursuit of variousacademic goals.
Dr Heather Frederick (04:58):
Well, interestingly, I think, whether
you're a student or not, whatI'm going to say will probably
resonate.
And where I'd love to start iswith this word called happiness.
That has recently becomesomewhat charged.
To think about happinessSometimes people say, well, that
gets into this movement they'recalling positive toxicity right
(05:22):
, where everything has to begreat all the time.
And if it's not good vibes allthe time, if you're not always
upbeat and finding the silverlining, there's something wrong
with you or the way you'relooking at life.
And so I want to be reallyclear.
When I adopted that word happyfor my podcast and my book, the
Happy Doc Student, I really wasgoing back to the roots of this
(05:47):
word.
Happiness.
That, for me and my definition,is a state that you're in when
you're living your life in linewith your values, when you feel
like you're doing things thatmove you towards your life
purpose.
So it's not this fleeting feelgood that you might get with oh,
I don't know a margarita and abowl of chips and guacamole.
(06:11):
It's not this fleeting state,but more of a sustainable way of
being, where you're finding joyin your life, where you can and
there's always places that youcan find joy.
That's not to mean there aren'tgoing to be tough seasons,
(06:33):
tough parts of a day, right,it's not about being happy all
the time.
It's about understanding how tonavigate life when you're not
feeling joyful, navigating lifewhen you are feeling stressful
and being better able to bounceback from those episodes.
So you can get back to thisbaseline of yeah, I'm doing
(06:53):
things that are in line with howI want to live my life.
William Wadsworth (06:57):
Yeah, yeah, so I guess from you know whether
from kind of your personalexperience or from from those
you've you've kind of met andexperience, or from those you've
kind of met and coached andworked with over the years.
If you kind of to come up witha little list, are there any
kind of specific patterns orsort of trends that you'd see
can often?
You know kind of stand betweenus and your, I think, very
(07:18):
excellent and wise definition ofwhat it means to be happy.
Dr Heather Frederick (07:23):
Yes, I can distill it down into one basic
barrier and that is stress,right?
So whether that's stress from ahealth challenge, stress from a
relationship challenge, stressfrom an academic challenge, a
work challenge, when we'refeeling stressed and I think if
(07:43):
all your listeners just thinkfor a moment, if I think about a
time where I was feeling joyfuland full of life, was I
stressed?
You'd say no.
And if I ask you, when you'refeeling stressed and overwhelmed
, is joy an easy feeling for youto grasp, to experience?
And the question probably yeah,no, when I'm stressed and
overwhelmed.
(08:04):
And when you think about it andI'm sure you've had people on
talking about this you knowwe're in a human body.
It's hardwired a certain way.
If we feel a threat, our bodykind of takes over right, fight,
flight and flow, thesedifferent states that we can go
into.
And physiologically whathappens is when you're stressed,
your amygdala kicks in rightand it basically hijacks your
(08:29):
brain so that you lose access toyour prefrontal cortex, the
part that helps you make gooddecisions.
So everyone out there listeningthink about a time you did
something that you're like ohman, why did I do that?
Oh, that wasn't me.
Or shoot, if only I could hitthe rewind button and do that
over that action that you took,those words that you said
(08:49):
probably happened during a timeof stress, because when you're
stressed you don't think clearly, right.
So I think it's beautiful If wecan just think of things simply
right, like what's what's thesimplest way out of this, this
mess of overwhelm that, by theway, most people the the burnout
(09:11):
rates among academicians,whether you're a student or a
faculty or off the charts.
Everyone's saying I'm burnt out,I'm tired, I'm tired of life.
If we go, okay, hang on.
If the root causes stress, itreally becomes very simple.
I'm not going to say it's easy.
It's not easy, but the solutionis fairly fairly simple.
What can I do to manage mystress?
(09:32):
How can I better manage mystress?
And when I do that, I make morespace for moments of joy.
William Wadsworth (09:40):
I'd love to ask that question of you in a
moment.
What can I do to manage stress?
But I think before that I'mjust curious.
You know you kind of referencedthat epidemic of stress and
overwhelm in the world ofacademia.
Why do you think that is?
I mean, why do you think it isthat kind of people in different
levels of academia kind of havethis experience?
What is it about pursuingacademic goals?
(10:01):
That kind of means this is sucha common experience for so many
people pursuing academic goals,that kind of means.
Dr Heather Frederick (10:06):
This is such a common experience for so
many people.
You know, anecdotally, it feelslike the colleagues that I
interact with from all over theworld feel like they're being
asked to do more with less.
And if you're a student in aclass with a faculty member
who's stretched, you're probablygoing to be experiencing that
feeling through them, right, ifthey don't have time to hang out
(10:27):
during office hours or hang outafter class and make that
connection, they don't have timeto give you all the feedback
they would really love to giveyou on your assignments.
But, interestingly, burnout usedto be reserved.
For you know quote unquote thecaring professions, people who
are interacting with.
For you know quote unquote thecaring professions people who
are interacting with otherpeople and helping them nurses,
(10:49):
healthcare professionals.
You know, academicians you'rein a class, you've got students
that you're caring for truly,but post pandemic, there's
really this shift whereeveryone's reporting it.
Now, whether this is ameasurement issue, whether this
is a cultural thing, but itreally comes down to feeling
(11:12):
like you have a lack ofresources and, whether you're in
academia or not, a lot of atleast in my network people are
feeling like they've got more todo than they have the time to
complete the tasks in, and thatmakes you feel burnt out.
William Wadsworth (11:29):
Yeah, I think that sensation is a very lots
of our listeners kind of feelthat in different ways.
You know, if you're aprofessional preparing for exams
or a difficult exam, jugglingyour demanding day job with the
kind of intense study scheduleyou want to do, and maybe you've
got a family andresponsibilities at home as well
, you know you feel pulled inthose different directions.
You don't feel you know.
(11:49):
You put it, but you talkedabout not having enough
resources.
You don't have the resource oftime, energy, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I think I think that's that's anice way of nice way of putting
it.
So I mean, I guess that was the, I guess that was the easy bit,
heather, what do we do about it?
Dr Heather Frederick (12:05):
Right.
Understanding that we're in asituation is one thing, right,
but getting out of it isentirely another.
So one of the things I love totalk about and interestingly I
hardly scratch on this directlyin my podcast episodes, but
personally I love to talk aboutthe vagus nerve and I'm
wondering are you familiar withthe vagus nerve, william, or
(12:31):
have you had?
William Wadsworth (12:31):
any previous guests talk about the vagus
nerve.
Tell us about the vagus nerve,Heather.
That'd be great to learn about.
Dr Heather Frederick (12:35):
Okay, I'm hoping people will Google this
after to get more in-depthinformation because it's really
fascinating.
So it's our longest cranialnerve.
It starts at the base of ourneck, runs through essentially
our entire body and it's reallyresponsible for how it is that
we feel and we experience theworld.
And what ends up happening whenyou're under chronic stress is
(12:58):
that your ventral vagus nerve sothere's different pathways has
a hard time coming online, has ahard time firing, and so there
is a movement out there.
And I'd like to give a shoutout to the polyvagal
instituteorg.
Stephen porges was the originalperson who came up with the
(13:18):
theory behind this, but atpolyvagal instituteorg you can
see videos, you can lots of freeresources, but essentially,
when your vagus nerve isn'ttoned, it's difficult for you to
manage stress.
When you're feeling it and look, we're all.
We're not trying to deletestress from our life, because
(13:39):
that's not possible.
Right, like, life will bestressful good stress and bad
stress.
By the way, life will bestressful, so we're not saying I
need to wipe all the stress outof my life.
I need to get rid of thisrelationship.
I need to quit this job, right,I need to stop this program
because it's stressing me out.
No, stress is already alwaysgoing to be there, guys.
The answer is, if there's goingto be stress in my life, how
(14:02):
can I better navigate it?
And toning your vagus nerve ismy number one go-to.
Lots of research behind it andyou're probably wondering how do
I tone my vagus nerve?
