January 29, 2025 • 31 mins
Something a little different this time around. We're not talking to another tattoo artist today - we're diving deep with Jenny Chambers, a serious tattoo collector who's got stories that'll make you see this whole world differently. In the current tattoo climate, it's not just about finding an artist who can slap some ink on you - it's about building relationships, understanding the craft, and respecting the process.
When Jenny talks about collecting work from legends like Jeff Gogue, Phil Garcia, and Ande Chambers, she's not just name-dropping - she's sharing a journey that most people never get to see. This isn't your typical "hey, I got a tattoo" story. This is about the real hustle, the behind-the-scenes grind that happens before that needle ever touches skin. So buckle up, because we're about to break down tattoo collecting in a way you've never heard before.
CLICK HERE, to read the deep dive into Jenny's conversation:
https://www.firesidetattoo.com/tattoo-library/-the-tattoo-collectors-perspective-jenny-chambers-ep-288~29272
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Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hey, welcome back to the fireside.My name is Jake.
Happy to have you here.
We are back againthis week with another episode
from the Richmond Tattoo,an arts fest of 2024.
I think this is our third episodefrom that show.
We got a couple more to go.This one is pretty unique.
It's different than what we normally do.
We are not talking to a tattooer today.
(00:20):
We are instead, talking to a tattoo collector.
Our guest today is Jenny Chambers.
And I met Jennybecause she is married to Andy Chambers,
who is a good friend of mineand who is actually doing my back piece.
And if you've watched this showfor any period of time,
then you've probably seen Andya time or two.
We've, we've worked together a good bit.
Jenny is a, a real tattoo collector.
(00:43):
She has collected work from some really,really great artists.
I won't remember them all,but folks like Jeff Gogue, Phil Garcia,
obviously Ande Chambers, Paul Acker,I believe Timmy
B bunch of bunch of really high level,high level tattooers.
And so I thought it would be interestingto get her perspective on what it's like
(01:06):
to work with so many high level tattooersand what their kind of commonalities were
and what their big differences were,how they worked.
You know, things like that.
We also diveinto a handful of other subjects.
And, Ande I've been married a long time,so she has seen the evolution
of the tattoo industryin a lot of different ways,
and the boththe good sides and the bad sides.
(01:26):
And so she has her own thoughtsand opinions on that.
And, it was fun to just to hear her ideasand to sit down and talk.
And while we're on the topicof the chambers
family,this is a good opportunity to mention
that both Andyand I believe Jenny are going to be
at this year's, Fireside Yacht Clubtrip in June, and you should come to.
There are only five spots availablefor artists.
(01:46):
Fireside Yacht Club, if you're notfamiliar, is, an event that I hold.
And I bring you to actually stayand hang out on my boat
in GreersFerry Lake, in Heber Springs, Arkansas.
And it's a beautiful lake.
The boat is a 43ft Silverton motor yacht.
And, we go out and we do dinner cruisesand we paint and we draw.
(02:08):
There are cliff jumping,there's jet skis, there's swimming.
There's all kinds of stuff.It's not like a regular lake.
It's a very beautiful,
crystal clear lake with a lot of sheercliffs and beautiful, beautiful landscape.
We get to watch the sunset.
We, we'll do some hiking.
There's a really beautifulwaterfall nearby
that we'll go and draw and paint from.
And Andy is going to be helping out.
(02:30):
He's going to come in as a
as an instructor and,share some of his knowledge
on illustration, design, illustrativetattooing and things like that.
Only five spots available.
I don't know how many are left right now,but I have, left a link in the video
description and there's probably somethingthat's popping up while I'm talking.
You should check it out and, jump in.
It's a really a great dealand a lot of fun.
(02:50):
And you'll make some new friends,I guarantee.
So that's it. Let's get to the episode.
About.
The sauce.
First time.
So excited I am delighted. Yeah, yeah.
So this is actually a prettyspecial episode because we don't get
I don't talk to a lot of peoplewho just have really awesome tattoos. Yes.
(03:12):
You know, I talked to a lot of peoplewho do really awesome tattoos.
Lucky guy. Yeah. That is yeah.
But I don't talk to a lot of peoplewho get really awesome tattoos
on a regular basis.
So we start, with, like
who all besides your husband,who I probably told in the intro
who your husband is,so I won't go through it again.
Besides your husband, do all.
Have you been tattooed by.
(03:34):
All right.
So I've been tattooed by Jeff.
Gogue Yeah.
Timmy B, sketchy lawyer.
All right.I've been tattooed by Nate Beavers.
I've been tattooed by, Phil Garcia.
Garcia? Yeah.
And it's crazy.
Yeah, that's a real list.
(03:54):
I tell me about it.
I'm cool.
I, I like collecting,so those would be that, too.
Oh, and Val.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, yeah. No valleys, dude. Yeah. Sweet.
So how.
I mean, I guess
because you're you're married to Andeand he's that, known tattooer
for quite a while now. Like, what is it?
I don't know if you can come up with any,like, examples of, like, differences
(04:16):
and just approachingreally high level tattooers
and getting on their books or any of that.
Have you had any, like,like from one person to another?
I know you want to shit talk anybody who'sterrible at their processes, but okay.
Do you have any like,
we'll start there, kind of move throughthe whole process of a tattoo as well.
Let's see.
I've done it the wrong wayand I've done it the right way.
(04:38):
So I would say the wrong wayis, for example, Jeff Gogue.
So the first time that I got to go outand Meet him, I asked him
if if he would be willing to tattoome and and he wasn't necessarily
right off the bat like, yes,I will totally tattoo you.
And so he said, well,you know, we'll talk about it.
And I kind of wore him down and I was justlike, I will just keep reaching out.
(05:04):
And so you say yes.
And of course he ended up himand Ande kind of built a rapport.
And, you know,I enjoyed hanging out with him as well.
And so the three of us, you know,I would say
were somewhat friendsor at least good acquaintances.
And so that was a the wrong way to goabout getting somebody to tattoo.
You just like wearing them down. Yeah.
But then the otherones, I think it's just been
(05:27):
an association thing.
So people when they meet or they know Andeand then they meet
me and people actually like me.
So I, you know,I do feel really thankful for that.
And I've asked a few peopleif I could get tattooed by them.
And the answer is has always been yes.
Yeah, yeah, that makes sense.
And it is a niceI know, getting to like having that
“in” already with someone
(05:47):
with some relationship where it's like,oh we know you know, we,
we have a relationshipwith the same person.
I just, I think about all the peoplethat I know, even our old,
Dan's helping with the, with this, fireside stuff now.
But I had two helpers for years
when we first started,and none of us really were known.
Like, I was not known in tattooingbefore I started
fireside, I, I did tattoos,but I was a popular anything.
(06:09):
And so my guys were like, dying to gettattooed by so many people conventions.
But we're so nervous to approach
or talk to thembecause there wasn't that like in over.
Yet over the years, fireside
became like in for thembecause they could go like,
hey, would you come podcastwith Jake and Fireside?
And that gave thema, a conversation starter, you know?
But it's not easy for people, I think now.
(06:30):
And I think, you know, especially it'sthe industry is so different now.
And as far as how
people are getting tattoos doneor even how they're finding their artists.
So when I got tattooed by Paul Acker,that was the day
I sent an email and I gave my ideathey were okay with it.
We booked the appointmentand then that was it.
So yeah, I think it just it really just
(06:52):
depends depends on the artist and.
Yeah, I'm sure. Right.
What as far as the process of workingwith the different artists.
Yeah I did and Paul Acker, another onewe didn't say on the front end. Right.
That's right.
Yeah.
