July 1, 2025 • 40 mins
Lando Norris dominated at the Red Bull Ring to score a confidence-boosting victory over title leader Oscar Piastri in a result that has refreshed his championship chances. Meanwhile, off the track, Alpine is reportedly considering its second driver change of the season as Franco Colapinto continues to struggle.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to Pit Talk, brought to you by Shannon's.
On today's episode, Lando Norris scores a decisive victory at
the Austrian Grand Prix to reduce his title devicit to
Oscar Piastri, and after another disappointing result for Alpine, is
yet another driver change on the cards. My name is
Michael Lomonado. It's great to have your company and the
company of my co host. He's just got off the
(00:22):
phone with Flavio Briatore something about a drive after the
mid season break. It's Matt Payton.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Look, I'm a little bit busy, but I could probably
squeeze five races in because that tends to be what
most drivers at Alpine get. So I'll be done just
in time for us to head to I don't know,
Katar or something. It's a bit hot there, so I'm
to drive there. But I'll do my best in my
five races and then pass the baton onto somebody else.
That seems to be the way it's going.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Yeah, who says there's no certainty at Alpine? You know,
you get five races and you're done. It's just the
way it is. We will talk about the situation at
Alpine a little bit later on, and of course at
Red Bull Racing, where nothing's changed and that's the problem.
But let's start with Lando Norris winning the OS and
Grand Prix. It was the rebound he needed after the
catastrophe in Canada, and he dominated from start to finish
(01:06):
except FP one, which he did not enter, but all
of the practice sessions is he had FP two, FP
three top. There are all three qualifying segments, biggest pole
margin of the season, victory over teammatee Oscar Piastre, including
some genuine wheel to wheel battling in the first stint
at least, does it feel like to you, Matt Lando
Norris's back, is there is this another false dawn like
(01:27):
the Monaco example.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
I don't know. Either of those questions could be yes
or no. I guess I think firstly, I'd like to
welcome you to the start of the second half of
the Formula one season two races early because I feel
that McLaren being in their own category at the front
of Grand Prix, particularly with a real change looming for
twenty six and all of the developmental taps being turned off,
a term we're going to hear quite a bit I
(01:49):
feel that we're going to have a lot more racist
like this, where it's too McLaren's in one race and
everybody else in another one. But to my mind, this
was a win that Norris had to have in the
manner that he had it because of what had happened
in Canada, the fact that he put his hand up,
the fact that he had lost wouldn't say control, certainly
lost momentum within his own team, and in the championship fight,
(02:10):
he needed to win a race. He needed to win
a race like this, and I think if this championship
battle is going to run and run for the remainder
of the season, which given that it seems to be
a two car championship now I think is going to happen,
he had to have this. We did foreshadow this in
last week's preview episode that this has been a particularly
good track for him, and even when McLaren wasn't particularly good,
(02:31):
he was quite good here. So the manner in which
he won on the weekend was impressive, probably not a
massive surprise. I guess we'll never really know how the
race might have played out differently, or at least the
battle for pole, because of how compromise. Q three was,
but given he'd had some sort of ropie races and
there'd been some questions about his championship bona fides, I
(02:52):
think this is a win he had to have, and
the way he did it was very impressive. Whether Oscar
Piastri had a pole position lap in him, we're never
going to because of what happened in Q three, you
would say unlikely, But we also know that Piastre is
a guy who rises to the occasion when the stakes
are at their higher, So it was a shame we
never really got a definitive answer to that. But the
first into the race, it was great that they allowed
(03:14):
them to race because it was very compelling tov, wasn't it.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Yeah, I mean it really made up for what otherwise
would have been very really quite streadfulard domination. So it
was an entertaining race. Once Osco Piastri got into second place,
you do wonder, how do you even at least qualified
on the front row, how different this race might have
been because he made a passed straight off the line. Okay,
wouldn't have been the same pass, but to have been
competing from turn one rather than turn three as it
(03:38):
was maybe things would have looked slightly different, but I
do like and I think the question is now obviously
beyond doubt because not only have we seen so many examples,
but it now looks pretty clear it is just a
two horse race for the driver's title. How many times
McLaren's proved that, yes, they are going to be free
to race and it's going to be fine, and we're
going to manage it fine, and there's going to be
no issues or controversies. I feel like they passed a
(04:00):
lot of those tests, you know, the only real test left,
and obviously the team will be hoping they never have
to be asked. The question is when they genuinely crash
into each other in the heat of battle, not in
a clumsy era like was in the case in Canada
with Lando Norris. But they are sticking to their guns,
and I think it's really interesting. And I'm not sure
if this is just because you only get a certain
amount of radio through the team and you can go
(04:21):
and find full radio communications, but every driver communicates with
the engineers differently. But I find it really interesting how
much Lando Norris in particular, But it is happening to
Oscar to a lesser extent is being motivated to compete
with the other car in a way that as if
the other car were from a different team. Obviously they
know that they're their chief championship rival, so it's not unusual,
(04:43):
it's not too strange, but it's just really interesting that,
you know, the further we get into this season, the
clear it's become that McLaren knew ahead of the year
that this was the likely outcome. Where all the down
talking every team does when they know they've got a
dominant car, and they feel really prepared to let these
two drivers battle as hard as possible and yet trust
them not to make a mistake. And I just think
(05:03):
there's another interesting chapter in that because they went very far,
and they let them go very far without ever intervening.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Which is commendable and again easier to do when you're
probably you know, you know, you're really the only two
drivers in contention for the World Driver's Championship. I mean,
at this stage McLaren's going to win the constructors Championship.
For most teams, that's exactly what they want, and so
the identity of the driver who wins it is probably
a bit of a secondary consideration. What you said then
is really interesting with the way that they were looking
(05:31):
to exploit what the other car was doing. But I
think there's also juxtaposed against this, they're trying to be
so fair strategically, I think between the two drivers in
that the way that race played out, I wonder if
you know there was an alternate strategy there for Pastre
to perhaps one stop or run the hard tire for longer.
(05:52):
And is that a strategic option you take if the
person you're racing against for the race win isn't from
the same team. And that's interesting to me because to say,
what was a Ferrari upfront of a Mercedes? I wonder
if you'd be more bullish about perhaps going for some
of those other strategic options. They're so determined to play
at fair strategically, yet they're trying to chip away at
(06:12):
every little advantage they can get over their rivals. So
it's is a strange contrast here in that, yes, they
are trying to win the race, but they're not going
to do it necessarily through throwing a hail Mary to
get an advantageous strategy or doing something different. There's this
fairness they're trying to operate and it's commendable and it
looks great when it's written down a piece of paper.
But as you just said, then we've got, however many rounds,
(06:34):
We've got to go a lot and there is inevitably
going to be some contact because this is what happens
in world championships with two strong race winning drivers in
a dominant team. You know, you think back to the
beginning of the V six turbo hybrid era where Lewis
Hamilton and Nico Rosberg ran into each other on a
number of occasions. Now only a Mercedes driver was going
to win those championships, but you know, you think back
(06:57):
to twenty fourteen. Daniel Rocado's winning Belgium that year vowed
itself to the fact that the Mercedes ran into each
other on the first lap, and it's going to happen.
I don't think Mercedes are going to win every race
of the rest of the year. A because Maxwistappen's two
good at certain places, and b because there will be
a race where you're going to see a Barcelona twenty
sixteen situation where they're probably both going to end up
(07:17):
in the gravel somewhere. It's just going to happen. So
how long this concept of fairness and team play and
everything else lasts It will depend on how many other
rivals there are realistically in the fight for race wins.
I think the championships out of the question now, but
we've got so much of this season still to go,
so this story could still change two or three times
between now and when we get to Abu Dhabi. And
picking when that's going to twist and what the inflection
(07:40):
points are going to be is going to be really
interesting in a series where on pace performance alone, I
think Austria showed us that this really is a one team,
two driver World Championship at this point. Those types of
championships and races can be super interesting, as we know.
But given you've got this looming regulation set change for
twenty twenty six, I think it's just escalate that even more.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
You think, I think so, And I think that it's
sort of funny to think you talk about how long
of the seasons to go, It feels like we've already
lived more than half of the season. With the momentum
Piastre had behind him since the Australian Grand Prix and
the prospect of maybe that won't change and maybe this
will be a one off, a nour or maybe it'll
simply be much more even between them. But with so
(08:21):
much the season still to go, it just makes you
reassess or recontextualize the fact that there's there is so
much potential for changes. You say the strategy thing just
before you move on, I think is really interesting because
I was trying to think back, and I've gone done
a little bit of reading to remind myself, because it's
alarming that it was a decade ago now when Mercedes
really had the run of things in the start of
his turbo hybrid era. It would always come to a
(08:43):
point where they'd also let each side of the garage
strategize their own way through races. Yes, like really it
was almost as though there were two separate teams, which
ultimately ended up being to the detriment of harmony. Anyone
who remembers twenty sixteen, as I've alluded to, their un
to the point where Tota Wolf swapped all the engineers
and mechanics between cars to try and detox the team,
if you like. But I wonder when that when McLaren
(09:05):
will feel comfortable allowing that to happen, because that four
lap op set is minimal strategy difference, right, it is
still a little bit because it meant the drivers are
doing slightly different things in middle stint. But I wonder
how many points behind is max with staff and have
to be in third place before McLaren is willing to
allow its drivers to do their own thing because it's
so clearly a one on one championship. But I don't
(09:27):
feel like they'really that close. There's still this hedging mentality.
