April 3, 2025 • 52 mins
Ever wonder what truly separates successful home care marketers from those who struggle to generate referrals? This candid roundtable discussion brings together three powerhouse veterans with over 60 years of combined experience who've helped grow agencies from startup to multi-million dollar operations.
Annette, Dawn, and Lisa reveal the psychology behind building trust with referral sources and why the strongest relationships can withstand occasional hiccups. They explain why being "pleasantly persistent" trumps aggressive sales tactics, and how taking those dreaded Friday afternoon discharges that other agencies avoid can put you on a social worker's speed dial.
You'll discover why qualifying referral sources and organizing your routes by zip code dramatically increases efficiency, and why your agency needs a genuine differentiator beyond the usual "our caregivers really care" messaging. The panel shares honest insights about what personality traits make someone successful in this role, why internal teamwork is critical to marketing success, and how even experienced marketers can struggle with asking for referrals.
For agency owners, this conversation offers a blueprint for identifying and nurturing marketing talent. For community liaisons, it provides practical strategies to increase referrals immediately. And for anyone considering a career in home care marketing, it paints an authentic picture of the challenges and rewards of this uniquely demanding role.
The panel concludes by sharing information about Approved Senior Network's 12-week sales training program, which provides structure, accountability, and peer learning to transform marketing efforts. Ready to take your home care sales to the next level? These experts reveal exactly how to do it.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for joining us everybody.
We're going to talk about thescience of selling home care and
the first thing we're going todo today we did a little
housekeeping, so I know you canhear me and see me and I know
we're recording.
So we are going to talkintroductions next, and I want
to just quickly introduce myself, because I'm really not the
person that is the star of theshow today.
(00:21):
It's these other lovely ladiesand Annette, who is our main
trainer she is amazing who aregoing to talk about themselves
and their experience.
I'm Valerie Van Boeven.
I'm the co-owner of ApprovedSenior Network.
I'm a registered nurse and I'vehad every role and job as a
nurse you could possibly imagine.
(00:42):
And yeah, but 18 years ago or17 years ago, I started Approved
Senior Network, or at that time, was called LTC Expert
Publication.
So I'm old, I love digitalmarketing.
It's my game, it's my thing,it's my thing I love to do, and
these ladies, however, areamazing at sales in home care,
(01:03):
so we're going to talk to themamazing at sales in home care,
so we're going to talk to them.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Annette, why don't you introduce yourself a?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
little bit.
Don't say too much, because I'mgoing to ask you a bunch of
questions, sure.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Hello everybody.
I'm Annette Ziegler and I havebeen with ASN.
In about a week or so it'sgoing to be a year.
Woohoo, went by quick.
I've been in home care not toage myself either.
20 plus years.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
I teach the sales training courses here and I just
love what I do.
Yay and Dawn yes, hi, I'm DawnFiela.
I've also been in home care fora long time and I will be here
three years in May, so that'salso coming up and it has just
flown by.
I love working with all of thehome care agencies.
We are always helping them withjust about everything, not just
digital marketing.
(01:49):
Feet on the ground how do Ihire?
Why are my caregiver applicantspoor quality lately?
Like we are an all in one.
Help you as much as we can andI love my job.
I miss home care sometimes, butI get enough of it with you
guys.
Thank you for being here today.
You're going to learn quite abit.
Lisa, you're up.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
Okay, my unmuted Okay .
Hi, I'm Lisa.
I've been here for two yearsand before this I had two
different loves.
One was it was newspaper andthe internet came around, and
then I learned internetadvertising as well as home care
.
I did everything and anythingin home care imaginable, from
(02:26):
client care to marketing to 3amshifts, you name it.
I've been in the trenches ofhome care and I just love home
care.
I really love being a part ofit every day with you guys, no
matter what it is, and I reallylove watching the growth and all
of that.
So I'm happy to be here.
Thanks for having me andlooking forward to this.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah, me too, okay.
So now I'm just going to saythis I didn't put a lot of work
in this PowerPoint because it'sreally about the voices on the
screen and the people that aregoing to talk to you.
So look at this dingy AI.
It's set in history and it gaveme world history.
Ai history that gave me worldhistory.
We're not as old as people inMesopotamia, but we will talk
(03:09):
about history a little bit, allright, and all of you can answer
this.
We're going to start withAnnette Sure, and because she is
the person that almosteverybody talks to, or everybody
does talk to, if they gothrough sales training along
with Lisa and Dawn.
But tell us about your historywith selling home care, who you
worked for, how it started.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
Okay, so actually it started back in 2004.
There was a really large CCRCthat was continuing care
community that was being builtright around the corner from my
house.
I used to drive by it often.
It was not built yet.
They had a big trailer andsenior.
I was always in marketing.
Senior living always interestedme.
(03:52):
My parents had me older in lifeand younger with my children.
I had to take care of them.
So I went through a lot movinghospice, moving to assisted
living.
So it interested me lot movinghospice, moving to assisted
living.
So it interests me.
So I started working for it wascalled Cherry Ridge.
It was a St Ann's community, avery large community here in
(04:13):
upstate New York, as a Bermudanrepresentative and I actually
started in the trailer and welooking out the window it was
just land and this community wasgoing to be built.
But we could.
They would not build it untilwe sold a certain amount.
So we had cottages, independentliving apartments, assisted
living, memory care, skillednursing and we had to sell a
(04:33):
certain amount of people, have acertain amount of people sign
up before they can even startbuilding.
So fast forward they built thewhole community.
They finally built a couplecottages and then we moved in
the cottage and that was myoffice.
It was beautiful and I workedthere for 13 years.
I was in the marketing.
I moved people in independentliving, assisted living, memory
(04:56):
care, and during my tenure thereI referred home care agencies
constantly to help theseresidents that needed extra
assistance.
And then it was like I said, Iwas there about 13 years and I
had.
I wanted to do somethingdifferent and I connected with a
home care agency that I usedoften at this community and the
owner offered me a position asthe community liaison marketing
(05:19):
manager.
So I started there and I workedfor this home care agency for
about seven and a half years.
I helped them grow from onemillion to four million.
It really helped me when I movedinto that role because I knew I
had a lot of connections.
I knew what senior living wasall about and, again, having
older parents, I understoodabout needing home care and so
(05:41):
forth.
Trying not to go too longwinded, but I just so you can
understand my history I reallylove home care.
I liked working in a CCRC, butit's so nice to see people age
in place at home, wherever homemay be, but to have them stay at
home and live in their houseand see all their treasures and
be able to stay there and getthe care they need.
(06:02):
That's really where my heartwas, so it's a little bit about
me.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
Awesome and I knew you had such an amazing history
with all of this, but I neverheard the whole story, and
that's lovely to have.
You've got a lot of tenure inall these places that you've
worked, so that's awesome.
I understand it all.
Yeah, you've seen everything.
So, dr Lisa, how long did youguys work in home care?
Speaker 3 (06:27):
I was at Home Instead Senior Care.
We were the number one officefor 10 years, started in sales,
outside sales, community liaison, and then was promoted to
operations manager and we grewby millions and millions of
dollars.
There were probably a thousandoffices when I left there across
the country and even in otherparts of the world, and more
(06:47):
recently an independent homecare agency who couldn't get the
private pay side of it.
They had a pretty good Medicaidside.
As we know, the margins aren'tgreat with Medicaid so they were
trying to break into theprivate pay and we did get to
about 3.5 million in under fouryears in private pay.
So in that company I was overrecruiting, retention and sales
(07:08):
and so we grew quite quickly andall the things that worked for
me through the years we aredoing in the sales training
class.
So yeah, that's a little bitabout me.
Speaker 4 (07:21):
All right, lisa, for me, gosh, it started way back
when I was a little kid.
I want to say I have that, thatstory that people bring up, that
I lived with my grandmother andso I saw firsthand what she
needed and I did a lot of thosethings as a little kid and from
there it just was built intowhere I knew I've always been a,
I want to take care of peopleand I want to help, right.
(07:44):
But then I was like I also wantto help in these other ways
where we can grow, and so Iworked for quite a few smaller
boutique style agencies to helpthem get from the ground up.
And then I've also worked forsome a couple of different
franchises as far as themarketing or the branch manager
or, just again, doing justeverything, especially when
(08:04):
you're building from the groundup, when you're starting a new
business.
I've done all of that.
So getting it to where it'sestablished and then branching
out to new locations and thingslike that, all of that stuff
super fun.
It's all a part of things thatI love to do.
So, yeah, started when.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
I was a little one, so you got.
You have a hundred years worthof knowledge right here.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
Yeah, and in home care it's rapid speed by fire
too.
It's not just it's, it's justreally fast.
Everything is very fast paced,so it's even more than that.
Probably one day feels like aweek.
Oh yeah, home care for sure.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
I always say I'm 200 years old in nurse years.
It's the same thing.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
It's, yeah, it's more than dog years.
For sure, for sure, oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
So what do you think made you a great home care
community liaison, miss Annette.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
I would say I have compassion, I have empathy.
I loved helping seniors.
I loved helping families.
I loved helping people solvetheir problems and helping them,
providing them with home care.
I've always been a verymission-driven person.
I like to succeed and I lovedthe drive and making sure that I
(09:24):
was helping our agency growwith lots of referrals.
So I really had a drive in methat excited me.
If somebody called me withreferrals, I would for a skilled
nursing facility called me.
I would be there, I would makeit happen.
So I think and also too, I wasable to multitask.
In this kind of business Thingschange day by day, hour by hour
.
I think because I was able toaccept that and realize that I
(09:49):
could be doing one thing and geta call for a 24-7, and I was
able to switch what I was doingand help people.
So I think I had everythingthat I needed to make me succeed
and I really did.
I really loved what I did.
I loved meeting the families.
I think my what I love the bestwas meeting the our clients
(10:10):
that we signed up and hearingtheir stories.
That was one of my favoritethings doing the assessments and
our clients.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Yeah, you gotta love.
You gotta love this business.
Yeah, really do.
And Dawn, what made you?
I know I think I know what madeyou great home care, community
liaison.
You're very organized andyou're very good, and I know
that.
But that's true.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
I'm very, whatever that is I am.
I have a lot of the socialworkers and the people that
you're going to meet out in thecommunity.
For those of you that are doingthis right now, you can't come
off like a used car salesman.
You have to be driven, you haveto have that sales ability to
make it, but you also have tohave a love for the mission,
(10:53):
because that's what keeps yougoing.
And when they see that heartcome out and you can sell,
that's a win.
It's the two things combined.
You can't fake it in thisbusiness If it's just about the
money and the paycheck and thecommission, they're going to see
right through that and they'renot going to refer to you.
They need to see your heart andyour passion and the fact that
you are willing to drive 15miles to go meet with a family
(11:16):
right now because all of asudden they're discharging today
at four o'clock and it wassupposed to be three days from
now.
The fact that you'll do that notbecause of the commission and
the money, but because you wantthis person to come home with a
caregiver and to have asuccessful discharge.
You're a part of the successfuldischarge that social worker's
counting on and whatever drivesyou to do that.
They need to see the missionand the passion for the business
(11:39):
and the care for the seniors inorder for you to be a really
great community liaison.
And you need to juggle, asAnnette said, the multitasking I
hired somebody in my early daysmaybe one of the first
marketers I hired didn't reallyknow what I was doing yet and
she literally spun in a circlein the office Like she didn't
know what.
There were like three things todo and she didn't know what do
I do first?
(11:59):
So the multitasking you'rebalancing a bunch of stuff over
here and you're on the phone andyou're just running.
That's adrenaline, that's funfor me.
I thought it was fun.
There's other people that can'tsucceed in that environment at
all.
