December 1, 2022 • 42 mins
Mr. Bigio is a professor in the biomedical engineering department, responsible for the Senior Capstone Design project. Currently, he is also serving as the department head. He comes to the university after having spent 30 years of professional experience working for large multinationals in different parts of the world, including the development of high technology start-ups in Silicon Valley, commercialization of technology used in large infrastructure projects, and coordinating strategic projects for a multinational consortium. Mr. Bigio clearly understands current challenges and opportunities in the biomedical engineering field. He is very focused on improving the education and skills of graduates in order to provide companies with better employees. He has been working with the Biomedical engineering students during their senior capstone design project to address two important aspects of their education; help them improve on the ‘soft’ skills that future employers expect from them, and also teach them about how to become entrepreneurs to give them employability alternatives and promote a much-needed activity in our country.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Latin MedTech Leaders podcast, a
conversation with MedTechleaders who have succeeded or
plan to succeed in LatinAmerica.
Please subscribe on yourfavorite podcasting platform.
Apple Podcast, Spotify, GooglePodcast.
Amazon Music is teacher.
Tune in.
I heard radio, Pandora, or theseare Welcome to the Latin Metech
(00:23):
Leaders podcast, a conversationswith leaders who have succeeded
or plan to succeed in LatinAmerica.
Today our guest is David B, thedeparting head of biomedical
engineering at University de LosAngeleses, or University of the
Andes in Bogota, Colombia, theleading private university in
Columbia, and one of the topuniversities in Latin America.
(00:46):
Hey, David, it's great to haveyou here today.
Welcome to the show.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Good morning, Julio.
Thank you so much for having me.
It's a pleasure and it's anhonor to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Awesome, David.
All right, so let's get startedhere.
So let's speak about yourjourney, uh, David or David
, I guess call you David,that Yeah.
Call
Speaker 2 (01:07):
You.
Let's go, let's go with David.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
So, uh, let's talk about your journey.
How is it that you got to whereyou are today?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
So, Julio, um, I graduated as a mechanical
engineer from the same schoolwhere I am now.
When you see that de losAngeleses in Bogota at the time,
uh, biomedical engineering didnot exist.
This is an engineering that, uh,started, uh, becoming a formal
program much later.
(01:35):
But nevertheless, at the time,our professors and directors had
a relationship with one of theteaching hospitals in Bogota, at
university at Havana.
It was, uh, hospital San Ignacio, and the idea for some of our
professors was to pair engineerswith, uh, doctors that were
(01:56):
finishing their residents.
And in my case, I was veryfortunate to be put, um, in a,
in a project with an orthopedicsurgeon, uh, that happens to be
Doctor Al, who today is, uh, themedical director of Fund San.
And we were given the challengeto work on a partial knee
(02:22):
replacement on an issue relatedwith reconstruction of the knee.
And, and that for me was a great, um, thing that happened,
Julio, because it, it, it, itreally made me aware of the fact
that I had, um, an interest anda talent for developing medical
(02:47):
devices, for thinking aboutsolutions and so on.
So that is something that stayedwith me for a very long time.
I wasn't able to put it inpractice right away, because
when I finished, uh, you know,the hospital there, even though
they saw, uh, a person like meuseful for talking about
problems and trying to solvethings they didn't really have
(03:09):
in their, um, HumanResources department, an
opportunity for a person likeme.
So I went and did some otherthings, Julio, and, uh, perhaps
we can talk about that.
But eventually, you know, Ireturned to the university, um,
to teach, uh, innovation andentrepreneurship to our
(03:32):
biomedical engineers becausethat is something that I was
very passionate about.
I wanted our engineers to learnabout that.
And the director of the programat the time also saw it as an
important thing to teach them.
So I came back to, to do that.
And we can talk about in moredetail if you want.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
Yeah.
Let's talk about your experiencein Silicon Valley.
You have over 30 years ofexperience working, uh, for
multinational companies,startups, and that's a
fascinating piece of, uh, yourstory.
So, uh, can you describe alittle bit of, uh,
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Sure.
So, so before I got there, I, Ihad, um, an opportunity to work
for an oil field servicescompany.
I worked for Schlumberger for anumber of years in the oil
field, in the platforms in theNorth Sea.
I was also in the jungles ofAfrica.
(04:29):
And, um, and I started to becomemore oriented towards the
development.
And, um, I joined, uh, aresearch facility at, at, at
Schlumberger in Texas andstarted developing technology.
And I was, uh, learning aboutsome other things that happened
(04:50):
in Schlumberger.
And one of the divisions thatthe company had was, um,
involved with electronictransactions.
They were getting into, youknow, some parallel business or
actually different business fromthe oil field.
And electronic transactions wasan area where they had patented
this.
They had purchased the patentfor the smart card, and they
(05:11):
wanted to develop something.
The thing is, Julio, that theysent me, uh, to, to learn about
marketing high technology inSanta Cruz in California.
And I went there and I learnedabout how to market high
technology, and I became awareof what was happening with the
(05:33):
internet and Silicon Valley andthe startups and this mentality.
And then Julio, I said tomyself, one day, soon when I am
gonna be in control of my owndestiny, this is the place where
I want to be.
Because I had visited Palo Altoin California, and I thought,
this is paradise.
(05:54):
I want to be here.
I wanna have a chance to behere.
So I went to to to, to Palo Altoafter I left Schlumberger.
And, um, after a while I joinedHP Labs.
And there, it was a beautifultime because the internet was
happening, and so many peoplehad so many ideas about what
(06:21):
could be added to the internet.
Some of them were silly, butsome of them were powerful.
But it was all about theinternet, and it was all about
startups, and it was all aboutcompanies coming to pitch, um,
to HP about what we could do forthem.
So that was an area where Ilearned about what it takes to
(06:43):
become a startup and thedifficult obstacles that some of
them face and, you know,pitching and, uh, business plans
and these kinds of things.
So that was something that Iwanted to also add to my
interest in, in the, thedevelopment of medical devices.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
Fascinating story.
And I, and I think, um, theregion on Columbia, specifically
Bogota, Los Angeles, is veryfortunate to have somebody with
your background here, because avery few Latin Americans are
exposed to the medical deviceinnovation ecosystem, or the me
(07:25):
or the technology innovationecosystem in general, uh, in the
Silicon Valley area.
And, and to come back to yourhome country and to, uh, share
your knowledge and experiencesto with your students, I think
that's quite a gift for theregion.
And thank you for that.
I mean, that's, that's,
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Yeah, I feel also very fortunate myself, Julio, to
be able to return, um, to, to myhome country and to my school,
um, because I am who I am,thanks to them.
And I am the person I am thanksto growing up in Colombia,
thanks to studying at universityI, Los Angeles.
And when I had the opportunity,um, I thought that was a good
(08:06):
way to return.
And I am actually, uh, learninga lot in this new adventure.
And hopefully, Julio, I'm alsobeing able to contribute.
So we are all winning here,
Speaker 1 (08:20):
Ext.
Excellent, excellent.
I'm so happy to hear that.
All right, uh, David, let's talkabout trains in Latin America
and Columbia.
What's happening that makesLatin America specific Columbia
a great place to do research,animal research, human research
development, medicaltechnologies and, and
commercialization?
I mean, what do you see?
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Sure.
So Julio, let's, let's state anobvious thing that we all
experience from the recentevents of the pandemic, right?
So it happens to all of us.
It affects all of us, and we cansee the level of preparedness or
the lack of it that we all hadin different ways.
So this was an eye opening eventfor everyone, you know,
(09:05):
including the United States thatall of us sudden sees that they
are not able to provide some ofthe things because either
workers are not going to thefactories to work, or most
things are coming from Asia.
