July 17, 2023 • 44 mins
We bring back Joe Pastorek's discussion on the 95th Civil Affairs Brigade's Advanced Skills Detachment with host Sean Acosta.
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civilaffairsasocial.org. Hi, this is Message for Jack.
This is John. You're doing a great job of the
show. It's really awesome.
We appreciate everything you've been putting out to the
(01:07):
community. So some older episodes that I'd
love for you to run back again. If you've got time one is the
95th CA Brigades Advanced SkillsDetachment.
That, of course, is John Mcellegate calling in to
recommend some episodes that deserve a second listen.
As you know, I use one week out of the month to bring in guest
(01:28):
shows that I think John has a great idea to also introduce
shows from the archives that complement today's topics.
So let's get started. All right.
Welcome to the One CA Podcast. I am your host, Shawn Acosta,
and today I have Joe Pistoric with me, who is the former NCIC
of the 95th Advanced Skills Detachment.
(01:51):
And today we're going to be talking a little bit about what
95th ASD offers for the 95th Civil Affairs Brigade and for
the greater civil affairs community.
So Joe, welcome to the to the One CA podcast.
Really appreciate you coming on.Yeah.
No thanks for having me. It's a pleasure.
So Joe, before we get started, could you just kind of give give
the audience A brief background on kind of your military
(02:14):
experience and why you came overto CA what you you've done in
your civil affairs career? Sure.
So join the Army in September of2000 as a chemical operations
specialist, I spent my first eight years in the 82nd Airborne
Division here at Fort Bragg in, let's see when Civil Affairs
(02:36):
Assessment Selection in 2011. I actually worked with Civil
affairs in Afghanistan in 2005 and 2006.
So you know glean some of the. Some of what they do and it's
different. It was reserved civil affairs,
but I was still very interestingto be able to you know, do the
things they were doing. So 2012 graduated the civil
(03:00):
affairs qualification course wassent to the 91st as a team
member and team Sergeant I, we deployed to East Africa and you
know, Somalia, Kenya, Uganda andDjibouti and then.
Moved on to the as a cmark into IC or Operations Sergeant,
(03:22):
Deployed a company to North and West Africa and served in the
Special Operations Command forward in North and West
Africa. And then in September of 17, I
was asked to go up to the Brigade Headquarters and start
the 95th Advanced Skills Detachment and that's where I
(03:44):
worked for my last three years. And now it's on to retirement.
So that's where I'm at now. Some some people may not be
familiar with the Advanced Skills Detachment.
I mean, you were saying that it just stood up in 2017, so in
late 2017. So really it's only been around
for about 2 1/2 years. Maybe you could explain a little
(04:07):
bit more about like how that came to be, how it was created
and and some of the different things that it that it offers.
Yeah. So in 2017, I was looking to
come out of the operation starting position and star Major
Derek Riley asked me if I would come up to the brigade and start
(04:27):
the Advanced Skills Detachment. The Advanced Skills Detachment,
It's not a new thing, right? We didn't invent it.
Colonel Burnett, the former Brigade commander, actually
wrote it in to the, you know, five year plan, I want to say in
2000. 14 or 15, maybe 13 when hewas up at Proponent and it takes
(04:49):
a while to, you know, get started.
All the groups started as, you know, Sophalic Detachments and
then you know, grew into advanced skills companies.
So we had to start somewhere. So the Advanced Skills
Detachment was I went up there in September of 2017, you know,
from just an Idea. Inception to actually manning
(05:12):
and and beginning training. We actually started training in
March of 2018, so we started with just basic committees of
tactics, mobility, combatives and at the time we did a Civil
Information Management slash Human Network analysis
(05:35):
committee. And that's grown into what it is
today, which we still have advanced tactics, mobility,
combatives. We also manage the civilian
trainer integrators up at Brigade for counter ID and
counter UAS. And there's now a civil
reconnaissance, advanced Civil Reconnaissance Committee.
(05:56):
So you know from what it startedto what it is it we went through
a lot. It was difficult, but I think
well worth it. So you're talking about some of
these committees that you began with.
Has anything evolved from that? I know you, I've seen some stuff
the training catalog offers you know, advanced tactics, some
unconmissional warfare stuff andyou guys are even getting into
(06:19):
some counter UAS as well. So is there there anything
outside of like the typical shoot move, communicate civil
affairs I guess skills that you guys offer?
Sure. Yeah.
So you know we started my, my goal was to really what the,
the, the charter of the AdvancedSkills detachment was to offer
(06:41):
internally resourced and manned instructed training comparable
to a contracted training. So to save money a lot of the
training have become you know itit's sort of infiltrated its way
into the brigade and became the norm so.
You know, we started with my, mygoal was to start, you know, I
(07:03):
didn't want to to move to failure too quickly.
So I thought if we start with the basics with shoot, move,
communicate, medicate, that was the the way to success that has
grown into aside from those things that are still running
and still, you know, doing greatthings and evolving every day.
Now we added the silver reconnaissance piece and I said
(07:25):
we started with the H and a kindof committee the idea.
Was to you know offer training that that generally was it's
really one of our core tasks butit was you know difficult to get
a lot of people in the training.It was expensive.
It didn't really work what we did we we ended up just
(07:46):
facilitating training for a lot of the for social network
analysis and critical infrastructure vulnerability
assessment but that. Through into what is now civil
reconnaissance which is you knowit's it's growing rapidly.
So one of you know commands on Major Swaggert's initiatives in
(08:09):
in coming up to be operations before he was the brigade.
So our major was to figure out how to offer the civil
reconnaissance training we have Civil reconnaissance is one of
our core tasks right. But there was really there
really wasn't any any formal training that you could.
You could participate in and come out of it and say okay I'm
trained in civil reconnaissance it was just kind of well all
(08:32):
these things we did Now I I knowcivil reconnaissance but adding
in the you know army reconnaissance and the
principles of reconnaissance andthen adding in like you had
talked about the the UAS and counter UAS as a reconnaissance.
You know resource was very important to us and it's
actually worked out really well.They're they're doing a lot of
(08:53):
training now with. Units from all over uses are you
know, especially now with you know the way things are there's
you know well over 80 students that sign up for these courses
from civil affairs, SIOP, special forces groups, you know
a WG from everywhere. So it's it's really grown into
(09:13):
something pretty special. That's great to hear, especially
with the the Silver Constance piece.
I know being at Special Warfare Center in school like we teach.
A very and and I'll just be frank a very a rudimentary form
of civil reconnaissance. I was happy when the additional
(09:34):
10 weeks for soft civil affairs was implemented into the pathway
They they were able to go into alittle bit more in depth talking
about the you know principles ofreconnaissance and so on like
you guys are like you were discussing and I think one of
the biggest issues that we've had in CA is not having a.
I guess an additional course, I'm hesitant to say advanced
(09:54):
course, but an additional coursefor those currently serving that
come back on it and kind of refine or hone those additional
skills like social network analysis etcetera.
I think a lot of times we focus a lot on gathering the
information, but then we don't focus so much on, on analyzing
and then refining and modeling that information so that we can
use it for targeting and other things later on and sharing that
(10:18):
with other communities. And that's one of the things we
figured out was you know civil reconnaissance, when you say
that and you tell people we do that, it really encompasses a
lot of different things, right. It's so Army reconnaissance is
they they have their principles and how they train.
What we did was we got former 19D Cav scouts and said you know
(10:40):
reconnaissance right now you also know civil affairs.
So let's let's meld these two things together and figure out
the best way to do it And we've added.
PAO does photography training during the course.
The bargaining officers do non lethal targeting and targeting
principles. The S2 comes and does
intelligence integration. So it's all really it's it's
(11:03):
really, you know all the plethora of things that go into
when you add the civil in front of reconnaissance.
It's it's a really good course and I think it's only going to
get better. I think you brought up another
good point too with ASD and whatit offers.
And that was the like the being able to kind of steer away from
the contracting portion. I know when I first came to CA
(11:25):
and got to a unit 2012, like people were talking about how we
need to do this training. Let's go to Griffin group for
this. And in my head as a young NCL is
like, why aren't why aren't we doing this?
Like, I thought this was a wholepurpose of having
noncommissioned officers. So, like, it's for me.
