December 14, 2024 • 46 mins
Join us this Saturday for our last live Open Line of 2024. We'll study the Scripures together and learn about the Savior whose birth we celebrate during this Christmas season. Ask Dr. Michael Rydelnik your questions about the Incarnation, messianic prophecy, King Herod, and Mary and Joseph and be a part of our Christmas Bible study across the airwaves.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
S1 (00:09):
Hello friends. It's time for the second hour of Open
Line with Doctor Michael Radonich Moody Radio's Bible Study Across America.
We're talking about your questions about the Bible, God and
the spiritual life. My name is Michael Ray Dolnick. I'm
a professor of Jewish studies and Bible at Moody Bible Institute,
also the academic dean there. And I'm so glad to
(00:31):
be sitting around the radio kitchen table with you, taking
your questions. Time to give me a call. (877) 548-3675 is
our number. That's (877) 548-3675. Remember, if you can't call, you
can always go to our website openline radio.org. Click on
(00:51):
Ask Michael a question and post your question there. Trish
will put it in the mailbag. And if you ask
a really good Christmas question. She'll try and get it
in today on the mailbag, even today if you do it.
But it's only got to be. You can ask any question,
but if you want it today, you got to try
to get a Christmas question in. I hope you have
(01:12):
your Bibles open, and I have my second cup of
coffee here. We're ready to talk about the scriptures. We're
going to go right back to the phones, to Amy
in Chicago listening on Wmbi. Welcome to Open Line, Amy.
How can I help you today?
S2 (01:26):
Morning, brother. God bless you. Um. You too. Only on
your second cup of coffee. I'm way ahead of you, man,
but I'm on about my 12th. So listen, yesterday we
were reading in Jeremiah 33, and I was a little
surprised at this. It says that, uh, David will never
(01:50):
lack a man to sit on the throne, and there
will never be a lack of priests through offering Offerings
and sacrifices, presumably in the temple. And and you know,
God says, this is my covenant. It'll never be broken.
And I was just thinking how I'm confused. And my
husband and I said, oh, we got to call Doctor
(02:10):
Rydell because, oh, good.
S1 (02:12):
Thank you for doing that, I appreciate it. Uh. Happy
to happy to answer. Uh, here's the deal. Let's start
with the priest. After the temple was destroyed and there
no longer any sacrifices, there was always the anticipation that
there was a, uh, a priest that would that we
(02:32):
would need priests to offer sacrifices again because the temple
would be rebuilt. And so, as a result, every generation
of Jewish people have passed on from generation to generation,
whether they are a priest or a Levite. So, for example,
I know that I'm a Levi, a Levite. My dad
told me that that's part of my name, actually, because
(02:54):
I'm the son of my Hebrew name says Son of
Isaac the Levite, which makes me a Levite. Okay. And
so that's been passed on for a couple thousand years now.
Generation to generation of Jewish people. So we know who
the priests and Levites, you see it in Jewish names.
If you see someone named Levi. That's Levi. Yes. You see.
S3 (03:15):
It in.
S1 (03:15):
Right? Kohen means priest. So we know Kohen. Uh, and
on my mom's side, I was a Kohen. But my
mom was a kohen because that was her family's line. However,
you get it from the dad. So though my mom,
a Kohen, a priest, married a Levite, their children were Levites. Okay.
(03:40):
So that's that's how it passes down. Okay. Uh, but there.
So there's never been a priest lacking. Israel has priests.
We just don't have a temple to offer sacrifice. Now,
when the. When the Davidic line ended, there's always been
the rightful king to come from the Davidic line. There's
never been a person lacking to sit on the throne
(04:02):
of David. The problem is the throne of David has
not been established. So, for example, Zerubbabel, who plays a
prominent role, for example, in the book of Zechariah and
that and also in the book of Haggai. Zerubbabel was
from the line of David. He was the scion, scion,
(04:22):
the descendant of David, that would have sit on, sat
on the throne, but there was no throne of David allowed.
So therefore, even when there wasn't a king, there was
always someone from the line of David available until the
coming of the messianic King. And he is the fulfillment
of that line. And there's still no one lacking to
sit on the throne because he will return. When you
(04:45):
read Isaiah nine six, we always look at Isaiah nine
six and it says that unto us a son is born,
unto us a child is given. That's clearly talking about
the first coming of the Messiah, his birth for us. However,
verse seven, there's I believe there's a huge gap between
Isaiah nine six and nine seven. Nine seven will be
(05:08):
fulfilled when he returns. It says his dominion will be
vast and its prosperity will never end. This king who
is born from the line of David. He will reign
on the throne of David and over his kingdom to
establish and sustain it with justice and righteousness. So the
messianic King is going to sit on the throne of David.
(05:29):
So we don't lack a person to sit on the
throne of David. We just need to wait for it
to be established. Okay.
S2 (05:36):
Mm. Okay. All right. Well, thank you very much.
S1 (05:40):
Yep. Thanks for your question. Really appreciate it. Uh, we're
going to speak with Carmen in South Carolina listening online.
Welcome to Open Line. Carmen. How can I help you today?
S4 (05:51):
Hi. How are you doing?
S1 (05:52):
I'm well, thank you.
S4 (05:55):
Oh, good. I was looking at the book of acts,
chapter 16, verse 31, where, um, Paul and Silas tell
the jailer, uh, believe in the Lord Jesus and you
will be saved, you and your household. And a friend
of mine was saying, well, that's you know, you can
use that prayer to pray for your household, and your
(06:20):
household will be saved. And I was wondering, is that true?
S1 (06:27):
Well, we have to ask ourselves, what did Paul mean
when he said it to the Philippian jailer, believe on
the Lord Jesus the Messiah, and you will be saved.
And then there's another implied principle there. And if your
household believes on the Lord Jesus, they will be saved too.
(06:48):
It's not limited to you. Philippian jailer. Anyone in your household.
You go home and you tell them and they believe
they will be saved. It's not a guarantee that his
household would be saved. It's the same principle if you
believe you'll be saved. If your family believes they'll be saved.
S5 (07:06):
That's. That's what.
S1 (07:07):
It means. Now, should we pray for our families? Absolutely. Absolutely.
You know what I think is so interesting? There's only
one verse in the whole Bible that talks about praying
for lost people. Almost every verse about evangelism, where it
talks about prayer, it's praying for the evangelist, for the
(07:30):
person sharing the gospel. Only one verse does it talk
about praying for lost people to come to know the Lord.
You know what verse that is? No, it's Romans ten one. Uh,
it's where Paul is talking about his people, Israel. And
he says, my heart's desire and prayer to God for
them is that they might be saved. My heart's desire
(07:52):
and prayer to God for them as they might be saved.
That establishes a principle, because Paul could pray for Jewish
people to come to know the Lord and be saved.
That means we can pray for any lost person.
S5 (08:04):
To.
S1 (08:04):
Come to know the Lord and be saved. So definitely
we should pray for our families so that they can
be saved. Okay.
S4 (08:14):
Okay. Thank you so much.
S1 (08:15):
Yeah. My pleasure. Thanks so much for calling. Uh, you know,
so often, uh, we are reading the scriptures more, I hope,
and we're getting ready to read the scriptures more for
this upcoming new year. I, I think that should be
our big resolution that we're going to read through the Bible.
(08:36):
Of course, at the start of the new year, Trish
is going to post on Facebook, ah, how to read
through the Bible in a year. And I think that's
that's a great thing to to do. and sooner or later,
hopefully sooner, you're going to come to Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians,
and you're going to find it a challenge. They're really
(08:57):
good books. They have timeless wisdom, but they sometimes the
profound truths are a little hard to understand. And that's
where the Moody Bible Commentary excerpt will come in. That's
what we're offering with as our current resource. Uh, it
gives clear explanations about what these letters teach. And it
(09:17):
doesn't matter if you're preparing a Bible study or leading
a home group, but especially if you're just reading through
the scriptures and you come to them and you think, ah,
I wish I knew a little bit better what these meant.
This excerpt from the Moody Bible Commentary will really help you.
It'll enrich your study of God's Word personally. And when
you give a gift of any size, we'll say thanks
(09:39):
by sending you a copy of this excerpt from the
Moody Bible Commentary covering Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians. And
it's the end of the year. And, you know, at Moody,
we're really hoping to start the new year, right, by
being completely in the black. And if you would be
willing to send a gift, we want to say thank
(09:59):
you by sending you this excerpt from the Moody Bible Commentary.
It's a great time to to give here at the
end of the year, if you'd like to give, call
(888) 644-7122 or go to Open Line radio.org. And we thank
you so much for your generosity. And we're going to
(10:22):
come back. And in just a moment, if you have
a question, the phone number here (877) 548-3675. We're going to
take your questions. It doesn't have to be a Christmas question.
But if you have one now is the time to
call to get your Christmas question in. This is Michael
Ray Dolnick. The program is called Open Line. You're listening
(10:42):
to Moody Radio, and we'll be right back in And
just a moment. So stay with us.
UU (10:57):
Lonely shepherds on quiet rocky hills. In the coldness of
the night. Dreaming of the one called Messiah. Loving shepherd
(11:26):
of Israel.
S6 (11:30):
Well, then you came.
S1 (11:33):
That's my dear friend Fagel Fagel Brooks.
S6 (11:37):
With.
