June 22, 2024 • 28 mins
Learn more about Parable Group at https://www.parablegroup.com
Learn more about the Echo Prayer App at https://www.echoprayer.com
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Hey guys, welcome to another episode of Modern Church
Leader here with my new bud,greg, who actually has taken
over as CEO of the Parable Group.
But you've been doing it for awhile now.
You're six years in and we'regoing to talk a lot about kind
of that journey and the newprayer app that you guys have
and, you know, have a good timetoday.
So welcome to the show, greg.
Sounds good, frank.
(00:26):
Yeah, glad to be here with youtoday.
Yeah, it's going to be fun.
It's going to be fun.
Where are you coming to us from?
San Luis Obispo, california.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Oh, I mean.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
I'm in San Diego, we're right next to each other.
We should have done this livein person.
So good, so good.
Well, man, parable Group hasbeen around for a long time.
We're going to talk a lot aboutprayer and everything, but I'd
love to get you know, give ourlisteners kind of your
background and how you gotconnected with you know doing
(00:56):
business in the church.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Yeah sure, so Parable Group was founded by a guy
named Steve Potratz in the 80swith a mission to serve
Christian publishers andChristian retailers.
So that was in a day of lots ofChristian bookstores in the 80s
and 90s, and so what hascontinued on over 30 plus years
is this mission to get the rightmessage to the right person at
(01:20):
the right time to draw peoplecloser to Christ.
So when I met Steve over adecade ago in this area Central
Coast, California where ParableGroups operated all this time,
it became clear that I was insimilar spaces of local retail,
digital marketing, a little bitof software and tech, and that
(01:42):
perhaps there would be a daywhere Steve would need to move
on.
He was 70 at the time that Itook on parable group and that I
may be looking for a kingdombusiness or some way with which
to weave business and missiontogether.
So that's kind of how I was ona journey through college and
early career of you know,ministry and mission and how
(02:03):
does, how, do you weave kingdomprinciples into running an
operating business, and so stillon that journey.
But it's an area of passion andinterest.
But yeah, Parable Group is mymain work and our mission is to
serve Christian organizations tospread their message, their
story, their content, whetherthat's an author with a book or
(02:26):
a church tech forum.
That's reaching pastors, reallywith an aim to strengthen what
they're doing and better telltheir story.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
So we're still doing that today.
How did you and Steve meet?
Speaker 1 (02:38):
We actually met at a global leadership summit hosted
locally in California around2012,.
Summit hosted locally inCalifornia around 2012, you know
and we went to lunch and got toknow each other.
And six years later, we satdown again for lunch and I said,
hey, I'm in this software techthing.
It's going to get bought outagain, just like the last one.
(02:58):
I was in.
I think I want to do somethingdifferent.
And he said, well, I'm lookingfor someone.
And I said I want to dosomething different.
And he said, well, I'm lookingfor someone.
And I said, well, I'm lookingfor something that has a kingdom
dimension to business and 2018,he transitioned out and I was
in.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Yeah, yeah, that's cool.
So you, you kind of bought thebusiness from him, took it over
and what, uh, what did you seein the business, like, what did
you see in Parable Group thatyou were excited about?
Speaker 1 (03:35):
Yeah, just first of all, an amazing team with people
that really love what we do,which is to work with local
retailers and publishers and towork with Christian ministries.
And then there's just thatheartbeat for marketing.
I love getting the rightmessage to the right person at
the right time, and you know,modern marketing is very
technical All the analyticsrequired to do it right, measure
it, help a client get resultsRight, and then just that I mean
(03:56):
there's like, there's a culture, a heartbeat of love for the
customer, love for the product,love for the mission, and that's
something that over time I Idon't think I realized how
important and valuable that isthat ethos, and I was very
fortunate to inherit a veryhealthy ethos and a commitment
of a team.
My leadership team is still inplace with all of those, all of
(04:17):
the team been with Parable Groupfor more than a decade, some of
them 25 plus years, so it's areally, really amazing team that
has been assembled that Ireceived the benefit of and you
know now my role is to kind ofadapt and shift and change for
where we've been and what thefuture may hold Right.
All right.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Can you, can you, give like a real concrete
example of the kind of work youguys do like work with and what
kind of digital things you dowith them?
Speaker 1 (04:45):
yeah.
So a client might come to usand say, hey, we have um.
We have a goal to grow ouraudience and we have 5 000 email
subscribers and we um.
It's our aim to bring thesechristian resources to these
audiences.
And who might be?
Speaker 2 (05:01):
like?
Who would give us like, a like?
What kind of entity would cometo you with their 5 000
subscribers?
Speaker 1 (05:09):
yeah.
So we have um, a guy named roygoble who's an author.
He came to us with the goal togrow his audience and he reaches
um christians who areinterested in growing in
generosity.
Um, we've done some bookmarketing for, uh, with Prayer.
So this book here.
There are some really greatfriends Ryan, peter and Cameron
(05:30):
with this goal to take this bookand bless the church with the
intersection of prayer andleadership, and so it is a lot
of book marketing.
We serve some church techplatforms like Planning Center,
pushpay.
Fively, those types oforganizations who want to reach
(05:50):
church leaders.
But the specific way that we dothat is often leading with
value-add content and oftenthrough email marketing, social
media.
So if we can get somebody on,say, an Instagram promoted post
that would say 10 ways toincrease generosity in your
(06:10):
church, that would be.
To do that requires thoughtfultargeting, thoughtful messaging,
thoughtful design and if thatleads to a landing page, it's
going to give that person valueand we'd say, yeah, download, I
want that content, here's myemail, send it to me.
(06:31):
And the specific, I guess, kindof unique value we bring to that
experience is um is, can youreally measure the dollars going
in and then the results comingout Right.
Very easy in marketing to kindof spend a lot and not really
know what's working and what'snot.
Um, obviously, with digitalmarketing and the ability to use
audience targeting, you cantrack all the way through.