I only have positive things to say about ASD and and what what
(11:46):
you guys have done. I think that it's it's giving
the onus back to the Nco's inside of our regiment which is
great. You know as you see the guys
that are get trained on this either at the unit level and
they can spread that knowledge or the the instructors
themselves once they're once they're done with their time at
ASD go back to the operational. You know all this knowledge is
now institutionalized or becoming institutionalized in
the brigade. So I think that's great and.
(12:09):
That's that's really. As like you had talked about as
a not a young NCO but a young civil affairs specialist, I I
realized that and I'll say a quick story.
I went to a company to do training for predeployment.
It was basically and a requirement to deploy.
We went out and had a, you know,a guy from the Delta Force and
(12:34):
he teach you basic pistol marksmanship and it really
bothered me that. You know NC O's train and lead
soldiers, what we do, I've invented my whole career and I
didn't understand. There are certain things you
know that that require some someoutsourcing.
But for the most part the thingsthat we've been doing in civil
affairs could be done by NC O's.And the added benefit is that
(12:56):
not only can NC O's do this on several fronts, it improves our
force. So you have the NC O's that are
being trained and highly specialized areas of of training
and instruction. So as you said, they go back to
the force that much better. We already have, you know,
instructors that have gone back to units and they they train
those units at a higher level than they've ever been trained.
(13:19):
And the other thing is I think people kind of misses when when
you send a team or a company to arrange as an example and they
see these, these instructors from their own unit that guys
that they've known and worked with.
And they see them teaching these, you know, very highly
(13:40):
advanced tactics and and weaponstraining and different things
that they do. And they're so impressed by it.
And what that does is it empowers those NCO's to also
realize that hey, I can do that stuff too.
I can, I can actually do what I'm supposed to do.
And it gives them confidence andinstills that, that that idea
(14:00):
that. You know, you don't have to to
figure out who you have to pay to be trained.
For the most part you can do it internally and that's that's
really an added benefit of the advanced skills attachment A.
100% agree. And I think that's that's key to
what you're saying, like instilling that confidence not
(14:22):
only in themselves, but you know, when the other guys in
that unit look around, they're like, okay, yeah, we've got some
guys in here that are knowledgeable.
They know what they're talking about.
And I think this continues to professionalize the regiment.
Absolutely. And those guys, they want to,
after they attend ASD training, I get, oh, I did get emails
(14:43):
constantly, three or four a weekof guys saying, hey, how can I
come to the ASD and be an instructor.
I was, you know, I have this experience and I want to do this
and so many that we actually turn people away and say, hey,
you know, we have to actually dopackets and have a select, which
is not how it started, right. So that's really good.
It shows you that you know, people want to train and people
(15:04):
are interested in taking ownership of the training for
their team. So it's it's really good.
I'm sure Battalion Csm's love that, all their guys trying to
come up to the ASD. Yeah, there's a.
There's a point of contention atyou know, you got on the one
hand, they're like, why do you need the ASD to train you?
(15:26):
You should be doing this yourself, which?
Is the goal right? It's not train the trainer in
the sense of certifying guys to train, but it is giving them the
tools to be better trainers and better NCO's and officers.
So yeah, you know, like anything, all the summer ages,
they're not looking to go with their best people to leave.
(15:47):
So it's it can be tough, but we've had pretty good support
over the years. So you guys not only train 95th,
but I saw I think it was a few months back where you guys are
trained at 412th CA Battalion aswell, which is a part of KPOC.
Was that a, was that coordinatedor was that by chance or how did
(16:08):
that, how did that training event work out?
Yeah. So from the beginning of the the
Advanced Skills Detachment, whatwe found very quickly was that.
The brigade was not the only unit that were looking for, you
know, this sort of training and we forget sometimes being in
(16:28):
special operations that not a lot of units just have all this
money to throw around to, to payfor, you know, $25,000 for some
some weapons training for three days.
So. We started out, you know, very
quickly training units from all over the United States, actually
getting, you know, requests to. You know send our guys down to
(16:50):
you know, Savannah, we sent our guys to San Antonio, we sent our
guys to Fort Sam Houston. You know our instructors have
gone all over the place and partof that you know that the
networking and marketing that you have to do with the new unit
of the the you know the 83rd wasan I I saw it as very important
(17:11):
to offer this training. And to be successful, the ASD
would have to market itself. We would have to advertise and
market and prove that it was a viable, a real option to be
comparable to contracted training so that commanders and
and everyone else would know that this is a legitimate, you
(17:33):
know programs of instruction that they could use to actually
validate teams. The 412 CA battalion which we've
trained with twice now that cameout of.
Of the brigades validation exercise, the operation
Stockham. So what had happened as the 4/12
was participating in Stockham once they learned that the
advanced skills attachment, the tactics instructors were going
(17:55):
to be there. They you know asked if you know
they could they could participate in a range and we
thought it was very important toto help them and show their
commander and their their NCO's that.
What the 95th is offering in terms of a SD and training.
So yeah, they did go down there.They got advanced skills or
(18:18):
advanced tactics training and combat management, marksmanship
system and low visibility training with concealed pistol
training and a lot of training that they don't get to get very
often. And what was really good about
it is, you know, aside from the glowing.
You know the glowing review of of the training and how how well
(18:39):
it went and how much they liked it.
We actually had tangible scoringdata to show their commander how
they improved from day one when they did these marksmanship
tables to the last day when theyactually it was a 99%
improvement. So only one one of their members
(19:00):
didn't get worse but didn't improve markedly so.
You know, being able to show a commander a tangible, you know,
the training improvement in a ina percentage, they were very
impressed by that and they we'vetrained with them since and I've
planned to train with them again.
(19:21):
This is very good. That's great to hear because I
know recently there's been a lotof talk about integrating active
duty and KPOC and I think it's important that we continue to
kind of integrate. Yeah, and it helps with
relationships, right? I absolutely we've reached out.
So social network analysis training are suet training that
(19:42):
we do the Unconventional Warfareexponential training.
We've actually, I invite guys from 3rd and 7th and 10th and
5th group by SIOP guys, guys from the 83rd.
So we try to get all these unitsand it's on a few levels to show
that you know the cooperation isvery important to me.
I always wanted to. I believe we're one team.
(20:05):
I know people say it and they don't always, you know, practice
what they preach. But I feel like it's very
important to to, you know, help out these other units and
especially when you get to like the 83rd is a good example.
They got, you know, with Forcecom and you know, being
under the MP brigade, they're the same people we are, right.
(20:26):
So I thought it was very important to offer them some of
these trains that they didn't have to pay for.
That they could get these skillsand come back and you know
again, hopefully, you know, spread to the word about the ASD
and and and how how good the training was.
So you guys, I mean we're talking about these, you know
the relationships with the 83rd and then I used to kpoch, but
(20:47):
you guys have also been able to establish some relationships
outside of that. I know from your Instagram page
there's been a, it looks like you guys have developed a pretty
close relationship with the Armyand Worksmanship Unit.
So how did that come to being? What are you?
I'm assuming, probably rightfully so, that it has a lot
to do with, you know, pistol andlong gun stuff, but how does
(21:10):
that relationship work out? Yeah, so the another thing we
did which was on a couple, on a couple of different levels was
recruiting was something that I also kind of took hold of and as
a recruiting lead for the brigade to try to liaise between
the the SORB and. You know, civil affairs
recruiting and make sure the brigade had a had a voice in
(21:32):
recruiting. So I thought sending our our
instructors, our tactics instructors to in combat it, we
send all our guys to different things.
But the tactics instructors specifically, I thought sending
them to national shooting championships and different
events would help with recruiting.
(21:53):
It would help with our guys, ourinstructors being.
You know, developing and improving their proficiency and
also it's a good incentive and it's good to say hey the, you
know a SD tactics instructor wassecond in the use of stock
pistol championship and you knowthe our two instructors have,
(22:15):
you know, developed these relationships with the AM U
through these, you know through these events and what came of it
was the AM U Sergeant major. Actually contacted me to tell me
how impressed he was with our with our tactics instructors
during the event. And you know our our instructors
(22:37):
really wanted to go over there and see that's that's who you go
to when you talk about marksmanship and you know the
the different things that they're doing, the innovative
things they're doing with marksmanship.
So they brought our our instructors over and they toured
their facility and gave them a lot of ideas, things that we use
today. We developed a zero target
(22:59):
system that one of our instructors was, you know, had
been working on for a while and they actually adopted it and
took it. And so all those things were
very, very good for that relationship as well as the Army
Remarksmanship Units Commission is.