The activities, again, aresimple.
That doesn't mean it's easy toalways adopt them into your
schedule, but things likehumming breath, work, movement,
(14:28):
connecting with others, being innature If I were to have asked
you before we even talked aboutthe vagus nerve hey, everyone
out there, write a list ofthings that make you feel good.
Chances are, the majority ofthings on that list, again,
adaptive things, not scrollingon Tik TOK or things that make
you or binge watching Netflix.
Things that make you feel goodare likely ventral, vagal toning
(14:52):
exercises.
So the trick here is where canI naturally weave these into my
life so that they become part ofmy lifestyle?
When you tone your vagus nerve,it's like a reset button.
You tell your nervous systemhey, it's okay.
Now there's times where thingsaren't okay.
Right, there's a dangeroussituation that you're in.
(15:14):
Well, your, your body will takeover.
You'll fight or flight.
You'll you'll know that part ofyour nervous system will be
activated.
But for most of the day, whenwe're sitting at our desk doing
our work whether that's academicor not when we're feeling
stressed and our nervous systemis being stressed, that's our
time to acknowledge.
(15:34):
Wait, hang on.
Is there something I could dohere that can reset me so that I
can think clearly, make gooddecisions and not feel this way?
That I can think clearly, makegood decisions and not feel this
way?
And so the task at hand isreally for people to get curious
and experiment with things thatwould fit for them, would work
(15:55):
for them and that they enjoy.
Certainly, don't do things thatyou do.
If you hate yoga, you hatehiking, don't do it just because
it might right Come into itwith a wow, this sounds
interesting, this sounds fun.
I'd like to go for a walk withmy loved one or my dog without
my cell phone.
That's going to tone my vagusnerve, and my recommendation
really is to challenge yourselfto prioritize your self-care
(16:20):
right.
Everyone out there has probablyheard statements like you can't
pour from an empty cup.
You can't.
You're not going to be a greatstudent, you're not going to be
a great employee, you're notgoing to be a great fill in the
blank.
You know, sister, mother,daughter if you're stressed and
overwhelmed and burnt out.
So what could you do for fiveminutes a day?
(16:40):
That would be an investment inyour, in your self care, and it
doesn't have to be, doesn't haveto cost you money, right?
Youtube, tons of free resources, a couple of deep breaths here
and there, some stretching,turning off your phone for
periods of time.
What can you do to show thatyou care about your health and
(17:04):
well being?
What are some simple steps youcould take?
I always recommend find someoneto do it with you, to hold each
other accountable.
Right, simple, but notnecessarily easy.
When we're in patterns of beingstressed out and that's our
normal Our normal is beingstressed out.
Now we need to break thatpattern.
William Wadsworth (17:24):
Yeah, no, and thank you for that.
Lots of, lots of great advice,uh, advice in that.
So I guess I guess there'sthere's an idea of kind of
adding to our schedule and kindof incorporating a little bit,
you know and I'm emphasizing theword adding, but, but you know
you you're emphasizing, ofcourse, like it doesn't have to
be a great big, enormous sort oftime commitment.
Like you know, even just a fewthings here and there you sort
(17:46):
of weave into our day-to-day.
We, we um interviewed a kind ofa meditation expert a couple of
weeks ago, uh on the show, annswanson, um, and and she was
really really interesting onkind of how to, how to weave
these little moments uh intoyour life, so you can always
it's not like you're making,it's not even like you're making
time for the task, they justsort of happen in the little
(18:07):
moments when you're kind of notreally doing anything else.
So that was kind of quite aninteresting take which I think
complements nicely what you'rehearing here, the kind of
follow-up thoughts on my mind iswhether there's also approaches
we could take that involvemaybe taking things away or
taking away, you know, perhapsthey're not going to happen
anyway, but we're kind ofkidding ourselves that they are
(18:29):
and we're going to try and do itall.
And that's why we're sostressed and like the early we
make that kind of painfuldecision that okay, well,
there's no way I'm going to getall this, it's just, there's
just no way the scope of allthis fits into the budget of
time available.
You know, in the early we cankind of make that painful
realization and potentiallypainful prioritization process
and make peace with what we'renot going to do.
(18:50):
The sooner we can we can againstart to bring those stress
levels under control a littlebit.
Yeah, I wondered.
I wondered if you had anythoughts on that idea.
Dr Heather Frederick (18:58):
Absolutely .
First, I'd love to say AnneSwanson is awesome, Lover book
meditation, clearly a ventral,vagal toning exercise.
But I love that you brought upthis idea of adding to a
schedule, because people willoften say well, Heather, of
course, if I had time to takecare of myself I would, but I
don't right.
So there's this thought of it'sgoing to be another thing to do
and my experience is that whenI take care of myself, I expand
(19:23):
time because I make betterdecisions.
It's easier for me to clearlysee, like you're saying, I'm
going to say no to this requestbecause I can see the ways it's
not in line with my currentgoals.
I'm going to set this boundaryand I know you interviewed
Alison Miller who has great,great advice about setting
(19:44):
boundaries.
So again, it feels like you'rehaving to put things in, even if
it's just weaving it in verynaturally, while you're waiting
for your coffee to brew orwhatnot, when you're at a
stoplight.
But again, I challenge yourlisteners when you start taking
care of yourself, do you seethat time seems to expand, that
(20:05):
you get more done on your to-dolist because you're discerning,
you're better able to discernwhat should be on that list,
what should be on that list.
So the saying no, theprioritizing, all those things
are absolutely important andalong those lines of taking away
, sometimes there's things we dothat deplete us.
(20:30):
Like, I'm going to say it,social media, things like
Netflix, Are there things thatyou're participating in, and
this takes a lot of courage.
It takes a lot of courage to beconsciously aware of how you're
engaging with things liketechnology and how it's
(20:50):
impacting you, not just in termsof productivity but in terms of
your emotional state.
So there are.
If you just keep a journal fora week, 10 days, what are the
things that I'm doing that aredepleting me and can I either
reduce it or completely take itout of my life is a huge win in
terms of self-care.
So there's this thought of whatcan I add?
(21:14):
But the flip side of that cointhat you so brilliantly brought
up, William, was and what can Itake away?
They're equally important.
William Wadsworth (21:24):
Yeah, yeah.
It's an interesting question toreflect on and I think
sometimes we're often quitesurprised.
You know, there's the exercisewhich has often surprised me
when you go into the settingssection of your smartphone and
look at the screen usage stats,which are there as standard on
most smartphones that areshipped these days, there as
(21:47):
standard on on most smartphonesthat ship these days, and you
know you, you look at the, thedaily screen time and the
breakdown by app and you think,oh goodness sake, goodness me,
like how did I spend?
Dr Heather Frederick (21:54):
how did that happen?
William Wadsworth (21:55):
right an hour a day, like I thought it was no
time at all, like an hour a dayon youtube or tiktok or
whatever it was.
You know I'm not going to dothat and you know so.
You know quite can be reallyilluminating One of your tips
that I remember reading aboutfor sort of time management and
maybe helping kind of auditthat's how you're using your
(22:19):
time.
You talk about colouring yourtask choices and having sort of
you know, red, green, yellow,grey tasks, tasks.
I wonder if you could maybejust talk a little bit about
that, that exercise yeah.
Dr Heather Frederick (22:31):
So this is , um, something I learned
through mark woods.
He authored a book calledattack your day before it
attacks you and again, these areexercises where they're really
exercises in awareness, beingbeing aware.
So, asking yourself when youremails are coming through, do I
need to stop?
I'm in the middle of a task.
(22:52):
I just got an email.
Am I stopping and reading thatemail, right?
Or can I chunk my email andcheck my email a certain time a
day, certain times each day,versus getting distracted?
And then, when I do check theemail, can I color it or my my
task list so red?
Those are the things.
(23:12):
You have to get them done todayand really, pending the tasks
unless they're easy, simplethings, you really don't want to
have too many reds in one daybecause you're just going to
feel like you failed and youdidn't get everything done that
you write.
