June 21, 2023 • 21 mins
What's the deal with the striped bass emergency regulation and its impact on recreational anglers? Are you baffled by the lack of communication between fisheries managers and the sport fishing community? Join us this week on the New York Angler fishing podcast as we unravel the mysteries surrounding the one-year class of striped bass that's stirring up controversy. From commercial fishermen being allowed to keep the fish to the importance of understanding fish numbers and weight for proper management, we'll cover it all.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
This is the New York angler fishing podcast brought
to you by NY Anglercom, yoursecret spot online, hosted by
the man who introduced NewYorkers to the world of online
fishing, mr George Scott.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Hello and welcome everyone to another episode of
the New York fishing podcast,brought to you by your friends
at New York Anglercom orNYAnglercom.
So I have some news just incase you haven't heard, because
a lot of people didn't hear,because no one bothered giving
(00:41):
anybody a heads up.
We are now fishing a one yearclass of striped bass up and
down the coast and that would be28 to 31 inch limit.
This regulation came into playbecause of what I would consider
(01:05):
an aberration.
I don't believe that we canaccurately count numbers of fish
.
I'm around fisheries managementnow pushing 40 years and
they're really correct.
It's not their fault.
(01:26):
How do you count all the fish,but they're really correct.
I heard hey, let's go to a 12inch blackback flounder.
Hey, let's go to a 14 inchfluke.
That's going to save the fluke,wait, 16.
Wait, you had 12, now you gotto go to 6.
My point is they're never right.
(01:48):
It's hard to be right.
So now we have an emergencyregulation that comes into play
in the middle of the stripedbass season, based on numbers
from last year.
Okay, so we all know it wascoming.
(02:11):
We're all told about it.
The industry is the mostaffected by this type of
regulation reduction, especiallymidstream.
Imagine being in a business andyou're selling I don't know a
(02:31):
hero for 10 bucks and then yougo into the store and you're
still paying 10 bucks, butthey're giving you a half a hero
.
So right now, when you'repreparing to go striped bass
fishing, understand that ourfisheries managers and
(02:54):
scientists are so good thatthey're able to tell you that in
two there was so many fish thatwere hatched and born whatever
they are in 2015 that we canonly kill those.
They weren't enough before,they weren't enough after.
(03:18):
But we cannot kill any otherfish.
But but the 2015 year class?
Keep looking at, just thinkingafter a second.
So we're talking one year class.
That's definitely.
It can't turn out well.
(03:41):
It just cannot turn out well.
I mean, the writing's on thewall.
We see it all the time.
So now we're going to take allthose fish, or we're going to
try, or maybe they're hopingthat there's going to be less
pressure on the fishery becausefewer people are going to fish
(04:02):
for striped bass right now.
I know there's a lot of peoplethat doubt that and there's a
lot of people.
That's not going to affect itall.
Personally.
It's not going to affect mebecause I have a boat, i do a
lot of catch and release.
It's just not going to affectme at all.
But if I was a charter captainthat has anglers most charter
(04:25):
captains have anglers and knowwhat's going on they may think
twice.
Or now you put that chartercaptain in a situation where
he's got to go baited foreverything because he has to
spin the wheel and hope he'sgoing to land on number 10 or he
(04:47):
is not going to get thatelusive 2015 fish.
So now let's get to what I seeas the real problem besides all
this that we've been goingthrough all this.
(05:08):
But the real problem is theauthority that is given managers
under these emergencysituations, what they consider
an emergency.
And if it was such an emergency, why is it that the commercial
(05:31):
fishery is allowed to keep thatfish?
Why is that?
I'll tell you why.
Because you see we don'tactually manage fish in numbers.
Why, i'll never know.
We manage fishing pounds.
So not only do we need to knowhow many fish there are, we also
(05:55):
need to know what they weigh.
So if you're a commercialfisherman, obviously you're
getting paid by the pound, soyou want to make a fish.
But why do they get to keep it?
Oh, because they don't reallytake that many, but this is an
emergency.
(06:16):
It's an emergency.
It's such an emergency that youjust pulled a carpet, the plank
, right out for the next twoweeks while people adjust or
hear these new regulations.
