Join Chris Enroth and Ken Johnson, horticulture educators with University of Illinois Extension, as they dive into the most pressing spring gardening questions. From getting seedlings ready for the great outdoors to how to water those newly planted Arbor Day trees and more, we've got some timely tips for the spring garden.
Watch us on YouTube https://youtu.be/ymjesr8Z24E
Skip to what you want to know:
00:56 Hey Ken!
01:29 How do I prepare my seedlings for planting outside? What does it mean to harden them off?
03:48 What if the garden isn't ready for planting, but our plants are outgrowing their pots?
06:20 How do I water my newly planted trees from Arbor Day? Specifically, Canadian hemlock.
10:45 Small caterpillars are eating all the needles off my Mugo pine! What are they, and how do I stop them?
14:31 Why are my blackberries dying back? It seems like the frost keeps killing them.
21:02 What do you do about a bumblebee nest near your front door?
24:03 Xerces Society moving bumblebee nest https://xerces.org/bumble-bees/nesting-overwintering
25:34 Illinois State Beekeepers Association https://www.ilsba.com/contact.html
25:58 Swarmed Website https://beeswarmed.org/
26:30 The difference between a bumblebee and a yellow jacket wasp
27:06 Rabbits are eating my arborvitae. What can I spray to stop them?
31:07 So long and thank you!
31:44 But wait, there's more! How do you tell the difference between a caterpillar and a sawfly?
Contact us!
Chris Enroth: cenroth@illinois.edu
Ken Johnson: kjohnso@illinois.edu
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Chris (00:06):
Welcome to the Good Growing podcast. I am Chris
Enroth, horticulture educatorwith University of Illinois
Extension coming at you from MacComb, Illinois, and we have got
a great show for you today.Well, my inbox, phone, all of
it's filling up, ringing off thehook. It has been a busy couple
weeks here as we kick off themonth of May in 2025. So we're
(00:28):
gonna talk about springgardening questions that are
coming into my office, Ken'soffice.
And, of course, you know I'm notdoing this by myself because I
have already mentioned his name,so he is here waiting for me to
introduce him. How long can Iprolong this? Well, we'll see.
No no more no more not muchlonger. So here we go.
Ken Johnson, horticultureeducator with U of I Extension
(00:50):
in Jacksonville, happily justwaiting for me to stop talking
so he can say hello. Hey, Ken.
Ken (00:58):
Hello, Chris. That was a that was that was a good intro.
Chris (01:02):
We'll cut most of that out. Just reuse an intro from a
previous episode.
Ken (01:10):
Make sure we're wearing the same clothes.
Chris (01:12):
Yes. We'll have to do that. Well, Ken, this week, we
are talking spring gardeningquestions, things that are
occurring outside in people'syards. They call us wanting to
know what the problem is and arethere any solutions to these
problems. So we're gonna kickthis off.
My first question to you isabout something that I've been
(01:35):
doing, I'm doing right now. Icall it the plant shuffle. But
it is, this question is, I keephearing about hardening off
plants. What is it and why arewe making our plants harder?
Ken (01:52):
Yes. So hardening off is if you're starting your plants,
indoors, we're taking themoutside and introducing them to
outdoor conditions. Becauseinside, no matter how good your
your lights are for your plants,it's not gonna be as intense as
the sun. Typically, we've got alot more air movement outdoors
even if you got a fan on there.It's kinda hard to simulate the
(02:14):
the wind and the breeze we'regonna have outdoors.
And just those outdoorconditions, you can't really
simulate that inside. So we'rebringing these seedlings
outdoors and slowlyreintroducing them to those
typically full sun conditions,you know, we're talking like a
vegetable garden, something likethat. What I do is my front
porch is on the north side of myhouse, but there's a little bit
(02:35):
on the east side, they get someearly morning sun. So I start
off, put them out there, so theyget that early morning sun and
then they're in the shade forthe rest of the day. They'll be
out there a couple days,sometimes a week, depending on
how busy my schedule gets andwhen I can get around to it.
But then I will slowly take themout to our back deck, which is
south facing, and slowly movethem out because we've got a
(02:58):
little covering to our backdoor. So we get a few hours of
that really full sun, middaysun, slowly move them out until
I've got them out full sun allday and night. Get them hard
enough so that when they're,those those leaves will be a
little bit thicker, so notgetting burned and stuff as you
slowly introduce. So if you justtake them straight from outside
(03:20):
or straight from inside, plantthem in the ground, there's a
good chance your plants aregoing to get burned up because
you're just not used to that sunintensity. Slowly doing that
over time.
Now if you're buying transplantsfrom a garden center or a box
store, more than likely thoseare already hardened off and
that's not something, you you'regoing to need to worry about,
but it may be worth asking. ButI've never had an issue with
(03:42):
with stuff I've gotten fromnursery or box store needing to
be hardened off. This is more ifyou're starting seeds at home.
Chris (03:49):
So that I'll just say a follow-up question here. You
know, a friend wants to know,hey. What if I'm not ready to
plant outside, but my plants areoutgrowing their pots? What can
I do right now?
Ken (04:03):
Well, ideally, we would we would pot them up into a bigger
if you got the cell packs into abigger one into small pots. So
they're not getting a real rootpound and they'll be able to
fill in that new container andstuff. So ideally that's what we
do, but I will say my plantsright now are still in their
little cell packs, and they're Iam watering daily, if not twice
(04:25):
a day, because they're they'revery root bound. So I either
need to get them in the groundor pot them up, and I really
don't want to pot them up. So Ineed to get my act together and
get them in the ground.
Chris (04:37):
Yeah. Well, I have found out that a lot of our seed
starting mix that I've I've usedthis year is formulated. It's a
little bit finer texture for forseed starting, and they don't
contain as much of that slowrelease fertilizer in it as say,
like, a regular potting mix. Youknow, on a regular potting mix,
(04:57):
might see on the bag, like, sixmonths of plant food, you know,
marketed on there. But that'snot necessarily the goal with
seed starting.
We're not trying to feed theseplants long term. We're just
trying to get them germinatedand, you know, off on the right
route and then outside in theground somewhere. And so I've
I've found after about a monthand a half, I think I might be
(05:20):
out of fertility with some of myseed starting mix because
everything's starting to look alittle puny that has been going
inside for a long time.
Ken (05:28):
Yeah. Some of my stuff's looking all getting a little
yellow. I need to get some somefertilizer or get them in the
ground.
Chris (05:36):
Yeah. Yeah. I do have like just kind of a basic liquid
feed that I might bottom waterwith in some cases. So that's
what I do on inside is I bottomwater and then I take them
outside and I water overhead andthe the plants like you said,
they're so weak and they'rethey're not quite ready for all
(05:56):
of that water on top of them.They just fall right over.
But they perk back up once theyget get more acclimated.
Ken (06:04):
Toughen them up. Tough love. Yes.
Chris (06:07):
Tough love plants. That's how you get them good garden
vegetables. You get them toughlove.
Ken (06:14):
Yes. Or they or they die.
Chris (06:17):
Or they just die. You go to the store and buy more.
Ken (06:20):
Alright. Our our next question is, I just planted a
Canadian hemlock. How do I waterit?
Chris (06:29):
Well, that is a great question. So I got this this one
online, and it it so Canadianhemlock is the species of Suga
canadensis. It is an evergreentree, and it's a little
sensitive. I I really this isprobably one of my favorite
evergreens out there. Butbecause it is a sort of a a
(06:52):
sensitive tree, you need to haveit really in the right spot.