So, soso as far as the process of working with
like those the different artists,how many of them like consulted you
(07:13):
on subject matterand like in the sketches in advance,
how many of them, like, you just showed upand it's like, this is what we're doing?
I would say I always had an idea in mind.
And then at that point,the idea was given to the artists
and they came up with their version ofwhat they saw when I gave them the idea.
And then that was it.
I would say when I did get tattooedby Jeff,
(07:35):
my idea, or at least, my idea behind the
the sleeve, he could have gone inso many different directions.
So he gave me two options, andI wanted him to go with his first option,
because I knew that
that's really where he was at,and that ended up being the best one.
I think Paul ended up drawing minethe minute that I went in there
(07:56):
and got tattooed.He drew mine up the day of.
And, Nate Beavershad already been working on my piece
when I had gotten there, so
a little bit of a little mismatcha little bit.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I'm always curious about thatbecause, you know,
I think as a tattooeryou get into your own kind of process
and it's rare that you are tattooingsomeone who's been tattooed by people
(08:16):
that you look up to.
Yeah, that you're it's like,well, what what do they do.
Like what was different.
Like, what was it like gettingtattooed by me as opposed to them?
That's I think most tattooerswho watch this have that kind of question,
you know, especially if they seethey're starting on piece
and they see that there's a reallybeautiful piece they're working up again.
So it's just like there'sthis like intimidation,
this natural intimidation where it's like,
well, you know, is this clientsmarter than me when it comes to be like,
(08:40):
are they gonna be like, oh, that'snot the way a Gogue did that, you know?
Yeah.
But I could see that. I could see that.
Well, I think I'd have to sayfor the most part, all of the people
that I've gotten tattooed by have beenthey've been pretty amazing.
Now, as far as their technique goes,I would say that
there were some that were a bit more heavyhanded than others,
(09:00):
and I can definitely tell a difference,but yeah, I know.
So you and Andeboth have large pieces by Jeff
Gogue, and he's getting a bodysuitessentially from it.
And I've had
I've never been tattooed by Jeff,but I've had conversations with Ande,
and then he's told me about you strugglingthrough some of those sessions as well.
So what's like, can you compare
(09:21):
like the easiest of these people,the easiest one to get tattoo by versus
Jeff, I assume might be one of the hardestthat I have, is he not?
I think it has more to do with the bodypart that your getting tattooed on.
Definitely.
So that was the biggest difference.
But I would say, wait,what was the question?
So Jeff Yeah.
That's where it's like the differencein like in, in, their approach.
(09:44):
Like how in and if you said thesome of the more heavy handed guys.
Oh my gosh Timmy B, oh feather fingersit was so awesome getting tattooed by him.
Well first of all he's hilarious.
And he's he's just amazing.
He's such a rad dude.
Absolutely loved getting tattooed by him.
Jeff, because I've been getting tattooby him for several years.
(10:08):
We started
and he did my sleeve, and now both himand Ande are working on my back piece.
Jeff is just a phenomenal human
being and we've had suchincredible conversations.
Him and I. I mean, he's just he's amazing.
Nate Beaver's also such a great guy.
He was so heavy handed.
I was going in and out of hotand cold sweats.
(10:30):
I don't think that was a brutal tattoo.
He started working on my socks.
So from the knee down on my right leg,
I thought I was going to come up outthat chair.
It was rough.
And then, the difference between Timmy B did
my right hand and PhilGarcia did my left hand.
Timmy B again, a lot easier on my hand.
(10:51):
Phil Garcia was more heavy handed.
However,the pieces are so totally different,
so he had to do what he needed to doto get this floral piece done.
So, yeah.
And I was, yeah,I assume really different approaches.
I mean, it seems like Philis more of a layerer than maybe Timmy is.
I don't know,
(11:12):
it seems likeTimmy might have a more traditional,
like, outlineblack shading, color done approach,
whereas PhilI know does a lot of like he comes in
and adds a lot of textural stufflater in the process.
It seems like, or no?
that's a great question.
I'm not easily and that goeswith attachment to the technique. Yes.
I that's that was given me.
That was where I was kind of goingthat is like, hey, as far as you're
(11:34):
talking about long sessions and with Andeand Jeff working on your back,
so your back is just your backor is it like a back down the knees or.
Yeah, back down. Yeah. Well, yeah, it's,
yeah.
It's So do you have any,
do you have any, like, tips or tricksfor how you sit through it?
Do you go to, like you just go.
(11:56):
You just, like,grit your teeth and get through it.
I would say
my biggest tip would beif you're wanting to get tattooed
and you're serious about itand you know the
things that you want to get done,get them done now
and don't prolong the processbecause the older you get,
I feel like, first of all,finding the time to do it is one thing,
(12:18):
but number two,the pain actually increases in my opinion.
So I would absolutely suggestgetting it done sooner rather than later.
I also suggest eating, so anytimeI'm going in for a huge session,
I will straight up eat a lot.
I'm talkinglike breakfast, like full on bacon egg.
(12:39):
So something I love to eat to begin withso you don't really have to coax me
to eat all that much, right?
But I definitely eat a full mealbefore I get tattooed
and I stick with having a drink,staying hydrated throughout the tattoo,
making sure that I'm eating somethingkind of sweet in between.
And then to be honest,I will keep up with the ibuprofen
throughout,so I'll take like two ibuprofen.
(13:00):
Before we start, let me take a break.I might take two more.
And then when we end, I'll take two more.
So yeah, that's been a huge help. Right?
Do you notice the difference
if you're not paying attentiona lot to their processes? Maybe not.
But like Ande and I for example,both use Bactine in the process.
We use it differently.
Ande, You know,he'll he'll tattoo me for a few hours
(13:21):
and then we'llwe're going to take a break.
He'll saturated with bactinelet it set and we come back.
It's much nicer for a period of time.
But he wants to, like, get througha big section, then bactine it.
I tend to use it throughout the process.
But as someone who, you know, no one has ever tattooed me the way that I
we using bactine the way that I use it.
So I don't know if my process is betteror worse.
(13:42):
I know that I know how it works with Andebecause I get tattooed by Ande.
Do you do you notice likehave you paid attention to like, who uses
things like lidocaine and who doesn'tand how they use it or anything like that?
Yes. And I would say that probably bothJeff and Ande use Bactine the same way.
So you're going to go through thosefirst few hours breaking the skin up
(14:02):
and beforethey even use anything like that.
And I think it's at this point,I think it's the best way to go
because it is it's super beneficialthroughout the tattoo.
Yeah.
Or at least while you're getting tattooedto, to have it.
Yeah.
And it gives you I think one thingabout the way that Ande uses it, which is,
like I said, it's different than mine.
It's like you're toughing it out,your toughing it out.
(14:24):
So you have this like you're either
your pain like level is creepingcreeping, creeping getting worse.
But you have this thing to look forwardto where it's like,
we're going to take a bathroom breakand it's going to get sprayed down
and it's going to be easierfor a period of time.
Whereas the way that I use it, where I'mtrying to keep people from hitting that
high pain level, whatever it's at, it'skind of where it's going to be.
It's not going to get better,because you know what I mean?
(14:44):
Because like, I've used it the whole time.
So if it's not working rightnow, it's not going to work
better in an hour or two, right?
You know, so that's why I wonder,
I kind of play around with maybechanging my approach a little bit
more towards that way, where I don't useit as much early on, and definitely
that skin has to be broken for itto do anything.
Same. Yeah.
I mean,I was kind of hoping that at some point
(15:05):
in time that I would just be ableto master sitting through,
you know, 8 or 9 hours.
And that is not the case.
And especially after having a baby,I thought for sure I was like,
oh my gosh, if I can do this,I can totally keep getting tattooed.
Yeah.