Yeah, I don't know.
I think that's what helped me.
I really did have a very.
I still have a strong passionfor the industry and the seniors
(12:20):
and their wellbeing, andthey've earned the right to stay
home if that's what they want.
I feel like they've aged.
They've done all the right.
Maybe they didn't do everythingright, maybe they're not eating
well, I don't know, but they'veearned the right after all of
these, years took all the shotsas long as it's safe to do so,
definitely.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
That's great.
And, lisa, I agree with all ofthose things that you guys are
saying.
I have like super high ADHD andthat's what helped me just be
that, be able to juggle, but inin anywhere I just floated,
floated around, that's maybe the.
That's Dawn's like deep, mineis like floating around like a
little butterfly everywhere Ican describe it and just got to
(12:58):
know everyone and buildrelationships and I think the
secret is knowing that littledetail that no one else would
remember about people.
That always helps me and Itruly care about whatever it is,
whether it's getting the seniorhome, making sure that they
have a good caregiver not just acaregiver, but a good, great
caregiver and just talking topeople like I would want to be
(13:20):
talked to, treated that way.
So I think that resonates withpeople just being real, getting
in where you fit in and justfiguring it out from there.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Yeah, absolutely, and detail is definitely.
That's a golden nugget rightthere.
Pay attention to detail, andLisa's a master at that.
I got a lemon meringue pie formy birthday.
Who knows that?
Who does that?
Who knows that I love lemonmeringue pie?
We don't work in the sameoffice every day.
Speaker 3 (13:47):
You mentioned it for a brief split second and she's a
liaison.
She got into it and went for it.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
That's part of the challenge, and she ordered it
and then she had somebody elseon the team delivered to my
house.
I was like what, what, and itwas so good.
Speaker 4 (14:03):
Anyway, I'm glad.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
No, okay, all right, great, all right.
Okay, we're going to talk alittle bit about trust here, and
all of this that we're talkingabout is we are going to talk
about at the end here what salesefforts and some more tangible
things, but everything theseladies are telling you is you
(14:25):
are the skills, the attitude,the place you need to be in, or
that you need your sales personto be in in order to really
close the deals.
So, thinking back, what werethe events and efforts that you
think made the most differencein building trust with referral
sources?
So, things that you organized,things that you did, what was it
(14:46):
that really helped?
Just think of one or two thingsthat helped them believe in you
and go ahead.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
I'm not even going to interject For, like events,
having in-services and lunch andlearns, having them understand
what we offer and how we can bethere in a split second, come to
see their patients on the sameday that they're discharging,
showing them always beingavailable, letting them know
this job.
It's really not nine to five.
You do get calls, sometimesafter five around the weekends,
(15:16):
If they call you and they're inan emergency situation, that
you're going to be there andyou're going to help them with
their patients, their residentsand do whatever it takes.
But I think having them see youin action you know how quickly
you can sign up a patient,letting them see you, help them.
This patient go home with theservices before they're
(15:36):
discharged from, say, a rehab, ahospital, and them seeing you
in action I think builds thetrust and always have been a
good communicator, I think, withyour referral sources.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Like taking those Friday discharges, those late
afternoon Friday afternoondischarges that nobody else will
call back.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
Yep, Four o'clock on a Friday or on a weekend, I I'll
tell you, myself and ourscheduler, it was like a.
We thrived on it.
They would call and we wouldmake it happen and it was just
exciting.
Sometimes we were able to getthere, have a caregiver there in
an hour or two.
That's amazing they had maybethey had a resident come home to
(16:14):
an assisted living that was inrehab and they were really
unsteady on their feet and theydidn't know how they were going
to make it on the weekend.
So they called me, I made ithappen and I solved their
problem.
But I was happy to do that andthat's part of the business.
And then by doing that I was onspeed dial.
They called me on my cell phonebecause they knew if they call
me on a Friday or a weekend, Iwas going to answer and I was
(16:37):
going to help them.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
And Dawn, yeah.
So I think if I were watchingthis I would be thinking how do
you get them to think of you ona Friday, or how do you get the
trust for them to even try thefirst time?
And so there are fiveimpressions to get them to trust
you.
We have it down to a sciencenow, and a lot of it is about
the relationship you're building.
(17:02):
You're building a foundation ofa relationship, not a one and
done.
It's about consistency, it'sabout reliability, it's about
being different.
You have to have a realdifferentiator, not a.
My staff stays till the job'sdone.
So what my caregivers reallycare about the clients.
They all say that you have tohave something that really makes
(17:22):
you stand out.
It could be your caregivertraining.
It could be your backup plan.
If the caregiver calls out,that's a negative thing, but you
can make it a positive thing.
People get sick.
It's life, it could be allkinds of things.
But you have to have adifferentiator to get in the
door in the first place so thatyou can build trust.
The kind of trust you need isdeep embedded trust.
(17:44):
If you have a caregiver intheir building doing an
overnight awake and thatcaregiver falls asleep, your
relationship should be so goodthat they pull you aside and say
, hey, your caregiver, lastnight she fell asleep and you
should be able to bounce backfrom that.
That's the kind of relationshipyou need and it's about being
consistent.
You have to go every eight to10 days.
There has to be some sort ofcontact with that referral
(18:08):
source every eight to 10 days.
It's not going to be aface-to-face every time.
Once a month you get aface-to-face.
What are you going to do inbetween?
It can't be a brochure.
You have to have a leave behindsomething important, something
that matters, something fun,something different.
So there's a lot going on withthis to get that trust built,
something different.
So there's a lot going on withthis to get that trust built.
So I think it's just the.
For me it's the consistency,the reliability and just always
(18:31):
being there, being respectful oftheir time.
Don't be a plopper.
I had a referral source call meabout marketers and she's she's
a plopper.
I don't want her coming in andplopping down in front of my
desk and just sitting there.
I have to work late now becauseshe sat here for 20 minutes.
Don't sit unless they ask you.
Be respectful of their time.
Don't expect and make them comeout and see you every time you
(18:51):
come into the building.
So it's just a mutual respectand they need to start seeing
you as a partner, more than avendor or referral source,
someone who is a home caresource for them.
They need to see you as apartner.
They're the social workerexpert and you're the home care
expert.
Someone needs home care.
I'm calling her.
That's what I would say melissamarceau, yeah I'm just gonna
(19:16):
agree with all of that.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
I just letting someone see you in action is
just a really big deal.
If they see you and they seeyou just handled everything like
they're going to come back toyou always, they're going to
trust you.
So I agree with everything youguys said, for sure yeah, I,
yeah, that is.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
I've heard this enough times now that I know all
of that is true.
I think consistency is wheresome folks start falling off the
mark, and that is one thingthat we all.
Speaker 3 (19:47):
I can tell you here in the summer and probably in
other places in the winter, noone's outside like it's
miserable.
That's when you go.
That's you're going to get inand get to see them.
It's Christmas week Go, no oneelse is going in there.
You want to face the face withyour social worker?
Go when no one else is going.
That consistency and that alwaysbeing there and it works,
(20:08):
because when I wasn't there fora week because I was on vacation
, guess what Phones were deadthe next week, dead
Cricketsickets because I leftfor a week.
That's how quick it changes.
You have to go every week andif you go on because you tell
them ahead of time I will begone, but I am coming back and
you double time it and get infront of everybody right when
you get back.
It's that quick because theyhave people coming in behind you
(20:31):
saying the same things andmaybe bad things sometimes, and
dropping off something better.
Maybe they brought them donuts,maybe they did something that
wowed them.
Now they're going to get a shotright, and then you've got to
earn your way back in.
So you got to go consistently,especially when nobody else is
going.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
Great, and I think that's a differentiator to
people that are consistent,because I would bet that
probably 20% actually areconsistent, consistent going
back all the time, and so thoseare.
That's your real competition isthose people who are just like
you.
Speaker 3 (21:07):
And you see their stuff, you see their brochure.
Oh, she was.
I saw her stuff last week.
What are we following eachother?
You start to know real quicklywho your stiff competitors are.
You just have to find a way tostand out.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
All right, great stuff, great nuggets of wisdom.
If you were starting all overagain today, what would be your
first priority of the week or ofthe month?
So what do you do first, rightout of the gate?
Speaker 2 (21:35):
So brand new, just starting this position.
I would qualify referralsources in my area, making map
out see who's out there whowould be where I would get
private pay referrals.
Mapping out all different typesof referral sources that I
would see in my area.
Make sure I have a communitypresence.
Connect with, maybe, referralssources that I already know.
(21:57):
Thinking about what my agency.
I think, just like Dawn said,you have to have a
differentiator.
So thinking about how I canpresent our agency and that it
could be different from the 10different home care agencies
that I had competition with.
Why are they going to listen tome?
Why am I different?
How can we help?
So I think this is what I woulddo.
Speaker 3 (22:19):
Yeah, dawn, I would qualify my referral sources.
There's a Medicare website.
You can go on and look at allthe SNFs in your area anyone
getting paid by Medicare and seewhat they're all about.
I would do that.
First I would build myself aroute sheet.
I would make sure I had areally good elevator speech with
(22:42):
a differentiator.
I'd make sure I could roll thatoff my tongue in my sleep if
need be, and then I would hitthe sniff.
If all I had time to do was goto sniffs because there's a lot
here in Phoenix where I'm atlots and lots of them that is
where I would be spending amajority of my time.
Skilled nursing facilities getto know them.
When I get someone face-to-face, get a lunch and learn
scheduled because I may neversee their face again, they're
very hard to get in front of.
Get in front of them, schedulethat lunch and learn, and you're
(23:04):
golden.
It's harder than that, but if Iwere starting over knowing what
I know now, that is where Iwould start.
Speaker 1 (23:10):
Perfect, Lisa.
Anything to add to that?
Are you floating around like abutterfly?
I'm floating.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
I was going to say I would just case the joint.
Make sure I know what everyoneelse is doing.
My competitors are doing too.
Out there.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Oh, yes, call them Secret shop.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
I shop them a little bit and then I'm going to set up
a plan of who are my top 25that I'm going to go out to
right now Sniffs for sure,Medicaregov also for sure Just
to compare and see what I'mdealing with and just create
that route.
When I first started, Iremember a lady that I worked
with said you can't just bepinging around like this.
You got to create.
And I was like you know what?
You're right, Let me createthis.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
Sort your referral sources by zip code.
Do it now.
Do it now Because if you'reover here, I'm going to talk
about where I am, if I'm inPhoenix and I'm marketing and
I'm getting it like I'm beingreal successful, it's going
really well.
And then I get a call in Mesa.
Can you come talk to thisfamily?
They're discharging tomorrow.
I'm going to drop everything andgo talk to the family in Mesa,
not only because it's incentive,but it's because it's the right
(24:13):
thing to do.
This person's got to have carewhen they get home.
And this is your opportunity toprove yourself.
See the social worker on yourway in to see that family.
I'm done with the family.
It's one o'clock.
Am I going to drive all the wayback to Phoenix to keep
marketing?
No, I'm going to pull up my zipcode locator and I'm going to
look for all the sniffs or myreferral sources in Mesa by zip
(24:33):
code and I'm going to keepmarketing there.
The back, like Lisa said, theback and forth is so inefficient
, such a waste of time and gasand everything.
It really is.
Sorry, Lisa, I didn't mean tocut you off, but that is really
good.
Speaker 4 (24:47):
That is perfect and that's I think we're good.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Cool, all right, that's a great answer.
Oh, annette, you've beentraining community liaisons for
almost a year now.
I guessed at that and I wasright, because it's about a week
away.
What makes this the greatestjob ever, and the reason I ask
that is because you get to seeseasoned folks, you get to see
owners, you get to see brand newpeople.