You have to protect it fromwind, like this really drying
wind, know, like an Easterlyexposure is good, you know,
morning sun, a little bit ofafternoon shade, know, or maybe
sort of in the understory of alarger shade tree that will help
(07:13):
this plant establish and thenmaybe thrive up into maturity
where then you don't have tobaby it as much. But they're
very specific in their siteconditions. And so I guess first
off, you know, what what I hadrecommended this person is,
well, yeah, I get it's alreadyin the ground, but, you know,
let's double check, making sureyou didn't put this in the in
the middle of a full blazing sunyard, you know, southern
(07:35):
exposure to the prevailing windsout of the Northwest, that that
probably is not gonna be thebest spot for a Canadian hemlock
tree. So moving past that, youknow, it's been Arbor Day, lots
of trees have gone on theground, a lot of folks ask,
well, how do I now water mytrees? In Illinois, for the most
(07:58):
part, we have sort of a loamyclay soil.
I know some of you lucky folkslike over in Mason County have
all sand. But it how you wateryour trees or how often is
really dictated by your soiltype or texture, you know, is if
it's more sandy, it's gonnadrain faster, you're gonna have
to water more. If it's moreclay, it's gonna drain slower,
(08:22):
you're probably gonna have towater less often. However, with
that clay soil, it it is harderfor that water to to kind of
penetrate or infiltrate intothat clay structure. So taking a
hose full blast on that spotisn't necessarily going to give
you the best absorption of thatwater into the soil.
It's just gonna run off in manycases. So that's why we
(08:44):
typically recommend get yourhose, set it to like a a drip
drip drip or maybe a slighttrickle. Set it down to where
you planted that tree and thenyou let that drip very slowly so
that, you know, in that claysoil it can be absorbed and then
fifteen, twenty minutes later,move it to another side of the
tree, let it drip drip dripuntil basically all around that
(09:08):
tree you've saturated that thatsoil. Well, not saturated, but
you know, you've given it a gooddeep drink. You know, that could
take upwards of an hour, maybe alittle bit more.
Again, all depends on soil type.And so, yeah, and do this all
summer long. So keep an eye onsoil moisture, touch that that
(09:28):
the soil with your fingers. Ifit's dry, feels dry, looks dry,
it's time to water. And it cantake up to three years for a
tree to become established in inthe the native soil there.
So you got to keep an eye onthings. And the other thing with
the the hemlock is because it ismore sensitive to drought and
(09:49):
and drying wind, intensesunlight, if you're five years
down the line and we encounter asummer drought here in Illinois,
that would be the tree that Iwould water first. Just because
of knowing that it's moresensitive to that. And you know
what you can do, Ken, to helpyou in all of this? You can lay
(10:10):
down a nice thick layer of woodchips or or mulch to help
insulate that soil so you don'thave to water all the time.
Ken (10:18):
Organic mulch. Yes. Once a living mulch. Yeah. Not
necessarily organic organic.
But
Chris (10:24):
Right. Don't put rocks down with with hemlock. It's
that's probably not going to bean ideal mulch for that one,
especially if you're in asunnier exposure where the rocks
heat up and it create thatlittle microclimate there around
that tree. So, yeah, justsomething that could decompose
and organic matter back to thesoil. Alright, Ken.
(10:46):
Well, let's stick on the themeof evergreen. So this next
question is, I've got three Mugopines infested with about half
inch long caterpillars, andthey're eating all the needles
off the plants. Any idea how Ican get rid of them?
Ken (11:05):
Yes. So these, in this case, these were the European or
red headed pine sawfly. Iusually see this European, but
some places referred to as redheaded pine sawfly. So this is a
caterpillar like insect. It'sactually a saw so sawflies are
related to wasps, whereascaterpillars will turn into
(11:25):
butterflies or moths.
And that'll be important when weget to the management here. But
for this one, this is kind of ait's got a caterpillar like,
it's got a blackhead, kind ofgray green body, white stripes
on it. And they are hatching inthe spring. They're feeding on
needles when they're reallyyoung. Their mouths aren't big
enough to eat the whole needle,they're just kind of scraping
off the surface, needles willturn brown and die.
(11:47):
As they get bigger, they willeat entire needles from the tip
to the base and they'regregarious, so they're feeding
in groups. You have 10, you havetwenty, thirty plus, of these
sawfly larvae feeding together.They'll kind of strip a branch
and move on to the next one.Typically they're feeding on the
older needles, so the newgrowth, a lot of times isn't out
(12:07):
yet when they're feeding, sothey may strip a branch, but
then eventually that new growthis going to come out, you get
your, kind of your Charlie Brownlooking Christmas tree where you
just have the, you know, tuftsat the end and everything else
has been stripped off. So Iguess, fortunately, because they
still have that new growth, youknow, the plants aren't going to
(12:28):
be killed necessarily.
Now this happens year after yearafter year, it's going to weaken
the plants and stuff, buttypically they're going recover
the aesthetics, they're going tolook pretty bad potentially if
you're losing a lot of theseolder needles. But the tree is
typically going to be okay.They'll feed for a month, month
and a half or so, then they'llpupate, they'll drop to the
ground typically, pupate in theground or near the tree itself.
(12:52):
And then the adults are going toemerge September into the fall.
Females are going to lay eggs inthe needles and they kind of
look like yellow pimples almoston the needles.
So it's kind of hard to see, butif you've had them in the past,
maybe something worthwhile to goinspect your plants and if you
see those, just remove thoseneedles, eliminate the problem,
(13:13):
right off the bat. One does cometo management, so one is going
out and scouting, in the fall tosee if you have any egg laying.
If you have the larvae on yourplants now, like most of the
things, it's easier to controlthem when they are small. Once
they get bigger, it gets alittle more difficult to manage
them. And because they are notcaterpillars, things like BTK,
(13:35):
bacillus thuringiensis,frestachiae, Dipel would be one
common trade name, does not workon them.
That only works on caterpillars.So you could, you know, douse
all your Mugle Pines with that.It's not going do any good
because they're notcaterpillars, it's not going to
affect them. So things likeactive variants of Acefate,
Azadactrim, Bifenthrin,Carbaryl, Permethrin, Spinosad
(14:00):
are some things that you canuse. But again, the younger they
are, the smaller they are, theeasier it is to control them.
Once they get real big, it'sit's it's not going to be as
effective. So you can go in andbe looking at going and hand
picking, smashing them. I'dprobably wear gloves if you're
going to smash them, becauseit's going to make a mess. But
(14:22):
then looking for and thenscouting for them in the fall so
they're not hatching out, andand defoliating your plants
again. Alright.
We'll keep on the, the insectpests here. So our our next
question is, why do myblackberries keep dying back? Is
the frost killing them? I guessit kind of gave away the answer
(14:43):
there.
Chris (14:44):
Well, it it kind of. Yes. In a way, this was an
interesting phone call that Igot from someone. So we didn't
have any photos. This person,you know, didn't wanna send
pictures in or anything.
So it was all based on verbaldescriptions coming through the
telephone. And, it was quite theCSI, the plant CSI. And so, you
(15:11):
know, insert, you know, wittypun here as I put my sunglasses
on and walk away. If only Icould wear sunglasses over my
glasses. But so the caller, hehe he asked about his
blackberries that he hadpurchased, I think, about two
years ago, 2023, he had had themplanted.