So for us and so affairs, recruiting is very important.
So it helped on a lot of different levels and that
(23:21):
relationship has only improved and I'm sure we'll continue for
for a very long time. That's a credit to the
instructors and you know the those those instructors that
went down there and and did all those things.
The tactics instructors took second in the You Suck Pistol
Championship. Yeah.
So one of our tactics instructors was second place in
(23:43):
the pistol and basic pistol championship are two of our two
other instructors. Our tactics instructors actually
went to the. The President's 100, The annual
President's 100, and up near Lake Erie, they were in the top
30% for the nation in rifle and then a little higher in pistol,
(24:09):
but still pretty good. And one of our instructors
actually was awarded the US ArmyExcellence in Competition badge
for pistol marksmanship, and I didn't know that badge existed.
Right. So until he showed me this badge
I had, I've never heard of it. I didn't know what it was and
(24:32):
it's, it's permanent orders and it's an actual award that he
gets to wear. And so that's really and that's
their work. They work on their own time.
They're very, very, very seriousabout, you know, being in front
of in the level that they're at which I kind of push them to.
And they, you know, are all of asudden they're in front of
(24:52):
entire units and. Looking at them and you know
hoping that they're the experts that they've heard they are so
they take it very seriously and they they train a lot and you
know civil affairs soldiers going to the Special Forces
Advanced Urban Combat or Sophalic is be daunting right.
(25:13):
Do you have all SF guys that arethere and it's it's a
requirement for them and they don't all pass because it's very
difficult course so. Our guys are very serious.
They really want to they really want to improve themselves and
it's it's really a testament to all of their all of their
character and their hard work because it's yeah, they they all
these instructors really they they amazed me every day that we
(25:35):
were up there and you know beingin the Detachment like that is
very unique in that it's you have to be self motivated.
I can't, you know, as a overseeing as the NCIC or the
Detachment Sergeant, I can't. I can't be available at every
training event. There's training going on
constantly, every day, every week.
(25:57):
So those guys, you know, they, they're not the type of soldiers
that sit around and wait for someone to tell them to do
something. They go out and do it.
And a lot of times I get a lot of credit for all these great
things they do. But that's them.
They're going out and they're they're contacting people and
starting and developing these relationships and you know, like
I said, coming back with badges I've never heard of.
(26:17):
And so it's really. It's.
It's pretty pretty humbling to see these, these, these
instructors do what they do. Yeah, I just wanted to confirm
about the second place in the pistol so I could talk crap to a
bunch of BB. I have his buddy.
Staff Sergeant Promotable court is He was actually the first one
(26:41):
of the first people in the ASD. He reenlisted.
So. He came to the ASD and.
He's he basically him and some first class words started that
committee where they started that was the first thing we did
And yeah the things that they doare he he participates in
contests all the time. He's a nationally ranked shooter
(27:03):
and yeah he's he's the one that developed that that proprietary
0 target and you know yeah he's he's pretty good.
It's pretty good with a pistol and a rifle but especially a
pistol. Oh, that's great to hear.
That was crazy because we have so much talent inside of inside
(27:23):
of the brigade that it's just sitting there.
And that's one thing I'm like over the past six months since
the Civil Affairs Association started the, you know, me a
journal. And I've become involved in
that. Like the the stuff that's coming
out of the woodworks now, like all this talent that's just been
sitting there basically. And once they have an outlet to
do it, it's like. Really all you've got to do is
(27:45):
give them an end state, like this is what we're looking for.
And they go, you know, we just turned our the You Know Me
Journal's Instagram page over toa young staff Sergeant and I was
running it terribly, to be honest, for about a month.
I think we had like 12 followersor something ridiculous.
I don't know. Anyways, earlier this week, you
know, he's taking that from the 12 followers we had and
(28:08):
surpassed, you know, the Brigadefollowers now.
And you know me, a journalist and those followers on on
Instagram for for civil affairs and he's done that all on his
own, you know? Well, I find, you know, yeah,
you it's really and you're a good example of that all this
all these things that we've beendoing and if you think about it,
(28:28):
you would have never heard any of these things when I first
came to civil Affairs in 2012. Before that you certainly would
not have heard any of these things.
But these are all in my opinion or we you give people.
The ability to innovate and we talk about it, right, it's on
our, it's on the it's on our evaluation for is it to for
(28:49):
innovation. But you know do people really,
truly have the ability to to do those things And I found that
once you give them that opportunity, they will run with
it. And maybe it's not always
successful, but I found that, you know, I, I, I bring
instructors into the ASD after they're selected.
(29:11):
And I go over there initial counseling and I basically tell
them this is yours. Whatever you choose to do with
this, I'm oversight, but this isyours.
So I want them to take ownershipof it and I want them to take it
where I know it can go. And they really, I find once you
give younger NCO's in senior NCO's that that kind of freedom,
(29:35):
they can do amazing things and. Like I said, the ASD, I get a
lot of credit because I founded it and I started it.
But these instructors have done all of this work.
All these things are are a result of theirs, their blood,
sweat and tears, and it's prettyamazing.
So you're talking about the, youknow, bringing these instructors
up and you alluded to it a little bit earlier.
(29:57):
What's the process? So if there's a guy or gal
sitting somewhere in the brigadethat wants to.
Come up to be an instructor. Who do they?
Who do they contact now, and what do they need to do in order
to try to get up there? So they usually will send out
things and we talk about it all the time.
We have a quarterly newsletter we send out, we have a portal
(30:19):
page that's that's pretty user friendly and then we have the.
The. What we call soft cop, which is
the orientation program for the brigade that we do and what we
do is and we also brief the classes, the C8, the graduating
CAQC classes. So what we do is we tell people
that you know if you're looking to do something and your your
(30:39):
time obviously has to kind of match up to just contact us.
And I usually ask people to sendme their ERB and some of their
experience and why they want to be an instructor in the the
advanced skills attachment. So it's the process is simply
just send me an e-mail, I'll askfor ERB if they didn't send it
(31:00):
and then. Once you know you review their
their file you know we'll we'll bring them in and do an
interview. And the final the final decision
the the ASD instructor positionsas well as my position, those
are command selected positions. So the command * major actually
selects people and and approves them going to the ASD but the
(31:20):
operation * major at the brigadeis also involved so it's.
You know, it's a it's a good process.
Now it's hard to you know, in the beginning saying that hey,
we're going to interview you andyou're going to interview with
the command * major and people like.
What is this thing? But yeah, now it's it's much,
you know it's established and it's it's a real thing and.
(31:42):
So one of the things that you just you mentioned and I briefly
heard about it, but I don't knowif anybody else has.
So maybe have you described thata little bit you talked about
soft copy orientation program atthe brigade, what what exactly
is that? So I've got one of the first
things I did when I when I started the ASD concurrently,
you know, setting up the committee's, you know, getting
(32:04):
the instructors trained and you know, developing the programs of
instruction we were going to use.
One of the first things I started doing outside of that
was developing the A program. One of the things that I always
thought was the brigade did not do well.
Was. Bringing people into the
(32:25):
brigade, right, an orientation program or they, you would call
it indoctrination. I didn't like the idea of a
green platoon or anything like that, and I didn't want it to be
any kind of selection process. These people have already been
selected. So I thought it was very
important and something that I thought the brigade was missing.
So I started to develop this program and think about how.
(32:49):
I would want it to look if I were I think back to when I came
to the brigade which was much different.
But so I developed this program and it's the soft CA orientation
program which is soft cop. And what it is, is at this point
with within 60 days of of reporting to the brigade and in
the future hopefully before you even report to the brigade.
(33:12):
So while you're sitting there, you know as you're waiting to
report they would actually they can.
Come to soft cop and and go through soft cop and it will be
a requirement for all new members of brigade and we run
the pilot course last year, latelast year and it went great, got
all the feedback. So the next course I believe
will be in after it was supposedto be after this graduating
(33:37):
course but it'll probably be after the next one with
everything COVID and everything going on.
Basically what it is, is the introduction to the brigade you
get introduction briefings by. The the language lab, you get
all the different staff sectionsand what they do.
You get some training, development, the collective and
individual training from the S37.
(33:58):
The commands are major in the Colonel address the course, we
go over recruiting, obviously the ASD, the S3X things that we
thought people don't know what they are and you don't want
people sitting down in a battalion on a team not knowing
the resources they have at hand up at the brigade because.
