Distance & Accuracy Combined In One Swing!

PGA Instructor Mike Austin drove over 500 yards in his 60s! Jaacob Bowden lowered his handicap from 14-scratch with Austin's method, now he's teaching it. Originally, this was Members Only episode #336, published in JUNE 2012, so it’s the first time it’s being shared publicly for free!

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Welcome to golf Smarter mulligans, yoursecond chance to gain insight and advice from
the best instructors featured on the golfSmarter podcast. Great Golf Instruction Never gets
old. Our interview library features hundredsof hours of game improvement conversations like this

(00:21):
that are no longer available in anypodcast app. Yeah sixty four. He
was sixty four years old and drovethe ball five hundred and fifteen yards.
Yeah yeah. I'm glad you saidthat he had some witnesses, because you
know, personally, I've driven theball six hundred yards but nobody was there.
Yeah right, Yeah, that's aticket six hundred Yeah to hit the

(00:41):
ball all the way to the secondhole. Yeah yeah. Fortunately there were
people there to witness it, andGuinness is pretty strict about verification of their
record, so they did whatever theyneeded to do to verify it and sure
enough. Wow. Wow, reallyamazing, isn't it. Yeah, it's

(01:02):
really amazing. With another interview fromthe archives of golf Smarter, here's your
host, Fred Green. Welcome togolf Smarter for members only, Jacob uh
thanks and we'll try that again.Sorry, I know I caught you by
surprise when I said, we're recording, but here we go. Welcome back

(01:23):
to Golf Smarter, Jacob. Oh, thanks, it's good to be back
on the show. Thank you verymuch. Speaking on Skype over to you
in Zurich, Switzerland, I lovethe fact that you you know, I
said, Oh, you're in Zurich, and I expect you to have some
very thick accent, you know,even if it's Scottish or something and it's
like you're from Saint Louis. Yeah. How's your game? How's your game?

(01:48):
Game is good? Is as goodas it can be? I guess
I'm not playing a whole lot rightnow, though I'm working more on some
instructional products and working on the businessside of things. I guess. Isn't
that amazing. I can't tell youhow many golf professionals I speak with that
say play golf? Are you kidding? Who has time to play golf?

(02:08):
I'm trying to run a business here. Yeah, what is that saying?
If you want to play play golf, don't work in the golf industry?
Absolutely absolutely. I've had I've hadkids. When I was in sports marketing
and working with baseball teams and stuff, I had kids come to me all
the time going, oh, Ilove baseball. I want a job,
and it's like, no, youdon't. No, if you love the

(02:30):
business of baseball, yeah, goget a job. If you love baseball,
sit in the stands. Right,same thing with golf man, It's
like, don't invent a new teajust so that you can quit your insurance
job. You won't be able toplay golf anymore. Exactly are you?
Are you doing instruction there as well? Yeah? I do all. Oh

(02:52):
gosh, I do all kinds ofthings related to golf now. I play
tournaments, competing and events. Igive exhibitions and clinics. I travel for
individual and corporate outings. I teachindividual and group lessons here and there.
I have my internet business. Iwrite, write books, film videos,

(03:15):
anything and everything way to the golfbasically. And when you get invited to
do these corporate outings is it's likewe're gonna hire Jacob Boden because we one
who have him hit the ball reallyfar for us. You're a long drive
guy, right, you love thelong drive thing. Uh. I got
into long drive by accident. Iguess I me personally, I prefer the

(03:39):
I guess the just the regular golfside of things that that speaks to me
more than than long drive. ButI did compete in long drive, uh
more more, I guess for fun. And I'm sorry, what was the
question? Why? Yeah? No, I mean when when someone's hiring you
for a corporate outing, a golfouting, what's the attraction to you?

(04:02):
Why are they hiring you? Whatdo you think to the game there?
I think, you don't know,this is really interesting. I wish I
could have a job jis like,hire me for corporate outing. I don't
know what I'm gonna do when Iget there, but this is good.
You know. It really depends onthe group in the or individual or whatever,

(04:25):
because there's a number of things.I think something. Some people are
kind of fascinated. I'm thirty sixnow, and when I was twenty seven,
I was a fourteen handicap. Sojust going from an average regular Joe
golfer to being a professional and along drive competitor, a lot of people
are just interested in that. Absolutely, So sometimes people want to know about