(15:33):
These were triple crownblackberries that he had bought
online, had them shipped in, andhe had three of them delivered.
Two of the three seemed tostruggle sort of that that
second year that he had them.The third one seemed to be doing
okay. And then this year,noticing that, again, the third
(15:53):
one doing alright, not growingas vigorously as he had thought,
but the other two are just itseemed like every time it would
frost that the canes would justdie back to the ground. And so,
you know, those very interestingso I'm like, alright.
Well, how frost tolerant aretriple crown blackberry? You
know, was trying to think, maybewe just got a a bad batch of
(16:15):
blackberries. And so lookingmore into this, I said, well,
well, do you see any lesions oranything on the the canes of the
particular plants? He said, oh,yeah. There are these swollen
areas along the canes.
And so I'm like, well, let'sinvestigate this a little bit
further. So these swollen areasturned out to be the the kind of
(16:37):
the the feeding damage of a caneborer. And cane borers, there's
many different species outthere. The one we sort of landed
on was the red necked cane boar.And the red necked cane boar is
a beetle.
And it's, you know, you know,imagine emerald ash borer in
your head, except for beinggreen and glossy. This is a
(16:59):
mostly black slender beetle witha little red band on the back of
its neck. And so hence the nameredneck boar. And so what this
does is female, she will lay hereggs on the lower part of a
blackberry cane. She then coversthat in like kind of a goo or
(17:24):
slime that then hardens andprotects her eggs.
So as the eggs hatched, heryoung are never exposed to the
outer elements, so it's reallyhard to to spray anything in
regard to to controlling theseparticular insects. So they bore
directly into the cane. Theykind of do like a little
corkscrew thing. Most of thetime, they will then proceed up
(17:46):
the cane. Sometimes, they willgo down the cane.
From what I read, you know, ifthey go up, they can go upwards
of 25. Inches. If they go down,normally, they only go down
about six inches. So if you'rescouting for these, best thing
to do is to take your suspectedcane that you think is infested
(18:07):
and split it open, you know,farther up than farther down,
but you want to split it openand try to find that larva in
there. Be like a kind of aprobably a whitish grub like
looking larva.
And that is one of the maincontrols also is just removing
those infested canes beforereally we see the buds begin to
(18:31):
swell in the early springtime.So looking for these swellings
or galls on the canes, cut belowthat, and and if you cut and you
notice that there's like a holein the middle of that cane,
might want to investigate alittle bit deeper down, make
sure that you actually got thatparticular larva out of there.
(18:52):
Once you cut them, burn them,get them off-site as best you
can, and then there are a fewthresholds that I found. So if
folks have large blackberrypatches and and maybe they they
aren't able to prune it all out,if you prune it all out, you
might remove all yourblackberries. The thresholds
(19:13):
that I saw varied from 10 tofive to 15%.
So if you had that much of yourcanes infested with these,
that's the threshold forspraying something. And so
because they're they're fairlyprotected, what this is would be
a contact insecticide that I Isuppose when the female lands to
(19:34):
lay her eggs might affect her.But something like carburol was
listed, malthion was listed, oresfenlorate. Is that how you say
that one,
Ken (19:43):
Ken? Esfenvalerate.
Chris (19:45):
Esfenvalerate. Yes. Alright. Something like that.
Put the text right here.
You can read it if you'rewatching us on YouTube. So so,
yeah, it it can be prettydifficult to control. Some of
the sources did say like, hey,within a year, these populations
of insects can explode toinfest, you know, fifth 50% of
(20:06):
your canes. So that that is thepossibility. But there are also
a lot of beneficial predatorsthat will go after these red
headed cane bores.
So they the beneficial predatorscan control up to 75% of a
population in a given year. Thatstill leaves about twenty five
percent to carry on. And sosomething just to be mindful of
(20:30):
if you do, you know, opt forsomething like malathion or
another insecticide that thereare also beneficial insects
going after these guys, so justbeing mindful of your spraying.
When you're spraying those, alsodirect your application to the
like, the bottom half, maybebottom third of the canes as
(20:52):
that's where egg layingtypically happens for these
guys. And they do overwinter inthem, so that's why we want to
to rogue out these infestedcanes before bud break.
Alright, Ken. Our next questiongoes comes from someone who
noticed a bumblebee flying intoa hole in the ground near their
(21:13):
front door. Is it possible thatthey do not have a nest there
yet and they can just cover upthat hole, or is there a nest
already in process of beingbuilt in this location?
Ken (21:28):
Yeah. I would say probably at this point in the year, early
May, there's probably already anest established here. This was
earlier in the year. You know,it could be a a queen bee. So
the bumblebees, they willoverwinter as mated queens, and
they will go out and start a newcolony every year.
So those colonies are annual.They don't, they're not like
honeybees where they'recontinuing on and on. They're
(21:49):
not perennial. So they will goout and scout for places. By
this point in the year, theyprobably find an area they like
and they're establishing a nest.
So bumblebees are nesting inpreexisting cavities. They are
not going to excavate their ownnests. Abandoned rodent burrows,
it could be, a birdhouse,bunches of base of bunch
(22:11):
grasses, all kinds of cavityareas, compost. I've heard of
them being in there as well. Soat this point, you know, they're
they're prob she's probablyestablished that nest.
She's going back and forthcollecting nectar and pollen,
feeding her young. And then asthose their offspring start
emerging and hatching anddeveloping, then the workers are
(22:31):
going go out and do all thatwork and the queen will stay in
there. So in this case, youknow, if it's right by the front
door, if it's not too close, youput some signage up saying, you
know, bumble bees here. Becareful. Put up a barrier around
there so people aren't gonnaaccidentally step on it.
Something like that. You youcould plug the hole. I I doubt
(22:54):
they're gonna crawl. I'm notsure how well they'd be able to
dig their way out of that. Sothat that could potentially be a
a death sentence to them.
But if it if it's somewhere likea front door and people are
gonna be risk and they'regetting stung, then obviously we
have to do something about it.Can say generally speaking,
they're they're probably notgoing to be as defensive as like
(23:14):
a yellow jacket or somethinglike that, but they are still
going to defend their nests ifthey feel threatened. So you
can't just go tromping on top ofit and and not expect to get
stung. So depending on how faraway it is and and stuff, you
may be able to leave it. They'reonly going to be there for a
year.
If get a few hard frosts, thatcolony is going to die out and
(23:34):
there won't be one there nextyear. Some people will try to
relocate nests. The problem withthey're in the ground, you don't
know where exactly that nest is,how far that tunnel is going. So
it makes it really difficult, torelocate ones in ground. You
know, if it's above ground,garbage can, bird house,
something like that, that thatthose are little bit easier to
(23:57):
move because you can find that,if you are going to move it,
Xerxes Society has someinformation on how you can do
that.
But basically, you're gonna bedoing this at night, because all
the the bees are gonna be backin the nest. They're gonna be
less active, and you're you'recovering yourself because they
can't sting. They will defendthemselves, and moving that to a
(24:18):
to a new location. So a lot oftimes you're putting that in a
cardboard box, plastic bin, sothey're not escaping while you
transport it, to the the newlocation. There are plans online
that you can look for, likebumblebee boxes where you're
building a wooden box.
A lot of times you're putting inpet hair, things like that. Some
(24:40):
kind of soft stuff that they'llbuild their nest on and stuff.