As you know, and I know when we came to the brigade, I didn't
(34:18):
have in the battalion, I didn't have much interaction with the
brigade headquarters at all. I didn't think, I mean, the
brigade didn't provide us anything that I knew of.
So the brigade, the way it's setup now with a lot of good
people, you know, really transform that brigade into what
it is, is, you know, supporting these battalions.
(34:41):
So you want to make sure everybody comes and knows these
things and gets a good baseline.Now the same with civil
reconnaissance. You know the the, the key to
these training is to get everybody baseline trained.
The advanced stuff comes later. So give everyone that baseline
the knowledge of you know. A good example is I was in, I
(35:02):
grew up in the 91st. I didn't know what any other
battalion did aside from where they were.
I didn't know. I didn't know much about anyone
else because you're coming in your own world.
So we want. People to have a more broad
picture of a better picture of what the brigade does and what
these other battalions do and what we offer.
So they go through, it's two weeks of training and they'll
(35:23):
get advanced tactics introduction.
They'll get licensed on M Razor and the Hilux or the nonstandard
vehicle inventory. They'll go through all the staff
briefings like I talked about, and they'll also do a little bit
in processing things that we cantake care of and the main goal.
Aside from the baseline of training is to relieve the
(35:44):
burden of some of the companies.So these these people come to
the brigade and they do advancedmarksmanship.
They kind of get some of the stuff out of the way.
We also do the ACFT, so you knowthey get that, they get all
those things that otherwise companies would have to scramble
and kind of try to schedule which kind of gets in the way of
(36:07):
their own training plan, so. Who was successful?
The first, the pilot iteration of it and and I'm sure the next,
the next course will be even better and just continue to get
better. So you mentioned recruiting.
I did want to talk to you a little bit about that because I
know ASD is involved in that. You're mentioning Sword and you
(36:30):
guys have a pretty robust Instagram page.
I think you. Guys are over 2000 right now.
Followers on there. And if it's been anything like
the you know Mia journal has taken off to we there are people
from all over that are are you know army just other MO s's
that'll message us and be like how do I become CA you know what
do I got to do to be soft CA andwe can put them in contact with
(36:52):
so we're recruiters or put them in contact with mentors which is
something we've been doing find somebody with their prior MOS
and link them in. So maybe you can help talk a
little bit about that what you guys been doing with recruiting
and then maybe where they can gofind the.
The Instagram page for 95th ASD.It's 95th under score ASD that's
(37:12):
our ASD Instagram page And one of the things I did when I went
up to Brigade and you know at the same time of you know
standing up ASD and developing that.
I also we realized there was there's a gap, right there's a
gap in in recruiting and you cansee it if you know if you were
to look three years ago at some of the you know whether it's on
(37:35):
Facebook or Instagram or. The different pages, even the
the trifolds that you would see people hand out and those things
did not represent soft civil affairs.
And with recruiting you, you want to get people to want to be
civil affairs, right? And from my perspective, I
(37:56):
didn't think any of the things that the sword were were
producing were things that wouldmake me say, oh, I want to be
civil if I didn't know anything about it.
And that wasn't the fault of thesword.
That was the brigade not having a hand in the recruiting, right.
The sword was only going to put out what they have.
So the sword puts out pictures that is actually not a civil
(38:19):
affairs person. You know, those the famous
pictures of a guy or a girl justsitting down eating with
children or you know, handing somebody a soccer ball or
digging a well or, you know all those kinds of things that.
Was kind of a joke about civil affairs and not really showing
the other side of civil affairs and all the different things
(38:41):
that we do and what what we offer.
So aside from you know just linking up with the sword, I
actually established relationships with all sort of
recruiters. I traveled all over the world to
the sea sword recruiters and andI briefed every sword recruiter
and every sword station commander on.
(39:02):
You know Civil Affairs and and the the real picture of what
civil affairs does and is and the best way for them to
explain. A lot of places don't have civil
Affairs sword. Recruiters.
So one of the things that came out of that was some
disappointment in in our social media footprint and I actually
(39:24):
have to credit some first class deal one our senior tactics
instructor and he. Decided hey, we're doing all
this cool training like all the things that we do that we have
video and pictures and those arethe things people want to see.
So he went to the PAO and started the the Instagram page,
(39:46):
the ASD Instagram page and very quickly was over 2500 followers.
He's getting recruiting like requests for information from
you know just. People that are interested in
civil affairs and want to know what it is, you know, getting
contacted by use of stock and first special forces command and
(40:08):
it's really grown into something, you know, pretty big
and originally just started because he said.
I want, I want to put out these these pictures.
I want people to see what we're actually doing and it turned
into something that's actually turned into.
A. A valuable.
Recruiting tool and you know so that's it's.
You know I think it's it's againa testament to that if you give
(40:28):
them the freedom and they have the opportunity to to you know
look at you know how can I improve the branch and how can
I, how can I make these things better.
And they get to actually implement the things that they
they innovate and think of it's pretty amazing.
So again 95th under score ASD isthe Instagram page and encourage
everyone to go and at the very least see what the ASD is doing
(40:51):
and see if you know these are. You know, these are guys that
work very hard and pretty special.
Joe, I just want to say thanks for coming on in 95th A SD in
general what you have done and what what all the other
instructions done has been incredible over the last couple
years. I feel good about what we're
(41:11):
doing as a branch, you know the way that we are moving forward
and I think that 95th A SD has has had a huge role in that and
improving you know. I guess our not our own
perceptions, but just and not even improving, really just
getting the word out about what it is that we do and what we
offer. And that's I think that's helped
immensely with with soft CA recruiting.
(41:33):
And I and I honestly think that it's helped the other tribes and
1st SFC understand what it is that we bring to the table.
Like you're saying, it's not soccer balls and wells, there's
so much more. It goes back to the old, you
know, leave, leave everything better than the way you found
it. That's.
I was taught. That at A.
Young age as a young soldier. And it's once you get the
(41:55):
opportunity to actually do it and you can look back, and I can
now, right. I'm retiring and I look back at
what we did and it's pretty amazing right, that you know me
a journal, the 1C, a stuff that the advanced skills detachment,
the silver reconnaissance, all of these things.
You know. People can take for granted
while you're in it, right? You're just doing a job and
(42:15):
you're doing the best you can and you're trying to do all
these things, but you look back.And people are changing the
branch, people are changing the army, people are changing civil
affairs. And it's it's really amazing.
You get to look back and see that you did something that I
really believe all these instructors.
And I tell them, you know when when people would come to the
(42:38):
ASD to be an instructor, I wouldsay you have the chance to
change this brigade, to make this brigade everything you've
complained about for. You know, who knows how long you
actually have the chance to change it to to affect change in
a real way. And I'm in it and looking back,
it's pretty amazing. And seeing all the things that
(42:58):
have just happened in the last couple years, it's, I mean it's
it's big and I hope people realize all the things that that
people are doing and it's reallya testament to to the quality of
people that are coming into softcivil affairs.
And it's. Yeah, it's it's pretty cool to
(43:19):
see and I'll be very interested to come you know if I come back
and you know five years and justsee I, I I'm can't imagine what
it'll look like if it continues on this trajectory.
So a. 100% agree. And you know, thank you for all
the the hard work that you put into the branch.
I don't think you realize what an impact you've made and I hope
(43:41):
that you enjoy retirement down in Florida.
And soaking up some some rays, maybe getting on a boat, fishing
a little bit. And I won't be far from you
still hit me up if you ever wantto get out on a boat and go
fishing sometime. So thanks again man.
I really appreciate you coming on the One CA podcast and for
all you've done for the branch. I appreciate it.
Thank you. Thanks for listening.
If you get a chance, please likeand subscribe and rate the show
(44:03):
on your favorite podcast platform.
Also, if you're interested in coming on the show or hosting an
episode, e-mail us at capodcasting@gmail.com.
I'll have the e-mail and CA association website in the show
notes. And now most importantly to
those currently out in the fieldworking with a partner nation's
people or leadership to forward US relations.
(44:25):
Thank you all for what you're doing.
This is Jack, your host. Stay tuned for more great
episodes, one CA podcast.
Do you want to win some money? I bet you do.
Do you care about civil affairs?Yes, I know for sure.
Because you're listening to the show.
Check out the call for issue papers.
The new theme is campaigning andcivil affairs.
