July 15, 2024 • 48 mins
Dean FM (Dean-Fraser Milford) is a Boston Massachusetts based non-binary rapper, activist and influencer.
His music encapsulates eclectic thoughts that scat over percussive rhythms and exotic sounds. His performances exude drag culture and satiric expression. In 2016, Dean released his debut EP “Watch It”, which received local and national coverage. In 2020, Dean FM released his EP entitled “SISSY.” The music video for his lead single “Bottom Bit” shines a light on the exploitation of prostitution.
Dean FM stands for compassion, courage, and equality. In his activism, he supports the awareness and acceptance of gender neutrality. He refuses to deny his true identity — identifying himself with both he and her pronouns. Dean also advocates for the awareness of minority mental health and the prevention of animal abuse.
As an influencer, Dean utilizes his platforms to further promote his art and advocacy work.
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Hosted by Alex Iantaffi
Music by Maxwell von Raven
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Alex Iantaffi (00:03):
Hello and welcome to another episode of Gender
Stories. As ever, I'm soexcited. I know I'm always
excited. But first of all, I'man easily excitable person. And
second of all for gender storiesI get to talk to so many
wonderful people. And today Iget to talk to Dean FM a Boston
Massachusetts based non-binaryrapper, activist and influencer.
(00:24):
His music encapsulates eclecticthoughts that scat over
percussive rhythms and exoticsounds. His performances exude
drag culture and satiricexpression. In 2016, Dean
released his debut EP “WatchIt”, which received local and
national coverage. In 2020, DeanFM released his EP entitled
“SISSY.” The music video for hislead single “Bottom Bit” shines
(00:47):
a light on the exploitation ofprostitution. Dean FM stands
for compassion, courage, andequality. In his activism, he
supports the awareness andacceptance of gender neutrality.
He refuses to deny his trueidentity — identifying himself
with both he and her pronouns.
Dean also advocates for theawareness of minority mental
health and the prevention ofanimal abuse. As an
influencer, Dean utilizes hisplatforms to further promote his
(01:10):
art and advocacy work. Sothank you, Dean for making the
time to talk with me for thegender stories, listeners,
welcome.
Dean FM (01:19):
Thank you so much for having me.
Alex Iantaffi (01:22):
Yeah, I'm always excited to talk about music
because I love music and allstyles of music. And so tell me
a little bit about your journeytowards becoming, you know, a
rapper, and really kind ofmaking the music that you make
what moved you to make music?
And when did you start makingmusic and all that good stuff?
Dean FM (01:45):
Yeah, so I started, I started writing and doing in
getting interested in rap inhigh school. And I started
working with the manager who Ihave now as a lab to tutor on
the side kind of like a mathtutor was a weird, so let's see,
she worked on, I worked with hertoday, nearly 15 years later,
but you know, it's I've gottenreally into music professionally
(02:08):
after about 2021 Or two, becauseI had left college due to an
issue of substance abuse. Andthe it was hard to get back into
school. But I still I decidedto, you know, take on music as I
as I worked in customer service,so I would be able to try to
(02:31):
work towards that. I really, myfirst EP Watch It was, you know,
it was an amazing time, I feltso good. You know, music is
definitely where I want to be.
And I continue to create and Ihave more stuff coming out soon
and that type of thing. So butand currently, I am doing my
music as well as influencing onYouTube and on Instagram, as
(02:54):
well. I have gotten back intoschool so I'm both went but I'm
also trying to go back intoschool and trying to diversify
my or expand my repertoire as aartist in songwriting. So I'm
going for songwriting degree.
And and yeah, that's so um, it'smusic is where it's at for me.
Alex Iantaffi (03:16):
Yeah, congrats on going back to school. I know,
it's not easy when there is adistraction, you know, with
school. And so I Yes, I hopeit's really fun and that you get
everything you want out of doinga songwriting degree. And let's
talk a little bit you know,music can be such a resource, at
least for me, I know, like musicreally helps me with my own
(03:37):
mental health music really helpsme you know, just be more
present, you know, with myselfand the world. And so, I'm
wondering, you know, youmentioned kind of dropping off
school because of substance useissue. Do you find the music as
a musician hopes also helps youkind of process challenges or
(03:58):
feel like you can expressdifferent parts of yourself or
I'm just curious about yourrelationship in terms of like,
mental and emotional and healthand music, if that makes sense.
Yeah,
Dean FM (04:11):
music has always been a pretty decent coping strategy.
And I've always been a creativeor artistic type of individual,
like, when I was younger, I didphysical art, you know, physical
mediums, like, you know,painting collages. I love that
type of thing. I was gonna gointo school for art, but then I
wasn't that didn't work out. SoI went to Tulane and I, Art has
(04:33):
always been a very much anescape. It's in school, you
know, doodling and stuff. I'vealways had these coping
mechanisms and I right now likewriting and producing and
content creating is very helpfulbecause as somebody who doesn't
feel you know, very selfconfident all the time, you
(04:53):
know, I'm working on that. It'snice to have things that that
are put out, and that I can beproud of that are You know,
that's that I can say,regardless as to whether or not
people you know, it's wildlyappreciate or wildly, you know,
like I still I'm proud of it andI'm proud of my you know, of
(05:13):
myself and the things that I putinto. And I encourage everybody,
no matter if they are, you know,it feels like they are
artistically inclined to stillto try it. And everybody
deserves a place in theindustry. That's my opinion, no
matter if they're good or bad.
So that's how I feel, you know?
Yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (05:29):
I really hear that I feel like they're
creating such such such a thingwe need as humans, right?
Whether it's creating a song,creating a meal, writing
something doodling, right,unlike terrible at drawing, but
I really enjoy coloring andchoosing different, you know,
color combination, when I'mcoloring, I think we need that
expression of creativity, whichis getting really hard under
(05:52):
capitalism, right? Becausethere's this idea, we have to,
like, produce and always like,you know, be excellent, I
everything, I'm like, No, we canjust do stuff because it feels
good. It helps us cope, youknow, it helps us express
ourselves. And I love that andyour music is great to also. So
I'm very grateful that you makemusic, by the way, lead with
(06:12):
that.
Dean FM (06:15):
But definitely use in terms of a coping skill. It's
more than that. Obviously, forme, it's, I want it to be
professional, I want to get intoa more professional zone with
it. But I think just beingrealistic with myself and
knowing that, you know, I'vegiven it five years, I'm still
going to keep going, I'm gonnatry to expand what I do. So I'm
definitely want to add music isalways going to be where I'm
(06:35):
gonna return I can. I'm marriedto it, you know, so yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (06:39):
yeah, you're a musician. And once you're a
musician, no matter what happensin terms of like, you know,
success in air quotes, whateversuccess means, right in this
world, that I'm so glad to hearyou're proud of your music, and
it's your music is beautiful.
Also, I just love that because Ifeel as poetry with music. right
it just just, you know, it justspeaks to my soul. So thank you
(07:01):
for making beautiful music. Andlet's talk about gender for a
minute. What is it like to be anon binary musician? Right, I
think there is this impressionof the moment, you know,
definitely for the last fewyears, you know, trans tipping
point, more visibility, and withthat visibility, also come
challenges. And so I'm wonderingabout your own experiences being
(07:23):
a non binary, you know, rapper,non binary musician, artist,
right now what what theexperience is like for you?
Dean FM (07:33):
Well, it's always been.
Music has definitely been a wayto get involved in my community.
And I feel like it's always beena way to, that has, I went out
music, I don't think I wouldhave been able to be as queer or
queer at all, I think music notonly helps me to come and
listen, I helped me come out, Ifeel like music helps me coming
(07:55):
out, like, you know, when I'mlistening to, you know, you
know, all these female rappers,you know, it's kind of hard to,
you know, not accept it.
Finally, you know, like, maybe alittle feminine, you know,
maybe, maybe you got some goodthings good. Yeah. So it's like,
that's always been a winner. AndI feel like performing on stage,
I'm able to be that characterI'm able to be. And it's not to
(08:17):
say that my appearance hasdetermined the character,
because this is who I wouldjust, like, it sounds like going
on stage, and things like that,that's always been a like, it's
such a an enlighteningexperience, as well, as you
know, but in terms of beinggender queer, in hip hop, in the
(08:38):
in what I've experienced in theindustry is not accepting, you
know, the industry is not veryaccepting of, you know, of
homosexuality, of femininity,and it's very often sexualized,
if it is feminine. You know, Ineed to be clear, I just know,
(08:59):
like, I've known and we all Imean, it's something that I
knew, since I was young, thatthis is not going to be an
industry that's going to be easyto be in because of all the, you
know, the macho, you know,people and that type of thing.
Alex Iantaffi (09:10):
Yeah, no, sorry.
Go ahead.
So yeah.
Dean FM (09:16):
Well, yeah, I mean, just these, I'm not gonna stop
doing what I gotta do. You know,there's a lot of, I'm happy to
see a lot of gay artists comingout a lot of gay rappers, a lot
of gay, you know, both lesbianand gay and non binary and in
terms of, you know, in theindustry, it's very nice to see
I think it is becoming moreopen. But that's been a struggle
(09:36):
for me, I wouldn't blame or inany way that that my lack of
success on on the homophobia inthe industry, because, you know,
we all I wanted to take personalresponsibility and that want to
make the best content thatpeople are gonna like, you know,
things like that. Yeah. I mean,yeah, yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (09:55):
No, but it is fairly at the same time. It is
pretty recent. The people havebeen able to be more out as
performers, especially trans nonbinary, gender queer, gender,
expansive performers, in allsorts of arts and in hip hop. I
mean, definitely, the landscapeis very different than it was
like 30 years ago. You know, forexample, when I was a teenager
(10:17):
in the 80s, I'm that old. I'm inmy 50 like, you know, the, it's
so wonderful to have moreartists engaged in the industry,
and they cannot be easy,whatever the industry is, right?
It's never easy. I don't thinkto be a trans non binary, gender
expensive artists. And so Iappreciate you taking personal
(10:38):
responsibility. And there's alsoreality of the system. Right,
when we know there's a lot ofsystemic barriers. And, you
know, let's talk about, youknow, your EP entitled Sissy.
This is often used as a slayer,by, you know, us, citizen,
straight folks, mostly towardskind of more effeminate, folks.