So when they start coming outwith a technique
where tattooing doesn't hurt anymore,that would be really nice
so that I could get the rest of my workfinished.
(15:27):
Yeah, more and more of my clients come inlike pre wrapped with lidocaine.
I'm not a big fan of it.
I think the skin's weird and rubberyand and I spend so much time
trying to wipe it offbecause I'm nervous about what's in it.
Exactly.
I've got the skin all irritatedbefore I even start tattooing,
because I'm, like, scrubbingthat shit out of it,
trying to get all the sticky lidocane off,you know?
Yeah, that's no bueno. No. Good.
(15:48):
But that's. But a lot of people do it.
And even if I say I'd rather you didn't,you know, they're like, well,
just use a little,you know, just gets me through.
But so I don't fight people on it.
But I'm definitely not a fan of it.
But, you know, sometimesit doesn't really make any difference.
I don't notice a lot of times, like,I wipe all that stuff off and in
five minutes end of the tattoo,they're like, oh, it's great.
I don't feel a thing.
(16:09):
But 45 minutes into the tattoo,they're struggling.
That's all I see. That's it didn't work.
That wasn't worthwhat you just went through
to get it all slathered on thereand wrap your body for two hours.
And I bet you it's a placebo thing.
I think so too.
I have never done that.
I'll say my husband won’t let me do that.
So that'sI haven't done it at all. Right.
(16:30):
Yeah, yeah.
So let's let's changegears a little bit and talk about kind of,
so you and Ande been married forhow long are dating, married, everything.
Oh. So what's the.We've been married for 13 years.
We actually just celebrated13 years of marriage.
But this year
has been 20 years altogether,so I thought it was around 20 years.
Yeah. And so he's been tattooingmost all of that time.
All that time.
(16:51):
So you witness
because you guys used to doprobably a lot more shows than you do now.
In so you've witnesseda big kind of evolution of tattooing.
And we've talked a little bit,you and I, about just like,
tattoo kind of cultureand evolution of that, like what?
What have you.
If you could like any kind of,like, can concise idea
(17:13):
what, what tattooing was likewhen you went to the early conventions
with Andy as opposed to this conventiontoday?
Wow, that's such a great question. I think
first, getting into the
tattoo industry,it was still kind of taboo.
And I think especially,
when it came to tattooing,it was more or less your magazine.
(17:35):
So the way that we found out aboutour artists was through magazines
and then of course, like goingto the conventions and stuff like that.
And then, you know, there was still a bitof a stigma as far as, you know,
what is okay to get tattooed, what isn’tand should women be tattooed heavily?
Should they not?
And so I thinkwhat's been amazing about this
(17:59):
industry is the way that it has becomeso much more fluid.
So I think once tattoo hitmainstream media,
and when you started seeing it in the TVshows,
that really took tattooingfrom kind of this base level
to bringing it up into a plateau,it really shed a
(18:20):
a limelight on it where people were going,oh, this isn't just
for either.
Like there's a stereotype of peoplethat get tattoos.
And so, I think that kind of brokethe mold and it shed this light on it.
And so now tattooingbecame really, in a sense, cool.
And so it was amazing to see
(18:42):
the amount of artiststhat were highlighted through TV.
But then you add on social media
and then tattooing completely changesfrom from there.
And I even think even now, like itcontinues to grow.
The industry is growing.
The amount of people that are tattooing,the amount of talent is just
(19:04):
it is phenomenal.
So it has been a wild journey, especiallynot not as an artist, but as a wife.
Being able to watch this from atotally different perspective and just see
how awesome people are,
how art is so it just takes on
(19:25):
so many different nuances and different,wow, just styles and everything.
So yeah, it's it's funnywhen when the shows first started, I, I,
I discounted them a lot
and I thought it was kind of sillyand funny
that people would pay attentionto what was happening in a tattoo shop
or somewhere, even before competitionshows, just like shows in the shop
(19:45):
where they're you.
But what people were seeingwas like the consultation process
for peoplewho had never been in a tattoo shop.
They're like, oh, actually drawing.
So it's not all just off the wall.They're drawing stuff.
Oh, they can draw or, you know, and thenand so that did a lot of things.
First off, it opened the clientele up.
So like we were justDan was actually just talking about,
it's hard to tell who
who's a tattooer hereand who's a collector
(20:07):
because there are
so many collectors that have their necksand faces like, or heavily tattooed.
We're just some guy yesterdaywe're talking to
and he's,like completely covered in tattoos.
He's a civil engineer.
That's like, yeah, that's tattoocollectors today.
You know, it's like there's not bikers.
It's like civil engineers, you know.
And I think those shows had moreto do with that than I gave credit for
on the front.
I just didn't see that coming from it.
(20:29):
I thought it was silly.
That was definitely, I think, areally beautiful side of the shows.
But I think on the other side ofthat was that people didn't
realizethat artists were people outside of that.
And so you had people thinkingit was this total party lifestyle.
And I think that wassometimes was really hard, especially,
(20:50):
I think, for Tattooers, but also tattooersin relationships as well, that you're
they were sometimes feeling
you kind of had to keep upwith this perceived reality,
which in all reality,if a lot of these guys, you're
you're coming home and you've got kidsand you still have bills to pay,
you know, like the partying lifestyle is,and that's not
(21:12):
what this whole industry is about.
You know, especially I watch my husband,you know, late at night.
He is up drawing and, you know,scrapping an idea and starting again.
And, you know,he put so much time and effort into that.
And that's what people don't see. Right.
And it is, you know,you guys you included.
But Ande you know all these tattooers outhere, the amount of time and effort
(21:37):
that they put into creatingthese custom pieces is you never know that
through a
social media page or even through a TV.
So it's it's a lot of hard work.
Yeah. Yeah, I think that's a good point.
And important boy, it'sone of those things that like,
you'll hear sometimes snide comments, butsometimes just genuine comments are like,
(22:00):
like I tattoo, a nurse in the traumaunit has been a nurse 30 plus years.
And at the end of the day, when he pays
the bill, he's just like, it's crazythat you make so much more money than me.
And I say people's lives all day,and I'm like, what is kind of crazy?
But not not as crazy as it seems,because he doesn't mean it in a mean way,
I know, but like, not as crazy as it seemsbecause you went to work and made
(22:22):
when you left work.
That was the end of the day.
Like, I understand you wrote a big checkfor six hours, but I'm like 25 hours
into this drawing before we ever set upa tattoo machine, you know?
And that's the one thingI think people don't realize.
Sometimes when I see now the,where how social is on the stories
and reels and stuff.
So people are showingmore of their process,
(22:43):
you know, maybe that helps a little bit.
Sometimes it makes that processlook super seamless and easy, right.
Which you know as well as I do.
Yeah. That's not right.
Yeah.
It's like,
you know, over the shoulderdrawing on your iPad stencil
being printed, finished tattoo.
And you're like, well kind ofoh that's like yeah, I'll never forget
when I had, I had a tattooercome up to Ande
and I and actually ask us, they said,how do you do this?
(23:06):
And we, we looked at him and we said,how do we do what?
And they were like this.
Like, how do you do a relationshipwithin tattooing?
And, you know,we kind of looked at each other
and I know that first wordsout of my mouth was it's a lot of grace
you know, because tattooing is so solo,you know, there's not much
that I can do to really helpAnde with the things that he does.
(23:27):
So, you know, it's a lot of grace.
It's a lot of patience.
It's, a lot of just understanding,supporting him.
I mean, he's been doing thisfor a really long time,
and I've been there from the beginning.
I actually met him as an apprentice.
But when he first started tattooing,and I've been there through all of it,
through the crazy seasons and the hardseasons and a really good season on.