Some questions to answer includehow can see it contribute to
(00:26):
campaigning. Beyond policy, what changes can
better operationalize and integrate C A's role in
campaigning? How would CA even measure
progress in campaigning? And how would a full concept of
the CA role in campaigning applyto conflict prevention, security
cooperation, irregular or Gray zone warfare?
(00:46):
So put that thinking cap on and submit your papers by Friday 15
September. For more details, visit
civilaffairsasocial.org. Hi, this is Message for Jack.
This is John. You're doing a great job of the
show. It's really awesome.
We appreciate everything you've been putting out to the
(01:07):
community. So some older episodes that I'd
love for you to run back again. If you've got time one is the
95th CA Brigades Advanced SkillsDetachment.
That, of course, is John Mcellegate calling in to
recommend some episodes that deserve a second listen.
As you know, I use one week out of the month to bring in guest
(01:28):
shows that I think John has a great idea to also introduce
shows from the archives that complement today's topics.
So let's get started. All right.
Welcome to the One CA Podcast. I am your host, Shawn Acosta,
and today I have Joe Pistoric with me, who is the former NCIC
of the 95th Advanced Skills Detachment.
(01:51):
And today we're going to be talking a little bit about what
95th ASD offers for the 95th Civil Affairs Brigade and for
the greater civil affairs community.
So Joe, welcome to the to the One CA podcast.
Really appreciate you coming on.Yeah.
No thanks for having me. It's a pleasure.
So Joe, before we get started, could you just kind of give give
the audience A brief background on kind of your military
(02:14):
experience and why you came overto CA what you you've done in
your civil affairs career? Sure.
So join the Army in September of2000 as a chemical operations
specialist, I spent my first eight years in the 82nd Airborne
Division here at Fort Bragg in, let's see when Civil Affairs
(02:36):
Assessment Selection in 2011. I actually worked with Civil
affairs in Afghanistan in 2005 and 2006.
So you know glean some of the. Some of what they do and it's
different. It was reserved civil affairs,
but I was still very interestingto be able to you know, do the
things they were doing. So 2012 graduated the civil
(03:00):
affairs qualification course wassent to the 91st as a team
member and team Sergeant I, we deployed to East Africa and you
know, Somalia, Kenya, Uganda andDjibouti and then.
Moved on to the as a cmark into IC or Operations Sergeant,
(03:22):
Deployed a company to North and West Africa and served in the
Special Operations Command forward in North and West
Africa. And then in September of 17, I
was asked to go up to the Brigade Headquarters and start
the 95th Advanced Skills Detachment and that's where I
(03:44):
worked for my last three years. And now it's on to retirement.
So that's where I'm at now. Some some people may not be
familiar with the Advanced Skills Detachment.
I mean, you were saying that it just stood up in 2017, so in
late 2017. So really it's only been around
for about 2 1/2 years. Maybe you could explain a little
(04:07):
bit more about like how that came to be, how it was created
and and some of the different things that it that it offers.
Yeah. So in 2017, I was looking to
come out of the operation starting position and star Major
Derek Riley asked me if I would come up to the brigade and start
(04:27):
the Advanced Skills Detachment. The Advanced Skills Detachment,
It's not a new thing, right? We didn't invent it.
Colonel Burnett, the former Brigade commander, actually
wrote it in to the, you know, five year plan, I want to say in
2000. 14 or 15, maybe 13 when hewas up at Proponent and it takes
(04:49):
a while to, you know, get started.
All the groups started as, you know, Sophalic Detachments and
then you know, grew into advanced skills companies.
So we had to start somewhere. So the Advanced Skills
Detachment was I went up there in September of 2017, you know,
from just an Idea. Inception to actually manning
(05:12):
and and beginning training. We actually started training in
March of 2018, so we started with just basic committees of
tactics, mobility, combatives and at the time we did a Civil
Information Management slash Human Network analysis
(05:35):
committee. And that's grown into what it is
today, which we still have advanced tactics, mobility,
combatives. We also manage the civilian
trainer integrators up at Brigade for counter ID and
counter UAS. And there's now a civil
reconnaissance, advanced Civil Reconnaissance Committee.
(05:56):
So you know from what it startedto what it is it we went through
a lot. It was difficult, but I think
well worth it. So you're talking about some of
these committees that you began with.
Has anything evolved from that? I know you, I've seen some stuff
the training catalog offers you know, advanced tactics, some
unconmissional warfare stuff andyou guys are even getting into
(06:19):
some counter UAS as well. So is there there anything
outside of like the typical shoot move, communicate civil
affairs I guess skills that you guys offer?
Sure. Yeah.
So you know we started my, my goal was to really what the,
the, the charter of the AdvancedSkills detachment was to offer
(06:41):
internally resourced and manned instructed training comparable
to a contracted training. So to save money a lot of the
training have become you know itit's sort of infiltrated its way
into the brigade and became the norm so.
You know, we started with my, mygoal was to start, you know, I
(07:03):
didn't want to to move to failure too quickly.
So I thought if we start with the basics with shoot, move,
communicate, medicate, that was the the way to success that has
grown into aside from those things that are still running
and still, you know, doing greatthings and evolving every day.
Now we added the silver reconnaissance piece and I said
(07:25):
we started with the H and a kindof committee the idea.
Was to you know offer training that that generally was it's
really one of our core tasks butit was you know difficult to get
a lot of people in the training.It was expensive.
It didn't really work what we did we we ended up just
(07:46):
facilitating training for a lot of the for social network
analysis and critical infrastructure vulnerability
assessment but that. Through into what is now civil
reconnaissance which is you knowit's it's growing rapidly.
So one of you know commands on Major Swaggert's initiatives in
(08:09):
in coming up to be operations before he was the brigade.
So our major was to figure out how to offer the civil
reconnaissance training we have Civil reconnaissance is one of
our core tasks right. But there was really there
really wasn't any any formal training that you could.
You could participate in and come out of it and say okay I'm
trained in civil reconnaissance it was just kind of well all
(08:32):
these things we did Now I I knowcivil reconnaissance but adding
in the you know army reconnaissance and the
principles of reconnaissance andthen adding in like you had
talked about the the UAS and counter UAS as a reconnaissance.
You know resource was very important to us and it's
actually worked out really well.They're they're doing a lot of
(08:53):
training now with. Units from all over uses are you
know, especially now with you know the way things are there's
you know well over 80 students that sign up for these courses
from civil affairs, SIOP, special forces groups, you know
a WG from everywhere. So it's it's really grown into
(09:13):
something pretty special. That's great to hear, especially
with the the Silver Constance piece.
I know being at Special Warfare Center in school like we teach.
A very and and I'll just be frank a very a rudimentary form
of civil reconnaissance. I was happy when the additional
(09:34):
10 weeks for soft civil affairs was implemented into the pathway
They they were able to go into alittle bit more in depth talking
about the you know principles ofreconnaissance and so on like
you guys are like you were discussing and I think one of
the biggest issues that we've had in CA is not having a.
I guess an additional course, I'm hesitant to say advanced
(09:54):
course, but an additional coursefor those currently serving that
come back on it and kind of refine or hone those additional
skills like social network analysis etcetera.
I think a lot of times we focus a lot on gathering the
information, but then we don't focus so much on, on analyzing
and then refining and modeling that information so that we can
use it for targeting and other things later on and sharing that
(10:18):
with other communities. And that's one of the things we
figured out was you know civil reconnaissance, when you say
that and you tell people we do that, it really encompasses a
lot of different things, right. It's so Army reconnaissance is
they they have their principles and how they train.
What we did was we got former 19D Cav scouts and said you know
(10:40):
reconnaissance right now you also know civil affairs.
So let's let's meld these two things together and figure out
the best way to do it And we've added.
PAO does photography training during the course.
The bargaining officers do non lethal targeting and targeting
principles. The S2 comes and does
intelligence integration. So it's all really it's it's
(11:03):
really, you know all the plethora of things that go into
when you add the civil in front of reconnaissance.
It's it's a really good course and I think it's only going to
get better. I think you brought up another
good point too with ASD and whatit offers.
And that was the like the being able to kind of steer away from
the contracting portion. I know when I first came to CA
(11:25):
and got to a unit 2012, like people were talking about how we
need to do this training. Let's go to Griffin group for
this. And in my head as a young NCL is
like, why aren't why aren't we doing this?