(11:00):
And so, tell me a little bitabout why that title and kind
of, how would you relate to thatword, if that makes sense? Yeah,
Dean FM (11:11):
I was called that when I was younger, because of, from
people in my family. And it's,you know, it's kind of like, I
don't want to, it's even, it'snot even that so deep that I
would like to put those peopleon blast, but it's like, you
know, I put people in my family,I was called up, and it was
always something that was, thatwas the hardest word, I feel
like that was called in, withinmy family towards me. And, you
(11:34):
know, that's, it was, you know,I was proud of that, and my
friends are fond of, you know,just friends of the family, you
know, and, you know, it's, it'sit, I wanted to kind of reclaim
it a little bit with calling myalbum that is just kind of
making it more fun for me, like,just, you know, that's my,
(11:56):
that's my slice. That's why Ifeel like we should be able to
use it, when, when, when thetime calls for it. And I think
there's nothing wrong with withwho people are. I don't think
there's anything Well, I was,you know, I think so slurs come
along with slurs, but there's,you know, there's no real
meaning and there shouldn't beany power in them. But there is
unfortunately, and you know,knowing that I kind of been
(12:17):
recently, even in my creativeclasses, looking back at Sissy I
kind of wonder if that was thebest terminology, because now
it's because, like, recently,Nicki Minaj came out with a song
that had "sissies". And I'mlike, now now I'm like, kind of
like, do I want people? Like,obviously, that's our word,
right. That's our word. And Idon't. And I think it's a
delicate, it's a tricky area tohave. And I don't I don't want
(12:40):
to push it in a way that peopleshould be using it. I don't want
to push it in a way that like,like, even gay people should use
it. I think it's a, it is a sortof my project. That was just the
project, basically. Yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (12:51):
And I think there is power in reclaiming your
words are being used against usto hurt us, right? It's like,
and like you said, it is a fineline, right? Because then it
doesn't mean we're givingpermission to other folks to use
it, if it's not a word that hasbeen used to hurt them, right?
It's like, for me, it's like, Iwould identify, I do identify as
a trans faggot, but I wouldn'tuse that word outside of queer
(13:14):
community, or my official bio,because I don't want to give
straight people the impressionthat they can use that, right.
It's like, no, that's like, it'sa reclaimed word. And, and I,
you know, I feel part of kind ofmovement. And I think it's also
like, interesting as a trans nonbinary, more effeminate,
masculine person to blame theword faggot, right? There's so
(13:36):
many layers. And at the sametime, it is a slayer that's been
used against me and againstother people right in the
community, and have somewhere toyou know, different and similar
to the words to say differentways. And it's like, you know,
how do we take our power backfrom like, the queer phobia? The
misogyny, right, the transmisogyny, the transmisogyny,
(13:56):
wire, like all all the thingsthat, you know, you've
experienced that other folksexperience? So it's, it is a
fine balance, but I think thereis power in reclaiming slurs,
right. And yeah, yeah. And Iactually love that. I was like,
Yeah, let's talk about it. It'slike, it's important. There's
Dean FM (14:14):
nothing wrong. There's nothing wrong with Yeah,
exactly. Yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (14:19):
And what is it like to really like, you know,
take it back and be like, Yes,this is why I am right. Yeah, I
remember you know, somebodyshouting on the street Fagre me
when I was holding hands with apartner and turn around I went
Thank you, and they were like,wow, that is not the reaction
that we're expecting Right? LikeI feel so gender affirmed right
(14:39):
now. And also I know you weretrying to hurt me, but I'm not
gonna let you my I'm just gonnatake my power and whatever way I
can as we do. And let's so let'stalk about this. You know, you
say you stand for compassion,courage and equality, which
totally comes through yourbeautiful music and you know, so
(14:59):
I can literally see ourreclaiming their power as part
of this courage and compassion?
And what is that fires you up atthe moment? What is the thing
that really gets you up in themorning and you're like, This is
the thing that I need to keeppushing for. And I feel at the
moment, I don't know if that'show you feel, but it's a happy
moment, there have been manyhappy moments. You know, in
(15:22):
history, of course, and this isone of those. And so I'm
interested in what fires you upright now and what makes you
makes that creativity flow foryou right now?
Dean FM (15:35):
Well, my, my, my initiatives for my brand, as far
as, you know, what makes me whenI think it's important to talk
about Black trans woman, and thepeople of trans People of Color
to, again, but like, black transwoman, specifically, because of
(15:56):
my interlink and with the, andhow much they've been murdered,
and how that has exponentiallygotten worse. Over the last four
years, specifically, selectthings like that. Not include
gun control, because most ofthose are done by people with
guns. So you know, it's that guncontrol. Yeah. And like, and,
(16:17):
yeah, just overall violence andthings like that, that breaks my
heart. And as somebody who has aplatform, and who has a, a
significant privilege levelcompared relative to, you know,
the world, I think that it'simportant that regardless of how
I feel, regardless of you know,depression, and all these
(16:37):
things, that I still get up inon it, and I try to make some
sort of, you know, change withthat.
Alex Iantaffi (16:45):
Absolutely. I mean, it is the level of trans
legislation that has beenintroduced across the country in
the last four years, the levelof you know, of course, the
ongoing systemic racism, policeviolence, really, it's, it's,
yes, it's heartbreaking. And Ican only imagine how much more
(17:07):
heartbreak and exhausting it isfor you as a, you know, trans
feminine non binary person ofcolor black trans woman, you
know, and so, yeah, I really, Ihear that, but sometimes all we
can do is like, when we get upand we keep fighting for
something better. So while asyou do this, what brings you
(17:30):
joy? What ways? Are younurturing yourself? That's the
question. I'm asking a lot oftrans non binary and gender
expansive folks at the moment,because I feel like it is a
heavy moment. So as well asfighting for justice and
liberation, which absolutely,how can we not for our
community, what kind of helpsyou feel supported and nurtured
and cared for? And, you know,finding moments of joy? How are
(17:53):
you finding your joy andnurturance nowadays?
Dean FM (17:57):
Well, I think one thing that is, first of all, the most
responsible advice to peoplewould be like to therapy therapy
is what I'm doing. And therapyis helpful to me right now. And
is, you know, aside from that,just working on my, my health,
my physical health, withexercising and things like that,
(18:17):
I understand it's not that it'snot easy for people who have
depressive tendencies toparalyze, you know, so it's
fine. You know, and youshouldn't shame yourself for
that, if you don't, if you'renot able to get those things
done. And, you know, I like totake, yeah, I have my own, you
know, struggles in that it'snot, there's not really any
direct fix for me, for for the,you know, the, you know, what,
(18:42):
let me just close it, like, Ihave depression, anxiety, but
it's not, but you know, like,it's, there's no real, you know,
fix for, for that, but, youknow, working every day to do
something better pickingvitamins, you know, knowing
knowing every day even, even ifeven if I take my vitamin that
day, I know that I didsomething, you know, I just
something I shouldn't, Ishouldn't hate myself, in trying
(19:03):
not to hate myself. I mean, thisthis sounds like a terrible
place, but like trying not to,you know, try not to take things
out on myself and to go slow,even though I know that, um, um,
stuff, you know, I'm, I'm notdoing my best to not think over
to overthink too much. And, youknow, to again, look at my art
coping and, and yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (19:25):
no, that makes sense. I mean, it's a delicate
balance, right? It's like, weknow that, of course. I mean, I
don't know anybody who's transwas not experiencing depression
and anxiety, because of theworld we live in. Right. And
again, I think when you'rebrought up with a, you know,
historically, marginalizedidentity, it's hard to find that
(19:46):
kind of confidence and self lovebecause you have a world like
hating on you and so in so manydifferent ways, right? So it's
kind of that balance, like wefight for justice, and we also
take care of ourselves andsometimes there are some days
where my well I'm breathing andI'm drinking some water good
enough, right? I'm here,tomorrow is a different day and
(20:06):
I can do something different.
And I think that's so important.
I think there are other No, theworld puts so much pressure on,
like, you have to do all thethings, right, you care for
yourself and you care forothers, and you have to be
productive. And this only 24hours in a day people. And we're
also tired. I feel tired, right?
Dean FM (20:27):
Yeah. And it's important to, you know, to take,
you know, to know that and toknow, your, and I want to say
know, your limitation, but toknow, like, that this is
something that's gonna you know,I don't know, it's not, it's not
something that you should. It'snot necessarily it's like a
blame thing, but it's more solike, making sure that you also
(20:48):
hold some sort of standard toyourself, because if you like
you don't fall, if you don'tstand for something like you'll
fall, you know, and I think thatjust just just taking it easy,
but every little step, everylittle step is valuable. And
it's should be celebrated to theeyes, because that's how I you
know, so yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (21:08):
absolutely. It's like, you know, I often ask
myself, Okay, what's, what's inmy control here? And what's
outside of my control? Okay,taking care of myself, it's in
my control. I'm doing the best Ican. And even if it's like, the
smallest step, like you said,it's still a step. Right? And
sometimes, that's all we can do.
And we do need to celebratethose moments because they are
important. Absolutely. And, youknow, I think being surrounded
(21:31):
by so much transphobia is noteasy, I think for for people
right now. And I don't know if Idon't even know if sis people
really understand just theimpact of the constant. Oh,
there's another bill and othertrans woman, usually a black
trans woman or a trans woman ofcolor murdered, right? It's,
(21:52):
it's like a drip, drip dripevery day? How can it not impact
our mental health? Esteem?
Dean FM (22:00):
Yeah, right. And as queer people, it's so
overlooked, I think, just themental health issue that goes
along with not only you know,just under being addressed, but
also homelessness, and all thosethings in society is so just
government doesn't care.
Government doesn't care about alot of things. So yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (22:16):
ya know, it's becoming increasingly clear.
Now, you can just be arrestedfor being houseless. And
sleeping, which I'm like,sleeping should be a human right
. I'm like, how, what is even? Imean, I know what is happening,
what's always happened and what,sometimes my clients are like,
Alex, do you think everybody hastrauma? And I was like, Well, of
(22:36):
course, I was like, it's acountry based on like, an
ongoing genocide, slavery, andcapitalism was like, Oh, can we
not or be traumatized in one wayor another? You know, obviously,
different ways. But of course,so well, and on that, on that
happy note, you know, like, butwe keep going, right, we keep
(22:57):
going, and you are an activist,as well as a musician and an
influencer? You know, and Ithink that, that's the, I don't
know about you, but it's like,do you feel that the activism in
a way, keeps you going, keepsyou connected to community?
Keeps you less isolated? I'mjust curious about the role of
activism in your life? And didit emerge through your music in
(23:20):
a different way? Like, where didyou get the passion to be like,
I need to do something, I needto be active as part of the
community.
Dean FM (23:29):
Yeah, with my music, the original purpose was not
necessarily to even mention thatI was queer. Like, that was not,
that was not my intent.