(25:12):
What is it about trainingothers?
That is just.
I know you like this and it's awonderful thing to do for
others.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
I think, because I was a community liaison too I
love seeing them grow and learnand get referrals.
It is a great job.
You're out.
You're not in an office nine tofive.
You're out meeting people.
You're helping families.
You're building lastingrelationships with referral
sources.
To this day I'm still friendswith some social workers from
(25:42):
back in the day when I worked asa community liaison, that we
have become close friends withFamilies, that I actually had a
family call me last week that Ihelped when they lived in the
senior living.
You're building lastingrelationships.
You're a problem solver.
Every day is different In thesales training.
We have new community liaisons.
(26:03):
We have experienced communityliaisons.
The exciting thing that I seeis if I have somebody really
experienced that we're in aclass and I teach them something
that they're like wow, I neverthought about that.
I've been doing this for years.
I didn't know that we could dobed sitting at a skilled nursing
home.
I never went to that side ofthe nursing home.
And also seeing these communityliaisons, usually by halfway
(26:26):
through our sales training, ifthey're doing everything we say,
they're getting referrals.
So it's exciting.
They're setting up lunch andlearns.
They're setting up meetings butit's a great job up lunch and
learns or setting up meetings.
But it's a great job if you, ifevery day is different you have
to go with the flow If you're,if you like meeting people and I
think again, like helpingpeople, like Lisa Dom, we all
(26:51):
said, you have to have thatcompassion and not be.
It's good to have some salesability.
Of course you want to likeclose, seal the deal, but you
don't want to be a salesy, youwant to.
They have to see that you carefirst and that you're passionate
about helping people andeverybody that comes through the
classes.
We have all different types ofpeople and it's just, it's
really exciting, especially thecommunity liaisons that we have
that come to our classes thatare maybe they've never done
this before, they've never beenmarketing ever.
(27:11):
They're afraid.
They're like oh, I don't knowwhat to say, I don't know what
to do.
We give you all the tools, wetell you what to say and I just
always remind everybody you'renot trying to talk them into
something they don't need.
Everybody needs home care thatyou're talking to.
They're patients, they'reresidents, so you're not trying
to walk in and sell themsomething they don't need.
(27:32):
So just, most people in homecare they're casual, they're
nice.
It's just a.
It's just a great job.
I think so yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
Yeah, I think being a problem solver is one of the
best I don't know.
It gives you a good feelingwhen you're able to do that for
families, helping them, socialworker, whoever.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely Allright, I'm I and I know you.
Ladies, I'm going to try to goto the next question so we don't
run out of too much time here.
Let's see, oh, this is a greatone no-transcript.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
You can't be really shy or afraid or be
unapproachable.
If you can't overcome that,it's going to be a little hard
for you because it's reallyboots on the ground.
You're getting out there,you're connecting, you're asking
to talk to the social worker oryour referral source.
So you have to be not too shy,you have to be okay with that
and I think somebody personableto be not too shy, you have to
(28:59):
be okay with that and I thinksomebody personable that's
likable not too pushy,pleasantly persistent.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
We were pretty much the same.
That's my word.
I love that word.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
I got that from Dawn.
It's so true.
It's so true because you haveto have.
You don't want to be that pushycar salesman Of course you
don't want to be but you have tobe pleasantly persistent and
sometimes you got to know whenit's right to go after that
client, maybe a little further.
Or reaching out to that socialworker and saying I really do
think this client is okay for us, let me come and see him, maybe
(29:28):
pursuing that a little more.
But if I would say I don't know, dawn, if you agree with me
about three months or so, Iwould say you can tell if
somebody's going to do it.
Speaker 3 (29:35):
I think you can tell and Annette's good at this
because people have been in thesales training class and she'll
say Dawn, this person's just not, they're not cut out for this.
And then I have to call theowner and tell the owner guess
what?
It hasn't happened a lot.
But she tells me and why wastemoney on a community liaison and
the cashflow of paying thatperson if it's not going to work
(29:56):
out?
And when I call the owner, Ithink it's happened twice.
Maybe they're like we have thesame reservation.
Thank you so much for lettingus know, Because not everybody's
cut out for this and this is atwofold job.
It's not just out cold callingand marketing, which is
difficult.
It's also selling that seniorand the adult children when it's
time to sign up for the job.
And sometimes most of the timeyou are piggybacking with the
(30:22):
adult child to convince mom ordad.
This is how it, this is thescenario, and so you have to get
a little.
You want to fall again, mrSmith?
You have to keep bathing.
You can't stop bathing.
Your daughter just wants us tomake sure you're safe while
you're in the shower.
Let's not fall again.
How many times do you bathe aweek?
Sometimes this is.
You have to make sure that it'sokay to be that way.
(30:42):
But there is that compassionthat has to come through for the
betterment of the client.
And when a social worker youcome back and say, yeah, mr
Smith signed up three daysa week, blah, blah, blah and she's I
can't believe you did that.
He's going to fall in theshower again.
Of course I signed him up.
So sometimes they're countingon you to be the person that can
get this senior to see thereality of their new life right
(31:05):
now and maybe it's not apermanent change, but maybe it
is.
And so the fact that they cangive you a referral and you can
make it happen Also it makestheir job easier.
It makes the adult children'sjob easier.
So that's a piece of it too isbeing able to be in charge when
you need to be in charge.
I'd say that's a big piece ofit as well.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
Yeah, and I so agree.
If you're meeting with thatsenior, you're signing them up
and they're refusing.
We don't want you to just walkout and close the door.
Sometimes you have to make'rerefusing.
We don't want you to just walkout and close the door.
Sometimes you have to makecompromises.
If I had somebody that was Iknew they were not going to sign
they were I'd say you know what?
Let's make a deal.
How about we try this for twoweeks?
Why don't we just try it fortwo weeks?
(31:48):
Let's see how that works?
And you know what.
They agreed to that and then,after two weeks, maybe they said
no, I still don't want it, okay.
But many times they said youknow what, it's going okay and
we like that.
That Susie you've sent, or Idon't know.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
I don't remember life before Susie, it's so much
better.
Thank you so much.
Yeah, yeah, getting them tojust try it for a couple of
weeks, although the schedulersdidn't like when I did that, I'm
like I promise it'll be good,they'll stay, they'll stay.
But yeah, that having to beable to do that and I've had
things thrown at me Get out ofmy room, I'm not talking.
Yeah, now I'm like okay, I'llcome back when you're ready, you
(32:23):
have to have thick skin too.
I would say another piece ofthis they don't, I don't want to
see big piece of it too isknowing when you have to be firm
and really just point out theobvious and when you don't, when
(32:45):
you can't.
Speaker 1 (32:47):
there are some situations where you just can't
Any other words of wisdom aboutbeing great, someone who's going
to be great at this job you cantell, because they're a social
butterfly.
Speaker 4 (33:01):
I agree with everything they were saying for
sure, just being able to be veryfluid, I feel like you just
have to be able to weave in andout.
I don't know any other way tosay that.
You just have to take thepunches as they come and know
what to give back and know howto deal with anything at any
time.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
Yeah, yeah, definitely roll with the punches
.
That's a good one.
All right, let's see what elseI got here.
What would you look for we justtalked about this.
Actually what would you lookfor if you were hiring a
community liaison today?
I think we've answered thatsomeone who is willing to take
charge a little bit, someone whoisn't shy.
And we'll have those hardconversations with families.
(33:38):
I think I can remember as moreof it as a case manager, but
saying, or a care manager sayingtalking to the senior about
that their daughter or son wasreally worried about them, and
when the senior would hear thosewords, they don't want their
family to worry about them.
They definitely don't.
So maybe implementing a fewservices or trying this for a
(34:01):
couple of weeks is a great idea.
So, anyway, just being able totalk the talk and help the
senior and the family understandthis doesn't have to be forever
, but let's get you through thenext couple of weeks or through
the next month or so and see howyou're doing, and then we can
reevaluate from there.
That kind of thing.
(34:22):
Let's see here, Okay, what's thebest advice for getting a
referral quickly?
You have to be willing to dowhat, and we've talked about
some of this consistency, but ifyou really are, you're starting
out and you want to get areferral quickly.
What are some things that youwould tell somebody to do?
Get that in-service scheduledor that.
(34:44):
How are you getting thatreferral quickly?
I?
Speaker 3 (34:47):
think the very first thing is they have to know that
they're going to step out oftheir comfort zone and they're
going to be really uncomfortablefor a while.
For a while like five in inservices in they're still going
to be uncomfortable and there'sa new building or a new social
worker.
Even if you've been doing thisfor two or three years, you
still get a little nervousbecause is it going to work this
(35:08):
time?
Am I going to get in this time?
Is it going to happen?
So I think being willing tostep out of your comfort zone
and knowing you're going to livethere for a while, if that's
what it takes until you buildthose relationships, yes, and it
doesn't happen overnight and itcan take five, six, seven times
before you even get to talk tothe social worker, and that is
totally normal I'd say.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
Being confident without being pushy is also like
pleasantly persistent.
I think that is a great way toget that.
Speaker 3 (35:40):
If you have your differentiator, you know what it
is and you know that it's ameaningful one.
You lean into that.
When they say I'm working withthese XYZ home care agencies, I
don't need another one, yeah,you do.
You don't know about me, youdon't know about this agency and
what we do, that's different.
So you do need to hear aboutwhat I'm doing, and it needs to.
So when, whatever that is, it'sgot to be worthwhile, right?
(36:03):
Because you've just said holdthe phone, listen to me, I have
something different for yourpatients.
It better be something reallydifferent.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
What is it Huh?
What is it that's different?
I think home care agencies havea hard time.
They do have a hard time withthe differentiator it can be
your caregiver training.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
It can be your backup plan.
It could be we had a leadcaregiver program so we could
start service in an hour if weneeded to.
God, I'm trying to think ofother things that that I have
done as differentiators.
We had a discharge package.
I've done invented all kinds ofrapid response program.
So if you call my office andyou say I have a rapid response,
(36:42):
you talk to nobody but theperson who's coming out to sign
that client up immediately, Likewe've reinvented ourselves a
million times.
But it needs to be important tothe senior.
It needs to be something thatthe discharge planner is gonna
go oh, my seniors will buy.
A discharge packet is beautiful.
That's a great way to get adischarge package.
(37:04):
That's all they do isdischarges all day long.
When you say the word dischargepackage and the senior likes it
and buys into it, you're golden.
There has to be something.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yeah, I think that's tough for a lot of folks.
But I also think dischargepackage is one I think you guys
teach and talk about and itworks really well With a flat
rate, and we can talk about thatin sales training too.
Yeah, certified or pick yourpoison, whichever one, whichever
(37:38):
thing you think is mostimportant, but being doing
dementia live training there's amillion of them out there and
making sure your caregivers areall or some subset of them that
deal with dementia clients areall trained specifically, or
maybe it is that you specializein 24 hour care.
Maybe you specialize in live inand 24 hour care.
Whatever it is, come up withsomething, and I know in sales
(38:01):
training class we talk aboutthat and don't people come back
to you and tell you what theirdifferentiators are.
They try to come up withsomething to give them one.
Speaker 3 (38:12):
Some of them do have their own, but we do give them
one that works quite well aswell, that's awesome, All right.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
Who are the people in the office?
I think this is oftenoverlooked.
Who should be the salesperson'sbiggest supporters?
Owners, schedulers what kind ofrelationships helped you close
more sales?
I would say that's the realquestion there.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
I would say every single person in that office.
If you're out on the road allday, you're not in operations.