Maybe it'll be a post mid season break thing, assuming
that there is no change in the form guy between
now and then, which is pretty unimaginable anyway. But I
think that'll be interesting because that'll be the next test
when you start to give them a bit more leash
to be creative, to fight their own battles rather than
deferring to the team and this idea of being a
(09:47):
good team player. That's when you risk a little bit
of those cracks. I think the characters are good and
can survive it, but you don't know how tense this
is going to be, right, We don't know what it's
going to look like in Abu Dhabi, and.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
That will actually be super compelled, I think, because I
think what made that Mercedes were just braining everybody every
race weekend at that point. But what made that interesting
was you always felt, I don't know whether it was
true or not, but it certainly felt from my vantage
point that there was this more sort of cerebral side
to Nico Rosberg and that he could engineer himself into
an advantageous position. And you know, whether that's reality or not,
(10:21):
it always felt like Hamilton was the faster rider and
a driver, and Rosberg was the smarter driver in that time,
and so the contrast of each other's strengths mitigated against
the other week That's what made that fight so interesting,
because they were trying to achieve the same thing from
different angles, Whereas at the moment the McLaren ever on
this very narrow path. We will do things fairly. We
will do things fairly. And in answer to your question,
(10:42):
at what point how many points ahead of third place
is enough? I mean, look, I said before McLaren's almost
unlosable lead in the Constructors Championship. The fact that they
already won that last year, so it's not what they're
going for that for the first time, I think is
an interesting point here as well, because they're not at
risk of losing that. And then once it becomes realistic
(11:03):
that nobody else other than a McLaren driver is going
to win the Driver's World Championship, I think we will
see that. The fascinating thing for me is that's probably
going to favor one driver over the other. But who
that's the answer. We don't know yet because we've got
no evidence to suggest that one of them is going
to be better placed. If they become the new dare
I say rules of engagement, If that becomes a new thing,
(11:24):
who does that advantage which side of the garage? Who
is better at that, Who can think better on the fly,
who has got better preparation, who can adapt within a
race situation. I think that adds a lot of intrigue
to some races at the end of the year, where
we'll go into them knowing that it's probably going to be,
all things considered, two orange cars on the front row
and one of them is going to win. I think
that will make it a lot more interesting just simply
(11:45):
we're dealing with something we've not seen.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Yeah, I think it will be, and I do wonder
whether they'll get there or whether they'll know for the
first Drivers Championship. They'll refuse to allow that relaxation, but
it'll be really interesting to see because I think it's
pretty clear at this point we're heading towards that conclusion.
I want to talk now about the broader picture here
because we've had quite a few what have almost been
billed as last chances for the rival teams to catch up. Right.
(12:09):
We had those rule changes in Spain, the first major
upgrades in him are all that sort of stuff, and
no one's been able to catch McClaren. There was Canada
that was a blip and there were circumstances behind it,
but this one felt a little bit different because all
the front running teams brought upgrades. Red Bull Racings brought
one that I hoped would change things for Arari two.
And I want to stick with Red Bull Racing here
because not only did they bring these upgrades, but this
(12:29):
is the home race of the Red Bull Company, even
if the team's not based here, and it's also a
track like Norris that Vestapan's always done very well and
he's always formittable here. Five wins at this circuit and
the team was just kind of nowhere all weekend. Versaven
probably could have qualified, well, let's say third, could have
done the front row. But if we assume he would
have completed his lap, we've got to say Pastre would
have been I think he probably would have taken the
(12:50):
front row. Nonetheless, he would have qualified a lot better.
It maybe not been obliterated by Andrea Kimi Antonelliot it
turned three, but he was And that's part of the story.
But the other part of the stories, of course, that
the team still had one car in the race, but
very easily forgettable. It was Yuki Sonoda who qualified eighteen,
finished two laps down. You only driver two laps down,
thirty seconds off the back of the pack. Yes, you
(13:11):
had to make a third pit stop. Nonetheless, really poor
race from him, despite the fact Matt that this was
actually his closest he's been to maxim qualifying in terms
of time deficit. This felt like a bit of a
new low for me because it was another race where
he ended saying I don't know why, I don't know
why I'm slow. I don't know what to do about it.
This is essentially paraphrasing his words, but they're not that different.
(13:32):
If anyone's got any ideas, I'll try them. This was
grim for Red Bull.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
So just to go back, you said that Red Bull
had two cars in the race. I was not aware
of this. In fact, I've not been aware that Red
Bulls had two cars since since Daniel Riccardo drove there
next to Maximstaff. And I mean, we only have to
listen to that Sergio Perro's interview last week where they
basically ambitted. They only according to Perez, they only run
two cars because they have to. And this is the problem.
(13:58):
I think it was at seventy seven since Red Bull
didn't score a point. And this is the issue here
because it is a one driver team and you've had
this rotating situation now where you've tried so many different
drivers in that second seat since Daniel Ricardo left that
team for twenty nineteen. And I'm starting to think that
(14:20):
we keep talking about the fact that they have a
second driver problem, maybe they have a first driver problem.
And because Max for stappad is so good and he
is able to drive around the difficulties of a problematic
car year on year, and we've discussed this before, it's
the Mark Marquez Hondo Motor GP analogy here that is
(14:41):
the problem. Is they're trying to find someone who can
do some sort of percentage of what for Stappan can do,
and maybe that person doesn't exist because the car is
so extreme and you saw a situation it was made
all the worse because everyone had come dressed in orange.
You know, whether you're supporting Red Bully, supporting Max or
whatever it is, you've got the giant or the infield
of the circuit. This race exists because of a drink
(15:04):
in a can. Let's be perfectly honest, and yes, their
main guy was out on the first lap, and then
after that that should be where the second driver is like, well,
I'm going to banker solid sixth then at the very
least so you actually notice. And the only time we
saw Yuki sonoda was when he was getting into scrapes
with people right at the very very back and trumbling around.
And this is not an isolated incert But you could
(15:26):
substitute Liam Lawson in here or anybody else. The contrast
for me as well, is that Liam Lawson had his
best Formula One result of his career with sixth place
in Austria, and the normal course of events with the
second team like that, you'd be like, well he seems
good that young lawson Blake. Maybe we could promote him
to Oh no, we can't do that because we gave
him two races and we sent him back to the
(15:48):
B team. So the whole thing is a bit of
a shambles, let's be perfectly honest. But they seem quite lost.
I mean, there was so much discussion about, oh wait
till we get to Barcelona and we've got these new
flexwing tests and this is going to be the you know,
the magic bullet to get us back to the top.
All that came and went with a bit of a whimpet,
didn't it. And they're just they're just pretty much nowhere.
(16:10):
And the one the thing I thought was interesting was
that you may have read that maxistaff and didn't even
watch the rest of the Grand Prix once he got
knocked out. He actually went and sat and watched the
spar twenty four hours with TV and that was fun,
but he wasn't watching it. I think quite a few
people in the crowd worked for that one either.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
I mean, I've done the Austrian ground for a couple
of times. I think a lot of people in the crowd,
maybe they look like they're watching but at some point
they're not fully aware of what's going on.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
They're mostly just sunburnt and slightly inebriated.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
Yes, yeah, at some point you can't tell the difference
between the orange capes and just the orange sunburn. It's yeah,
I think that's pretty much it. It is an interesting
situation for it. Well, I like the way you put it.
It is a first driver problem because you can't help
but think. And I've been thinking about this this week
because there's this idea that well, you know, we've got
to the end of the regulation. This is certainly Christian
Hornet's perspective. Okay, we've struggled in the last years of
(17:01):
the regulations. He's blamed the old wind tunne a little bit.
He's talked about well, this team's also designed that most
dominant car in f On history a couple of years ago. Yeah,
haven't become indiots overnight. Next year's regulation change is completely new,
including with the power unit. It'll be a blank slate.
We'll go back to being good again. But I can't
help but think. I can't believe I'm making an analogy
(17:22):
with Daniel Ricardo. Remarkable for an Australian doing such a thing.
But remember when he joined McLaren in the preview the
last year of the previous set of regulations. Now and
we made the exact same assumptions. He couldn't needn't understand
the car, didn't jar with the car, but you know,
the regulations are going to change the following year, and
he'll start from zero like everyone else, and it will
be good. And yet he struggled in pretty much exactly
(17:43):
the same way because it's the same team of designers
who are designing the car, even if the regulations are different.
When we're talking about things like the balance of the
car and how you adjust that and the operating window. Yes,
there's an aerodynamic component, and the aerodynamics are changing next year.
But I've found it interesting how many different teams been saying, well,
there are some things we can carry over to next year,
because you know, suspension is fundamentally the same note of
(18:05):
what car you build, and the tires are going to
be the same next year, and all these interacting elements
that Red Bull seems to be struggling with, at least
a little bit or as a part of their struggles,
will be built by the same people who built this
year's car, and the same people who Adrian Nue since
left the team has said refused or did not or
could not recognize these problems when they began occurring in
twenty twenty three because Max was making them look so
(18:28):
good and are now playing catch up. Maybe you can't
have as much confidence that that same group of people,
using Max for staff and as their reference as they should,
won't design a car with similar problems or some other
problems that Max will be able to handle for a
year or two until the land up down the same
dead end road of development, by which point Dalla burned through,
(18:49):
Isaac Kadjar and probably three or four other drivers two
years down the road have brought Daniel kiveyat back presumably,
and Hill have done no good as well. I think
that it's too easy to say, well, we just got
to it through this year and ride it off. I
think this problem at Red Bull now it's nearly a
decade sin Saniel Ricardo left. It's a long running thing. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
And also the fact that you aren't just rolling through
a very stable set of regulations for next year and
so oh we might find something next year, or we
could change the driver and it's all fine. There's a
lot of trying to speak optimism into existence right now
when you're looking at twenty six, because yeah, there's spinning
a lot of plates for next year with a new
engine partner, and there's a lot of change. As it
(19:26):
is when you've got a second car that, no matter
who drives it, contributes absolutely nothing, and then when you've
got races like this that it just exposes the problem. Yeah,
I think there's a lot of unanswered questions there, and
you've always got this is Max leaving? Is Max going
to retire young? Is Max going to move to Mercedes?
There's so much being placed upon him and about you.
(19:48):
I think I never underrated Max Forstappan as a driver.
I mean, the guy's won four World championships. He's clearly
excellent at driving a Formula WLDE car. We've had a
lot of evidence of that over a long period of time.