(23:50):
So, yeah, it's work, but it's workthat is so worth it.
Yeah.
So yeah. Yeah.
Especially you see,I mean you meet so many people you see.
Like what the end, the end resultof a lot of his work is so impressive.
You know, it's like for all of his work,he's awesome.
It's so impressive.
It's funny, I, I I'll, I'll say thingsoccasionally, like,
(24:10):
I'll see paintingsthat people put up or work.
It's not tattoo related.
And I'll, like,
say something to my wife about like, like I need to make more time in the draw.
And she's like, all you do is draw.
What are you talking about?
I'm like,all I do is, like, fumble through tattoos.
I need to be a better tattooerdraw tattoo drawer.
So that I can work on fun stuffmore often,
you know,but I'm separating it in my mind.
(24:30):
But from her perspective, she's like,what do you mean? Find time to draw?
Like, I don't ever see you not drawing,but like.
But it's a different thing,you know, to me.
Yeah, well, it's funny because Andywill kind of say the same thing.
Like, I just wish.I wish I had more time to paint.
I wish I had more time to draw.
Well, you know,
that stuff that you guys are working onthat's specific for a client.
That's what they want.
So as far as I know that he is brimmingwith just ideas and concepts
(24:56):
and everything like that.
But to be able to have the time to dothe work that he wants to do versus
the work that he needs to dofor an upcoming client, unfortunately,
there isn't on the lot of timefor him to do that personal stuff.
He is very task driven, work drivento create the best piece
that he possibly can.
(25:16):
So I can kind of see it. Yeah, yeah.
And then a lot of that, you were talkingabout the family side of it.
You know, it's funnyhow many like I I'll forget about it.
But we'll be tattooinglike on a Saturday night or something.
I'm like, yeah,I'm going to go get dinner afterwards.
I'm traveling in the tattooed
and is like, yeah, it's like,if we can get out of here in time,
but we have to be somewhere in six
in the morning because we've volunteeron Sundays at Other Thing or whatever.
(25:39):
It's like, oh yeah, it's crazy.
I have this whole other like,
like you have to get upto volunteer at 6:00 on a Sunday.
You tattooed until 730or 8 on Saturday night.
And there's probably drawingsthat need to be done
in between that as well,you know, so I yeah, I'm
well I mean I'm thankful nowbecause the schedule is a lot better now.
I mean, for the first several yearsof our relationship,
(25:59):
we saw each other one day a week.
You know,he worked Tuesday through Saturday.
I worked Monday through Friday.
And so we only saw each other on Sundays.
His first boss was verya very interesting guy.
I'm trying to not throw him under the bus,but just worked him like crazy.
And so he'd get home at,you know, two, three, 4:00 in the morning.
(26:21):
And then that's when I'm getting upand I'm getting ready to go to work.
So his schedule now,thank God, is definitely more beneficial.
It's more helpful.
It's more healthy for our family.
And he gets to have more dad momentswith our daughter,
which is and him and I get to havea little bit more time together now.
And that's also, you know, I'mso thankful for that.
(26:44):
I'm thankful that he values ourrelationship, that he values our family,
he values our marriage.
So, you know, that definitely helps.
Yeah.
Sometimes it's toughwhen when there are, you know,
when everything is urgent, likethe drawing has to be done for a client.
It's tough to separatelike important and urgent
and you know, and like, you know,you know,
(27:05):
I forget Ashland's age, but, like,
she's only that agefor a certain period of time.
And then and then it's gone.
And then all you all you have.
Luckily now we have cell phonesthat have some recording of them at three
or 4 or 5 years old. So you're like, oh,I remember what she had that laugh.
You know,I remember when it was that little thing.
But it's stillit's like it's so fleeting and,
and when there's urgent stuff in the way,it's so easy to miss.
(27:27):
It's it's easy.
It's easier to keep in mindwhen you're 50 years old than it is
when you're a 25 year old tattooerwith a young kid.
Right.
But, yeah,a very 25 year old tattooers with a kid.
It's, you know, it's it's important.
I know it's hard to thinkthat it's important, but it is, I think.
Fine,probably trying to find balance in life
for really anyonetoday is such a hard thing to do
(27:49):
because we're such,we're a consumer society
and everything is so incrediblyfast paced and it's, you know,
we got to get to the work dayand we got to get to the next thing
on our to do list,and we've got to do all these things.
And so, you know, trying to find the balance of living while you're still working,
try and do it now
(28:09):
before you look back and realizethat you spent your life working away.
I know I did that for such a long time.
I worked two jobsand I was going to college,
and so I missed out on so many thingsbecause I did that.
Though now, thankfully in our daughter,she's she's just such a blessing.
She's totally.
Our lives are so different nowbecause of her, I couldn't be
(28:32):
I couldn't be more thankful. Honestly.
We it's forced us to slow down by.
And we need that. Yeah. Yeah.
And it's so fortunate, you know,that happened when you were, you know,
far enough along in your life that youactually were able to recognize it.
My, my, my first son was born.
He was four months oldwhen I graduated high school.
And I think I'm a muchso much better of a dad to Max.
(28:52):
And I was the justice
because I remember nowI can visualize the things that I miss,
like when Max is an age, I'mtrying to picture justice, at that age,
and I'm like, man, I was kind of I knowit was happening at that point in time.
I was doing this, this and this,and I, like I dropped him off at school.
I went to tattoo, like wheneverhe was getting out of school.
I was starting tattooing.
By the time I got home,he was already in bed. And that was like.
(29:12):
So my relationship for a several yearperiod was dropping him off at school
in the morning.
That was all I got, you know,and at the time,
I wasn't thinking about itbecause I was 23, you know.
Right.
And so but now, you know, at 48, I'm like,oh yeah, pay attention to this.
Like, this is only it's only happensfor a minute, you know, and yeah.
Yeah.
So right,there's no hood like Parenthood.
(29:32):
That is a wild, crazy, amazing ride.
So yeah.
Yeah, yeah, it definitely.
well sweetwhat an interesting perspective.
I'm glad we I'm glad we sat downand did this.
I don't ever getI don't ever get that perspective.
Like, it's rare that, you know,we sit down
and talk about drawing pictures a lotme and whoever I'm talking to, but rarely
about all the stuff that makes it possibleto, you know, to draw good pictures.
So I love the tattoo community,you know, and,
(29:56):
and I've seen the really dark sides of it.
So but the there's, there's so much goodand we've met such incredible people.
I've had an opportunityto meet so many incredible people.
And I know my heart is just to see thisbe the healthiest community.
And that's not just physically,
you know, I want to see relationshipsand this community be healthy
(30:17):
and marriages be healthy and familiesbe healthy in this community.
It can happen.
I know that there's probably been itcan sometimes get a bad rap.
And yeah, it's it's not the easiest.
But this is such an amazing,
amazing community full of amazing people.
And I just, I'm happy to share.
Have made it be a part of it.
(30:38):
Yeah. Yeah, I'm happy that we met.
That's awesome and there came across.
I do need to get to how many,
how many like fresh photosof all these pieces we talked about.
You still have.
Oh, no. Oh, my gosh.
I would have to ask Ande.
Yeah.
There's like,I'm trying to think about B-roll
to lay over this and like,oh, we have to see some.
You can't just throw all those names out
and not So any of the tattoosso have to find something.
Maybe I was getting old photos I so I knowand usually conventions are ice boxes.
(31:01):
So I come at
they have like a Snuggie booth up in here.
They’d make so much money
because now I got to come inlike fully clothed, right?
Yeah, yeah.
Back in the days to bare them allbut not know I'm a little smarter now
and I don't like being cold.Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Breathe. Understand?
