Episode 379 - S17E13 - Forty-One Witnesses - Law and Order: Special Viewing Unit

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hello, welcome back to another because you screwed me on
the recording thing, so that now you get that. Enjoy it,
you fucker. Hello listener, So welcome back to another episode
of Law in a Special Viewing Unit, the show where
we view review and a lovedly ridicule everyone's favorite cop drama,
Law and Order Special Victims Unit, every episode in a
row from the beginning, throwing to you of Eve so

(00:32):
you don't have to. I am your host, Matt Reuter
joining me as always a non participatory co host today.
So for the no that would be me? Who are
you would be? Who are you gonna be? You could
be creasy the carees of this podcast, who's actually doing
police work kind of and just being kind of a dick?

(00:53):
That's a Vive roup beside. How are you doing over there?
AVIV live from the Battle of Los Angeles itself?

Speaker 2 (00:59):
You think I don't know anythink about your horror tricks.

Speaker 1 (01:03):
My note, whatever that happens. Just like, bro, let's mind
your own fucking business, all right. Yes, you live in
New York, you know where you live.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
But that's that's the whole point of this fucking episode
is cops can't mind their own business and they hate
when other people mind their own business, but also like,
isn't that horrible because because Kitty Genevie's happened once?

Speaker 1 (01:21):
Oops? But wait did it?

Speaker 2 (01:23):
Turns out we're gonna we're gonna be hearing from Psychology Today, the.

Speaker 1 (01:28):
Right periodical And so for listeners that are.

Speaker 2 (01:32):
Sorry the American Psychological Association that we're going from.

Speaker 1 (01:36):
Uh. For for listeners that are new or new ERTs
of this podcast, right, but you're going to hear is
some perhaps new information. If you are a long time listener,
you will understand that we have we're going to talk
about this for the ninth time, and it seems like
we're just recycling storylines now with a little extra spice

(01:56):
on it here and there. I'll tell you what I
did not have super drunk guy testifying on the Big
Go card from.

Speaker 2 (02:01):
The show Man.

Speaker 1 (02:02):
It's a payoff.

Speaker 2 (02:03):
That was the that was a real that was like
at one point, I'm like, Kitty Jenne's, Kitty Jenevie's, Knty
Jennevie's we're doing flight now. Well, I was like, Kitty, yes,
do it a bump a coke? Just straighten out before
having to testify in front of Congress.

Speaker 1 (02:22):
I never saw a Flight, but I was gonna say,
finally me, I can see me on screen of you.
It's like, all right, here's what we're gonna do. I'm
gonna chill out here. I'm just gonna have the spear
before I go in and testify. Everything's gonna be fine.

Speaker 2 (02:34):
Uh, nobody panic, It's fine.

Speaker 1 (02:37):
I swear to you it's fine.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
That's basically the plot of Flight. Denzel Washington like drunk
lands of playing upside down and saves a bunch of
people's lives, and Congress is like, were you drunk when
you did that? And he's like, not only that, I'm drunk.

Speaker 1 (02:50):
Right now, and they're like, not guilty.

Speaker 2 (02:52):
YEA.

Speaker 1 (02:52):
Basically it's like, well, what do you what are you
gonna do? The guy, for whatever reason, sort of a savant, yeah,
And is that really your crime?

Speaker 2 (03:03):
This guy's a drunk savant too. How are you this week? Matt?

Speaker 1 (03:06):
I like, how we're kicking to be first? Good? So
I have a Reid Recommends and I asked you this
last week. It's not a show or a movie.

Speaker 2 (03:15):
Though.

Speaker 1 (03:16):
I finished reading the book Project Hail Mary Yes and
Book Yes, which apparently is also now going to be
a movie.

Speaker 2 (03:25):
We lost Matt Damon again.

Speaker 1 (03:27):
No, it's it's Ryan Gosling this time, I believe.

Speaker 2 (03:31):
Yes, all we lost Ryan Gosling again. So wait a minute,
Wait a minute, wait a bite. Whait whoa whoa whoa
whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa Wait a minute, Yes, because
a couple of things. A couple of things.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
Matt sure. Start with the first.

Speaker 2 (03:48):
Ryan Gosling plays a character named Ryland Grace, which sounds
like if if Ryan Gosling wrote a scrip at seventeen,
wrote a screenplay for him to be in, and it's like, well,
I'm not not talking about myself talking about Ryland to Grace.

Speaker 1 (04:07):
That would be silly. No one will suspect. Yes, in fact,
that is the main character's name, so that makes sense.
Cassie's gonna read it, so I did. I was like
one of those things where it was like, oh, I
want to tell you about this part of my book.
It's real fun, but it's like she's going to read it,
so like I can't say it of this, but you
don't sound like you're planning to go reading.

Speaker 2 (04:24):
Well, so couple couple things. Everyone loves this book. I
don't think I'm gonna read it. However, it's quite good,
it's quite fun. I am going to see it because
it's being directed not just starring Ryan Gosling who I
like and Milana Veintrab who I like, but also written
by Drew Goddard who I like, and directed by Phil

(04:44):
Lord and Chris Miller, who I like.

Speaker 1 (04:46):
Uh what are what's their? What else have they done?

Speaker 2 (04:50):
You might know them from their first TV show that
they sold Clone High.

Speaker 1 (04:55):
Oh okay.

Speaker 2 (04:57):
They also did the Lego movie and the first into
the Spider Verse movie and oh so primarily comedy in
all comedy. Oh all animation, Yeah, lots of animation. They
also did twenty one and I think twenty two Jump
Street ah okay, but there they did. They did some
live action stuff, all right.

Speaker 1 (05:18):
So for any I, you know, for anyone that doesn't
want to hear spoilers, but I have to say that,
knowing now that it's a movie, Yeah, I have to
say something that is going to give away. It's not
like a it's not a surprise or anything necessarily, it's
it's a it's I don't maybe it is, maybe it isn't.
But so I'm very very concerned about this movie because
it's a space adventure, so you know, the CGI is

(05:38):
going to be ninety five percent of this movie for sure.

Speaker 2 (05:41):
But these are the Spider Verse guys, so maybe it'll look.

Speaker 1 (05:44):
Cool, right, Like, I hope they do have some variety
of like practice. And again you're it's space zero gravity.
It's like, of course that's this is going to be
like that. That's that's that's inevitable. But my concern is
that there is a non human life.

Speaker 2 (05:59):
For oh sure, and it's it's.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
Gonna be I doubt they're doing this in practical effects.
So again we're looking at a CGI, so that means
Ryan Gosling is gonna be looking at a fucking tennis ball. Yeah,
well for the majority of the movie, and that really
I feel like it's got disaster written all over it.

Speaker 2 (06:18):
I well, I will say it worked for and Or
and they diego Luna wasn't looking at a tennis ball,
but was looking at by his very own account, Alan
tudex Cock that uh, that that worked pretty well. So
I think it's basically just down to shot design. It's

(06:40):
also oh never buy it's be it's like the produced
by Pascal Pictures that Amy Pascal's uh a shingle after
she left Sony or she might still be now she's
not what Sony, but I read I read Amy Pascal
as Pedro Pascal. I was like, Pedro Pascal, I was
producing this movie.

Speaker 1 (07:01):
No, that would be interesting, but it's I'm I'm concerned
because I love the book so much. Highly recommend go
go read it if you are into that kind of thing.
I'm not a particular sci fi fan, but had heard
good things about it, so I was just like, I'll
give it a go, and it was really good.

Speaker 2 (07:18):
Okay, so let me pitch you a reason to be
feeling good. Feeling good about this optimistic Remember the thing
I said about and Or and looking at Alan Tutick's cock.

Speaker 1 (07:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:34):
The cinematography for Product. The cinematographer for Project Hail. Mary
is also the cinematographer for Rogue one and Both Dunes
and The Batman which you haven't seen but has shot
very well, and a movie called The Creator which I
don't love, but the visual effects in it are like
masterpiece level.

Speaker 1 (07:55):
Was that Zack Snyder?

Speaker 2 (07:56):
No, it's Gareth Edwards, the guy that did the first
Godzilla reboot in like twenty sixteen, or whatever. Oh with Craston, No,
maybe pre Cranston. This is the one yes with Cranston
where he dies in Fukushima. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yes, yes, yes.

(08:17):
Spoilers for for a fifteen year old movie.

Speaker 1 (08:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (08:21):
He also he also shot zero Arc thirty So this
this Greg Fraser knows what's up. So hopefully yeah yeah,
hopefully it'll work.

Speaker 1 (08:29):
Yeah. So uh but yes, very very good book. Highly
recommend it.

Speaker 2 (08:33):
I have some Rubinstein doesn't recommend, but a ba okay,
here we go. Rubinstein does not recommend the Phoenician scheme.

Speaker 1 (08:42):
I've heard. It's not good.

Speaker 2 (08:43):
It's not great. It's not great. There's a lot of
stuff happening, very very little of it makes sense. People
are talking fast, not emoting. And then and then there's credits.

Speaker 1 (08:54):
So it's a Wes Anderson.

Speaker 2 (08:56):
Yeah, Wes Anderson keep visually it looks cool, it looks
very nice. He keeps sort of like re upping his
own style every time. It's like a copy of a
copy of a copy, and now we're fucked.

Speaker 1 (09:09):
It's just it's gone. It's going too four.

Speaker 2 (09:13):
You know, I liked his last one, Like, I don't
think the style is necessarily an indication of bad quality.
I think it's just like a both and but yeah,
I liked Asteroid City significantly more than this one. But
Benista Delta quite goodn't it? I will say no, Okay, well,
two thumbs up for Benisio's performance. And there's a there's

(09:34):
a woman in the movie. She's like the basically the
second main character. And if you watch it, you're gonna
be like, why who is this person? I don't recognize her.
Why is she the lead of this movie? And the
answer is because she's Kate Winslet's daughter. Ah.

Speaker 1 (09:52):
I did see something where it's like, oh, the newest
NEPO baby hot off the presses.

Speaker 2 (09:56):
I can't even pronounce her last name. It's like too english. Threrapleton.

Speaker 1 (10:03):
Oh that is that is?

Speaker 2 (10:04):
I really think it's th Rapleton. And I also watched
The Woman in Black, the Daniel Radcliffe haunted house movie.

Speaker 1 (10:12):
From Oh I've seen yeah a while ago.

Speaker 2 (10:14):
Did we not care for it?

Speaker 1 (10:15):
It's not great, It's okay.

Speaker 2 (10:17):
It's okay, it's ending fine, kind of fun.

Speaker 1 (10:19):
Yeah, the ending does a lot. It's you know, it's
I it's also been a while s associated, but I
remember being like, no, that's yeah.

Speaker 2 (10:28):
We were so bad at color grading in twenty twelve.

Speaker 1 (10:32):
Oh that was the style of the time.

Speaker 2 (10:35):
It was just turning it on. Now I'm like, Jesus Christ,
what is this shit?

Speaker 1 (10:39):
Yeah, you can't see shit. The lighting is always shit.

Speaker 2 (10:42):
All the blacks are like completely crushed.

Speaker 1 (10:44):
Right, it's uh, everything's like always kind of blue.

Speaker 2 (10:48):
Yeah, yeah, the bale blue. Yeah. So that's been my
that's been my my week. Watched a couple of movies,
didn't get shot by the police. Pretty good week.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
And now that that's out of the way, on to
the main event, we're gonna be viewing and reviewing Season seventeen,
episode thirteen of sv YOU entitled forty one Witnesses. Jesus Christ,
we're doing this again right after.

Speaker 2 (11:10):
This Vive in the future. It's witnesses. You wrote witness
forty one witness which is wrong. So fix it.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
And we're back. And as we said before the break,
we're gonna be viewing and reviewing Season seventeen, episode thirteen
of SVU entitled forty one Witnesses. Just a reminder to
our listeners, all the episodes are available to watch on
Hulu and Peacock up to this point, so we recommend
that you watched the episode before. Here is break down
this what's kind of crazy.