That can be an option as well.And when you're moving that
nest, you're moving the nest andall that, the debris and whatnot
that they've built that nest onas well. Again, in the ground,
signage, coordinate off sopeople can get on top of it.
(25:03):
But if it's still, you know,more of a risk than you're
willing to take, that may be a akill or attempt to move it. And
if you're attempting to move itand you're not comfortable, then
maybe looking for, beekeepers inyour area. Typically, they're
dealing with honeybees, but youmay find somebody that would be
willing to try bumblebees. Idon't I don't know how many
people there are, but that wouldbe a contact your local
(25:25):
beekeeping association. Ifyou're not sure where if you
have one or where that would be,Illinois State Beekeepers
Association has a list of alltheir their member associations
on their website that you couldlook up.
Chris (25:37):
Yeah. Our our local beekeeping association, they
when I call them asking about aa honeybee swarm or something
that's been found in someone'syard or maybe, I don't know,
potentially a bumblebee nest,they always refer me to a
website. It's calledbeeswarmed.org. I think the the
(26:01):
website, like, the page name iscalled swarmed. Basically, you
report a swarm, and if you havea beekeeper nearby that is
registered on the site that iswilling to come out and collect
that swarm, they will they willdo so.
So something to be mindful of.If you are a beekeeper that's
looking for wild swarms in yourarea and you're not part of this
website, might be worth gettingin touch and and registering
(26:24):
because that's this is what myassociation that's what they're
referring people to now. And I'mI'm glad you distinguish between
bumblebees and yellow jackets,Ken, because I have been with
people that use that terminterchangeably.
Ken (26:38):
Yes. Yeah. Bumblebees are gonna be big and fuzzy. Yellow
jackets are they've got hair,but they're smooth and shiny
looking for the most part. Therethere is, and even bumblebees
and carpenter bees are differenttoo.
Carpenter bees, the abdomen isgoing be a little more shiny,
they're bigger and they'renesting in wood And they will
(26:59):
excavate their own nests, inwood, whereas bumblebees are in
cavities and somebody's alreadydone the work for them. Alright.
Last question we've got fortoday is rabbits have been
eating the bottoms of myarborvitae. What can I spray to
stop them?
Chris (27:17):
Oh, rascally rabbits are going after the arborvitae. This
was a question where they hadalso followed up and said, I
know I don't have deer. And Isaid, oh, no, you don't, but you
do have rabbits. And so the thedamage was pretty telltale. I
mean, was uniform acrossmultiple shrubs and it was at
(27:40):
like a foot, foot and a halfheight, you know, basically what
a rabbit could reach.
And so it was something that wasfairly easy to diagnose. Again,
that uniformity across multipleshrubs was that kind of telltale
giveaway and then that thatreally again, another uniform,
(28:02):
like, point of damage acrossthem. So their rabbits will go
after arborvitae. They'll eat itin the winter. They'll eat that
especially that soft, you know,flush of growth in the
springtime.
The other thing to be mindfulof, you know, as I was talking
about control recommendationsalso with this person was they
(28:24):
lived up in Northern Illinois. Isaid, well, if you you get more
snow than we do, a rabbit willperch upon the snow. And and if
they can get a little higher,they will. So depending on your
snow level, your controlrecommendations might need to go
a little higher up on the shrubitself. And what are those
recommendations?
The best thing we can do is sometype of physical exclusion.
(28:47):
Rabbits, they they do not havethumbs that I know of that are
opposable that would allow themto operate like pliers or a
hammer. You know, they don'thave bolt cutters. So, you know,
anything you can construct,whether it be made of, like, you
know, a a chicken wire or ahardware mesh cloth or even like
(29:10):
a plastic snow fencing or guardwould be enough to keep a rabbit
from eating at the base of yourshrubs. You would install those
usually in the fall and letthose then, you know, go
throughout winter.
Again, making sure whateverguard it is would be tall enough
to prevent a rabbit from, like,hopping on top of the snow and
(29:32):
then eating, you know, not justlike jumping over your guard.
And so just making sure it'stall enough for whatever kind of
snow conditions that you have inthe winter. And then in terms of
sprays, there are repellentsthat you might be able to use.
Most of them are well, guessthere's there's two different
types of repellents. There'sthere's ones that smell bad, and
(29:54):
there's ones that taste bad.
And the key thing with either ofthese is that they don't last
very long. So you have toreapply them, and wildlife get
acclimated to these scents orthese flavors. And if you're
hungry enough, they're gonna goafter it. So I would not rely
(30:19):
solely on repellents. Physicalbarriers or some type of
exclusion tactic is going to bethe way to go.
Get a dog. Yes. Get a get a dogthat will frequent that area in
the winter.
Ken (30:42):
So hopefully when you put your fence up, you're not don't
have a rabbit nest under there.Rabbit tunnel. Oh. And trapping
them in there.
Chris (30:48):
Great point. Yes. Yeah. Oh, rabbits, they can tunnel. So
you do wanna go a few inchesinto like the mulch or the soil,
you know, so go down a littlebit to prevent their tunneling.
And, yeah, reach in there. I'msure there's dead leaves and
twigs and things. Pull outstuff. Make sure you're not
trapping them in there. Well,that was a lot of great
(31:09):
information about springquestions.
Things are are going on thistime of year. People calling us
about wanting to know moreinformation, whether it's a
problem or just kind ofcuriosity that they have. So
that's what extension is here todo. Well, the Good Growing
podcast is a production ofUniversity of Illinois
Extension, edited this week byme, Chris Enroth. Hey, Ken.
(31:31):
Thanks for hanging out with metoday and answering some of
these questions that we've beengetting these last few weeks.
Ken (31:38):
Yes. Thank you. I and I realized sorry right now, this
is gonna make your editing apain potentially, that I didn't
say how you tell the differencebetween a caterpillar and a
sawfly. If you see
Chris (31:50):
Oh, no. Let's cut this in real quick, folks.
Ken (31:53):
So sawflies are gonna have, six or mere pair six or more
pairs of pro legs, and those arethose, like, fleshy outgrowths
on the the back end of acaterpillar sawfly that look
like legs and aren't reallylegs, Whereas caterpillars have
five or fewer. So sawflies, youcan spell out sawfly when you're
counting pro legs, that's asawfly. They also don't have
(32:16):
crochets, which are like littlehooks on the bottom of the Pro
Legs that caterpillars have.Sawflies don't. So my apologies.
Chris (32:27):
And now you know the difference between caterpillars
and sawflies. Dogwood sawfliesare another ones that seem to
pop up too. So those are kind offun to see and terrifying
because I love my dogwoods.
Ken (32:39):
No, sir. Rose slugs. Those are all sawflies. Yep.
Chris (32:45):
Yeah. You never see the rose slug, it seems like. It's
always get the call after thefact, like, do I do now? Like,
well, nothing. It's too late.
Ken (32:51):
It's gone. It's done. It's gone.
Chris (32:53):
We're done for the year. So there is an invasive rose
slug though. Think I heard Iread it on the Joe Boggs blog.
Ken (33:01):
Yeah. There's a couple different species you can get.
Chris (33:04):
Yeah. Well, now we're getting into more stuff, Ken. We
gotta cut it off right here.It's the end of the show, folks.
No more information until nextweek.
Ken (33:12):
Alright. Speaking of next week, let's do this again next
week.
Chris (33:15):
We'll give them more information next week. So that's
what's gonna happen. That's thethat's our format of our show.
That's what we do here. So yes,we will be coming back at you
again with more horticulturalhijinks next week.