So there's this again thisawareness, this realistic, this
realistic approach to how manyhours are there really in a day?
(23:33):
And what Mark Woods wouldrecommend is actually block out
your day in hours.
Well, if I'm going to do yogafor 20 minutes and I'm going to
do check my emails and thatusually takes me two hours, I
and then suddenly you'll see wow, I only have six hours to get
50 things done.
What was I thinking?
And you try to put them in theslots and you so, right away,
(23:53):
you reduce your, your dailyto-do list, and that reduces
overwhelm because you're morerealistic.
But when you color, you don't.
You know the red ones need toget done and you prioritize them
, and so sometimes that may becommunicating to someone.
I got your email.
I'm going to give you athoughtful response.
Please give me three businessdays.
(24:13):
Versus feeling because itwasn't an urgent email.
It was someone who had aquestion.
You absolutely want to get backto them, but with this idea you
can't do everything at once.
If you ask yourself what coloris this task?
Is this something where youknow it's a yellow?
So I need to pay attention, Ineed to set a deadline.
I'm telling them it'll get donein three days.
(24:33):
Is it a green?
Is it some of this ongoingstuff?
Tasks that you do that areongoing, that whether you get it
done this week or next week,isn't really a big deal.
The gray tasks are really theones that tend to revolutionize
how productive we are when wenotice them, and those are the
things like scrolling on socialmedia, binge watching things,
(24:58):
participating in gossip at work,right?
Things that don't bring youtowards the execution of your
goals.
That don't bring you towardsthe execution of your goals.
So really, it comes down topaying attention.
Yes, you've got your to-do list, but look at it realistically.
What can you actually get donetoday and which ones really are
(25:20):
the reds that need to get donetoday?
Movement needs to be done todaybecause your boss is waiting
for that report and they need tosubmit it to the to the board
tomorrow, right?
So it has to get done.
And how can you take some ofthat stress off yourself?
By communicating with the othercolors, with realistic
deadlines.
(25:41):
You know, I think if you're in aposition where you're giving
out tasks, make it clear to yourteam members I'm asking you to
do these 10 things, but Icertainly don't expect them to
be done this week.
If you can prioritize these twoand then we'll meet about the
other eight next week, becauseoften, when you're in a position
where a boss or someone ofauthority is asking you to do
(26:02):
something, they all feel likereds.
So I always like to encouragepeople who are in a position
where they're doling out thetasks to help your employees,
your team members, color them sothey're not feeling overwhelmed
.
If you're in a situation whereyou're all the tasks are being
dumped on you, particularly ifthey're coming from different
(26:22):
sources, then that's where I sayfind your voice and ask for
clarity.
No problem, what's theexpectation here?
Are we talking tomorrow?
Are we talking the first ofnext month?
Again, so that you canprioritize and manage your time.
There's only 24 hours a day andI hope everyone listening to
this is spending a significantamount, you know, six or more
(26:45):
hours resting each of those days.
William Wadsworth (26:50):
Absolutely, absolutely.
So we're kind of starting totake back a little bit of
control of our schedule.
There may be still other thingsthat come up and cause stress.
I think one of the reallyinteresting things I remember
reading in your book, to quote,I think you talk about using ego
shattering feedback to youradvantage and certainly speaking
(27:12):
from personal experience,feedback definitely has the
tendency to be ego shatteringand can turn an otherwise very
productive week into a week fullof disappointment and spinning
around in your head and notgetting an awful lot done and
being fairly unhappy in theprocess.
So I'd love it if you might beable to share any wisdom for us.
When we do get thosedisappointing results, that
(27:33):
feedback from others that makesus feel pretty lousy, how can we
move forward?
Dr Heather Frederick (27:39):
It's hard not to take feedback personal
right, whether it's how you'refolding the laundry, how you're
driving or an essay that youthat you turned in, it's that's
natural.
So know that it's natural tohave that response and then
again have that awareness.
Wait, that just put my body ina state of stress, which means I
(28:00):
may not be thinking clearly.
So some of the tips I like togive when you get feedback like
that is what can you do to resetyour nervous system so that you
can engage with this feedbackin a meaningful way?
One of my favorite quotes isfrom Viktor Frankl and I hope I
get it right.
But it's something like thisBetween stimulus and response
(28:21):
there is a space, and in thatspace is our power to choose our
response, and in our responselies our growth, right?
So stimulus, feedback Now,before you react, react
reflexively, can you stop, takea deep breath, maybe need to go
(28:47):
for a run, take a shower,journal before you respond to
that feedback?
It's a huge time saver.
It's a huge time saver not justbecause you'll be thinking more
clearly if you need to fixsomething in an assignment or a
paper, right, if you need toredo something, but it's a huge
time saver because think aboutthose reactive things that
(29:08):
happen when you get feedback,that create disasters you have
to clean up later.
Right, you were.
You were rude to a coworker,you said terrible things to your
, to your partner.
You shot off an email that, ohmy goodness, you would give
anything to get back now.
So now you're doing damagecontrol because you reacted to
(29:31):
the feedback instead of givingyourself space so that you could
respond to it appropriately andto the best that you can and I
know I get it, it's difficult,but the best that you can
approach feedback with curiosity.
Right, this, this attitudeisn't this interesting.
Hmm, I wonder what I might belearning by this.
(29:53):
Hmm, right, to just againgiving yourself that space so
that you can engage with it in away that um doesn't create more
problems for you.
William Wadsworth (30:04):
A friend of mine talks about.
When you get those emails andyou get that result, when you
get that bit of in-personfeedback, you know, okay, what
was this designed to teach me?
What was this designed to teachme Just what you're saying
there about, okay, how can Ilearn from this?
This is curious.
I like that idea of bringingcuriosity.
So we've talked a bit aboutmanaging schedules and kind of a
(30:26):
very significant challengethere for many of us.
We talked a little bit aboutnavigating the feedback.
I guess are there kind of anyother big sources of stress that
we haven't touched on yet?
We've always talked about theimportance of the self-care and
managing that.
Are there any other sort oflittle ideas around kind of
managing stress that you thinkwould be particularly helpful to
surface to people listeningtoday?
Dr Heather Frederick (30:47):
You know, I think the one thing that we
haven't really touched on, butthat I see a lot, is simply
related to communication.
Sometimes you're under stressbecause you've misunderstood
something.
It could be the feedback thatyou just got, it could be the
expectations that you believepeople have for you, but they
(31:08):
may or may not.
So I know my twins now are incollege and when I visit them
and I see them in moments ofstress and I ask them what's
going on, often I'm saying whydon't you just ask, why don't
you reach out to your professorand say you know what?
I'm reading it this way.
Is this right?
What exactly is due nextTuesday?
(31:30):
And my experience is that peopleare afraid to ask questions
because they think it will look,you know it'll be a dumb
question and people are going togo.
Really, you're asking that.
So I actually have a pot, avery short podcast it's like
less than 10 minutes on calledsomething like how to not ask a
dumb question and basically thatis do your work.
(31:53):
You know, spend a few minutestrying to find the answer, but
my goodness, once you'veattempted to find the answer,
when you don't have the answer,you still don't have the clarity
.
By all means, please ask.
This goes beyond just askingyour faculty member.
Can I get some clarity on whatyou said here or how this rubric
is read?
(32:13):
It really goes to every part oflife.
Someone says something to youthat rubs you the wrong way.
I'm sorry, can you?
What did you just say to me?
Can I ask what you meant bythat?
Because, wow, when you saidthat to me, it made me feel
really yucky.
It made me feel really yuckyinside.
Am I interpreting thiscorrectly?
So asking for clarification,opening up those lines of
(32:36):
communication, I think, isanother way to reduce stress and
find more joy.
Often it's misunderstanding.
There's a lot ofmisunderstanding I see happening
out there.
William Wadsworth (32:48):
I think that's a great point.
Yeah, you don't need to guessyou, you can ask, you can ask
yes so I mean so manyinteresting things.