I'm actually respecting a lot more what he's doing this year,
simply because the car is clearly very difficult and he's
just swimming upstream against the current every single weekend to
(20:12):
try and get into a position to do anything. There's
a bloody mindedness and a determination that is commendable with
the way he's going about it. But it also feels
like at some point the courage is just going to
take him down stream when he can't keep swimming back
up again. It's got a little bit of a feeling
of that, whether it's being taken out unluckily on the
first lap of a race, or they'll just come a
point where the car just doesn't work and he's doing
(20:34):
everything in his power to finish sixth Somewhere. That's going
to be the period where you know they're in trouble now,
that they could be in serious trouble for next year,
because if I had to frame a market on who
do I trust to get a new regulation set right
for twenty twenty six, Red Bull aren't at the top
for me, and they might not even be in the
top two or three.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
Yeah, and I think that's a fair call. It's the
great mystery of the regulation change, particular ones that are
so big and include a power unit and red Will
Racing speret inhouse power. It's interesting situation. Just before we
move on, Matt red Bill scored twenty scored nineteen points
in the last three races. Sober has scored twenty.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
I'm so glad you wrote this down that Saber has
outscored every team except for McLaren Ferrari m Mercedes over
the last three Grand Prix. So I'm glad you've bought
sober up. Hat tip to them. Also on my list
because we needed to talk about Liam laws and we've
done that. Gabrielle brought a letto. He's looking quite good,
isn't he.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
Yes. Finally, I mean imagine this, Matt. Imagine a team
in Formula one giving a rookie more than five to
six races to prove they belong in Formula one.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
What do you try to That's ridiculous talk from you, Lemonado,
What are you talking about.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
Let's move to Move of the Week, brought to you
by Shannon's Formula One and Moto GP in action over
the course of the weekend. I'm going to kick us
off today. I'm going to go with the Austrian Grand Prix.
I'm going to keep it pretty straightforward though, because I
thought this was a great move with a great bit
of context behind it, which was what technically Lando Norris's
(22:01):
overtake for the lead. I think it was on a
lap eleven after Piastri had briefly taken it from him
at turn three. He played the more clever tactical game,
which is something that I feel like we've struggled to
say about him almost ever. To be fair, he's only
been in a race winning circumstance for a year or so,
(22:22):
but particularly in the in contrast with last year when
he was battling with Max Withstappen for the lead, and
while the crash was Max's fault, there's no denying that
in the sense of him not winning the race with
a car that at the place to do it, I
think Lando was guilty of just being too blunt of
an instrument, of not really understanding the tactics of racing
at this circuit that is unique three to our s zones.
(22:42):
I think it's seventy percent of the track whatever it is,
A lot of the track is dominated by drs. It
is a certain way of racing. This year, he got
it absolutely right when Oscar made the move up into
turn three, understood how he could fight back from that,
and he did exactly that. You know, because had he
not done that, Oscar had taken the lead. I think
it would have been pretty easy to imagine a Constants
in which he just then controls the race there after
and he's not seen again or fundamentally, so a really
(23:05):
important overtake, one that shows that he is developing. When
I think earlier this year it's been easy to say
maybe he hasn't been particularly in a racecraft sense, which
I think is a weakness reality of tu Oscar. So
I think that made this victory just that a little
bit more important, regardless of the bounce back from Canada,
the points, all that stuff proving that he's made progress
and he's doing it against his teammates, equal machinery, all
(23:26):
that kind of stuff. I thought it was a really
important overtakes. That's my move of the week.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
Yeah, certainly more important. You know that, the context and
what it means, and even the fact of where it
was because of Austria last year. I think they're all
very good points. And I'll also give you an extra
golf clap for use of blunt instrument because it's the
for anyone playing lemonato bingo at home. You can cross
that one off.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
All right, what do you got for us about?
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Well, I sort of in one of those uncharitable moods today,
so I'm just going to let this one fly. I'm
saying move of the Week was Kimmie Antonelli taking Max
for staff and out at seven three on the opening
lab simply because Michael, simply because it exposed the red
Bull driver pipeline for what it is, basically a car crash,
making us more aware of something that's actually a car
(24:10):
craw So that's why I'm giving Kimmy Antonelli Move of
the Week because it brought something into plain view that
we all know that we all talk around the edges
from time to time, and then what happened in the
subsequent sixty nine and three quarter lapse of that race
just expose that driver pipeline for what it is.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
Yes, I like it. I like a lot where you've
taken that and like I said, move of the Week
does not imply success, does not even imply and overtake,
so perfectly happy for that loophole to be exploited. There's
one other team I want to talk about, Matt in
summing up the Austrian Grand Prix, and that's Alpine Alpine,
which is owned by Reno, one of the biggest car
(24:46):
companies in the world, also partially owned by the French state.
Some people don't know that it's last in the Constructors Championship.
It's scored just eleven points. That's less than half the
total of Sauba, which is on a great run. Now
looking at this race, Pierre Gasly qualified in the top ten,
just tenth after he spent out the last warning, but
unth less top ten. Franco Colobindo qualified in Q two's
(25:06):
that's okay, that's fine, talk about him in a second
as well, but failed to score. Both cars just went
backwards through this race, and that's indicted well, not only
because the cars went backwards, but this is a race
in which only five of the front runners scored points.
Two of them. Of course, will wiped out and Yuki
Snoda was never at the races and both Williams cars,
I think this is almost the more important part. They
both retired in what's turning into a pretty horrendous mid
(25:28):
season runner reliability for the team that looked pretty locked
on for fifth in a Constructors champion twenty a few
weeks ago. That should have been easy pickings for a
team like Elpaine that had qualified again with one kind
of the top ten, but it was South that got
both cars into the points and good with them, but
it's interesting to hear the language coming out of the
team now Flaveerberatore, and it's up to you how you
want to interpret all of the words, but it's called
(25:51):
it increasingly concerning you, he said, and this was after
on Saturday he said he was disappointed by Franco Colobinda
not getting into the top ten, that he needs both
cars to be there. Someone I assumably told him afterwards
that he's only been in the car for five races
to help him. But nonetheless, this is a team that's
looking pretty shaky. And then there are reports on Monday,
and I think this is where things start to get
(26:11):
increasingly bizarre or highlights the chaos. That the teams are
talking to valtri Botas or Mercedes to try and get
the services of Volti Botas, not just for next year,
but for this year.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
What on earth is going on now? I mean, it's
the way you set that up earlier, and that you
were talking about the context of what Alpine has done,
and that Souber given the resource and the budget and
the fact they run very very garish green cars that
look like they don't belong in Formula one, the fact
that they're comprehensively outperforming a team that is partially owned
(26:41):
by the French state. I mean, put that together as
a sentence, that doesn't make sense. It's absolutely crazy. What
is not going on there. It just seems it seems reactionary,
it seems rudderless, it seems there's just there's almost an
inevitability now when you wat them that you just expect
(27:01):
it to be no good. And part of that, I
think is that it's talking about other drivers whose stocks
and reputation are probably up this year. Pierre Gastly's driving
very very well at the moment, and oh he used
to drive a red bull racing remember that. But he's
another guy who's been rehabilitated and gone off somewhere else
and made a very good Formula One career for himself.
I don't think that the problem is what he is
(27:23):
doing necessarily. It just seems very haphazard. It seems even
coming into this season, when you're a works outfit and
you've made the decision to shut your own engine program down,
even things like that at the start of the season,
it's like, what are we actually doing here? And it's
highlighted by Williams having this really strong start to the season. Yes,
(27:45):
things have nosed dive pretty spectacularly since, but they have
made what I believe is the very sensible decision to
if we had a stable rule set for twenty twenty six,
I think Williams would have pushed on and really and
really taken that early season momentum and run with it.
They're making the sensible decision. It's like, Okay, good, we
can build a good car, we can do good things.
Let's do that when everything changes then, so they're going
(28:06):
to clearly tail off what Sauba doing at the moment
is it's a product of stability and slight evolution and execution.
It feels like Sauber get a lot of things right
on race weekends at the moment, and these are the
areas to me that Alpine is always left falling short.
And then you've got the driver instability, and you know
Jack doing at the start of the season refusing to
(28:28):
answer questions about his future because he and we all
knew exactly where that was going. And then Franco Colopinto
comes in and he scores precisely the same number of
points as Jack doing over his five races in the car,
and the whole thing is completely chaotic. But you mentioned
Valterie Botas. This is really interesting for me because yes,
there's a Mercedes power plant going into that car for
twenty twenty six, but of course Botas has already been
(28:50):
discussed in potentially being a Cadillac driver for next season.
That's an interesting conundrum, isn't it, Because you've got a
team that operationally and stability and management wise is a
bit of a mess and our plane has been for
a while. They're going to have an engine that I
would almost put the house on is probably going to
be the best engine in Formula One next year in
(29:11):
twenty twenty six with a Mercedes engine. So there's a
known quantity in terms of management and potentially engine, and
he's also driven Mercedes powered cars a lot in his career.
Or is the potential of a startup getting on the
ground floor base camp Cadillac operation with a Ferrari power plant,
which is more probably of an unknown than Mercedes. You'd
have to say the fact that Valsi Botas has potentially
(29:34):
got two options is two more options than we probably
thought he'd have to get back on the grid. But
if he does have two options, there's no easy answer
to that is there because there's compelling cases for both.
I don't think either of them are wrong, but one
of them is going to be more right.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Yeah, I think you're right, because it's just funny that
there's a choice at all. Forether of these drivers, I
mean their fortunately Cadillac's coming in. Otherwise all of this
could be Bizarren. We shouldn't forget that. Alpines also farming
out paul aarro On. It's reserve driver at a Saber
for a couple of FP one sessions before the mid
season break, plus three it's got planned for later in
the year and he's potentially in the frame, you know,
(30:09):
as a contingency at a minimum. So that's sort of
interesting in its own right. But let me sell you
alp in two different ways.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
I'm looking forward to this.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
One is the Renault owned works manufacturer Alpe know it
is Reno by another name. It's just a different color
with a great history of championship winning success. B it's
the independent team that's going to finish the last in
the Constructors Championship with less than half the points of
the team that was last last year. Because that's what
it is. Next year, it's owned by a big company,
(30:38):
but it will no longer be a works team. It's
a team that fields, like with the exception of Flavio
Brittorio has a remit to report to the board at
Reno or the CEO who's now leaving the team, so
that throws that into uncertainty on a different level. Feels
like it's at arm's length from the works team anyway,
certainly different from Ferrari is an example, different even to Mercedes, which,
even though Mercedes only owns a third of the Mercedes
(31:00):
F one team, the collaboration is close and historical and
likewise with the engine component of that team. Cadillac, on
the other hand, yeah, it's running Ferrari customer engines next year.