Speaker 2 (11:35):
It is, honestly and like pretty frustrating. We've been a
one that frustrated me a lot in a minute.

Speaker 1 (11:42):
Sure, and I kind of enjoyed because it's just creasy
being a dick to people for like the whole episode,
which is kind of funny. But before we get into
breaking down the episode, in the greatenest tradition that we
have on this podcast of VIV, you're gonna hit us
with the ninety second recap of what happened in this
week's episode. So, Vive, we're gonna put ninety seconds on
the clock. Why did you tell us what the fuck
happened this week's episode of Best for You?

Speaker 2 (12:03):
Okay, you guys, what the fuck is this fucking coffee shop?
They're just dealing special k out in the open and
then doing almost a rape out in the open, and
someone who we find out later goes to Fordham Law
School is like writing a screenplay in the corner. So yeah,

(12:23):
that's right, we're doing a kitty Genevieve's these three teenish
teen and twenty somethings grab this woman who's all in
like a k hole, take her back to her apartment,
try to break in. When they can't do that, they
rape her in the courtyard in front of a hundred windows,
and no one calls nine to one one, and the

(12:45):
cops are just like, man, sucks being a cop because
everyone in New York is a piece of shit that
doesn't help people. And so they look around. Everyone's a
piece of shit who doesn't help people. And then they
find one woman with a black eye and she's like,
they scared me into thinking that I couldn't help anybody,
and they're like, please testify, and she's like all right,

(13:08):
And then they do it again with the other neighbor
who's a white guy, and he the guilt was breaking
him up so much that he got drunk, broke his
five year sobriety after witnessing the rape and not doing anything,
and then they get him to testify. He also testifies drunk,

(13:28):
and Barbara I guess gets him to prove that he's
got the best memory in the world and therefore can
be trusted guilty on all accounts. Even the kid who
probably shouldn't be with the rest of them, Dick Wolf.

Speaker 1 (13:42):
Yeah, that might have actually been ninety seconds.

Speaker 2 (13:43):
Yeah, let me take a look. I didn't want to
call my shot. I think I just missed it. I
think it was like a minute forty.

Speaker 1 (13:51):
Here's the thing. I often at this point, I don't
even bother looking at it more because I'm like, you're
not gonna make it. You make it so whatever. It's like,
oh shit, you might actually have this one. I don't know.
I verify that you'll have to do it later. Yeah,
there's there's a lot of so Rollins is back.

Speaker 2 (14:08):
Uh yeah, and she she fucking hates her baby. She's like,
I my baby sucks ass. I cannot wait to go
back to work after eight weeks.

Speaker 1 (14:17):
Yeah, it's just it's more it's like whenever she's like, hey,
that late. That lady's got kids, so no more mistakes,
it's like, motherfucker, you're a gambling addict. Like you figure
you would have a bit more sympathy for someone that
is also an addict. It's yea, the same. It's the
same fucking thing. Yours is gambling hers the drugs.

Speaker 2 (14:35):
And I think that she like this might be like
the lady protests too much, and now that the baby's
out of her fucking body, she's like, give give me
some alcohol and some blackjack.

Speaker 1 (14:45):
Right, like you know, it's awful, high and mighty. They're
Rollins for your life, going off the rails numerous times
as a result. But hey, who am I to judge?
That's for the cops to do, am I?

Speaker 2 (14:56):
Right?

Speaker 1 (14:57):
So yeah, we opened with Rollins on the phone with
of being like, boy, I hate this, baby, let me
come back to work.

Speaker 2 (15:04):
And I was like, fuck you guys, baby, I mean
not literally, we did that last week?

Speaker 1 (15:08):
Right, Well, no, we didn't do that last week.

Speaker 2 (15:10):
We oh oh boy, oh boy.

Speaker 1 (15:14):
And as Rollins is like walking out of a bodega,
there's some guy getting in an argument with his girlfriend.

Speaker 2 (15:20):
He's like his or fucking employee, sex employee.

Speaker 1 (15:24):
Or girlfriend like I don't all both and and because
he's like, I know your horr tricks, And I was like,
well that could be is that actual? Like a again.

Speaker 2 (15:33):
Yeah, like I know I know your I know your
hor tricks.

Speaker 1 (15:36):
Or is it you know, just like you shut your
whore mouth kind of situation? I don't know you.

Speaker 2 (15:40):
And then he gets he gets in her face and
tells her to mind her own fucking business. A lah
Walt Flanagin in Dogma, a movie I also saw last Weekend. Again,
not that it's any of your fucking business, but no, no.
And then we cut over to a coffee shop and
a lady is buying a baggie of special K and
then doing a bump of special K in full view

(16:04):
of the girl writing her screenplay. I know that she's
supposed to be in law school. She's probably could ever
legal briefs. There's no one working on a laptop in
a coffee shop that's not writing a screenplay the end, well,
perhaps in La No, not anyone on the planet.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
Oh wow, okay, all right, well, uh what about that
one time I watched the episode of SVU for the podcast.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
Yeah, but you were I guess you weren't typing notes,
so may you might be the the exception.

Speaker 1 (16:34):
So I'm just saying the exception that disproves the rule. Now,
And here's the thing, I don't know if it's supposed
to be that she's in law school. I think she's
just also taking night classes.

Speaker 2 (16:42):
Oh right, night screenwriting classes.

Speaker 1 (16:45):
That for sure, let's say. Because CHRISA never says like,
are you in one of my law school classes? He
just is like, oh, I also go to Fordham. I
think I may have seen you at but Foredom.

Speaker 2 (16:54):
But it's Fordam law School.

Speaker 1 (16:56):
Right. But here's the thing, I don't know if it's
got like it's own whole separate. Maybe he could go
to the library.

Speaker 2 (17:03):
I don't know, Like, yeah, yeah, so Fordham does have
a u a film and television program and uh and
they have a bunch of screenwriting classes, so you know.

Speaker 1 (17:16):
It could be anything. Yeah, yeah, I was gonna say,
who who could say? She's a lawyer, she's a writer,
she's a writer lawyer? How about that?

Speaker 2 (17:23):
You have a no idea how many of those fucking
guys there are. They're all guys. They all think that
their story needs to be told.

Speaker 1 (17:31):
Yeah no, I I I'm fully aware of that. I
got you. And Rollins is like, she seems real concerned
about this phone call. And then my note is just
ronind's my drone fucking business. Just go home. This is
not this is not your concern. Not to mention the
fact you're fucking off duty, you know, like it's it's

(17:51):
not just any any time anywhere you suspect something might
be happening, that means you have to get involved. You're
not on the class.

Speaker 2 (17:58):
Well, we know that New York is like a cess,
and to prove that point, into the coffee shop just
so happens to walk three rape its, including Anthony Ramos,
and they start they walk by and start rape, basically
raping this girl in full view of everything everyone, but
also like the girl on her laptop, right.

Speaker 1 (18:20):
So the shot is set up that like, as these
guys are kind of like they're like, yeah, get her purse,
come back, they're they're you know, they're talking like, but
it's it's showing every single person that is looking over
and seeing this happening and not doing anything except for
the one girl in the laptop who films the three
of these people picking the lady up and like basically

(18:42):
dragging her out, dragging her out of there.

Speaker 2 (18:44):
She's she's so fucked up, and so they like take
her down the street and like basically no one does anything,
and then they try to break into her apartment without her,
Like one of them goes up and tries to break
into her apartment and two of them do two oh
is the two of them yeah, and and then a
neighbor is like, who are you? You don't live here,
and then then they roden and so they because they

(19:07):
can get into her apartment, like rape her in the courtyard.

Speaker 1 (19:11):
Apparently, and come on. Halfway through what's happening? She wakes
up and starts screaming for help, and then I think
we see three or four different people kind of coat
to the window.

Speaker 2 (19:23):
And then like do nothing.

Speaker 1 (19:24):
Yeah, and then it ends with like it's a it's
a pan out of the courtyard and then you just see,
one by one the lights all start going out, so
then it's completely dark in the courtyard. Again, Oh the drama,
And I'm just like, we've done this so many times before.

Speaker 2 (19:42):
We go So the next mention it this time though
no they didn't, which.

Speaker 1 (19:47):
They mentioned the bystander effect, but not specifically.

Speaker 2 (19:51):
Yeah. So so next morning cops find her. Olivia shows up.
They're being they're wheeling her into the ambulance and she's like, ah,
what's going on in here? And the EMT's like she's hypothermic,
we have to go. And Olivia's like, wait a minute,
let me ask you a question. Oh what is it?
I forgot? Yeah, Oh, it'll come to you know, isn't

(20:15):
that always the thing? It's like, you have like a
really important question to ask you? Oh? Yeah, No, My
question was how long has she been out here?

Speaker 1 (20:25):
Lieutenant? She just died?

Speaker 2 (20:27):
Fucking well, this is not an urgent question, you ask
whole right.

Speaker 1 (20:31):
Like, well, if she's if she's hypothermic, a while, figure
it the fuck out, you know, Like, how long do
you think you would take someone to suffer from hypotherbia
being out in the courtyard in this thin jacket the
whole night? Probably a long fucking time.

Speaker 2 (20:48):
Long time?

Speaker 1 (20:49):
Is this? Yeah? Does this have to be answered now?

Speaker 2 (20:52):
So we cut to we don't even cut wait before
we cut to, oh, maybe you're talking about the same thing.
They're still in the courtyard, right, you know.

Speaker 1 (21:00):
Isn't this what they we go up to there in
her apartment now?

Speaker 2 (21:04):
So before that, we like, we're about to go to
our theme and it's either Finn or Careesy like looks
around up He's like, there must be a hundred windows
up here. Cool, thanks, Yeah, I think it's live.

Speaker 1 (21:19):
No, it's because Finn is coming out of the out
from like the building, and he's like, no one saw anything.
And then she's like, there's a hundred windows up there.

Speaker 2 (21:27):
Yeah right boy? So right, oh you're right, because because
we go back to uh, we go back from our theme,
and we have Rollin's in the hospital on the phone
with her nanny babysitter, being like, there's more milk in
the freezer. Hey, Doc, what's up with this girl? And
Doc's like, fucking she's in a coma. Goodbye. And that's

(21:51):
the end of the scene. That's it's a nothing scene.
What are we doing here?

Speaker 1 (21:55):
Well, it's we're it's we're shoeharding in that Rollins cares
about her kid because she's checking in and being like,
oh boys, she ate all that food. Huh, well there's
more in the.

Speaker 2 (22:05):
Diet.

Speaker 1 (22:06):
Yeah, what would you have done? It's like, oh, fuck,
I didn't expect you to eat. Like, it's clearly shoe okay,
She's there's no tension here, there's nothing. It's not why
is Noah always in peril? But Rollins's baby totally fine?
Maybe that should says something to you, Live, if your
baby is the one always in peril and you have
a detective on your squad who is also a single

(22:28):
brother whose baby is not in peril at any point in.

Speaker 2 (22:32):
Time, I'm really puzzled by Live at the end of
this episode, visa vis this conversation that we're having right
now like the thing that Live does at the end
of the episode is like deeply weird, and I don't
I'm like worried about what the implication is for the
rest of the show.

Speaker 1 (22:49):
Like are they they're they've been trying to like slow
and soft launch, like li Live has a drinking problem
because like.

Speaker 2 (22:59):
I forget a fucking fish bowl.

Speaker 1 (23:02):
I it's like, I think I have wine glasses that
are very similar looking to those you but no, it's
but it's like they've done that before where it's like
a couple of different times where it's Live like just
I think it's probably after the William Lewis episodes.

Speaker 2 (23:17):
You know, she's like, oh, you're right, she was a
bunch of working alone after William Lewis here.