Saying. sweetThank you Jenny, I enjoyed it.
Well, absolutely. Any time.
All right.Thank you guys. We'll see you next time.
(31:22):
There you go.
Thank you again for supporting what we do.
Thank you to Jesse Smith and RichmondTattoo and Arts Festival.
Definitely come out next year andcheck out that show if you, if you can.
It's a great, great show.
Thanks to Jenny, for spending a little bit of time with us.
What else? I guess that's it.We'll see you next time. Thanks.
Hey, welcome back to the fireside.My name is Jake.
Happy to have you here.
We are back againthis week with another episode
from the Richmond Tattoo,an arts fest of 2024.
I think this is our third episodefrom that show.
We got a couple more to go.This one is pretty unique.
It's different than what we normally do.
We are not talking to a tattooer today.
(00:20):
We are instead, talking to a tattoo collector.
Our guest today is Jenny Chambers.
And I met Jennybecause she is married to Andy Chambers,
who is a good friend of mineand who is actually doing my back piece.
And if you've watched this showfor any period of time,
then you've probably seen Andya time or two.
We've, we've worked together a good bit.
Jenny is a, a real tattoo collector.
(00:43):
She has collected work from some really,really great artists.
I won't remember them all,but folks like Jeff Gogue, Phil Garcia,
obviously Ande Chambers, Paul Acker,I believe Timmy
B bunch of bunch of really high level,high level tattooers.
And so I thought it would be interestingto get her perspective on what it's like
(01:06):
to work with so many high level tattooersand what their kind of commonalities were
and what their big differences were,how they worked.
You know, things like that.
We also diveinto a handful of other subjects.
And, Ande I've been married a long time,so she has seen the evolution
of the tattoo industryin a lot of different ways,
and the boththe good sides and the bad sides.
(01:26):
And so she has her own thoughtsand opinions on that.
And, it was fun to just to hear her ideasand to sit down and talk.
And while we're on the topicof the chambers
family,this is a good opportunity to mention
that both Andyand I believe Jenny are going to be
at this year's, Fireside Yacht Clubtrip in June, and you should come to.
There are only five spots availablefor artists.
(01:46):
Fireside Yacht Club, if you're notfamiliar, is, an event that I hold.
And I bring you to actually stayand hang out on my boat
in GreersFerry Lake, in Heber Springs, Arkansas.
And it's a beautiful lake.
The boat is a 43ft Silverton motor yacht.
And, we go out and we do dinner cruisesand we paint and we draw.
(02:08):
There are cliff jumping,there's jet skis, there's swimming.
There's all kinds of stuff.It's not like a regular lake.
It's a very beautiful,
crystal clear lake with a lot of sheercliffs and beautiful, beautiful landscape.
We get to watch the sunset.
We, we'll do some hiking.
There's a really beautifulwaterfall nearby
that we'll go and draw and paint from.
And Andy is going to be helping out.
(02:30):
He's going to come in as a
as an instructor and,share some of his knowledge
on illustration, design, illustrativetattooing and things like that.
Only five spots available.
I don't know how many are left right now,but I have, left a link in the video
description and there's probably somethingthat's popping up while I'm talking.
You should check it out and, jump in.
It's a really a great dealand a lot of fun.
(02:50):
And you'll make some new friends,I guarantee.
So that's it. Let's get to the episode.
About.
The sauce.
First time.
So excited I am delighted. Yeah, yeah.
So this is actually a prettyspecial episode because we don't get
I don't talk to a lot of peoplewho just have really awesome tattoos. Yes.
(03:12):
You know, I talked to a lot of peoplewho do really awesome tattoos.
Lucky guy. Yeah. That is yeah.
But I don't talk to a lot of peoplewho get really awesome tattoos
on a regular basis.
So we start, with, like
who all besides your husband,who I probably told in the intro
who your husband is,so I won't go through it again.
Besides your husband, do all.
Have you been tattooed by.
(03:34):
All right.
So I've been tattooed by Jeff.
Gogue Yeah.
Timmy B, sketchy lawyer.
All right.I've been tattooed by Nate Beavers.
I've been tattooed by, Phil Garcia.
Garcia? Yeah.
And it's crazy.
Yeah, that's a real list.
(03:54):
I tell me about it.
I'm cool.
I, I like collecting,so those would be that, too.
Oh, and Val.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, yeah. No valleys, dude. Yeah. Sweet.
So how.
I mean, I guess
because you're you're married to Andeand he's that, known tattooer
for quite a while now. Like, what is it?
I don't know if you can come up with any,like, examples of, like, differences
(04:16):
and just approachingreally high level tattooers
and getting on their books or any of that.
Have you had any, like,like from one person to another?
I know you want to shit talk anybody who'sterrible at their processes, but okay.
Do you have any like,
we'll start there, kind of move throughthe whole process of a tattoo as well.
Let's see.
I've done it the wrong wayand I've done it the right way.
(04:38):
So I would say the wrong wayis, for example, Jeff Gogue.
So the first time that I got to go outand Meet him, I asked him
if if he would be willing to tattoome and and he wasn't necessarily
right off the bat like, yes,I will totally tattoo you.
And so he said, well,you know, we'll talk about it.
And I kind of wore him down and I was justlike, I will just keep reaching out.
(05:04):
And so you say yes.
And of course he ended up himand Ande kind of built a rapport.
And, you know,I enjoyed hanging out with him as well.
And so the three of us, you know,I would say
were somewhat friendsor at least good acquaintances.
And so that was a the wrong way to goabout getting somebody to tattoo.
You just like wearing them down. Yeah.
But then the otherones, I think it's just been
(05:27):
an association thing.
So people when they meet or they know Andeand then they meet
me and people actually like me.
So I, you know,I do feel really thankful for that.
And I've asked a few peopleif I could get tattooed by them.
And the answer is has always been yes.
Yeah, yeah, that makes sense.
And it is a niceI know, getting to like having that
“in” already with someone
(05:47):
with some relationship where it's like,oh we know you know, we,
we have a relationshipwith the same person.
I just, I think about all the peoplethat I know, even our old,
Dan's helping with the, with this, fireside stuff now.
But I had two helpers for years
when we first started,and none of us really were known.
Like, I was not known in tattooingbefore I started
fireside, I, I did tattoos,but I was a popular anything.
(06:09):
And so my guys were like, dying to gettattooed by so many people conventions.
But we're so nervous to approach
or talk to thembecause there wasn't that like in over.
Yet over the years, fireside
became like in for thembecause they could go like,
hey, would you come podcastwith Jake and Fireside?
And that gave thema, a conversation starter, you know?
But it's not easy for people, I think now.
(06:30):
And I think, you know, especially it'sthe industry is so different now.
And as far as how
people are getting tattoos doneor even how they're finding their artists.
So when I got tattooed by Paul Acker,that was the day
I sent an email and I gave my ideathey were okay with it.
We booked the appointmentand then that was it.
So yeah, I think it just it really just
(06:52):
depends depends on the artist and.
Yeah, I'm sure. Right.
What as far as the process of workingwith the different artists.
Yeah I did and Paul Acker, another onewe didn't say on the front end. Right.
That's right.
Yeah.
So, soso as far as the process of working with
like those the different artists,how many of them like consulted you
(07:13):
on subject matterand like in the sketches in advance,
how many of them, like, you just showed upand it's like, this is what we're doing?
I would say I always had an idea in mind.
And then at that point,the idea was given to the artists
and they came up with their version ofwhat they saw when I gave them the idea.
And then that was it.
I would say when I did get tattooedby Jeff,
(07:35):
my idea, or at least, my idea behind the
the sleeve, he could have gone inso many different directions.
