June 10, 2025 • 37 mins
In this episode, I unpack the journey of healing from hyper-independence, the version of me that wore capability like a badge of honor and tied worth to how much I could carry. I’m sharing what it looks like to step out of survival mode, release the need to do it all alone, and build a life and business rooted in support, softness, and self-trust. If you’re used to proving your value through productivity, this episode will feel like a breath of fresh air.
Here’s What You’ll Learn:
- Healing Hyper-Independence: Understand how high-functioning self-reliance is often a trauma response and what it takes to build a life where ease and support are safe.
- Rewriting the Metrics of Success: Discover how to shift from adrenaline-based success to a sustainable business model rooted in peace, presence, and alignment.
- Regulated Growth Over Constant Hustle: Learn the value of scaling without self-abandonment and why slowing down might be your next level.
- Permission to Be Supported: Explore what it means to be fully resourced, both emotionally and financially, without guilt or shame.
If you've ever confused self-worth with self-reliance, this conversation will help you start untangling the two.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
There's a version of me thatcould push through anything, and
(00:03):
I did four years I couldengineer a six figure launch
down to the dollar, hit arevenue goal on demand.
My old motto really was exceedthe bar.
I.
I look up the stats, I wouldlearn the benchmarks, then I
would do whatever I had to do tobeat them.
And that mindset really shapedeverything for me.
How I built, how I carried, howI coped, really my whole sense
(00:26):
of self-identity was rooted inthat.
All through college, mycorporate career as an engineer
and this.
Especially, I carried thatmindset with me into
entrepreneurship.
You know, I carried the weightof managing the household
logistics, tracking the movingpieces.
No one else was talking aboutthe bills, the birthdays, the
grocery list, the mentalcalendar of who needed what and
(00:46):
when.
And on top of that, you know, Iwas building and scaling a
business from scratch,navigating rocky relationships
and holding the emotional weightof it all with a detailed
planned in hand.
But here's what I've beensitting with lately.
What happens when your nervoussystem stops?
Confusing urgency with identity?
(01:06):
What happens when pushing isn'tyour default anymore?
And this is what healing hyperindependence has looked like for
me.
This is something I've reallybeen working through over the
past maybe nine to 12 months,and there was a time when I wore
my capability, like a badge ofhonor.
Okay.
I could carry more, hold moreoutlast the chaos, like that was
my edge and that really was myidentity.
(01:29):
So now when I intentionallychoose to do less, when I say no
to pushing, when I walk awayfrom the race, it can feel like
this shrinking experience forme, which has really been hard
to hold even when I know I'mnot, you know?
But here's the tension I've beensitting with.
Just because I can doesn't meanthat I should.
(01:50):
Just because I know how to pushdoesn't mean that.
That version of me is still whoI want to be, and that version
of me feels further and furtheraway.
And that's brought up a new kindof discomfort that I've been
learning how to sit in.
Because when you choose adifferent path, when you decide
not to chase the same version ofsuccess everyone else is posting
(02:13):
about, it's so easy to feelothered.
Like you suddenly are on theoutside of a club you helped to
build and who I feel like youused to be the president of.
And if I'm being really honest,it's not, you know, I'm not just
starting to notice a pattern,but really this is a pattern
that I haven't really named yetfor myself.
(02:34):
What I noticed that I had beendoing repeatedly is that as, as
soon as I get comfortable, assoon as things feel really
secure and feel really steady.
I feel this inner tension andthis inner turmoil that I am not
doing enough.
I'm playing too small, I'm beingirresponsible.
I'm going to lose everythingthat I've built.
And then my default thought isthat you need to stretch your
(02:56):
edge again.
Like, oh, things arecomfortable.
That means you're not workinghard enough.
That means you need to.
Push yourself to the edge ofwhat you can tolerate.
Oh, things are feeling reallysteady and feeling kind of
manageable.
Mm-hmm.
Right?
Alarm woo woo.
You need to do more, pushharder, like put more on your
plate.
And before I get into the restof this episode, I just wanna
(03:17):
say thank you so much for tuningin.
I, um, am really excited to.
To break down this whole healingfrom my hyper independence with
you.
And I do wanna take a momentjust to shout out, uh, those of
you who have been leaving areview lately, it just means so
much to me.
You know, that is the number oneway that people find my podcast,
is when you share it withsomebody else.
You send somebody a dm.
(03:38):
Or you text it to one of yourfriends, um, or you leave a
review.
So I just wanna take a momentjust to say thank you for those
of you guys who have left areview.
Um, this is a five star reviewfrom the working mom coach, and
I just wanna give her a quickshout out.
She said, Isha said, is such arefreshing take on marketing
without the hustle andconvincing energy.
I actually stopped and tooknotes during the podcast because
(04:00):
the information was so great.
Um, the Working Mom Coach, thankyou so much for tuning in and
let's get back into thisepisode.
So the moment things feelsteady, a part of me looks for
the next mountain to climb.
And that has been a repeatedpattern that I have noticed
about myself.
Not always because I want more,but because ease still feels
(04:21):
super unfamiliar.
It feels untrustworthy.
Even like if I don't stretchmyself, I'm somehow slipping.
I'm somehow playing small.
I'm somehow putting at risk.
Everything that I've created formyself, I'm putting my security
at risk and I'm learning to sitwith that discomfort instead of
reacting to it.
I'm learning not to make a hardseason just to prove that I can
(04:47):
handle it where I used toself-sabotage and I would
literally manufacture discomfortin my seasons or discomfort in
what I was doing just so that Icould recreate the chaos where I
had more comfort in before.
And that's the pattern I'mreally trying to break.
And one thing that I wasrecently talking to a client
about and I resonated so muchbecause she's been feeling
something similar, is that this,this heaviness that you are
(05:10):
feeling right now.
It might be here for a couple ofdays or for a couple of weeks,
but it's also very healthy thatyou know me operating at the
edge of what I can tolerate andme always feeling as if I have
to stretch my.
My, my capacity for what I canhold, like that being this
(05:31):
constant push, this constantpursuit, the fact that I'm able
to name it, the fact that I'mable to slow down and pause
within it.
The fact that I'm able toarticulate what is going on is a
sign that I am healing.
It is a sign that my awarenessis at a better state.
The fact that I'm willing topause and that I can sit in the
discomfort while I'm pausing.
(05:52):
It's a huge testament to growth.
So if you're in somethingsimilar, just recognize that
progress may not be about therebeing an avoidance or there
being a lack of a weight that isnoticeable in your life or in
your business or in the season,but your progress is in your
ability to have differentchoices and different responses
to what you do with theheaviness that you now feel.
(06:14):
And again, that's a pattern thatI'm trying to break.
And the other thing that's beencoming up for me is that there
is a loneliness.
A sense of isolation that comeswith choosing ease and a culture
that worships exhaustion becauselet's be honest, this world
doesn't always celebrate rest.
It idolizes the woman who wakesup at five 30 in the morning who
(06:36):
time blocks her day down to the15 minute increments, who
scaling two businesses whilemanaging a team of 15.
Who's on flights every otherweekend, closing deals in her
designer heels.
Like that's the image we areshown.
And like honestly, when I lookup to peers of mine who are in
the industry who are reallycrushing it like that is their
lifestyle.
It is very fast paced.
(06:56):
It is very jam packed.
Like it's these large teams,these.
Um, different loads of risktolerance that they are
carrying, and that's a versionof success that I feel like is
often the one that is most, um,spotlighted and most amplified.
So when you choose not to keepup with that pace.
When you say, actually, I want aslower, maybe softer, maybe
(07:18):
saner way to succeed.
'cause success doesn't mean thatit, you know, just because you
choose to do it at a differentpace doesn't mean that your
success isn't inevitable.
But you know, you really riskbeing misunderstood when you
choose that alternative path.
And it can be so easy to fallinto comparison, to fall into
feeling like you're doingsomething wrong, to feel like,
(07:39):
you know, the, the, the voicesthat are internal really start
to get louder that.