(04:49):
that. Other times it's for justdistance. People like watching other people hit
the ball far. And it wasn'tI wasn't a long hitter to start with.
So it was something that I learnedand trained how to do, so
people are interested in that. Oneof my more unique niches now is swing

(05:14):
speed training. Golf fitness has certainlybecome more popular in the last fifteen years
or so, but you can befit and not fast, and conversely,
you can be a little bit outof shape and absolutely just ripped the ball.
So I've put together some training programsfor people to increase their swing speed,

(05:39):
and I've got an instructional website forthat. So sometimes people This past
weekend I did a swing speed trainingclinic and exhibition for about eighty people in
a golf course. So sometimes it'sthat. And then also I was fortunate
enough to meet Mike Austin before hedied. And Mike Austin, for those

(06:01):
people who don't know, he hitthe Guinness record five hundred and fifteen yard
drive in nineteen seventy four in theUS National Senior Open. It wasn't in
Zuri, Switzerland on the ice.No, it was just a regular golf
course in Las Vegas. And hedid it with the old personmon wood steel

(06:27):
shafted driver blot a ball. Howmuch role did he get on that?
I mean, what was the carryon five hundred and fifteen yard drive.
I if I remember correctly, itwas a four hundred and fifty yard hole.
I don't. I don't recall.He overdrove the hole. Yeah,
he hit the ball. He overdrovea five hundred yard hole. It landed

(06:54):
the green downhill. Got to bedownhill, right, it's flat. Actually
it's desert rose in Las Vegas.You can still play it. Actually played
it last fall. And when youstepped up to the tee when you played
it, it's like, no,how can a guy in competition drive this
hole with the prison and driver?Yeah? Yeah, there is an element

(07:15):
to that. You sit there andlook at it, and I remember thinking
just that, sitting on the teabox and looking like, holy cow,
Like the green is way over there. And he hit it over the green
and he ended up bogeing in thehole, but I mean, still to
hit it drove it was just amazing. And apparently he played with this guy,

(07:36):
I think Chandler Chandler Harper, ifI remember correctly, he won the
PJA champions So he played with somegood players and had some witnesses for it,
and they said that he was hittingmultiple drives over four hundred that day,
so I guess it wasn't crazy thathe hit five point fifteen because he

(08:01):
was he had multiple drives over fourhundred that day, so, which is
really still amazing. Yeah. Well, I mean, and the guy was
probably you said that he died whenwe were speaking earlier. He died in
what two thousand and five? Uh, yeah, I'd have to check exactly.
Yeah, he was in his midnineties at the time, and soph
he hit this in nineteen seventy four. That means he was in his sixties.

(08:26):
Yeah, sixty four. He wassixty four years old and drove the
ball five hundred and fifteen yards.Yeah. Yeah, amazing, isn't it.
I'm glad you said that he hadsome witnesses because you know, personally,
I've driven the ball six hundred yardsbut nobody was there. Yeah right,
Yeah, that's a ticket six hundredYeah, to hit the ball all

(08:48):
the way to the second hole.Yeah yeah. Fortunately there were people there
to witness it, and the Guinnessis pretty strict about their verification of their
record, so they did whatever theyneeded to do to to verify it,
and sure enough, Wow, reallyamazing, isn't it. Yeah, it's

(09:13):
really amazing, and so you hadthe opportunity to work with him, study
him. You're just fascinated, You'reobsessed. What's the deal with and why
did you? Why are you?Isn't that you're late? You were you
were telling your latest product is aMic Costin type video. Yeah, I

(09:33):
just came out with a it's calledthe Mike Austin Swing with Jacob Boughton.
So it's a a Mike Costin Swinginstructional video. It's a downloadable video.
I first met him in two thousandand three, a couple of years before
he died. It was right whenI was when I was twenty seven,

(09:54):
I moved from the Midwest out toCalifornia to pursue a golf career and I'm
met Dan Shauger out there and hehe was a friend of Mike's. And
Dan took me under his swing andtaught me the basis for the Austin swing,
and he was the one that alsointroduced me to Mike. So I
got to go over to Mike's housea number of times, and Mike came

(10:18):
out to the range with us.I think, yeah, he came out
to the range with us once,and yeah, so I was I was
fortunate enough to be one of theones that got a chance to meet meet
with him and learn from them.And yeah, and and and I think

(10:41):
six months after I started working withDan uh And and had those those meetings
with Mike was I added sixty sixtyyards sixty three yards to my longest drive
and I won uh over or overperiod of time or that day? No,