Like, I thought this was a wholepurpose of having
noncommissioned officers. So, like, it's for me.
I only have positive things to say about ASD and and what what
(11:46):
you guys have done. I think that it's it's giving
the onus back to the Nco's inside of our regiment which is
great. You know as you see the guys
that are get trained on this either at the unit level and
they can spread that knowledge or the the instructors
themselves once they're once they're done with their time at
ASD go back to the operational. You know all this knowledge is
now institutionalized or becoming institutionalized in
the brigade. So I think that's great and.
(12:09):
That's that's really. As like you had talked about as
a not a young NCO but a young civil affairs specialist, I I
realized that and I'll say a quick story.
I went to a company to do training for predeployment.
It was basically and a requirement to deploy.
We went out and had a, you know,a guy from the Delta Force and
(12:34):
he teach you basic pistol marksmanship and it really
bothered me that. You know NC O's train and lead
soldiers, what we do, I've invented my whole career and I
didn't understand. There are certain things you
know that that require some someoutsourcing.
But for the most part the thingsthat we've been doing in civil
affairs could be done by NC O's.And the added benefit is that
(12:56):
not only can NC O's do this on several fronts, it improves our
force. So you have the NC O's that are
being trained and highly specialized areas of of training
and instruction. So as you said, they go back to
the force that much better. We already have, you know,
instructors that have gone back to units and they they train
those units at a higher level than they've ever been trained.
(13:19):
And the other thing is I think people kind of misses when when
you send a team or a company to arrange as an example and they
see these, these instructors from their own unit that guys
that they've known and worked with.
And they see them teaching these, you know, very highly
(13:40):
advanced tactics and and weaponstraining and different things
that they do. And they're so impressed by it.
And what that does is it empowers those NCO's to also
realize that hey, I can do that stuff too.
I can, I can actually do what I'm supposed to do.
And it gives them confidence andinstills that, that that idea
(14:00):
that. You know, you don't have to to
figure out who you have to pay to be trained.
For the most part you can do it internally and that's that's
really an added benefit of the advanced skills attachment A.
100% agree. And I think that's that's key to
what you're saying, like instilling that confidence not
(14:22):
only in themselves, but you know, when the other guys in
that unit look around, they're like, okay, yeah, we've got some
guys in here that are knowledgeable.
They know what they're talking about.
And I think this continues to professionalize the regiment.
Absolutely. And those guys, they want to,
after they attend ASD training, I get, oh, I did get emails
(14:43):
constantly, three or four a weekof guys saying, hey, how can I
come to the ASD and be an instructor.
I was, you know, I have this experience and I want to do this
and so many that we actually turn people away and say, hey,
you know, we have to actually dopackets and have a select, which
is not how it started, right. So that's really good.
It shows you that you know, people want to train and people
(15:04):
are interested in taking ownership of the training for
their team. So it's it's really good.
I'm sure Battalion Csm's love that, all their guys trying to
come up to the ASD. Yeah, there's a.
There's a point of contention atyou know, you got on the one
hand, they're like, why do you need the ASD to train you?
(15:26):
You should be doing this yourself, which?
Is the goal right? It's not train the trainer in
the sense of certifying guys to train, but it is giving them the
tools to be better trainers and better NCO's and officers.
So yeah, you know, like anything, all the summer ages,
they're not looking to go with their best people to leave.
(15:47):
So it's it can be tough, but we've had pretty good support
over the years. So you guys not only train 95th,
but I saw I think it was a few months back where you guys are
trained at 412th CA Battalion aswell, which is a part of KPOC.
Was that a, was that coordinatedor was that by chance or how did
(16:08):
that, how did that training event work out?
Yeah. So from the beginning of the the
Advanced Skills Detachment, whatwe found very quickly was that.
The brigade was not the only unit that were looking for, you
know, this sort of training and we forget sometimes being in
(16:28):
special operations that not a lot of units just have all this
money to throw around to, to payfor, you know, $25,000 for some
some weapons training for three days.
So. We started out, you know, very
quickly training units from all over the United States, actually
getting, you know, requests to. You know send our guys down to
(16:50):
you know, Savannah, we sent our guys to San Antonio, we sent our
guys to Fort Sam Houston. You know our instructors have
gone all over the place and partof that you know that the
networking and marketing that you have to do with the new unit
of the the you know the 83rd wasan I I saw it as very important
(17:11):
to offer this training. And to be successful, the ASD
would have to market itself. We would have to advertise and
market and prove that it was a viable, a real option to be
comparable to contracted training so that commanders and
and everyone else would know that this is a legitimate, you
(17:33):
know programs of instruction that they could use to actually
validate teams. The 412 CA battalion which we've
trained with twice now that cameout of.
Of the brigades validation exercise, the operation
Stockham. So what had happened as the 4/12
was participating in Stockham once they learned that the
advanced skills attachment, the tactics instructors were going
(17:55):
to be there. They you know asked if you know
they could they could participate in a range and we
thought it was very important toto help them and show their
commander and their their NCO's that.
What the 95th is offering in terms of a SD and training.
So yeah, they did go down there.They got advanced skills or
(18:18):
advanced tactics training and combat management, marksmanship
system and low visibility training with concealed pistol
training and a lot of training that they don't get to get very
often. And what was really good about
it is, you know, aside from the glowing.
You know the glowing review of of the training and how how well
(18:39):
it went and how much they liked it.
We actually had tangible scoringdata to show their commander how
they improved from day one when they did these marksmanship
tables to the last day when theyactually it was a 99%
improvement. So only one one of their members
(19:00):
didn't get worse but didn't improve markedly so.
You know, being able to show a commander a tangible, you know,
the training improvement in a ina percentage, they were very
impressed by that and they we'vetrained with them since and I've
planned to train with them again.
(19:21):
This is very good. That's great to hear because I
know recently there's been a lotof talk about integrating active
duty and KPOC and I think it's important that we continue to
kind of integrate. Yeah, and it helps with
relationships, right? I absolutely we've reached out.
So social network analysis training are suet training that
(19:42):
we do the Unconventional Warfareexponential training.
We've actually, I invite guys from 3rd and 7th and 10th and
5th group by SIOP guys, guys from the 83rd.
So we try to get all these unitsand it's on a few levels to show
that you know the cooperation isvery important to me.
I always wanted to. I believe we're one team.
(20:05):
I know people say it and they don't always, you know, practice
what they preach. But I feel like it's very
important to to, you know, help out these other units and
especially when you get to like the 83rd is a good example.
They got, you know, with Forcecom and you know, being
under the MP brigade, they're the same people we are, right.
(20:26):
So I thought it was very important to offer them some of
these trains that they didn't have to pay for.
That they could get these skillsand come back and you know
again, hopefully, you know, spread to the word about the ASD
and and and how how good the training was.
So you guys, I mean we're talking about these, you know
the relationships with the 83rd and then I used to kpoch, but
(20:47):
you guys have also been able to establish some relationships
outside of that. I know from your Instagram page
there's been a, it looks like you guys have developed a pretty
close relationship with the Armyand Worksmanship Unit.
So how did that come to being? What are you?
I'm assuming, probably rightfully so, that it has a lot
to do with, you know, pistol andlong gun stuff, but how does
(21:10):
that relationship work out? Yeah, so the another thing we
did which was on a couple, on a couple of different levels was
recruiting was something that I also kind of took hold of and as
a recruiting lead for the brigade to try to liaise between
the the SORB and. You know, civil affairs
recruiting and make sure the brigade had a had a voice in
(21:32):
recruiting. So I thought sending our our
instructors, our tactics instructors to in combat it, we
send all our guys to different things.
But the tactics instructors specifically, I thought sending
them to national shooting championships and different
events would help with recruiting.
(21:53):
It would help with our guys, ourinstructors being.
You know, developing and improving their proficiency and
also it's a good incentive and it's good to say hey the, you
know a SD tactics instructor wassecond in the use of stock
pistol championship and you knowthe our two instructors have,
(22:15):
you know, developed these relationships with the AM U
through these, you know through these events and what came of it
was the AM U Sergeant major. Actually contacted me to tell me
how impressed he was with our with our tactics instructors
during the event. And you know our our instructors
(22:37):
really wanted to go over there and see that's that's who you go
to when you talk about marksmanship and you know the
the different things that they're doing, the innovative
things they're doing with marksmanship.