The self-doubt and you'requestioning yourself and all of
it, but like choosing peace overperformance will confuse people
who only know you by yourproductivity.
And I wanna say that again.
'cause as somebody who used topride herself and how productive
she could be, as somebody whoused to be known for her grit
(08:03):
and her resilience, and how hardshe could hustle, and how
scrappy she was and what shecould tolerate and what she
could hold.
Choosing peace over performancewill confuse people who only
know you buy your productivity.
It's a big difference now.
It's not that you're any lesscapable, it's that you're no
longer willing to portrayyourself to prove what you are
(08:24):
capable of.
And even when you're doingwhat's right for you, it can
still feel like you don't belongin the ecosystem that you're
operating in.
And that's something I've alsobeen really wrestling with.
Um,'cause you know, you lookaround and you wonder like, do I
still fit in here?
Do people still respect me ifI'm not striving the way that I
used to?
What community spaces make sensefor me to attach myself to, to
(08:47):
join, to invest in when it feelslike?
The promises and the purpose ofall these other masterminds or
group programs are rooted in a,a version of my identity that
I'm trying to heal from.
It's like, where do I belong?
Who do I talk to?
Who is my community?
Um, and sometimes the mostradical thing that you can do is
(09:08):
step off the pedestal you builtand stop performing for the
applause.
You know, I think this issomething that is so necessary,
especially in the digitalmarketing online space because.
Unlike other professions, we areconstantly being judged, viewed,
looked at on a daily basisbecause we create content and we
(09:28):
show up and we share ourperspective.
Like the more visible you get,the uh, more likelihood that
you're gonna be open to beingmisunderstood.
And just choosing a differentversion of success has made me
feel like an outcast at times.
You know, not because I'mfailing, but because I'm no
longer subscribing to the same.
(09:49):
Proven blueprint or the samepath.
The same script anymore.
And when you stop performing,people don't always know where
to place you.
You know?
And honestly, again, some ofthose internal thoughts that I
keep having to self-coach myselfthrough and have a external
sounding board to regainperspective on is like, am I
(10:09):
playing too small?
And or is it just that I justwant something different now?
Like, and that's just, it's alayer dynamic because I go back
and forth between this, but Ithink I'm at a point now where
I'm settling in to this versionof enoughness and I think it's
been difficult for me to hold,like.
What is it?
(10:30):
What does it mean about me if Idon't wanna scale to eight
figures?
Like if I don't want to engineeranother record breaking revenue
month, like, and still there'sthis little voice that sometimes
whispers like, shouldn't youstill want that?
It's the residue of being in aspace where ambition was and had
one definition, more money, moreclients, more growth.
(10:50):
Faster, faster, faster.
Where success is about what youcan hold, what you can hustle,
and how long you can sustainthat unrelenting pace.
And yet I've started askingmyself a different question.
I.
And you've heard me talk aboutthis over the past handful of
episodes, um, or sprinkledthroughout the episodes in this,
in the podcast over the pastyear because I've really been
(11:12):
asking myself differentquestions.
And I'm just here to tell you,I'm still wrestling with the
tension of being okay with adifferent version of success
than what I have anchored myidentity to over the past eight
years.
But what if more means somethingdifferent now to me, which is
what it feels like it does.
You know, more looks like havingthe energy to be present with my
(11:33):
partner, to show up for myfamily.
Um, last weekend I flew 2300miles to go to Detroit, just to
go to my cousin's graduation.
It was a 30 hour trip.
I had the capacity to do that,you know, to be present for my
friends, to be able to call myfriends in the morning and chit
chat on FaceTime and check inwith my friends, uh, via text.
(11:54):
Without that feeling like it's aback burner thought, that always
gets pushed off.
Where I'm scheduling, meeting upwith my friends six months from
now on a particular two daysthat I have available that's
carved out like, um, success forme and more for me now looks
like having the capacity andspaciousness to enjoy slow
mornings.
Instead of rushing into work,you know, as somebody who has
(12:16):
been trying to adjust herhormones and work through her
cortisol levels that have beenreally imbalanced, slow mornings
have been critical for my ownstress management, for my gut
health, and being able to havethat spaciousness in my calendar
where I'm not waking up with analready predetermined three hour
checklist that has to get done.
(12:36):
Um, but I'm able to ease into mymornings ease into.
Working out, you know, slow downand have a very mindful,
intentional breakfast.
Um, even just preparing moodsmeals for myself now that don't
feel like I have to hire a chefor feel like I have to, you
know, delegate everything.
'cause I just don't have thecapacity.
(12:56):
Like more is having thatcapacity to nurture myself and
take care of myself.
And for that to feel like apriority more looks like
mastering my craft.
Not for the applause, but foralignment, for congruency, for
my own sense ofself-fulfillment, for knowing
that I put, uh, my all intosomething and I've created
(13:16):
something that I'm truly proudof for myself.
And to be honest, I've had torevisit this truth more than
once.
You know, this isn't a conceptI've figured out and tucked
neatly into a journal.
It's something I've had to keeptalking about, something I've
needed to process out loud morethan once.
And I, if you've been listeningto the podcast over the past
year, you've noticed this as arecurring theme, but it's a
(13:37):
recurring theme because it'salso, um, it's something that.
It's not like my logical brainknows that I'm safe.
My logical brain knows that medefining a new definition of
success is the best thing for mein this season, and there's
still a part of my other, partof my brain, this other part of
(13:59):
my identity that I'm stillhealing from and healing through
and healing with.
That's like, hmm.
Is it really safe for you toadjust your pace?
Girl?
Mm.
Can you really make money doingwhat you love, honoring your
capacity and honoring thespaciousness, but still being
able to deliver well?
Mm.
Are you not playing small?
Because what you want looksdifferent than how you, what
(14:22):
you've been kind of told, orwhat you've believed is supposed
to look like?
And, ugh, that little whisper,that little ghetto voice in the
back of my mind.
Telling me shit and I want more.
It doesn't disappear justbecause you intellectually know
better.
Sometimes the only way to quietthe mental chatter is to process
it externally to get it out ofyour head and into a
(14:43):
conversation to say the thingand have someone mirror back
that you are not crazy, thatthis all makes sense and to help
validate that and hold space foryou while you're processing,
because mental clarity doesn'tcome from having the right
answer.
It comes from having the spaceto say the messy, unsure thing
out loud without being judgedfor it.
(15:04):
That's what the integrationlooks like and what it has
looked like for me, not justknowing something, but living in
alignment with it again andagain.
I.
And part of that integrationwork has meant digging deeper
into this root of hyperindependence because I didn't
just wake up one day cravingease.
I had to unravel why it felt sohard to let go of the push in
(15:25):
the first place.
And let me pause here and justgive some context around like
what hyper independence reallyis, because hyper independence
is self-protection in disguise.
It's a habit of doing it allyourself, not because you
genuinely want to, but becauseat some point it became safe,
unsafe to trust others.
And I think that's a reallyimportant concept to understand.
(15:47):
When I say I'm healing hyperindependence, I'm talking about
the internal pattern that saysI'm safest when I do everything
myself.
I am talking about the internalpattern that says receiving help
is risky or means I'm bound tobe disappointed.
My value comes from what I cancarry and how fast I can carry
it.
Hyper independence is controlmasquerading as confidence.
(16:10):
If you were praised for neverneeding anyone, healing will
look like letting someone elsecarry responsibility even when
you're still perfectly capableof doing it yourself.
And listen, I've been capable mywhole life, but being capable is
not the same as being cared for.
(16:30):
That mindset served me for avery long time, and it got me
through some real shit, but italso quietly convinced me that I
had to earn love, I had to earnrest, and I had to earn ease.
So when I started stepping intoa new season of life, one being
in a super supportiverelationship.
(16:51):
And just thinking about like theversion of what I want my
experience of motherhood to belike.
I was shocked at howuncomfortable that felt because
it was really given thatGabrielle Union 50 50 or bust
energy.
But in my case, I caught myselfclinging to the last shreds of
independence as proof that I wasstill safe.
