April 15, 2025 • 30 mins
In this episode of the Main Street Business Podcast, Mark J. Kohler welcomes Chris Van Dusen to unpack the biggest mistakes business owners make when trying to sell—and how to avoid them. From cleaning up your books to understanding your true enterprise value, this is your roadmap to a smarter exit.
Here are some of the highlights:
- Mark and Chris explain the concept of enterprise value, differentiating it from lifestyle businesses.
- Chris emphasizes the importance of understanding the market and strategic fit for a business looking to sell.
- Mark and Chris discuss the significance of replacing oneself in a business to increase its value.
- Chris introduces the term EBITDA and its role in determining business profitability.
- Mark shares his experience with clients who decide to stay in their business after preparing it for sale.
- How multiple businesses can be combined to create a larger, more efficient entity.
- Discussion on the role of investment bankers in helping businesses prepare for sale.
- Chris advises being prepared for the emotional transition and having a plan for the next chapter.
- Grab my FREE Ultimate Tax Strategy Guide HERE!
- You don't want to miss this! Secure your tickets for the most significant business, tax & legal event of the year: Main Street 360
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Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Main Street Business Podcast with
your distinguished hosts, mark JKohler and Matt Sorenson.
Both are best-selling authorsand have over 25 years of
industry experience, with 10,000client consultations, making
them the leading tax and legalexperts in the nation.
Together, they'll unpack themost complex tax, legal and
financial strategies crucial forsaving more, stressing less and
(00:23):
building generational wealth.
Today they're your personaladvisors, ready to break it down
for you and make the tax andlegal game easier than ever.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Here is Mark and Matt , welcome to another episode of
the Main Street Business Podcast.
Today I have the honor ofintroducing to you and
interviewing Chris Van Dusen, acapital growth expert.
He likes to help businessowners with a big idea raise the
capital they need to launchthat special idea and create an
(00:54):
incredible business, and he'salso helping those that have a
current business that think it'sscalable or want to exit at
some point.
He's sold several businesseshimself for millions of dollars
and has so much insideinformation and techniques on
working with business ownersthrough the private equity
process.
So I'm excited today to breakdown that process, some of the
(01:17):
definitions of terms and getsome tips from him that might
help some of you that are onyour path to an exit as well.
Well, chris, thanks for joiningus.
It is an honor to have you hereand I know a lot of business
owners are going to be reallyfind this conversation very
(01:38):
interesting.
Awesome, mark, thanks forhaving me Really excited to be
here.
Well, you've got a really neatpedigree of experience and
something that a lot of businessowners wish they had in
hindsight, because you kind ofjust don't know what you don't
know.
Maybe let's start there with,like an average business owner
says, hey, I want to sell mybusiness, or could I, should I?
(01:59):
You know how hard is it goingto be.
I know you consult with a lotof clients on the front end,
raising capital, but also on theexit.
What are some of your initialthoughts?
I mean, let's just unpack itfor a minute.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Yeah.
So it's funny.
It's almost like the questionis how long is a piece of string
right?
You don't know.
And that's what's interestingis you'll sit down and go okay,
I've got my business to a point,whether or not it needs some
efficiencies right, which mostdo right, especially if it's a
family business or somethingyou're doing and you're trying
to figure out.
Is there enterprise value here?
(02:30):
Is there something interesting?
And what's really kind of toughis depending on the business,
depends on the multiple you'regoing to get, and so what you
find is people love their babyMany times.
They've been working on thesecompanies for a very, very long
time and they might havedifferent expectations of the
(02:50):
value versus what the marketwill actually bear.
So my first thing is startlooking and are there other
companies in your market beingsold right, depending on how
much EBITDA you have?
Should it be part of a roll-upstrategy, meaning find someone
who is taking five or six orseven businesses like yours and
(03:11):
putting them into a roll-up, oris it something that there's a
strategic, you fit a certainniche in the marketplace and
there's a call it a biggercompany that would love to have
that as a service offering andfiguring out how to work at it.
But just saying I'm here, Ihave a great company, someone's
going to buy it.
Traditionally isn't the bestplace to start right.
(03:32):
It's figuring out like why wouldsomeone want this thing that
I've created?
And sure, cashflow is one thing, but usually it needs to fit
into something bigger Right andso so it's this into something
bigger right and so it's thisbalance of.
I know the industry.
I'm in well enough tounderstand who the big players
are.
Maybe you are the big player,so maybe it's the other side.
You should be acquiring moreright into your business, but
(03:54):
traditionally it's finding outin your market who's the biggest
player.
What are you doing?
They're not doing.
And figuring out how tostrategically place yourself or
with a private equity firm,who's doing other businesses
like that, where you're going toget the best multiple but also
the best home for your company,because sometimes the best
multiple on exit isn't the besthome right and you can get Now.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Hold it Now, before you keep going here.
I got to interject.
You've thrown out about 19things here, so we got to unpack
this a little.
Sure, you're throwing out termsthe average small business
owner and I'm a small businessowner.
I mean, I've only learned thesebecause I consult with so many
other business owners goingthrough this process.
Okay, let's start with one ofthe first terms you used they
(04:37):
don't know a business owner ifthey have an enterprise value.
What do you mean by enterprisevalue?
Speaker 3 (04:41):
So I look at things for is this company large enough
where it can scale?
Or is this truly a great momand pop business that puts cash
flow in the pockets of theowners, right?
And so when we look at it andagain I'm glad you mentioned it
from the front side right,providing capital for venture
(05:04):
deals, it from the front sideright, providing capital for
venture deals we look at thingsthat we call lifestyle
businesses versus ones that havetrue kind of this enterprise
growth or value.
Now, a lifestyle business,they're great businesses and not
everyone's going to like this,but my wife and I have owned a
marketing firm forever.
It's a service-based business,right, typically, you're trading
time for dollars.
(05:24):
Right, you're going in andyou're doing some work.
Maybe it's creative, maybe it'semail marketing, maybe it's
something, and it's somethingwe've had for 12 years.
That value is very differentthan if I were manufacturing a
product at scale and had amanufacturing facility hard
assets, things like that andwhat I mean by that is it's an
actual physical location thatmakes goods right.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
The way I like to describe it too is on the can
scale, or if it's an enterprisevalue, it can run without you,
correct Like you're it's goingto.
You've been able to replaceyourself, or could, very easily,
and they could take it toanother level.
That means you might havesomething special, If not, a
buyer is really just buying ajob, exactly.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
Exactly.
And so service-based businesseslike the one I mentioned,
marketing firms, not the bestexample, because once they get
to a certain size, they do havethat right.
There's no key man risk anymore.
There's no CEO, that's theleader, right, You're really
buying this machine that's beenbuilt, but with a small agency
or small service-based businessto your point.