And Asia has shut down becauseof the pandemic.
And, and, and it's an eyeopening event where we see that
not producing things locally isa problem.
(09:28):
And we become aware whensomething like this happen, and
we can go from the simple things, uh, of, of face masks that all
come from China to the morecomplex things of ventilators
that people were going to needfor the pandemic.
And we realize we rely onsomebody else for everything,
(09:48):
for production, forcommercialization.
And I think Julio, that two goodthings happen as a result.
First, we become aware of thefact that we need to have a
little bit more control of ourown destiny.
And the second thing thathappened is that great
collaboration spurs to try tosolve the needs.
(10:11):
Um, and so people start workingtogether and we see an effort to
go and join forces.
And that I think is gonna be,uh, very beneficial.
But we saw some things that were, were alarming Julio in some of
our neighboring countries, forexample, that, that you run out
of oxygen to treat patients andthings like that, that should,
(10:33):
that should open our eyes, andthat should give an opportunity
for us to know that this is notthe last time something like
this is gonna happen, and thatwe need to be better prepared.
So yes, it is nice to thinkabout all of the fancy
developments of new devices andnew technologies and
telemedicine, which we are goingto talk about, because I think,
(10:57):
um, covid open an opportunityfor telemedicine or for remote
care, but also Julio, to thinkthat we need to have our basis
covered, our basic thingscovered.
I think it's also veryimportant.
So a trend that I see is that weare gonna go back to basics,
Julio.
We have not produced vaccines inColombia for humans for many,
(11:20):
many years.
For whatever reason.
I think that this is a momentwhere we should reconsider
things like that.
We may not have the technologyand the capability to develop a
vaccine from scratch, but weshould certainly be able to
produce vaccines that, um,companies are gonna license to
(11:40):
companies here.
So these are the kind of thingsthat I would say going into,
into thinking about how thepandemic affected, um, access to
health.
Julio.
I think that a big opportunityhas opened up for, for remote
care, for remote diagnosis,which even after this pandemic
(12:04):
passes, should give us anopportunity to think about the
people that live in, in remoteareas that should not come to
the big cities as the onlyalternative to receive good
care.
I think that now we have anopportunity to develop
technologies and improvetechnologies that will be able
to bring good healthcare, gooddiagnostic, um, to remote areas.
(12:30):
I think that this is a goodopportunity and this is a trend
that is happening.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Absolutely.
Mm-hmm.
?
Yeah, continue.
Go on.
I'm sorry.
I thought,
Speaker 2 (12:39):
No, and I was just going add onto that, uh, Julio,
that, um, that the other thingthat is happening is the
understanding or the need tounderstand the treatments that
work better compared to others.
So, so, so I'm thinking aboutdata science, machine learning,
artificial intelligence termsthat we hear.
(12:59):
We don't know exactly what theymean, but we know they're, they
are good, they are fancy, theyare nice to talk about.
I think that here, for example,we, it took us a while to learn
what was working for patients,Julio, and imagine if we could
really build a cooperation wherenot just in one hospital or one
(13:22):
local area, we learn about whathappens to a patient that comes
in with, with a certaincondition, but we join all of
the information and we analyzethis data and we say, look,
these, uh, procedure works andit works well, and here is the
(13:43):
data that's supported thesemedicine works, this treatment
works, this course ofantibiotics work.
We have a nice opportunity to cocooperate with others for better
results towards the patients,which is something that we
should all strive for.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely.
All right, David, uh, let's moveon and let's talk about your
current work.
I mean, what interestingtechnologies your students are
working on.
And I also like to, to speakabout the obstacles that they
have in the local ecosystems.
(14:23):
Um, what would you see happeningin Columbia that will make
Columbia a country ofinnovation, medical innovation,
please.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
Great.
Who you, so, so let me tell youa little bit about, um, the
biomedical engineeringdepartment at university los,
and is, just to give you a sensefor the kinds of things that we
do.
So I'm, I'm currently, you know,very fortunate to, to be, you
know, the head of thedepartment, which is an, uh, an
(14:52):
opportunity that I welcomeknowing that some of the things
I can do is, is, is bring morevisibility to the great talent
that we have.
So I'm gonna take thisopportunity to share with you
some of the things we do, um,with the nine professors and the
nine research areas that we have.
Um, just to give you a sense,you know, we, we work in the
(15:14):
area of biomechanics, somethingthat is very, uh, top of mind on
people when they think aboutbiomedical engineering.
They think about biomechanics,they think about human movement,
they think about prostheticdevices, and that's an area
where we work.
We also work in computer vision.
We have one of the top 100scientists in the area in Dr.
(15:38):
Pablo ar who directs a centerfor the learning of information,
uh, artificial intelligence, um,not only for health application,
but for general application.
But he happens to be ourprofessor.
And a lot of our students areinterested in that.
We have research in the area ofbiomaterials and bioprinting.
(16:00):
So you, you mentioned briefly,um, animal trials and trials
using animals, something that weknow Julio is becoming very
difficult to do.
So one of the things that we aredeveloping is, uh, we are
developing artificial human skinso that we can do trial of, um,
(16:22):
cosmetic products andpharmaceuticals on artificial
skin that resembles human skinso that we don't have to use
animals.
I think that this is a goodpotential for companies that are
interested in, in, in trialingthings related with, with the
skin.
Um, just to continue, um, we doresearch in nanomaterials, uh,
(16:47):
to help us improve drug deliverymethods and also to try to
understand how some of these,some diseases, like, like the
Parkinson, if we can bring theright pharmaceutical product to
the right element that isaffected, could be better.
Uh, treatments.
We have a professor that havebeen studying and working on the
(17:10):
cardiovascular system for a longtime.
So we are developing somedevices that are built here for,
um, for, for patients, forexample, just to give you,
that's, to give you an examplearound that, uh, Julio, for
infants that are born with, um,cardiovascular problems,
(17:35):
neonatal, uh, that arecongenital heart diseases, most
of the devices that exist, uh,are made for adults.
And here we saw that, uh, wecould help some doctors at
Puntil that had some idea on howto minimally invasive go and
(17:56):
address some problems in thesepatients by modifying some
devices and building themspecifically for neonatal
patients.
So these are the kinds of thingsthat we are able to do here, um,
very efficiently and at a verygood cost or very good value,
which we hopefully will talk alittle bit later.
(18:19):
We have also worked in mamathematical modeling, Julio,
and it became very important nowwhen we had the pandemic and we
wanted to assist our officialsto measure the impact of their
decisions or therecommendations, you know,
mathematical models, supportdecision making.
(18:40):
And we had, um, professor, uh,Juan Manuel Cordo, a very good
mathematician, and a group ofpeople that were able to help.
We have, um, another researcherthat works on brain signals.
So he wants to help, um,understand better problems
related with sleep, Julio,something that is affecting
(19:03):
many, many people for differentreasons, but also to be able to
gain from, from what we learned,for example, how can you learn
things better by sleeping in acertain way or by having some
things done to you while you'resleeping or before or, or, or
something like that.
(19:24):
Um, one of our professors isalso an expert in genetics, and
she's studying behavior.
So she's studying, you know,how, for example, posttraumatic
stress changes, uh, the, the,the genetic makeup of a person
and what will happen in thefuture.
And finally, um, we work inareas of innovation and
(19:47):
entrepreneurship where we are,um, um, giving the students the
tools to become entrepreneurs,to solve the local problems, um,
to start the small companies tostop a little bit their reliance
on, on everything coming fromthe outside or perhaps, you
know, developing something for,for the companies that listen to
(20:09):
these kind of podcasts to say,we can give a little help to the
students to bring their ideas tocomplete products.