I I wonder, as we sort of worktowards bringing the
conversation to a close time, asalways is is against us?
Uh, when we're, as so oftenhappens, are we having a great
conversation?
Conversation?
But I was curious, reflectingback on your own time as a
(33:11):
student yourself.
I'm just curious, looking backwith the benefit of hindsight.
What are some of the things youthink you did well, and are
there any particular messagesyou wish you yourself?
Maybe learned a little bitsooner to help you on the
journey.
Dr Heather Frederick (33:26):
I would say that my type A personality
worked for me in the sense thatI'd read the syllabus line by
line, right.
I'd ask for clarification whenit wasn't there because, my
goodness, I wanted to perform, Iwanted to perform, and so
having that diligence worked forme.
At the same time, I'm going tosay if I had to go back and talk
(33:48):
to my younger self as a student, I would have said hey, you
know, there's times that thatpart of your personality, the
wanting to be hyper vigilant, isa great trait as a student.
But, my goodness, you need tochill out sometimes.
You need to chill out.
Sometimes my mom actually tellsa story.
I don't remember it, but shesaid I came home from
(34:09):
kindergarten crying because Ihad missed an item on a spelling
test or something.
So that kind of gives you asense of the type of student I
was.
I really had to do well or myfeelings got hurt.
And so, going back, I think Iwould say to myself you know,
this is a journey, feedback,grades, it's all part of the
(34:34):
process.
It's an adventure where you'regoing to learn what you're good
at, what you like, what you'renot so good at, what you don't
like.
And take it as that Don't justbe focused on that grade.
I think that's how I would sumit up.
I wish I wasn't so focused ongetting the grade.
(34:54):
I wish I had been more focusedon enjoying the experience of
learning, and I hope all yourlisteners out there go.
Hmm, what would my day looklike?
How would my experience bedifferent If I thought about
that, if I thought aboutenjoying the process of learning
something new, learningsomething about myself?
William Wadsworth (35:15):
Definitely important for us all to think
about.
I think Not always easy, notalways easy, but that makes it
sometimes almost.
I think sometimes the best andmost important advice of all is
the kind of harder stuff tothink about and to take.
So, heather, thank you so much.
It's been such an interestingconversation.
We've touched on so many reallyinteresting things.
(35:35):
I'm just curious if anybody'sinterested to learn more about
you and your work.
You mentioned a couple ofthings.
Where might they want to gonext?
Dr Heather Frederick (35:44):
Sure, everything is on my website and
hopefully it's easy to remember.
It's expandyourhappycom, so youcan hop over there and see if
anything resonates.
William Wadsworth (35:55):
Fantastic.
Well, we'll pop that link inthe show notes, along with a
couple of other things you'vementioned along the way today.
And, heather, thank you so muchonce again.
It's been such fun to catch upand looking forward to talking
again soon.
Dr Heather Frederick (36:06):
Yeah, William.
Thank you so much for theinvite and thanks for all the
great work that you're doing aswell.
William Wadsworth (36:13):
Well, heather , thank you once again for your
time today and sharing yourwisdom.
Thank you for coming on theshow.
I've linked your podcast andyour book in the show notes for
anyone who wants to check thoseresources out, especially
relevant if you're pursuing adoctoral program of some kind.
But really, as you've seentoday, has an awful lot that's
(36:34):
relevant for lots of us.
And, as I say, the book, that5.0 star rating definitely not
something you see every day, sowell worth checking out.
Remember, if you use the linksin the show notes on a huge
number of the episodes of theExample Today Expert podcast
where we've suggested particularbooks, if you use those links
to go on and purchase a book,then we are able to earn a small
(36:56):
referral fee which comes at nocost to you, which is a great
little way to support some ofthe costs of making the show for
you.
And if you've been a long timelistener and we've been able to
help you through the podcast,then I'd warmly invite you to
take the step to join our VIPsupporters club over on Patreon.
We have a range of price pointsto support at Really.
(37:18):
That's there to reflect thewide range of financial
circumstances that I know ourlistener base have.
You know I know some of youhave more limited resources as
students yourselves.
You know I know some of youhave more limited resources as
students yourselves.
Others are now on a more stablefooting financially, as perhaps
parents, or you're kind ofgetting established in your
career, so you might be able tosupport at a level that makes
(37:39):
sense to you.
I've kept the main benefits thesame across all different
levels of support, so it's sortof a pay, what you can kind of
model.
You can kind of choose thesupport level that makes sense
to you, that feels appropriateto your financial situation.
But I've kept the kind of corebenefits that you get in terms
of lots of juicy, extra sort ofvideo lessons, downloadables, a
(37:59):
selection of high impact goodiesthat I know you'll love, that
is available just the same foreverybody, no matter what price
point you're supporting at.
To suggest a particular resourcethat ties in well to this
episode and the self-care themein particular, I'd suggest
checking out the Deep Dress forStudents meditation, which was
(38:20):
recorded especially for the examstudy expert community by
Camilla Walker, a really niceway to set down your burden, for
a time to unwind and deeplyrest and refresh yourself.
That's just one of the manynice goodies you'll find in the
vip supporters club over onpatreon.
You can get all of that at uhhead at examstudyexpertscom
(38:43):
forward slash patreon, where youcan learn more and join us
today.
That that's examstudyexpertcomforward slash Patreon.
P-a-t-r-e-o-n.
For now, I just wanted to saythank you, as always, for
listening today.
It's been such a joy to haveyour company and I want to wish
you every success and happinessin your studies.
Speaker 3 (39:05):
Just before you go.
Did you know you can hireWilliam as your very own coach
and mentor to show you thestress-free way to ace your
exams?
By studying smarter, not harder.
Find out how, atexamstudyexpertcom, slash
coaching.
Hello and welcome to the Exam Study Expert
podcast.
Today we're continuing our dipinto the world of mindset for
scholars and talking about whatI'm sure you'll agree is a very
important subject, namely how tobe happy as a student.
I'm William Wadsworth,psychologist and your host for
the podcast.
There are two reasons that Iwant to talk to you about
(00:24):
happiness today.
One is that I simply think wedeserve to be happy, or more
happy than not.
Wherever possible it's nicer.
And, of course, if you'restruggling with mental health
and sort of feeling like, theidea of being happy is this sort
of feels like a little bit of atough ask.
You know, I hear you and youknow, maybe we've reframed this
(00:44):
conversation in terms of of it.
Maybe it's about finding moreof the good days, fewer of the
bad ones.
You know, wherever we can, youknow we might still have some
elements of unhappiness in our,in our world, um, but perhaps we
get a little bit better atbouncing back when we get a
setback.
And and, of course, then theother reason I think we want to
strive for happiness is is thatI think we we fundamentally we
(01:07):
do better work if we are morecontent with our world generally
and our progress in our studies.
Specifically, we show up moreeasily.
We do our best work.
We were able to, as alicemiller from the a few episodes
back, put it make make it easierto make meaningful contact with
our work, especially when thework's a little bit difficult.
And it make make it easier tomake meaningful contact with our
work, especially when thework's a little bit difficult
and it's a little bit of astretch.
(01:27):
It's easy to do that when we'rekind of emotionally in in a
good place.
So today's conversation issomething of a master class in
identifying key barriers to yourhappiness and finding ways to
overcome said barriers so thatthe effects of whatever has
caused you some challenge, sothat we make those effects a
little bit smaller and a littlebit shorter lived, so we bounce
(01:48):
back that much faster.
Some of our big themes aregoing to be finding ways to
mitigate stress, how tointegrate self-care even perhaps
, especially when it feelsimpossible to find time for
yourself, how to prioritise andnavigate an overwhelming to-do
list and how to bounce back frombad feedback or a disappointing
result that knocks yourconfidence.
(02:09):
And I've certainly been thereI'm sure you have too.
To help us unpack this topictoday, I am joined by the
wonderful Dr Heather.
Frederick Heather is a PhD inpsychology with over 20 years
experience in academia in a widerange of roles, from teaching
roles through to being a gradschool dean.
