Episode Transcript
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S1 (00:08):
Money is never just about dollars and cents. It's a
window into our hearts, a test of our faith, and
even a testimony to the world. Hi, I'm Rob West.
Few people have taught that truth more faithfully than Ron Blue. Today,
he'll share lessons from his own journey from Wall Street
to biblical stewardship, and how the way we handle finances
transforms us and our relationships with others. And then it's
(00:32):
on to your calls at 800 525 7000. That's 805,
two five 7000. This is faith and finance. Live. Biblical
wisdom for your financial decisions. Well, it's always a special
day when Ron Blue joins us. He's a financial teacher
(00:53):
and author and co-founder of Kingdom Advisors. What makes his
voice so powerful is that he speaks not just from theory,
but from a lifetime of experience. Time and again, Ron
has seen and lived how following God's financial principles can
transform lives in profound ways. Ron, it is truly a
delight to welcome you back to the program.
S2 (01:14):
Thanks, Rob. Good to be with you again as always.
S1 (01:17):
Ron, would you share a bit of your own journey?
How you came to see that God uses money as
a tool to shape us in our walk with Christ?
I know that truth has been at the heart of
your teaching for many years.
S2 (01:28):
Well, you know, I started out on Wall Street and
learned a lot about finance there, and I had an
accounting firm for seven years and did a lot of
personal planning for entrepreneurs and professionals. And then when I
became a Christian and began reading, uh, Larry Burkett's work, uh,
really and some of Howard Dayton's, I began to realize
(01:49):
that everything that worked in the financial world had its
roots in biblical, uh, wisdom. Uh, and so over the
last 40 some years, I've just had a front row
seat to God's work of redemption and restoration in and
through people's lives. And often that occurs, uh, as they
(02:11):
handle money. I believe that money is a revealer of
the heart and an entry to the heart, and is
one of those, uh, kind of bottom line things when
it comes to managing my life. Uh, according to God's wisdom.
Billy Graham said that when you get your attitude about money, right,
(02:32):
the rest of life tends to fall into place.
S1 (02:34):
Well, that's certainly been my experience as well. Now, you
mentioned the late Larry Burkett a moment ago. He often
went a step further, saying that how we handle money
is one of the clearest indicators of a person's spiritual life.
Would you agree with that?
S2 (02:48):
Oh, absolutely. Um, I think that almost every speech I give,
I quote that and say that if you give me
your checkbook and your credit card statements, I can tell
you what your goals, your priorities, your values are. And
I can even see how you spend your time to
some extent. Um, I see how often you go to
(03:09):
the grocery store and which grocery store you want to
go to that you like to shop at. And also
then it reveals, uh, what I give and how I
honor the Lord from the wealth that he's entrusted to me.
So absolutely. I agree with that, Rob.
S1 (03:25):
Ron, before we take our first break, what are some
of the key lessons you've observed over the years as
you've watched men and women put God's principles into practice
with their money?
S2 (03:34):
Well, first of all, I think that they've come to
the conclusion that God owns it all. And that changes
everything about the way that I shape life. I become
a steward as opposed to an owner of the things
that I'm entrusted with. Mhm. I think that another, uh,
thing that happens is that they tend to be content,
(03:56):
and they are content because they have an eternal perspective.
And they know they know where they're headed, and they
know that there will be ups and downs relative to
this life and money. Yeah. Um, but they're content with
where they are. Uh, and they trust God and his wisdom, uh,
to give them the wisdom to make the financial decisions, uh, that, uh,
(04:19):
are true to his word. They they believe, in other words,
that God, uh, is interested in their financial life will
give them wisdom and guidance and direction. Uh, he will, uh,
always he says, I will never leave you nor forsake you. Uh,
and that comes with, uh, with money. Uh, I've learned
(04:39):
that when, uh, husbands and wives talk about money, uh,
that it's one of those things that can be either
a barrier to their communication in life together, or it
can be a unifier.
S1 (04:52):
Yes.
S2 (04:52):
And once they learn how to talk about money, they
they solve a lot of communication problems.
S1 (05:00):
That's exactly right. Well, you just described is what everyone
longs for contentment, peace of mind and stronger communication. And
that's the result when we live by God's truth. We'll
unpack more of this right after the break. You're listening
to Faith and finance live. I'm Rob West, and we'll
be right back with more from our guest, Ron Blue.