You can say, okay, well, to geta lead would be worth this
(06:56):
amount to me, and if I can put abudget that would be very
targeted and very measurable,then we can help guys like Roy
and some other authors that wework directly to say, okay, for
X dollars, we can grow thisaudience, which we then have
other means with which to createvalue, whether that be through
more books that we'll write orcourses that we'll launch.
(07:21):
So one course we work with isthe journey course.
Um, it's a um, beautiful set ofcontent around sexual addiction
and helping us go through, uh,understanding of that, either
for ourselves or for someonewe're working closely with.
So there's there's manyorganizations and individuals
like that that created somethingand I just I want to get the
(07:43):
word out I need help doing itand I don't have a full
marketing team.
Can you help?
That's where, where we love tojump in.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
I love that Super cool Um.
So then I guess you showed theprayer book.
Um, I know that's a currentthing that you guys are doing
too, but you also.
So you jump into parable group.
You're doing your thing for thelast six years and then you
decided to go off and acquireanother piece of tech
specifically around prayer and aprayer app.
So I mean, tell us like it'sfascinating to me, right, like
(08:19):
your digital marketing for kindof ministries, authors, those
kinds of things.
And then you jump into, hey,we're going to add a prayer app
into our arsenal.
So talk through that like what,what was that dream like?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Yeah, there's this, uh, there's this book and this
visual that really helped usabout three or four years ago
called lead from the future, andif you can imagine kind of a
you know um upper right quadrant, um constellation diagram of
what's in your kind of near termorbit and what's in your in
your further you know orbit outin the future, and one of those
things we drew on a board in astrategic session was some form
(08:50):
of faith tech like an app orsome digital platform that would
serve the church, that wouldhave an audience of people who
are hungry to grow in theirfaith, and something that we
could steward as an organization, and at the time we didn't have
specific ideas of what thatwould be.
So that was a seed that then ledus to work with this team at
(09:14):
Echo Prayer so Echo is the nameof the prayer app.
It was built in 2015.
So it's been around almost 10years and it had been launched
and done quite well without alot of activity or investment or
really marketing behind it, andso we came alongside them a few
years ago and helped thefounders do a little bit of
(09:34):
marketing and grow theiraudience and also serve their
audience with some content andrecommended books around, prayer
and that sort of thing, andthey came to the end of their
time saying, hey, we're notreally able to run this anymore,
We've moved on to other thingsand we had the opportunity to
add it to our suite of products.
(09:55):
And so for Parable Group, it isa new thing to be running a
mobile technology, but it's notnew to be serving an audience or
to be working in relationshipwith churches and Christian
ministries.
But part of what we're nowdoing, after almost two years of
stewarding this app, is toassess what is it and how is it
(10:18):
blessing people and how could itbless more people and help more
organizations prioritize prayer.
So it's a it's an extension ofparable groups mission and
something that we're excitedabout and excited to share.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Yeah, yeah, what?
What is it like?
What is a prayer app or like inthe Christian context, right
Like, or in a normal church.
It's like you have like in mychurch, right you, you walk in
and over to the left is kind ofthe you know, request prayer,
like submit prayer.
Kind of like there's an arearight and like literally you go
(10:54):
over there and you can likewrite down your prayer requests
and put them in the box and thenyou know the pastoral staff is
going to grab those and and havethe prayer list.
And now we have some tech, butnothing too sophisticated, but
it's like that's the prayer listright there.
It's people submitting prayersinto a box and then pastoral
(11:15):
staff prays.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Yeah, so there's a process there.
Whether it's documented anddigital or not, there's a
process, right, there's an inputpoint, physical card, then
those get organized somewhereand somebody probably types them
out, emails them out.
But the way that that's lackingis do you get notified if
(11:43):
someone prayed for you, maybe?
Maybe the pastor reaches out ifit's some acute.
You know, I have a surgery at10 am on Wednesday, you know,
does someone call you onThursday, ask out when?
Often, yes, um, but then howwould the, how would you get
updates Right, other than, oh,do we have Frank's cell phone?
Can we email him?
(12:03):
Who is this person?
So what if that person?
What if you could actuallyprovide an update via some
channel?
So so I'll just kind of back upand say, well, what is a prayer
app and how does echo prayerkind of fit into the landscape
of apps?
There are many apps that are outthere that do lots of things.
I would say that echo prayer isspecifically a tool to help
(12:28):
individuals manage their prayerlists and to set reminders to
pray.
Other apps have a lot morecontent that like abide and
hallow and praycom.
They're a lot more contentforward, meaning they have lots
of recommended guides and peoplethat provide the contents,
often some voiceovers that allowyou to kind of enter into a
(12:52):
meditative experience with theLord really helpful.
Echo has built some text-basedguided prayers into the app
experience.
But really the goal is toprovide a place for you to kind
of have that conversation with afriend on Sunday morning and
tell them about that surgery onWednesday and say, yeah, I'll
pray for you, but do we and dowe remember and how can we, you
(13:13):
know, be a little more organizedaround that?
So the kind of person that'sreally drawn to this app is
someone that does like lists anddoes like to track things and
likes to keep things in oneplace, and so Echo is a free app
for people to download andbegin tracking prayers and
getting into also a focusedprayer experience.
(13:35):
So we have this button calledPray Now and it kind of takes
over the screen and you canswipe through the different
cards.
That for me it's like my fourkids each have a card and my
staff each have a card and uh,the different uh verses.
There's a verse that you knowcame to mind and I'll just paste
it in and you know, have thatbe in the flow of the thing that
I want to be reminded of Right,um.
(13:57):
But then where there's more ishow do you turn that into a
shared experience?
And that's really what EchoPlus is and that has been around
for some five years.
But what we did this past yearis expanded it and made a lot
more robust to help Christianministries better organize their
prayer requests.
Right, right, right.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
Yeah, no, I mean, it makes sense.