Speaker 1 (23:21):
Which is not again she's having a glass of wine
at home as she's unwindy. Like that's not a that
that's not something where it's like, oh she's a problem drinker.
It's that yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah right. It's like that's
that seems like a normal, reasonable thing to do at
the end of it.

Speaker 2 (23:34):
I also like drinking alone is like that's it's it's code, right,
It's like whenever a woman throws up in a show
or movie. You know she's pregnant. Well, someone has a
big glass of wine alone.

Speaker 1 (23:47):
Of eve, I have to point out it also passes out.
I have to point out the factual error. She's not
drinking alone. No was in the other room.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
Oh my god, it's fine. How many Noah already had?

Speaker 1 (24:00):
Why do you think he's asleep? They split the bottle.

Speaker 2 (24:04):
Yeah, she's not drinking a lot. Noh to have that
bottle exactly?

Speaker 1 (24:07):
So what you'll get off for? Ass it's fine, But
like you know, they they've done this ominous wine drinking thing.
But it doesn't it doesn't come to anything. It never has.

Speaker 2 (24:17):
Yeah, but but this this has been the heaviest version
of that. And they also keep talking about how Live
is going is like going to therapy and like went
through such like a tough ordeal. And I literally am like,
what tough? Like we've already had two episodes since the
Brownstone townhouse, Like, like she seems kind of fine.

Speaker 1 (24:41):
Also, she was also kidnapped in like assaulted or nearly raped, Yeah,
for like days on end, and that was not that
long ago. So like if that happens, then the townhouse
incident happens. No, one's sitting there asking the question, maybe
just maybe we should, like, you know, a full honorable

(25:05):
discharge from the NYPD, because just too much fucked up
stuff has happened to you and you can't you can't
be a cop anymore after this, you know, like this
isn't like oh whatever, this is like you were held
hostage twice? Yeah, three times, fucking three times?

Speaker 2 (25:21):
Three times maybe four, depending on four the FBI thing.

Speaker 1 (25:25):
That wait, no, didn't lou Diamond Phillips hold her hostage too,
like unto her head and then sad.

Speaker 2 (25:30):
To probably I mean gun wait wait wait are we
talking hostage like gun to her head? Because then it's
like in the double digits at least, right.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
Sure, okay ducky oh okay, no, I get right. Not
that then? So four four times.

Speaker 2 (25:45):
Hosta legitimate hostages the prison FBI William Lewis and this,
and well I'm sure we're forgetting some more.

Speaker 1 (25:54):
Oh right, yeah, Like so at what point Diamond and
someoneould be like, all right, you know you've pitched a
hell of a game live, but we're gonna finish this
one for you. We're gonna go We're gonna go to
the bullpen here because it's just it's too fucking much,
and all we.

Speaker 2 (26:07):
Have to go legit. You've done legitimately seventeen innings.

Speaker 1 (26:11):
It's it's it's nearly superhuman. I don't know what to say,
but uh, it's probably a bad idea to keep this
going because the luck's gonna run out sooner or later. Uh.
But again, it's like, then make stuff. This show likes
to drop so many breadcrumbs and they just never follow them.

Speaker 2 (26:28):
It's the lost it's lost, right, It's like, what's the
polar Bear doing there? I don't know, that's for next
season's writers to figure out.

Speaker 1 (26:36):
It's it's aggravating again, like make at least with rollins whatever,
Like she had the gambling addiction. Something came of that,
she got into trouble. What with the gambling addiction? Live
is the baby who was constantly in peril and a
bunch of fucked up shit happens for her, and she's
is does she have a drinking problem? Is? Is she
developing a drinking problem? What is happening here? Is that

(26:57):
the theme because we had the fucking is its post
debate that she is an alcoholic, But it's the through
line is that one guy is a highly functioning alcoholic
and can do he can remember shit really well. So
like Live is that person and that she can do everything,
but she so happens to be because that's not interesting
at all. It's like, great, so she is, so she's

(27:18):
doing every So nothing's happening. He's presenting no conflict.

Speaker 2 (27:21):
It's interesting because that did never even occurred to me
that like that could be, like, oh, he's that dude
is like I've figured out how to mask my alcoholism
and function in public and like there's a term for
that is function alcoholic, and like it never occurred to
me that that could be what's happening with Liz with
Live in that last scene.

Speaker 1 (27:43):
But the way that they're presenting it, it's something like
they want you to yeah, it's concertain about that second
class of wine.

Speaker 2 (27:49):
It's so it's like a giant class anyway. Uh, Finn
and I want to send tomorrow Careesy are are in
the apartment building and they asked the super for the
name and information of every tenant that has a unit
that faces the courtyard, and it is, as someone said,

(28:10):
agog in the courtyard like a hundred people.

Speaker 1 (28:14):
Really Like that's I don't I don't think. I mean,
I've just tried to think, like how big was this courtyard?
Like I tried to count the it was.

Speaker 2 (28:23):
It was relatively big. I mean it's like an only
murders in the building size courtyard.

Speaker 1 (28:29):
Yeah, okay, I guess so the Yeah, the super is
just like I'll get right on that, like he's got
a great line delivery of like like this happens in
his building every day, like way that he plays it.
I'm like, is this the murder capital of New York City?
In this building?

Speaker 2 (28:45):
I don't get it well because nobody saw a shit because.

Speaker 1 (28:49):
They're also so tired of dealing with it. So we
they're in her apartment and that's where the across the
way neighbor is like, oh the police, Just so you know,
around one o'clock there were two gentlemen trying to get in.

Speaker 2 (29:01):
Yeah, yeah, I didn't. I didn't recognize them, and then
I put my headphones in.

Speaker 1 (29:05):
Yeah, He's like, and then I yelled at them and
they ran away.

Speaker 2 (29:07):
So putting your headphones in after that is such a
weirdly unsafe for you move Like I just saw I
just chased someone off trying to break into the apartment
across the hall from me, and now I'm going to
like make my like like purposely make it so I

(29:28):
can't hear, just in case they come back and kill me.

Speaker 1 (29:32):
I mean, I don't know if I would think that
would be like, no, they ran away, it's.

Speaker 2 (29:35):
Fine, sure, But I wouldn't. I wouldn't. I would be like,
you know, I'd have my ear to the ground for
the rest of the night.

Speaker 1 (29:42):
See. I think it's the opposite of that. I think
the guy's like, all right, well I broke that up,
and I don't want to be called to fucking testify,
so I want to put these headphones in so I
could be like, I didn't see anything after that, sorry, officers.

Speaker 2 (29:53):
Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (29:55):
So I think it was a self preservation move to
not get involved, as everyone is trying very hard.

Speaker 2 (29:59):
To kind of everybody's thing, right. But he does kind
of get involved in the begin His instinct in the
beginning is to get involved, and then he's like, fight
that instinct.

Speaker 1 (30:08):
Well, again, he's fine getting involved as long as it's
not with the actual police. Who wants to get involved
with the actual.

Speaker 2 (30:14):
Police, honestly, and this this is an invitation for the
police to look inward and ask themselves, welly I no
one wants to help them. But of course they don't
do that. N And so they look into they look
in her apartment, they look in her name's Libby. They
look in Libby's apartment and there's no men's clothes, and
they're like, well, someone was in her life, and there's

(30:34):
like a picture of her with two kids. I'm like,
what a what a weird once again, what a weird
thing to say?

Speaker 1 (30:42):
And Dobbs is like, ah, they look like maybe nieces.
It's like, no, those are her kids.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
Esshole, Uh, I'm gonna get yelled at if I don't
yell at you. It's Dodds.

Speaker 1 (30:53):
Oh fuck god, damn it. Yeah Dodds. I was like, no,
it's not. No, Dobbs is the fucking abortion decision. I
keep this, It's just a problem.

Speaker 2 (31:01):
Dobbs is the elf that gets a sock from Harry Potter.

Speaker 1 (31:05):
That's Dobby.

Speaker 2 (31:07):
Yes, she she Dobby on my Nobby until I Chamber
of Secrets. Is that a thing?

Speaker 1 (31:14):
Ah, it's I possibly, but I don't know what forget it.

Speaker 2 (31:19):
Forget a kiss, so a kiss?

Speaker 1 (31:23):
Yes, there we go.

Speaker 2 (31:25):
And so they also talked to the upstairs neighbor.

Speaker 1 (31:30):
Who's like I heard screaming and uh uh, and we
don't like her.

Speaker 2 (31:36):
She smokes all the time. So it's like a like
a black woman and her Asian husband. So this is
a weird combination to my eye, not because a black
woman can't fall in love with an Asian man, but
there is a something polloquially referred to as the black

(31:59):
girlfriend effect, where men start dressing better when they date
black women. And this guy did not have that.

Speaker 1 (32:09):
Is is that a thing?

Speaker 2 (32:10):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I didn't have the drip. As the
kids say, I swag.

Speaker 1 (32:16):
I did not. I learned something new today. Was unaware
of that effect. Sure, although later whenever they're leaving the
courtyard and Rollins is chasing them down to testify or whatever,
or to look at mug shots or something like that,
he looked like he was dressed pretty well. They were
in like pajamas when they were talking to the cops. Sooh, so,
I don't know if that's necessarily a fair judgment. What

(32:40):
do you wanted like a three piece? He's got the
with the little hat and like sharp pajamas.

Speaker 2 (32:47):
According to I'm not going to read the AI overview
because this is fucking ridiculous. But this is Reddit, okay,
and so this this could go either way. Yeah, this
is from one year ago, saying from from the subreddit
black Ladies. Okay, it's just it's just pornography America. No

(33:11):
so uh, says my partner. White and I were discussing
the black wife effect on TikTok, and for some reason,
I found it bittersweet, as in, it gave me the ick,
but it also made me feel a little seen. I
have reservations about the trend, not because black women are
showing off all the improvements their partners have made, but
because it seems like it's such a popular trend for
black women to fix their partners. My partner asked me

(33:34):
if the trend was a spin on the Mammy trope,
where I'm going to stop reading now, but it's enough
that it has a TikTok trend and also some questions
on on Reddit the black wife effect or black girlfriend effect?
Huh yeah, dress, start dressing better, get better haircuts.

Speaker 1 (33:55):
Well, I guess I'll have to look for that. I
don't really know what to do with that information, but sure.
But yeah, so the the wife is like I heard
screaming and the issue guy's like, yeah, I don't know
what I heard.

Speaker 2 (34:08):
It's you didn't hear shit. My I didn't hear shit.
My wife didn't hear shit. Everyone's shut in the fuck up.

Speaker 1 (34:13):
Yeah kinda, So who else we have we have? Who's there?

Speaker 2 (34:16):
Oh, there's not an older woman that has like a
dark wig on, but she's like in her like sixties
or seventies, and she's kind of like.

Speaker 1 (34:25):
If Iliana Douglas drank from like the wrong cup in
Indiana Joe's. But then it's sell out very quickly.

Speaker 2 (34:31):
I was gonna say Indiana, Illiana Douglas and uh Carol Burnett, now.

Speaker 1 (34:36):
Sure that I think that works. And she's basically like, yeah,
I looked out there and there were three.

Speaker 2 (34:41):
Heard someone screaming, and then was like that's past my bedtime.

Speaker 1 (34:45):
Yeah, and there like why didn't you call the cops?
She's like, I don't fucking know what. What's it fucking
to you? Stop bothering me?

Speaker 2 (34:52):
So this has been the situation. Everyone thought that someone
else was calling the cops.

Speaker 1 (34:56):
And then she says there was a bunch of other
lights on. So I just oh, I.

Speaker 2 (35:00):
Thought, right, yeah, that is the textbook definition of the
bystander effect, right, right, And so then they go back
outside they're like, well, this sucks. And so then this
dude walks up with.

Speaker 1 (35:15):
A dog, gets away from a guy, just runs into
the crime scene area.

Speaker 2 (35:21):
Right. It's a multi poo in a pink vest.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
No, I think it. I thought it was a Yorky.