If you're a full-time marketerout on the road which I was, and
they're in the office goingcrazy, but you might have to
call at a minute's notice andthat scheduler has to be able to
help you immediately.
The owner, the care manager,the executive director, the
(38:57):
office that I worked in, we werea team and we all, we all
worked together and if I wasn'tout there getting business and
they weren't able to fill theshifts and they didn't hire
caregivers, we wouldn't have abusiness.
So I think my biggest supportis was everybody in the office.
We had a really good connectionand if I didn't, like I said,
if I didn't get the business, ifour HR person did not hire
(39:20):
caregivers, if our schedulerwasn't scheduling doing well at
the scheduling, nothing wouldwork.
And also, our owner was veryinvolved and I think it's really
important when you have anowner that is involved and that
is even willing to go do a shiftif they have to Once in a great
while.
Speaker 3 (39:36):
We would all do shifts, but I would say I think
everybody I don't know if Dawnand Lisa agree or Yeah- I agree,
I think everybody too becausewhen you're out in the field all
day, some days you just getbeat up all day long.
You do.
You just feel completelydestroyed from your visits.
It just no one would let you in.
They looked at you like, oh God, here she is again and you are
(39:57):
getting beat up and you do needtheir support.
The worst thing that everhappened to me was I had been
working in an area called SunLakes very tough to break into.
It's very community, deep rootcommunity.
We even had to get a phonenumber with the prefix of Sun
Lakes to just get them to takeour calls Very community.
And I finally got a job.
I got a referral, went out,signed it I was so excited
(40:18):
called the schedule and she goesoh God, how am I going to ever
get that staffed?
We don't have caregivers outthere and it was so deflating
and she always reacted that wayand I finally went to the owner.
I'm like I'm out here killingmyself and I'm excited Like I
need her to be.
A fake it.
If you're not excited, justfake it for me Like I was.
I needed a high five.
(40:39):
So bad that day and I did notget one.
It was a slap in the face.
It was so bad.
So your schedulers, even thoughthey're stressed and they're
like today, right now, I have tofind someone now Like it does.
It needs to be a team becauseevery part affects the other
Recruiting, marketing,scheduling they all affect one
another and they all have to bemoving at the same speed, same
(41:00):
momentum, constantly andsupporting them, because no jobs
are easy, definitely.
Speaker 4 (41:08):
I'd like to just add that working in a company where
there was no one else but myselfand the owner, versus working
where they're and this isprobably where I learned how to
be able to schedule on the flyand also do my client care
duties and also go out and shakesome hands right, so being able
(41:28):
to have that support oh man,what a weight off of your
shoulders to be able to go.
Okay, I have.
I'm going to send you thissynopsis over to my scheduler.
This is what the person needs,this is what they want.
I already have a caregiver inmind, but being able to push
that over to someone and getthat support is huge.
It's just it's like night andday and I've experienced both
(41:51):
sides, so it's definitelyeveryone in the office, but that
scheduler, client care andreally helpful to have that
support being able to call youroffice and instead of we
actually had a client carecoordinator once.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
She didn't stay long, but I would have she'd go.
We're not taking them, they'retoo hard, or something like that
.
I'm like wait a minute, I justgot this referral.
We are going to make it work,let's go.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
You just trusted me enough to send me a referral and
you're not taking it.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
This is the first referral I had from this
resource.
The first referral has tohappen.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
This is the first referral I had from this
resource.
The first referral has tohappen, guys, has to happen.
The first referral.
I'll go myself, exactly.
You finally have trust for themto send you someone and you're
going to say oops, sorry, wecan't stop it.
Speaker 1 (42:32):
No, that's it, you can't do that Sounds to me like
if you're working with peoplewho are burned out, have become
toxic and they just aren't theyes people that you need or the
optimistic people that you need,then it might be time to
definitely raise your hand andsay something about I'm working
this hard and here's what'shappening.
(42:53):
I'm being defeated by my ownteam, and it's definitely worth
speaking up and saying somethingabout that, because people do
get burned out.
Speaker 3 (43:01):
Come on, Scheduling is hard.
I always understood why I gotthe reactions I got and they're
like we told you we didn't havepeople in this area.
Why are you marketing overthere?
And I would say I'm notmarketing over there.
The person in this sniff isstaying 30 miles from their
house and now they'redischarging to the area I was
not marketing and there'snothing I can do about that.
We've got to make it work.
(43:21):
I'm sorry, you don't alwayshave control over that.
They could be at a sniff 30miles from their house and
you're marketing where you'resupposed to be because you got
caregivers over there and thenthey discharge home 30 miles
away.
You still have to make it workand so I get that.
It's tough for scheduling.
It's a tough job.
Speaker 2 (43:37):
Oh it is, and if you have a great we had a great
scheduler and I just think it'sa tough job, but everybody has
to work together and it reallyit's just a team effort.
You're out there getting thatbusiness and they have to, and I
think that's how the bestagencies I think that are the
most successful is everybodyworking together and making it
happen 100%.
Speaker 1 (43:57):
Yeah and making it happen 100% yeah.
And so I'm going to put a littlecommercial in here.
But you guys have accumulated40 or more video testimonials
this year alone, and not thisyear in the last year alone, and
they're amazing.
They're amazing testimonials,you guys, and we have all of
(44:20):
them.
If you go to sellinghomecarecom, forward slash.
Yes, our website address ismuch longer than, and she's just
so full of golden nuggets andgreat ideas, and I don't want to
(44:47):
promise anything that's outsideof the scope of what we do, but
you guys even text back andforth with people who are having
challenging days and thingslike that, right.
Speaker 3 (44:56):
Yeah, of course I see them.
They'll text Annette and say mylunch and learn is in an hour
and I know we went through it.
But I have one quick questionand that girl is on the phone
with them in seconds.
Like she, annette is diehard.
Speaker 2 (45:10):
But I do want to say too, like Dawn created this
program and we all live indifferent States and it's just
amazing how, when I saw thesales training, I was like this
is what I did, and it doesn'tmatter where you live.
You may have different rulesand regulations with your state,
but it's all the same.
It's establishing thoserelationships, being different
(45:32):
from the other home careagencies.
It's all about being there andhaving them see you.
They need to see your face andyou have to connect with them
and we teach that all and it'snice to see everybody.
Like by week six, if people arefollowing what we tell them to
do.
They're getting private payreferrals, they host lunch and
(45:52):
learns in services.
They've never done that before.
So it's really exciting to seeeven somebody that's never done
marketing before.
You can have somebody with nomarketing experience and they do
phenomenal.
So it's not like it's you know,if you have somebody that
doesn't have any salesexperience.
I've seen people do very wellthat don't have sales experience
.
Speaker 3 (46:10):
Yep, I think too the reason that this works is
because it's 90 days.
I've trained lots of marketersin my time.
It's not a one and done, it'snot a one weekend bootcamp, it's
not even a week long bootcampthey need, and this is what we
do.
We teach all about skillednursing facility.
This is exactly who, what yousay, what you bring with you,
what you can expect.
(46:31):
They're thinking about you.
So you're ready for thoseobjections when they come flying
out of their mouth.
You are ready to overcome them.
We do all of that about skillednursing and then you go do it,
and then you come back next weekand we talk about it and you
not only get to, we deal withwhat happened with you the good,
the bad, the ugly and we do thesame with everybody in class,
(46:51):
with six to seven people.
So you're learning from that.
And then the next week we dothe same thing for independent
living, and then we do memorycare, and so it's the back and
forth and it's that mentorship.
We hold you accountable withhomework.
It's that is making this work.
It's not a one and done.
It's impossible.
One and done doesn't work withthis.
It's too involved and you can'tanticipate everything that's
(47:11):
going to happen.
And so when you come back withsomething that's happened, you
need help with what do I do?
Just quit going there, becausethat's what we want to do as
humans.
I just don't want to go backthere ever again.
That's not an option.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
So anyway, I think that's why it works.
I would totally agree with that.
And just little things likedidn't somebody go to a skilled
facility?
She was brand new and she tookthem some kind of cookies from
Starbucks, but the little bagsweren't closed, the kind like a.
You stick it to that.
Speaker 2 (47:44):
Fell out of the bag.
Fell out of the bag.
Speaker 1 (47:46):
Yeah, and the social worker had a complete fit about
that, I think.
Speaker 3 (47:51):
So she came back and we helped her with that.
We walked her through that.
She didn't quit going there andwe walked her through that
problem.
And Annette has people who havebeen through sales training and
done that even reached out.
This has happened and we don'tlike just disappear, we're just,
we want to help.
That's who we are.
Speaker 1 (48:08):
Yeah, so we have training classes starting all
the time and the next two thatare starting are April 15.
And April 30th.
So when we say that, what wemean is that the April 15th
class is every Tuesday at 1.30pm Eastern.
You're going to have tocalculate what your time zone is
and you meet once a week for 12weeks and an hour each time yes
(48:33):
, for one hour.
So wherever you are hopefullysomewhere quiet where you can
listen and talk in, and it'ssmall groups of people and you
are not in a class with someonewho's a direct competitor of
yours in the same territory.
We try to make that very clearso that you don't have to feel
like you can't talk about whatyou were doing or where you were
(48:55):
because somebody else this nextstory is also in the class.
We don't do that Very carefulabout that.
So it's a really nice way tohave some colleagues once a week
and you're learning, but you'realso like in counseling.
Speaker 3 (49:09):
And I don't know if you know this, but they stay in
touch with each other.
The people that stay in touchwith each other and're just.
They help each other.
It's so exciting to see what'shappened.
Speaker 2 (49:22):
I just love it.
Lisa helps me on the week 12.
She's always in my week 12classes and we it's we've we've
all grown to know each othermore and they're always sad it's
going to be over.
But, like Dawn said, peopleshare their emails and their
phone numbers, their differentagencies from different states
(49:42):
and also in the classes theyshare.
Maybe they have a different wayof doing things and something
that's really worked for them.
I love how everybody sharestheir personal experiences and
it also gives we have alldifferent levels in our classes.
When they see somebody that'sdoing really well and there's
maybe somebody that's newer atthis, I think it gives them more
(50:02):
ambition to get out there anddo better too.
Speaker 1 (50:06):
I just made the screen all crazy.
Where did I go?
Oh no, everything's crazy, it'sall gone.
So, anyway, hopefully we cansee each other.
Yes, okay, and what else was it?
Oh, so we have two classescoming up April 15th and 30th,
and there'll be some more in May, and then also we have
continuum, which is twice amonth, and we talk about all
(50:29):
kinds of different things duringcontinuum, including digital
and in-person sales, and Lisacreates handouts for four months
in advance that you can takeadvantage of.
They are not she creates them,you have to customize them
yourself advance that you cantake advantage of.
They are not she creates them,you have to customize them
yourself, but you can do all ofthat.
She gives you ideas forleave-behinds.
Everything is put together, soall you have to do is print it,
(50:51):
get the goodies and go.
You don't have to think aboutanything, just have everything
available to you.
A continuum is also a great wayto stay in touch and stay
involved or, if you've neverbeen through sales training,
participate in that.
You can sign up for that.
So does anybody have anyquestions for any of these
ladies about sales training?
(51:12):
Closing the deal?
I think one of the things thatpeople ask about is or maybe
people have trouble with isasking for the referral, and
that's sometimes tough to getpast.
So I think training reallyhelps people get through all of
those reservations.
Speaker 3 (51:31):
Yeah, I would think that is the hardest challenge
probably is well, being out ofyour comfort zone, but then
asking for the referral can bedifficult, but we work through
all of that.
There's a one liner for everytype of referral source.
Speaker 2 (51:45):
Yeah, we have a whole class on that where and it's
pretty simple.