So this is, um, quickly anoverview of what we do, Julio,
which I don't know if itanswered the question because I
think the question had more toit.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Well, there's another part of the question that we can
address in a, in a moment.
But, um, to, to kind of, uh,summarize what you're saying and
to pinpoint an opportunity ortwo opportunities that I see
here.
I mean, first of all, it lookslike you guys are doing some
world class research, and youhave some world class, uh,
(20:48):
faculty in your department, uh,David, and, uh, the global
medical device ecosystem cantake advantage of your platform
or of your infrastructure andyour resources and at a, at a
much lower cost than, than, uh,doing the research in other, in
(21:12):
developed countries.
Uh, because we all know thatcost in, in, in, in places like
Columbia, especially now that Ijust, I just read the news a
couple days ago that theColumbian peso is the most
devalued currency in the worldright now.
So it's really a bargain tocollaborate and to, um, and to,
(21:33):
to buy services from, uh, labsor places, uh, like, like Los
Angeles.
And, um, that's one thing.
And another thing is theintellectual property that you
guys may be generating.
I don't know how much volume ofintellectual property you guys
(21:53):
are generating every year, but,um, if there is, uh, something
unique, something that you seeas a, that has great potential,
certainly if you're looking for,uh, funding or a partner that
can take the, that interproperty to the next level, you
(22:13):
know, setting it up a company inthe United States and developing
the technology in the UnitedStates for global markets.
Not, not necessarily localmarkets, cuz they're probably
too small.
But, uh, if the, if theintellectual property that you
guys are generating has globalimpact, I'm sure, uh, people in
the Silicon Valley, Minnesotaand Boston, et cetera, the hops
of medical innovation will beinterested in, in collaborating
(22:36):
with you to commercialize, uh,to be the vehicle for
commercialization developmentand commercialization, uh, of
that technology and to bring itto global markets.
Yeah.
So, um, yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Let me, let me, let me address the, the first part
of, of, of the comment, Julio,about the capabilities, uh, that
we have here and, and, andcertainly the fact that the cost
is gonna be much lower comparedto doing it in other countries
doesn't necessarily mean thatthe quality is gonna be inferior
(23:09):
to that of, you know, uh, theUnited States of Europe.
We have world class hospitalshere and doctors, uh, that
provide, you know, very goodcare.
So to do clinical trials and tobring some of the hospitals
here, we, at the university, ILos Angeleses now have, um, uh,
(23:34):
a program in, in, in medicine.
So we are also, uh, teaching,um, uh, a medical doctors at our
school, something that isrelatively recent, and we work
together with our teachinghospital, which is p but we have
also relationship with, I wouldsay many hospitals here in the
(23:58):
area or any hospital that weneed to work with, we can work
with, and we can do, um, thesupport that the clinical trials
need here with, with ourprofessors, with our students,
undergrad postgraduate students.
We have good talent here andpeople are much more interested
(24:20):
in solving real problems andworking in real needs than in
some theoretical aspects.
You know, we, we will continuedoing research and, um,
expanding on the basicknowledge, but we rather work on
real problems and, and pro andhelp people that are making real
solutions.
So it is definitely aninvitation to look at our
(24:43):
country, to look at our school,to look at the resources that we
have here, to do clinical trialswith us, to help us, because
that's another beautiful way toteach our students, to give them
tools, Julio, that they don'thave to go into other countries
to learn how to do things likethey are done in the US and in
(25:05):
Europe.
So that will be another win-winsituation at very good value, I
would say.
And the fact that the peso is,is, is where it is at the moment
compared to the US dollar, it'sanother advantage.
And as you know, Julio, becauseyou are a big advocate of this
and you have been working theregulatory, uh, uh, department
(25:28):
here, the Invi ema, the FDAequivalent here in Colombia is
also aware of the fact that theyneed to improve on their
processes.
So things that used to takevery, very long time don't take
so long now, things in part towork of people like yourself
have done in that area.
(25:48):
Um, and, and that is alsosomething that is, that is very
bene beneficial.
So that in the area of, um, ofthe clinical trials and the
things that could be done here.
And, um, and, and then thesecond part on the development
of the intellectual property.
So one of the things that wasnot well done before Julio, in
(26:12):
my opinion, is that theuniversities here in Colombia,
and I will speak for my ownuniversity, did not appreciate
the potential thatcommercializing the intellectual
property had.
But, but one of the steps thatyou need in order to do that is
to create a technology transferoffice or, or strengthen a
(26:37):
technology transfer office.
We now have one, um, which is,which is very well equipped to
take advantage of theintellectual property that is
developed at the university.
Which I think also if we see themodel of universities around the
world and universities in the USthat have made their
(27:02):
commercialization of theirintellectual property a very
good source of revenue, that issomething that we have not
utilized here in a Hulu.
So we patent and we do haveprofessors that, um, patent
some, some really goodinnovations, but we stop there,
(27:23):
we feel happy that we have apatent and that we can put it
into our statistics.
I would love to see that westart working with companies
that see the value of thosepatents and help us bring those
patents to the real world intocommercial products.
Um, and, and everybody gains,which is also where I think
(27:48):
things will work, is wheneverybody will gain and will
benefit.
We have some good ideas here,Julio.
Um, I give you, give you anexample that, uh, catheter that
I was just mentioning for theintervention of neonatal
patients that have congenitalheart disease was something that
was patented and, and it couldbe a good thing for, um, medical
(28:12):
device companies that would liketo, to use that.
I have been working myself on achallenge that was given to me
to treat burn patients, Julio.
And, um, and, and when a patientis burned, the, the, especially
with, you know, deep burns, notthe superficial burns that are
(28:33):
going to heal without anintervention, but the deeper
wounds where you are going toneed to remove the revitalized
tissue and create, um, the, the,the capillary bleeding that is
going to promote tissueregeneration.
That is something that is, it'sa procedure called dermal aion.
And it's done not just here inColomb Julio, but in many places
(28:58):
around the world, even in thefirst world countries, it's done
with sandpaper sand, sand paper,sand paper, because it's very
effective or with mechanicaldevices that are difficult to
control and don't provide a verygood result for the patient.
So we were given this challengeby the wound, uh, care unit here
at Wound San TAFE to come upwith an alternative.
(29:21):
And we developed a device thatwhen you see it looks like a
very, very simple device, andpeople that see, say, well, you
know, anyone could have comewith that.
And, and that I think is what isgreat about good innovations and
good inventions, is that theybecome very obvious after you
see them.
So we developed a device, Julio,that converts the hand of the
(29:44):
surgeon into a medical device.
We have added the abrasivesurface directly onto the glove
that the surgeon uses to removetheit eye skin.
We have filed for a patent.
And hopefully it's one of thoseideas that people that
commercialize medical deviceswould say, we would like to
(30:05):
bring that to the world and tothe plastic surgeons that are
working on derma elaboration forburn patients or other patients.
So we do have some good thingshere, Julio, that hopefully, um,
others are gonna be interestedand together we can develop it.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Yeah, yeah.
Animal trials, you guys have agreat animal facility in at the
university.
Uh, and that's something thatnobody has, uh, looked at yet.
I mean, companies pay like$50,000 for one animal in the
Silicon Valley area, whereas inColumbia is at a fraction of the
(30:43):
cost with great talent.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
We have a research lab, yes, we have a research lab
, uh, with, um, with, we are, weare currently in, in, in a, in a
trial, um, Julio, where we are,uh, looking at, at alternatives
to, to graft for, um, forcardiovascular disease that are
(31:11):
from animal sources that havebeen, um, uh, properly treated,
you know, animal cells have beenremoved and the, the, the grafts
have been prepared in such a waythat hopefully could be an
alternative for, for humans.