Don't go anywhere. When you accept Jesus Christ as your
(05:36):
Lord and Savior, every part of your life begins to change,
sometimes in ways you don't even realize. And one of
those areas is your approach to money. God's money, which
he entrusts to us to manage to share how that
truth transformed his own life. We're joined today by author
and teacher Ron Blue. Ron, just before the break, you
were talking about the reality that when we recognize God
(05:59):
owns it all, it changes everything. Not just how we
view money, but also how we relate to the Lord himself.
One of the themes you've emphasized for many years is
answering the question, how much is enough? And that's such
a crucial part of this journey. Would you share with
us what happens, the fruit you've seen when someone embraces
(06:20):
that truth and begins to define their financial finish line?
S2 (06:24):
Well, when you set a finish lines, you know when
you've arrived. And if you don't set finish lines, you
never stop. And I think the two biggest areas of
finish lines and financial freedom really are what's the lifestyle
that I want to choose? You know, we mentioned a
(06:45):
time or two, the two Harvard MBAs that said finish
lines on their lifestyle before they left Harvard. They did it.
They did it right. And consequently, when they receive rewards
for what they do, they know how much to keep
and how much to give. I think setting a finish line,
even on accumulation is important. So that I know. I
(07:07):
know when enough is enough. Yes. In fact, from a
worldly perspective, uh, enough is never enough. Okay. Right. From
God's perspective, uh, there is an answer to the question.
How much is enough? Yeah. And it will give you
great freedom when you set those finish lines.
S1 (07:25):
The truth is, when you start walking by faith, including
in your finances, it changes your goals, even your financial goals. So, Ron,
how have you seen the goal setting process shift when
someone truly embraces God's ownership?
S2 (07:40):
Well, when you recognize God's ownership, uh, and you establish
a lifestyle, and then you begin to think long term
about what you would like to do financially, You find,
first of all, that you can't accomplish anything unless you
have some financial margin in your life. So when you
recognize that you're handling God's money and that he has
(08:02):
plans for you, uh, it changes the way that you
manage the money that he entrusts you to have. Uh,
it changes, perhaps even your thinking relative to, uh, education.
I think one of the biggest decisions that parents have
to make is do they provide a Christian education or
(08:24):
send them to a Christian school, or do homeschool or
public schools? And public schools are not wrong by any means,
but money is just a tool to be used to
accomplish God's purposes.
S1 (08:36):
Yeah.
S2 (08:37):
And he calls me to be salt and light in
this world. Uh, and therefore when people look at me,
they should not see someone better, but they should see
someone different. Different priorities. Different values. Different goals. Different objectives
with the resources that God has entrusted to me.
S1 (08:57):
So everything changes. And you mentioned a moment ago that
it can even transform communication in marriage. But what about
when only one spouse has embraced this? Maybe one has
invited the Lord into their financial life while the other
isn't on board, which creates real tension around money. How
have you counseled couples in that situation to move forward together?
S2 (09:19):
First of all, my mentor, Doctor Howard Hendricks, said, God
did not give you a spouse to frustrate you. And
what he was reflecting was the fact that we're two
different people. We've been raised differently, and our values are different.
And so we have to learn to live together, and
we live together out of one checkbook, typically. Plus it changes, uh,
(09:42):
a lot of other things. I, uh, yesterday I got
a call, for example, from somebody that I've known for years.
And she said, you know, you changed my life by
the advice you gave me when I was in my
first marriage, when you gave me counsel. And I said, well,
what did I say? And I said, look, God needs
your marriage to work more than he needs your money.
(10:05):
She wanted to tithe. He wasn't saved. He didn't want
to tithe. So I said, you need to honor your marriage. Uh,
as probably the higher priority. Uh, God has all the
money he needs. And she said he still gives testimony
to how that changed his way. That he viewed, uh,
(10:26):
the savior. So, uh, it can really change everything in
our marriage relationship. You know, you had Judy. She got
saved before I did it, and she wanted to tithe
off the income that I was earning. I'm not sure
I'd have ever even looked at the gospel because it
would have been such a threat. to what I was
(10:46):
attempting to achieve.
S1 (10:47):
Even though Judy was a believer and you shared the
same faith, Ron, I have to imagine that over the years,
even as you were writing all those books that now
sit on people's shelves, you two didn't always see eye
to eye on money. I'm sure there was some growth
and learning along the way, maybe even mostly on your end.
That had to be a part of your journey, right?