I don't think anyone expects them to do great things
even in the first few years, but will be a
real works team later eventually. So there's something there. I
think you can you could you know if you were
(31:21):
a Cadillac at least you're Mari Andrettie talking to Valdri
Botas or Sergio Peris, because he's been rumored to be
linked to Alpine as well. I think that's gone pretty
cold recently. I think the pitch is probably easier to
make for Cadillac, because then you've got to add in
the fact that I think Cadillac is going to be
certain inn F one for a minimum and a long
amount of time, right, Like the minimum time is going
to be long because you don't make this kind of
(31:43):
investment and then leaving three ys, it's not going to happen.
Alpine's future to me looks pretty uncertain because, like I said,
the CEO is left unexpected, he's got a job elsewhere,
and he's always insisted the team's not for sale. But
like you said, they've shouted their engine division. A lot
of the moves they've made looks like a team that
wants to be sold. And more important that we don't
know what the next CEO's opinion is going to be,
regardless of the fact the team has denied consistently that
(32:05):
they're up for sale and so far they haven't been sold.
They've been right. There is a new CEO arriving. We
don't know who it's going to be. We don't know
what their opinion on the Formula one program is going
to be, and the massive expense of that it could
be sold, it could be closed. We don't know. So
if you're looking for a Valtriebot has not looking for
a one year deal just to prove you could get
back in F one. He's looking for a couple of
years at least. The team could cease to exist in
(32:25):
that time. I think, actually it's a big question. I'm
not saying you should definitely not choose Alpine because it
could be a root of the grid in as little
as two weeks, who knows, But I think the question
of the long term is a much bigger one than
you would have thought, maybe even twelve months ago. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Absolutely. And the other parts of this too is there's
an expectation management element to all of this because of
Alpine's name, and it's you know, it's longevity in the
sport and what have you. Anything that Botas would do
in Cadillac. There's that sort of underpromise over deliver, like
no one's expecting Botas to come in and all of
a sudden being Q three in next year. Fantastic if
(33:01):
it happens. So every result that Cadillac get next year,
it'll be well, they're a startup there and youw team,
haven't they done well? You know, one of their cars
just MISQ three that was excellent. What about that really
good twelfth that Valteri Botas got in Bahrain or something.
Whereas if you go to alp and it's got a
Mercedes in the back of it and you're finishing twelfth,
it's a disaster and the world is on fire. So
the same results could happen but be interpreted two very
(33:24):
very different ways, simply based on where these two teams
and entities are in their Formula one journeys. If you're
looking for a longer runway and perhaps longevity and the sport,
if you're Valterie Botas, you'd probably be going to Cadillac
because everything that you do that's positive is going to
be celebrated far more than well, that was positive what
you did at alp But why wasn't it more positive
(33:45):
because your Alpene you should be doing better than this.
So look, the Mercedes power plant is a pretty big
character dangle in front of somebody in particularly because he
knows how that company works. But I'm with you, like
the whole thing with Alpine, is in any other business,
any other sort of to sport business or sport business
or just business per se, with the amount of decisions
that have gone on behind the scenes there. It feels
(34:06):
like something that is being prepared to be sold despite
the denials to the country. And it's felt like that
for a while. And you and I know that if
you woke up tomorrow morning, look at your phone, it's like, oh,
do you hear al Peina pulling out of Formula one?
You'd go wow, But then you'd go, well, yeah, okay,
that makes complete sense, whereas I don't think Cadillac are
going to go, look, we've done all this prap, we
(34:27):
we've spent all this buddey, we've hired all these people.
But no, thanks, we don't want to do that. And
that's a key difference between these two teams. So look,
hoay fa valtrie Botouse. He's got choices. Certainly we didn't
expect that. But I wonder if the incumbent team, with
the history that Alpine's got, is actually going to be
seen as the worst of the two choices for whoever
(34:47):
takes that seat.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
Yeah, which is pretty remarkable. Just quickly. It's just reminds
us speaking of a colleague and different podcasts. Actually, and
he put it to me like this, and I really
liked it. First, I thought it was just a brutal
bit of commentary, but I think actually it sums up
is that Alpine Alping is not at the bottom yet.
I think that's the most alarming part, because they're not.
If you look at their structure of Alpine and I
(35:08):
know that part of the biggest problems. They don't have
a team principle at the moment. But you can't tell
me that that is the structure the senior managers. Who
is going to take this team to success. Maybe, look,
you people have different opinions on flav bet Or. I
get it, but he's not there for the long term.
He's already pretty old. He's got some old school ideas
clearly on how they run the team, and I just
don't see it being I just don't see, you know,
(35:29):
the next time Alpine wins a race, you know, purely
on merit is in Bodihuim contention, I can't see him
being there going, oh well, I've I'm sure he will
say it was all up to him, but I can't
see him being there as the one who orchestrated at all.
They don't have a team principal. Technical leadership has changed
a lot in recent years, it doesn't feel like they're
at and by rock bottom. I don't just mean they
potentially could get worse, but I mean they're not at
(35:49):
base camp. I think maybe he's a more clear way
to say, they're not at that point where you can
see the route to the top yet, whereas with Cadillac
they are at they're at the start of thing. You know,
we don't know when they'll ever win a race or a
championship away, it's impossible to say, but they are at
the start of something. Everything Valtrie does that's good there
would have contributed to the foundations of the team or
any driver who goes there. I just thought it was
(36:12):
very interesting to think about the idea that helping is
still further to go.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
No, you're right, Cadillacs at the start of something and
Alpine might not be at the end of something else.
And that's that's the easiest way to describe it at
the moment. But the interesting choice for botasid all of this,
because clearly he's not a guy who's going to be
driving forever in a day. Either is there's a brand
association AMBASSADORI or you can hit your you can hit
(36:37):
yourself to a project that's got instant credibility and gravitas
as you go forward, as opposed to something that, like
I said, if you wake up tomorrow morning and the
whole thing was in the bin, you wouldn't be surprised
with Alpine. So yeah, there's more than just driving to
consider with these sorts of things. And you know, all
these guys of someone of his reputation and the ILK
and Grand Prix winning experience has made enough cash at
(36:57):
this point, so it's not just about that either. So yeah,
it's certainly interesting. And you know the question there is
if he ends up taking the Alpine seat, then who's
in the frame for Cadillac or vice versa, Because yeah,
like you were saying, Alpine's got about six hundred reserve drivers,
they might all get three races each before the end
of the year.
Speaker 1 (37:15):
All Right, that was the Austrian Grand Prix and a
little bit of that news that's come out since then
the British Grand Prixx this weekend, so you don't have
to wait long for more Formula one. But let's have
a crack at thinking looking at what's going to be
happening with the Crystal Ball. Brought to you by complete
home filtration. Matt, would you like to start us off?
What are you? What's in your forecast? Now?
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Look, if you don't blow your own trumpet in this
mic where no one's going to So I'm just going
to remind you and everyone listening that I actually picked
Lando Norris to win the Austrian Grand Prix, so good
victory that for me. I'm only going to mention these
things when I get them right. You'll never hear me
mention it when I don't. But my crystal ball this
week has been fitted with a very impressive square jaw
line in honor of Mark Weber. Obviously, Mark Webber of
(37:55):
course banishes Oscar Pastre and Mark Webber was as good
at his home grownd pri as Jensen Button was at
his home Grand Prix, and that Jensen Button would always
win in Australia. Mark Webber won several times at Silveston,
and both of them never fired a shot at their
home Grand Prix, which is a very long way of
saying that the British McLaren driver is not going to
win at Silveston this weekend. Oscar Piastre is so Sky
(38:18):
Sports can put the pomp Poms back in the box
Bristol and Glastonbury tetowls flying at half masted over Silveston
this weekend. I think we're going to see an Australian
winning at Silverston, and I think Oscar Piastre is going
to bounce back and take victory.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
I like it a lot. I like it a lot.
My prediction. My Crystal Ball tell me some really specific things, though,
I think might tally well with yours. I think we're
going to hear a record number in the broadcast of
the plural third person possessive determiner, a lot of our George's,
our allies, our Lewis, depending on how he's performing, our
(38:51):
Alex otherwise he's from Thailand. Yes, and of course I'm
going to hear a lot about our nine and our Damon.
I bet they're going to be there. Ian's also tally
when I think I'm going to be spot on with
this one. The Crystal World's telling me that the Lewis
Hamilton's honorific of sir is going to be wheeled out
quite a bit. Oh yes, Sir Lewis Helenon Ferrari hasn't.
I haven't heard it in a while, but if it's
ever going to happen. It's going to be at the
(39:11):
British Grand Prix, which Matt, I'm sure you'll be reminded
many times, is the first Grand Prix. It's coming home
former World War air field and you know Sterling Moss,
et cetera.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Can we take the listeners behind the curtains slightly here.
I'm not going to completely reveal all the contents of this,
but I do believe that I still haven't saved in
my phone somewhere that you made a Bingo card of
things that will be said on the commentary during the
British Grand Prix. We should post it somewhere if we
don't get ourselves sacked in the meantime. But I think
I had the whole Bingo card filled out by like
the first ten minutes of FP two a couple of
(39:44):
years ago. So all the old ones are going to
come out, but the use of our is going to
be absolutely fantastic. And pstre He is from that place
where we used to send the convicts and everything as well,
so I certainly won't do anything.
Speaker 1 (39:57):
Look you'll see they will all be ticked off very rapid.
I am confident I think we've both made good predictions.
We'll find out how they go next week. But that's
all the time we have for bit talk today. You
can subscribe to bittalk wherever you get your favorite podcasts,
and you can leave us a rating and a review
as well. This weekend it is the Formula one British
Grand Prix, with lights out at midnight Sunday night. You
can keep up to date for the latest F one,
(40:18):
supercars and MotoGP news at Fox Sports dot com dot
Au from Matt Clayton and me Michael Lomonado. Thanks very
much for your company and we'll catch you next week.