And we are at the momentstarting and at, at trial, uh,
(31:36):
to validate some of theimprovements that we have done
on those grafts.
So yes, you are right.
There is a very good, um,facility there, even though it's
a lot tougher to do animalexperimentation.
It's still possible here withall the, the ethical
considerations with ethicalcommittees on the side of the
(31:58):
hospital and the universitydoctors that are extremely
proficient in this area,veterinary areas that are
involved also in the care ofthese animals.
And a lot of improvements havebeen, uh, since the time that I
work with my orthopedic doctorfriend, where we, where we used
(32:20):
animals to validate ourpartially replacement, um, in
ethical ways because, you know,we all care for the animals.
So I know that people feel badwhen we use animals, but if we
do it, if we do it in the rightway, we will benefit the
society.
And it's not that that we can doit here because nobody cares.
(32:41):
No, we care as much as everyoneelse.
Um, and we can do it the rightway.
So don't, don't think that we'regonna cut the corners or be
cruel to the animals,because we want
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Yeah.
Good to know.
Yeah.
My experience with the humantrials in Columbia has been very
good.
I mean, strict guidelines,ethical approvals, regulatory,
national regulatory approvals ofthe Ministry of Health, and, and
, and every, I mean, everythinghas been done, uh, by the book.
And I'm sure animal trials canalso be done by the book, uh,
(33:13):
because that's what companieswant at the end, because we
wanna show your investors andyour, uh, partners, your
strategics, uh, that you getproper, uh, animal trials at top
facilities.
So, and the other opportunity is, um, licensing of, uh, ip, uh,
that you guys are generating.
(33:34):
I mean, that's a, that's such a,an overlooked, uh, possibility
that, uh, I mean the, the, theinnovations that you're
describing are something thatnobody, I'm sure nobody thinks
that they're coming from acountry like Columbia.
But, uh, in
Speaker 2 (33:51):
That sense, Julio, we welcome the help.
Yeah.
Because when we go out here intoour local environment to look
for support, to look forfinancial support, to look for
investment, to, to, to, to talkto a venture capital here about
one of these, um, investmentsin, in, in a medical device or a
(34:11):
procedure or something whereyou, you have very uncertain
results.
And, and a in addition to that,it takes a long time, as you
will know, some of them say, mymoney is safer on a, on a
building, on a brick building,because I can see where my money
goes.
I, I know that at the end it isgoing to be sold.
(34:33):
I may not make as much money,but my money is going to be
saved.
So here I would say that we donot have the maturity to see the
potential.
I hope that Covid will open theeyes and say, look, we cannot
continue relying on the outsidefor everything we do.
We need to start investinglocally in developing some of
(34:54):
our own solutions.
And, and even for themultinational companies that are
here, if they see that they caninvest some of their money
developing local talent, thattalent can bring ideas and
products to their companies andto their research centers at a
(35:14):
very reduced cost.
And that is good for everyone.
So please invest in us, investin Colombia, look for the young
groups of biomedical engineersall around the country that are
developing beautiful productsand ideas.
And we are starting to educatethem earlier in their careers.
(35:35):
Julio, just to be betterprepared to do this, you know,
we are starting to tell them,work on a real problem, build a
solution, build an economicmodel, understand the financial
implications of what you'redoing, just so that they are
better prepared to have theseconversations, Julio, with
potential investors, because aninvestor would like to speak
(35:57):
with a person that is somewhateducated and aware of what is
coming.
And we didn't have that beforeJulio.
So you could, you couldprobably, you know,
underestimate the, the, the, the, the scientists because when it
comes to, to, to the businessmodel or the sustainability,
(36:18):
they haven't thought about that.
And therefore, you know, you maynot want to start the
conversation.
We are trying to change that.
We are trying to make them awareof these kinds of things from,
from the university, uh, beforethey graduate and go and try to
do this and get frustrated anddecide that they will go and
just take a regular job.
(36:39):
Cause they need to earn aliving.
So we, we can, we can be, we canbe useful, Julio, and with help,
we can be more useful.
Speaker 1 (36:49):
Absolutely.
I mean, podcasts like this are agood platform.
And, uh, it is also worthmentioning, um, that it, and I'm
proud of the news that, uh,Paola kba, one of your program,
one of the students at yourprogram is part of the bio, the
Stanford Biodesign, uh,innovation Program Fellowship.
(37:12):
I mean, that's a fascinatingnews.
I mean, I'm so happy to hearthat because we have, she's
probably the first Colombianever that is accepted in the
program.
And the first female also
Speaker 2 (37:24):
.
I think you're right.
So Julio, this, this, this, thisbring me an opportunity to tell
you that, you know, the programthat we are using to educate our
students is a program that wasdeveloped in Stanford a little
over 10 years ago, and it'scalled Biodesign.
So they have a methodology tobring solutions to health
(37:46):
related needs to life and, andbuild companies and so on.
So we didn't have to reinventthe wheel.
We took biodesign from Stanfordand we have adapted, and we are
teaching that here.
And, and then recently, um, itbecause of our relationship with
the professors at Stanford, andin particular, Dr.
(38:08):
Paul Yo, who is one of theoriginal creators of this
program, says, uh, you know, youguys have great talent over
there.
We need to have some of thattalent here in our fellowship
program.
So we, we thought about this,this wonderful candidate, uh,
she's a medical doctor, educatedhere in Bogota to New York, Los
(38:30):
Angeleses, and then she did hermasters of biomedical
engineering, uh, at, atuniversity at de Los Sandis.
And she started, you know,complementing her knowledge of,
of medicine.
Cause unlike the US Julio, wherea medical doctor has an
undergraduate education inanother field, it is not the
(38:51):
case here.
So, so as you mentioned, powerLa Ava is a person that acquires
her medical degree, then hermaster's in biomedical
engineering then goes to Harvardand starts working on, um,
projects that bring, you know,machine learning and artificial
(39:12):
intelligence.
She learns about programminglanguages.
She starts working, um, on a, onthe development of, of
technology that will, uh, detect, um, infections in catheters
while the patients arehospitalized and using some
(39:32):
artificial intelligence tosupport the decision.
No.
So she's, she's getting intothese very complimentary set of,
of, of education and knowledge.
And when, when we are asked fora candidate that we think could
be suitable for this program,you know, she's ideal.
But she, she had to survive avery rigorous, uh, process of,
(39:54):
of recruitment.
She was successful.
And she's been in the programnow for the last couple of
months, um, as a fellow in thisincredibly powerful biodesign
fellowship program at Stanfordthat produces some incredible
innovations and some goodcompanies.
Um, and hopefully Paola will bea person that has always wanted
(40:21):
to, to acquire the knowledge toapply it here back in, in
Columbia, her country and in inthe region in Latin America.
And just, just to give you anadditional point about her,
Julio, since you mentioned, um,she has been producing a podcast
like yourself, which is calledthe Mio Cardio Podcast.
(40:44):
And it's a podcast aboutcardiology in Spanish for Latin
America.
Very powerful tool to educatethe region, uh, bringing some
speakers from, uh, the bestinstitutions in the world and,
um, for the benefit of everyone.
So we are, we are helping the,the region.
(41:07):
She's also very passionate likemyself, about working in this
region, about helping theregion, about bringing the level
of this re region app, Julio, soanother good source and another
potential contact for you.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
Yes, yes.
Well, we're proud of, ofpowerless accomplishments as
fellow Colombians.
Speaker 2 (41:26):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
All right, David, uh, it's about time to close the
show.
Thank you so much for beinghere.
I mean, it is been a fascinatingconversation.
I really enjoyed it, and I'msure listeners, uh, got a lot
out of it.