Speaker 2 (35:28):
Yorkie and a pink I don't know. It's a little
dog in a pink vest. And the owner is like, oh,
did something happen? And the cops like, yeah, did you
were you walking your dog last night? And he's like,
I was at a bar with my boyfriend. Wait, you
mean to tell me the guy with the Yorki in
a pink vest is gay?

Speaker 1 (35:47):
Come on? Whatever do you mean?

Speaker 2 (35:48):
Come on New York and anything's possible.

Speaker 1 (35:52):
And I think that says like, oh, looking at what
it's like, Oh what happened? Oh one of your fellow
building mates or whatever, neighbors that's what it is, neighbors
building was attacked. And he's like, oh, I wish I
was here last night doing that in grease is like, yeah,
I wish you were too. Don't worry, folks, this will
be coming back. And that guy also looks very familiar.

Speaker 2 (36:11):
Yeah, so that's Patrick Breen. I mentioned him last episode
because I know someone named Patrick Breen who is not
that guy. But Patrick Breen is that guy. Say that
five times fast and you might recognize him. Where I
recognize him from because he plays Quellick in the movie Galaxy.

Speaker 1 (36:33):
Quest Ah, yep, that'll be it.

Speaker 2 (36:36):
Fucking love the movie Galax. He's in a bunch of
other things.

Speaker 1 (36:40):
I think he has play a lawyer on either Original
Recipe or SVU at some point in time. I feel
like I remember him being on an episode.

Speaker 2 (36:47):
He does look like so I think you're talking about
a different, like a different Greg Kanear looking guy, which is.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
Entirely possible because he looks familiar, but he looks slightly
different than a guy who also looks I think a
lot like him.

Speaker 2 (37:03):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know, I know who you're talking about.
But for the life of me, I can't fuck it.

Speaker 1 (37:07):
Tell it's it's a real Josh Dumel situation.

Speaker 2 (37:14):
And so Careesy puts a button on this by saying,
say what you went about Staten Island. At least we
stick up for our own what what?

Speaker 1 (37:22):
What? What does that mean?

Speaker 2 (37:24):
So?

Speaker 1 (37:24):
What is that? No? Care No, No, no, slow down, asshole,
What the fuck does that mean?

Speaker 2 (37:28):
And Carese he's having a real, a real weird one
because he's like yelling as he's walking away, like oh no,
so he goes, he goes to the coffee shop. He's
yelling in the coffee shop like did anyone see anybody?
Does anyone like Boloni sandwiches? Please pay attention to me?
Am I dead? Is this a sixth sense situation?

Speaker 1 (37:47):
Noboddy, It's just New York and everyone minds their own
fucking business. No, But it's it's crazy because every time
we see Careesy asking someone what did you hear? What
did you see? What happened? And there? And the question
all the cops, including him, keep asking, is like why
did you why didn't you call nine on one or
anything or anyone an ambulance? Because someone was like, well,

(38:10):
by the time, you know, it looked like it was over,
so it was too late for the cops too, like
it was over. And Cariese's like, it wasn't too late
for a fucking ambulance though, And I'm like, well that's
a good point. Actually you could be like the attacks over, but.

Speaker 2 (38:22):
She hoped up. I think that this is not real
I don't think that. I mean, I think that the
bystander effect is somewhat real. The Kitty Jenevie's story we're
going to talk about in a second, but like there
are there is no one more ready to call the
cops than like a white neighbor who's business. This isn't right?

(38:46):
And so I basically what happens, what happened in this
episode is like a reverse Spider Man, where like, you
know how it's.

Speaker 1 (38:54):
Spider Man, you messed with one of us?

Speaker 2 (38:56):
Yeah, yeah, And that happens in like every spider It's
like it's like.

Speaker 1 (38:59):
Four fre and Goblin. They weren't fighting Spider Man. They
were fighting with Spider Man.

Speaker 2 (39:04):
And I think also doc oc they do it kind
of in every Spider Man iteration. This is like a
this is like a pivotal moment in the Spider Man stories,
like the City of New York rallies around this young
boy who has got the powers of a spider And.

Speaker 1 (39:18):
For those of you are that are unfamiliar with the
comic Spider Mans and movies Spider.

Speaker 2 (39:23):
Man, let me step back.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
Spider dash Man. It's important that you know that that's
how you spell it.

Speaker 2 (39:28):
He's got this uncle named Ben, and.

Speaker 1 (39:30):
There's a ticking clock according to Madam Webb, over that
guy's head, and she doesn't say a fucking thing, and
she could see the future.

Speaker 2 (39:37):
I heard a funny thing, was it from you? Where
it's like no one stays dead in the comics except
for Uncle Ben.

Speaker 1 (39:43):
That wasn't me, but it's very true. Well, to be fair,
they resurrect him for every reboot again. Oh boy, maybe
it'll be different now, maybe Madam Webb will help. O. God,
I'll still cut down.

Speaker 2 (39:55):
So I Spider Man really fucked with me. I'm so sorry.
So so Carisee's in the coffee shop and he spots
the girl from the previous night who was still riding
her street, so.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
He comes in. Any first of all, we established they
get a hit on her credit card from the coffee
shop at eleven pms, like let's go, And they get
there and they've got the carease he's got. It's like
an iPad, or it's like as it looks like an idea.

Speaker 2 (40:23):
It is absolutely an iPad with pictures on it.

Speaker 1 (40:26):
Yeah, with the picture of Libby on it. And it's like, okay,
who is seeing this girls that I was seeing this
girl she was here last night, but he's saying it like, dude,
it's the next morning. Why do you think people It's like, ah, good,
I stayed at the coffee shop till midnight, went hope,
went to sleep, woke up, came right back down to
the exact same coffee shop that I left less than
twelve hours ago. And he seems shocked that it's a
different crop of people that are in the coffee shop

(40:48):
at a totally different.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
Any one here last night, Hey, I recognize you, and
they honestly would not have had Eddie break in the
case of Corese he didn't happen to know witness right.
It's this is like completely fucking.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
This episode is very jam packed with like DISX market
a DISX witness for sure twice for this because uh,
Dodds goes and asks the barista. I guess like, hey,
uh do you guys have do you guys sell drugs here?
He's like, no, officer, that would be illegal or something
like that.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
Yeah, yeah, and we have we have a security camera,
but it gets deleted after an hour because it makes
the camera sad.

Speaker 1 (41:28):
Which I was like, yeah, that's everyone in this facility
is on drugs, right, now a lot of drugs in
this episode, because then there was a guy later in
the episode just smoking a j on the street.

Speaker 2 (41:39):
Yeah, and he says it's medicinal. Well, it's twenty sixteen.
The world is changing. I'm just saying put that guy
through a wall.

Speaker 1 (41:47):
That's also very true. So yeah, they don't have cameras.
Uh careesy, I don't know why he like doesn't want
to get this girl jammed up the way he's like
because the way he's like, hey, yeah, we're ford them together. Yeah,
I'm a I go to law school. Haha, midterms are fun. Anyway,
here's my card. If you saw anything, let me know.
And then he starts yelling to the rest of the
coffee shop like he doesn't want anyone to know that

(42:08):
she's cooperating or potentially cooperating. It's like, is she in
some sort of danger for talking to you?

Speaker 2 (42:15):
So I have I have a similar note later where
they start seeing the real witnesses and they're like, he
said he'd kill me if I told anybody. I'm like,
this kid is twenty, Like you are more afraid of
testifying against these three random kids than than we have
seen in this show about testifying against the.

Speaker 1 (42:35):
Mob right or like actual legitimate gang kingpitch.

Speaker 2 (42:42):
Get get, like timmor And and Johnny d and.

Speaker 1 (42:45):
That right, who have actual bodies on them.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
This is also where they bring up the idea of
the bystander effect. So it's time here we go.

Speaker 1 (42:55):
Let's we should really just pull.

Speaker 2 (42:58):
The old Audien just it would take me longer to
find it than it would just read this again. So
this is from the American Psychological Association. Katy Geneviez was
murdered in nineteen sixty four, March thirteenth, in Q Gardens
in Queen's and the story goes that she was that

(43:20):
there were thirty eight witnesses to this thing that saw
her being murdered in her courtyard and then also kind
of later in a vestibule, and they did nothing. And
so this is from and this is where the bystander
effect like sort of comes from. And so this is
from the American Psychological Association. The first articles in the

(43:43):
Long Island Press New York Times made no mention of witnesses,
but a front page March twenty seven, so that's two
weeks after Time story shocked the nation for more than
half an hour. The article began thirty eight respectable law
abiding citizens and queens washed a killer, stock at stab
a woman separate attacks in Q gardens. Not one person
telephoned the police during the assault. Publications across the nation

(44:07):
quickly followed with their own accounts. So thing number one
to bring up in what world, in the year of
our Lord twenty twenty five, would this be news for
two weeks? Oh my god, this wouldn't make top of
the folds for a day. No. So. Joseph de Maay,

(44:28):
a lawyer and historian and Q Garden's resident, argued that
few residents of nearby buildings could have even seen the attacker,
understood that Kitty Geneve's life was in danger, and more importantly,
people did intervene. They shouted at the attacker, and they
called the police. And the reason that they got that
number thirty eight is because the cop on the scene

(44:50):
counted the windows and.

Speaker 1 (44:53):
Just assumed that number of people who were watching could
have potentially seen something because the windows were in the
right place and therefore all certainly must have been watching.
And then there it's like that's a fucking leap and
a half.

Speaker 2 (45:11):
Yeah, And so the during the trial, it we learned
that Winston Moseley attacked Katy Johnyvie's not three times, as
the newspaper said, but twice with a ten minute hiatus,
and the second attacked the first. When the first act happened,

(45:31):
a shout from the windows scared Moseley away, which is
why he attacked her again in the vestibule of her
building with no witnesses. So like, extremely clearly, this is
not what the story that got, Like, you know, this
is not the legend that was printed.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
Right, I mean print the legend man, like.

Speaker 2 (45:55):
I fucking guess because it.

Speaker 1 (45:57):
Helps I don't know who it helps. It helps everyone
feel better when they don't call the cops when something happens.
I guess I don't. Or I mean it's supposed to
just be like, oh, showing how much of a shithole
allegedly New York is, and it's just it's a hellhole
and it's the seventies and fucking everything is like it's

(46:17):
it's like a Republican fever dream.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
It is, right, it is like it is this conservative
fever dream. And and maybe that's why I like wholly
reject it, but I like, I kind of believe in
the Spider Man version of New York than the Kitty
Genevies version of New York, specifically because maybe specifically because

(46:43):
of what's happening in La now, where you're seeing a
huge ground swell of people like supporting their neighbors, helping
people when they're being shot in the face by the
fucking cops. Like like I think that, yeah, and like
small people are good.

Speaker 1 (46:56):
Yeah, small towns. Like whenever I think what it was like,
it was like what or something like that, whatever the
cops came into the neighborhood.

Speaker 2 (47:02):
Yeah, yeah, it was like.

Speaker 1 (47:03):
That entire of like middle aged moms just came out
and started fucking blocking the streets and stuff. Actually, there
was a protest in Seattle today, which I thought was
the funniest thing that they did. So they went down
to this federal building where they had like eight immigrants
they were ice was gonna fucking put into a truck
and disappear or whatever like that. So the protesters what

(47:26):
they started to do is they just started collecting all
of like the different Lime scooters and bikes and just
throwing them in the driveway. So that I love that
the cops couldn't go anywhere because there was just a
giant pile of the lime scooters.

Speaker 2 (47:39):
And bikes blocking every tool of it.

Speaker 1 (47:43):
Literally, like the headline from the Seattle Times I saw
where it was like protesters and ice get into like
a cat and mouse for like eight hours because they
every time they would clear one, so people would just
fill it back in, so like while they're filling it
back in, they would try to clear the other one
so they could try to get out in time. So
they were just like they were just going back and forth,
just throwing lime scooters.