It's like tithely giving was away to take the you know,
physical giving in a basket andmake it digital.
And this is kind of makingprayer digital and putting it on
your phone so that you can haveyour prayer list and be
reminded about it.
I mean super simple, but foreveryone who's on their phone.
You have it with you all thetime and your notebook doesn't
(14:37):
remind you, so you know yourphone will.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
Right, well, and like I said, every church has this
Christian ministry thatprioritizes prayer.
Every Christian school, everyChristian led business has some
way to have people submit prayerrequests.
Right, it could be a WhatsAppgroup, it could be a text thread
, it could be an email list, itcould be paper, right, you know?
Speaker 2 (15:00):
and so we have Slack, so we have a whole prayer
channel and people post hey,whatever surgery or someone
passed away or whatever it is,and so people, the whole company
has the prayer channel andthere's a meeting that happens
once a week that people can kindof jump into.
So it's just done in Slack forus right now.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
But there you go.
It's a system that was designedusing software to create a
little bit more interaction, andthat's what Echo aims to be is
a kind of best-in-class prayermanagement system for
organizations that say, yeah, wereally want to embrace prayer
and weave it through ourorganization, embrace prayer and
(15:43):
weave it through ourorganization.
So let's create an input pointwhere we have a web form where
people can say hi, I'm Frank,here's what's going on.
You can mark it as anonymous ifit is super private thing, and
then there's tools to either getthat to a staff team or an
elder leadership team or it canactually go into a church's feed
that gets shared with anintercessor team.
And then the other thing we cando is like small groups.
(16:07):
Right, you're sitting around asmall group of 10 people and
there's some text group youmight be using, but is there one
place where we can list thosethings?
And then, when I'm praying forFrank a few days after our small
group, he can get anotification that that Greg's
been praying for him throughoutthe week and and chatter back
and forth about it.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Yeah, yeah, what.
What's been since you?
I mean, you've been connectedwith Echo for a while.
You guys have kind of taken itover over the last couple of
years.
What?
Where have you seen it, youknow, taking off?
You know, like, where are youseeing it?
Kind of like people, really,you know, enjoying the product.
Is it like in churches?
(16:45):
Is it in ministries, Likewhere's the signs of life?
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Yeah, yeah, small to medium sized churches that are
really wanting to prioritizeprayer.
We get such great feedback fromthose pastors who are like we
get such great feedback fromthose pastors who are like I'm
so glad I have this.
I mean, even a small church of50 people, they all just join
the group Right, so let's haveour prayer group and everybody
(17:10):
in the church is in there, andso churches are a really strong
user base.
We've got several thousandchurches that are using it.
No-transcript.
(17:47):
We're having an outreachtomorrow.
Would you pray for us?
You know they can post thatprayer and if I'm either
following that feed through theapp or I get emailed those
requests through echo, becausewe added the prayers and then we
click send email and it goes toall the followers, um, then
they can be alerted and then caninteract and chatter back and
(18:07):
hear the updates and followalong, so that churches and
missionaries are a real stronguse case.
A lot of small groups and we'vehad a bunch of christian
schools and then even like afaith-led business, I use it to
share with my advisors what'sgoing on with things that I'm
working on and ways that I needspecific prayer.
So I've been I've seen it useda lot of different ways, and
(18:31):
that's kind of a sign of aflexible platform is people
configuring it for different usecases, some of which you design
for and others of which kind ofget discovered.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Right, yeah, no, I love that.
Where do you.
Where do you go?
Like?
It sounds so basic on one hand,right, like you know, app-based
prayer list, but it's got abunch of like connectivity and
flexibility and it's, you know,bringing the communities
together and groups, smallgroups and churches and all that
.
So, like, where do you go now?
(19:02):
Like, how do you keep improvingthe tried and true you know
prayer list and making it betterin the digital age?
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Yeah well, that's a great question of kind of where
this is going and headed.
We really want to listen tocustomer and understand, you
know, we believe we're solving aparticular problem, like we
talk about the process, right,how is prayer submitted, how is
prayer received, organized, sent, syndicated, and then how do
you create the feedback loops?
So, with that as kind of aprimary problem solve, I think
(19:31):
philosophically, one of thequestions we're asking about an
app is whether it should be a, aspecial purpose tool for a
particular, you know, needprayer and prayer organization,
right, you know.
And or is there?
There's a role for the superapp, like the, the U version app
is a super app, right, it'll domany things, and so and I'm
(19:54):
sure you guys have thought aboutthis, you know, from a product
perspective with Tidely, is whatis it?
Do you want to create thesespecialized apps for specialized
purpose that don't have a lotof noise?
Or is the weaving of contentwhere there are these guide,
more guided prayer experiences?
Is that really what thecustomers want, right?
(20:15):
And I think so.
That's a big strategic questionfor us as we kind of look at
the other apps and see, you know, what's the engagement in that
content and is there a role fora very specialized tool like
this?
Um, and that's where I'd say ourcurrent thesis is.
But with a lot of ourrelationships with Christian
publishers and ministries,there's lots of desire to
(20:38):
provide content.
Right now, we're doing a lot ofthat more through kind of email
marketing and communicationwith our users outside of the
app experience so that thereisn't noise, and I think that's
the approach that we believe wewant to take with prayer is that
(20:58):
you're using this digitaldevice that is known for being
the distraction demon.
It's the thing that is keepingus from praying because I just
am scrolling and spending toomuch time doing other things.
But can it be redeemed and canwe actually have tech to help us
to be to not get alerted of allthe things happening all day
(21:19):
long, but actually be remindedto pray at 10 o'clock for my
daughter and at 11 o'clock formy son and actually have the
tech help me be a more prayerfulperson and abide with Jesus
throughout the whole day?
Can the tool do that?
And I think that's that's whatwe're looking to really nail and
to do that as best as we can.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Yeah, how's the Echo Plus portion Cause that's like
the premium feature set, thepaid part of the product.