S2 (11:09):
You couldn't couldn't be more true, Judy and I. Uh,
we've communicated, but we have a financial advisor. And the
reason we have a financial advisor is I required all
of our client managers to have an advisor. And the
reason is, a third party facilitator may not tell you
(11:32):
something new about money, as in my case, but he
sure did help the communication between Judy and I. Uh,
and just having him sit in on a meeting where
we talked about money, uh, really facilitated a better relationship
when it came to money. And I always counseled people.
(11:53):
It's not his money. It's not her money. It's God's money. Yeah.
And the way you spend money and the way you
communicate about money says an awful lot about your marriage.
S1 (12:02):
Yeah.
S2 (12:03):
It can be a great help to your marriage, or
it can be a great barrier to your marriage.
S1 (12:08):
That's right. Ron, we've got just a couple of minutes left.
You've written in more than one book that money is
a tool. And you touched on that earlier. But you've
said it's a test and a testimony. Can you briefly
explain what you mean by those two?
S2 (12:22):
Well, Paul said, I've learned to be content. I've learned
how to have a little and I've learned how to
have a lot. So a lot of times God uses
money to test. And actually, I would say to build
my faith.
S1 (12:35):
Yeah.
S2 (12:36):
Uh, and so it can be a test. Um, And secondly,
it without question is a testimony. Because what it's how
I live, how I treat money, how generous I am,
how content I am is a incredible testimony to the
(12:56):
rest of the world. And I think right now, in
the culture we live in, if I can demonstrate contentment, confidence, peace, joy,
good communication, the world would look at that and say, wow,
money must. If money speaks to somebody's life like that
and it works, then does it speak to all of
(13:17):
my life?
S1 (13:18):
Yes.
S2 (13:18):
And so I look at money as maybe being an
evangelistic and discipleship tool.
S1 (13:23):
It's also a testimony to the next generation, as our
children watch us hold money with an open hand and
discover the joy of biblical financial stewardship. Ron, thanks so
much for being with us today.
S2 (13:35):
Oh, always a joy. Thank you for having me.
S1 (13:37):
If you'd like to dig deeper into how biblical financial
principles can transform your life. Check out Ron's best selling book,
Master Your Money a step by step plan for experiencing
financial contentment. You can find his books wherever you buy books,
and you can't go wrong with any of them. Your
calls are next. 800 525 7000. That's 800 525 7000.
(14:01):
And if you prefer not to call, keep in mind
you can always send us an email and ask Rob
at Faith 5.com. That's ask Rob at Faith the letters
f i.com I'm Rob West and this is faith in
finance live. Biblical wisdom for your financial decisions. We'll be
right back after this break.
S3 (14:34):
The opinions offered during this program represent the personal or
professional opinions of the participants given for informational purposes only.
Any information provided is not intended to replace advice from
a financial, medical, legal or other professional who understands your
specific situation.
S1 (14:58):
Great to have you with us today on faith and
finance live. What a treat to have Ron Blue here today.
You know, Ron is one of my mentors, uh, the
founder of Kingdom Advisors, one of the founders of the
National Christian Foundation, uh, Ron has written more than 20
books on biblical finance. He and Larry Burkett and Howard
Dayton really, along with, uh, Randy Alcorn, I would consider
(15:21):
kind of the fathers of modern, uh, personal finance as
it relates to a biblical perspective. They've written and taught
and spoken on the topic probably more than anyone. And
if you haven't read Master Your Money, it's a game changer.
You know, it was really one of those books for
me that really set me on the course professionally toward
(15:41):
the intersection of faith and finance in college. And it's
a classic. You certainly should pick up a copy. You
can buy it wherever you buy books. But, you know,
we recognize that as we think about biblical money management,
it really begins with an understanding that God owns it all.
I mean, that is the bedrock to everything we do
(16:03):
as Christ followers, as stewards of what God has entrusted
to us, accepting our role not as owner. And it's
not the 10% belongs to God, and 90% is ours
because we've worked hard for it. No, it's all his.
And our job is to be found faithful. And so
each day we want to encourage you in that, give
you some wise counsel, remind you that we're not always
(16:25):
going to get it right, but that when we work
together in community, we can really seek to be found
faithful as stewards so that we can each hear those
words one day when we stand before the Lord. Well done,
good and faithful servant. That's our goal each day. By
the way, if you have some questions today, we'd love
to hear from you. We do have some lines open.