Originally, overtime, I was kindof taught to sorry about that.
Like, you can't really, youcan't really just not address
that. It's not like that. Butit's like, you know, also, like,
advocate, like, that's wherethat came from. And I wanted to,
(23:50):
it's important to have acommunity I think, when you're
struggling with, especially ifyou don't have a supportive
place, to have people aroundyou, therapists are not, you
know, have a lot of peoplearound you, you know, that are
either trans or just family thatloves you. And yeah, that's
those are always things that Ithink are helpful in this
(24:12):
society.
Alex Iantaffi (24:16):
Absolutely, yeah.
And finding our people can be sohard but so worthwhile, right?
Because when we feel isolated,then that depression can feel
even heavier, that isolation canreally feed all this like
anxious thoughts, too. So, youknow, I really appreciate how
open you are about mental healthand that is part of your
passion, right? And in otherparts of your passion is gender
(24:39):
neutrality, as you mentioned, inyour bio, tell me more about
what gender neutrality means toyou. When you say that what
what's the dream, right? If youcould wave a magic wand and
tomorrow we're leaving thegender neutral world that you
dream off, what does the worldlook like?
Dean FM (24:58):
Like with gender neutrality, Yeah, definitely I
do identify as genderqueer. He,he pronouns primarily. And I
mean, to me, the whole point ofthe gender expression, and
something that I really want topush is allowing everybody, not
(25:19):
just queer people, everybody tobe able to express themselves.
That's what I want. Like, like,when I go out with my full face
of black heavy stuff, or when Ijust go out to the supermarket,
or when I go to like, like, Iwant a woman to look at me and
say, okay, maybe I can wear someskin, you know, maybe this guy
is out there doing this. Solet's, you know, maybe I can
encourage the women so even ifthey want to, if they want to
(25:41):
not be ashamed, and not feel,you know, uncomfortable, and
yeah, that's, that's primarilyhow I view that. And I also
want, I would hope that one daythere would be neutral pronouns
for for everybody. It is verytricky, right now. Let that
especially when it's like youdon't know who you're talking to
(26:03):
another the straight community,how they view us, it's hard for
them to, to grasp the day, whichis, you know, I don't know why,
but that is that's though it'sgonna be a struggle. But But I
right now, I really just want topeople to be more expressive,
because that's going to be 1000sof years down the line. But I
think right now, people arealready doing it. People are
already doing I want straightand I want straight men to be
able to do what they want, youknow, and so yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (26:27):
I'm with you. I was like, I think that it's so
constrictive to police genderthe way we do and also just
policing anything. It's messedup in so many ways. And so,
yeah, that gender expansiveness,that freedom, just clothing,
art, clothing, you know, hair,his hair, you know, I remember
in like, a neighborhood emailthread somebody going, how do
(26:49):
you take care of boys long hair?
And I was like, I guess the sameas you take care of girls long
hair. It's like it's hair. Andthey were like, Oh, I hadn't
thought about it. And I waslike, Yes, that's right. I was
like, I was trying to have somuch compassion. But I was also
so puzzled. Because, you know, Iwas like, it is it's long hair.
I mean, like, if they've askedlike, how, you know, I've always
(27:13):
had short hair. I don't know howto take care of long hair.
Absolutely. I mean, like, myoldest loves hair braids. And I
was like, I can't help you. I'mterrible at it. Like, let's find
somebody else who can write,I've always loved my hair
shorts. So I don't have a lot ofpractice with that. Right. But I
think people have sought suchweird ideas around, like, you
know, even things that you know,how everybody has kind of making
(27:36):
them gender, right, men's andbought, you know, men's clothes,
women's clothes, boys, toys,girls toys, I'm like, or just
toys, and clothes and makeup,you know, and accessories. And
yeah, and even recently,
Dean FM (27:53):
I was talking about like, something like this, you
saw some show. And it was like,You should have seen that there
was somebody who's genderqueer,who's clear on them. Like, what,
how did they say that right now?
I just have a look. I'm like,Mom, maybe that guy does not
want to be you know, that's kindof what I'm saying is that
somebody shouldn't be looked atand doesn't even viewed as they
don't want to be. And, you know,that's kind of Yeah, yeah,
(28:15):
there's a lot of
Alex Iantaffi (28:17):
that was watching some standout by like some trans
comics. And you know, one ofthem is like, you can be in a
room with 50 people I can Ithink it was River oh my god, I
can never Butcher I think it'slike, you can be in a room with
50 people and there's like, 49people, and then somebody goes,
what are your pronouns? Right?
Like, it's like, they're kind ofgetting singled out, right. Like
(28:39):
I look forward to when it's soaccepted that actually we ask
everybody what their pronounsare, because we can't make
assumptions you know aboutsomebody's gender or sexuality
just based on their mannerism orclothing. Absolutely. Wouldn't
that be amazing? I want to be inthat world one day, but probably
not. Yeah, meats. Well, maybe inour lifetime, who knows there's
(29:05):
so much that can happen. Right?
And, you know, you say in yourbio as well, that you really
advocate for awareness ofMinority Mental Health. And I
know that like mental health andaccess to therapy can be so
stigmatized. And so I'mwondering about, you know, what
do you see that makes youpassionate about be more open
(29:29):
about mental health? What do yousee in terms of stigma around
Minority Mental Healthspecifically, that makes you
passionate about this topic?
Dean FM (29:38):
Um, substance use to me is one of the biggest things
that I feel like I can speak onin terms of mental health, due
to seeing many people that arenot just for people of color,
but you know, in general, youknow, that's something that I
know that is. I've seen peoplein my own biological Family pass
(30:01):
from. I had two sistersrecently, two years ago that
were biological who passed. Andone was because of a, a
potentially a substance issueand seeing 16, things like that,
and you know, I mean, just just,you know, and also going through
(30:23):
what I've gone through not onlyas an adult but as a child to
being diagnosed at a very youngage with ADHD do put on
medication at what is it 11 or12? Or, you know, it's starting
to start to get off, then Ithink that not only in the, in
the queer community, and thisisn't color specific. This is
not when I talk about mentalhealth, I don't really mean
color specific, except for thefact that we, it's like, we
(30:46):
can't access it. And there's notmuch I can, you know, say about
that, I think that there's a lotof systemic issues that are
behind that, that need to beaddressed. But with mental
health, I always want to be anadvocate. And by that, like, I
want people to reach out if theywant to reach out. And I like to
talk to people and you know,about people, and I am a very
much open book. So I don't mindbeing a voice in that sense.
Alex Iantaffi (31:09):
And thank you for being a voice because I think
people do find it hard, right?
And there's a lot of like, oh,people should reach out. And I'm
like, and when people reach out,how do we react? And also, how
can we kind of really make itcommon for folks to be like, Oh,
I'm struggling with this? Or canyou come over and do some
parallel tasks with me? Right?
Maybe I'll do my dishes when youwhile you answer emails, because
(31:31):
we're both like struggling withthat. Right? Can we just say,
almost the law talks a lot aboutreally dreaming about what this
community care looks like,right? And that's something I'm
really passionate about, right?
Because I think that we all feelso isolated and disconnected
because of white supremacy, andcolonialism and capitalism. And
so really resisting thatnarrative of isolation and
(31:52):
nurturing community and buildingcommunity is so important. I'm
also so sorry to hear about yoursisters. And
Dean FM (32:01):
yeah. Oh, thank you. I mean, about the Black. Really, I
think one thing also that wouldbe important to mention, is,
it's a tricky thing to, for meto want to discuss the panel,
because it's, I don't know ifit's necessarily something that
everybody should hear, you know,but but when it sounds like the
Black community, I feel likethere's an internal internal
struggle there that's verysevere, with with queer people
(32:24):
and things like that, that alsocould affect mental health and,
you know, being ostracized, andyou know, and those things, you
know, beat the stone to thestone, you know, thrown out the
door, it's not necessarilymentally the best situation. So,
yeah, I think that the Blackreally has a lot of issues not
only come from beingsystemically oppressed in
(32:45):
behind, but within the internal,not only the, the Black church,
the Black church, we have awhole lot of has a whole lot of
history there with exorcisms ofqueer people. Like it's a whole,
it's a whole, you know, so. Sothere's a lot of, but it's not
just the Black community as if,you know, that's causing the
internal issues, but you knowwhat I mean? Yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (33:05):
I do and that Christian supremacy, you know,
kind of world that sometimes welive in, and, you know, if it's
not an inclusive Church, it canbe really impactful. And, yeah,
I agree with you. I mean, it'snot just Black churches. It's
also like, right, angelical,white churches, Baptist
churches, I see this, you know,and then there's other systemic
issues, you know, but, and I cantotally understand the
(33:27):
reluctance to talk about it,because I think there's a strong
stereotype that sometimes, youknow, Black community or Black
churches are more transphobic,or queer phobic. And that has
not been my experiencenecessarily. I was like, and
queer phobia with white folks,too. But I think I was like,
let's not deflect the issue. Youknow what I mean, but it's like,
(33:48):
the reluctance as a both...and.
Right? It's like, yeah, yeah.
And, and it is tricky, because Ithink that, yeah, I think that
it's always I think, sometimes Iwonder, as a minoritized person,
if I shared this vulnerablething is going to be weaponized
against me or my community,right? And so I don't know if
(34:08):
there is also that feeling likethings can get turned around and
distorted. And so I'm alwayslike, when I talk about things,
I'm always like, oh, I want toshare the thing. And also, I
don't want it to come acrosswrong or to be used against me
or my communities. Right. So I'mwondering if there's a little
bit of that, which is totallyunderstandable. Yeah, yeah.
(34:29):
Yeah,
Dean FM (34:30):
that is because, you know, I don't want the Black
community, I think that it'simportant that, you know, we're
not be viewed as weak. I don'tthink that the community is
necessarily weak as far as muchas it is behind and I just, you
know, yeah. Obviously, the Blackcommunity is where I was grazed.
And so, you know, that's mypeople. You know, I just don't
(34:50):
like to see that. We are havingany sort of dilemma here. It's
not it's not beneficial in thispolitical climate. Certainly
still. Yeah. Yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (34:58):
no, yes. And this political climate also just, I
don't know, there are timeswhere I'm like, Well, do I even
want to be visible? Like, evenwith all my privilege as like a
light skinned person, as adisabled person, as a trans
person? It's like this. Not easytimes to navigate.
Dean FM (35:14):
Like, No, believe me.
My comments on YouTube, I couldnot handle this point, like, I'm
still growing my audience. Andright now, I'm just getting the
Trump 2020 cores, you know, likeall those.