I think it's gonna be a gardenbite. Got a busy week, couple
weeks coming up. So yeah, we'regonna be all over the place.
Different events, programs hereand there. Growing stuff, it's
(33:37):
gonna be it's it's summeralready.
I'll just say it right now. May6 is when we're recording.
Welcome to summertime. Oh.Listeners, thank you for doing
what you do best and that islistening or if you're watching
us on YouTube watching.
And as always, keep on growing.
Ken (34:08):
I may take it out. I'll save it for your retirement.
Chris (34:10):
Thank you.
Ken (34:11):
Retirement party.
Chris (34:13):
I'm having my walker. I'm 88 years old. Remember when you
could do this? Yep. When I couldlay down on the ground and get
up.
And people weren't concerned.
Welcome to the Good Growing podcast. I am Chris
Enroth, horticulture educatorwith University of Illinois
Extension coming at you from MacComb, Illinois, and we have got
a great show for you today.Well, my inbox, phone, all of
it's filling up, ringing off thehook. It has been a busy couple
weeks here as we kick off themonth of May in 2025. So we're
(00:28):
gonna talk about springgardening questions that are
coming into my office, Ken'soffice.
And, of course, you know I'm notdoing this by myself because I
have already mentioned his name,so he is here waiting for me to
introduce him. How long can Iprolong this? Well, we'll see.
No no more no more not muchlonger. So here we go.
Ken Johnson, horticultureeducator with U of I Extension
(00:50):
in Jacksonville, happily justwaiting for me to stop talking
so he can say hello. Hey, Ken.
Ken (00:58):
Hello, Chris. That was a that was that was a good intro.
Chris (01:02):
We'll cut most of that out. Just reuse an intro from a
previous episode.
Ken (01:10):
Make sure we're wearing the same clothes.
Chris (01:12):
Yes. We'll have to do that. Well, Ken, this week, we
are talking spring gardeningquestions, things that are
occurring outside in people'syards. They call us wanting to
know what the problem is and arethere any solutions to these
problems. So we're gonna kickthis off.
My first question to you isabout something that I've been
(01:35):
doing, I'm doing right now. Icall it the plant shuffle. But
it is, this question is, I keephearing about hardening off
plants. What is it and why arewe making our plants harder?
Ken (01:52):
Yes. So hardening off is if you're starting your plants,
indoors, we're taking themoutside and introducing them to
outdoor conditions. Becauseinside, no matter how good your
your lights are for your plants,it's not gonna be as intense as
the sun. Typically, we've got alot more air movement outdoors
even if you got a fan on there.It's kinda hard to simulate the
(02:14):
the wind and the breeze we'regonna have outdoors.
And just those outdoorconditions, you can't really
simulate that inside. So we'rebringing these seedlings
outdoors and slowlyreintroducing them to those
typically full sun conditions,you know, we're talking like a
vegetable garden, something likethat. What I do is my front
porch is on the north side of myhouse, but there's a little bit
(02:35):
on the east side, they get someearly morning sun. So I start
off, put them out there, so theyget that early morning sun and
then they're in the shade forthe rest of the day. They'll be
out there a couple days,sometimes a week, depending on
how busy my schedule gets andwhen I can get around to it.
But then I will slowly take themout to our back deck, which is
south facing, and slowly movethem out because we've got a
(02:58):
little covering to our backdoor. So we get a few hours of
that really full sun, middaysun, slowly move them out until
I've got them out full sun allday and night. Get them hard
enough so that when they're,those those leaves will be a
little bit thicker, so notgetting burned and stuff as you
slowly introduce. So if you justtake them straight from outside
(03:20):
or straight from inside, plantthem in the ground, there's a
good chance your plants aregoing to get burned up because
you're just not used to that sunintensity. Slowly doing that
over time.
Now if you're buying transplantsfrom a garden center or a box
store, more than likely thoseare already hardened off and
that's not something, you you'regoing to need to worry about,
but it may be worth asking. ButI've never had an issue with
(03:42):
with stuff I've gotten fromnursery or box store needing to
be hardened off. This is more ifyou're starting seeds at home.
Chris (03:49):
So that I'll just say a follow-up question here. You
know, a friend wants to know,hey. What if I'm not ready to
plant outside, but my plants areoutgrowing their pots? What can
I do right now?
Ken (04:03):
Well, ideally, we would we would pot them up into a bigger
if you got the cell packs into abigger one into small pots. So
they're not getting a real rootpound and they'll be able to
fill in that new container andstuff. So ideally that's what we
do, but I will say my plantsright now are still in their
little cell packs, and they're Iam watering daily, if not twice
(04:25):
a day, because they're they'revery root bound. So I either
need to get them in the groundor pot them up, and I really
don't want to pot them up. So Ineed to get my act together and
get them in the ground.
Chris (04:37):
Yeah. Well, I have found out that a lot of our seed
starting mix that I've I've usedthis year is formulated. It's a
little bit finer texture for forseed starting, and they don't
contain as much of that slowrelease fertilizer in it as say,
like, a regular potting mix. Youknow, on a regular potting mix,
(04:57):
might see on the bag, like, sixmonths of plant food, you know,
marketed on there. But that'snot necessarily the goal with
seed starting.
We're not trying to feed theseplants long term. We're just
trying to get them germinatedand, you know, off on the right
route and then outside in theground somewhere. And so I've
I've found after about a monthand a half, I think I might be
(05:20):
out of fertility with some of myseed starting mix because
everything's starting to look alittle puny that has been going
inside for a long time.
Ken (05:28):
Yeah. Some of my stuff's looking all getting a little
yellow. I need to get some somefertilizer or get them in the
ground.
Chris (05:36):
Yeah. Yeah. I do have like just kind of a basic liquid
feed that I might bottom waterwith in some cases. So that's
what I do on inside is I bottomwater and then I take them
outside and I water overhead andthe the plants like you said,
they're so weak and they'rethey're not quite ready for all
(05:56):
of that water on top of them.They just fall right over.
But they perk back up once theyget get more acclimated.
Ken (06:04):
Toughen them up. Tough love. Yes.
Chris (06:07):
Tough love plants. That's how you get them good garden
vegetables. You get them toughlove.
Ken (06:14):
Yes. Or they or they die.
Chris (06:17):
Or they just die. You go to the store and buy more.
Ken (06:20):
Alright. Our our next question is, I just planted a
Canadian hemlock. How do I waterit?
Chris (06:29):
Well, that is a great question. So I got this this one
online, and it it so Canadianhemlock is the species of Suga
canadensis. It is an evergreentree, and it's a little
sensitive. I I really this isprobably one of my favorite
evergreens out there. Butbecause it is a sort of a a
(06:52):
sensitive tree, you need to haveit really in the right spot.
You have to protect it fromwind, like this really drying
wind, know, like an Easterlyexposure is good, you know,
morning sun, a little bit ofafternoon shade, know, or maybe
sort of in the understory of alarger shade tree that will help
(07:13):
this plant establish and thenmaybe thrive up into maturity
where then you don't have tobaby it as much. But they're
very specific in their siteconditions. And so I guess first
off, you know, what what I hadrecommended this person is,
well, yeah, I get it's alreadyin the ground, but, you know,
let's double check, making sureyou didn't put this in the in
the middle of a full blazing sunyard, you know, southern
(07:35):
exposure to the prevailing windsout of the Northwest, that that
probably is not gonna be thebest spot for a Canadian hemlock
tree. So moving past that, youknow, it's been Arbor Day, lots
of trees have gone on theground, a lot of folks ask,
well, how do I now water mytrees? In Illinois, for the most
(07:58):
part, we have sort of a loamyclay soil.