Speaker 2 (48:04):
Under the chances, under no circumstances. Should you realize that
there are limescooters in every major city in the United
States and city bikes.

Speaker 1 (48:12):
I'm like, it's the funniest form of civil disobedience. Those
things are pain of the ass anyway. So it's like, oh,
I don't know, we just you know, our friend's coming
to pick them up. I don't fucking know they're gonna
go charge them.

Speaker 2 (48:23):
The guy that like charged the ice cops in l A.
I don't want to call them, I mean cops, but
also like double fuck eyes.

Speaker 1 (48:33):
Ss you could just say the ss ye there's just
coming through. Yeah, that's what they are at this point.

Speaker 2 (48:39):
And so of course this is like the most realistic
part of the episode. We uh try to reach out
to Libby's parents and they don't want to talk to
her or her father and he doesn't want to talk
to her because she's a junkie. And so we're doing
the like she was no Angel part of it.

Speaker 1 (48:58):
Make sure isn't it her ex husband?

Speaker 2 (49:01):
Oh? I thought it was her dad.

Speaker 1 (49:03):
No, I thought it was her ex husband because they're divorced.
And he's like, I don't go fuck because he has.

Speaker 2 (49:07):
She's yeah, oh yeah, I may have misheard because doesn't
she talk about her dad. Later she's like, don't tell
my dad.

Speaker 1 (49:14):
Oh maybe you know what it's She's got no one. Basically,
that's that's what we know.

Speaker 2 (49:18):
But what they do have is a video that the
video that the The Ford Dome Law School screenwriter girl
took of the of the doers like pulling her out
of the thing. They quickly identify the kids as kids
that go that like live at a youth center.

Speaker 1 (49:38):
Yeah, because there's some YadA YadA. It's like, oh, put
this through facial recognition.

Speaker 2 (49:42):
Facial recognition, which I guess.

Speaker 1 (49:43):
Is what they get the hit on. But they're like, oh,
we go down to the youth center, but there's talks
later Dodds is like, well, don't you lock these kids
in at night? I was like, youth center sounds like
it's a boys and girls club kind of situation, not
a well you're And then they say later it's a shelter. Sure,
that's such a shelter.

Speaker 2 (50:03):
Yeah, that's true. At shelters in halfway houses, they do
lock people in at night.

Speaker 1 (50:07):
Right, which makes sense. But I just don't know why
they referred to it as a fucking youth center.

Speaker 2 (50:11):
Well because because same reason we call it the Department
of Defense.

Speaker 1 (50:15):
Sure, I guess.

Speaker 2 (50:17):
And so they go to the youth center and they're
like caseworker person. So lady social worker lady is like, yeah, yeah,
I told them that we were having some like problem
with like something, and I told them to wait in
the game room. And they get into the game room
and everyone's face drops and like.

Speaker 1 (50:33):
And they locked them into the game room, by the way.

Speaker 2 (50:36):
And they they crawled out like a top like what
are those things a transom like a top window pane thing.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
Yeah, and they're like, all right, well they're in the wind.
It's like, well, who would.

Speaker 2 (50:47):
Have thought, and so they none of them have cell
phone oh sorry, none of them have cell phone plans.
But they all have cell phones and they communicate with
each other via Facebook and Instagram and stuff. But they
all have street names, so like you can't. So it's
a very complicated situation.

Speaker 1 (51:04):
So their their profiles, it won't be easy to but
they were looking at the records. I guess they all
have records except the one kids.

Speaker 2 (51:12):
So what is a finsta? Can can they make the finstas?
Is that? Is that a service that you offer?

Speaker 1 (51:21):
Are they trans in the mass?

Speaker 2 (51:23):
Yeah? That is, by the way, almost verbade. I'm a
quote from a senator who didn't understand that finstad just
stood for fake Instagram.

Speaker 1 (51:31):
Jesus Christ. Which senator was that?

Speaker 2 (51:33):
I think it was a congress person, but someone who
was like, uh.

Speaker 1 (51:37):
Ninety five years old, clearly yeah, Jesus yes. And these
are the people governing our this great land of ours,
people that don't understand fuck the internet anything.

Speaker 2 (51:49):
Your your motivation is you're afraid of the Internet. But
I but I think the weirdest part was I think
that this is when they were talking to the TikTok
guy and they're like do you know what a fence is?
He's like yeah. He's like, is that a service you offer?
And he's like, no, I don't.

Speaker 1 (52:04):
I don't quite know how to answer that. Sir, you
are wrong and you are so far off base. I
don't even I have to educate you enough to then
explain to you why what you said makes no sense.
And I don't think we frankly have the time.

Speaker 2 (52:20):
It's a series of tubes, if you must.

Speaker 1 (52:23):
So they also, oh no, but they find out the
one kid he was picked up for his only uh,
the only thing that he got picked up for was
for solicitation, So we know that he.

Speaker 2 (52:34):
Has and he escaped from like a sex trafficking ring.
So there's three guys. There's Ronnie, jan and Will and
Will the youngest is just eighteen. He's the one that
escaped from the sex trafficking ring.

Speaker 1 (52:47):
Yeah, so we know he has it. So they're talking
to the social workers like where do these kids go
whenever they're out? He's like, well, the streets, I don't,
I don't fucking know. Like they're gonna probably go sell
drugs and do a bunch of other ships. So they're like,
all right, well, the one kid we know was forced
into the sex trade, so he's probably gonna go and

(53:11):
do that again solicity, which I guess, Like why why
that assumption?

Speaker 2 (53:16):
I guess make money, I guess money. But they go
to the same cruising park from that they went to
like last season, they went to the cruising park.

Speaker 1 (53:26):
Yeah, and it's like all and as Finn and Creasy
are coming through. I think it's Finn. It's just like, yeah,
like homeless kids. After two days, they all just turned
to fucking selling their bodies And I'm like, is that
what that's a I don't think that's accurate right there. Yeah,

(53:46):
So they happen to find Will, who is leaning into
a car, and so they're like, go get him and figets.
So the thing's like Baltimore, get the fuck out of
here or something.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
Yeah, And so they they ask him to DM Ronnie
and Wan to try to like smoke him out, and
he's like he's like a child, like like he might
be a teen, but he looks very young.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
Yeah. He says like, oh, Ronnie will kill me if
I if I said.

Speaker 2 (54:16):
Him on basically, and someone says I think it might
be Caresy is like he's not. He's wetting the bed.
He's no thug. No, No, that's Dodds, Dodds, And.

Speaker 1 (54:30):
I was like, fucking Dodds with the thug thing. Man,
it's the Year of Our Lord twenty sixteen in the
in the show like come the fuck on, man, which
I guess maybe no, that's you know, no, that was
this long before that, we've established that as basically a.

Speaker 2 (54:49):
Slur, and so yeah, it's it's at at at least
a dog whistle. And so finally they Libby is a
and so they go to the hospital and she says
that she took some special K, no hesitation, no delay,
you come on just like special K and great, so

(55:12):
great song. I love Placebo as the band and I
can do a passable Placebo impression when I sing Yeah,
you wouldn't expect it right now?

Speaker 1 (55:21):
Right, No, you wouldn't, You really wouldn't.

Speaker 2 (55:24):
And so she's like, well, you know this sucks. Wait,
they tried to like break into my apartment. How did
they know where I lived?

Speaker 1 (55:32):
That's also I mean they because they must have just
looked at her license.

Speaker 2 (55:37):
Maybe yeah, that makes sense.

Speaker 1 (55:38):
Because she was so she was so fucked up with it.
It's not like she could tell the because even like
she could I live on the quarter of.

Speaker 2 (55:46):
She wasn't making any words when they were carried.

Speaker 1 (55:49):
She was basically nonverbal. Yeah, in terms of communication, so
it had to have been they looked at her id.

Speaker 2 (55:55):
Yeah. So then she's like, so, well, someone must have
seen what happened to me.

Speaker 1 (56:00):
And they're like, you could be surprised.

Speaker 2 (56:01):
Actually, uhh, we have some live listener feedback from leanne O'Shea.
City of Los Angeles just announced a curfew for downtown.
Oh it's fucking.

Speaker 1 (56:12):
On, well, steer clearer downtown.

Speaker 2 (56:15):
I guess this is this may be our last broadcast.

Speaker 1 (56:18):
We're so close to having the full backlog. We need
one more, one more, one more. That's gonna annoy me,
just on that principle.

Speaker 2 (56:27):
Whatever happens, I'm dead, and you're like, we were so close.

Speaker 1 (56:32):
That, like in the ulas you have, like h So
in conclusion, we've one what's so fucking.

Speaker 2 (56:39):
Close one more episode and.

Speaker 1 (56:42):
The other ones yet, so I gotta go back and
get them.

Speaker 2 (56:44):
I want the cops to think about that one more episode.
So she says, someone else, police, you robbed of the
greatest crime the police have ever.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
That will be my final joker turn or sitting there
with a the fuck her two face? I guess just
slipping the coin like that last one, where were you were?

Speaker 2 (57:07):
Disgrace da? And so uh Rollins is really on one
and she's like, how could this woman relapse? She's got kids,
she's a piece of shit. And Olivia's like, well, she's
an addict. You know, addicts are like, it's a disease,
and she's like, nah, she's not kid, she's a piece
of shit. She take her kids away and get it
and live.

Speaker 1 (57:27):
Is like, I mean, I mean, I you know, I
guess I'm not going to point out the glaring hypocrisy,
be like, so, Rollins, how's the Gamble's anonymous meetings going?
As also, perhaps you should view her as the victim
of a crime, that being your job at all, and
not just being like she was raped.

Speaker 2 (57:46):
You're not.

Speaker 1 (57:47):
I'm glad you got raped. Don't remember any of it,
you bitch.

Speaker 2 (57:50):
You're not a narco, as Robin Trand puts it, you
got to get back to Gamble Hollocks anonymous. So sorry,
I just think it's funny. So Fannie d M's wan
and or is it one that's in the in the
in the No, Yeah, Wan is the young one, not Will, Sorry,

(58:12):
Ronnie d m's Wan, and Wan tells them that Ronnie
and and Will are in on like Atlantic Avenue selling weed,
so that the cops show up chase him down. Everyone
in New York is in the way once again for
a Spider Man situation and then they just pull their

(58:33):
guns on him on them, which is not great.

Speaker 1 (58:35):
Which, by the way, so the way that they find
them is it's care and wandering around in a very
what appears to be like retail heavy lot of foot
traffic area of town. Yeah, man, I don't sure that means.

Speaker 2 (58:54):
I know, I don't know what that means either.

Speaker 1 (58:56):
And carrese sees someone like up a jay and he
so he just runs over to him and he's like,
where did you get that? And I guess it's it
makes sense where it's like you probably you would get
the weed and then I guess just smoke it immediately
where you got it. I'm not sure that's how that
would work.

Speaker 2 (59:13):
But he says across the street at the subway, and
I'm like, you don't start the subway like that's easy
escape route, man, Like, what come on, guys? Right?

Speaker 1 (59:23):
So it's because he cares saw the guy smoking weed
who as suits you, So he's like, where'd you get that?
He just like a little bit of smoke up, so
he's like nothing nowhere, and he's like, yeah, where'd you
get it? Over there? Then the chase is on. They
all draw down, chase after them, they're all being filmed,
and Careese has a total fucking meltown.

Speaker 2 (59:44):
Oh my god, this is the best thing. Citizens of
New York. You should have gotten involved in a police
chase to help us.

Speaker 1 (59:52):
Never mind all of the random shootings of innocent people
that you have seen on this program the past couple
of weeks. You should absolutely do our job for us.

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
Never mind all the times that people have tried to
get involved and you're like, you are just making things worse, right, And.