So he gave me two options, andI wanted him to go with his first option,
because I knew that
that's really where he was at,and that ended up being the best one.
I think Paul ended up drawing minethe minute that I went in there
(07:56):
and got tattooed.He drew mine up the day of.
And, Nate Beavershad already been working on my piece
when I had gotten there, so
a little bit of a little mismatcha little bit.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I'm always curious about thatbecause, you know,
I think as a tattooeryou get into your own kind of process
and it's rare that you are tattooingsomeone who's been tattooed by people
(08:16):
that you look up to.
Yeah, that you're it's like,well, what what do they do.
Like what was different.
Like, what was it like gettingtattooed by me as opposed to them?
That's I think most tattooerswho watch this have that kind of question,
you know, especially if they seethey're starting on piece
and they see that there's a reallybeautiful piece they're working up again.
So it's just like there'sthis like intimidation,
this natural intimidation where it's like,
well, you know, is this clientsmarter than me when it comes to be like,
(08:40):
are they gonna be like, oh, that'snot the way a Gogue did that, you know?
Yeah.
But I could see that. I could see that.
Well, I think I'd have to sayfor the most part, all of the people
that I've gotten tattooed by have beenthey've been pretty amazing.
Now, as far as their technique goes,I would say that
there were some that were a bit more heavyhanded than others,
(09:00):
and I can definitely tell a difference,but yeah, I know.
So you and Andeboth have large pieces by Jeff
Gogue, and he's getting a bodysuitessentially from it.
And I've had
I've never been tattooed by Jeff,but I've had conversations with Ande,
and then he's told me about you strugglingthrough some of those sessions as well.
So what's like, can you compare
(09:21):
like the easiest of these people,the easiest one to get tattoo by versus
Jeff, I assume might be one of the hardestthat I have, is he not?
I think it has more to do with the bodypart that your getting tattooed on.
Definitely.
So that was the biggest difference.
But I would say, wait,what was the question?
So Jeff Yeah.
That's where it's like the differencein like in, in, their approach.
(09:44):
Like how in and if you said thesome of the more heavy handed guys.
Oh my gosh Timmy B, oh feather fingersit was so awesome getting tattooed by him.
Well first of all he's hilarious.
And he's he's just amazing.
He's such a rad dude.
Absolutely loved getting tattooed by him.
Jeff, because I've been getting tattooby him for several years.
(10:08):
We started
and he did my sleeve, and now both himand Ande are working on my back piece.
Jeff is just a phenomenal human
being and we've had suchincredible conversations.
Him and I. I mean, he's just he's amazing.
Nate Beaver's also such a great guy.
He was so heavy handed.
I was going in and out of hotand cold sweats.
(10:30):
I don't think that was a brutal tattoo.
He started working on my socks.
So from the knee down on my right leg,
I thought I was going to come up outthat chair.
It was rough.
And then, the difference between Timmy B did
my right hand and PhilGarcia did my left hand.
Timmy B again, a lot easier on my hand.
(10:51):
Phil Garcia was more heavy handed.
However,the pieces are so totally different,
so he had to do what he needed to doto get this floral piece done.
So, yeah.
And I was, yeah,I assume really different approaches.
I mean, it seems like Philis more of a layerer than maybe Timmy is.
I don't know,
(11:12):
it seems likeTimmy might have a more traditional,
like, outlineblack shading, color done approach,
whereas PhilI know does a lot of like he comes in
and adds a lot of textural stufflater in the process.
It seems like, or no?
that's a great question.
I'm not easily and that goeswith attachment to the technique. Yes.
I that's that was given me.
That was where I was kind of goingthat is like, hey, as far as you're
(11:34):
talking about long sessions and with Andeand Jeff working on your back,
so your back is just your backor is it like a back down the knees or.
Yeah, back down. Yeah. Well, yeah, it's,
yeah.
It's So do you have any,
do you have any, like, tips or tricksfor how you sit through it?
Do you go to, like you just go.
(11:56):
You just, like,grit your teeth and get through it.
I would say
my biggest tip would beif you're wanting to get tattooed
and you're serious about itand you know the
things that you want to get done,get them done now
and don't prolong the processbecause the older you get,
I feel like, first of all,finding the time to do it is one thing,
(12:18):
but number two,the pain actually increases in my opinion.
So I would absolutely suggestgetting it done sooner rather than later.
I also suggest eating, so anytimeI'm going in for a huge session,
I will straight up eat a lot.
I'm talkinglike breakfast, like full on bacon egg.
(12:39):
So something I love to eat to begin withso you don't really have to coax me
to eat all that much, right?
But I definitely eat a full mealbefore I get tattooed
and I stick with having a drink,staying hydrated throughout the tattoo,
making sure that I'm eating somethingkind of sweet in between.
And then to be honest,I will keep up with the ibuprofen
throughout,so I'll take like two ibuprofen.
(13:00):
Before we start, let me take a break.I might take two more.
And then when we end, I'll take two more.
So yeah, that's been a huge help. Right?
Do you notice the difference
if you're not paying attentiona lot to their processes? Maybe not.
But like Ande and I for example,both use Bactine in the process.
We use it differently.
Ande, You know,he'll he'll tattoo me for a few hours
(13:21):
and then we'llwe're going to take a break.
He'll saturated with bactinelet it set and we come back.
It's much nicer for a period of time.
But he wants to, like, get througha big section, then bactine it.
I tend to use it throughout the process.
But as someone who, you know, no one has ever tattooed me the way that I
we using bactine the way that I use it.
So I don't know if my process is betteror worse.
(13:42):
I know that I know how it works with Andebecause I get tattooed by Ande.
Do you do you notice likehave you paid attention to like, who uses
things like lidocaine and who doesn'tand how they use it or anything like that?
Yes. And I would say that probably bothJeff and Ande use Bactine the same way.
So you're going to go through thosefirst few hours breaking the skin up
(14:02):
and beforethey even use anything like that.
And I think it's at this point,I think it's the best way to go
because it is it's super beneficialthroughout the tattoo.
Yeah.
Or at least while you're getting tattooedto, to have it.
Yeah.
And it gives you I think one thingabout the way that Ande uses it, which is,
like I said, it's different than mine.
It's like you're toughing it out,your toughing it out.
(14:24):
So you have this like you're either
your pain like level is creepingcreeping, creeping getting worse.
But you have this thing to look forwardto where it's like,
we're going to take a bathroom breakand it's going to get sprayed down
and it's going to be easierfor a period of time.
Whereas the way that I use it, where I'mtrying to keep people from hitting that
high pain level, whatever it's at, it'skind of where it's going to be.
It's not going to get better,because you know what I mean?
(14:44):
Because like, I've used it the whole time.
So if it's not working rightnow, it's not going to work
better in an hour or two, right?
You know, so that's why I wonder,
I kind of play around with maybechanging my approach a little bit
more towards that way, where I don't useit as much early on, and definitely
that skin has to be broken for itto do anything.
Same. Yeah.
I mean,I was kind of hoping that at some point
(15:05):
in time that I would just be ableto master sitting through,
you know, 8 or 9 hours.
And that is not the case.
And especially after having a baby,I thought for sure I was like,
oh my gosh, if I can do this,I can totally keep getting tattooed.
Yeah.
So when they start coming outwith a technique
where tattooing doesn't hurt anymore,that would be really nice
so that I could get the rest of my workfinished.
(15:27):
Yeah, more and more of my clients come inlike pre wrapped with lidocaine.
I'm not a big fan of it.
I think the skin's weird and rubberyand and I spend so much time
trying to wipe it offbecause I'm nervous about what's in it.
Exactly.
I've got the skin all irritatedbefore I even start tattooing,
because I'm, like, scrubbingthat shit out of it,
trying to get all the sticky lidocane off,you know?