Heather is perhaps best knownkind of around the world as the
(02:32):
host of the very popular HappyDoc Student podcast.
I was honoured to be on hershow last year.
It was a great time and she'shad wonderful, many wonderful
episodes that you can dig intoover the years.
She's also the author of thebook of the same name, which has
a mightily impressive 5.0 starrating perfect 5.0 star rating
(02:54):
on Amazon from reviews aroundthe world, which is not
something you see every day.
It's important to stress.
Although her work is kind of thehappy doc student, so meaning
students pursuing a doctoralprogram or phd um, though that's
in the title of her podcast andher book uh, she really
stresses now that you don't haveto be pursuing a doctorate
program or even in highereducation at all, or, frankly,
(03:16):
even in education of any form atall, to benefit from heather's
ideas.
Much of her work, and certainlyuh, the the content we'll be
talking about today, is notspecific to any level of, you
know, any kind of specific partof your kind of academic journey
.
You know these themes and theideas she brings to the table
(03:37):
are pretty universal to alllevels in your academic journey
and indeed to all points alongyour journey of life as a human
being, no matter what goalsyou're pursuing at the time.
So I think we'll all find lotsof great things to take from
today's episode, no matter whatit was that inspired you to come
along and tune in to the ExamStudy Expert podcast.
It's wonderful how to have yourcompany today.
(03:58):
I hope you enjoy today'sconversation.
Let's meet Heather and dive in.
Dr Heather Frederick (04:03):
Thank you so much.
What an honor to be here.
My name is Dr Heather Frederick.
I've been working in highereducation for almost 30 years
now.
I'm an expert in doctoraleducation, but what I'm really
passionate about is helpingpeople find more joy in their
academic journey.
So, william, I can't wait tosee where our conversation goes
(04:25):
today.
William Wadsworth (04:25):
Me too, heather, it's wonderful to have
your company, so I wanted tojust, I guess, dig right into
that theme you introduced asecond ago.
So when we think about kind of,I guess, finding happiness, or
finding a calm and peaceful wayto pursue our academic pursuits,
from your vast experience ofthinking about this topic over
(04:46):
the years, what are some of thecommon things that you see
causing us problems when itcomes to finding happiness?
In our pursuit of variousacademic goals.
Dr Heather Frederick (04:58):
Well, interestingly, I think, whether
you're a student or not, whatI'm going to say will probably
resonate.
And where I'd love to start iswith this word called happiness.
That has recently becomesomewhat charged.
To think about happinessSometimes people say, well, that
gets into this movement they'recalling positive toxicity right
(05:22):
, where everything has to begreat all the time.
And if it's not good vibes allthe time, if you're not always
upbeat and finding the silverlining, there's something wrong
with you or the way you'relooking at life.
And so I want to be reallyclear.
When I adopted that word happyfor my podcast and my book, the
Happy Doc Student, I really wasgoing back to the roots of this
(05:47):
word.
Happiness.
That, for me and my definition,is a state that you're in when
you're living your life in linewith your values, when you feel
like you're doing things thatmove you towards your life
purpose.
So it's not this fleeting feelgood that you might get with oh,
I don't know a margarita and abowl of chips and guacamole.
(06:11):
It's not this fleeting state,but more of a sustainable way of
being, where you're finding joyin your life, where you can and
there's always places that youcan find joy.
That's not to mean there aren'tgoing to be tough seasons,
(06:33):
tough parts of a day, right,it's not about being happy all
the time.
It's about understanding how tonavigate life when you're not
feeling joyful, navigating lifewhen you are feeling stressful
and being better able to bounceback from those episodes.
So you can get back to thisbaseline of yeah, I'm doing
(06:53):
things that are in line with howI want to live my life.
William Wadsworth (06:57):
Yeah, yeah, so I guess from you know whether
from kind of your personalexperience or from from those
you've you've kind of met andexperience, or from those you've
kind of met and coached andworked with over the years.
If you kind of to come up witha little list, are there any
kind of specific patterns orsort of trends that you'd see
can often?
You know kind of stand betweenus and your, I think, very
(07:18):
excellent and wise definition ofwhat it means to be happy.
Dr Heather Frederick (07:23):
Yes, I can distill it down into one basic
barrier and that is stress,right?
So whether that's stress from ahealth challenge, stress from a
relationship challenge, stressfrom an academic challenge, a
work challenge, when we'refeeling stressed and I think if
(07:43):
all your listeners just thinkfor a moment, if I think about a
time where I was feeling joyfuland full of life, was I
stressed?
You'd say no.
And if I ask you, when you'refeeling stressed and overwhelmed
, is joy an easy feeling for youto grasp, to experience?
And the question probably yeah,no, when I'm stressed and
overwhelmed.
(08:04):
And when you think about it andI'm sure you've had people on
talking about this you knowwe're in a human body.
It's hardwired a certain way.
If we feel a threat, our bodykind of takes over right, fight,
flight and flow, thesedifferent states that we can go
into.
And physiologically whathappens is when you're stressed,
your amygdala kicks in rightand it basically hijacks your
(08:29):
brain so that you lose access toyour prefrontal cortex, the
part that helps you make gooddecisions.
So everyone out there listeningthink about a time you did
something that you're like ohman, why did I do that?
Oh, that wasn't me.
Or shoot, if only I could hitthe rewind button and do that
over that action that you took,those words that you said
(08:49):
probably happened during a timeof stress, because when you're
stressed you don't think clearly, right.
So I think it's beautiful If wecan just think of things simply
right, like what's what's thesimplest way out of this, this
mess of overwhelm that, by theway, most people the the burnout
(09:11):
rates among academicians,whether you're a student or a
faculty or off the charts.
Everyone's saying I'm burnt out,I'm tired, I'm tired of life.
If we go, okay, hang on.
If the root causes stress, itreally becomes very simple.
I'm not going to say it's easy.
It's not easy, but the solutionis fairly fairly simple.
What can I do to manage mystress?
(09:32):
How can I better manage mystress?
And when I do that, I make morespace for moments of joy.
William Wadsworth (09:40):
I'd love to ask that question of you in a
moment.
What can I do to manage stress?
But I think before that I'mjust curious.
You know you kind of referencedthat epidemic of stress and
overwhelm in the world ofacademia.
Why do you think that is?
I mean, why do you think it isthat kind of people in different
levels of academia kind of havethis experience?
What is it about pursuingacademic goals?
(10:01):
That kind of means this is sucha common experience for so many
people pursuing academic goals,that kind of means.
Dr Heather Frederick (10:06):
This is such a common experience for so
many people.
You know, anecdotally, it feelslike the colleagues that I
interact with from all over theworld feel like they're being
asked to do more with less.
And if you're a student in aclass with a faculty member
who's stretched, you're probablygoing to be experiencing that
feeling through them, right, ifthey don't have time to hang out
(10:27):
during office hours or hang outafter class and make that
connection, they don't have timeto give you all the feedback
they would really love to giveyou on your assignments.
But, interestingly, burnout usedto be reserved.
For you know quote unquote thecaring professions, people who
are interacting with.
For you know quote unquote thecaring professions people who
are interacting with otherpeople and helping them nurses,
(10:49):
healthcare professionals.
You know, academicians you'rein a class, you've got students
that you're caring for truly,but post pandemic, there's
really this shift whereeveryone's reporting it.
Now, whether this is ameasurement issue, whether this
is a cultural thing, but itreally comes down to feeling
(11:12):
like you have a lack ofresources and, whether you're in
academia or not, a lot of atleast in my network people are
feeling like they've got more todo than they have the time to
complete the tasks in, and thatmakes you feel burnt out.
William Wadsworth (11:29):
Yeah, I think that sensation is a very lots
of our listeners kind of feelthat in different ways.
You know, if you're aprofessional preparing for exams
or a difficult exam, jugglingyour demanding day job with the
kind of intense study scheduleyou want to do, and maybe you've
got a family andresponsibilities at home as well
, you know you feel pulled inthose different directions.