You know, I would say thingslike, well, I'm still paying
(17:13):
half the mortgage, as if thatmade it more okay to accept the
rest of the support that wasbeing offered in my household
and from my partner.
And as if letting someone elsecarry more meant I was somehow
failing or I was putting myselfat risk, or I would be unsafe
for me to depend on somebody inthat way.
And it's wild because on paper,this is what I had prayed for.
(17:37):
But in practice receiving itrequired a whole new version of
safety inside my body.
So healing hyper independencehas looked like letting my man
take care of things without mehovering, worrying, or jumping
into just do it myself.
If he says, do you needanything?
My answer is always yes.
Yes to the help.
(17:57):
Yes to the softness, yes, tobeing held.
It's not about what I'm capableof doing, it's about allowing
myself to be cared for.
Okay.
Uh, healing my hyperindependence has looked like me
when I go back to Detroit.
Staying at a friend's house, notgetting a rental car, letting my
friends drive me around.
As somebody who had, does not dothat, that was probably one.
(18:20):
I just, when I went back homefrom my cousin's graduation, I
stayed at one of my friend'shouses and I told her, I said,
listen.
She's been begging me to comeand stay at her house for years.
And if you listen to a recentepisode I did with Monique
Shields, we talked about this,um, if you recall that from a
few episodes ago, but I, I, Idid it guys.
Okay?
(18:41):
I asked to stay at my friend'shouse.
I received her invitation, butbefore I got there, I texted her
and I said, this is like a leveleight discomfort level for me.
Uh, I'm doing it'cause I knowthis is gonna be a growth
opportunity for our friendship,but it's also a growth
opportunity for me of allowingmyself to be cared for.
And as somebody who just alwaysgets her own hotels, always
(19:03):
books her own cars, always takescare of herself when she goes
someplace.
That was a version of me healingmy hyper independence.
Um, another version of this haslooked like allowing myself to
be resourced.
Not because I can't figure itout, but because I don't want to
do it all alone anymore.
You know, hiring project basedhelp delegating what I could
easily do myself, working with acoach, not because I'm lost, but
(19:26):
because I value support.
And I think too, even when itcomes to hiring help.
I, um, really only used to hirehelp if I was in a hyper-growth
state, which was my entirebusiness before this, you know,
versus now, even when I'msteady, I'm still committed to
having a coach.
Even when I'm not trying to growdouble or triple my revenue, I
still have coach, I still havesupport in my corner because I
(19:50):
think that that is something forme that I need to normalize,
that IOI.
I deserve help even when I'm notin a constant state of stretch.
I deserve help and beingsupported and to be resourced,
even if I'm in a calmer state,I'm in a chill state because I
don't want to hold all theresponsibility or the, I don't
wanna hold the cognitive loadalone anymore.
(20:12):
Um, another way that I've beenhealing it is just letting life
be good without waiting for theother shoe to drop.
You know, sometimes the nextlevel of growth isn't adding
more to your plate.
It's learning how to let someoneelse carry it for once, or carry
versions of it or parts of it.
And as I began to unpack thatidentity and welcome in support,
something else started to shifttoo, my relationship with money.
(20:35):
Because when you enter or when,when your entire sense of safety
has been rooted inself-reliance, money isn't just
currency.
It is proof.
Proof that you're secure.
That you're doing enough, thatyou're worthy.
But when that need to provebegins to fade, so does the way
that you chase.
(20:56):
Some people chase growth bystretching their limits.
I'm growing by choosing torespect mine because when you're
used to building from survivalrevenue, become revenue goals,
become your lifeline.
They're how you create security.
They're how you prove thatyou're okay.
They're how you justify yourrest.
But now money feels sodifferent.
(21:17):
It's no longer about chasing anumber, but it's about building
a rhythm I can actually liveinside of.
So I'm not scaling for applauseanymore.
I'm building for stability.
I am no longer interested inmaxing out my risk tolerance
just because I can.
I've done the season of highrisk, high speed, high stakes,
and what I mean by that is likeI lived through the season of
(21:39):
moving every 18 months prettymuch my entire life.
Up until hopefully now I'mpraying I do not move another 18
months, but like my entire life,even as a kid, I moved about
every 18 to 24 months, you know?
And then when I think about likethis journey, since you've seen
me on being an entrepreneur andbuilding my business, I went
from living in a$600 a monthapartment in Westland, Michigan,
(22:01):
to within 18 months, living in ahigh rise, my dream apartment in
downtown Detroit, paying themost I had ever paid in rent.
To 18 months later to purchasinga$5,000, I mean a 5,000 square
foot historic home in SherwoodForest in Detroit.
Then from there, joining theDetroit Golf Club, my entire
(22:22):
lifestyle, changing to 18 monthslater, selling that house moving
2300 miles across the country.
I had my little stunting season,yet I cannot believe I'm about
to admit this on here, but I wasspending$11,000 a month in rent
for my apartment for about 18 to20 months.
Which was such a good experiencefor me.
I, I do believe that if you arenew money, you should have a, a
(22:44):
responsible, um, hustle.
I mean, as a responsible stuntin season to just enjoy the, the
limits of what this new moneycan kind of afford and
experiences you never knew youcould have.
That, that living in thatapartment really upgraded my
identity in a way I didn't know,I just didn't know was
available.
I did that for 18 to 20 months.
(23:05):
Um, purchased another property,renovated that property cash.
I was investing in hedge funds,crypto, private equity
evaluations, potential franchisedeals.
Like all of this was happeningso quickly all while my business
was still doubling in triplingevery year.
So I know what it costs, like Iknow what it felt like to live
(23:26):
in a high risk, high volatility,high speed, high stakes for
about five or six years.
My nervous system was fried and'cause it was like, baby, it's
like you keep trying to run themarathon and your body's like,
bro, can we please just go for awalk?
Like my heart rate was throughthe roof and I knew what that
(23:47):
felt like.
And because behind themilestones was at pace, that
burned through my energy.
It caused so much fog with mysense of clarity and my sense of
self.
My nervous system was fried.
Way that my therapist kind ofdescribes it is like I, I gave
my nervous system no time totitrate.
(24:09):
I would just open the ball, goto the most expansive version
possible, and I just keptstretching it and stretching it
and stretching it, versusallowing my nervous system to
titrate to that edge.
I just skipped all the steps andwent to the furthest realm
possible, and it was a cycle ofself abandonment is what also
tense started to happen.
(24:29):
Of following blueprints that Inever paused long enough to ask
myself if I even wanted in thefirst place.
I was attaching myself toversions of success that I never
checked in with myself to evenask, is that an outcome that you
even want?
I was outsourcing myself, trust,waiting for someone else to give
me permission or to validate myideas.
Like it.
(24:49):
It created such a divide withwhat I was doing and who I was
and my ability to trust myselfin that.
And, and also living at the edgeof what I could tolerate for so
many years and constantlystretching the limits of what
that was.
It made me terrified to slowdown.
Like I became very, very afraidof a slower pace because the
(25:11):
slowness, when you were so usedto moving at such a high speed,
felt so disorienting.
Um, that's what felt unsafe whenreally the speed at which I was
moving at was the problematicissue.
So I don't need volatility.
I don't need volatility to provethat I can weather it.
That has been a core truth thatI have been learning in this
season, that I need steadinessto prove that I'm safe without
(25:35):
it.
You know, there's nothing cuteabout choosing and chasing
chaos, which hand raising up,that's what I had been doing.
I used to see risk as power.
Now I see power in havingoptions and breathing room.
So now the question I ask myselfis simple is what's actually
sustainable and what is it thatyou actually want?
In this season of life, in thisseason of business for where
(25:57):
you're at right now, like whatare you happy with?
And I've already proven that Ican outpace the pressure.
I don't want to scale faster.
I want to scale withoutbetraying myself.
I used to tolerate chaos for thepayoff.
Now I'm building a life thatdoesn't require a 12 month
sabbatical for recovery.
Okay?