Yeah, that's no bueno. No. Good.
(15:48):
But that's. But a lot of people do it.
And even if I say I'd rather you didn't,you know, they're like, well,
just use a little,you know, just gets me through.
But so I don't fight people on it.
But I'm definitely not a fan of it.
But, you know, sometimesit doesn't really make any difference.
I don't notice a lot of times, like,I wipe all that stuff off and in
five minutes end of the tattoo,they're like, oh, it's great.
I don't feel a thing.
(16:09):
But 45 minutes into the tattoo,they're struggling.
That's all I see. That's it didn't work.
That wasn't worthwhat you just went through
to get it all slathered on thereand wrap your body for two hours.
And I bet you it's a placebo thing.
I think so too.
I have never done that.
I'll say my husband won’t let me do that.
So that'sI haven't done it at all. Right.
(16:30):
Yeah, yeah.
So let's let's changegears a little bit and talk about kind of,
so you and Ande been married forhow long are dating, married, everything.
Oh. So what's the.We've been married for 13 years.
We actually just celebrated13 years of marriage.
But this year
has been 20 years altogether,so I thought it was around 20 years.
Yeah. And so he's been tattooingmost all of that time.
All that time.
(16:51):
So you witness
because you guys used to doprobably a lot more shows than you do now.
In so you've witnesseda big kind of evolution of tattooing.
And we've talked a little bit,you and I, about just like,
tattoo kind of cultureand evolution of that, like what?
What have you.
If you could like any kind of,like, can concise idea
(17:13):
what, what tattooing was likewhen you went to the early conventions
with Andy as opposed to this conventiontoday?
Wow, that's such a great question. I think
first, getting into the
tattoo industry,it was still kind of taboo.
And I think especially,
when it came to tattooing,it was more or less your magazine.
(17:35):
So the way that we found out aboutour artists was through magazines
and then of course, like goingto the conventions and stuff like that.
And then, you know, there was still a bitof a stigma as far as, you know,
what is okay to get tattooed, what isn’tand should women be tattooed heavily?
Should they not?
And so I thinkwhat's been amazing about this
(17:59):
industry is the way that it has becomeso much more fluid.
So I think once tattoo hitmainstream media,
and when you started seeing it in the TVshows,
that really took tattooingfrom kind of this base level
to bringing it up into a plateau,it really shed a
(18:20):
a limelight on it where people were going,oh, this isn't just
for either.
Like there's a stereotype of peoplethat get tattoos.
And so, I think that kind of brokethe mold and it shed this light on it.
And so now tattooingbecame really, in a sense, cool.
And so it was amazing to see
(18:42):
the amount of artiststhat were highlighted through TV.
But then you add on social media
and then tattooing completely changesfrom from there.
And I even think even now, like itcontinues to grow.
The industry is growing.
The amount of people that are tattooing,the amount of talent is just
(19:04):
it is phenomenal.
So it has been a wild journey, especiallynot not as an artist, but as a wife.
Being able to watch this from atotally different perspective and just see
how awesome people are,
how art is so it just takes on
(19:25):
so many different nuances and different,wow, just styles and everything.
So yeah, it's it's funnywhen when the shows first started, I, I,
I discounted them a lot
and I thought it was kind of sillyand funny
that people would pay attentionto what was happening in a tattoo shop
or somewhere, even before competitionshows, just like shows in the shop
(19:45):
where they're you.
But what people were seeingwas like the consultation process
for peoplewho had never been in a tattoo shop.
They're like, oh, actually drawing.
So it's not all just off the wall.They're drawing stuff.
Oh, they can draw or, you know, and thenand so that did a lot of things.
First off, it opened the clientele up.
So like we were justDan was actually just talking about,
it's hard to tell who
who's a tattooer hereand who's a collector
(20:07):
because there are
so many collectors that have their necksand faces like, or heavily tattooed.
We're just some guy yesterdaywe're talking to
and he's,like completely covered in tattoos.
He's a civil engineer.
That's like, yeah, that's tattoocollectors today.
You know, it's like there's not bikers.
It's like civil engineers, you know.
And I think those shows had moreto do with that than I gave credit for
on the front.
I just didn't see that coming from it.
(20:29):
I thought it was silly.
That was definitely, I think, areally beautiful side of the shows.
But I think on the other side ofthat was that people didn't
realizethat artists were people outside of that.
And so you had people thinkingit was this total party lifestyle.
And I think that wassometimes was really hard, especially,
(20:50):
I think, for Tattooers, but also tattooersin relationships as well, that you're
they were sometimes feeling
you kind of had to keep upwith this perceived reality,
which in all reality,if a lot of these guys, you're
you're coming home and you've got kidsand you still have bills to pay,
you know, like the partying lifestyle is,and that's not
(21:12):
what this whole industry is about.
You know, especially I watch my husband,you know, late at night.
He is up drawing and, you know,scrapping an idea and starting again.
And, you know,he put so much time and effort into that.
And that's what people don't see. Right.
And it is, you know,you guys you included.
But Ande you know all these tattooers outhere, the amount of time and effort
(21:37):
that they put into creatingthese custom pieces is you never know that
through a
social media page or even through a TV.
So it's it's a lot of hard work.
Yeah. Yeah, I think that's a good point.
And important boy, it'sone of those things that like,
you'll hear sometimes snide comments, butsometimes just genuine comments are like,
(22:00):
like I tattoo, a nurse in the traumaunit has been a nurse 30 plus years.
And at the end of the day, when he pays
the bill, he's just like, it's crazythat you make so much more money than me.
And I say people's lives all day,and I'm like, what is kind of crazy?
But not not as crazy as it seems,because he doesn't mean it in a mean way,
I know, but like, not as crazy as it seemsbecause you went to work and made
(22:22):
when you left work.
That was the end of the day.
Like, I understand you wrote a big checkfor six hours, but I'm like 25 hours
into this drawing before we ever set upa tattoo machine, you know?
And that's the one thingI think people don't realize.
Sometimes when I see now the,where how social is on the stories
and reels and stuff.
So people are showingmore of their process,
(22:43):
you know, maybe that helps a little bit.
Sometimes it makes that processlook super seamless and easy, right.
Which you know as well as I do.
Yeah. That's not right.
Yeah.
It's like,
you know, over the shoulderdrawing on your iPad stencil
being printed, finished tattoo.
And you're like, well kind ofoh that's like yeah, I'll never forget
when I had, I had a tattooercome up to Ande
and I and actually ask us, they said,how do you do this?
(23:06):
And we, we looked at him and we said,how do we do what?
And they were like this.
Like, how do you do a relationshipwithin tattooing?
And, you know,we kind of looked at each other
and I know that first wordsout of my mouth was it's a lot of grace
you know, because tattooing is so solo,you know, there's not much
that I can do to really helpAnde with the things that he does.
(23:27):
So, you know, it's a lot of grace.
It's a lot of patience.
It's, a lot of just understanding,supporting him.
I mean, he's been doing thisfor a really long time,
and I've been there from the beginning.
I actually met him as an apprentice.
But when he first started tattooing,and I've been there through all of it,
through the crazy seasons and the hardseasons and a really good season on.
(23:50):
So, yeah, it's work, but it's workthat is so worth it.
Yeah.
So yeah. Yeah.
Especially you see,I mean you meet so many people you see.
Like what the end, the end resultof a lot of his work is so impressive.
You know, it's like for all of his work,he's awesome.
It's so impressive.
It's funny, I, I I'll, I'll say thingsoccasionally, like,
(24:10):
I'll see paintingsthat people put up or work.
It's not tattoo related.