Speaker 1 (01:00:06):
It's like we saw and I guess we're supposed to
be like, oh, the people should help their fellow man,
because those fleeing felons or whatever fucking shoved over a
dude because they like, they show him go over and
then they shoot it from the ground, so you're seeing
him laying there as they're running by, and they cut

(01:00:26):
back to it twice like and it's like, we get it.
He knocked a guy over. Stabler throws people through brick
walls like the Hulk, and we don't think that's okay either.
It's possible for you both to be wrong. You understand that, right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:39):
Also, I was right the first time. It is Will
that is in custody. I don't know why. I oh,
maybe they like cloned the phone or something whatever. But
uh Wan is played by Anthony Ramos. He's so young looking.

Speaker 1 (01:00:53):
Yeah he is, because I was like, holy, I guess
I looked at him. Jesus Christ. He fucking is a g.

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
He well, he aged pretty fast because he does not
look this young. And in The Heights, which is two
years after this, wow really oh sorry sorry? In the
Heights is twenty yeah one. But he's in A Star
is Born. Oh okay, I never saw that, which, yeah,
it's good. He's just got a really small part, but

(01:01:21):
he doesn't look this young to be fire.

Speaker 1 (01:01:23):
I also never saw In the Heights, so it doesn't matter.
But I know that the year that was.

Speaker 2 (01:01:27):
Not as good as not as good as A Star
is Born. So it turns out that they said that
they were running because the cops were chasing them, and
very smart, I mean, yeah, yeah, And they talked to
Wan and they're like, Wan, where were you last night?
He's like, I don't remember what did Ronnie say, which

(01:01:49):
is pretty smart. Then they talked to Ronnie, I mean
kind of. And then they talked to Ronnie and they're like, uh,
we have you on camera and he's like, I know
you don't because I watched the news and I know
that you have.

Speaker 1 (01:02:03):
No no, no. They said that we have witnesses and I
know that. And they said we have you on video,
and he shows a video. He's like, she was passed out.
We were just helping get helping her, like you know,
good citizens.

Speaker 2 (01:02:16):
The kid that plays Ronnie is j Mallory McCree, and uh,
he does a lot of like he's in good trouble.
He's in Homeland. He plays like a like a Muslim
guy in Homeland. He's he's on the wrong side of
an interrogation room table kind of a lot. But he's

(01:02:36):
he's pretty good at it.

Speaker 1 (01:02:38):
Why do you think he's had a lot of practice
at it? I guess as an actor. I think the
big issue is the lawyer thing, Like why these kids
don't lawyer up immediately?

Speaker 2 (01:02:48):
Yeah, So eventually they each get your own lawyer.

Speaker 1 (01:02:51):
No, no, no, no. Will gets his own attorney, which is
to be Diggs.

Speaker 2 (01:02:55):
Yeah. Yeah, and the other two have two different attorneys.
One's a woman, one's a man, but but only the
man talks correct as it as it should be in
all legal life, right during.

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
The right there.

Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
Yeah, yeah, there's that other lady there. Yeah. So they
talk to Will, poor Will, and he's like, hey, can
I go just go back to my group home because
Linda can vouch for me and Olive He's like, Linda
can't help you now, kid.

Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
You were in too deep where it's like, I mean, yeah,
you kind of you participated in a brutal gang rate.

Speaker 2 (01:03:32):
Yeah, so like it's not it's not good. But I
have to stress how young this kid. This kid looks
about fourteen. I mean, but come on, I'm not no, no,
I'm not defending him. I'm saying, Olivia, if you put
just like a little bit of pressure on him in
like the motherly way, he's gonna fold, Like what are

(01:03:54):
you doing?

Speaker 1 (01:03:55):
Well, there's so many points in this show where I'm like,
what is anyone doing to try to because they don't
have a case at this.

Speaker 2 (01:04:00):
Point, Basically, no witnesses.

Speaker 1 (01:04:03):
They have no or they have no ecuse, they have
no witnesses at this point, Yeah, And dav Diggs approaches
Barba and is like, hey, my client is willing to
roll on the other two in exchange, like you know,
for something far reduced, and Barba's like, no, go fuck yourself.

(01:04:25):
But at this point they don't have any evidence, They
don't have any witnesses. They have the video, but it's.

Speaker 2 (01:04:30):
Like, I don't know, Yeah, I don't quite know why
Barbara doesn't go for that.

Speaker 1 (01:04:34):
And again, like you said, he's a he's the youngest
of them, and David Diggs is like, he's also like
got out of a sex trafficking.

Speaker 2 (01:04:41):
Yeah, we learned later that he didn't participate, and like
maybe if he had died, Yeah, that's not good.

Speaker 1 (01:04:49):
That's participating, it's just not in in that way.

Speaker 2 (01:04:54):
In the yah. We also learned that one of them,
I think Ronnie, had two cell phones.

Speaker 1 (01:05:02):
Two cell phones, and Dodds is like, well, it's just
a bunch of Hispanic names in there and lives like
then fucking call them and say.

Speaker 2 (01:05:09):
You're trying to we don't we don't know that yet
because because it's been wiped, and so they got to
go to Taru first, and so we have their line
up pictures and we go back to talk to all
of them, the witnesses who didn't see shit, and they're like,
we still haven't seen shit, and Careesy is so fucking

(01:05:30):
put out of this. He's just like, oh, great, they
can't remember.

Speaker 1 (01:05:34):
Yeah, and it's like the one guy picks out one
of them and and they're about to be like gay,
great job, and he's like, actually, wait.

Speaker 2 (01:05:43):
They talked to the Asian guy again with his wife,
and he's like, this is horrible. I'm not helping you
because people are blaming on having you read the paper.
People are blaming us for what happened to Libby. And
he's like because you didn't help, and I'm asking you
to help now, what the what the fuck?

Speaker 1 (01:06:02):
That's Relin's like, prove them all wrong, help us now,
and they're like yeah, damn it. Fine.

Speaker 2 (01:06:07):
So Barbara runs into dav Diggs, who is a civil
rights attorney we met a few episodes ago, counselor Henderson,
and Henderson's like, hypothetically, if my client this is what
you were saying, if my client is gonna die and
says that he was there, what is your what is

(01:06:31):
your offer? And Barbera's like, I offer you a thumb
in the eye. And Henderson says, quote, if the guilty
need to walk for my client to walk, so be it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:41):
Which which that's that's pretty cynical.

Speaker 2 (01:06:45):
A little fucked up. But also isn't that like the
isn't there like a famous quote that's like, I would
rather see a thousand guilty men walk free than put
one innocent man to death. That's basically the same thing.

Speaker 1 (01:06:57):
Well, I mean death versus not death, or slightly different stations.

Speaker 2 (01:07:02):
Yeah, yeah, I think it's just like a variation of that. Yeah, right,
same same concept, painted to be a little bit more cynical.
And this is so the phone comes back. This is
when we learned it's not his phone. It's just a
bunch of flattened women in the in the call log.

Speaker 1 (01:07:15):
Right, and there was a nine one one call that
went through for like two seconds and then and then
and then hung up. Uh, so they find out it's
this what's this lady's name? I don't have it written.

Speaker 2 (01:07:25):
Down, fucking Consuela Maria or whatever. She's sure her name
is Craig. That can't be right, No, that can't be oh,
this is Craig.

Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
Yeah. Anyway, so they go to her apartment. I got
I got nothing. They go to an apartment and she's
got a black eye and it's living I think Coreasy
talking to her and they're like did you get that? Uh?
Or where did you? Where did you lose your phone?
And they're like, oh, you cause you you nanny for
someone at the building where this attack went down. So
they they're like, we were pretty sure you saw something
and you've got a black eye. What happened?

Speaker 2 (01:07:59):
Well, so they actually don't mention the black eye until
like five minutes into the con So.

Speaker 1 (01:08:05):
She basically tells him like, I don't want to get involved,
and that's sort of like gouh, So you got a
nice black guy there sure would be a shame if
we were to match that on the other side.

Speaker 2 (01:08:13):
Yeah, and she's like, listen, he said that he would
kill me if if I said anything, and so I'm
not going to say anything, but uh, yeah, I saw.
I saw the rape wasn't great, it was it was
it was bad. Maria is her name, because of course
it is. It was it was a bad situation and
I saw it. And these are the three guys and

(01:08:34):
then she like picks them out of a lineup right.
She says, the black boy hit me and he said
he knew who I was and if I called the cops,
he'd kill me. So we're we're not just doing Kitty Jenevie's.
We're doing Super Predators.

Speaker 1 (01:08:48):
We're playing all the hits. Yeah, so great, We've got
all three of them. We're going to trial now. And
the way that this is shot is I thought, I
think it's pretty good because we have Yeah, it's a
cross between you know, one of the the witnesses will
be talking, one of the neighbors will be talking, and
then you'll hear Barba off screen asking the question, and

(01:09:09):
then they'll respond and then it'll cut back to then
it'll be like to be Digs asking a question and
then goes to a different witness.

Speaker 2 (01:09:17):
Yeah, it's like shot like that monage. Yeah, right right
before we go to trial, they talked to Ronnie one
last time and they're like, oh, we have a witness now,
And Ronnie's lawyer is like, he was afraid to tell
you what really happened because he if he told you,
he thinks he thought that you jump to conclusions. And
it turns out that she picked them up. She wanted

(01:09:40):
it rough, but they're not like that. So they dropped
her off at home because they didn't want a triple
team this this k holed girl, because they're good kids.

Speaker 1 (01:09:51):
Uh huh sure and yeah, and they're like, you know,
so we'll accept knocking it down to something else at Barber's,
like wad to like a salts, right, so we will
in court.

Speaker 2 (01:10:04):
So we have this court montage and then finally Libby
takes the stand and Counselor Henderson kind of picks her
apart where she's like I was, oh, sorry, no, first
it was it's all the all the witnesses. Yeah, where
he picks apart all the witnesses, being like, so you
never actually saw the defendants with the victims and like

(01:10:28):
maybe you're so sure of it now because their pictures
are in the paper and and we're basically like saying
that they're guilty before their trial and you know.

Speaker 1 (01:10:41):
So all valid points for a defense attorney to bring.

Speaker 2 (01:10:44):
Up and the the the Central Park five defense essentially,
which which turned out to be very true.

Speaker 1 (01:10:51):
Yeah, so that whoops. That's why I was like, wait,
is this the Central Park five? It's it's all of it.

Speaker 2 (01:10:56):
It's all like the one sequence of Central Park, and
and the the neighbors are like, well, they were wearing
hoodies like the boys on the news had, and nobody
looked upset. I thought that they were making a movie
in the courtyard Jesus.

Speaker 1 (01:11:09):
Yeah, and uh because that's also a kitty Jennefe's thing,
where like someone was quoted as saying like, oh, we
thought it was a lover's quarrel or something, yeah, which
also I can't under say what that means, like, oh,
it's a love of It's like so if someone's getting
the shit, getgether, like, yeah, it's a lover's core. It's fine.

Speaker 2 (01:11:24):
They know each other intimately, it's okay for a man
to beat a woman to death.

Speaker 1 (01:11:28):
Right, And it's not like the percentage of women that
are murdered by instant partners or people that they.

Speaker 2 (01:11:32):
Know isn't insanely higher than any other form of uh
of murder.

Speaker 1 (01:11:39):
So I swear to God, like men have had just
the best pr for years to just guess like people
to be like, no, it's fine, it's a lover's quarrel.
It's just a man beating the shit out of his wife,
and that's okay because it's a man and that's a woman.

Speaker 2 (01:11:53):
To another one hundred years of the empire. Baby, it's
fucking it.

Speaker 1 (01:11:57):
Really, it's just the messaging spitting on point for men
for just forever.

Speaker 2 (01:12:04):
It's like, it's like I cut to Don Draper in
his in his.

Speaker 1 (01:12:09):
You're not beating your wife. It's a lover's quarrel.

Speaker 2 (01:12:12):
It's a lover's quarrel.