(11:01):
no, no, I've gotten oneday. Yeah, sixty that day.
It took a month a month toadd sixty yards, which is still
amazing. Are you kidding me?Yeah, no, I'm not kidding.
Yeah, sixty sixty three yards ina month, and within six months that

(11:26):
was when I won that the twothousand and three Pinnacle Business Challenge. It
hit a three hundred and eighty oneyard drive on TV in front of a
nice crowd. So that was thatwas a lot of fun. Oh,
very cool. What you started tosay would probably be incredibly interesting to most

(11:50):
of the audience, and that isthat you started out as a fourteen handicap.
And I know too many golf smarterand recreational golfers that getting to a
fourteen handicap is a beautiful thing.It's like, Okay, I'm comfortable with
this game here, this is great, but then you took it over not

(12:11):
a tremendous amount of time, butyou got to scratch, right, Yes,
yes, I did and eventually turnedpro. And now I got some
tournament rounds and some cuts mades tournamentrounds in sixties and seventies. So it's
and I've gotten to play in tournamentsin the US, Europe, Asia,

(12:31):
Africa. This past winter I wentto Australia. So's it's really been an
incredible journey. That tell me aboutthe journey from fourteen to scratch. How
long did that take you? Andwhat do you think if you can tease
this apart and isolate something that madeyou that much better of a golfer,

(12:52):
besides practicing eight hours a day,right, I mean it's every single day.
Is there something that did that?For? Part of it certainly was
the extra practice. I was acomputer engineer before I started my little journey,
and I quit with you and livedoff my savings for a little bit
with the intention of seeing how goodI could get. And when I first

(13:16):
started, my best score was aseventy eight at the Walker course at Clemson
University, six over, and soI'd only broken eighty on a regular eighteen
hold golf course once, and thenwithin a month of I guess two months

(13:37):
of from when I started, Ishot my first round under par one under
on eighteen hole course. Wow.So some of it, yes, was
definitely just getting an opportunity to practicemore and get some repetitions in. But
then also I think that my workwith Dan Shauger in getting to learn that

(14:01):
Mike Austin swing was a tremendous,tremendous help for me. I started striking
the ball a lot better, alot more consistently. I picked up you
know, I picked up everything.I picked up distance, accuracy, consistency.
So you know, it's just it'sjust really amazing. Yeah. And

(14:22):
and so the Mike Austin method thatyou were introduced to is more than just
long distance, clearly. Yeah.Yeah, I mean it's it's accurate distance.
That's that's the amazing part, becausea lot of people can hit the
ball far, but they it's notnecessarily going to be straight right right,

(14:43):
Yes? Yeah, So I guessis there is there, like, can
you summarize it in the next twelveminutes? You know, I'm not gonna
give you a sense. I'll giveyou. I'll give you twelve minutes here,
But how do you combine consistently combinedistance and accuracy? Where did you
find the secret the way? Accuracywise? I think the thing that contributed

(15:09):
the most was that, Now,Mike taught a couple of different types of
hand actions, but the one thatI learned from from Dan and that Mike
was was also advocating for me,was one that uh where you don't rotate
the club face down through the hittingarea as much. You keep it more

(15:33):
square to U to your swing path, so there's there's less timing involved with
getting that the club fase square atthe moment of impact. So that that
that was I think the real bigkicker for accuracy by less timing involved.

(15:58):
I guess most popularly now, uh, the the golf instructors will have you
open the blade, open the clubface a little bit on the way back,
and then uh swing all the wayto the top and then come back
down and then roll the hands throughback to square and then roll them over

(16:19):
through impact. And when you usethat kind of hand action, the club
face is only square to your swingpath for just a split second, so
it it takes a good amount oftiming to do that, and it's certainly
easier if you're you know, ifyou're practicing and hitting a lot of balls

(16:42):
every day. But I got alot farther with keeping the club face more
square to the swing path, especiallydown through the hitting area. That that
really helped my accuracy a lot.And I have not more instructors adopted that
method, I mean, if itworks so well. For this was Mike

(17:02):
Austin, a PGA certified instructor,which I believe, I believe he I
believe he was, Yes, Ithink, I think I'd have to look
for sure, but I think hewas Southern California and PGA Instructor of the
Year one year or something like that. But he he was a little,
uh, a bit a bit brash, I guess with some people. So