And the worst part about thewhole thing here in New York
state and it really disappointsme because I thought we had
(06:40):
better communications to thepoint where they would have
given us a heads up Yeah, i getit.
Oh man, they did it right away.
This one did it right away.
That one did it right away.
They're not taking any fish.
Look at their numbers.
Doesn't mean anything to them.
In fact, that's like their size.
(07:02):
That is the perfect slide.
So here, now.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
So here we are.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
We are strapped with this reg and we don't even get a
heads up.
There's an open line ofcommunication.
There were people sittingaround a table talking all the
time And the state had to knowthat this was gonna have a
negative effect on the sportfishing, recreational angler.
(07:35):
And when I view it, itfrightens me to think that
that's how they think of us inthe industry, that they couldn't
say, okay, asmfc said thesecond of July, it will go into
effect the second of July.
I mean, doesn't that sound likethe same thing to do to send
(07:59):
out a press release and say, hey, folks, get ready for this,
this is coming.
Rather than already today Ihave to have 15, 20 emails from
people asking me if it's true.
But no, we don't have that openline.
I'm scared.
I'm afraid of the issues thatare facing us and the fact that
(08:25):
we are being treated just soinsignificantly.
The wreck angler is alwaystreated like a piece of crap.
We just are.
We always have been.
And please don't say, george,you know you're exaggerating,
you're this, you know, just lookat it all.
(08:46):
Just look at it all.
And while this is happening,we're actually doing a PCB study
to see if we can open up thecommercial fishery for the West
Because, you know, somehow it'sthat curtain where the striped
(09:06):
bass goes past a certain pointAnd all of a sudden it's too
high in PCBs.
Well, i don't know, they'retrying to open that up, but this
is an emergency.
It's an emergency.
It's so bad we had to shut youdown without even the courtesy
of a heads up, email, phone call, anything.
(09:33):
So this is the way the state hasbeen treating us in many ways
recently.
Say what you want about ourpast governor, i always said it.
The man was a fisherman and hecared about fishermen, but I
(09:55):
don't see anyone caring about usat all.
And if anything anything showedthat, it was this, because it's
not like they didn't know thatthe industry was concerned and
wanted to know what was going on.
And don't they have that right?
(10:16):
Don't they have the right toknow that the trip that they had
planned for today it's got tobe a change.
It's got to be a change.
So they're going to have tofish for another species to keep
the person happy if he cancatch it right.
And all the plans that go intoa charter and there's a lot of
(10:40):
them wind direction, tide, theystand.
The other thing.
Many people think that plan haschanged overnight And you have
to hope that you're going todeliver some kind of fish.
So listen, folks, this is goingto affect not it doesn't affect
(11:07):
the recreational angle, like meor like a lot of people but it
does affect the industry and notjust the charter boat people.
Let's not forget about tackleshop people.
How many times today andtomorrow and the next three to
four weeks are they going to beas is it true?
Can I?
(11:29):
I have to throw up.
I can only keep somethingbetween 28 and 31 inches.
Yes, you have a better.
You have a better chance ofbuying a scratch off date.
Take it or play in a slot andtry to catch a slot.
Yes, that's true.
(11:50):
So this, i don't know, can calladministration, i don't know.
But the people in charge rightnow obviously do not care about
the recreational angler.
It's been shown time and againand I'm not going to get into it
here.
I have a lot of respect for alot of people that work there,
but but this, this move, is verydisappointing, very, very
(12:16):
disappointing.
And for those of you thataren't aware, which most people
are not aware, i'm not evensupposed to be aware, i'm not
even allowed to.
Nobody's even allowed to talkto me about it for some reason.
But you've got a group ofanglers, many of which claim to
represent you but they've neverheard from you.
(12:39):
They don't even know who youare, but they represent you.
And they are now puttingtogether a survey of how you
would like your salt waterlicense.
Not do you want to sort waterlicense, it's.
How do you want the money fromthe license spent?
(13:01):
Now, i'm not going to get toomuch into that, because we all
know what happens to that money.
You know, like the schoollottery money, it all just
blends in in the end.
I guess that's why I'm not partof the conversation, because
I'm not a believer in it.
But I also know that it's coming.
(13:22):
It's coming, but please keep inmind the way you were just
treated.