Alex Iantaffi (35:27):
Yeah. Imagine, I'm so glad that you're kind of
turned off those comments,because sometimes we were like,
oh, and I'm like, no block away,you know, delete the comments,
like, do what you need to do toprotect your mental health, for
sure, more visible because it'snot a good environment right now
out there. So I'm glad you'reprotecting your well being by
(35:49):
turning off those comments.
100%. Yeah, yeah. Talking aboutyour work and your visibility
online? What are the projectsthat you're working towards? Any
projects that you want to talkabout, like, music that you're
working on? Or? Yeah, what? Whatare you working on right now?
Dean FM (36:09):
Um, right now, I'm just kind of editing a music video, I
haven't, I haven't come out witha music video in a while. So I'm
kind of editing that taking abreak from reaction content on
YouTube for just for like, lessthan a week, to be honest. But
like with the, because I, that'sbeen over 40 videos, plus in
that channel over the last likesix months. So I, I have, I
(36:29):
really wants to get in the actto queer content. It's all queer
content. You know, it says, Ilike to do commentary on tech
talks, commentary on, you know,the Jerry Springer show, but all
trans episodes, you know, andthose type of things and give my
opinions and not necessarily belike the political thing,
because I'm not a politicalperson. I don't think I would be
responsible to say that I am ifI'm not well educated in that,
(36:53):
but I still want to give like apositive you will maybe get some
staff here where I think the CFOappropriate. So yeah, that's
what they're doing. No, I
Alex Iantaffi (37:01):
hear that, unfortunately, sometimes
existing as a minoritized personmeans being political
inherently. Like I feel likejust existing as a trans person
is inherently political. Youknow, you existing as a black
person on Turtle Island, isinherently political because of
the systemic issues. Absolutely.
Right. Like but, but I do lovethat, because, and I love how
(37:22):
social media can really give usa way of being in conversation
with popular culture. Right, Ithink just kind of that dialogue
with popular culture. Well, I'mexcited about the new music
video. I can't wait to see thatbad. Fabulous, do you know, more
or less when it's gonna comeout? So listeners can watch out
for it?
Dean FM (37:44):
Yeah, it should be coming out this week. I mean,
I'm working on it. Now. It'skind of like it's my own
homemade music, because we'rekind of like the biggest club,
but it's not my major budgetvideo. But it's like, you know,
that's, it's coming out. Soyeah, it's been coming out this
week. And I still have morevideos to watch by Sunday. And,
you know, I try to try to I'mtrying to stay up with it. But
like, you know, yeah, I'm doingmy best.
Alex Iantaffi (38:06):
It takes a lot of time and effort. Are you
kidding? It's like, it's a lotto me content. So, you know,
it's not easy to I think it'sway more time consuming than
people think. To get coal. Yeah.
I don't know. Like, I feel likethat 90, at least for me, 98% of
God that that went out there.
It's really a labor of love, youknow, and kind of wanting to
(38:26):
share people. Yeah. So Yeah. Yousaid, there's a question that I
asked everybody, when Iinterview them, which is, is
there anything that we haven'ttalked about? That you would
like to talk about? Or that youwould like, Oh, I was really
open to talk about that. And ifthere isn't, it's okay. But I
always ask my guests goes on,like, if there's something we
(38:49):
haven't touched on, we can talkabout it, and take the time, you
need to think about it. Um,yeah,
Dean FM (38:54):
I mean, I think just in terms of the, my gender queer
experience, and what I wouldlike to say about like, why I
choose to identify asgenderqueer a lot of people ask
me, like, why aren't you awoman, you know, actually was
identified as a woman. I feellike it's important for every
trans person to take time to notif they don't know what the,
what they want. I'm a veryunsure person, I'm very
(39:17):
confused. And I just, I didn'twant to, you know, to make a
decision that might not be thebest for me mental health
considered mostly, and I thinkthere's nothing wrong with that.
With being, you know,genderqueer in the middle, and
just just experimenting withyour appearance and stuff like
(39:39):
that. And, you know, I urgeeverybody to be careful.
Alex Iantaffi (39:45):
I love that, you know, I'm like, yes, let's play
with gender. Also, gender is ajourney. Now remember, when I
got my top surgery, 14 yearsago, almost now, people are
like, so you're gonna be a mannow and I'm like, Nope, not
gonna be a man still gonna be myA queer door self like not a man
or woman, you know, just likethere's this little puzzle piece
(40:09):
that when I'm out in the worldpeople are like, Ma'am, sir, I
mean, sorry. And I'm so goodrelax. Like, you know,
Dean FM (40:16):
ya know, I definitely relate to that because I Yeah,
yeah, yeah, exactly. I relate tothat because with, with, I want
to start hormones, you know, Iwant to start hormones, but not
for the fact of wanting to be afemale. I just want more
feminization. And you know,that's okay to people can people
as long as you pass? Yeah, yeah,yeah, God, I
Alex Iantaffi (40:37):
love that.
Because it's like people. AndI'm like, and I'm a therapist.
And I understand that peopleneed to think through it. And
all sudden, there are somethings that you need to
experience in your body to knowif it's right for you. Even like
I've been on testosterone. Ithink this is my, this is my
third time over the last 10 or20 years, right. And I have been
on it and then stopped because Idon't want to masculinize
(41:00):
completely. But there are somethings that are helpful,
especially now withperimenopause. And I think
people think about is, this is adecision. And then once you make
it, there's no going back. AndI'm like, No, you need to think
about the impact and theconsequences, but that you
actually can try something, stopit. If it's not right for you,
then maybe it's right for youfive years down the line, or 10
(41:22):
years down the line. And there'snothing wrong with that. I'm,
I'm with you. Let's normalizegender exploration. And then
let's normalize like, I want totry hormones and see if they're
for me, because there's somestuff that we don't know until
you experience it. You know whatI mean? Like, I can think about
it all day long. But it's onlywhen I experienced it. I know
what it feels like in my body. Idon't know if I'm making sense.
(41:44):
But no,
Dean FM (41:46):
that's that's good.
Yeah, that's true. But it'strue. Yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (41:50):
So I hope when you try it out, that you will
give yourself whatever time youneed to figure out what's right
for you. Because I think that'salso the beauty of being
genderqueer. Is that, okay? Idon't fit into a box, which
means I get to, you know, I drawmy own map of where I want to
go. And it's a way if I'm yonderdown one path, and then I'm
(42:13):
like, you know, this is not forme, I'm just gonna turn around
and go back and go another way.
Like, I think that's great.
Definitely, any, anything thatyou think if there's younger
listeners, you know, maybeteenagers or young adults who
are feeling in that more liminalspace of like, I'm not sure I'm
(42:36):
genderqueer. But I'm not sureyou know, how to present myself
or what to do, especially maybeyoung, kind of black gender
queer folks, right? Any thingthat you would want to say to
them or share with them? Or?
Yeah,
Dean FM (42:53):
it takes time for people around you to know what's
going on. Like, I think, I thinksomething that's important is,
like, obviously, to me likethis, if that, like, boy, if you
want to talk to just like, Iwould just say that, but like in
terms of like, be realistic,what society like, and what I
would want people to how I wantpeople to be saved, would be
(43:14):
like to, to, first of all, ifyou're going to come out to know
the political climate of yourfamily, you know, to know what's
how they feel about those typesof things. And if you can start
wearing makeup to do it, maybegradually and, but don't don't
like, throw yourself intosituations that might be
dangerous, like, if you'regonna, like it might be and you
(43:35):
don't know, definitely, there'sone or 2% We've got to be issues
somewhere, somewhere there'sgonna be issues. So just be
prepared. And, and just go easywith yourself go slow and and to
know that if you can't, if yourfamily does not accept you,
that's and that to find acommunity that does to find a
(43:56):
queer support group before youthere many of those in in
Boston, I know. And I'm actuallyhelping out with one I'm going
to be volunteering without MetroWest, which is a youth support
group. So I'm doing so there'sthat and you know, find find
people who who you relate to andalso like to keep your situation
(44:21):
in mind. And don't to don't goslow like you're just like
you're just if you're under 18Like you have your time and and
to be safe, just be safe and berealistic. And it's hard to say
that because I want everybodylike I want a boy who's like
listening if they want to wearjust to just to pull out a
dress. Let's like I think beingcareful is also like you know,
(44:43):
worth worth worth payingattention to.
Alex Iantaffi (44:46):
Absolutely. I think safety is important and
you know, I do dream of the daywhen it's not even an issue
right? Like you said if a boywants to wear a dress they can
just put on the dress and notworry about safety back While
it's an issue, I think that itmakes complete sense. And
sometimes when we're young, likesafety is not our top concern.
(45:07):
At least it wasn't for me. Iknow, I put myself in a lot of
dangerous situations as a youngperson, you know, but I think,
yeah,
Dean FM (45:15):
that to like be just be, be safe, be safe sexually
Don't, don't be too active.
Like, don't, don't do that whenI did, which was I was 15 Go on
dating apps, like talking to,you know, older guys don't do
that. Don't, don't be you know,just just just stay in the kids
stay being a child, like don'tlike just because we quit
(45:35):
doesn't mean we got to do allthis stuff. We can still have
fun, you know? And yeah, yeah,just don't just be careful.
Alex Iantaffi (45:44):
There's a lot of time to do all this stuff. And
it, you know, to young and olderfolks out there too. If you
know, if something happens, andyou're not safe, look for some
support and some help, therewill be people who have
compassion and support to giveyou so I know, I feel lucky that
there were people to give mesupport and compassion. And so I
(46:05):
hope that the folks do findthemselves in unsafe situation
that they can talk about it withsomebody and find that
compassion and care somewhere.
Dean FM (46:14):
Yeah. So yeah, it saved my life going to the youth
support group, because that wasvery helpful to me to have a
youth support group, as well,when I was in high school. So
yeah, me that's that's why, youknow, just reach out, reach out.
Absolutely.
Alex Iantaffi (46:29):
Reach out, find your people. Peer support is so
wonderful. So I'm so glad thatyou had a queer youth support
group, a school that was likethat place for you. I feel like
I could keep talking about withyou about mental health, about
music, but I want to berespectful of your time. But
before we sign off, where canpeople find your work where they
(46:50):
can follow you? You know, I'llput that in the Episode Notes
too. But let's share the in theepisode to like, where can they
find you on YouTube andInstagram.
Dean FM (47:01):
It's at DeanFMofficial on all platforms. And the laptop
if you just search for musicit's DeanFM on all platforms,
and then DeanFMOfficoal forsocial media.
Alex Iantaffi (47:13):
Wonderful. So it's also in the Episode Notes.