(17:26):
he didn't he wasn't always tactful withthe way he would say things, so
I think he probably just rubbed somepeople the wrong way. And yeah,
well, I just finished reading theSteve Jobs book and he wasn't He wasn't
the most sensitive human being either,but he had a tremendous amount of success

(17:47):
and followers and devotees. I'm justwondering even though this guy could be brash
and rude and cocky. Perhaps hismethod was working, and you would think
that would be enough to get morethan just some guy in Zurich following him
right right. Well, I thinkit's a growing A growing leads into it's

(18:14):
a swing. Yeah, there's there'smore and more people that are doing it.
But also, you know, Iguess with with golf, when there's
a collective conscious golf conscious that you'regoing up against, and some people are
kind of stubborn that, well,this is the way it is, and
so they're kind of closed minded tonew thing, new or different things.

(18:40):
You know. I really don't knowwhy it hasn't h taken off. I
guess, you know, perhaps itwill in the near future. Here.
It certainly helped me and a lotof the people that I've worked with,
it's really helped them. Also,there's a buddy of mine that's playing on
the sun Shine Tour in South Africanow and he just switched over to that

(19:03):
and he's he's just playing. He'splaying really great now. He's hitting a
lot straight, a lot easier.It's I think we'll see some growth,
I guess with the number of peopleusing that kind of hand action. I
guess sure, sure, but soobviously not everyone's gonna be able to drive

(19:27):
the ball like Mike Austin did,and they may be able to increase their
distance somewhat, but distance is notwhat gets you close to the pin,
right, And I've said it multipletimes. I just love when Terry Kaylor
of score Golf said this, andwe even used it as the title of

(19:48):
the show is give me ten feetcloser over ten yards farther any day of
the week. Yeah, right,so true, just such a great line.
But what does he advocate? DoesMike and does Jacob advocate the same
keeping the club face square even onyour shorter game as well? Yes,

(20:12):
yes, so there's there's minimal,uh, club face rotation. I guess
there is still a little bit,a little bit, but it's it's dramatically
reduced, and it's the same samehand action with chipping or pitching or the
full swing. So and and isthat the focus of your instruction now?

(20:34):
Is is is the club face rotation? Lack of club face rotation? Well,
I guess I teach whatever people wantme to teach them. I guess
you know, there's please, there'sa lot of different swing styles at the

(21:02):
professional level that produce great results.And some things make better sense to other
people than other things, and somepeople do swing certain ways more naturally than
other ways. So I I guess, especially when I work with individuals,
I'm really personalize my golf instruction towhatever the goals of that specific person are,

(21:33):
whether you know whatever they are,and how much they're willing to practice,
how much they're willing to change allthose different things. And are there
are people that you're like when youstart working with them, you realize,
I'm not even going to go thatdirection with the with the club face scaring
that off. It's just doesn't workfor some people and it's not worth that

(21:53):
that focus and you go elsewhere withit, or do you always try to
incorporate that. It just it reallyjust depends on the person. So I
mean, if if yeah, itreally just depends on the person, I
might might try and keep it.If they're struggling with some accuracy and I
can see that they're really, uhdoing an exaggerated club face role, and

(22:21):
I'll say, oh, well,you know, why not try not to
roll it as much, try andkeep the club face a little bit straighter
down through the hitting area there andjust to kind of keep it simple and
yeah, so you know, itjust depends on the person. If people

(22:44):
wanted to find out more and seeit in action, I'm sure that you're
you have a number of YouTube videosas well to talk about that, because
I'm really curious to watch and seewhere it is that, you know,
in my swing, where that turnis and at what point it's square,
if at all, you know,and then the rotation through it. I'm

(23:06):
not necessarily saying that I can goahead and watch a YouTube video and figure
out how to do this on myown, but tell me about your latest
product and where I can see moreof that. Well. With the Mic
Austin instructional video in particular, that'son my swingman golf dot com website,

(23:27):
it's just a downloadable video. Yeah, so it's that aspect of how to
use your hands and forums and clubclub face. I guess it's definitely contained
in that. I also talk aboutit on the inside member portion of the

(23:48):
Swingman Golf website. I'm trying tothink if I have anything on the YouTube
channel. There maybe one video whereI talk about it, but I definitely
do have something on the swing Manside and the members on the member area