Hello, and welcome to Pit Talk, brought to you by Shannon's.
On today's episode, Lando Norris scores a decisive victory at
the Austrian Grand Prix to reduce his title devicit to
Oscar Piastri, and after another disappointing result for Alpine, is
yet another driver change on the cards. My name is
Michael Lomonado. It's great to have your company and the
company of my co host. He's just got off the
(00:22):
phone with Flavio Briatore something about a drive after the
mid season break. It's Matt Payton.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Look, I'm a little bit busy, but I could probably
squeeze five races in because that tends to be what
most drivers at Alpine get. So I'll be done just
in time for us to head to I don't know,
Katar or something. It's a bit hot there, so I'm
to drive there. But I'll do my best in my
five races and then pass the baton onto somebody else.
That seems to be the way it's going.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Yeah, who says there's no certainty at Alpine? You know,
you get five races and you're done. It's just the
way it is. We will talk about the situation at
Alpine a little bit later on, and of course at
Red Bull Racing, where nothing's changed and that's the problem.
But let's start with Lando Norris winning the OS and
Grand Prix. It was the rebound he needed after the
catastrophe in Canada, and he dominated from start to finish
(01:06):
except FP one, which he did not enter, but all
of the practice sessions is he had FP two, FP
three top. There are all three qualifying segments, biggest pole
margin of the season, victory over teammatee Oscar Piastre, including
some genuine wheel to wheel battling in the first stint
at least, does it feel like to you, Matt Lando
Norris's back, is there is this another false dawn like
(01:27):
the Monaco example.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
I don't know. Either of those questions could be yes
or no. I guess I think firstly, I'd like to
welcome you to the start of the second half of
the Formula one season two races early because I feel
that McLaren being in their own category at the front
of Grand Prix, particularly with a real change looming for
twenty six and all of the developmental taps being turned off,
a term we're going to hear quite a bit I
(01:49):
feel that we're going to have a lot more racist
like this, where it's too McLaren's in one race and
everybody else in another one. But to my mind, this
was a win that Norris had to have in the
manner that he had it because of what had happened
in Canada, the fact that he put his hand up,
the fact that he had lost wouldn't say control, certainly
lost momentum within his own team, and in the championship fight,
(02:10):
he needed to win a race. He needed to win
a race like this, and I think if this championship
battle is going to run and run for the remainder
of the season, which given that it seems to be
a two car championship now I think is going to happen,
he had to have this. We did foreshadow this in
last week's preview episode that this has been a particularly
good track for him, and even when McLaren wasn't particularly good,
(02:31):
he was quite good here. So the manner in which
he won on the weekend was impressive, probably not a
massive surprise. I guess we'll never really know how the
race might have played out differently, or at least the
battle for pole, because of how compromise. Q three was,
but given he'd had some sort of ropie races and
there'd been some questions about his championship bona fides, I
(02:52):
think this is a win he had to have, and
the way he did it was very impressive. Whether Oscar
Piastri had a pole position lap in him, we're never
going to because of what happened in Q three, you
would say unlikely, But we also know that Piastre is
a guy who rises to the occasion when the stakes
are at their higher, So it was a shame we
never really got a definitive answer to that. But the
first into the race, it was great that they allowed
(03:14):
them to race because it was very compelling tov, wasn't it.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Yeah, I mean it really made up for what otherwise
would have been very really quite streadfulard domination. So it
was an entertaining race. Once Osco Piastri got into second place,
you do wonder, how do you even at least qualified
on the front row, how different this race might have
been because he made a passed straight off the line. Okay,
wouldn't have been the same pass, but to have been
competing from turn one rather than turn three as it
(03:38):
was maybe things would have looked slightly different, but I
do like and I think the question is now obviously
beyond doubt because not only have we seen so many examples,
but it now looks pretty clear it is just a
two horse race for the driver's title. How many times
McLaren's proved that, yes, they are going to be free
to race and it's going to be fine, and we're
going to manage it fine, and there's going to be
no issues or controversies. I feel like they passed a
(04:00):
lot of those tests, you know, the only real test left,
and obviously the team will be hoping they never have
to be asked. The question is when they genuinely crash
into each other in the heat of battle, not in
a clumsy era like was in the case in Canada
with Lando Norris. But they are sticking to their guns,
and I think it's really interesting. And I'm not sure
if this is just because you only get a certain
amount of radio through the team and you can go
(04:21):
and find full radio communications, but every driver communicates with
the engineers differently. But I find it really interesting how
much Lando Norris in particular, But it is happening to
Oscar to a lesser extent is being motivated to compete
with the other car in a way that as if
the other car were from a different team. Obviously they
know that they're their chief championship rival, so it's not unusual,
(04:43):
it's not too strange, but it's just really interesting that,
you know, the further we get into this season, the
clear it's become that McLaren knew ahead of the year
that this was the likely outcome. Where all the down
talking every team does when they know they've got a
dominant car, and they feel really prepared to let these
two drivers battle as hard as possible and yet trust
them not to make a mistake. And I just think
(05:03):
there's another interesting chapter in that because they went very far,
and they let them go very far without ever intervening.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Which is commendable and again easier to do when you're
probably you know, you know, you're really the only two
drivers in contention for the World Driver's Championship. I mean,
at this stage McLaren's going to win the constructors Championship.
For most teams, that's exactly what they want, and so
the identity of the driver who wins it is probably
a bit of a secondary consideration. What you said then
is really interesting with the way that they were looking
(05:31):
to exploit what the other car was doing. But I
think there's also juxtaposed against this, they're trying to be
so fair strategically, I think between the two drivers in
that the way that race played out, I wonder if
you know there was an alternate strategy there for Pastre
to perhaps one stop or run the hard tire for longer.
(05:52):
And is that a strategic option you take if the
person you're racing against for the race win isn't from
the same team. And that's interesting to me because to say,
what was a Ferrari upfront of a Mercedes? I wonder
if you'd be more bullish about perhaps going for some
of those other strategic options. They're so determined to play
at fair strategically, yet they're trying to chip away at
(06:12):
every little advantage they can get over their rivals. So
it's is a strange contrast here in that, yes, they
are trying to win the race, but they're not going
to do it necessarily through throwing a hail Mary to
get an advantageous strategy or doing something different. There's this
fairness they're trying to operate and it's commendable and it
looks great when it's written down a piece of paper.
But as you just said, then we've got, however many rounds,
(06:34):
We've got to go a lot and there is inevitably
going to be some contact because this is what happens
in world championships with two strong race winning drivers in
a dominant team. You know, you think back to the
beginning of the V six turbo hybrid era where Lewis
Hamilton and Nico Rosberg ran into each other on a
number of occasions. Now only a Mercedes driver was going
to win those championships, but you know, you think back
(06:57):
to twenty fourteen. Daniel Rocado's winning Belgium that year vowed
itself to the fact that the Mercedes ran into each
other on the first lap, and it's going to happen.
I don't think Mercedes are going to win every race
of the rest of the year. A because Maxwistappen's two
good at certain places, and b because there will be
a race where you're going to see a Barcelona twenty
sixteen situation where they're probably both going to end up
(07:17):
in the gravel somewhere. It's just going to happen. So
how long this concept of fairness and team play and
everything else lasts It will depend on how many other
rivals there are realistically in the fight for race wins.
I think the championships out of the question now, but
we've got so much of this season still to go,
so this story could still change two or three times
between now and when we get to Abu Dhabi. And
picking when that's going to twist and what the inflection
(07:40):
points are going to be is going to be really
interesting in a series where on pace performance alone, I
think Austria showed us that this really is a one team,
two driver World Championship at this point. Those types of
championships and races can be super interesting, as we know.
But given you've got this looming regulation set change for
twenty twenty six, I think it's just escalate that even more.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
You think, I think so, And I think that it's
sort of funny to think you talk about how long
of the seasons to go, It feels like we've already
lived more than half of the season. With the momentum
Piastre had behind him since the Australian Grand Prix and
the prospect of maybe that won't change and maybe this
will be a one off, a nour or maybe it'll
simply be much more even between them. But with so
(08:21):
much the season still to go, it just makes you
reassess or recontextualize the fact that there's there is so
much potential for changes. You say the strategy thing just
before you move on, I think is really interesting because
I was trying to think back, and I've gone done
a little bit of reading to remind myself, because it's
alarming that it was a decade ago now when Mercedes
really had the run of things in the start of
his turbo hybrid era. It would always come to a
(08:43):
point where they'd also let each side of the garage
strategize their own way through races. Yes, like really it
was almost as though there were two separate teams, which
ultimately ended up being to the detriment of harmony. Anyone
who remembers twenty sixteen, as I've alluded to, their un
to the point where Tota Wolf swapped all the engineers
and mechanics between cars to try and detox the team,
if you like. But I wonder when that when McLaren
(09:05):
will feel comfortable allowing that to happen, because that four
lap op set is minimal strategy difference, right, it is
still a little bit because it meant the drivers are
doing slightly different things in middle stint. But I wonder
how many points behind is max with staff and have
to be in third place before McLaren is willing to
allow its drivers to do their own thing because it's
so clearly a one on one championship. But I don't
(09:27):
feel like they'really that close. There's still this hedging mentality.