Once we go through the class,you know they're like OK, I just
ask if they have any patientsdischarging today.
Ok, I didn't think about that.
And then the social worker juststarts thinking about everybody
she has that you can help herwith.
Speaker 1 (52:03):
Yeah, absolutely All right.
I think that's it.
We've used our hour.
We're like right on time.
So thank you, ladies, forhaving to chat with me and for
all the other folks that signedup to listen.
Speaker 2 (52:16):
And then I just want to say Tam Tamara has a question
, but we can get back, we can.
Speaker 4 (52:21):
Yeah, I was okay yeah , I was just messaging her.
We'll get back to her thanksfor coming everybody thank you
everyone, bye-bye, see you later.
Thanks for joining us everybody.
We're going to talk about thescience of selling home care and
the first thing we're going todo today we did a little
housekeeping, so I know you canhear me and see me and I know
we're recording.
So we are going to talkintroductions next, and I want
to just quickly introduce myself, because I'm really not the
person that is the star of theshow today.
(00:21):
It's these other lovely ladiesand Annette, who is our main
trainer she is amazing who aregoing to talk about themselves
and their experience.
I'm Valerie Van Boeven.
I'm the co-owner of ApprovedSenior Network.
I'm a registered nurse and I'vehad every role and job as a
nurse you could possibly imagine.
(00:42):
And yeah, but 18 years ago or17 years ago, I started Approved
Senior Network, or at that time, was called LTC Expert
Publication.
So I'm old, I love digitalmarketing.
It's my game, it's my thing,it's my thing I love to do, and
these ladies, however, areamazing at sales in home care,
(01:03):
so we're going to talk to themamazing at sales in home care,
so we're going to talk to them.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Annette, why don't you introduce yourself a?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
little bit.
Don't say too much, because I'mgoing to ask you a bunch of
questions, sure.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Hello everybody.
I'm Annette Ziegler and I havebeen with ASN.
In about a week or so it'sgoing to be a year.
Woohoo, went by quick.
I've been in home care not toage myself either.
20 plus years.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
I teach the sales training courses here and I just
love what I do.
Yay and Dawn yes, hi, I'm DawnFiela.
I've also been in home care fora long time and I will be here
three years in May, so that'salso coming up and it has just
flown by.
I love working with all of thehome care agencies.
We are always helping them withjust about everything, not just
digital marketing.
(01:49):
Feet on the ground how do Ihire?
Why are my caregiver applicantspoor quality lately?
Like we are an all in one.
Help you as much as we can andI love my job.
I miss home care sometimes, butI get enough of it with you
guys.
Thank you for being here today.
You're going to learn quite abit.
Lisa, you're up.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
Okay, my unmuted Okay .
Hi, I'm Lisa.
I've been here for two yearsand before this I had two
different loves.
One was it was newspaper andthe internet came around, and
then I learned internetadvertising as well as home care
.
I did everything and anythingin home care imaginable, from
(02:26):
client care to marketing to 3amshifts, you name it.
I've been in the trenches ofhome care and I just love home
care.
I really love being a part ofit every day with you guys, no
matter what it is, and I reallylove watching the growth and all
of that.
So I'm happy to be here.
Thanks for having me andlooking forward to this.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah, me too, okay.
So now I'm just going to saythis I didn't put a lot of work
in this PowerPoint because it'sreally about the voices on the
screen and the people that aregoing to talk to you.
So look at this dingy AI.
It's set in history and it gaveme world history.
Ai history that gave me worldhistory.
We're not as old as people inMesopotamia, but we will talk
(03:09):
about history a little bit, allright, and all of you can answer
this.
We're going to start withAnnette Sure, and because she is
the person that almosteverybody talks to, or everybody
does talk to, if they gothrough sales training along
with Lisa and Dawn.
But tell us about your historywith selling home care, who you
worked for, how it started.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
Okay, so actually it started back in 2004.
There was a really large CCRCthat was continuing care
community that was being builtright around the corner from my
house.
I used to drive by it often.
It was not built yet.
They had a big trailer andsenior.
I was always in marketing.
Senior living always interestedme.
(03:52):
My parents had me older in lifeand younger with my children.
I had to take care of them.
So I went through a lot movinghospice, moving to assisted
living.
So it interested me lot movinghospice, moving to assisted
living.
So it interests me.
So I started working for it wascalled Cherry Ridge.
It was a St Ann's community, avery large community here in
(04:13):
upstate New York, as a Bermudanrepresentative and I actually
started in the trailer and welooking out the window it was
just land and this community wasgoing to be built.
But we could.
They would not build it untilwe sold a certain amount.
So we had cottages, independentliving apartments, assisted
living, memory care, skillednursing and we had to sell a
(04:33):
certain amount of people, have acertain amount of people sign
up before they can even startbuilding.
So fast forward they built thewhole community.
They finally built a couplecottages and then we moved in
the cottage and that was myoffice.
It was beautiful and I workedthere for 13 years.
I was in the marketing.
I moved people in independentliving, assisted living, memory
(04:56):
care, and during my tenure thereI referred home care agencies
constantly to help theseresidents that needed extra
assistance.
And then it was like I said, Iwas there about 13 years and I
had.
I wanted to do somethingdifferent and I connected with a
home care agency that I usedoften at this community and the
owner offered me a position asthe community liaison marketing
(05:19):
manager.
So I started there and I workedfor this home care agency for
about seven and a half years.
I helped them grow from onemillion to four million.
It really helped me when I movedinto that role because I knew I
had a lot of connections.
I knew what senior living wasall about and, again, having
older parents, I understoodabout needing home care and so
(05:41):
forth.
Trying not to go too longwinded, but I just so you can
understand my history I reallylove home care.
I liked working in a CCRC, butit's so nice to see people age
in place at home, wherever homemay be, but to have them stay at
home and live in their houseand see all their treasures and
be able to stay there and getthe care they need.
(06:02):
That's really where my heartwas, so it's a little bit about
me.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
Awesome and I knew you had such an amazing history
with all of this, but I neverheard the whole story, and
that's lovely to have.
You've got a lot of tenure inall these places that you've
worked, so that's awesome.
I understand it all.
Yeah, you've seen everything.
So, dr Lisa, how long did youguys work in home care?
Speaker 3 (06:27):
I was at Home Instead Senior Care.
We were the number one officefor 10 years, started in sales,
outside sales, community liaison, and then was promoted to
operations manager and we grewby millions and millions of
dollars.
There were probably a thousandoffices when I left there across
the country and even in otherparts of the world, and more
(06:47):
recently an independent homecare agency who couldn't get the
private pay side of it.
They had a pretty good Medicaidside.
As we know, the margins aren'tgreat with Medicaid so they were
trying to break into theprivate pay and we did get to
about 3.5 million in under fouryears in private pay.
So in that company I was overrecruiting, retention and sales
(07:08):
and so we grew quite quickly andall the things that worked for
me through the years we aredoing in the sales training
class.
So yeah, that's a little bitabout me.
Speaker 4 (07:21):
All right, lisa, for me, gosh, it started way back
when I was a little kid.
I want to say I have that, thatstory that people bring up, that
I lived with my grandmother andso I saw firsthand what she
needed and I did a lot of thosethings as a little kid and from
there it just was built intowhere I knew I've always been a,
I want to take care of peopleand I want to help, right.
(07:44):
But then I was like I also wantto help in these other ways
where we can grow, and so Iworked for quite a few smaller
boutique style agencies to helpthem get from the ground up.
And then I've also worked forsome a couple of different
franchises as far as themarketing or the branch manager
or, just again, doing justeverything, especially when
(08:04):
you're building from the groundup, when you're starting a new
business.
I've done all of that.
So getting it to where it'sestablished and then branching
out to new locations and thingslike that, all of that stuff
super fun.
It's all a part of things thatI love to do.
So, yeah, started when.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
I was a little one, so you got.
You have a hundred years worthof knowledge right here.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
Yeah, and in home care it's rapid speed by fire
too.
It's not just it's, it's justreally fast.
Everything is very fast paced,so it's even more than that.
Probably one day feels like aweek.
Oh yeah, home care for sure.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
I always say I'm 200 years old in nurse years.
It's the same thing.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
It's, yeah, it's more than dog years.
For sure, for sure, oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
So what do you think made you a great home care
community liaison, miss Annette.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
I would say I have compassion, I have empathy.
I loved helping seniors.
I loved helping families.
I loved helping people solvetheir problems and helping them,
providing them with home care.
I've always been a verymission-driven person.
I like to succeed and I lovedthe drive and making sure that I
(09:24):
was helping our agency growwith lots of referrals.
So I really had a drive in methat excited me.
If somebody called me withreferrals, I would for a skilled
nursing facility called me.
I would be there, I would makeit happen.
So I think and also too, I wasable to multitask.
In this kind of business Thingschange day by day, hour by hour
.
I think because I was able toaccept that and realize that I
(09:49):
could be doing one thing and geta call for a 24-7, and I was
able to switch what I was doingand help people.
So I think I had everythingthat I needed to make me succeed
and I really did.
I really loved what I did.
I loved meeting the families.
I think my what I love the bestwas meeting the our clients
(10:10):
that we signed up and hearingtheir stories.
That was one of my favoritethings doing the assessments and
our clients.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Yeah, you gotta love.
You gotta love this business.
Yeah, really do.
And Dawn, what made you?
I know I think I know what madeyou great home care, community
liaison.
You're very organized andyou're very good, and I know
that.
But that's true.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
I'm very, whatever that is I am.
I have a lot of the socialworkers and the people that
you're going to meet out in thecommunity.
For those of you that are doingthis right now, you can't come
off like a used car salesman.
You have to be driven, you haveto have that sales ability to
make it, but you also have tohave a love for the mission,
(10:53):
because that's what keeps yougoing.
And when they see that heartcome out and you can sell,
that's a win.
It's the two things combined.
You can't fake it in thisbusiness If it's just about the
money and the paycheck and thecommission, they're going to see
right through that and they'renot going to refer to you.
They need to see your heart andyour passion and the fact that
you are willing to drive 15miles to go meet with a family
(11:16):
right now because all of asudden they're discharging today
at four o'clock and it wassupposed to be three days from
now.
The fact that you'll do that notbecause of the commission and
the money, but because you wantthis person to come home with a
caregiver and to have asuccessful discharge.
You're a part of the successfuldischarge that social worker's
counting on and whatever drivesyou to do that.
They need to see the missionand the passion for the business
(11:39):
and the care for the seniors inorder for you to be a really
great community liaison.
And you need to juggle, asAnnette said, the multitasking I
hired somebody in my early daysmaybe one of the first
marketers I hired didn't reallyknow what I was doing yet and
she literally spun in a circlein the office Like she didn't
know what.
There were like three things todo and she didn't know what do
I do first?
(11:59):
So the multitasking you'rebalancing a bunch of stuff over
here and you're on the phone andyou're just running.
That's adrenaline, that's funfor me.
I thought it was fun.
There's other people that can'tsucceed in that environment at
all.
Yeah, I don't know.
I think that's what helped me.
I really did have a very.
I still have a strong passionfor the industry and the seniors
(12:20):
and their wellbeing, andthey've earned the right to stay
home if that's what they want.
I feel like they've aged.
They've done all the right.
Maybe they didn't do everythingright, maybe they're not eating
well, I don't know, but they'veearned the right after all of
these, years took all the shotsas long as it's safe to do so,
definitely.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
That's great.
And, lisa, I agree with all ofthose things that you guys are
saying.
I have like super high ADHD andthat's what helped me just be
that, be able to juggle, but inin anywhere I just floated,
floated around, that's maybe the.