You can call 800 525 7000. Again, that number is
(16:49):
800 525 7000. Uh, a lot going on in the
news today. Um, but, uh, we wanted to begin with
just a reminder for you. Uh, you know, if you
visit nearly any online store, you'll see the same tricks.
Only one left in stock. Just two left. Have you
seen that recently? You know, these scarcity cues are no accident.
(17:13):
They're part of a strategy called scarcity marketing. And it
taps into our primal instinct to act quickly when resources
seem limited. Well, studies published in Frontiers in Psychology demonstrate
that scarcity increases urgency. It overrides rational thought. So when
we see messages like only three left order soon. The amygdala,
(17:36):
the brain's fear and impulse center, lights up. And it
pushes us toward an emotional purchase. And behavioral economists recognize
this phenomenon that happens when something appears rare. We assume
it's more valuable or higher quality. And even when identical
(17:56):
substitutes exist and retailers exploit exploit this with countdown timers
and flash sales and even, quote low stock alerts, each
designed to trigger loss aversion. Our fear of missing out FOMO.
These tactics then flood the brain with dopamine, the same
reward chemical linked to gambling, and it creates excitement and urgency.
(18:18):
And you know, while not all this scarcity is fake,
many online tactics manipulate perception to drive sales fast. So
what's the best defense? Well, pause before purchasing. Wait 24
to 48 hours before checking out. Recognize that most urgency
cues are manufactured, and the thoughtful delay can protect both
(18:40):
your wallet and your peace of mind. Let me finish
with this. As Christ followers, we're called to live from abundance,
not anxiety or scarcity. Jesus reminds us in Matthew six
that our father knows what we need, and when we
trust his provision, well, we're freed from fear of missing
out and we can spend intentionally aligned with our values,
(19:01):
seeking first his kingdom instead of chasing the next limited
time offer. I hope that's an encouragement to you the
next time you see one of these scarcity tactics. All right,
let's dive into your questions today. I'm ready. The lines
are filling up, so we'll get to as many as
we can. Uh, Wyoming's where we're headed first. Hi, Mary.
Go ahead.
S4 (19:20):
Hi. How are you?
S1 (19:21):
I'm doing great. Thanks for your call.
S4 (19:23):
Okay, so I was wondering about reverse mortgage, and if
I get if I what's involved. And if I did
something like that, would my, um, creditors come after me
for money that I owe? You know what I'm saying?
S1 (19:44):
I do, but let me clarify what's going on. Do
you have some accounts that are in collection status or
charge off? What's your situation?
S4 (19:53):
They're not in the collection status. They are. This. This, um,
company is working with me. They're taking so much, so
much every month. They set it aside, and they've already
settled one of my, um, accounts with US bank. But
there's two left that they're working with that they're trying
(20:14):
to settle.
S5 (20:15):
All right.
S4 (20:16):
Well, about that.
S5 (20:18):
Yeah, it's.
S1 (20:19):
A good question.
S5 (20:20):
Um, you know.
S1 (20:21):
Let me just say, first and foremost, not to scare you,
but debt settlement, these programs that you're describing are really
not my preferred option. There is a lot of bad
actors in this space. I'm certainly not saying the one
that you're working with is, but there are a good
many of them, and usually their strategy is to stop paying,
get you into an arrears status, possibly a collection status,
(20:46):
even a charge off status. And then they use that
to come in and try to, uh, you know, settle
in full and secure a lower payoff. But unfortunately, it
trashes your credit in the process. Um, in terms of
the reverse mortgage specifically, that doesn't automatically trigger any kind of, uh,
demand payment. When you take out a reverse mortgage, it's
(21:09):
secured by your home, not your credit cards. The money
you receive doesn't go to your credit card lenders unless
you choose to use it that way. So simply getting
a reverse mortgage doesn't alert or obligate you for any
kind of collection right away. But again, you know, depending
on how they're approaching this in terms of the negotiating
(21:29):
of those settlements. And if you got a lump sum,
creditors could see that as a reason to push for
higher settlements. And as a part of you qualifying for
a reverse mortgage, they are going to pull your credit.
So you just need to be aware of the implications
of the strategies that they're using. If in fact, these
these accounts are becoming past due while they're negotiating them.
(21:53):
I hope that helps. Thanks for your call. We'll be
right back. Great to have you with us today on
Faith and Finance Live. Let me mention one thing here
in the middle of October as we're headed quickly toward
the end of the year. And I'm not trying to
(22:14):
rush it. I want to enjoy the season with you.