Speaker 1 (01:12:13):
Because only bad men beat their wives and you're not.
Quarrels are very different.

Speaker 2 (01:12:19):
It starts with four Scotches Deep, just got all lined
up in front of him. Peggy Olsen's like fucking frantically
writing ship down. So they put they put Libby on
the stand and she's and and uh.

Speaker 1 (01:12:34):
I don't think of you at all.

Speaker 2 (01:12:36):
I feel bad for I feel bad for you. I
don't think of you at all. So they put her
on the stand and David Diggs is like, do you
remember giving consent to a sexual encounter. She's like, absolutely not,
and I never would. They're people of color.

Speaker 1 (01:12:51):
He's like, interesting, we'll get into that in a minute.
So you don't. But like it's done in such a
way where it's like, oh, it's so devastated where because
he's just like, you don't remember anything. You couldn't tell
me they brought you. You don't remember meeting my clients,
they brought you home, and you don't remember. What can
you tell us about that night.

Speaker 2 (01:13:09):
It's a really interesting lawyer tactical he used a lot
in the show in probably real life, where he's like,
wasn't your first time using Kenmede And she's like no,
And she's like, and you don't remember leaving the coffee shop.
Point of fact, she left the coffee shop, she's like, no,
And you don't remember bringing these kids to your house?
Questionable point of fact. Right, we don't know whether she

(01:13:32):
brought them there or they took her there. Probably they
took her there. No, and you don't remember begging them
to have rough sex. And she's like no, but not
for the reason that I said no to the other thing.
No because it didn't happen, Not no because I don't
remember it. Also, don't you remember what do you remember?

Speaker 1 (01:13:49):
It's like, no, because I'm not into rough sex like that.
He's like, well, how do you know you take so
much Kennemede, you can't remember anything. We should call you
elon musk on the.

Speaker 2 (01:13:59):
Stand here basically, and so.

Speaker 1 (01:14:02):
Why don't you just tell me the name of the
thing that you know where it's. But at the same time,
it's like, okay, so but there's never the argument that
argument only works, uh, like because she doesn't remember that
it happened doesn't mean that it didn't happen.

Speaker 2 (01:14:24):
Oh, we actually litigated that point a few weeks ago, because.

Speaker 1 (01:14:28):
Like he's saying, because the defense at this point is
basically like, well, she wanted it, but he's doing like
you don't remember any of this as if like that
we don't even know if you were raped. Like it's
that's where it's kind of going the way that he's
trying to present the argument. But it's like, but you
have everyone else showing saying that they saw something happening. Yeah,

(01:14:48):
we know something happened, Like she didn't just end up
like that in the courtyard.

Speaker 2 (01:14:54):
I don't think that they like saw consensual rough sex
and public like New York's fucked up and not that.

Speaker 1 (01:15:00):
Right, but like because the one attorney presents in the
interrogation room, like the alternate theory like yeah, my clients
whenever they were like but we didn't want to do
her like that, So we just left her there in
the fucking courtyard, and his attorney's like, and then another
rapist came along and all of that, but they don't
bring that, right, But no one brings that up except

(01:15:20):
so it's like, is it supposed to be that someone
else did it or that she she consented to all
of this? But then he hammers the memory thing is
like what difference does that make?

Speaker 2 (01:15:31):
This is the same thing that happened last episode where
the defense doesn't provide an alternate.

Speaker 1 (01:15:37):
The theory of the crime.

Speaker 2 (01:15:38):
It's just like, this isn't me well at the same like.

Speaker 1 (01:15:42):
You don't have to have necessarily an alternate theory of
the crime. You just have to show that your client
didn't do it. It goes a lot further defense if
you can say, like, we think this is what happened.

Speaker 2 (01:15:52):
This is what happened. Yeah, So they cut to like
a scene of aftermath, and Libby's like, I just got fucked,
didn't I? And Crisey's like, well, the jury heard what
you went through and that counts for something.

Speaker 1 (01:16:06):
Like does it? But I, again, I just don't think
that's the slam dunk that it's supposed to be.

Speaker 2 (01:16:11):
No, I don't. Oh for v Diggs, you mean yeah,
because it's like it doesn't make her look good.

Speaker 1 (01:16:17):
I mean, she didn't id any of the people. The
other people did, so it's so whatever, like you didn't
remember anything. It's like no. But what everyone else is
saying is if I have evidence of being sexually assaulted
and they saw forty other people saw it happen in
some capacity, including the one lady that could pick them
all out, and they got punched in the face as

(01:16:38):
a result, and you're hammering home that I just don't remember.
You really need you need to be really focusing your
questions on I consented to that and that's what happened. Instead,
you're attacking me like Perry Mason style to be like aha,
as supposed to like, no, but you did consent to this.
That's you just don't remember, and I'm sorry then that happened.

Speaker 2 (01:17:01):
Ultimately, da V Diggs is not trying to prove that
the other two didn't rape her, just that his client
didn't do it. I think that that's like the logic
behind this. He's just like, so you don't remember who
who raped you, and his clothes is gonna be like
them two motherfuckers are guilty. My kid's fine.

Speaker 1 (01:17:20):
I owe them nothing. Is that what it's supposed to be,
because like why would the memory thing be like this dagger?
It's bad.

Speaker 2 (01:17:27):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:17:27):
It doesn't look good, but like who cares, no one.

Speaker 2 (01:17:30):
As Libby is mourning her her fucking court case, she
gets a knock on the door and it's the fucking
dog guy, Doug, and I.

Speaker 1 (01:17:40):
Was like, look at that fucking dog. That's a cute dog.

Speaker 2 (01:17:43):
Look at that fucking dog. So Doug played by Patrick Breen,
is like, I just wanted to give you flowers. And
she says, oh, I got the flower, the flowers. I'm sorry,
and so he leaves and she's.

Speaker 1 (01:17:56):
Like okay, So Libby, I have to say, Libby, the
fuck are you doing?

Speaker 2 (01:18:00):
Girl?

Speaker 1 (01:18:01):
Because Crazy's like it's the dog guy and he's like,
oh yeah, he's he's a neighbor. He's been like a
real friend and uh, you know, he sent me those flowers.
And we go to AA together and Crazy's like he
goes to AA. He's like, She's like, yeah, he goes
to AA. Alcoholics Anonymous don't worry about that second word
in that phrase of the anonymous portion, because.

Speaker 2 (01:18:22):
He gets so he gets so mad when I slip,
and and she also mentions that he's single, and I think.

Speaker 1 (01:18:31):
Not cool. Don't reveal someone if you're in.

Speaker 3 (01:18:33):
A a well anonymous is the I get that, but
but okay, I had like a I like spiraled when
she said he gets real mad when I slip, And
I'm like, did Doug hire these guys to come rape her?

Speaker 1 (01:18:50):
Right? Because like for as, because he's he was introduced
and now he's being reintroduced. It's like, well, he clearly
has something to do.

Speaker 2 (01:18:57):
With and and and and caught in a lie right.

Speaker 1 (01:18:59):
Right, because immediately he's like, oh, I was at a
bar with my boyfriend, so we already know. But at
the same time, I was like, okay, well he's single.
Does it mean for now?

Speaker 2 (01:19:07):
I know? Right? It's like both of those things could.

Speaker 1 (01:19:09):
Be also an alcoholic, like if you have go to
a bar, if that aren't alcoholics, you can go to
a bar and get something to eat.

Speaker 2 (01:19:17):
Have we not heard of Sam Malone and he owned
a bar?

Speaker 1 (01:19:20):
Right?

Speaker 2 (01:19:21):
If that was totally real? And so so they they
corner him Caresey and.

Speaker 1 (01:19:27):
No rollins ex is it gambling and drunk.

Speaker 2 (01:19:30):
And owns the bar and owns the bar, a real
Sam Malone type, and so Carresey corners this guy and
he's like, why did you lie to me? Like that's
so fucked up, and this person's your friend, and he's like, well,
better than having them kill me. I didn't want to
say anything because I would have died. Okay, cancel me

(01:19:52):
if you want to. I've never met a gay man
who didn't want to gossip.

Speaker 1 (01:19:56):
It's a little bit more than gossip.

Speaker 2 (01:19:58):
I think spill the tea again.

Speaker 1 (01:20:01):
Like they make it sound like this group of teens.

Speaker 2 (01:20:04):
Work they got MS thirteen or something, right, But.

Speaker 1 (01:20:07):
They're they're closer. I don't know, man, they they're not.

Speaker 2 (01:20:10):
They don't kids and coffee. They're closer to the kids
that pushed the trans girl off the bridge, which is
not to say that they're good, but just that they're
Like I don't think that they went out like hunting
for rape victims.

Speaker 1 (01:20:26):
Right, and to be like, oh, somebody said, like all
fucking kill you. It's like in the same way that
some puffed up sixteen.

Speaker 2 (01:20:31):
Year old wants your window in traffic.

Speaker 1 (01:20:34):
Right, Like was anyone actually yeah, that one lady got
punched in.

Speaker 2 (01:20:38):
The faces A dad.

Speaker 1 (01:20:41):
Well, right, are you really concerned because you were like,
oh god, I wouldn't go to sleep, I wouldn't put
my headphones se if someone was trying to break in,
They're gonna come here and kill me. Like, but you
would look at them be like, really, those kids, they
look like a bunch of fucking punks.

Speaker 2 (01:20:52):
I still wouldn't put my headphones in because I think
that they come back to rob more. But either way,
So it turns out that after being paralyzed with fear,
Doug couldn't call nine on one, and out of the
guilt or immediate guilt, he like fell off the wagon
and got really uh.

Speaker 1 (01:21:10):
He said he went and well on the stand, He's like, well,
I went back to my apartment and drank until I
couldn't remember anymore. I'm like that sounds about right.

Speaker 2 (01:21:18):
Yeah, And he says he has a good memory, but
no morality.

Speaker 1 (01:21:22):
No.

Speaker 2 (01:21:22):
Barbara says that, Oh, Barbara says that he's got a
good memory but no morality.

Speaker 1 (01:21:25):
Yeah, because Crisie's bringing this to Barbara being like, I've
got a witness. He saw everything, he saw their faces,
he can identify them. This is the whole thing. And
Barbara's like what's the problem. He's like, well, he's a
bit of a drunk.

Speaker 2 (01:21:37):
Yeah, just as long as he doesn't come to court
drug cut too.

Speaker 1 (01:21:42):
He comes out, Oh it's like an hour late.

Speaker 2 (01:21:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:21:45):
They say like, well, did he remember what time he
was supposed to show up because he's an hour late.
And he strolls out of the elevator and he's like, dude.

Speaker 2 (01:21:54):
It's time for me to testify for my good friend
the president.

Speaker 1 (01:22:00):
And Barbara's like, are you fucking drunk? He's like, yes, yes,
I certainly am. And Chriss like I'm gonna get him
some air, and Barbara's like, get him gallons of coffee.
I'm like, Dad, won't do anything.

Speaker 2 (01:22:13):
Some cocaine right, booth me.

Speaker 1 (01:22:16):
So they they put him on a flight. We'll just
put some cocaine or do they have to wake him up?

Speaker 2 (01:22:23):
That's basically what happens. So they basically just put him
on the stand drunk, and he's clearly drunk, but that
he's been sober for almost five years, but he fell
off the wagon that night and he learned how to
function a while drunk a long time ago. Please don't
ask me if I'm drunk. And then Dav things, is like,

(01:22:43):
are you in toxic and right now? He's like, God's
my witness, yes, and uh, I.

Speaker 1 (01:22:49):
Think that's what ends. And so Barbara's like, uh, redirects
like I gotta do something.

Speaker 2 (01:22:55):
I gotta do something familiar with this one's called pennies
from heaven.

Speaker 1 (01:23:04):
So he he starts asking him questions. That was like, okay,
what what were the questions that TV digs just asked you?

Speaker 2 (01:23:13):
Like?