S1 (11:38):
Her original composition for Christmas. And you know Fagel and
her husband Lee and I have been friends. Eve and
I have been friends with them o for over 50 years,
which is just amazing. And she is the most biblically
literate person you'll ever meet. She's phenomenal. And her songs,
(12:01):
which have most people never heard of but I have, uh,
are so biblical, so wonderful, really appreciate it. And I
think she sounds better than Judy Collins. So there we go.
That's that's my friend. Well, maybe we'll find that song
and get it posted on Facebook so you can hear
the whole song, but it's a great one. Uh, she's,
(12:21):
she's someone that that really communicates truth in her music. Now, uh,
we are, uh, we're facing really kind of an amazing
time here because I, I got to meet last week
at the at the start of the Christmas season, it
was Candlelight Carols at Moody Bible Institute. People came from
(12:44):
all over the country to celebrate and to be part
of this great concert. It was just wonderful. And I
was standing in the Commons at Moody Bible Institute, and
I can't tell you how many people came up and said,
I'm a kitchen table partner. And I wanted to say hello.
And so I got to stand there and thank one
after another for all these people who really believe in
(13:06):
helping people understand the Bible better, and therefore they are
kitchen table partners. And I so appreciate them. Appreciate the team.
If you're a regular listener and you appreciate the fact
that Moody Radio is trying to help people understand the
scriptures better, then you might want to become a kitchen
table partner too. Uh, that means giving monthly. So Open
(13:26):
Line can be on the air weekly. And that that's
just a tremendous, generous gift that you can do. And
we really appreciate it. Uh, if you want to become
a kitchen table partner, uh, if when you do, we
will send you a digital or an audio Bible study.
What you'll do is you'll get an email, click on
it every other week. It's a special benefit for those
(13:48):
of you who are kitchen table partners. You get to
to hear a little Bible study for about 7 to
10 minutes. It's it's a lot of fun for me
to produce and and well, actually Trish produces. But I
get to record it and we get to to write
it and do it and hopefully, uh, it encourages you
as well to become a kitchen table partner. All you
(14:11):
have to do is go to Openline radio.org, or you
can call (888) 644-7122. That's (888) 644-7122. And we're going to go
to the phones now Mark in Des Plaines Illinois listening
on Wmbi. Welcome to Open Line. Mark. How can I
(14:32):
help you.
S7 (14:33):
Good morning. Good morning doctor. My daughter asked me a
question about the identity of Jesus Uh, Christ the Son
of God. And, uh, she said, when did he become
considered the son? Was he considered the son at the
creation of the earth, or only after he had been begotten?
S1 (14:54):
Uh, it seems to me that the best way to.
There are some people who held to a wrong teaching.
I'll just say it that way. Uh, not not something
that casts them out of the community of faith. It's
not an essential doctrine, but it was a mistaken one
(15:14):
called incarnational sonship, that the Lord Jesus only became the
Son of God at the incarnation. He is the eternal
Son of God, the the Triune God. Though we may
not have used these terms or known about it. Uh,
so much before the incarnation. The Triune God is father, son,
(15:37):
Holy Spirit. He's Eternally the Son of God. Uh, those
are terms to indicate how the the Triune. They're all
fully equal. Uh, equal. Equal in essence, but different in function.
And as a result, uh, the relation I think those
(15:57):
are terms used to help us understand the function of
father and son and Holy Spirit. And so that's what
it's there for. Uh, he's always been the Son of God,
the eternal Son of God. And and he didn't just
become the Son of God at the incarnation or at creation.
It was always, he's the eternal Son of God. Okay.
S7 (16:21):
I think so. Uh, so I understand that he's with God.
John says always, and he's God. Mhm. I just couldn't
understand how to answer my young daughter. And it is
someone who I thought.
S1 (16:34):
It's a simple answer. He's in in eternity past, before
time began, the father and the son and the Holy
Spirit eternally existed as father, son, and Holy Spirit.
S7 (16:48):
All right.
S1 (16:50):
That's it. Thank you. There's one God in three persons.
And and boy, I tell you what, when you start
trying to think about. How do I understand the Trinity?
You know, I, I would say that that's one of
those things that if you try to really completely comprehend
it for me, I'd lose my mind if I, I
(17:12):
don't I don't know that I could fully comprehend it,
but I accept it. I believe it eternally. Uh, father, son,
Holy Spirit, one God, three persons, and and and I
just accept that. I do too.
S7 (17:27):
Thank you very much.
S1 (17:28):
Thank you. Great talking with you. Okay. We're going to
talk to Brandon in Boynton Beach, Florida, listening on Wmbb.
Welcome to Open Line. Brandon. How can I help you today?
S8 (17:39):
Yes. Hi. Um, I wanted to know, is there a
specific passage in Genesis or elsewhere that indicates when Satan
was cast to Earth in the timeline of creation?
S1 (17:51):
Uh, it just says in revelation 12 that he was
cast out. Uh, not in Genesis. Doesn't say anything about
that in Genesis. Uh, it says in revelation 12. Uh.
The dragon stood in. Let's see. Wait. Here it is. Uh,
(18:18):
the red dragon having seven heads and ten horns. The
dragon is Satan, by the way, and his heads were
seven diadems. His tail swept away a third of the
stars in heaven and hurled them to the earth. And
the dragon then tried to destroy the. The baby Jesus
is what that says. So it's just he took a
third of the heavens with him. He was cast out.
(18:39):
Other passage that, uh, talks about the fall of Satan.
I'm not sure. It talks about him being cast out.
Is Ezekiel 28. I have to take a quick look
at it here. Ezekiel 28. It says that he was
in the Garden of Eden. Uh, the Garden of God,
(18:59):
verse 13. Uh, and it says you are an anointed
guardian cherub. You are on the holy mountain of God.
You walked among the fiery stones. That's verse 14 from
the day you were created. You were blameless in your
ways until wickedness was found in you. Uh, and so
it says in verse 17, so I threw you down
(19:21):
to the earth. I made you a spectacle. So, uh,
cast out of heaven. Ezekiel 2817 I think that was
before the garden. He was in the garden of God
when he was cast out. Then he went to the.
Then he was cast out on the earth. And when
God created Eden. Then he went and tried to tempt
(19:46):
and succeeded in tempting Adam and Eve. That's what I think. So.
Ezekiel 2817 is when he was cast out of heaven,
and I think that was pre-creation of humanity.
S8 (19:59):
Okay, so it was like when Earth was a void
then in a way.
S1 (20:05):
I don't I don't know when it was, uh, it was,
I think before because it was so early in the garden.
I think he must have fallen early on. Some people
want to say it's when the right there. Like when
God creates everything and then, uh, the earth becomes form,
formless and empty because of Satan's fall. That that's what
(20:27):
happened to the earth. I think that's speculative. I don't
think that's the truth. I think that means that God
created the world to be a wilderness and a waste.
And then he formed it in six days to be
what he wanted it to be. I think it was
a pre-creation fall of the enemy. And then he, uh,
pre creation of the earth, and then he, uh, what
(20:48):
he does is he tries to tempt Adam and Eve.
S8 (20:52):
Okay. Yeah. Thanks. I appreciate it. Sure.
S1 (20:55):
Thank you for your call. Appreciate it. Of course there's
speculation there. I don't no one's sure of that, but
that's what I think. Uh, I want to be really clear.
Sometimes when I can give you an exact time frame
that the scriptures say, I'll point it out in Scripture.
If I'm just kind of looking at what what we
have in the text, then, um, this is what I
conjecture from that. So, uh, we're going to talk with
(21:17):
Rosa next in Palm Beach, Florida, listening on Wmbb. Welcome
to Open Line, Rosa. How can I help you today?
S9 (21:25):
Oh, hi. Thanks for answering my call. Actually, I heard
you say in the beginning that you're from Brooklyn, and
I grew up in Brooklyn. Um, Riga, Latvia, Soviet Union, Latvia.
S1 (21:37):
And we're in Brooklyn. Tell me your neighborhood.
S9 (21:42):
Uh, flatlands.
S1 (21:45):
Where were you from in Brooklyn? Rosa. Rosa, where were
you from in Brooklyn?
S9 (21:51):
Can you hear me?
S1 (21:52):
No I can't. So where were you from in Brooklyn?
S9 (21:57):
Uh, Avenue H and 58th Street. Flatlands. Avenue.
S1 (22:01):
Flatlands. Got it. Okay.
S9 (22:03):
Not far South Shore High school and, uh, project. Anyway, I,
you know, moved to Florida. I got married and, um,
living in Palm Beach now, and I'm complete Jew. Thank god. But, um,
there's a lot of a lot of, um, speculation where
people talk about, uh, Eastern European Jews not really being Jewish,
(22:27):
and I, I mean, my, my Soviet Union birth certificate
says I'm Hebrew from both sides of my family. But
is there any way that we can actually prove it,
besides being the Russian Soviet Union trying to use it
for anti-Semitism?
S1 (22:43):
Let me ask you, what was it like for the
Jewish people in the Soviet Union? How well were they treated?
S9 (22:51):
Well, I was a child, so I didn't really feel it.
But my mother, you know, there was a lot of anti-Semitism,
a lot of.
S1 (22:57):
Oh, yeah. There was a lot of anti-Semitism.
S9 (22:59):
Pushing a lot of, you know, my mom said she
would go for interviews and they would say, oh, don't
call us. We'll call you that kind of thing where.
S1 (23:07):
You know, and also.
S9 (23:09):
Look, studying. Yeah.
S1 (23:11):
Also before, uh, before the the Soviet Union, in Czarist Russia,
what was it like for Jewish people? It was even worse. Pogroms. Right?
I mean, pogroms terrible.