(26:18):
So I used to treat my businesslike a race, like every launch,
every quarter, every year wasrun faster, beat your last
record, and stay ahead.
And that was the only speed thatI knew.
Sprinting was the strategy.
Overachieving was the baseline,and I wanted to prove that I
could now.
I ain't trying to win a, I'm noteven trying to win a race
(26:38):
anymore.
I don't even want to run a race.
I'm focused on staying in mygame, on building something that
I want to last in, you know,something that won't cost me my
health, my joy or my peace tomaintain, and I don't want
adrenaline based successanymore.
Like, I want a regulatedsuccess.
And I think something too, forentrepreneurs, especially those
(27:00):
of us who might be, uh, a littlebit more seasoned, there's a
high amount of dopamine thathappens with this fast-paced,
adrenaline based success thatI've been talking about, and I
do think that many of us getaddicted to it.
Oftentimes because we do nothave enough dopamine happening
in other areas of our life, likewe get so much of our joy and
(27:21):
sense of self-fulfillment andthe dopamine hits as being
purely sourced from the businesswhen, and I think that's a
really problematic space to bein, especially if you start to
notice that as a pattern isbecause I think sometimes we can
put all of our energy and all ofour identity into the business.
So all of our joy, sense ofself-worth, sense of validation,
all the dopamine hits is onlybeing sourced through the
(27:42):
business because we actuallyhaven't created a life.
We haven't nurturedrelationships.
We haven't explored otherinterests and curiosities and
hobbies.
We haven't allowed ourselves totap into other things outside of
work that can fulfill thosethings that yes, you need as a
human, but should not be solelysourced from the business, you
know?
Um.
(28:04):
Like I said, I, I just, I don'twant an adrenaline based success
anymore.
I want a regulated success fromthe business, not the kind that
spikes and crashes, but the kindthat feels good to live inside
of every day, not just duringlaunches.
So I'm no longer chasingvisibility or volume.
I'm chasing alignment.
I'm, I'm in pursuit ofintegrity.
And I think really where I'vebeen wrapping my mind around is
(28:25):
like, my new version of successis really about mastery of my
craft, and I'll talk about thata little bit more.
In just a little bit.
But these days I'm measuringsuccess by how resourced I feel
while doing the work.
I am measuring success by howresourced I feel while doing the
work, by how honest I can be inmy delivery, by how much of
(28:48):
myself I get to bring to thetable without burning out,
trying to prove anything ortrying to keep up with anyone or
anything like that, like.
Self-mastery is the new metric,and the work is really the
reward.
It's a byproduct of me remainingcommitted to myself, and when I
stopped performing to provesomething and started creating
(29:10):
from a place of clarity andcalm, guess what happened?
The money still came, the moneyis still coming.
You know, in fact, it flowed somuch more freely, it flowed so
much more easefully.
Like, it felt so much morepleasurable to be quite honest.
Um, the happier I felt, the moregrounded I became.
The more naturally my businessgrew.
(29:31):
I.
Not just in revenue or clientcount, but in fulfillment, in
spaciousness and ease and thecaliber of the client
relationships that I wasattracting.
Because I wasn't gripping, I wasnot grasping.
I wasn't trying to force resultsor outpace my capacity.
I was offering.
I was showing up from wholenessinstead of hustle.
(29:52):
I was creating from desire andnot desperation, and people felt
that, my clients felt that.
I felt that, and I know you dotoo.
You can always tell whensomebody's operating from peace
instead of pressure.
And I wanna be honest withsomething else too.
I.
There was a time that I judgedother women who had this type of
(30:13):
support that I'm talking about.
I think it was because there wasa part of me that just could not
understand the concept that somethat was somebody else's like
day-to-day reality, like womenwho had husbands that funded
their businesses or were theirfinancial providers in their
household, and any money thatthey made was really nice to
have money.
It wasn't needed money.
Um, women who came from trustfunds or very generous parents,
(30:36):
or who had these safety netsthat let them leap without
looking like women who didn'thave to run the numbers five
times before remindingthemselves they were financially
safe.
Like, who could just take bigrisks, mess it up, and still
land on their feet becausesomeone else was there to catch
them.
Like, I, that was the, theconcept of that.
(30:56):
Like, I knew that those peopleexisted.
I just did not understand it.
And there was a part of me thateither I, I'm not sure if it was
a judgment or you know, a levelof enviness, it was a level of
confusion.
'cause it was just somethingthat was so out of the realm of
what I even knew how toexperience or anything that I
had personally felt.
And I used to just tell myselflike, bro, we are not the same.
Like, we got different startinglines.
(31:17):
And I think that that wassomething too.
It was like, I felt like I wasso, I felt like I was so far
behind.
The starting line that I saw somany other women starting at, I
felt that that was somethingelse I had to prove.
Like I had to catch up.
I needed to, you know what?
These other women got tobenefit.
From, from previous generations.
I needed to do the LA you know,in a short timeframe.
(31:37):
Like I couldn't wait until mykids' kids benefited from this.
I needed to do it now.
And that's what also contributedto the speed at which I, of the
pressure that I put on myself.
'cause I felt I was so farbehind the starting line.
I felt like I, you know, I wasmy own safety net.
I didn't have other people thatI could rely on or depend on to
take risks or to show up for mefinancially.
(31:59):
I did, I literally could notafford to make a mistake.
You know, if I made the mistake,I couldn't afford to try again.
Um, and that was a very realreality for me for a long time.
Um, and I used to really thinklike, Hey, look, we're not the
same.
And for a long time we weren't.
You know, I was an accidentalbreadwinner in my previous
marriage.
Um, I was the one who reallymade it work.
(32:21):
And my family, like my familydynamic, they call me when
problems arise, you know?
I was the one with no fallbackplan.
I carried the weight and I heldit all.
And that had been my story foryears.
So yeah, I held some distance,like, you know, I held some
judgment, if I'm being reallyhonest.
Um, maybe even just some quiet,quiet resentment.
(32:41):
But now.
I'm becoming the woman I used tojudge.
I'm becoming the woman I used tosilently resent.
And that's been a lot to unpack,you know, because that is what I
prayed for.
You know, a partner who supportsme.
Um, a partner who bears the riskand the responsibility
(33:03):
financially in our household.
I, you know, prayed for a lifewhere with more softness than
strain, I prayed for a businessthat doesn't demand my constant
force to stay afloat and for meto feel safe and believing that
that is true.
Um, but now that I have it.
Uh, you know, I'm gettingmarried.
I hope motherhood is in the, inthe horizon at uh, um, in the
(33:26):
short horizon.
You know, after taking asabbatical and redesigning my
business, like I'm facing a newchallenge, releasing the belief
that I have to do it all alone,to be worthy of it, and am
learning to sit in this newidentity, not with guilt, not
with shame, but with softness,with gratitude, with openness.
And sometimes a breakthroughisn't earning more.
(33:46):
It's allowing yourself toreceive what you no longer have
to hustle for.
I'm allowed to be supported.
I'm allowed to bewell-resourced.
I'm allowed to make decisionsfrom desire and not just
survival.
I'm allowed to let it be easier.
Now I'm allowed to be thiswoman, and maybe that's the
part.
No one tells you that lettingyourself be supported softens
(34:08):
everything that releasingcontrol doesn't mean that you
lose yourself.
It means you finally get to meetthe version of you that doesn't
have to hold it all.
So if you've been in a similarplace, or maybe holding similar
judgment like I used to, whereyour ambition is shifting, where
your desires are changing, whereyour body is asking you for
(34:29):
something gentler, where you'reno longer available for proving,
welcome to the club.
This is the work.
This is what it looks like tobuild from enough.
To create from fullness to Chasemastery instead of metrics.
And I just hope that thisconversation allows us to
normalize this a little bitmore, um, and to allow us to
(34:50):
expand the definition of whatsuccess means to name this as
growth, and for us to count itas growth.
Because healing hyperindependence doesn't mean that
you lose your edge.
It means you finally learn howto use it with discernment.