Speaker 1 (01:23:14):
What were the three questions or however many questions that
he just asked you. He's like, I s how long
I was sober? He asked if I was intoxicated? Now
he asked me if it's possible that my memory was
compromised based off of like like he goes, he rattles off.

Speaker 2 (01:23:34):
Everything he was would you like me to continue?

Speaker 1 (01:23:37):
Yeah? Barb was like no, it's okay. What were what
do you remember the defendants wearing the night that you saw?
I was like, uh, black coodie blue whatever and a
shirt with leather leather vest. And Barber's like, okay, uh,
do do be a favor, close your eyes and look

(01:23:58):
that way. And to be Dis's like, what, I haven't
fucking do a sobriety test? What the fuck dore we doing.

Speaker 2 (01:24:02):
Is basically that's what he's doing.

Speaker 1 (01:24:04):
And Barber's like, what is the makeup of the jury,
And he's like.

Speaker 2 (01:24:08):
This, I couldn't. I couldn't. I couldn't do this. No.

Speaker 1 (01:24:12):
It's like if I if I was stone sober and
got pulled over and was like, do the alphabet backwards,
I'd be like, just put the cuffs on me. I
can't do that. I just do it another way. There's guy,
I should have options, not the alphabet backwards. What I
could never do that, not in a way that would
they would not think like you're absolutely hammered, because I'd
be sitting there just like thinking the whole time, like.

Speaker 2 (01:24:31):
M Z.

Speaker 1 (01:24:33):
Why X right because I'm hearing the music and it'd
be fucking me up.

Speaker 2 (01:24:39):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:24:39):
And he does it. He's like, you know, it's this
many men, this way women, this many white women, many
Hispanic women. Yeah, blah blah blah blah blah. And Uh,
that I guess is the nail of the coffin because
we cut to the multics. Yeah, fucking guilty, guilty.

Speaker 2 (01:24:55):
It's a it's an impressive trick, I'll tell I'll say
that much. And uh and so well, what if the
gamble didn't work? Whatever, it was fun either way.

Speaker 1 (01:25:04):
Once the guy admitted that he was drunk on the.

Speaker 2 (01:25:06):
Stand, so that's true. That's true. And so he goes
up to Barbara crazy at the end of the after
the traveling He's like, you know, I don't know what.
I feel so bad. I don't know what to say
to her. And he's like, you just you can try.
I'm sorry and start there.

Speaker 1 (01:25:22):
And so he goes in. He's like, I'm so sorry.
She's like, yeah, I am too.

Speaker 2 (01:25:27):
Anyway, funk off and uh. And so after the verdict
comes in, everyone's like, well, I sure glad that this
this this young kid is going back to jail and uh,
and maybe Libby can move on now. And Ron's like,
she'll be drinking again by Friday night. What an absolute bitch, right,

(01:25:47):
It's like, what the fuck?

Speaker 1 (01:25:48):
Man?

Speaker 2 (01:25:49):
So then our final scene we cut to live at home.
We've talked about this a little bit, but she's she's
like flirty talking to someone on the phone.

Speaker 1 (01:25:57):
Yeah, it's supposed to be to Tuck her.

Speaker 2 (01:26:00):
Gotta be Tucker, right, Brian Cassidy. Maybe and the last
words that will come out of your mouth are Brian.

Speaker 1 (01:26:10):
Cassidy, what's up, dummy?

Speaker 2 (01:26:13):
What's up dummy? And so she's drinking wine out of
a fish bowl alone and watching Noah on the on
the baby monitor, Dick Wolf, what the fuck? Like?

Speaker 1 (01:26:23):
She has a glass of wine, she drinks it not empty,
and adds a bunch more in and has another long
gulp off of it. And again it's like, is this
is this the thing? Is this supposed to be a
thing where it's like, oh, no, Live is either oh
she's turning, she's kind of an alcoholic or she's a
high functioning alcoholic. Much like the guy that just what
is this?

Speaker 2 (01:26:43):
It's no idea.

Speaker 1 (01:26:45):
What conflict does this bring into the show on a
week's week basis? Again, they've tried to launch this before, seemingly,
but we it never amounts to anything. Again, I know
we said this earlier, but like Robin's problem resulted in
an episode or two where we had to deal with
the consequence of her having that addiction.

Speaker 2 (01:27:05):
I'm very concerned that we're going to have a Olivia
alcoholics storyline. But I also feel like that would have
someone would have like mentioned that to us in the
last ten years, that this is like a thing.

Speaker 1 (01:27:18):
Then it's just a really weird choice.

Speaker 2 (01:27:20):
Such a weird choice. And that's our episode for this week.
Lonuter SVU season seventeen, episode thirteen, entitled forty one Witnesses
from Trivia Corner. What the Fuck? So? Benson and Stabler
investigated a similar case of the bystander effect. The episode
was called Spectacle. It was from twenty eleven season twelve,

(01:27:42):
episode sixteen. And I think that we did one in
very early days. Yeah, yeah, another one. That's it. Nothing
else good TV. Diggs, Andy Ramas, Andy Carl and Rolla
Sparza are Broadway musical veteran.

Speaker 1 (01:27:57):
Wait, was there a second Hamilton person because they.

Speaker 2 (01:27:59):
Normally come into he digs and Anthony Ramosh Oh right, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:28:03):
Yeah, the original.

Speaker 2 (01:28:05):
He's the son, Oh okay, and he's he's the dual role.
He's the son and also one of the revolutionaries that
ends that leaves in the first act and then he
comes back as the Sun from the Goop's department. When
a jury four person reads out the verdict, she includes

(01:28:25):
all three defendants' names before saying guilty. Even if the
jury comes to the same conclusion on each count, the
four person should only include a single defendant. And charge
in each sentence. So for example, she should say, on
the cauterisexual assault, we've defined the defendant John Q guilty.
On the count of sexual salt, we defendant, we find
the defendant James Doe guilty, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. So and uh,

(01:28:50):
plot holes. Although the black defendant Ronnie admits to punching
the nanny and the nanny testifies that he punched her,
there's no assault charge read out when the journey rents
it's verdict. Okay, sure, this is a great one. During
the opening when all those dumb questions to the girl

(01:29:12):
with hypothermia, she's wearing the wrong badge. She has on
a sergeant's shield instead of her lieutenant's badge. It's a
good that's a very very silly one. Yeah. And from
user review.

Speaker 1 (01:29:26):
Corner, that's a keen eye too.

Speaker 2 (01:29:29):
This is from Lachlan Elliott from February second, twenty sixteen,
so basically right after the episode came out six out
of ten stars. Dull and uninteresting, but brutally highlights the
negligence of modern society. I was looking forward to watching
this episode in light of Season seventeen's and surprisingly improved

(01:29:53):
upon stories. However, this episode is without a sense of
passion and aggression that is usually prevalent with such carearacters
such as Barbara and Benson. The guest stars were definitely
not memorable in their performances, and the courtroom half of
the episode was quite dull and uninspired. Although I found
this to be a fairly boring episode, it does cut

(01:30:13):
touch on the carelessness of modern citizens when witnessed to
a cry, which to me alerts us all that our
compassions to fellow humans these days has faded. Overall, I
give this uninspired ep six out of ten stars. The
problem with this is we watched People Intervene and film

(01:30:35):
when the cops were shooting an unarmed black man, and
we're saying the show is implying that that's just because
it was police brutality and not because someone was being hurt,
which I don't Yeah, I don't think that's really the case.

Speaker 1 (01:30:51):
It was citizen from.

Speaker 2 (01:30:53):
The same other side of the aisle. This is from
like eight days ago, from an aisle. This is from
eight days ago from June's second from a tex Chad.
Seven out of ten stars. Simple episode. We finally get
a win without any silly twists or dumb characters showing

(01:31:15):
up or changing their minds. No stupid judge decision. Kind
of a boring story, lots of courtroom time. However, it
was satisfying watching the bad guys get convicted and the
one defense attorney who acted so cocky come running to
the DA at the end to beg If it were
not for the last witness coming forward, the case would

(01:31:36):
have been lost. Pretty cool watching him drunk and showing
his photographic memory. Those boys deserve to be convicted, including
the one who said he did not participate. Another plus
is that we did not have to see or listen
to Benson pontificate or show her sanctimonious side too much.
Her facial expressions are classic though, Thanks atex Chad. Yeah yeah,

(01:32:02):
and that's our episode for this jeez, yeah, that's our
episode of this weekloud Our or SVU Season seventeen, Episode thirteen,
forty one witnesses. If you agree or disagree with us,
if you want to be the forty second witness, let
us know. We're an SVU podcast on Blue Sky, which
is the official Blue Sky of just of doing something,

(01:32:23):
Just do something.

Speaker 1 (01:32:25):
Yeah, and you can take that to the Bank, Blood
Bank Senator and for longer or weirder stuff or tweetsize emails,
send us an email special viewing Unit strudelegmail dot com
and give us a rate and review.

Speaker 2 (01:32:34):
I think I think we're onto spidermonkeygmail dot com.

Speaker 1 (01:32:37):
Spider Monkey, I guess Okay, spider monkeygmail dot com, and
give us a rate and reviewer for fine podcasts are sold.

Speaker 2 (01:32:45):
So Matt, Yes, I need you. I need you to
do you have any like grounding exercises that you do? Uh?
Do you meditate?

Speaker 1 (01:32:59):
I do not met. There are some grounding exercises that
I have.

Speaker 2 (01:33:03):
I need you go. I needs you to go to
your happy place. He needs your ground for a second. Okay,
tune in next week when we view and review and
lovingly ridicule Law and Order. SVU Season seventeen, Episode fourteen,
entitled Nationwide Manhunt. Two notorious killers from SVU and Chicago
officer Aaron Lindsay's past doctor Greg Yates, and doctor Carl

(01:33:26):
Rudnick escape from prison Breathe Breathe through a buddy, prompting
a massive manhunt and returning fuck you, we got we got,
Sophia Bush as Aaron Lindsay, We got Jason Bayhee as
Hank Floyd. We got Robin to Jesus as the guy

(01:33:47):
that no one can remember. We got Jefferson Mays as
Carl Rudnick Dallas Roberts as Greg Yates. I can't even
believe it.

Speaker 1 (01:33:58):
I really hope they put these two down like dogs
in the fucking street, just so we have to stop.

Speaker 2 (01:34:03):
This is really apparently like a very beloved episode. Anna
Devere Smith, who played the Secretary of Defense on the
West Wing and is a playwright in her own right
as Warden Lucille Fenton and Sarah Storm is back as
Bronwyn Freed Wilkins.

Speaker 1 (01:34:25):
So this so that we've been waiting, This one's been
cued up for a while.

Speaker 2 (01:34:28):
I think that they go. I guess that they go
to Bronwyin to get into the mind of the killers
to catch them. That's my guess.

Speaker 1 (01:34:38):
I really hope you're wrong, but I am so pissed
off that you are probably right.

Speaker 2 (01:34:44):
Oh boy, So that's.

Speaker 1 (01:34:47):
Gonna be the last one we record before you officially.

Speaker 2 (01:34:51):
Leave, unless we do want to do a third one
this week.

Speaker 1 (01:34:55):
Fuck no, because you leave, you leave next week.

Speaker 2 (01:34:57):
I leave on Monday.

Speaker 1 (01:34:58):
Yeah, Jesus Christ we're cut. Hey, we're gonna do it
though we were cutting close, but fuck it, we finally
did so.

Speaker 2 (01:35:04):
Until then, I guess Jesus Jesus fucking Christ for a
Lot and Order special viewing unit. I'm a Vive Rubinstein.

Speaker 1 (01:35:12):
And I'm at Reuter. We will see you guys next week.
Threw it buy I'm fucking trying. Come gung

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Episode 379 - S17E13 - Forty-One Witnesses

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 379 - S17E13 - Forty-One Witnesses