That's Dawn's like deep, mineis like floating around like a
little butterfly everywhere Ican describe it and just got to
(12:58):
know everyone and buildrelationships and I think the
secret is knowing that littledetail that no one else would
remember about people.
That always helps me and Itruly care about whatever it is,
whether it's getting the seniorhome, making sure that they
have a good caregiver not just acaregiver, but a good, great
caregiver and just talking topeople like I would want to be
(13:20):
talked to, treated that way.
So I think that resonates withpeople just being real, getting
in where you fit in and justfiguring it out from there.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Yeah, absolutely, and detail is definitely.
That's a golden nugget rightthere.
Pay attention to detail, andLisa's a master at that.
I got a lemon meringue pie formy birthday.
Who knows that?
Who does that?
Who knows that I love lemonmeringue pie?
We don't work in the sameoffice every day.
Speaker 3 (13:47):
You mentioned it for a brief split second and she's a
liaison.
She got into it and went for it.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
That's part of the challenge, and she ordered it
and then she had somebody elseon the team delivered to my
house.
I was like what, what, and itwas so good.
Speaker 4 (14:03):
Anyway, I'm glad.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
No, okay, all right, great, all right.
Okay, we're going to talk alittle bit about trust here, and
all of this that we're talkingabout is we are going to talk
about at the end here what salesefforts and some more tangible
things, but everything theseladies are telling you is you
(14:25):
are the skills, the attitude,the place you need to be in, or
that you need your sales personto be in in order to really
close the deals.
So, thinking back, what werethe events and efforts that you
think made the most differencein building trust with referral
sources?
So, things that you organized,things that you did, what was it
(14:46):
that really helped?
Just think of one or two thingsthat helped them believe in you
and go ahead.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
I'm not even going to interject For, like events,
having in-services and lunch andlearns, having them understand
what we offer and how we can bethere in a split second, come to
see their patients on the sameday that they're discharging,
showing them always beingavailable, letting them know
this job.
It's really not nine to five.
You do get calls, sometimesafter five around the weekends,
(15:16):
If they call you and they're inan emergency situation, that
you're going to be there andyou're going to help them with
their patients, their residentsand do whatever it takes.
But I think having them see youin action you know how quickly
you can sign up a patient,letting them see you, help them.
This patient go home with theservices before they're
(15:36):
discharged from, say, a rehab, ahospital, and them seeing you
in action I think builds thetrust and always have been a
good communicator, I think, withyour referral sources.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Like taking those Friday discharges, those late
afternoon Friday afternoondischarges that nobody else will
call back.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
Yep, Four o'clock on a Friday or on a weekend, I I'll
tell you, myself and ourscheduler, it was like a.
We thrived on it.
They would call and we wouldmake it happen and it was just
exciting.
Sometimes we were able to getthere, have a caregiver there in
an hour or two.
That's amazing they had maybethey had a resident come home to
(16:14):
an assisted living that was inrehab and they were really
unsteady on their feet and theydidn't know how they were going
to make it on the weekend.
So they called me, I made ithappen and I solved their
problem.
But I was happy to do that andthat's part of the business.
And then by doing that I was onspeed dial.
They called me on my cell phonebecause they knew if they call
me on a Friday or a weekend, Iwas going to answer and I was
(16:37):
going to help them.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
And Dawn, yeah.
So I think if I were watchingthis I would be thinking how do
you get them to think of you ona Friday, or how do you get the
trust for them to even try thefirst time?
And so there are fiveimpressions to get them to trust
you.
We have it down to a sciencenow, and a lot of it is about
the relationship you're building.
(17:02):
You're building a foundation ofa relationship, not a one and
done.
It's about consistency, it'sabout reliability, it's about
being different.
You have to have a realdifferentiator, not a.
My staff stays till the job'sdone.
So what my caregivers reallycare about the clients.
They all say that you have tohave something that really makes
(17:22):
you stand out.
It could be your caregivertraining.
It could be your backup plan.
If the caregiver calls out,that's a negative thing, but you
can make it a positive thing.
People get sick.
It's life, it could be allkinds of things.
But you have to have adifferentiator to get in the
door in the first place so thatyou can build trust.
The kind of trust you need isdeep embedded trust.
(17:44):
If you have a caregiver intheir building doing an
overnight awake and thatcaregiver falls asleep, your
relationship should be so goodthat they pull you aside and say
, hey, your caregiver, lastnight she fell asleep and you
should be able to bounce backfrom that.
That's the kind of relationshipyou need and it's about being
consistent.
You have to go every eight to10 days.
There has to be some sort ofcontact with that referral
(18:08):
source every eight to 10 days.
It's not going to be aface-to-face every time.
Once a month you get aface-to-face.
What are you going to do inbetween?
It can't be a brochure.
You have to have a leave behindsomething important, something
that matters, something fun,something different.
So there's a lot going on withthis to get that trust built,
something different.
So there's a lot going on withthis to get that trust built.
So I think it's just the.
For me it's the consistency,the reliability and just always
(18:31):
being there, being respectful oftheir time.
Don't be a plopper.
I had a referral source call meabout marketers and she's she's
a plopper.
I don't want her coming in andplopping down in front of my
desk and just sitting there.
I have to work late now becauseshe sat here for 20 minutes.
Don't sit unless they ask you.
Be respectful of their time.
Don't expect and make them comeout and see you every time you
(18:51):
come into the building.
So it's just a mutual respectand they need to start seeing
you as a partner, more than avendor or referral source,
someone who is a home caresource for them.
They need to see you as apartner.
They're the social workerexpert and you're the home care
expert.
Someone needs home care.
I'm calling her.
That's what I would say melissamarceau, yeah I'm just gonna
(19:16):
agree with all of that.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
I just letting someone see you in action is
just a really big deal.
If they see you and they seeyou just handled everything like
they're going to come back toyou always, they're going to
trust you.
So I agree with everything youguys said, for sure yeah, I,
yeah, that is.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
I've heard this enough times now that I know all
of that is true.
I think consistency is wheresome folks start falling off the
mark, and that is one thingthat we all.
Speaker 3 (19:47):
I can tell you here in the summer and probably in
other places in the winter, noone's outside like it's
miserable.
That's when you go.
That's you're going to get inand get to see them.
It's Christmas week Go, no oneelse is going in there.
You want to face the face withyour social worker?
Go when no one else is going.
That consistency and that alwaysbeing there and it works,
(20:08):
because when I wasn't there fora week because I was on vacation
, guess what Phones were deadthe next week, dead
Cricketsickets because I leftfor a week.
That's how quick it changes.
You have to go every week andif you go on because you tell
them ahead of time I will begone, but I am coming back and
you double time it and get infront of everybody right when
you get back.
It's that quick because theyhave people coming in behind you
(20:31):
saying the same things andmaybe bad things sometimes, and
dropping off something better.
Maybe they brought them donuts,maybe they did something that
wowed them.
Now they're going to get a shotright, and then you've got to
earn your way back in.
So you got to go consistently,especially when nobody else is
going.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
Great, and I think that's a differentiator to
people that are consistent,because I would bet that
probably 20% actually areconsistent, consistent going
back all the time, and so thoseare.
That's your real competition isthose people who are just like
you.
Speaker 3 (21:07):
And you see their stuff, you see their brochure.
Oh, she was.
I saw her stuff last week.
What are we following eachother?
You start to know real quicklywho your stiff competitors are.
You just have to find a way tostand out.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
All right, great stuff, great nuggets of wisdom.
If you were starting all overagain today, what would be your
first priority of the week or ofthe month?
So what do you do first, rightout of the gate?
Speaker 2 (21:35):
So brand new, just starting this position.
I would qualify referralsources in my area, making map
out see who's out there whowould be where I would get
private pay referrals.
Mapping out all different typesof referral sources that I
would see in my area.
Make sure I have a communitypresence.
Connect with, maybe, referralssources that I already know.
(21:57):
Thinking about what my agency.
I think, just like Dawn said,you have to have a
differentiator.
So thinking about how I canpresent our agency and that it
could be different from the 10different home care agencies
that I had competition with.
Why are they going to listen tome?
Why am I different?
How can we help?
So I think this is what I woulddo.
Speaker 3 (22:19):
Yeah, dawn, I would qualify my referral sources.
There's a Medicare website.
You can go on and look at allthe SNFs in your area anyone
getting paid by Medicare and seewhat they're all about.
I would do that.
First I would build myself aroute sheet.
I would make sure I had areally good elevator speech with
(22:42):
a differentiator.
I'd make sure I could roll thatoff my tongue in my sleep if
need be, and then I would hitthe sniff.
If all I had time to do was goto sniffs because there's a lot
here in Phoenix where I'm atlots and lots of them that is
where I would be spending amajority of my time.
Skilled nursing facilities getto know them.
When I get someone face-to-face, get a lunch and learn
scheduled because I may neversee their face again, they're
very hard to get in front of.
Get in front of them, schedulethat lunch and learn, and you're
(23:04):
golden.
It's harder than that, but if Iwere starting over knowing what
I know now, that is where Iwould start.
Speaker 1 (23:10):
Perfect, Lisa.
Anything to add to that?
Are you floating around like abutterfly?
I'm floating.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
I was going to say I would just case the joint.
Make sure I know what everyoneelse is doing.
My competitors are doing too.
Out there.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Oh, yes, call them Secret shop.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
I shop them a little bit and then I'm going to set up
a plan of who are my top 25that I'm going to go out to
right now Sniffs for sure,Medicaregov also for sure Just
to compare and see what I'mdealing with and just create
that route.
When I first started, Iremember a lady that I worked
with said you can't just bepinging around like this.
You got to create.
And I was like you know what?
You're right, Let me createthis.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
Sort your referral sources by zip code.
Do it now.
Do it now Because if you'reover here, I'm going to talk
about where I am, if I'm inPhoenix and I'm marketing and
I'm getting it like I'm beingreal successful, it's going
really well.
And then I get a call in Mesa.
Can you come talk to thisfamily?
They're discharging tomorrow.
I'm going to drop everything andgo talk to the family in Mesa,
not only because it's incentive,but it's because it's the right
(24:13):
thing to do.
This person's got to have carewhen they get home.
And this is your opportunity toprove yourself.
See the social worker on yourway in to see that family.
I'm done with the family.
It's one o'clock.
Am I going to drive all the wayback to Phoenix to keep
marketing?
No, I'm going to pull up my zipcode locator and I'm going to
look for all the sniffs or myreferral sources in Mesa by zip
(24:33):
code and I'm going to keepmarketing there.
The back, like Lisa said, theback and forth is so inefficient
, such a waste of time and gasand everything.
It really is.
Sorry, Lisa, I didn't mean tocut you off, but that is really
good.
Speaker 4 (24:47):
That is perfect and that's I think we're good.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Cool, all right, that's a great answer.
Oh, annette, you've beentraining community liaisons for
almost a year now.
I guessed at that and I wasright, because it's about a week
away.
What makes this the greatestjob ever, and the reason I ask
that is because you get to seeseasoned folks, you get to see
owners, you get to see brand newpeople.
(25:12):
What is it about trainingothers?
That is just.
I know you like this and it's awonderful thing to do for
others.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
I think, because I was a community liaison too I
love seeing them grow and learnand get referrals.
It is a great job.
You're out.
You're not in an office nine tofive.
You're out meeting people.
You're helping families.
You're building lastingrelationships with referral
sources.
To this day I'm still friendswith some social workers from
(25:42):
back in the day when I worked asa community liaison, that we
have become close friends withFamilies, that I actually had a
family call me last week that Ihelped when they lived in the
senior living.
You're building lastingrelationships.
You're a problem solver.
Every day is different In thesales training.