You don't feel you know.
(11:49):
You put it, but you talkedabout not having enough
resources.
You don't have the resource oftime, energy, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I think I think that's that's anice way of nice way of putting
it.
So I mean, I guess that was the, I guess that was the easy bit,
heather, what do we do about it?
Dr Heather Frederick (12:05):
Right.
Understanding that we're in asituation is one thing, right,
but getting out of it isentirely another.
So one of the things I love totalk about and interestingly I
hardly scratch on this directlyin my podcast episodes, but
personally I love to talk aboutthe vagus nerve and I'm
wondering are you familiar withthe vagus nerve, william, or
(12:31):
have you had?
William Wadsworth (12:31):
any previous guests talk about the vagus
nerve.
Tell us about the vagus nerve,Heather.
That'd be great to learn about.
Dr Heather Frederick (12:35):
Okay, I'm hoping people will Google this
after to get more in-depthinformation because it's really
fascinating.
So it's our longest cranialnerve.
It starts at the base of ourneck, runs through essentially
our entire body and it's reallyresponsible for how it is that
we feel and we experience theworld.
And what ends up happening whenyou're under chronic stress is
(12:58):
that your ventral vagus nerve sothere's different pathways has
a hard time coming online, has ahard time firing, and so there
is a movement out there.
And I'd like to give a shoutout to the polyvagal
instituteorg.
Stephen porges was the originalperson who came up with the
(13:18):
theory behind this, but atpolyvagal instituteorg you can
see videos, you can lots of freeresources, but essentially,
when your vagus nerve isn'ttoned, it's difficult for you to
manage stress.
When you're feeling it and look, we're all.
We're not trying to deletestress from our life, because
(13:39):
that's not possible.
Right, like, life will bestressful good stress and bad
stress.
By the way, life will bestressful, so we're not saying I
need to wipe all the stress outof my life.
I need to get rid of thisrelationship.
I need to quit this job, right,I need to stop this program
because it's stressing me out.
No, stress is already alwaysgoing to be there, guys.
The answer is, if there's goingto be stress in my life, how
(14:02):
can I better navigate it?
And toning your vagus nerve ismy number one go-to.
Lots of research behind it andyou're probably wondering how do
I tone my vagus nerve?
The activities, again, aresimple.
That doesn't mean it's easy toalways adopt them into your
schedule, but things likehumming breath, work, movement,
(14:28):
connecting with others, being innature If I were to have asked
you before we even talked aboutthe vagus nerve hey, everyone
out there, write a list ofthings that make you feel good.
Chances are, the majority ofthings on that list, again,
adaptive things, not scrollingon Tik TOK or things that make
you or binge watching Netflix.
Things that make you feel goodare likely ventral, vagal toning
(14:52):
exercises.
So the trick here is where canI naturally weave these into my
life so that they become part ofmy lifestyle?
When you tone your vagus nerve,it's like a reset button.
You tell your nervous systemhey, it's okay.
Now there's times where thingsaren't okay.
Right, there's a dangeroussituation that you're in.
(15:14):
Well, your, your body will takeover.
You'll fight or flight.
You'll you'll know that part ofyour nervous system will be
activated.
But for most of the day, whenwe're sitting at our desk doing
our work whether that's academicor not when we're feeling
stressed and our nervous systemis being stressed, that's our
time to acknowledge.
(15:34):
Wait, hang on.
Is there something I could dohere that can reset me so that I
can think clearly, make gooddecisions and not feel this way?
That I can think clearly, makegood decisions and not feel this
way?
And so the task at hand isreally for people to get curious
and experiment with things thatwould fit for them, would work
(15:55):
for them and that they enjoy.
Certainly, don't do things thatyou do.
If you hate yoga, you hatehiking, don't do it just because
it might right Come into itwith a wow, this sounds
interesting, this sounds fun.
I'd like to go for a walk withmy loved one or my dog without
my cell phone.
That's going to tone my vagusnerve, and my recommendation
really is to challenge yourselfto prioritize your self-care
(16:20):
right.
Everyone out there has probablyheard statements like you can't
pour from an empty cup.
You can't.
You're not going to be a greatstudent, you're not going to be
a great employee, you're notgoing to be a great fill in the
blank.
You know, sister, mother,daughter if you're stressed and
overwhelmed and burnt out.
So what could you do for fiveminutes a day?
(16:40):
That would be an investment inyour, in your self care, and it
doesn't have to be, doesn't haveto cost you money, right?
Youtube, tons of free resources, a couple of deep breaths here
and there, some stretching,turning off your phone for
periods of time.
What can you do to show thatyou care about your health and
(17:04):
well being?
What are some simple steps youcould take?
I always recommend find someoneto do it with you, to hold each
other accountable.
Right, simple, but notnecessarily easy.
When we're in patterns of beingstressed out and that's our
normal Our normal is beingstressed out.
Now we need to break thatpattern.
William Wadsworth (17:24):
Yeah, no, and thank you for that.
Lots of, lots of great advice,uh, advice in that.
So I guess I guess there'sthere's an idea of kind of
adding to our schedule and kindof incorporating a little bit,
you know and I'm emphasizing theword adding, but, but you know
you you're emphasizing, ofcourse, like it doesn't have to
be a great big, enormous sort oftime commitment.
Like you know, even just a fewthings here and there you sort
(17:46):
of weave into our day-to-day.
We, we um interviewed a kind ofa meditation expert a couple of
weeks ago, uh on the show, annswanson, um, and and she was
really really interesting onkind of how to, how to weave
these little moments uh intoyour life, so you can always
it's not like you're making,it's not even like you're making
time for the task, they justsort of happen in the little
(18:07):
moments when you're kind of notreally doing anything else.
So that was kind of quite aninteresting take which I think
complements nicely what you'rehearing here, the kind of
follow-up thoughts on my mind iswhether there's also approaches
we could take that involvemaybe taking things away or
taking away, you know, perhapsthey're not going to happen
anyway, but we're kind ofkidding ourselves that they are
(18:29):
and we're going to try and do itall.
And that's why we're sostressed and like the early we
make that kind of painfuldecision that okay, well,
there's no way I'm going to getall this, it's just, there's
just no way the scope of allthis fits into the budget of
time available.
You know, in the early we cankind of make that painful
realization and potentiallypainful prioritization process
and make peace with what we'renot going to do.
(18:50):
The sooner we can we can againstart to bring those stress
levels under control a littlebit.
Yeah, I wondered.
I wondered if you had anythoughts on that idea.
Dr Heather Frederick (18:58):
Absolutely .
First, I'd love to say AnneSwanson is awesome, Lover book
meditation, clearly a ventral,vagal toning exercise.
But I love that you brought upthis idea of adding to a
schedule, because people willoften say well, Heather, of
course, if I had time to takecare of myself I would, but I
don't right.
So there's this thought of it'sgoing to be another thing to do
and my experience is that whenI take care of myself, I expand
(19:23):
time because I make betterdecisions.
It's easier for me to clearlysee, like you're saying, I'm
going to say no to this requestbecause I can see the ways it's
not in line with my currentgoals.
I'm going to set this boundaryand I know you interviewed
Alison Miller who has great,great advice about setting
(19:44):
boundaries.
So again, it feels like you'rehaving to put things in, even if
it's just weaving it in verynaturally, while you're waiting
for your coffee to brew orwhatnot, when you're at a
stoplight.
But again, I challenge yourlisteners when you start taking
care of yourself, do you seethat time seems to expand, that
(20:05):
you get more done on your to-dolist because you're discerning,
you're better able to discernwhat should be on that list,
what should be on that list.
So the saying no, theprioritizing, all those things
are absolutely important andalong those lines of taking away
, sometimes there's things we dothat deplete us.
(20:30):
Like, I'm going to say it,social media, things like
Netflix, Are there things thatyou're participating in, and
this takes a lot of courage.