They are going to stuff us withwhatever they want because they
don't care about us, because weare no longer organized, nor
(13:44):
are we respected.
And, to be honest, i've been atmany of those meetings And with
the way some of those peopleconduct themselves at their
meetings, they don't deserve tobe respected.
We used to get things done whenwe were respected and at the
(14:10):
same time feared because we wereorganized.
So when you get the survey, i'mnot sure what's coming out, but
I do believe the money'salready spent somewhere in the
budget Or it's part of thebudget, i don't know.
But you're getting a licensenext year, 2014,.
(14:31):
You will be fishing with asaltwater license.
I think it's only starting atten bucks they're talking, but
I'm guessing it'll be 20.
So now we could add that to theindustry.
That'll be another hassle thatthe industry is going to have to
deal with, And you know whatthey're going to do.
(14:53):
They're going to cut you rightoff.
It's going to be a day beforefluke season.
Whoop, there's not enoughtwo-year-old fluke.
Gotta stop, gotta go down.
That's what you're going to get.
You have no respect.
Nobody cares about therecreational fishing industry.
(15:16):
If I was a charter boat owner ora tackle shop owner right now,
i would be, so I know what'sinvolved, i know what they do,
how they order, how advancedthings have to be and what
you're preparing for.
So look, they don't care aboutyou, they don't care about me,
(15:42):
and this is going to continuewith every fishery there is.
They're coming after the surfshark fishermen because they
take too many pictures, andpeople see those photos and they
believe that those kids arecausing sharks to come.
(16:02):
In short, i mean technically Iguess it is while it's getting
real then, but I mean there's.
I don't think there's ever beena registered death from a shark
in New York waters, ever inhistory.
I think that one little sandtiger bite, which I still think
was a bluefish So, but nowthey're going after you.
(16:27):
Next.
I'm telling you it's coming.
I wonder what the bycatchrelease mortality is on a
striped bass caught on a fly.
What do you think that is?
How many of those bass do youthink are able to survive?
(16:49):
The small ones, okay, they'retough, but how about the bigger
ones?
Should there be a ban ontargeting bass with flies?
Should there be a ban from flyfishing in the Hudson River for
striped bass?
(17:10):
This isn't look, this isn't likeoutrageous.
I think you'll save a hell of alot more fish.
So it's coming for everybody.
I'm just trying to make thatpoint.
They're making us use circlehooks.
Now The next thing you're gonnaknow is you gotta have a heavy
(17:32):
fishing line and you gotta havean X ratio reel.
Don't think it couldn't happen,because it could.
They have that ability, andrecreational anglers are nothing
but a nuisance.
We fish on a beach, we're dirty, we're fishermen, we're the
(17:56):
drugs of the earth, when thetruth is, we're the stewards of
the fishery.
We take care of the fishery.
So, folks, i hope you get agood feel for what we're in
store for.
We are in store for a licensethat they're gonna shove down
(18:20):
our throats because you're gonnatell them everything you wanna
tell them and they're not gonnalisten, just like now, who knows
?
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Maybe they'll say it's an emergency.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
They're gonna use some kind of an excuse So, and
then supposedly we're gonna havereal numbers.
But I don't even wanna get intothat.
That's a whole nother story.
This issue we knew was coming.
It was not the state's fault.
The state did not want.
(18:54):
I'm not saying that they didn'twant them, but this came out of
the ASMFC.
But the communication and thedisregard for letters and emails
and things that were sent showme that we are in a different
(19:16):
space than we were with the lastgovernor.
So watch out for your surveyand remember you gotta spin that
lucky wheel to get between 28inches and 31 inches, because
we're so good that we know thatthere's more of those swimming
(19:43):
than bigger and smaller.
That is how good we've gotten.
Pretty amazing, huh?
Consider when we just found outa couple of years ago like they
take ones out to the canyonevery now and then.
All right, folks, i'll be backagain with more bass news and
(20:03):
more fisheries news coming up.
There's a lot going on.
This show is not about hey,what are you catching?
And we're catching it.
There's plenty of that on theinternet.
We will have a lot of hell too.
I have a Cobia special that'scoming out.
I'm just waiting on one lastpiece and we got a lot of good
(20:24):
stuff coming.
Please subscribe to this.
It's gonna come out.