Certainly.
So, and they, I'm sure theylearned so much about the
potential that a place like LosSanders and, and, uh, and your
(41:50):
team, uh, can offer, uh, to themedical device, innovation, uh,
industry and journal.
So thank you again, David, anduh, have a wonderful day.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
.
Thank you so much, Julio, forthe opportunity, and thank you
for the work that you do.
Speaker 1 (42:07):
Excellent.
Bye-Bye.
Welcome to the Latin MedTech Leaders podcast, a
conversation with MedTechleaders who have succeeded or
plan to succeed in LatinAmerica.
Please subscribe on yourfavorite podcasting platform.
Apple Podcast, Spotify, GooglePodcast.
Amazon Music is teacher.
Tune in.
I heard radio, Pandora, or theseare Welcome to the Latin Metech
(00:23):
Leaders podcast, a conversationswith leaders who have succeeded
or plan to succeed in LatinAmerica.
Today our guest is David B, thedeparting head of biomedical
engineering at University de LosAngeleses, or University of the
Andes in Bogota, Colombia, theleading private university in
Columbia, and one of the topuniversities in Latin America.
(00:46):
Hey, David, it's great to haveyou here today.
Welcome to the show.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Good morning, Julio.
Thank you so much for having me.
It's a pleasure and it's anhonor to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Awesome, David.
All right, so let's get startedhere.
So let's speak about yourjourney, uh, David or David
Call
Speaker 2 (01:07):
You.
Let's go, let's go with David.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
So, uh, let's talk about your journey.
How is it that you got to whereyou are today?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
So, Julio, um, I graduated as a mechanical
engineer from the same schoolwhere I am now.
When you see that de losAngeleses in Bogota at the time,
uh, biomedical engineering didnot exist.
This is an engineering that, uh,started, uh, becoming a formal
program much later.
(01:35):
But nevertheless, at the time,our professors and directors had
a relationship with one of theteaching hospitals in Bogota, at
university at Havana.
It was, uh, hospital San Ignacio, and the idea for some of our
professors was to pair engineerswith, uh, doctors that were
(01:56):
finishing their residents.
And in my case, I was veryfortunate to be put, um, in a,
in a project with an orthopedicsurgeon, uh, that happens to be
Doctor Al, who today is, uh, themedical director of Fund San.
And we were given the challengeto work on a partial knee
(02:22):
replacement on an issue relatedwith reconstruction of the knee.
And, and that for me was a great, um, thing that happened,
Julio, because it, it, it, itreally made me aware of the fact
that I had, um, an interest anda talent for developing medical
(02:47):
devices, for thinking aboutsolutions and so on.
So that is something that stayedwith me for a very long time.
I wasn't able to put it inpractice right away, because
when I finished, uh, you know,the hospital there, even though
they saw, uh, a person like meuseful for talking about
problems and trying to solvethings they didn't really have
(03:09):
in their, um,
opportunity for a person likeme.
So I went and did some otherthings, Julio, and, uh, perhaps
we can talk about that.
But eventually, you know, Ireturned to the university, um,
to teach, uh, innovation andentrepreneurship to our
(03:32):
biomedical engineers becausethat is something that I was
very passionate about.
I wanted our engineers to learnabout that.
And the director of the programat the time also saw it as an
important thing to teach them.
So I came back to, to do that.
And we can talk about in moredetail if you want.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
Yeah.
Let's talk about your experiencein Silicon Valley.
You have over 30 years ofexperience working, uh, for
multinational companies,startups, and that's a
fascinating piece of, uh, yourstory.
So, uh, can you describe alittle bit of, uh,
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Sure.
So, so before I got there, I, Ihad, um, an opportunity to work
for an oil field servicescompany.
I worked for Schlumberger for anumber of years in the oil
field, in the platforms in theNorth Sea.
I was also in the jungles ofAfrica.
(04:29):
And, um, and I started to becomemore oriented towards the
development.
And, um, I joined, uh, aresearch facility at, at, at
Schlumberger in Texas andstarted developing technology.
And I was, uh, learning aboutsome other things that happened
(04:50):
in Schlumberger.
And one of the divisions thatthe company had was, um,
involved with electronictransactions.
They were getting into, youknow, some parallel business or
actually different business fromthe oil field.
And electronic transactions wasan area where they had patented
this.
They had purchased the patentfor the smart card, and they
(05:11):
wanted to develop something.
The thing is, Julio, that theysent me, uh, to, to learn about
marketing high technology inSanta Cruz in California.
And I went there and I learnedabout how to market high
technology, and I became awareof what was happening with the
(05:33):
internet and Silicon Valley andthe startups and this mentality.
And then Julio, I said tomyself, one day, soon when I am
gonna be in control of my owndestiny, this is the place where
I want to be.
Because I had visited Palo Altoin California, and I thought,
this is paradise.
(05:54):
I want to be here.
I wanna have a chance to behere.
So I went to to to, to Palo Altoafter I left Schlumberger.
And, um, after a while I joinedHP Labs.
And there, it was a beautifultime because the internet was
happening, and so many peoplehad so many ideas about what
(06:21):
could be added to the internet.
Some of them were silly, butsome of them were powerful.
But it was all about theinternet, and it was all about
startups, and it was all aboutcompanies coming to pitch, um,
to HP about what we could do forthem.
So that was an area where Ilearned about what it takes to
(06:43):
become a startup and thedifficult obstacles that some of
them face and, you know,pitching and, uh, business plans
and these kinds of things.
So that was something that Iwanted to also add to my
interest in, in the, thedevelopment of medical devices.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
Fascinating story.
And I, and I think, um, theregion on Columbia, specifically
Bogota, Los Angeles, is veryfortunate to have somebody with
your background here, because avery few Latin Americans are
exposed to the medical deviceinnovation ecosystem, or the me
(07:25):
or the technology innovationecosystem in general, uh, in the
Silicon Valley area.
And, and to come back to yourhome country and to, uh, share
your knowledge and experiencesto with your students, I think
that's quite a gift for theregion.
And thank you for that.
I mean, that's, that's,
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Yeah, I feel also very fortunate myself, Julio, to
be able to return, um, to, to myhome country and to my school,
um, because I am who I am,thanks to them.
And I am the person I am thanksto growing up in Colombia,
thanks to studying at universityI, Los Angeles.
And when I had the opportunity,um, I thought that was a good
(08:06):
way to return.
And I am actually, uh, learninga lot in this new adventure.
And hopefully, Julio, I'm alsobeing able to contribute.
So we are all winning here,
Speaker 1 (08:20):
Ext.
Excellent, excellent.
I'm so happy to hear that.
All right, uh, David, let's talkabout trains in Latin America
and Columbia.
What's happening that makesLatin America specific Columbia
a great place to do research,animal research, human research
development, medicaltechnologies and, and
commercialization?
I mean, what do you see?
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Sure.
So Julio, let's, let's state anobvious thing that we all
experience from the recentevents of the pandemic, right?
So it happens to all of us.
It affects all of us, and we cansee the level of preparedness or
the lack of it that we all hadin different ways.
So this was an eye opening eventfor everyone, you know,
(09:05):
including the United States thatall of us sudden sees that they
are not able to provide some ofthe things because either
workers are not going to thefactories to work, or most
things are coming from Asia.
And Asia has shut down becauseof the pandemic.
And, and, and it's an eyeopening event where we see that
not producing things locally isa problem.
(09:28):
And we become aware whensomething like this happen, and
we can go from the simple things, uh, of, of face masks that all
come from China to the morecomplex things of ventilators
that people were going to needfor the pandemic.
And we realize we rely onsomebody else for everything,
(09:48):
for production, forcommercialization.