I know some of you lucky folkslike over in Mason County have
all sand. But it how you wateryour trees or how often is
really dictated by your soiltype or texture, you know, is if
it's more sandy, it's gonnadrain faster, you're gonna have
to water more. If it's moreclay, it's gonna drain slower,
(08:22):
you're probably gonna have towater less often. However, with
that clay soil, it it is harderfor that water to to kind of
penetrate or infiltrate intothat clay structure. So taking a
hose full blast on that spotisn't necessarily going to give
you the best absorption of thatwater into the soil.
It's just gonna run off in manycases. So that's why we
(08:44):
typically recommend get yourhose, set it to like a a drip
drip drip or maybe a slighttrickle. Set it down to where
you planted that tree and thenyou let that drip very slowly so
that, you know, in that claysoil it can be absorbed and then
fifteen, twenty minutes later,move it to another side of the
tree, let it drip drip dripuntil basically all around that
(09:08):
tree you've saturated that thatsoil. Well, not saturated, but
you know, you've given it a gooddeep drink. You know, that could
take upwards of an hour, maybe alittle bit more.
Again, all depends on soil type.And so, yeah, and do this all
summer long. So keep an eye onsoil moisture, touch that that
(09:28):
the soil with your fingers. Ifit's dry, feels dry, looks dry,
it's time to water. And it cantake up to three years for a
tree to become established in inthe the native soil there.
So you got to keep an eye onthings. And the other thing with
the the hemlock is because it ismore sensitive to drought and
(09:49):
and drying wind, intensesunlight, if you're five years
down the line and we encounter asummer drought here in Illinois,
that would be the tree that Iwould water first. Just because
of knowing that it's moresensitive to that. And you know
what you can do, Ken, to helpyou in all of this? You can lay
(10:10):
down a nice thick layer of woodchips or or mulch to help
insulate that soil so you don'thave to water all the time.
Ken (10:18):
Organic mulch. Yes. Once a living mulch. Yeah. Not
necessarily organic organic.
But
Chris (10:24):
Right. Don't put rocks down with with hemlock. It's
that's probably not going to bean ideal mulch for that one,
especially if you're in asunnier exposure where the rocks
heat up and it create thatlittle microclimate there around
that tree. So, yeah, justsomething that could decompose
and organic matter back to thesoil. Alright, Ken.
(10:46):
Well, let's stick on the themeof evergreen. So this next
question is, I've got three Mugopines infested with about half
inch long caterpillars, andthey're eating all the needles
off the plants. Any idea how Ican get rid of them?
Ken (11:05):
Yes. So these, in this case, these were the European or
red headed pine sawfly. Iusually see this European, but
some places referred to as redheaded pine sawfly. So this is a
caterpillar like insect. It'sactually a saw so sawflies are
related to wasps, whereascaterpillars will turn into
(11:25):
butterflies or moths.
And that'll be important when weget to the management here. But
for this one, this is kind of ait's got a caterpillar like,
it's got a blackhead, kind ofgray green body, white stripes
on it. And they are hatching inthe spring. They're feeding on
needles when they're reallyyoung. Their mouths aren't big
enough to eat the whole needle,they're just kind of scraping
off the surface, needles willturn brown and die.
(11:47):
As they get bigger, they willeat entire needles from the tip
to the base and they'regregarious, so they're feeding
in groups. You have 10, you havetwenty, thirty plus, of these
sawfly larvae feeding together.They'll kind of strip a branch
and move on to the next one.Typically they're feeding on the
older needles, so the newgrowth, a lot of times isn't out
(12:07):
yet when they're feeding, sothey may strip a branch, but
then eventually that new growthis going to come out, you get
your, kind of your Charlie Brownlooking Christmas tree where you
just have the, you know, tuftsat the end and everything else
has been stripped off. So Iguess, fortunately, because they
still have that new growth, youknow, the plants aren't going to
(12:28):
be killed necessarily.
Now this happens year after yearafter year, it's going to weaken
the plants and stuff, buttypically they're going recover
the aesthetics, they're going tolook pretty bad potentially if
you're losing a lot of theseolder needles. But the tree is
typically going to be okay.They'll feed for a month, month
and a half or so, then they'llpupate, they'll drop to the
ground typically, pupate in theground or near the tree itself.
(12:52):
And then the adults are going toemerge September into the fall.
Females are going to lay eggs inthe needles and they kind of
look like yellow pimples almoston the needles.
So it's kind of hard to see, butif you've had them in the past,
maybe something worthwhile to goinspect your plants and if you
see those, just remove thoseneedles, eliminate the problem,
(13:13):
right off the bat. One does cometo management, so one is going
out and scouting, in the fall tosee if you have any egg laying.
If you have the larvae on yourplants now, like most of the
things, it's easier to controlthem when they are small. Once
they get bigger, it gets alittle more difficult to manage
them. And because they are notcaterpillars, things like BTK,
(13:35):
bacillus thuringiensis,frestachiae, Dipel would be one
common trade name, does not workon them.
That only works on caterpillars.So you could, you know, douse
all your Mugle Pines with that.It's not going do any good
because they're notcaterpillars, it's not going to
affect them. So things likeactive variants of Acefate,
Azadactrim, Bifenthrin,Carbaryl, Permethrin, Spinosad
(14:00):
are some things that you canuse. But again, the younger they
are, the smaller they are, theeasier it is to control them.
Once they get real big, it'sit's it's not going to be as
effective. So you can go in andbe looking at going and hand
picking, smashing them. I'dprobably wear gloves if you're
going to smash them, becauseit's going to make a mess. But
(14:22):
then looking for and thenscouting for them in the fall so
they're not hatching out, andand defoliating your plants
again. Alright.
We'll keep on the, the insectpests here. So our our next
question is, why do myblackberries keep dying back? Is
the frost killing them? I guessit kind of gave away the answer
(14:43):
there.
Chris (14:44):
Well, it it kind of. Yes. In a way, this was an
interesting phone call that Igot from someone. So we didn't
have any photos. This person,you know, didn't wanna send
pictures in or anything.
So it was all based on verbaldescriptions coming through the
telephone. And, it was quite theCSI, the plant CSI. And so, you
(15:11):
know, insert, you know, wittypun here as I put my sunglasses
on and walk away. If only Icould wear sunglasses over my
glasses. But so the caller, hehe he asked about his
blackberries that he hadpurchased, I think, about two
years ago, 2023, he had had themplanted.
(15:33):
These were triple crownblackberries that he had bought
online, had them shipped in, andhe had three of them delivered.
Two of the three seemed tostruggle sort of that that
second year that he had them.The third one seemed to be doing
okay. And then this year,noticing that, again, the third
(15:53):
one doing alright, not growingas vigorously as he had thought,
but the other two are just itseemed like every time it would
frost that the canes would justdie back to the ground. And so,
you know, those very interestingso I'm like, alright.
Well, how frost tolerant aretriple crown blackberry? You
know, was trying to think, maybewe just got a a bad batch of
(16:15):
blackberries. And so lookingmore into this, I said, well,
well, do you see any lesions oranything on the the canes of the
particular plants? He said, oh,yeah. There are these swollen
areas along the canes.