(06:29):
you have this CEO or usuallysmall group that really are that
secret sauce, and if you removethem you remove a lot of the
value, and so they're not goingto give you what we call
multiple right.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
I have revenue.
Okay, no, that was my nextquestion.
Can you tell everybody what amultiple is?
Speaker 3 (06:44):
Sure.
So it's based on typically twodifferent factors.
It'd be revenue or EBITDA,right, and EBITDA would be an
easy way to look at it as yourprofit dollars and they're going
to say we value your businessat some multiple or your profit
times.
Some number Could be three,could be five, could be 10,
right.
Obviously, if we have a 10Xprofit business, that's a great
(07:07):
business and someone reallywants that.
When you go down into theservice-based businesses,
traditionally they're gonna havea smaller multiple.
Maybe you get 2X or 3X.
So you have a business doingtwo $3 million a year.
That's doing two $300,000 inEBITDA or profit dollars.
Maybe you're getting six$800,000 for that business.
(07:29):
That business owner might go,but wait, I love owning this
business because I get all ofthe benefits of owning the
business outside of just myprofit dollars, and so they'll
have to make a decision is thatworth it?
But maybe at 10X, 12x, it getsvery worth it for them, and so
that's where you need tounderstand the valuation you're
going to get for that businessin your own unique market.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Okay, so valuation is based on that net profit times,
this multiple, this numberthat's going to range from three
to 12, let's say based on theindustry you're in and how
strong you have as muchenterprise value as possible.
Let's define EBITDA.
You know people throw it around.
People say different ways tooEBITDA, DA, DA, I never know
(08:16):
EBITDA.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
Yeah, earnings before interest, depreciation taxes
and amortization Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Earnings before interest taxes.
Depreciation and amortizationOkay, earnings before interest
taxes, depreciation andamortization.
Which is a fancy account Likewhat do you?
Speaker 3 (08:29):
make it.
Yeah, it's a fancy way of doingaccounting right, cause you're
able to depreciate some things.
Yeah, but really it is.
What is the business making?
Speaker 2 (08:40):
a profit at the end of the day, gotcha, and don't
get me started.
Okay, now you said another coolword here, so all right,
everybody and this is this isreally helpful.
I wanted this, this show today,to be give some next steps for
someone that sees an opportunity, but also kind of as a reality
check to others that might havepie in the sky, because if
(09:03):
you're only going to get threeor four times your profit, you
might say, well, I'll just stayin the freaking business for the
next three years and make thatsame amount, and I think I could
tweak a little bit what I'veseen.
That's interesting.
Have you ever seen this where Ihave a client that's like, yeah
, yeah, I want to sell mybusiness?
And la, la la.
And I'll say, okay, we got toprepare, it's going to be at
least a year out, maybe 18months to two years.
I need you to get efficient, Ineed you to replace yourself.
(09:26):
Go hire that person, train them.
I want all the fat cut.
I don't want you to run inanything through your books.
We can add that into the taxreturn later, but other than
that, I want it tight, I want itclean, and they're like, okay,
okay, and then they come backhere later.
They're like oh my gosh, I wishI would have done that 10 years
ago.
I'm like showing up at theoffice half as much and I'm
making 20% more.
(09:47):
I don't want to sell, I'mloving my business now, right,
have you ever seen that?
Speaker 3 (09:51):
kind of experience, 100%.
Well, because if you thinkabout it as a small business
owner and we both been smallbusiness owners and we've also
been business owners that wereable to sell you're running it
very differently than you wouldif it was a huge company.
Right, you said you might beputting things through it.
Right, maybe it's your carlease, maybe it's something else
(10:12):
.
Right, you're just kind ofrunning it because it's your
business.
When you clean it up, itbecomes a lot more efficient.
On paper, the business does,maybe not what you're taking
home.
So that's the first littletweak, right?
Number two you don't realize asyou're building because a lot of
times, as founders, we're doingthe things we need to do to
solve the problems that are athand today without a 12, 18
(10:35):
month outlook.
So we're going no, I'm going tohire this person because I need
to fill this gap.
I haven't then looked at it andsaid, yeah, but in the Venn
diagram of labor I have a 50%overlap and really I just needed
to put some systems in placefor the one person, not the two,
and so you do, naturally,become more efficient.
I've seen, however, the onething that no one does to get
(10:57):
ready, aside actually doing allthe efficiency work, is having
what we call a data room.
Now, a data room is like your100% Bible for the company.
It's every contract, it's everyagreement, it is your
financials, not necessarilyhaving to be crazy audited, but
(11:17):
just everything you have to getready.
And so you have a buyer who saysman, I really like your
business.
May I check your assumptionsand validate what your business
is doing?
And they go sure, here's aQuickBooks printout.
And they're going no, no, no,no, no, no, thank you, I would
like everything about yourcompany.
And you're finding a contractwith a coffee stain on it in
(11:38):
some file folder somewhere fromtwo years ago and it just isn't
efficient.
What ends up happening is it'sa 12 to 18 months just to build
the everything that is yourcompany, to get ready to sell it
.
I look at it.
It's like the home buyingprocess right, you have all the
stuff that goes into thatprocess and it feels arduous,
(11:58):
but that's what it takes to sella company.
You can't just say yeah, no, no, trust me, it does well, you
should like it.
Here's the $2 million that wedid last year.
It's no, I want to see yourcontracts.
I want to see how defensiblethey are.
I want to see everything.
And that's the thing mostpeople don't have ready to go.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
Yeah, I'd like that selling of the house concept
because it's now doing all thoselittle things that are a little
broken.
It's looking for all the homewarranties, all the manuals for
all the appliances, what are allthe utility bills, so I can
show what utilities really are.
And is the swimming poolworking how it's supposed to,
how much is the lawn, people orwhatever, and so all those
(12:34):
little pieces that you have togather to sell your home.
It's a good three to four orfive months for an average home
seller, I would think, and for abusiness owner, I like what
you're saying at least a year totwo to really, because it's
going to affect your sales pricedramatically.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Yeah, in the real estate world, we'll call it
concessions need to be made fromthe seller.
In the business world, we callit being traded down, meaning
they offered you, on a termsheet, a certain amount of money
for your company, and then,once they get into the data room
past the term sheet, they gouh-uh, this wasn't what you said
it really was, or no, thatdoesn't work as efficiently as
(13:13):
you said, and the price goesdown and it's really hard to get
it back up right, and so it'svery similar.
You're selling an asset, aliving, breathing asset, that
has value, and so you need to beable to prove that it has the
value you've agreed upon.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
Many of my followers that listen to my show here know
in my book Financial Freedom, Ihave a whole section on
preparing to sell your businessto family, a whole other animal.
But I wanted to stick with thisprivate equity concept if I
could for a minute.
You've had so much experiencein that area.
It's a very interesting world.
So let's assume for a minuteokay, I clean up my business.