And that's the version ofsuccess I want to build from
now.
A success that's sustainable,spacious, rooted in truth, and
(35:13):
that's more than enough for me.
So I just, I hope you enjoyedthis episode.
Um, if you have any downloads orinsights, feel free to pop it
into comments to send me a DMover on Instagram.
I'm at Isha Hawk.
Um, let me know what you thinkand if you're navigating
something similar.
Um, but I will see you in thenext episode.
I hope you have a blessed, uh,rest of your day and I'll talk
(35:35):
to you soon.
There's a version of me thatcould push through anything, and
(00:03):
I did four years I couldengineer a six figure launch
down to the dollar, hit arevenue goal on demand.
My old motto really was exceedthe bar.
I.
I look up the stats, I wouldlearn the benchmarks, then I
would do whatever I had to do tobeat them.
And that mindset really shapedeverything for me.
How I built, how I carried, howI coped, really my whole sense
(00:26):
of self-identity was rooted inthat.
All through college, mycorporate career as an engineer
and this.
Especially, I carried thatmindset with me into
entrepreneurship.
You know, I carried the weightof managing the household
logistics, tracking the movingpieces.
No one else was talking aboutthe bills, the birthdays, the
grocery list, the mentalcalendar of who needed what and
(00:46):
when.
And on top of that, you know, Iwas building and scaling a
business from scratch,navigating rocky relationships
and holding the emotional weightof it all with a detailed
planned in hand.
But here's what I've beensitting with lately.
What happens when your nervoussystem stops?
Confusing urgency with identity?
(01:06):
What happens when pushing isn'tyour default anymore?
And this is what healing hyperindependence has looked like for
me.
This is something I've reallybeen working through over the
past maybe nine to 12 months,and there was a time when I wore
my capability, like a badge ofhonor.
Okay.
I could carry more, hold moreoutlast the chaos, like that was
my edge and that really was myidentity.
(01:29):
So now when I intentionallychoose to do less, when I say no
to pushing, when I walk awayfrom the race, it can feel like
this shrinking experience forme, which has really been hard
to hold even when I know I'mnot, you know?
But here's the tension I've beensitting with.
Just because I can doesn't meanthat I should.
(01:50):
Just because I know how to pushdoesn't mean that.
That version of me is still whoI want to be, and that version
of me feels further and furtheraway.
And that's brought up a new kindof discomfort that I've been
learning how to sit in.
Because when you choose adifferent path, when you decide
not to chase the same version ofsuccess everyone else is posting
(02:13):
about, it's so easy to feelothered.
Like you suddenly are on theoutside of a club you helped to
build and who I feel like youused to be the president of.
And if I'm being really honest,it's not, you know, I'm not just
starting to notice a pattern,but really this is a pattern
that I haven't really named yetfor myself.
(02:34):
What I noticed that I had beendoing repeatedly is that as, as
soon as I get comfortable, assoon as things feel really
secure and feel really steady.
I feel this inner tension andthis inner turmoil that I am not
doing enough.
I'm playing too small, I'm beingirresponsible.
I'm going to lose everythingthat I've built.
And then my default thought isthat you need to stretch your
(02:56):
edge again.
Like, oh, things arecomfortable.
That means you're not workinghard enough.
That means you need to.
Push yourself to the edge ofwhat you can tolerate.
Oh, things are feeling reallysteady and feeling kind of
manageable.
Mm-hmm.
Right?
Alarm woo woo.
You need to do more, pushharder, like put more on your
plate.
And before I get into the restof this episode, I just wanna
(03:17):
say thank you so much for tuningin.
I, um, am really excited to.
To break down this whole healingfrom my hyper independence with
you.
And I do wanna take a momentjust to shout out, uh, those of
you who have been leaving areview lately, it just means so
much to me.
You know, that is the number oneway that people find my podcast,
is when you share it withsomebody else.
You send somebody a dm.
(03:38):
Or you text it to one of yourfriends, um, or you leave a
review.
So I just wanna take a momentjust to say thank you for those
of you guys who have left areview.
Um, this is a five star reviewfrom the working mom coach, and
I just wanna give her a quickshout out.
She said, Isha said, is such arefreshing take on marketing
without the hustle andconvincing energy.
I actually stopped and tooknotes during the podcast because
(04:00):
the information was so great.
Um, the Working Mom Coach, thankyou so much for tuning in and
let's get back into thisepisode.
So the moment things feelsteady, a part of me looks for
the next mountain to climb.
And that has been a repeatedpattern that I have noticed
about myself.
Not always because I want more,but because ease still feels
(04:21):
super unfamiliar.
It feels untrustworthy.
Even like if I don't stretchmyself, I'm somehow slipping.
I'm somehow playing small.
I'm somehow putting at risk.
Everything that I've created formyself, I'm putting my security
at risk and I'm learning to sitwith that discomfort instead of
reacting to it.
I'm learning not to make a hardseason just to prove that I can
(04:47):
handle it where I used toself-sabotage and I would
literally manufacture discomfortin my seasons or discomfort in
what I was doing just so that Icould recreate the chaos where I
had more comfort in before.
And that's the pattern I'mreally trying to break.
And one thing that I wasrecently talking to a client
about and I resonated so muchbecause she's been feeling
something similar, is that this,this heaviness that you are
(05:10):
feeling right now.
It might be here for a couple ofdays or for a couple of weeks,
but it's also very healthy thatyou know me operating at the
edge of what I can tolerate andme always feeling as if I have
to stretch my.
My, my capacity for what I canhold, like that being this
(05:31):
constant push, this constantpursuit, the fact that I'm able
to name it, the fact that I'mable to slow down and pause
within it.
The fact that I'm able toarticulate what is going on is a
sign that I am healing.
It is a sign that my awarenessis at a better state.
The fact that I'm willing topause and that I can sit in the
discomfort while I'm pausing.
(05:52):
It's a huge testament to growth.
So if you're in somethingsimilar, just recognize that
progress may not be about therebeing an avoidance or there
being a lack of a weight that isnoticeable in your life or in
your business or in the season,but your progress is in your
ability to have differentchoices and different responses
to what you do with theheaviness that you now feel.
(06:14):
And again, that's a pattern thatI'm trying to break.
And the other thing that's beencoming up for me is that there
is a loneliness.
A sense of isolation that comeswith choosing ease and a culture
that worships exhaustion becauselet's be honest, this world
doesn't always celebrate rest.
It idolizes the woman who wakesup at five 30 in the morning who
(06:36):
time blocks her day down to the15 minute increments, who
scaling two businesses whilemanaging a team of 15.
Who's on flights every otherweekend, closing deals in her
designer heels.
Like that's the image we areshown.
And like honestly, when I lookup to peers of mine who are in
the industry who are reallycrushing it like that is their
lifestyle.
It is very fast paced.
(06:56):
It is very jam packed.
Like it's these large teams,these.
Um, different loads of risktolerance that they are
carrying, and that's a versionof success that I feel like is
often the one that is most, um,spotlighted and most amplified.
So when you choose not to keepup with that pace.
When you say, actually, I want aslower, maybe softer, maybe
(07:18):
saner way to succeed.
'cause success doesn't mean thatit, you know, just because you
choose to do it at a differentpace doesn't mean that your
success isn't inevitable.
But you know, you really riskbeing misunderstood when you
choose that alternative path.
And it can be so easy to fallinto comparison, to fall into
feeling like you're doingsomething wrong, to feel like,
(07:39):
you know, the, the, the voicesthat are internal really start
to get louder that.
The self-doubt and you'requestioning yourself and all of
it, but like choosing peace overperformance will confuse people
who only know you by yourproductivity.
And I wanna say that again.
'cause as somebody who used topride herself and how productive
she could be, as somebody whoused to be known for her grit
(08:03):
and her resilience, and how hardshe could hustle, and how
scrappy she was and what shecould tolerate and what she
could hold.
Choosing peace over performancewill confuse people who only
know you buy your productivity.
It's a big difference now.