And I'll, like,
say something to my wife about like, like I need to make more time in the draw.
And she's like, all you do is draw.
What are you talking about?
I'm like,all I do is, like, fumble through tattoos.
I need to be a better tattooerdraw tattoo drawer.
So that I can work on fun stuffmore often,
you know,but I'm separating it in my mind.
(24:30):
But from her perspective, she's like,what do you mean? Find time to draw?
Like, I don't ever see you not drawing,but like.
But it's a different thing,you know, to me.
Yeah, well, it's funny because Andywill kind of say the same thing.
Like, I just wish.I wish I had more time to paint.
I wish I had more time to draw.
Well, you know,
that stuff that you guys are working onthat's specific for a client.
That's what they want.
So as far as I know that he is brimmingwith just ideas and concepts
(24:56):
and everything like that.
But to be able to have the time to dothe work that he wants to do versus
the work that he needs to dofor an upcoming client, unfortunately,
there isn't on the lot of timefor him to do that personal stuff.
He is very task driven, work drivento create the best piece
that he possibly can.
(25:16):
So I can kind of see it. Yeah, yeah.
And then a lot of that, you were talkingabout the family side of it.
You know, it's funnyhow many like I I'll forget about it.
But we'll be tattooinglike on a Saturday night or something.
I'm like, yeah,I'm going to go get dinner afterwards.
I'm traveling in the tattooed
and is like, yeah, it's like,if we can get out of here in time,
but we have to be somewhere in six
in the morning because we've volunteeron Sundays at Other Thing or whatever.
(25:39):
It's like, oh yeah, it's crazy.
I have this whole other like,
like you have to get upto volunteer at 6:00 on a Sunday.
You tattooed until 730or 8 on Saturday night.
And there's probably drawingsthat need to be done
in between that as well,you know, so I yeah, I'm
well I mean I'm thankful nowbecause the schedule is a lot better now.
I mean, for the first several yearsof our relationship,
(25:59):
we saw each other one day a week.
You know,he worked Tuesday through Saturday.
I worked Monday through Friday.
And so we only saw each other on Sundays.
His first boss was verya very interesting guy.
I'm trying to not throw him under the bus,but just worked him like crazy.
And so he'd get home at,you know, two, three, 4:00 in the morning.
(26:21):
And then that's when I'm getting upand I'm getting ready to go to work.
So his schedule now,thank God, is definitely more beneficial.
It's more helpful.
It's more healthy for our family.
And he gets to have more dad momentswith our daughter,
which is and him and I get to havea little bit more time together now.
And that's also, you know, I'mso thankful for that.
(26:44):
I'm thankful that he values ourrelationship, that he values our family,
he values our marriage.
So, you know, that definitely helps.
Yeah.
Sometimes it's toughwhen when there are, you know,
when everything is urgent, likethe drawing has to be done for a client.
It's tough to separatelike important and urgent
and you know, and like, you know,you know,
(27:05):
I forget Ashland's age, but, like,
she's only that agefor a certain period of time.
And then and then it's gone.
And then all you all you have.
Luckily now we have cell phonesthat have some recording of them at three
or 4 or 5 years old. So you're like, oh,I remember what she had that laugh.
You know,I remember when it was that little thing.
But it's stillit's like it's so fleeting and,
and when there's urgent stuff in the way,it's so easy to miss.
(27:27):
It's it's easy.
It's easier to keep in mindwhen you're 50 years old than it is
when you're a 25 year old tattooerwith a young kid.
Right.
But, yeah,a very 25 year old tattooers with a kid.
It's, you know, it's it's important.
I know it's hard to thinkthat it's important, but it is, I think.
Fine,probably trying to find balance in life
for really anyonetoday is such a hard thing to do
(27:49):
because we're such,we're a consumer society
and everything is so incrediblyfast paced and it's, you know,
we got to get to the work dayand we got to get to the next thing
on our to do list,and we've got to do all these things.
And so, you know, trying to find the balance of living while you're still working,
try and do it now
(28:09):
before you look back and realizethat you spent your life working away.
I know I did that for such a long time.
I worked two jobsand I was going to college,
and so I missed out on so many thingsbecause I did that.
Though now, thankfully in our daughter,she's she's just such a blessing.
She's totally.
Our lives are so different nowbecause of her, I couldn't be
(28:32):
I couldn't be more thankful. Honestly.
We it's forced us to slow down by.
And we need that. Yeah. Yeah.
And it's so fortunate, you know,that happened when you were, you know,
far enough along in your life that youactually were able to recognize it.
My, my, my first son was born.
He was four months oldwhen I graduated high school.
And I think I'm a muchso much better of a dad to Max.
(28:52):
And I was the justice
because I remember nowI can visualize the things that I miss,
like when Max is an age, I'mtrying to picture justice, at that age,
and I'm like, man, I was kind of I knowit was happening at that point in time.
I was doing this, this and this,and I, like I dropped him off at school.
I went to tattoo, like wheneverhe was getting out of school.
I was starting tattooing.
By the time I got home,he was already in bed. And that was like.
(29:12):
So my relationship for a several yearperiod was dropping him off at school
in the morning.
That was all I got, you know,and at the time,
I wasn't thinking about itbecause I was 23, you know.
Right.
And so but now, you know, at 48, I'm like,oh yeah, pay attention to this.
Like, this is only it's only happensfor a minute, you know, and yeah.
Yeah.
So right,there's no hood like Parenthood.
(29:32):
That is a wild, crazy, amazing ride.
So yeah.
Yeah, yeah, it definitely.
well sweetwhat an interesting perspective.
I'm glad we I'm glad we sat downand did this.
I don't ever getI don't ever get that perspective.
Like, it's rare that, you know,we sit down
and talk about drawing pictures a lotme and whoever I'm talking to, but rarely
about all the stuff that makes it possibleto, you know, to draw good pictures.
So I love the tattoo community,you know, and,
(29:56):
and I've seen the really dark sides of it.
So but the there's, there's so much goodand we've met such incredible people.
I've had an opportunityto meet so many incredible people.
And I know my heart is just to see thisbe the healthiest community.
And that's not just physically,
you know, I want to see relationshipsand this community be healthy
(30:17):
and marriages be healthy and familiesbe healthy in this community.
It can happen.
I know that there's probably been itcan sometimes get a bad rap.
And yeah, it's it's not the easiest.
But this is such an amazing,
amazing community full of amazing people.
And I just, I'm happy to share.
Have made it be a part of it.
(30:38):
Yeah. Yeah, I'm happy that we met.
That's awesome and there came across.
I do need to get to how many,
how many like fresh photosof all these pieces we talked about.
You still have.
Oh, no. Oh, my gosh.
I would have to ask Ande.
Yeah.
There's like,I'm trying to think about B-roll
to lay over this and like,oh, we have to see some.
You can't just throw all those names out
and not So any of the tattoosso have to find something.
Maybe I was getting old photos I so I knowand usually conventions are ice boxes.
(31:01):
So I come at
they have like a Snuggie booth up in here.
They’d make so much money
because now I got to come inlike fully clothed, right?
Yeah, yeah.
Back in the days to bare them allbut not know I'm a little smarter now
and I don't like being cold.Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Breathe. Understand?
Saying. sweetThank you Jenny, I enjoyed it.
Well, absolutely. Any time.
All right.Thank you guys. We'll see you next time.
(31:22):
There you go.
Thank you again for supporting what we do.
Thank you to Jesse Smith and RichmondTattoo and Arts Festival.
Definitely come out next year andcheck out that show if you, if you can.
It's a great, great show.
Thanks to Jenny, for spending a little bit of time with us.
What else? I guess that's it.We'll see you next time. Thanks.
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