And so I'm like, well, let'sinvestigate this a little bit
further. So these swollen areasturned out to be the the kind of
(16:37):
the the feeding damage of a caneborer. And cane borers, there's
many different species outthere. The one we sort of landed
on was the red necked cane boar.And the red necked cane boar is
a beetle.
And it's, you know, you know,imagine emerald ash borer in
your head, except for beinggreen and glossy. This is a
(16:59):
mostly black slender beetle witha little red band on the back of
its neck. And so hence the nameredneck boar. And so what this
does is female, she will lay hereggs on the lower part of a
blackberry cane. She then coversthat in like kind of a goo or
(17:24):
slime that then hardens andprotects her eggs.
So as the eggs hatched, heryoung are never exposed to the
outer elements, so it's reallyhard to to spray anything in
regard to to controlling theseparticular insects. So they bore
directly into the cane. Theykind of do like a little
corkscrew thing. Most of thetime, they will then proceed up
(17:46):
the cane. Sometimes, they willgo down the cane.
From what I read, you know, ifthey go up, they can go upwards
of 25. Inches. If they go down,normally, they only go down
about six inches. So if you'rescouting for these, best thing
to do is to take your suspectedcane that you think is infested
(18:07):
and split it open, you know,farther up than farther down,
but you want to split it openand try to find that larva in
there. Be like a kind of aprobably a whitish grub like
looking larva.
And that is one of the maincontrols also is just removing
those infested canes beforereally we see the buds begin to
(18:31):
swell in the early springtime.So looking for these swellings
or galls on the canes, cut belowthat, and and if you cut and you
notice that there's like a holein the middle of that cane,
might want to investigate alittle bit deeper down, make
sure that you actually got thatparticular larva out of there.
(18:52):
Once you cut them, burn them,get them off-site as best you
can, and then there are a fewthresholds that I found. So if
folks have large blackberrypatches and and maybe they they
aren't able to prune it all out,if you prune it all out, you
might remove all yourblackberries. The thresholds
(19:13):
that I saw varied from 10 tofive to 15%.
So if you had that much of yourcanes infested with these,
that's the threshold forspraying something. And so
because they're they're fairlyprotected, what this is would be
a contact insecticide that I Isuppose when the female lands to
(19:34):
lay her eggs might affect her.But something like carburol was
listed, malthion was listed, oresfenlorate. Is that how you say
that one,
Ken (19:43):
Ken? Esfenvalerate.
Chris (19:45):
Esfenvalerate. Yes. Alright. Something like that.
Put the text right here.
You can read it if you'rewatching us on YouTube. So so,
yeah, it it can be prettydifficult to control. Some of
the sources did say like, hey,within a year, these populations
of insects can explode toinfest, you know, fifth 50% of
(20:06):
your canes. So that that is thepossibility. But there are also
a lot of beneficial predatorsthat will go after these red
headed cane bores.
So they the beneficial predatorscan control up to 75% of a
population in a given year. Thatstill leaves about twenty five
percent to carry on. And sosomething just to be mindful of
(20:30):
if you do, you know, opt forsomething like malathion or
another insecticide that thereare also beneficial insects
going after these guys, so justbeing mindful of your spraying.
When you're spraying those, alsodirect your application to the
like, the bottom half, maybebottom third of the canes as
(20:52):
that's where egg layingtypically happens for these
guys. And they do overwinter inthem, so that's why we want to
to rogue out these infestedcanes before bud break.
Alright, Ken. Our next questiongoes comes from someone who
noticed a bumblebee flying intoa hole in the ground near their
(21:13):
front door. Is it possible thatthey do not have a nest there
yet and they can just cover upthat hole, or is there a nest
already in process of beingbuilt in this location?
Ken (21:28):
Yeah. I would say probably at this point in the year, early
May, there's probably already anest established here. This was
earlier in the year. You know,it could be a a queen bee. So
the bumblebees, they willoverwinter as mated queens, and
they will go out and start a newcolony every year.
So those colonies are annual.They don't, they're not like
honeybees where they'recontinuing on and on. They're
(21:49):
not perennial. So they will goout and scout for places. By
this point in the year, theyprobably find an area they like
and they're establishing a nest.
So bumblebees are nesting inpreexisting cavities. They are
not going to excavate their ownnests. Abandoned rodent burrows,
it could be, a birdhouse,bunches of base of bunch
(22:11):
grasses, all kinds of cavityareas, compost. I've heard of
them being in there as well. Soat this point, you know, they're
they're prob she's probablyestablished that nest.
She's going back and forthcollecting nectar and pollen,
feeding her young. And then asthose their offspring start
emerging and hatching anddeveloping, then the workers are
(22:31):
going go out and do all thatwork and the queen will stay in
there. So in this case, youknow, if it's right by the front
door, if it's not too close, youput some signage up saying, you
know, bumble bees here. Becareful. Put up a barrier around
there so people aren't gonnaaccidentally step on it.
Something like that. You youcould plug the hole. I I doubt
(22:54):
they're gonna crawl. I'm notsure how well they'd be able to
dig their way out of that. Sothat that could potentially be a
a death sentence to them.
But if it if it's somewhere likea front door and people are
gonna be risk and they'regetting stung, then obviously we
have to do something about it.Can say generally speaking,
they're they're probably notgoing to be as defensive as like
(23:14):
a yellow jacket or somethinglike that, but they are still
going to defend their nests ifthey feel threatened. So you
can't just go tromping on top ofit and and not expect to get
stung. So depending on how faraway it is and and stuff, you
may be able to leave it. They'reonly going to be there for a
year.
If get a few hard frosts, thatcolony is going to die out and
(23:34):
there won't be one there nextyear. Some people will try to
relocate nests. The problem withthey're in the ground, you don't
know where exactly that nest is,how far that tunnel is going. So
it makes it really difficult, torelocate ones in ground. You
know, if it's above ground,garbage can, bird house,
something like that, that thatthose are little bit easier to
(23:57):
move because you can find that,if you are going to move it,
Xerxes Society has someinformation on how you can do
that.
But basically, you're gonna bedoing this at night, because all
the the bees are gonna be backin the nest. They're gonna be
less active, and you're you'recovering yourself because they
can't sting. They will defendthemselves, and moving that to a
(24:18):
to a new location. So a lot oftimes you're putting that in a
cardboard box, plastic bin, sothey're not escaping while you
transport it, to the the newlocation. There are plans online
that you can look for, likebumblebee boxes where you're
building a wooden box.
A lot of times you're putting inpet hair, things like that. Some
(24:40):
kind of soft stuff that they'llbuild their nest on and stuff.
That can be an option as well.And when you're moving that
nest, you're moving the nest andall that, the debris and whatnot
that they've built that nest onas well. Again, in the ground,
signage, coordinate off sopeople can get on top of it.
(25:03):
But if it's still, you know,more of a risk than you're
willing to take, that may be a akill or attempt to move it. And
if you're attempting to move itand you're not comfortable, then
maybe looking for, beekeepers inyour area. Typically, they're
dealing with honeybees, but youmay find somebody that would be
willing to try bumblebees. Idon't I don't know how many
people there are, but that wouldbe a contact your local
(25:25):
beekeeping association. Ifyou're not sure where if you
have one or where that would be,Illinois State Beekeepers
Association has a list of alltheir their member associations
on their website that you couldlook up.