So they brought our our instructors over and they toured
their facility and gave them a lot of ideas, things that we use
today. We developed a zero target
(22:59):
system that one of our instructors was, you know, had
been working on for a while and they actually adopted it and
took it. And so all those things were
very, very good for that relationship as well as the Army
Remarksmanship Units Commission is.
So for us and so affairs, recruiting is very important.
So it helped on a lot of different levels and that
(23:21):
relationship has only improved and I'm sure we'll continue for
for a very long time. That's a credit to the
instructors and you know the those those instructors that
went down there and and did all those things.
The tactics instructors took second in the You Suck Pistol
Championship. Yeah.
So one of our tactics instructors was second place in
(23:43):
the pistol and basic pistol championship are two of our two
other instructors. Our tactics instructors actually
went to the. The President's 100, The annual
President's 100, and up near Lake Erie, they were in the top
30% for the nation in rifle and then a little higher in pistol,
(24:09):
but still pretty good. And one of our instructors
actually was awarded the US ArmyExcellence in Competition badge
for pistol marksmanship, and I didn't know that badge existed.
Right. So until he showed me this badge
I had, I've never heard of it. I didn't know what it was and
(24:32):
it's, it's permanent orders and it's an actual award that he
gets to wear. And so that's really and that's
their work. They work on their own time.
They're very, very, very seriousabout, you know, being in front
of in the level that they're at which I kind of push them to.
And they, you know, are all of asudden they're in front of
(24:52):
entire units and. Looking at them and you know
hoping that they're the experts that they've heard they are so
they take it very seriously and they they train a lot and you
know civil affairs soldiers going to the Special Forces
Advanced Urban Combat or Sophalic is be daunting right.
(25:13):
Do you have all SF guys that arethere and it's it's a
requirement for them and they don't all pass because it's very
difficult course so. Our guys are very serious.
They really want to they really want to improve themselves and
it's it's really a testament to all of their all of their
character and their hard work because it's yeah, they they all
these instructors really they they amazed me every day that we
(25:35):
were up there and you know beingin the Detachment like that is
very unique in that it's you have to be self motivated.
I can't, you know, as a overseeing as the NCIC or the
Detachment Sergeant, I can't. I can't be available at every
training event. There's training going on
constantly, every day, every week.
(25:57):
So those guys, you know, they, they're not the type of soldiers
that sit around and wait for someone to tell them to do
something. They go out and do it.
And a lot of times I get a lot of credit for all these great
things they do. But that's them.
They're going out and they're they're contacting people and
starting and developing these relationships and you know, like
I said, coming back with badges I've never heard of.
(26:17):
And so it's really. It's.
It's pretty pretty humbling to see these, these, these
instructors do what they do. Yeah, I just wanted to confirm
about the second place in the pistol so I could talk crap to a
bunch of BB. I have his buddy.
Staff Sergeant Promotable court is He was actually the first one
(26:41):
of the first people in the ASD. He reenlisted.
So. He came to the ASD and.
He's he basically him and some first class words started that
committee where they started that was the first thing we did
And yeah the things that they doare he he participates in
contests all the time. He's a nationally ranked shooter
(27:03):
and yeah he's he's the one that developed that that proprietary
0 target and you know yeah he's he's pretty good.
It's pretty good with a pistol and a rifle but especially a
pistol. Oh, that's great to hear.
That was crazy because we have so much talent inside of inside
(27:23):
of the brigade that it's just sitting there.
And that's one thing I'm like over the past six months since
the Civil Affairs Association started the, you know, me a
journal. And I've become involved in
that. Like the the stuff that's coming
out of the woodworks now, like all this talent that's just been
sitting there basically. And once they have an outlet to
do it, it's like. Really all you've got to do is
(27:45):
give them an end state, like this is what we're looking for.
And they go, you know, we just turned our the You Know Me
Journal's Instagram page over toa young staff Sergeant and I was
running it terribly, to be honest, for about a month.
I think we had like 12 followersor something ridiculous.
I don't know. Anyways, earlier this week, you
know, he's taking that from the 12 followers we had and
(28:08):
surpassed, you know, the Brigadefollowers now.
And you know me, a journalist and those followers on on
Instagram for for civil affairs and he's done that all on his
own, you know? Well, I find, you know, yeah,
you it's really and you're a good example of that all this
all these things that we've beendoing and if you think about it,
(28:28):
you would have never heard any of these things when I first
came to civil Affairs in 2012. Before that you certainly would
not have heard any of these things.
But these are all in my opinion or we you give people.
The ability to innovate and we talk about it, right, it's on
our, it's on the it's on our evaluation for is it to for
(28:49):
innovation. But you know do people really,
truly have the ability to to do those things And I found that
once you give them that opportunity, they will run with
it. And maybe it's not always
successful, but I found that, you know, I, I, I bring
instructors into the ASD after they're selected.
(29:11):
And I go over there initial counseling and I basically tell
them this is yours. Whatever you choose to do with
this, I'm oversight, but this isyours.
So I want them to take ownershipof it and I want them to take it
where I know it can go. And they really, I find once you
give younger NCO's in senior NCO's that that kind of freedom,
(29:35):
they can do amazing things and. Like I said, the ASD, I get a
lot of credit because I founded it and I started it.
But these instructors have done all of this work.
All these things are are a result of theirs, their blood,
sweat and tears, and it's prettyamazing.
So you're talking about the, youknow, bringing these instructors
up and you alluded to it a little bit earlier.
(29:57):
What's the process? So if there's a guy or gal
sitting somewhere in the brigadethat wants to.
Come up to be an instructor. Who do they?
Who do they contact now, and what do they need to do in order
to try to get up there? So they usually will send out
things and we talk about it all the time.
We have a quarterly newsletter we send out, we have a portal
(30:19):
page that's that's pretty user friendly and then we have the.
The. What we call soft cop, which is
the orientation program for the brigade that we do and what we
do is and we also brief the classes, the C8, the graduating
CAQC classes. So what we do is we tell people
that you know if you're looking to do something and your your
(30:39):
time obviously has to kind of match up to just contact us.
And I usually ask people to sendme their ERB and some of their
experience and why they want to be an instructor in the the
advanced skills attachment. So it's the process is simply
just send me an e-mail, I'll askfor ERB if they didn't send it
(31:00):
and then. Once you know you review their
their file you know we'll we'll bring them in and do an
interview. And the final the final decision
the the ASD instructor positionsas well as my position, those
are command selected positions. So the command * major actually
selects people and and approves them going to the ASD but the
(31:20):
operation * major at the brigadeis also involved so it's.
You know, it's a it's a good process.
Now it's hard to you know, in the beginning saying that hey,
we're going to interview you andyou're going to interview with
the command * major and people like.
What is this thing? But yeah, now it's it's much,
you know it's established and it's it's a real thing and.
(31:42):
So one of the things that you just you mentioned and I briefly
heard about it, but I don't knowif anybody else has.
So maybe have you described thata little bit you talked about
soft copy orientation program atthe brigade, what what exactly
is that? So I've got one of the first
things I did when I when I started the ASD concurrently,
you know, setting up the committee's, you know, getting
(32:04):
the instructors trained and you know, developing the programs of
instruction we were going to use.
One of the first things I started doing outside of that
was developing the A program. One of the things that I always
thought was the brigade did not do well.
Was. Bringing people into the
(32:25):
brigade, right, an orientation program or they, you would call
it indoctrination. I didn't like the idea of a
green platoon or anything like that, and I didn't want it to be
any kind of selection process. These people have already been
selected. So I thought it was very
important and something that I thought the brigade was missing.
So I started to develop this program and think about how.
(32:49):
I would want it to look if I were I think back to when I came
to the brigade which was much different.
But so I developed this program and it's the soft CA orientation
program which is soft cop. And what it is, is at this point
with within 60 days of of reporting to the brigade and in
the future hopefully before you even report to the brigade.
(33:12):
So while you're sitting there, you know as you're waiting to
report they would actually they can.
Come to soft cop and and go through soft cop and it will be
a requirement for all new members of brigade and we run
the pilot course last year, latelast year and it went great, got
all the feedback. So the next course I believe
will be in after it was supposedto be after this graduating
(33:37):
course but it'll probably be after the next one with
everything COVID and everything going on.
Basically what it is, is the introduction to the brigade you
get introduction briefings by. The the language lab, you get
all the different staff sectionsand what they do.
You get some training, development, the collective and
individual training from the S37.