So check out Dean FM's music iswonderful, and all his other
content too. So thank you somuch for today. I really
appreciate this conversation. Ireally appreciate you and I
really appreciate the beautifulcontent and music that you
(47:34):
create. So thank you so much.
Dean FM (47:36):
Thank you, thank you
Alex Iantaffi (47:40):
and to your gender stories, listeners, you
know, stay safe, stay creative,and stay expansive in your own
life. And until next time,
Hello and welcome to another episode of Gender
Stories. As ever, I'm soexcited. I know I'm always
excited. But first of all, I'man easily excitable person. And
second of all for gender storiesI get to talk to so many
wonderful people. And today Iget to talk to Dean FM a Boston
Massachusetts based non-binaryrapper, activist and influencer.
(00:24):
His music encapsulates eclecticthoughts that scat over
percussive rhythms and exoticsounds. His performances exude
drag culture and satiricexpression. In 2016, Dean
released his debut EP “WatchIt”, which received local and
national coverage. In 2020, DeanFM released his EP entitled
“SISSY.” The music video for hislead single “Bottom Bit” shines
(00:47):
a light on the exploitation ofprostitution. Dean FM stands
for compassion, courage, andequality. In his activism, he
supports the awareness andacceptance of gender neutrality.
He refuses to deny his trueidentity — identifying himself
with both he and her pronouns.
Dean also advocates for theawareness of minority mental
health and the prevention ofanimal abuse. As an
influencer, Dean utilizes hisplatforms to further promote his
(01:10):
art and advocacy work. Sothank you, Dean for making the
time to talk with me for thegender stories, listeners,
welcome.
Dean FM (01:19):
Thank you so much for having me.
Alex Iantaffi (01:22):
Yeah, I'm always excited to talk about music
because I love music and allstyles of music. And so tell me
a little bit about your journeytowards becoming, you know, a
rapper, and really kind ofmaking the music that you make
what moved you to make music?
And when did you start makingmusic and all that good stuff?
Dean FM (01:45):
Yeah, so I started, I started writing and doing in
getting interested in rap inhigh school. And I started
working with the manager who Ihave now as a lab to tutor on
the side kind of like a mathtutor was a weird, so let's see,
she worked on, I worked with hertoday, nearly 15 years later,
but you know, it's I've gottenreally into music professionally
(02:08):
after about 2021 Or two, becauseI had left college due to an
issue of substance abuse. Andthe it was hard to get back into
school. But I still I decidedto, you know, take on music as I
as I worked in customer service,so I would be able to try to
(02:31):
work towards that. I really, myfirst EP Watch It was, you know,
it was an amazing time, I feltso good. You know, music is
definitely where I want to be.
And I continue to create and Ihave more stuff coming out soon
and that type of thing. So butand currently, I am doing my
music as well as influencing onYouTube and on Instagram, as
(02:54):
well. I have gotten back intoschool so I'm both went but I'm
also trying to go back intoschool and trying to diversify
my or expand my repertoire as aartist in songwriting. So I'm
going for songwriting degree.
And and yeah, that's so um, it'smusic is where it's at for me.
Alex Iantaffi (03:16):
Yeah, congrats on going back to school. I know,
it's not easy when there is adistraction, you know, with
school. And so I Yes, I hopeit's really fun and that you get
everything you want out of doinga songwriting degree. And let's
talk a little bit you know,music can be such a resource, at
least for me, I know, like musicreally helps me with my own
(03:37):
mental health music really helpsme you know, just be more
present, you know, with myselfand the world. And so, I'm
wondering, you know, youmentioned kind of dropping off
school because of substance useissue. Do you find the music as
a musician hopes also helps youkind of process challenges or
(03:58):
feel like you can expressdifferent parts of yourself or
I'm just curious about yourrelationship in terms of like,
mental and emotional and healthand music, if that makes sense.
Yeah,
Dean FM (04:11):
music has always been a pretty decent coping strategy.
And I've always been a creativeor artistic type of individual,
like, when I was younger, I didphysical art, you know, physical
mediums, like, you know,painting collages. I love that
type of thing. I was gonna gointo school for art, but then I
wasn't that didn't work out. SoI went to Tulane and I, Art has
(04:33):
always been a very much anescape. It's in school, you
know, doodling and stuff. I'vealways had these coping
mechanisms and I right now likewriting and producing and
content creating is very helpfulbecause as somebody who doesn't
feel you know, very selfconfident all the time, you
(04:53):
know, I'm working on that. It'snice to have things that that
are put out, and that I can beproud of that are You know,
that's that I can say,regardless as to whether or not
people you know, it's wildlyappreciate or wildly, you know,
like I still I'm proud of it andI'm proud of my you know, of
(05:13):
myself and the things that I putinto. And I encourage everybody,
no matter if they are, you know,it feels like they are
artistically inclined to stillto try it. And everybody
deserves a place in theindustry. That's my opinion, no
matter if they're good or bad.
So that's how I feel, you know?
Yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (05:29):
I really hear that I feel like they're
creating such such such a thingwe need as humans, right?
Whether it's creating a song,creating a meal, writing
something doodling, right,unlike terrible at drawing, but
I really enjoy coloring andchoosing different, you know,
color combination, when I'mcoloring, I think we need that
expression of creativity, whichis getting really hard under
(05:52):
capitalism, right? Becausethere's this idea, we have to,
like, produce and always like,you know, be excellent, I
everything, I'm like, No, we canjust do stuff because it feels
good. It helps us cope, youknow, it helps us express
ourselves. And I love that andyour music is great to also. So
I'm very grateful that you makemusic, by the way, lead with
(06:12):
that.
Dean FM (06:15):
But definitely use in terms of a coping skill. It's
more than that. Obviously, forme, it's, I want it to be
professional, I want to get intoa more professional zone with
it. But I think just beingrealistic with myself and
knowing that, you know, I'vegiven it five years, I'm still
going to keep going, I'm gonnatry to expand what I do. So I'm
definitely want to add music isalways going to be where I'm
(06:35):
gonna return I can. I'm marriedto it, you know, so yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (06:39):
yeah, you're a musician. And once you're a
musician, no matter what happensin terms of like, you know,
success in air quotes, whateversuccess means, right in this
world, that I'm so glad to hearyou're proud of your music, and
it's your music is beautiful.
Also, I just love that because Ifeel as poetry with music. right
it just just, you know, it justspeaks to my soul. So thank you
(07:01):
for making beautiful music. Andlet's talk about gender for a
minute. What is it like to be anon binary musician? Right, I
think there is this impressionof the moment, you know,
definitely for the last fewyears, you know, trans tipping
point, more visibility, and withthat visibility, also come
challenges. And so I'm wonderingabout your own experiences being
(07:23):
a non binary, you know, rapper,non binary musician, artist,
right now what what theexperience is like for you?
Dean FM (07:33):
Well, it's always been.
Music has definitely been a wayto get involved in my community.
And I feel like it's always beena way to, that has, I went out
music, I don't think I wouldhave been able to be as queer or
queer at all, I think music notonly helps me to come and
listen, I helped me come out, Ifeel like music helps me coming
(07:55):
out, like, you know, when I'mlistening to, you know, you
know, all these female rappers,you know, it's kind of hard to,
you know, not accept it.
Finally, you know, like, maybe alittle feminine, you know,
maybe, maybe you got some goodthings good. Yeah. So it's like,
that's always been a winner. AndI feel like performing on stage,
I'm able to be that characterI'm able to be. And it's not to
(08:17):
say that my appearance hasdetermined the character,
because this is who I wouldjust, like, it sounds like going
on stage, and things like that,that's always been a like, it's
such a an enlighteningexperience, as well, as you
know, but in terms of beinggender queer, in hip hop, in the
(08:38):
in what I've experienced in theindustry is not accepting, you
know, the industry is not veryaccepting of, you know, of
homosexuality, of femininity,and it's very often sexualized,
if it is feminine. You know, Ineed to be clear, I just know,
(08:59):
like, I've known and we all Imean, it's something that I
knew, since I was young, thatthis is not going to be an
industry that's going to be easyto be in because of all the, you
know, the macho, you know,people and that type of thing.
Alex Iantaffi (09:10):
Yeah, no, sorry.
Go ahead.
So yeah.
Dean FM (09:16):
Well, yeah, I mean, just these, I'm not gonna stop
doing what I gotta do. You know,there's a lot of, I'm happy to
see a lot of gay artists comingout a lot of gay rappers, a lot
of gay, you know, both lesbianand gay and non binary and in
terms of, you know, in theindustry, it's very nice to see
I think it is becoming moreopen. But that's been a struggle
(09:36):
for me, I wouldn't blame or inany way that that my lack of
success on on the homophobia inthe industry, because, you know,
we all I wanted to take personalresponsibility and that want to
make the best content thatpeople are gonna like, you know,
things like that. Yeah. I mean,yeah, yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (09:55):
No, but it is fairly at the same time. It is
pretty recent. The people havebeen able to be more out as
performers, especially trans nonbinary, gender queer, gender,
expansive performers, in allsorts of arts and in hip hop. I
mean, definitely, the landscapeis very different than it was
like 30 years ago. You know, forexample, when I was a teenager
(10:17):
in the 80s, I'm that old. I'm inmy 50 like, you know, the, it's
so wonderful to have moreartists engaged in the industry,
and they cannot be easy,whatever the industry is, right?
It's never easy. I don't thinkto be a trans non binary, gender
expensive artists. And so Iappreciate you taking personal
(10:38):
responsibility. And there's alsoreality of the system. Right,
when we know there's a lot ofsystemic barriers. And, you
know, let's talk about, youknow, your EP entitled Sissy.
This is often used as a slayer,by, you know, us, citizen,
straight folks, mostly towardskind of more effeminate, folks.