Chris (25:37):
Yeah. Our our local beekeeping association, they
when I call them asking about aa honeybee swarm or something
that's been found in someone'syard or maybe, I don't know,
potentially a bumblebee nest,they always refer me to a
website. It's calledbeeswarmed.org. I think the the
(26:01):
website, like, the page name iscalled swarmed. Basically, you
report a swarm, and if you havea beekeeper nearby that is
registered on the site that iswilling to come out and collect
that swarm, they will they willdo so.
So something to be mindful of.If you are a beekeeper that's
looking for wild swarms in yourarea and you're not part of this
website, might be worth gettingin touch and and registering
(26:24):
because that's this is what myassociation that's what they're
referring people to now. And I'mI'm glad you distinguish between
bumblebees and yellow jackets,Ken, because I have been with
people that use that terminterchangeably.
Ken (26:38):
Yes. Yeah. Bumblebees are gonna be big and fuzzy. Yellow
jackets are they've got hair,but they're smooth and shiny
looking for the most part. Therethere is, and even bumblebees
and carpenter bees are differenttoo.
Carpenter bees, the abdomen isgoing be a little more shiny,
they're bigger and they'renesting in wood And they will
(26:59):
excavate their own nests, inwood, whereas bumblebees are in
cavities and somebody's alreadydone the work for them. Alright.
Last question we've got fortoday is rabbits have been
eating the bottoms of myarborvitae. What can I spray to
stop them?
Chris (27:17):
Oh, rascally rabbits are going after the arborvitae. This
was a question where they hadalso followed up and said, I
know I don't have deer. And Isaid, oh, no, you don't, but you
do have rabbits. And so the thedamage was pretty telltale. I
mean, was uniform acrossmultiple shrubs and it was at
(27:40):
like a foot, foot and a halfheight, you know, basically what
a rabbit could reach.
And so it was something that wasfairly easy to diagnose. Again,
that uniformity across multipleshrubs was that kind of telltale
giveaway and then that thatreally again, another uniform,
(28:02):
like, point of damage acrossthem. So their rabbits will go
after arborvitae. They'll eat itin the winter. They'll eat that
especially that soft, you know,flush of growth in the
springtime.
The other thing to be mindfulof, you know, as I was talking
about control recommendationsalso with this person was they
(28:24):
lived up in Northern Illinois. Isaid, well, if you you get more
snow than we do, a rabbit willperch upon the snow. And and if
they can get a little higher,they will. So depending on your
snow level, your controlrecommendations might need to go
a little higher up on the shrubitself. And what are those
recommendations?
The best thing we can do is sometype of physical exclusion.
(28:47):
Rabbits, they they do not havethumbs that I know of that are
opposable that would allow themto operate like pliers or a
hammer. You know, they don'thave bolt cutters. So, you know,
anything you can construct,whether it be made of, like, you
know, a a chicken wire or ahardware mesh cloth or even like
(29:10):
a plastic snow fencing or guardwould be enough to keep a rabbit
from eating at the base of yourshrubs. You would install those
usually in the fall and letthose then, you know, go
throughout winter.
Again, making sure whateverguard it is would be tall enough
to prevent a rabbit from, like,hopping on top of the snow and
(29:32):
then eating, you know, not justlike jumping over your guard.
And so just making sure it'stall enough for whatever kind of
snow conditions that you have inthe winter. And then in terms of
sprays, there are repellentsthat you might be able to use.
Most of them are well, guessthere's there's two different
types of repellents. There'sthere's ones that smell bad, and
(29:54):
there's ones that taste bad.
And the key thing with either ofthese is that they don't last
very long. So you have toreapply them, and wildlife get
acclimated to these scents orthese flavors. And if you're
hungry enough, they're gonna goafter it. So I would not rely
(30:19):
solely on repellents. Physicalbarriers or some type of
exclusion tactic is going to bethe way to go.
Get a dog. Yes. Get a get a dogthat will frequent that area in
the winter.
Ken (30:42):
So hopefully when you put your fence up, you're not don't
have a rabbit nest under there.Rabbit tunnel. Oh. And trapping
them in there.
Chris (30:48):
Great point. Yes. Yeah. Oh, rabbits, they can tunnel. So
you do wanna go a few inchesinto like the mulch or the soil,
you know, so go down a littlebit to prevent their tunneling.
And, yeah, reach in there. I'msure there's dead leaves and
twigs and things. Pull outstuff. Make sure you're not
trapping them in there. Well,that was a lot of great
(31:09):
information about springquestions.
Things are are going on thistime of year. People calling us
about wanting to know moreinformation, whether it's a
problem or just kind ofcuriosity that they have. So
that's what extension is here todo. Well, the Good Growing
podcast is a production ofUniversity of Illinois
Extension, edited this week byme, Chris Enroth. Hey, Ken.
(31:31):
Thanks for hanging out with metoday and answering some of
these questions that we've beengetting these last few weeks.
Ken (31:38):
Yes. Thank you. I and I realized sorry right now, this
is gonna make your editing apain potentially, that I didn't
say how you tell the differencebetween a caterpillar and a
sawfly. If you see
Chris (31:50):
Oh, no. Let's cut this in real quick, folks.
Ken (31:53):
So sawflies are gonna have, six or mere pair six or more
pairs of pro legs, and those arethose, like, fleshy outgrowths
on the the back end of acaterpillar sawfly that look
like legs and aren't reallylegs, Whereas caterpillars have
five or fewer. So sawflies, youcan spell out sawfly when you're
counting pro legs, that's asawfly. They also don't have
(32:16):
crochets, which are like littlehooks on the bottom of the Pro
Legs that caterpillars have.Sawflies don't. So my apologies.
Chris (32:27):
And now you know the difference between caterpillars
and sawflies. Dogwood sawfliesare another ones that seem to
pop up too. So those are kind offun to see and terrifying
because I love my dogwoods.
Ken (32:39):
No, sir. Rose slugs. Those are all sawflies. Yep.
Chris (32:45):
Yeah. You never see the rose slug, it seems like. It's
always get the call after thefact, like, do I do now? Like,
well, nothing. It's too late.
Ken (32:51):
It's gone. It's done. It's gone.
Chris (32:53):
We're done for the year. So there is an invasive rose
slug though. Think I heard Iread it on the Joe Boggs blog.
Ken (33:01):
Yeah. There's a couple different species you can get.
Chris (33:04):
Yeah. Well, now we're getting into more stuff, Ken. We
gotta cut it off right here.It's the end of the show, folks.
No more information until nextweek.
Ken (33:12):
Alright. Speaking of next week, let's do this again next
week.
Chris (33:15):
We'll give them more information next week. So that's
what's gonna happen. That's thethat's our format of our show.
That's what we do here. So yes,we will be coming back at you
again with more horticulturalhijinks next week.
I think it's gonna be a gardenbite. Got a busy week, couple
weeks coming up. So yeah, we'regonna be all over the place.
Different events, programs hereand there. Growing stuff, it's
(33:37):
gonna be it's it's summeralready.
I'll just say it right now. May6 is when we're recording.
Welcome to summertime. Oh.Listeners, thank you for doing
what you do best and that islistening or if you're watching
us on YouTube watching.
And as always, keep on growing.
Ken (34:08):
I may take it out. I'll save it for your retirement.
Chris (34:10):
Thank you.
Ken (34:11):
Retirement party.
Chris (34:13):
I'm having my walker. I'm 88 years old. Remember when you
could do this? Yep. When I couldlay down on the ground and get
up.
And people weren't concerned.
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