We have new community liaisons.
(26:03):
We have experienced communityliaisons.
The exciting thing that I seeis if I have somebody really
experienced that we're in aclass and I teach them something
that they're like wow, I neverthought about that.
I've been doing this for years.
I didn't know that we could dobed sitting at a skilled nursing
home.
I never went to that side ofthe nursing home.
And also seeing these communityliaisons, usually by halfway
(26:26):
through our sales training, ifthey're doing everything we say,
they're getting referrals.
So it's exciting.
They're setting up lunch andlearns.
They're setting up meetings butit's a great job up lunch and
learns or setting up meetings.
But it's a great job if you, ifevery day is different you have
to go with the flow If you're,if you like meeting people and I
think again, like helpingpeople, like Lisa Dom, we all
(26:51):
said, you have to have thatcompassion and not be.
It's good to have some salesability.
Of course you want to likeclose, seal the deal, but you
don't want to be a salesy, youwant to.
They have to see that you carefirst and that you're passionate
about helping people andeverybody that comes through the
classes.
We have all different types ofpeople and it's just, it's
really exciting, especially thecommunity liaisons that we have
that come to our classes thatare maybe they've never done
this before, they've never beenmarketing ever.
(27:11):
They're afraid.
They're like oh, I don't knowwhat to say, I don't know what
to do.
We give you all the tools, wetell you what to say and I just
always remind everybody you'renot trying to talk them into
something they don't need.
Everybody needs home care thatyou're talking to.
They're patients, they'reresidents, so you're not trying
to walk in and sell themsomething they don't need.
(27:32):
So just, most people in homecare they're casual, they're
nice.
It's just a.
It's just a great job.
I think so yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
Yeah, I think being a problem solver is one of the
best I don't know.
It gives you a good feelingwhen you're able to do that for
families, helping them, socialworker, whoever.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely Allright, I'm I and I know you.
Ladies, I'm going to try to goto the next question so we don't
run out of too much time here.
Let's see, oh, this is a greatone no-transcript.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
You can't be really shy or afraid or be
unapproachable.
If you can't overcome that,it's going to be a little hard
for you because it's reallyboots on the ground.
You're getting out there,you're connecting, you're asking
to talk to the social worker oryour referral source.
So you have to be not too shy,you have to be okay with that
and I think somebody personableto be not too shy, you have to
(28:59):
be okay with that and I thinksomebody personable that's
likable not too pushy,pleasantly persistent.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
We were pretty much the same.
That's my word.
I love that word.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
I got that from Dawn.
It's so true.
It's so true because you haveto have.
You don't want to be that pushycar salesman Of course you
don't want to be but you have tobe pleasantly persistent and
sometimes you got to know whenit's right to go after that
client, maybe a little further.
Or reaching out to that socialworker and saying I really do
think this client is okay for us, let me come and see him, maybe
(29:28):
pursuing that a little more.
But if I would say I don't know, dawn, if you agree with me
about three months or so, Iwould say you can tell if
somebody's going to do it.
Speaker 3 (29:35):
I think you can tell and Annette's good at this
because people have been in thesales training class and she'll
say Dawn, this person's just not, they're not cut out for this.
And then I have to call theowner and tell the owner guess
what?
It hasn't happened a lot.
But she tells me and why wastemoney on a community liaison and
the cashflow of paying thatperson if it's not going to work
(29:56):
out?
And when I call the owner, Ithink it's happened twice.
Maybe they're like we have thesame reservation.
Thank you so much for lettingus know, Because not everybody's
cut out for this and this is atwofold job.
It's not just out cold callingand marketing, which is
difficult.
It's also selling that seniorand the adult children when it's
time to sign up for the job.
And sometimes most of the timeyou are piggybacking with the
(30:22):
adult child to convince mom ordad.
This is how it, this is thescenario, and so you have to get
a little.
You want to fall again, mrSmith?
You have to keep bathing.
You can't stop bathing.
Your daughter just wants us tomake sure you're safe while
you're in the shower.
Let's not fall again.
How many times do you bathe aweek?
Sometimes this is.
You have to make sure that it'sokay to be that way.
(30:42):
But there is that compassionthat has to come through for the
betterment of the client.
And when a social worker youcome back and say, yeah, mr
Smith signed up three daysa week, blah, blah, blah and she's I
can't believe you did that.
He's going to fall in theshower again.
Of course I signed him up.
So sometimes they're countingon you to be the person that can
get this senior to see thereality of their new life right
(31:05):
now and maybe it's not apermanent change, but maybe it
is.
And so the fact that they cangive you a referral and you can
make it happen Also it makestheir job easier.
It makes the adult children'sjob easier.
So that's a piece of it too isbeing able to be in charge when
you need to be in charge.
I'd say that's a big piece ofit as well.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
Yeah, and I so agree.
If you're meeting with thatsenior, you're signing them up
and they're refusing.
We don't want you to just walkout and close the door.
Sometimes you have to make'rerefusing.
We don't want you to just walkout and close the door.
Sometimes you have to makecompromises.
If I had somebody that was Iknew they were not going to sign
they were I'd say you know what?
Let's make a deal.
How about we try this for twoweeks?
Why don't we just try it fortwo weeks?
(31:48):
Let's see how that works?
And you know what.
They agreed to that and then,after two weeks, maybe they said
no, I still don't want it, okay.
But many times they said youknow what, it's going okay and
we like that.
That Susie you've sent, or Idon't know.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
I don't remember life before Susie, it's so much
better.
Thank you so much.
Yeah, yeah, getting them tojust try it for a couple of
weeks, although the schedulersdidn't like when I did that, I'm
like I promise it'll be good,they'll stay, they'll stay.
But yeah, that having to beable to do that and I've had
things thrown at me Get out ofmy room, I'm not talking.
Yeah, now I'm like okay, I'llcome back when you're ready, you
(32:23):
have to have thick skin too.
I would say another piece ofthis they don't, I don't want to
see big piece of it too isknowing when you have to be firm
and really just point out theobvious and when you don't, when
(32:45):
you can't.
Speaker 1 (32:47):
there are some situations where you just can't
Any other words of wisdom aboutbeing great, someone who's going
to be great at this job you cantell, because they're a social
butterfly.
Speaker 4 (33:01):
I agree with everything they were saying for
sure, just being able to be veryfluid, I feel like you just
have to be able to weave in andout.
I don't know any other way tosay that.
You just have to take thepunches as they come and know
what to give back and know howto deal with anything at any
time.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
Yeah, yeah, definitely roll with the punches
.
That's a good one.
All right, let's see what elseI got here.
What would you look for we justtalked about this.
Actually what would you lookfor if you were hiring a
community liaison today?
I think we've answered thatsomeone who is willing to take
charge a little bit, someone whoisn't shy.
And we'll have those hardconversations with families.
(33:38):
I think I can remember as moreof it as a case manager, but
saying, or a care manager sayingtalking to the senior about
that their daughter or son wasreally worried about them, and
when the senior would hear thosewords, they don't want their
family to worry about them.
They definitely don't.
So maybe implementing a fewservices or trying this for a
(34:01):
couple of weeks is a great idea.
So, anyway, just being able totalk the talk and help the
senior and the family understandthis doesn't have to be forever
, but let's get you through thenext couple of weeks or through
the next month or so and see howyou're doing, and then we can
reevaluate from there.
That kind of thing.
(34:22):
Let's see here, Okay, what's thebest advice for getting a
referral quickly?
You have to be willing to dowhat, and we've talked about
some of this consistency, but ifyou really are, you're starting
out and you want to get areferral quickly.
What are some things that youwould tell somebody to do?
Get that in-service scheduledor that.
(34:44):
How are you getting thatreferral quickly?
I?
Speaker 3 (34:47):
think the very first thing is they have to know that
they're going to step out oftheir comfort zone and they're
going to be really uncomfortablefor a while.
For a while like five in inservices in they're still going
to be uncomfortable and there'sa new building or a new social
worker.
Even if you've been doing thisfor two or three years, you
still get a little nervousbecause is it going to work this
(35:08):
time?
Am I going to get in this time?
Is it going to happen?
So I think being willing tostep out of your comfort zone
and knowing you're going to livethere for a while, if that's
what it takes until you buildthose relationships, yes, and it
doesn't happen overnight and itcan take five, six, seven times
before you even get to talk tothe social worker, and that is
totally normal I'd say.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
Being confident without being pushy is also like
pleasantly persistent.
I think that is a great way toget that.
Speaker 3 (35:40):
If you have your differentiator, you know what it
is and you know that it's ameaningful one.
You lean into that.
When they say I'm working withthese XYZ home care agencies, I
don't need another one, yeah,you do.
You don't know about me, youdon't know about this agency and
what we do, that's different.
So you do need to hear aboutwhat I'm doing, and it needs to.
So when, whatever that is, it'sgot to be worthwhile, right?
(36:03):
Because you've just said holdthe phone, listen to me, I have
something different for yourpatients.
It better be something reallydifferent.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
What is it Huh?
What is it that's different?
I think home care agencies havea hard time.
They do have a hard time withthe differentiator it can be
your caregiver training.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
It can be your backup plan.
It could be we had a leadcaregiver program so we could
start service in an hour if weneeded to.
God, I'm trying to think ofother things that that I have
done as differentiators.
We had a discharge package.
I've done invented all kinds ofrapid response program.
So if you call my office andyou say I have a rapid response,
(36:42):
you talk to nobody but theperson who's coming out to sign
that client up immediately, Likewe've reinvented ourselves a
million times.
But it needs to be important tothe senior.
It needs to be something thatthe discharge planner is gonna
go oh, my seniors will buy.
A discharge packet is beautiful.
That's a great way to get adischarge package.
(37:04):
That's all they do isdischarges all day long.
When you say the word dischargepackage and the senior likes it
and buys into it, you're golden.
There has to be something.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yeah, I think that's tough for a lot of folks.
But I also think dischargepackage is one I think you guys
teach and talk about and itworks really well With a flat
rate, and we can talk about thatin sales training too.
Yeah, certified or pick yourpoison, whichever one, whichever
(37:38):
thing you think is mostimportant, but being doing
dementia live training there's amillion of them out there and
making sure your caregivers areall or some subset of them that
deal with dementia clients areall trained specifically, or
maybe it is that you specializein 24 hour care.
Maybe you specialize in live inand 24 hour care.
Whatever it is, come up withsomething, and I know in sales
(38:01):
training class we talk aboutthat and don't people come back
to you and tell you what theirdifferentiators are.
They try to come up withsomething to give them one.
Speaker 3 (38:12):
Some of them do have their own, but we do give them
one that works quite well aswell, that's awesome, All right.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
Who are the people in the office?
I think this is oftenoverlooked.
Who should be the salesperson'sbiggest supporters?
Owners, schedulers what kind ofrelationships helped you close
more sales?
I would say that's the realquestion there.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
I would say every single person in that office.
If you're out on the road allday, you're not in operations.
If you're a full-time marketerout on the road which I was, and
they're in the office goingcrazy, but you might have to
call at a minute's notice andthat scheduler has to be able to
help you immediately.
The owner, the care manager,the executive director, the
(38:57):
office that I worked in, we werea team and we all, we all
worked together and if I wasn'tout there getting business and
they weren't able to fill theshifts and they didn't hire
caregivers, we wouldn't have abusiness.
So I think my biggest supportis was everybody in the office.
We had a really good connectionand if I didn't, like I said,
if I didn't get the business, ifour HR person did not hire
(39:20):
caregivers, if our schedulerwasn't scheduling doing well at
the scheduling, nothing wouldwork.