Like are you finding people arereally interested in those like
the community aspects of it andeverything?
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Yeah, our subscriber base is growing, so Echo Plus
really has two tiers to it.
So Echo Plus has been aroundfor some years.
It's $15 a year, available inGoogle and Apple stores, and
what that allows you to do is tocreate a group or create a feed
.
So think a missionary use casea small group, a family you know
(22:19):
, or even a small church coulduse the tool and upgrade.
And if one person upgrades,everybody benefits, right,
everybody gets the free app andcan join the groups and follow
the feeds.
So that's Echo Plus and that'sbeen going well and we're sort
of improving how peopleexperience that.
One big addition we made thispast year was to add a web app.
(22:41):
So it was mobile app only, soyou're typing with your thumbs
and if you have high volumes ofprayers that gets really hard.
So that was a big change andaddition we made and we're
getting great feedback from ourEcho Plus users who have been
asking for this for a long time.
And then Echo Plus forMinistries is the product that
(23:02):
serves churches and ministryorganizations and faith-led
businesses and that has a 30-daytrial and it's a $300 a year
subscription that gets access toa whole robust set of tools,
including the prayer submissionform and a way with which to
send out prayer requests throughemail and such, and all the web
(23:23):
dashboard and tools.
So so that's going quite well.
That actually just launched amonth ago.
We did a private beta in thespring and it's going great.
We're having people sign up andget through their 30-day trial,
and that's all happening now.
So we're just wanting to spreadthe word and our goal is that
thousands of organizations woulduse this and be blessed by it,
(23:46):
and now we can continue to serveorganizations this way, yeah,
yeah, I mean that's super cool.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
I mean going from kind of an agency into a
software business.
I mean you, it sounds like youhad some kind of background in
all of that, but it's a bigshift right.
And now you're out there likeshipping product.
What is the?
What does the team look like onthe tech side of things?
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Yeah, so Parable Group is a bunch of technical
marketers and so while we dosome work in retail, like we
talked about, it's a verytechnical driven team.
We have software, we haveretail analytics, we hook in
with point of sale data, so wehave a pretty strong tech and
data background.
(24:28):
And then our digital agencydoing all the tracking and
monitoring actually requirespretty strong engineering
experience and aptitude.
So that's it's a really funworking with marketers that have
the right brain, creative andtechnical teams that have the
left brain, science and weavingthose two too.
(24:56):
So Echo, as a technical productthat's to be marketed,
certainly fits in our ecosystem.
Running mobile app technology isthe new space and we've been
able to work with some teamsactually out of Romania who are
bivocational missionaries andwe've been able to benefit from
their work and their support tohelp with some of that mobile
tech.
Yeah, that's true, but yeah,we're on a journey around you
(25:18):
know Parable Group running thesedifferent things and
determining how do we stewardthis app into the future and
perhaps add to running more appsor just finding ways we can
serve and bless more people.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Yeah, I love that so good.
Or just finding ways we canserve and bless more people?
Yeah, I love that so good.
Where is it?
Just people go look up EchoPrayer on the App Store and they
can go check it out.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
Yeah, Echo Prayer can be found in Google and Apple.
Echoprayercom is our websitethat explains all the different
features and such I downloadedit today.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
This morning I was checking it out, so I got my
first prayer in there, um, but Igot to go check out the echo
plus portion of it.
Um, but it seems super cool.
Um, is there any like newfeature sets that you're
dreaming up right now that youthink you're going to lean into
soon?
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Yeah, so one of the new things that we've built that
is, as these users of the newstuff uh begin to use it is the
ability to share out prayerrequests in batches.
And so think of you know, alarge organization that may
receive, like a Christian radiostation or a large church or a
ministry.
That's global.
They receive maybe hundreds ofprayer requests at a time and
(26:29):
then they have hundreds ofintercessors.
So the problem we've tried tosolve there is that not everyone
needs everything, because canone individual pray for hundreds
of prayer requests, right,right?
So we actually created abatching system that is working
and ready but just hasn't had alot of activity yet, because we
just launched it and it's partof the new features, yeah, so
(26:49):
I'll be really curious to seehow that solves some of those
higher volume environments where, you know, you just think, if
I'm a user, I'm on your emaillist, I say I want to pray and
we get, you know, hundreds ofprayer requests, but then I'm
actually going to get five or 10that come to me and I get an
email that says, hey, yourprayer requests are ready.
(27:11):
You know, would you join us andpray?
Pray now, right, and you don'teven need the app.
You can just open it up in abrowser URL so that way people
who are following you are partof your prayer ministry.
You know they don't have tohave the app, they can just
click a link and they can openup and they can get in this
prayer experience and swipethrough their 10 cards and then
(27:35):
Frank gets notified that someperson prayed for them.
Right, and it kind of protected, anonymized kind of way, but
still super interesting tocreate these tools and see how
they get adopted and used.
So I'll be really excited tosee that leveraged in some
really creative ways, yeah yeah,totally yeah, totally yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
It's cool, man.
Well, greg, this has been greatand thanks for coming on and
kind of sharing what you guysare up to and and even your
journey into parable group.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
It's great to get to know you and kind of what you've
been up to for the last sixyears uh, helping to build a
great kingdom business the timeand appreciate all the questions
and the passion and love whatyou guys are doing at tithely
and serving so many churches umthinking about the modernization
of all kinds of things.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
Oh yeah, I mean great work.
Church tech is a blast.
Where should folks go?
Speaker 1 (28:24):
do you want to go check out the echo app or go to
parable group, like uh, tellfolks where to where to head
next yeah, echo prayer dot comif you're interested in learning
about modernizing the prayerchain, or use an app for your
personal or for yourorganization, echo prayercom.
Start there.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
Let's go Love it Awesome.
Thanks, Greg.
Thanks guys for listening.