(13:52):
I've got, I'm okay, I've got itcould scale a little.
I've replaced myself, my booksare clean, I'm working my butt
off.
I'm ready to just take a break,do something new, focus on my
real estate and I think in myarea I could get a six or seven
(14:13):
multiple and maybe I've, I've.
I've eked out a million dollarsin profit this year and I did
it last year close to it.
So I think I and my books areordered.
I got my data room, you know,and so, okay, everybody you've
done all those things.
Generally you're pretty close.
And so, seven times a million,I could sell this thing for
maybe six to 7 million.
That's exciting.
It's a big payout for so manyAmericans in middle income
America.
So I try to shop it and I knowprivate equity is going to look
(14:39):
for bigger deals maybe, but youmentioned the word roll up.
What does that mean?
And I think in my experience,that's where maybe a five to $15
million sale might be a part ofa private equity roll-up.
What does that look?
Speaker 3 (14:51):
like.
So what we call it in privateequity is you'll have an
independent sponsor.
Fancy for people like us whosay, hey, you know what If we
took six businesses that allhave about this profile and we
put them together and we useshared services, right?
So the accounting is oneaccounting team, right, or the
finance teams, one legals one.
(15:13):
We have the sales team thathandles all of this, not eight,
you know, six different salesteams and we make the totality
of the business more efficient.
Our overall EBITDA profit goesup dramatically.
And now to your point.
As you started off, we have a$30, $40 million business that
we can then go sell for a highermultiple.
(15:34):
What ends up happening is, aswe move up from $2 to $3 million
in EBITDA to $5 to $10, to $15,to $20, to $25 to $30, the
value goes up tremendously.
So does your exit multiple, orwhat you're going to get from a
value perspective.
So we could sit and take fivecompanies, put them together,
(15:55):
and then now we have rolled themup into one company, right In a
holding company, with fiveindividual businesses that
become one.
And now the value, as I cleanthat up and use shared services,
becomes greater than they wereindependently.
And so that right there is whatwe call right An industry or a
(16:16):
vertical roll-up.
What typically happens and thisis what most people forget is at
first, whoever the sponsor firmis, the independent sponsor
will want the principlestraditionally to stay on.
So they will not buy 100% ofthe company, which means you as
a founder will traditionally getsome portion of the new hold
(16:37):
company.
And don't forget, privateequity makes their money by at
some point operating and sellingthese businesses at a higher
valuation.
So we have what we call thesecond bite of the apple.
So not only have I sold that $7million, but really I only got
five.
Okay, 2 million stays in, butthat 2 million might be worth 15
(16:59):
in three to five years.
So the totality of my salebecame much better and bigger,
and that's where it becomes veryinteresting in the private
equity world.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
Okay.
So let's play with someexamples.
What's interesting?
We've all probably seen it andif you're out in the HVAC, it's
kind of this unique little areawhere HVAC, solar heating, air
and conditioning is what we'rereferring to, and people doing
garage doors, kind of theseunique little service businesses
(17:31):
that can get really efficientwith teams.
I've had a couple of clientsget a purchase and a roll-up.
So let's say, in a mid-sizedcity in the US there's six to
ten of these little HVACbusinesses and they're all
making maybe a million dollars.
And these they've been careerworkers, mom and pops, and
they're making their million,they're eking it out, they're
(17:52):
getting close.
And PE, private equity comesaround and finds these seven or
eight businesses that all had amillion in profit and say, okay,
we're going to buy you out for7 million, but I'm only going to
give you five.
I'll buy you out for a hundredpercent, but 20% of yours goes
into the big pool.
And so I'm just repeating whatyou said with an example.
So seven of these HVACbusinesses sell out for a
(18:16):
million each.
Now we got a 7 million inEBITDA on year two.
But the holding company, theparent company, says all right,
guys, we got a few things toteach you, and we're going to
kind of combine a lot of theservices that you guys could be
more efficient at and just withwhat we're going to do to help
you.
Even within a year to two'stime, we can turn your seven
(18:39):
into 10 million Easy.
Then, once everybody'sefficient, let's take it to 15.
And so within.
But you got to stay on and work.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
They're like, I want it out.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we know you want it out.
We'll give you 5 million nowbut if you hang on that
remaining two, you're going toget to sell on the big game.
When we take that 15 millionand get a nine multiple on a
bigger EBITDA and you get apiece of that and they're like
you mean I'll get more at thesecond exit than the first.
Is that true?
(19:09):
Like you could really see kindof more in that second exit than
the first.
Happens, Absolutely Happens allthe time.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
I have a good friend I was actually just on a trip
with, who is about to get hissecond payment, which is
considerably larger than thefirst one.
He's ecstatic Now.
He stayed on three extra yearsAbsolutely, but it was.
It was a three years of a newprofessional team alongside of
him not having to do it byhimself, looking at growth that
(19:35):
they didn't expect to happen andgetting a really nice second
bite of the apple Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
Wow, okay.
So let's say wow guys.
Mark, chris, this is amazing.
How do I find these privateequity groups?
And do we need to explain theword investment banker?
Probably should.
Yes, where do you go next?
You're like, okay, I'm going toget lean and mean, I'm going to
get efficient.
You'd want to start arelationship with someone who
would you recommend Is aninvestment banker, explain what
(20:02):
that is, and would that be theperson you'd start talking with?
Speaker 3 (20:05):
Yeah, I mean traditionally, you're going to
have service providers in anybusiness, right.
You're going to have anaccountant, you're going to have
an relationships, right, soyou're not calling every
(20:31):
strategic or every privateequity firm.
They're going to help you getin front of the ones that
actually do these things in yourspace.
Now, most individuals, mostbusiness owners go well, doesn't
that mean that everyone's goingto have their handout, getting
fees for helping me sell mybusiness?
And the unfortunate answer is,yeah, but guess what?
They're going to get you ahigher price, right, then you
(20:54):
would have on your own.
They're going to be helping youdrive and negotiate the deal.
You want that and they're wellpaid for helping you do that.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I like it.
What you're talking about isyou mean I shouldn't just go for
sale by owner on Zillow?
If I get a good agent thatshows me how to price my home
better and how to stage it, Imight make more money even after
I pay my agent.
Get what you pay for Duh, right?
No, that's cool.
So that's a great pointeverybody needs to understand
here and I like the way youframed it.
(21:25):
Okay, mark, I'm a two tothree-year-old trajectory on
this.
I got a lot to do to clean upmy business.
I see some potential, someinefficiencies, data room, all
that.
Love it.
I start to get on that path.
Don't wait two to three yearsto then start calling someone
Call a broker lack of a betterword broker, investment banker,
a business broker they're outthere, that's a phrase.
(21:48):
And a business broker they'reout there, that's a phrase and
say, hey, I really want toprepare to sell my business.