S9 (23:25):
And of course, during Nazi Germany, you know, and I
was just watching a program where as soon as the
Nazis came into, into Russia, into into that part of Europe,
the everybody was happy to give the Jews up to
the Nazis.
S1 (23:39):
Yeah. Now, let me ask you this.
S9 (23:41):
When you was one of them, the Latvians were worse
than the Nazis and Ukrainians. Also, the Christian Ukrainians were
like that, too.
S1 (23:49):
And I was I.
S9 (23:51):
Was really I mean, I was a student.
S1 (23:53):
Teacher. Rosa. Brooklyn. Rosa, wait wait wait wait wait wait. Rosa. Rosa. Rosa! Rosa, wait. Here's.
Here's the point I'm trying to make. There was so
much anti-Semitism in Russia, in Eastern Europe. No one would
opt to become Jewish. Uh, that that that it was
(24:15):
it was, uh, just unheard of. Uh, those who were
Russian Orthodox or Ukrainian Catholic or Latvian Orthodox or any
of those, they would not have become Jewish. So here's
my here's the thing. Okay. Now I'm going to try
and answer as best I can. There's an allegation that
(24:36):
there was a medieval Ukrainian, uh, uh, nation that converted
to Judaism. It's really not true. The Khazars, as they
were called, it was just the royalty and nobility converted
to Judaism. The people didn't. The people became Catholic. And
there's all sorts of DNA testing that's been done to
(25:00):
compare Sephardic Jews from the Mediterranean world and the Arab
world and Ashkenazi Jews from Eastern Europe. And what they
find is they have a common source, that they're both
of the same people. So this whole idea that somehow the, uh,
(25:20):
the Ashkenazi Jews from Eastern Europe were not really Jewish
because of the Khazars is just a falsehood that's been
perpetuated to say that Jewish people don't have a right
to the land of Israel, that they're not the same
Jewish people, just a falsehood. So don't worry, Rosa, you're
from a Jewish family. Guess what? You're from a Jewish family.
(25:42):
We're going to come back with the mailbag in just
a moment, so don't go away. You're listening to Open
Line with Michael Zelnick.
UU (26:06):
Silent night, Holy night.
S10 (26:14):
All is calm.
UU (26:18):
All is bright. Round yon virgin mother and child.
S10 (26:30):
Holy infant so.
UU (26:35):
Tender and mild. Sleep in heavenly peace.
S1 (26:45):
There we are. That's the image of what it was
like in the manger, in the stable, when the Lord
Jesus was born. And so I've got Tricia McMillan joining
me right now for the Febc mailbag. And, Tricia, do
you think that infant only slept and was never, never cried?
S11 (27:03):
Hahaha, no, I'm sure he cried because there's even though
he was perfect. I don't think number one that crying
is what indicates perfection or not crying. And I also
think that that he he could not speak when he
was born. And so that is still the only way
babies have to communicate is through exactly the sounds they make.
S1 (27:26):
But of course, you know, the imagery of the Nativity
is that the Lord Jesus was the perfect baby that
never cried, never complained, didn't want to have his diaper changed. Nothing.
You know, I think that's so interesting. Don't you think
it perhaps.
S11 (27:42):
Perhaps it was a parent who said, you know, what
would be great is if is if I think you'd
be perfect if a baby didn't ever need their diaper
changed and didn't cry. That's what would make this baby perfect.
But you know what we look at? We look at
babies today. At a newborn, you're like, this baby is perfect. Like, yeah.
And it doesn't. Even when they're crying. Even when they're crying.
(28:03):
You may not say it right when they're crying, but
you will still say that, you know, this baby is perfect,
but we don't mean perfection in terms of no sin. Yeah. Yeah.
Just to clarify.
S1 (28:14):
I remember that firstborn of mine when he was in
that tray. You know, they take the baby, and they
put him on the tray to weigh.
S11 (28:20):
Him and that that's.
S1 (28:21):
The way, you know, he's on the tray. And it's
like he's a little over. You want to keep him,
you know, like at the deli? No, no, they they said, uh,
they said he was just crying so loud. I said,
is he okay? And the doctor said he's perfect. That's
what he said. So I love that. So anyway, uh,
(28:44):
it's time for the FBC, FBC mailbag. I'm so grateful
that FBC partners with Open Line to bring us the
weekly mailbag. Uh, it's a terrific organization. It brings the
good news to people both via media and through personal encouragement.
Check out their podcast, the FBC podcast called Until All
Have Heard. Just go to fbc.org. That's the Far Eastern
(29:08):
Broadcasting Company, fbc.org and Tricia, let's let's get to this
mailbag right away.
S11 (29:15):
All right. Our first question is from Ron in Illinois
who listens to WNBA, says in Matthew two verses 14
and 15 the Bible says. So he got up, took
the child and his mother. This is Joseph during the
night and left for Egypt, where he stayed until the
death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord
had said through the prophet Out of Egypt I called
(29:36):
my son. In Luke two verse 41, the Bible says,
every year Jesus parents went to Jerusalem for the feast
of the Passover. Could you explain how they went to
Jerusalem every year if they were exiled in Egypt until
the death of Herod?
S1 (29:52):
Well, first of all, that's a general statement. They may
have missed a year, you know, and that doesn't mean
they didn't do it every year. It just means they
missed that first year that Jesus was born. And then
after that, for 11 years, they they went every year.
That's not a not a problem. But I don't think
they even missed that year. They may have, but, uh,
(30:13):
they weren't exiled to Egypt. They escaped to Egypt. Herod
died in four BC, and this happened. The slaughter of
the innocent in Matthew two happened just before Herod's death. Uh,
and the Lord Jesus was born probably four, or maybe
(30:35):
at most five BC. Uh, so he, the the family
only went down to Egypt for, I think, a few
weeks or a month or two. It wasn't very long. So, uh,
they weren't there in Egypt. It wasn't like they they
were immigrants. I hear a lot of people say, oh,
the Lord Jesus was an immigrant to Egypt. No he wasn't.
(30:57):
He was there, uh, for an extended few weeks or months,
but nothing more than that. Okay. So.
S11 (31:05):
Okay. Yeah. Great. Hope that helps. Ron. Next question is from, uh,
came to an email after you gave the call. Esmeralda
in Texas listening Online were the shepherds in the Nativity
story considered humble people? Or was there a reason that
God chose them to go and seek Jesus first?
S1 (31:27):
Uh, you know, there are people that always want to
say that they were despised, that that somehow shepherds were
especially despised group. You hear that a lot in sermons,
don't you? And the basis of that is from the
Joseph story. When his brothers come down in Egypt, they
(31:47):
were despised. But there's no evidence in Judaism in the
first century that shepherds were an especially despised class, and
especially because the kings were called the shepherds of Israel. And, uh,
also the Ezekiel 34 talks about the coming Messiah and
(32:08):
describes him as the shepherd of Israel. So it just
seems to me that to. To say that shepherds were
especially despised is just reading something into from 1400 BC
or 1800 BC, at the time of of Joseph.
S11 (32:29):
You're talking about Joseph in Genesis? Yeah.
S1 (32:31):
Joseph and.
S11 (32:32):
Genesis. Jesus's earthly father. Yeah. Okay. Sorry. I it's okay. Nope.
S1 (32:37):
1800 BC Joseph goes down or, you know, somewhere around
there and, uh, his family is despised in Egypt. We're
talking about a whole different culture and a whole different time.
And then you come to, you know, how many more
than a millennium later in the land of Israel. There's
(32:57):
no need to think of shepherds as being especially despised.
I think that the reason they appeared is that these
were the temple shepherds, likely there in Bethlehem. Uh uh,
caring for the sheep that would be used for sacrifice.
And so they had a great deal of interest in
the idea that the Savior would be born, the one
(33:19):
that would be the fulfillment of all those sacrifices. And
so maybe that's why. But the Bible doesn't tell us why.
They were the ones that were revealed that the Messiah
was revealed to.
S11 (33:31):
Would they have been more humble people or like poorer within,
within the realm of what people would have been.
S1 (33:40):
How they would have.
S11 (33:40):
Been living economically?
S1 (33:42):
I don't think that shepherds were exactly the wealthy class.
They were just laborers. Okay.
S11 (33:48):
Mhm. Okay. Yeah. Um, it is very tempting. We talked
last hour about the symbolism. It is very tempting to
want to extrapolate. Um, the shepherds were the first one
and Jesus was the shepherd was the good shepherd. And
it is very easy to extrapolate that out. How do
(34:08):
we keep that biblical? I know we kind of talked
about it, but I'm finding my my brain just making
that connection. Like, oh, he appeared, you know, the angel
appeared to the shepherds and now the he is the
good shepherd. And so there's this, you know, seems like
a natural connection, but I don't want to falsely draw
this narrative that is not there necessarily.
S1 (34:33):
Mhm. Yeah. Uh, I don't know. I think that sometimes we,
we need to practice Deuteronomy 2929, where it says the
secret things belong to the Lord, the things revealed belong
to us, and we're looking for the secret meanings, the
things that God hid. And so, uh, you know, uh,
(34:57):
Paul writes in Second Corinthians and First Corinthians, don't go
beyond that which is written. Mhm. And, and so God
has revealed to us everything we know. I think if
we mastered everything that's clear and plain and revealed, we've
got plenty to chew on there. We don't need to, uh,
to do more than that. I guess that's what I.
You know, one of my favorite verses is Isaiah 4816.
(35:19):
It says from the beginning I have not spoken in secret.