You know, i mean regularly,because now, with this ability
to turn all this into content,it's easier for me to do this.
I actually didn't sit and writeall day, so thank you all for
(20:48):
listening.
Thank you to those whosubscribe wwwenglercom, your
secret spot online.
This is the New York angler fishing podcast brought
to you by NY Anglercom, yoursecret spot online, hosted by
the man who introduced NewYorkers to the world of online
fishing, mr George Scott.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Hello and welcome everyone to another episode of
the New York fishing podcast,brought to you by your friends
at New York Anglercom orNYAnglercom.
So I have some news just incase you haven't heard, because
a lot of people didn't hear,because no one bothered giving
(00:41):
anybody a heads up.
We are now fishing a one yearclass of striped bass up and
down the coast and that would be28 to 31 inch limit.
This regulation came into playbecause of what I would consider
(01:05):
an aberration.
I don't believe that we canaccurately count numbers of fish
.
I'm around fisheries managementnow pushing 40 years and
they're really correct.
It's not their fault.
(01:26):
How do you count all the fish,but they're really correct.
I heard hey, let's go to a 12inch blackback flounder.
Hey, let's go to a 14 inchfluke.
That's going to save the fluke,wait, 16.
Wait, you had 12, now you gotto go to 6.
My point is they're never right.
(01:48):
It's hard to be right.
So now we have an emergencyregulation that comes into play
in the middle of the stripedbass season, based on numbers
from last year.
Okay, so we all know it wascoming.
(02:11):
We're all told about it.
The industry is the mostaffected by this type of
regulation reduction, especiallymidstream.
Imagine being in a business andyou're selling I don't know a
(02:31):
hero for 10 bucks and then yougo into the store and you're
still paying 10 bucks, butthey're giving you a half a hero
.
So right now, when you'repreparing to go striped bass
fishing, understand that ourfisheries managers and
(02:54):
scientists are so good thatthey're able to tell you that in
two there was so many fish thatwere hatched and born whatever
they are in 2015 that we canonly kill those.
They weren't enough before,they weren't enough after.
(03:18):
But we cannot kill any otherfish.
But but the 2015 year class?
Keep looking at, just thinkingafter a second.
So we're talking one year class.
That's definitely.
It can't turn out well.
(03:41):
It just cannot turn out well.
I mean, the writing's on thewall.
We see it all the time.
So now we're going to take allthose fish, or we're going to
try, or maybe they're hopingthat there's going to be less
pressure on the fishery becausefewer people are going to fish
(04:02):
for striped bass right now.
I know there's a lot of peoplethat doubt that and there's a
lot of people.
That's not going to affect itall.
Personally.
It's not going to affect mebecause I have a boat, i do a
lot of catch and release.
It's just not going to affectme at all.
But if I was a charter captainthat has anglers most charter
(04:25):
captains have anglers and knowwhat's going on they may think
twice.
Or now you put that chartercaptain in a situation where
he's got to go baited foreverything because he has to
spin the wheel and hope he'sgoing to land on number 10 or he
(04:47):
is not going to get thatelusive 2015 fish.
So now let's get to what I seeas the real problem besides all
this that we've been goingthrough all this.
(05:08):
But the real problem is theauthority that is given managers
under these emergencysituations, what they consider
an emergency.
And if it was such an emergency, why is it that the commercial
(05:31):
fishery is allowed to keep thatfish?
Why is that?
I'll tell you why.
Because you see we don'tactually manage fish in numbers.
Why, i'll never know.
We manage fishing pounds.
So not only do we need to knowhow many fish there are, we also
(05:55):
need to know what they weigh.
So if you're a commercialfisherman, obviously you're
getting paid by the pound, soyou want to make a fish.
But why do they get to keep it?
Oh, because they don't reallytake that many, but this is an
emergency.
(06:16):
It's an emergency.
It's such an emergency that youjust pulled a carpet, the plank
, right out for the next twoweeks while people adjust or
hear these new regulations.
And the worst part about thewhole thing here in New York
state and it really disappointsme because I thought we had
(06:40):
better communications to thepoint where they would have
given us a heads up Yeah, i getit.
Oh man, they did it right away.
This one did it right away.
That one did it right away.
They're not taking any fish.
Look at their numbers.