And I think Julio, that two goodthings happen as a result.
First, we become aware of thefact that we need to have a
little bit more control of ourown destiny.
And the second thing thathappened is that great
collaboration spurs to try tosolve the needs.
(10:11):
Um, and so people start workingtogether and we see an effort to
go and join forces.
And that I think is gonna be,uh, very beneficial.
But we saw some things that were, were alarming Julio in some of
our neighboring countries, forexample, that, that you run out
of oxygen to treat patients andthings like that, that should,
(10:33):
that should open our eyes, andthat should give an opportunity
for us to know that this is notthe last time something like
this is gonna happen, and thatwe need to be better prepared.
So yes, it is nice to thinkabout all of the fancy
developments of new devices andnew technologies and
telemedicine, which we are goingto talk about, because I think,
(10:57):
um, covid open an opportunityfor telemedicine or for remote
care, but also Julio, to thinkthat we need to have our basis
covered, our basic thingscovered.
I think it's also veryimportant.
So a trend that I see is that weare gonna go back to basics,
Julio.
We have not produced vaccines inColombia for humans for many,
(11:20):
many years.
For whatever reason.
I think that this is a momentwhere we should reconsider
things like that.
We may not have the technologyand the capability to develop a
vaccine from scratch, but weshould certainly be able to
produce vaccines that, um,companies are gonna license to
(11:40):
companies here.
So these are the kind of thingsthat I would say going into,
into thinking about how thepandemic affected, um, access to
health.
Julio.
I think that a big opportunityhas opened up for, for remote
care, for remote diagnosis,which even after this pandemic
(12:04):
passes, should give us anopportunity to think about the
people that live in, in remoteareas that should not come to
the big cities as the onlyalternative to receive good
care.
I think that now we have anopportunity to develop
technologies and improvetechnologies that will be able
to bring good healthcare, gooddiagnostic, um, to remote areas.
(12:30):
I think that this is a goodopportunity and this is a trend
that is happening.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Absolutely.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, continue.
Go on.
I'm sorry.
I thought,
Speaker 2 (12:39):
No, and I was just going add onto that, uh, Julio,
that, um, that the other thingthat is happening is the
understanding or the need tounderstand the treatments that
work better compared to others.
So, so, so I'm thinking aboutdata science, machine learning,
artificial intelligence termsthat we hear.
(12:59):
We don't know exactly what theymean, but we know they're, they
are good, they are fancy, theyare nice to talk about.
I think that here, for example,we, it took us a while to learn
what was working for patients,Julio, and imagine if we could
really build a cooperation wherenot just in one hospital or one
(13:22):
local area, we learn about whathappens to a patient that comes
in with, with a certaincondition, but we join all of
the information and we analyzethis data and we say, look,
these, uh, procedure works andit works well, and here is the
(13:43):
data that's supported thesemedicine works, this treatment
works, this course ofantibiotics work.
We have a nice opportunity to cocooperate with others for better
results towards the patients,which is something that we
should all strive for.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely.
All right, David, uh, let's moveon and let's talk about your
current work.
I mean, what interestingtechnologies your students are
working on.
And I also like to, to speakabout the obstacles that they
have in the local ecosystems.
(14:23):
Um, what would you see happeningin Columbia that will make
Columbia a country ofinnovation, medical innovation,
please.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
Great.
Who you, so, so let me tell youa little bit about, um, the
biomedical engineeringdepartment at university los,
and is, just to give you a sensefor the kinds of things that we
do.
So I'm, I'm currently, you know,very fortunate to, to be, you
know, the head of thedepartment, which is an, uh, an
(14:52):
opportunity that I welcomeknowing that some of the things
I can do is, is, is bring morevisibility to the great talent
that we have.
So I'm gonna take thisopportunity to share with you
some of the things we do, um,with the nine professors and the
nine research areas that we have.
Um, just to give you a sense,you know, we, we work in the
(15:14):
area of biomechanics, somethingthat is very, uh, top of mind on
people when they think aboutbiomedical engineering.
They think about biomechanics,they think about human movement,
they think about prostheticdevices, and that's an area
where we work.
We also work in computer vision.
We have one of the top 100scientists in the area in Dr.
(15:38):
Pablo ar who directs a centerfor the learning of information,
uh, artificial intelligence, um,not only for health application,
but for general application.
But he happens to be ourprofessor.
And a lot of our students areinterested in that.
We have research in the area ofbiomaterials and bioprinting.
(16:00):
So you, you mentioned briefly,um, animal trials and trials
using animals, something that weknow Julio is becoming very
difficult to do.
So one of the things that we aredeveloping is, uh, we are
developing artificial human skinso that we can do trial of, um,
(16:22):
cosmetic products andpharmaceuticals on artificial
skin that resembles human skinso that we don't have to use
animals.
I think that this is a goodpotential for companies that are
interested in, in, in trialingthings related with, with the
skin.
Um, just to continue, um, we doresearch in nanomaterials, uh,
(16:47):
to help us improve drug deliverymethods and also to try to
understand how some of these,some diseases, like, like the
Parkinson, if we can bring theright pharmaceutical product to
the right element that isaffected, could be better.
Uh, treatments.
We have a professor that havebeen studying and working on the
(17:10):
cardiovascular system for a longtime.
So we are developing somedevices that are built here for,
um, for, for patients, forexample, just to give you,
that's, to give you an examplearound that, uh, Julio, for
infants that are born with, um,cardiovascular problems,
(17:35):
neonatal, uh, that arecongenital heart diseases, most
of the devices that exist, uh,are made for adults.
And here we saw that, uh, wecould help some doctors at
Puntil that had some idea on howto minimally invasive go and
(17:56):
address some problems in thesepatients by modifying some
devices and building themspecifically for neonatal
patients.
So these are the kinds of thingsthat we are able to do here, um,
very efficiently and at a verygood cost or very good value,
which we hopefully will talk alittle bit later.
(18:19):
We have also worked in mamathematical modeling, Julio,
and it became very important nowwhen we had the pandemic and we
wanted to assist our officialsto measure the impact of their
decisions or therecommendations, you know,
mathematical models, supportdecision making.
(18:40):
And we had, um, professor, uh,Juan Manuel Cordo, a very good
mathematician, and a group ofpeople that were able to help.
We have, um, another researcherthat works on brain signals.
So he wants to help, um,understand better problems
related with sleep, Julio,something that is affecting
(19:03):
many, many people for differentreasons, but also to be able to
gain from, from what we learned,for example, how can you learn
things better by sleeping in acertain way or by having some
things done to you while you'resleeping or before or, or, or
something like that.
(19:24):
Um, one of our professors isalso an expert in genetics, and
she's studying behavior.
So she's studying, you know,how, for example, posttraumatic
stress changes, uh, the, the,the genetic makeup of a person
and what will happen in thefuture.
And finally, um, we work inareas of innovation and
(19:47):
entrepreneurship where we are,um, um, giving the students the
tools to become entrepreneurs,to solve the local problems, um,
to start the small companies tostop a little bit their reliance
on, on everything coming fromthe outside or perhaps, you
know, developing something for,for the companies that listen to
(20:09):
these kind of podcasts to say,we can give a little help to the
students to bring their ideas tocomplete products.
So this is, um, quickly anoverview of what we do, Julio,
which I don't know if itanswered the question because I
think the question had more toit.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Well, there's another part of the question that we can
address in a, in a moment.
But, um, to, to kind of, uh,summarize what you're saying and
to pinpoint an opportunity ortwo opportunities that I see
here.