(11:00):
And so, tell me a little bitabout why that title and kind
of, how would you relate to thatword, if that makes sense? Yeah,
Dean FM (11:11):
I was called that when I was younger, because of, from
people in my family. And it's,you know, it's kind of like, I
don't want to, it's even, it'snot even that so deep that I
would like to put those peopleon blast, but it's like, you
know, I put people in my family,I was called up, and it was
always something that was, thatwas the hardest word, I feel
like that was called in, withinmy family towards me. And, you
(11:34):
know, that's, it was, you know,I was proud of that, and my
friends are fond of, you know,just friends of the family, you
know, and, you know, it's, it'sit, I wanted to kind of reclaim
it a little bit with calling myalbum that is just kind of
making it more fun for me, like,just, you know, that's my,
(11:56):
that's my slice. That's why Ifeel like we should be able to
use it, when, when, when thetime calls for it. And I think
there's nothing wrong with withwho people are. I don't think
there's anything Well, I was,you know, I think so slurs come
along with slurs, but there's,you know, there's no real
meaning and there shouldn't beany power in them. But there is
unfortunately, and you know,knowing that I kind of been
(12:17):
recently, even in my creativeclasses, looking back at Sissy I
kind of wonder if that was thebest terminology, because now
it's because, like, recently,Nicki Minaj came out with a song
that had "sissies". And I'mlike, now now I'm like, kind of
like, do I want people? Like,obviously, that's our word,
right. That's our word. And Idon't. And I think it's a
delicate, it's a tricky area tohave. And I don't I don't want
(12:40):
to push it in a way that peopleshould be using it. I don't want
to push it in a way that like,like, even gay people should use
it. I think it's a, it is a sortof my project. That was just the
project, basically. Yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (12:51):
And I think there is power in reclaiming your
words are being used against usto hurt us, right? It's like,
and like you said, it is a fineline, right? Because then it
doesn't mean we're givingpermission to other folks to use
it, if it's not a word that hasbeen used to hurt them, right?
It's like, for me, it's like, Iwould identify, I do identify as
a trans faggot, but I wouldn'tuse that word outside of queer
(13:14):
community, or my official bio,because I don't want to give
straight people the impressionthat they can use that, right.
It's like, no, that's like, it'sa reclaimed word. And, and I,
you know, I feel part of kind ofmovement. And I think it's also
like, interesting as a trans nonbinary, more effeminate,
masculine person to blame theword faggot, right? There's so
(13:36):
many layers. And at the sametime, it is a slayer that's been
used against me and againstother people right in the
community, and have somewhere toyou know, different and similar
to the words to say differentways. And it's like, you know,
how do we take our power backfrom like, the queer phobia? The
misogyny, right, the transmisogyny, the transmisogyny,
(13:56):
wire, like all all the thingsthat, you know, you've
experienced that other folksexperience? So it's, it is a
fine balance, but I think thereis power in reclaiming slurs,
right. And yeah, yeah. And Iactually love that. I was like,
Yeah, let's talk about it. It'slike, it's important. There's
Dean FM (14:14):
nothing wrong. There's nothing wrong with Yeah,
exactly. Yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (14:19):
And what is it like to really like, you know,
take it back and be like, Yes,this is why I am right. Yeah, I
remember you know, somebodyshouting on the street Fagre me
when I was holding hands with apartner and turn around I went
Thank you, and they were like,wow, that is not the reaction
that we're expecting Right? LikeI feel so gender affirmed right
(14:39):
now. And also I know you weretrying to hurt me, but I'm not
gonna let you my I'm just gonnatake my power and whatever way I
can as we do. And let's so let'stalk about this. You know, you
say you stand for compassion,courage and equality, which
totally comes through yourbeautiful music and you know, so
(14:59):
I can literally see ourreclaiming their power as part
of this courage and compassion?
And what is that fires you up atthe moment? What is the thing
that really gets you up in themorning and you're like, This is
the thing that I need to keeppushing for. And I feel at the
moment, I don't know if that'show you feel, but it's a happy
moment, there have been manyhappy moments. You know, in
(15:22):
history, of course, and this isone of those. And so I'm
interested in what fires you upright now and what makes you
makes that creativity flow foryou right now?
Dean FM (15:35):
Well, my, my, my initiatives for my brand, as far
as, you know, what makes me whenI think it's important to talk
about Black trans woman, and thepeople of trans People of Color
to, again, but like, black transwoman, specifically, because of
(15:56):
my interlink and with the, andhow much they've been murdered,
and how that has exponentiallygotten worse. Over the last four
years, specifically, selectthings like that. Not include
gun control, because most ofthose are done by people with
guns. So you know, it's that guncontrol. Yeah. And like, and,
(16:17):
yeah, just overall violence andthings like that, that breaks my
heart. And as somebody who has aplatform, and who has a, a
significant privilege levelcompared relative to, you know,
the world, I think that it'simportant that regardless of how
I feel, regardless of you know,depression, and all these
(16:37):
things, that I still get up inon it, and I try to make some
sort of, you know, change withthat.
Alex Iantaffi (16:45):
Absolutely. I mean, it is the level of trans
legislation that has beenintroduced across the country in
the last four years, the levelof you know, of course, the
ongoing systemic racism, policeviolence, really, it's, it's,
yes, it's heartbreaking. And Ican only imagine how much more
(17:07):
heartbreak and exhausting it isfor you as a, you know, trans
feminine non binary person ofcolor black trans woman, you
know, and so, yeah, I really, Ihear that, but sometimes all we
can do is like, when we get upand we keep fighting for
something better. So while asyou do this, what brings you
(17:30):
joy? What ways? Are younurturing yourself? That's the
question. I'm asking a lot oftrans non binary and gender
expansive folks at the moment,because I feel like it is a
heavy moment. So as well asfighting for justice and
liberation, which absolutely,how can we not for our
community, what kind of helpsyou feel supported and nurtured
and cared for? And, you know,finding moments of joy? How are
(17:53):
you finding your joy andnurturance nowadays?
Dean FM (17:57):
Well, I think one thing that is, first of all, the most
responsible advice to peoplewould be like to therapy therapy
is what I'm doing. And therapyis helpful to me right now. And
is, you know, aside from that,just working on my, my health,
my physical health, withexercising and things like that,
(18:17):
I understand it's not that it'snot easy for people who have
depressive tendencies toparalyze, you know, so it's
fine. You know, and youshouldn't shame yourself for
that, if you don't, if you'renot able to get those things
done. And, you know, I like totake, yeah, I have my own, you
know, struggles in that it'snot, there's not really any
direct fix for me, for for the,you know, the, you know, what,
(18:42):
let me just close it, like, Ihave depression, anxiety, but
it's not, but you know, like,it's, there's no real, you know,
fix for, for that, but, youknow, working every day to do
something better pickingvitamins, you know, knowing
knowing every day even, even ifeven if I take my vitamin that
day, I know that I didsomething, you know, I just
something I shouldn't, Ishouldn't hate myself, in trying
(19:03):
not to hate myself. I mean, thisthis sounds like a terrible
place, but like trying not to,you know, try not to take things
out on myself and to go slow,even though I know that, um, um,
stuff, you know, I'm, I'm notdoing my best to not think over
to overthink too much. And, youknow, to again, look at my art
coping and, and yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (19:25):
no, that makes sense. I mean, it's a delicate
balance, right? It's like, weknow that, of course. I mean, I
don't know anybody who's transwas not experiencing depression
and anxiety, because of theworld we live in. Right. And
again, I think when you'rebrought up with a, you know,
historically, marginalizedidentity, it's hard to find that
(19:46):
kind of confidence and self lovebecause you have a world like
hating on you and so in so manydifferent ways, right? So it's
kind of that balance, like wefight for justice, and we also
take care of ourselves andsometimes there are some days
where my well I'm breathing andI'm drinking some water good
enough, right? I'm here,tomorrow is a different day and
(20:06):
I can do something different.
And I think that's so important.
I think there are other No, theworld puts so much pressure on,
like, you have to do all thethings, right, you care for
yourself and you care forothers, and you have to be
productive. And this only 24hours in a day people. And we're
also tired. I feel tired, right?
Dean FM (20:27):
Yeah. And it's important to, you know, to take,
you know, to know that and toknow, your, and I want to say
know, your limitation, but toknow, like, that this is
something that's gonna you know,I don't know, it's not, it's not
something that you should. It'snot necessarily it's like a
blame thing, but it's more solike, making sure that you also
(20:48):
hold some sort of standard toyourself, because if you like
you don't fall, if you don'tstand for something like you'll
fall, you know, and I think thatjust just just taking it easy,
but every little step, everylittle step is valuable. And
it's should be celebrated to theeyes, because that's how I you
know, so yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (21:08):
absolutely. It's like, you know, I often ask
myself, Okay, what's, what's inmy control here? And what's
outside of my control? Okay,taking care of myself, it's in
my control. I'm doing the best Ican. And even if it's like, the
smallest step, like you said,it's still a step. Right? And
sometimes, that's all we can do.
And we do need to celebratethose moments because they are
important. Absolutely. And, youknow, I think being surrounded
(21:31):
by so much transphobia is noteasy, I think for for people
right now. And I don't know if Idon't even know if sis people
really understand just theimpact of the constant. Oh,
there's another bill and othertrans woman, usually a black
trans woman or a trans woman ofcolor murdered, right? It's,
(21:52):
it's like a drip, drip dripevery day? How can it not impact
our mental health? Esteem?
Dean FM (22:00):
Yeah, right. And as queer people, it's so
overlooked, I think, just themental health issue that goes
along with not only you know,just under being addressed, but
also homelessness, and all thosethings in society is so just
government doesn't care.
Government doesn't care about alot of things. So yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (22:16):
ya know, it's becoming increasingly clear.
Now, you can just be arrestedfor being houseless. And
sleeping, which I'm like,sleeping should be a human right
. I'm like, how, what is even? Imean, I know what is happening,
what's always happened and what,sometimes my clients are like,
Alex, do you think everybody hastrauma? And I was like, Well, of
(22:36):
course, I was like, it's acountry based on like, an
ongoing genocide, slavery, andcapitalism was like, Oh, can we
not or be traumatized in one wayor another? You know, obviously,
different ways. But of course,so well, and on that, on that
happy note, you know, like, butwe keep going, right, we keep
(22:57):
going, and you are an activist,as well as a musician and an
influencer? You know, and Ithink that, that's the, I don't
know about you, but it's like,do you feel that the activism in
a way, keeps you going, keepsyou connected to community?
Keeps you less isolated? I'mjust curious about the role of
activism in your life? And didit emerge through your music in
(23:20):
a different way? Like, where didyou get the passion to be like,
I need to do something, I needto be active as part of the
community.
Dean FM (23:29):
Yeah, with my music, the original purpose was not
necessarily to even mention thatI was queer. Like, that was not,
that was not my intent.
Originally, overtime, I was kindof taught to sorry about that.
Like, you can't really, youcan't really just not address
that. It's not like that. Butit's like, you know, also, like,
advocate, like, that's wherethat came from. And I wanted to,
(23:50):
it's important to have acommunity I think, when you're
struggling with, especially ifyou don't have a supportive
place, to have people aroundyou, therapists are not, you
know, have a lot of peoplearound you, you know, that are
either trans or just family thatloves you. And yeah, that's
those are always things that Ithink are helpful in this
(24:12):
society.