So we don't need to find the secret mysteries. Let's
deal with the things that we know. Okay?
S11 (35:28):
So all right, next question is from Justin in Illinois.
Why does Isaiah mention Everlasting Father as one of the
titles for Christ, and how does that fit in with
the Trinity?
S1 (35:40):
I think we would have a problem with the Trinity
if the son is the father. Yes.
S11 (35:46):
And it's it's confusing at the very least.
S1 (35:51):
Yeah. I wish that they translated it more accurately. And
one of the things we had a great Bible study
pre-record that we're going to air next week and it
will cover Isaiah nine six. And and so I will
give you a little foretaste of what I tease.
S11 (36:06):
It a little bit for us, Michael.
S1 (36:08):
Yeah. This Is it, uh, that the phrase actually means
Father of Eternity? That is the more literal translation of
that word, not Everlasting Father, but father of eternity, just
like we have a father of our country. That means
the founder of our country, the creator of the United
(36:29):
States would be George Washington, right? The indispensable man. Well,
when we see this phrase father of eternity, it means
the father of time, the creator of time, the author
of time. When we talk about the author of time,
we're not talking about the Eternal Father. We're talking about
the creator of time. And that is different, the Lord Jesus.
(36:49):
There's nothing that was made that was not made by him.
John tells us in John one, uh, he's the creator.
And the very first act of creation was to create time.
We often think in the beginning God created the heavens
and the earth, so the heavens and the earth was
the first act of creation. The first act of creation
was the beginning Because before. Before that beginning, there was
(37:13):
no such thing as time. So the Lord Jesus is
the author of time. And that's what it means about
him being the. It indicates his deity.
S11 (37:20):
Okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you for that.
S1 (37:25):
Yeah. And again.
S11 (37:26):
Special airs next Saturday. It's a Bible study about the
Isaiah prophecies about Jesus. It's really good. Yeah.
S1 (37:33):
Yeah. We had a great time. Tricia, Eva and Chris
Fabry and I were all together studying that. Check it
out next week. You'll enjoy it. We'll be right back
with more of your questions. Right here on Open Line. Thanks.
Tricia McMillan, I'm Michael Dolnick, and this is Moody Radio.
Stay with us.
S12 (38:11):
O come.
UU (38:13):
O come, Emmanuel, and ransom.
S12 (38:23):
Captive Israel.
UU (38:29):
That mourns in.
S1 (38:33):
One of my favorite versions of the song by Selah.
What a great reminder that Israel was longing for the Messiah,
and God fulfilled his promise and sent him the Lord Jesus,
the Messiah of Israel. I love it because it starts
with Hatikvah, the the hope, which is the the national
(38:54):
anthem of the State of Israel. I love that music
that it starts with. Well, most people think of Hanukkah
as the season's only Jewish holiday. However, the Messiah Jesus
was born to a Jewish virgin in Bethlehem of Judea,
according to the Jewish scriptures. The promises. What could be
(39:15):
more Jewish? So chosen People Ministries, one of Open Lines partners,
is offering a free book, Christmas Through Jewish Eyes, to
help us see the Jewishness of Christmas. For your free copy,
just go to Open Line radio.org. That's our website, open
Line radio.org. Scroll down till you see the link that
says A free gift from Chosen People Ministries. Click on
(39:36):
that and you'll be taken to a page where you
can sign up for your very own free copy of
Christmas Through Jewish Eyes. And we are going to go
right back to the phones here, Beth in Akron, Ohio,
listening on Wtxf. Welcome to Open Line. Beth. How can
I help you today?
S13 (39:53):
Well, I have a question. You know how it's wrong
to take to celebrate communion. If you're not a Christian,
you're going to get judged for it. Well, if you
want nothing to do with Jesus and you don't even
go to church, is it wrong to celebrate Christmas by
giving your children gifts and stuff like that and letting
(40:13):
them think it's just a holiday?
S1 (40:16):
Well, first of all, let's talk about that. Uh, I'm
going to say shocking things here when when I was
a pastor and I would lead the Lord's Supper, I
would always say, this is the fellowship meal of followers
of Jesus, but I never forbade anyone from taking it.
And the reason I didn't forbid anyone was it says
(40:43):
in first Corinthians 11, if you take the Lord's Supper unworthily,
you're drinking judgment to yourself. What I would tell people
who are believers, I would tell people who are believers, uh,
don't take the Lord's Supper unworthily. If there's a sin,
you need to confess it. If there's a relationship issue
that needs to be resolved, go do it. But, Uh,
(41:03):
in terms of lost people. I never told them not to.
And here's why. Because John three says that condemnation is
upon them already. Uh, and so how much worse could
it be? Could it be worse than that of not
knowing the Lord? So I didn't tell people not to.
And and in the same way, uh, uh, the Bible
(41:25):
says that there's no verse in the Bible that says
one that we should celebrate Christmas. You can if you
want to. I think it's a great celebration, but you
don't have to. And then secondly, there's no verse saying
that it's it brings condemnation on someone to celebrate Christmas
if they don't know the Lord. Here's what I think.
I think anything that gets people to listen more, hear more,
(41:50):
see more about Jesus, that's a good thing for them.
And so, uh, yeah, I think let's celebrate Christmas. And,
you know, there this is what a great season. There
are people who want to celebrate Christmas. They don't know
the Lord. Let's invite them to church to our Christmas celebrations.
Let's have joyful, cheerful Christmas celebrations at church and invite
(42:12):
people to it. Invite them for Christmas Eve. Help them
to celebrate in a way that will help them come
to know the Lord. That's what I think. Bring them in.
Don't cast them out, okay?
S13 (42:24):
They have Christian knowledge and they don't want nothing to
do with it. What if they've been to church and
they just don't want nothing to do with it? Would
it be wrong to get your kids all kinds of
presents and let them think?
S1 (42:35):
Not for me, Beth. Beth, I don't think it's wrong.
I think anything that gets them a little bit closer,
so be it. That's good. That's what I think.
S13 (42:44):
So it's not like making a mockery of God.
S1 (42:47):
No, I don't think it's making a mockery of God.
Here's the thing that I find amazing that there are
people who don't want anything to do with God that
are celebrating Christmas. It's making them. I mean, they it's
making them even those who are hardened atheists recognize that
there is something special that happened 2000 years ago that
we're still celebrating it. So that's I think it's.
S13 (43:10):
Why why can't why can't you take communion if without
being judged, if you know.
S14 (43:16):
Really the.
S1 (43:16):
The, the limitation on not taking communion is for believers
not to take it unworthily. It's not talking about unbelievers.
S13 (43:26):
But but but I I've always heard pastors say, if
you're not safe, well, I'm.
S1 (43:29):
Just telling you what the Bible says. Beth. Beth, the
Bible says that believers shouldn't take it unworthily. It doesn't
say anything about non-believers.
S14 (43:37):
Okay?
S13 (43:37):
Like like like like if you're a believer and you're
not living the Christian life, is that what it is?
S1 (43:43):
That's right. Or if you have a conflict with someone,
if there's tension. So that's that's what the issue is. Uh, let's,
let's be inviting and not excluding at Christmas time. Let's
bring people in, not cast them out. Okay. Thanks for
your call. Beth. Really appreciate it. Uh, Andy in Alabama,
(44:04):
welcome to Open Line. How can I help you?
S15 (44:07):
Yes, sir. Good morning. I have, if you could please
give a little insight or some clarification on it, which
is kind of a two part question. Same topic on when.
At which point does the believer receive the Holy Spirit,
and is there different levels of it? Does a person
obtain different levels?
S1 (44:28):
Well, the Bible says, uh, if anyone doesn't have the spirit,
they don't belong to Christ. It says if anyone does
not have the Holy Spirit, they don't belong to Christ.
Do you know what that tells me? Anyone that belongs
to Christ, anyone that's a believer, has the Holy Spirit
from the instant that they believe. Uh, that's Romans eight nine.
(44:50):
That's Romans eight nine. And then first Corinthians. First Corinthians
1213 says, we're all baptized by one spirit into one body.
And if we're all baptized by one spirit, that means
everyone has the baptism by the Holy Spirit at the
moment that we believe. Uh, now, what the Bible says
(45:11):
is that we were commanded to be filled with the spirit.
That means controlled by the spirit. Does the Holy Spirit
have more control of some people than other people? Yes.
But it's not because they have more of the Holy Spirit.
They're allowing the Holy Spirit greater control. Uh, everyone has
the same amount of the Holy Spirit. Uh, it says
(45:33):
that really plainly in Scripture that, uh, the the spirit
that raised Jesus from the dead. This is Romans eight.
The spirit that raised Jesus from the dead dwells in us.
I don't know if we need more power than that.
We've got all the power we need. We just need
the Holy Spirit to empower us to submit ourselves to him,
(45:54):
to allow him to lead and guide us to, to
motivate us to obey the scriptures. We all have the
Holy Spirit if we're believers in Jesus from the moment
we believe. But boy, we need to allow him to
control us. And that's what we're commanded to do. Hey,
thanks for that. Excellent call, Andy. Really appreciate it. And
thanks for listening, everyone, because the program can't believe that
(46:17):
that's the program for the week. Fastest two hours of
my week. Appreciate you all. And thank you so much
for calling or writing with your questions. And thanks to
today's Open Line team. Tricia, Omar, Tahira and Gabby. Remember,
keep in touch with Open Line during the week by
going to our web page, Open Line radio.org. It's got
all the links you're looking for about the program. Keep
(46:40):
reading the Bible and we'll talk about it next week
in our special Bible study. Don't miss that open line
with Doctor Michael Riddell. Nick is a production of Moody Radio,
a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.