Maybe it'll be a post mid season break thing, assuming
that there is no change in the form guy between
now and then, which is pretty unimaginable anyway. But I
think that'll be interesting because that'll be the next test
when you start to give them a bit more leash
to be creative, to fight their own battles rather than
deferring to the team and this idea of being a
(09:47):
good team player. That's when you risk a little bit
of those cracks. I think the characters are good and
can survive it, but you don't know how tense this
is going to be, right, We don't know what it's
going to look like in Abu Dhabi, and.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
That will actually be super compelled, I think, because I
think what made that Mercedes were just braining everybody every
race weekend at that point. But what made that interesting
was you always felt, I don't know whether it was
true or not, but it certainly felt from my vantage
point that there was this more sort of cerebral side
to Nico Rosberg and that he could engineer himself into
an advantageous position. And you know, whether that's reality or not,
(10:21):
it always felt like Hamilton was the faster rider and
a driver, and Rosberg was the smarter driver in that time,
and so the contrast of each other's strengths mitigated against
the other week That's what made that fight so interesting,
because they were trying to achieve the same thing from
different angles, Whereas at the moment the McLaren ever on
this very narrow path. We will do things fairly. We
will do things fairly. And in answer to your question,
(10:42):
at what point how many points ahead of third place
is enough? I mean, look, I said before McLaren's almost
unlosable lead in the Constructors Championship. The fact that they
already won that last year, so it's not what they're
going for that for the first time, I think is
an interesting point here as well, because they're not at
risk of losing that. And then once it becomes realistic
(11:03):
that nobody else other than a McLaren driver is going
to win the Driver's World Championship, I think we will
see that. The fascinating thing for me is that's probably
going to favor one driver over the other. But who
that's the answer. We don't know yet because we've got
no evidence to suggest that one of them is going
to be better placed. If they become the new dare
I say rules of engagement, If that becomes a new thing,
(11:24):
who does that advantage which side of the garage? Who
is better at that, Who can think better on the fly,
who has got better preparation, who can adapt within a
race situation. I think that adds a lot of intrigue
to some races at the end of the year, where
we'll go into them knowing that it's probably going to be,
all things considered, two orange cars on the front row
and one of them is going to win. I think
that will make it a lot more interesting just simply
(11:45):
we're dealing with something we've not seen.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Yeah, I think it will be, and I do wonder
whether they'll get there or whether they'll know for the
first Drivers Championship. They'll refuse to allow that relaxation, but
it'll be really interesting to see because I think it's
pretty clear at this point we're heading towards that conclusion.
I want to talk now about the broader picture here
because we've had quite a few what have almost been
billed as last chances for the rival teams to catch up. Right.
(12:09):
We had those rule changes in Spain, the first major
upgrades in him are all that sort of stuff, and
no one's been able to catch McClaren. There was Canada
that was a blip and there were circumstances behind it,
but this one felt a little bit different because all
the front running teams brought upgrades. Red Bull Racings brought
one that I hoped would change things for Arari two.
And I want to stick with Red Bull Racing here
because not only did they bring these upgrades, but this
(12:29):
is the home race of the Red Bull Company, even
if the team's not based here, and it's also a
track like Norris that Vestapan's always done very well and
he's always formittable here. Five wins at this circuit and
the team was just kind of nowhere all weekend. Versaven
probably could have qualified, well, let's say third, could have
done the front row. But if we assume he would
have completed his lap, we've got to say Pastre would
have been I think he probably would have taken the
(12:50):
front row. Nonetheless, he would have qualified a lot better.
It maybe not been obliterated by Andrea Kimi Antonelliot it
turned three, but he was And that's part of the story.
But the other part of the stories, of course, that
the team still had one car in the race, but
very easily forgettable. It was Yuki Sonoda who qualified eighteen,
finished two laps down. You only driver two laps down,
thirty seconds off the back of the pack. Yes, you
(13:11):
had to make a third pit stop. Nonetheless, really poor
race from him, despite the fact Matt that this was
actually his closest he's been to maxim qualifying in terms
of time deficit. This felt like a bit of a
new low for me because it was another race where
he ended saying I don't know why, I don't know
why I'm slow. I don't know what to do about it.
This is essentially paraphrasing his words, but they're not that different.
(13:32):
If anyone's got any ideas, I'll try them. This was
grim for Red Bull.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
So just to go back, you said that Red Bull
had two cars in the race. I was not aware
of this. In fact, I've not been aware that Red
Bulls had two cars since since Daniel Riccardo drove there
next to Maximstaff. And I mean, we only have to
listen to that Sergio Perro's interview last week where they
basically ambitted. They only according to Perez, they only run
two cars because they have to. And this is the problem.
(13:58):
I think it was at seventy seven since Red Bull
didn't score a point. And this is the issue here
because it is a one driver team and you've had
this rotating situation now where you've tried so many different
drivers in that second seat since Daniel Ricardo left that
team for twenty nineteen. And I'm starting to think that
(14:20):
we keep talking about the fact that they have a
second driver problem, maybe they have a first driver problem.
And because Max for stappad is so good and he
is able to drive around the difficulties of a problematic
car year on year, and we've discussed this before, it's
the Mark Marquez Hondo Motor GP analogy here that is
(14:41):
the problem. Is they're trying to find someone who can
do some sort of percentage of what for Stappan can do,
and maybe that person doesn't exist because the car is
so extreme and you saw a situation it was made
all the worse because everyone had come dressed in orange.
You know, whether you're supporting Red Bully, supporting Max or
whatever it is, you've got the giant or the infield
of the circuit. This race exists because of a drink
(15:04):
in a can. Let's be perfectly honest, and yes, their
main guy was out on the first lap, and then
after that that should be where the second driver is like, well,
I'm going to banker solid sixth then at the very
least so you actually notice. And the only time we
saw Yuki sonoda was when he was getting into scrapes
with people right at the very very back and trumbling around.
And this is not an isolated incert But you could
(15:26):
substitute Liam Lawson in here or anybody else. The contrast
for me as well, is that Liam Lawson had his
best Formula One result of his career with sixth place
in Austria, and the normal course of events with the
second team like that, you'd be like, well he seems
good that young lawson Blake. Maybe we could promote him
to Oh no, we can't do that because we gave
him two races and we sent him back to the
(15:48):
B team. So the whole thing is a bit of
a shambles, let's be perfectly honest. But they seem quite lost.
I mean, there was so much discussion about, oh wait
till we get to Barcelona and we've got these new
flexwing tests and this is going to be the you know,
the magic bullet to get us back to the top.
All that came and went with a bit of a whimpet,
didn't it. And they're just they're just pretty much nowhere.
(16:10):
And the one the thing I thought was interesting was
that you may have read that maxistaff and didn't even
watch the rest of the Grand Prix once he got
knocked out. He actually went and sat and watched the
spar twenty four hours with TV and that was fun,
but he wasn't watching it. I think quite a few
people in the crowd worked for that one either.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
I mean, I've done the Austrian ground for a couple
of times. I think a lot of people in the crowd,
maybe they look like they're watching but at some point
they're not fully aware of what's going on.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
They're mostly just sunburnt and slightly inebriated.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
Yes, yeah, at some point you can't tell the difference
between the orange capes and just the orange sunburn. It's yeah,
I think that's pretty much it. It is an interesting
situation for it. Well, I like the way you put it.
It is a first driver problem because you can't help
but think. And I've been thinking about this this week
because there's this idea that well, you know, we've got
to the end of the regulation. This is certainly Christian
Hornet's perspective. Okay, we've struggled in the last years of
(17:01):
the regulations. He's blamed the old wind tunne a little bit.
He's talked about well, this team's also designed that most
dominant car in f On history a couple of years ago. Yeah,
haven't become indiots overnight. Next year's regulation change is completely new,
including with the power unit. It'll be a blank slate.
We'll go back to being good again. But I can't
help but think. I can't believe I'm making an analogy
(17:22):
with Daniel Ricardo. Remarkable for an Australian doing such a thing.
But remember when he joined McLaren in the preview the
last year of the previous set of regulations. Now and
we made the exact same assumptions. He couldn't needn't understand
the car, didn't jar with the car, but you know,
the regulations are going to change the following year, and
he'll start from zero like everyone else, and it will
be good. And yet he struggled in pretty much exactly
(17:43):
the same way because it's the same team of designers
who are designing the car, even if the regulations are different.
When we're talking about things like the balance of the
car and how you adjust that and the operating window. Yes,
there's an aerodynamic component, and the aerodynamics are changing next year.
But I've found it interesting how many different teams been saying, well,
there are some things we can carry over to next year,
because you know, suspension is fundamentally the same note of
(18:05):
what car you build, and the tires are going to
be the same next year, and all these interacting elements
that Red Bull seems to be struggling with, at least
a little bit or as a part of their struggles,
will be built by the same people who built this
year's car, and the same people who Adrian Nue since
left the team has said refused or did not or
could not recognize these problems when they began occurring in
twenty twenty three because Max was making them look so
(18:28):
good and are now playing catch up. Maybe you can't
have as much confidence that that same group of people,
using Max for staff and as their reference as they should,
won't design a car with similar problems or some other
problems that Max will be able to handle for a
year or two until the land up down the same
dead end road of development, by which point Dalla burned through,
(18:49):
Isaac Kadjar and probably three or four other drivers two
years down the road have brought Daniel kiveyat back presumably,
and Hill have done no good as well. I think
that it's too easy to say, well, we just got
to it through this year and ride it off. I
think this problem at Red Bull now it's nearly a
decade sin Saniel Ricardo left. It's a long running thing. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
And also the fact that you aren't just rolling through
a very stable set of regulations for next year and
so oh we might find something next year, or we
could change the driver and it's all fine. There's a
lot of trying to speak optimism into existence right now
when you're looking at twenty six, because yeah, there's spinning
a lot of plates for next year with a new
engine partner, and there's a lot of change. As it
(19:26):
is when you've got a second car that, no matter
who drives it, contributes absolutely nothing, and then when you've
got races like this that it just exposes the problem. Yeah,
I think there's a lot of unanswered questions there, and
you've always got this is Max leaving? Is Max going
to retire young? Is Max going to move to Mercedes?
There's so much being placed upon him and about you.
(19:48):
I think I never underrated Max Forstappan as a driver.
I mean, the guy's won four World championships. He's clearly
excellent at driving a Formula WLDE car. We've had a
lot of evidence of that over a long period of time.