Definitely check out echoprayer and we'll catch you next
week on another episode ofmodern church leader.
See ya.
Hey guys, welcome to another episode of Modern Church
Leader here with my new bud,greg, who actually has taken
over as CEO of the Parable Group.
But you've been doing it for awhile now.
You're six years in and we'regoing to talk a lot about kind
of that journey and the newprayer app that you guys have
and, you know, have a good timetoday.
So welcome to the show, greg.
Sounds good, frank.
(00:26):
Yeah, glad to be here with youtoday.
Yeah, it's going to be fun.
It's going to be fun.
Where are you coming to us from?
San Luis Obispo, california.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Oh, I mean.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
I'm in San Diego, we're right next to each other.
We should have done this livein person.
So good, so good.
Well, man, parable Group hasbeen around for a long time.
We're going to talk a lot aboutprayer and everything, but I'd
love to get you know, give ourlisteners kind of your
background and how you gotconnected with you know doing
(00:56):
business in the church.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Yeah sure, so Parable Group was founded by a guy
named Steve Potratz in the 80swith a mission to serve
Christian publishers andChristian retailers.
So that was in a day of lots ofChristian bookstores in the 80s
and 90s, and so what hascontinued on over 30 plus years
is this mission to get the rightmessage to the right person at
(01:20):
the right time to draw peoplecloser to Christ.
So when I met Steve over adecade ago in this area Central
Coast, California where ParableGroups operated all this time,
it became clear that I was insimilar spaces of local retail,
digital marketing, a little bitof software and tech, and that
(01:42):
perhaps there would be a daywhere Steve would need to move
on.
He was 70 at the time that Itook on parable group and that I
may be looking for a kingdombusiness or some way with which
to weave business and missiontogether.
So that's kind of how I was ona journey through college and
early career of you know,ministry and mission and how
(02:03):
does, how, do you weave kingdomprinciples into running an
operating business, and so stillon that journey.
But it's an area of passion andinterest.
But yeah, Parable Group is mymain work and our mission is to
serve Christian organizations tospread their message, their
story, their content, whetherthat's an author with a book or
(02:26):
a church tech forum.
That's reaching pastors, reallywith an aim to strengthen what
they're doing and better telltheir story.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
So we're still doing that today.
How did you and Steve meet?
Speaker 1 (02:38):
We actually met at a global leadership summit hosted
locally in California around2012,.
Summit hosted locally inCalifornia around 2012, you know
and we went to lunch and got toknow each other.
And six years later, we satdown again for lunch and I said,
hey, I'm in this software techthing.
It's going to get bought outagain, just like the last one.
(02:58):
I was in.
I think I want to do somethingdifferent.
And he said, well, I'm lookingfor someone.
And I said I want to dosomething different.
And he said, well, I'm lookingfor someone.
And I said, well, I'm lookingfor something that has a kingdom
dimension to business and 2018,he transitioned out and I was
in.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Yeah, yeah, that's cool.
So you, you kind of bought thebusiness from him, took it over
and what, uh, what did you seein the business, like, what did
you see in Parable Group thatyou were excited about?
Speaker 1 (03:35):
Yeah, just first of all, an amazing team with people
that really love what we do,which is to work with local
retailers and publishers and towork with Christian ministries.
And then there's just thatheartbeat for marketing.
I love getting the rightmessage to the right person at
the right time, and you know,modern marketing is very
technical All the analyticsrequired to do it right, measure
it, help a client get resultsRight, and then just that I mean
(03:56):
there's like, there's a culture, a heartbeat of love for the
customer, love for the product,love for the mission, and that's
something that over time I Idon't think I realized how
important and valuable that isthat ethos, and I was very
fortunate to inherit a veryhealthy ethos and a commitment
of a team.
My leadership team is still inplace with all of those, all of
(04:17):
the team been with Parable Groupfor more than a decade, some of
them 25 plus years, so it's areally, really amazing team that
has been assembled that Ireceived the benefit of and you
know now my role is to kind ofadapt and shift and change for
where we've been and what thefuture may hold Right.
All right.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Can you, can you, give like a real concrete
example of the kind of work youguys do like work with and what
kind of digital things you dowith them?
Speaker 1 (04:45):
yeah.
So a client might come to usand say, hey, we have um.
We have a goal to grow ouraudience and we have 5 000 email
subscribers and we um.
It's our aim to bring thesechristian resources to these
audiences.
And who might be?
Speaker 2 (05:01):
like?
Who would give us like, a like?
What kind of entity would cometo you with their 5 000
subscribers?
Speaker 1 (05:09):
yeah.
So we have um, a guy named roygoble who's an author.
He came to us with the goal togrow his audience and he reaches
um christians who areinterested in growing in
generosity.
Um, we've done some bookmarketing for, uh, with Prayer.
So this book here.
There are some really greatfriends Ryan, peter and Cameron
(05:30):
with this goal to take this bookand bless the church with the
intersection of prayer andleadership, and so it is a lot
of book marketing.
We serve some church techplatforms like Planning Center,
pushpay.
Fively, those types oforganizations who want to reach
(05:50):
church leaders.
But the specific way that we dothat is often leading with
value-add content and oftenthrough email marketing, social
media.
So if we can get somebody on,say, an Instagram promoted post
that would say 10 ways toincrease generosity in your
(06:10):
church, that would be.
To do that requires thoughtfultargeting, thoughtful messaging,
thoughtful design and if thatleads to a landing page, it's
going to give that person valueand we'd say, yeah, download, I
want that content, here's myemail, send it to me.
(06:31):
And the specific, I guess, kindof unique value we bring to that
experience is um is, can youreally measure the dollars going
in and then the results comingout Right.
Very easy in marketing to kindof spend a lot and not really
know what's working and what'snot.
Um, obviously, with digitalmarketing and the ability to use
audience targeting, you cantrack all the way through.