Doesn't mean anything to them.
In fact, that's like their size.
(07:02):
That is the perfect slide.
So here, now.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
So here we are.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
We are strapped with this reg and we don't even get a
heads up.
There's an open line ofcommunication.
There were people sittingaround a table talking all the
time And the state had to knowthat this was gonna have a
negative effect on the sportfishing, recreational angler.
(07:35):
And when I view it, itfrightens me to think that
that's how they think of us inthe industry, that they couldn't
say, okay, asmfc said thesecond of July, it will go into
effect the second of July.
I mean, doesn't that sound likethe same thing to do to send
(07:59):
out a press release and say, hey, folks, get ready for this,
this is coming.
Rather than already today Ihave to have 15, 20 emails from
people asking me if it's true.
But no, we don't have that openline.
I'm scared.
I'm afraid of the issues thatare facing us and the fact that
(08:25):
we are being treated just soinsignificantly.
The wreck angler is alwaystreated like a piece of crap.
We just are.
We always have been.
And please don't say, george,you know you're exaggerating,
you're this, you know, just lookat it all.
(08:46):
Just look at it all.
And while this is happening,we're actually doing a PCB study
to see if we can open up thecommercial fishery for the West
Because, you know, somehow it'sthat curtain where the striped
(09:06):
bass goes past a certain pointAnd all of a sudden it's too
high in PCBs.
Well, i don't know, they'retrying to open that up, but this
is an emergency.
It's an emergency.
It's so bad we had to shut youdown without even the courtesy
of a heads up, email, phone call, anything.
(09:33):
So this is the way the state hasbeen treating us in many ways
recently.
Say what you want about ourpast governor, i always said it.
The man was a fisherman and hecared about fishermen, but I
(09:55):
don't see anyone caring about usat all.
And if anything anything showedthat, it was this, because it's
not like they didn't know thatthe industry was concerned and
wanted to know what was going on.
And don't they have that right?
(10:16):
Don't they have the right toknow that the trip that they had
planned for today it's got tobe a change.
It's got to be a change.
So they're going to have tofish for another species to keep
the person happy if he cancatch it right.
And all the plans that go intoa charter and there's a lot of
(10:40):
them wind direction, tide, theystand.
The other thing.
Many people think that plan haschanged overnight And you have
to hope that you're going todeliver some kind of fish.
So listen, folks, this is goingto affect not it doesn't affect
(11:07):
the recreational angle, like meor like a lot of people but it
does affect the industry and notjust the charter boat people.
Let's not forget about tackleshop people.
How many times today andtomorrow and the next three to
four weeks are they going to beas is it true?
Can I?
(11:29):
I have to throw up.
I can only keep somethingbetween 28 and 31 inches.
Yes, you have a better.
You have a better chance ofbuying a scratch off date.
Take it or play in a slot andtry to catch a slot.
Yes, that's true.
(11:50):
So this, i don't know, can calladministration, i don't know.
But the people in charge rightnow obviously do not care about
the recreational angler.
It's been shown time and againand I'm not going to get into it
here.
I have a lot of respect for alot of people that work there,
but but this, this move, is verydisappointing, very, very
(12:16):
disappointing.
And for those of you thataren't aware, which most people
are not aware, i'm not evensupposed to be aware, i'm not
even allowed to.
Nobody's even allowed to talkto me about it for some reason.
But you've got a group ofanglers, many of which claim to
represent you but they've neverheard from you.
(12:39):
They don't even know who youare, but they represent you.
And they are now puttingtogether a survey of how you
would like your salt waterlicense.
Not do you want to sort waterlicense, it's.
How do you want the money fromthe license spent?
(13:01):
Now, i'm not going to get toomuch into that, because we all
know what happens to that money.
You know, like the schoollottery money, it all just
blends in in the end.
I guess that's why I'm not partof the conversation, because
I'm not a believer in it.
But I also know that it's coming.
(13:22):
It's coming, but please keep inmind the way you were just
treated.
They are going to stuff us withwhatever they want because they
don't care about us, because weare no longer organized, nor
(13:44):
are we respected.
And, to be honest, i've been atmany of those meetings And with
the way some of those peopleconduct themselves at their
meetings, they don't deserve tobe respected.