I'm actually respecting a lot more what he's doing this year,
simply because the car is clearly very difficult and he's
just swimming upstream against the current every single weekend to
(20:12):
try and get into a position to do anything. There's
a bloody mindedness and a determination that is commendable with
the way he's going about it. But it also feels
like at some point the courage is just going to
take him down stream when he can't keep swimming back
up again. It's got a little bit of a feeling
of that, whether it's being taken out unluckily on the
first lap of a race, or they'll just come a
point where the car just doesn't work and he's doing
(20:34):
everything in his power to finish sixth Somewhere. That's going
to be the period where you know they're in trouble now,
that they could be in serious trouble for next year,
because if I had to frame a market on who
do I trust to get a new regulation set right
for twenty twenty six, Red Bull aren't at the top
for me, and they might not even be in the
top two or three.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
Yeah, and I think that's a fair call. It's the
great mystery of the regulation change, particular ones that are
so big and include a power unit and red Will
Racing speret inhouse power. It's interesting situation. Just before we
move on, Matt red Bill scored twenty scored nineteen points
in the last three races. Sober has scored twenty.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
I'm so glad you wrote this down that Saber has
outscored every team except for McLaren Ferrari m Mercedes over
the last three Grand Prix. So I'm glad you've bought
sober up. Hat tip to them. Also on my list
because we needed to talk about Liam laws and we've
done that. Gabrielle brought a letto. He's looking quite good,
isn't he.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
Yes. Finally, I mean imagine this, Matt. Imagine a team
in Formula one giving a rookie more than five to
six races to prove they belong in Formula one.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
What do you try to That's ridiculous talk from you, Lemonado,
What are you talking about.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
Let's move to Move of the Week, brought to you
by Shannon's Formula One and Moto GP in action over
the course of the weekend. I'm going to kick us
off today. I'm going to go with the Austrian Grand Prix.
I'm going to keep it pretty straightforward though, because I
thought this was a great move with a great bit
of context behind it, which was what technically Lando Norris's
(22:01):
overtake for the lead. I think it was on a
lap eleven after Piastri had briefly taken it from him
at turn three. He played the more clever tactical game,
which is something that I feel like we've struggled to
say about him almost ever. To be fair, he's only
been in a race winning circumstance for a year or so,
(22:22):
but particularly in the in contrast with last year when
he was battling with Max Withstappen for the lead, and
while the crash was Max's fault, there's no denying that
in the sense of him not winning the race with
a car that at the place to do it, I
think Lando was guilty of just being too blunt of
an instrument, of not really understanding the tactics of racing
at this circuit that is unique three to our s zones.
(22:42):
I think it's seventy percent of the track whatever it is,
A lot of the track is dominated by drs. It
is a certain way of racing. This year, he got
it absolutely right when Oscar made the move up into
turn three, understood how he could fight back from that,
and he did exactly that. You know, because had he
not done that, Oscar had taken the lead. I think
it would have been pretty easy to imagine a Constants
in which he just then controls the race there after
and he's not seen again or fundamentally, so a really
(23:05):
important overtake, one that shows that he is developing. When
I think earlier this year it's been easy to say
maybe he hasn't been particularly in a racecraft sense, which
I think is a weakness reality of tu Oscar. So
I think that made this victory just that a little
bit more important, regardless of the bounce back from Canada,
the points, all that stuff proving that he's made progress
and he's doing it against his teammates, equal machinery, all
(23:26):
that kind of stuff. I thought it was a really
important overtakes. That's my move of the week.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
Yeah, certainly more important. You know that, the context and
what it means, and even the fact of where it
was because of Austria last year. I think they're all
very good points. And I'll also give you an extra
golf clap for use of blunt instrument because it's the
for anyone playing lemonato bingo at home. You can cross
that one off.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
All right, what do you got for us about?
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Well, I sort of in one of those uncharitable moods today,
so I'm just going to let this one fly. I'm
saying move of the Week was Kimmie Antonelli taking Max
for staff and out at seven three on the opening
lab simply because Michael, simply because it exposed the red
Bull driver pipeline for what it is, basically a car crash,
making us more aware of something that's actually a car
(24:10):
craw So that's why I'm giving Kimmy Antonelli Move of
the Week because it brought something into plain view that
we all know that we all talk around the edges
from time to time, and then what happened in the
subsequent sixty nine and three quarter lapse of that race
just expose that driver pipeline for what it is.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
Yes, I like it. I like a lot where you've
taken that and like I said, move of the Week
does not imply success, does not even imply and overtake,
so perfectly happy for that loophole to be exploited. There's
one other team I want to talk about, Matt in
summing up the Austrian Grand Prix, and that's Alpine Alpine,
which is owned by Reno, one of the biggest car
(24:46):
companies in the world, also partially owned by the French state.
Some people don't know that it's last in the Constructors Championship.
It's scored just eleven points. That's less than half the
total of Sauba, which is on a great run. Now
looking at this race, Pierre Gasly qualified in the top ten,
just tenth after he spent out the last warning, but
unth less top ten. Franco Colobindo qualified in Q two's
(25:06):
that's okay, that's fine, talk about him in a second
as well, but failed to score. Both cars just went
backwards through this race, and that's indicted well, not only
because the cars went backwards, but this is a race
in which only five of the front runners scored points.
Two of them. Of course, will wiped out and Yuki
Snoda was never at the races and both Williams cars,
I think this is almost the more important part. They
both retired in what's turning into a pretty horrendous mid
(25:28):
season runner reliability for the team that looked pretty locked
on for fifth in a Constructors champion twenty a few
weeks ago. That should have been easy pickings for a
team like Elpaine that had qualified again with one kind
of the top ten, but it was South that got
both cars into the points and good with them, but
it's interesting to hear the language coming out of the
team now Flaveerberatore, and it's up to you how you
want to interpret all of the words, but it's called
(25:51):
it increasingly concerning you, he said, and this was after
on Saturday he said he was disappointed by Franco Colobinda
not getting into the top ten, that he needs both
cars to be there. Someone I assumably told him afterwards
that he's only been in the car for five races
to help him. But nonetheless, this is a team that's
looking pretty shaky. And then there are reports on Monday,
and I think this is where things start to get
(26:11):
increasingly bizarre or highlights the chaos. That the teams are
talking to valtri Botas or Mercedes to try and get
the services of Volti Botas, not just for next year,
but for this year.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
What on earth is going on now? I mean, it's
the way you set that up earlier, and that you
were talking about the context of what Alpine has done,
and that Souber given the resource and the budget and
the fact they run very very garish green cars that
look like they don't belong in Formula one, the fact
that they're comprehensively outperforming a team that is partially owned
(26:41):
by the French state. I mean, put that together as
a sentence, that doesn't make sense. It's absolutely crazy. What
is not going on there. It just seems it seems reactionary,
it seems rudderless, it seems there's just there's almost an
inevitability now when you wat them that you just expect
(27:01):
it to be no good. And part of that, I
think is that it's talking about other drivers whose stocks
and reputation are probably up this year. Pierre Gastly's driving
very very well at the moment, and oh he used
to drive a red bull racing remember that. But he's
another guy who's been rehabilitated and gone off somewhere else
and made a very good Formula One career for himself.
I don't think that the problem is what he is
(27:23):
doing necessarily. It just seems very haphazard. It seems even
coming into this season, when you're a works outfit and
you've made the decision to shut your own engine program down,
even things like that at the start of the season,
it's like, what are we actually doing here? And it's
highlighted by Williams having this really strong start to the season. Yes,
(27:45):
things have nosed dive pretty spectacularly since, but they have
made what I believe is the very sensible decision to
if we had a stable rule set for twenty twenty six,
I think Williams would have pushed on and really and
really taken that early season momentum and run with it.
They're making the sensible decision. It's like, Okay, good, we
can build a good car, we can do good things.
Let's do that when everything changes then, so they're going
(28:06):
to clearly tail off what Sauba doing at the moment
is it's a product of stability and slight evolution and execution.
It feels like Sauber get a lot of things right
on race weekends at the moment, and these are the
areas to me that Alpine is always left falling short.
And then you've got the driver instability, and you know
Jack doing at the start of the season refusing to
(28:28):
answer questions about his future because he and we all
knew exactly where that was going. And then Franco Colopinto
comes in and he scores precisely the same number of
points as Jack doing over his five races in the car,
and the whole thing is completely chaotic. But you mentioned
Valterie Botas. This is really interesting for me because yes,
there's a Mercedes power plant going into that car for
twenty twenty six, but of course Botas has already been
(28:50):
discussed in potentially being a Cadillac driver for next season.
That's an interesting conundrum, isn't it, Because you've got a
team that operationally and stability and management wise is a
bit of a mess and our plane has been for
a while. They're going to have an engine that I
would almost put the house on is probably going to
be the best engine in Formula One next year in
(29:11):
twenty twenty six with a Mercedes engine. So there's a
known quantity in terms of management and potentially engine, and
he's also driven Mercedes powered cars a lot in his career.
Or is the potential of a startup getting on the
ground floor base camp Cadillac operation with a Ferrari power plant,
which is more probably of an unknown than Mercedes. You'd
have to say the fact that Valsi Botas has potentially
(29:34):
got two options is two more options than we probably
thought he'd have to get back on the grid. But
if he does have two options, there's no easy answer
to that is there because there's compelling cases for both.
I don't think either of them are wrong, but one
of them is going to be more right.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Yeah, I think you're right, because it's just funny that
there's a choice at all. Forether of these drivers, I
mean their fortunately Cadillac's coming in. Otherwise all of this
could be Bizarren. We shouldn't forget that. Alpines also farming
out paul aarro On. It's reserve driver at a Saber
for a couple of FP one sessions before the mid
season break, plus three it's got planned for later in
the year and he's potentially in the frame, you know,
(30:09):
as a contingency at a minimum. So that's sort of
interesting in its own right. But let me sell you
alp in two different ways.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
I'm looking forward to this.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
One is the Renault owned works manufacturer Alpe know it
is Reno by another name. It's just a different color
with a great history of championship winning success. B it's
the independent team that's going to finish the last in
the Constructors Championship with less than half the points of
the team that was last last year. Because that's what
it is. Next year, it's owned by a big company,
(30:38):
but it will no longer be a works team. It's
a team that fields, like with the exception of Flavio
Brittorio has a remit to report to the board at
Reno or the CEO who's now leaving the team, so
that throws that into uncertainty on a different level. Feels
like it's at arm's length from the works team anyway,
certainly different from Ferrari is an example, different even to Mercedes, which,
even though Mercedes only owns a third of the Mercedes
(31:00):
F one team, the collaboration is close and historical and
likewise with the engine component of that team. Cadillac, on
the other hand, yeah, it's running Ferrari customer engines next year.