You're not going to callprivate equity firms that are
doing roll-ups.
You're going to call a brokerthat says, help me look good,
and then they're going to takeyou to 10 private equities,
maybe Correct, and prepare youfor that process.
Would that be a fair summary ofkind of like where to go.
Speaker 3 (22:10):
Absolutely, absolutely.
Yeah, and I've know, I've been,I've been in this world for a
while.
You have as well.
Relationships are the best wayto do it right?
You're not just going to coldcall some investment bank.
Traditionally, you're going tomeet them through someone, and
again I go back to look at theother providers you have in your
network.
So attorneys and CPAs have allworked with them and you're
going to know ones that are.
They're going to know ones thatare in your space and what if I
(22:30):
may, what?
Speaker 2 (22:31):
what's the biggest risk?
Or like, what are some?
I mean, everything we'retalking about sounds incredible.
I really like sign me up, youknow, maybe, or whatever, but
what are some?
Some bad stories per se orthings to look out for that
could nip you in the butt andyou don't even know it.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
So a couple One is sometimes and it's natural we
chase the highest dollarsoffered not the best place for
my company that I've had tosucceed.
So if you're getting a fullbuyout, they want to buy and
give you that $7 million as wetalked about, and it's the
highest price and you don'tnecessarily care what happens to
(23:09):
your company afterwards.
That's a decision.
If you're going to have fiveand two is going to go into this
new company, you better makesure your new dance partner is
the one that's really going tobe able to take it to get that
second bite of the apple, thatsecond piece, and grow it
meaningfully.
Sometimes the highest offerisn't the best offer.
It's the one that's reallygoing to take the attention or
(23:31):
give the attention in growingthis meaningfully, and so that's
, that's a big one.
Number two there's a sale,meaning I've sold my business.
There is a sale where it's amix of cash and stock, but don't
forget, when I sell my business, I'm responsible for both the
cash and stock, and sounderstanding forget when I sell
my business, I'm responsiblefor both the cash and stock, and
(23:51):
so understanding the splits ofwhat my tax liability is.
Then there is a merger, so it'stwo companies coming together,
and if you merge, that's greatno tax but now you've got to
make sure your dance partner isactually the one we want to use.
And so all of those areconsiderations.
As you're sitting there tryingto understand, once I give up
(24:13):
control because we've merged orI've sold, I don't have the same
say I had before.
So are the individuals who aregonna be running my venture now,
even though I have cash in mypocket?
My bank account looks great.
My personal balance sheet looksamazing.
Is it the right place for mycompany?
Is the right place for mycompany?
Is the right place for myemployees?
May have been with me for 20plus years?
(24:34):
And those are allconsiderations.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Yeah, it's funny you say that I was at a Christmas
party just a couple of monthsago.
Wow, this year is alreadyflying by and this woman I was
with had sold her business andshe was a part owner in it and
it had been a private equitydeal really for all intents and
purposes, but there was a totalbuyout.
(24:57):
They had bought it out to dosome bigger plan and I was like
so excited to hear about it andI was like, oh man, I'd love to
sell my business, this businessor this project.
And she's like, oh man, I'dlove to sell my business, this
business or this project.
And she's like prepare yourself.
She's like it's not as she goes.
It's a really weird feeling.
You know this has been yourbaby, you're, you've got
(25:18):
employees in there, you've lovedand cared for and you might
benefit them financially alittle bit with some of what you
receive.
But you're going to have towalk away and feel like you've
sent your kid off to college inthe right hands.
And it was really kind of aneye-opener for me.
Speaker 3 (25:34):
On the emotional piece, you know it's a great way
of putting it, sending your kidoff to college.
So I was fortunate and sold abusiness in 2021.
And, to make a long story short, I didn't continue on after the
sale, so we sold the business.
I was the chief revenue officerNothing negative, just more.
They wanted me to move and Isaid I'm not interested in
(25:56):
moving.
So stayed on consulting a littlelonger, but after that was done
, I had spent the better part of2017 to 2021, August, hundred
hours a week growing thiscompany into the second largest
uh CBD firm in the country orthe CBD company in the country,
and like that it was gone,Meaning I'm sitting at my desk.
(26:18):
There's no email coming in.
There's no phone calls going.
Teams Isn't doing that annoyingring coming in every day, right
, there's no dinging and binging.
And I can remember making thejoke to my wife like I just
responded to an at&t upgradeemail going no, thank you.
At&t, right, sounds good, butI'm not interested.
Yeah, what else?
What else you're doing?
Yeah, what's going on, butyou're sitting there going like
(26:42):
I, it's everything I've done andit's over and you're right, my
balance sheet looks betterpersonally, but like I don't
have that purpose that I got upevery day to do.
Now, hopefully you're in aplace where you can go find new
purpose and new ventures, andthat is also something I don't
coach or mentor necessarily, butI do talk to people and say are
you prepared for what the nexthill to climb is going to be be?
(27:11):
Because if not, that's toughright.
Like you're now over with thatentire chapter and you're about
to open a new one and if youhaven't given that any
consideration, I think it's atough transition.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Wow, that's a great point.
Well, on that, maybe this is agood transitionary point when
you talk about some of thesupport you're providing people
through this process.
How can people get ahold of you?
What are you doing right now?
Where can we send people thatwould like to work with you?
What's your story've grown andsold one in 19 and two in 21.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
I help early stage companies with capital and
resources.
We have a full managementconsulting firm that we kind of,
during these formidable times,help companies grow, provide
them not only capital butresources.
Easy way to get a hold of me iseither my email, which is
cvanduzen at SlycoCapitalcom, orLinkedIn's the same thing.
Chris M Van Dusen Would love tochat.
(28:13):
I love hearing theentrepreneurial journey and
story.
It's not for the faint of heart, but I think that's maybe why I
love it.
It takes a lot of grit anddetermination to truly do the
entrepreneurial journey.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Oh, yeah, it does.
It's so exciting, so it can beso lonely and hard and every,
every emotion as an entrepreneur, which is the, the blessing and
the curse.
You know it's.
I love it, yeah, but well,chris, thank you so much for
joining us.
We'll put all that contactinformation down in the
description.
And any final word of advicefor someone that's thinking of a
(28:46):
possible exit, any final wordsof wisdom, someone that's
thinking of a possible exit.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Any final words of wisdom Buckle up.
It will be a tough challenge.
If you make it through, it willbe an amazing journey because
not that many people have theopportunity to start something.
Have.
It be a wonderful experiencefor you the good, bad, the
sideways and the ugly and thenbe able to have someone else see
so much value in it.
They want to spend anincredible amount of money and
(29:12):
try to take it to the next level.