It takes a lot of courage to beconsciously aware of how you're
engaging with things liketechnology and how it's
(20:50):
impacting you, not just in termsof productivity but in terms of
your emotional state.
So there are.
If you just keep a journal fora week, 10 days, what are the
things that I'm doing that aredepleting me and can I either
reduce it or completely take itout of my life is a huge win in
terms of self-care.
So there's this thought of whatcan I add?
(21:14):
But the flip side of that cointhat you so brilliantly brought
up, William, was and what can Itake away?
They're equally important.
William Wadsworth (21:24):
Yeah, yeah.
It's an interesting question toreflect on and I think
sometimes we're often quitesurprised.
You know, there's the exercisewhich has often surprised me
when you go into the settingssection of your smartphone and
look at the screen usage stats,which are there as standard on
most smartphones that areshipped these days, there as
(21:47):
standard on on most smartphonesthat ship these days, and you
know you, you look at the, thedaily screen time and the
breakdown by app and you think,oh goodness sake, goodness me,
like how did I spend?
Dr Heather Frederick (21:54):
how did that happen?
William Wadsworth (21:55):
right an hour a day, like I thought it was no
time at all, like an hour a dayon youtube or tiktok or
whatever it was.
You know I'm not going to dothat and you know so.
You know quite can be reallyilluminating One of your tips
that I remember reading aboutfor sort of time management and
maybe helping kind of auditthat's how you're using your
(22:19):
time.
You talk about colouring yourtask choices and having sort of
you know, red, green, yellow,grey tasks, tasks.
I wonder if you could maybejust talk a little bit about
that, that exercise yeah.
Dr Heather Frederick (22:31):
So this is , um, something I learned
through mark woods.
He authored a book calledattack your day before it
attacks you and again, these areexercises where they're really
exercises in awareness, beingbeing aware.
So, asking yourself when youremails are coming through, do I
need to stop?
I'm in the middle of a task.
(22:52):
I just got an email.
Am I stopping and reading thatemail, right?
Or can I chunk my email andcheck my email a certain time a
day, certain times each day,versus getting distracted?
And then, when I do check theemail, can I color it or my my
task list so red?
Those are the things.
(23:12):
You have to get them done todayand really, pending the tasks
unless they're easy, simplethings, you really don't want to
have too many reds in one daybecause you're just going to
feel like you failed and youdidn't get everything done that
you write.
So there's this again thisawareness, this realistic, this
realistic approach to how manyhours are there really in a day?
(23:33):
And what Mark Woods wouldrecommend is actually block out
your day in hours.
Well, if I'm going to do yogafor 20 minutes and I'm going to
do check my emails and thatusually takes me two hours, I
and then suddenly you'll see wow, I only have six hours to get
50 things done.
What was I thinking?
And you try to put them in theslots and you so, right away,
(23:53):
you reduce your, your dailyto-do list, and that reduces
overwhelm because you're morerealistic.
But when you color, you don't.
You know the red ones need toget done and you prioritize them
, and so sometimes that may becommunicating to someone.
I got your email.
I'm going to give you athoughtful response.
Please give me three businessdays.
(24:13):
Versus feeling because itwasn't an urgent email.
It was someone who had aquestion.
You absolutely want to get backto them, but with this idea you
can't do everything at once.
If you ask yourself what coloris this task?
Is this something where youknow it's a yellow?
So I need to pay attention, Ineed to set a deadline.
I'm telling them it'll get donein three days.
(24:33):
Is it a green?
Is it some of this ongoingstuff?
Tasks that you do that areongoing, that whether you get it
done this week or next week,isn't really a big deal.
The gray tasks are really theones that tend to revolutionize
how productive we are when wenotice them, and those are the
things like scrolling on socialmedia, binge watching things,
(24:58):
participating in gossip at work,right?
Things that don't bring youtowards the execution of your
goals.
That don't bring you towardsthe execution of your goals.
So really, it comes down topaying attention.
Yes, you've got your to-do list, but look at it realistically.
What can you actually get donetoday and which ones really are
(25:20):
the reds that need to get donetoday?
Movement needs to be done todaybecause your boss is waiting
for that report and they need tosubmit it to the to the board
tomorrow, right?
So it has to get done.
And how can you take some ofthat stress off yourself?
By communicating with the othercolors, with realistic
deadlines.
(25:41):
You know, I think if you're in aposition where you're giving
out tasks, make it clear to yourteam members I'm asking you to
do these 10 things, but Icertainly don't expect them to
be done this week.
If you can prioritize these twoand then we'll meet about the
other eight next week, becauseoften, when you're in a position
where a boss or someone ofauthority is asking you to do
(26:02):
something, they all feel likereds.
So I always like to encouragepeople who are in a position
where they're doling out thetasks to help your employees,
your team members, color them sothey're not feeling overwhelmed
.
If you're in a situation whereyou're all the tasks are being
dumped on you, particularly ifthey're coming from different
(26:22):
sources, then that's where I sayfind your voice and ask for
clarity.
No problem, what's theexpectation here?
Are we talking tomorrow?
Are we talking the first ofnext month?
Again, so that you canprioritize and manage your time.
There's only 24 hours a day andI hope everyone listening to
this is spending a significantamount, you know, six or more
(26:45):
hours resting each of those days.
William Wadsworth (26:50):
Absolutely, absolutely.
So we're kind of starting totake back a little bit of
control of our schedule.
There may be still other thingsthat come up and cause stress.
I think one of the reallyinteresting things I remember
reading in your book, to quote,I think you talk about using ego
shattering feedback to youradvantage and certainly speaking
(27:12):
from personal experience,feedback definitely has the
tendency to be ego shatteringand can turn an otherwise very
productive week into a week fullof disappointment and spinning
around in your head and notgetting an awful lot done and
being fairly unhappy in theprocess.
So I'd love it if you might beable to share any wisdom for us.
When we do get thosedisappointing results, that
(27:33):
feedback from others that makesus feel pretty lousy, how can we
move forward?
Dr Heather Frederick (27:39):
It's hard not to take feedback personal
right, whether it's how you'refolding the laundry, how you're
driving or an essay that youthat you turned in, it's that's
natural.
So know that it's natural tohave that response and then
again have that awareness.
Wait, that just put my body ina state of stress, which means I
(28:00):
may not be thinking clearly.
So some of the tips I like togive when you get feedback like
that is what can you do to resetyour nervous system so that you
can engage with this feedbackin a meaningful way?
One of my favorite quotes isfrom Viktor Frankl and I hope I
get it right.
But it's something like thisBetween stimulus and response
(28:21):
there is a space, and in thatspace is our power to choose our
response, and in our responselies our growth, right?
So stimulus, feedback Now,before you react, react
reflexively, can you stop, takea deep breath, maybe need to go
(28:47):
for a run, take a shower,journal before you respond to
that feedback?
It's a huge time saver.
It's a huge time saver not justbecause you'll be thinking more
clearly if you need to fixsomething in an assignment or a
paper, right, if you need toredo something, but it's a huge
time saver because think aboutthose reactive things that
(29:08):
happen when you get feedback,that create disasters you have
to clean up later.
Right, you were.
You were rude to a coworker,you said terrible things to your
, to your partner.
You shot off an email that, ohmy goodness, you would give
anything to get back now.
So now you're doing damagecontrol because you reacted to
(29:31):
the feedback instead of givingyourself space so that you could
respond to it appropriately andto the best that you can and I
know I get it, it's difficult,but the best that you can
approach feedback with curiosity.
Right, this, this attitudeisn't this interesting.
Hmm, I wonder what I might belearning by this.
(29:53):
Hmm, right, to just againgiving yourself that space so
that you can engage with it in away that um doesn't create more
problems for you.
William Wadsworth (30:04):
A friend of mine talks about.
When you get those emails andyou get that result, when you
get that bit of in-personfeedback, you know, okay, what
was this designed to teach me?
What was this designed to teachme Just what you're saying
there about, okay, how can Ilearn from this?
This is curious.
I like that idea of bringingcuriosity.