I don't think anyone expects them to do great things
even in the first few years, but will be a
real works team later eventually. So there's something there. I
think you can you could you know if you were
(31:21):
a Cadillac at least you're Mari Andrettie talking to Valdri
Botas or Sergio Peris, because he's been rumored to be
linked to Alpine as well. I think that's gone pretty
cold recently. I think the pitch is probably easier to
make for Cadillac, because then you've got to add in
the fact that I think Cadillac is going to be
certain inn F one for a minimum and a long
amount of time, right, Like the minimum time is going
to be long because you don't make this kind of
(31:43):
investment and then leaving three ys, it's not going to happen.
Alpine's future to me looks pretty uncertain because, like I said,
the CEO is left unexpected, he's got a job elsewhere,
and he's always insisted the team's not for sale. But
like you said, they've shouted their engine division. A lot
of the moves they've made looks like a team that
wants to be sold. And more important that we don't
know what the next CEO's opinion is going to be,
regardless of the fact the team has denied consistently that
(32:05):
they're up for sale and so far they haven't been sold.
They've been right. There is a new CEO arriving. We
don't know who it's going to be. We don't know
what their opinion on the Formula one program is going
to be, and the massive expense of that it could
be sold, it could be closed. We don't know. So
if you're looking for a Valtriebot has not looking for
a one year deal just to prove you could get
back in F one. He's looking for a couple of
years at least. The team could cease to exist in
(32:25):
that time. I think, actually it's a big question. I'm
not saying you should definitely not choose Alpine because it
could be a root of the grid in as little
as two weeks, who knows, But I think the question
of the long term is a much bigger one than
you would have thought, maybe even twelve months ago. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Absolutely. And the other parts of this too is there's
an expectation management element to all of this because of
Alpine's name, and it's you know, it's longevity in the
sport and what have you. Anything that Botas would do
in Cadillac. There's that sort of underpromise over deliver, like
no one's expecting Botas to come in and all of
a sudden being Q three in next year. Fantastic if
(33:01):
it happens. So every result that Cadillac get next year,
it'll be well, they're a startup there and youw team,
haven't they done well? You know, one of their cars
just MISQ three that was excellent. What about that really
good twelfth that Valteri Botas got in Bahrain or something.
Whereas if you go to alp and it's got a
Mercedes in the back of it and you're finishing twelfth,
it's a disaster and the world is on fire. So
the same results could happen but be interpreted two very
(33:24):
very different ways, simply based on where these two teams
and entities are in their Formula one journeys. If you're
looking for a longer runway and perhaps longevity and the sport,
if you're Valterie Botas, you'd probably be going to Cadillac
because everything that you do that's positive is going to
be celebrated far more than well, that was positive what
you did at alp But why wasn't it more positive
(33:45):
because your Alpene you should be doing better than this.
So look, the Mercedes power plant is a pretty big
character dangle in front of somebody in particularly because he
knows how that company works. But I'm with you, like
the whole thing with Alpine, is in any other business,
any other sort of to sport business or sport business
or just business per se, with the amount of decisions
that have gone on behind the scenes there. It feels
(34:06):
like something that is being prepared to be sold despite
the denials to the country. And it's felt like that
for a while. And you and I know that if
you woke up tomorrow morning, look at your phone, it's like, oh,
do you hear al Peina pulling out of Formula one?
You'd go wow, But then you'd go, well, yeah, okay,
that makes complete sense, whereas I don't think Cadillac are
going to go, look, we've done all this prap, we
(34:27):
we've spent all this buddey, we've hired all these people.
But no, thanks, we don't want to do that. And
that's a key difference between these two teams. So look,
hoay fa valtrie Botouse. He's got choices. Certainly we didn't
expect that. But I wonder if the incumbent team, with
the history that Alpine's got, is actually going to be
seen as the worst of the two choices for whoever
(34:47):
takes that seat.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
Yeah, which is pretty remarkable. Just quickly. It's just reminds
us speaking of a colleague and different podcasts. Actually, and
he put it to me like this, and I really
liked it. First, I thought it was just a brutal
bit of commentary, but I think actually it sums up
is that Alpine Alping is not at the bottom yet.
I think that's the most alarming part, because they're not.
If you look at their structure of Alpine and I
(35:08):
know that part of the biggest problems. They don't have
a team principle at the moment. But you can't tell
me that that is the structure the senior managers. Who
is going to take this team to success. Maybe, look,
you people have different opinions on flav bet Or. I
get it, but he's not there for the long term.
He's already pretty old. He's got some old school ideas
clearly on how they run the team, and I just
don't see it being I just don't see, you know,
(35:29):
the next time Alpine wins a race, you know, purely
on merit is in Bodihuim contention, I can't see him
being there going, oh well, I've I'm sure he will
say it was all up to him, but I can't
see him being there as the one who orchestrated at all.
They don't have a team principal. Technical leadership has changed
a lot in recent years, it doesn't feel like they're
at and by rock bottom. I don't just mean they
potentially could get worse, but I mean they're not at
(35:49):
base camp. I think maybe he's a more clear way
to say, they're not at that point where you can
see the route to the top yet, whereas with Cadillac
they are at they're at the start of thing. You know,
we don't know when they'll ever win a race or a
championship away, it's impossible to say, but they are at
the start of something. Everything Valtrie does that's good there
would have contributed to the foundations of the team or
any driver who goes there. I just thought it was
(36:12):
very interesting to think about the idea that helping is
still further to go.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
No, you're right, Cadillacs at the start of something and
Alpine might not be at the end of something else.
And that's that's the easiest way to describe it at
the moment. But the interesting choice for botasid all of this,
because clearly he's not a guy who's going to be
driving forever in a day. Either is there's a brand
association AMBASSADORI or you can hit your you can hit
(36:37):
yourself to a project that's got instant credibility and gravitas
as you go forward, as opposed to something that, like
I said, if you wake up tomorrow morning and the
whole thing was in the bin, you wouldn't be surprised
with Alpine. So yeah, there's more than just driving to
consider with these sorts of things. And you know, all
these guys of someone of his reputation and the ILK
and Grand Prix winning experience has made enough cash at
(36:57):
this point, so it's not just about that either. So yeah,
it's certainly interesting. And you know the question there is
if he ends up taking the Alpine seat, then who's
in the frame for Cadillac or vice versa, Because yeah,
like you were saying, Alpine's got about six hundred reserve drivers,
they might all get three races each before the end
of the year.
Speaker 1 (37:15):
All Right, that was the Austrian Grand Prix and a
little bit of that news that's come out since then
the British Grand Prixx this weekend, so you don't have
to wait long for more Formula one. But let's have
a crack at thinking looking at what's going to be
happening with the Crystal Ball. Brought to you by complete
home filtration. Matt, would you like to start us off?
What are you? What's in your forecast? Now?
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Look, if you don't blow your own trumpet in this
mic where no one's going to So I'm just going
to remind you and everyone listening that I actually picked
Lando Norris to win the Austrian Grand Prix, so good
victory that for me. I'm only going to mention these
things when I get them right. You'll never hear me
mention it when I don't. But my crystal ball this
week has been fitted with a very impressive square jaw
line in honor of Mark Weber. Obviously, Mark Webber of
(37:55):
course banishes Oscar Pastre and Mark Webber was as good
at his home grownd pri as Jensen Button was at
his home Grand Prix, and that Jensen Button would always
win in Australia. Mark Webber won several times at Silveston,
and both of them never fired a shot at their
home Grand Prix, which is a very long way of
saying that the British McLaren driver is not going to
win at Silveston this weekend. Oscar Piastre is so Sky
(38:18):
Sports can put the pomp Poms back in the box
Bristol and Glastonbury tetowls flying at half masted over Silveston
this weekend. I think we're going to see an Australian
winning at Silverston, and I think Oscar Piastre is going
to bounce back and take victory.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
I like it a lot. I like it a lot.
My prediction. My Crystal Ball tell me some really specific things, though,
I think might tally well with yours. I think we're
going to hear a record number in the broadcast of
the plural third person possessive determiner, a lot of our George's,
our allies, our Lewis, depending on how he's performing, our
(38:51):
Alex otherwise he's from Thailand. Yes, and of course I'm
going to hear a lot about our nine and our Damon.
I bet they're going to be there. Ian's also tally
when I think I'm going to be spot on with
this one. The Crystal World's telling me that the Lewis
Hamilton's honorific of sir is going to be wheeled out
quite a bit. Oh yes, Sir Lewis Helenon Ferrari hasn't.
I haven't heard it in a while, but if it's
ever going to happen. It's going to be at the
(39:11):
British Grand Prix, which Matt, I'm sure you'll be reminded
many times, is the first Grand Prix. It's coming home
former World War air field and you know Sterling Moss,
et cetera.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Can we take the listeners behind the curtains slightly here.
I'm not going to completely reveal all the contents of this,
but I do believe that I still haven't saved in
my phone somewhere that you made a Bingo card of
things that will be said on the commentary during the
British Grand Prix. We should post it somewhere if we
don't get ourselves sacked in the meantime. But I think
I had the whole Bingo card filled out by like
the first ten minutes of FP two a couple of
(39:44):
years ago. So all the old ones are going to
come out, but the use of our is going to
be absolutely fantastic. And pstre He is from that place
where we used to send the convicts and everything as well,
so I certainly won't do anything.
Speaker 1 (39:57):
Look you'll see they will all be ticked off very rapid.
I am confident I think we've both made good predictions.
We'll find out how they go next week. But that's
all the time we have for bit talk today. You
can subscribe to bittalk wherever you get your favorite podcasts,
and you can leave us a rating and a review
as well. This weekend it is the Formula one British
Grand Prix, with lights out at midnight Sunday night. You
can keep up to date for the latest F one,
(40:18):
supercars and MotoGP news at Fox Sports dot com dot
Au from Matt Clayton and me Michael Lomonado. Thanks very
much for your company and we'll catch you next week.
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