Hello friends. It's time for the second hour of Open
Line with Doctor Michael Radonich Moody Radio's Bible Study Across America.
We're talking about your questions about the Bible, God and
the spiritual life. My name is Michael Ray Dolnick. I'm
a professor of Jewish studies and Bible at Moody Bible Institute,
also the academic dean there. And I'm so glad to
(00:31):
be sitting around the radio kitchen table with you, taking
your questions. Time to give me a call. (877) 548-3675 is
our number. That's (877) 548-3675. Remember, if you can't call, you
can always go to our website openline radio.org. Click on
(00:51):
Ask Michael a question and post your question there. Trish
will put it in the mailbag. And if you ask
a really good Christmas question. She'll try and get it
in today on the mailbag, even today if you do it.
But it's only got to be. You can ask any question,
but if you want it today, you got to try
to get a Christmas question in. I hope you have
(01:12):
your Bibles open, and I have my second cup of
coffee here. We're ready to talk about the scriptures. We're
going to go right back to the phones, to Amy
in Chicago listening on Wmbi. Welcome to Open Line, Amy.
How can I help you today?
S2 (01:26):
Morning, brother. God bless you. Um. You too. Only on
your second cup of coffee. I'm way ahead of you, man,
but I'm on about my 12th. So listen, yesterday we
were reading in Jeremiah 33, and I was a little
surprised at this. It says that, uh, David will never
(01:50):
lack a man to sit on the throne, and there
will never be a lack of priests through offering Offerings
and sacrifices, presumably in the temple. And and you know,
God says, this is my covenant. It'll never be broken.
And I was just thinking how I'm confused. And my
husband and I said, oh, we got to call Doctor
(02:10):
Rydell because, oh, good.
S1 (02:12):
Thank you for doing that, I appreciate it. Uh. Happy
to happy to answer. Uh, here's the deal. Let's start
with the priest. After the temple was destroyed and there
no longer any sacrifices, there was always the anticipation that
there was a, uh, a priest that would that we
(02:32):
would need priests to offer sacrifices again because the temple
would be rebuilt. And so, as a result, every generation
of Jewish people have passed on from generation to generation,
whether they are a priest or a Levite. So, for example,
I know that I'm a Levi, a Levite. My dad
told me that that's part of my name, actually, because
(02:54):
I'm the son of my Hebrew name says Son of
Isaac the Levite, which makes me a Levite. Okay. And
so that's been passed on for a couple thousand years now.
Generation to generation of Jewish people. So we know who
the priests and Levites, you see it in Jewish names.
If you see someone named Levi. That's Levi. Yes. You see.
S3 (03:15):
It in.
S1 (03:15):
Right? Kohen means priest. So we know Kohen. Uh, and
on my mom's side, I was a Kohen. But my
mom was a kohen because that was her family's line. However,
you get it from the dad. So though my mom,
a Kohen, a priest, married a Levite, their children were Levites. Okay.
(03:40):
So that's that's how it passes down. Okay. Uh, but there.
So there's never been a priest lacking. Israel has priests.
We just don't have a temple to offer sacrifice. Now,
when the. When the Davidic line ended, there's always been
the rightful king to come from the Davidic line. There's
never been a person lacking to sit on the throne
(04:02):
of David. The problem is the throne of David has
not been established. So, for example, Zerubbabel, who plays a
prominent role, for example, in the book of Zechariah and
that and also in the book of Haggai. Zerubbabel was
from the line of David. He was the scion, scion,
(04:22):
the descendant of David, that would have sit on, sat
on the throne, but there was no throne of David allowed.
So therefore, even when there wasn't a king, there was
always someone from the line of David available until the
coming of the messianic King. And he is the fulfillment
of that line. And there's still no one lacking to
sit on the throne because he will return. When you
(04:45):
read Isaiah nine six, we always look at Isaiah nine
six and it says that unto us a son is born,
unto us a child is given. That's clearly talking about
the first coming of the Messiah, his birth for us. However,
verse seven, there's I believe there's a huge gap between
Isaiah nine six and nine seven. Nine seven will be
(05:08):
fulfilled when he returns. It says his dominion will be
vast and its prosperity will never end. This king who
is born from the line of David. He will reign
on the throne of David and over his kingdom to
establish and sustain it with justice and righteousness. So the
messianic King is going to sit on the throne of David.
(05:29):
So we don't lack a person to sit on the
throne of David. We just need to wait for it
to be established. Okay.
S2 (05:36):
Mm. Okay. All right. Well, thank you very much.
S1 (05:40):
Yep. Thanks for your question. Really appreciate it. Uh, we're
going to speak with Carmen in South Carolina listening online.
Welcome to Open Line. Carmen. How can I help you today?
S4 (05:51):
Hi. How are you doing?
S1 (05:52):
I'm well, thank you.
S4 (05:55):
Oh, good. I was looking at the book of acts,
chapter 16, verse 31, where, um, Paul and Silas tell
the jailer, uh, believe in the Lord Jesus and you
will be saved, you and your household. And a friend
of mine was saying, well, that's you know, you can
use that prayer to pray for your household, and your
(06:20):
household will be saved. And I was wondering, is that true?
S1 (06:27):
Well, we have to ask ourselves, what did Paul mean
when he said it to the Philippian jailer, believe on
the Lord Jesus the Messiah, and you will be saved.
And then there's another implied principle there. And if your
household believes on the Lord Jesus, they will be saved too.
(06:48):
It's not limited to you. Philippian jailer. Anyone in your household.
You go home and you tell them and they believe
they will be saved. It's not a guarantee that his
household would be saved. It's the same principle if you
believe you'll be saved. If your family believes they'll be saved.
S5 (07:06):
That's. That's what.
S1 (07:07):
It means. Now, should we pray for our families? Absolutely. Absolutely.
You know what I think is so interesting? There's only
one verse in the whole Bible that talks about praying
for lost people. Almost every verse about evangelism, where it
talks about prayer, it's praying for the evangelist, for the
(07:30):
person sharing the gospel. Only one verse does it talk
about praying for lost people to come to know the Lord.
You know what verse that is? No, it's Romans ten one. Uh,
it's where Paul is talking about his people, Israel. And
he says, my heart's desire and prayer to God for
them is that they might be saved. My heart's desire
(07:52):
and prayer to God for them as they might be saved.
That establishes a principle, because Paul could pray for Jewish
people to come to know the Lord and be saved.
That means we can pray for any lost person.
S5 (08:04):
To.
S1 (08:04):
Come to know the Lord and be saved. So definitely
we should pray for our families so that they can
be saved. Okay.
S4 (08:14):
Okay. Thank you so much.
S1 (08:15):
Yeah. My pleasure. Thanks so much for calling. Uh, you know,
so often, uh, we are reading the scriptures more, I hope,
and we're getting ready to read the scriptures more for
this upcoming new year. I, I think that should be
our big resolution that we're going to read through the Bible.
(08:36):
Of course, at the start of the new year, Trish
is going to post on Facebook, ah, how to read
through the Bible in a year. And I think that's
that's a great thing to to do. and sooner or later,
hopefully sooner, you're going to come to Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians,
and you're going to find it a challenge. They're really
(08:57):
good books. They have timeless wisdom, but they sometimes the
profound truths are a little hard to understand. And that's
where the Moody Bible Commentary excerpt will come in. That's
what we're offering with as our current resource. Uh, it
gives clear explanations about what these letters teach. And it
(09:17):
doesn't matter if you're preparing a Bible study or leading
a home group, but especially if you're just reading through
the scriptures and you come to them and you think, ah,
I wish I knew a little bit better what these meant.
This excerpt from the Moody Bible Commentary will really help you.
It'll enrich your study of God's Word personally. And when
you give a gift of any size, we'll say thanks
(09:39):
by sending you a copy of this excerpt from the
Moody Bible Commentary covering Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians. And
it's the end of the year. And, you know, at Moody,
we're really hoping to start the new year, right, by
being completely in the black. And if you would be
willing to send a gift, we want to say thank
(09:59):
you by sending you this excerpt from the Moody Bible Commentary.
It's a great time to to give here at the
end of the year, if you'd like to give, call
(888) 644-7122 or go to Open Line radio.org. And we thank
you so much for your generosity. And we're going to
(10:22):
come back. And in just a moment, if you have
a question, the phone number here (877) 548-3675. We're going to
take your questions. It doesn't have to be a Christmas question.
But if you have one now is the time to
call to get your Christmas question in. This is Michael
Ray Dolnick. The program is called Open Line. You're listening
(10:42):
to Moody Radio, and we'll be right back in And
just a moment. So stay with us.
UU (10:57):
Lonely shepherds on quiet rocky hills. In the coldness of
the night. Dreaming of the one called Messiah. Loving shepherd
(11:26):
of Israel.
S6 (11:30):
Well, then you came.
S1 (11:33):
That's my dear friend Fagel Fagel Brooks.
S6 (11:37):
With.
S1 (11:38):
Her original composition for Christmas. And you know Fagel and
her husband Lee and I have been friends. Eve and
I have been friends with them o for over 50 years,
which is just amazing. And she is the most biblically
literate person you'll ever meet. She's phenomenal. And her songs,
(12:01):
which have most people never heard of but I have, uh,
are so biblical, so wonderful, really appreciate it. And I
think she sounds better than Judy Collins. So there we go.