But I also know, as a listener supported ministry here
at Faith five, we rely on your generous gifts and
especially year end, where we're trying to close out the
year and prepare for all that we believe God has
for us in 2026. A new devotional coming out from
me called Our Ultimate Treasure. I am so excited about it! Uh,
(22:37):
it's the 21 bottom lines that I think God's people
need to understand how to manage God's money God's way.
You know, if I distill down all the things I've
shared over the years, these are kind of the 21
really central ideas, and we've built it out as a
21 day devotional, so you can focus on one each day.
I can't wait to put it in your hands. A
(22:59):
brand new Faith fi app coming, and boy, what the
team is building is just incredible as we really allow
the technology to do, uh, the money management for you
in the sense that it's going to do all the
budgeting work behind the scenes so you can just see
the information you need to make, the decisions you need
to make. And we integrate all the content in plus
(23:23):
new daily, weekly and monthly Rhythms to really check in
to see how you're doing spiritually as you're managing the money.
And I think it's just going to be a game changer.
Think of it like financial discipleship on your smartphone. That's
going to be the new Faith fi app that's coming
next year. Uh, of course, new studies and devotionals, just
(23:43):
some incredible resources we're going to be able to put
in your hands. But none of that happens without your support.
So if you love the ministry, maybe you've been blessed
by one of the episodes or you listen regularly, you've
been able to apply something you'd you've heard. We would
encourage you to consider a gift here at year end,
whether that's appreciated stock a one time gift, or, uh,
(24:04):
if you want to consider becoming a partner, we'd be
grateful for that as well. And you'll learn about all
of it when you go to faith. That's faith. And
thanks in advance. All right, back to the phones, Ohio. Logan,
how can we help?
S6 (24:22):
Hey, Rob. How, uh, how how can this younger generation, uh,
build wealth? What are some techniques, strategies, and how can
we stay motivated and positive about it when this, uh,
generation isn't really like that?
S1 (24:40):
Yeah. Yeah. Uh, you know, a couple of thoughts. Um,
you know, I love the fact that you're thinking about
this now, um, and I can understand that you might
feel like the headlines act like the deck is stacked
against you, but I think, you know, number one, we
need to recognize that, uh, first of all, we need
(25:01):
to live out a biblical worldview of handling money. And,
you know, that applies at every age. But we need
to understand that money really is a tool to accomplish
God's purposes. And so I think from just a practical
money management standpoint, you need to focus on what you
can control. You can't control the markets, inflation, elections, the
(25:26):
tax code, uh, you know, any of those things. But
what you can control is your spending. Is it aligned
with your values and priorities, including your giving, your saving,
those kinds of things that you get to do with
God's money entrusted to you. And I would say we
need to build a spending plan that allows you to
live below your means. So that leaves room for generosity
(25:49):
and saving and strategic investing every month. I would say
start early and stay consistent. And so the earlier you
begin investing, the more compound growth works in your favor.
Even modest monthly contributions grow dramatically over time, and whenever possible,
do it through a 401 K or a Roth IRA,
(26:09):
and don't stop when the markets dip. Because remember, the
markets go through cycles. And you know, we've seen these
average annual returns of, you know, 910% a year over
long periods of time. Even despite 1929 1987, the.com bubble burst.
(26:29):
2008 2009 The housing and financial crisis. Uh, you know,
the once in a hundred year pandemic. I mean, all
of these things put together and the market always recovers,
always moves to new highs. And, you know, there's some
real exciting things going on right now despite our challenges.
I think some of the policies of President Trump in particular,
(26:51):
are paving the way for a robust economy in the future.
Deregulating the tax code changes. Um, you know, some of
the things going on there, uh, I think he the
fact that he's pro-crypto is helpful. I also think AI
is kind of a, you know, a new opportunity here
that is going to drive greater productivity than we've ever
(27:12):
heard before or ever seen before, which is going to
help to overcome some of the challenges we have. Just
in terms of Demographics. I think some one other thing,
you know, that's really exciting is just the the intersection
of this new generation, in particular Gen Z, their desire
for impact even more than a paycheck, and simultaneously, the
(27:36):
growth of faith based investing, where you can now invest
in a way that solves real problems and promotes human flourishing,
and really is a way to love our neighbor and
get a good return at the same time. And I
think the combination of the wealth transfer, this new generation
and their desire to return to faith and their desire
(27:57):
for impact, combined with the maturing of the faith based
investing space where you can deploy capital in a way that,
you know, advances God's redemptive work in the world, pre,
you know, his return, I think, is a really exciting opportunity.