But the buckle up part is I hada mentor of mine say once in
the sale process if you are notusing expletives with each other
, do either of you really wantto be there, which means you are
both trying to get this for thebest for each of you, pricing
(29:32):
value, all of the things, andyou will be what feels like
mortal enemies right up to thepoint where it's signed and then
you give each other a huge hugand say now the fun begins.
But it is a challenge, but it'swell worth it.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Great advice.
Well, chris, thanks again forjoining us.
We appreciate those incredibletips and pieces of advice, and
good luck to you this upcomingyear 2025.
Exciting, very exciting.
Thanks again, we'll see youaround.
Hope to have you back.
Thanks, mark, appreciate it.
Thank you you.
Welcome to the Main Street Business Podcast with
your distinguished hosts, mark JKohler and Matt Sorenson.
Both are best-selling authorsand have over 25 years of
industry experience, with 10,000client consultations, making
them the leading tax and legalexperts in the nation.
Together, they'll unpack themost complex tax, legal and
financial strategies crucial forsaving more, stressing less and
(00:23):
building generational wealth.
Today they're your personaladvisors, ready to break it down
for you and make the tax andlegal game easier than ever.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Here is Mark and Matt , welcome to another episode of
the Main Street Business Podcast.
Today I have the honor ofintroducing to you and
interviewing Chris Van Dusen, acapital growth expert.
He likes to help businessowners with a big idea raise the
capital they need to launchthat special idea and create an
(00:54):
incredible business, and he'salso helping those that have a
current business that think it'sscalable or want to exit at
some point.
He's sold several businesseshimself for millions of dollars
and has so much insideinformation and techniques on
working with business ownersthrough the private equity
process.
So I'm excited today to breakdown that process, some of the
(01:17):
definitions of terms and getsome tips from him that might
help some of you that are onyour path to an exit as well.
Well, chris, thanks for joiningus.
It is an honor to have you hereand I know a lot of business
owners are going to be reallyfind this conversation very
(01:38):
interesting.
Awesome, mark, thanks forhaving me Really excited to be
here.
Well, you've got a really neatpedigree of experience and
something that a lot of businessowners wish they had in
hindsight, because you kind ofjust don't know what you don't
know.
Maybe let's start there with,like an average business owner
says, hey, I want to sell mybusiness, or could I, should I?
(01:59):
You know how hard is it goingto be.
I know you consult with a lotof clients on the front end,
raising capital, but also on theexit.
What are some of your initialthoughts?
I mean, let's just unpack itfor a minute.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Yeah.
So it's funny.
It's almost like the questionis how long is a piece of string
right?
You don't know.
And that's what's interestingis you'll sit down and go okay,
I've got my business to a point,whether or not it needs some
efficiencies right, which mostdo right, especially if it's a
family business or somethingyou're doing and you're trying
to figure out.
Is there enterprise value here?
(02:30):
Is there something interesting?
And what's really kind of toughis depending on the business,
depends on the multiple you'regoing to get, and so what you
find is people love their babyMany times.
They've been working on thesecompanies for a very, very long
time and they might havedifferent expectations of the
(02:50):
value versus what the marketwill actually bear.
So my first thing is startlooking and are there other
companies in your market beingsold right, depending on how
much EBITDA you have?
Should it be part of a roll-upstrategy, meaning find someone
who is taking five or six orseven businesses like yours and
(03:11):
putting them into a roll-up, oris it something that there's a
strategic, you fit a certainniche in the marketplace and
there's a call it a biggercompany that would love to have
that as a service offering andfiguring out how to work at it.
But just saying I'm here, Ihave a great company, someone's
going to buy it.
Traditionally isn't the bestplace to start right.
(03:32):
It's figuring out like why wouldsomeone want this thing that
I've created?
And sure, cashflow is one thing, but usually it needs to fit
into something bigger Right andso so it's this into something
bigger right and so it's thisbalance of.
I know the industry.
I'm in well enough tounderstand who the big players
are.
Maybe you are the big player,so maybe it's the other side.
You should be acquiring moreright into your business, but
(03:54):
traditionally it's finding outin your market who's the biggest
player.
What are you doing?
They're not doing.
And figuring out how tostrategically place yourself or
with a private equity firm,who's doing other businesses
like that, where you're going toget the best multiple but also
the best home for your company,because sometimes the best
multiple on exit isn't the besthome right and you can get Now.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Hold it Now, before you keep going here.
I got to interject.
You've thrown out about 19things here, so we got to unpack
this a little.
Sure, you're throwing out termsthe average small business
owner and I'm a small businessowner.
I mean, I've only learned thesebecause I consult with so many
other business owners goingthrough this process.
Okay, let's start with one ofthe first terms you used they
(04:37):
don't know a business owner ifthey have an enterprise value.
What do you mean by enterprisevalue?
Speaker 3 (04:41):
So I look at things for is this company large enough
where it can scale?
Or is this truly a great momand pop business that puts cash
flow in the pockets of theowners, right?
And so when we look at it andagain I'm glad you mentioned it
from the front side right,providing capital for venture
(05:04):
deals, it from the front sideright, providing capital for
venture deals we look at thingsthat we call lifestyle
businesses versus ones that havetrue kind of this enterprise
growth or value.
Now, a lifestyle business,they're great businesses and not
everyone's going to like this,but my wife and I have owned a
marketing firm forever.
It's a service-based business,right, typically, you're trading
time for dollars.
(05:24):
Right, you're going in andyou're doing some work.
Maybe it's creative, maybe it'semail marketing, maybe it's
something, and it's somethingwe've had for 12 years.
That value is very differentthan if I were manufacturing a
product at scale and had amanufacturing facility hard
assets, things like that andwhat I mean by that is it's an
actual physical location thatmakes goods right.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
The way I like to describe it too is on the can
scale, or if it's an enterprisevalue, it can run without you,
correct Like you're it's goingto.
You've been able to replaceyourself, or could, very easily,
and they could take it toanother level.
That means you might havesomething special, If not, a
buyer is really just buying ajob, exactly.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
Exactly.
And so service-based businesseslike the one I mentioned,
marketing firms, not the bestexample, because once they get
to a certain size, they do havethat right.
There's no key man risk anymore.
There's no CEO, that's theleader, right, You're really
buying this machine that's beenbuilt, but with a small agency
or small service-based businessto your point.
(06:29):
you have this CEO or usuallysmall group that really are that
secret sauce, and if you removethem you remove a lot of the
value, and so they're not goingto give you what we call
multiple right.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
I have revenue.
Okay, no, that was my nextquestion.
Can you tell everybody what amultiple is?
Speaker 3 (06:44):
Sure.
So it's based on typically twodifferent factors.
It'd be revenue or EBITDA,right, and EBITDA would be an
easy way to look at it as yourprofit dollars and they're going
to say we value your businessat some multiple or your profit
times.
Some number Could be three,could be five, could be 10,
right.