So we've talked a bit aboutmanaging schedules and kind of a
(30:26):
very significant challengethere for many of us.
We talked a little bit aboutnavigating the feedback.
I guess are there kind of anyother big sources of stress that
we haven't touched on yet?
We've always talked about theimportance of the self-care and
managing that.
Are there any other sort oflittle ideas around kind of
managing stress that you thinkwould be particularly helpful to
surface to people listeningtoday?
Dr Heather Frederick (30:47):
You know, I think the one thing that we
haven't really touched on, butthat I see a lot, is simply
related to communication.
Sometimes you're under stressbecause you've misunderstood
something.
It could be the feedback thatyou just got, it could be the
expectations that you believepeople have for you, but they
(31:08):
may or may not.
So I know my twins now are incollege and when I visit them
and I see them in moments ofstress and I ask them what's
going on, often I'm saying whydon't you just ask, why don't
you reach out to your professorand say you know what?
I'm reading it this way.
Is this right?
What exactly is due nextTuesday?
(31:30):
And my experience is that peopleare afraid to ask questions
because they think it will look,you know it'll be a dumb
question and people are going togo.
Really, you're asking that.
So I actually have a pot, avery short podcast it's like
less than 10 minutes on calledsomething like how to not ask a
dumb question and basically thatis do your work.
(31:53):
You know, spend a few minutestrying to find the answer, but
my goodness, once you'veattempted to find the answer,
when you don't have the answer,you still don't have the clarity
.
By all means, please ask.
This goes beyond just askingyour faculty member.
Can I get some clarity on whatyou said here or how this rubric
is read?
(32:13):
It really goes to every part oflife.
Someone says something to youthat rubs you the wrong way.
I'm sorry, can you?
What did you just say to me?
Can I ask what you meant bythat?
Because, wow, when you saidthat to me, it made me feel
really yucky.
It made me feel really yuckyinside.
Am I interpreting thiscorrectly?
So asking for clarification,opening up those lines of
(32:36):
communication, I think, isanother way to reduce stress and
find more joy.
Often it's misunderstanding.
There's a lot ofmisunderstanding I see happening
out there.
William Wadsworth (32:48):
I think that's a great point.
Yeah, you don't need to guessyou, you can ask, you can ask
yes so I mean so manyinteresting things.
I I wonder, as we sort of worktowards bringing the
conversation to a close time, asalways is is against us?
Uh, when we're, as so oftenhappens, are we having a great
conversation?
Conversation?
But I was curious, reflectingback on your own time as a
(33:11):
student yourself.
I'm just curious, looking backwith the benefit of hindsight.
What are some of the things youthink you did well, and are
there any particular messagesyou wish you yourself?
Maybe learned a little bitsooner to help you on the
journey.
Dr Heather Frederick (33:26):
I would say that my type A personality
worked for me in the sense thatI'd read the syllabus line by
line, right.
I'd ask for clarification whenit wasn't there because, my
goodness, I wanted to perform, Iwanted to perform, and so
having that diligence worked forme.
At the same time, I'm going tosay if I had to go back and talk
(33:48):
to my younger self as a student, I would have said hey, you
know, there's times that thatpart of your personality, the
wanting to be hyper vigilant, isa great trait as a student.
But, my goodness, you need tochill out sometimes.
You need to chill out.
Sometimes my mom actually tellsa story.
I don't remember it, but shesaid I came home from
(34:09):
kindergarten crying because Ihad missed an item on a spelling
test or something.
So that kind of gives you asense of the type of student I
was.
I really had to do well or myfeelings got hurt.
And so, going back, I think Iwould say to myself you know,
this is a journey, feedback,grades, it's all part of the
(34:34):
process.
It's an adventure where you'regoing to learn what you're good
at, what you like, what you'renot so good at, what you don't
like.
And take it as that Don't justbe focused on that grade.
I think that's how I would sumit up.
I wish I wasn't so focused ongetting the grade.
(34:54):
I wish I had been more focusedon enjoying the experience of
learning, and I hope all yourlisteners out there go.
Hmm, what would my day looklike?
How would my experience bedifferent If I thought about
that, if I thought aboutenjoying the process of learning
something new, learningsomething about myself?
William Wadsworth (35:15):
Definitely important for us all to think
about.
I think Not always easy, notalways easy, but that makes it
sometimes almost.
I think sometimes the best andmost important advice of all is
the kind of harder stuff tothink about and to take.
So, heather, thank you so much.
It's been such an interestingconversation.
We've touched on so many reallyinteresting things.
(35:35):
I'm just curious if anybody'sinterested to learn more about
you and your work.
You mentioned a couple ofthings.
Where might they want to gonext?
Dr Heather Frederick (35:44):
Sure, everything is on my website and
hopefully it's easy to remember.
It's expandyourhappycom, so youcan hop over there and see if
anything resonates.
William Wadsworth (35:55):
Fantastic.
Well, we'll pop that link inthe show notes, along with a
couple of other things you'vementioned along the way today.
And, heather, thank you so muchonce again.
It's been such fun to catch upand looking forward to talking
again soon.
Dr Heather Frederick (36:06):
Yeah, William.
Thank you so much for theinvite and thanks for all the
great work that you're doing aswell.
William Wadsworth (36:13):
Well, heather , thank you once again for your
time today and sharing yourwisdom.
Thank you for coming on theshow.
I've linked your podcast andyour book in the show notes for
anyone who wants to check thoseresources out, especially
relevant if you're pursuing adoctoral program of some kind.
But really, as you've seentoday, has an awful lot that's
(36:34):
relevant for lots of us.
And, as I say, the book, that5.0 star rating definitely not
something you see every day, sowell worth checking out.
Remember, if you use the linksin the show notes on a huge
number of the episodes of theExample Today Expert podcast
where we've suggested particularbooks, if you use those links
to go on and purchase a book,then we are able to earn a small
(36:56):
referral fee which comes at nocost to you, which is a great
little way to support some ofthe costs of making the show for
you.
And if you've been a long timelistener and we've been able to
help you through the podcast,then I'd warmly invite you to
take the step to join our VIPsupporters club over on Patreon.
We have a range of price pointsto support at Really.
(37:18):
That's there to reflect thewide range of financial
circumstances that I know ourlistener base have.
You know I know some of youhave more limited resources as
students yourselves.
You know I know some of youhave more limited resources as
students yourselves.
Others are now on a more stablefooting financially, as perhaps
parents, or you're kind ofgetting established in your
career, so you might be able tosupport at a level that makes
(37:39):
sense to you.
I've kept the main benefits thesame across all different
levels of support, so it's sortof a pay, what you can kind of
model.
You can kind of choose thesupport level that makes sense
to you, that feels appropriateto your financial situation.
But I've kept the kind of corebenefits that you get in terms
of lots of juicy, extra sort ofvideo lessons, downloadables, a
(37:59):
selection of high impact goodiesthat I know you'll love, that
is available just the same foreverybody, no matter what price
point you're supporting at.
To suggest a particular resourcethat ties in well to this
episode and the self-care themein particular, I'd suggest
checking out the Deep Dress forStudents meditation, which was
(38:20):
recorded especially for the examstudy expert community by
Camilla Walker, a really niceway to set down your burden, for
a time to unwind and deeplyrest and refresh yourself.
That's just one of the manynice goodies you'll find in the
vip supporters club over onpatreon.
You can get all of that at uhhead at examstudyexpertscom
(38:43):
forward slash patreon, where youcan learn more and join us
today.
That that's examstudyexpertcomforward slash Patreon.
P-a-t-r-e-o-n.
For now, I just wanted to saythank you, as always, for
listening today.
It's been such a joy to haveyour company and I want to wish
you every success and happinessin your studies.
Speaker 3 (39:05):
Just before you go.
Did you know you can hireWilliam as your very own coach
and mentor to show you thestress-free way to ace your
exams?
By studying smarter, not harder.
Find out how, atexamstudyexpertcom, slash
coaching.
Popular Podcasts
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.