It's not that you're any lesscapable, it's that you're no
longer willing to portrayyourself to prove what you are
(08:24):
capable of.
And even when you're doingwhat's right for you, it can
still feel like you don't belongin the ecosystem that you're
operating in.
And that's something I've alsobeen really wrestling with.
Um,'cause you know, you lookaround and you wonder like, do I
still fit in here?
Do people still respect me ifI'm not striving the way that I
used to?
What community spaces make sensefor me to attach myself to, to
(08:47):
join, to invest in when it feelslike?
The promises and the purpose ofall these other masterminds or
group programs are rooted in a,a version of my identity that
I'm trying to heal from.
It's like, where do I belong?
Who do I talk to?
Who is my community?
Um, and sometimes the mostradical thing that you can do is
(09:08):
step off the pedestal you builtand stop performing for the
applause.
You know, I think this issomething that is so necessary,
especially in the digitalmarketing online space because.
Unlike other professions, we areconstantly being judged, viewed,
looked at on a daily basisbecause we create content and we
(09:28):
show up and we share ourperspective.
Like the more visible you get,the uh, more likelihood that
you're gonna be open to beingmisunderstood.
And just choosing a differentversion of success has made me
feel like an outcast at times.
You know, not because I'mfailing, but because I'm no
longer subscribing to the same.
(09:49):
Proven blueprint or the samepath.
The same script anymore.
And when you stop performing,people don't always know where
to place you.
You know?
And honestly, again, some ofthose internal thoughts that I
keep having to self-coach myselfthrough and have a external
sounding board to regainperspective on is like, am I
(10:09):
playing too small?
And or is it just that I justwant something different now?
Like, and that's just, it's alayer dynamic because I go back
and forth between this, but Ithink I'm at a point now where
I'm settling in to this versionof enoughness and I think it's
been difficult for me to hold,like.
What is it?
(10:30):
What does it mean about me if Idon't wanna scale to eight
figures?
Like if I don't want to engineeranother record breaking revenue
month, like, and still there'sthis little voice that sometimes
whispers like, shouldn't youstill want that?
It's the residue of being in aspace where ambition was and had
one definition, more money, moreclients, more growth.
(10:50):
Faster, faster, faster.
Where success is about what youcan hold, what you can hustle,
and how long you can sustainthat unrelenting pace.
And yet I've started askingmyself a different question.
I.
And you've heard me talk aboutthis over the past handful of
episodes, um, or sprinkledthroughout the episodes in this,
in the podcast over the pastyear because I've really been
(11:12):
asking myself differentquestions.
And I'm just here to tell you,I'm still wrestling with the
tension of being okay with adifferent version of success
than what I have anchored myidentity to over the past eight
years.
But what if more means somethingdifferent now to me, which is
what it feels like it does.
You know, more looks like havingthe energy to be present with my
(11:33):
partner, to show up for myfamily.
Um, last weekend I flew 2300miles to go to Detroit, just to
go to my cousin's graduation.
It was a 30 hour trip.
I had the capacity to do that,you know, to be present for my
friends, to be able to call myfriends in the morning and chit
chat on FaceTime and check inwith my friends, uh, via text.
(11:54):
Without that feeling like it's aback burner thought, that always
gets pushed off.
Where I'm scheduling, meeting upwith my friends six months from
now on a particular two daysthat I have available that's
carved out like, um, success forme and more for me now looks
like having the capacity andspaciousness to enjoy slow
mornings.
Instead of rushing into work,you know, as somebody who has
(12:16):
been trying to adjust herhormones and work through her
cortisol levels that have beenreally imbalanced, slow mornings
have been critical for my ownstress management, for my gut
health, and being able to havethat spaciousness in my calendar
where I'm not waking up with analready predetermined three hour
checklist that has to get done.
(12:36):
Um, but I'm able to ease into mymornings ease into.
Working out, you know, slow downand have a very mindful,
intentional breakfast.
Um, even just preparing moodsmeals for myself now that don't
feel like I have to hire a chefor feel like I have to, you
know, delegate everything.
'cause I just don't have thecapacity.
(12:56):
Like more is having thatcapacity to nurture myself and
take care of myself.
And for that to feel like apriority more looks like
mastering my craft.
Not for the applause, but foralignment, for congruency, for
my own sense ofself-fulfillment, for knowing
that I put, uh, my all intosomething and I've created
(13:16):
something that I'm truly proudof for myself.
And to be honest, I've had torevisit this truth more than
once.
You know, this isn't a conceptI've figured out and tucked
neatly into a journal.
It's something I've had to keeptalking about, something I've
needed to process out loud morethan once.
And I, if you've been listeningto the podcast over the past
year, you've noticed this as arecurring theme, but it's a
(13:37):
recurring theme because it'salso, um, it's something that.
It's not like my logical brainknows that I'm safe.
My logical brain knows that medefining a new definition of
success is the best thing for mein this season, and there's
still a part of my other, partof my brain, this other part of
(13:59):
my identity that I'm stillhealing from and healing through
and healing with.
That's like, hmm.
Is it really safe for you toadjust your pace?
Girl?
Mm.
Can you really make money doingwhat you love, honoring your
capacity and honoring thespaciousness, but still being
able to deliver well?
Mm.
Are you not playing small?
Because what you want looksdifferent than how you, what
(14:22):
you've been kind of told, orwhat you've believed is supposed
to look like?
And, ugh, that little whisper,that little ghetto voice in the
back of my mind.
Telling me shit and I want more.
It doesn't disappear justbecause you intellectually know
better.
Sometimes the only way to quietthe mental chatter is to process
it externally to get it out ofyour head and into a
(14:43):
conversation to say the thingand have someone mirror back
that you are not crazy, thatthis all makes sense and to help
validate that and hold space foryou while you're processing,
because mental clarity doesn'tcome from having the right
answer.
It comes from having the spaceto say the messy, unsure thing
out loud without being judgedfor it.
(15:04):
That's what the integrationlooks like and what it has
looked like for me, not justknowing something, but living in
alignment with it again andagain.
I.
And part of that integrationwork has meant digging deeper
into this root of hyperindependence because I didn't
just wake up one day cravingease.
I had to unravel why it felt sohard to let go of the push in
(15:25):
the first place.
And let me pause here and justgive some context around like
what hyper independence reallyis, because hyper independence
is self-protection in disguise.
It's a habit of doing it allyourself, not because you
genuinely want to, but becauseat some point it became safe,
unsafe to trust others.
And I think that's a reallyimportant concept to understand.
(15:47):
When I say I'm healing hyperindependence, I'm talking about
the internal pattern that saysI'm safest when I do everything
myself.
I am talking about the internalpattern that says receiving help
is risky or means I'm bound tobe disappointed.
My value comes from what I cancarry and how fast I can carry
it.
Hyper independence is controlmasquerading as confidence.
(16:10):
If you were praised for neverneeding anyone, healing will
look like letting someone elsecarry responsibility even when
you're still perfectly capableof doing it yourself.
And listen, I've been capable mywhole life, but being capable is
not the same as being cared for.
(16:30):
That mindset served me for avery long time, and it got me
through some real shit, but italso quietly convinced me that I
had to earn love, I had to earnrest, and I had to earn ease.
So when I started stepping intoa new season of life, one being
in a super supportiverelationship.
(16:51):
And just thinking about like theversion of what I want my
experience of motherhood to belike.
I was shocked at howuncomfortable that felt because
it was really given thatGabrielle Union 50 50 or bust
energy.
But in my case, I caught myselfclinging to the last shreds of
independence as proof that I wasstill safe.
You know, I would say thingslike, well, I'm still paying
(17:13):
half the mortgage, as if thatmade it more okay to accept the
rest of the support that wasbeing offered in my household
and from my partner.
And as if letting someone elsecarry more meant I was somehow
failing or I was putting myselfat risk, or I would be unsafe
for me to depend on somebody inthat way.
And it's wild because on paper,this is what I had prayed for.
(17:37):
But in practice receiving itrequired a whole new version of
safety inside my body.