Alex Iantaffi (24:16):
Absolutely, yeah.
And finding our people can be sohard but so worthwhile, right?
Because when we feel isolated,then that depression can feel
even heavier, that isolation canreally feed all this like
anxious thoughts, too. So, youknow, I really appreciate how
open you are about mental healthand that is part of your
passion, right? And in otherparts of your passion is gender
(24:39):
neutrality, as you mentioned, inyour bio, tell me more about
what gender neutrality means toyou. When you say that what
what's the dream, right? If youcould wave a magic wand and
tomorrow we're leaving thegender neutral world that you
dream off, what does the worldlook like?
Dean FM (24:58):
Like with gender neutrality, Yeah, definitely I
do identify as genderqueer. He,he pronouns primarily. And I
mean, to me, the whole point ofthe gender expression, and
something that I really want topush is allowing everybody, not
(25:19):
just queer people, everybody tobe able to express themselves.
That's what I want. Like, like,when I go out with my full face
of black heavy stuff, or when Ijust go out to the supermarket,
or when I go to like, like, Iwant a woman to look at me and
say, okay, maybe I can wear someskin, you know, maybe this guy
is out there doing this. Solet's, you know, maybe I can
encourage the women so even ifthey want to, if they want to
(25:41):
not be ashamed, and not feel,you know, uncomfortable, and
yeah, that's, that's primarilyhow I view that. And I also
want, I would hope that one daythere would be neutral pronouns
for for everybody. It is verytricky, right now. Let that
especially when it's like youdon't know who you're talking to
(26:03):
another the straight community,how they view us, it's hard for
them to, to grasp the day, whichis, you know, I don't know why,
but that is that's though it'sgonna be a struggle. But But I
right now, I really just want topeople to be more expressive,
because that's going to be 1000sof years down the line. But I
think right now, people arealready doing it. People are
already doing I want straightand I want straight men to be
able to do what they want, youknow, and so yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (26:27):
I'm with you. I was like, I think that it's so
constrictive to police genderthe way we do and also just
policing anything. It's messedup in so many ways. And so,
yeah, that gender expansiveness,that freedom, just clothing,
art, clothing, you know, hair,his hair, you know, I remember
in like, a neighborhood emailthread somebody going, how do
(26:49):
you take care of boys long hair?
And I was like, I guess the sameas you take care of girls long
hair. It's like it's hair. Andthey were like, Oh, I hadn't
thought about it. And I waslike, Yes, that's right. I was
like, I was trying to have somuch compassion. But I was also
so puzzled. Because, you know, Iwas like, it is it's long hair.
I mean, like, if they've askedlike, how, you know, I've always
(27:13):
had short hair. I don't know howto take care of long hair.
Absolutely. I mean, like, myoldest loves hair braids. And I
was like, I can't help you. I'mterrible at it. Like, let's find
somebody else who can write,I've always loved my hair
shorts. So I don't have a lot ofpractice with that. Right. But I
think people have sought suchweird ideas around, like, you
know, even things that you know,how everybody has kind of making
(27:36):
them gender, right, men's andbought, you know, men's clothes,
women's clothes, boys, toys,girls toys, I'm like, or just
toys, and clothes and makeup,you know, and accessories. And
yeah, and even recently,
Dean FM (27:53):
I was talking about like, something like this, you
saw some show. And it was like,You should have seen that there
was somebody who's genderqueer,who's clear on them. Like, what,
how did they say that right now?
I just have a look. I'm like,Mom, maybe that guy does not
want to be you know, that's kindof what I'm saying is that
somebody shouldn't be looked atand doesn't even viewed as they
don't want to be. And, you know,that's kind of Yeah, yeah,
(28:15):
there's a lot of
Alex Iantaffi (28:17):
that was watching some standout by like some trans
comics. And you know, one ofthem is like, you can be in a
room with 50 people I can Ithink it was River oh my god, I
can never Butcher I think it'slike, you can be in a room with
50 people and there's like, 49people, and then somebody goes,
what are your pronouns? Right?
Like, it's like, they're kind ofgetting singled out, right. Like
(28:39):
I look forward to when it's soaccepted that actually we ask
everybody what their pronounsare, because we can't make
assumptions you know aboutsomebody's gender or sexuality
just based on their mannerism orclothing. Absolutely. Wouldn't
that be amazing? I want to be inthat world one day, but probably
not. Yeah, meats. Well, maybe inour lifetime, who knows there's
(29:05):
so much that can happen. Right?
And, you know, you say in yourbio as well, that you really
advocate for awareness ofMinority Mental Health. And I
know that like mental health andaccess to therapy can be so
stigmatized. And so I'mwondering about, you know, what
do you see that makes youpassionate about be more open
(29:29):
about mental health? What do yousee in terms of stigma around
Minority Mental Healthspecifically, that makes you
passionate about this topic?
Dean FM (29:38):
Um, substance use to me is one of the biggest things
that I feel like I can speak onin terms of mental health, due
to seeing many people that arenot just for people of color,
but you know, in general, youknow, that's something that I
know that is. I've seen peoplein my own biological Family pass
(30:01):
from. I had two sistersrecently, two years ago that
were biological who passed. Andone was because of a, a
potentially a substance issueand seeing 16, things like that,
and you know, I mean, just just,you know, and also going through
(30:23):
what I've gone through not onlyas an adult but as a child to
being diagnosed at a very youngage with ADHD do put on
medication at what is it 11 or12? Or, you know, it's starting
to start to get off, then Ithink that not only in the, in
the queer community, and thisisn't color specific. This is
not when I talk about mentalhealth, I don't really mean
color specific, except for thefact that we, it's like, we
(30:46):
can't access it. And there's notmuch I can, you know, say about
that, I think that there's a lotof systemic issues that are
behind that, that need to beaddressed. But with mental
health, I always want to be anadvocate. And by that, like, I
want people to reach out if theywant to reach out. And I like to
talk to people and you know,about people, and I am a very
much open book. So I don't mindbeing a voice in that sense.
Alex Iantaffi (31:09):
And thank you for being a voice because I think
people do find it hard, right?
And there's a lot of like, oh,people should reach out. And I'm
like, and when people reach out,how do we react? And also, how
can we kind of really make itcommon for folks to be like, Oh,
I'm struggling with this? Or canyou come over and do some
parallel tasks with me? Right?
Maybe I'll do my dishes when youwhile you answer emails, because
(31:31):
we're both like struggling withthat. Right? Can we just say,
almost the law talks a lot aboutreally dreaming about what this
community care looks like,right? And that's something I'm
really passionate about, right?
Because I think that we all feelso isolated and disconnected
because of white supremacy, andcolonialism and capitalism. And
so really resisting thatnarrative of isolation and
(31:52):
nurturing community and buildingcommunity is so important. I'm
also so sorry to hear about yoursisters. And
Dean FM (32:01):
yeah. Oh, thank you. I mean, about the Black. Really, I
think one thing also that wouldbe important to mention, is,
it's a tricky thing to, for meto want to discuss the panel,
because it's, I don't know ifit's necessarily something that
everybody should hear, you know,but but when it sounds like the
Black community, I feel likethere's an internal internal
struggle there that's verysevere, with with queer people
(32:24):
and things like that, that alsocould affect mental health and,
you know, being ostracized, andyou know, and those things, you
know, beat the stone to thestone, you know, thrown out the
door, it's not necessarilymentally the best situation. So,
yeah, I think that the Blackreally has a lot of issues not
only come from beingsystemically oppressed in
(32:45):
behind, but within the internal,not only the, the Black church,
the Black church, we have awhole lot of has a whole lot of
history there with exorcisms ofqueer people. Like it's a whole,
it's a whole, you know, so. Sothere's a lot of, but it's not
just the Black community as if,you know, that's causing the
internal issues, but you knowwhat I mean? Yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (33:05):
I do and that Christian supremacy, you know,
kind of world that sometimes welive in, and, you know, if it's
not an inclusive Church, it canbe really impactful. And, yeah,
I agree with you. I mean, it'snot just Black churches. It's
also like, right, angelical,white churches, Baptist
churches, I see this, you know,and then there's other systemic
issues, you know, but, and I cantotally understand the
(33:27):
reluctance to talk about it,because I think there's a strong
stereotype that sometimes, youknow, Black community or Black
churches are more transphobic,or queer phobic. And that has
not been my experiencenecessarily. I was like, and
queer phobia with white folks,too. But I think I was like,
let's not deflect the issue. Youknow what I mean, but it's like,
(33:48):
the reluctance as a both...and.
Right? It's like, yeah, yeah.
And, and it is tricky, because Ithink that, yeah, I think that
it's always I think, sometimes Iwonder, as a minoritized person,
if I shared this vulnerablething is going to be weaponized
against me or my community,right? And so I don't know if
(34:08):
there is also that feeling likethings can get turned around and
distorted. And so I'm alwayslike, when I talk about things,
I'm always like, oh, I want toshare the thing. And also, I
don't want it to come acrosswrong or to be used against me
or my communities. Right. So I'mwondering if there's a little
bit of that, which is totallyunderstandable. Yeah, yeah.
(34:29):
Yeah,
Dean FM (34:30):
that is because, you know, I don't want the Black
community, I think that it'simportant that, you know, we're
not be viewed as weak. I don'tthink that the community is
necessarily weak as far as muchas it is behind and I just, you
know, yeah. Obviously, the Blackcommunity is where I was grazed.
And so, you know, that's mypeople. You know, I just don't
(34:50):
like to see that. We are havingany sort of dilemma here. It's
not it's not beneficial in thispolitical climate. Certainly
still. Yeah. Yeah,
Alex Iantaffi (34:58):
no, yes. And this political climate also just, I
don't know, there are timeswhere I'm like, Well, do I even
want to be visible? Like, evenwith all my privilege as like a
light skinned person, as adisabled person, as a trans
person? It's like this. Not easytimes to navigate.
Dean FM (35:14):
Like, No, believe me.
My comments on YouTube, I couldnot handle this point, like, I'm
still growing my audience. Andright now, I'm just getting the
Trump 2020 cores, you know, likeall those.
Alex Iantaffi (35:27):
Yeah. Imagine, I'm so glad that you're kind of
turned off those comments,because sometimes we were like,
oh, and I'm like, no block away,you know, delete the comments,
like, do what you need to do toprotect your mental health, for
sure, more visible because it'snot a good environment right now
out there. So I'm glad you'reprotecting your well being by
(35:49):
turning off those comments.
100%. Yeah, yeah. Talking aboutyour work and your visibility
online? What are the projectsthat you're working towards? Any
projects that you want to talkabout, like, music that you're
working on? Or? Yeah, what? Whatare you working on right now?