Obviously, if we have a 10Xprofit business, that's a great
(07:07):
business and someone reallywants that.
When you go down into theservice-based businesses,
traditionally they're gonna havea smaller multiple.
Maybe you get 2X or 3X.
So you have a business doingtwo $3 million a year.
That's doing two $300,000 inEBITDA or profit dollars.
Maybe you're getting six$800,000 for that business.
(07:29):
That business owner might go,but wait, I love owning this
business because I get all ofthe benefits of owning the
business outside of just myprofit dollars, and so they'll
have to make a decision is thatworth it?
But maybe at 10X, 12x, it getsvery worth it for them, and so
that's where you need tounderstand the valuation you're
going to get for that businessin your own unique market.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Okay, so valuation is based on that net profit times,
this multiple, this numberthat's going to range from three
to 12, let's say based on theindustry you're in and how
strong you have as muchenterprise value as possible.
Let's define EBITDA.
You know people throw it around.
People say different ways tooEBITDA, DA, DA, I never know
(08:16):
EBITDA.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
Yeah, earnings before interest, depreciation taxes
and amortization Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Earnings before interest taxes.
Depreciation and amortizationOkay, earnings before interest
taxes, depreciation andamortization.
Which is a fancy account Likewhat do you?
Speaker 3 (08:29):
make it.
Yeah, it's a fancy way of doingaccounting right, cause you're
able to depreciate some things.
Yeah, but really it is.
What is the business making?
Speaker 2 (08:40):
a profit at the end of the day, gotcha, and don't
get me started.
Okay, now you said another coolword here, so all right,
everybody and this is this isreally helpful.
I wanted this, this show today,to be give some next steps for
someone that sees an opportunity, but also kind of as a reality
check to others that might havepie in the sky, because if
(09:03):
you're only going to get threeor four times your profit, you
might say, well, I'll just stayin the freaking business for the
next three years and make thatsame amount, and I think I could
tweak a little bit what I'veseen.
That's interesting.
Have you ever seen this where Ihave a client that's like, yeah
, yeah, I want to sell mybusiness?
And la, la la.
And I'll say, okay, we got toprepare, it's going to be at
least a year out, maybe 18months to two years.
I need you to get efficient, Ineed you to replace yourself.
(09:26):
Go hire that person, train them.
I want all the fat cut.
I don't want you to run inanything through your books.
We can add that into the taxreturn later, but other than
that, I want it tight, I want itclean, and they're like, okay,
okay, and then they come backhere later.
They're like oh my gosh, I wishI would have done that 10 years
ago.
I'm like showing up at theoffice half as much and I'm
making 20% more.
(09:47):
I don't want to sell, I'mloving my business now, right,
have you ever seen that?
Speaker 3 (09:51):
kind of experience, 100%.
Well, because if you thinkabout it as a small business
owner and we both been smallbusiness owners and we've also
been business owners that wereable to sell you're running it
very differently than you wouldif it was a huge company.
Right, you said you might beputting things through it.
Right, maybe it's your carlease, maybe it's something else
(10:12):
.
Right, you're just kind ofrunning it because it's your
business.
When you clean it up, itbecomes a lot more efficient.
On paper, the business does,maybe not what you're taking
home.
So that's the first littletweak, right?
Number two you don't realize asyou're building because a lot of
times, as founders, we're doingthe things we need to do to
solve the problems that are athand today without a 12, 18
(10:35):
month outlook.
So we're going no, I'm going tohire this person because I need
to fill this gap.
I haven't then looked at it andsaid, yeah, but in the Venn
diagram of labor I have a 50%overlap and really I just needed
to put some systems in placefor the one person, not the two,
and so you do, naturally,become more efficient.
I've seen, however, the onething that no one does to get
(10:57):
ready, aside actually doing allthe efficiency work, is having
what we call a data room.
Now, a data room is like your100% Bible for the company.
It's every contract, it's everyagreement, it is your
financials, not necessarilyhaving to be crazy audited, but
(11:17):
just everything you have to getready.
And so you have a buyer who saysman, I really like your
business.
May I check your assumptionsand validate what your business
is doing?
And they go sure, here's aQuickBooks printout.
And they're going no, no, no,no, no, no, thank you, I would
like everything about yourcompany.
And you're finding a contractwith a coffee stain on it in
(11:38):
some file folder somewhere fromtwo years ago and it just isn't
efficient.
What ends up happening is it'sa 12 to 18 months just to build
the everything that is yourcompany, to get ready to sell it
.
I look at it.
It's like the home buyingprocess right, you have all the
stuff that goes into thatprocess and it feels arduous,
(11:58):
but that's what it takes to sella company.
You can't just say yeah, no, no, trust me, it does well, you
should like it.
Here's the $2 million that wedid last year.
It's no, I want to see yourcontracts.
I want to see how defensiblethey are.
I want to see everything.
And that's the thing mostpeople don't have ready to go.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
Yeah, I'd like that selling of the house concept
because it's now doing all thoselittle things that are a little
broken.
It's looking for all the homewarranties, all the manuals for
all the appliances, what are allthe utility bills, so I can
show what utilities really are.
And is the swimming poolworking how it's supposed to,
how much is the lawn, people orwhatever, and so all those
(12:34):
little pieces that you have togather to sell your home.
It's a good three to four orfive months for an average home
seller, I would think, and for abusiness owner, I like what
you're saying at least a year totwo to really, because it's
going to affect your sales pricedramatically.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Yeah, in the real estate world, we'll call it
concessions need to be made fromthe seller.
In the business world, we callit being traded down, meaning
they offered you, on a termsheet, a certain amount of money
for your company, and then,once they get into the data room
past the term sheet, they gouh-uh, this wasn't what you said
it really was, or no, thatdoesn't work as efficiently as
(13:13):
you said, and the price goesdown and it's really hard to get
it back up right, and so it'svery similar.
You're selling an asset, aliving, breathing asset, that
has value, and so you need to beable to prove that it has the
value you've agreed upon.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
Many of my followers that listen to my show here know
in my book Financial Freedom, Ihave a whole section on
preparing to sell your businessto family, a whole other animal.
But I wanted to stick with thisprivate equity concept if I
could for a minute.
You've had so much experiencein that area.
It's a very interesting world.
So let's assume for a minuteokay, I clean up my business.
(13:52):
I've got, I'm okay, I've got itcould scale a little.
I've replaced myself, my booksare clean, I'm working my butt
off.
I'm ready to just take a break,do something new, focus on my
real estate and I think in myarea I could get a six or seven
(14:13):
multiple and maybe I've, I've.
I've eked out a million dollarsin profit this year and I did
it last year close to it.
So I think I and my books areordered.
I got my data room, you know,and so, okay, everybody you've
done all those things.
Generally you're pretty close.
And so, seven times a million,I could sell this thing for
maybe six to 7 million.