I mean, first of all, it lookslike you guys are doing some
world class research, and youhave some world class, uh,
(20:48):
faculty in your department, uh,David, and, uh, the global
medical device ecosystem cantake advantage of your platform
or of your infrastructure andyour resources and at a, at a
much lower cost than, than, uh,doing the research in other, in
(21:12):
developed countries.
Uh, because we all know thatcost in, in, in, in places like
Columbia, especially now that Ijust, I just read the news a
couple days ago that theColumbian peso is the most
devalued currency in the worldright now.
So it's really a bargain tocollaborate and to, um, and to,
(21:33):
to buy services from, uh, labsor places, uh, like, like Los
Angeles.
And, um, that's one thing.
And another thing is theintellectual property that you
guys may be generating.
I don't know how much volume ofintellectual property you guys
(21:53):
are generating every year, but,um, if there is, uh, something
unique, something that you seeas a, that has great potential,
certainly if you're looking for,uh, funding or a partner that
can take the, that interproperty to the next level, you
(22:13):
know, setting it up a company inthe United States and developing
the technology in the UnitedStates for global markets.
Not, not necessarily localmarkets, cuz they're probably
too small.
But, uh, if the, if theintellectual property that you
guys are generating has globalimpact, I'm sure, uh, people in
the Silicon Valley, Minnesotaand Boston, et cetera, the hops
of medical innovation will beinterested in, in collaborating
(22:36):
with you to commercialize, uh,to be the vehicle for
commercialization developmentand commercialization, uh, of
that technology and to bring itto global markets.
Yeah.
So, um, yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Let me, let me, let me address the, the first part
of, of, of the comment, Julio,about the capabilities, uh, that
we have here and, and, andcertainly the fact that the cost
is gonna be much lower comparedto doing it in other countries
doesn't necessarily mean thatthe quality is gonna be inferior
(23:09):
to that of, you know, uh, theUnited States of Europe.
We have world class hospitalshere and doctors, uh, that
provide, you know, very goodcare.
So to do clinical trials and tobring some of the hospitals
here, we, at the university, ILos Angeleses now have, um, uh,
(23:34):
a program in, in, in medicine.
So we are also, uh, teaching,um, uh, a medical doctors at our
school, something that isrelatively recent, and we work
together with our teachinghospital, which is p but we have
also relationship with, I wouldsay many hospitals here in the
(23:58):
area or any hospital that weneed to work with, we can work
with, and we can do, um, thesupport that the clinical trials
need here with, with ourprofessors, with our students,
undergrad postgraduate students.
We have good talent here andpeople are much more interested
(24:20):
in solving real problems andworking in real needs than in
some theoretical aspects.
You know, we, we will continuedoing research and, um,
expanding on the basicknowledge, but we rather work on
real problems and, and pro andhelp people that are making real
solutions.
So it is definitely aninvitation to look at our
(24:43):
country, to look at our school,to look at the resources that we
have here, to do clinical trialswith us, to help us, because
that's another beautiful way toteach our students, to give them
tools, Julio, that they don'thave to go into other countries
to learn how to do things likethey are done in the US and in
(25:05):
Europe.
So that will be another win-winsituation at very good value, I
would say.
And the fact that the peso is,is, is where it is at the moment
compared to the US dollar, it'sanother advantage.
And as you know, Julio, becauseyou are a big advocate of this
and you have been working theregulatory, uh, uh, department
(25:28):
here, the Invi ema, the FDAequivalent here in Colombia is
also aware of the fact that theyneed to improve on their
processes.
So things that used to takevery, very long time don't take
so long now, things in part towork of people like yourself
have done in that area.
(25:48):
Um, and, and that is alsosomething that is, that is very
bene beneficial.
So that in the area of, um, ofthe clinical trials and the
things that could be done here.
And, um, and, and then thesecond part on the development
of the intellectual property.
So one of the things that wasnot well done before Julio, in
(26:12):
my opinion, is that theuniversities here in Colombia,
and I will speak for my ownuniversity, did not appreciate
the potential thatcommercializing the intellectual
property had.
But, but one of the steps thatyou need in order to do that is
to create a technology transferoffice or, or strengthen a
(26:37):
technology transfer office.
We now have one, um, which is,which is very well equipped to
take advantage of theintellectual property that is
developed at the university.
Which I think also if we see themodel of universities around the
world and universities in the USthat have made their
(27:02):
commercialization of theirintellectual property a very
good source of revenue, that issomething that we have not
utilized here in a Hulu.
So we patent and we do haveprofessors that, um, patent
some, some really goodinnovations, but we stop there,
(27:23):
we feel happy that we have apatent and that we can put it
into our statistics.
I would love to see that westart working with companies
that see the value of thosepatents and help us bring those
patents to the real world intocommercial products.
Um, and, and everybody gains,which is also where I think
(27:48):
things will work, is wheneverybody will gain and will
benefit.
We have some good ideas here,Julio.
Um, I give you, give you anexample that, uh, catheter that
I was just mentioning for theintervention of neonatal
patients that have congenitalheart disease was something that
was patented and, and it couldbe a good thing for, um, medical
(28:12):
device companies that would liketo, to use that.
I have been working myself on achallenge that was given to me
to treat burn patients, Julio.
And, um, and, and when a patientis burned, the, the, especially
with, you know, deep burns, notthe superficial burns that are
(28:33):
going to heal without anintervention, but the deeper
wounds where you are going toneed to remove the revitalized
tissue and create, um, the, the,the capillary bleeding that is
going to promote tissueregeneration.
That is something that is, it'sa procedure called dermal aion.
And it's done not just here inColomb Julio, but in many places
(28:58):
around the world, even in thefirst world countries, it's done
with sandpaper sand, sand paper,sand paper, because it's very
effective or with mechanicaldevices that are difficult to
control and don't provide a verygood result for the patient.
So we were given this challengeby the wound, uh, care unit here
at Wound San TAFE to come upwith an alternative.
(29:21):
And we developed a device thatwhen you see it looks like a
very, very simple device, andpeople that see, say, well, you
know, anyone could have comewith that.
And, and that I think is what isgreat about good innovations and
good inventions, is that theybecome very obvious after you
see them.
So we developed a device, Julio,that converts the hand of the
(29:44):
surgeon into a medical device.
We have added the abrasivesurface directly onto the glove
that the surgeon uses to removetheit eye skin.
We have filed for a patent.
And hopefully it's one of thoseideas that people that
commercialize medical deviceswould say, we would like to
(30:05):
bring that to the world and tothe plastic surgeons that are
working on derma elaboration forburn patients or other patients.
So we do have some good thingshere, Julio, that hopefully, um,
others are gonna be interestedand together we can develop it.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Yeah, yeah.
Animal trials, you guys have agreat animal facility in at the
university.
Uh, and that's something thatnobody has, uh, looked at yet.
I mean, companies pay like$50,000 for one animal in the
Silicon Valley area, whereas inColumbia is at a fraction of the
(30:43):
cost with great talent.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
We have a research lab, yes, we have a research lab
, uh, with, um, with, we are, weare currently in, in, in a, in a
trial, um, Julio, where we are,uh, looking at, at alternatives
to, to graft for, um, forcardiovascular disease that are
(31:11):
from animal sources that havebeen, um, uh, properly treated,
you know, animal cells have beenremoved and the, the, the grafts
have been prepared in such a waythat hopefully could be an
alternative for, for humans.
And we are at the momentstarting and at, at trial, uh,
(31:36):
to validate some of theimprovements that we have done
on those grafts.
So yes, you are right.
There is a very good, um,facility there, even though it's
a lot tougher to do animalexperimentation.
It's still possible here withall the, the ethical
considerations with ethicalcommittees on the side of the
(31:58):
hospital and the universitydoctors that are extremely
proficient in this area,veterinary areas that are
involved also in the care ofthese animals.