That's that's my friend. Well, maybe we'll find that song
and get it posted on Facebook so you can hear
the whole song, but it's a great one. Uh, she's,
(12:21):
she's someone that that really communicates truth in her music. Now, uh,
we are, uh, we're facing really kind of an amazing
time here because I, I got to meet last week
at the at the start of the Christmas season, it
was Candlelight Carols at Moody Bible Institute. People came from
(12:44):
all over the country to celebrate and to be part
of this great concert. It was just wonderful. And I
was standing in the Commons at Moody Bible Institute, and
I can't tell you how many people came up and said,
I'm a kitchen table partner. And I wanted to say hello.
And so I got to stand there and thank one
after another for all these people who really believe in
(13:06):
helping people understand the Bible better, and therefore they are
kitchen table partners. And I so appreciate them. Appreciate the team.
If you're a regular listener and you appreciate the fact
that Moody Radio is trying to help people understand the
scriptures better, then you might want to become a kitchen
table partner too. Uh, that means giving monthly. So Open
(13:26):
Line can be on the air weekly. And that that's
just a tremendous, generous gift that you can do. And
we really appreciate it. Uh, if you want to become
a kitchen table partner, uh, if when you do, we
will send you a digital or an audio Bible study.
What you'll do is you'll get an email, click on
it every other week. It's a special benefit for those
(13:48):
of you who are kitchen table partners. You get to
to hear a little Bible study for about 7 to
10 minutes. It's it's a lot of fun for me
to produce and and well, actually Trish produces. But I
get to record it and we get to to write
it and do it and hopefully, uh, it encourages you
as well to become a kitchen table partner. All you
(14:11):
have to do is go to Openline radio.org, or you
can call (888) 644-7122. That's (888) 644-7122. And we're going to go
to the phones now Mark in Des Plaines Illinois listening
on Wmbi. Welcome to Open Line. Mark. How can I
(14:32):
help you.
S7 (14:33):
Good morning. Good morning doctor. My daughter asked me a
question about the identity of Jesus Uh, Christ the Son
of God. And, uh, she said, when did he become
considered the son? Was he considered the son at the
creation of the earth, or only after he had been begotten?
S1 (14:54):
Uh, it seems to me that the best way to.
There are some people who held to a wrong teaching.
I'll just say it that way. Uh, not not something
that casts them out of the community of faith. It's
not an essential doctrine, but it was a mistaken one
(15:14):
called incarnational sonship, that the Lord Jesus only became the
Son of God at the incarnation. He is the eternal
Son of God, the the Triune God. Though we may
not have used these terms or known about it. Uh,
so much before the incarnation. The Triune God is father, son,
(15:37):
Holy Spirit. He's Eternally the Son of God. Uh, those
are terms to indicate how the the Triune. They're all
fully equal. Uh, equal. Equal in essence, but different in function.
And as a result, uh, the relation I think those
(15:57):
are terms used to help us understand the function of
father and son and Holy Spirit. And so that's what
it's there for. Uh, he's always been the Son of God,
the eternal Son of God. And and he didn't just
become the Son of God at the incarnation or at creation.
It was always, he's the eternal Son of God. Okay.
S7 (16:21):
I think so. Uh, so I understand that he's with God.
John says always, and he's God. Mhm. I just couldn't
understand how to answer my young daughter. And it is
someone who I thought.
S1 (16:34):
It's a simple answer. He's in in eternity past, before
time began, the father and the son and the Holy
Spirit eternally existed as father, son, and Holy Spirit.
S7 (16:48):
All right.
S1 (16:50):
That's it. Thank you. There's one God in three persons.
And and boy, I tell you what, when you start
trying to think about. How do I understand the Trinity?
You know, I, I would say that that's one of
those things that if you try to really completely comprehend
it for me, I'd lose my mind if I, I
(17:12):
don't I don't know that I could fully comprehend it,
but I accept it. I believe it eternally. Uh, father, son,
Holy Spirit, one God, three persons, and and and I
just accept that. I do too.
S7 (17:27):
Thank you very much.
S1 (17:28):
Thank you. Great talking with you. Okay. We're going to
talk to Brandon in Boynton Beach, Florida, listening on Wmbb.
Welcome to Open Line. Brandon. How can I help you today?
S8 (17:39):
Yes. Hi. Um, I wanted to know, is there a
specific passage in Genesis or elsewhere that indicates when Satan
was cast to Earth in the timeline of creation?
S1 (17:51):
Uh, it just says in revelation 12 that he was
cast out. Uh, not in Genesis. Doesn't say anything about
that in Genesis. Uh, it says in revelation 12. Uh.
The dragon stood in. Let's see. Wait. Here it is. Uh,
(18:18):
the red dragon having seven heads and ten horns. The
dragon is Satan, by the way, and his heads were
seven diadems. His tail swept away a third of the
stars in heaven and hurled them to the earth. And
the dragon then tried to destroy the. The baby Jesus
is what that says. So it's just he took a
third of the heavens with him. He was cast out.
(18:39):
Other passage that, uh, talks about the fall of Satan.
I'm not sure. It talks about him being cast out.
Is Ezekiel 28. I have to take a quick look
at it here. Ezekiel 28. It says that he was
in the Garden of Eden. Uh, the Garden of God,
(18:59):
verse 13. Uh, and it says you are an anointed
guardian cherub. You are on the holy mountain of God.
You walked among the fiery stones. That's verse 14 from
the day you were created. You were blameless in your
ways until wickedness was found in you. Uh, and so
it says in verse 17, so I threw you down
(19:21):
to the earth. I made you a spectacle. So, uh,
cast out of heaven. Ezekiel 2817 I think that was
before the garden. He was in the garden of God
when he was cast out. Then he went to the.
Then he was cast out on the earth. And when
God created Eden. Then he went and tried to tempt
(19:46):
and succeeded in tempting Adam and Eve. That's what I think. So.
Ezekiel 2817 is when he was cast out of heaven,
and I think that was pre-creation of humanity.
S8 (19:59):
Okay, so it was like when Earth was a void
then in a way.
S1 (20:05):
I don't I don't know when it was, uh, it was,
I think before because it was so early in the garden.
I think he must have fallen early on. Some people
want to say it's when the right there. Like when
God creates everything and then, uh, the earth becomes form,
formless and empty because of Satan's fall. That that's what
(20:27):
happened to the earth. I think that's speculative. I don't
think that's the truth. I think that means that God
created the world to be a wilderness and a waste.
And then he formed it in six days to be
what he wanted it to be. I think it was
a pre-creation fall of the enemy. And then he, uh,
pre creation of the earth, and then he, uh, what
(20:48):
he does is he tries to tempt Adam and Eve.
S8 (20:52):
Okay. Yeah. Thanks. I appreciate it. Sure.
S1 (20:55):
Thank you for your call. Appreciate it. Of course there's
speculation there. I don't no one's sure of that, but
that's what I think. Uh, I want to be really clear.
Sometimes when I can give you an exact time frame
that the scriptures say, I'll point it out in Scripture.
If I'm just kind of looking at what what we
have in the text, then, um, this is what I
conjecture from that. So, uh, we're going to talk with
(21:17):
Rosa next in Palm Beach, Florida, listening on Wmbb. Welcome
to Open Line, Rosa. How can I help you today?
S9 (21:25):
Oh, hi. Thanks for answering my call. Actually, I heard
you say in the beginning that you're from Brooklyn, and
I grew up in Brooklyn. Um, Riga, Latvia, Soviet Union, Latvia.
S1 (21:37):
And we're in Brooklyn. Tell me your neighborhood.
S9 (21:42):
Uh, flatlands.
S1 (21:45):
Where were you from in Brooklyn? Rosa. Rosa, where were
you from in Brooklyn?
S9 (21:51):
Can you hear me?
S1 (21:52):
No I can't. So where were you from in Brooklyn?
S9 (21:57):
Uh, Avenue H and 58th Street. Flatlands. Avenue.
S1 (22:01):
Flatlands. Got it. Okay.
S9 (22:03):
Not far South Shore High school and, uh, project. Anyway, I,
you know, moved to Florida. I got married and, um,
living in Palm Beach now, and I'm complete Jew. Thank god. But, um,
there's a lot of a lot of, um, speculation where
people talk about, uh, Eastern European Jews not really being Jewish,
(22:27):
and I, I mean, my, my Soviet Union birth certificate
says I'm Hebrew from both sides of my family. But
is there any way that we can actually prove it,
besides being the Russian Soviet Union trying to use it
for anti-Semitism?
S1 (22:43):
Let me ask you, what was it like for the
Jewish people in the Soviet Union? How well were they treated?
S9 (22:51):
Well, I was a child, so I didn't really feel it.
But my mother, you know, there was a lot of anti-Semitism,
a lot of.
S1 (22:57):
Oh, yeah. There was a lot of anti-Semitism.
S9 (22:59):
Pushing a lot of, you know, my mom said she
would go for interviews and they would say, oh, don't
call us. We'll call you that kind of thing where.
S1 (23:07):
You know, and also.
S9 (23:09):
Look, studying. Yeah.
S1 (23:11):
Also before, uh, before the the Soviet Union, in Czarist Russia,
what was it like for Jewish people? It was even worse. Pogroms. Right?
I mean, pogroms terrible.
S9 (23:25):
And of course, during Nazi Germany, you know, and I
was just watching a program where as soon as the
Nazis came into, into Russia, into into that part of Europe,
the everybody was happy to give the Jews up to
the Nazis.