We used to get things done whenwe were respected and at the
(14:10):
same time feared because we wereorganized.
So when you get the survey, i'mnot sure what's coming out, but
I do believe the money'salready spent somewhere in the
budget Or it's part of thebudget, i don't know.
But you're getting a licensenext year, 2014,.
(14:31):
You will be fishing with asaltwater license.
I think it's only starting atten bucks they're talking, but
I'm guessing it'll be 20.
So now we could add that to theindustry.
That'll be another hassle thatthe industry is going to have to
deal with, And you know whatthey're going to do.
(14:53):
They're going to cut you rightoff.
It's going to be a day beforefluke season.
Whoop, there's not enoughtwo-year-old fluke.
Gotta stop, gotta go down.
That's what you're going to get.
You have no respect.
Nobody cares about therecreational fishing industry.
(15:16):
If I was a charter boat owner ora tackle shop owner right now,
i would be, so I know what'sinvolved, i know what they do,
how they order, how advancedthings have to be and what
you're preparing for.
So look, they don't care aboutyou, they don't care about me,
(15:42):
and this is going to continuewith every fishery there is.
They're coming after the surfshark fishermen because they
take too many pictures, andpeople see those photos and they
believe that those kids arecausing sharks to come.
(16:02):
In short, i mean technically Iguess it is while it's getting
real then, but I mean there's.
I don't think there's ever beena registered death from a shark
in New York waters, ever inhistory.
I think that one little sandtiger bite, which I still think
was a bluefish So, but nowthey're going after you.
(16:27):
Next.
I'm telling you it's coming.
I wonder what the bycatchrelease mortality is on a
striped bass caught on a fly.
What do you think that is?
How many of those bass do youthink are able to survive?
(16:49):
The small ones, okay, they'retough, but how about the bigger
ones?
Should there be a ban ontargeting bass with flies?
Should there be a ban from flyfishing in the Hudson River for
striped bass?
(17:10):
This isn't look, this isn't likeoutrageous.
I think you'll save a hell of alot more fish.
So it's coming for everybody.
I'm just trying to make thatpoint.
They're making us use circlehooks.
Now The next thing you're gonnaknow is you gotta have a heavy
(17:32):
fishing line and you gotta havean X ratio reel.
Don't think it couldn't happen,because it could.
They have that ability, andrecreational anglers are nothing
but a nuisance.
We fish on a beach, we're dirty, we're fishermen, we're the
(17:56):
drugs of the earth, when thetruth is, we're the stewards of
the fishery.
We take care of the fishery.
So, folks, i hope you get agood feel for what we're in
store for.
We are in store for a licensethat they're gonna shove down
(18:20):
our throats because you're gonnatell them everything you wanna
tell them and they're not gonnalisten, just like now, who knows
?
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Maybe they'll say it's an emergency.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
They're gonna use some kind of an excuse So, and
then supposedly we're gonna havereal numbers.
But I don't even wanna get intothat.
That's a whole nother story.
This issue we knew was coming.
It was not the state's fault.
The state did not want.
(18:54):
I'm not saying that they didn'twant them, but this came out of
the ASMFC.
But the communication and thedisregard for letters and emails
and things that were sent showme that we are in a different
(19:16):
space than we were with the lastgovernor.
So watch out for your surveyand remember you gotta spin that
lucky wheel to get between 28inches and 31 inches, because
we're so good that we know thatthere's more of those swimming
(19:43):
than bigger and smaller.
That is how good we've gotten.
Pretty amazing, huh?
Consider when we just found outa couple of years ago like they
take ones out to the canyonevery now and then.
All right, folks, i'll be backagain with more bass news and
(20:03):
more fisheries news coming up.
There's a lot going on.
This show is not about hey,what are you catching?
And we're catching it.
There's plenty of that on theinternet.
We will have a lot of hell too.
I have a Cobia special that'scoming out.
I'm just waiting on one lastpiece and we got a lot of good
(20:24):
stuff coming.
Please subscribe to this.
It's gonna come out.
You know, i mean regularly,because now, with this ability
to turn all this into content,it's easier for me to do this.
I actually didn't sit and writeall day, so thank you all for
(20:48):
listening.
Thank you to those whosubscribe wwwenglercom, your
secret spot online.
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