That's exciting.
It's a big payout for so manyAmericans in middle income
America.
So I try to shop it and I knowprivate equity is going to look
(14:39):
for bigger deals maybe, but youmentioned the word roll up.
What does that mean?
And I think in my experience,that's where maybe a five to $15
million sale might be a part ofa private equity roll-up.
What does that look?
Speaker 3 (14:51):
like.
So what we call it in privateequity is you'll have an
independent sponsor.
Fancy for people like us whosay, hey, you know what If we
took six businesses that allhave about this profile and we
put them together and we useshared services, right?
So the accounting is oneaccounting team, right, or the
finance teams, one legals one.
(15:13):
We have the sales team thathandles all of this, not eight,
you know, six different salesteams and we make the totality
of the business more efficient.
Our overall EBITDA profit goesup dramatically.
And now to your point.
As you started off, we have a$30, $40 million business that
we can then go sell for a highermultiple.
(15:34):
What ends up happening is, aswe move up from $2 to $3 million
in EBITDA to $5 to $10, to $15,to $20, to $25 to $30, the
value goes up tremendously.
So does your exit multiple, orwhat you're going to get from a
value perspective.
So we could sit and take fivecompanies, put them together,
(15:55):
and then now we have rolled themup into one company, right In a
holding company, with fiveindividual businesses that
become one.
And now the value, as I cleanthat up and use shared services,
becomes greater than they wereindependently.
And so that right there is whatwe call right An industry or a
(16:16):
vertical roll-up.
What typically happens and thisis what most people forget is at
first, whoever the sponsor firmis, the independent sponsor
will want the principlestraditionally to stay on.
So they will not buy 100% ofthe company, which means you as
a founder will traditionally getsome portion of the new hold
(16:37):
company.
And don't forget, privateequity makes their money by at
some point operating and sellingthese businesses at a higher
valuation.
So we have what we call thesecond bite of the apple.
So not only have I sold that $7million, but really I only got
five.
Okay, 2 million stays in, butthat 2 million might be worth 15
(16:59):
in three to five years.
So the totality of my salebecame much better and bigger,
and that's where it becomes veryinteresting in the private
equity world.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
Okay.
So let's play with someexamples.
What's interesting?
We've all probably seen it andif you're out in the HVAC, it's
kind of this unique little areawhere HVAC, solar heating, air
and conditioning is what we'rereferring to, and people doing
garage doors, kind of theseunique little service businesses
(17:31):
that can get really efficientwith teams.
I've had a couple of clientsget a purchase and a roll-up.
So let's say, in a mid-sizedcity in the US there's six to
ten of these little HVACbusinesses and they're all
making maybe a million dollars.
And these they've been careerworkers, mom and pops, and
they're making their million,they're eking it out, they're
(17:52):
getting close.
And PE, private equity comesaround and finds these seven or
eight businesses that all had amillion in profit and say, okay,
we're going to buy you out for7 million, but I'm only going to
give you five.
I'll buy you out for a hundredpercent, but 20% of yours goes
into the big pool.
And so I'm just repeating whatyou said with an example.
So seven of these HVACbusinesses sell out for a
(18:16):
million each.
Now we got a 7 million inEBITDA on year two.
But the holding company, theparent company, says all right,
guys, we got a few things toteach you, and we're going to
kind of combine a lot of theservices that you guys could be
more efficient at and just withwhat we're going to do to help
you.
Even within a year to two'stime, we can turn your seven
(18:39):
into 10 million Easy.
Then, once everybody'sefficient, let's take it to 15.
And so within.
But you got to stay on and work.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
They're like, I want it out.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we know you want it out.
We'll give you 5 million nowbut if you hang on that
remaining two, you're going toget to sell on the big game.
When we take that 15 millionand get a nine multiple on a
bigger EBITDA and you get apiece of that and they're like
you mean I'll get more at thesecond exit than the first.
Is that true?
(19:09):
Like you could really see kindof more in that second exit than
the first.
Happens, Absolutely Happens allthe time.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
I have a good friend I was actually just on a trip
with, who is about to get hissecond payment, which is
considerably larger than thefirst one.
He's ecstatic Now.
He stayed on three extra yearsAbsolutely, but it was.
It was a three years of a newprofessional team alongside of
him not having to do it byhimself, looking at growth that
(19:35):
they didn't expect to happen andgetting a really nice second
bite of the apple Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
Wow, okay.
So let's say wow guys.
Mark, chris, this is amazing.
How do I find these privateequity groups?
And do we need to explain theword investment banker?
Probably should.
Yes, where do you go next?
You're like, okay, I'm going toget lean and mean, I'm going to
get efficient.
You'd want to start arelationship with someone who
would you recommend Is aninvestment banker, explain what
(20:02):
that is, and would that be theperson you'd start talking with?
Speaker 3 (20:05):
Yeah, I mean traditionally, you're going to
have service providers in anybusiness, right.
You're going to have anaccountant, you're going to have
an relationships, right, soyou're not calling every
(20:31):
strategic or every privateequity firm.
They're going to help you getin front of the ones that
actually do these things in yourspace.
Now, most individuals, mostbusiness owners go well, doesn't
that mean that everyone's goingto have their handout, getting
fees for helping me sell mybusiness?
And the unfortunate answer is,yeah, but guess what?
They're going to get you ahigher price, right, then you
(20:54):
would have on your own.
They're going to be helping youdrive and negotiate the deal.
You want that and they're wellpaid for helping you do that.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I like it.
What you're talking about isyou mean I shouldn't just go for
sale by owner on Zillow?
If I get a good agent thatshows me how to price my home
better and how to stage it, Imight make more money even after
I pay my agent.
Get what you pay for Duh, right?
No, that's cool.
So that's a great pointeverybody needs to understand
here and I like the way youframed it.
(21:25):
Okay, mark, I'm a two tothree-year-old trajectory on
this.
I got a lot to do to clean upmy business.
I see some potential, someinefficiencies, data room, all
that.
Love it.
I start to get on that path.
Don't wait two to three yearsto then start calling someone
Call a broker lack of a betterword broker, investment banker,
a business broker they're outthere, that's a phrase.
(21:48):
And a business broker they'reout there, that's a phrase and
say, hey, I really want toprepare to sell my business.
You're not going to callprivate equity firms that are
doing roll-ups.
You're going to call a brokerthat says, help me look good,
and then they're going to takeyou to 10 private equities,
maybe Correct, and prepare youfor that process.
Would that be a fair summary ofkind of like where to go.
Speaker 3 (22:10):
Absolutely, absolutely.
Yeah, and I've know, I've been,I've been in this world for a
while.
You have as well.
Relationships are the best wayto do it right?
You're not just going to coldcall some investment bank.
Traditionally, you're going tomeet them through someone, and
again I go back to look at theother providers you have in your
network.