(33:58):
The commands are major in the Colonel address the course, we
go over recruiting, obviously the ASD, the S3X things that we
thought people don't know what they are and you don't want
people sitting down in a battalion on a team not knowing
the resources they have at hand up at the brigade because.
As you know, and I know when we came to the brigade, I didn't
(34:18):
have in the battalion, I didn't have much interaction with the
brigade headquarters at all. I didn't think, I mean, the
brigade didn't provide us anything that I knew of.
So the brigade, the way it's setup now with a lot of good
people, you know, really transform that brigade into what
it is, is, you know, supporting these battalions.
(34:41):
So you want to make sure everybody comes and knows these
things and gets a good baseline.Now the same with civil
reconnaissance. You know the the, the key to
these training is to get everybody baseline trained.
The advanced stuff comes later. So give everyone that baseline
the knowledge of you know. A good example is I was in, I
(35:02):
grew up in the 91st. I didn't know what any other
battalion did aside from where they were.
I didn't know. I didn't know much about anyone
else because you're coming in your own world.
So we want. People to have a more broad
picture of a better picture of what the brigade does and what
these other battalions do and what we offer.
So they go through, it's two weeks of training and they'll
(35:23):
get advanced tactics introduction.
They'll get licensed on M Razor and the Hilux or the nonstandard
vehicle inventory. They'll go through all the staff
briefings like I talked about, and they'll also do a little bit
in processing things that we cantake care of and the main goal.
Aside from the baseline of training is to relieve the
(35:44):
burden of some of the companies.So these these people come to
the brigade and they do advancedmarksmanship.
They kind of get some of the stuff out of the way.
We also do the ACFT, so you knowthey get that, they get all
those things that otherwise companies would have to scramble
and kind of try to schedule which kind of gets in the way of
(36:07):
their own training plan, so. Who was successful?
The first, the pilot iteration of it and and I'm sure the next,
the next course will be even better and just continue to get
better. So you mentioned recruiting.
I did want to talk to you a little bit about that because I
know ASD is involved in that. You're mentioning Sword and you
(36:30):
guys have a pretty robust Instagram page.
I think you. Guys are over 2000 right now.
Followers on there. And if it's been anything like
the you know Mia journal has taken off to we there are people
from all over that are are you know army just other MO s's
that'll message us and be like how do I become CA you know what
do I got to do to be soft CA andwe can put them in contact with
(36:52):
so we're recruiters or put them in contact with mentors which is
something we've been doing find somebody with their prior MOS
and link them in. So maybe you can help talk a
little bit about that what you guys been doing with recruiting
and then maybe where they can gofind the.
The Instagram page for 95th ASD.It's 95th under score ASD that's
(37:12):
our ASD Instagram page And one of the things I did when I went
up to Brigade and you know at the same time of you know
standing up ASD and developing that.
I also we realized there was there's a gap, right there's a
gap in in recruiting and you cansee it if you know if you were
to look three years ago at some of the you know whether it's on
(37:35):
Facebook or Instagram or. The different pages, even the
the trifolds that you would see people hand out and those things
did not represent soft civil affairs.
And with recruiting you, you want to get people to want to be
civil affairs, right? And from my perspective, I
(37:56):
didn't think any of the things that the sword were were
producing were things that wouldmake me say, oh, I want to be
civil if I didn't know anything about it.
And that wasn't the fault of thesword.
That was the brigade not having a hand in the recruiting, right.
The sword was only going to put out what they have.
So the sword puts out pictures that is actually not a civil
(38:19):
affairs person. You know, those the famous
pictures of a guy or a girl justsitting down eating with
children or you know, handing somebody a soccer ball or
digging a well or, you know all those kinds of things that.
Was kind of a joke about civil affairs and not really showing
the other side of civil affairs and all the different things
(38:41):
that we do and what what we offer.
So aside from you know just linking up with the sword, I
actually established relationships with all sort of
recruiters. I traveled all over the world to
the sea sword recruiters and andI briefed every sword recruiter
and every sword station commander on.
(39:02):
You know Civil Affairs and and the the real picture of what
civil affairs does and is and the best way for them to
explain. A lot of places don't have civil
Affairs sword. Recruiters.
So one of the things that came out of that was some
disappointment in in our social media footprint and I actually
(39:24):
have to credit some first class deal one our senior tactics
instructor and he. Decided hey, we're doing all
this cool training like all the things that we do that we have
video and pictures and those arethe things people want to see.
So he went to the PAO and started the the Instagram page,
(39:46):
the ASD Instagram page and very quickly was over 2500 followers.
He's getting recruiting like requests for information from
you know just. People that are interested in
civil affairs and want to know what it is, you know, getting
contacted by use of stock and first special forces command and
(40:08):
it's really grown into something, you know, pretty big
and originally just started because he said.
I want, I want to put out these these pictures.
I want people to see what we're actually doing and it turned
into something that's actually turned into.
A. A valuable.
Recruiting tool and you know so that's it's.
You know I think it's it's againa testament to that if you give
(40:28):
them the freedom and they have the opportunity to to you know
look at you know how can I improve the branch and how can
I, how can I make these things better.
And they get to actually implement the things that they
they innovate and think of it's pretty amazing.
So again 95th under score ASD isthe Instagram page and encourage
everyone to go and at the very least see what the ASD is doing
(40:51):
and see if you know these are. You know, these are guys that
work very hard and pretty special.
Joe, I just want to say thanks for coming on in 95th A SD in
general what you have done and what what all the other
instructions done has been incredible over the last couple
years. I feel good about what we're
(41:11):
doing as a branch, you know the way that we are moving forward
and I think that 95th A SD has has had a huge role in that and
improving you know. I guess our not our own
perceptions, but just and not even improving, really just
getting the word out about what it is that we do and what we
offer. And that's I think that's helped
immensely with with soft CA recruiting.
(41:33):
And I and I honestly think that it's helped the other tribes and
1st SFC understand what it is that we bring to the table.
Like you're saying, it's not soccer balls and wells, there's
so much more. It goes back to the old, you
know, leave, leave everything better than the way you found
it. That's.
I was taught. That at A.
Young age as a young soldier. And it's once you get the
(41:55):
opportunity to actually do it and you can look back, and I can
now, right. I'm retiring and I look back at
what we did and it's pretty amazing right, that you know me
a journal, the 1C, a stuff that the advanced skills detachment,
the silver reconnaissance, all of these things.
You know. People can take for granted
while you're in it, right? You're just doing a job and
(42:15):
you're doing the best you can and you're trying to do all
these things, but you look back.And people are changing the
branch, people are changing the army, people are changing civil
affairs. And it's it's really amazing.
You get to look back and see that you did something that I
really believe all these instructors.
And I tell them, you know when when people would come to the
(42:38):
ASD to be an instructor, I wouldsay you have the chance to
change this brigade, to make this brigade everything you've
complained about for. You know, who knows how long you
actually have the chance to change it to to affect change in
a real way. And I'm in it and looking back,
it's pretty amazing. And seeing all the things that
(42:58):
have just happened in the last couple years, it's, I mean it's
it's big and I hope people realize all the things that that
people are doing and it's reallya testament to to the quality of
people that are coming into softcivil affairs.
And it's. Yeah, it's it's pretty cool to
(43:19):
see and I'll be very interested to come you know if I come back
and you know five years and justsee I, I I'm can't imagine what
it'll look like if it continues on this trajectory.
So a. 100% agree. And you know, thank you for all
the the hard work that you put into the branch.
I don't think you realize what an impact you've made and I hope
(43:41):
that you enjoy retirement down in Florida.
And soaking up some some rays, maybe getting on a boat, fishing
a little bit. And I won't be far from you
still hit me up if you ever wantto get out on a boat and go
fishing sometime. So thanks again man.
I really appreciate you coming on the One CA podcast and for
all you've done for the branch. I appreciate it.
Thank you. Thanks for listening.
If you get a chance, please likeand subscribe and rate the show
(44:03):
on your favorite podcast platform.
Also, if you're interested in coming on the show or hosting an
episode, e-mail us at capodcasting@gmail.com.
I'll have the e-mail and CA association website in the show
notes. And now most importantly to
those currently out in the fieldworking with a partner nation's
people or leadership to forward US relations.
(44:25):
Thank you all for what you're doing.
This is Jack, your host. Stay tuned for more great
episodes, one CA podcast.
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