You can say, okay, well, to geta lead would be worth this
(06:56):
amount to me, and if I can put abudget that would be very
targeted and very measurable,then we can help guys like Roy
and some other authors that wework directly to say, okay, for
X dollars, we can grow thisaudience, which we then have
other means with which to createvalue, whether that be through
more books that we'll write orcourses that we'll launch.
(07:21):
So one course we work with isthe journey course.
Um, it's a um, beautiful set ofcontent around sexual addiction
and helping us go through, uh,understanding of that, either
for ourselves or for someonewe're working closely with.
So there's there's manyorganizations and individuals
like that that created somethingand I just I want to get the
(07:43):
word out I need help doing itand I don't have a full
marketing team.
Can you help?
That's where, where we love tojump in.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
I love that Super cool Um.
So then I guess you showed theprayer book.
Um, I know that's a currentthing that you guys are doing
too, but you also.
So you jump into parable group.
You're doing your thing for thelast six years and then you
decided to go off and acquireanother piece of tech
specifically around prayer and aprayer app.
So I mean, tell us like it'sfascinating to me, right, like
(08:19):
your digital marketing for kindof ministries, authors, those
kinds of things.
And then you jump into, hey,we're going to add a prayer app
into our arsenal.
So talk through that like what,what was that dream like?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Yeah, there's this, uh, there's this book and this
visual that really helped usabout three or four years ago
called lead from the future, andif you can imagine kind of a
you know um upper right quadrant, um constellation diagram of
what's in your kind of near termorbit and what's in your in
your further you know orbit outin the future, and one of those
things we drew on a board in astrategic session was some form
(08:50):
of faith tech like an app orsome digital platform that would
serve the church, that wouldhave an audience of people who
are hungry to grow in theirfaith, and something that we
could steward as an organization, and at the time we didn't have
specific ideas of what thatwould be.
So that was a seed that then ledus to work with this team at
(09:14):
Echo Prayer so Echo is the nameof the prayer app.
It was built in 2015.
So it's been around almost 10years and it had been launched
and done quite well without alot of activity or investment or
really marketing behind it, andso we came alongside them a few
years ago and helped thefounders do a little bit of
(09:34):
marketing and grow theiraudience and also serve their
audience with some content andrecommended books around, prayer
and that sort of thing, andthey came to the end of their
time saying, hey, we're notreally able to run this anymore,
We've moved on to other thingsand we had the opportunity to
add it to our suite of products.
(09:55):
And so for Parable Group, it isa new thing to be running a
mobile technology, but it's notnew to be serving an audience or
to be working in relationshipwith churches and Christian
ministries.
But part of what we're nowdoing, after almost two years of
stewarding this app, is toassess what is it and how is it
(10:18):
blessing people and how could itbless more people and help more
organizations prioritize prayer.
So it's a it's an extension ofparable groups mission and
something that we're excitedabout and excited to share.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Yeah, yeah, what?
What is it like?
What is a prayer app or like inthe Christian context, right
Like, or in a normal church.
It's like you have like in mychurch, right you, you walk in
and over to the left is kind ofthe you know, request prayer,
like submit prayer.
Kind of like there's an arearight and like literally you go
(10:54):
over there and you can likewrite down your prayer requests
and put them in the box and thenyou know the pastoral staff is
going to grab those and and havethe prayer list.
And now we have some tech, butnothing too sophisticated, but
it's like that's the prayer listright there.
It's people submitting prayersinto a box and then pastoral
(11:15):
staff prays.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Yeah, so there's a process there.
Whether it's documented anddigital or not, there's a
process, right, there's an inputpoint, physical card, then
those get organized somewhereand somebody probably types them
out, emails them out.
But the way that that's lackingis do you get notified if
(11:43):
someone prayed for you, maybe?
Maybe the pastor reaches out ifit's some acute.
You know, I have a surgery at10 am on Wednesday, you know,
does someone call you onThursday, ask out when?
Often, yes, um, but then howwould the, how would you get
updates Right, other than, oh,do we have Frank's cell phone?
Can we email him?
(12:03):
Who is this person?
So what if that person?
What if you could actuallyprovide an update via some
channel?
So so I'll just kind of back upand say, well, what is a prayer
app and how does echo prayerkind of fit into the landscape
of apps?
There are many apps that are outthere that do lots of things.
I would say that echo prayer isspecifically a tool to help
(12:28):
individuals manage their prayerlists and to set reminders to
pray.
Other apps have a lot morecontent that like abide and
hallow and praycom.
They're a lot more contentforward, meaning they have lots
of recommended guides and peoplethat provide the contents,
often some voiceovers that allowyou to kind of enter into a
(12:52):
meditative experience with theLord really helpful.
Echo has built some text-basedguided prayers into the app
experience.
But really the goal is toprovide a place for you to kind
of have that conversation with afriend on Sunday morning and
tell them about that surgery onWednesday and say, yeah, I'll
pray for you, but do we and dowe remember and how can we, you
(13:13):
know, be a little more organizedaround that?
So the kind of person that'sreally drawn to this app is
someone that does like lists anddoes like to track things and
likes to keep things in oneplace, and so Echo is a free app
for people to download andbegin tracking prayers and
getting into also a focusedprayer experience.
(13:35):
So we have this button calledPray Now and it kind of takes
over the screen and you canswipe through the different
cards.
That for me it's like my fourkids each have a card and my
staff each have a card and uh,the different uh verses.
There's a verse that you knowcame to mind and I'll just paste
it in and you know, have thatbe in the flow of the thing that
I want to be reminded of Right,um.
(13:57):
But then where there's more ishow do you turn that into a
shared experience?
And that's really what EchoPlus is and that has been around
for some five years.
But what we did this past yearis expanded it and made a lot
more robust to help Christianministries better organize their
prayer requests.
Right, right, right.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
Yeah, no, I mean, it makes sense.
It's like tithely giving was away to take the you know,
physical giving in a basket andmake it digital.