So let me finish by saying, and I know I'm
kind of been long winded on this, um, every generation
(28:19):
faces its challenges. But those who stay disciplined, I would say,
understand that God owns it all. Trust in him as provider.
Keep a long term perspective and really keep an eternal
perspective of handling God's money. Um, I think we'll do
quite well, and I don't think there's an exception. Even
(28:40):
despite what we're what we're seeing play out before our
eyes right now. Does that all make sense, though?
S6 (28:46):
Yes, sir. Thank you very much.
S1 (28:47):
All right. Hey, let me ask you, what is your situation?
First of all, what is your age?
S6 (28:54):
I'm 23.
S1 (28:56):
Okay, good. Um, I want to send you a resource
that I think you will enjoy. Um, that will take
you into some of these things that I just talked
about in terms of understanding God's heart as it relates
to money. Some of the kind of nuances of starting
to save and give and invest and and Roth IRAs,
(29:16):
but all from a biblical perspective. And it's called Open
Hands Finance. And it was written by a couple who,
at Taylor University, started a small group with, uh, some
of their, you know, peers at Taylor and really just
have a gift and an interest in this area of
biblical money management. And they created this workbook, if you will,
(29:39):
and there's podcasts that go with it. And they did
a fabulous job with it. And I think, you know,
it's really geared towards somebody in their early 20s. And
it's not only going to deal with all the essential
topics you need, but it's all going to come from
a biblical perspective. So if you'll stay on the line, Logan,
we'll send you open Hands Finance. I think you'll enjoy it.
It's our gift to you. And if you have questions
(30:01):
that comes up that come up along the way, please
don't hesitate to reach out. Lord bless you. Thanks for
being on the program today. Well, folks, uh, we're going
to take a break there. I promise I'll, uh, I'll
be a little quicker on these next few because we've got, uh,
lines stacked up here. When we come back, we're going
to talk to David in Nashville about crypto. He wants
to know whether it's a good investment right now. Uh,
(30:23):
Nancy's in Florida, David and Georgia. And perhaps your question
at 800 525 7000. Also, uh, Jerry Bowyer is going
to stop by. We'll get, uh, Jerry's take on the
markets before we round out the show today and find
out what's moving those markets. So still a lot more
to come. This is faith and finance live. I'm Rob West.
(30:44):
We're trying to give you biblical wisdom for your financial decisions.
Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back. Hey, I'm so
(31:04):
glad you're with us today. Here in our final segment,
Jerry Bowyer is here. We will be headed back to
the phones here in just a moment. But first, Jerry, uh, boy,
a lot move in the markets. Uh, although, as you
and I talked earlier, whether it's the banks or China
or any of these other concerns, it seems like they're
all intertwined, aren't they?
S7 (31:23):
Yeah. I mean, the big picture is the, you know,
the trade war and the fed. Right. Um, both basically
kind of government things. Government is in charge of the markets.
So I know a lot of people like to say
the markets are moving around and gosh, isn't our markets,
you know, irrational. Uh, we need to put government in
charge of things. Well, markets are moving around because governments
(31:44):
already have too much power. Uh, so, um, in this
particular case, what we have is, um, you know, the
central bank was really easy for a long time. It
created a lot of inflation. It also probably created some
misallocation of resources. So some banks made some decisions. Regional banks. Um,
and there's almost like an inverse relationship between money supply
(32:06):
and prudence. You know, it's a little bit like, um,
you know, uh, someone once said to the fed chairman,
what do you at a at a party? He said.
What do you do for a living? The woman said,
and he pointed at the punch bowl. And he says,
when the party gets going too much, I take the
punch bowl away. Uh, so, you know, when there's a
lot of money flowing, the banks get a little dumber.
(32:26):
And it looks like some, maybe some of the regional
banks made some mistakes. And so maybe we'll have a
problem with, um, regional banks and when when something goes
wrong with a regional bank, then people look at other
regional banks and then maybe something wrong there, and it
can kind of cascade. Um, so that makes it very likely.
The central bank knows that, the fed knows that. So
it makes it much more likely that they're going to
(32:47):
pump more money into the system. Uh, and that's probably
one of the main reasons why markets are up. The
other main reason is because in the trade war back
and forth with China, the president today basically said something like, well,
we really can't keep going on like this. This is unsustainable.