Dean FM (36:09):
Um, right now, I'm just kind of editing a music video, I
haven't, I haven't come out witha music video in a while. So I'm
kind of editing that taking abreak from reaction content on
YouTube for just for like, lessthan a week, to be honest. But
like with the, because I, that'sbeen over 40 videos, plus in
that channel over the last likesix months. So I, I have, I
(36:29):
really wants to get in the actto queer content. It's all queer
content. You know, it says, Ilike to do commentary on tech
talks, commentary on, you know,the Jerry Springer show, but all
trans episodes, you know, andthose type of things and give my
opinions and not necessarily belike the political thing,
because I'm not a politicalperson. I don't think I would be
responsible to say that I am ifI'm not well educated in that,
(36:53):
but I still want to give like apositive you will maybe get some
staff here where I think the CFOappropriate. So yeah, that's
what they're doing. No, I
Alex Iantaffi (37:01):
hear that, unfortunately, sometimes
existing as a minoritized personmeans being political
inherently. Like I feel likejust existing as a trans person
is inherently political. Youknow, you existing as a black
person on Turtle Island, isinherently political because of
the systemic issues. Absolutely.
Right. Like but, but I do lovethat, because, and I love how
(37:22):
social media can really give usa way of being in conversation
with popular culture. Right, Ithink just kind of that dialogue
with popular culture. Well, I'mexcited about the new music
video. I can't wait to see thatbad. Fabulous, do you know, more
or less when it's gonna comeout? So listeners can watch out
for it?
Dean FM (37:44):
Yeah, it should be coming out this week. I mean,
I'm working on it. Now. It'skind of like it's my own
homemade music, because we'rekind of like the biggest club,
but it's not my major budgetvideo. But it's like, you know,
that's, it's coming out. Soyeah, it's been coming out this
week. And I still have morevideos to watch by Sunday. And,
you know, I try to try to I'mtrying to stay up with it. But
like, you know, yeah, I'm doingmy best.
Alex Iantaffi (38:06):
It takes a lot of time and effort. Are you
kidding? It's like, it's a lotto me content. So, you know,
it's not easy to I think it'sway more time consuming than
people think. To get coal. Yeah.
I don't know. Like, I feel likethat 90, at least for me, 98% of
God that that went out there.
It's really a labor of love, youknow, and kind of wanting to
(38:26):
share people. Yeah. So Yeah. Yousaid, there's a question that I
asked everybody, when Iinterview them, which is, is
there anything that we haven'ttalked about? That you would
like to talk about? Or that youwould like, Oh, I was really
open to talk about that. And ifthere isn't, it's okay. But I
always ask my guests goes on,like, if there's something we
(38:49):
haven't touched on, we can talkabout it, and take the time, you
need to think about it. Um,yeah,
Dean FM (38:54):
I mean, I think just in terms of the, my gender queer
experience, and what I wouldlike to say about like, why I
choose to identify asgenderqueer a lot of people ask
me, like, why aren't you awoman, you know, actually was
identified as a woman. I feellike it's important for every
trans person to take time to notif they don't know what the,
what they want. I'm a veryunsure person, I'm very
(39:17):
confused. And I just, I didn'twant to, you know, to make a
decision that might not be thebest for me mental health
considered mostly, and I thinkthere's nothing wrong with that.
With being, you know,genderqueer in the middle, and
just just experimenting withyour appearance and stuff like
(39:39):
that. And, you know, I urgeeverybody to be careful.
Alex Iantaffi (39:45):
I love that, you know, I'm like, yes, let's play
with gender. Also, gender is ajourney. Now remember, when I
got my top surgery, 14 yearsago, almost now, people are
like, so you're gonna be a mannow and I'm like, Nope, not
gonna be a man still gonna be myA queer door self like not a man
or woman, you know, just likethere's this little puzzle piece
(40:09):
that when I'm out in the worldpeople are like, Ma'am, sir, I
mean, sorry. And I'm so goodrelax. Like, you know,
Dean FM (40:16):
ya know, I definitely relate to that because I Yeah,
yeah, yeah, exactly. I relate tothat because with, with, I want
to start hormones, you know, Iwant to start hormones, but not
for the fact of wanting to be afemale. I just want more
feminization. And you know,that's okay to people can people
as long as you pass? Yeah, yeah,yeah, God, I
Alex Iantaffi (40:37):
love that.
Because it's like people. AndI'm like, and I'm a therapist.
And I understand that peopleneed to think through it. And
all sudden, there are somethings that you need to
experience in your body to knowif it's right for you. Even like
I've been on testosterone. Ithink this is my, this is my
third time over the last 10 or20 years, right. And I have been
on it and then stopped because Idon't want to masculinize
(41:00):
completely. But there are somethings that are helpful,
especially now withperimenopause. And I think
people think about is, this is adecision. And then once you make
it, there's no going back. AndI'm like, No, you need to think
about the impact and theconsequences, but that you
actually can try something, stopit. If it's not right for you,
then maybe it's right for youfive years down the line, or 10
(41:22):
years down the line. And there'snothing wrong with that. I'm,
I'm with you. Let's normalizegender exploration. And then
let's normalize like, I want totry hormones and see if they're
for me, because there's somestuff that we don't know until
you experience it. You know whatI mean? Like, I can think about
it all day long. But it's onlywhen I experienced it. I know
what it feels like in my body. Idon't know if I'm making sense.
(41:44):
But no,
Dean FM (41:46):
that's that's good.
Yeah, that's true. But it'strue. Yeah.
Alex Iantaffi (41:50):
So I hope when you try it out, that you will
give yourself whatever time youneed to figure out what's right
for you. Because I think that'salso the beauty of being
genderqueer. Is that, okay? Idon't fit into a box, which
means I get to, you know, I drawmy own map of where I want to
go. And it's a way if I'm yonderdown one path, and then I'm
(42:13):
like, you know, this is not forme, I'm just gonna turn around
and go back and go another way.
Like, I think that's great.
Definitely, any, anything thatyou think if there's younger
listeners, you know, maybeteenagers or young adults who
are feeling in that more liminalspace of like, I'm not sure I'm
(42:36):
genderqueer. But I'm not sureyou know, how to present myself
or what to do, especially maybeyoung, kind of black gender
queer folks, right? Any thingthat you would want to say to
them or share with them? Or?
Yeah,
Dean FM (42:53):
it takes time for people around you to know what's
going on. Like, I think, I thinksomething that's important is,
like, obviously, to me likethis, if that, like, boy, if you
want to talk to just like, Iwould just say that, but like in
terms of like, be realistic,what society like, and what I
would want people to how I wantpeople to be saved, would be
(43:14):
like to, to, first of all, ifyou're going to come out to know
the political climate of yourfamily, you know, to know what's
how they feel about those typesof things. And if you can start
wearing makeup to do it, maybegradually and, but don't don't
like, throw yourself intosituations that might be
dangerous, like, if you'regonna, like it might be and you
(43:35):
don't know, definitely, there'sone or 2% We've got to be issues
somewhere, somewhere there'sgonna be issues. So just be
prepared. And, and just go easywith yourself go slow and and to
know that if you can't, if yourfamily does not accept you,
that's and that to find acommunity that does to find a
(43:56):
queer support group before youthere many of those in in
Boston, I know. And I'm actuallyhelping out with one I'm going
to be volunteering without MetroWest, which is a youth support
group. So I'm doing so there'sthat and you know, find find
people who who you relate to andalso like to keep your situation
(44:21):
in mind. And don't to don't goslow like you're just like
you're just if you're under 18Like you have your time and and
to be safe, just be safe and berealistic. And it's hard to say
that because I want everybodylike I want a boy who's like
listening if they want to wearjust to just to pull out a
dress. Let's like I think beingcareful is also like you know,
(44:43):
worth worth worth payingattention to.
Alex Iantaffi (44:46):
Absolutely. I think safety is important and
you know, I do dream of the daywhen it's not even an issue
right? Like you said if a boywants to wear a dress they can
just put on the dress and notworry about safety back While
it's an issue, I think that itmakes complete sense. And
sometimes when we're young, likesafety is not our top concern.
(45:07):
At least it wasn't for me. Iknow, I put myself in a lot of
dangerous situations as a youngperson, you know, but I think,
yeah,
Dean FM (45:15):
that to like be just be, be safe, be safe sexually
Don't, don't be too active.
Like, don't, don't do that whenI did, which was I was 15 Go on
dating apps, like talking to,you know, older guys don't do
that. Don't, don't be you know,just just just stay in the kids
stay being a child, like don'tlike just because we quit
(45:35):
doesn't mean we got to do allthis stuff. We can still have
fun, you know? And yeah, yeah,just don't just be careful.
Alex Iantaffi (45:44):
There's a lot of time to do all this stuff. And
it, you know, to young and olderfolks out there too. If you
know, if something happens, andyou're not safe, look for some
support and some help, therewill be people who have
compassion and support to giveyou so I know, I feel lucky that
there were people to give mesupport and compassion. And so I
(46:05):
hope that the folks do findthemselves in unsafe situation
that they can talk about it withsomebody and find that
compassion and care somewhere.
Dean FM (46:14):
Yeah. So yeah, it saved my life going to the youth
support group, because that wasvery helpful to me to have a
youth support group, as well,when I was in high school. So
yeah, me that's that's why, youknow, just reach out, reach out.
Absolutely.
Alex Iantaffi (46:29):
Reach out, find your people. Peer support is so
wonderful. So I'm so glad thatyou had a queer youth support
group, a school that was likethat place for you. I feel like
I could keep talking about withyou about mental health, about
music, but I want to berespectful of your time. But
before we sign off, where canpeople find your work where they
(46:50):
can follow you? You know, I'llput that in the Episode Notes
too. But let's share the in theepisode to like, where can they
find you on YouTube andInstagram.
Dean FM (47:01):
It's at DeanFMofficial on all platforms. And the laptop
if you just search for musicit's DeanFM on all platforms,
and then DeanFMOfficoal forsocial media.
Alex Iantaffi (47:13):
Wonderful. So it's also in the Episode Notes.
So check out Dean FM's music iswonderful, and all his other
content too. So thank you somuch for today. I really
appreciate this conversation. Ireally appreciate you and I
really appreciate the beautifulcontent and music that you
(47:34):
create. So thank you so much.
Dean FM (47:36):
Thank you, thank you
Alex Iantaffi (47:40):
and to your gender stories, listeners, you
know, stay safe, stay creative,and stay expansive in your own
life. And until next time,
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