And this is kind of makingprayer digital and putting it on
your phone so that you can haveyour prayer list and be
reminded about it.
I mean super simple, but foreveryone who's on their phone.
You have it with you all thetime and your notebook doesn't
(14:37):
remind you, so you know yourphone will.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
Right, well, and like I said, every church has this
Christian ministry thatprioritizes prayer.
Every Christian school, everyChristian led business has some
way to have people submit prayerrequests.
Right, it could be a WhatsAppgroup, it could be a text thread
, it could be an email list, itcould be paper, right, you know?
Speaker 2 (15:00):
and so we have Slack, so we have a whole prayer
channel and people post hey,whatever surgery or someone
passed away or whatever it is,and so people, the whole company
has the prayer channel andthere's a meeting that happens
once a week that people can kindof jump into.
So it's just done in Slack forus right now.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
But there you go.
It's a system that was designedusing software to create a
little bit more interaction, andthat's what Echo aims to be is
a kind of best-in-class prayermanagement system for
organizations that say, yeah, wereally want to embrace prayer
and weave it through ourorganization, embrace prayer and
(15:43):
weave it through ourorganization.
So let's create an input pointwhere we have a web form where
people can say hi, I'm Frank,here's what's going on.
You can mark it as anonymous ifit is super private thing, and
then there's tools to either getthat to a staff team or an
elder leadership team or it canactually go into a church's feed
that gets shared with anintercessor team.
And then the other thing we cando is like small groups.
(16:07):
Right, you're sitting around asmall group of 10 people and
there's some text group youmight be using, but is there one
place where we can list thosethings?
And then, when I'm praying forFrank a few days after our small
group, he can get anotification that that Greg's
been praying for him throughoutthe week and and chatter back
and forth about it.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Yeah, yeah, what.
What's been since you?
I mean, you've been connectedwith Echo for a while.
You guys have kind of taken itover over the last couple of
years.
What?
Where have you seen it, youknow, taking off?
You know, like, where are youseeing it?
Kind of like people, really,you know, enjoying the product.
Is it like in churches?
(16:45):
Is it in ministries, Likewhere's the signs of life?
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Yeah, yeah, small to medium sized churches that are
really wanting to prioritizeprayer.
We get such great feedback fromthose pastors who are like we
get such great feedback fromthose pastors who are like I'm
so glad I have this.
I mean, even a small church of50 people, they all just join
the group Right, so let's haveour prayer group and everybody
(17:10):
in the church is in there, andso churches are a really strong
user base.
We've got several thousandchurches that are using it.
No-transcript.
(17:47):
We're having an outreachtomorrow.
Would you pray for us?
You know they can post thatprayer and if I'm either
following that feed through theapp or I get emailed those
requests through echo, becausewe added the prayers and then we
click send email and it goes toall the followers, um, then
they can be alerted and then caninteract and chatter back and
(18:07):
hear the updates and followalong, so that churches and
missionaries are a real stronguse case.
A lot of small groups and we'vehad a bunch of christian
schools and then even like afaith-led business, I use it to
share with my advisors what'sgoing on with things that I'm
working on and ways that I needspecific prayer.
So I've been I've seen it useda lot of different ways, and
(18:31):
that's kind of a sign of aflexible platform is people
configuring it for different usecases, some of which you design
for and others of which kind ofget discovered.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Right, yeah, no, I love that.
Where do you.
Where do you go?
Like?
It sounds so basic on one hand,right, like you know, app-based
prayer list, but it's got abunch of like connectivity and
flexibility and it's, you know,bringing the communities
together and groups, smallgroups and churches and all that
.
So, like, where do you go now?
(19:02):
Like, how do you keep improvingthe tried and true you know
prayer list and making it betterin the digital age?
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Yeah well, that's a great question of kind of where
this is going and headed.
We really want to listen tocustomer and understand, you
know, we believe we're solving aparticular problem, like we
talk about the process, right,how is prayer submitted, how is
prayer received, organized, sent, syndicated, and then how do
you create the feedback loops?
So, with that as kind of aprimary problem solve, I think
(19:31):
philosophically, one of thequestions we're asking about an
app is whether it should be a, aspecial purpose tool for a
particular, you know, needprayer and prayer organization,
right, you know.
And or is there?
There's a role for the superapp, like the, the U version app
is a super app, right, it'll domany things, and so and I'm
(19:54):
sure you guys have thought aboutthis, you know, from a product
perspective with Tidely, is whatis it?
Do you want to create thesespecialized apps for specialized
purpose that don't have a lotof noise?
Or is the weaving of contentwhere there are these guide,
more guided prayer experiences?
Is that really what thecustomers want, right?
(20:15):
And I think so.
That's a big strategic questionfor us as we kind of look at
the other apps and see, you know, what's the engagement in that
content and is there a role fora very specialized tool like
this?
Um, and that's where I'd say ourcurrent thesis is.
But with a lot of ourrelationships with Christian
publishers and ministries,there's lots of desire to
(20:38):
provide content.
Right now, we're doing a lot ofthat more through kind of email
marketing and communicationwith our users outside of the
app experience so that thereisn't noise, and I think that's
the approach that we believe wewant to take with prayer is that
(20:58):
you're using this digitaldevice that is known for being
the distraction demon.
It's the thing that is keepingus from praying because I just
am scrolling and spending toomuch time doing other things.
But can it be redeemed and canwe actually have tech to help us
to be to not get alerted of allthe things happening all day
(21:19):
long, but actually be remindedto pray at 10 o'clock for my
daughter and at 11 o'clock formy son and actually have the
tech help me be a more prayerfulperson and abide with Jesus
throughout the whole day?
Can the tool do that?
And I think that's that's whatwe're looking to really nail and
to do that as best as we can.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Yeah, how's the Echo Plus portion Cause that's like
the premium feature set, thepaid part of the product.