S1 (23:39):
Yeah. Now, let me ask you this.
S9 (23:41):
When you was one of them, the Latvians were worse
than the Nazis and Ukrainians. Also, the Christian Ukrainians were
like that, too.
S1 (23:49):
And I was I.
S9 (23:51):
Was really I mean, I was a student.
S1 (23:53):
Teacher. Rosa. Brooklyn. Rosa, wait wait wait wait wait wait. Rosa. Rosa. Rosa! Rosa, wait. Here's.
Here's the point I'm trying to make. There was so
much anti-Semitism in Russia, in Eastern Europe. No one would
opt to become Jewish. Uh, that that that it was
(24:15):
it was, uh, just unheard of. Uh, those who were
Russian Orthodox or Ukrainian Catholic or Latvian Orthodox or any
of those, they would not have become Jewish. So here's
my here's the thing. Okay. Now I'm going to try
and answer as best I can. There's an allegation that
(24:36):
there was a medieval Ukrainian, uh, uh, nation that converted
to Judaism. It's really not true. The Khazars, as they
were called, it was just the royalty and nobility converted
to Judaism. The people didn't. The people became Catholic. And
there's all sorts of DNA testing that's been done to
(25:00):
compare Sephardic Jews from the Mediterranean world and the Arab
world and Ashkenazi Jews from Eastern Europe. And what they
find is they have a common source, that they're both
of the same people. So this whole idea that somehow the, uh,
(25:20):
the Ashkenazi Jews from Eastern Europe were not really Jewish
because of the Khazars is just a falsehood that's been
perpetuated to say that Jewish people don't have a right
to the land of Israel, that they're not the same
Jewish people, just a falsehood. So don't worry, Rosa, you're
from a Jewish family. Guess what? You're from a Jewish family.
(25:42):
We're going to come back with the mailbag in just
a moment, so don't go away. You're listening to Open
Line with Michael Zelnick.
UU (26:06):
Silent night, Holy night.
S10 (26:14):
All is calm.
UU (26:18):
All is bright. Round yon virgin mother and child.
S10 (26:30):
Holy infant so.
UU (26:35):
Tender and mild. Sleep in heavenly peace.
S1 (26:45):
There we are. That's the image of what it was
like in the manger, in the stable, when the Lord
Jesus was born. And so I've got Tricia McMillan joining
me right now for the Febc mailbag. And, Tricia, do
you think that infant only slept and was never, never cried?
S11 (27:03):
Hahaha, no, I'm sure he cried because there's even though
he was perfect. I don't think number one that crying
is what indicates perfection or not crying. And I also
think that that he he could not speak when he
was born. And so that is still the only way
babies have to communicate is through exactly the sounds they make.
S1 (27:26):
But of course, you know, the imagery of the Nativity
is that the Lord Jesus was the perfect baby that
never cried, never complained, didn't want to have his diaper changed. Nothing.
You know, I think that's so interesting. Don't you think
it perhaps.
S11 (27:42):
Perhaps it was a parent who said, you know, what
would be great is if is if I think you'd
be perfect if a baby didn't ever need their diaper
changed and didn't cry. That's what would make this baby perfect.
But you know what we look at? We look at
babies today. At a newborn, you're like, this baby is perfect. Like, yeah.
And it doesn't. Even when they're crying. Even when they're crying.
(28:03):
You may not say it right when they're crying, but
you will still say that, you know, this baby is perfect,
but we don't mean perfection in terms of no sin. Yeah. Yeah.
Just to clarify.
S1 (28:14):
I remember that firstborn of mine when he was in
that tray. You know, they take the baby, and they
put him on the tray to weigh.
S11 (28:20):
Him and that that's.
S1 (28:21):
The way, you know, he's on the tray. And it's
like he's a little over. You want to keep him,
you know, like at the deli? No, no, they they said, uh,
they said he was just crying so loud. I said,
is he okay? And the doctor said he's perfect. That's
what he said. So I love that. So anyway, uh,
(28:44):
it's time for the FBC, FBC mailbag. I'm so grateful
that FBC partners with Open Line to bring us the
weekly mailbag. Uh, it's a terrific organization. It brings the
good news to people both via media and through personal encouragement.
Check out their podcast, the FBC podcast called Until All
Have Heard. Just go to fbc.org. That's the Far Eastern
(29:08):
Broadcasting Company, fbc.org and Tricia, let's let's get to this
mailbag right away.
S11 (29:15):
All right. Our first question is from Ron in Illinois
who listens to WNBA, says in Matthew two verses 14
and 15 the Bible says. So he got up, took
the child and his mother. This is Joseph during the
night and left for Egypt, where he stayed until the
death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord
had said through the prophet Out of Egypt I called
(29:36):
my son. In Luke two verse 41, the Bible says,
every year Jesus parents went to Jerusalem for the feast
of the Passover. Could you explain how they went to
Jerusalem every year if they were exiled in Egypt until
the death of Herod?
S1 (29:52):
Well, first of all, that's a general statement. They may
have missed a year, you know, and that doesn't mean
they didn't do it every year. It just means they
missed that first year that Jesus was born. And then
after that, for 11 years, they they went every year.
That's not a not a problem. But I don't think
they even missed that year. They may have, but, uh,
(30:13):
they weren't exiled to Egypt. They escaped to Egypt. Herod
died in four BC, and this happened. The slaughter of
the innocent in Matthew two happened just before Herod's death. Uh,
and the Lord Jesus was born probably four, or maybe
(30:35):
at most five BC. Uh, so he, the the family
only went down to Egypt for, I think, a few
weeks or a month or two. It wasn't very long. So, uh,
they weren't there in Egypt. It wasn't like they they
were immigrants. I hear a lot of people say, oh,
the Lord Jesus was an immigrant to Egypt. No he wasn't.
(30:57):
He was there, uh, for an extended few weeks or months,
but nothing more than that. Okay. So.
S11 (31:05):
Okay. Yeah. Great. Hope that helps. Ron. Next question is from, uh,
came to an email after you gave the call. Esmeralda
in Texas listening Online were the shepherds in the Nativity
story considered humble people? Or was there a reason that
God chose them to go and seek Jesus first?
S1 (31:27):
Uh, you know, there are people that always want to
say that they were despised, that that somehow shepherds were
especially despised group. You hear that a lot in sermons,
don't you? And the basis of that is from the
Joseph story. When his brothers come down in Egypt, they
(31:47):
were despised. But there's no evidence in Judaism in the
first century that shepherds were an especially despised class, and
especially because the kings were called the shepherds of Israel. And, uh,
also the Ezekiel 34 talks about the coming Messiah and
(32:08):
describes him as the shepherd of Israel. So it just
seems to me that to. To say that shepherds were
especially despised is just reading something into from 1400 BC
or 1800 BC, at the time of of Joseph.
S11 (32:29):
You're talking about Joseph in Genesis? Yeah.
S1 (32:31):
Joseph and.
S11 (32:32):
Genesis. Jesus's earthly father. Yeah. Okay. Sorry. I it's okay. Nope.
S1 (32:37):
1800 BC Joseph goes down or, you know, somewhere around
there and, uh, his family is despised in Egypt. We're
talking about a whole different culture and a whole different time.
And then you come to, you know, how many more
than a millennium later in the land of Israel. There's
(32:57):
no need to think of shepherds as being especially despised.
I think that the reason they appeared is that these
were the temple shepherds, likely there in Bethlehem. Uh uh,
caring for the sheep that would be used for sacrifice.
And so they had a great deal of interest in
the idea that the Savior would be born, the one
(33:19):
that would be the fulfillment of all those sacrifices. And
so maybe that's why. But the Bible doesn't tell us why.
They were the ones that were revealed that the Messiah
was revealed to.
S11 (33:31):
Would they have been more humble people or like poorer within,
within the realm of what people would have been.
S1 (33:40):
How they would have.
S11 (33:40):
Been living economically?
S1 (33:42):
I don't think that shepherds were exactly the wealthy class.
They were just laborers. Okay.
S11 (33:48):
Mhm. Okay. Yeah. Um, it is very tempting. We talked
last hour about the symbolism. It is very tempting to
want to extrapolate. Um, the shepherds were the first one
and Jesus was the shepherd was the good shepherd. And
it is very easy to extrapolate that out. How do
(34:08):
we keep that biblical? I know we kind of talked
about it, but I'm finding my my brain just making
that connection. Like, oh, he appeared, you know, the angel
appeared to the shepherds and now the he is the
good shepherd. And so there's this, you know, seems like
a natural connection, but I don't want to falsely draw
this narrative that is not there necessarily.
S1 (34:33):
Mhm. Yeah. Uh, I don't know. I think that sometimes we,
we need to practice Deuteronomy 2929, where it says the
secret things belong to the Lord, the things revealed belong
to us, and we're looking for the secret meanings, the
things that God hid. And so, uh, you know, uh,
(34:57):
Paul writes in Second Corinthians and First Corinthians, don't go
beyond that which is written. Mhm. And, and so God
has revealed to us everything we know. I think if
we mastered everything that's clear and plain and revealed, we've
got plenty to chew on there. We don't need to, uh,
to do more than that. I guess that's what I.
You know, one of my favorite verses is Isaiah 4816.
(35:19):
It says from the beginning I have not spoken in secret.
So we don't need to find the secret mysteries. Let's
deal with the things that we know. Okay?
S11 (35:28):
So all right, next question is from Justin in Illinois.