So healing hyper independencehas looked like letting my man
take care of things without mehovering, worrying, or jumping
into just do it myself.
If he says, do you needanything?
My answer is always yes.
Yes to the help.
(17:57):
Yes to the softness, yes, tobeing held.
It's not about what I'm capableof doing, it's about allowing
myself to be cared for.
Okay.
Uh, healing my hyperindependence has looked like me
when I go back to Detroit.
Staying at a friend's house, notgetting a rental car, letting my
friends drive me around.
As somebody who had, does not dothat, that was probably one.
(18:20):
I just, when I went back homefrom my cousin's graduation, I
stayed at one of my friend'shouses and I told her, I said,
listen.
She's been begging me to comeand stay at her house for years.
And if you listen to a recentepisode I did with Monique
Shields, we talked about this,um, if you recall that from a
few episodes ago, but I, I, Idid it guys.
Okay?
(18:41):
I asked to stay at my friend'shouse.
I received her invitation, butbefore I got there, I texted her
and I said, this is like a leveleight discomfort level for me.
Uh, I'm doing it'cause I knowthis is gonna be a growth
opportunity for our friendship,but it's also a growth
opportunity for me of allowingmyself to be cared for.
And as somebody who just alwaysgets her own hotels, always
(19:03):
books her own cars, always takescare of herself when she goes
someplace.
That was a version of me healingmy hyper independence.
Um, another version of this haslooked like allowing myself to
be resourced.
Not because I can't figure itout, but because I don't want to
do it all alone anymore.
You know, hiring project basedhelp delegating what I could
easily do myself, working with acoach, not because I'm lost, but
(19:26):
because I value support.
And I think too, even when itcomes to hiring help.
I, um, really only used to hirehelp if I was in a hyper-growth
state, which was my entirebusiness before this, you know,
versus now, even when I'msteady, I'm still committed to
having a coach.
Even when I'm not trying to growdouble or triple my revenue, I
still have coach, I still havesupport in my corner because I
(19:50):
think that that is something forme that I need to normalize,
that IOI.
I deserve help even when I'm notin a constant state of stretch.
I deserve help and beingsupported and to be resourced,
even if I'm in a calmer state,I'm in a chill state because I
don't want to hold all theresponsibility or the, I don't
wanna hold the cognitive loadalone anymore.
(20:12):
Um, another way that I've beenhealing it is just letting life
be good without waiting for theother shoe to drop.
You know, sometimes the nextlevel of growth isn't adding
more to your plate.
It's learning how to let someoneelse carry it for once, or carry
versions of it or parts of it.
And as I began to unpack thatidentity and welcome in support,
something else started to shifttoo, my relationship with money.
(20:35):
Because when you enter or when,when your entire sense of safety
has been rooted inself-reliance, money isn't just
currency.
It is proof.
Proof that you're secure.
That you're doing enough, thatyou're worthy.
But when that need to provebegins to fade, so does the way
that you chase.
(20:56):
Some people chase growth bystretching their limits.
I'm growing by choosing torespect mine because when you're
used to building from survivalrevenue, become revenue goals,
become your lifeline.
They're how you create security.
They're how you prove thatyou're okay.
They're how you justify yourrest.
But now money feels sodifferent.
(21:17):
It's no longer about chasing anumber, but it's about building
a rhythm I can actually liveinside of.
So I'm not scaling for applauseanymore.
I'm building for stability.
I am no longer interested inmaxing out my risk tolerance
just because I can.
I've done the season of highrisk, high speed, high stakes,
and what I mean by that is likeI lived through the season of
(21:39):
moving every 18 months prettymuch my entire life.
Up until hopefully now I'mpraying I do not move another 18
months, but like my entire life,even as a kid, I moved about
every 18 to 24 months, you know?
And then when I think about likethis journey, since you've seen
me on being an entrepreneur andbuilding my business, I went
from living in a$600 a monthapartment in Westland, Michigan,
(22:01):
to within 18 months, living in ahigh rise, my dream apartment in
downtown Detroit, paying themost I had ever paid in rent.
To 18 months later to purchasinga$5,000, I mean a 5,000 square
foot historic home in SherwoodForest in Detroit.
Then from there, joining theDetroit Golf Club, my entire
(22:22):
lifestyle, changing to 18 monthslater, selling that house moving
2300 miles across the country.
I had my little stunting season,yet I cannot believe I'm about
to admit this on here, but I wasspending$11,000 a month in rent
for my apartment for about 18 to20 months.
Which was such a good experiencefor me.
I, I do believe that if you arenew money, you should have a, a
(22:44):
responsible, um, hustle.
I mean, as a responsible stuntin season to just enjoy the, the
limits of what this new moneycan kind of afford and
experiences you never knew youcould have.
That, that living in thatapartment really upgraded my
identity in a way I didn't know,I just didn't know was
available.
I did that for 18 to 20 months.
(23:05):
Um, purchased another property,renovated that property cash.
I was investing in hedge funds,crypto, private equity
evaluations, potential franchisedeals.
Like all of this was happeningso quickly all while my business
was still doubling in triplingevery year.
So I know what it costs, like Iknow what it felt like to live
(23:26):
in a high risk, high volatility,high speed, high stakes for
about five or six years.
My nervous system was fried and'cause it was like, baby, it's
like you keep trying to run themarathon and your body's like,
bro, can we please just go for awalk?
Like my heart rate was throughthe roof and I knew what that
(23:47):
felt like.
And because behind themilestones was at pace, that
burned through my energy.
It caused so much fog with mysense of clarity and my sense of
self.
My nervous system was fried.
Way that my therapist kind ofdescribes it is like I, I gave
my nervous system no time totitrate.
(24:09):
I would just open the ball, goto the most expansive version
possible, and I just keptstretching it and stretching it
and stretching it, versusallowing my nervous system to
titrate to that edge.
I just skipped all the steps andwent to the furthest realm
possible, and it was a cycle ofself abandonment is what also
tense started to happen.
(24:29):
Of following blueprints that Inever paused long enough to ask
myself if I even wanted in thefirst place.
I was attaching myself toversions of success that I never
checked in with myself to evenask, is that an outcome that you
even want?
I was outsourcing myself, trust,waiting for someone else to give
me permission or to validate myideas.
Like it.
(24:49):
It created such a divide withwhat I was doing and who I was
and my ability to trust myselfin that.
And, and also living at the edgeof what I could tolerate for so
many years and constantlystretching the limits of what
that was.
It made me terrified to slowdown.
Like I became very, very afraidof a slower pace because the
(25:11):
slowness, when you were so usedto moving at such a high speed,
felt so disorienting.
Um, that's what felt unsafe whenreally the speed at which I was
moving at was the problematicissue.
So I don't need volatility.
I don't need volatility to provethat I can weather it.
That has been a core truth thatI have been learning in this
season, that I need steadinessto prove that I'm safe without
(25:35):
it.
You know, there's nothing cuteabout choosing and chasing
chaos, which hand raising up,that's what I had been doing.
I used to see risk as power.
Now I see power in havingoptions and breathing room.
So now the question I ask myselfis simple is what's actually
sustainable and what is it thatyou actually want?
In this season of life, in thisseason of business for where
(25:57):
you're at right now, like whatare you happy with?
And I've already proven that Ican outpace the pressure.
I don't want to scale faster.
I want to scale withoutbetraying myself.
I used to tolerate chaos for thepayoff.
Now I'm building a life thatdoesn't require a 12 month
sabbatical for recovery.
Okay?
(26:18):
So I used to treat my businesslike a race, like every launch,
every quarter, every year wasrun faster, beat your last
record, and stay ahead.
And that was the only speed thatI knew.
Sprinting was the strategy.
Overachieving was the baseline,and I wanted to prove that I
could now.
I ain't trying to win a, I'm noteven trying to win a race
(26:38):
anymore.
I don't even want to run a race.
I'm focused on staying in mygame, on building something that
I want to last in, you know,something that won't cost me my
health, my joy or my peace tomaintain, and I don't want
adrenaline based successanymore.