So that's him saying that he doesn't want to have
a prolonged trade war with China. So markets are up.
(33:08):
And that's a good reason for the markets to be up.
You know, kind of removing some uncertainty, having more trade,
having more growth. It's not a good reason for the
markets to be up, because the central bank's going to
pump more money into the system. So it's kind of
a mixture of good reasons and bad reasons. In general,
you know, gold's gotten really high recently. So when markets
are high and gold is also high, which is kind
(33:29):
of an inflation hedge, that usually means that it's not
mainly an economic growth story. It's mainly an easy money story.
S1 (33:38):
Yeah. All right. Jerry. Well, uh, it seems like, uh,
you know, it continues this narrative, uh, around what moves
these markets and is not always a good thing. But
I appreciate you shedding some light on at least how
we should think about it. And, um, we'll, uh, we'll
see how it plays out. Uh, one good news that
came out last night. I guess it was. Or maybe
(33:59):
it was two nights ago and the Wall Street Journal
was related to proxy advising. And I know not a
lot of people understand how this works, but you had
a role in this, and I think this is a
big deal. Share this quickly with our audience.
S7 (34:10):
Yeah. So these are the organizations that you've never heard
of that have such a tremendous influence on corporate America.
So when you're a shareholder, then you have a vote.
When you invest with a fund, a Blackrock, Vanguard, State
Street or Christian Fund or whatever. You give your vote
to them. So they have to vote on things like
who should be the board of directors, what should their
(34:31):
pay package be? Um, and on these various shareholder proposals,
which are often driven by political activism. Now the asset managers,
that's not their area of expertise. They're there to make
investment decisions, not to know how to vote on these
confusing and complex issues. So this expert class grew up
of proxy advisory services, and they say whether you should
(34:53):
vote for or against Elon Musk's package, uh, pay package.
Or they say, you know, whether you should vote for
or against some proposal that's trying to get a company
to divest from Israel or to divest from pro-life states.
Or today we had a meeting with Apple about, you know,
there's a proposal there that's telling Apple you need to
be a lot more careful about exposing children to pornography. Well,
(35:14):
these proxy advisory services, they decide whether you vote for
or against that. By the way, they they both the
big ones voted against, recommended to vote against holding Apple
accountable for child sexual abuse material so they don't always
get it right. Well, one of them, Glass Lewis, said,
you know what? We're not going to make recommendations anymore.
We're going to go back to the investors and we're
(35:36):
going to say there's different approaches that you can take.
You can be pro or anti ESG. You can align
with the United Nations or you can align with the unions,
or you can rubber stamp whatever management says, or you
can do what the people at Boyer Research say, which
is to vote against the ESG and Dei and more
focused on shareholder returns. And they no longer have an opinion.
They're not a restaurant, they're a food court. That is
(35:59):
definitely a step in the right direction. The other one,
the bigger one, ES, has not done that, at least
not yet. I don't know if they will, but this
is moving more towards consumer choice, and this is the
way Christians can be kind of taking their vote back.
Because you if you're an investor, you're voting, you probably
don't know you're voting. You probably don't know how you voted.
(36:19):
You probably don't know how you voted on on that
Apple thing that I mentioned about child sexual abuse material.
But you did if you if you're in a, in
a fund that owns Apple, and this is an opportunity
to get a little bit more control back to investors.
S1 (36:34):
And in most cases, if you did know how you voted,
you probably wouldn't be happy about it. So this is
definitely a step in the right direction. Jerry, I know
you've been out leading the way on this, so thanks
for your work, my friend.
S7 (36:45):
Yeah, for most people who are listening to this show
right now, you probably would not be happy with the
way your money is being voted.
S1 (36:51):
Yeah that's right. Well, that can all change now. And
that's in part due to your great work. Hey, have
a great weekend, my friend.
S7 (36:58):
Same to you.
S1 (36:59):
All right, that's Jerry Bowyer. He's our resident economist. Let's
try to sneak a few more questions in here before
we round out the show today. Nashville, Tennessee. Hi, David.
Go ahead.
S8 (37:08):
Hey, um, thanks for taking my call. This is a
real confusing time in the monetary area, as I'm not
telling you anything you don't already know. I'm, uh, curious.