And a lot of improvements havebeen, uh, since the time that I
work with my orthopedic doctorfriend, where we, where we used
(32:20):
animals to validate ourpartially replacement, um, in
ethical ways because, you know,we all care for the animals.
So I know that people feel badwhen we use animals, but if we
do it, if we do it in the rightway, we will benefit the
society.
And it's not that that we can doit here because nobody cares.
(32:41):
No, we care as much as everyoneelse.
Um, and we can do it the rightway.
So don't, don't think that we'regonna cut the corners or be
cruel to the animals
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Yeah.
Good to know.
Yeah.
My experience with the humantrials in Columbia has been very
good.
I mean, strict guidelines,ethical approvals, regulatory,
national regulatory approvals ofthe Ministry of Health, and, and
, and every, I mean, everythinghas been done, uh, by the book.
And I'm sure animal trials canalso be done by the book, uh,
(33:13):
because that's what companieswant at the end, because we
wanna show your investors andyour, uh, partners, your
strategics, uh, that you getproper, uh, animal trials at top
facilities.
So, and the other opportunity is, um, licensing of, uh, ip, uh,
that you guys are generating.
(33:34):
I mean, that's a, that's such a,an overlooked, uh, possibility
that, uh, I mean the, the, theinnovations that you're
describing are something thatnobody, I'm sure nobody thinks
that they're coming from acountry like Columbia
But, uh, in
Speaker 2 (33:51):
That sense, Julio, we welcome the help.
Yeah.
Because when we go out here intoour local environment to look
for support, to look forfinancial support, to look for
investment, to, to, to, to talkto a venture capital here about
one of these, um, investmentsin, in, in a medical device or a
(34:11):
procedure or something whereyou, you have very uncertain
results.
And, and a in addition to that,it takes a long time, as you
will know, some of them say, mymoney is safer on a, on a
building, on a brick building,because I can see where my money
goes.
I, I know that at the end it isgoing to be sold.
(34:33):
I may not make as much money,but my money is going to be
saved.
So here I would say that we donot have the maturity to see the
potential.
I hope that Covid will open theeyes and say, look, we cannot
continue relying on the outsidefor everything we do.
We need to start investinglocally in developing some of
(34:54):
our own solutions.
And, and even for themultinational companies that are
here, if they see that they caninvest some of their money
developing local talent, thattalent can bring ideas and
products to their companies andto their research centers at a
(35:14):
very reduced cost.
And that is good for everyone.
So please invest in us, investin Colombia, look for the young
groups of biomedical engineersall around the country that are
developing beautiful productsand ideas.
And we are starting to educatethem earlier in their careers.
(35:35):
Julio, just to be betterprepared to do this, you know,
we are starting to tell them,work on a real problem, build a
solution, build an economicmodel, understand the financial
implications of what you'redoing, just so that they are
better prepared to have theseconversations, Julio, with
potential investors, because aninvestor would like to speak
(35:57):
with a person that is somewhateducated and aware of what is
coming.
And we didn't have that beforeJulio.
So you could, you couldprobably, you know,
underestimate the, the, the, the, the scientists because when it
comes to, to, to the businessmodel or the sustainability,
(36:18):
they haven't thought about that.
And therefore, you know, you maynot want to start the
conversation.
We are trying to change that.
We are trying to make them awareof these kinds of things from,
from the university, uh, beforethey graduate and go and try to
do this and get frustrated anddecide that they will go and
just take a regular job.
(36:39):
Cause they need to earn aliving.
So we, we can, we can be, we canbe useful, Julio, and with help,
we can be more useful.
Speaker 1 (36:49):
Absolutely.
I mean, podcasts like this are agood platform.
And, uh, it is also worthmentioning, um, that it, and I'm
proud of the news that, uh,Paola kba, one of your program,
one of the students at yourprogram is part of the bio, the
Stanford Biodesign, uh,innovation Program Fellowship.
(37:12):
I mean, that's a fascinatingnews.
I mean, I'm so happy to hearthat because we have, she's
probably the first Colombianever that is accepted in the
program.
And the first female also
Speaker 2 (37:24):
I think you're right.
So Julio, this, this, this, thisbring me an opportunity to tell
you that, you know, the programthat we are using to educate our
students is a program that wasdeveloped in Stanford a little
over 10 years ago, and it'scalled Biodesign.
So they have a methodology tobring solutions to health
(37:46):
related needs to life and, andbuild companies and so on.
So we didn't have to reinventthe wheel.
We took biodesign from Stanfordand we have adapted, and we are
teaching that here.
And, and then recently, um, itbecause of our relationship with
the professors at Stanford, andin particular, Dr.
(38:08):
Paul Yo, who is one of theoriginal creators of this
program, says, uh, you know, youguys have great talent over
there.
We need to have some of thattalent here in our fellowship
program.
So we, we thought about this,this wonderful candidate, uh,
she's a medical doctor, educatedhere in Bogota to New York, Los
(38:30):
Angeleses, and then she did hermasters of biomedical
engineering, uh, at, atuniversity at de Los Sandis.
And she started, you know,complementing her knowledge of,
of medicine.
Cause unlike the US Julio, wherea medical doctor has an
undergraduate education inanother field, it is not the
(38:51):
case here.
So, so as you mentioned, powerLa Ava is a person that acquires
her medical degree, then hermaster's in biomedical
engineering then goes to Harvardand starts working on, um,
projects that bring, you know,machine learning and artificial
(39:12):
intelligence.
She learns about programminglanguages.
She starts working, um, on a, onthe development of, of
technology that will, uh, detect, um, infections in catheters
while the patients arehospitalized and using some
(39:32):
artificial intelligence tosupport the decision.
No.
So she's, she's getting intothese very complimentary set of,
of, of education and knowledge.
And when, when we are asked fora candidate that we think could
be suitable for this program,you know, she's ideal.
But she, she had to survive avery rigorous, uh, process of,
(39:54):
of recruitment.
She was successful.
And she's been in the programnow for the last couple of
months, um, as a fellow in thisincredibly powerful biodesign
fellowship program at Stanfordthat produces some incredible
innovations and some goodcompanies.
Um, and hopefully Paola will bea person that has always wanted
(40:21):
to, to acquire the knowledge toapply it here back in, in
Columbia, her country and in inthe region in Latin America.
And just, just to give you anadditional point about her,
Julio, since you mentioned, um,she has been producing a podcast
like yourself, which is calledthe Mio Cardio Podcast.
(40:44):
And it's a podcast aboutcardiology in Spanish for Latin
America.
Very powerful tool to educatethe region, uh, bringing some
speakers from, uh, the bestinstitutions in the world and,
um, for the benefit of everyone.
So we are, we are helping the,the region.
(41:07):
She's also very passionate likemyself, about working in this
region, about helping theregion, about bringing the level
of this re region app, Julio, soanother good source and another
potential contact for you.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
Yes, yes.
Well, we're proud of, ofpowerless accomplishments as
fellow Colombians
Speaker 2 (41:26):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
All right, David, uh, it's about time to close the
show.
Thank you so much for beinghere.
I mean, it is been a fascinatingconversation.
I really enjoyed it, and I'msure listeners, uh, got a lot
out of it.
Certainly.
So, and they, I'm sure theylearned so much about the
potential that a place like LosSanders and, and, uh, and your
(41:50):
team, uh, can offer, uh, to themedical device, innovation, uh,
industry and journal.
So thank you again, David, anduh, have a wonderful day.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Thank you so much, Julio, forthe opportunity, and thank you
for the work that you do.
Speaker 1 (42:07):
Excellent.
Bye-Bye.
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