Like, I want a regulatedsuccess.
And I think something too, forentrepreneurs, especially those
(27:00):
of us who might be, uh, a littlebit more seasoned, there's a
high amount of dopamine thathappens with this fast-paced,
adrenaline based success thatI've been talking about, and I
do think that many of us getaddicted to it.
Oftentimes because we do nothave enough dopamine happening
in other areas of our life, likewe get so much of our joy and
(27:21):
sense of self-fulfillment andthe dopamine hits as being
purely sourced from the businesswhen, and I think that's a
really problematic space to bein, especially if you start to
notice that as a pattern isbecause I think sometimes we can
put all of our energy and all ofour identity into the business.
So all of our joy, sense ofself-worth, sense of validation,
all the dopamine hits is onlybeing sourced through the
(27:42):
business because we actuallyhaven't created a life.
We haven't nurturedrelationships.
We haven't explored otherinterests and curiosities and
hobbies.
We haven't allowed ourselves totap into other things outside of
work that can fulfill thosethings that yes, you need as a
human, but should not be solelysourced from the business, you
know?
Um.
(28:04):
Like I said, I, I just, I don'twant an adrenaline based success
anymore.
I want a regulated success fromthe business, not the kind that
spikes and crashes, but the kindthat feels good to live inside
of every day, not just duringlaunches.
So I'm no longer chasingvisibility or volume.
I'm chasing alignment.
I'm, I'm in pursuit ofintegrity.
And I think really where I'vebeen wrapping my mind around is
(28:25):
like, my new version of successis really about mastery of my
craft, and I'll talk about thata little bit more.
In just a little bit.
But these days I'm measuringsuccess by how resourced I feel
while doing the work.
I am measuring success by howresourced I feel while doing the
work, by how honest I can be inmy delivery, by how much of
(28:48):
myself I get to bring to thetable without burning out,
trying to prove anything ortrying to keep up with anyone or
anything like that, like.
Self-mastery is the new metric,and the work is really the
reward.
It's a byproduct of me remainingcommitted to myself, and when I
stopped performing to provesomething and started creating
(29:10):
from a place of clarity andcalm, guess what happened?
The money still came, the moneyis still coming.
You know, in fact, it flowed somuch more freely, it flowed so
much more easefully.
Like, it felt so much morepleasurable to be quite honest.
Um, the happier I felt, the moregrounded I became.
The more naturally my businessgrew.
(29:31):
I.
Not just in revenue or clientcount, but in fulfillment, in
spaciousness and ease and thecaliber of the client
relationships that I wasattracting.
Because I wasn't gripping, I wasnot grasping.
I wasn't trying to force resultsor outpace my capacity.
I was offering.
I was showing up from wholenessinstead of hustle.
(29:52):
I was creating from desire andnot desperation, and people felt
that, my clients felt that.
I felt that, and I know you dotoo.
You can always tell whensomebody's operating from peace
instead of pressure.
And I wanna be honest withsomething else too.
I.
There was a time that I judgedother women who had this type of
(30:13):
support that I'm talking about.
I think it was because there wasa part of me that just could not
understand the concept that somethat was somebody else's like
day-to-day reality, like womenwho had husbands that funded
their businesses or were theirfinancial providers in their
household, and any money thatthey made was really nice to
have money.
It wasn't needed money.
Um, women who came from trustfunds or very generous parents,
(30:36):
or who had these safety netsthat let them leap without
looking like women who didn'thave to run the numbers five
times before remindingthemselves they were financially
safe.
Like, who could just take bigrisks, mess it up, and still
land on their feet becausesomeone else was there to catch
them.
Like, I, that was the, theconcept of that.
(30:56):
Like, I knew that those peopleexisted.
I just did not understand it.
And there was a part of me thateither I, I'm not sure if it was
a judgment or you know, a levelof enviness, it was a level of
confusion.
'cause it was just somethingthat was so out of the realm of
what I even knew how toexperience or anything that I
had personally felt.
And I used to just tell myselflike, bro, we are not the same.
Like, we got different startinglines.
(31:17):
And I think that that wassomething too.
It was like, I felt like I wasso, I felt like I was so far
behind.
The starting line that I saw somany other women starting at, I
felt that that was somethingelse I had to prove.
Like I had to catch up.
I needed to, you know what?
These other women got tobenefit.
From, from previous generations.
I needed to do the LA you know,in a short timeframe.
(31:37):
Like I couldn't wait until mykids' kids benefited from this.
I needed to do it now.
And that's what also contributedto the speed at which I, of the
pressure that I put on myself.
'cause I felt I was so farbehind the starting line.
I felt like I, you know, I wasmy own safety net.
I didn't have other people thatI could rely on or depend on to
take risks or to show up for mefinancially.
(31:59):
I did, I literally could notafford to make a mistake.
You know, if I made the mistake,I couldn't afford to try again.
Um, and that was a very realreality for me for a long time.
Um, and I used to really thinklike, Hey, look, we're not the
same.
And for a long time we weren't.
You know, I was an accidentalbreadwinner in my previous
marriage.
Um, I was the one who reallymade it work.
(32:21):
And my family, like my familydynamic, they call me when
problems arise, you know?
I was the one with no fallbackplan.
I carried the weight and I heldit all.
And that had been my story foryears.
So yeah, I held some distance,like, you know, I held some
judgment, if I'm being reallyhonest.
Um, maybe even just some quiet,quiet resentment.
(32:41):
But now.
I'm becoming the woman I used tojudge.
I'm becoming the woman I used tosilently resent.
And that's been a lot to unpack,you know, because that is what I
prayed for.
You know, a partner who supportsme.
Um, a partner who bears the riskand the responsibility
(33:03):
financially in our household.
I, you know, prayed for a lifewhere with more softness than
strain, I prayed for a businessthat doesn't demand my constant
force to stay afloat and for meto feel safe and believing that
that is true.
Um, but now that I have it.
Uh, you know, I'm gettingmarried.
I hope motherhood is in the, inthe horizon at uh, um, in the
(33:26):
short horizon.
You know, after taking asabbatical and redesigning my
business, like I'm facing a newchallenge, releasing the belief
that I have to do it all alone,to be worthy of it, and am
learning to sit in this newidentity, not with guilt, not
with shame, but with softness,with gratitude, with openness.
And sometimes a breakthroughisn't earning more.
(33:46):
It's allowing yourself toreceive what you no longer have
to hustle for.
I'm allowed to be supported.
I'm allowed to bewell-resourced.
I'm allowed to make decisionsfrom desire and not just
survival.
I'm allowed to let it be easier.
Now I'm allowed to be thiswoman, and maybe that's the
part.
No one tells you that lettingyourself be supported softens
(34:08):
everything that releasingcontrol doesn't mean that you
lose yourself.
It means you finally get to meetthe version of you that doesn't
have to hold it all.
So if you've been in a similarplace, or maybe holding similar
judgment like I used to, whereyour ambition is shifting, where
your desires are changing, whereyour body is asking you for
(34:29):
something gentler, where you'reno longer available for proving,
welcome to the club.
This is the work.
This is what it looks like tobuild from enough.
To create from fullness to Chasemastery instead of metrics.
And I just hope that thisconversation allows us to
normalize this a little bitmore, um, and to allow us to
(34:50):
expand the definition of whatsuccess means to name this as
growth, and for us to count itas growth.
Because healing hyperindependence doesn't mean that
you lose your edge.
It means you finally learn howto use it with discernment.
And that's the version ofsuccess I want to build from
now.
A success that's sustainable,spacious, rooted in truth, and
(35:13):
that's more than enough for me.
So I just, I hope you enjoyedthis episode.
Um, if you have any downloads orinsights, feel free to pop it
into comments to send me a DMover on Instagram.
I'm at Isha Hawk.
Um, let me know what you thinkand if you're navigating
something similar.
Um, but I will see you in thenext episode.
I hope you have a blessed, uh,rest of your day and I'll talk
(35:35):
to you soon.
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