I've been studying quite heavily. Exactly what this, uh, electronic
coins are about. And, you know, with Trump behind it
(37:29):
and several others coming out and, uh, the, uh, ability
to move money without a huge charge like banks give you,
and the same thing with the security, uh, codes, etc.,
that they're coming out with, it looks like that's moving
in the right direction. And I would like any comments
(37:50):
or suggestions you might have.
S1 (37:52):
Yeah. Well, there's a lot to talk about here and
we just have a little bit of time. But what
I would say is, you know, this idea that, uh,
you know, the We would see, um, this takeover as
a means of exchange. Um, you know, really is not
(38:13):
something I don't think that's going to pan out. Um,
but what I will say is that, you know, Bitcoin
clearly stands apart from the rest of the crypto industry,
and it's reached critical mass, and it appears to be
here to stay. And that's in large part due to
the regulatory environment that is completely reversed from being hostile
(38:34):
to being welcoming. Uh, and we've seen institutional adoption because
now we have Bitcoin ETFs so the big institutions can
buy it. Um, and so as a result of that,
I think there is something to be said about Bitcoin
acting kind of like a digital gold of sorts, where
you might, you know, include it as a part of
(38:55):
your gold allocation. And usually there's a generational line there
between those who are interested in it and those who
don't want to touch it. Um, with regard to, you know,
how they might invest in it. But I would say
for those who might want to, you know, if you
had a 5% allocation to gold, you might want to
take 1% and put it in Bitcoin. Or if you
(39:17):
had a 10%, maybe 2%, because it is still quite volatile. Um,
but if you're comfortable with digital assets, I think it has,
you know, a lot of the appeal of gold as
a store of value because it's there's this there's scarcity
built into the DNA of Bitcoin. And and so I
think there is something to be said about that. I
(39:37):
would also say that blockchain, I don't think is is
going anywhere. And there's pretty wide reaching, uh, applications for
blockchain well beyond even just in the, in the financial space. Um,
so I think for that reason, you know, it's something
worth looking at. But I would make it a very
small piece of your portfolio just because it is so volatile.
(39:59):
There were many that hoped it would become an independent
currency that people could buy and sell outside the normal
government money system. That view is mostly dead at this point. Um,
but I think there is something to be said about
at least Bitcoin, uh, you know, acting as a part
of your gold allocation. Um, at this point. And I
think as long as you can stomach the volatility. So
(40:22):
hopefully that at least gets you thinking in the right
direction here. David, uh, I'd love to to talk much
further about this in the future. So don't hesitate to
call back if you have other questions. Thanks for being
on the program today. Let's finish up in Florida today. Hi, Nancy.
Go ahead.
S9 (40:36):
Hi. Good afternoon. My question is my husband is 65.
He he retired already and 66. I'm still working. And
my question is, I think I heard you last year.
Somebody called with the same question that you can collect.
What is equal to half of the spouse, um, Social Security.
(40:59):
but you have to be 60 and older. Is that true?
S1 (41:03):
Uh, yes. So he is already collecting his Social Security,
is that right?
S9 (41:10):
Yes.
S1 (41:12):
Okay. Yeah. And and so, yes. Um, you can file
over the age of 62 if your husband is already
collecting benefits. Um, and so you could get up to
half of your husband's full retirement benefit. Not what he
gets if he filed early, but in order to get
(41:34):
the full 50% of his full retirement age benefit, you
would have to wait till your full retirement age to
begin collecting it. So if you took it at 62, um,
it would be permanently reduced. So the most you can get, um,
is is 50%. And then they would back it down
based on the fact that you took it early. Does
(41:56):
that make sense?
S9 (41:59):
Yes. Okay, so it's not 60.
S1 (42:04):
Uh, no, it's 62. And you would get a reduced amount.
So for instance, with the full benefit, you're the max
you could get if you waited until full retirement age
would be 50% of your your husband's full retirement age benefit.
But if you took it at 62, instead of getting 50%
of that amount, you'd get about 30% because you took
(42:26):
it early. Um, so the only way to max it
out and get that full 50% is to not take
it at 62 and wait until full retirement age, which
for you is probably 67. Hope that helps. Nancy, thanks
for your call today. That's going to do it for us.
Big thanks to my team today. They are amazing. Got
some wonderful folks like Dan and Tara and Taylor and Josh.
(42:49):
Everybody here at Faith by Faith is a partnership between
Moody Radio and Faith by. Have a great weekend. Bye bye.