And also, our owner was veryinvolved and I think it's really
important when you have anowner that is involved and that
is even willing to go do a shiftif they have to Once in a great
while.
Speaker 3 (39:36):
We would all do shifts, but I would say I think
everybody I don't know if Dawnand Lisa agree or Yeah- I agree,
I think everybody too becausewhen you're out in the field all
day, some days you just getbeat up all day long.
You do.
You just feel completelydestroyed from your visits.
It just no one would let you in.
They looked at you like, oh God, here she is again and you are
(39:57):
getting beat up and you do needtheir support.
The worst thing that everhappened to me was I had been
working in an area called SunLakes very tough to break into.
It's very community, deep rootcommunity.
We even had to get a phonenumber with the prefix of Sun
Lakes to just get them to takeour calls Very community.
And I finally got a job.
I got a referral, went out,signed it I was so excited
(40:18):
called the schedule and she goesoh God, how am I going to ever
get that staffed?
We don't have caregivers outthere and it was so deflating
and she always reacted that wayand I finally went to the owner.
I'm like I'm out here killingmyself and I'm excited Like I
need her to be.
A fake it.
If you're not excited, justfake it for me Like I was.
I needed a high five.
(40:39):
So bad that day and I did notget one.
It was a slap in the face.
It was so bad.
So your schedulers, even thoughthey're stressed and they're
like today, right now, I have tofind someone now Like it does.
It needs to be a team becauseevery part affects the other
Recruiting, marketing,scheduling they all affect one
another and they all have to bemoving at the same speed, same
(41:00):
momentum, constantly andsupporting them, because no jobs
are easy, definitely.
Speaker 4 (41:08):
I'd like to just add that working in a company where
there was no one else but myselfand the owner, versus working
where they're and this isprobably where I learned how to
be able to schedule on the flyand also do my client care
duties and also go out and shakesome hands right, so being able
(41:28):
to have that support oh man,what a weight off of your
shoulders to be able to go.
Okay, I have.
I'm going to send you thissynopsis over to my scheduler.
This is what the person needs,this is what they want.
I already have a caregiver inmind, but being able to push
that over to someone and getthat support is huge.
It's just it's like night andday and I've experienced both
(41:51):
sides, so it's definitelyeveryone in the office, but that
scheduler, client care andreally helpful to have that
support being able to call youroffice and instead of we
actually had a client carecoordinator once.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
She didn't stay long, but I would have she'd go.
We're not taking them, they'retoo hard, or something like that
.
I'm like wait a minute, I justgot this referral.
We are going to make it work,let's go.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
You just trusted me enough to send me a referral and
you're not taking it.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
This is the first referral I had from this
resource.
The first referral has tohappen.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
This is the first referral I had from this
resource.
The first referral has tohappen, guys, has to happen.
The first referral.
I'll go myself, exactly.
You finally have trust for themto send you someone and you're
going to say oops, sorry, wecan't stop it.
Speaker 1 (42:32):
No, that's it, you can't do that Sounds to me like
if you're working with peoplewho are burned out, have become
toxic and they just aren't theyes people that you need or the
optimistic people that you need,then it might be time to
definitely raise your hand andsay something about I'm working
this hard and here's what'shappening.
(42:53):
I'm being defeated by my ownteam, and it's definitely worth
speaking up and saying somethingabout that, because people do
get burned out.
Speaker 3 (43:01):
Come on, Scheduling is hard.
I always understood why I gotthe reactions I got and they're
like we told you we didn't havepeople in this area.
Why are you marketing overthere?
And I would say I'm notmarketing over there.
The person in this sniff isstaying 30 miles from their
house and now they'redischarging to the area I was
not marketing and there'snothing I can do about that.
We've got to make it work.
(43:21):
I'm sorry, you don't alwayshave control over that.
They could be at a sniff 30miles from their house and
you're marketing where you'resupposed to be because you got
caregivers over there and thenthey discharge home 30 miles
away.
You still have to make it workand so I get that.
It's tough for scheduling.
It's a tough job.
Speaker 2 (43:37):
Oh it is, and if you have a great we had a great
scheduler and I just think it'sa tough job, but everybody has
to work together and it reallyit's just a team effort.
You're out there getting thatbusiness and they have to, and I
think that's how the bestagencies I think that are the
most successful is everybodyworking together and making it
happen 100%.
Speaker 1 (43:57):
Yeah and making it happen 100% yeah.
And so I'm going to put a littlecommercial in here.
But you guys have accumulated40 or more video testimonials
this year alone, and not thisyear in the last year alone, and
they're amazing.
They're amazing testimonials,you guys, and we have all of
(44:20):
them.
If you go to sellinghomecarecom, forward slash.
Yes, our website address ismuch longer than, and she's just
so full of golden nuggets andgreat ideas, and I don't want to
(44:47):
promise anything that's outsideof the scope of what we do, but
you guys even text back andforth with people who are having
challenging days and thingslike that, right.
Speaker 3 (44:56):
Yeah, of course I see them.
They'll text Annette and say mylunch and learn is in an hour
and I know we went through it.
But I have one quick questionand that girl is on the phone
with them in seconds.
Like she, annette is diehard.
Speaker 2 (45:10):
But I do want to say too, like Dawn created this
program and we all live indifferent States and it's just
amazing how, when I saw thesales training, I was like this
is what I did, and it doesn'tmatter where you live.
You may have different rulesand regulations with your state,
but it's all the same.
It's establishing thoserelationships, being different
(45:32):
from the other home careagencies.
It's all about being there andhaving them see you.
They need to see your face andyou have to connect with them
and we teach that all and it'snice to see everybody.
Like by week six, if people arefollowing what we tell them to
do.
They're getting private payreferrals, they host lunch and
(45:52):
learns in services.
They've never done that before.
So it's really exciting to seeeven somebody that's never done
marketing before.
You can have somebody with nomarketing experience and they do
phenomenal.
So it's not like it's you know,if you have somebody that
doesn't have any salesexperience.
I've seen people do very wellthat don't have sales experience
.
Speaker 3 (46:10):
Yep, I think too the reason that this works is
because it's 90 days.
I've trained lots of marketersin my time.
It's not a one and done, it'snot a one weekend bootcamp, it's
not even a week long bootcampthey need, and this is what we
do.
We teach all about skillednursing facility.
This is exactly who, what yousay, what you bring with you,
what you can expect.
(46:31):
They're thinking about you.
So you're ready for thoseobjections when they come flying
out of their mouth.
You are ready to overcome them.
We do all of that about skillednursing and then you go do it,
and then you come back next weekand we talk about it and you
not only get to, we deal withwhat happened with you the good,
the bad, the ugly and we do thesame with everybody in class,
(46:51):
with six to seven people.
So you're learning from that.
And then the next week we dothe same thing for independent
living, and then we do memorycare, and so it's the back and
forth and it's that mentorship.
We hold you accountable withhomework.
It's that is making this work.
It's not a one and done.
It's impossible.
One and done doesn't work withthis.
It's too involved and you can'tanticipate everything that's
(47:11):
going to happen.
And so when you come back withsomething that's happened, you
need help with what do I do?
Just quit going there, becausethat's what we want to do as
humans.
I just don't want to go backthere ever again.
That's not an option.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
So anyway, I think that's why it works.
I would totally agree with that.
And just little things likedidn't somebody go to a skilled
facility?
She was brand new and she tookthem some kind of cookies from
Starbucks, but the little bagsweren't closed, the kind like a.
You stick it to that.
Speaker 2 (47:44):
Fell out of the bag.
Fell out of the bag.
Speaker 1 (47:46):
Yeah, and the social worker had a complete fit about
that, I think.
Speaker 3 (47:51):
So she came back and we helped her with that.
We walked her through that.
She didn't quit going there andwe walked her through that
problem.
And Annette has people who havebeen through sales training and
done that even reached out.
This has happened and we don'tlike just disappear, we're just,
we want to help.
That's who we are.
Speaker 1 (48:08):
Yeah, so we have training classes starting all
the time and the next two thatare starting are April 15.
And April 30th.
So when we say that, what wemean is that the April 15th
class is every Tuesday at 1.30pm Eastern.
You're going to have tocalculate what your time zone is
and you meet once a week for 12weeks and an hour each time yes
(48:33):
, for one hour.
So wherever you are hopefullysomewhere quiet where you can
listen and talk in, and it'ssmall groups of people and you
are not in a class with someonewho's a direct competitor of
yours in the same territory.
We try to make that very clearso that you don't have to feel
like you can't talk about whatyou were doing or where you were
(48:55):
because somebody else this nextstory is also in the class.
We don't do that Very carefulabout that.
So it's a really nice way tohave some colleagues once a week
and you're learning, but you'realso like in counseling.
Speaker 3 (49:09):
And I don't know if you know this, but they stay in
touch with each other.
The people that stay in touchwith each other and're just.
They help each other.
It's so exciting to see what'shappened.
Speaker 2 (49:22):
I just love it.
Lisa helps me on the week 12.
She's always in my week 12classes and we it's we've we've
all grown to know each othermore and they're always sad it's
going to be over.
But, like Dawn said, peopleshare their emails and their
phone numbers, their differentagencies from different states
(49:42):
and also in the classes theyshare.
Maybe they have a different wayof doing things and something
that's really worked for them.
I love how everybody sharestheir personal experiences and
it also gives we have alldifferent levels in our classes.
When they see somebody that'sdoing really well and there's
maybe somebody that's newer atthis, I think it gives them more
(50:02):
ambition to get out there anddo better too.
Speaker 1 (50:06):
I just made the screen all crazy.
Where did I go?
Oh no, everything's crazy, it'sall gone.
So, anyway, hopefully we cansee each other.
Yes, okay, and what else was it?
Oh, so we have two classescoming up April 15th and 30th,
and there'll be some more in May, and then also we have
continuum, which is twice amonth, and we talk about all
(50:29):
kinds of different things duringcontinuum, including digital
and in-person sales, and Lisacreates handouts for four months
in advance that you can takeadvantage of.
They are not she creates them,you have to customize them
yourself advance that you cantake advantage of.
They are not she creates them,you have to customize them
yourself, but you can do all ofthat.
She gives you ideas forleave-behinds.
Everything is put together, soall you have to do is print it,
(50:51):
get the goodies and go.
You don't have to think aboutanything, just have everything
available to you.
A continuum is also a great wayto stay in touch and stay
involved or, if you've neverbeen through sales training,
participate in that.
You can sign up for that.
So does anybody have anyquestions for any of these
ladies about sales training?
(51:12):
Closing the deal?
I think one of the things thatpeople ask about is or maybe
people have trouble with isasking for the referral, and
that's sometimes tough to getpast.
So I think training reallyhelps people get through all of
those reservations.
Speaker 3 (51:31):
Yeah, I would think that is the hardest challenge
probably is well, being out ofyour comfort zone, but then
asking for the referral can bedifficult, but we work through
all of that.
There's a one liner for everytype of referral source.
Speaker 2 (51:45):
Yeah, we have a whole class on that where and it's
pretty simple.
Once we go through the class,you know they're like OK, I just
ask if they have any patientsdischarging today.
Ok, I didn't think about that.
And then the social worker juststarts thinking about everybody
she has that you can help herwith.
Speaker 1 (52:03):
Yeah, absolutely All right.
I think that's it.
We've used our hour.
We're like right on time.
So thank you, ladies, forhaving to chat with me and for
all the other folks that signedup to listen.
Speaker 2 (52:16):
And then I just want to say Tam Tamara has a question
, but we can get back, we can.
Speaker 4 (52:21):
Yeah, I was okay yeah , I was just messaging her.
We'll get back to her thanksfor coming everybody thank you
everyone, bye-bye, see you later.
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