(24:08):
and then in this my costume instructionalvideo, tell me about your member area
and how we can get there,and can the golf smarter listeners get any
sort of gimme son helping you outto get through your site? Sure,
yeah, yeah something. The primaryniche I guess and focus of the member

(24:33):
aspect of the site is more focusingon swing speed training. So there's it's
it's quite easy actually to pick upten to fifteen miles an hour on your
driver swing speed in a month.And I've got the basic program that I
have in there, takes about fifteenminutes and need to do it twice a

(24:56):
week. It's not something you needto go to the golf of course.
For if you got room to swingyour swinger club, then that's that's all,
you know. I whenever I domy training, I just go out
to the backyard and do it outthere. So that was one of the
cool things about that becacident. Youknow, people work and people have their

(25:18):
families, so it's there's not alwaystime to go to the range and stuff.
So so that's that's one of thebig niches I guess about the member
side of the part member part ofthe site is uh swing speed training,
the programs and the just swing speedtraining one on one. I go into

(25:38):
anything and everything about training to increaseyour swing speed. Awesome because a lot
of people that is really important tothem and seeing how they can do that.
But with control, I mean,you know, increasing and again I
would say not only with control,but with less tension. And isn't that
a key element of increasing swing speedis not harder but having less tension.

(26:03):
Well, there's there's a maximum maximumswing speed that we all that each of
us has as a person at anygiven point. Uh, And then there's
a point I don't know, likea playing speed where you back off a
little bit to a point where youfeel like you can hit consistently and straight.
So the swing speed training you wework with the maximum speed to raise

(26:30):
your your body's ability to move faster. And then so when you raise your
maximum speed, your playing speed,your accuracy speed also goes up. So
it's it's it's a really cool thingin that way. Yeah, Hey,
listen, our Skype signal is gettinga little bit scratchy here, So I
want to be able to wrap thisup and have you talk a little bit

(26:52):
more about your member area of yoursite, what it costs, how to
get in, and details to getin touch with you. Yeah, it's
the member side is just a onetime fifty buck fifty dollars payment. Let
me just pay by PayPal or creditcard or whatever you want and then fill
in the form and it signs youup automatically and then access all the content.

(27:18):
I have a number of other productsthere on the side as well.
The Skype thing is really getting badright now, so tell me before you
go, because I don't want todrag this on. But if they put
in golf Smarter somewhere, can theyget a couple of bucks off the fifty
Is that possible? Huh yeah,yeah, I'll have Yeah, we can
figure something out absolutely well. No, and by the time the show,

(27:42):
between the time we've done this interviewand by the time we publish it,
which actually is going to be soon. So you think we can get that
set up in the next short amountof time. Yeah, sure, Okay,
So what kind of discount and ifthey just enter golf Smarter right,
they'll be able to get make theoffer. Right now, I'm going to

(28:03):
put you on the spot, dude. Well, it's how about yeah,
golf golf Smarter, I guess.And then what I'm really putting you on
the spot? Yeah right, I'mlooking at what's great is I'm looking at
you on this skype and you can'tsee me. I'm like, come on,

(28:25):
I've got my fist out, I'mholding a club my hand. Come
on, make it a good offer. You know you want people to come
from golf Smarter and see if thisworks for you. Come on, come
on, give you ten percent discount, right sure? Sure, okay,
all right, so it's now fortyfive dollars sold to the man in Zurich,
Switzerland. So if you enter golfSmart you can do it for forty

(28:45):
five bucks. I thank you forletting me put you on the spot.
There. We'll talk about the detailswhen we get off the get off the
line here in just a moment.But hey again, it's swingman golf dot
com. Increase your speed, increaseyour accuracy, and increase the amount of
time you or decrease the amount oftime you're on the golf course. I

(29:07):
guess is with that increase right?Uh yeah, just well for the swing
speed training, Yeah, you don'tneed to have the golf course to do
it well. No, just thefact that your game is gonna be you
know, you're gonna take less shots, You're gonna be out there less amount
of time because your score is gonnago down. Yeah. Yeah, I
made the leap. Apparently I confusedyou with that, Jacob. It was

(29:30):
great to talk to you again,man. Yeah. Yeah, good talking.
And we'll get you back on becauseI really want to talk more about
how we can get to the swingspeed training and the more accuracy and more
distance. Okay, yeah, soundsgood. All right, buddy, it's
great to talk to you. Bestof luck, and we'll talk to Okay,

(29:52):
sounds good.