Like are you finding people arereally interested in those like
the community aspects of it andeverything?
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Yeah, our subscriber base is growing, so Echo Plus
really has two tiers to it.
So Echo Plus has been aroundfor some years.
It's $15 a year, available inGoogle and Apple stores, and
what that allows you to do is tocreate a group or create a feed
.
So think a missionary use casea small group, a family you know
(22:19):
, or even a small church coulduse the tool and upgrade.
And if one person upgrades,everybody benefits, right,
everybody gets the free app andcan join the groups and follow
the feeds.
So that's Echo Plus and that'sbeen going well and we're sort
of improving how peopleexperience that.
One big addition we made thispast year was to add a web app.
(22:41):
So it was mobile app only, soyou're typing with your thumbs
and if you have high volumes ofprayers that gets really hard.
So that was a big change andaddition we made and we're
getting great feedback from ourEcho Plus users who have been
asking for this for a long time.
And then Echo Plus forMinistries is the product that
(23:02):
serves churches and ministryorganizations and faith-led
businesses and that has a 30-daytrial and it's a $300 a year
subscription that gets access toa whole robust set of tools,
including the prayer submissionform and a way with which to
send out prayer requests throughemail and such, and all the web
(23:23):
dashboard and tools.
So so that's going quite well.
That actually just launched amonth ago.
We did a private beta in thespring and it's going great.
We're having people sign up andget through their 30-day trial,
and that's all happening now.
So we're just wanting to spreadthe word and our goal is that
thousands of organizations woulduse this and be blessed by it,
(23:46):
and now we can continue to serveorganizations this way, yeah,
yeah, I mean that's super cool.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
I mean going from kind of an agency into a
software business.
I mean you, it sounds like youhad some kind of background in
all of that, but it's a bigshift right.
And now you're out there likeshipping product.
What is the?
What does the team look like onthe tech side of things?
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Yeah, so Parable Group is a bunch of technical
marketers and so while we dosome work in retail, like we
talked about, it's a verytechnical driven team.
We have software, we haveretail analytics, we hook in
with point of sale data, so wehave a pretty strong tech and
data background.
(24:28):
And then our digital agencydoing all the tracking and
monitoring actually requirespretty strong engineering
experience and aptitude.
So that's it's a really funworking with marketers that have
the right brain, creative andtechnical teams that have the
left brain, science and weavingthose two too.
(24:56):
So Echo, as a technical productthat's to be marketed,
certainly fits in our ecosystem.
Running mobile app technology isthe new space and we've been
able to work with some teamsactually out of Romania who are
bivocational missionaries andwe've been able to benefit from
their work and their support tohelp with some of that mobile
tech.
Yeah, that's true, but yeah,we're on a journey around you
(25:18):
know Parable Group running thesedifferent things and
determining how do we stewardthis app into the future and
perhaps add to running more appsor just finding ways we can
serve and bless more people.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Yeah, I love that so good.
Or just finding ways we canserve and bless more people?
Yeah, I love that so good.
Where is it?
Just people go look up EchoPrayer on the App Store and they
can go check it out.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
Yeah, Echo Prayer can be found in Google and Apple.
Echoprayercom is our websitethat explains all the different
features and such I downloadedit today.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
This morning I was checking it out, so I got my
first prayer in there, um, but Igot to go check out the echo
plus portion of it.
Um, but it seems super cool.
Um, is there any like newfeature sets that you're
dreaming up right now that youthink you're going to lean into
soon?
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Yeah, so one of the new things that we've built that
is, as these users of the newstuff uh begin to use it is the
ability to share out prayerrequests in batches.
And so think of you know, alarge organization that may
receive, like a Christian radiostation or a large church or a
ministry.
That's global.
They receive maybe hundreds ofprayer requests at a time and
(26:29):
then they have hundreds ofintercessors.
So the problem we've tried tosolve there is that not everyone
needs everything, because canone individual pray for hundreds
of prayer requests, right,right?
So we actually created abatching system that is working
and ready but just hasn't had alot of activity yet, because we
just launched it and it's partof the new features, yeah, so
(26:49):
I'll be really curious to seehow that solves some of those
higher volume environments where, you know, you just think, if
I'm a user, I'm on your emaillist, I say I want to pray and
we get, you know, hundreds ofprayer requests, but then I'm
actually going to get five or 10that come to me and I get an
email that says, hey, yourprayer requests are ready.
(27:11):
You know, would you join us andpray?
Pray now, right, and you don'teven need the app.
You can just open it up in abrowser URL so that way people
who are following you are partof your prayer ministry.
You know they don't have tohave the app, they can just
click a link and they can openup and they can get in this
prayer experience and swipethrough their 10 cards and then
(27:35):
Frank gets notified that someperson prayed for them.
Right, and it kind of protected, anonymized kind of way, but
still super interesting tocreate these tools and see how
they get adopted and used.
So I'll be really excited tosee that leveraged in some
really creative ways, yeah yeah,totally yeah, totally yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
It's cool, man.
Well, greg, this has been greatand thanks for coming on and
kind of sharing what you guysare up to and and even your
journey into parable group.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
It's great to get to know you and kind of what you've
been up to for the last sixyears uh, helping to build a
great kingdom business the timeand appreciate all the questions
and the passion and love whatyou guys are doing at tithely
and serving so many churches umthinking about the modernization
of all kinds of things.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
Oh yeah, I mean great work.
Church tech is a blast.
Where should folks go?
Speaker 1 (28:24):
do you want to go check out the echo app or go to
parable group, like uh, tellfolks where to where to head
next yeah, echo prayer dot comif you're interested in learning
about modernizing the prayerchain, or use an app for your
personal or for yourorganization, echo prayercom.
Start there.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
Let's go Love it Awesome.
Thanks, Greg.
Thanks guys for listening.
Definitely check out echoprayer and we'll catch you next
week on another episode ofmodern church leader.
See ya.
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