Why does Isaiah mention Everlasting Father as one of the
titles for Christ, and how does that fit in with
the Trinity?
S1 (35:40):
I think we would have a problem with the Trinity
if the son is the father. Yes.
S11 (35:46):
And it's it's confusing at the very least.
S1 (35:51):
Yeah. I wish that they translated it more accurately. And
one of the things we had a great Bible study
pre-record that we're going to air next week and it
will cover Isaiah nine six. And and so I will
give you a little foretaste of what I tease.
S11 (36:06):
It a little bit for us, Michael.
S1 (36:08):
Yeah. This Is it, uh, that the phrase actually means
Father of Eternity? That is the more literal translation of
that word, not Everlasting Father, but father of eternity, just
like we have a father of our country. That means
the founder of our country, the creator of the United
(36:29):
States would be George Washington, right? The indispensable man. Well,
when we see this phrase father of eternity, it means
the father of time, the creator of time, the author
of time. When we talk about the author of time,
we're not talking about the Eternal Father. We're talking about
the creator of time. And that is different, the Lord Jesus.
(36:49):
There's nothing that was made that was not made by him.
John tells us in John one, uh, he's the creator.
And the very first act of creation was to create time.
We often think in the beginning God created the heavens
and the earth, so the heavens and the earth was
the first act of creation. The first act of creation
was the beginning Because before. Before that beginning, there was
(37:13):
no such thing as time. So the Lord Jesus is
the author of time. And that's what it means about
him being the. It indicates his deity.
S11 (37:20):
Okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you for that.
S1 (37:25):
Yeah. And again.
S11 (37:26):
Special airs next Saturday. It's a Bible study about the
Isaiah prophecies about Jesus. It's really good. Yeah.
S1 (37:33):
Yeah. We had a great time. Tricia, Eva and Chris
Fabry and I were all together studying that. Check it
out next week. You'll enjoy it. We'll be right back
with more of your questions. Right here on Open Line. Thanks.
Tricia McMillan, I'm Michael Dolnick, and this is Moody Radio.
Stay with us.
S12 (38:11):
O come.
UU (38:13):
O come, Emmanuel, and ransom.
S12 (38:23):
Captive Israel.
UU (38:29):
That mourns in.
S1 (38:33):
One of my favorite versions of the song by Selah.
What a great reminder that Israel was longing for the Messiah,
and God fulfilled his promise and sent him the Lord Jesus,
the Messiah of Israel. I love it because it starts
with Hatikvah, the the hope, which is the the national
(38:54):
anthem of the State of Israel. I love that music
that it starts with. Well, most people think of Hanukkah
as the season's only Jewish holiday. However, the Messiah Jesus
was born to a Jewish virgin in Bethlehem of Judea,
according to the Jewish scriptures. The promises. What could be
(39:15):
more Jewish? So chosen People Ministries, one of Open Lines partners,
is offering a free book, Christmas Through Jewish Eyes, to
help us see the Jewishness of Christmas. For your free copy,
just go to Open Line radio.org. That's our website, open
Line radio.org. Scroll down till you see the link that
says A free gift from Chosen People Ministries. Click on
(39:36):
that and you'll be taken to a page where you
can sign up for your very own free copy of
Christmas Through Jewish Eyes. And we are going to go
right back to the phones here, Beth in Akron, Ohio,
listening on Wtxf. Welcome to Open Line. Beth. How can
I help you today?
S13 (39:53):
Well, I have a question. You know how it's wrong
to take to celebrate communion. If you're not a Christian,
you're going to get judged for it. Well, if you
want nothing to do with Jesus and you don't even
go to church, is it wrong to celebrate Christmas by
giving your children gifts and stuff like that and letting
(40:13):
them think it's just a holiday?
S1 (40:16):
Well, first of all, let's talk about that. Uh, I'm
going to say shocking things here when when I was
a pastor and I would lead the Lord's Supper, I
would always say, this is the fellowship meal of followers
of Jesus, but I never forbade anyone from taking it.
And the reason I didn't forbid anyone was it says
(40:43):
in first Corinthians 11, if you take the Lord's Supper unworthily,
you're drinking judgment to yourself. What I would tell people
who are believers, I would tell people who are believers, uh,
don't take the Lord's Supper unworthily. If there's a sin,
you need to confess it. If there's a relationship issue
that needs to be resolved, go do it. But, Uh,
(41:03):
in terms of lost people. I never told them not to.
And here's why. Because John three says that condemnation is
upon them already. Uh, and so how much worse could
it be? Could it be worse than that of not
knowing the Lord? So I didn't tell people not to.
And and in the same way, uh, uh, the Bible
(41:25):
says that there's no verse in the Bible that says
one that we should celebrate Christmas. You can if you
want to. I think it's a great celebration, but you
don't have to. And then secondly, there's no verse saying
that it's it brings condemnation on someone to celebrate Christmas
if they don't know the Lord. Here's what I think.
I think anything that gets people to listen more, hear more,
(41:50):
see more about Jesus, that's a good thing for them.
And so, uh, yeah, I think let's celebrate Christmas. And,
you know, there this is what a great season. There
are people who want to celebrate Christmas. They don't know
the Lord. Let's invite them to church to our Christmas celebrations.
Let's have joyful, cheerful Christmas celebrations at church and invite
(42:12):
people to it. Invite them for Christmas Eve. Help them
to celebrate in a way that will help them come
to know the Lord. That's what I think. Bring them in.
Don't cast them out, okay?
S13 (42:24):
They have Christian knowledge and they don't want nothing to
do with it. What if they've been to church and
they just don't want nothing to do with it? Would
it be wrong to get your kids all kinds of
presents and let them think?
S1 (42:35):
Not for me, Beth. Beth, I don't think it's wrong.
I think anything that gets them a little bit closer,
so be it. That's good. That's what I think.
S13 (42:44):
So it's not like making a mockery of God.
S1 (42:47):
No, I don't think it's making a mockery of God.
Here's the thing that I find amazing that there are
people who don't want anything to do with God that
are celebrating Christmas. It's making them. I mean, they it's
making them even those who are hardened atheists recognize that
there is something special that happened 2000 years ago that
we're still celebrating it. So that's I think it's.
S13 (43:10):
Why why can't why can't you take communion if without
being judged, if you know.
S14 (43:16):
Really the.
S1 (43:16):
The, the limitation on not taking communion is for believers
not to take it unworthily. It's not talking about unbelievers.
S13 (43:26):
But but but I I've always heard pastors say, if
you're not safe, well, I'm.
S1 (43:29):
Just telling you what the Bible says. Beth. Beth, the
Bible says that believers shouldn't take it unworthily. It doesn't
say anything about non-believers.
S14 (43:37):
Okay?
S13 (43:37):
Like like like like if you're a believer and you're
not living the Christian life, is that what it is?
S1 (43:43):
That's right. Or if you have a conflict with someone,
if there's tension. So that's that's what the issue is. Uh, let's,
let's be inviting and not excluding at Christmas time. Let's
bring people in, not cast them out. Okay. Thanks for
your call. Beth. Really appreciate it. Uh, Andy in Alabama,
(44:04):
welcome to Open Line. How can I help you?
S15 (44:07):
Yes, sir. Good morning. I have, if you could please
give a little insight or some clarification on it, which
is kind of a two part question. Same topic on when.
At which point does the believer receive the Holy Spirit,
and is there different levels of it? Does a person
obtain different levels?
S1 (44:28):
Well, the Bible says, uh, if anyone doesn't have the spirit,
they don't belong to Christ. It says if anyone does
not have the Holy Spirit, they don't belong to Christ.
Do you know what that tells me? Anyone that belongs
to Christ, anyone that's a believer, has the Holy Spirit
from the instant that they believe. Uh, that's Romans eight nine.
(44:50):
That's Romans eight nine. And then first Corinthians. First Corinthians
1213 says, we're all baptized by one spirit into one body.
And if we're all baptized by one spirit, that means
everyone has the baptism by the Holy Spirit at the
moment that we believe. Uh, now, what the Bible says
(45:11):
is that we were commanded to be filled with the spirit.
That means controlled by the spirit. Does the Holy Spirit
have more control of some people than other people? Yes.
But it's not because they have more of the Holy Spirit.
They're allowing the Holy Spirit greater control. Uh, everyone has
the same amount of the Holy Spirit. Uh, it says
(45:33):
that really plainly in Scripture that, uh, the the spirit
that raised Jesus from the dead. This is Romans eight.
The spirit that raised Jesus from the dead dwells in us.
I don't know if we need more power than that.
We've got all the power we need. We just need
the Holy Spirit to empower us to submit ourselves to him,
(45:54):
to allow him to lead and guide us to, to
motivate us to obey the scriptures. We all have the
Holy Spirit if we're believers in Jesus from the moment
we believe. But boy, we need to allow him to
control us. And that's what we're commanded to do. Hey,
thanks for that. Excellent call, Andy. Really appreciate it. And
thanks for listening, everyone, because the program can't believe that
(46:17):
that's the program for the week. Fastest two hours of
my week. Appreciate you all. And thank you so much
for calling or writing with your questions. And thanks to
today's Open Line team. Tricia, Omar, Tahira and Gabby. Remember,
keep in touch with Open Line during the week by
going to our web page, Open Line radio.org. It's got
all the links you're looking for about the program. Keep
(46:40):
reading the Bible and we'll talk about it next week
in our special Bible study. Don't miss that open line
with Doctor Michael Riddell. Nick is a production of Moody Radio,
a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.
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