So attorneys and CPAs have allworked with them and you're
going to know ones that are.
They're going to know ones thatare in your space and what if I
(22:30):
may, what?
Speaker 2 (22:31):
what's the biggest risk?
Or like, what are some?
I mean, everything we'retalking about sounds incredible.
I really like sign me up, youknow, maybe, or whatever, but
what are some?
Some bad stories per se orthings to look out for that
could nip you in the butt andyou don't even know it.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
So a couple One is sometimes and it's natural we
chase the highest dollarsoffered not the best place for
my company that I've had tosucceed.
So if you're getting a fullbuyout, they want to buy and
give you that $7 million as wetalked about, and it's the
highest price and you don'tnecessarily care what happens to
(23:09):
your company afterwards.
That's a decision.
If you're going to have fiveand two is going to go into this
new company, you better makesure your new dance partner is
the one that's really going tobe able to take it to get that
second bite of the apple, thatsecond piece, and grow it
meaningfully.
Sometimes the highest offerisn't the best offer.
It's the one that's reallygoing to take the attention or
(23:31):
give the attention in growingthis meaningfully, and so that's
, that's a big one.
Number two there's a sale,meaning I've sold my business.
There is a sale where it's amix of cash and stock, but don't
forget, when I sell my business, I'm responsible for both the
cash and stock, and sounderstanding forget when I sell
my business, I'm responsiblefor both the cash and stock, and
(23:51):
so understanding the splits ofwhat my tax liability is.
Then there is a merger, so it'stwo companies coming together,
and if you merge, that's greatno tax but now you've got to
make sure your dance partner isactually the one we want to use.
And so all of those areconsiderations.
As you're sitting there tryingto understand, once I give up
(24:13):
control because we've merged orI've sold, I don't have the same
say I had before.
So are the individuals who aregonna be running my venture now,
even though I have cash in mypocket?
My bank account looks great.
My personal balance sheet looksamazing.
Is it the right place for mycompany?
Is the right place for mycompany?
Is the right place for myemployees?
May have been with me for 20plus years?
(24:34):
And those are allconsiderations.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Yeah, it's funny you say that I was at a Christmas
party just a couple of monthsago.
Wow, this year is alreadyflying by and this woman I was
with had sold her business andshe was a part owner in it and
it had been a private equitydeal really for all intents and
purposes, but there was a totalbuyout.
(24:57):
They had bought it out to dosome bigger plan and I was like
so excited to hear about it andI was like, oh man, I'd love to
sell my business, this businessor this project.
And she's like, oh man, I'dlove to sell my business, this
business or this project.
And she's like prepare yourself.
She's like it's not as she goes.
It's a really weird feeling.
You know this has been yourbaby, you're, you've got
(25:18):
employees in there, you've lovedand cared for and you might
benefit them financially alittle bit with some of what you
receive.
But you're going to have towalk away and feel like you've
sent your kid off to college inthe right hands.
And it was really kind of aneye-opener for me.
Speaker 3 (25:34):
On the emotional piece, you know it's a great way
of putting it, sending your kidoff to college.
So I was fortunate and sold abusiness in 2021.
And, to make a long story short, I didn't continue on after the
sale, so we sold the business.
I was the chief revenue officerNothing negative, just more.
They wanted me to move and Isaid I'm not interested in
(25:56):
moving.
So stayed on consulting a littlelonger, but after that was done
, I had spent the better part of2017 to 2021, August, hundred
hours a week growing thiscompany into the second largest
uh CBD firm in the country orthe CBD company in the country,
and like that it was gone,Meaning I'm sitting at my desk.
(26:18):
There's no email coming in.
There's no phone calls going.
Teams Isn't doing that annoyingring coming in every day, right
, there's no dinging and binging.
And I can remember making thejoke to my wife like I just
responded to an at&t upgradeemail going no, thank you.
At&t, right, sounds good, butI'm not interested.
Yeah, what else?
What else you're doing?
Yeah, what's going on, butyou're sitting there going like
(26:42):
I, it's everything I've done andit's over and you're right, my
balance sheet looks betterpersonally, but like I don't
have that purpose that I got upevery day to do.
Now, hopefully you're in aplace where you can go find new
purpose and new ventures, andthat is also something I don't
coach or mentor necessarily, butI do talk to people and say are
you prepared for what the nexthill to climb is going to be be?
(27:11):
Because if not, that's toughright.
Like you're now over with thatentire chapter and you're about
to open a new one and if youhaven't given that any
consideration, I think it's atough transition.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Wow, that's a great point.
Well, on that, maybe this is agood transitionary point when
you talk about some of thesupport you're providing people
through this process.
How can people get ahold of you?
What are you doing right now?
Where can we send people thatwould like to work with you?
What's your story've grown andsold one in 19 and two in 21.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
I help early stage companies with capital and
resources.
We have a full managementconsulting firm that we kind of,
during these formidable times,help companies grow, provide
them not only capital butresources.
Easy way to get a hold of me iseither my email, which is
cvanduzen at SlycoCapitalcom, orLinkedIn's the same thing.
Chris M Van Dusen Would love tochat.
(28:13):
I love hearing theentrepreneurial journey and
story.
It's not for the faint of heart, but I think that's maybe why I
love it.
It takes a lot of grit anddetermination to truly do the
entrepreneurial journey.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Oh, yeah, it does.
It's so exciting, so it can beso lonely and hard and every,
every emotion as an entrepreneur, which is the, the blessing and
the curse.
You know it's.
I love it, yeah, but well,chris, thank you so much for
joining us.
We'll put all that contactinformation down in the
description.
And any final word of advicefor someone that's thinking of a
(28:46):
possible exit, any final wordsof wisdom, someone that's
thinking of a possible exit.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Any final words of wisdom Buckle up.
It will be a tough challenge.
If you make it through, it willbe an amazing journey because
not that many people have theopportunity to start something.
Have.
It be a wonderful experiencefor you the good, bad, the
sideways and the ugly and thenbe able to have someone else see
so much value in it.
They want to spend anincredible amount of money and
(29:12):
try to take it to the next level.
But the buckle up part is I hada mentor of mine say once in
the sale process if you are notusing expletives with each other
, do either of you really wantto be there, which means you are
both trying to get this for thebest for each of you, pricing
(29:32):
value, all of the things, andyou will be what feels like
mortal enemies right up to thepoint where it's signed and then
you give each other a huge hugand say now the fun begins.
But it is a challenge, but it'swell worth it.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Great advice.
Well, chris, thanks again forjoining us.
We appreciate those incredibletips and pieces of advice, and
good luck to you this upcomingyear 2025.
Exciting, very exciting.
Thanks again, we'll see youaround.
Hope to have you back.
Thanks, mark, appreciate it.
Thank you you.
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